Aluminum iMac v. White iMac

[Woochifer]

Given that I bought a white iMac back in March, I was a tad envious (and miffed) when the aluminum iMacs were announced over the summer, sporting those eyecatching metallic finishes, glossy screens (yes, I prefer glossy screens), and ~$300 price cut for comparably configured models. But, that's life in the tech world, and at that time my wife and I needed a new computer. Plus, we'd already been very happily using our iMac for 5 months before the aluminum iMacs arrived in stores.

Now, I'm wondering if I should count my blessings. Seems that among the Intel iMacs, the aluminum models have more issues with Leopard than the white ones. Also, the aluminum iMacs have the ongoing freezing issues with both Tiger and Leopard. I've also noticed that several retailers still have the 24" white iMacs available for around $1,500 (and they now come with a Leopard upgrade DVD).

For anyone in the market for an iMac, does it make sense to go with the older models? Here's how I see the pros and cons lining up for each version. (Keep in mind that I'm not assessing the Pros and Cons for design features that the aluminum and white iMacs might have in common -- i.e., the Mighty Mouse, the expansion options or lack thereof, the basic all-in-one design, etc.)

White Intel iMac

PROS
- matte LCD screen (for those who prefer this option)
- reportedly higher quality 20" LCD screen
- sleep indicator (can't imagine not knowing the power status)
- magnetic remote mount (nice convenience feature that shows attention to detail)
- proven reliability
- seemingly fewer reported problems with Leopard than other Mac models
- 24" iMac uses Nvidia GeForce 7300 GPU (gamers seem to prefer the Nvidia chipsets)

CONS
- slower benchmark performance (800 MHz v. 667 MHz bus speed)
- USB 1.1 ports in the keyboard
- horrible keyboard (bad key feel, poorly designed function keys, shows dirt, difficult to clean)
- plastic case scratches easily
- 24" iMac still cannot run Boot Camp (a fix is supposedly in the works)

Aluminum Intel iMac

PROS
- faster benchmark performance with comparable CPUs
- glossy LCD screen (which I would prefer)
- improved keyboard (controversial design, but I find it much better than the keyboard that came with the white iMacs)
- more unified look overall (no big chin, iSight camera nicely hidden)
- solid feel to the case
- USB 2.0 ports in the keyboard
- 256 MB video memory now standard with 2.4 GHz 20" and 24" models
- option for 2.8 GHz CPU

CONS
- reportedly mediocre 20" LCD quality with narrower viewing angle than previous model
- no sleep indicator
- no place to hang the remote
- random freezes common (purportedly an issue with the GPU)
- seems to have more issues with Leopard

[Mindflux]

CONS
- reportedly mediocre 20" LCD quality with narrower viewing angle than previous model
- no sleep indicator
- no place to hang the remote
- random freezes common (purportedly an issue with the GPU)



Sleep indicator? My sleep indicator is when I mash the keyboard and it either a) wakes up or b) does not. Do we need more dummy lights? Do you prefer a manual transmission vehicle with a shift indicator?

Remote needs a place to hang? last I checked there is a 6" wide aluminum stand base that fits the remote quite adequately.

No freezes here.

[itsmeok]

Based on your categorization of Pros and Cons, and picking the ones that matter, the Aluminium iMac's postives outweigh those of the white one's. However, are these positives worth the $300 increase in price? Well, for me, an outright yes!

[JayLenochiniMac]

My advice is keep your white 20" unless you're upgrading to the 24", especially if glossy screen is that important to you. White 20" to Alu 20" is too much of a downgrade.

I for one am extremely glad the sleep indicator is gone in the Alu iMac, given that it sits in my bedroom. Who wants to watch the blinking light throughout the night? Display off means something is sleeping.

[valdore]

Save your money and buy the Alum, and keep the white one.

[Woochifer]

Sleep indicator? My sleep indicator is when I mash the keyboard and it either a) wakes up or b) does not. Do we need more dummy lights?

Having gotten used to the sleep indicator light, I would refer to that as a useful feature (and it's especially useful when performing a firmware update). Besides, it's the only indicator on the front panel (aside from the iSight indicator) -- it's not like the iMac looks like some DIY tower PC festooned with LED indicators galore.

Do you prefer a manual transmission vehicle with a shift indicator?

Nope. Would you prefer a car without an oil indicator?

Remote needs a place to hang? last I checked there is a 6" wide aluminum stand base that fits the remote quite adequately.

The stand base is where I tuck the keyboard away -- no room there for the remote. Before I discovered the magnetic remote mount, the remote got knocked off my desk numerous times. It's not a make or break feature, but it's definitely nice to have for people whose desk is as crowded and cluttered as mine gets.

Based on your categorization of Pros and Cons, and picking the ones that matter, the Aluminium iMac's postives outweigh those of the white one's. However, are these positives worth the $300 increase in price? Well, for me, an outright yes!

Actually, the aluminum iMacs cost about $300 less than equivalently configured white iMacs, AND they have the higher benchmark scores, although the $1,500 price on the discontinued 24" white iMac is $500 off. Generally, the aluminum iMacs are a major overall improvement, but these reports of freezing problems (and the apparent downgrade on the 20" LCD panel) make them less of a no brainer than they would otherwise be.

[Mindflux]

Nope. Would you prefer a car without an oil indicator?





Considering I've never ever had to rely on my oil indicator I wouldn't miss it if it were gone.

[plumosa]

I bought an AlumiMac the very first day. I have had no screen issues or freezing. The keyboard is an absolute DREAM! When I'm using the old white iMacs at school I constantly cringe from the gross keyboard and all the extra weight I have to press on the keys.


I haven't upgraded to leopard yet, but I sincerely doubt I'll have any problems.


My computer is SO quiet, especially when its sleeping and a simple touch of the keys wakes it up. (however wiggling the mouse does not) The only time I turn off my computer is to restart for an application or if there's a thunderstorm. Not having a power indicator light does not bother me. In fact, I'm glad there isn't one because it would be distracting while watching a movie.

As for the remote not having a home, well I really don't see the point. There isn't anything the remote can do that your keyboard or mouse can't just as easily. I leave the remote on my nightstand so I can control the settings without having to get up. I mean that's the whole point of a remote right?


Now for buying a new computer in general, I would wait simply because your computer is still so new. You're not going to get a major update buying either the 24" white or a 20" alumiMac. Obviously if you are dead set on buying a new computer, I'd go with aluminum...

[Woochifer]

My advice is keep your white 20" unless you're upgrading to the 24", especially if glossy screen is that important to you. White 20" to Alu 20" is too much of a downgrade.

I for one am extremely glad the sleep indicator is gone in the Alu iMac, given that it sits in my bedroom. Who wants to watch the blinking light throughout the night? Display off means something is sleeping.

Glossy screen's nice, but obviously the matte LCD screen wasn't a dealbreaker when I bought my iMac! :D At that time (and now still), I wish that Apple had a matte or glossy screen option for the iMacs, like they do for the MacBooks.

I brought up this subject because some Apple resellers still have factory new 24" white iMacs in stock, and they are selling for the same price as the 20" aluminum iMacs (w/ 2.4 GHz CPU). For anyone in the market right now, that's an intriguing choice, since there are tradeoffs on both sides.

No upgrade plans are in the offing for me. My only short term plans are to trade in my Dell WinXP laptop for a Macbook Pro when I scrape enough funds together. :cool:

[je1ani]

wait 24" C2D white iMacs can't run bootcamp?! WTF!

[ryannel2003]

I love the new aluminum iMac's! They are simply stunning and for me, the pros outweigh the cons. The freezing issue is quite rare and while it looks to be a huge deal, alot of people are just reposting on how they hate their new iMac; it freezes, screen is crappy, blah, blah, blah. It's overhyped to the point of boringness. Had my finances been a little better, i would have ordered myself a 20" 2GHz iMac. However, I struck deal on the Apple refurb page with a 17" White Core 2 Duo iMac and am extremely happy. Waiting until Christmas to open her up, so the anticipation will kill me. One huge improvement over the white models: the damn keyboard. My eMac had the same keyboard and at the time I thought it was great; now, I can't stand it. I'm ordering an Apple bluetooth keyboard and mighty mouse. That will solve that problem. Other than that, the new iMac's are just better machines. Period.

However, I do like the white sensor on the front of the white iMac's. When I checked out the Al-iMac's, I noticed they didn't have that. Kinda weird. My old eMac had the same light, and after awhile it actually helped put me to sleep. Another great feature is the magnet on the side. However, that would definitely not deter me from purchasing the new model.

[rfrankl]

Some people like one or the other. I think they both look sharp. I have a 24" white iMac and love it. I do think the new Aluminum ones look awesome though, and if I didn't already have a machine, I wouldn't hesitate to get it. For what I do, no need to upgrade at this time. I was concerned with all the freezing posts, etc with the new ones I read about, but I still think those are a small number of machines versus the overall number sold. Usually only people with a problem post, while the large number without a problem don't.

[rfrankl]

wait 24" C2D white iMacs can't run bootcamp?! WTF!

Mine does!

[jstad]

Having just comtemplated a white 24" imac or the the new alum. ones. Here is what I have found. Be the white iMac is cheaper and all that, it has the matte screen which I do not perfer (the only valid reason to perfer it is if you are dealing with print graphics where true color matters, no the enhanced look you get from glossy screens). The video card on the new 24" models (ATi card) is DirectX 10 compatible which is a big plus for longevity of the product (in the windows market). Also the 256MB of video RAM is a plus since you do not have to pay extra for it. One thing I did note is that the card appears as the XT model in Windows Vista, not the Pro model listed on the website.

For me the big selling point was the 1GB only using 1 slot which makes for a cheaper upgrade to 2GB or 3GB, the 7300GT was always just a sub-average card, where as the 2600 HD XT is (one of) the midrange gaming champs at the moment for budget gamers. The 7300 never had that title, but the 7600GT did but that was a premium upgrade.

The graphics and RAM configuration was the two big selling points for me, the fact it was Aluminum was just a plus, and the other "features" are a wash for me. The $300 difference I will regain whenever I decide to resell the computer anyway, thanks to Apple's high resale value :)

[Woochifer]

The keyboard is an absolute DREAM! When I'm using the old white iMacs at school I constantly cringe from the gross keyboard and all the extra weight I have to press on the keys.

Totally agreed. I'd always hated the keyboard that came with my iMac (and plenty of visible crud had already accumulated inside the transparent keyboard after just two months of use), and was actually very happy when my wife spilled coffee on it and fried it. The aluminum keyboard has great touch feel, and I like the spacing much better.

The only keyboards that I like better are the more tactile keyboards like the old IBM Model M, Apple Extended, or Northgate Omnikey keyboards. (The Matias Tactile Pro is the equivalent model currently available for Macs)

My computer is SO quiet, especially when its sleeping and a simple touch of the keys wakes it up. (however wiggling the mouse does not) The only time I turn off my computer is to restart for an application or if there's a thunderstorm. Not having a power indicator light does not bother me. In fact, I'm glad there isn't one because it would be distracting while watching a movie.

It's not a power indicator, but a sleep indicator. It only turns on when the computer's asleep or the screen powers down ("pulsing" indicator means it's asleep, solid indicator means that the system's on with either a screen saver or blank screen). It's also used during firmware updates. Apple actually obsessed quite a bit over this seemingly inocuous feature, using a firmware update to dim the indicator on the original G5 iMacs, and later on installing a light sensor to dim the sleep indicator whenever the room is dark. Personally, I find it handy because it tells me right there whether the computer's on, asleep, or off whenever the screen's blank.

As for the remote not having a home, well I really don't see the point. There isn't anything the remote can do that your keyboard or mouse can't just as easily. I leave the remote on my nightstand so I can control the settings without having to get up. I mean that's the whole point of a remote right?

Like I said earlier, if your desk is as cluttered as mine gets, it's very easy to lose that remote or knock it onto the floor considering how small it is (I've lost some other keyfob/credit card sized remotes). I don't always use Front Row, but whenever I do, it's nice to know that the remote will always be mounted on the lower right side of the computer. As I indicated, it's a convenience feature, nothing make or break but yet another detail that Apple thought about and nobody else did.

[psychofreak]

wait 24" C2D white iMacs can't run bootcamp?! WTF!

Thats just not true - all Macs with Intel processors can run Boot Camp :)

[Woochifer]

wait 24" C2D white iMacs can't run bootcamp?! WTF!

Oops, my bad! :confused:

Apple posted a firmware update a few weeks ago that purportedly fixes the Boot Camp issue with the 24" white iMacs.

http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/imacmxmupdate10.html

[Cybergypsy]

Still love the G4 imacs but if i had to pick one the white would be it,,,,the alum. one is fugly!

[Killyp]

I'd wait and then upgrade. Wait for the mk2 version of the alu iMac to come out, it'll be far more reliable.

Other than the reliability, the new iMacs have no disadvantage over the older ones IMO, the lack of a sleep light is an advantage to me (stops my whole room pulsating at night like with my MBP).

I also don't keep my remote control right next to my computer, as that defeats the point in a remote control ;)

[GSMiller]

wait 24" C2D white iMacs can't run bootcamp?! WTF!

I know, I'm confused :confused: Why not?

Anyway, I love my white 20" iMac. I was a bit envious too when the new aluminum ones were released but I dunno I just think the white looks better. The aluminum keyboard is much improved though and it looks great alongside my white iMac. :)

If I had the money I'd snap up one of the discounted 24" white ones in an instant!

[Woochifer]

I was concerned with all the freezing posts, etc with the new ones I read about, but I still think those are a small number of machines versus the overall number sold. Usually only people with a problem post, while the large number without a problem don't.

I would tend to agree with you on that, as my upgrade to Leopard went relatively smoothly with none of the installation issues being reported on this and other sites (my installation had other issues, but nothing fatal ... well, nothing that couldn't be recovered from my backup drive). Aside from the very commonly reported Disk Utility bug and occasional beachball hangups, my system with Leopard is running faster and more responsively than before. That said, there are still enough bugs in Leopard to necessitate the upcoming 10.5.1 update, and apparently these freezing complaints have also warranted software updates from Apple.

[je1ani]

the thing I like about the white ones is the big "iMac" behind the screen ;)

[gorby]

Here's how I compared the two-- I only switched to Apple about 2 weeks ago.

Initially, I was going to get the 20" Alu (I'm on somewhat of a budget)-- but the bad press (on the forums got to me). So that plan was nixed. On to the 24".

While the 24" screens were acknowledged as better, they still had too many reported problems. So I took a long and hard look between an Alu 24 vs. White 24:

White iMac
24" Display 2.16 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
1 GB RAM
250 GB Hard Drive

$1,539.99 shipped! (Amazon via Smalldog) (http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FApple-Desktop-Display-MA456LL-SuperDrive%2Fdp%2FB000EPNEY0%3Fie%3DUTF8%26s%3Delectronics%26qid%3D1193591450%26sr%3D8-6&tag=songgallery-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325)

I thought about this long and hard, and really must admit that I was almost about to go with aluminum before reading of the screen issues.

Gradient/tinting reports aside, what really bugged me were some reports of people complaining of increased eyestrain... that's a big no-no for me. I could see how it could happen with the glossy glass display, though I have no real way of testing it. (camp in front of an iMac all day at an apple store?)

So on that note, 'keeping it matte' was a nice incentive to go white.

Here's how I compared:
white iMac 24" vs. alu iMac 24"
2.16 vs. 2.4 GHz
3 GB RAM vs. 1 GB RAM
250 vs. 320 GB Hard Drive
$1624 vs. $1699

That's with a 2GB stick of RAM added to the white mac, also reflected in overall price. It still comes out a bit cheaper... what do you think, performance wise?

I know that the new iMacs have faster BUS or something to do with Santa Rosa, but I have no idea what any of that means. There other sort of 'bells and whistles' too, that I know it has...

But in the end I think the matte screen and avoiding the generally reported issues (glare, freezing, leopard freezing, condensation, eyestrain) really pushed me towards the white. On a base aesthetic level, I think it's a wash. I love the aluminum but could do without the black. (An alu mac with a carved out/ indented apple logo would look awesome! instead of the black apple)

So ... yeah, thanks for letting me rant on, I'm excited to own my first Apple computer :D:apple:



And after owning it for 2 weeks, I do think there are a few minor CONS to the white.... mainly I think the ability to have more RAM on the Alu is the one think I'd want. Other than that....nothing really. I mean, faster proc is a faster proc. But I'm not experiencing any performance issues. Wireless n? ...honestly have no use for it.

And best of all, I have no screen issues and it hasn't froze on me once, and I'm loving the matte screen.



OH WOW, I just realized I must've gotten an upgrade video card? It's supposed to come with the nvidia 7300, but I got the 7600GT. Gosh, I love this thing.

[Big-TDI-Guy]

I have a white 24" Core 2 Duo iMac, and it's been running bootcamp just fine since October of 2006. (when I purchased it)

I think this comes down to personal preference - the performance boosts among the "common" models, is relatively negligible. Yes, the increased bus speed, and 4GB memory addressing is obviously more powerful - but 90% of imac users likely would be hard pressed to find it a gap too wide.

The white imac has grown on me, every other appliance I own looks like the current imac. (black, metal and shiny)

My imac stands out on my desk - which is nice change.

If I'm not mistaken - every 24" imac made, has a wireless N wifi radio. Just with the older white imacs - you need to pay Apple 5 dollars or some stupid amount - to "enable" it. Which, I have yet to do - because I'm running hardline anyhow.

[gorby]

BTW, to the OP - if you actually prefer a glossy screen, I think that should put you right over.

You can go back and forth on a lot of things, but hell, if you prefer glossy, looks like Alu is it.

[je1ani]

I don't see ram as a problem on my machine when I'm handbraking while downloading a movie online while editing movies in imovie while listening to music I still have around 1.5 RAM free... I've never seen it drop under 1.5 ram free since using my imac...

[gorby]

You have 4GB! Of course you don't see it as a problem!

Am I missing something?

Can't wait to upgrade mine to 3GB :p

[GimmeSlack12]

Newer > Older.

Next thread please.

[je1ani]

yeah but the point is 3gb is just as good :rolleyes:

[plumosa]

I don't see ram as a problem on my machine when I'm handbraking while downloading a movie online while editing movies in imovie while listening to music I still have around 1.5 RAM free... I've never seen it drop under 1.5 ram free since using my imac...


I see it low all the time...and I have 3 gb! Right now I have 327.46 mb free. I'm downloading two files, have a multi-tabbed firefox open, itunes is paused and downsized, as is a movie.


oh wait, its 317.37 mb free now. :/


oh look! I finally hit member status. :)

[gorby]

yeah but the point is 3gb is just as good :rolleyes:

Well I hope so anyway

I can't get it 'matched' though, don't know how much difference that makes

I see it low all the time...and I have 3 gb! Right now I have 327.46 mb free. I'm downloading two files, have a multi-tabbed firefox open, itunes is paused and downsized, as is a movie.


oh wait, its 317.37 mb free now. :/


I have about 100 mb free at the moment :o

[decksnap]

BTW, to the OP - if you actually prefer a glossy screen, I think that should put you right over.

You can go back and forth on a lot of things, but hell, if you prefer glossy, looks like Alu is it.

Well not really... would you prefer a quality matte panel or a crappy panel covered in glass?

[gorby]

Well not really... would you prefer a quality matte panel or a crappy panel covered in glass?

Well, supposedly they are pretty much the same panel on the 24". So I don't know why there are so many reported instances of bad displays on the new Alu's. Well, I mean, none of us know, obviously.

I personally wonder if it has anything to do with the Alu being even thinner (which I think was pretty much an unnecessary 'improvement')


As for what I prefer, well I think it's clear judging by what I chose :D

[decksnap]

Yes the 24=good. 20=bad.

[Big-TDI-Guy]

From 512MB to 1GB noticed a change in Tiger. From 1GB to 1.5GB - saw some change in Tiger.

From 1.5GB to 3GB - seriously, I see no difference.

I'm not running Final Cut Pro or Aperture - though if I was, I'd probably move out of the iMac line entirely.

[itsmeok]

Newer > Older.

Next thread please.

Hehe.. quite applicable to almost everything except XP/Vista ;)

[Leon Kowalski]

1) Keyboard differences are a non-issue. If you prefer the new ALU keyboard, it costs $49 and works fine with white iMacs.

2) No one seems to have mentioned the biggest performance difference: SATA I vs. SATA II internal HD bus speeds. I do notice a slight performance penalty when browsing albums of large (3-4 MB) JPGs in iPhoto. Very minor, IMO, but real.

3) Also, the white 20" only has FW400, not FW800.

Nonetheless, after test-driving a 20" ALU and a 24" ALU for one month each, I gave up on the nasty, non-uniform displays and switched to a white 20", with an ACD-quality display.

No gradients, no freezing, no regrets.

BTW, gloss vs. matte was never an issue -- I had no preference when I bought the ALU 20" -- but in retrospect, after two months experience with gloss, I much prefer the matte display. YMMV.

Since I wanted a 20" from the start, I see the price difference as $1200 for 20" white versus $1800 for 24" ALU -- because even if Apple eventually fixes all the ALU display problems, the 20" ALU will still have a second-rate TN-film panel. Sorry, I refuse to pay $1500 for second-rate.

So, even if I could get a 24" ALU with an acceptable display, there's no way the 10% speed increase would justify a 50% price bump -- especially for computers that'll be seriously obsolete as soon as Apple introduces an iMac with BlueRay or HD DVD ...

... or a midi-tower with iMac-level performance,

LK

[ScottFitz]

Slight performance boost wouldn't be a big deal to me. I rarely push this white imac to its limits anyway. It handles my idvd/imovie stuff with ease at 2gb ram. I prefer the white look, the matte screen as well.

Also, i rarely buy the first revision of anything. On a new vehicle, I always wait until they release the 2nd year of a body style. Let some of poor guy find all the bugs for them.

If I was getting an Al imac, I'd wait until the next batch is released. All the issues will likely be gone by then and it'll be easier to rationalize.

[gorby]

Slight performance boost wouldn't be a big deal to me. I rarely push this white imac to its limits anyway. It handles my idvd/imovie stuff with ease at 2gb ram. I prefer the white look, the matte screen as well.

Also, i rarely buy the first revision of anything. On a new vehicle, I always wait until they release the 2nd year of a body style. Let some of poor guy find all the bugs for them.

If I was getting an Al imac, I'd wait until the next batch is released. All the issues will likely be gone by then and it'll be easier to rationalize.

Isn't the Alu iMac already THE 'Rev B"?

I mean, it's just the same (mostly) intel iMac. Cosmetic differences aside.

[JayLenochiniMac]

Isn't the Alu iMac already THE 'Rev B"?

I mean, it's just the same (mostly) intel iMac. Cosmetic differences aside.

Not really, the internal is quite different. See http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=386295

Newer > Older.

Next thread please.

Not necessary. Sometimes a new model is a downgrade from the model it replaces (the 20" iMac in this case). I see the same thing with cameras and printers.

[ivan1234]

if it irks you so much, upgrade! :D

[Sandman1969]

Both of our 24" iMacs are perfect!

[GimmeSlack12]

Not necessary. Sometimes a new model is a downgrade from the model it replaces (the 20" iMac in this case). I see the same thing with cameras and printers.

You are aware that only a fraction of new models have these issues right? And since nothing in the world is perfect, or 100% equal in all cases it could be assumed a 'fudge' factor happens on absolute statements. Ignoring the fudge factor is acceptable because such a low probability of 'malfunction' occurs.

Therefore I stand by my post.
Newer > Older.

[Leon Kowalski]

Therefore I stand by my post.
Newer > Older.

1) Newer 20" http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/20IMacScreenPhotos

2) Older 20" http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/White20IMacScreenPhotos

... 'nuff said,

LK

[Mindflux]

1) Newer 20" http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/20IMacScreenPhotos

2) Older 20" http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/White20IMacScreenPhotos

... 'nuff said,

LK

Still see a LT->RT fade on your "Older 20"".

'nuff said.

[JayLenochiniMac]

You are aware that only a fraction of new models have these issues right? And since nothing in the world is perfect, or 100% equal in all cases it could be assumed a 'fudge' factor happens on absolute statements. Ignoring the fudge factor is acceptable because such a low probability of 'malfunction' occurs.

Therefore I stand by my post.
Newer > Older.

I was referring strictly to features, not issues. The TN panel is a feature of the Alu 20" iMac.

[decksnap]

You are aware that only a fraction of new models have these issues right? And since nothing in the world is perfect, or 100% equal in all cases it could be assumed a 'fudge' factor happens on absolute statements. Ignoring the fudge factor is acceptable because such a low probability of 'malfunction' occurs.

Therefore I stand by my post.
Newer > Older.

No... the newer screen is a technical downgrade in the 20''. That's before discussing other screen issues that have cropped up.

[Leon Kowalski]

Still see a LT->RT fade on your "Older 20".

Yep, without a doubt. Nothin' is perfect, ...never claimed it was.
However, according to my light meter, the max:min brightness
difference is no more than 20%.

Hint: I spelt that out, right there in the picasaweb comments,
in the (ever-futile) hope of dis-confusing the lame of brain.

Now try to stay with me here. I'll type slowly. A max:min brightness
difference of only 20% easily beats every known ergonomic standard
(including the one Apple specifies for its 20" ACD -- which happens to
use exactly the same LCD panel as my white iMac).

In contrast, my 20" and 24" ALU iMacs both had max:min brightness
differences of well over 100% -- so, they easily and miserably fail
every ergonomic standard ever written.

...tune-in SesameStreet for a refresher course on "huge" vs. "tiny",

LK

[AlexisV]

No... the newer screen is a technical downgrade in the 20''. That's before discussing other screen issues that have cropped up.

Yes it is, but you know, so what? If you're happy with the white and don't want to get a new one, that's fine. If you have nothing and don't want to get a new alumnium, then it's a silly reason not to. I use the white all day at work and the aluminium at home. I don't sit down at the alumnium and go 'ewww'. I just use it. It's nice and glossy and I wasn't bothered by the viewing angle after a couple of days of use. And that's after using the white one for 8 hours every day.

If I was getting an Al imac, I'd wait until the next batch is released. All the issues will likely be gone by then and it'll be easier to rationalize.

Sorry to pick on you here, but the 'I never buy revision A products' is an line of reasoning I've never quite understood. Nobody doesn't buy a new TV because it might be a new model! We have a Core Duo iMac in the office that was bought after launch - no problems. I have a new alu iMac bought on 7th August - no problems.
I don't know how people can sit there not buying if they really want to, waiting 6-12 months for the same computer to come out but with a small speed bump. That's 6-12 months of your life gone! :D

[pictures]

it has the matte screen which I do not perfer (the only valid reason to perfer it is if you are dealing with print graphics where true color matters, no the enhanced look you get from glossy screens).

that is exactly what I use mine for, and finding that the new iMacs offered only glossy screens was a huge disappointment for me.

[128k]

The new imacs are junk. From their crappy screens to their freezing to their nominal performance. The White 24" c2d 2.33 with the 7600 is the apex of the line this is de evolution. The cheap PC looking black plastic and partial aluminum ijoke looks like an HP $600 desktop. I still can't believe apple released this machine.

[Mindflux]

The new imacs are junk. From their crappy screens to their freezing to their nominal performance. The White 24" c2d 2.33 with the 7600 is the apex of the line this is de evolution. The cheap PC looking black plastic and partial aluminum ijoke looks like an HP $600 desktop. I still can't believe apple released this machine.

Oh no a pigment change in the plastic! It's so cheap now that it's not white!

:rolleyes:

[sportsnut]

The new imacs are junk. From their crappy screens to their freezing to their nominal performance. The White 24" c2d 2.33 with the 7600 is the apex of the line this is de evolution. The cheap PC looking black plastic and partial aluminum ijoke looks like an HP $600 desktop. I still can't believe apple released this machine.
:D



;) But Steve listened when they said 'Get rid of the chin'

[gorby]

The chin is still there-- it's just not as obvious as part of it is now the black bezel. A clever sleight of hand perhaps, but they by no means 'got rid' of it.

[AlexisV]

The new imacs are junk. From their crappy screens to their freezing to their nominal performance. The White 24" c2d 2.33 with the 7600 is the apex of the line this is de evolution. The cheap PC looking black plastic and partial aluminum ijoke looks like an HP $600 desktop. I still can't believe apple released this machine.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree.

[sportsnut]

The chin is still there-- it's just not as obvious as part of it is now the black bezel. A clever sleight of hand perhaps, but they by no means 'got rid' of it.


Didn't you see my ;) :D

[gorby]

;)

I just see that sentiment (said for real) a lot, and I wonder if the people saying that are missing that point.

[clyde2801]

After buying my new in the box white 20" imac, I noticed apple had it's newer, shinier, refurbed sister for $9 more, not including sales tax.

Wow, I had no idea some people were so opinionated as to the differences between the imacs. In my opinion, the differences are relatively so minor as to make the choice one of aesthetics. Paper or plastic? Plastic or aluminum?

What I am thinking is that it's good we have a choice in the matter for now. Don't like glossy displays? Great, buy a refurbed for a discount! Think white plastic looks tacky and dated? Splendid, run down to the Apple Store or to a Best Buy!

BTW, I'm keeping my big, white, jay leno imac. I'm not a gamer, the card handles my screen and the 22" lcd next to it, and 3gig of cheap ram helps me run xp on parallels faster than it goes on many windows machines. I just think it's a great time to be a mac owner.

[stainlessliquid]

Its not aesthetics, its the LCD panel that is causing the uproar. The white 20" has an LCD panel thats worth around $300 more than the garbage in the aluminum one. Despite apple massively downgrading the LCD inside the machine they didnt pass any savings to us. They could have gone with a cheaper S-IPS panel, or even a much cheaper but still decent PVA panel, but they didnt, they went with the cheapest and worst technology available: TN. The kind of LCD's only found in sub $200 monitors and the kind you get for free when ordering a PC.

[bluedoggiant]

Given that I bought a white iMac back in March, I was a tad envious (and miffed) when the aluminum iMacs were announced over the summer, sporting those eyecatching metallic finishes, glossy screens (yes, I prefer glossy screens), and ~$300 price cut for comparably configured models. But, that's life in the tech world, and at that time my wife and I needed a new computer. Plus, we'd already been very happily using our iMac for 5 months before the aluminum iMacs arrived in stores.

Now, I'm wondering if I should count my blessings. Seems that among the Intel iMacs, the aluminum models have more issues with Leopard than the white ones. Also, the aluminum iMacs have the ongoing freezing issues with both Tiger and Leopard. I've also noticed that several retailers still have the 24" white iMacs available for around $1,500 (and they now come with a Leopard upgrade DVD).

For anyone in the market for an iMac, does it make sense to go with the older models? Here's how I see the pros and cons lining up for each version. (Keep in mind that I'm not assessing the Pros and Cons for design features that the aluminum and white iMacs might have in common -- i.e., the Mighty Mouse, the expansion options or lack thereof, the basic all-in-one design, etc.)

White Intel iMac

PROS
- matte LCD screen (for those who prefer this option)
- reportedly higher quality 20" LCD screen
- sleep indicator (can't imagine not knowing the power status)
- magnetic remote mount (nice convenience feature that shows attention to detail)
- proven reliability
- seemingly fewer reported problems with Leopard than other Mac models
- 24" iMac uses Nvidia GeForce 7300 GPU (gamers seem to prefer the Nvidia chipsets)

CONS
- slower benchmark performance (800 MHz v. 667 MHz bus speed)
- USB 1.1 ports in the keyboard
- horrible keyboard (bad key feel, poorly designed function keys, shows dirt, difficult to clean)
- plastic case scratches easily
- 24" iMac still cannot run Boot Camp (a fix is supposedly in the works)

Aluminum Intel iMac

PROS
- faster benchmark performance with comparable CPUs
- glossy LCD screen (which I would prefer)
- improved keyboard (controversial design, but I find it much better than the keyboard that came with the white iMacs)
- more unified look overall (no big chin, iSight camera nicely hidden)
- solid feel to the case
- USB 2.0 ports in the keyboard
- 256 MB video memory now standard with 2.4 GHz 20" and 24" models
- option for 2.8 GHz CPU

CONS
- reportedly mediocre 20" LCD quality with narrower viewing angle than previous model
- no sleep indicator
- no place to hang the remote
- random freezes common (purportedly an issue with the GPU)
- seems to have more issues with Leopard

Freezing problems are old, apple fixed them ages ago. There are no problems with Leopard.

[stainlessliquid]

so is this thread

[lostprophet894]

Yup. And the Alu iMacs are damn sexy. I think the white looks cheap.

:eek: Oh no he dit'int!!!11

[cheeseadiddle]

My 24" Al iMac has been trouble free. The 20" Al iMac we have was an intermittent freezer before the last Leopard/firmware update. Now it's solid.

[neiltc13]

I owned a 17" white Core Duo iMac before I switched to a 20" aluminium one. The aluminium one is ugly as hell. I don't know what Apple were thinking when they decided on all this black but it's ghastly. Seems like they were merely changing things for change's sake and didn't spend long enough refining the design.

Gaming performance on both is rubbish. I've not noticed any flaws with my new iMac, with the exception of one stuck pixel. You definitely get better value for money with the new ones, but the white is 100% the better looking machine.

The 2.8GHz upgrade is the biggest nonsense upgrade Apple has ever sold. The machine has a HUGE bottleneck in it already with the graphics card and throwing an extra 400MHz to the CPU isn't going to help. One thing I am confident of though is that the keyboard is the best part of the new machine. It's incredible, absolutely without a doubt the best keyboard I have ever used in my life so if you get either machine, make sure you get the new keyboard.

[gorby]

The 2.8GHz upgrade is the biggest nonsense upgrade Apple has ever sold. The machine has a HUGE bottleneck in it already with the graphics card and throwing an extra 400MHz to the CPU isn't going to help. One thing I am confident of though is that the keyboard is the best part of the new machine. It's incredible, absolutely without a doubt the best keyboard I have ever used in my life so if you get either machine, make sure you get the new keyboard.

I am considering it. I don't know what it is, but my typo percentage has increased 100% ever since I got my imac (with the 'white keyboard') It's not uncomfortable or anything, but damn.

Cool thing is the new keyboard (white + alu) looks more at home with the good ol' white mac than it does with the alu/black new imacs.

[clyde2801]

I was wondering about the keyboard myself, but the only trouble is that it looks wider than the white one. Is it? I'm limited on space where I am now.

[bluedoggiant]

The new imacs are junk. From their crappy screens to their freezing to their nominal performance. The White 24" c2d 2.33 with the 7600 is the apex of the line this is de evolution. The cheap PC looking black plastic and partial aluminum ijoke looks like an HP $600 desktop. I still can't believe apple released this machine.

When are you living? The Freezing problem was fixed by apple on november 17th or something like that, freezing is no more. They do not have crappy screen, if you say so, then yours is crappy too, Apple uses the same panels used in the white 24" iMac in their new iMac. The only thing they did was put a TN panel in the 20", not effecting you, and because of that, the 20" is now thinner. and I'm more than sure that my 2.8 C2E beats your 2.33 C2D. and if you think thats unfair, so does the 2.4 C2D. And how does it look like a cheap PC HP $600 computer? More than half the world knows very well that HP's and other PC manufacturers use silver and black in their computers. Hell my old sony vaio desktop was glossy black, and silver. My iMac is made of HIGHER quality smoother black plastic, glass, i mean for F*cks sake, what damn computer manufacturer uses GLASS in their computers other than the LCD (given)?? And my iMac uses Aluminum, last time i checked, apple is the only manufacturer that uses aluminum in their products. I have a new printer (canon mp470), its glossy black and silver, same colors as my imac, totally different.

A lot of manufacturers are adopting the white look of apple products, so stop showing off your white imac, its a great machine, but u have no right to call the Al iMacs *****.

:D



;) But Steve listened when they said 'Get rid of the chin'

The chin is still there-- it's just not as obvious as part of it is now the black bezel. A clever sleight of hand perhaps, but they by no means 'got rid' of it.

You just said it.

[gorby]

I was wondering about the keyboard myself, but the only trouble is that it looks wider than the white one. Is it? I'm limited on space where I am now.

wider? i think if anything it must be less wide

i'm sure you can find the measurements on apple's site. i'm only working off memory here

[Leon Kowalski]

Apple uses the same panels used in the white 24" iMac in their new iMac.

Simply not true. The TFT panel matrices are (probably) very similar,
but the panels have different part numbers. I suspect that the ALU
iMac panel required a different backlight/diffuser/inverter assembly
to fit inside the new "slim" cabinet.

24" white: LG.Philips LM240WU2-SLA1

24" alum: LG.Philips LM240WU2-SLB1

Whatever the reason, many of the 24" aluminum iMacs have (had?)
serious problems with brightness uniformity. For example:

http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/24IMacScreenPhotos

LK

[Tom Sawyer]

...and I love them both. I know, too easy but they are both fantastic machines. I will say though that IMHO, the white iMac seems to be a bit more... "solid". The build quality seems higher... but perhaps it's just from the fact that the white iMac is made with thick plastic in the classic apple clear/white setup. The back of the Al iMac seems thin in comparison... but it's not the side of my iMac that interests me anyway :rolleyes:

Now I've been inside my 24" Al a couple times, and it's put together fine. Feel free to check out the interior in this thread: AL Pics (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=350120) Every manufacturer is going to make compromises to keep the cost as low as possible. If you compare the first G5 iMacs with all the modular design they had to the current line, there is no comparison. But as I've mentioned in another post, it cost a LOT of $ from a production standpoint to make things modular, user servicable with rails, clip in's/out's etc.

I do give the nod to the Glossy screen. I feel that the Al iMac is a very sophisticated and more serious looking piece of hardware where the whites are a bit more "toy like".

I will also say that every transcriptionist should buy one of the new keyboards... I can type so much faster on the new Al keyboard it's crazy! :eek:

[bluedoggiant]

Simply not true. The TFT panel matrices are (probably) very similar,
but the panels have different part numbers. I suspect that the ALU
iMac panel required a different backlight/diffuser/inverter assembly
to fit inside the new "slim" cabinet.

24" white: LG.Philips LM240WU2-SLA1

24" alum: LG.Philips LM240WU2-SLB1

Whatever the reason, many of the 24" aluminum iMacs have (had?)
serious problems with brightness uniformity. For example:

http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby/24IMacScreenPhotos

LK

Why is it you always have to comment on something that has to do with the iMac display?:p

Well I can say one thing, the iMac display is glossy (I know that cuz i took the glass off and saw it), whereas the white imacs arent glossy. but either way, taking the glass off the imac, you will still have glossy. They look like similar models, except with different little specs. I don't see anything wrong with the pictures given, i think its an allusion, ive seen worse.

...and I love them both. I know, too easy but they are both fantastic machines. I will say though that IMHO, the white iMac seems to be a bit more... "solid". The build quality seems higher... but perhaps it's just from the fact that the white iMac is made with thick plastic in the classic apple clear/white setup. The back of the Al iMac seems thin in comparison... but it's not the side of my iMac that interests me anyway :rolleyes:

Now I've been inside my 24" Al a couple times, and it's put together fine. Feel free to check out the interior in this thread: AL Pics (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=350120) Every manufacturer is going to make compromises to keep the cost as low as possible. If you compare the first G5 iMacs with all the modular design they had to the current line, there is no comparison. But as I've mentioned in another post, it cost a LOT of $ from a production standpoint to make things modular, user servicable with rails, clip in's/out's etc.

I do give the nod to the Glossy screen. I feel that the Al iMac is a very sophisticated and more serious looking piece of hardware where the whites are a bit more "toy like".

I will also say that every transcriptionist should buy one of the new keyboards... I can type so much faster on the new Al keyboard it's crazy! :eek:

Well, the white imacs should feel more solid since they are heavy pieces of one material plastic:p. Whereas the iMac is made of Aluminum, glass, and plastic, different materials, making it seem more "open" and un-solid. But IMO, they are the same build quality.

[stainlessliquid]

When are you living? The Freezing problem was fixed by apple on november 17th or something like that, freezing is no more
youre arguing with someone who posted 4 months ago

[bluedoggiant]

youre arguing with someone who posted 4 months ago

Oops, my bad:p. As a matter of fact, i think the firmware that fixed the freezing came on the 17th, he posted on the 16th

[daneoni]

The only thing the white has over the Alum is the screen and maybe the Nvidia GPX. Everything else is a matter personal taste

I personally think the Alum design is the second best design ever with the first being the Lamp/G4 iMacs. I've never like the white plastic on any of the product line line except maybe the iPod and have avoided anything white like a plague. Every non-mac user i've shown the iMac has loved it's design

The remote can conveniently be placed on the base of the iMac and its the easiest access. I still dont get the complaints about them not sticking to the side on this one. The iMac would rarely move so just place it (remote) on the base and move on...you'd come back to find it there

I find the glossy screen to be really good even though i admit it has horrible viewing angles and gradient issues. Overall the image is very palatable and good enough for me

The graphics card on the 2.4GHz models and higher is not bad either. Its the Radeon HD2600 XT clocked down to HD2600 Pro specs and is more than capable for most iMac users' needs

The freezing issue has been addressed as well (i never had it btw) and when i was running Leopard at 10.5.0 i had no issues but i downgraded back to Tiger (not because i had problems but just general dislike for Leopard itself) so i don't know what it's like now

[seanemac007]

Freezing problems are old, apple fixed them ages ago. There are no problems with Leopard.

I keep hearing that Apple fixed the freezing issue with Leopard. However, I just upgraded my late 2006 white iMac 20" and it has froze-up on me about 12 times since Saturday. I have been able to download and install all updates that it detected.

Side issues, possibly related, are weird graphic events happening... an icon on the desktop went all pixelated; then a finder list was pink for 2 seconds... weird stuff.

Is there something I should download that was not part of the updates?

[AlexisV]

Did you archive and install or erase?

You're best of wiping and starting from scratch.

[seanemac007]

Did you archive and install or erase?

You're best of wiping and starting from scratch.

I did not; just installed with computer as-is.

[gregorsamsa]

I keep hearing that Apple fixed the freezing issue with Leopard. However, I just upgraded my late 2006 white iMac 20" and it has froze-up on me about 12 times since Saturday. I have been able to download and install all updates that it detected.

Side issues, possibly related, are weird graphic events happening... an icon on the desktop went all pixelated; then a finder list was pink for 2 seconds... weird stuff.

Is there something I should download that was not part of the updates?

I've had my HD 2600 iMac for some 4 months now & experienced my first screen-freeze 2 days ago - in fact, it happened 3 times whilst playing "Age of Empires 3" when nothing much was going on, with neither processor nor graphics card being taxed. Turned down the shadow quality from very high to high (everything else at max settings) & no problems since, despite 100s of troops & cannons going all out, etc. Still, rather odd, to say the least.

[gregorsamsa]

Ignore my previous post. I've been so busy recently that I've overlooked downloading a firmware update (along with a few other updates I didn't need). Everything now back up at max settings & my iMac running sweetly for hours non-stop, without any screen-freeze issues since downloading firmware update. Sorry Apple. :o