LCD gradient test

[rpeters83]

In case anyone needs it, I put one together below:

http://home.ryanpetersonline.com/lcdtest.html

Compare the left and right sides and let us honestly know how yours did. And here's how my screen did and am not sure how this compares:

http://home.ryanpetersonline.com/screen2.jpg

Thanks.

[peejack]

Compare what?

[bot44]

argh. not so good... my screen is worse than i thought.

white -- blue -- grey

but i'm only doing music production stuff so i might just suck it up unless apple publicly acknowledges that this is a problem that EVERYONE has and they're going to give us all going spanking new computers with beautiful, even toned screens, and free RAM and pre-bundled software to make up for it. :rolleyes:

[rpeters83]

argh. not so good... my screen is worse than i thought.

white -- blue -- grey

but i'm only doing music production stuff so i might just suck it up unless apple publicly acknowledges that this is a problem that EVERYONE has and they're going to give us all going spanking new computers with beautiful, even toned screens, and free RAM and pre-bundled software to make up for it. :rolleyes:

From what I hear, it is a problem for most.

Anyone else want to share their results? How does yours look?

[mbalson]

Worse than the one above. Much more of a dirty gray on the right.

[RickT67]

I noticed my gradient when I put the apple site up twice (side by side) to show off the size of my screen. I immediately noticed the gradient. When I brought it back to the apple store, I showed them "my test", and they gave me a new iMac which was opened and tested on the genius bar. :-)

[rpeters83]

I noticed my gradient when I put the apple site up twice (side by side) to show off the size of my screen. I immediately noticed the gradient. When I brought it back to the apple store, I showed them "my test", and they gave me a new iMac which was opened and tested on the genius bar. :-)

And how is yours now? Did you give it the test? :-D

I wish they would do that kind of testing for me at compusa. They just get you in and get you out :-(

[RickT67]

All set now... It's the best computer I've ever owned!:)

[Washac]

argh. not so good... my screen is worse than i thought.

white -- blue -- grey

but i'm only doing music production stuff so i might just suck it up unless apple publicly acknowledges that this is a problem that EVERYONE has and they're going to give us all going spanking new computers with beautiful, even toned screens, and free RAM and pre-bundled software to make up for it. :rolleyes:


Do not follow others and go looking for stuff, for if you do you sure wont like what you find.

That goes for most things in life I'm afraid.

Sad to say that if people/companies use the cheaper end panels then you will find all the issues that these cheaper panels have.

Take a look at this page.

http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000991.html

The other thing is that if Apple had released the Imacs with a far far better Display Profile, then most people would not have even noticed the issues that these panels have.

I also feel that if people who want these machines for professional photographic use are just buying without going to a store to see them first, then hey what can I say ?

[Tom J]

I noticed my gradient when I put the apple site up twice (side by side) to show off the size of my screen. I immediately noticed the gradient. When I brought it back to the apple store, I showed them "my test", and they gave me a new iMac which was opened and tested on the genius bar. :-)

You didn't say, but I assume that the new one is OK?
Since I haven't bought one yet, I'm trying to get a sense of where we are with this issue on recently purchased iMacs.

[Nordichund]

Sad to say that if people/companies use the cheaper end panels then you will find all the issues that these cheaper panels have.

Take a look at this page.

http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000991.html

?

According to that chart the "IPS" is the quality panel and that's what the 24" Al iMac uses. My old 24 Al iMac" and some other 24" Al iMacs seem to be suffering from this gradient problem mentioned above.

[wizwaz3]

Yesss. Mine's perfect. :)

[rpeters83]

Yesss. Mine's perfect. :)

Lucky you. They're rare.

[Albal]

Yesterday, I received my new iMac (20" 2.4ghz) from shanghai bought from the apple store.

It is a week 47 (W8474****....) pre-installed Leopard. The gradient issue on it was massive - the dock looked horrible and washed out. Luckily (?) after I had a first play on it and familiarised myself with Leopard (that I have decided I didn't like) I turned it off and it wouldn't turn back on.

Phoned up Apple and they've issued a refund. So today, I went to a local Apple store and purchased another iMac, an older one as it happens - a week 41 (W8741****....) and the gradient issue on it almost unnoticeable on it. The Dock is very colourful and it is a lovely screen. The best part is it is a Tiger machine.

Very happy that three issues were resolved in one go... now let's try and explain to the credit card people about the 2K hit it has just had!!!!!

I will post pics of the new iMac screen test in a mo, sadly the old one won't even turn on, so no comparison. Oh well.

Here are the pics - set at full screen brightness. No flash on camera, 5.1 MP.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/Albal1/DSC01912.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/Albal1/DSC01913.jpg

[ceres]

The one I have right now is better than my first unit.
However, there is still a yellowish tint I am not prepared to live with.
On top of that the dvd drive on my replacement is a rather noisy optiarc drive while the first one was a very silent matshita drive. Right now, I am not happy. Not beeing able to get a proper white on the screen kills me. It´s the most frequent background in pdfs, web pages and what not.
However, there is no guarantee whatsoever that the next replacement will be any better. I am kind of out of options.

[Vapor]

I can tell no difference on my 24". Good I guess.

[Dimwhit]

I can tell no difference on my 24". Good I guess.

Ditto

[dcorban]

I see nothing of note on my MacBook.

[bot44]

I'm wondering what brightness level people have their monitors at. I have mine all the way down because I find the screen extremely bright otherwise (and am guessing this also helps with power consumption?) but I feel like maybe it makes the gradient more noticeable.

Thoughts?

[SaSaSushi]

Lucky you. They're rare.

I'm still waiting for you to provide your hard data on this. Where are all those articles you mentioned??

Why don't you get your Mini already and stop with the incessant whining about gradients in 12 different threads? If you think the iMac is such a universally flawed product what's the point, right??

Gradient-free 24" aluminum iMacs are NOT rare. Please do not drink the Kool-Aid. If gradient problems were as widespread as this guy would have you believe there would be a public outcry so loud that Apple would be forced to comment on it officially like they did with the freezing problems, believe me.

I'm NOT saying gradient problems don't exist in some screens but it certainly is as widespread as some in here would have you believe.

Some people love to complain.

[rpeters83]

I'm still waiting for you to provide your hard data on this. Where are all those articles you mentioned??

Why don't you get your Mini already and stop with the incessant whining about gradients in 12 different threads? If you think the iMac is such a universally flawed product what's the point, right??

Gradient-free 24" aluminum iMacs are NOT rare. Please do not drink the Kool-Aid. If gradient problems were as widespread as this guy would have you believe there would be a public outcry so loud that Apple would be forced to comment on it officially like they did with the freezing problems, believe me.

I'm NOT saying gradient problems don't exist in some screens but it certainly is as widespread as some in here would have you believe.

Some people love to complain.

Listen, I'm not going to waste my time on you or get into some forum pissing-contest, but lighten up and stop following my every move.

The hard data I was referring to was the Tom's article. There was one more I had open on my work computer if you'd like to wait until monday to get it to do. Would that make you happy, sweetie?

[rpeters83]

I'm wondering what brightness level people have their monitors at. I have mine all the way down because I find the screen extremely bright otherwise (and am guessing this also helps with power consumption?) but I feel like maybe it makes the gradient more noticeable.

Thoughts?

I just noticed that if you tilt the screen upwards a little, the gradient is less noticeable (before it was pretty much perpendicular to the desk).

[czachorski]

Lucky you. They're rare.

---yawn ---

Sure, rare in on-line forums where people generally go with issues.

[rpeters83]

---yawn ---

Sure, rare in on-line forums where people generally go with issues.

Yeah, I agree. Which is why I'm still on the fence. However, I have yet to see one in person that was perfect, but everyone's idea of it varies.

[cxc]

Yeah, I agree. Which is why I'm still on the fence. However, I have yet to see one in person that was perfect, but everyone's idea of it varies.

good luck. it´s probably not going to happen.
I have had a total of three 24in machines shipped to me via apple bto and all of them suffered from the gradient / tint issue. two machines were complete rubbish - absolutely laughable, with the right side of the screen not beeing able to display any white whatsoever. I have a review of the AL Imacs by
c´t magazin ( http://www.heise-security.co.uk/ )and they clearly spell out the issue. the review is in German (that´s where I live) but you can rut it through babelfish to get the picture. Good screens are a rarity with the Al Imacs. If you absolutely need OS X wait and see what Apple does with the Pros and ACDs.

[czachorski]

Yeah, I agree. Which is why I'm still on the fence. However, I have yet to see one in person that was perfect, but everyone's idea of it varies.

Perfect is a dangerous word. This post makes it sounds like you are thinking of buying, but your 1st one made me think you just wanted to rag on it. If you are thinking about buying it, get it. There have been several threads themed of "who is happy with their screen" and they all went several multiple pages with many many very good screen shots. This is not a systematic problem, but it is real - you are just drawing into small odds of getting a bad one.

My observations from this forum is that there is a lot of bias towards the problems, but the reality is closer to my experience. I was worried before I ordered after reading this very forum, and I volunteered to be a "random sample" for all the doom and gloomers - no bias in my sample, because I had not received it yet.

Judge for yourself, I won't use the word perfect, but I will say that I am happy with the performance:


Full Screen:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac16.jpg



Left and Right Edges Side by Side:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac17.jpg

[czachorski]

good luck. it´s probably not going to happen.
I have had a total of three 24in machines shipped to me via apple bto and all of them suffered from the gradient / tint issue. two machines were complete rubbish - absolutely laughable, with the right side of the screen not beeing able to display any white whatsoever. I have a review of the AL Imacs by
c´t magazin (heise.co.uk for English readers) and they clearly spell out the issue. the review is in German (that´s where I live) but you can rut it through babelfish to get the picture. Good screens are a rarity with the Al Imacs. If you absolutely need OS X wait and see what Apple does with the Pros and ACDs.

I'm sorry but there just no evidence so support your claim. Even your situation of 3 bad ones is plausible with a small percentage of bad ones - some people are going to have terrible luck and draw on 5 or 10% odds and crap out 2,3 or even 4 times in a row. I feel terrible for people like you, and I understand why you are claiming that they are all bad, after your experience, but it just is not true, nor is it true that it is as widespread as you are making it out to be.

[rpeters83]

Perfect is a dangerous word. This post makes it sounds like you are thinking of buying, but your 1st one made me think you just wanted to rag on it. If you are thinking about buying it, get it. There have been several threads themed of "who is happy with their screen" and they all went several multiple pages with many many very good screen shots. This is not a systematic problem, but it is real - you are just drawing into small odds of getting a bad one.

My observations from this forum is that there is a lot of bias towards the problems, but the reality is closer to my experience. I was worried before I ordered after reading this very forum, and I volunteered to be a "random sample" for all the doom and gloomers - no bias in my sample, because I had not received it yet.

Judge for yourself, I won't use the word perfect, but I will say that I am happy with the performance:


Full Screen:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac16.jpg



Left and Right Edges Side by Side:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac17.jpg

I meant I was on the fence about exchanging mine. Who knows, maybe I'll just keep trying until I get one better.

BTW, can you tell me which build week yours is? Thanks.

[czachorski]

I meant I was on the fence about exchanging mine. Who knows, maybe I'll just keep trying until I get one better.

BTW, can you tell me which build week yours is? Thanks.

How do you do that?

[cxc]

How do you do that?

pull up your serial number. it´s the 3rd and 4th digit, or so.
man, I did go out to find a good screen but none of the retailers had a single one.
It´s definitely an issue. Apple is being silent about it bc what should they do?
As long as the Mac doesn´t burn down the house it´s in perfect order for them.

[czachorski]

pull up your serial number. it´s the 3rd and 4th digit, or so.
man, I did go out to find a good screen but none of the retailers had a single one.
It´s definitely an issue. Apple is being silent about it bc what should they do?
As long as the Mac doesn´t burn down the house it´s in perfect order for them.

My wife and I were just looking at the image on the screen, and you're eyes can trick you depending on where you are standing due to viewing issue angles. She thought the right looked slightly darker, and I thought the left did, even though we know the screen is good and that a straight on photo in the dark shows evenness, and normal daily use there is no noticeable gradient. When you start starring at something under scrutiny, even your eyes and brain play tricks on you (as has been demonstrated with optical illusions over the years - see below). Even photos of nearly perfect screens can be taken under conditions that make it look poor. For fun, I took a photo of my white wall a while back and posted it here, and it had a gradient. There is a lot more in play here than just the screen, including the viewing angles, lighting conditions in the shop, lighting conditions when photos are taken, the camera itself etc.

Serial starts with W8742Ou......so does that mean its week 42?


Stare at this bugger for a while, and you will convince yourself there are grey spots in between the dark squares, where there are not:

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/spots.gif

[SaSaSushi]

pull up your serial number. it´s the 3rd and 4th digit, or so.
man, I did go out to find a good screen but none of the retailers had a single one.
It´s definitely an issue. Apple is being silent about it bc what should they do?
As long as the Mac doesn´t burn down the house it´s in perfect order for them.

It's not a matter of what Apple "should" do. All due respect to your fine German magazine if this was as widespread a problem as they (and you) claim Apple would be forced to respond officially.

[SaSaSushi]

How do you do that?

This app is great for all the details you could want to know about your Mac:

http://www.coconut-flavour.com/coconutidentitycard/index.html

[SaSaSushi]

Listen, I'm not going to waste my time on you or get into some forum pissing-contest, but lighten up and stop following my every move.

The hard data I was referring to was the Tom's article. There was one more I had open on my work computer if you'd like to wait until monday to get it to do. Would that make you happy, sweetie?

I hope you'll pardon me for saying so but you don't come across as very intelligent.

I already responded to the Tom's Hardware article in one of your other dozen threads about gradients.

I can appreciate your romantic advances but sorry, I'm married (to a woman).

I've already told you what would make me happy is if you stop spouting disinformation in 12 threads a day about the same nonsense. Your ridiculous BS theories with absolutely no data to support them like 'non-gradient iMacs are a rarity' are dangerous.

[rpeters83]

It's not a matter of what Apple "should" do. All due respect to your fine German magazine if this was as widespread a problem as they (and you) claim Apple would be forced to respond officially.

For what it's worth, the apple rep I met with today said apple was "restricting" shipments of the ALU imacs (I tried to get an exchange but they had none!). Perhaps they are trying to remedy the problem, albeit silently.

[SaSaSushi]

My wife and I were just looking at the image on the screen, and you're eyes can trick you depending on where you are standing due to viewing issue angles. She thought the right looked slightly darker, and I thought the left did, even though we know the screen is good and that a straight on photo in the dark shows evenness, and normal daily use there is no noticeable gradient. When you start starring at something under scrutiny, even your eyes and brain play tricks on you (as has been demonstrated with optical illusions over the years - see below). Even photos of nearly perfect screens can be taken under conditions that make it look poor. For fun, I took a photo of my white wall a while back and posted it here, and it had a gradient. There is a lot more in play here than just the screen, including the viewing angles, lighting conditions in the shop, lighting conditions when photos are taken, the camera itself etc.

It's an excellent point. I noticed the same exact thing on my own screen with the gradient test images. Just adjusting the viewing angle slightly makes you start seeing things.

[SaSaSushi]

For what it's worth, the apple rep I met with today said apple was "restricting" shipments of the ALU imacs (I tried to get an exchange but they had none!). Perhaps they are trying to remedy the problem, albeit silently.

Perhaps the guy is just tiring of you showing up 3 times a day to exchange your iMac and is blowing you off. Have you given that any consideration?

A quick check of the online Apple Store here in Japan where I bought my own iMac still shows the "ships within 24 hours" on the standard 24" model.

Considering your track record in here in "news" and fact reporting you'll pardon me if I'm a bit skeptical.

[rpeters83]

I hope you'll pardon me for saying so but you don't come across as very intelligent.

I already responded to the Tom's Hardware article in one of your other dozen threads about gradients.

I can appreciate your romantic advances but sorry, I'm married (to a woman).

I've already told you what would make me happy is if you stop spouting disinformation in 12 threads a day about the same nonsense. Your ridiculous BS theories with absolutely no data to support them like 'non-gradient iMacs are a rarity' are dangerous.

Wow. A personal attack now? Damn, man, lighten up. I'm not the only one posting about these screens. The only data I have to go on are the one's I've seen in person and an Apple rep agreeing with me.

Now can we stop this already? I truley don't care what you say or how you feel about my posts. I'm seeking information, not friendships.

[rpeters83]

Perhaps the guy is just tiring of you showing up 3 times a day to exchange your iMac and is blowing you off. Have you given that any consideration?

A quick check of the online Apple Store here in Japan where I bought my own iMac still shows the "ships within 24 hours" on the standard 24" model.

Considering your track record in here in "news" and fact reporting you'll pardon me if I'm a bit skeptical.

I only mentioned about his article once...

And I have only been to that store once since I got it almost 2 weeks ago...

As for shipping, I'm going by what the rep told me, that's all.

[czachorski]

Wow. A personal attack now? Damn, man, lighten up. I'm not the only one posting about these screens. The only data I have to go on are the one's I've seen in person and an Apple rep agreeing with me.

Now can we stop this already? I truley don't care what you say or how you feel about my posts. I'm seeking information, not friendships.

Human nature tends to want to see patterns and trends in things. It is reasonable for you to conclude from your own experience and a few trips to the store with bad iMacs that they are all bad. But that doesn't make it so. There are other very real possibilities in play. Hang around here long enough and you will see it play out. I have seen it in just the last few months.

If you keep that in mind, and make posts with a more open mind towards potential angles on the situation, you will get better data from your efforts here.

My own theory is that the screen gradient issue is absolutely real, and isolated, but there have been batches of entire Apple stores with bad ones, and stories of people getting 3-4 bad ones in a row. These are also very plausible occurrences, even if the incidence rate is relatively low. As a matter of fact, due to the things like the potential for a bad batch to go through and end up at the same store, and the laws of probability, it would be unusual if there were not stories like this, even with the incidence rate low. Try to keep that in mind, and know that an on-line forum is going to be a magnet for reporting such things (the tails of the probability distribution).

[rpeters83]

Human nature tends to want to see patterns and trends in things. It is reasonable for you to conclude from your own experience and few trips to the store with bad iMacs that they are all bad. But that doesn't make it so. There are other very real possibilities in play. Hang around here long enough and you will see it play out. I have seen it in just the last few months.

If you keep that in mind, and make posts with a more open mind towards potential angles on the situation, you will get better data from your efforts here.

My own theory is that the screen gradient issue is absolutely real, and isolated, but there have been batches of entire Apple stores with bad ones, and stories of people getting 3-4 bad ones in a row. These are also very plausible occurrences, even if the incidence rate is relatively low. As a matter of fact, due to the things like the potential for a bad batch to go through and end up at the same store, and the laws of probability, it would be unusual if there were not stories like this, even with the incidence rate low. Try to keep that in mind, and know that an on-line forum is going to be a magnet for reporting such things.

And I completely agree with you. I apologize if it made me seem like I was judging every imac to have a bad screen - but only the ones I've seen personally.

Obviously if it was serious matter, Apple would do something about it. And, they may be at this point from talking with the rep today.

Maybe I'm just disgruntled; this is only my second mac and my first macbook even had screen problems on its third exchange. :(

[czachorski]

And I completely agree with you. I apologize if it made me seem like I was judging every imac to have a bad screen - but only the ones I've seen personally.

Obviously if it was serious matter, Apple would do something about it. And, they may be at this point from talking with the rep today.

Maybe I'm just disgruntled; this is only my second mac and my first macbook even had screen problems on its third exchange. :(

I don't blame you a bit for being disgruntled - and that is a kind word given the situation. If I were you, I would be angry as hell after getting that many bad ones.

There were a lot of posts around here in July/Aug/Sept on the bad screens, and they seemed to die off about the time I got mine in Mid-October. That is about the time that a bunch of threads started to surface around here with a bunch of reports on good screens. If mine is week 42 from the serial number, perhaps that suggests that Apple fixed the problem or at least greatly improved upon it around that time. I would try again.

Is it possible to go to a store, and open the unit up and test it before you take it home?

[rpeters83]

I don't blame you a bit for being disgruntled - and that is a kind word given the situation. If I were you, I would be angry as hell after getting that many bad ones.

There were a lot of posts around here in July/Aug/Sept on the bad screens, and they seemed to die off about the time I got mine in Mid-October. That is about the time that a bunch of threads started to surface around here with a bunch of reports on good screens. If mine is week 42 from the serial number, perhaps that suggests that Apple fixed the problem or at least greatly improved upon it around that time. I would try again.

Is it possible to go to a store, and open the unit up and test it before you take it home?

Not really at compusa; where i got it from. I tried to once but they guy simply said he "assured" me it would be good. Plus there was a long line :rolleyes:

Also, I doubt my store will even have anymore, since they said they were sold out and not getting much in.

[czachorski]

Not really at compusa; where i got it from. I tried to once but they guy simply said he "assured" me it would be good. Plus there was a long line :rolleyes:

Also, I doubt my store will even have anymore, since they said they were sold out and not getting much in.

The Apple reps in the CompUSA's tend to be really cool, in my experience. If you told one about your woes, I bet you could either get them to open it up in the store for you, or let you come back and exchange it if you are unlucky again. Heck, if done in the right tact, you could probably get the rep to really become your advocate. You deserve a good screen!

[Bobioden]

Yeah, I agree. Which is why I'm still on the fence. However, I have yet to see one in person that was perfect, but everyone's idea of it varies.


Maybe a Dell is more suited for you.

[rpeters83]

Maybe a Dell is more suited for you.

hell no! i was a PC user since i was 8 and i'm not going now that vista's out there.

though in my experience, they have been very reliable machines.

[SaSaSushi]

Wow. A personal attack now? Damn, man, lighten up. I'm not the only one posting about these screens. The only data I have to go on are the one's I've seen in person and an Apple rep agreeing with me.

Now can we stop this already? I truley don't care what you say or how you feel about my posts. I'm seeking information, not friendships.

It wasn't a "personal attack" so much as bewilderment over how someone could make so many contradictory statements.

As for the "seeking friendships" thing it was obviously in response to your sarcastic use of "sweetie".

As for "stopping this already" I'm all for it.

[SaSaSushi]

I only mentioned about his article once...

And I have only been to that store once since I got it almost 2 weeks ago...

As for shipping, I'm going by what the rep told me, that's all.

Have you considered returning the CompUSA purchased machine and taking your business directly to an Apple Store where they might let you open up and examine a machine prior to purchase?

[rpeters83]

It wasn't a "personal attack" so much as bewilderment over how someone could make so many contradictory statements.

As for the "seeking friendships" thing it was obviously in response to your sarcastic use of "sweetie".

As for "stopping this already" I'm all for it.

Good.

[rpeters83]

Have you considered returning the CompUSA purchased machine and taking your business directly to an Apple Store where they might let you open up and examine a machine prior to purchase?

What sold me at compusa was the 12 months 0% interest. i also just bought a new car last month so i don't have all the money in the world at the moment.

However, I may still do that. Do they offer financing?

[SaSaSushi]

And I completely agree with you. I apologize if it made me seem like I was judging every imac to have a bad screen - but only the ones I've seen personally.

This is what I meant by contradictory and was exactly what I was mainly objecting to. When you make statements to someone who reports having a good screen to the effect of "You're lucky. They're rare." it seems very much as if you're saying what you you deny saying above.

Commenting on your own personal experiences I neither have any problem with nor would I try to refute.

[rpeters83]

This is what I meant by contradictory and was exactly what I was mainly objecting to. When you make statements to someone who reports having a good screen to the effect of "You're lucky. They're rare." it seems very much as if you're saying what you you deny saying above.

Commenting on your own personal experiences I neither have any problem with nor would I try to refute.

Here we go again...

I said he's lucky. That's a compliment. I wish I was that lucky. Again, like I said, I was only basing it off what I've been seeing.

[SaSaSushi]

What sold me at compusa was the 12 months 0% interest. i also just bought a new car last month so i don't have all the money in the world at the moment.

However, I may still do that. Do they offer financing?

Well, I financed mine here in Japan but sorry I don't know what the deal is back stateside. It can't hurt to ask. I would imagine so although it may not be 0%. I wish I had that option over here! I did 10 months at about 5.3%.

It seriously sounds to me like CompUSA might just be blowing you off. Tell them there is no word of any restricted shipments on the Apple Store and I would think especially at the busy holiday season it would be huge news if there were.

[SaSaSushi]

Here we go again...

I said he's lucky. That's a compliment. I wish I was that lucky. Again, like I said, I was only basing it off what I've been seeing.

OK, last word on this and I hope you get it this time. It was not the "lucky" part it was the "those are rare" after it with absolutely no qualifiers like "in my experience".

You clearly insinuated that the vast majority of iMacs had gradient issues and only a rare few have good screens.

[rpeters83]

OK, last word on this and I hope you get it this time. It was not the "lucky" part it was the "those are rare" after it with absolutely no qualifiers like "in my experience".

You clearly insinuated that the vast majority of iMacs had gradient issues and only a rare few have good screens.

Ok. Fine. Good. Big deal. You caught my mistake. I didn't elaborate on my comment. I'll be sure to triple check what I say next time so that nothing I write may offends you.

LOL...

[Leon Kowalski]

Judge for yourself, I won't use the word perfect, but I will say that I am happy with the performance:

Full Screen:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac16.jpg



It's not possible to judge from that photo -- the white areas are totally blown out at 97%-99% RGB saturation.
The blue center stripe is also blown out at 97%-99% blue saturation (plus a significant green component that's
not present in the original test pattern). At that exposure level, any information on relative brightness or color
uniformity is completely lost. Back off an f-stop or so and try again.

LK

[SaSaSushi]

Ok. Fine. Good. Big deal. You caught my mistake. I didn't elaborate on my comment. I'll be sure to triple check what I say next time so that nothing I write may offends you.

LOL...

You still don't get it, lending further credence to my prior observation which you called a "personal insult".

But hey, it wasn't for my lack of trying to explain things to you.

Best of luck to you, friend.

[czachorski]

It's not possible to judge from that photo -- the white areas are totally blown out at 97%-99% RGB saturation.
The blue center stripe is also blown out at 97%-99% blue saturation (plus a significant green component that's
not present in the original test pattern). At that exposure level, any information on relative brightness or color
uniformity is completely lost. Back off an f-stop or so and try again.

LK

That's exactly how it looks. Leon - sounds like you are "blaming the tools" - wasn't it you who said that only a poor carpenter blames his tools? :p

[czachorski]

Not the photographic expert here - all I did last night was shut out all the lights, and take the pic, letting my camera use all it's auto settings, as has usually been the specified procedure by the naysayers. Seems like every time they see something good, they try to change the rules......

I have never used the manual settings on my camera, but it has them, and I found a setting called "ISO level". Not sure how this relates to f-stops, but the manual says this will lower the camera's sensitivity to light, so I took 3 more this morning, one with auto settings, and then I dialed the ISO down to -1 and -2 (as low as it will go). Whatever those settings mean. How many ways are we going to have to slice this until some people shed this silly bias / slant??? Did the photoshop left/right side by side thing with the same result as last night (too lazy to post it, plus I think the results below are pretty clear). Here you go:


http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac18.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac19.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac20.jpg

[Mindflux]

Yesterday, I received my new iMac (20" 2.4ghz) from shanghai bought from the apple store.



You have a 20". Your test needs to have the white on top and bottom, with the blue bar in the middle. The test above is for the 24" who have a left to right fade, 20's have a top to bottom fade.

[Leon Kowalski]

That's exactly how it looks.
Could be. Can't tell one way or the other based on that photo.

Leon - sounds like you are "blaming the tools" - wasn't it you who said that only a poor carpenter blames his tools? :p

a) None of MY tools involved.

b) It's not the camera's fault.

LK

[czachorski]

Could be. Can't tell one way or the other based on that photo.



a) None of MY tools involved.

b) It's not the camera's fault.

LK

Thanks for ignoring the photos I posted that meet your technique specifications, and show the same good quality of the screen. Nice.

So all camera's perfectly replicate the color, saturation, gradation present in the field? You seem like someone who knows a thing or 2 about cameras, and even I know better than that.

[Leon Kowalski]

... letting my camera use all it's auto settings, as has
usually been the specified procedure by the naysayers.

a) Now who is blaming whose tools? :D

b) I never saw any such "specified procedure." If you read the photo notes
in my 24" ALU gallery, it's obvious that they weren't auto-exposures.

http://picasaweb.google.com/TheLooby

... so I took 3 more this morning, one with auto settings, and then I dialed the ISO down
to -1 and -2 (as low as it will go). Whatever those settings mean.

The "-1 and -2" look like exposure bias rather than ISO settings -- but it's results that count.
Ya done good. the 2nd photo is fine for "passing judgement." I'll let others decide what they
think -- but I will say your photo #2 looks far better than my (ex) 24" ALU. OTOH, I think
you'll agree that it doesn't look as uniform as it did in the overexposed photo posted earlier.

...thanks for taking the time to post useful info,

LK

[czachorski]

but I will say your photo #2 looks far better than my (ex) 24" ALU. OTOH, I think
you'll agree that it doesn't look as uniform as it did in the overexposed photo posted earlier.

...thanks for taking the time to post useful info,

LK

The comment on the comparison to your 24" AL makes it sound like you think I am disputing that there are any bad iMacs. I totally understand there are bad ones, and feel genuinely bad for you and others that have got them. It is the general tone by you and others that all iMacs or even most iMacs have the gradient that I am taking issue with.

As far as agreeing that the it doesn't look as uniform as the one from last night - I thought it looked about the same. Here is the left/right photoshop of photo #2. It looks about the same as the one from last night to me:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac21.jpg

And the one from last night again:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac17.jpg

[Leon Kowalski]

It is the general tone by you and others that all iMacs or even most iMacs
have the gradient that I am taking issue with.
Can't speak for "all" iMacs, but I've carefully examined over a dozen first-hand, and
took light meter readings on five of them -- and they were all extremely bad. Every
one I measured had brightness non-uniformities of 2.5:1 or worse, and the others
didn't look any better. 12-out-of-12 duds (with different production dates) is pretty
good evidence that the problem is (or was) far from "rare." Maybe they're getting
better, and I truly hope they are. Your photos are much more valuable for judging
that than a bunch of fanboy "mine looks really, really great" testimonials.

Seriously, thanks again for posting them.

As far as agreeing that the it doesn't look as uniform as the one from last night -
I thought it looked about the same. Here is the left/right photoshop of photo #2.
It looks about the same as the one from last night to me:
I don't mean to be critical of your effort, but comparing the extreme right/left edges
doesn't necessarily reveal non-uniformities. My 24" ALU had an intense hotspot about
6" from the left edge of the screen; right/left edge differences were not the problem.

LK

[czachorski]

I only compared the extreme left/right edges, because that seems to be the most common manifestation of the gradient issue (and that's the way you did it in your comparisons in other threads :D ). The brightness looks uniform to me across the entire screen in real life, and in the photos, although I have not photoshopped every square inch to compare. But so far, my eyes have been fairly consistent with the PS results.

The store observations of the numerous bad Macs, is it recent? You made similar observation a few months ago, and subsequent to that, I have too, and I have seen nothing but good ones. I'm still operating under the theory that there were batches of bad ones that filled entire stores amongst the early shipped ones, and that the problem has since been reduced or fixed. That's just based on my own experience with my iMac and what I have seen in just a few stores.

[czachorski]

Just a quick PS -

Do you want to take bets that if I went to the Apple store near me tonight and took similar photos of the 24" iMacs in the store, that every single one would look just like mine?

Just sayin....

[Leon Kowalski]

Do you want to take bets that if I went to the Apple store near me tonight and took similar
photos of the 24" iMacs in the store, that every single one would look just like mine?

Just sayin....
Could be. My interest in visiting Apple stores has waned; the white 20" will be just fine
for a year or three. I seriously hope Apple is silently working on the problem, although
a more public/transparent approach would be far better for customers AND their own
long-term corporate street creds.

I only compared the extreme left/right edges, because that seems to be the most common manifestation
of the gradient issue (and that's the way you did it in your comparisons in other threads :D ).
Please allow me to refresh your memory:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=4361550&postcount=29

Of course, a few posters unfamiliar with industry-standard definition of "luminance uniformity"
were critical of the fact that I followed the universally accepted practice of comparing brightest
to darkest -- rather than using arbitrarily pre-selected screen locations:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=4362408&postcount=33


"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example."
- Mark Twain

.

[rpeters83]

Not the photographic expert here - all I did last night was shut out all the lights, and take the pic, letting my camera use all it's auto settings, as has usually been the specified procedure by the naysayers. Seems like every time they see something good, they try to change the rules......

I have never used the manual settings on my camera, but it has them, and I found a setting called "ISO level". Not sure how this relates to f-stops, but the manual says this will lower the camera's sensitivity to light, so I took 3 more this morning, one with auto settings, and then I dialed the ISO down to -1 and -2 (as low as it will go). Whatever those settings mean. How many ways are we going to have to slice this until some people shed this silly bias / slant??? Did the photoshop left/right side by side thing with the same result as last night (too lazy to post it, plus I think the results below are pretty clear). Here you go:


http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac18.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac19.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac20.jpg

Yours looks just like mine. If you squint, you can sort of tell a difference in all 3 photos. However, as I'm learning with mine and by playing around with settings, it's ever so slight.

I'm actually leaning on the edge of keeping mine.

I contemplated getting a mac mini and using a monitor that i had here that was "good". turned out, when i tested it, it was complete crap and the backlight bleed was horrible. colors were also all grayed out.

granted, it was even on both sides, but it was crap compared to the 24" imac screen.

i also found out that by using a calibration that takes out some of the brown hues, it really helps it out. you can barely tell a difference on whites but on greys (like the os x title bars), you cant tell a difference as opposed to using the stock imac calibration.

i can upload it if anyone wants too to try it out.

[czachorski]

Yours looks just like mine. If you squint, you can sort of tell a difference in all 3 photos.

I sorry - what? Squint? I don't mean to rip on your screen, or anything, but I have to take issue with these statements. When I looked at your photo, I can see a gradient with the right side darker immediately. I just don't see a gradient like that on mine in real life, in the photos, or when I place the left and right edges side by side in photoshop.

If this is your criteria for judging screen - that a screen like mine has an issue that makes it defective, then you will never be happy with another iMac, or probably any screen for that matter. So on second thought, definitely don't go exchange it for another one. It looks like your never going to be happy.

Your screen left/right edges:

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac22.jpg

My screen left/right edges with the light sensitivity reduced per Leon's suggestion (middle photo):

http://homepage.mac.com/czachorski/fun/alum_imac21.jpg

[ceres]

Yes please upload that profile. The iMac panel per se is good. The tinting is horrible (on my machines so far).

[czachorski]

Yes please upload that profile. The iMac panel per se is good. The tinting is horrible (on my machines so far).

My profile? It's one of the built-in ones: Apple RGB