Bye Bye... iPhone....Bye Bye

[redshovel]

Well after several weeks I finally sold my UK ‘unlocked to any O2 sim card’ iPhone.
I was never going to partake of the 18 month contract. Leaving aside the pathetic call and text bundles on offer I feel 18 months is 6 months to long for any mobile phone contract.

I have got shot for a number of reasons.

1. The poor camera meant I was back to carrying a separate digital one. Very annoying.
2. Edge coverage (when you can get it) is only ok for web browsing.
3. I was feed up of people moaning that I keep on sending them two text messages with only one word in the second message. All this due to the iPhones lack of a simple character counter.
4. No Bluetooth file transfer. All your mates are swapping files around you and your sitting there with latest, greatest phone and you can’t join in. That’s just wrong.
5. That would make a great ringtone for my phone. Hold on till I set that up. Dam it. I can’t do that either.
6. Most annoying of all was not being able to set a decent SMS tone. I never once heard the thing go off in my pocket.
I know there are several ways round some of these problems but as with unlocking the phone and 3rd party appz, you’re in a consent battle with apple. It’s just not worth the hassle. Not for a phone and especially not this phone.

To some up, iPhone is brilliant in some ways. Connected to Wi-Fi and its interface makes the best portable web browser by far. But in many others resects, some key to being a usable mobile phone, it fails miserably.
Many may disagree with the above but most will agree with this....The whole affair has been one hell of a marketing disaster.
Better Luck next time apple.


PS. Using an Nokia N95 8GB now and feel right at home again after what seems like a just ok holiday with 6 day flight delays on either side.

[alFR]

If you are a serious photographer you'd need a separate camera whatever your phone - no phone cam can match even a fairly basic digicam, the lenses aren't good enough. I find the iphone camera fine for casual snaps and can easily put on custom ringtones without hacks with the current firmware. Edge has been fine for me and the vibrate alert works fine for SMS. Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

[Ninja Dom]

Please explain the "marketing disaster" part for me.

Nearly 5 million units sold in only 6 months seems far from a Marketing Disaster for Apple.

[redshovel]

If you are a serious photographer you'd need a separate camera whatever your phone - no phone cam can match even a fairly basic digicam, the lenses aren't good enough. I find the iphone camera fine for casual snaps and can easily put on custom ringtones without hacks with the current firmware. Edge has been fine for me and the vibrate alert works fine for SMS. Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

Before I got the iPhone I was using a K800i with 3.2 MP camera. It performed just as well as my CyberShot 3.2MP digital Camera. My new N95 8GB sports a 5.0MP Carl Zeiss lens. It produces better results my freinds samsung 5MP stand alone camera. So your argument is void. Unless your a professional photographer you should not need to carry a seperate camera in this day and age. The camera on the iphone behind the times. Apple got this so so wrong. EDGE is ok but 3G leaves it for dead. Another bad apple. Hell with the Opera Mini Browser on my N95 8GB I can surf the web (FULL SIZE PAGES) faster on GPRS connect than an iPhone on EDGE!

[phungy]

How do you like the N95?

[redshovel]

Please explain the "marketing disaster" part for me.

Nearly 5 million units sold in only 6 months seems far from a Marketing Disaster for Apple.

The marketing disaster is the ‘barrier to purchase’ apple has created. The usual barrier to purchase of any product is the price. It’s a simple matter of life in that if you don’t have the money you can’t buy the product. However apple has re written this rule and even people with the money to purchase the iphone wont, even though they may still want it. The ridiculous 18 month contract being the main put off. Many people already have a contract and would just want a ‘sim free’ version and be happy enough to pay the £269. Hell I know some willing to pay twice that for a legit sim free version. The same case applies for people on PAYG.
So they may have sold nearly 5 million units, but this should have been a hell of a lot more. The whole affair has damaged the apple brand also. People with cash ready feel they are being bullied into contracts. Others in the know purchase unlocked versions but are in a consent battle to keep their phones online. Many are just confused and don’t bother buying into any iPhone. All this combined and it’s a ‘marketing disaster’.

[redshovel]

How do you like the N95?

I am really likeing the N95 8GB. It’s got the functionality of any Nokia phone combined with a really really god Carl Zeiss camera. Web browsing on it is brilliant also. Ok it hasn’t got the slick touch screen of the iphone, but I have loaded Opera Mini onto my N95 8GB and with its somewhat magical compression system Opera Mini can display FULL SIZE websites to me as fast on a GPRS connect than iPhone can over EDGE.

[Ninja Dom]

Quite the opposite, my friend.

The Apple iPhone has been a marketing success. Look through the various magazines in the world to see the product listed in the top 5 product pages. Time magazine rated it the greatest product/gadget of 2007.

You have a lot of criticism for the buying model. But even with this buying model Apple still sold nearly 5 million units. Do you understand? FIVE MILLION IN SIX MONTHS!!! With it ONLY being available in the US, UK, France & Germany. No other mobile phone has ever sold like that regardless of the price it sells for.

O2 said that 80% of iPhone sales were to new customers. How can any of this be called a marketing disaster??

In fact, once Apple announce the amount of money they have made through the iPhone don't be surprised if you start to see other mobile phone manufacturers copying this distribution model for phones in 2008.

[Ish]

I am really likeing the N95 8GB. It’s got the functionality of any Nokia phone combined with a really really god Carl Zeiss camera. Web browsing on it is brilliant also. Ok it hasn’t got the slick touch screen of the iphone, but I have loaded Opera Mini onto my N95 8GB and with its somewhat magical compression system Opera Mini can display FULL SIZE websites to me as fast on a GPRS connect than iPhone can over EDGE.

'Fraid I'm going to get a bit off-topic here. Sorry.

What do you use for loading your N95? I bought an N73 recently and while it syncs fine with the Mac for calendar and address book, as far as I can tell I'd have to install the Nokia software on someone else's PC to download any software upgrades etc.

[redshovel]

Quite the opposite, my friend.

The Apple iPhone has been a marketing success. Look through the various magazines in the world to see the product listed in the top 5 product pages. Time magazine rated it the greatest product/gadget of 2007.

You have a lot of criticism for the buying model. But even with this buying model Apple still sold nearly 5 million units. Do you understand? FIVE MILLION IN SIX MONTHS!!! With it ONLY being available in the US, UK, France & Germany. No other mobile phone has ever sold like that regardless of the price it sells for.

O2 said that 80% of iPhone sales were to new customers. How can any of this be called a marketing disaster??

In fact, once Apple announce the amount of money they have made through the iPhone don't be surprised if you start to see other mobile phone manufacturers copying this distribution model for phones in 2008.

In response to your points:
The iphone has indeed been listed in various magazines as being one of the top 5 gadgets of 2007. ‘Gadgets’, NOT PHONE. I too enjoyed some of the groundbreaking features of the iPhone but it doesn’t make it a good all round mobile phone.

These 5 million units you keep banging on about are poor compare to what it could have been if apple had not restricted the sale of the iPhone.

You claim ‘O2 said that 80% of iPhone sales were to new customers.’ So what! What percentage of that figure are iPhones purchased with no intent on signing the 18 month contract and getting the phone unlocked?

Also I very much doubt you will ever see another mobile phone manufacture takes this marketing approach. Because when all the legal wrangling and disgruntled customers and brand damage has been assed they would be crazy too.
I think you will see the opposite and that iPhone Version 2 will be launched to ALL THE NETWORKS.

[redshovel]

'Fraid I'm going to get a bit off-topic here. Sorry.

What do you use for loading your N95? I bought an N73 recently and while it syncs fine with the Mac for calendar and address book, as far as I can tell I'd have to install the Nokia software on someone else's PC to download any software upgrades etc.

The opera mini browser I mentioned can be downloaded and installed directly off the opera website through the current browser on the n95. Any other loading/upgrades I have used the bundled nokia software on my PC. However I am told there are other 3rd Party programs you can use to load software etc and some that work on mac also. Guess wot ...Nokia wont launch a firmware update attack and remove them on you either. :) unlike apple :mad:
Check out one of the various N95 forums.

[synth3tik]

I have never had the SMS texting problems you had. 1 text no matter how long it is is just one message.

As far as the ring tones go. Apple updated garage band to be able to create ring tones. No sneaking around there at all.

Saying bye bye to the iPhone is also saying bye bye to some major cool points:p j/k

[thepandamancan]

I have never had the SMS texting problems you had. 1 text no matter how long it is is just one message.

As far as the ring tones go. Apple updated garage band to be able to create ring tones. No sneaking around there at all.

Saying bye bye to the iPhone is also saying bye bye to some major cool points:p j/k

Actually...texts can only be a certain length so the original poster has a valid argument there. I believe its only like 150 characters or maybe up to 300. If it goes over that, the iPhone will split it up into two or even three messages if you send an essay for a text message. We may see it as one bubble in the text app but to whoever you sent it to will see it as seperate texts.

[miniConvert]

The N95 8GB is fantastic. I have no doubt that it'll keep you very happy for quite some time. Symbian and S60 aren't done for yet ;)

The first gen iPhone is flawed in many ways. For many people, however, what it offers is fantastic - even revolutionary. For those of us who have managed to browse the net, send emails and, heaven forbid, send picture messages with Nokia smartphones for years now there's really very little appeal.

Still, there's nothing in your experiences that you couldn't have known before owning the thing. It's just not ready for technophiles, yet.

I hope an iPhone arrives in the future that suites me (and, I'd imagine, you). Until then, it's not an option. You did the right thing to get rid.

Edit: A standard SMS, btw, is 160 characters. All phones worth a dime will, when a texter goes over 160 characters, use concatenated messaging. This uses up some characters to put coded headers in the SMS that allows the recipient handset to reform multiple messages into a single one for reading. For example, the maximum number of characters that can be sent in a 3-part concatenated message is 459. I recently confirmed with a friend that concatenated messaging was working on his UK iPhone, but perhaps it's buggy, or perhaps it can only join two or three SMS together before rolling over to a completely new message. Oh well, I wouldn't have expected Apple to have done SMS properly the first time around... it's much, much bigger outside of the US.

[Passante]

It is interesting to hear redshovel's criticisms of the iPhone and think to my self that none of them are of any concern to me. It just demonstrates that we are all different and while the iPhone is a great phone for many some will not like it.

Don't be too harsh on the OP.

[redshovel]

It is interesting to hear redshovel's criticisms of the iPhone and think to my self that none of them are of any concern to me. It just demonstrates that we are all different and while the iPhone is a great phone for many some will not like it.

Don't be too harsh on the OP.

I do aggree that for some iPhone is great and for other like me, it just not suitable.

However I wont fold on the point that the marketing for iPhone was been the work of someone with play-doh for a brain.

[OW22]

The iPhone is perfect for what I need. I don't need and never used MMS, I don't need bluetooth and I get all the apps I need from the developers.

I just love the interface and the web and mail apps and the iPod.

But thats just me, i know there are bound to be people who need a lot more functions and the iPhone is not right for them.

But I totally agree with redshovel on the "barriers to purchase" Apple have erected. It's a very poor strategy and yes they gain revenue from the operators but they are excluding a lot more sales with this direction and it's actually very anti-consumer and is not going down well here in Europe and has been legally challenged and successfully in some countries. And the continued threats of "bricking" with each new update is pathetic from Apple.

I expected better from them.

[MacRumorUser]

I have an N95 at the moment but would trade it in - in an instant should Apple finally release the bloody iPhone in Ireland.

It has lots of +points , but for also a lot of bad ones.

Yes the N95 can open a word doc ? so?
Yes the N95 has GPS ? I never use it as I have a tomtom so? Oh and to get it to route plan after demoing the voice support you HAVE to buy the voices for $70 otherwise the phone just wont route plan properly.
Yes it has a Carl Zeis lens, but it is utterly crap in low light conditions, and it takes way too long between shots, especially with flash, and its slow to initialize/start up.
The phone will often crash... Nothing worse middle of call your cut off, you look at the phone screen and see the nokia logo.
It's very expensive (but hey they all are)
It has really CRAP software support for Apple users.

So the N95 is far from perfect.


It's looking like it will be the REV2 iPhone that will launch in Ireland, one with 3G, so at least it may be worth the wait.

[Indydenny]

I don't understand the need to tell everyone you are saying goodbye to the iphone.

Best of luck in whatever you choose.

[philipz]

I do agree that for some iPhone is great and for other like me, it just not suitable.

However I wont fold on the point that the marketing for iPhone was been the work of someone with play-doh for a brain.

I do agree with all of Redshovel's points, except the marketing :) Put it the way you want, from a marketing point of view the launch was a success, no matter how much everybody dislikes the strategy.

I had one as well, but didn't like it too much. Sending an SMS to multiple people? Didn't work... I guess many iPhone owners got frustrated typing over the same 'best wishes' again and again on new years eve...
Re-use an SMS you just wrote? Forget it... Finding names/contacts easily? Forget it... (I know there's a 3rd party app now, but come on...)
Sometimes - for me - there's the need to send an SMS or type in a number blindly - no chance to do that on the iPhone because it has no buttons (this is no criticism; this is just a fact). For instance while driving, try to dial a number; you really need to focus on the screen...

All in all, the iPhone has many extras that are nice to have and eye-catching, but the basic functionality I expect from a phone (which it is in the first place anyway) is just not implemented properly.

I do guess that next generation iPhones will perform better on the basic stuff.

In the end, my iPhone got confiscated by my girlfriend, who likes it a lot, so it was no waste of money anyway.

[Fuchal]

The iPhone camera is much worse than most European camera phones, but it is also much better than 99% of all U.S. camera phones. We need European phones. :(

[fr33 loader]

I think calling it smartphone is a misnomer, iPhone should have been called multi-media phone. I think iPhone has the best delivery of music, photos, movies and the internet on any phone to date. It'll just get better with every update. When N95 adds a new usable button(s) on its next software upgrade and syncs with iTunes let me know.:p

[gkarris]

But in many others resects, some key to being a usable mobile phone, it fails miserably.
Many may disagree with the above but most will agree with this....The whole affair has been one hell of a marketing disaster.
Better Luck next time apple.


Apple is looking towards the future.

Just a few years ago, I use to rack up over 500 voice minutes a month, and no text messaging.

Now, with all these smartphones, blackberries, and the fact people don't really want to "talk" anymore, my voice usage went to only about 50 minutes per month and my text usage to over 300 (I had to get the text plan added).

So yes, as a "phone" it fails, but it seems like no one is really using the "phone" anymore. Heck, I think I use the iPod watching music videos more than the talking on the phone....

[Cleverboy]

These 5 million units you keep banging on about are poor compare to what it could have been if apple had not restricted the sale of the iPhone.So... the 5 million units are poor compared to the imaginary projections in your head? Ok.

Well, I really wish you luck with your Nokia N95. Hopefully the situation changes with Apple a few years from now. More than likely however, Nokia will come out with a phone that will more than suit your needs and be very similar to the iPhone later this year, or early 2009. Nothing will change about Apple's overall carrier strategy in the next 2 years or so, so complaining about it is pretty pointless. Contracts have been signed. The die has been cast. That ship has sailed, and I can understand why you won't be on the boat.

~ CB

[nickspohn]

I do aggree that for some iPhone is great and for other like me, it just not suitable.

However I wont fold on the point that the marketing for iPhone was been the work of someone with play-doh for a brain.

If the phone sells, it sells. Apple has the best marketing strategys IMO. iPhone users sell their phones to people that don't have them, and it's a chain effect. Because of their iPod passed, the media covers Apple, which is another huge boost.

If i go out in public, and i'm using an iPhone, people will be like "Hey, that's an iPhone!". Now, if i go out in public with a Nokia N95, no one is basically going to say "Hey man, is that the new Nokia N95!?".

You're forgetting Apple doesn't sell phones like Nokia does. Nokia makes cell phones. Apple is a industry that sells a lot more stuff than just phones, and afterall, this is their first REAL phone. (The ROKR or whatever it was called was nothing special).

[skinnylegs]

I think I'm 'gonna puke if I read one more of these threads.

[redshovel]

That ship has sailed, and I can understand why you won't be on the boat.

~ CB

I aint on the boat cuase the boat is made out of rice paper. Perhaps verison 2 will be wood or even iron.

[redshovel]

I think I'm 'gonna puke if I read one more of these threads.

Well go right ahead if it quits you posting vomit like replies.

[redshovel]

If i go out in public, and i'm using an iPhone, people will be like "Hey, that's an iPhone!". Now, if i go out in public with a Nokia N95, no one is basically going to say "Hey man, is that the new Nokia N95!?".


I dont want people to 'notice' my phone like that. People who wish that to happen are insecure sad little muppets with no life. The type who mask of their iPhone to cleam the chrome bit with Brasso. :p

[Ninja Dom]

The main problem with your posts is that you say that the iPhone is a "marketing failure".

I understand that you do not like the sales model of the iPhone but as I said earlier, even with the sales model that you may or may not like - the iPhone is the most successful selling mobile phone in recent times in the Western World.

Apple may have sold more iPhones had they have gone down the conventional mobile phone sales route or they could have sold less - we'll never know. But the way the sales model currently is shows nobody has sold anything like what Apple has sold in the time it has taken Apple to sell them.

Not only are there nearly 5 million genuine users, but these people also need to use and register iTunes accounts.

The term "marketing failure" is something you dreamt up simply to fan flames. The truth is very much the opposite, the iPhone is the biggest mobile phone marketing success we have had for quite some time.

[nickspohn]

I dont want people to 'notice' my phone like that. People who wish that to happen are insecure sad little muppets with no life. The type who mask of their iPhone to cleam the chrome bit with Brasso. :p

But Apple markets likes this, and it's successful.

[peeaanuut]

isnt a long text msg contradictory to the whole SHORT message system? I think some people want to use SMS as e-mail and that simply is not it.

[sananda]

3. I was feed up of people moaning that I keep on sending them two text messages with only one word in the second message. All this due to the iPhones lack of a simple character counter.


good point. i hadn't even thought about this until now. i send quite a lot of more expensive international texts and try to keep what i want to say in one text. this won't be so easy now i have iphone.

[rdowns]

Just what we needed, another of these threads. It is the first of 2008 though. :rolleyes:

Spare us your trials and tribulations. The iPhone's limitations are well known, especially to European buyers as it was out in the US for almost 5 months prior. My only question, given these limitations, why the heck did you buy it? :rolleyes:

[sananda]

isnt a long text msg contradictory to the whole SHORT message system? I think some people want to use SMS as e-mail and that simply is not it.

i suppose so. but i sent texts to people who people in a certain country who generally don't have easy access to email.

[alFR]

Before I got the iPhone I was using a K800i with 3.2 MP camera. It performed just as well as my CyberShot 3.2MP digital Camera. My new N95 8GB sports a 5.0MP Carl Zeiss lens. It produces better results my freinds samsung 5MP stand alone camera. So your argument is void. Unless your a professional photographer you should not need to carry a seperate camera in this day and age. The camera on the iphone behind the times. Apple got this so so wrong. EDGE is ok but 3G leaves it for dead. Another bad apple. Hell with the Opera Mini Browser on my N95 8GB I can surf the web (FULL SIZE PAGES) faster on GPRS connect than an iPhone on EDGE!

sorry, unless there is something wrong with your friend's samsung there's no way it would be noisier and have worse colour balance etc. than the n95. There are plenty of comparisons on the web that bear that out. Also, given that there was a comparison posted on here a few weeks ago showing that the iPhone on edge rendered pages as fast as a nokia on 3g I find it hard to believe that the nokia on GPRS is faster than the iPhone on edge.

Still, at the end of the day if you don't like the phone you were right to change it. It'd be boring if there was only one phone on the market after all. :)

[rayward]

Actually...texts can only be a certain length so the original poster has a valid argument there. I believe its only like 150 characters or maybe up to 300. If it goes over that, the iPhone will split it up into two or even three messages if you send an essay for a text message. We may see it as one bubble in the text app but to whoever you sent it to will see it as seperate texts.

All cell phones split long messages into multiple texts. Some, like the iPhone, will reassemble those messages upon receipt. Presumably, the cool phones that the Thread Starter's friends use can't do that.

[sjo]

So... the 5 million units are poor compared to the imaginary projections in your head? Ok.


5 million units sold is an imaginary number. out there with the 700 000 units sold during the lauch weekend.

[GuillaumeB]

Well i'm sure you're gonna love
looking at your pictures
listening to your music
sending emails
browsing the real web
flawlessly syncing your infos from your mac
...on your N95
Plus you'll get to practice weight-lifting!!! what a lucky boy you are!!

J/k :) I really hate that phone, I took a look at it and found it nowhere intuitive and utterly clutter in my opinion.
But then if it fits your needs go with it.

That being said, you shall be cursed and regret it for the rest of your life :)

[chadrob30]

Sounds to me like the OP should've done more research before he jumped on the Apple bandwagon and bought the "newest toy out there". Could've saved him some heartache.

[redshovel]

Well i'm sure you're gonna love
looking at your pictures
listening to your music
sending emails
browsing the real web
flawlessly syncing your infos from your mac
...on your N95
Plus you'll get to practice weight-lifting!!! what a lucky boy you are!!

J/k :) I really hate that phone, I took a look at it and found it nowhere intuitive and utterly clutter in my opinion.
But then if it fits your needs go with it.

That being said, you shall be cursed and regret it for the rest of your life :)

Yes, Yes, Yes, No (using a PC with it) and eh?.....have you seen the size and weight of the iPhone. Slimmer and better in a jeans pocket it might be but the N95 8GB fits better into the hand.
Plus guess what....you can change ringtones, sms tones, swap files, send MMS msgs and best of all Nokia wont attack these features with firmware updates.

[redshovel]

Sounds to me like the OP should've done more research before he jumped on the Apple bandwagon and bought the "newest toy out there". Could've saved him some heartache.

I take your point onboard and understand why you say that. But in reality it’s impossible to make the right choice of mobile phone before buying it. You can read as many reviews/forums and play with the demo phones in shops for hours. But until you actually live with the phone for a couple of weeks you will never really know if it’s the one for you.

[chadrob30]

I take your point onboard and understand why you say that. But in reality it’s impossible to make the right choice of mobile phone before buying it. You can read as many reviews/forums and play with the demo phones in shops for hours. But until you actually live with the phone for a couple of weeks you will never really know if it’s the one for you.

Point taken. Real world experience is better than showroom demos. :)

[Lord Blackadder]

But until you actually live with the phone for a couple of weeks you will never really know if it’s the one for you.

The same goes for marriage...of course you aren't supposed to return a spouse for refund...though our divorce rate suggests that we make as fickle marriage partners as we do consumers. :rolleyes:

[moel]

OP your obviously a bit of a willy waver

You bought the iphone because you wanted people to go ooooh i've got an iphone, had you actually thought about how you use the phone then you shouldn't have got one..although quite honestly if you still 'bluetooth files to your mates' and use mms, then your an idiot. I don't know anyone that does either of those things other than the uber geeks, and you've basically traded down to a phone that is clunky, unimpressive with piss poor battery life.

Good Riddence

[waremaster]

Well to me the iPhone is two things.. It's a phone and an iPod. As a phone it is the best phone I have ever used. And I can say I have used a few. I currently own a Treo 700wx and an HTC Kaiser and I will state again as a phone the iPhone is the best. And as the second thing being an iPod it is also the best iPod I have ever used with exception of storage capacity. But I think to myself do I really need more than 8gig of space on an iPod I can carry daily? The answer to that would have to be no. I load all of my current favorite albums on the device and still have room to spare. Now onto the browser.. If you honestly think that Opera Mini even compares to safari I think you are just fooling yourself. The web experience on the iPhone is unmatched by any current mobile phone period. Yes it could use flash and java but that is not an end all for the device. As for the camera I could care less. If I wanted to use a camera I would use a Canon DSLR and not some crappy cell phone camera anyway. Text messaging is very popular in the UK and other places I know and it is quite popular here as well but it is not the end all of the device either it is not perfect no but it is damn good and is getting better. Lack of MMS means nothing to me on a device that has internet. If I want to send a photo to someone I will just send it to an email address. If they haven’t got email on their phone I guess too bad they will have to wait till they get home because my iPhone emails better than any other phone as well. Custom ringtones.. Not a problem since iTunes 7.5 and FW 1.1.2 so I see no fault there either.

[redshovel]

OP your obviously a bit of a willy waver

You bought the iphone because you wanted people to go ooooh i've got an iphone, had you actually thought about how you use the phone then you shouldn't have got one..although quite honestly if you still 'bluetooth files to your mates' and use mms, then your an idiot. I don't know anyone that does either of those things other than the uber geeks, and you've basically traded down to a phone that is clunky, unimpressive with piss poor battery life.

Good Riddence

'Willy Waver'???.......Did you hear that one in the playground today??
Or you just like waving yours?

Using bluetooth to exchange files is the work of idiots is it. No No No....more like sour grapes as that apple you have cant. ;)

'Clunky, unimpressive with piss poor battery life'........well its a bit fatter than iPhone and shorter. Might suit your person being such a 'willy waver'

Unimpressive???...ok N95 8GB has no touch screen...but does everthing the iphone can do and more.

As for battery life.....the original N95 could have been considered piss poor on the battery life but the N95 8gb uses a differnt battery model all together offering 50-75% more standby.

I adivise you to go ly down in a darkened room with a cup of tea and have a wee rethink.

[redshovel]

Well to me the iPhone is two things.. It's a phone and an iPod. As a phone it is the best phone I have ever used. And I can say I have used a few. I currently own a Treo 700wx and an HTC Kaiser and I will state again as a phone the iPhone is the best. And as the second thing being an iPod it is also the best iPod I have ever used with exception of storage capacity. But I think to myself do I really need more than 8gig of space on an iPod I can carry daily? The answer to that would have to be no. I load all of my current favorite albums on the device and still have room to spare. Now onto the browser.. If you honestly think that Opera Mini even compares to safari I think you are just fooling yourself. The web experience on the iPhone is unmatched by any current mobile phone period. Yes it could use flash and java but that is not an end all for the device. As for the camera I could care less. If I wanted to use a camera I would use a Canon DSLR and not some crappy cell phone camera anyway. Text messaging is very popular in the UK and other places I know and it is quite popular here as well but it is not the end all of the device either it is not perfect no but it is damn good and is getting better. Lack of MMS means nothing to me on a device that has internet. If I want to send a photo to someone I will just send it to an email address. If they haven’t got email on their phone I guess too bad they will have to wait till they get home because my iPhone emails better than any other phone as well. Custom ringtones.. Not a problem since iTunes 7.5 and FW 1.1.2 so I see no fault there either.

If you had bothered to read what I said you would have understood I rate the iPhone head and shoulders above any mobile for web browsing.......but only when connected to Wi-Fi. On EDGE (if you can get it) the iPhone performs just ok. Opera Mini can give a decent web browseing experance on GPRS.....iphone on GRPS is unusable. The fact of the matter is that iPhone should have been 3G. EDGE is not up to the job. Admit it you lot have wasted money on a phone designed for the US market place.
I have admited it and ditched the iPhone.

[yayaba]

Before I got the iPhone I was using a K800i with 3.2 MP camera. It performed just as well as my CyberShot 3.2MP digital Camera.

I had a SE K790A here in the states and I had high hopes for the camera but I can't see how you can say it's just as well as a standard point-and-shoot camera. The lens sizes in phone camera's are just too small in comparison.

Outdoors in bright daylight, yes it is comparable but as soon as you are indoors or during the night time, the pictures come out incredibly grainy and the Xenon flash does not help matters much. The sensor inside the phone camera is just too small to capture any light.

Case in point, my now 10 year old Canon Powershot S10 is still better than the k790a.

[redshovel]

I had a SE K790A here in the states and I had high hopes for the camera but I can't see how you can say it's just as well as a standard point-and-shoot camera. The lens sizes in phone camera's are just too small in comparison.

Outdoors in bright daylight, yes it is comparable but as soon as you are indoors or during the night time, the pictures come out incredibly grainy and the Xenon flash does not help matters much. The sensor inside the phone camera is just too small to capture any light.

Case in point, my now 10 year old Canon Powershot S10 is still better than the k790a.

Well for me the K800i / K790A was the first camera phone to allowed me to ditch my Sony Cybershot. I dont profess to be a photo wizard but over the year I had my k800i I used the camera for work, holidays, family events and being out in pubs/clubs. It producted great results all the time. Maybe if i had been printing out large versions of my pics there would be a differance between cameras. But you have to ask yourself....how good a camera does the average joe really need to carry.
One better than the iPhone is for sure.....but even though the 5MP on my N95 8GB is better than the 3.2MP on the K800i.......the 3.2MP was fine for me.

[daneoni]

Well after several weeks I finally sold my UK ‘unlocked to any O2 sim card’ iPhone.
I was never going to partake of the 18 month contract. Leaving aside the pathetic call and text bundles on offer I feel 18 months is 6 months to long for any mobile phone contract.

I have got shot for a number of reasons.

1. The poor camera meant I was back to carrying a separate digital one. Very annoying.
2. Edge coverage (when you can get it) is only ok for web browsing.
3. I was feed up of people moaning that I keep on sending them two text messages with only one word in the second message. All this due to the iPhones lack of a simple character counter.
4. No Bluetooth file transfer. All your mates are swapping files around you and your sitting there with latest, greatest phone and you can’t join in. That’s just wrong.
5. That would make a great ringtone for my phone. Hold on till I set that up. Dam it. I can’t do that either.
6. Most annoying of all was not being able to set a decent SMS tone. I never once heard the thing go off in my pocket.
I know there are several ways round some of these problems but as with unlocking the phone and 3rd party appz, you’re in a consent battle with apple. It’s just not worth the hassle. Not for a phone and especially not this phone.

To some up, iPhone is brilliant in some ways. Connected to Wi-Fi and its interface makes the best portable web browser by far. But in many others resects, some key to being a usable mobile phone, it fails miserably.
Many may disagree with the above but most will agree with this....The whole affair has been one hell of a marketing disaster.
Better Luck next time apple.


PS. Using an Nokia N95 8GB now and feel right at home again after what seems like a just ok holiday with 6 day flight delays on either side.

I actually agree with ALL of these and i am SERIOUSLY considering selling mine. Just haven't really found a suitable replacement yet.

[Ninja Dom]

Admit it you lot have wasted money on a phone designed for the US market place.
I have admited it and ditched the iPhone.

So you came to an Apple Mac forum and then the iPhone sub-forums to tell iPhone users that they have "wasted money" on their phones??

Are you gonna pay a visit to the Macbook forums here and tell everyone how they've "wasted money" there too??

The whole aim of this thread was not to provide new insight, solutions or help into the flaws almost all forum members here are aware of with the iPhone at all, was it?

What do you expect people to do, ignore their iPhone purchase and contracts and run down to their local Vodafone store and get a Nokia 95 8Gb on a new contract?? (Not too bad an idea seeing as I work in one of the largest ones :D)

[redshovel]

So you came to an Apple Mac forum and then the iPhone sub-forums to tell iPhone users that they have "wasted money" on their phones??

Are you gonna pay a visit to the Macbook forums here and tell everyone how they've "wasted money" there too??

The whole aim of this thread was not to provide new insight, solutions or help into the flaws almost all forum members here are aware of with the iPhone at all, was it?

What do you expect people to do, ignore their iPhone purchase and contracts and run down to their local Vodafone store and get a Nokia 95 8Gb on a new contract?? (Not too bad an idea seeing as I work in one of the largest ones :D)

I belive some ppl are very happy with their iPhones and woundnt change them for the world. Others I think, if they are honest, are very dissapointed with iPhone and dont wont to admit it. And they really dont want to admint it when they have tied it to O2 for 18 months.
I just tell it how it is....and admit I made a mistake buying into iPhone. I am not stating I hate apple products or will be giving Macbook owners a hard time, I just think apple got the iphone wrong. Perhaps version2 will be better and if it is I might get one. I just ask people to ask themselves - 'Is my iPhone really that good?'

[moel]

'Willy Waver'???.......Did you hear that one in the playground today??
Or you just like waving yours?

Using bluetooth to exchange files is the work of idiots is it. No No No....more like sour grapes as that apple you have cant. ;)

'Clunky, unimpressive with piss poor battery life'........well its a bit fatter than iPhone and shorter. Might suit your person being such a 'willy waver'

Unimpressive???...ok N95 8GB has no touch screen...but does everthing the iphone can do and more.

As for battery life.....the original N95 could have been considered piss poor on the battery life but the N95 8gb uses a differnt battery model all together offering 50-75% more standby.

I adivise you to go ly down in a darkened room with a cup of tea and have a wee rethink.

Well stop trolling then!!!!

I know the N95's not THAT bad, but lets be honest your just a penny scrimping gainsaying internet troll!

[nickspohn]

Just wait until iPhone 2. It will be better than the N95 and any other model N phone nokia has, and cost cheaper. ;)

[gkarris]

Admit it you lot have wasted money on a phone designed for the US market place.

I have admited it and ditched the iPhone.

I admit I have wasted money on a phone designed for the US marketplace - wait, I'm in the US marketplace.... :eek:

All the iPhone copies should be out within the next few months. I've started to see the Sprint HTC Touch phone more and more. There will be a suitable touchscreen phone that you should like...

[redshovel]

Well stop trolling then!!!!

I know the N95's not THAT bad, but lets be honest your just a penny scrimping gainsaying internet troll!

Go back into the stinking little hole which you popped out off!:D

[redshovel]

Just wait until iPhone 2. It will be better than the N95 and any other model N phone nokia has, and cost cheaper. ;)

yeah....and I might be able to a buy a sim free one and not live in fear of Jobs and co bricking me for putting my own rigtones on and installing a simple card game.

[jamesconroyfinn]

You can put your own ringtones on to your iPhone using Garageband.

Simply create a new project and using the Media browser drag and drop your desired song from your iTunes library in to the Garageband score.

Once the track's in there make a selection of no more than 40 seconds by clicking on loop and dragging in the selection bar above the score.

When you're happy with your selection, you'll find an option to export to a ringtone for iPhone in the Share menu!

Sadly Garageband can't unlock your iPhone…

[moel]

Go back into the stinking little hole which you popped out off!:D

mmmhmmmm cos thats mature! I state facts, you state opinion

[waremaster]

If you had bothered to read what I said you would have understood I rate the iPhone head and shoulders above any mobile for web browsing.......but only when connected to Wi-Fi. On EDGE (if you can get it) the iPhone performs just ok. Opera Mini can give a decent web browseing experance on GPRS.....iphone on GRPS is unusable. The fact of the matter is that iPhone should have been 3G. EDGE is not up to the job. Admit it you lot have wasted money on a phone designed for the US market place.
I have admited it and ditched the iPhone.

Oh I bothered to read your post and I am in the US market. So yes the phone was designed for me. Edge works just fine for me. I also have Verizon with my Treo 700WX and can honestly say where I am there isn't much difference in browsing speeds as I do not get EVDO in all of the areas I travel to so not much difference there. Oh did I also mention I have an HTC Kaiser? That happens to be on AT&T oh and guess what not too much 3G coverage with that either so yes the iPhone was made for me in the US and gets relatively equal speeds compared to that as well with the benefit of having a longer lasting battery. So tout the 3G connections all you want the simple fact is it does not make a damn bit of difference if you can't get the signal anyway. It simply appears that your post was brought here to start these kinds of antagonizing comments. Well my Kaiser is better than your N95. How’s that?

[chr1s60]

The OP is simply ignorant for calling the iPhone a marketing disaster. It is such a disaster that every company that signed with the iPhone is making new customers and lots of money. On top of that, companies that didn't get the iPhone are desperately attempting to advertise new phones wishing that they would sell like the iPhone. Take a look on TV. Here in the US I can't watch TV for more than an hour without seeing at least 2 or 3 Verizon commercials trying to push their network and phones. I usually only see an iPhone commercial maybe 5 times in a week. For every whining unsatisfied customer like you there are about 20 extremely happy customers. Surveys have shown that iPhone customer satisfaction is extremely high, something that is almost never seen in cell phones. You can say all you want about barriers Apple put up and how many more they could have sold without the barriers, but the iPhone selling better than pretty much any phone in history is a success no matter what way you try to spin it. At the end of the day Apple is making millions of dollars off the iPhone, whether it is sold to someone who should have done more research like you or to someone who knew iPhone was right for them.

[msmith2112]

For a cameraphone, this is more than good enough quality for me.

http://img36.picoodle.com/img/img36/4/1/2/f_IMG0198m_61dc617.jpg

[Ubuntu]

Just wait until iPhone 2. It will be better than the N95 and any other model N phone nokia has, and cost cheaper. ;)

Surely Nokia will have another model by then, to keep up with the times? I mean, we're probably talking two years here.

[Lord Blackadder]

But you have to ask yourself....how good a camera does the average joe really need to carry.
One better than the iPhone is for sure.....but even though the 5MP on my N95 8GB is better than the 3.2MP on the K800i.......the 3.2MP was fine for me.

That's a highly subjective question - I, for example, have decided I need a DSLR, and picked up a Canon Digital Rebel XT. No camera phone could hope to replace that and the portability of the camera phone is irrelevant to me. But as the cameras in phones get better they are sure to cross into decent point-and-shoot territory. I suppose it's convenient to have the phone and camera in one package, although that means when you get rid of one you have to get rid of the other as well...

[Phil A.]

Admit it you lot have wasted money on a phone designed for the US market place.
I have admited it and ditched the iPhone.
You shouldn't assume everyone's requirements are the same as yours. I bought my iPhone about 6 weeks ago and it is, without a doubt, the best gadget I've ever owned. Over the last few years I've tried numerous devices in an attempt to get the perfect mobile experience for my requirements: A small sample is as follows:

Orange SPV
Orange SPV E100
Sony Ericsson P900
Nokia E61
Nokia N95
Orange SPV M3100
Samsung i600

I've also tried an N800 tablet with a simple 3G phone

All of these left me cold after a few weeks due to limitations and / or annoyances

However, the iPhone just gets better and better IMO. This is what it allows me to do:

1) Browse the internet with the best browsing experience on a portable device I've ever had. Brilliant on WiFi, great on EDGE (at least where I've used it), and painful but possible on GPRS (only ever had to use GPRS in the Scottish Highlands and the fact I could still log on and check my bank account from the top of a mountain made up for the slow speed!)
2) E-Mail. The E-mail client on the iPhone is (when coupled with an IMAP server) outstanding and has the feel of "real" e-mail which is something that all the other devices I've used failed to do
3) iPod - I have 36 albums, 2 movies and 16 hours of TV shows currently on my iPhone. Whilst this isn't as much as I can fit on my classic, it is more than enough to keep me amused! The integration between the iPod and phone functionality is superb and makes the whole experience even better. The iPhone also plugs straight into my Harman Kardon Drive and Play and gives me full access to my music from my car complete with browsable albums, etc. As an iPod it has everything (except extreme capacity) any other iPod I've owned has had, and then some: Watching videos on this device is a joy
4) Phone - As a phone it has far better sound quality than any of the ones I've listed above, and is simple and easy to use
5) SMS - love the way the SMS shows as a chat thread. Could be improved by the ability to send to multiple recipients, but it's not the end of the world
6) Interface - what can I say? The touch display is out of the top drawer and is head and shoulders above any other portable device I've ever used, both for general use and inputing text
7) Camera - fine for what I ever use a camera phone for (quick snaps). For serious photography I always use my D200 SLR

On the things the iPhone lacks, here's my take:

1) MMS - I can understand why people want this but it's really not an issue for me: I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of MMS messages I've ever sent so don't miss it at all
2) Bluetooth file transfer - Again, can see why people might want it but it's not something I've ever really used so don't miss it
3) Custom Ringtones - got that covered off with 1.1.2: Quicktime or Garageband do the trick
4) Custom Apps - I jailbroke my phone when I first got it, but found I wasn't really using any of the apps beyond the standard set so put it back to how it came out of the box and haven't really missed not being able to install custom apps and can wait until the SDK comes out this year
5) 3G - before I got the iPhone I always thought the lack of 3G would be a deal killer. It honestly isn't for me: EDGE works perfectly quick enough for my requirements and whilst I wouldn't complain if the iPhone had HSDPA speeds, I'd far rather have iPhone on EDGE than any of the others on 3G
6) GPS - I've had phones with GPS in and never used it (beyond a five minute play because it was there) - I've got Sat Nav integrated in my car which does a far better job than any phone could hope to do!
7) 18 month lock-in to O2. So What? I moved from Orange to O2 for the iPhone and (so far), I've found the O2 coverage better, faster and more reliable than Orange. I'm more than happy with O2 and don't envisage moving away from them now.

In conclusion, whilst the iPhone may not be perfect, it is, for my requirements, the best fit I've ever had and the things it's missing are nowhere near as important as the things it has. I absolutely love my iPhone and it is the best investment in Technology I've ever made in my life :D

[iTiki]

I purchased my iPhone about a week after it came out. I was so excited with the iPhone, I purchased some Apple stock. I have been more than pleased with both purchases!:D

Mike

[marcol]

For a cameraphone, this is more than good enough quality for me.

http://img36.picoodle.com/img/img36/4/1/2/f_IMG0198m_61dc617.jpg
Children that age shouldn't be given sheep's heads to play with.

[sagnier]

I don't understand the need to tell everyone you are saying goodbye to the iphone.


yeah, because its only a forum for people to whine about/praise Apple. What was he thinking?!

[Trent0341]

Well I'd love to contribute to this forum and thread but I'm to busy on the Nokia forums telling them their phones suck.

[Hudzilla]

Children that age shouldn't be given sheep's heads to play with.

I agree, very irresponsible!!!

[garethlewis2]

Please for the love of English teachers in the country, learn to spell. Actually reading your text before posting would be nice.

Example.

To some up. WFT does that mean? some in this case is a word pertaining to the fact that the subject is plural. Correction. To sum up. sum in this context is summing up all the above points.

Nothing to see, move on.

[redshovel]

That's a highly subjective question - I, for example, have decided I need a DSLR, and picked up a Canon Digital Rebel XT. No camera phone could hope to replace that and the portability of the camera phone is irrelevant to me. But as the cameras in phones get better they are sure to cross into decent point-and-shoot territory. I suppose it's convenient to have the phone and camera in one package, although that means when you get rid of one you have to get rid of the other as well...

Anyone I know belives that when the SE K800i and the likes of the Nokia N80 launched (now that was a crap phone), the 'cross over' between mobile cameras and standard cameras happened, for the average person.

[redshovel]

For a cameraphone, this is more than good enough quality for me.

http://img36.picoodle.com/img/img36/4/1/2/f_IMG0198m_61dc617.jpg

Not a bad pic.....the best the iPhone would do being outside and all....thats if it was taken with an iphone ;)

[redshovel]

On the things the iPhone lacks, here's my take:

1) MMS - I can understand why people want this but it's really not an issue for me: I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of MMS messages I've ever sent so don't miss it at all
2) Bluetooth file transfer - Again, can see why people might want it but it's not something I've ever really used so don't miss it
3) Custom Ringtones - got that covered off with 1.1.2: Quicktime or Garageband do the trick
4) Custom Apps - I jailbroke my phone when I first got it, but found I wasn't really using any of the apps beyond the standard set so put it back to how it came out of the box and haven't really missed not being able to install custom apps and can wait until the SDK comes out this year
5) 3G - before I got the iPhone I always thought the lack of 3G would be a deal killer. It honestly isn't for me: EDGE works perfectly quick enough for my requirements and whilst I wouldn't complain if the iPhone had HSDPA speeds, I'd far rather have iPhone on EDGE than any of the others on 3G
6) GPS - I've had phones with GPS in and never used it (beyond a five minute play because it was there) - I've got Sat Nav integrated in my car which does a far better job than any phone could hope to do!
7) 18 month lock-in to O2. So What? I moved from Orange to O2 for the iPhone and (so far), I've found the O2 coverage better, faster and more reliable than Orange. I'm more than happy with O2 and don't envisage moving away from them now.

In conclusion, whilst the iPhone may not be perfect, it is, for my requirements, the best fit I've ever had and the things it's missing are nowhere near as important as the things it has. I absolutely love my iPhone and it is the best investment in Technology I've ever made in my life :D

I am happy that you like the iPhone but your 'lack list' breaks the deal for me.

The O2 18 month contract is a TOTAL RIP OFF!
To get custom ringtones and appz you have to Jailbreak the phone and are in a consent battle with firmware updates. Also the if the phone screws up and needs repair apple will tell you to get lost. WHO IN THERE RIGHT MIND WOULD BE BOTHERED WITH ALL THAT!!

[m477h3w]

To get custom ringtones and appz you have to Jailbreak the phone and are in a consent battle with firmware updates. Also the if the phone screws up and needs repair apple will tell you to get lost. WHO IN THERE RIGHT MIND WOULD BE BOTHERED WITH ALL THAT!!

You don't need to Jailbreak the iPhone to get custom ringtones, you can either buy them from iTunes or make your own for free using the new update of Garage Band. Personally I use Logic and export as m4r, works a treat.

Also, the whole Jailbreaking to add apps malarky is rubbish, just wait for the SDK, it is only round the corner and you can add all the apps your phone will hold, and still be covered under warranty!!!! Happy days :D

[redshovel]

You don't need to Jailbreak the iPhone to get custom ringtones, you can either buy them from iTunes or make your own for free using the new update of Garage Band. Personally I use Logic and export as m4r, works a treat.

Also, the whole Jailbreaking to add apps malarky is rubbish, just wait for the SDK, it is only round the corner and you can add all the apps your phone will hold, and still be covered under warranty!!!! Happy days :D

Take what you say onboard but I just want to be able to 'use mp3 as ringtone' like I can on my SE or Nokia. All this messing around with M4r and Garage Band is annoying and really not required if apple would allow iPhone to fuction like a normal phone.

Aslo I dont want to have to wait until something called SDK sticks its head up from the sand. I want to use 3rd party appz the second my iPhone is taken out of the box.

[m477h3w]

Take what you say onboard but I just want to be able to 'use mp3 as ringtone' like I can on my SE or Nokia. All this messing around with M4r and Garage Band is annoying and really not required if apple would allow iPhone to fuction like a normal phone.

Aslo I dont want to have to wait until something called SDK sticks its head up from the sand. I want to use 3rd party appz the second my iPhone is taken out of the box.

It's a shame I couldn't convince you :(

[redshovel]

It's a shame I couldn't convince you :(

The only shame is that apple put these silly restrictions in place on their iPhone. It give use a super touch screen and web browser with one hand and took away simple things like using mp3 as ringtones/sms with the other hand.
Y......cause they are greedy. But its biting then in the ass as we speak.
IPhone V2 will be a different kettle of chips.

[msmith2112]

Not a bad pic.....the best the iPhone would do being outside and all....thats if it was taken with an iphone ;)

hehe...yes, it was taken with my iPhone.

[Phil A.]

I am happy that you like the iPhone but your 'lack list' breaks the deal for me.

The O2 18 month contract is a TOTAL RIP OFF!
To get custom ringtones and appz you have to Jailbreak the phone and are in a consent battle with firmware updates. Also the if the phone screws up and needs repair apple will tell you to get lost. WHO IN THERE RIGHT MIND WOULD BE BOTHERED WITH ALL THAT!!

The point is, not everyone's requirements are the same (and there's no need to insult people with a different opinion to your own): For me, I'd much rather put up with messing around for 5 minutes when creating a custom ring tone (no jailbreak required) than permanently have to put up with a screen resolution of 320x240 when browsing the internet, reading e-mail or generally using my phone. As for apps, as I said I'm sure I'll install some when the SDK becomes available, but in the meantime I can't think of a single app that I absolutely need that is available on any other device (either natively or as a 3rd party install). I've had plenty of Nokia phones and installed plenty of apps but (except for the possible exception of an SSH client), I can't think of any that I have used for more than a few hours.

[redshovel]

The point is, not everyone's requirements are the same (and there's no need to insult people with a different opinion to your own): For me, I'd much rather put up with messing around for 5 minutes when creating a custom ring tone (no jailbreak required) than permanently have to put up with a screen resolution of 320x240 when browsing the internet, reading e-mail or generally using my phone. As for apps, as I said I'm sure I'll install some when the SDK becomes available, but in the meantime I can't think of a single app that I absolutely need that is available on any other device (either natively or as a 3rd party install). I've had plenty of Nokia phones and installed plenty of apps but (except for the possible exception of an SSH client), I can't think of any that I have used for more than a few hours.

I understand everyone's requirements are different and am in no way insulting people with a different opinion.
I am simply stating the fact that the O2 iPhone contract is not comparable in value to what other tarrifs on different phones have to offer.
If this really does suit you then bully for you! The point many of you are missing is that I respect your choice of mobile handset, iPhone but find apples way of providing it laughable and a little bit sick.

[outkaste25]

I understand everyone's requirements are different and am in no way insulting people with a different opinion.
I am simply stating the fact that the O2 iPhone contract is not comparable in value to what other tarrifs on different phones have to offer.
If this really does suit you then bully for you! The point many of you are missing is that I respect your choice of mobile handset, iPhone but find apples way of providing it laughable and a little bit sick.

One would think if apple's product sickens you so, you'd wipe your hands of them and leave well enough alone. Personally, if I found a product to my disliking in the past, I have left feedback at the Products website but I have never quite found the need to go out and find product forums to bully everyone who has that product.

The iPhone's not for you? Fine. Go somewhere else and complain about it.

[redshovel]

One would think if apple's product sickens you so, you'd wipe your hands of them and leave well enough alone. Personally, if I found a product to my disliking in the past, I have left feedback at the Products website but I have never quite found the need to go out and find product forums to bully everyone who has that product.

The iPhone's not for you? Fine. Go somewhere else and complain about it.

Oh...FOR THE LOVE......do you have one brain cell even sparkin there....DO YOU???

To confrim....AGAIN
I dont find apples iPhone sick. I like it in many ways. I just dislike it in others and its not for me. I respect that others will find it just the phone for them.
What I do find VERY annoying and...yes...a little sick.....is the way this product has been brought to market.
I belive even apple now knows it made a mess of things. And before ppl start banging on about the iPhones sales figures.....just think of what they could have been if ppl had not been put off with silly 18 month contracts and bricking days.

[VenomousSVT]

Before I got the iPhone I was using a K800i with 3.2 MP camera. It performed just as well as my CyberShot 3.2MP digital Camera. My new N95 8GB sports a 5.0MP Carl Zeiss lens. It produces better results my freinds samsung 5MP stand alone camera. So your argument is void. Unless your a professional photographer you should not need to carry a seperate camera in this day and age. The camera on the iphone behind the times. Apple got this so so wrong. EDGE is ok but 3G leaves it for dead. Another bad apple. Hell with the Opera Mini Browser on my N95 8GB I can surf the web (FULL SIZE PAGES) faster on GPRS connect than an iPhone on EDGE!

no serious photographer would be satisfied using a 3.2mp camera

even when I am just "snapping off pictures" they are done at 8.0 mp

[moel]

Oh...FOR THE LOVE......do you have one brain cell even sparkin there....DO YOU???

To confrim....AGAIN
I dont find apples iPhone sick. I like it in many ways. I just dislike it in others and its not for me. I respect that others will find it just the phone for them.


Please take your ignorance elsewhere, your really starting to piss me off.

1) NO IPHONE HAS EVER been bricked, EVERY iphone is restorable
2) FOR THE 8,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,00 0,000,000,000,000,000 time Apple is a business, the model they have chosen is the one MOST PROFITABLE to them. All business does this, yes in some respects the O2 contracts are wanky and 'below value' but this is a premium product...Both a Robin Reliant and a Ferrari 360 will get you to the same destination, but you can't buy a Ferrari for £350. Put up or shut up and take a look at the cost of other mobile providers unlimited data plans...they aren't exactly cheap either for a decent QOS
3) Don't minge on about the price of the actual iphone itself either. it's an ipod touch which is 200 quid, for an extra 64 quid for phone functionality i don't see what your problem is. When was the last time you bought a phone for 64 quid?
4)Well done your happy with your N95, enjoy it..have fun with it's semi decent GPS and less able and intuitive OS
5)We'll see you back here when you've bought iphone 2 and come back with 'oh my god this is amazing' finally it does what the first one should have done, um yes thats technology it progresses. The iPhone is a product of it's time and is the BEST compromise to allow for battery life, user experience and cost...does it not occur to you that it would have been a massive failure, instead of the success it has been, had the thing died inside 6 hours and seccumbed to MANY a bug and virus because it was open to anyone to develop for (like your nokia) all to support a bigger camera and 3G which no one uses anyway, because we've all got wifi at home and work! MMS yes would be nice and surprise surprise i've got it on my iphone and it'll be easy for the 'person' in the street to get it once the SDK is out there next month for developers!

Anyway have fun, don't reply, go away see you in 18 months

[SFC Archer]

Oh...FOR THE LOVE......do you have one brain cell even sparkin there....DO YOU???

To confrim....AGAIN
I dont find apples iPhone sick. I like it in many ways. I just dislike it in others and its not for me. I respect that others will find it just the phone for them.
What I do find VERY annoying and...yes...a little sick.....is the way this product has been brought to market.
I belive even apple now knows it made a mess of things. And before ppl start banging on about the iPhones sales figures.....just think of what they could have been if ppl had not been put off with silly 18 month contracts and bricking days.

Do you have any clue what "Marketing" truly is??? You keep bringing this up and I finally have to add my opinion to your ranting. Apple is in complete control of their marketing strategy and it goes without saying...ITS KICKING ASS...EVERYWHERE!!! In the states, all other cellular services are advertising 4 commercials to apples 1 trying to pull people back. I also want you to tell me what Cell Phone has sold over 5 million products in only 3 major markets in less then six months...This is going to require you to do alot of research. I would give anything to be a part of Apples "Marketing Strategy" since its stock has already increased to $199 (was 200) per share and is expected to be valued up to $600 per share in as little as 18 months...and this is bad marketing? I also want you to tell me what the frick difference it makes whether you have a six month, 12, 18 or 24 month contract...gee whiz ding dong, if you want a phone then "oh my god" you gotta have a friggin contract. If you do your research before you sign then you wont have to worry about the length...I have been with AT&T (Cingular) for over 7 years so could care crap less about the length of a "contract". Bricking and Contracts has NOT stopped the market, nor reduced sales figures in the least, in fact, again doing a little research...sales have EXCEEDED what Apple projected, bad marketing? I think not!

Cool...you don't like the iPhone, so don't buy it and continue using what will work for you...this is totally understanding, just don't degrade what others find totally usable and useful to them and you use what is useful to you.

Please do your research and learn about marketing before you start trolling about it because you have no clue what you are talking about...in the aspect that you are posting about!

Have a terrific New Year!

P.S. If you don't like your iPhone so much then why do you still advertise it in your Signature? Just curous

[redshovel]

no serious photographer would be satisfied using a 3.2mp camera

even when I am just "snapping off pictures" they are done at 8.0 mp

Did I say a serious photographer would be satisfied using a 3.2mp camera?

NO......again someone else who cant read.

Also if you feel the need to 'snap off pictures' on something 8MP or above...well your beyond help.:D

[redshovel]

In reply to others.

I do indeed understand that the iPhone is makeing apple money. Shedloads of it. But again you miss the point.
For every 2 ppl I know who owns an iPhone I know of 6 others who, even though they would like to own one and have money at hand, will not buy one due mainly to the silly O2 contract and there not being a legit sim free version.

Now do the sums. The more handsets apple sells more money they make.
DO YOU GET IT??????

[moel]

In reply to others.

I do indeed understand that the iPhone is makeing apple money. Shedloads of it. But again you miss the point.
For every 2 ppl I know who owns an iPhone I know of 6 others who, even though they would like to own one and have money at hand, will not buy one due mainly to the silly O2 contract and there not being a legit sim free version.

Now do the sums. The more handsets apple sells more money they make.
DO YOU GET IT??????

Now you do the sums here....IF there was a legitimate sim free version of the phone, no mobile carriers stores would take it (because they wouldn't make any money from it), it's only outlet would be from an Apple store and the device would have BOMBED because how many apple stores are there around the world? Not that many..it misses out on mass market. Also without a carrier specific phone it would be funtionally crippled as there would be no incentive to install edge on the network masts or visual voicemail

Please just stop writing, every post you make, makes you look more and more stupid and your retorts become more and more whiney and infantile.

[redshovel]

Now you do the sums here....IF there was a legitimate sim free version of the phone, no mobile carriers stores would take it (because they wouldn't make any money from it), it's only outlet would be from an Apple store and the device would have BOMBED because how many apple stores are there around the world? Not that many..it misses out on mass market. Also without a carrier specific phone it would be funtionally crippled as there would be no incentive to install edge on the network masts or visual voicemail

Please just stop writing, every post you make, makes you look more and more stupid and your retorts become more and more whiney and infantile.

I have never read so much turd in all my life.

Every other decent phone in the world is offered by mobile carriers, as well as having sim free versions. And only a fool would offer iPhone through apple stores only. So you 'argument' is void. Also having iPhone on different networks gives choice, would incourage all networks to upgrade and SELL EVEN MORE IPHONES

So Mr Moel ....go back to your HOLE. Is that retort whiney and infantile enough for you??

[SFC Archer]

In reply to others.

I do indeed understand that the iPhone is makeing apple money. Shedloads of it. But again you miss the point.
For every 2 ppl I know who owns an iPhone I know of 6 others who, even though they would like to own one and have money at hand, will not buy one due mainly to the silly O2 contract and there not being a legit sim free version.

Now do the sums. The more handsets apple sells more money they make.
DO YOU GET IT??????

I am sorry to say that it is YOU who has missed the the point and in your case the "BOAT" Apple is SELLING MORE iPHONES THEN they even PROJECTED

I am truly surprised that you know that many people with the attitude you display toward others in this forum. A very very very small percentage...maybe 2% or less of the whole market will not buy because of one carrier or another...That is NOT Apple's fault or problem...many companies/carriers were given opportunity and THEY declined. Apple did not set up the carrier plans....the carrier did! If you have a problem with O2 then go to their forums and Troll...you are fighting a loosing battle with your own thread.

You are wrong so get over it and move on!

[sananda]

I have never read so much turd in all my life.

Every other decent phone in the world is offered by mobile carriers, as well as having sim free versions. And only a fool would offer iPhone through apple stores only. So you 'argument' is void. Also having iPhone on different networks gives choice, would incourage all networks to upgrade and SELL EVEN MORE IPHONES

So Mr Moel ....go back to your HOLE. Is that retort whiney and infantile enough for you??

s/he made a good point about EDGE though.

[redshovel]

s/he made a good point about EDGE though.

EDGE is a dead format/connection method
3G and 3.5G is way ahead on speed

apple got this way way wrong

[redshovel]

I am sorry to say that it is YOU who has missed the the point and in your case the "BOAT" Apple is SELLING MORE iPHONES THEN they even PROJECTED

I am truly surprised that you know that many people with the attitude you display toward others in this forum. A very very very small percentage...maybe 2% or less of the whole market will not buy because of one carrier or another...That is NOT Apple's fault or problem...many companies/carriers were given opportunity and THEY declined. Apple did not set up the carrier plans....the carrier did! If you have a problem with O2 then go to their forums and Troll...you are fighting a loosing battle with your own thread.

You are wrong so get over it and move on!

Trust me.....more than 2% of the market are put off by apples marketing blunder. And its TOTALLY apples fault. They are the ones that pull the strings even regarding the O2 tarrif.

[VenomousSVT]

Did I say a serious photographer would be satisfied using a 3.2mp camera?

NO......again someone else who cant read.

Also if you feel the need to 'snap off pictures' on something 8MP or above...well your beyond help.:D

I can assure you I can read just fine, all I am saying is, if your serious about going out and being able to take pictures you SHOULD have a thin point and shoot to carry around with you. I take pictures with my iphone solely for the purpose of keeping them on my iphone to look at every now and then. I do upload some of them to my flickr page just for grins to show some of the crazy ***** I run into on a daily.

My point and shoot is an 8mp camera. I try and keep it around me all the time, or at least in the car. When I see something I want to shoot, I want to be able to capture it in the best possible way. Shooting it with a "P-N-S" is bad enough but carrying my DSLR constantly is rediculous. Having a backpack with my DSLR/tripod/3 lenses/ect isnt very feasable UNLESS I am going to a photoshoot.

i guess what I am saying mainly is, if you want to be able to capture good pictures of things you see a good p-n-s camera is very very afforadble these days, let the 1.3mp iphone camera be what it is.....a cell phone camera, nothing more.

and yes, there is no hope for me. I cant just snap off memories any more. Once I took photography as a serious hobby, it took most of the fun out of it. Now every shot is about lighting,presentation, whats in the background, location, and composition.... it became work for every picture!:D

[SFC Archer]

Trust me.....more than 2% of the market are put off by apples marketing blunder. And its TOTALLY apples fault. They are the ones that pull the strings even regarding the O2 tarrif.

Again...you are basing your figures on opinion...not fact! When you can quote fact and numbers and show me that Apple is failing then I will start to respect your opinion.

And Apple sure is pulling your strings...You just can't seem to let it go...even your signature still advertises what you despise...LMAO at your trolling

You are so far out there that even at warp 9 you would never get out of your tunnel visoned attitude toward the world...so, good luck and I sure hope that someday someone or something makes you happy because right now your are totally miserable...Conversation Completed!

[VenomousSVT]

and on a side note... I am not one of those getting all pissy becuase you are "bashing their beloved iphone" you are entitled to you opinion just as they are. If you felt it wasnt worth the money then so be it.. no skin off my back. ;)
but say it how it is... You didnt think it was worth it to you for various reasons..period

[waremaster]

Trust me.....more than 2% of the market are put off by apples marketing blunder. And its TOTALLY apples fault. They are the ones that pull the strings even regarding the O2 tarrif.

Marketing Blunder? What world are you living in? Because it sure isn't the same one we are in. This has been such a hugely successful marketing strategy. And you complain about contracts. Let me guess are you one of those calling card types? Are you one of those with bad credit and can’t get a contract without a deposit? Phone companies have been doing contracts as long as they have been selling cell service. You don’t like that then too bad. I agreed to a 2 year contract to get my iPhone and guess what I am happy as are millions of others. Hell I liked the iPhone so much I didn’t even bother to drop my existing carrier which is Verizon and instead just bought the AT&T phone anyway.

[Lord Blackadder]

Trust me.....more than 2% of the market are put off by apples marketing blunder. And its TOTALLY apples fault. They are the ones that pull the strings even regarding the O2 tarrif.

I agree that a lot of people are passing on the iPhone because of the contract terms and price, but I disagree that there is a permanent loss in interest. When newer revisions of the iPhone become available that address the current model's flaws many of the same people that passed on it before will be lining up to buy one.

[colinmack]

So how do you really feel?

[waremaster]

I agree that a lot of people are passing on the iPhone because of the contract terms and price, but I disagree that there is a permanent loss in interest. When newer revisions of the iPhone become available that address the current model's flaws many of the same people that passed on it before will be lining up to buy one.


I completely agree with that. And to tell you the truth if the next one is even that much better I will buy it too. And extend my contract again.

[redshovel]

Marketing Blunder? What world are you living in? Because it sure isn't the same one we are in. This has been such a hugely successful marketing strategy. And you complain about contracts. Let me guess are you one of those calling card types? Are you one of those with bad credit and can’t get a contract without a deposit? Phone companies have been doing contracts as long as they have been selling cell service. You don’t like that then too bad. I agreed to a 2 year contract to get my iPhone and guess what I am happy as are millions of others. Hell I liked the iPhone so much I didn’t even bother to drop my existing carrier which is Verizon and instead just bought the AT&T phone anyway.

When you ppl dont buy your product, not due to lack of funds, but due to silly restrictions......that is a marketing blunder. Even apple know this now....but will never admit it. They will just launch V2 in the correct fashion and spin it to to suit them.

I have no problem with contrats....as long as they dont take the pi*s.
And no I aint a 'calling card type' and in no way have credit problems. In fact quite the opposite :D

[Trent0341]

In reply to others.

I do indeed understand that the iPhone is makeing apple money. Shedloads of it. But again you miss the point.
For every 2 ppl I know who owns an iPhone I know of 6 others who, even though they would like to own one and have money at hand, will not buy one due mainly to the silly O2 contract and there not being a legit sim free version.

Now do the sums. The more handsets apple sells more money they make.
DO YOU GET IT??????

Well sounds like you're well on your way to running Apple. Conrats on being smarter than one of the most successful marketing teams this year. I wish I was that smart... Of course I'd probably pick a better place to use my super genius than this forum.

Or maybe you're talking about something you don't understand. Stop taking you're completely unresearched OPINIONS and acting like you're some marketing whiz. You're not. You could always try for a job on the Microsoft marketing team. Other than that I doubt you'll find anyone to agree with your bizarre statements.

[Flanline]

In reply to others.

I do indeed understand that the iPhone is makeing apple money. Shedloads of it. But again you miss the point.
For every 2 ppl I know who owns an iPhone I know of 6 others who, even though they would like to own one and have money at hand, will not buy one due mainly to the silly O2 contract and there not being a legit sim free version.

Now do the sums. The more handsets apple sells more money they make.
DO YOU GET IT??????

Enough with the SHOUTING and insults - I wonder whether you would be so keen on behaving that way face-to-face, rather than cowering behind internet anonymity..

You are very keen on telling everyone in your signature that you don't pay for "the silly O2 contract" because you have jailbroken your phone and use a cheaper SIM-only tariff. I'm very happy with my iPhone and I'm happy to pay the contract cost legally. 18-month contracts are becoming the standard in the UK, and in the US the minimum contract is two years, so we got off lightly in some respects.

Despite what you might read elsewhere, the iPhone is subsidised by the contract cost. This was demonstrated when the unlocked price of the iPhone in Germany was unveiled as £745. Sounds astronomical, but remember that Nokia sells the unlocked n95 8GB on its own website for £500. Are we to believe that the true unlocked retail cost of an n95 is almost twice that of an iPhone? Of course not. The iPhone's development was an enormously costly affair, involving the introduction of new technology like the multi-touch display, and no less than 200 patents. The n95 is basically a repackaging of readily available technology in a stubby little box.

If that makes the iPhone a luxury item, so be it. I don't think Rolex will be making plastic watches just so more people can buy them.. That business model is working extremely well for Apple, and Forbes magazine has called it a "stunning success". I assume they know a bit more about "marketing disasters" than you.

[redshovel]

You lot are starting to bore me now.

You are so in love with you iPhone you just cant admit these two basic facts:

1. iPhone....great in many ways...flawed in others.
2. iPhone.....more would have sold if marketed as other mobile phones are.

[Trent0341]

When you ppl dont buy your product, not due to lack of funds, but due to silly restrictions......that is a marketing blunder. Even apple know this now....but will never admit it. They will just launch V2 in the correct fashion and spin it to to suit them.

I have no problem with contrats....as long as they dont take the pi*s.
And no I aint a 'calling card type' and in no way have credit problems. In fact quite the opposite :D

I highly doubt that apple will change their highly successful business model for the release of v.2. Once again (for someone who accuses others of not being able to read it doesn't seem to be one of your strong points) the iPhone has been a huge success for apple.

Let me reiterate:
Unresearched opinion: "For every 2 people I know with an iPhone I know 6 more who wouldve bought one".
Fact: Apple's launch of the iPhone was one of the most successful launches in mobile phone history. Its sales have exceeded even apple's expectations.

[chr1s60]

2. iPhone.....more would have sold if marketed as other mobile phones are.

The iPhone has sold more than any other mobile phone being marketed the way it is. How can you be 100% sure that the exclusive deal isn't part of what is driving the sales? You can't, you only assume. If open availability is the key to marketing then why aren't there other phones out there that have sold 5 million in 6 months?

[redshovel]

oh....this is painful now.

You lot are so blinded by the love of all things apple you cant see past the core.

Of course iPhone has sold more than any other phone in that that period. How could it not have given the press hype and the simple 'I want that factor'

But...and for the final time.....THEY COULD HAVE SOLD EVEN MORE IF THEY HAD NOT LIMITED THE SALES TO CONTRACT ONLY.

[moel]

I'm a he,..unsurprisingly....original retort there, i haven't heard that one before :rolleyes:

Your just plain WRONG

If you were a shop, and were offered a product on which you knew you wouldn't make any money on at POS (point of sale) and which you couldn't guarantee would make your company any money after POS...AND you had to upgrade your entire network infrastructure to sell it..you wouldn't. Despite the halo effect, if it means your customer base stays unchanged you wouldn't do it, because as your friends point out with their cheapskate ways, they aren't prepared to take part in the upsell.

Which is essentially what the iphone is, it's an upsell from a normal mobile phone. Which is why O2's sales have a large percentage of new subscribers such as myself, jumping from other networks! (before you say...how can you prove that, i have a few friends at o2 one of whom is in the upper management and consequently KNOWS the sales figures)


But...and for the final time.....

I wish that was the case, unfortunately you can't stop biting and want the last word, you want to leave it but it eats you up inside with burning desire to get the last word even if it is wrong as has been proved time and time and time again throughout this thread

[moel]

Are you aware of the revenue-sharing agreements Apple has negotiated with the carriers?

You know, the one where the carriers pay Apple monthly for every iPhone using customer they have? Apple stands to make more money (per customer) from that agreement than they do from the sale of the phone to the customer.

Revenue-sharing wouldn't work if they offered SIM-free iPhones (or had multiple carriers in one geographic area).

So it's not as simple as "selling a SIM-free iPhone would make them more money".

I already tried to get this point across earlier, he didnt seem to be able to grasp such a complex idea so i gave up.

[redshovel]

I'm a he,..unsurprisingly....original retort there, i haven't heard that one before :rolleyes:

Your just plain WRONG

If you were a shop, and were offered a product on which you knew you wouldn't make any money on at POS (point of sale) and which you couldn't guarantee would make your company any money after POS...AND you had to upgrade your entire network infrastructure to sell it..you wouldn't. Despite the halo effect, if it means your customer base stays unchanged you wouldn't do it, because as your friends point out with their cheapskate ways, they aren't prepared to take part in the upsell.

Which is essentially what the iphone is, it's an upsell from a normal mobile phone. Which is why O2's sales have a large percentage of new subscribers such as myself, jumping from other networks! (before you say...how can you prove that, i have a few friends at o2 one of whom is in the upper management and consequently KNOWS the sales figures)

LOL.....just have a good long look and think about what you have written there. Think about how the current non iPhone mobile market works (flawed in many ways too) and how at each stage everyone gets their cut.
Its clear to me that you no nothing about how 'money makes the world go round' and have very little knowledge regarding marketing in general. Just because Apple is a big company, dont mean to say they always get it right marketing wise - remember 'Coke Classic'......no? Yur sound like your 14 or 15 years old, and nothing is more important than your shiny new apple phone. Well all this might change with the love of a good women - if you can put your phone down long enough to aquire one.

[FunkyJunk]

Your sound like your 14 or 15 years old and nothing is more important than your shiny new apple phone.

Work on your spelling and grammar and we might take that remark more seriously. :rolleyes:

[skunk]

Work on your spelling and grammar and we might take that remark more seriously. :rolleyes:But I doubt it.

[moel]

Yes mate..thats right i know nothing about marketing....despite having a media degree, and working in a business and marketing consultancy, that works with o2 and others. So please take your tripe elsewhere... kthxbye

[Hudzilla]

Anyone else smell a troll?!

[redshovel]

Work on your spelling and grammar and we might take that remark more seriously. :rolleyes:

Work on a better retort and I might not just think of you while flushing the toilet.

[FunkyJunk]

Work on a better retort and I might not just think of you while flushing the toilet.

Physician, heal thyself.

[VenomousSVT]

Work on a better retort and I might not just think of you while flushing the toilet.

as long as you're not moaning while doing it

[redshovel]

Yes mate..thats right i know nothing about marketing....despite having a media degree, and working in a business and marketing consultancy, that works with o2 and others. So please take your tripe elsewhere... kthxbye

Was that 'Media Degree' purchased online off some 'Get a Degree Today' site.
Mmmm. I fear it might have been 'Dr' Moel
Turn your mac off and go to bed.....mummy will be coming up soon to turn the light off anyway!

[Hudzilla]

Or two...

[FunkyJunk]

The line between trolls and legitimate posts blurs when the mudslinging becomes more fun than the topic itself. ;) Point taken. I'm getting out before the lock.

[redshovel]

The line between trolls and legitimate posts blurs when the mudslinging becomes more fun than the topic itself. ;) Point taken. I'm getting out before the lock.

Yes I aggree.....lets end it now.

So it goodnight from him :p and goodnight from me ;)

[Phil A.]

The line between trolls and legitimate posts blurs when the mudslinging becomes more fun than the topic itself. ;) Point taken. I'm getting out before the lock.

I don't think the OP is a troll - he's getting himself far too wound up :D

[WildCowboy]

And good night to all of us.