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oldschool
Sep 30, 2003, 02:32 AM
A few things.

I'm new to the board, so hello to everybody.

Also, i just got my new 15" pb last week. While its a great machine, i do have a few questions. When I close the screen, should i be able to push it down about a quarter of an inch, or should it be totally secure?

Another thing. It seems that i have one dead pixel. Is this normal?

Lastly, it seems that the powerbook doesn't sit perfectly flat. Is this a known problem? My desks fault?

cb911
Sep 30, 2003, 03:38 AM
oldschool, welcome. :)

i've noticed a few of the same problems with my new PB as well. the screen on my TiBook used to close very securely, with no movement of the screen when it is latched up.

on the new PB i have noticed that when the screen is latched closed you can still push it down about 2mm. i don't know about 1/4" but that sounds like alot. if you're really picky about it, and can do without your precious for a while, then you might as well see if Apple will fix it.

i've got a bright pixel on my screen. a green one.... hold on i just checked now, and i either can't see it, or it fixed itself. :D people have sometimes 'massaged' the screen with a soft, non-scratch cloth and the dead or bright pixels have gone away.

generally, i don't think Apple, or any computer seller will do anything if there is only one dead pixel.

one thing is sure though - your PB should sit flat on the desk. check it on a desk you know is level... if it wobbles like a chair that has one leg shorter then another... then take it in and get it fixed. i can't imagine how annoying it would be to have a lop-sided PowerBook. :p

hope that's helped you a bit. :)

oldschool
Sep 30, 2003, 12:13 PM
Thanks for the reply.

I just wanted to confirm that the dead pixel is normal.

Also when the screen is closed, it moves up and down when i'm carrying it, and makes a "clapping" noise. I don't know if this is normal or not, but I assume it should be held steady.

dswoodley
Sep 30, 2003, 12:30 PM
Unfortunately, a dead pixel is not out of the ordinary - just annoying. Hope you like your new machine!

oldschool
Sep 30, 2003, 12:43 PM
While i don't care about any of these thing...dead pixel...etc...

i just want to know if everybody elses 15"ers have the enormous play in the screen.

It doesn't bother me but i just want to know.

And i love the powerbook. Chances are even if its not normal its not going back.

Toeknee
Sep 30, 2003, 01:25 PM
Yeah i noticed the slight play to the screen as well... im thinking that apple did this due to the fact that the TiBook screens were getting the imprint of the kb over a long period of time. At least I hope thats the reason b/c it looks nasty when that happens. I too have a dead pixel but its no biggy i still love this comp.

Powerbook G5
Sep 30, 2003, 01:50 PM
The lid thing is normal, but it should only be 1/10", though. Apple did this to help with the problem with earlier PowerBooks causing an imprint on the screen from the keyboard when closed. As far as the dead pixel, try gently massaging it, I did that once with my G3 when I had a bright green pixel on the left corner of the screen and it went away after that. Not sure about the uneven thing, though, I'd check the bottom to see if all the feet are on it and check the desk to see if maybe the desk isn't even.

oldschool
Sep 30, 2003, 03:19 PM
Thanks guys, its nice to know that the play in the screen is normal. The quarter of an inch i said was estimated wrong. My imperial skills are no good (i live in canada-land of base ten)

Anyways, thanks for all the replys, and sorry for rehashing a subject that has probably been flogged to death already. I didn't know it was an issue when i first posted.

I would like to say however, that FEDEX is amazing. The tracking info they give you, and the delivery time, customer service...its all excellent. (they delivered my computer.)

oldschool
Sep 30, 2003, 03:28 PM
OK i just turned my screen all one color, and it turns out there are three dead pixels.


Should I phone apple? How many is too many?

Toeknee
Sep 30, 2003, 03:38 PM
I forget the link to the apple site but if you go to the other forum "new powerbooks finally" toward the end i start talking..(More like asking) about dead pixels too and some other members provided some links to apples site about how many is too many and what their policy on that kinda stuff is. Most of the replies there help too

joeyjojoe
Sep 30, 2003, 06:49 PM
I'm fairly certain the magic number is 8. If you have more than 8 dead pixels, they will consider repairing/replacing.

ColoJohnBoy
Oct 1, 2003, 12:56 AM
Is it really eight pixels? That seems like an awful lot. If I remember correctly from when I worked at the store, it was four or five. It may, however, just depend on the store manager or even on the MacGenius/support rep who hears the case.

cb911
Oct 1, 2003, 02:01 AM
whoa, 3 dead pixels is a few. :P (few = 3, get it?)

are the pixels 'dead' or 'bright'. i could imagine trying to use a screen with 3 bright pixels, that would be so annoying.

you could always just take it into the store and see if they can do something about it... but those screens aren't cheap.


and about the 'play' with the screen... i don't think that is normal. sure, there should be a gap, so the keys don't touch the screen, as shown on all the 15" PB pics where it is closed. But i don't think there should be any movement when the screen is latched closed. is that what everyone's talking about? my screen moves about 2mm up and down when it is closed.

Powerbook G5
Oct 1, 2003, 08:44 AM
Originally posted by cb911
whoa, 3 dead pixels is a few. :P (few = 3, get it?)

are the pixels 'dead' or 'bright'. i could imagine trying to use a screen with 3 bright pixels, that would be so annoying.

you could always just take it into the store and see if they can do something about it... but those screens aren't cheap.


and about the 'play' with the screen... i don't think that is normal. sure, there should be a gap, so the keys don't touch the screen, as shown on all the 15" PB pics where it is closed. But i don't think there should be any movement when the screen is latched closed. is that what everyone's talking about? my screen moves about 2mm up and down when it is closed.

It shouldn't move when it is latched besides a small mm or two if any. Once it is latched, it is pretty secure and doesn't wobble like some have said. Maybe the hinge is loose? As far as the pixels, it depends on where they are. If they are dead center, Apple will more likely replace it than if they were in the corner somewhere.

MattG
Oct 1, 2003, 08:54 AM
My screen latches properly, and doesn't seem to be 'uneven.' However I do have a dead pixel, or at least an intermittently-dead pixel. Sometimes it glows green, sometimes it works normally. I'm used to it already, though.

Toeknee
Oct 1, 2003, 03:35 PM
man its a real bummer that ive heard a lot of people having dead pixels.... including myself. I've heard that you can massage them out with a soft cloth, im not quite sure how to do this.... lil' help. The dead pixel that i have i rarely notice since ive put a background that kinda hides it.

Powerbook G5
Oct 1, 2003, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by Toeknee
man its a real bummer that ive heard a lot of people having dead pixels.... including myself. I've heard that you can massage them out with a soft cloth, im not quite sure how to do this.... lil' help. The dead pixel that i have i rarely notice since ive put a background that kinda hides it.

With my G3 PowerBook, I just rubbed them for about 10 seconds and they just went away. Also, they sometimes just got "stuck" so a simple reboot or putting it to sleep also helped sometimes, too.

Toeknee
Oct 1, 2003, 04:06 PM
No go... :( bummer oh well i can live with it.

oldschool
Oct 1, 2003, 10:24 PM
Nice to know you guys aren't going to make a big deal out of it. I basically just wanted to know if everybody else was going to bitch about it to apple. Then I would have got on the bandwagon, b/c i wouldn't have wanted to be left out of a new LCD.

BTW, anybody here successfuly gotten a new LCD? What did it take?

somecows
Oct 2, 2003, 01:15 PM
I recently received my new 15" 1.25ghz power book and right out of the box I noticed two problems with it. One, the hard drive keeps making a weird clicking noise. I am familiar with the noise hard drives normally make and this is different. Even if I'm not using the machine, about once a minute the hard drive goes "click". Second, the track pad button is extremely hard to press. I know this doesn't sound like a big deal but trust me, its HARD. It just makes it kind of hard to use.

I called up apple and they said if my HD is clicking it probably means its going to "fail" soon and that I should send it back to them. But the thing is, I don't want to send it back and have it repaired. I want a computer that works right the first time. If I wanted a repaired machine I would have purchased a refurbished one. I can understand Apple wanting to repair instead of replace machines if they break after a month or two of use, but if it's broken right out of the box, doesn't it seem like they should replace it? I had a 5300 laptop ages ago that came with a broken hard drive, and even though apple replaced it, the machine was never quite right. It just always acted funny.

So my question is, does anyone know of anything you can do to get apple to replace a broken machine rather than fix it? Does anyone know what our rights are as consumers?

I love apple and have had multiple macs in my life, but I hate having to deal with this sort of thing.

Thanks.

oldschool
Oct 2, 2003, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by somecows
I recently received my new 15" 1.25ghz power book and right out of the box I noticed two problems with it. One, the hard drive keeps making a weird clicking noise. I am familiar with the noise hard drives normally make and this is different. Even if I'm not using the machine, about once a minute the hard drive goes "click". Second, the track pad button is extremely hard to press. I know this doesn't sound like a big deal but trust me, its HARD. It just makes it kind of hard to use.

I called up apple and they said if my HD is clicking it probably means its going to "fail" soon and that I should send it back to them. But the thing is, I don't want to send it back and have it repaired. I want a computer that works right the first time. If I wanted a repaired machine I would have purchased a refurbished one. I can understand Apple wanting to repair instead of replace machines if they break after a month or two of use, but if it's broken right out of the box, doesn't it seem like they should replace it? I had a 5300 laptop ages ago that came with a broken hard drive, and even though apple replaced it, the machine was never quite right. It just always acted funny.

So my question is, does anyone know of anything you can do to get apple to replace a broken machine rather than fix it? Does anyone know what our rights are as consumers?

I love apple and have had multiple macs in my life, but I hate having to deal with this sort of thing.

Thanks.

Damn. Mine makes that clicking noise too. And a very high pitched nails on chalkboard sound when its moving.

somecows
Oct 2, 2003, 01:31 PM
Originally posted by oldschool
Damn. Mine makes that clicking noise too. And a very high pitched nails on chalkboard sound when its moving.

Really? I don't know what to say. I can't say for sure that there is something wrong with a machine that makes that noise, but I can tell you that it sounds very different from the sounds my other macs have made.

If anyone has any advice please respond.

Toeknee
Oct 2, 2003, 01:55 PM
My hard drive every once in a while makes the chalkboard noise but thats only when its doing something HD intensive. It just freaks me out. I just hope that it doesnt die on me.

oldschool
Oct 2, 2003, 03:32 PM
Ok good. Just wanted to know it was common. All my other macs have had annoying hard disks, and i've never had one fail once. Just this one is different from all of them.

latergator116
Oct 2, 2003, 06:44 PM
Id call apple and ask them to replace the machine. my iBook was a lemon and they never replaced it and now it is shot and the warranty is over. Be stern with the person on the phone and tell them you want a new computer. I think they have a policy somewhere that if your computer arrives defected you can request a new one.

latergator116
Oct 2, 2003, 06:46 PM
An Apple-branded hardware product is considered DOA if it shows symptoms of a hardware failure, preventing basic operability, upon its first use out of the box. If you believe that your product is DOA, please call Apple Care Technical Support at 1-800-APL-CARE (1-800-275-2273) within 30 calendar days of the invoice date. Apple Care Technical Support will determine whether the product is DOA and offer you the following options:

Replacement: The same product that you ordered will be shipped to you at Apple's expense. An Apple Store Sales Support representative will contact you within 24 hours of your call with the replacement product delivery time and the procedure for returning the DOA product.


Service: You may have the product repaired; however, once serviced, the product is no longer eligible for replacement.


I found this on apples website

somecows
Oct 2, 2003, 08:16 PM
Originally posted by latergator116
An Apple-branded hardware product is considered DOA if it shows symptoms of a hardware failure, preventing basic operability, upon its first use out of the box. If you believe that your product is DOA, please call Apple Care Technical Support at 1-800-APL-CARE (1-800-275-2273) within 30 calendar days of the invoice date. Apple Care Technical Support will determine whether the product is DOA and offer you the following options:

Replacement: The same product that you ordered will be shipped to you at Apple's expense. An Apple Store Sales Support representative will contact you within 24 hours of your call with the replacement product delivery time and the procedure for returning the DOA product.


Service: You may have the product repaired; however, once serviced, the product is no longer eligible for replacement.


I found this on apples website

Argh this is so annoying. Cuz I know apple isn't going to accept the idea that the clicking sound and trackpad problems are "preventing basic operability". But I still don't think I should have to pay for a product that arrives defective.

I'm sitting here listening to my PB go "click click click click" as I type this. Apple is supposedly sending me a box so I can ship it back to them for repair but it just seems so unfair. I don't see why I should have to go through all that hassle and wait for 7 business days or whatever it is. It seems to me this is THEIR problem, not mine.

I am very upset.

somecows
Oct 2, 2003, 08:20 PM
Originally posted by latergator116
Id call apple and ask them to replace the machine. my iBook was a lemon and they never replaced it and now it is shot and the warranty is over. Be stern with the person on the phone and tell them you want a new computer. I think they have a policy somewhere that if your computer arrives defected you can request a new one.

That's what I'm worried about - that this machine is a lemon and it's never going to be quite right, no matter what apple does to it. But it just seems like we have no rights as consumers. I am basically at their mercy.

I'm worried that when apple gets it back in their shop to repair it that they won't even pay attention to the problem. I'm worried that they will just dismiss my complaint and not listen to the clicking sound.

And I'm worried they won't care that the track pad is messed up. They might say that as long as it's technically usable, it's not their responsibility to fix it.

latergator116
Oct 2, 2003, 08:25 PM
I know exactly how you feel. If I were you I would not send the computer back becase as it says "once its has been repaired it can not be returned." I would just leave it how it is and wait until the hardrive crashes if it should crash.(ironically my harddrive just crashed). If it is too annoying call them up and tell them that it is impossible to work with the noise and it is not usable. they are sometimes very flexible. Just remember to be stern and thats its ok to stretcch the truth a little(or a lot). Also, it cant hurt to call them up so give it a shot. the worst that can happen is that they dont want to replace it.

Powerbook G5
Oct 2, 2003, 09:32 PM
When I got my PowerBook G3, right out of the box it would make a high pitched hum that would get louder/softer as you adjust the lighting of the LCD. I called Apple and they replaced it with a new one with overnight shipping with no questions asked. They usually seem pretty good with that when a product arrives defective. I'd definitely get on them over that.

cb911
Oct 2, 2003, 10:44 PM
it's a shame that we're hearing about all of these problems... it's starting to sound like Apple rushed the release... or tried to get cheaper components or something... but i'd like not to think that.

i'm still concearned about the screen moving when it is closed. the new PB's have a built in gap so that the keys don't touch the screen... but i still think that the screen shouldn't move at all when closed. the TiBooks screen never moved when it was latched, shouldn't the new PB's behave the same?

i'm sticking to my story that there's too much 'looseness' in the latching mechanism. :rolleyes:

latergator116
Oct 3, 2003, 07:00 AM
It could just be that a batch of them have problems

coolbreeze
Oct 3, 2003, 09:45 AM
I've cancelled my 1.25 order, and developed a renewed love for my iBook. I am always a cutting-edge early adopter to new technology, but there seems to be too many problems with the new Powerbooks (15"). Just read the stories on Apple's own message boards. Battery. Latch. White spots on display. Clicking noises. Nightmare. Think I'll sip on some cold lemonade while waiting on Rev.B.

natebailey11
Oct 3, 2003, 10:34 AM
I assume this is normal, but if I put weight (say from my wrist) right toward the front-right edge of the PB, where the slot-load is, it depresses and makes an odd clicking noise. I assume this is just the nature of the slot-load, but I wanted to make sure.

So everybody with a 15 go push right on the edge in the middle of the drive area and see if it goes down and clicks. And then let me know. :)

Powerbook G5
Oct 3, 2003, 11:04 AM
I can't believe someone would cancel their order just from hearing some people complain. You must realize that people with good PowerBooks don't go on Apple's forum and say how great it is. Out of the thousands received, only a handful have had problems. Mine is great and I've talked to many who also got great systems and I love mine to death. But it's your choice, I suppose. Just don't take the few reports you hear as the norm since it is pretty skewed with the people who report problems v. the people who simply got great systems and have no need to complain.

the_dalex
Oct 3, 2003, 11:32 AM
We've sold about 125 15" Powerbooks since release, and I've seen a much larger percentage of defects than with any other Apple product. The majority of the problems are bad latches, with that problem affecting about 10% of the population. I've also seen a large number of bad pixels, in the old days you were unlucky if you got a bad pixel and nowadays you're lucky if you didn't. Several of my employees bought the new SuperDrives, and all four of them have at least one bad pixel. Luckily our demo model is perfect, but we had to reinstall the OS immediately because Internet Explorer and every other program took 20 bounces to launch. Sloppy.

It was bad enough when I had customers waiting six weeks for Powerbooks, and I had hoped that they would all be happy with what we gave them. Now, people are questioning if the wait was worth it or not. Luckily, every 15" Powerbook leaves this store with Applecare since we have good bundle deals, so I don't worry because I know they will be taken care of by Apple when they have time to send it in for repair, and I just have to put up with the complaints for just a little longer...

oldschool
Oct 4, 2003, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by natebailey11
I assume this is normal, but if I put weight (say from my wrist) right toward the front-right edge of the PB, where the slot-load is, it depresses and makes an odd clicking noise. I assume this is just the nature of the slot-load, but I wanted to make sure.

So everybody with a 15 go push right on the edge in the middle of the drive area and see if it goes down and clicks. And then let me know. :)
Ya same thing..

natebailey11
Oct 4, 2003, 06:20 PM
Good to know I'm not the only one, oldschool. The more I think about this, the more I'm sure it just be because of the drive. If anybody knows differently, please let me know.

Also, do we have anything conclusive on heat/battery life? Mine seems, to me, to get quite hot often and the battery life is at most 2:15. I've let it run down to empty and then fully recharged it twice, so I don't think calibration is an issue. With the heat, I haven't had a chance to do anything "intesive" on it yet at all. Mostly it just sits next to me with iChat, Mail and Safari open. Ideas or tips here would be helpful -- I'd like to get to that 3.5/4 hr range on the battery and cool case that others seem to have.

Jottle
Oct 17, 2003, 12:19 PM
I think almost every new alum makes this clicking noise and people arent' listening to it. It can only heard in a very quiet environment. I have the same noise and am still debating whether it is just normal and will happen again if I get a replacement/repair? Anyone have more updates?

jbomber
Oct 17, 2003, 11:31 PM
How many people have noticed bright areas or white spots on their screens?

I'm a pixel-pusher by trade and my brand new 15" has 3 bright areas that are kind of annoying to deal with. I didn't notice them at first becasue i was using a bright white background image, but after making some changes, they're clearly visible.

JettaBoyWA
Oct 18, 2003, 06:32 AM
I purchased a 23" Cinema Display from a local Apple reseller... got it home, and noticed some kind of "dirt" between the LCD layer and the illuminant. I took it back the next day, and the reseller said they'd have to send it back to Apple for repair.

I didn't accept that response, asked for the manager who said the same thing, and finally started getting upset and raised my voice so other shoppers could hear my frustration. At that point, they agreed to give me a new display, and I insisted that they open it and power it up so that I could see that it was perfect.

I think it's unfortunate that we spend so much money and get defective products. It's very important that, if you feel you are entitled to a new unit, you make your feelings known and continue escalating through the corporate chain of command until you reach someone who will make the right decision for you.

I think the number of dead pixels you have, although under Apple's repair limit, is unacceptable for the price you're paying regardless. And since you noticed it immediately, out of the box, I think they should send you a new unit -- you may wish to go back to the place where you bought it, and ask them for an exchange.

If anyone gives you crap, tell them that you made a conscious choice to give them your business over their competition, and that you've recommended them to your friends and family, and that they owe you some consideration. Any good businessman will jump to keep you happy.

Good luck.

Fall
Oct 19, 2003, 07:22 PM
Originally posted by latergator116
Id call apple and ask them to replace the machine. my iBook was a lemon and they never replaced it and now it is shot and the warranty is over. Be stern with the person on the phone and tell them you want a new computer. I think they have a policy somewhere that if your computer arrives defected you can request a new one.

They were prepared to DOA my 5-day-old 15.2" because it had a broken latch and 2 dead pixels, but I couldn't wait 3 weeks for another one.

jbomber
Oct 23, 2003, 02:36 AM
Originally posted by Fall
They were prepared to DOA my 5-day-old 15.2" because it had a broken latch and 2 dead pixels, but I couldn't wait 3 weeks for another one.

3 weeks? did they quote you 3 weeks as the turn-around time? i talked to them today and they said 1 week.

Fall
Oct 24, 2003, 08:30 AM
Originally posted by oldschool

BTW, anybody here successfuly gotten a new LCD? What did it take?

Me. I took it to our nearest apple retailer (i'm in a small town), to get the latch fixed. they checked the support databases and found an article that stated all displays with faulty latches are to be replaced entirely.

Certainly takes care of those two dead pixels too! Two birds /w one stone!

They're replacing it next week.

Fall
Oct 24, 2003, 08:35 AM
Originally posted by jbomber
3 weeks? did they quote you 3 weeks as the turn-around time? i talked to them today and they said 1 week.

I see I already replied in this thread, hehehe

Yeh, mine's the 15.2" Combo with backlit keyboard, the backlit adds two weeks to delivery time. thus 3 weeks. I told them just to give me the superdrive model then, they laughed...I wasn't hopeful of that deal goinfg through.

illumin8
Oct 24, 2003, 03:54 PM
Originally posted by somecows
Really? I don't know what to say. I can't say for sure that there is something wrong with a machine that makes that noise, but I can tell you that it sounds very different from the sounds my other macs have made.

If anyone has any advice please respond.
I don't know about you, but I just ordered a PowerBook and if mine has that problem I will probably nicely ask the merchant to replace it with a new one. If they refuse, and you have tried to be cordial with them, threaten to call your credit card company and do a charge-back. Most credit-card companies will allow you to do this which gives you extra protection if you receive a product that is defective or not working as advertised. In fact a lot of credit cards actually extend the return period to something like 90 days on all purchases. The merchants know this and usually when they hear the magic word (chargeback), they all of a sudden get super cooperative.

I wouldn't recommend using this tactic unless you have exhausted all possible options, but that's one reason why you should always make big purchases on a credit card. You have a lot more power as a buyer that way and you can't be shafted as easily.