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MacRumors
Oct 19, 2007, 12:30 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple has posted a guided tour (http://www.apple.com/macosx/guidedtour/) of Mac OS 10.5 "Leopard."


http://images.macrumors.com/article/2007/10/19/leopardtour_400.jpg


Apple has been steadily expanding the flow of information about Leopard in the days leading up to its release, detailing all 300 features (http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/300.html). Readers may also be interested in recent stories detailing some of the more less talked about features (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/10/18/some-of-leopards-300-new-features/) and under the hood improvements (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/10/17/leopard-under-the-hood-and-requirements-analysis/), as well as system requirements analysis.

If you haven't already ordered online (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000FK88JK?tag=weeno&camp=0&creative=0&linkCode=as1&creativeASIN=B000FK88JK&adid=1MD6ZAC88T1F7SWKZWPF&), MacRumors readers are organizing meetups (http://forums.macrumors.com/forumdisplay.php?f=114) in their local regions.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/10/19/apple-posts-mac-os-10-5-leopard-guided-tour/)



Multimedia
Oct 19, 2007, 12:31 PM
Almost Down. Will also download the iPod version and put it on my Video iPod.

NOTE: The large 768x480 perfectly fills the 30" Display.

The small 320x200 is going to appear widescreen on the iPod. Very cool aspect ratio design Apple.

Eidorian
Oct 19, 2007, 12:31 PM
Already downloaded and extracting.

theheyes
Oct 19, 2007, 12:34 PM
Nice. I'm still holding off till it gets "tested" for a couple of months in the wild. Thanks in advance people. ;)

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 12:35 PM
It's good to see it in action, perhaps merge this into the original thread ?

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=371543

lofight
Oct 19, 2007, 12:36 PM
watching it !

Does anyone know john? :p

FJ218700
Oct 19, 2007, 12:37 PM
downloaded the large size. Watching now.

Slip
Oct 19, 2007, 12:37 PM
I'm gunna wait until I have Leopard so that I can follow it through step by step ;)

twoodcc
Oct 19, 2007, 12:38 PM
i'll download it when i get home and watch it then

FJ218700
Oct 19, 2007, 12:41 PM
I didn't realize that dragging a folder from the finder to the dock automatically makes it a stack. Cool.

Fabio_gsilva
Oct 19, 2007, 12:41 PM
i'll download it when i get home and watch it then

Same here.

I don't remember well, but as far as I concern there wheren't movies like that to Tiger, were it?

Fabio.

lofight
Oct 19, 2007, 12:42 PM
I didn't realize that dragging a folder from the finder to the dock automatically makes it a stack. Cool.

yeah, and if you hold down the stack, it opens a small menu with choosing of grid and other things

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 12:44 PM
I was very glad to see this today! I was a little upset when they announced leopard but took down the videos with the new leopard information. I really wanted to see updated videos of how leopard works.

This just satisfied me for at least the weekend! Screen sharing looks amazing! :)

vassillios
Oct 19, 2007, 12:44 PM
It's strange that the middle Mac, in the guided tour page, doesn't have a menu bar.

lofight
Oct 19, 2007, 12:45 PM
i also didn't realize the search now in finder!!

Prof.
Oct 19, 2007, 12:48 PM
Leopard is going to be so cool! :D

Prof. :apple:

lofight
Oct 19, 2007, 12:48 PM
i didn't know you can search in spotlight for old files deleted that are back-uped with time machine!

TheSpecialist
Oct 19, 2007, 12:49 PM
AGAIN a new guy?!

FJ218700
Oct 19, 2007, 12:50 PM
I knew that quicklook played movies and read multi-page PDF's, but I didn't know it went full screen, that's going to do away with several apps I use.

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 12:51 PM
AGAIN a new guy?!

i like this guy a lot better than the iphone tour guy...he sounded tired

Luap
Oct 19, 2007, 12:51 PM
Is this guy an ex airline steward? Anyone know? I was half expecting him to say "Inflate your life vest by pulling on this cord" at any moment, in that condescending/simpleton type voice that such people use.

Vaphoron
Oct 19, 2007, 12:52 PM
I love how Johnny Appleseed's .Mac account doesn't expire for another 36,485 days. I wish my account didn't expire for another 100 years.

Eidorian
Oct 19, 2007, 12:52 PM
I'm converting it to DVD format to pass out to users. :D

TheSpecialist
Oct 19, 2007, 12:53 PM
Is this guy an ex airline steward? Anyone know? I was half expecting him to say "Inflate your life vest by pulling on this cord" at any moment, in that condescending/simpleton type voice that such people use.

Definatly true, they should put more feel into it. Instead of just talking in one tone all the time.

queshy
Oct 19, 2007, 12:58 PM
Wow, Johnny Appleseed has some expensive taste...$4995 for a bike...haha.

This is a great video though, really shows off the features of leopard. I cant wait to try it out next week!

Freg3000
Oct 19, 2007, 12:58 PM
I didn't realize that dragging a folder from the finder to the dock automatically makes it a stack. Cool.

Is it possible to not use a folder as a stack? I'd be upset if I can't drill into folder easily like I am in Tiger:

guzhogi
Oct 19, 2007, 12:59 PM
I knew that quicklook played movies and read multi-page PDF's, but I didn't know it went full screen, that's going to do away with several apps I use.

Actually, Quicklook only lets you look at documents on screen. You can't print them, edit them or anything. Plus, I'm not sure how many kinds of files Quicklook actually works for, so you still may need a 3rd party app to be able to read a document.

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 12:59 PM
It still doesn't show whether the Stacks "fan" will work from a dock on the side, but oh well.

I love how Johnny Appleseed's .Mac account doesn't expire for another 36,485 days. I wish my account didn't expire for another 100 years.

Nice !! Didn't look too closely at that detail, lucky him.

Is it possible to not use a folder as a stack? I'd be upset if I can't drill into folder easily like I am in Tiger:

That works more or less the same, when you click on a folder inside a folder in a Stack, it opens it within the original "grid" view. So instead of having tabs stretching across your screen, the grid view goes deeper and deeper without taking up any more space (unless there are more files and folders of course).

burnhamish
Oct 19, 2007, 12:59 PM
Wake me when it finishes downloading.

happydude
Oct 19, 2007, 01:03 PM
freakin awesome!!! can't wait for the copy to arrive!!

FreeState
Oct 19, 2007, 01:05 PM
i like this guy a lot better than the iphone tour guy...he sounded tired

This guys kinda hot too LOL... sorry couldn't resist :p

macthetiger85
Oct 19, 2007, 01:05 PM
This is a great guide! This is the first time most of us have ever seen Leopard in action. I can't wait to get my copy in the mail.:)

(By the way - first post!)

queshy
Oct 19, 2007, 01:08 PM
Howcome when he installs leopard it just "installs" and doesn't ask if he wants to clean install, archive and install, or upgrade?

Luap
Oct 19, 2007, 01:09 PM
Already downloaded and extracting.


I'm converting it to DVD format to pass out to users. :D

Oh dear oh dear...

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 01:11 PM
Howcome when he installs leopard it just "installs" and doesn't ask if he wants to clean install, archive and install, or upgrade?

If you watch the video during the first part of install there was a "custom" button on the bottom left.Thats where you would do a custom install..
E.G. Archive and Install or a "erase drive and install".The default type would be an "upgrade".Thats what he did in the movie.

aLoC
Oct 19, 2007, 01:11 PM
I can't watch that sterilized corporate presentation. Anyone spot anything new?

milo
Oct 19, 2007, 01:12 PM
Oh dear oh dear...

I assume he means he's downloading and burning the video, not Leopard itself.

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:12 PM
Howcome when he installs leopard it just "installs" and doesn't ask if he wants to clean install, archive and install, or upgrade?

I would imagine there's a simple option for new users recent switchers that just does it for you, and an advanced option incase you'd like to customise it a bit more to your liking.

Edit: Gah! Peace beat me.

vassillios
Oct 19, 2007, 01:13 PM
It still doesn't show whether the Stacks "fan" will work from a dock on the side, but oh well.


I had read somewhere that stacks only open in grid when the dock is on the side.

0racle
Oct 19, 2007, 01:13 PM
I am very excited about stacks now. If spaces works nicely with Fusion in fullscreen, I'll be a very very happy person. I also now feel the need to get an external drive for Time Machine.

My goodness that Mac he was on was zipping along.

MacTheSpoon
Oct 19, 2007, 01:16 PM
Leopard's looking really good! That Time Machine feature is pretty trippy. Love its user interface. I also think I'll really enjoy the coverflow Finder, too... although... I kind of wish they could figure out a way to simplify the 3-panel design (sidebar, coverflow, list underneath coverflow) down to 2 panels, just sidebar and coverflow, without losing that list of items currently under the coverflow area... or maybe if they just took that list and put it as a third column on the right side of coverflow. Three vertical columns would be easier for my eyes to read than the current design, I think.

Also, that Mail to-do list feature is a really cool idea, I've often used my email just for that purpose (emailing myself things I need to do). Love how they've made it easy to sync with Gmail and Yahoo! mail.

Also, I kept on admiring that iMac! That new thin design is just so great.

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:17 PM
I had read somewhere that stacks only open in grid when the dock is on the side.

That's silly :(

But predictable.

I also think I'll really enjoy the coverflow Finder, too... although... I kind of wish they could figure out a way to simplify the 3-panel design (sidebar, coverflow, list underneath coverflow) down to 2 panels, just sidebar and coverflow, without losing that list of items currently under the coverflow area... or maybe if they just took that list and put it as a third column on the right side of coverflow. Three vertical columns would be easier for my eyes to read than the current design, I think.

I think you'll find you can probably drag the middle bar to make one section smaller and one larger, so the bottom section might still be there, just completely hidden with just Cover Flow in view.

Also, that Mail to-do list feature is a really cool idea, I've often used my email just for that purpose (emailing myself things I need to do). Love how they've made it easy to sync with Gmail and Yahoo! mail.

I just hope they (Yahoo!, Google and .Mac) add in a special folder for notes and To-do's online, as that'd be much easier to keep things organised than just having it in your inbox.

queshy
Oct 19, 2007, 01:18 PM
If you watch the video during the first part of install there was a "custom" button on the bottom left.Thats where you would do a custom install..
E.G. Archive and Install or a "erase drive and install".The default type would be an "upgrade".Thats what he did in the movie.

Cool, thanks! good news I guess!

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 01:19 PM
I had read somewhere that stacks only open in grid when the dock is on the side.

Really? That would f-ed up

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 01:19 PM
That's silly :(

But predictable.

Not really silly. What if you have a stack with 30 or so items? If it was in fan view it would reach up over and beyond the screen. That's why it's only grid view on the side.

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 01:21 PM
Not really silly. What if you have a stack with 30 or so items? If it was in fan view it would reach up over and beyond the screen. That's why it's only grid view on the side.

You could reach the limit with the dock on the bottom too, with a widescreen couldn't you have more room on the side?

dr_lha
Oct 19, 2007, 01:22 PM
Great video, my feeling about Coverflow in Finder has gone from "What's the obsession to putting Coverflow everywhere" to "I can actually see how that will make my life easier".

BTW to the person who asked earlier, yes there was a similar video for Tiger, I remember because my wife called me a nerd for watching it. This video I made sure I was somewhere I wouldn't be abused!

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:23 PM
BTW to the person who asked earlier, yes there was a similar video for Tiger, I remember because my wife called me a nerd for watching it. This video I made sure I was somewhere I wouldn't be abused!

Does your wife know you post here and if she does, does she read your posts ;)

Not really silly. What if you have a stack with 30 or so items? If it was in fan view it would reach up over and beyond the screen. That's why it's only grid view on the side.

Well the "fan" wouldn't reach up on the side, it'd reach out across the screen, like a banana :p

I know, I know :eek:

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 01:23 PM
You could reach the limit with the dock on the bottom too, with a widescreen couldn't you have more room on the side?

The fan goes up and to the right.If the dock is on the bottom and in fan view it will say at the top of the fan something like " 16 more items in finder"

shecky
Oct 19, 2007, 01:24 PM
while some of the visuals i could do without (dock, time machine's starry night background, etc..) i think leopard is generally looking really good. i like the unified finder, i like the notes/to dos in mail, i like time machine, and a few other things.

it looks like a very sophisticated OS; which is good. i do wonder about how much horsepower stuff like quicklook and coverflow in the finder will take (i hope these new features do not mean a lot of beachballs) but so long as its reasonably snappy im feeling good about it.

now im looking forward to leopard a bit more than i was.

tkermit
Oct 19, 2007, 01:24 PM
..
That works more or less the same, when you click on a folder inside a folder in a Stack, it opens it within the original "grid" view. So instead of having tabs stretching across your screen, the grid view goes deeper and deeper without taking up any more space (unless there are more files and folders of course).

No it doesn't... As far as I know this functionality was removed in recent builds

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 01:24 PM
Really? That would f-ed up

Its true...

Laslo Panaflex
Oct 19, 2007, 01:24 PM
There is a bug in spaces on the build they used for the demo video, the menu bar is cut short:

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 01:25 PM
The fan goes up and to the right.If the dock is on the bottom and in fan view it will say at the top of the fan something like " 16 more items in finder"

is this just mild speculation or are you speaking from experience?

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 01:26 PM
is this just mild speculation or are you speaking from experience?


Too much experience..:)

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:27 PM
No it doesn't... As far as I know this functionality was removed in recent builds

Sorry, I'm not working off of a recent build. That functionality was there, perhaps not anymore.

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 01:29 PM
Sorry, I'm not working off of a recent build. That functionality was there, perhaps not anymore.


I have yet to see that functionality in all of the builds I've worked with sam.Perhaps you're thinking of something else. :confused:

[edit]

Fan view :
Notice the top of the fan

Grid View :

taybo20
Oct 19, 2007, 01:29 PM
i like this guy a lot better than the iphone tour guy...he sounded tired

Speaking of, anyone know what store he works for? He said he works in an Apple retail store. Or is that just for effect?

tonybeyondo
Oct 19, 2007, 01:30 PM
Leopard looks awesome- and I love the video stuff they've been releasing this year to go along with new products. Can't wait to get my new mac I've been waiting for with Leopard preinstalled!

Did anyone notice that all of the "Apple rep" actors used in these look like...

TheSpecialist
Oct 19, 2007, 01:32 PM
I just watchet the whole video and Leopard looks great overall. I really wan't it but can't afford all those stuff. A shame though. Maybe my school will upgrade from Tiger to Leopard, or when they buy new Macs they will have it installed which I will love!!!!

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:32 PM
I have yet to see that functionality in all of the builds I've worked with sam.Perhaps you're thinking of something else. :confused:

Oh, maybe I just explained it wrong or I got it confused with something else, but it was one of the 9A4XX builds, however I deleted it last night (I know I'm naughty) because it has no use to me anymore.

However as I recall, if I opened a stack with a folder in it and clicked on the folder, that folder would open within the original grid view that came up when I clicked the stack. At least for me. And I couldn't navigate back, I had to click out and start again if I took the wrong path.

Edit: I see your fan view, so I assume it wont work full stop as a "fan" from a dock positioned on the side, or it just looks awkward (and not like a banana) ?

Double Edit: And in grid view, if you clicked on say "Stuffit 11", would it open a finder window for you, or would the folder open within your existing grid (not a new grid) ?

imwoblin
Oct 19, 2007, 01:33 PM
So the "Top Secret" features that Stevie teased us with this year is just a myth to hype Leopard or do you think they are included with the release.

0racle
Oct 19, 2007, 01:34 PM
So the "Top Secret" features that Stevie teased us with this year is just a myth to hype Leopard or do you think they are included with the release.
Oh for the love of god. They were shown in July.

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 01:36 PM
I have yet to see that functionality in all of the builds I've worked with sam.Perhaps you're thinking of something else. :confused:

[edit]

Fan view :
Notice the top of the fan

cool, thanks for the example! Personally, I was curious if you could choose the fan even if there were more items.

Merser
Oct 19, 2007, 01:37 PM
I am freaking now... This was a VERY well done introduction. It answered a ton of my questions.

I'm ready!!

JNB
Oct 19, 2007, 01:38 PM
Just watched it, and I have to say that Tiger is now feeling a bit, well, plain.

I'm so jaded. Sigh...

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 01:40 PM
So the "Top Secret" features that Stevie teased us with this year is just a myth to hype Leopard or do you think they are included with the release.

Oh for the love of god. They were shown in July.

Seriously. I don't know how so many people missed the features introduced at WWDC? Over-hyped secrets that didn't meet expectations I guess :rolleyes:.

Oh well, the good thing is leopard looks like the most useful and productive OS X upgrade so far. I am looking forward to using spaces just as much or more than expose!

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 01:43 PM
I have a few questions about Leopard, and if anyone can answer them, please do:

Has anyone tried Menufela with Leopard? I won't upgrade if it doesn't work

Is there support for older scanners than in Tiger? The HP Scanjet 4400c namely has OS9 drivers, but not for Tiger

Is there a warning when you try to rename the Home folder?

Can you share internet via Ethernet to an Xbox 360 without hackery from the get-go

Are there keyboard shortcuts for (a) 'Merge All Windows' in Safari and (b) 'Next Unread RSS' in Mail?

We recently saw a funky volume bezel in Front Row. Is this still there? Is it only in Front Row?

In Safari 2, I could right-click an image and press 'Scale to Fit'. This is not an option in Safari3beta...is it an option in Leopard?

Eric Lewis
Oct 19, 2007, 01:45 PM
anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer either

chr1s60
Oct 19, 2007, 01:45 PM
Downloading now. I enjoy the videos like this and the ones Apple put out for iPhone.

TurboSC
Oct 19, 2007, 01:46 PM
I can taste the Leopard in my mouth. mmmm leopard.

Brianstorm91
Oct 19, 2007, 01:47 PM
My Windows craptop refuses to load anything on the Apple site except for the store, because it knows I'll be ordering by phone anyway :D

But seriously, does anybody have a link to the video itself?

Firefox does absolutely nothing when I try to get on the apple site.

Popeye206
Oct 19, 2007, 01:48 PM
One thing I noticed in the demo... and maybe they're running on a totally kick butt iMac... but 10.5 looks fast! Everything was very snappy on the demo. Vista freaks will be crying when they see this one! Is it next Friday yet???

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 01:49 PM
In preparation for Leopard, I'm starting to use my Dock on the bottom. After being a "sider" for a long time, it's not too bad down there! (That's what she said)

Brianstorm91
Oct 19, 2007, 01:49 PM
he wasnt even really actually using the computer either

Ahaha!

"Wasn't even really actually", nice, I like it :p

ellsworth
Oct 19, 2007, 01:50 PM
what's up with apple using dudes who are married and use the words "Georgeous" and "Beautiful" like it's going out of style?

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 01:50 PM
One thing I noticed in the demo... and maybe they're running on a totally kick butt iMac... but 10.5 looks fast! Everything was very snappy on the demo. Vista freaks will be crying when they see this one! Is it next Friday yet???

That guy's computer is definitely maxed out

jellomizer
Oct 19, 2007, 01:51 PM
anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer either

Not surprising. Because it is staged and acted, over many shots not just one take with him using it live.

benpatient
Oct 19, 2007, 01:52 PM
Is anyone else prepared for screen sharing to be a lot less....impressive than was shown in this video?

Maybe if every person you're "chatting" with is on your gigabit wired network, then full-color full-screen full-speed video will play over screen sharing with no lag and no skipped frames.


...maybe...


but over a standard internet connection like cable or dsl? Un-stinkin-likely!

irahodges
Oct 19, 2007, 01:54 PM
anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer either

i did notice this. I didn't think to much about the fact that he wasnt using it, it was just there for visual representation, then the actual click and stuff recorded separately.

I wonder i that is a new full length wireless keyboard option to ship from apple soon? :p

EDIT: jellomizer beat me to the punch

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 01:55 PM
In preparation for Leopard, I'm starting to use my Dock on the bottom. After being a "sider" for a long time, it's not too bad down there! (That's what she said)

I recently moved to the side, mainly because I'm on a MacBook now and I really need the vertical space. Sure, I could hide the dock, but that's not for me right now, it was more of a phase.

Is anyone else prepared for screen sharing to be a lot less....impressive than was shown in this video?

Maybe if every person you're "chatting" with is on your gigabit wired network, then full-color full-screen full-speed video will play over screen sharing with no lag and no skipped frames.

...maybe...

but over a standard internet connection like cable or dsl? Un-stinkin-likely!

At least it'll be an "experience" :p

liv4Mac
Oct 19, 2007, 01:56 PM
There is a bug in spaces on the build they used for the demo video, the menu bar is cut short:

The bug can very well be on the Tiger Woods game app itself since it's a non-apple app that might not even be Leopard ready. Its the only one that is affected throughout all the apps that were in spaces.

iJawn108
Oct 19, 2007, 01:57 PM
They should have used Joy from the apple quick tip of the week video.

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 01:58 PM
Is anyone else prepared for screen sharing to be a lot less....impressive than was shown in this video?

Did I see that correctly, he had control over her desktop after she gave him permission to share their desktop?

I suppose if it's someone you know and you're watching the whole time nothing's going to happen, but still... gonna have to hide some stuff

ricosuave
Oct 19, 2007, 02:00 PM
anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer either

The cord is barely visible on the left of the keyboard. From the left of the keyboard and the base of the iMac, there is about an inch of cord showing.

Popeye206
Oct 19, 2007, 02:00 PM
Anyone old enough to remember the video that Apple did back in the late 80's that I think was called the Information Age???? If I remember it correctly, there we're many things in that video that are now reality. Looking at what's in here and just the general state of the industry today... this is all amazing stuff. I would have never thought we'd be here back in the day when I was staring at my Mac Plus.... and mind you... thee was lots of staring!! LOL!

adamfilip
Oct 19, 2007, 02:01 PM
Nice. I'm still holding off till it gets "tested" for a couple of months in the wild. Thanks in advance people. ;)

Yeah I hate Buggy videos too! :)

FJ218700
Oct 19, 2007, 02:03 PM
anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer either


THAT IS THE TOP SECRET FEATURE. TELEPATHY.

Hopstretch
Oct 19, 2007, 02:07 PM
what's up with apple using dudes who are married and use the words "Georgeous" and "Beautiful" like it's going out of style?
Let's just say that if this "John" is married, he must live here in the great state of Massachusetts. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Go Sox.

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 02:08 PM
Actually, Quicklook only lets you look at documents on screen. You can't print them, edit them or anything. Plus, I'm not sure how many kinds of files Quicklook actually works for, so you still may need a 3rd party app to be able to read a document.

Developers can write Quick Look plugins so their apps work with Quick Look and iChat Theatre.

JSpence
Oct 19, 2007, 02:09 PM
i like this guy a lot better than the iphone tour guy...he sounded tired

lol im lmao at work at these comments. I hate how my office, for some unknown reason, doesn't have the newest Quicktime. Also, they block all downloads. $#@%!$:mad:

toddheasley
Oct 19, 2007, 02:14 PM
Does anybody else find it suspicious that the Time Machine demo doesn't use -- or even mention -- Airport Disk? It appears that all references to Time Machine using Airport Disk have been removed from elsewhere on the Apple site, too. (Google's still got the old mentions.)

ClassicMac247
Oct 19, 2007, 02:14 PM
I can't wait for the release, and until then does anyone know the song in the beginning? I have heard it on other apple releated occasions, I just cant remeber what it is. Please help me out

Yvan256
Oct 19, 2007, 02:15 PM
Is anyone else prepared for screen sharing to be a lot less....impressive than was shown in this video?

Maybe if every person you're "chatting" with is on your gigabit wired network, then full-color full-screen full-speed video will play over screen sharing with no lag and no skipped frames.

...maybe...

but over a standard internet connection like cable or dsl? Un-stinkin-likely!

I don't know... FireWire and UVC webcams are better than the old ones, and seeing movie trailers stream on my :apple:TV is definitely impressive. Of course they're buffered, but other than that, people with cable or DSL should be able to get a good experience.

nagromme
Oct 19, 2007, 02:21 PM
I didn't realize Leopard randomly deleted files so often :p

Or maybe it's him! We're supposed to take the word of a guy who regularly deletes his own work and then forgets he did it? Time Machine will save the day, but what about his wallet and car keys? I guarantee he has misplaced both. And his pants? There's a reason the video doesn't show them. They're still folded where he left them the night before--in his refrigerator.

jbstew32
Oct 19, 2007, 02:23 PM
I wonder how the guys at Apple pick who gets stuck making all those fake documents and brochures for these demos.

I bet they make the interns do it

nagromme
Oct 19, 2007, 02:24 PM
I can't wait for the release, and until then does anyone know the song in the beginning? I have heard it on other apple releated occasions, I just cant remeber what it is. Please help me out

According to an anonymous comment on YouTube (which may be totally wrong):

Song: Exodus Honey
Artist: Honeycut
Album: The Day I Turned to Glass

bbarnhart
Oct 19, 2007, 02:24 PM
The guide didn't read the entire EULA before he install Leopard.

overcast
Oct 19, 2007, 02:25 PM
Almost Down. Will also download the iPod version and put it on my Video iPod.

NOTE: The large 768x480 perfectly fills the 30" Display.

The small 320x200 is going to appear widescreen on the iPod. Very cool aspect ratio design Apple.
No it doesn't, it perfectly fills 768x480. It's just the same aspect ratio as 2560x1600 for scaling.

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 02:27 PM
I am very excited about stacks now. If spaces works nicely with Fusion in fullscreen, I'll be a very very happy person. I also now feel the need to get an external drive for Time Machine.

My goodness that Mac he was on was zipping along.

Some of it could be the software. No doubt that machine was maxed out, but Tiger was more responsive than Panther, which in turn was more responsive than Jaguar etc.

Is there support for older scanners than in Tiger? The HP Scanjet 4400c namely has OS9 drivers, but not for Tiger

I haven't seen Leopard and you might get a nice surprise, but I wouldn't get your hopes up . I don't think they (Apple) would have spent engineering time on supporting a 5+ year old peripheral (especially when similar devices are on the market for so little). It is probably deemed simply not worth it for the amount of people who would benefit.

I would take the issue up with HP (if you haven't already done so).

Wow, Johnny Appleseed has some expensive taste...$4995 for a bike...haha.

The Pinarello Prince (http://www.pinarello.com/prince/) in the photo is even more expensive and far nicer. Maybe expensive, but he has taste.

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 02:29 PM
The guide didn't read the entire EULA before he install Leopard.

Nor will anyone else. Apple knows thanks to the folks who installed the iPhone software update even though the EULA specifically warned them not to if their phone had been hacked.

berkleeboy210
Oct 19, 2007, 02:34 PM
Why are they so in love with coverflow?

Phobophobia
Oct 19, 2007, 02:37 PM
Why are they so in love with coverflow?

Because it is a very direct link to the iPhone and iPod interface. People like things they are familiar with, and Apple wants to take advantage of that.

Project
Oct 19, 2007, 02:37 PM
Love how Apple is heavily using these video guides.

jholzner
Oct 19, 2007, 02:40 PM
Does anybody else find it suspicious that the Time Machine demo doesn't use -- or even mention -- Airport Disk? It appears that all references to Time Machine using Airport Disk have been removed from elsewhere on the Apple site, too. (Google's still got the old mentions.)

Dang, I just double checked and you are right. All mention of it is gone! I bought an Airport Extreme for this very purpose! Hope it still works. I have a laptop for mobility and I don't want it tethered to an external HD for back ups!

Phobophobia
Oct 19, 2007, 02:41 PM
Will we be able to use iPod Classics with time machine?

overcast
Oct 19, 2007, 02:42 PM
Will we be able to use iPod Classics with time machine?

SCARY.

overcast
Oct 19, 2007, 02:45 PM
I just grabbed the Large file version at 4090KB/s , gotta love 50mbit pipes at the office :)

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 02:46 PM
SCARY.

Why?

It should be technically possible, as the OS can view iPod Classic as a regular volume connected via USB. That said most models (except the 160GB model) are smaller than the HD on most Macs, so you wouldn't be able to go back that far. Also the drive speed is quite slow.

Exodemia
Oct 19, 2007, 02:46 PM
Douche me or whatever but I've got to say this

Leopard absolutely trounces Vista. It makes Vista look like it came out 5 years ago, it's a bloated, clunky, resource-hogger which has poorly implemented features. Over-priced, 10 zillion editions and Ultimate owners don't even get their 'Ultimate Extras'. Leopard is clean, full of practical and easy-to-use features, sleek, fast and all you need for everyday computing. :apple: to the future and beyond!

DaBrain
Oct 19, 2007, 02:47 PM
This guys kinda hot too LOL... sorry couldn't resist :p

Whatever Floats your Boat!

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 02:48 PM
Douche me or whatever but I've got to say this

Leopard absolutely trounces Vista. It makes Vista look like it came out 5 years ago, it's a bloated, clunky, resource-hogger which has poorly implemented features. Over-priced, 10 zillion editions and Ultimate owners don't even get their 'Ultimate Extras'. Leopard is clean, full of practical and easy-to-use features, sleek, fast and all you need for everyday computing. :apple: to the future and beyond!

Do you expect to get bashed for this opinion?

daneoni
Oct 19, 2007, 02:50 PM
This guys kinda hot too LOL... sorry couldn't resist :p

.....and also married.

Anyone else think he looks like Richard Gere?

BTW
Oct 19, 2007, 02:54 PM
Why?

It should be technically possible, as the OS can view iPod Classic as a regular volume connected via USB. That said most models (except the 160GB model) are smaller than the HD on most Macs, so you wouldn't be able to go back that far. Also the drive speed is quite slow.

That actually would be very neat. :cool: Charge, sync, and back-up the mother ship. :D

Phobophobia
Oct 19, 2007, 02:58 PM
.....and also married.

Not for long. He's going to have thousands of people stalking him at whatever Apple store he works at.

Slip
Oct 19, 2007, 02:58 PM
When he creates a note in Mail the date he types is my birthday
Made me happy anyway :)

MrMoore
Oct 19, 2007, 02:59 PM
Is it the 26th yet? :rolleyes:

I'll need to wait until I can download it with my Mac at home, as my Windows PC at work sometimes has issues with Quicktime movies and IE. :mad:

redgaz26
Oct 19, 2007, 03:00 PM
That actually would be very neat. :cool: Charge, sync, and back-up the mother ship. :D

he went and got the deleted files using time machine and the external back up drive?
but if time machine checks every hour would it not take the deleted file off the drive?
someone please explain this to me!

FF_productions
Oct 19, 2007, 03:00 PM
Lol you guys are really over analyzing the video.

Yes it's staged, why would they not stage the video, it needs to look professional and look good for potential customers.


It was a nice way to showcase Leopard.

The one part that made me :eek::eek: was when he said "The installation will take an hour or 2, so just grab a cup of coffee and when you get back, Leopard will be on your Mac."

1-2 Hours? Jesus Christ! Maybe if you install all the crap included with OS X like the printer drivers and extra languages.

Eidorian
Oct 19, 2007, 03:00 PM
I assume he means he's downloading and burning the video, not Leopard itself.The tour only took 18 minutes to convert. ;)

Leopard looks awesome- and I love the video stuff they've been releasing this year to go along with new products. Can't wait to get my new mac I've been waiting for with Leopard preinstalled!

Did anyone notice that all of the "Apple rep" actors used in these look like...I noticed that too! :D

anyone notice that the keyboard(it was wired) cause of the usb and the mouse

was not hooked up to the computer?

it was just sitting there? and the mouse connected to it..he wasnt even really actually using the computer eitherIt's an overlay.

Phobophobia
Oct 19, 2007, 03:05 PM
he went and got the deleted files using time machine and the external back up drive?
but if time machine checks every hour would it not take the deleted file off the drive?
someone please explain this to me!

Time Machine copies your files, as well as data that tells it when the file existed. It will keep a copy of the file as long as it has the hard drive space to do so. The interval at which it updates can be changed. If you are worried about files taking up too much space, you can tell it to only back up certain files.

milo
Oct 19, 2007, 03:07 PM
he went and got the deleted files using time machine and the external back up drive?
but if time machine checks every hour would it not take the deleted file off the drive?
someone please explain this to me!

TM works like a versioning system. It doesn't just backup how your drive is now, it constantly takes snapshots of your drive and keeps track of the changes you make. So it even keeps backups of files you delete.

I'm curious about the prefs for it, about how long deleted stuff is kept and choosing which items and directories to back up. If I delete a huge file, I don't want it backed up forever, especially with things like temp files and old versions that I've converted from.

MacsRgr8
Oct 19, 2007, 03:09 PM
Must be a newer build of Leopard than the 9A559.

Take a look at the different Front Row icons:

First the Guided Tour's version, 2nd the 9A559 build version:

jbstew32
Oct 19, 2007, 03:10 PM
if your HD completely dies, can Time Machine restore it from the external drive automatically? they didn't mention this, but I'd really hate to think it couldn't do that....

redgaz26
Oct 19, 2007, 03:11 PM
TM works like a versioning system. It doesn't just backup how your drive is now, it constantly takes snapshots of your drive and keeps track of the changes you make. So it even keeps backups of files you delete.

I'm curious about the prefs for it, about how long deleted stuff is kept and choosing which items and directories to back up. If I delete a huge file, I don't want it backed up forever, especially with things like temp files and old versions that I've converted from.


thats what i was sort of saying is it going to back up every single thing u do?
and then keep all the crap you don't need.

MacsRgr8
Oct 19, 2007, 03:12 PM
if your HD completely dies, can Time Machine restore it from the external drive automatically? they didn't mention this, but I'd really hate to think it couldn't do that....

Yep.
During installation of Leopard you can also choose to perform a restore from a Time Machine backup.

Time machine copies absolutely everything.... even the system files.

inkswamp
Oct 19, 2007, 03:13 PM
As someone whose job involves making sure a number of Macs play nice on a Windows network, I'm very curious to see what kinds of things Apple has done in that regard in Leopard, although I'm concerned because they haven't commented on that much. In the past, they've made a big deal out of improvements to interoperability with Windows networks and Windows machines but this time around, it's been a lot quieter. I hope that doesn't mean Apple has neglected that end of things.

I'm particularly interested in two areas: how much better Address Book interfaces with Exchange servers and LDAP servers, how much better Mail integrates with Exchange and whatever improvements may have been made to Directory Access, in particular the Active Directory plug-in.

Those aren't very sexy topics, but it's stuff like that that keeps Macs viable in Windows network settings (which is the norm for most businesses) and hopefully Apple isn't neglecting that stuff this time around.

milo
Oct 19, 2007, 03:13 PM
thats what i was sort of saying is it going to back up every single thing u do?
and then keep all the crap you don't need.

That's what the prefs are for. I wonder if it will allow you to select specific items and remove them from the backup individually if you want to.

Exodemia
Oct 19, 2007, 03:15 PM
Yes I did expect to get bashed because some will defend Vista despite the fact they might not like it and say that I'm not being very fair.

aswitcher
Oct 19, 2007, 03:17 PM
Yep.
During installation of Leopard you can also choose to perform a restore from a Time Machine backup.

Time machine copies absolutely everything.... even the system files.

Yeah TM rocks.

jersey
Oct 19, 2007, 03:20 PM
Why at 13:34 is their a gnome in his summer photos time machine recovery?

superspiffy
Oct 19, 2007, 03:26 PM
I've got all my media files on a couple of firewire external hdds. Would TM back those drives too?

FreeState
Oct 19, 2007, 03:28 PM
Must be a newer build of Leopard than the 9A559.

Take a look at the different Front Row icons:

First the Guided Tour's version, 2nd the 9A559 build version:

Here is a better look at the new Front Row icon (from Apple's 300+ page (http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/300.html#frontrow)):

notsofatjames
Oct 19, 2007, 03:30 PM
did anyone notice that the keyboard isnt plugged in. There isnt any USB Cables going into the back of the iMac (until the Time Machine Demo)

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 03:32 PM
did anyone notice that the keyboard isnt plugged in. There isnt any USB Cables going into the back of the iMac (until the Time Machine Demo)

Yes, this has been mentioned...

SiCbe
Oct 19, 2007, 03:34 PM
So I really like they unified almost everything in the UI...

Although in the latest iTunes they changed the scrollbars from this ugly aqua stuff to some new cool scrollbars... I was hoping they would make their way into leopard and get the same scrollbars everywhere but it appears they didn't change in in the build they used in the video yet.

Every thing is new except the old ugly fugly aqua scrollbars! FIX IT! :rolleyes:

daneoni
Oct 19, 2007, 03:35 PM
The OS seems very fast. Then again a QuadCore MacPro was probably doing all the heavy lifting. 1-2hrs for an OS upgrade?

AHDuke99
Oct 19, 2007, 03:45 PM
this video makes me laugh. i am beginning to be a big fan of these tutorial videos apple makes .. like the iphone ones.

Project
Oct 19, 2007, 03:50 PM
lol @ the iChat section

The way it switched from iMac to iMac was very well done.

hadleydb
Oct 19, 2007, 03:55 PM
My video keeps freezing and crap from this dumpy PC at work... will have to watch at home. :(

hadleydb
Oct 19, 2007, 04:00 PM
Is it the 26th yet? :rolleyes:

I'll need to wait until I can download it with my Mac at home, as my Windows PC at work sometimes has issues with Quicktime movies and IE. :mad:

I here ya. I downloaded the latest version of quicktime and this junker doesn't like it. I soooo need to talk my boss into a mac. :rolleyes:

tribulation
Oct 19, 2007, 04:02 PM
Now that resolution independence is here will Apple FINALLY update the cinema display line? It's been how many years since even a small change? I would guess that this has been what they've been waiting for all of this time, any rumors about this?

With Minis and Pros and a cinema display, there's no iSight. Heck you haven't even been able to buy an ext isight in a couple years. I know there's other brands but seems like Apple really missed an opportunity with the extra long delay and I havnt heard any rumors about these. Any hints?

crees!
Oct 19, 2007, 04:06 PM
Actually, Quicklook only lets you look at documents on screen. You can't print them, edit them or anything.

That's why it's called Quicklook, not Quickedit.

Peace
Oct 19, 2007, 04:08 PM
That's why it's called Quicklook, not Quickedit.

Sehr Gut!

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 04:10 PM
Now that resolution independence is here will Apple FINALLY update the cinema display line? It's been how many years since even a small change? I would guess that this has been what they've been waiting for all of this time, any rumors about this?

With Minis and Pros and a cinema display, there's no iSight. Heck you haven't even been able to buy an ext isight in a couple years. I know there's other brands but seems like Apple really missed an opportunity with the extra long delay and I havnt heard any rumors about these. Any hints?

1. There is no scaleable UI in Leopard...hopefully it will come in 10.6
2. A small update came to the displays 199 days ago
3. The only real rumours about the ACDs are about iSights inside them
4. The external iSights went off sale in December 2006

jonny
Oct 19, 2007, 04:12 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/article/2007/10/19/leopardtour_400.jpg

hahaha, nice rim tintin!

lazyrighteye
Oct 19, 2007, 04:23 PM
AGAIN a new guy?!

I like him better than that chump in the iPhone demos.
That aside, Leopard looks wonderful. Can't wait.

tribulation
Oct 19, 2007, 04:24 PM
1. There is no scaleable UI in Leopard...hopefully it will come in 10.6

Is that a fact? It has been on the drawing board since 10.4 or earlier and is on the developer site and was talked about in depth at WWDC this year. Did they really remove it from the release?

On the last wwdc session list it was there also
http://developer.apple.com/wwdc/tracks/macosx.html
'Making Your Custom Controls, Icons, and Artwork Resolution Independent'

Darkroom
Oct 19, 2007, 04:31 PM
so what happens if i have "Fan" selected for my stack, but the stack has 300 items? does it automatically change to "Automatic" or "Grid"?

brinstar
Oct 19, 2007, 04:32 PM
In the video it's stated that Leopard comes pre-installed on all new Macs. So does this mean if I order an iMac today it'll come pre-installed with Leopard? Or does it mean that when Leopard releases? Just curious. I know it may sound silly, but I've been holding out on getting an iMac until Leopard released. Now, I'm quite anxious!

shawnce
Oct 19, 2007, 04:35 PM
Is that a fact? It has been on the drawing board since 10.4 or earlier and is on the developer site and was talked about in depth at WWDC this year. Did they really remove it from the release?

On the last wwdc session list it was there also
http://developer.apple.com/wwdc/tracks/macosx.html
'Making Your Custom Controls, Icons, and Artwork Resolution Independent'

Let me put it this way... nothing has changed from what Apple has stated to developers at WWDC 07.

shawnce
Oct 19, 2007, 04:37 PM
In the video it's stated that Leopard comes pre-installed on all new Macs. So does this mean if I order an iMac today it'll come pre-installed with Leopard? Or does it mean that when Leopard releases? Just curious. I know it may sound silly, but I've been holding out on getting an iMac until Leopard released. Now, I'm quite anxious! Likely the later... aka starting Oct. 26th. Likely any orders for Macs made via the Apple online store wont ship until after Leopard is available. Also I believe any Mac purchased today is within the free upgrade window.

mashinhead
Oct 19, 2007, 04:44 PM
i have to admit that mail and ichat have become much better productivity tools. i still hate the stationary in mail. it would be far more effective if you could say design you're own template in pages and have that integrate with mail. apple templates are horrible and even more, everyone would have the smae one. this feature would be better to create your own html email, if you had to say send out a weekly newsletter in html or something.

i like the share screen option in ichat, but i don't like having someone control my computer. does that make my controling the computer, disabled while that runs? it seems since you are already in a video chat and can communicate with the other user, that you should should just see their screen and verbally communicate. seems a bit redundant. i mean if you're physically going to make changes yourself then shouldn't you just do it on your machine so i can at least still use mine? it's like one guy doing one job using two computers redering one person not working. although i can see it being a useful teaching tool. for example if you're chatting with someone and say they ask you how to do something specific in photoshop. or you could even watch a tv show together or a movie.

i'm really psyched except everyone i can do this with has old macs and old software so i can't do it with them:(

Also while they are all really cool features they seem to be really cpu intensive to me. i just don't see them running that smooth on all machines.

Mac OS X Ocelot
Oct 19, 2007, 04:58 PM
Why come they have to make everybody look like Steve Jobs. I bet this guy's hair isn't even naturally gray and he doesn't need glasses.

nagromme
Oct 19, 2007, 05:02 PM
Is that a fact? It has been on the drawing board since 10.4 or earlier and is on the developer site and was talked about in depth at WWDC this year. Did they really remove it from the release?

On the last wwdc session list it was there also
http://developer.apple.com/wwdc/tracks/macosx.html
'Making Your Custom Controls, Icons, and Artwork Resolution Independent'

My take--as an UN-informed NON-developer :) is:

* The feature has not been "removed"--it was announced for the future since before Tiger, but Apple never said when exactly. I suspect the Leopard DOES have the feature since even Tiger has it (for testing purposes). But it was never listed as a Leopard feature. That was only ever a good guess.

* But I think it will remain a developer feature, not exposed to users, for a while. Apple won't claim it as a feature or talk about it publicly until it is ready to be provide a quality experience.

* Maybe 10.6, but I predict Apple will pull the lever some time next year via free update. Possibly alongside new displays, although I'd love the feature NOW on my current screens.

* So why the wait? Maybe the feature is truly not done, or more likely, a lot of apps don't play nice with it. Until most apps--especially the big names--play nice with res-independence, it will be a frustration or annoyance to users (at best) or a source of crashes and screen scrambling (at worst). And that means Apple's not wholly in control of when the feature is ready for the public. I think it will be available once the experience is a very consistent one.

vassillios
Oct 19, 2007, 05:07 PM
I've got all my media files on a couple of firewire external hdds. Would TM back those drives too?

yes...

vassillios
Oct 19, 2007, 05:11 PM
My take--as an UN-informed NON-developer :) is:

* The feature has not been "removed"--it was announced for the future since before Tiger, but Apple never said when exactly. I suspect the Leopard DOES have the feature since even Tiger has it (for testing purposes). But it was never listed as a Leopard feature. That was only ever a good guess.

* But I think it will remain a developer feature, not exposed to users, for a while. Apple won't claim it as a feature or talk about it publicly until it is ready to be provide a quality experience.

* Maybe 10.6, but I predict Apple will pull the lever some time next year via free update. Possibly alongside new displays, although I'd love the feature NOW on my current screens.

* So why the wait? Maybe the feature is truly not done, or more likely, a lot of apps don't play nice with it. Until most apps--especially the big names--play nice with res-independence, it will be a frustration or annoyance to users (at best) or a source of crashes and screen scrambling (at worst). And that means Apple's not wholly in control of when the feature is ready for the public. I think it will be available once the experience is a very consistent one.

It has been stated that RI is embedded but can only be turned on through the developer tools. The reason it is not turned on is that there currently are not enough apps that utilize RI.

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 05:14 PM
I like him better than that chump in the iPhone demos.
That aside, Leopard looks wonderful. Can't wait.

:D I'm pretty sure he was a project manager involved in the development, so hardly a chump! I think both of them were pretty good, they sounded calm and took their time.

Every thing is new except the old ugly fugly aqua scrollbars! FIX IT! :rolleyes:

Buttons, checkboxes and tick boxes are also Aqua in the style of the scroll bars. So not quite everything.

Why at 13:34 is their a gnome in his summer photos time machine recovery?

I actually read a story that all of the pictures and videos in these things are submitted by Apple employees, because Jobs wants the stuff to look like things everyday individuals can create. So maybe one of them has a fascination with Gnomes! Good spot…

so what happens if i have "Fan" selected for my stack, but the stack has 300 items? does it automatically change to "Automatic" or "Grid"?

It will fit as many in the fan as it can (say 11) and then have an arrow linking to the remaining 289 in the Finder.

[QUOTE=mashinhead;4355001it would be far more effective if you could say design you're own template in pages and have that integrate with mail. apple templates are horrible and even more, everyone would have the smae one.[/QUOTE]

Support for HTML + CSS varies widely from mail client to mail client. The only way Apple can guarantee the recipient will be likely to read it is if they write their own.

If you think Apple's templates are horrible (goodness knows how this conclusion is reached when we have only seen fleeting screenshots), you obviously haven't used or seen "Stationary" in Windows Mail.

http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t62/elppa_bucket/Picture3-1.png

Loudwater
Oct 19, 2007, 05:15 PM
Those functions are amazing! Not mentioning all those useful ones were not shown in the demo video.
I love the Finder! Just a couple of days ago, I was looking for a person's phone number on my PC but just couldn't figure out where it was (and it was kinda emergent). I guess with Finder on my new Mac, it won't be a problem at all! In the Mail part, he mentioned Yahoo, Gmail, etc. but not Hotmail, does that mean Mail do not integrate Windows Hotmail automatically? The new iChat is cool too. I take a lot of pictures while travelling, it's really hard/slow for friends or families to browse all of them where I uploaded on Facebook or myspace. With iChat, I can show them quickly through a good amount and tell them what's happening in the photo at the same time! (But I guess you have to have Mac on both ends first... damn) Stack and TM..... all those good ones just keep flowing in...
I can't wait!!!

metallicaisgood
Oct 19, 2007, 05:16 PM
So I really like they unified almost everything in the UI...

Although in the latest iTunes they changed the scrollbars from this ugly aqua stuff to some new cool scrollbars... I was hoping they would make their way into leopard and get the same scrollbars everywhere but it appears they didn't change in in the build they used in the video yet.

Every thing is new except the old ugly fugly aqua scrollbars! FIX IT! :rolleyes:

I agree so much, I guess I'll have to find a theme for the scroll bars online or something.

pscoble
Oct 19, 2007, 05:18 PM
This is great it really looks good the stacks are starting to look more and more usefull to me. I still really hope they ditch those aqua scrollbars though.

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 05:19 PM
In the Mail part, he mentioned Yahoo, Gmail, etc. but not Hotmail, does that mean Mail do not integrate Windows Hotmail automatically?No, but there is a plug-in

With iChat, I can show them quickly through a good amount and tell them what's happening in the photo at the same time! (But I guess you have to have Mac on both ends first... damn)
All the more reason to convert your friends :)

FreeState
Oct 19, 2007, 05:20 PM
In the Mail part, he mentioned Yahoo, Gmail, etc. but not Hotmail, does that mean Mail do not integrate Windows Hotmail automatically? !

Hotmail wont work because Hotmail does not use an industry standard system (IMAP, POP), Hotmail uses HTTPMail. I don't know if the plug in for HTTPMail (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/18189) works in Leopard .

FSBW21086
Oct 19, 2007, 05:29 PM
I absolutely hate the glowing blue dots. If apple does have to use this stupid dock why don't they implement something like the opacity under the running application darker when open not a stupid blue dot that looks so out of place. The dock separator is also horrible. Two simple things that make me not want to buy leopard even though I will the day it comes out.

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 05:31 PM
I absolutely hate the glowing blue dots. If apple does have to use this stupid dock why don't they implement something like the opacity under the running application darker when open not a stupid blue dot that looks so out of place. The dock separator is also horrible. Two simple things that make me not want to buy leopard even though I will the day it comes out.

Cleardock (http://unsanity.com/haxies/cleardock) will allow you to use the old-style dock. Personally I like the dock separator. The dots do look awful, but thankfully I'm a Quicksilver user, so everything in my dock is an open app :)

Halsey12
Oct 19, 2007, 05:31 PM
Why come they have to make everybody look like Steve Jobs. I bet this guy's hair isn't even naturally gray and he doesn't need glasses.

That guy is my dad. Hi Poppa!

milo
Oct 19, 2007, 05:36 PM
i like the share screen option in ichat, but i don't like having someone control my computer. does that make my controling the computer, disabled while that runs? it seems since you are already in a video chat and can communicate with the other user, that you should should just see their screen and verbally communicate. seems a bit redundant. i mean if you're physically going to make changes yourself then shouldn't you just do it on your machine so i can at least still use mine? it's like one guy doing one job using two computers redering one person not working. although i can see it being a useful teaching tool. for example if you're chatting with someone and say they ask you how to do something specific in photoshop. or you could even watch a tv show together or a movie.


If you don't like it, don't use it. I think this is a HUGE feature, and the ability to actually control the other machine is a big plus. It's perfect for helping out the "grandma" types. And being able to just control the machine can be way faster than telling them what to do. Have you ever looked over the shoulder of someone not good with computers and tried to tell them what to do? Even that can be like pulling teeth. I'm very excited about this feature.

Loudwater
Oct 19, 2007, 05:43 PM
If you don't like it, don't use it. I think this is a HUGE feature, and the ability to actually control the other machine is a big plus. It's perfect for helping out the "grandma" types. And being able to just control the machine can be way faster than telling them what to do. Have you ever looked over the shoulder of someone not good with computers and tried to tell them what to do? Even that can be like pulling teeth. I'm very excited about this feature.

Can't agree more... The only thing is it could be even harder to convert my parents to Mac users. LOL

martinmartin
Oct 19, 2007, 05:46 PM
Does anybody else find it suspicious that the Time Machine demo doesn't use -- or even mention -- Airport Disk? It appears that all references to Time Machine using Airport Disk have been removed from elsewhere on the Apple site, too. (Google's still got the old mentions.)

I noticed the same thing.

I Googled this a few days ago and the google descriptions indicated that wireless backups with TM were possible...but the links were dead.

I hope wireless backups are going to be possible with Airport Extreme...

overcast
Oct 19, 2007, 05:50 PM
i like the share screen option in ichat, but i don't like having someone control my computer. does that make my controling the computer, disabled while that runs? it seems since you are already in a video chat and can communicate with the other user, that you should should just see their screen and verbally communicate. seems a bit redundant. i mean if you're physically going to make changes yourself then shouldn't you just do it on your machine so i can at least still use mine? it's like one guy doing one job using two computers redering one person not working. although i can see it being a useful teaching tool. for example if you're chatting with someone and say they ask you how to do something specific in photoshop. or you could even watch a tv show together or a movie.
.
Are you kidding? You must not work in the IT sector and all of your friends/relatives must be computer whizzes. Having the ability to have a "remote assistance", like that on Windows XP is a BIG DEAL. It's absolutely been a HUGE life saver in more ways than I can count. In both my professional and personal life.

nagromme
Oct 19, 2007, 05:50 PM
I agree so much, I guess I'll have to find a theme for the scroll bars online or something.

I'm not sure why people complain about the glassy scrollbars but not about the glassy stoplight gizmos, the glassy menu bar, the glassy icons for things, etc.

It's not as if removing the scrollbars will remove all vestiges of glass and leave a glorious flat gray world :)

I like the glassy aqua scrollbars a lot better than the ones in iTunes, and I'm glad they are staying.

People used to like the glass, until Vista copied it :)

TassieApple
Oct 19, 2007, 05:53 PM
Great job Apple.... these guide tours are great additions to the release of new products... very helpful.
:)

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 05:55 PM
I'm not sure why people complain about the glassy scrollbars but not about the glassy stoplight gizmos, the glassy menu bar, the glassy icons for things, etc.

It's not as if removing the scrollbars will remove all vestiges of glass and leave a glorious flat gray world :)

I like the glassy aqua scrollbars a lot better than the ones in iTunes, and I'm glad they are staying.

People used to like the glass, until Vista copied it :)
The scrollbars really look out of place against the dark unified theme, the menubar does not...personally I would like the scrollbar shown horizontal near the top of this (http://www.apple.com/itunes/) page :)

sndgeek91
Oct 19, 2007, 05:58 PM
Leopard looks awesome- and I love the video stuff they've been releasing this year to go along with new products. Can't wait to get my new mac I've been waiting for with Leopard preinstalled!

Did anyone notice that all of the "Apple rep" actors used in these look like...

I'm as giddy as a little gurhl...LMAO!

SuperMatt
Oct 19, 2007, 05:58 PM
I think they need a guided tour on how that guy does up his hair...

hotdamn
Oct 19, 2007, 06:01 PM
Sehr Gut!

They speak German in space?

Simplesimon101
Oct 19, 2007, 06:05 PM
that guy in the photo has great posture...

dotcomlarry
Oct 19, 2007, 06:09 PM
I think they need a guided tour on how that guy does up his hair...

Agreed. And where to buy those glasses.

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 06:21 PM
Apple needs a guided tour on how to put links to guided tours on webpages in a good looking way...
http://grapefruit.quickshareit.com/share/picture177b73.png

elppa
Oct 19, 2007, 06:29 PM
The scrollbars really look out of place against the dark unified theme, the menubar does not...personally I would like the scrollbar shown horizontal near the top of this (http://www.apple.com/itunes/) page :)

Apple moves in mysterious ways. I wouldn't be surprised if those were part of the so called "illuminous" UI that got pulled from Leopard but will be refined make an appearance at a latter date.

It's worth looking at what else the company is doing to get clues for where it is moving in terms of appearance — for example when Aqua was unveiled it very much complemented the hardware of the time.

Note how the Aqua style tabs were removed from the web-site as well. Apple can't update that website every year or so, therefore a lot of thought must of gone into how it will fit into the future design ideas. Everything connects…

megfilmworks
Oct 19, 2007, 06:36 PM
I received an email with the link to this from Apple overnight.

Tim117
Oct 19, 2007, 06:41 PM
Apple needs a guided tour on how to put links to guided tours on webpages in a good looking way...
http://grapefruit.quickshareit.com/share/picture177b73.png

Yea I thought it looked really awkward too.

majordude
Oct 19, 2007, 06:43 PM
Wow, what a great video. I wasn't really interested (or excited) about the upgrade -- other than wanting to be on the bleeding edge of technology -- but now I am EXCITED! And I purchased a copy through Apple so I can get it on the 26th! (Anyone know if it is sent FedEx/UPS or if it goes out with morning or afternoon delivery options?)

That Spaces thing is just what I need to keep all my desktops clutter free. I am constantly minimizing and maximizing frames throughout the day. Now I can set up desktops that keep everything where I need them. I wonder if it has a permanent setting so if I always like Mail and Camino running it will save it in a permanent "space" for me.

And Time Machine is pretty slick. I feel like deleting something important just so I can go back in time and get it back! :D

Lastly, I think that Finder (preview) application is going to be the killer application. It will be cool to view documents without having to open them or run a program.

It is SHOCKING :eek: that Apple actually improves their OS with useful, value adding applications and tweaks while Microsoft spends five years working on eye candy and bonehead security upgrades.

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 06:47 PM
Lastly, I think that Finder (preview) application is going to be the killer application. It will be cool to view documents without having to open them or run a program.

Its called Quick Look, and its awesome. If you want the closest-thing-to-it, there is a great Finder replacement for Tiger called Leap (http://www.ironicsoftware.com/leap/video.html)...

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 07:16 PM
I want to visit Nicole too.

RobMccormack
Oct 19, 2007, 07:19 PM
Can You Use Mail With Msn?

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 07:22 PM
Can You Use Mail With Msn?

Yes, with httpmail (http://httpmail.sourceforge.net/) :)

TheChemist
Oct 19, 2007, 07:34 PM
Hotmail wont work because Hotmail does not use an industry standard system (IMAP, POP), Hotmail uses HTTPMail. I don't know if the plug in for HTTPMail (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/18189) works in Leopard .

That recently stopped working for me in tiger.

Seems that windows live is 'allowing/using' pop3 access but only to paying members at the moment.

rtcruz1
Oct 19, 2007, 08:00 PM
This guys kinda hot too LOL... sorry couldn't resist :p

I agree.. he's HOT... a lot better looking then the boring lame looking spokespeople in the other video tours..

Italiana
Oct 19, 2007, 08:11 PM
26th can't come soon enough. Does Leopard throw up a warning if you try to rename your home folder? Seriously, this would save so many people's asses. :o

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 08:12 PM
26th can't come soon enough. Does Leopard throw up a warning if you try to rename your home folder? Seriously, this would save so many people's asses. :o

Unfortunately not!

Taylor C
Oct 19, 2007, 08:17 PM
Personally I think they should've covered migrating user settings with migration assistant, and possibly included a more in-depth look at the different installation methods. This isn't something that I personally need, but I'm sure it would be a godsend for recent switchers.

Other than that, really good video. I liked the narrator in this one a -lot- better than the one in the iPhone guided tours. Can't wait for Leopard.

macpro2000
Oct 19, 2007, 08:18 PM
This was too cool to find John doing the demo...because he works at our Apple Store in Omaha, Nebraska. Funny thing however, I had to teach him about switches and how they can be networked with an AEBS last time I was in. All in all though, a pretty cool guy. Good for him.

Taylor C
Oct 19, 2007, 08:19 PM
This was too cool to find John doing the demo...because he works at our Apple Store in Omaha, Nebraska. Funny thing however, I had to teach him about switches and how they can be networked with an AEBS last time I was in. All in all though, a pretty cool guy. Good for him.

Seriously? I guess it's not surprising that Apple is using actual retail employees, the iPhone narrator was actually someone employed in Apple's iPhone department. I just didn't expect someone to actually -know- who this guy was, on a personal level anyway.

whiteyanderson
Oct 19, 2007, 08:30 PM
watching it !

Does anyone know john? :p

actually John looks like the store manager at the sherman oaks apple store here in socal. guess i was wrong though.

freelunch
Oct 19, 2007, 08:31 PM
Well since macpro2000 already let the cat out of the bag, I can confirm that Jon does indeed work at the apple store in Omaha, Nebraska as a Creative (trainer).

megfilmworks
Oct 19, 2007, 08:40 PM
Ordered mine from Apple, I hope to get it the evening of the 25th, or at the latest well before 6pm on the 26th.

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 08:43 PM
Ordered mine from Apple, I hope to get it the evening of the 25th, or at the latest well before 6pm on the 26th.

Mine says 'Shipped on or before 26th' without an estimated delivery date...I'm worried...

EagerDragon
Oct 19, 2007, 08:54 PM
My Windows craptop refuses to load anything on the Apple site except for the store, because it knows I'll be ordering by phone anyway :D

But seriously, does anybody have a link to the video itself?

Firefox does absolutely nothing when I try to get on the apple site.

The problem you are seeing is because most of Redmond is downloading the video.

FreeState
Oct 19, 2007, 09:09 PM
That recently stopped working for me in tiger.

Seems that windows live is 'allowing/using' pop3 access but only to paying members at the moment.

maybe try reinstalling it? It works great for me... (just wish it worked on the iPhone too...)

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 09:10 PM
maybe try reinstalling it? It works great for me... (just wish it worked on the iPhone too...)

I wish development would be put in to make it Universal...

FreeState
Oct 19, 2007, 09:14 PM
I wish development would be put in to make it Universal...

It doesn't seem slow on my system (MacBook Pro 2.4 4 gigs of ram - that might be why). I'd welcome native support as well - not sure its needed though...

EDIT - mine says it is universal under mail>preferences>HTTPMail

EagerDragon
Oct 19, 2007, 09:15 PM
i have to admit that mail and ichat have become much better productivity tools. i still hate the stationary in mail. it would be far more effective if you could say design you're own template in pages and have that integrate with mail. apple templates are horrible and even more, everyone would have the smae one. this feature would be better to create your own html email, if you had to say send out a weekly newsletter in html or something.

i like the share screen option in ichat, but i don't like having someone control my computer. does that make my controling the computer, disabled while that runs? it seems since you are already in a video chat and can communicate with the other user, that you should should just see their screen and verbally communicate. seems a bit redundant. i mean if you're physically going to make changes yourself then shouldn't you just do it on your machine so i can at least still use mine? it's like one guy doing one job using two computers redering one person not working. although i can see it being a useful teaching tool. for example if you're chatting with someone and say they ask you how to do something specific in photoshop. or you could even watch a tv show together or a movie.

i'm really psyched except everyone i can do this with has old macs and old software so i can't do it with them:(

Also while they are all really cool features they seem to be really cpu intensive to me. i just don't see them running that smooth on all machines.

It is faster to show them than to tell them. Also you dont have to give them your account and they don't have to give your theirs. They can also cut the session if they feel unconfortable with your actions.

Eric Lewis
Oct 19, 2007, 09:21 PM
who is this nerd

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 09:26 PM
It doesn't seem slow on my system (MacBook Pro 2.4 4 gigs of ram - that might be why). I'd welcome native support as well - not sure its needed though...

EDIT - mine says it is universal under mail>preferences>HTTPMail

Thanks! Its been updated since I last checked :)

EagerDragon
Oct 19, 2007, 09:30 PM
Great job Apple.... these guide tours are great additions to the release of new products... very helpful.
:)

Now they need to cut it into multiple 30 seconds tv spots and send them out to the TV stations.

DanB91
Oct 19, 2007, 09:35 PM
Douche me or whatever but I've got to say this

Leopard absolutely trounces Vista. It makes Vista look like it came out 5 years ago, it's a bloated, clunky, resource-hogger which has poorly implemented features. Over-priced, 10 zillion editions and Ultimate owners don't even get their 'Ultimate Extras'. Leopard is clean, full of practical and easy-to-use features, sleek, fast and all you need for everyday computing. :apple: to the future and beyond!this is an APPLE forum! how would u be flamed for bashing windows, the source of suckiness for the lot on this forum? any way i completely agree w/ u!

on a side note.... anyone notice apple is actually starting to promote video games for the mac? could this be a hint?

BWhaler
Oct 19, 2007, 09:51 PM
I can't wait for Leopard.

Please, please, please don't be buggy like the new iPods.

mashinhead
Oct 19, 2007, 09:53 PM
Are you kidding? You must not work in the IT sector and all of your friends/relatives must be computer whizzes. Having the ability to have a "remote assistance", like that on Windows XP is a BIG DEAL. It's absolutely been a HUGE life saver in more ways than I can count. In both my professional and personal life.

Yeah guy. to you and the 3 other people that did the same thing. Listen next time read my post instead of reading three lines and posting something for a cheap applause based on a premature conclusion. I never said it wasn't a useful or important feature, i acutally listed uses for it. one being exactly what you mentioned. When i said i didn't like it was personal preference, I don't want other people controling my machine because i'm paranoid like that. Overall my post is really positive on these featues. you can tell from the first line. gore's right there is no more reason in society.

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 10:12 PM
Why at 13:34 is their a gnome in his summer photos time machine recovery?

I noticed that too, was quite funny.

puckhead193
Oct 19, 2007, 10:13 PM
i love the new ichat remote desktop feature. my mom is going to be using it a lot ;)

elec999
Oct 19, 2007, 10:18 PM
Is there a list of all 300 new Leopard features.
Thanks

jackc
Oct 19, 2007, 10:25 PM
Is there a list of all 300 new Leopard features.
Thanks

http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/300.html

Quillz
Oct 19, 2007, 10:31 PM
I didn't realize that dragging a folder from the finder to the dock automatically makes it a stack. Cool.
One of the best new features in Leopard, in my opinion. Stacks is great, as well as the live thumbnails and Quick Look.

Quillz
Oct 19, 2007, 10:43 PM
So the "Top Secret" features that Stevie teased us with this year is just a myth to hype Leopard or do you think they are included with the release.
Sigh... The "top secret" features were revealed months ago at WWDC 2007. They were *drumroll* the new Desktop + Finder & Stacks. Whoop-de-doo.

Quillz
Oct 19, 2007, 10:46 PM
I can't wait for Leopard.

Please, please, please don't be buggy like the new iPods.
Bugs are a part of life, and you can expect a 10.5.1 release within a few weeks, guaranteed.

jbstew32
Oct 19, 2007, 10:47 PM
Now they need to cut it into multiple 30 seconds tv spots and send them out to the TV stations.

that's actually not a bad idea

Quillz
Oct 19, 2007, 10:54 PM
Developers can write Quick Look plugins so their apps work with Quick Look and iChat Theatre.
Glad to hear this. VLC needs a Quick Look plugin, quickly.

cohibadad
Oct 19, 2007, 11:00 PM
Did I see that correctly, he had control over her desktop after she gave him permission to share their desktop?

I suppose if it's someone you know and you're watching the whole time nothing's going to happen, but still... gonna have to hide some stuff

with screen sharing the other person can use the mouse too so if they get near something you don't want them to see just fight them off until you can close the share!

SiliconAddict
Oct 19, 2007, 11:01 PM
Gah.
The IT pro in me wants me to hold off on installing Leopard until reviews on its stability (In the wild not in the hands of a small number, relatively speaking, of developers.) and until .1 comes out.
The nerd in me likes teh shiny and want to install and play with Leopard the day I get it.

Glad to hear this. VLC needs a Quick Look plugin, quickly.

Ditto with Excel. I hope MS or someone else throws out a plugin to quicklook spreadsheets.

EDIT: Umm is there built in Excel support already?!? o.O The video says Word and Excel docs. Sweeeeeet. :)

EDIT AGAIN: Umm how does one browse through the file system via cover flow. Seems counter intuitive to browse somewhere. Change to cover flow, then change back, browse somewhere else, and then change back to coverflow. Am I missing something here? Almost feels like a tacked on UI vs. an integrated one. *shrugs* We'll see.

Multimedia
Oct 19, 2007, 11:14 PM
Talk about a marketing masterpiece. That video is pure genius. :)

The Leopard iChat's ability to play on other's Macs is a consultant's dream.

cooknwitha
Oct 19, 2007, 11:33 PM
Why did they release this?! It's making the wait all the more difficult!

Spaces has just gone up in my opinion and Quicklook also appears to have it's uses for me. I also plan on using iPhoto once I get iPhoto 8. Up until now, I've never used it.

cohibadad
Oct 19, 2007, 11:35 PM
Talk about a marketing masterpiece. That video is pure genius. :)

The Leopard iChat's ability to play on other's Macs is a consultant's dream.

it's everyone with a computer using parent's dream too

samh004
Oct 19, 2007, 11:43 PM
I hope MS or someone else throws out a plugin to quicklook spreadsheets.

EDIT: Umm is there built in Excel support already?!? o.O The video says Word and Excel docs. Sweeeeeet. :)

I would assume Apple figured it'd take Microsoft a couple years to develop a plug-in for Quick Look so did one themselves to entice more switchers.

twoodcc
Oct 19, 2007, 11:46 PM
i'm downloading this now. it's taking awhile though

Great Dave
Oct 19, 2007, 11:49 PM
Hello All

Does anyone know if Java 6 will be available in Leopard?

Thank you for your help

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 11:50 PM
Does anyone know if Java 6 will be available in Leopard?


It will not at first, but it may come in an update...

pomus
Oct 19, 2007, 11:57 PM
Now they need to cut it into multiple 30 seconds tv spots and send them out to the TV stations.

Apple should learn from others:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kvbWLfr-Z4s

lol, sorry I was tempted. :D:D:D

psychofreak
Oct 19, 2007, 11:58 PM
Apple should learn from others:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kvbWLfr-Z4s

lol, sorry I was tempted. :D:D:D

I love it more and more every time I watch that :)

pkoch1
Oct 20, 2007, 12:05 AM
on a side note.... anyone notice apple is actually starting to promote video games for the mac? could this be a hint?

I have! They started showing World of Warcraft when they started talking about Leopard and Spaces. Now they have the EA Sports games. Maybe there's a lot more to come!

QuarterSwede
Oct 20, 2007, 12:05 AM
it's everyone with a computer using parent's dream too
Amen to that!

ajhill
Oct 20, 2007, 12:17 AM
Amazing! It puts Vista to shame.

Just 6 days to go. I hope I don't have to wait in line again...

Great Dave
Oct 20, 2007, 12:35 AM
It will not at first, but it may come in an update...

Thank you for your super-quick reply.

Do you have any idea why Apple is so slow to release Java 6?

lamina
Oct 20, 2007, 12:38 AM
This video just stoked the fires further. I absolutely cannot wait until next Friday.

The video made me as excited about it as I was when Steve demo'd the 'feature complete' Leopard.

:apple:

SiliconAddict
Oct 20, 2007, 12:43 AM
Amazing! It puts Vista to shame.

Just 6 days to go. I hope I don't have to wait in line again...

Umm no it doesn't but we've already been though that thread.
From Apple's MO my guess is that OS 11 will put Vista to shame. Leopard does continue the trend of putting XP to shame though.
What Leopard does do is point and laugh at Vista for having to be held back a year in class vs. XP that is in the "special" class. You can ID XP by the guy in the corner coloring with green and blue crayons.
If we get as big of an upgrade in OS 11 as what there was between 9 -> 10 then let the public shamings begin.

PS- *sighs* I really need to drop some money on a new 3.5" FW800 enclosure and get a 500GB harddrive. I have a feeling that Time Machine is going to be a beast on my computer. :\ Does anyone know if Time Machine works on drives formatted with FAT32?

BWhaler
Oct 20, 2007, 12:53 AM
Umm no it doesn't but we've already been though that thread.
From Apple's MO my guess is that OS 11 will put Vista to shame. Leopard does continue the trend of putting XP to shame though.
What Leopard does do is point and laugh at Vista for having to be held back a year in class vs. XP that is in the "special" class. You can ID XP by the guy in the corner coloring with green and blue crayons.
If we get as big of an upgrade in OS 11 as what there was between 9 -> 10 then let the public shamings begin.

PS- *sighs* I really need to drop some money on a new 3.5" FW800 enclosure and get a 500GB harddrive. I have a feeling that Time Machine is going to be a beast on my computer. :\

You either haven't used Vista or have low standards.

All fanboi stuff aside, XP is more usable and better than Vista.

Leopard is going to leave them spinning. And this is just the slow march to the new UI and platform. Step by step. (I'll stop now before I get ahead of myself.)

SiliconAddict
Oct 20, 2007, 01:10 AM
You either haven't used Vista or have low standards.

All fanboi stuff aside, XP is more usable and better than Vista.

Leopard is going to leave them spinning. And this is just the slow march to the new UI and platform. Step by step. (I'll stop now before I get ahead of myself.)

My problem with XP is it has no room to grow with technological enhancements. You can say its more usable however can you set customize the PCI Express power mgmt settings in the power options? Does it have a Res Ind interface? Etc, etc, etc. The only reason XP is preferable over Vista is its maturity. And this is the same reason why OS X is generally preferable over Vista. Its a more mature OS.

Italiana
Oct 20, 2007, 01:17 AM
Apple should learn from others:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kvbWLfr-Z4s

lol, sorry I was tempted. :D:D:D

lmfao, is that for real???

Quillz
Oct 20, 2007, 01:30 AM
You either haven't used Vista or have low standards.

All fanboi stuff aside, XP is more usable and better than Vista.

Leopard is going to leave them spinning. And this is just the slow march to the new UI and platform. Step by step. (I'll stop now before I get ahead of myself.)
And all FUD aside, Vista is technically better than XP. Please stop using the weak excuse that XP is better because "it's more stable and more software supports it." This is only because XP has been out longer. Vista has been available for less than a year. You cannot expect all software and drivers to be ready overnight. Anyone who honestly believes XP is better than Vista does not understand anything about the underlying technology that is in Vista's kernel.

And I find it strange how no one seems to care that in addition to copying portions of Vista's UI, Leopard has also seen a number of delays. Why can't Apple fans be just as critical of Apple, who have recently become just as evil as Microsoft?

Master Atrus
Oct 20, 2007, 01:47 AM
So when using the iChat video features with a PC user using AOL IM; will the backdrops and etc still work or do you have to be talking to someone on a Mac running Leopard?

samh004
Oct 20, 2007, 01:49 AM
And I find it strange how no one seems to care that in addition to copying portions of Vista's UI, Leopard has also seen a number of delays. Why can't Apple fans be just as critical of Apple, who have recently become just as evil as Microsoft?

Quite true and lots of Apple fans do see this happening, it's the recent switchers that are generally jumping on top of Microsoft at last, a long time after it was originally done.

On the point of delay's Apple did delay, true, but by a far shorter amount of time if you'll recall.

Multimedia
Oct 20, 2007, 01:49 AM
Regarding iChat remote control of another's computer:it's everyone with a computer using parent's dream tooWould you please explain what you mean by that?

Quillz
Oct 20, 2007, 01:51 AM
Regarding iChat remote control of another's computer:Would you please explain what you mean by that?
I'd suppose that it'd mean that parents who know how to use a computer can check their child's computer for "naughty things." Of course, it could also be used more innocently, they could talk to their children who are away at college or something.

samh004
Oct 20, 2007, 01:52 AM
Regarding iChat remote control of another's computer:Would you please explain what you mean by that?

I think he's referring to his parents' problems faced by using the computer, so he'll be able to help diagnose their issues a little easier.

Edit: A completely different perception as above.

BKKbill
Oct 20, 2007, 01:58 AM
Does it always have to come down to my mom can beat up your mom. Lets just take the high road.

irahodges
Oct 20, 2007, 01:59 AM
with screen sharing the other person can use the mouse too so if they get near something you don't want them to see just fight them off until you can close the share!

ha ha ha...i visualized that and it made me laugh for like 5 minutes! thanks! :D

irahodges
Oct 20, 2007, 02:01 AM
Does it always have to come down to my mom can beat up your mom. Lets just take the high road.

well said. if you like vista...you like vista. if you like xp...you like xp. if you like leopard...you get a cookie! :p let people have their preferences.

Goldenbear
Oct 20, 2007, 02:07 AM
well said. if you like vista...you like vista. if you like xp...you like xp. if you like leopard...you get a cookie! :p let people have their preferences.

XP? Vista? What's that?

Microsoft just got owned, big time!:p

And yes, many of the new feature have been around before, but in typical Apple fashion, they've never been so easy for people to actually use.

This is the first version of OS X that I consider a "must have" upgrade.

Simply amazing!

Quillz
Oct 20, 2007, 02:20 AM
XP? Vista? What's that?

Microsoft just got owned, big time!:p

And yes, many of the new feature have been around before, but in typical Apple fashion, they've never been so easy for people to actually use.

This is the first version of OS X that I consider a "must have" upgrade.

Simply amazing!
Owned? How? Does Apple suddenly own the consumer market? Did major corporations around the world suddenly stop using Windows servers? Leopard is a very nice OS, and maybe it'll help Apple gain 1-2% market share, but no matter how hard Apple tries, it will never unseat Microsoft from its throne. They had their chance back in the 90s and they blew it.

Decrepit
Oct 20, 2007, 02:31 AM
I'm done with the whole black uniform thing...

BUT, Leopard looks insane. Now I have to find a decent webcam that works with a Mini to use the new iChat. And then I have to make find friends with Macs to use the feature. :-) I'm seriously considering giving my current machine to my folks just for video chat.

As somebody who used to teach Windows to tech support staffs for one of the top 3 PC vendors, the Mac OS just keeps getting better and better. I've taught everything from DOS 6.0 through Vista. Each had its own charm and use.

But the integration that the Mac has between applications, and the true ease of use is just incredible. Microsoft should just show this video to the judge every time that somebody says that they are being anti-competitive by having their applications work together. Microsoft applications don't work together. They run at the same time. Apple applications work together.

That presentation makes me want a Mac Pro so that I can have a system as fast as the one they used for the demo. My Mini isn't snappy, as they say.