The Golden Compass (movie)

[FoxyKaye]

Couldn't find an "official" thread for this movie, so I thought I'd start one.

It looks like the worldwide trailer has just been released this week - there's a link from the main Golden Compass movie Web site: http://www.goldencompassmovie.com

I have to say that I'm a huge fan of the books (The Golden Compass (Northern Lights), The Subtle Knife, and The Amber Spyglass), but the latest bits of dialogue from the trailer have given me pause for concern. All references to the Alethiometer that appeared in the previous teaser trailer and ComiCon preview seem to have been changed to "golden compass," the implication is now that Mrs. Coulter is running the Magesterium whereas it was previously her running the Gobblers, and in general the whole Dust phenomenon seems to be more and more downplayed in favor of the Magesterium attempting to control other worlds.

I trust New Line, but the movie has also swapped directors and writers more times than a keychain party - if it does well, there are plans to film The Subtle Knife and The Amber Spyglass back-to-back. But I'm starting to be very concerned that the qualities of the books and story arc that made them most rich are being glossed over - I suppose that's Hollywood.

In many regards, I'm hoping New Line doesn't bungle this movie, since to me these books are even better than the Harry Potter series but don't have as much exposure (well, at least here in the States).

[killmoms]

If by "the very qualities of the books" you mean "their increasingly narrow-minded and screed-like qualities," then yes. If you thought Pullman's clear hatred for spirituality would be preserved in mass-market films, well... you're as crazy as he is. ;)

I used to love this series when I was younger. Now I appreciate it, but by The Amber Spyglass Pullman had put all his personal biases clearly on the page in a way that (I thought) really detracted from the story. His critical stance on the church as an instrument of power in society in the first book I could see, but... well, let's just say that I certainly don't think the third book is at all graceful about the point.

That said, I'll still go see it. :)

[bartelby]

I wasn't too keen on the books to begin with. I like Northern Lights, but the other two rambled on. I gave them another chance and I love the books now.
They are much, much more interesting than Potter.

When I first heard the films were being made it was said that the screenplay writers were trying to remove all religious references because it would upset the American market.

I've been worried about the films ever since.

KillMoms, So Pullman dislikes religion and spirituality? So what?
If the studio want to make a film of the books they should stick to the plot.
If they don't like it, they shouldn't option the film.

[calculus]

The Young Vic did a stage version of the books a few years back. It was in two parts (six hours in all) and was absolutely brilliant.

[FoxyKaye]

More pause for concern:

http://www.hisdarkmaterials.org/news/the-golden-compass/a-message-from-chris-weitz-to-his-dark-materials-fans

But yes, that the books stand as a stunning indictment of organized religion, and the Catholic Church in particular - it's shameful these qualities will be downplayed almost entirely in the movie.

[killmoms]

KillMoms, So Pullman dislikes religion and spirituality? So what?
If the studio want to make a film of the books they should stick to the plot.
If they don't like it, they shouldn't option the film.

It's okay to dislike it. It's quite another to be thoroughly uncreative and harm the plot of your books by being a dick about it.

Believe me, I'm of the "keep it off my wave" school of thought when it comes to religion, but I'm not rude about it to people. Lots of people take it seriously and it plays an important part in their lives, and if that works for them, cool. Pullman could've easily written that series without being a petulant child about "killing God" and whatnot, which just smacks of "let's see how the religious community likes THIS" instead of legitimate storytelling. It's a case of an atheist being just as snot-nosed as a religious extremist—I find both poles equally annoying.

As for the studios, they smelled money, they offered Pullman (or his publisher, or whomever) a deal, probably with a script, and he took it. If you think making big-budget Hollywood movies has ANYTHING to do with art or story or integrity, well, you just haven't worked in the business. ;)

[bartelby]

The Young Vic did a stage version of the books a few years back. It was in two parts (six hours in all) and was absolutely brilliant.

I wish I could have gone.

Lucky Londoners..

[Phat Elvis]

I'm not a huge fan of organized (or disorganized) religion but I can see where the producers would have to alter the book to make it "sell-able." It's still a kids movie and there would be far too many protests from over-opinionated groups to make any money - and this will be an expensive film to make. The wikipedia page is pretty interesting. It seems there have been a few rewrites.

With that said, I'll still see it. The sets from the previews look pretty cool.

[calculus]

Lucky Londoners..

Just to be clear about this, and not wanting to insult anyone, I am not a Londoner! (just someone with a good rail service into London...)

[calculus]

There is an article about the film in today's Observer (http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2190765,00.html)

[bartelby]

Just to be clear about this, and not wanting to insult anyone, I am not a Londoner! (just someone with a good rail service into London...)

Lucky South Easteners...:rolleyes:;)

There is an article about the film in today's Observer (http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2190765,00.html)

I wish film studio execs has spines!

[Osarkon]

Having seen the trailer I'm now slightly concerned as well. I knew they were going to be downplaying things, but 'golden compass'? It sounds really....anti-climactic in a way. "She has the golden compass' .

I do hope this doesn't turn out to be another Harry Potter-esque film attempt.

[Matildaaaargh]

Believe me, this movie is going to be fabulous. I'm an avid fan of the books I did some work experience at Pinewood on this film and it just looks amazing. I can't really say much, but as a film it is very well crafted.

I know it is very difficult to separate a movie adaptation from its original story, but you have to treat them as different things. Who was expecting this film to be anything less than a huge budget Hollywood blockbuster when they first announced it? You have to accept what it is being made for.

Trust me on this one. Go to see it. Take your friends to see it. Drag in strangers, because it really is awesome.

[killmoms]

Having seen the trailer I'm now slightly concerned as well. I knew they were going to be downplaying things, but 'golden compass'? It sounds really....anti-climactic in a way. "She has the golden compass' .

I do hope this doesn't turn out to be another Harry Potter-esque film attempt.

Haha, clearly you never knew the title of the book had been changed in the States. Interestingly enough, I didn't know until just now that it was titled "Northern Lights" in the UK. To me, "The Golden Compass" makes more sense, given the titles of the other two books are the names of the other powerful artifacts in the series. Ah well, it's a question of familiarity I guess.

[Osarkon]

Haha, clearly you never knew the title of the book had been changed in the States. Interestingly enough, I didn't know until just now that it was titled "Northern Lights" in the UK. To me, "The Golden Compass" makes more sense, given the titles of the other two books are the names of the other powerful artifacts in the series. Ah well, it's a question of familiarity I guess.

Oh really? That would make a whole lot more sense then. :D

Why they do that in the first place is beyond me...

[newboy4128]

I can not wait to see it, because the trailer looks awesome. Of course some family members are refusing to see it because the Catholic church says to boycott it.

I doubt someone is going to watch the movie and walk out and say to themselves "Wait now it is clear the church was wrong." In my book censorship is wrong at any level.

[Killyp]

I was really looking forward to these movies as His Dark Materials are my favourite books, but the trailer didn't impress me much...

[Highcroft]

I go to a Catholic school and they discourage us from watching it and the principal at my old elementary school sent letters home telling parents not to watch it. I still plan on watching it since I read parts of the books and thought it was pretty good.

[d_and_n5000]

I go to a Catholic school and they discourage us from watching it and the principal at my old elementary school sent letters home telling parents not to watch it. I still plan on watching it since I read parts of the books and thought it was pretty good.

Me too - it said something along the lines of "The movie has been watered down so as not to offend Christians, but they are lead-ins to the book - the first one is anti-religion, the second one more obvious in its hatred of Christianity, and the third more blatant still. Parents may take their children to see the movie, then want to buy the trilogy for their children for Christmas. No parent trying to raise their child in faith will want anything to do with this series!"

(it helps I have a church bulletin that has a note saying as much right in front of me. ;))

I haven't really checked into either the books or movie, so can't really pass judgment.

[AP_piano295]

It's okay to dislike it. It's quite another to be thoroughly uncreative and harm the plot of your books by being a dick about it.

Believe me, I'm of the "keep it off my wave" school of thought when it comes to religion, but I'm not rude about it to people. Lots of people take it seriously and it plays an important part in their lives, and if that works for them, cool. Pullman could've easily written that series without being a petulant child about "killing God" and whatnot, which just smacks of "let's see how the religious community likes THIS" instead of legitimate storytelling. It's a case of an atheist being just as snot-nosed as a religious extremist—I find both poles equally annoying.

As for the studios, they smelled money, they offered Pullman (or his publisher, or whomever) a deal, probably with a script, and he took it. If you think making big-budget Hollywood movies has ANYTHING to do with art or story or integrity, well, you just haven't worked in the business. ;)

I would'nt say Pullman ever lost his creativity as the stories continued, and while I can understand your feelings on the blatant anti religious sentiments within the book I never felt like Pullman's reasons for placing them within the story were mean spirited (ie* being a dick).

I'd say Pullman deffinitely has very strong feelings on the issue, the major difference I saw between the first book and the second two was a slight loss of subtlety, while the first book hinted at the authors feelings the second two stated it and then used concrete methods to illustrate the authors ideas.

[karattop]

You've probably seen the previews for "The Golden Compass", but don't let the Hollywood hype and creative footage lure you! Pastor Pauley begins an in-depth five part examination of what this movie is about, and why it is a silver screen offering that you'll want to avoid.

Don't be fooled by Mr. Pullman's deception. You can catch this amazing series on EZRAWEB.COM under Feature Articles_The Daily Blender

[bartelby]

Just in case you're not a 1 post troll...

We all know what the film is about, we've read the books!

Maybe Pastor Pauley shouldn't have seen a film he knows he wouldn't have liked. He'd better not read the books by the way, they're stronger than the film.

[karattop]

Pastor Pauley has not seen the movie - it doesn't come out until Friday, 12/7/07. However, he has read the books and has completed an extensive investigation. If you're not a Believer and do not have knowledge of Scripture, I guess you would have a hard time understanding. I hope that you will investigate Pastor Pauley's findings, though.

In His Love.

Merry Christmas!

[Roric]

Me too - it said something along the lines of "The movie has been watered down so as not to offend Christians, but they are lead-ins to the book - the first one is anti-religion, the second one more obvious in its hatred of Christianity, and the third more blatant still. Parents may take their children to see the movie, then want to buy the trilogy for their children for Christmas. No parent trying to raise their child in faith will want anything to do with this series!"

(it helps I have a church bulletin that has a note saying as much right in front of me. ;))

I haven't really checked into either the books or movie, so can't really pass judgment.
As I told a family friend of mine, (our families are both Catholic home schoolers who are very involved at church) "No parent raising their child in faith will be afraid of this series." If you are truly raising your child to be a good faithful Christian, you will not be afraid of this movie or the books. You will have faith in your ability to overcome the harm this story causes.

I would also hope that the parents would TALK to their child about how this series does not represent what you believe. In fact, this series could even STRENGTHEN your faith.

I find it extremely ironic that these church groups are getting all up in arms over the movie. Don't they realize that by shouting from the rooftops that this is a horrible movie that should never be seen, they are actually giving it more publicity and making MORE people want to see it?

[gauchogolfer]

So, it looks as if it has indeed been watered down, so that the Catholic bishops in the US are supporting it. (http://www.kansascity.com/entertainment/columnists/robert_w_butler/story/389007.html)
“The Golden Compass” — and Philip Pullman’s His Dark Materials trilogy of novels on which it is based — has been criticized in some quarters for being anti-religious and specifically anti-Catholic.

But the U.S. Conference of Bishops recently issued its official review of the film — and it’s a rave.

Writing for the Catholic News Service (catholicnews.com), critics Harry Forbes and John Mulderig call the movie “lavish, well-acted and fast-paced.”

“The good news,” they write, “is that the first book’s explicit references to this church have been completely excised, with only the term Magisterium retained. The choice is still a bit unfortunate, however, as the word refers so specifically to the church’s teaching authority. Yet the film’s only clue that the Magisterium is a religious body comes in the form of the icons which decorate one of their local headquarters.

“Most moviegoers with no foreknowledge of the books or Pullman’s personal belief system will scarcely be aware of religious connotations, and can approach the movie as a pure fantasy-adventure. This is not the blatant real-world anti-Catholicism of, say, the recent ‘Elizabeth: The Golden Age’ or ‘The Da Vinci Code.’ Religious elements, as such, are practically nil.”

[Macaddicttt]

As I told a family friend of mine, (our families are both Catholic home schoolers who are very involved at church) "No parent raising their child in faith will be afraid of this series." If you are truly raising your child to be a good faithful Christian, you will not be afraid of this movie or the books. You will have faith in your ability to overcome the harm this story causes.

I would also hope that the parents would TALK to their child about how this series does not represent what you believe. In fact, this series could even STRENGTHEN your faith.

I find it extremely ironic that these church groups are getting all up in arms over the movie. Don't they realize that by shouting from the rooftops that this is a horrible movie that should never be seen, they are actually giving it more publicity and making MORE people want to see it?

I'm not saying that I feel very strongly on the issue either way, but you should also keep in mind that if you go see the movie, you're giving money to Philip Pullman and the studio that makes the movie. I don't know how anti-religious/anti-Catholic the movie/book is, but I believe the main reason there are calls for boycotts, etc. is that you're supporting those who want to promote ideas contrary to your own, you're giving them money that can help them do that.

Sure, no good Catholic is going to be brainwashed by seeing the movie, but why would a Catholic want to put money in the pocket of a very strong atheist who actively preaches his atheism?

[QuarterSwede]

Sure, no good Catholic is going to be brainwashed by seeing the movie, but why would a Catholic want to put money in the pocket of a very strong atheist who actively preaches his atheism?
Pretty much what I was thinking.

There is no doubt that the story is compelling ... until you find out what happens at the end of the series. It's a blatant rip off of The Chronicles of Narnia and that's all there is to it.

[sebascrub]

I love the books to death. I've honestly read all three of them like a thousand times each. That being said, I'm not sure about the movie. I'll end up watching it of course, but I don't have great expectations. It'll be all kitsch all the time, and while it most likely will be entertaining, it won't approximate the books in quality of narrative or depth of interpretation.

And to those that say that Pullman hates spirituality and religion, that's not really entirely true. He hates organized religion most of all, but is a strong believer in spirituality - in fact, the end of the series is about a reclaiming of a freer sense of the word "religion" in that it pulls towards the original Latin term religare, which means to bind. In the end, anyways, he doesn't care what people think. I was reading an interview the other day where he said that his intention was never to change the way people think; to paraphrase him, he said that if he wanted to do that, he'd just "write a sermon."

[twoodcc]

well i'm not Catholic, and didn't know it was anti-catholic or whatever. but the preview did seem to be ok. think i should go see it?

[mrwizardno2]

Honestly, I could not really care less about the author's religious agenda or affiliation. The previews looked interesting, it looks like a film that I would enjoy, I'm going to go see it.

It is amusing, it was already mentioned, that by making such a fuss over the movie, religious groups are providing free advertising for the film. They're so concerned with getting people to not go, that others wonder "Well what are their panties all bunched up for?" and go see the movie. I know that's how I felt about Davinci Code.

I guess everyone needs something to argue about. No one can just be happy they've got their health and their family.

[galganog]

As an atheist myself, yeah the books are pro-atheist and about being an individual human being.

I also read C.S. Lewis's Chronicles of Narnia and reading those at a young age i didn't have any clue to the allusions to Christianity, but now as I read them again you can cut the religious allusion with a knife in some of the earlier books it is so strong.

I always think its funny though that the religious people protest while the atheist people sit by quietly and put up with all the religious peoples crap day in and day out.

[twoodcc]

I always think its funny though that the religious people protest while the atheist people sit by quietly and put up with all the religious peoples crap day in and day out.

don't even start :rolleyes:

[Macaddicttt]

I always think its funny though that the religious people protest while the atheist people sit by quietly and put up with all the religious peoples crap day in and day out.

The religious people aren't protesting. They're organized, and urging their organization to not give money to someone who's against the organization. This isn't an attack on atheism. Would you go to a movie that you knew was giving money to missionaries? Would you urge fellow atheists to not give missionaries money?

They aren't burning effigies in the streets you know.

[notjustjay]

The religious people aren't protesting. They're organized, and urging their organization to not give money to someone who's against the organization. This isn't an attack on atheism. Would you go to a movie that you knew was giving money to missionaries? Would you urge fellow atheists to not give missionaries money?

Yeah, or support the Salvation Army, YMCA or YWCA, World Vision (sponsoring children in Africa etc)...

I freely admit I am a "religious" person, a protestant Christian. I believe that the purpose of Christianity is to develop a personal relationship with our Creator. The church, and organized religion, should be a means, and not an end. Too many people see "religion" as a set of codes, memes, structures, rules, and a structure for power and control over other people and societies. Even in the Bible there are countless stories of Jesus himself fighting against "the system" for that very reason.

Or, to put it in another perspective, I choose to use a Mac because it brings me joy and a smile to my face and helps me get my work done. I come read MacRumors to learn more about my Mac and how to use it better and be better informed about Apple and society, and I tell other people they should use a Mac because I genuinely believe they will be better off once they make the switch. I don't do any of this because of any wish to control anyone or gain power and prestige in the forums or hope to become second in command after Steve Jobs, and I don't use a Mac only because I was promised great rewards for doing so or threatened that my life would suffer if I dared to ever so much as look at a Windows PC. I don't tell others about Macs based on a commission I expect to receive on their purchases.

I haven't read the books, or frankly even heard of them until the hype for this movie came out. I intend to see the movie, and I intend to read the books, and I intend to think for myself. I don't think this is too much to ask from anyone, religious or not, Christian or atheist.

When Catholic groups or church groups cry "boycott" it strikes me as being severely counterproductive, both because (a) it stirs up interest in the thing they would rather be quieted, and (b) because it only reinforces the notion that believing in a religion or church requires one to intentionally close himself off to reasoning and logic and opposing viewpoints -- kind of a "la la la I'm not listening!" syndrome. This not only makes us look like irrational nutcases, but the believer who falls for that crap will be in for a rude shock when one day he or she finds that they really can't explain rationally what they believe in or why they believe it.

Or, again, I use a Mac and I can explain to you exactly why, and debate the merits of Macs versus PCs, and indeed can use a PC productively and see the pros and cons of each, as opposed to someone that says "I've always used Apple and I've never even tried a Windows PC and I never will because Macs are just better and they always will be and that's all I ever need to know. And I'm pulling my kids out of school because they use PCs and I only want them to know how to use Macs".

I have a Christian friend who has read the books and could find nothing to protest because, he says, he shares the author's criticisms on certain aspects of organized religion.

[Macaddicttt]

When Catholic groups or church groups cry "boycott" it strikes me as being severely counterproductive, both because (a) it stirs up interest in the thing they would rather be quieted, and (b) because it only reinforces the notion that believing in a religion or church requires one to intentionally close himself off to reasoning and logic and opposing viewpoints -- kind of a "la la la I'm not listening!" syndrome. This not only makes us look like irrational nutcases, but the believer who falls for that crap will be in for a rude shock when one day he or she finds that they really can't explain rationally what they believe in or why they believe it.

Boycotting giving someone money is not saying "la la la I'm not listening." It's a reasoned response. Again, I don't really have any particular viewpoint on this, I'm just trying to show that it's not irrationality that's driving people to want to boycott the movie. If people want to boycott it, it's for a perfectly reasoned motive. People aren't boycotting it because of the content per se, but because one motive behind writing the books was spreading a sort of anti-religiosity. Why would a Christian want to give this guy more money to write more anti-Christian books?

While point a) might be true, point b) definitely isn't.

[notjustjay]

People aren't boycotting it because of the content per se, but because one motive behind writing the books was spreading a sort of anti-religiosity. Why would a Christian want to give this guy more money to write more anti-Christian books?

OK, fair enough, IF the author is indeed promoting an anti-religious agenda. (At first glance it appears he is, though some have said it's more anti-organized-religion which I feel does not equate to anti-Christian). Again I haven't read the books yet so I can't say.

But some churches/groups have a way of boycotting things that don't promote their agenda even if it's not actively against. The DaVinci Code, Harry Potter, are examples. And I was also speaking out against those who would say "Ooh, it's not pro-Christian, avoid it, don't even read it"... I'm more inclined to say "Read it, but understand where the author is coming from, apply critical thinking skills, draw conclusions for yourself." This skill is sadly lacking, and from both pro-religion AND pro-atheist folks alike.

[Macaddicttt]

But some churches/groups have a way of boycotting things that don't promote their agenda even if it's not actively against. The DaVinci Code, Harry Potter, are examples. And I was also speaking out against those who would say "Ooh, it's not pro-Christian, avoid it, don't even read it"... I'm more inclined to say "Read it, but understand where the author is coming from, apply critical thinking skills, draw conclusions for yourself." This skill is sadly lacking, and from both pro-religion AND pro-atheist folks alike.

See, this is different than Harry Potter or the Da Vinci code because it is a direct attack on organized religion, the Catholic Church in particular. The bad guys are the "Magisterium" and the only other context in which that word appears is as the body within the Catholic Church that maintains its supposed inerrancy. This is the problem for a lot of people. The books at least, are a direct attack on the Catholic Church. The movie appears to have been toned down, but it makes sense to not want to give this guy money to write more books.

[eric55lv]

i want to see it but i have not seen it yet

[Taylor C]

I think it's ridiculous that the church thinks they have the right to dictate what movies are and aren't appropriate for the public because they may offend some people. You were not forced to read the books, you are not being forced to see the movie, so leave those of us who thoroughly enjoyed the series for what it is, despite Pullman's personal beliefs, a fantasy adventure that is in my opinion a masterful work of art.

I apologize for interjecting my personal stance on religion into this post, but I don't see how so many people believe that it's right for one group (majority or not) to dictate what is appropriate media for public release despite the fact that their entire foundation is based on personal beliefs.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a Harry Potter book burning to attend (just kidding).

As for the movie, I'm planning to go tomorrow. As usual with movies based on books, I'm planning to go in assuming I have little to no knowledge about the story itself so I can attempt to enjoy it without acknowledging what was/wasn't left out.

[Macaddicttt]

Obviously you have not read this thread and have posted in complete ignorance. I suggest you read about the motives for a boycott of the movie before making such rash judgments. The Church is not trying to dictate what is and is not appropriate, which is obvious to anyone who actually knew anything about this case. Please don't burst into threads completely ignorant of the situation, injecting your own biased bpolitical/religious ideas. No one wants this goodnatured thread about a movie to end up in the Political Forum.

[notjustjay]

The Church is not trying to dictate what is and is not appropriate

Let's also not forget that there are many "The Church"es -- the Catholic church, various flavours of Protestants (Baptists, United, Anglican, etc) as well as not-quite-traditional-Christian-church groups like the Mormoms, Jehovah's Witnesses, Scientology, etc. Even then, there are regional groups, etc. You have to be careful not to paint with too broad a brush.

Sometimes one of these groups will get all up in arms about a topic that the others simply shrug and say "Eh?" Unfortunately this can be a cause of divisiveness and criticism from non-church-goers, but at the same time it can be a litmus test to see what issues are truly important/relevant.

Back on topic: Hoping to see this movie next week maybe. Will let you know what I think.

[jimN]

the movie isn't so much an attack on God but rather on the organisations that commit terrible acts in his name. You should see it as more of attack on what the catholic church used to be - an organisation that supported the spanish inquisition, the crusades, witch burnings and the massacre of countless south american peoples. If you read the books you'll see that God is entirely absolved of any wrong doing and effectively everything is being done by others in his name.

Sorry if people seem affronted by the rare event of atheists getting a bit preachy, we have to put up with all sorts of craps from religious types so why shouldn't we weigh in with a bit of passion occasionally. Generally we're a quiet bunch - to my knowledge bands of atheists have never gone to war to win anything!

[Macaddicttt]

Sorry if people seem affronted by the rare event of atheists getting a bit preachy, we have to put up with all sorts of craps from religious types so why shouldn't we weigh in with a bit of passion occasionally. Generally we're a quiet bunch - to my knowledge bands of atheists have never gone to war to win anything!

I personally just like playing Devil's advocate. I don't like it when either the religious or atheists make ridiculous claims. :)

[Sayhey]

Having seen the movie on Friday, my short review is it is worth seeing. Trying not to reveal anything for those who haven't read the books, let me say they have changed some things from the book that are disconcerting, but it still works as a movie. My biggest complaint is where the movie stops. It gives a much different feel to the subject matter by not continuing on to where the first book stops in the story. It also makes me wonder if they are planning to make Lyra's father into a one-dimensional good guy. That would be horrendous.

Cast is great. And the girl who plays Lyra is perfect. I don't know where they found her, but they couldn't have found a better person to play the role. Which means they had also better start filming the other books before the kid grows up.

[hvfsl]

Well the movie seems to be getting bad reviews and is doing particularly baddly at the box office.

I have to say i thought it looked interesting when I saw the trailers (having never heard about the books before), but when I heard the reviews, I quickly lost interest.

[notjustjay]

I have to say i thought it looked interesting when I saw the trailers (having never heard about the books before), but when I heard the reviews, I quickly lost interest.

All the religious discussion aside, when I saw the trailer, I immediately thought it looked like a wanna-be knockoff of some kind of "Narnia meets Lord of the Rings" child-fantasy-talking-animals-epic-adventure.

Could be that this is what everyone is tempted to compare it to.

[FoxyKaye]

Well the movie seems to be getting bad reviews and is doing particularly baddly at the box office.

I have to say i thought it looked interesting when I saw the trailers (having never heard about the books before), but when I heard the reviews, I quickly lost interest.
Mixed reviews across the board in the States, seems to be fairing better in the UK. I saw it last night - It's a fine movie in its own right for folks who haven't read the book, and it could have been outstanding with a more experienced director at the helm. In many ways, I think I now know how the hard-core Potter fans felt when Chris Columbus released Sorcerer's Stone back in 2001. Personally, I think Chris Weitz should be yanked from the project and the sequels, if they get made, be given to a more competent director.

I do think it's quite interesting that the various Christian churches are desperately trying to tell people how to think about the movie and the books, and the books themselves (and to a much lesser extent, the movie) are precisely about the church abusing its power. Personally, I'm sick and tired of various factions of Christianity believing they've got a monopoly on morality, politics and faith in the States - anything that unsettles that lot I'll gladly support.

[Prof.]

I didn't like it. I didn't read the book, so I was like... "WTF are they talking about" throughout the whole movie.

[Phat Elvis]

I do think it's quite interesting that the various Christian churches are desperately trying to tell people how to think about the movie and the books, and the books themselves (and to a much lesser extent, the movie) are precisely about the church abusing its power. Personally, I'm sick and tired of various factions of Christianity believing they've got a monopoly on morality, politics and faith in the States - anything that unsettles that lot I'll gladly support.

I totally agree. I wonder if Pullman is getting a kick out of the church proving his point?

My cousin goes to a catholic school. They sent home letters to the parents telling them that the students "are not allowed" to see The Golden Compass. Since he is Jewish I wonder if he is going to get a letter that he is not allowed to celebrate Chanukah...

[stcanard]

Here's my point of view from somebody who has not read the books.

When the movie was being advertised, I wasn't particularly interested. I flagged it as a potential rental based on the strength of the cast.

The attention generated by the protests piqued my interest enough that this weekend I took my family (wife and 12 year old son) to see it.

Without having read the books, I can see that it suffered horribly from being cut down -- things happened way too fast, and for the most part seemed to easy. I could sense all the missing backstory. I think it would have helped immensely to have a more experienced director to navigate through, and probably an extra 1/2 hour running time at least.

The ending felt like the right spot -- even knowing it came from a trilogy of books, I had expected a more complete finish to it, leaving it hanging came as a surprise. But I could feel it wrapping up after the big battle, going much farther would have been too anti-climactic (and not knowing what was left out, other than the fact that it is a bit of a shock, my guess is it would be too open-ended for a movie that New Line is not totally behind).

With that said, in the end for my family the movie worked. The visuals were amazing, the acting superb, they should have put more heart and experience into the adaptation and directing. But -- a couple of hours later we were still talking about it and some of the ideas, and it has generated enough interest for us to want to read the books (which will now show up as a Christmas present; I guess there may be an irony there).

As far as the theological aspects, I believe in a God, but am opposed to organized religion, which I believe carries a historical corruption of the idea. The rest of my family is far more interested in the organized religion point. This is a common point of debate/discussion in our house.

It sounds like these books will add nicely to the talking points.

[FoxyKaye]

Here's my point of view from somebody who has not read the books...
I'm glad to hear from someone who has seen the movie before reading the books, and that the movie seemed to "fly" for you. It's always hard to tell, having read the books several times, how much of the narrative I'm adding from my own experience and how much comes across coherently in the movie (although the previous poster to you didn't like it, so I guess this is also pretty subjective). In some ways, I think Golden Compass suffered from the same kind of myopia that Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix did this past summer - very self referential, and a somewhat built-in expectation that the viewer has read the book.

All that being said, I sincerely hope you and your family enjoy the books - they are among the most wonderful fantasy I've ever read, and there's actually a nice hardcover collector's set out right now. There will be plenty to discuss, especially after the conclusion of the third book, The Amber Spyglass.

[cycocelica]

I go to a Catholic school and they discourage us from watching it and the principal at my old elementary school sent letters home telling parents not to watch it. I still plan on watching it since I read parts of the books and thought it was pretty good.

What these "teachers" are doing is exactly what is wrong religion, but this isn't the thread for that.

[PowerFullMac]

I saw the movie a few days ago and its very good! I have the book at home but have never read it, think I will now though!

[Iscariot]

Does Daniel Craig at any point face down an army of Uruk'hai, and without pause for alarm, pull out his sword and cut a swath through their ranks?

[SpookTheHamster]

I saw it the other day and thought that it was missing any importance to the storyline. Nothing that happened in the film had any impact or feeling. In the book, the scene where Lyra finds Billy by the lake is chilling and powerful, the film has no emotion.

Everything is too simple: "We need to go to this place.... We're here now"

[BoyBach]

I was hoping that it would be on the in-flight entertainment of my flight from Singapore to Bali next week, but according to the Singapore Airlines website it's not - 'Ratatouille' it is then!

So now I have to try and find the time to go to the cinema in Kuala Lumpur.

:)

[killmoms]

I saw it the other day and thought that it was missing any importance to the storyline. Nothing that happened in the film had any impact or feeling. In the book, the scene where Lyra finds Billy by the lake is chilling and powerful, the film has no emotion.

Everything is too simple: "We need to go to this place.... We're here now"

Yes! YES! A million times yes! Horrendous and utterly disappointing—a failure as a film adaptation on every level. :(

The ONLY good thing to come out of this is that it will flop so terribly at theaters that someone at New Line will lose their shirt over it and they'll never get to ruin 2 and 3 in the same manner.

[Fiveos22]

I can't wait to see it, but my favorite reviewers were kinda luke warm about it (http://www.avclub.com/content/cinema/the_golden_compass).


From the AV Club Review:
"Still, The Golden Compass does manage the job of bringing Pullman's world to the screen. With luck, any future entries will try harder to get the job done right."

[MyDesktopBroke]

Maybe it's because Mac users are level-headed by default, but this is by far the most respectable, fair and inoffensive discussion about this movie I've seen. Most of the time it turns into a religion bashing/condemning non-believers to the pits hell sort of things*– the worst from both points of view.

I heard Iorek's (spelling?) fight was spectacular.

[Stampyhead]

I'm going to be listening to the audio book this week and then plan on taking my niece and nephews to see the movie over the Christmas holidays. All the church protests over the film are kind of silly in my opinion, and catholic schools telling their pupil's families to not go see the movie is just wrong. If the church feels that it isn't good for their members to see then maybe issue a warning to that effect and let people decide for themselves (not that they can't anyway, but it seems rather insulting). Of course, I'm not catholic (I belong to the "not-quite-traditional-Christian" Mormon church, as notjustjay put it ;)), so it doesn't really affect me if they make the Catholic church look bad. I'm all for the idea of people making their own decisions about things and and about seeing knowledge as a good thing, not a bad thing.

[notjustjay]

I'm all for the idea of people making their own decisions about things and and about seeing knowledge as a good thing, not a bad thing.

Thank you. Me too. If a "Christian" or "Catholic" person views these films or reads the books and as a result decides not to believe in God anymore, then I would argue that their faith wasn't so strong to begin with. Just like, I suppose is appropriate on the Mac forum, if I can get you to switch to a Mac based on one sit-down, then you probably weren't very committed to the PC in the first place (as opposed to the die-hard Windows users, no matter what you say they'll never switch).

I would much rather see a minister preach a series of sermons expounding on the criticisms made by the books/movies, or apologetics to counter them, rather than a blanket "Thou Shalt Not See These Movies!" Much more interesting, lets you learn and explore, and makes you much better prepared to deal with the issues. If a Christian feels that it is wrong I would much rather have a discussion with them about why they feel that way, rather than have them just say "I refuse to read the books, I refuse to see the movies, I just know it's wrong (because my church said so)." Right, and that gets them a lot of street cred too I'm sure. :P

I haven't had a chance to see the movie yet (sigh)... maybe this weekend?

[yeroen]

I'm waiting for Stephen Colbert to chime in on this movie.

Bloodthirsty Armored Polar Bears who are the enemy of the one true church!

[Stampyhead]

Thank you. Me too. If a "Christian" or "Catholic" person views these films or reads the books and as a result decides not to believe in God anymore, then I would argue that their faith wasn't so strong to begin with. Just like, I suppose is appropriate on the Mac forum, if I can get you to switch to a Mac based on one sit-down, then you probably weren't very committed to the PC in the first place (as opposed to the die-hard Windows users, no matter what you say they'll never switch).

I would much rather see a minister preach a series of sermons expounding on the criticisms made by the books/movies, or apologetics to counter them, rather than a blanket "Thou Shalt Not See These Movies!" Much more interesting, lets you learn and explore, and makes you much better prepared to deal with the issues. If a Christian feels that it is wrong I would much rather have a discussion with them about why they feel that way, rather than have them just say "I refuse to read the books, I refuse to see the movies, I just know it's wrong (because my church said so)." Right, and that gets them a lot of street cred too I'm sure. :P

I haven't had a chance to see the movie yet (sigh)... maybe this weekend?

Yes, exactly. Open dialogue is good. We all learn something that way. If more churches worked the way you described perhaps we could eventually eliminate the stereotype of Christians being mindless automatons who just do what they're told.
I've only just started the book but it seems alright so far. I'm listening to the audiobook version during my commute to/from work every day. Hoping to be done with it before Christmas so I can take my sister's kids to go see the movie that week.

[FoxyKaye]

I heard Iorek's (spelling?) fight was spectacular.
My gods yes - it was one of a few moments in the movie that were real highlights for me. What astounded me is that the fight, not necessarily the circumstances leading up to it in the book, was almost identical to the book, including its conclusion (which I'm not sure how they got away with in a PG-13 movie).

Other well done parts of the movie for me were Lyra's first meeting with Iorek (which was almost exactly as I imagined it), and the sequence that begins with he finding Billy Costa in the shack. Even though this wasn't completely faithful to the book, it conveyed the same terror and violation of intercission from the book (although the room that Lyra discovers that is full of cut away daemons would have been a welcome addition to the movie).

Edit: Oh sh*t - I just realized I posted a potential spoiler for folks who have neither seen the movie nor read the full book. Sorry. Anyone who's a mod might want to amend the thread title if they care to to alert folks that there might be spoilers embedded in here.

Edit 2: This has actually been one of the more civil discussions I've seen online re: the book/movie. I agree with the above poster re: if more Christian churches promoted dialog rather than issuing edicts it would do a fair bit of good to change people's general assumptions (including my own) about Christians.