2008 Formula One Thread [Archive]

iGav

Nov 14, 2007, 10:28 AM

Not certain, but I believe that's a new (though unofficial) lap record (http://www.f1today.nl/liveupdate.php?liveupdateID=20) for the revised circuit. :eek: :D

So, timing glitch apparently... best time of 1:21:3... but still quickest of the day.

Schumacher surprised to be so fast (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63932).

"It took me a bit of time..."

Said Schumacher...

...maybe two laps, and then I was back into the groove,"

:eek: :p :D

Come back Schumi... :( but please not in a ********* Honda. :( :p

Squonk

Nov 14, 2007, 10:36 AM

Not certain, but I believe that's a new (though unofficial) lap record (http://www.f1today.nl/liveupdate.php?liveupdateID=20) for the revised circuit. :eek: :D

And Schumi recorded the most number of laps as well. I'm thinking he missed the cockpit some.... And fastest for both days! I'd like to see Schumi RACE with Lewis!

R.Youden

Nov 14, 2007, 05:09 PM

And Schumi recorded the most number of laps as well. I'm thinking he missed the cockpit some.... And fastest for both days! I'd like to see Schumi RACE with Lewis!

Lewis doesn't even get mentioned in the same breath, not yet anyway and he will have to go some to even come close.

Lord Blackadder

Nov 14, 2007, 07:11 PM

Yeah, like winning 7 drivers' championships. ;)

smueboy

Nov 14, 2007, 10:33 PM

Well, at least 1 championship to get mentioned in the same sentence anyway.
:p

iGav

Nov 21, 2007, 10:56 AM

This should probably go in the 2009 Formula One Thread, but... teams to test slick tyres at Jerez. (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64080) :D

Why they're not going to be used for the '08 season is just... :rolleyes:

Lord Blackadder

Nov 21, 2007, 07:34 PM

Yeah, I saw this today...sounds cool except for the part where we won't see them till '09.

R.Youden

Nov 22, 2007, 02:40 AM

Will running on slick rubber make a huge difference (apart from the looks?). There is only one manufacturer now so it will basically be a control tyre. They could give the grooved tyre far more grip than a slick. To see real benefits you need 2 - 3 manufacturers at least.

SpookTheHamster

Nov 22, 2007, 05:04 AM

I remember reading a story about Ferrari testing with GP2 slick tyres, and the lap times went down quite considerably. I can't for the life of me find it though.

iGav

Nov 22, 2007, 05:07 AM

I remember reading a story about Ferrari testing with GP2 slick tyres, and the lap times went down quite considerably. I can't for the life of me find it though.

I think it was at Monza last year (2006), in an FIA approved test to see it'd contribute to an improvement in the racing.

In the meanwhile...

Schumacher to test again at Jerez (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64084).

First no driver aids, now some slicks. Schumi for 2008 WDC! :D

bartelby

Nov 22, 2007, 05:09 AM

First no driver aids, now some slicks. Schumi for 2008 WDC! :D

No driver aids?

The car had a manual gearbox?

iGav

Nov 22, 2007, 06:30 AM

The car had a manual gearbox?

Paddle shifts can't really be considered a driver aid, it'd be akin to suggesting that synchromesh is one as well. :p

R.Youden

Nov 22, 2007, 06:34 AM

bartelby

Nov 22, 2007, 06:35 AM

Paddle shifts can't really be considered a driver aid, it'd be akin to suggesting that synchromesh is one as well. :p

Semi automatic gearboxes are a driver aid though.

They say "no driver aids" when all they really mean is he had the traction control off.

There are plenty of other bits and pieces that aid the driver that he was more than likely using.

iGav

Nov 22, 2007, 06:58 AM

Semi automatic gearboxes are a driver aid though.

As I said, in no more a sense than how synchromesh could be considered a driver aid, or even a clutch.

The term semi-manual would probably be more apt, because whilst part of the process of changing gear is electro-hydraulically controlled, the actual decision to change gear is decided by the driver.

They say "no driver aids" when all they really mean is he had the traction control off.

Amongst other things, it's not just traction control that F1 will be losing.

bartelby

Nov 22, 2007, 07:02 AM

I'm sorry, I'm in a stupidly argumentative mood today.:o

Glen Quagmire

Nov 23, 2007, 05:21 PM

In fact make the drivers push the cars, that would get rid off ALL driver aids! :rolleyes:

I remember Minardi having to test on F3000 tyres because they didn't have a contract with either Bridgestone or Michelin at the time. They where about 5 seconds a lap slower than usual!

That's because they were Avon tyres, not designed for the car. And it was a Minardi.

I don't mind semi-auto gearboxes, but I'm glad that traction control has gone.

Lord Blackadder

Nov 24, 2007, 09:15 AM

So what do you reckon are the odds that Schu will race in a GP again? Most drivers find it hard to step away, and Schu seems not to have lost any speed since he left...

Ensign Paris

Nov 24, 2007, 04:31 PM

To be honest I don't think it is a terrible thing that M. Schumacher may come back. It would be great to see him race head to head against Hamilton. Schumacher for champion in 2008 :)

Ensign

ps. Hello again!

MOFS

Nov 24, 2007, 05:02 PM

So what do you reckon are the odds that Schu will race in a GP again? Most drivers find it hard to step away, and Schu seems not to have lost any speed since he left...

I can't see him coming back as a race driver, but a proper test driver is a distinct possibility. Much better than Luca Badoer anyway!:eek:

Oh and Prodrive won't be racing this yr either...http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7109405.stm

Counterfit

Nov 24, 2007, 05:04 PM

Much better than Luca Badoer anyway!:eek:

If I had to pick two guys to develop a car, it would be Badoer and Schumacher.

MOFS

Nov 24, 2007, 05:06 PM

If I had to pick two guys to develop a car, it would be Badoer and Schumacher.

Personally I'd pick Brawn and Newey.:p

Highcroft

Nov 24, 2007, 05:11 PM

Oh and Prodrive won't be racing this yr either...http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7109405.stm
To bad, I really wanted to see them race next year. Hopefully this means they continue with their Le Mans program.

iGav

Nov 26, 2007, 10:32 AM

ps. Hello again!

Blimey... :eek: :eek: hello again fella. :)

<edit>And MOFS too... :)

To the task at hand...

Purnell: engine freeze good for F1 (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64117).

He does have a point I guess.

And more importantly...

Schumacher wins go-kart challenge (http://www.autosport.com/news/grapevine.php/id/64105).

He must be tempted you know... :D

iGav

Dec 6, 2007, 01:24 PM

scotthayes

Dec 6, 2007, 01:41 PM

Renault found guilty but not penalised (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64302).

Pretty much the same as McLaren in July, the transcript should make interesting reading, especially the part where McLaren start throwing all their toys out of the pram. :p

Waiting for somebody to say the FIA don't have anything against McLaren. Bet Ron Dennis is mega pissed-off tonight.

DAC47

Dec 6, 2007, 02:12 PM

I'm confused Mclaren & Renault got caught doing basically the same thing
one gets a $100 million fine the other gets a slap on the wrist (if that)
isn't that just a tiny bit inconsistent?

Remind me, in which country is the FIA based?

SpookTheHamster

Dec 6, 2007, 02:49 PM

The 10 year freeze is still stupid.

If F1 engines are irrelevant, why would you freeze them as being so irrelevant for 10 years? A better way to keep F1 relevant would be to force the cars to do, say, 20mpg by bringing in fixed fuel amounts for races with no refuelling.

I predict that if this comes in, it won't last the 10 years. Either that or the "rogue" teams finally go through with their competing series plan.

iGav

Dec 6, 2007, 02:50 PM

I'm confused Mclaren & Renault got caught doing basically the same thing one gets a $100 million fine the other gets a slap on the wrist (if that) isn't that just a tiny bit inconsistent?

Nope. The precedent was set in July when McLaren were found guilty but went unpunished as well.

scotthayes

Dec 7, 2007, 02:44 AM

Nope. The precedent was set in July when McLaren were found guilty but went unpunished as well.

Unpunished!!! So what do you call loosing all constructors points?

R.Youden

Dec 7, 2007, 03:24 AM

Unpunished!!! So what do you call loosing all constructors points?

They where punished at a later hearing when evidence of an e-mail conversation between Alonso and De La Rosa became apparent, and phone calls and text message logs where found to show more communication between Stepney and Coughlan. It was at that point that McLaren where penalised.

RemarkabLee

Dec 7, 2007, 04:30 AM

iGav

Dec 7, 2007, 05:32 AM

They where punished at a later hearing when evidence of an e-mail conversation between Alonso and De La Rosa became apparent, and phone calls and text message logs where found to show more communication between Stepney and Coughlan. It was at that point that McLaren where penalised.

Indeed. I suspect that should any new evidence come to light suggesting that Renault were receiving a near constant stream of information from a current senior McLaren staff member throughout the majority of the 2007 Formula 1 season then they, like McLaren will be invited back to an extraordinary meeting of the WMSC and will suffer a similar penalty.

Personally... I think both McLaren and Renault should've been excluded from participating in the 2008 Formula 1 World Championship.

God bless the good ship Ferrari. :p :p :p

AlBDamned

Dec 7, 2007, 05:49 AM

AlBDamned

Dec 7, 2007, 06:28 AM

Also looks like the younger Schumacher may be hanging up the fireproof overalls... (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7116961.stm)

Edit: Scratch that, it looks like wayward BBC interpretation compared to the Autosport report (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64306) on the same quotes... :rolleyes:

iGav

Dec 7, 2007, 06:45 AM

but time and history aren't on his side.

History could be... Lauda in '84 and Prost in '93 are two examples of drivers making a a comeback and winning the WDC.

But I'm convinced that he'd take Räikkönen over a season. Schumacher's average gap over Massa was significantly greater than that of Räikkönen's. ;)

Also looks like the younger Schumacher may be hanging up the fireproof overalls...

He's done nothing other than bring the good name of Schumacher into disrepute. :p

Squonk

Dec 7, 2007, 08:45 AM

I'd like to see Schumacher back. Don't care what team, but to have him race on a futher leveled field with another two champions on the grid would be a good test for him, especially after taking a sabbatical year.

It's unlikely though, why risk being beaten to the title again? :D

Having said that, his already uber high status would send his kudos level to new heights if he spanked the opposition again for 'old times sake'.

I wonder what team he'd come back to. Would Ferrari cut Kimi or Massa to have one more year of Michael? And for that matter, Michael would only come back to a team with a car that is a title contender - so that would be Ferrari, McLaren and what? Bmw maybe?

I'd like to see him back for a full season, but I just don't see it happening, sadly.

JFreak

Dec 7, 2007, 09:48 AM

I wonder what team he'd come back to.

Ferrari.

Would Ferrari cut Kimi or Massa to have one more year of Michael?

Yes, Massa is not a world champion.

Squonk

Dec 7, 2007, 09:59 AM

Ferrari.

Yes, Massa is not a world champion.

And Massa only has 1 more year on this contract, right? I guess that makes sense. I like Massa, but for Michael, I'd let him go. Hmm, so then in 2009 it would be Kimi and Fred?

DAC47

Dec 7, 2007, 10:24 AM

Nope. The precedent was set in July when McLaren were found guilty but went unpunished as well.

Either way it Looks unfair in the light of the mclaren fine

Squonk

Dec 7, 2007, 11:01 AM

The McLaren-Mercedes Formula One team will have to wait several more weeks before it learns whether or not the FIA has found its 2008 car includes any of Ferrari's intellectual property.

If it does, McLaren-Mercedes will face further sanctions on top of the $100 million fine and loss of constructors' championship points it was hit with in 2007 as a result of the spy scandal that rocked the sport.

The FIA World Motor Sport Council met in Monaco on Friday, Dec. 7, and was set to announce the findings of inspectors who examined McLaren's new MP4-23 car.

The FIA sent inspectors to review the car's design after it became clear that information passed by former Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney to former McLaren chief designer Mike Coughlan might have been used in the design or technology of McLaren's new car.

The FIA now wants McLaren and Ferrari to comment on the inspectors' findings and has scheduled a meeting for Feb. 14 in Paris.

I guess this means that Fred will not make up his mind and Mc and Ren and Toy are all in a holding pattern?

iGav

Dec 7, 2007, 12:30 PM

Either way it Looks unfair in the light of the mclaren fine

Maybe, but I'd argue that it's better that it looks unfair rather than it actually been unfair which it undeniably would've been had Renault been punished for a similar offense to which McLaren themselves went unpunished for in July.

OllyW

Dec 10, 2007, 07:15 AM

Fred back at Renault (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7136498.stm)

Lord Blackadder

Dec 10, 2007, 08:42 PM

Huge surprise, that...Flav seemed able to handle him before, anyway. But is the car good for a championship run?

AlBDamned

Dec 10, 2007, 09:14 PM

Huge surprise, that...Flav seemed able to handle him before, anyway. But is the car good for a championship run?

Depends how much McLaren is in it I guess. Or Ferrari for that matter. Fred has intimate knowledge of both, although I'd warrant that he wouldn't be as stupid next time to e-mail people admitting as such... :rolleyes:

needthephone

Dec 11, 2007, 05:29 AM

The FIA are doing their best to ruin F1. What nonsense all the Ferrari spying business is. F1 is such a tight knit sport where engineers at all levels from mechanics to head desgners go from team to team regularly. Ferrari were notorous for spying on radio traffic.

If ferrari were so foolish as to piss off their head designer so much that he copies documents and offers them to other teams it is their fault.

F1 is in free fall and most people think its a complete farce, Mclaren not being awarded any points but their drivers still eligible. What crap.

I'm totally loosing interest in F1 and the FIA won't rest until all the geat UK teams are out of the running.

Most spectators won't care and will be turned off by all this. All the people I know who were once huge F1 fans (myself included) are now turned off this festering sport to the point of vowing not to watch it anymore.

I have been to many GP and would look forward to my copy of Grand Prix International magazine. Now its nothing more than oversponsored borefest.

What sort of an example is Alonso to my kids? A brooding pouting self centred bitter over paid ego maniac who seems clinically deranged and ruthless. Where are teh knock about larikins like Alan Jones and James hunt-they were heroes. Not this bunch of whining prima donners

Sorry for my rant but I am so fed up with all these stupid rule changes, prancing spoilt drivers and now this spying crap is the final straw for me.

http://en.ce.cn/sports/formula/200707/30/t20070730_12359126.shtml

Squonk

Dec 11, 2007, 01:44 PM

Fred back at Renault (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7136498.stm)

I am surprised that there is no discussion about this.... I guess we all expected it to go this way. And Heike gets the boot to not be too competitive with Fred. I hope Heike gets the McLaren spot and has a great season and scores more points than Fred.

Lord Blackadder

Dec 12, 2007, 10:03 PM

Schumi the Cabbie. (http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3213_2963058,00.html)

Most hilarious thing I've read all week. :D

iGav

Dec 13, 2007, 02:11 PM

Disgraceful (http://www.fia.com/public/mclaren.pdf).

FIA moves to close spying affair (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64373).

Not really. If they wanted to truly close the spying affair, they would've kicked McLaren out of the sport. For good.

iGav

Dec 14, 2007, 09:49 AM

McLaren plan no launch for new car (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64386).

No need when the original is being launched in Maranello on Jan 7th.

Also...

Heikki (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64384) confirmed at McLaren for 2008.

R.Youden

Dec 21, 2007, 07:46 AM

Its a while since I posted on here, anyway:

Fred to Renault, not a huge shock there.

Heikki to McLaren, good move by McLaren. Ferd did a Senna and said that he didn't want Heikki as a team mate because he was too fast, poor little Freddie!

And Lewis has been caught doing over 120mph in France.

Now this may cause a few outbursts, but it is my opinion that if a driver is caught speeding on the public highway then they should be penalised in the sport. They have a responsibility to show people that just beacsue they drive at 200mph it does not make that behaviour acceptable on a road and they are commiting a serious crime. I just think it sends out all the wrong messages, and Lewis is behaving like a spoilt child at the moment.

R.Youden

Jan 6, 2008, 07:19 AM

New ferrari for 2008 (sorry, don't know how long the pics will stay up, they should not be out 'till tomorrow):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/1-5.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/3-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/5-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/4.jpg

Looks OK, Toyota style front nose.

R.Youden

Jan 6, 2008, 07:33 AM

To compare to the F2007 (top)

http://cars.wallpaperme.com/index.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=6483&g2_serialNumber=2
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Ajacied/2.jpg

The most obvious changes are the new engine cover (BMW link) and the higher head protectors around the cockpit. Also, there are no turning veins around the rear of the nose section (the are now in the suspension). The also have dropped the telemetry antenna so they may be running the flat-patch antenna like the Honda have in the past.

The overall height of the side pod is the same, but they have been 'lifted' with more of an undercut.

There is also some slits in the sidepod winglet.

iGav

Jan 6, 2008, 07:56 AM

To compare to the F2007 (top)

It's difficult to compare the two at the moment, the same way as it was between the 248 and the F2007 at launch, because the launch photographs seldom show the new (season starting) aero-package.

And a link posted on the Atlas Forums reminded me just how good a contemporary Ferrari F1 car would look with '80's aping black wings and detailing. :D

Here (http://www.mschumacher.extra.hu/FaF.jpg).

R.Youden

Jan 6, 2008, 08:52 AM

It's difficult to compare the two at the moment, the same way as it was between the 248 and the F2007 at launch, because the launch photographs seldom show the new (season starting) aero-package.

And a link posted on the Atlas Forums reminded me just how good a contemporary Ferrari F1 car would look with '80's aping black wings and detailing. :D

Here (http://www.mschumacher.extra.hu/FaF.jpg).

Ferrari have said that they will see some updates before Australia. That is pretty obvious when you look at the rear wing end plates, they are almost identical as last year.

iGav

Jan 6, 2008, 12:03 PM

Ferrari have said that they will see some updates before Australia. That is pretty obvious when you look at the rear wing end plates, they are almost identical as last year.

Supposed to be an innovative nose in the works isn't there... :D

MOFS

Jan 6, 2008, 02:52 PM

Counterfit

Jan 6, 2008, 03:32 PM

It's difficult to compare the two at the moment, the same way as it was between the 248 and the F2007 at launch, because the launch photographs seldom show the new (season starting) aero-package.

And a link posted on the Atlas Forums reminded me just how good a contemporary Ferrari F1 car would look with '80's aping black wings and detailing. :D

Here (http://www.mschumacher.extra.hu/FaF.jpg).

Holy crap that looks sexy! I always enjoyed the Marlboro/Vodafone red with white, but this car would look amazing in red/black, especially since I'm not really a fan of the red/red.

Also, I don't think those are Ferraris in that picture. The top and bottom aren't even the same development of whatever car they are.

R.Youden

Jan 6, 2008, 03:52 PM

Looks a bit burnt to be honest.:eek: Wonder what the Honda livery is gonna be? Grey with smog detailng?:p

They will have to stick with the Earth car for a few more seasons, it won't send out a good message if they say, well actually this environment stuff is all crap, we want sponsors!

Malcster

Jan 7, 2008, 07:38 AM

McLaren MP4-23 just revealed at Stuttgart.

iGav

Jan 7, 2008, 09:05 AM

McLaren MP4-23 just revealed at Stuttgart.

At least they've painted it a different colour. ;)

vendettabass

Jan 7, 2008, 10:32 AM

wow.. mclaren number 23 :(

Squonk

Jan 7, 2008, 10:38 AM

wow.. mclaren number 23 :(

I had missed that. Yeah, that sure does look out of place...

Malcster

Jan 7, 2008, 10:46 AM

At least they've painted it a different colour. ;)

What with all the spygate stuff from last year i was half expecting it to be red ;)

As with Ferrari, McLaren have said final aero package won't come till much closer to first race in March, im looking forward to them all rediscovering there limits with no traction control, especially in the wet :D

R.Youden

Jan 7, 2008, 12:58 PM

Interesting little detail on the McLaren airbox:

http://www.motorsport-total.com//bilder/2008/080107/z1199716202.jpg

Also if you compare the Ferrari F2007 at Brazil to the F2008 at launch:

http://www.formulamag.com/images/news/30014/f2007-side_large.jpg
http://www.formulamag.com/images/news/30021/newf20082_large.jpg

There ain't much difference between the two...

R.Youden

Jan 9, 2008, 02:16 PM

Just found this on the Mclaren steering wheel:

http://www.mschumacher.extra.hu/tc%20off.jpg

"TC Off" Hmmmm........

iGav

Jan 10, 2008, 04:24 AM

"TC Off" Hmmmm........

Once a cheater always a cheater... ;)

But it's straightforwardphotoshopfookover isn't it?

c-Row

Jan 10, 2008, 04:39 AM

Just found this on the Mclaren steering wheel:

"Drinks"? :D

R.Youden

Jan 10, 2008, 11:38 AM

"Drinks"? :D

Oh yeah the drinks button is very important. At Honda we used to have a windscreen whipper pump connected to the button to inject fluid into the drivers mouth. No expense spared there!

SpookTheHamster

Jan 10, 2008, 05:24 PM

Just found this on the Mclaren steering wheel:

"TC Off" Hmmmm........

Sure the wheel isn't just carried over from the old car for the time being?

R.Youden

Jan 11, 2008, 03:40 AM

Sure the wheel isn't just carried over from the old car for the time being?

Well it shouldn't be. With the new McLaren electronics systems they should have a new wheel. What I guess is they havn't got it finished and they can get away with showing the car with an old wheel as it looks like a standard McLaren wheel. This is one of the big advantages for McLaren with the new standard electronics. They don't have to totally redesign everything, all the other teams need to design new wheels, housing brackets for the units, cooling systems, harness layouts. McLaren get a big advantage with this.

TheChillPill

Jan 11, 2008, 05:34 AM

That is definitely last year's wheel - I actually have one of them on display in my office, and it's identical to that.

R.Youden

Jan 11, 2008, 04:45 PM

I quite like the knobs on the McLaren wheel where the number is visible through a cut-out. The other buttons can easily be mapped to any setting that the driver likes. All that happens is the labels are moved and remapped. Each driver will have his own data set which is loaded onto the car with a corresponding data mapping. From what I can remember Taku and Jenson had the buttons at completely different locations, very complicated when a driver changes cars or goes to the T-car, they have to ensure the correct data set.

iGav

Jan 13, 2008, 08:43 AM

Engine freeze shortened to five years (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64660).

with provisional engine regulations due to be presented to the teams within the next two years.

And potentially budget caps too... though it's difficult to see how they can be implemented without the risk of potential infractions... no matter how great or small... for example would a team that strayed over the cap by a £10 be subject to the same punishment as one that strays over by £10,000,000?

pachyderm

Jan 16, 2008, 04:45 PM

new BMW

http://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-tm-0304.jpg

http://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-xp-0342.jpg

pachyderm

Jan 17, 2008, 04:14 PM

http://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-xp-0276.jpg

http://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-xp-0279.jpg

Toyota TF108

pachyderm

Jan 17, 2008, 04:16 PM

http://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-xp-0543.jpghttp://motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/gen/f1-2008-gen-xp-0565.jpg

Red Bull RB4

pachyderm

Jan 17, 2008, 04:20 PM

Ferrari: Raikkonen, Massa

McLaren: Hamilton, Kovelainen

BMW: :apple:Heidfeld:apple:, Kubica

Renault: Alonso, Piquet

Williams: :apple:Rosberg:apple:, Nakajima

Red Bull: Webber, Coulthard

Toyota: :apple:Trulli:apple:, Glock

Honda: Button, Barrichello

Super Aguri: TBA, TBA

Toro Rosso: Vettel, Bourdais

Force India: Sutil, Fisichella

Currently unconfirmed seats:

Super Aguri

c-Row

Jan 17, 2008, 04:34 PM

I really hope Heidfeld can keep up his great performance of last year. Oh, and the new BMW can hopefully take on Ferrari and McLaren. :cool:

Brianstorm91

Jan 17, 2008, 04:37 PM

http://www.independent.ie/multimedia/archive/00082/Lewis_Hamilton_has_p_82959t.jpg
:D

pachyderm

Jan 18, 2008, 05:34 AM

I really hope Heidfeld can keep up his great performance of last year. Oh, and the new BMW can hopefully take on Ferrari and McLaren. :cool:

me too.

and jarno, poor little jarno...:o:rolleyes:;)

xUKHCx

Jan 18, 2008, 07:40 AM

Want calendars are people using to keep track of this season.

The best one I found is this one (http://www.icalshare.com/article.php?story=2007101508252225). Shame apple messed up iCal a bit it is less user friendly.

iGav

Jan 18, 2008, 08:30 AM

Two observations.

F1 cars whose dominant colour is white, look really... dull.

And

That RB4 looks like a pastiche of every other F1 car.

iGav

Jan 18, 2008, 09:02 AM

McLaren extend Hamilton's contract (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64757).

Unsurprising really.

Though quite why one would wish to stay with a team of serial cheaters with a reputation that potentially taints ones achievements is beyond me. :confused:

Should've gone to the team that epitomises honesty and integrity... :D

pachyderm

Jan 18, 2008, 03:26 PM

Two observations.

F1 cars whose dominant colour is white, look really... dull.

And

That RB4 looks like a pastiche of every other F1 car.

i like a white car or all one color.

and for me most F1 cars look very similar ...

TheChillPill

Jan 18, 2008, 04:05 PM

pachyderm

Jan 18, 2008, 07:09 PM

When I heard Williams were showcasing their milestones with 6 different liveries during testing, I really hoped they would bring back the livery on the FW14 - one of the best looking cars in modern F1 history (IMO)

i agree.:apple:

http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/tes/f1-2008-tes-xp-0040.jpg

On Monday, to inaugurate the start of Williams' thirtieth year of Formula One racing, the Williams F1 team will unveil the first of six winter test liveries designed to celebrate a sequence of landmarks that will take place when the 2008 FIA Formula One World Championship gets underway in March later this year.

As the two FW29B interim cars rolled out this morning at the Jerez de la Frontera circuit to start the team's preparation and testing for 2008, the car livery will include references to the company's 30th year of racing and its 500th entry in a Formula One Grand Prix, a milestone that will be recorded at the Turkish Grand Prix this season. In addition, the team will record its 50,000 racing lap during the forthcoming year, potentially during the Spanish Grand Prix in Barcelona assuming both FW30s demonstrate a complete finishing record to this point in the season.

In addition to these company milestones, the Monaco Grand Prix will be Frank Williams' 600th Formula One Grand Prix as an entrant, and with a personal record that will span 39 years (and only 23 races missed in almost four decades), he will become the sport's longest enduring entrant, surpassing the record of the legendary Enzo Ferrari.

The team will release its second winter livery at the Valencia test next week, which is also scheduled to be the first run for the team's 2008 racecar, the FW30, which will make its track debut on Tuesday, January 22, 2008. In total, six themed liveries will be run across the two month winter testing campaign in Spain prior to the team's full racing colours being released prior to the season's inaugural race in Melbourne, Australia on March 16, 2008.

iGav

Jan 21, 2008, 04:54 AM

Stepney says not to blame for spy scandal (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64770).

Didn't he originally deny anything to do with it?
Didn't he originally state that he was being set-up?

I bet his arse is burning... ;)

R.Youden

Jan 21, 2008, 07:11 AM

Well today we got the new Renault and Williams:

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests13/diapo_111.jpg

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests13/diapo_118.jpg

I really don't like the trend for the bridge nose wing which almost all teams are running now. Hopefully the FIA will do something about banning them soon. :(

pachyderm

Jan 21, 2008, 07:35 AM

Well today we got the new Renault and Williams:

I really don't like the trend for the bridge nose wing which almost all teams are running now. Hopefully the FIA will do something about banning them soon. :(

me either! it looks like it would catch more wind than re-funnel it a good direction.

so far only the BMW doesn't have one! i hope they win...:apple:

pachyderm

Jan 21, 2008, 04:58 PM

http://www.pitpass.com/images/galleries/2008fw30debut/2008fw30debut_s006.jpghttp://www.pitpass.com/images/galleries/2008fw30debut/2008fw30debut_s010.jpg

more of the williams...

iGav

Jan 23, 2008, 04:52 AM

so far only the BMW doesn't have one! i hope they win...

No... they've something far more heinous. :eek: :eek: :p

R.Youden

Jan 23, 2008, 05:05 AM

No... they've something far more heinous. :eek: :eek: :p

Maybe a better view:

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests18/diapo_108.jpg

Personally I think they look better, but hey.

Also the new Honda RA108:

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests22/diapo_124.jpg

Markleshark

Jan 23, 2008, 05:06 AM

Whats that on the nose of the Williams? [The Lettering]

R.Youden

Jan 23, 2008, 05:09 AM

Could be staff names. At Honda we used to have all the staff names on the inside of the rear end plate. Or it could have something to do with their year of records they are promoting.

TheChillPill

Jan 23, 2008, 05:13 AM

It's definitely the staff names - it was added to coincide with their 'Thanks' livery.

iGav

Jan 23, 2008, 05:31 AM

Speaking of the Williams livery, I do hope they'll continue their tradition of carrying the Senna S on their cars.

Markleshark

Jan 23, 2008, 05:39 AM

That white Honda looks (If you'll excuse the pun) worlds better than last years livery.

pachyderm

Jan 23, 2008, 05:49 AM

Maybe a better view:

BMW F1 Car (http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests18/diapo_108.jpg)

Personally I think they look better, but hey.

Also the new Honda RA108:

Honda F1 Car (http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests22/diapo_124.jpg)

the honda looks great!

and that abscess on the bmw needs to be removed, asap!

R.Youden

Jan 23, 2008, 06:02 AM

Speaking of the Williams livery, I do hope they'll continue their tradition of carrying the Senna S on their cars.

I think they will do. I remember that it used to be on the nose struts, but I can't remember where it was last season.

The Honda does look nice, the front wing is a bit different. What does surprise me is that it does not look like the BMW considering almost all of the new Honda aero staff are from BMW!

SpookTheHamster

Jan 23, 2008, 06:35 PM

The front wing on the Honda looks interesting, but the rest of the car doesn't look too great. At least it's not the same as all the others.

iGav

Jan 24, 2008, 04:45 AM

I think they will do. I remember that it used to be on the nose struts, but I can't remember where it was last season.!

It was on the flip of the front wing, right under the nose.

I've not seen any hi-res pictures of the Williams in season livery yet, so I'm presuming it'll be in a similar location.

Always good to see that modest tribute to the great man. :)

The front wing on the Honda looks interesting, but the rest of the car doesn't look too great. At least it's not the same as all the others.

It might be just the angles of the photos I've seen, but it looks like it's sporting a really high nose... :eek:

And in comparison to other teams... the aerodynamics don't look any near as developed as other cars. It almost looks... outdated. :eek:

R.Youden

Jan 24, 2008, 08:06 AM

I think what Honda are doing this season is taking a very cautious approach. last season the launch car had 101 flick-ups and fins which just confused the aero analysis. They had had problems with correlating the wind tunnel to the track so if they make things simple it will be easier to work out what is going on, then they can start adding bits when the know what effect they will have on the car. A very calming influence from Ross Brawn I am guessing.

The front nose is very high, I think they are trying to get more air around the diff, very similar to the way BMW have worked. Also the have painted the underside of the nose black which gives a bit of an optical illusion.

macgruder

Jan 24, 2008, 09:31 AM

I wonder how all the non-Japanese drivers will feel when they discover that Japan has instituted fingerprinting of all foreign visitors to 'combat terrorism', or according to a TV personality, to 'help combat the rising crime perpetrated by foreigners'. Unlike the U.S. system (who the database is shared with) this includes long-term residents and work visa holders. I can just see Ecclestone, Brawn, Schumacher, Hamilton, Alonso, Raikonnen, etc. being really happy about that when the time comes.

SpookTheHamster

Jan 24, 2008, 12:25 PM

macgruder

Jan 24, 2008, 09:14 PM

I doubt they care too much, they'll probably be fingerprinted entering other countries anyway.

Which countries?

Especially I'm not too sure they'll be happy to be added to an international database along with their mechanics etc who would perhaps be affected by this.

R.Youden

Jan 29, 2008, 06:09 AM

TheChillPill

Jan 29, 2008, 06:10 AM

That has got to be the worst livery I can recall ever seeing.

Markleshark

Jan 29, 2008, 06:17 AM

I quite like it, a little plain though.

Heres to hoping Jenson Button has another piss poor season.

R.Youden

Jan 29, 2008, 07:37 AM

I quite like it, a little plain though.

Heres to hoping Jenson Button has another piss poor season.

Jenson had a fantastic season last year. It was the car that was the problem. Some of his drives towards the end of the season where excellent. Japan springs to mind. He really got the most out of that car and showed Rubens up pretty well.

iGav

Jan 29, 2008, 08:28 AM

Well Honda show off their new car today in an official manor.

They still can't get sponsors then. heheh.

SpookTheHamster

Jan 29, 2008, 09:22 AM

I can't think of a livery from any period that I like less then the new Honda one, apart from perhaps the split BAR livery.

pachyderm

Jan 29, 2008, 05:08 PM

Well Honda show off their new car today in an official manor.

http://www.hondaracingf1.com/images/gallery/pvs/6258_420a_pvs.jpg

Not too sure about the livery, I think I prefer the old Earth car. It looks too much like the BMW (not that they will be close enough on the track to confuse them!).

Lets hope for a better 2008!

i quoted the top photo for a reason, to compare and contrast, please don't edit it out. or diminish it to a link...thanks.
http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/team-honda/diapo_107.jpg
i like it. hope it wins some races.

R.Youden

Jan 29, 2008, 07:23 PM

i quoted the top photo for a reason, to compare and contrast, please don't edit it out. or diminish it to a link...thanks.
http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/team-honda/diapo_107.jpg
i like it. hope it wins some races.

I doubt that it will win any races, but it certainly does look better from that angle.

iGav

Jan 30, 2008, 04:08 AM

I doubt that it will win any races.

Q. What are the feelings about the new car following the Valencia test?

Ross Brawn: It's difficult to know what to expect as that particular car was a collection of bits that had never been run in the wind tunnel. Because we had to pick a point last November when parts were frozen. So the car we ran in Valencia had never been run as a collection of parts in the wind tunnel.

Winner! :p :p :p

R.Youden

Jan 30, 2008, 04:19 AM

That is and isn't a big surprise. What does not surprise me is that they ran a car cobbled together with some old bits they had lying around. At this time of year it is quite common. What has surprised me is they appear to have done the shake-down in public. Normally they would go to Silverstone week before a car launch or maybe even Santa-pod just to check everything out.

Another interesting theory maybe that they are trying to reverse engineer the thing. Maybe its more of, OK we know how it performs on the track, lets see what the tunnel tells us. Instead of the old, OK this is the wind tunnel data, this is how fast it should be on the track.

Now this isn't a long term methodology, but it may help them get out of the hole they are in with the tunnel at the moment.

pachyderm

Jan 30, 2008, 05:28 AM

Winner! :p :p :p
lol. Ross Brawn is...they will be soon enough.;):apple:

MOFS

Jan 30, 2008, 06:15 AM

I doubt that it will win any races, but it certainly does look better from that angle.

Looking at it it seems to follow this years trend of greatly shortening the side pods and having the aerodynamic flairs before attached to the floor entirely as free standing objects, as opposed to looking like "out pouching" from the sidepods. I guess this is all about weightloss. The Honda itself looks quite pretty, the "earth stripes" and the engine cover helping to make it not just another white car. Renault seem once again to have trumped the rest by having a yellow, white and orange car. UUUUUUUUUUUUUgly!:eek:

Maldini

Jan 30, 2008, 06:54 AM

Ross Brawn is with Honda now?:eek:

iGav

Jan 30, 2008, 08:17 AM

lol. Ross Brawn is...they will be soon enough.;):apple:

Ross Brawn only won with Schumacher. ;) He doesn't have that luxury anymore. :p :p :p

R.Youden

Jan 30, 2008, 08:57 AM

Ross Brawn only won with Schumacher. ;) He doesn't have that luxury anymore. :p :p :p

Not at the moment ;)

iGav

Jan 30, 2008, 12:23 PM

Not at the moment ;)

Don't even think it... I had a nightmare about that very scenario only the other night. *Shudders*

SpookTheHamster

Jan 30, 2008, 04:34 PM

Anyone else heard that Raikkonen is considering ending his F1 career at Ferrari, as early as next year?

pachyderm

Jan 30, 2008, 10:26 PM

Ross Brawn only won with Schumacher. ;) He doesn't have that luxury anymore. :p :p :p

and the ferrari's of brawn weren't good enough to win?
keep in mind he damn near won the title with irvine!
only schumacer coming back at the end of '99 kept irvine in check.

R.Youden

Jan 31, 2008, 03:52 AM

and the ferrari's of brawn weren't good enough to win?
keep in mind he damn near won the title with irvine!
only schumacer coming back at the end of '99 kept irvine in check.

Are you saying that if Schumacher hadn't come back then Irvine would have won?

If that is the case then you are very much wrong my friend. Schuamcer competed in the last two races of that season. The first, Malaysia, he was stunning and pulled a fantastic move where by Irvine was allowed to overtake Schumacher and then Schuamcher blocked Mika so Irvine could close-in on the championship lead.

Then in Japan Schuamcher again finished second after Mika won the race with Irvine finished second. There was nothing that Schuamcher could do about Mika in that race so Irvine only just lost out on the title.

So to say that Irvine would have won the title if Schuamcher hadn't returned for the last two races is far from the truth.

Counterfit

Jan 31, 2008, 04:04 AM

Ross Brawn is with Honda now?:eek:
Since two months ago (http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/11/7082.html).
Don't even think it... I had a nightmare about that very scenario only the other night. *Shudders*

So who would they dump, Jenson or Rubens? :D

iGav

Jan 31, 2008, 05:00 AM

Anyone else heard that Raikkonen is considering ending his F1 career at Ferrari, as early as next year?

That's only when his current contract expires, I expect he'll sign another 2 maybe 3 year contract and then retire, I doubt he'll go on as long as Schumacher did for example.

and the ferrari's of brawn weren't good enough to win?
keep in mind he damn near won the title with irvine!

But they didn't win with Irvine that's the point. ;)

Anyhow, my original comment was only in jest, though I do think that Jenson will not be capable of raising the bar in the way that Schumacher did, Ross Brawn or not.

So who would they dump, Jenson or Rubens?

What's with the or? ;)

pachyderm

Jan 31, 2008, 05:21 AM

Are you saying that if Schumacher hadn't come back then Irvine would have won?

If that is the case then you are very much wrong my friend. Schuamcer competed in the last two races of that season. The first, Malaysia, he was stunning and pulled a fantastic move where by Irvine was allowed to overtake Schumacher and then Schuamcher blocked Mika so Irvine could close-in on the championship lead.

Then in Japan Schuamcher again finished second after Mika won the race with Irvine finished second. There was nothing that Schuamcher could do about Mika in that race so Irvine only just lost out on the title.

So to say that Irvine would have won the title if Schuamcher hadn't returned for the last two races is far from the truth.

I know exactly what MS did.
i'm saying he came back to remind folks that he was top dog and that it would be bad form for irvine to win the first ferrari title in God knows how many years. the malaysia performance aside, he wasn't going to sit idly by while irvine outshone him. irvine supposedly got all the attention that MS would have while MS was away. could irvine have beaten mika with salo as a teammate the final two races...hard to say. he definitely wasn't going to win the title with MS back in the picture...

R.Youden

Jan 31, 2008, 05:40 AM

he definitely wasn't going to win the title with MS back in the picture...

Hmm, I am not sure about that. If you watched the Malaysian grand prix, Schui could have walked that and Irvine would never had a chance, but he didn't.

Maybe he didn't push as hard as he could have done in Japan, we will never know, but to say that Irvine was never going to win with Schui back is a very bold statement, why did the team bring him back? It would have been very easy to say, Michael, take a nice long holiday. He risked a lot in those two races. Recovering from a broken leg is not nice (I broke mine 18 months ago and it is still not 100%). so to take that risk the team must have wanted him to either help Irvine win, or make sure he didn't.

iGav

Jan 31, 2008, 06:15 AM

i'm saying he came back to remind folks that he was top dog
&
so to take that risk the team must have wanted him to either help Irvine win, or make sure he didn't.

Indeed, Schumacher had no intention of returning for the remaining races of 1999, it was Luca di Montezemolo that requested his return.

Maybe he didn't push as hard as he could have done in Japan.

Considering that he finished a minute and half ahead of Irvine, I've never quite understood how some have suggested that he didn't push as hard as he could've. :D

Irvine had an enormous amount of help after Schumacher's accident, but he dropped the ball in Hungary, and required the implementation of team orders in Belgium, Germany and Malaysia and was lacklustre in Italy and Japan.

R.Youden

Jan 31, 2008, 06:29 AM

Irvine had an enormous amount of help after Schumacher's accident, but he dropped the ball in Hungary,

Wasn't that the 'oh, we only have three wheels' race and the fans pilled a load of wheels outside the Fiarono factory the next day?

DarkNetworks

Jan 31, 2008, 07:26 AM

Anyone else heard that Raikkonen is considering ending his F1 career at Ferrari, as early as next year?

I wouldn't be surprised even if he did this year. The guy doesn't really seem to have the passion for Formula 1. No doubt he's talented and all but I don't really seem to see his passion for F1. The night races this year will be cool though. Really looking forward to it.

iGav

Jan 31, 2008, 08:24 AM

Wasn't that the 'oh, we only have three wheels' race and the fans pilled a load of wheels outside the Fiarono factory the next day?

No that was the European GP. At Hungary, he made a mistake under pressure from DC in the closing laps and lost 2nd position.

And considering that Mika was doing his upmost best to lose the Championship as well, it makes Eddies failure to secure the WDC even more puzzling. :confused: :eek:

G4DP

Jan 31, 2008, 08:43 AM

A community thread I wish to post in at last.

First of i'll state some things os that no-one gets confused. Firstly, I am a Brit, I am an avid Ferrari fan and lastly, as long as Ferrari win I don't care which of the two drivers it is.

MS coming back to test is a bit of fun, it helps the team out and gets him out from under the wife's feet once in a while, so everyone is happy. KR retiring, a strong possibility although if he wins the title again I would like to see him try and make it a three.

As for LH, i'll keep quiet on that, my views on this individual have got me into trouble and banned from posting on the ITV website.

Counterfit

Jan 31, 2008, 08:56 AM

The night races this year will be cool though.
Just what I need, another Sunday morning starting at 7AM. (My condolences to anyone in Mountain or Pacific time, you guys have it worse for the European races.)
What's with the or? ;)

Okay, sure, Honda could probably only afford just Schumi, but they'd still have another car to drive. Unless... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzDGpgGQGok) :D

SpookTheHamster

Jan 31, 2008, 12:11 PM

That's only when his current contract expires, I expect he'll sign another 2 maybe 3 year contract and then retire, I doubt he'll go on as long as Schumacher did for example.

I know that's when his current contract expires, but he's reported as saying he's considering finishing in F1 then.

I wouldn't be surprised even if he did this year. The guy doesn't really seem to have the passion for Formula 1. No doubt he's talented and all but I don't really seem to see his passion for F1. The night races this year will be cool though. Really looking forward to it.

He has a lot of passion, but stick a camera in his face and he turns to stone.

pachyderm

Jan 31, 2008, 03:25 PM

yeah. i didn't mean to rehash any old antischumi/proschumi debates.

MS was/is/may still be great. no argument. i do think that him pulling over in malaysia was an extraordinary feat and well out of character. irvine did fine in '99 but i agree he did drop the ball. but i also think no matter how you slice it...ferrari and MS weren't going to let irvine win any title before MS would. irvine was never hired for that.MS was.

and mika simply kicked his ass in the last race anyway...

i still think ross brawn will have honda winning soon.

R.Youden

Jan 31, 2008, 03:29 PM

pachyderm

Jan 31, 2008, 05:16 PM

I think Honda will win again within 2 years. They have too many good quality people there. The resources are amazing, they just need to learn how to use them!

i hope it doesn't take that long... one win under their belts from two seasons ago .. hard to believe they looked that lost last year...

R.Youden

Jan 31, 2008, 05:22 PM

i hope it doesn't take that long... one win under their belts from two seasons ago .. hard to believe they looked that lost last year...

I think this year they may take the odd podium in the second half of the season. They still, nearly 2 years after it opened, do not fully understand the most advanced wind tunnel in formula one! That is a must for Ross and his team, then they have a solid foundation with which the can work and start improving the car.

R.Youden

Feb 1, 2008, 05:01 AM

Something a bit different from Red Bull:

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests31/diapo_109.jpg

Markleshark

Feb 1, 2008, 05:05 AM

Different indeed. I don't like it, but I wonder if it works/what it adds. Stability at the arse end?

pachyderm

Feb 1, 2008, 05:10 AM

"the anvil".

iGav

Feb 1, 2008, 05:16 AM

but i also think no matter how you slice it...ferrari and MS weren't going to let irvine win any title before MS would.

That doesn't make sense, if that were indeed the case, Ferrari wouldn't have allowed Irvine to win in Malaysia.

What cost Irvine the Championship, was frequent poor performances and mistakes.

Though I do agree that Ferrari would've preferred Schumacher to win the Championship over Irvine, the suggestion that they would've preferred Häkkinen winning in preference to Irvine is just... :p :p :p

and mika simply kicked his ass in the last race anyway...

Mika made extraordinarily hard work of winning the title, with an extraordinary car that season.

As for that Red Bull... looks like the stern from the Titanic. :p

R.Youden

Feb 1, 2008, 11:30 AM

That Ross Brawn bloke is good.....

1.--Hamilton-----McLaren-Mercedes----(B)--1:22.263---82
2.--Alonso-------Renault-----------------(B)--1:22.889---61
3.--Kubica-------BMW-Sauber-----------(B)--1:22.983---65
4.--Fisichella----Force India-Ferrari-----(B)--1:23.015---98
5.--Heidfeld-----BMW-Sauber-----------(B)--1:23.270---52
6.--Paffett-------McLaren-Mercedes---- (B)--1:23.349---45
7.--Piquet--------Renault----------------(B)--1:23.367---44
8.--Vettel--------Toro Rosso-Ferrari----(B)--1:23.387---89
9.--Rosberg-----Williams-Toyota--------(B)--1:23.453---12
10.-Coulthard---Red Bull-Renault-------(B)--1:23.491---60
11.-Webber-----Red Bull-Renault-------(B)--1:23.547---52
12.-Bourdais----Toro Rosso-Ferrari-----(B)--1:23.836---54
13.-Nakajima---Williams-Toyota--------(B)--1:23.955---35
14.-Barrichello--Honda------------------(B)--1:24.125---53
15.-Wurz--------Honda-------------------(B)--1:26.975---26

Fissi did a good lap in the F1ndia car. Maybe a fuel burn run, but he did the most laps in the day, good work so far!

pachyderm

Feb 1, 2008, 12:52 PM

That doesn't make sense, if that were indeed the case, Ferrari wouldn't have allowed Irvine to win in Malaysia.

What cost Irvine the Championship, was frequent poor performances and mistakes.

Though I do agree that Ferrari would've preferred Schumacher to win the Championship over Irvine, the suggestion that they would've preferred Häkkinen winning in preference to Irvine is just... :p :p :p

Mika made extraordinarily hard work of winning the title, with an extraordinary car that season.

As for that Red Bull... looks like the stern from the Titanic. :p

it was only one race.

irvine did make some mistakes but was within a shout at the end.
ferrari and MS put a good face on it. so good, in fact, that they seem to have fooled you.

iGav

Feb 1, 2008, 02:06 PM

it was only one race.

...Of two. Or 50%.

And a further two races if you include Germany and Belgium where team orders assisted Irvine greatly.

ferrari and MS put a good face on it. so good, in fact, that they seem to have fooled you.

So... in your opinion what exactly should Ferrari and Schumacher have done in the final 2 races?

pachyderm

Feb 1, 2008, 03:34 PM

...Of two. Or 50%.

And a further two races if you include Germany and Belgium where team orders assisted Irvine greatly.

So... in your opinion what exactly should Ferrari and Schumacher have done in the final 2 races?

MS, never should have come back in '99. he waits until the '00 season. let irvine fight it out. as it is either way it doesn't matter. you have your opinion and i have mine. do want you to keep saying the same thing over and over?

Alfadoc

Feb 1, 2008, 03:36 PM

Fisi can see the tail of Alonso's R28 up close. That's motivation enough, 'course no one "wins" testing! :)

iGav

Feb 2, 2008, 04:43 AM

MS, never should have come back in '99. he waits until the '00 season.

But why?

Though as I stated above he didn't want to come back. He was ordered to by the then boss of Ferrari.

let irvine fight it out.

Honestly, I'm failing to see what difference not having Schumacher would've made?

Other than had he not returned then Irvine would've been even further out of contention in the Championship after Malaysia because he simply didn't have the pace to win without the aid of Schumacher and team orders (and in all probability would've finished 4th or below, with a Häkkinen win). And Ferrari would've lost the Constructors Championship too.

Japan's a moot point, because Irvine simply wasn't in contention regardless of whether Schumacher was on the grid or not, hence why he finished a minute and a half behind. Had Irvine actually been on the pace, and had Schumacher been leading, after Malaysia I have no doubt that Schumacher would've relinquished the lead had that been required.

you have your opinion and i have mine.

Indeed, but I'm trying to attempt to make mine a well reasoned and rationale one. If you disagree without it, that's fine. :) I'm only interested in why you're of your opinion that's all.

pachyderm

Feb 2, 2008, 08:07 AM

i am sure ferrari wanted MS back to keep irvine from winning. they paid a lot of money to have MS win the title not EI. it was clear eddie could beat salo often enough. even though salo had the better of him @hockenheim (sp?).

MS pulling over in malaysia made me start to like him again. ever since that i have slowly gotten around to thinking he is all right.

i don't have any true hard facts other that i simply don't/didn't trust them(the whole lot @ferrari).

and on another topic sort of...frentzen was the driver of the year in '99 in my book. he was as close to the title as anyone ... for a while anyway. ;)

MOFS

Feb 2, 2008, 08:10 AM

And the winner for ugliest F1 car goes to...
100519

:eek:

F1 cars have seriously lost their refined elegance recently.

PS: How to you just get the thumbnail to show? I've been here 6 yrs but I still haven't properly worked that out.:o

pachyderm

Feb 2, 2008, 08:15 AM

the cars are beginning to look like airplanes...:(

MOFS

Feb 2, 2008, 08:19 AM

the cars are beginning to look like airplanes...:(

I wouldn't mind if thy were starting to look like Concordes but Sopwith Camels? Biplanes?:confused:

R.Youden

Feb 2, 2008, 02:09 PM

Great quote from Rubens:

"In Fuji you hear the engineer say, 'Come in, come in'. And on the back of his voice you can hear people say, 'No, no, no'

Good old Jockie!

R.Youden

Feb 3, 2008, 07:49 AM

Honda have tried out the McLaren / BMW style bull horns today on the final day of the Barcelona test. It looks like they are slowly building up the aero package on the car and it is looking a bit better.

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests38/diapo_194.jpg

But they have gone with the flat rear win compared to the heavily sculpted version from a few days ago, maybe doing a back-to-back on the setups.

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2008/tests33/diapo_170.jpg

iGav

Feb 7, 2008, 07:08 AM

Italian magistrate summons McLaren bosses (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65029).

So they still haven't sacked Mike Coughlan yet? :confused:

R.Youden

Feb 7, 2008, 05:37 PM

Italian magistrate summons McLaren bosses (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65029).

So they still haven't sacked Mike Coughlan yet? :confused:

Would you sack someone with such in-depth knowledge of the Ferrari?

Also of note today Force India F1 (or whatever they are called) unveiled their new car for 2008:

http://www.autosport.com/gallery/picture_free.php/dir/2008fi1/image/l__h0y5005-2

SpookTheHamster

Feb 7, 2008, 07:07 PM

Didn't Force India unveil their car at Autosport International? It was one of the main things publicised on the Autosport International website.

R.Youden

Feb 8, 2008, 08:33 PM

I think the car was unveiled, but not the great new livery :rolleyes:

pachyderm

Feb 9, 2008, 08:11 AM

anyone seen anymore pics of the williams tribute?

R.Youden

Feb 15, 2008, 03:28 AM

McLaren really are very sneaky.

Under the rules of the FIA if a team finishes last in the previous years championship then they get car numbers to reflect their position which will mean McLaren run with 22 and 23, which they are. Now that also means that they have to use the garage at the end of the pit lane (and the smallest). But McLaren have spat their dummy out at that prospect and have now been moved to the 5th garage (the last of the 'big' garages). This means that they can now use their mini Paragon at all the European races.

All of a sudden the FIA are sucking-up to McLaren, they have given them a better pit-box and then they have launched the anti-racism campaign.

pachyderm

Feb 15, 2008, 05:45 AM

wow. a little humility is what they needed. would have been fun watching them from the last stall all season long.
the racism stuff is all good and well though.

iGav

Feb 15, 2008, 06:34 AM

McLaren really are very sneaky.

Liars and cheats too.

Seen the rumbles on the Atlas Forums about secret hidden settings in the MES ECU?

Ferrari International Assistance my arse.

SpookTheHamster

Feb 16, 2008, 03:27 PM

All I can find are threads on forums, anything more concrete?

R.Youden

Feb 17, 2008, 02:22 PM

Liars and cheats too.

Seen the rumbles on the Atlas Forums about secret hidden settings in the MES ECU?

Ferrari International Assistance my arse.

Could you put some links up?

Speaking to people in the know there is nothing going on, probably just bitter Ferrari fans again!

pachyderm

Feb 19, 2008, 04:07 PM

Feb 20th @Barcelona times:

Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:30.675 73
2. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) 1:32.370 96
3. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:32.599 26
4. Alonso Renault (B) 1:32.820 16
5. Coulthard Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:32.924 22
6. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:33.283 57
7. Piquet Renault (B) 1:40.073 8

Whorehay

Feb 20, 2008, 12:52 AM

i hope it doesn't take that long... one win under their belts from two seasons ago .. hard to believe they looked that lost last year...

Still remember that win. I was cheering so hard for Button.

pachyderm

Feb 20, 2008, 05:38 AM

me too... seeing that jarno gave me nothing to cheer about...:rolleyes:
i like button well enough. i enjoyed that win.

R.Youden

Feb 20, 2008, 05:51 AM

me too... seeing that jarno gave me nothing to cheer about...:rolleyes:
i like button well enough. i enjoyed that win.

I enjoyed that win too, I got a big fat bonus out of it :D

However, speaking to people who still work there things are not looking too good and all these promised major aero updates aren't exactly flying out the factory!

pachyderm

Feb 20, 2008, 03:45 PM

R.Youden

Feb 20, 2008, 05:07 PM

Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Massa Ferrari (B) 1:30.673 46
2. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:31.213 43
3. Badoer Ferrari (B) 1:31.288 33
4. Coulthard Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:31.654 44
5. Alonso Renault (B) 1:31.731 28
6. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:31.963 97
7. Glock Toyota (B) 1:32.407 33
8. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:32.571 47
9. Hulkenberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:33.102 53
10. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) no time 33
11. Piquet Renault (B) no time 1

damp most of the day...

How can Nakajima do 33 laps and not set a time?

Maybe he kept going through the pits for a but of pit-stop practice to ensure this doesn't happen again:

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/photos/2007/gpinterlagos/diapo_394.jpg

SpookTheHamster

Feb 20, 2008, 05:54 PM

How can Nakajima do 33 laps and not set a time?

Maybe he kept going through the pits for a but of pit-stop practice to ensure this doesn't happen again:

Classic picture. I also can't understand how he didn't set a time. I don't believe he would have done 33 laps without a single flying lap.

pachyderm

Feb 20, 2008, 07:40 PM

Classic picture. I also can't understand how he didn't set a time. I don't believe he would have done 33 laps without a single flying lap.
lol. me either... but hey i'm copy/pasting...

R.Youden

Feb 20, 2008, 07:50 PM

Classic picture. I also can't understand how he didn't set a time. I don't believe he would have done 33 laps without a single flying lap.

It must have been pit-stop practice and general system tests. I think under the new FIA rules about how many laps can be done during the season in testing only flying laps count so they got some running in but no real data and therefore saved on their testing allowance.

EDIT: Linky (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/080220185815.shtml) from F1-Live

pachyderm

Feb 21, 2008, 05:29 AM

It must have been pit-stop practice and general system tests. I think under the new FIA rules about how many laps can be done during the season in testing only flying laps count so they got some running in but no real data and therefore saved on their testing allowance.

EDIT: Linky (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/080220185815.shtml) from F1-Live

wow... loopholes, loopholes...

the fia sometimes makes you wonder how they can get as many teams as they do with all the rules fiddling they do..

R.Youden

Feb 21, 2008, 05:39 AM

wow... loopholes, loopholes...

the fia sometimes makes you wonder how they can get as many teams as they do with all the rules fiddling they do..

I think the FIA would have encouraged pit-stop practice under these circumstances, if only for the sake of the Williams mechanics!

Also you can never get any really useful data from purely installation laps. Your tires are never hot enough and you don't get any brake disk temperature. There are certain things you can test, basic system controls and some tests you can not run at full speed; I remember seeing Renault run a wheel load cell sensor and they could not run flat-out with that installed so only did installation laps, maybe Williams where doing something similar?

pachyderm

Feb 21, 2008, 05:48 AM

I think the FIA would have encouraged pit-stop practice under these circumstances, if only for the sake of the Williams mechanics!

Also you can never get any really useful data from purely installation laps. Your tires are never hot enough and you don't get any brake disk temperature. There are certain things you can test, basic system controls and some tests you can not run at full speed; I remember seeing Renault run a wheel load cell sensor and they could not run flat-out with that installed so only did installation laps, maybe Williams where doing something similar?

yeah, could be... then again. lol.
i think you make a very valid point though... just at first sight... seemed like maybe they were trying to get around the rules. ;)

pachyderm

Feb 21, 2008, 03:58 PM

Barcelona, dry track
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) 1:22.153 32
2. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:22.185 64
3. de la Rosa McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:22.208 92
4. Massa Ferrari (B) 1:22.213 95
5. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:22.248 108
6. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:22.477 81
7. Coulthard Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:22.499 102
8. Badoer Ferrari (B) 1:22.535 102
9. Alonso Renault (B) 1:22.657 61
10. Glock Toyota (B) 1:22.901 109
11. Piquet Renault (B) 1:23.286 104
12. Kobayashi Toyota (B) 1:24.132 56
13. Hulkenberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:24.222 59

Valencia top 3! damp in the morning
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber (B) 1:12.258 59
2. Kubica BMW-Sauber (B) 1:12.293 70
3. Klien BMW-Sauber (B) 1:23.857 32

pachyderm

Feb 27, 2008, 06:35 AM

Unofficial Tuesday times from Barcelona:
1. Lewis Hamilton, McLaren, 1:21.234
2. Heikki Kovalainen, McLaren, 1:21.434
3. Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari, 1:21.722
4. Nico Rosberg, Williams, 1:22.309
5. Felipe Massa, Ferrari, 1:22.513
6. Giancarlo Fisichella, Force India, 1:22.516
7. Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull, 1:22.558
8. Robert Kubica, BMW Sauber, 1:22.625
..............
9. Jenson Button, Honda, 1:22.659
10. Vitantonio Liuzzi, Force India, 1:22.942
11. Kazuki Nakajima, Williams, 1:22.977
12. Jarno Trulli, Toyota, 1:23.023
13. Fernando Alonso, Renault, 1:23.112
14. Rubens Barrichello, Honda, 1:23.169
15. Nick Heidfeld, BMW Sauber, 1:23.284
16. Sebastien Bourdais, Toro Rosso, 1:23.323
17. Mark Webber, Red Bull, 1:23.458
18. Nelson Piquet Jr, Renault, 1:23.467
19. Timo Glock, Toyota, 1:23.561

SpookTheHamster

Feb 27, 2008, 04:15 PM

There's apparently a rumour going round that Ron Dennis will be/has been fired

OllyW

Feb 27, 2008, 04:24 PM

There's apparently a rumour going round that Ron Dennis will be/has been fired

A rumour (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/27/rumormill-mclaren-boss-ron-dennis-fired/).

pachyderm

Feb 27, 2008, 05:02 PM

A rumour (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/27/rumormill-mclaren-boss-ron-dennis-fired/).

i'll believe it when i see it....

pachyderm

Feb 27, 2008, 05:13 PM

WOW!! i just saw this!!!

os Driver Team Time Laps
1. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:20.801 83
2. Coulthard Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:21.258 76
3. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:21.293 77
4. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:21.309 87
5. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:21.368 91
6. Piquet Renault (B) 1:21.443 114
7. Alonso Renault (B) 1:21.454 128
8. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) 1:21.796 124
9. Raikkonen Ferrari (B) 1:21.933 80
10. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:22.011 88
11. Glock Toyota (B) 1:22.155 49
12. Fisichella Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.233 90
13. Massa Ferrari (B) 1:22.286 49
14. Kubica BMW-Sauber (B) 1:22.299 93
15. Bourdais Toro Rosso-Ferrari (B) 1:22.465 79
16. Sutil Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.521 97
17. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber (B) 1:22.624 61
18. Wurz Honda (B) 1:24.154 82
19. Button Honda (B) 1:24.275 73

iGav

Feb 28, 2008, 06:28 AM

anything more concrete?

Only rumbles.

I don't think McLaren (or in this case, MES) would be that stupid personally, but then... after their behaviour last season, I also wouldn't be at all surprised.

It's still astonishing as to why MES were given the contract over Magnet Marelli even before Spygate. :confused:

Could you put some links up?

At the time I wrote my post, the thread was here (http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?threadid=99167&perpage=40&display=&pagenumber=1). I've not had chance to read it since then, so as to whether the rumbles are ongoing I have no idea.

Speaking to people in the know there is nothing going on, probably just bitter Ferrari fans again!

Well, Trulli has stated (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64806) that he thought something odd was afoot with other teams.

And it's been intimated by a poster (AFCA) in that thread that Honda have discovered a bug with the MES. Given your sources, it'd be interesting to know if that has some substance or not. ;)

Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:20.801 83
2. Coulthard Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:21.258 76
3. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:21.293 77
4. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:21.309 87
5. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:21.368 91
6. Piquet Renault (B) 1:21.443 114
7. Alonso Renault (B) 1:21.454 128
8. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) 1:21.796 124
9. Raikkonen Ferrari (B) 1:21.933 80
10. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:22.011 88
11. Glock Toyota (B) 1:22.155 49
12. Fisichella Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.233 90
13. Massa Ferrari (B) 1:22.286 49
14. Kubica BMW-Sauber (B) 1:22.299 93
15. Bourdais Toro Rosso-Ferrari (B) 1:22.465 79
16. Sutil Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.521 97
17. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber (B) 1:22.624 61
18. Wurz Honda (B) 1:24.154 82
19. Button Honda (B) 1:24.275 73

Wow, Honda really are screwed aren't they.

G4DP

Feb 28, 2008, 06:58 AM

R.Youden

Feb 28, 2008, 07:36 AM

FIA gave the deal to Microsoft because they gave the lowest quote. Simple really. Although MM have been produce ECU's for years and most teams use them the FIA went with the Mclaren ECU which is a different shape and size to the MM unit. So all those teams who have used the MM had to change the design of the engine covers etc around the new Mclaren unit.

Another example of involving more costs and not cutting them.

The way I remember it all working out is as follows:

When the FIA announced that they where going to have a standard ECU no team really supported the idea, let alone the ECU manufacturers. Anyway the big three ECU manufacturers, Pi, MES and MM, all got together and decided that they should not bid for the contract, therefore if no-one bid then no company would be awarded the contract and no-one would loose out.

Anyway, about 2 weeks before the deadline word started to leak out of the FIA that a small company who make ECUs for another racing series had placed a bid and that if no-one else bid the FIA would have to accept it and award the contract to them. So anyway the big 3 all threw together bids at the last minute and MES managed to get Microsoft backing and they won, primarily because they had a big name technology firm helping them.

Also the MES ECUs are the most stupid shape ever!

http://www.mclarenelectronics.com/products/all/i/unit_cont_TAG-310B.gif

I think that it was that shape because McLaren wanted to put the ECU ontop of the gear box and that was the only way to get it to fit. I know this caused Jordan headaches when they ran with MES. Most teams mount the electronics in the side-pod to get decent air-flow for cooling but not McLaren. The Pi units would be a standard shape like so:

http://www.piresearch.com/Images/Uploads/SQ6M-01E-500720.jpg

pachyderm

Feb 29, 2008, 03:41 PM

Only rumbles.

I don't think McLaren (or in this case, MES) would be that stupid personally, but then... after their behaviour last season, I also wouldn't be at all surprised.

It's still astonishing as to why MES were given the contract over Magnet Marelli even before Spygate. :confused:

At the time I wrote my post, the thread was here (http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?threadid=99167&perpage=40&display=&pagenumber=1). I've not had chance to read it since then, so as to whether the rumbles are ongoing I have no idea.

Well, Trulli has stated (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64806) that he thought something odd was afoot with other teams.

And it's been intimated by a poster (AFCA) in that thread that Honda have discovered a bug with the MES. Given your sources, it'd be interesting to know if that has some substance or not. ;)

Wow, Honda really are screwed aren't they.

if the toyota is really that much faster than them, yes...

iGav

Mar 2, 2008, 09:20 AM

if the toyota is really that much faster than them, yes...

A Prius would be quicker than Honda at the moment.

McLaren throwing their toys out of the pram again (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65391).

"It should be noted that none of the extensive searches or investigations completed to date have produced any evidence that the Ferrari documents which Mr Nigel Stepney handed over to Mr Michael Coughlan were ever passed to anyone else at McLaren Racing or used on the McLaren Formula One car."

That's a very carefully worded paragraph isn't it. This makes me laugh (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65414) though.

R.Youden

Mar 4, 2008, 05:07 PM

Well only two weeks to go until the first race of the season and almost all the teams have completed their preparations (Honda and Super Aguri are testing this week).

So how will the season shape up?

For the first few fly-away races I think it will be Ferrari ahead of McLaren with BMW, Williams, Renault and Red Bull making up the top 10. Toyota will be poor again and Honda will struggle (unless this new aero is a revolutionary as I have heard - bridge front wing and an even more radical engine cover than Red Bulls). Torro Rosso, Force India and Super Aguri will make up the number again.

But after that I can see McLaren close the gap (once all the Ferrari cheats are leaked out!) and it should be another great season. I think Kimi will retain his title but Lewis will push him hard again.

pachyderm

Mar 4, 2008, 07:12 PM

R.Youden

Mar 5, 2008, 01:56 AM

i see all of that as a likely scenario... that said i also can see louie winning the title in a close one v kimi. i will add that i think toyota will be better than most expect.... and then cross my fingers for all i'm worth... lol..;)

The problem with Toyota is that no-one knows how to win there. They always have had Ok drivers and most of the engineers have shown 'promise' within other teams, non have ever won anything. That is why I think Honda will recover as Ross Brawn knows what it takes to win and how to make a winning team. When they where successful in 2004 they had Dave Richards in charge who had won almost everything in WRC so he had the right mentality.

I can also see Williams getting the better of Toyota which will be yet further embarrassment for them. I could almost see a scenario where Toyota sell-up to Audi (who are very interested in F1 at the moment, and the factory is in Germany) and buy Williams as they appear to know what they are doing.

pachyderm

Mar 5, 2008, 05:19 AM

The problem with Toyota is that no-one knows how to win there. They always have had Ok drivers and most of the engineers have shown 'promise' within other teams, non have ever won anything. That is why I think Honda will recover as Ross Brawn knows what it takes to win and how to make a winning team. When they where successful in 2004 they had Dave Richards in charge who had won almost everything in WRC so he had the right mentality.

I can also see Williams getting the better of Toyota which will be yet further embarrassment for them.
I could almost see a scenario where Toyota sell-up to Audi (who are very interested in F1 at the moment, and the factory is in Germany) and buy Williams as they appear to know what they are doing.

completely agreed. and gascoyne(sp?) did know a little bit about winning but they let him go...
wow! this i didn't know nor would of thought! audi coming in would be very cool. although i'd rather sir frank not sell his team...

i'm just glad to see jarno still has a ride. i hope when his days are done in F1 he wants to race here in the states a bit.

R.Youden

Mar 5, 2008, 06:11 AM

completely agreed. and gascoyne(sp?) did know a little bit about winning but they let him go...
wow! this i didn't know nor would of thought! audi coming in would be very cool. although i'd rather sir frank not sell his team...

i'm just glad to see jarno still has a ride. i hope when his days are done in F1 he wants to race here in the states a bit.

With regard to Audi this is no means gospel, but....

About 2 - 3 years ago the head of Renault was not happy with being involved with Formula One, despite winning 2 World Championships! Anyway he wanted to pull the plug at the end of 2006 and had already sounded out Audi to take over the whole operation. Audi had apparently the funding in to get Schumacher (the good one!) in to run the ship and there was an initial contract in place. Then the head of Renault stepped down and the current man in charge took over, now he loves F1 and has confirmed Renaults long term future to the sport.

Now I don't know how much truth there is in the story, it was not a gossip story, this was an 'inside F1' story and people took it seriously. Now weather Audi still have the desire to compete in F1 I am not sure. I am sure they would be effective but they get better publicity from winning Le Mans every year than they would from chugging around midfield with F1.

iGav

Mar 5, 2008, 07:50 AM

The problem with Toyota is that no-one knows how to win there.

Well... not honestly anyway. Heheh.

That is why I think Honda will recover as Ross Brawn knows what it takes to win and how to make a winning team.

I think it'll depend greatly on whether Brawn has been able to convince the Honda board to stop medalling, indeed numerous articles I have read over the years have intimated that the interfering nature of Japanese corporate culture is to blame for the lack of their competitiveness in F1. See Toyota as well.

I could almost see a scenario where Toyota sell-up to Audi (who are very interested in F1 at the moment, and the factory is in Germany) and buy Williams as they appear to know what they are doing.

I'm not sure I can imagine Audi in F1, at least not as a soul brand, I'm not entirely convinced that it'd be anymore beneficial to them than their current involvement in sports and touring car.

Now that Porsche are acquiring a majority stake in Volkswagon, I could perhaps see the Auto Union brand making a return, but obviously no longer representing Audi, DKW, Horch and Wanderer, instead representing the current VAG brands.

But more than likely any F1 entry would surely sport the VW brand?

aerove

Mar 5, 2008, 09:09 AM

nope .. williams wont sell his team for his life!! and toyota gave its f1 team abt two years to turn around..

talkin of honda... only god can save them this season... they'r dead last in all the tests.. ross brawn has a HUGE job to do for 09!

SpookTheHamster

Mar 5, 2008, 12:37 PM

I remember reading a year or so ago that Audi would only consider entering if the FIA allowed them to use an alternative fuel, as they want to promote their TDI brand as much as possible.

Lord Blackadder

Mar 11, 2008, 08:33 AM

Patrick Head wants to reverse the grid (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7282861.stm)...not gonna happen, I think.

I like the idea of an Auto Union team.

iGav

Mar 11, 2008, 02:11 PM

Patrick Head wants to reverse the grid (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7282861.stm)...not gonna happen, I think.

Of course he cared about spectacle when his Williams-Hondas/Renaults were wiping the floor with everyone. :rolleyes:

Reading his comments anyone would think that every race back in the '80's and '90's was like Dijon '79. :rolleyes:

One only has to read the contemporary press of the time to understand that the same concerns regarding the lack of, and difficulty of overtaking in F1 relative to previous era's.

But as soon as F1 starts trying to artifically create a spectacle, it is no longer a sport... it is entertainment.

pachyderm

Mar 12, 2008, 05:18 AM

Of course he cared about spectacle when his Williams-Hondas/Renaults were wiping the floor with everyone. :rolleyes:

Reading his comments anyone would think that every race back in the '80's and '90's was like Dijon '79. :rolleyes:

One only has to read the contemporary press of the time to understand that the same concerns regarding the lack of, and difficulty of overtaking in F1 relative to previous era's.

But as soon as F1 starts trying to artifically create a spectacle, it is no longer a sport... it is entertainment.

well reality tv is very popular...:p

R.Youden

Mar 12, 2008, 07:01 AM

For someone as well respected as Patrick Head, sometimes he does spurt out absolute garbage!

What F1 needs is a method of ensuring that the grid is reasonably random, and not manipulated. Maybe by having a similar setup to what the have (had?) at the Indy 500. The drivers draw lots from 1 - 22 and that is their position on a one lap flying run. I don't know really :o

pachyderm

Mar 12, 2008, 04:41 PM

R.Youden

Mar 13, 2008, 01:03 PM

This looks good:

Linky (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65680)

About bloody time too!

iGav

Mar 13, 2008, 03:13 PM

Qualifying should be 1 hour, 12 laps, 4 sets of super sticky qualifiers, low fuel. Fastest gets pole.

Imagine the battles we would've been deprived of had such nonsensical qualifying systems existed back in the Senna/Prost era? Or even the Schumacher/Häkkinen one?

vendettabass

Mar 14, 2008, 05:04 AM

This looks good:

Linky (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65680)

About bloody time too!

speaking of free practice, check out those red bulls (http://www.formula1.com/news/features/2008/3/7479.html)!

djellison

Mar 14, 2008, 05:29 AM

Sadly, ITV's live streams were...what's the word...

CRAP

Stuttery beyond the point of being watchable. Pointless to be honest.

Doug

pachyderm

Mar 14, 2008, 05:59 AM

Toyota
Fastest lap of day, Trulli, 1m 28.292s, afternoon
Tyre graining was Toyota’s primary problem today, which set the team working hard on settings to try and alleviate the problem. Jarno Trulli felt that this was a qualified success and was unhappy to drop his RF108 in the gravel after putting a rear wheel on the grass under braking. Timo Glock was busy learning the track, and admitted that he hasn’t yet set up his TF108 to suit his press-on driving style.
4th fastest, ;).
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/aus/f1-2008-aus-xp-0126.jpg
jensen?

R.Youden

Mar 14, 2008, 06:34 AM

The ITV coverage was crap.

The Honda mechanics look like someone left a can of mushy peas in the laundry basket.

But the Honda did look better and was upto 11th so the improvements in Jerez last week appear to be working so far.

Renault where poor, as where BMW. It looks like another Ferrari McLaren battle this year, so far anyway.

What I did find interesting, from what of the ITV stream that worked, was how little effect the traction control ban was having. Although a lot of people where going off the road, most of these where loosing the car going into the corner under breaking. Martin Brundle said that a corner is 75% entry, 25% exit and the ban on engine breaking is really showing this up so far. It doesn't help that the track is very dusty but it is causing them some problems so far.

djellison

Mar 14, 2008, 06:50 AM

Quite a few people getting it wrong on entry, that's for sure - it looks, from the outside, like they're just putting two wheels onto the grass on the outside before turn-in, but I'm fairly sure it's because the car is getting squirrelly with the lack of engine management braking going on.

When the feed DID work - it was bliss to have uninterrupted F1 without James Allen's voice infecting it. Sadly, that was a rare occurrence.

Very much a Red and Silver season ahead I think. Surprised that Williams and BMW were not further up. Pleasantly surprised that Newey's influence at RB seems to be making itself seen on track. I don't imagine that they're be higher than 5th come qually, but they look like being the best of the rest, ahead of BMW, Honda, Toyota, etc.

Doug

iGav

Mar 14, 2008, 08:36 AM

Coughlan's finally been sacked (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65691) then.

Nothing to say about the times so far, only practice and still over a second shy of last years times, they should tumble tomorrow.

pachyderm

Mar 14, 2008, 03:52 PM

4th fastest, ;).
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2008/aus/f1-2008-aus-xp-0126.jpg
jensen?

The ITV coverage was crap.

The Honda mechanics look like someone left a can of mushy peas in the laundry basket....

and several boxes of donuts...

R.Youden

Mar 14, 2008, 10:36 PM

Well its 3:30 am in the UK and for some stupid reason I am up watching qualifying.

So far Kimi out and 16th at most. Webber has just binned it after a brake failure.

What ever they put in that Honda laundry they also put some go faster stripes. That car is, dare I say it, looking good. Hopefully one of them will make it into the top 10 :eek:

Yawn....

pachyderm

Mar 15, 2008, 07:14 AM

Pos No Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3 Laps
1 22 Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:26.572 1:25.187 1:26.714 14
2 4 Robert Kubica BMW 1:26.103 1:25.315 1:26.869 15
3 23 Heikki Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes 1:25.664 1:25.452 1:27.079 13
4 2 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:25.994 1:25.691 1:27.178 12
5 3 Nick Heidfeld BMW 1:25.960 1:25.518 1:27.236 16
6 11 Jarno Trulli Toyota 1:26.427 1:26.101 1:28.527 17
7 7 Nico Rosberg Williams-Toyota 1:26.295 1:26.059 1:28.687 21
8 9 David Coulthard Red Bull-Renault 1:26.381 1:26.063 1:29.041 18
**9 12 Timo Glock Toyota 1:26.919 1:26.164 1:29.593 17
10 15 Sebastian Vettel STR-Ferrari 1:26.702 1:25.842 No time 18
11 17 Rubens Barrichello Honda 1:26.369 1:26.173 13
12 5 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:26.907 1:26.188 10
13 16 Jenson Button Honda 1:26.712 1:26.259 13
14 8 Kazuki Nakajima Williams-Toyota 1:26.891 1:26.413 13
15 10 Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1:26.914 No time 8
16 1 Kimi Räikkönen Ferrari 1:26.140 3
17 21 Giancarlo Fisichella Force India-Ferrari 1:27.207 9
18 14 Sebastien Bourdais STR-Ferrari 1:27.446 10
19 20 Adrian Sutil Force India-Ferrari 1:27.859 9
20 18 Takuma Sato Super Aguri-Honda 1:28.208 9
21 6 Nelsinho Piquet Renault 1:28.330 6
22 19 Anthony Davidson Super Aguri-Honda 1:29.059 9

** = glock will start 19th...

Jarno Trulli, Toyota (6th, Q3 - 1m 28.527s):
“Sixth place is a good start to the season so the result is satisfying. But it was quite a difficult qualifying session and I’m still not completely happy with the set-up because I wasn’t able to get the most out of my lap. We’ve also been struggling more than we expected with the tyres here. So I feel there is more potential to come. Our race package is good so I am positive and optimistic for tomorrow. I just hope we can do a good race. Our long runs have been strong with this car during testing so I’ll cross my fingers. I’m really fired up for the season and confident that we can get some strong results.”

MOFS

Mar 15, 2008, 10:17 AM

Pos No Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3 Laps
1 22 Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:26.572 1:25.187 1:26.714 14
2 4 Robert Kubica BMW 1:26.103 1:25.315 1:26.869 15
3 23 Heikki Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes 1:25.664 1:25.452 1:27.079 13
4 2 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:25.994 1:25.691 1:27.178 12
5 3 Nick Heidfeld BMW 1:25.960 1:25.518 1:27.236 16
6 11 Jarno Trulli Toyota 1:26.427 1:26.101 1:28.527 17
7 7 Nico Rosberg Williams-Toyota 1:26.295 1:26.059 1:28.687 21
8 9 David Coulthard Red Bull-Renault 1:26.381 1:26.063 1:29.041 18
**9 12 Timo Glock Toyota 1:26.919 1:26.164 1:29.593 17
10 15 Sebastian Vettel STR-Ferrari 1:26.702 1:25.842 No time 18
11 17 Rubens Barrichello Honda 1:26.369 1:26.173 13
12 5 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:26.907 1:26.188 10
13 16 Jenson Button Honda 1:26.712 1:26.259 13
14 8 Kazuki Nakajima Williams-Toyota 1:26.891 1:26.413 13
15 10 Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1:26.914 No time 8
16 1 Kimi Räikkönen Ferrari 1:26.140 3
17 21 Giancarlo Fisichella Force India-Ferrari 1:27.207 9
18 14 Sebastien Bourdais STR-Ferrari 1:27.446 10
19 20 Adrian Sutil Force India-Ferrari 1:27.859 9
20 18 Takuma Sato Super Aguri-Honda 1:28.208 9
21 6 Nelsinho Piquet Renault 1:28.330 6
22 19 Anthony Davidson Super Aguri-Honda 1:29.059 9

** = glock will start 19th...

Interesting grid. Did Bourdais have a problem - for a driver who did so well in the US to be over a second down Vettel's slowest is astounding. Piquet Jr also seems to have done poorly. Looks like a Mclaren win for me - BMW don't seem to optimistic about this season.

pachyderm

Mar 15, 2008, 12:27 PM

from what i'm hearing piquet is nothing special. bourdais, i think, with time will improve.

Brianstorm91

Mar 15, 2008, 04:06 PM

Can't stand F1 but
http://ww2.tagheuer.com/_img/Ambassadors/Lewis%20Hamilton/big/TAG-Heuer-Lewis-Hamilton1.jpg
all the way!
:)

xUKHCx

Mar 15, 2008, 10:31 PM

xUKHCx

Mar 15, 2008, 11:39 PM

Well that was an interesting start to the first grand prix of the season. Poor Mark Webber, shame to go out at your home track, especially so early.

R.Youden

Mar 15, 2008, 11:52 PM

Hell yeah I am up!

I managed to get the ITV stream to work for the free practice session but it was so choppy. I will try and find the link.

Kimi is stuck behind that Honda, not something you would have expected a few weeks ago. Honda really have pulled one out of the bag at Jerez.

Unfortunately it looks like a Hamilton walk in the park so yet more garbage from the UK press.

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 01:17 AM

Well that was a good race. Bit boring up front, but if every race is like that it will be a great season.

Felt sorry for Bourdais, he had a great race. It is silly that they call him a rookie, he has more world championships that the rest of the F1 grid combined!

What where Ferrari doing though! They did almost everything they could to throw that race away, and in all fairness, they did a damn good job. Hopefully they will get it all sorted by next weekend, anyone got Ross Brawns phone number?

xUKHCx

Mar 16, 2008, 01:18 AM

Hell yeah I am up!

Unfortunately it looks like a Hamilton walk in the park so yet more garbage from the UK press.

I imagined you'd be up, did you stay up or get up. I stayed up.

It was a good race by Hamilton and a shocking one by Raikkonen so many errors all over the place.

Seems like the Ferrari engines didn't like the conditions of this race.

Very eventful race and a good start to the season. Only 7 finishers.

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 01:25 AM

I got up to watch it. I like my sleep!

And now we have mark Brundell talking utter garbage, Lewis Hamilton, the drive of a World Champion! Sorry but I thought Kimi was the World Champion as Hamilton bottled it last year.

Massa was his usual self, great start and he binned it by himself. Then took a swipe at DC. Fantastic comments by DC during the race. Kimi sometimes just can't get everything hooked up and looses interest.

Kebabselector

Mar 16, 2008, 01:29 AM

Any UK members up and about (or any members where it is an unsociable hour).

I wanted to see if the itv.com stream would not have adverts but currently it doesn't support Mac OS X so that idea is out :mad:

I was watching it my MacBook (on Leopard, not bootcamp) and the stream worked. The stream did have the ads. (was watching the TV though, put it on to see if the ads were present).

doubleohseven

Mar 16, 2008, 01:34 AM

I apologise if this has been brought up already, but;

Did anyone notice the MacBook Air in the commentators room?

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 01:36 AM

I apologise if this has been brought up already, but;

Did anyone notice the MacBook Air in the commentators room?

No, when was that shown? I never bother watching all the crap they spout before the race, I normally turn on with about 15 minutes to go. Was it in the ITV booth?

doubleohseven

Mar 16, 2008, 01:50 AM

No, when was that shown? I never bother watching all the crap they spout before the race, I normally turn on with about 15 minutes to go. Was it in the ITV booth?

It was shown at the end of the race with three commentators- I don't know if it was in the ITV booth, but they were indoors. It may not have been shown for international viewers, but it was definitely shown here in Australia.

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 01:52 AM

It was shown at the end of the race with three commentators- I don't know if it was in the ITV booth, but they were indoors. It may not have been shown for international viewers, but it was definitely shown here in Australia.

No, it will probably have been the Australian only broadcast. That is the perfect environment for a MBA, just hope the battery life lasts the race!

Father Jack

Mar 16, 2008, 01:53 AM

Lewis is the man ... :cool:

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 05:09 AM

In further fall-out from the Grand Prix, Rubens has been disqualified for leaving the pit lane whilst the exit was closed, thats a shame as the safety car came just at the wrong time for him so he HAD to stop for more fuel.

And Nakajima has been docked 10 qualifying spots on the grid in Malaysia because of running into the back of Kubica.

No doubt he will try and blame that on a lack of traction control. James Allen on ITV blamed all 3 safety car periods on the TC ban, then Martin Brundle turned round a basically said that is b****cks, the 1st period was because of the start which could have happened before (and did!), the 2nd was Massa getting a rush of blood to his head to taking out DC, and the final one was when Glock ran wide and got air-born on a service road, again no TC to blame there.

Please can someone shut James Allen up! I am thinking of watching the next race without any sound and listen to radio 5 live commentary,its far better, the only down-side is that the two are out of sync.

Updated results:

1. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes
2. Heidfeld BMW Sauber
3. Rosberg Williams-Toyota
4. Alonso Renault
5. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes
6. Nakajima Williams-Toyota
7. Bourdais Toro Rosso-Ferrari
8. Raikkonen Ferrari

pachyderm

Mar 16, 2008, 07:07 AM

1 Lewis Hamilton British McLaren-Mercedes 10
2 Nick Heidfeld German BMW 8
3 Nico Rosberg German Williams-Toyota 6
4 Fernando Alonso Spanish Renault 5
5 Heikki Kovalainen Finnish McLaren-Mercedes 4
6 Kazuki Nakajima Japanese Williams-Toyota 3
7 Sebastien Bourdais French STR-Ferrari 2
8 Kimi Räikkönen Finnish Ferrari 1

Nick Heidfeld, BMW Sauber (2nd):
"This was a fantastic start to the season for us. The team was working extremely hard to solve the problems we had in the beginning with the F1.08. We made constant progress and we have not exploited the full potential of the car yet. At the start I had too much wheel spin and could not keep Nico Rosberg behind me. I thought it is going to become a difficult race because I expected him to pit earlier. But we stopped on the same lap and our crew did a really great job to get me in front of him. With my second pit stop I was lucky that the safety car didn't come out earlier and I could refuel as planned. In the last stint I had to take care not to kill the option tyres. Overall the first race without traction control was less difficult than expected."

Nico Rosberg, Williams (3rd):
“I am really, really happy and I have to say that being on the podium in Formula One is a really great feeling. It’s been a while since I have been here and its great for the whole team as they have been working hard over the winter, they have done a good job and made some real progress. I gave everything I had today, but it was a tough race on a street circuit in the heat which didn’t make it easy. The team deserves my thanks for this great result and it really encourages me to feel that I can grow with Williams. I also want to thank my father for everything he has done to help me to get to this position. We have a solid race car and some good developments coming, but we don’t want to get too excited because it’s early days yet.”

Jarno Trulli, Toyota (DNF):
“From early on in the race the battery was too hot. Then when I stopped in the pits it just gave up. That is a pity because the car felt good and I was doing pretty well. I was running comfortably in the points so it is unfortunate to lose out on a scoring start to the year. Still, the car is better than last year's and there is performance to come. Here we didn't look too strong because we didn't work the tyres perfectly but even so we could have had a good result. So I'm sure we can fight well this year and I hope to be stronger in Malaysia.”

2/3 's of my guys did well...jarno looked like a point scorer for a bit...poor little jarno... :( nick and nico did very well! :cool:

iGav

Mar 16, 2008, 08:56 AM

the 2nd was Massa getting a rush of blood to his head to taking out DC

Even DC's manager placed the blame on DC for that one. :p DC's never used his mirrors, he never will... he'll just keep on turning in regardless.

But even then, both of Ferrari's drivers looked like... rookies. Unbelievable.

Ferrari are sooooo going to regret not giving Ross Brawn what ever he wanted. :(

R.Youden

Mar 16, 2008, 09:04 AM

Even DC's manager placed the blame on DC for that one. :p DC's never used his mirrors, he never will... he'll just keep on turning in regardless.

But even then, both of Ferrari's drivers looked like... rookies. Unbelievable.

Ferrari are sooooo going to regret not giving Ross Brawn what ever he wanted. :(

It is funny you mention the mirrors. I know a race engineer from Red Bull and that is all DC can say after a test, how much he hates the position on the mirrors. Once they tried a new diff and when asked how he thought it performed his reply was, "I don't know really, I couldn't see anything out of the mirrors!"

iGav

Mar 18, 2008, 03:21 PM

Toro Rosso team put up for sale (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65874).

Toro Rosso was formed at the start of 2006, after Mateschitz bought the team off Minardi boss Paul Stoddart.

Please, please don't sell it back to him.

bartelby

Mar 18, 2008, 03:22 PM

Toro Rosso team put up for sale (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/65874).

Please, please don't sell it back to him.

I liked Stoddart. He was a proper second hand car dealer.

Counterfit

Mar 18, 2008, 04:38 PM

Even DC's manager placed the blame on DC for that one. :p DC's never used his mirrors, he never will... he'll just keep on turning in regardless.
Video certainly shows that Massa's front wheel was about equal with DC's barge boards. But then DC says he knew FM was there, so he turned in why?
But even then, both of Ferrari's drivers looked like... rookies. Unbelievable.
Kimi looked ****ing FANTASTIC until he went off trying to pass Heikki.
Ferrari are sooooo going to regret not giving Ross Brawn what ever he wanted. :(

Wasn't he on sabbatical last year anyway? Maybe they need Schumi at more GPs. :D

pachyderm

Mar 18, 2008, 06:25 PM

i hate to see toro rosso fade away and although i have no problem with stoddart i'd rather him not go back to f1 just yet. be neat if they could just be absorbed into another team... and i'd like to see the teams be allowed to field 3-4 cars each if they could make the grid...

xUKHCx

Mar 18, 2008, 10:13 PM

Kimi looked ****ing FANTASTIC until he went off trying to pass Heikki.

He looked good but the errors could've easily put him out of the race, how many times did he go off.

Also big news day

Todt steps down as Ferrari boss (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7303936.stm)

Ferrari have named Amedeo Felisa as the Formula One team's chief executive after the resignation of Jean Todt.
Todt, 62, who was a key figure in turning the Italian team into one of F1's most successful teams, will stay on in a senior executive role.