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alchemistmuffin
Jan 1, 2008, 03:15 PM
For the last couple of days, rumours were going around that movie rentals are comming to iTunes Store.....

I thought that this was untrue for long time, but I now taken a closer look at the one product that relates to movies: :apple:TV......

The product was announced last year, the first generation, and now with :apple:TV becomming one year old this year, I was thinking.....

Will Apple announce the new 2nd generation :apple:TV to coincide with the iTunes movie rental announcement?



iTeen
Jan 1, 2008, 03:19 PM
i think this would be very cool...possibly even with a DVR feature to record stuff and possibly even watch shows that you recorded on your computor and ipod. sortof like tivo, and i think the movie rentals will also be very awsome as well.

CWallace
Jan 1, 2008, 05:42 PM
If they update the hardware, it would likely be to support HD content better. So moving to Gigabit Ethernet on the wired end (since 802.11n wireless is already supported) and maybe true 1080i/1080p output (with a bump in GPU power if necessary). That way, if you rip Blu-Ray or HD-DVD content on your PC, you can send it quicker to the :apple:tv as well as see it in all it's glory.

Perhaps add that new Display Port display connector technology.

MacNut
Jan 1, 2008, 05:43 PM
Do enough people care about the Apple TV to warrant an upgrade.

CWallace
Jan 1, 2008, 05:49 PM
Do enough people care about the Apple TV to warrant an upgrade.

Maybe not. For the technically savvy, the Mac Mini offers more capability - for admittedly more cost, but not unreasonably so. I like the concept of the :apple:tv, but not the execution for what I want it for. As such, I think a Mac Mini with the new Front Row will be the better choice for me.

SheriffParker
Jan 1, 2008, 06:02 PM
I think its time they made the :apple:tv a whole lot cheaper.

nlivo
Jan 1, 2008, 06:12 PM
What I want/not so much think/hope they will do is......They will have two models of the appletv. One will be a tv with all of the stuff built in and have a DVR. The other is it's current state with maybe some additional features they will add at Macworld. They will both have bluetooth. They will both be running OS X and they will have a new interface with a home screen sort of look (like the iPhone's). They will have Safari, iChat, maybe some widgets. I don't know. But that's what it will be like.

I keep saying "They will have" when basically it should be "I hope they will have". Haha.

alchemistmuffin
Jan 1, 2008, 06:15 PM
Do enough people care about the Apple TV to warrant an upgrade.

I care...

I have an :apple:TV, and I actually love it...

I have a EyeTV set as well, and I wrote an app that lets you convert the recorded show automatically into format compatible with :apple:TV and iPod, and since my :apple:TV is always connected to my Mac Pro, the show is ready to be streamed over to my HDTV.....

and no, I'm not going to share the app to the public, since it's still in beta....

But I would love to add another :apple:TV to my 2nd HDTV I got for christmas....

but I want to wait till the 2nd genration verison arrives...

Last year at Macworld, Apple heavily advertised :apple:TV as a video playback device for TV, so the movie rental announcment has something to do with :apple:TV.

MacNut
Jan 1, 2008, 06:17 PM
Apple didn't give the Apple TV enough features to warrant it's release. If it did more it would of sold more.

Cave Man
Jan 1, 2008, 06:21 PM
Apple didn't give the Apple TV enough features to warrant it's release.

Sure they did.

If it did more it would of sold more.

If it did more, it would probably cost more.

MacNut
Jan 1, 2008, 06:22 PM
If it has enough features people will over pay, look at the iPhone.

alchemistmuffin
Jan 1, 2008, 06:24 PM
Apple didn't give the Apple TV enough features to warrant it's release. If it did more it would of sold more.


I think that's the movie rental announcement is all about.....

with :apple:TV, watching movie rented from iTunes Store is much easier, and more convinent for some people....

and another thing now I'm predicting....
:apple:TV will also have the iTunes Store app, just like the iPod touch and the iPhone, so people can buy music, but also rent or buy movies, audiobooks, all from the comfort of one's couch....

Apple will probably target the movie rental for people owning :apple:TV.....

evilyankeefan
Jan 1, 2008, 06:24 PM
Yes please on a new :apple:tv, though I'd be more happy if it was after MW as my wishlist has a new MBP at the top of it. Really want to jump in. If the rumors are true on the subscription model, I'm going to be diving in.

Now if they would get rid of old models by bundling it with a MBP purchase, I'd be very happy. Who needs a free printer anyways? :)

MacNut
Jan 1, 2008, 06:25 PM
I think that's the movie rental announcement is all about.....

with :apple:TV, watching movie rented from iTunes Store is much easier, and more convinent for some people....

and another thing now I'm predicting....
:apple:TV will also have the iTunes Store app, just like the iPod touch and the iPhone, so people can buy music, but also rent or buy movies, audiobooks, all from the comfort of one's couch....I think a lot of people want a Tivo type device.

alchemistmuffin
Jan 1, 2008, 06:28 PM
I think a lot of people want a Tivo type device.

another thing: Apple will team up with Tivo to bring their recording technology to :apple:TV, so people can record TV show on :apple:TV, and yes, it will be free....

and the recorded show can be synced back to iTunes....

Cave Man
Jan 1, 2008, 06:35 PM
If it has enough features people will over pay, look at the iPhone.

Apples and oranges (no pun intended). The ATV is entertainment, the iPhone is principally a tool.

synth3tik
Jan 1, 2008, 06:37 PM
I think it is time to kill the Apple TV before Apple gets back into the Newton years.

MacNut
Jan 1, 2008, 06:37 PM
Apples and oranges (no pun intended). The ATV is entertainment, the iPhone is principally a tool.A lot of it is useless fluff. Besides the phone what do you really need an iPhone for that an iTouch can't do. I don't think I would call the iPhone a tool more of a gadget.

alchemistmuffin
Jan 1, 2008, 06:48 PM
A lot of it is useless fluff. Besides the phone what do you really need an iPhone for that an iTouch can't do. I don't think I would call the iPhone a tool more of a gadget.

I call iPhone, a successer to the Newton, now with a mobile device....

it's really a windows mobile device, except it uses Mac OS X, and it's made by Apple, and it's A LOT EASIER TO USE...

balamw
Jan 1, 2008, 07:33 PM
I think it is time to kill the Apple TV before Apple gets back into the Newton years.

:apple:TV is already quite useful if you already have lots of video in iTunes compatible format, so why should they kill it?

As the hackers have shown it could be A LOT more powerful. What irks me about it is how decidedly un-Mac it can be, if I needed to enter an access code every time I connected my iPod to a new library, the iPod would have been a failure of monumental proportions.

Things that would IMHO make the :apple:TV even more useful.


Enable the USB port. (Hooking up a 1TB drive to the :apple:TV would be just great).
A companion server product. ( I don't want to have to have my Mac/PC on to stream media to the :apple:TV)
A small display. (Particularly so it could be used as a standalone stereo component).


Depending on what comes at MWSF, I am planning to put the largest HDD I can fit in mine once the warranty is up.

B

imlucid
Jan 1, 2008, 08:13 PM
What irks me about it is how decidedly un-Mac it can be, if I needed to enter an access code every time I connected my iPod to a new library, the iPod would have been a failure of monumental proportions.

This is because of the networked connection for pairing. With an iPod you have a dedicated USB/Firewire connection. In an environment with potentially multiple Apple TVs on the network, deciding

a) which one is yours and

b) keeping someone else from accidentally/purposely picking it

makes the pairing scheme a necessity...

Kevin

balamw
Jan 1, 2008, 09:10 PM
makes the pairing scheme a necessity...


It's NOT a necessity for streaming from iTunes to iTunes, so why should it be for streaming from iTunes to :apple:TV.

If I bring home my notebook from work, it can stream from my shared iTunes libraries without "pairing". If I had a Mac Mini hooked up to my TV, it also would not need to pair. (I can password protect the shared libary to avoid unauthorized use.) Same would be true if the :apple:TV had a manual mode like most iPod do (so you could add content to it from any of the computers in your house.)

Apple touted the feature of playing back content from a PC or Mac brought to your house, but made it difficult to do in practice. (In fact the 1.0 rev wouldn't even handle shared photos from anything but your paired PC/Mac.)

This could be handled SO much easier, in a more Mac like manner with only software changes.

B

Mr9758
Jan 1, 2008, 10:05 PM
I thought that the Demi-gods, of everyone, would be the ones to appreciate the AppleTV most. There are many of us who love it, not necessarily because it is the most full-featured device of this type out there, but because it works wonderfully with our Macs and iTunes. Anyone who is too blind to try it out (Costco, people!) can go screw themselves.

Alchemistmuffin, I'm eagerly awaiting the release of your app. :D

jarenado
Jan 1, 2008, 10:17 PM
I agree with CWallace, If I were in the market for an apple tv i would just save a bit more money and get a mac mini. You can do everything apple tv can, and also have another computer

nordesmic
Jan 1, 2008, 10:24 PM
I have a EyeTV set as well, and I wrote an app that lets you convert the recorded show automatically into format compatible with :apple:TV and iPod, and since my :apple:TV is always connected to my Mac Pro, the show is ready to be streamed over to my HDTV.....

and no, I'm not going to share the app to the public, since it's still in beta....


At the moment EyeTV gives you the option to automatically convert to iPod or AppleTV when you set a recording.

Cave Man
Jan 1, 2008, 10:47 PM
I agree with CWallace, If I were in the market for an apple tv i would just save a bit more money and get a mac mini. You can do everything apple tv can, and also have another computer

But my 7, 5 and 3 year olds cannot operate the Mac Mini. They're very, very good at operating the ATV. :)

Cave Man
Jan 1, 2008, 10:49 PM
Anyone who is too blind to try it out (Costco, people!) can go screw themselves.

Easy there. We're all Mac people. That means we're civilized, even when we disagree. Otherwise, we might be confused for PC weenies.

Cave Man
Jan 1, 2008, 10:51 PM
At the moment EyeTV gives you the option to automatically convert to iPod or AppleTV when you set a recording.

Yeah, don't know what the big deal is. The only thing I wish it did was have an option to delete the original Eye TV recording after sending the MPEG4 to iTunes. That would save a lot of time tracking down those huge MPEG2 files.

zedsdead
Jan 2, 2008, 06:19 AM
But my 7, 5 and 3 year olds cannot operate the Mac Mini. They're very, very good at operating the ATV. :)

I agree with you...I have a six year old brother, and he is great at getting through the Apple TV menu's...I have most of his shows and movies on that now...just because the Mini and the Apple TV are both square shaped, it does not mean they should be merged. The Apple TV is far closer to the iPod than it is to a Mac.

milo
Jan 2, 2008, 10:03 AM
Do enough people care about the Apple TV to warrant an upgrade.

Sure. The reason most people don't care is because the product isn't up to snuff yet.

If they up the functionality (full HD, surround sound, etc...but DVR will NOT happen, ever) and especially if they lower the price as well, a LOT more people will get interested. Right now, it's still too expensive for the masses and too limited for video geeks who want the latest and greatest.

Especially if they add movie rentals, assuming they do it right, and increase their movie download library.

Sure they did.

Sure, if "warranting its release" doesn't include selling a decent number of them.

another thing: Apple will team up with Tivo to bring their recording technology to :apple:TV, so people can record TV show on :apple:TV, and yes, it will be free....

and the recorded show can be synced back to iTunes....

No way in hell. If they did this, all the movie and TV studios would yank their content from the itunes store.

I think it is time to kill the Apple TV before Apple gets back into the Newton years.

Nah, this is the future, it's just too early (and expensive) for most people to get into. It's a market in its infancy, someday everyone will have a box like this. Apple just needs to keep improving the box and dropping the price. Dumping it now would be insanely moronic, just giving up on what may be a multibillion dollar industry in the future. It would be like if they killed the iPod after a year (which initially wasn't that big a seller - that market was immature when apple entered it as well).

There are many of us who love it, not necessarily because it is the most full-featured device of this type out there, but because it works wonderfully with our Macs and iTunes. Anyone who is too blind to try it out (Costco, people!) can go screw themselves.

You admit that it isn't full featured...and yet people who aren't willing to try it out are "blind"? We're talking about a box that doesn't even output surround sound, something DVD players have done for ten years. Convenience is nice, but don't begrudge people who aren't willing to take a step down in quality - apple dropped the ball on this one, making a box that only connects to HDTV but lacks full HD resolution (1080) and surround.

Cave Man
Jan 2, 2008, 11:04 AM
Sure. The reason most people don't care is because the product isn't up to snuff yet.

But a low-end Porsche is still a Porsche. :)

If they up the functionality (full HD, surround sound, etc...but DVR will NOT happen, ever) and especially if they lower the price as well, a LOT more people will get interested. Right now, it's still too expensive for the masses and too limited for video geeks who want the latest and greatest.

It's really new technology and I think Apple is still feeling the market. I think exciting things are in store for the ATV. HD video is only a content issue (and hopefully a software-only issue for 1080), and 5.1 surround is only a Quicktime fix. Most movies are not 5.1-intense, even though they are encoded as such. Let's hope this fix comes to fruition in a couple of weeks.

Sure, if "warranting its release" doesn't include selling a decent number of them.

Your position, as well as mine, is completely subjective.

You admit that it isn't full featured...and yet people who aren't willing to try it out are "blind"? We're talking about a box that doesn't even output surround sound...

It already does surround sound, just not 5.1 (e.g., DD, DTS).

...something DVD players have done for ten years.

But DVD players have to passthrough the DD and DTS files to the receiver to get 5.1. If you only want matrix (e.g., DPL or Neo), then two-channel RCA cables will do the job, provided your receiver can decode the matrix.

Convenience is nice, but don't begrudge people who aren't willing to take a step down in quality - apple dropped the ball on this one, making a box that only connects to HDTV but lacks full HD resolution (1080) and surround.

Again, I hope it only takes a software update to rectify this. Certainly the 5.1 surround is software-only, but I'm not so sure about the 1080. The specs on the chip are that it can do 1080 resolution, but I do not know if it can do so at 24 fps. Does anyone know, by chance?

CWallace
Jan 2, 2008, 11:31 AM
But my 7, 5 and 3 year olds cannot operate the Mac Mini. They're very, very good at operating the ATV. :)

I can understand if they have to boot the Mac Mini and navigate to Front Row, but if Front Row is already running when they switch to that video input on the TV, are the two interfaces not similar?

Cave Man
Jan 2, 2008, 11:38 AM
I can understand if they have to boot the Mac Mini and navigate to Front Row, but if Front Row is already running when they switch to that video input on the TV, are the two interfaces not similar?

Yes, they're just about the same. But you're always a few clicks away from being out of Front Row and into the Finder on the Mac. The ATV won't let you do that. Less risk of damage, ya know? :)

2A Batterie
Jan 2, 2008, 11:41 AM
I think they should just cut their losses and throw in the towel with Apple TV. I don't foresee any devout fan followings springing up like happened with the Newton after it was discontinued.

Cave Man
Jan 2, 2008, 12:02 PM
I think they should just cut their losses and throw in the towel with Apple TV. I don't foresee any devout fan followings springing up like happened with the Newton after it was discontinued.

How do you know they're losing money? Apple will abandon any device that is a losing enterprise, but they're strong enough to let some things ride if they think they can leverage the market. With the HD-DVD vs. BluRay battle still at an impasse, I think Apple has a real opportunity to steal this market. Hopefully, we'll get good news at MWSF - 1080/DD movies from iTMS.

Yvan256
Jan 2, 2008, 12:02 PM
:apple:TV mini:
- RCA composite and S-Video ouputs (only)
- Stereo output (only, no optical)
- No hard drive (only enough flash for the OS and programs)
- No wireless

US$99

Current :apple:TV gets a software update to match the new features of the mini (and hopefully 4:3 TV support for people like me), and gets a price drop (40GB at US$199, 160GB at US$299).

That's my prediction for Macworld, anyway.

Sweetfeld28
Jan 2, 2008, 12:15 PM
I could see Apple upgrading the :apple:TV. It looks like it would be a good product if they bundled more features in it.

I would buy one if Apple included:

1. larger HD [maybe the 2.5 WD 320GB]
2. included a DVR feature
3. a DVD drive of some kind, or allow it to use the Ultra Portable's external DVD drive?

CWallace
Jan 2, 2008, 01:21 PM
Yes, they're just about the same. But you're always a few clicks away from being out of Front Row and into the Finder on the Mac. The ATV won't let you do that. Less risk of damage, ya know? :)

Indeed I do. :)

balamw
Jan 2, 2008, 01:26 PM
:apple:TV mini:
<SNIP>
- No wireless


IMHO wireless is a must for this kind of device, 'cause anyone who has wired network or is willing to lay wire to their TV is already likely to not need such a device. Essentially though what you're describing is the Airport Express w/video that everyone expected to materialize.

B

CWallace
Jan 2, 2008, 01:31 PM
:apple:TV mini:
- RCA composite and S-Video ouputs (only)
- Stereo output (only, no optical)
- No hard drive (only enough flash for the OS and programs)
- No wireless

US$99

With respect, I think that would flop with the target market for this product, which is people who are technically-inclined and "first adopters".

Composite/S-Video is incapable of handling an HD signal and handles analog video far worse then component.

Stereo output means that when iTunes does eventually add HD and DD/DTS content, you'll never hear it. If you're using it with a TV only, you face that issue now with the :apple:tv, but those connecting it to a receiver are at least getting better stereo sound now via the digital output and will be able to get multi-channel discrete down the road.

Also, one wonders if the labels will ever offer multi-channel audio content mastered from DVD-Audio and SACD sources. Many with home theater setups might find value in it and it would allow the studios to both sell yet another copy of the media to consumers and do so for a bit more money.

Lack of wireless means that you either need to keep it close to the router and run a long S-Video or composite cable ( :eek: ) or you keep it close to the TV and run a long RJ-45 cable.

HDDs are cheaper then flash RAM on a per megabyte and per gigabyte basis. So you would have no storage and would be dependent on the streaming. And I fear that hiccups on the PC or over the wire will mean a degraded (stuttering/halting) viewing experience.

aswitcher
Jan 2, 2008, 01:45 PM
I would be more interested in buying an Apple TV if it was;

Cheaper - its to expensive for the 160GB.

Had more capacity - 160GB doesn't really cut it for me with lots of 320KBps music, video podcasts etc, and 10,000+ photos. 250GB would be a better start or enable or have an additional USB that supports Airdisk/server.

Was also a fully fledged Airport Extreme - it would be much easier to justify buying it if it also worked as a AE.

Ran cooler or was taller to be cooler - it runs VERY hot these days and I worry its not going to last more than a couple of years under such heat.

A small backlit lcd display would be nice to know its current state and for simple diagnostics.


I also wonder if Apple might one day make it an HDMI/Audio switcher so that I can plug my DVD player etc through it to save me one less issue/task because I can really see my iPod touch becoming a super home remote when the SDK comes out.

gkarris
Jan 2, 2008, 01:55 PM
I see Apple upgrading to the next version of the OS on it to support rentals and direct iTunes purchases. I also see a price drop with the following specs:

80 Gig :apple:TV - $249
160 Gig :apple:TV - $349

Maybe they'll even throw in 5 free movie rentals and 5 free TV Shows/Music Vids...

Closeout existing 40 Gigs at $199...

JimmyDreams
Jan 2, 2008, 02:30 PM
Nah, this is the future, it's just too early (and expensive) for most people to get into. It's a market in its infancy, someday everyone will have a box like this. Apple just needs to keep improving the box and dropping the price. Dumping it now would be insanely moronic, just giving up on what may be a multibillion dollar industry in the future. It would be like if they killed the iPod after a year (which initially wasn't that big a seller - that market was immature when apple entered it as well).



Probably the best explanation I've seen yet concerning :apple:TV. And how nice it is that it matches my viewpoint exactly!!!:rolleyes:

zedsdead
Jan 2, 2008, 03:13 PM
Probably the best explanation I've seen yet concerning :apple:TV. And how nice it is that it matches my viewpoint exactly!!!:rolleyes:


I agree. Jobs has already stated that an update was coming, and all signs are pointing to Macworld. Hopefully it will be more than just rentals through iTunes.

Outside of the obvious HD content and better surround sound, I would love to get more screen savers (like the ones in leopard), event syncing with iPhoto, chapter market selection menu, and lyrics.

Cave Man
Jan 2, 2008, 03:24 PM
I would love to get more screen savers (like the ones in leopard), event syncing with iPhoto, chapter market selection menu, and lyrics.

Oooh. Karaoke without public embarrassment! :D

milo
Jan 2, 2008, 04:06 PM
But a low-end Porsche is still a Porsche. :)

I'm not sure what you mean by that...are you saying that people should buy it just because it has the APPLE name on it, regardless of whether it

It already does surround sound, just not 5.1 (e.g., DD, DTS).

"Just" not 5.1. A format that has been supported by DVD for over a decade. So I'll clarify, it doesn't support DISCRETE surround sound, which is a huge oversight for a product that only connects to HDTV, meaning it's limiting itself to the higher end of the market.

But DVD players have to passthrough the DD and DTS files to the receiver to get 5.1.

Yep, that's what they do. And that's exactly what the aTV can't do. What's your point?

I share your hope that at least 5.1 surround, if not 1080i/p as well can be added to the aTV already released with just a software/firmware update.

Yes, they're just about the same. But you're always a few clicks away from being out of Front Row and into the Finder on the Mac. The ATV won't let you do that. Less risk of damage, ya know? :)

As long as you're running the mac from the remote and not the keyboard and mouse, is there any difficulty in getting to front row, isn't it just one button click? And what is at risk of getting damaged?

I think they should just cut their losses and throw in the towel with Apple TV. I don't foresee any devout fan followings springing up like happened with the Newton after it was discontinued.

So does that mean that you think that consumers will never watch TV via a box streaming from the internet? Or that it will happen but apple should just stand back and let someone else have the huge profits that will come from this market someday? For what little it costs apple to develop a box like this, it seems like it would be a horrible idea to walk away from this market just because they're ahead of their time.

:apple:TV mini:
- RCA composite and S-Video ouputs (only)
- Stereo output (only, no optical)
- No hard drive (only enough flash for the OS and programs)
- No wireless
US$99


Why no optical out? A $30 DVD player has that output, meaning that the cost of having the feature is dirt cheap. That's one of the biggest things keeping people from adopting the aTV, does it really make sense to ship a $99 device that can't do what a $30 one can?

And without the wireless, how would it get the content from your computer or the internet? If I have to run wires all over my house, I might as well just run a video cable from my computer and not buy a box like this at all!

ztark
Jan 2, 2008, 06:13 PM
And without the wireless, how would it get the content from your computer or the internet? If I have to run wires all over my house, I might as well just run a video cable from my computer and not buy a box like this at all!


My concern with the current appleTV setup is the opposite of this: My imac is a mere four feet from my HDTV and I am not seeing the reason I should buy an appleTV to move my itunes media four feet.

milo
Jan 2, 2008, 06:17 PM
My concern with the current appleTV setup is the opposite of this: My imac is a mere four feet from my HDTV and I am not seeing the reason I should buy an appleTV to move my itunes media four feet.

For you, there isn't a reason.

Buy a four foot cable. Done.

You aren't the target market for aTV.

ztark
Jan 2, 2008, 06:25 PM
thanks, this thread (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=407205) had almost convinced me to buy one (after Macworld, of course).

chatin
Jan 2, 2008, 10:02 PM
I thought that the Demi-gods, of everyone, would be the ones to appreciate the AppleTV most. There are many of us who love it, not necessarily because it is the most full-featured device of this type out there, but because it works wonderfully with our Macs and iTunes. Anyone who is too blind to try it out (Costco, people!) can go screw themselves.

:apple:TV is actually a better made unit than the mini. Built to fall, to be abused. It will sync perfectly to any HDTV. Problem is that people are chasing blu-ray and DVR and the old cable media.

Get liberated, get :apple: TV!

McGiord
Jan 2, 2008, 10:41 PM
If the mini doesn't have the HDMI port neither the optical sound one, even the current iTunes store media don't take advantage of them, why some people prefer the mini instead of the :apple:TV?
Can you connect the mini via HDMI using some adapters?

I has been using my MacBook with the miniDVI to DVI video adpater plus a DVI to HDMI adapter and HDMI cable to connect it to my 40" LCD Sony to watch TV shows from abc.com and nbc.com + you tube and many other things via Front Row.
This past weekend I tried to watch a Movie using my MacBook setup described above via Netflix's "Watch it Instantly" under Parallels Desktop 3.0 with Windows XP pro, sadly the movie quality was poor and I didn't watch it at all.

The Pros:
-many free content
-only cables needed

The cons:
-Additional cable for stereo only audio (iPod miniplug to RCA cable), audio signal is lower than other sources (cablebox, dvd, etc)
-The MacBook video card isn't capable to fill the whole screen
-When not using Front Row with the Remote the need to navigate with my track pad (I don't have a wireless mouse yet)

I think that with a Mac with better video processing capabilities and audio output we can have an economical alternative to the :apple:TV.

There are ways to record HD video on your Mac using the firewire port from certain cableboxes, but requires a lot of setup and HDD space, and after you record it you need to manipualte it to make it playable.

I will get an :apple:TV when the media I can watch on it make it worth to spend any money on it, and that even with a 3rd party add on I can easily record with it.

As of Today the :apple:TV is just a potential Home Theater device for HD content, until HD with Surround Sound media is available.
I hope this changes soon at the 2008 MacWorld's Conference.
________
Ram (disambiguation) (http://www.dodge-wiki.com/wiki/Dodge_Ram_(disambiguation))

LiveForever
Jan 3, 2008, 06:23 AM
The apple TV could be a huge success but its held back in my opinion by a lack of a cd/DVD drive built in.

What I would like is a dedicated unit to store all my music (like a big ipod) - I could directly place in my CD's so all the tracks and cover art are downloaded to it and I could browse through using the excellent cover flow. At the moment this is what I do with my imac but it seems a waste of disc space really. I mean I have all this glorious computing power and its mainly used to store my music so I can play it through my stereo.

This apple TV could so easily be that unit, it just needs a CD/DVD player built iin.

Like wise if i could rip my DVD collection straight to it so I could scroll through my music and DVD's (and photos) then this would be a killer product.

At the moment it seems no more than a glorified airport extreme.

I heard rumours that it will be revamped as a full network device.

"Andy Neff, an analyst with New York investment bank, Bear Stearns, says Apple could accelerate its iPhone/iPod momentum by introducing a handheld device with a larger screen for playing music and surfing the web. Well, yes, but isn't that what the iPod touch and the iPhone do? Or is Neff talking about a 4-inch or 6-inch screen, and if so, is that the aforementioned "slate"?

Neff also guesses that AppleTV, an under-rated box that makes transmitting to a big screen TV movies stored on a home computer consumer-easy, may be revamped and turned into a full-scale home networking device."


http://www.smh.com.au/news/how-tos/noncore-tips/2007/12/31/1198949883698.html

ironjaw
Jan 3, 2008, 07:14 AM
I don't know about all of you but I want my :apple:TV to make me a cup coffee in the morning and give me foot massage :D

wPod
Jan 3, 2008, 09:14 AM
:apple:TV doesn't hit a target audience. If :apple:TV is going for the high end market, then they need HD content and (at least) 5.1 surround. If :apple:TV is going for the lower end mass market (ie anyone that owns a TV and a DVD player) then they need to have some sort of analog video out such as composite video so the 70% of people who do NOT have HD tvs can plug the :apple:TV into their TV.

I hope Apple decides to hit the upper end market and introduce HD content to iTMS as well as introduce a way to purchase/rent directly from the :apple:TV. Also add 5.1 surround. and assuming all of this can be changed with a firmware update, then they can follow what M$ did with the release of the new zune and allow people with the old :apple:TV to upgrade the software to be equivalent to the new :apple:TV!!!!

so hopefully there will be an announcement of some sort at MW and not a silent loss of the :apple:TV.

Cave Man
Jan 3, 2008, 09:53 AM
If the mini doesn't have the HDMI port neither the optical sound one, even the current iTunes store media don't take advantage of them, why some people prefer the mini instead of the :apple:TV?

The Mini has an optical port, both input and output. It will passthrough Dolby Digital and DTS 5.1 surround from DVDs through this port, and it will play Dolby Digital 5.1 from MKV files through VLC. The ATV doesn't have the software ability to do 5.1 passthrough.

Can you connect the mini via HDMI using some adapters?

Yes, DVI to HDMI, as you apparently have. You only get video, not audio.

There are ways to record HD video on your Mac using the firewire port from certain cableboxes, but requires a lot of setup and HDD space, and after you record it you need to manipualte it to make it playable.

You can also use Elgato's Eye TV products to receive and record HD shows through the USB port. There is no need for other "manipulations" to play live TV or recordings on the Mac.

I will get an :apple:TV when the media I can watch on it make it worth to spend any money on it, and that even with a 3rd party add on I can easily record with it.

I really don't think that'll happen. You already have a computer, as does anyone who uses an ATV. It's what you should use for recording. But, Stevie might surprise us at MWSF. He just might include a digital tuner in a revised ATV and provide DVR capabilities. If he does, I sure hopes he changes the hard drive to a 3.5" SATA.

sammoj
Jan 3, 2008, 10:31 AM
Guys/Girls

All this talk about a 'New Apple TV', no thanks!

I purchased a 160GB one less than 6 months ago, what I want is some updates - just basic please.

Integration into iLife08, ie: Events in iPhoto
Purchase iTunes music via :apple:TV.
Better folder management on movies, aka TV shows.

No new box please, don't want to shell out again after 6 months - this is a computer lets just upgrade the software please...don't leave the early adopters behind Apple.

J

ztark
Jan 3, 2008, 06:13 PM
Guys/Girls

All this talk about a 'New Apple TV', no thanks!

I purchased a 160GB one less than 6 months ago, what I want is some updates - just basic please.

Integration into iLife08, ie: Events in iPhoto
Purchase iTunes music via :apple:TV.
Better folder management on movies, aka TV shows.

No new box please, don't want to shell out again after 6 months - this is a computer lets just upgrade the software please...don't leave the early adopters behind Apple.

J

agreed

Mr9758
Jan 4, 2008, 12:09 AM
Like wise if i could rip my DVD collection straight to it so I could scroll through my music and DVD's (and photos) then this would be a killer product.


You can.

legacyb4
Jan 4, 2008, 11:14 PM
Same reason a Tivo works well for non-technically minded folks compared to a MCE/MythTV/BeyondTV solution.

I just got a new HDTV for Christmas and need to figure out what will be the best HD-compatible solution to replace my aging BeyondTV box...

Yes, they're just about the same. But you're always a few clicks away from being out of Front Row and into the Finder on the Mac. The ATV won't let you do that. Less risk of damage, ya know? :)

alchemistmuffin
Jan 4, 2008, 11:23 PM
Guys/Girls

All this talk about a 'New Apple TV', no thanks!

I purchased a 160GB one less than 6 months ago, what I want is some updates - just basic please.

Integration into iLife08, ie: Events in iPhoto
Purchase iTunes music via :apple:TV.
Better folder management on movies, aka TV shows.

No new box please, don't want to shell out again after 6 months - this is a computer lets just upgrade the software please...don't leave the early adopters behind Apple.

J

They probably will release the update so current :apple:TV owners get the same functionality on the new :apple:TV....

Since :apple:TV interface is basically OS X based, the software can be instantly upgraded with no difficulties, it's just like upgrading your Mac OS X operating system from Tiger to Leopard, only without the disc....

SthrnCmfrtr
Jan 5, 2008, 01:35 AM
I would be more interested in buying an Apple TV if it was;

Cheaper - its to expensive for the 160GB.

Had more capacity - 160GB doesn't really cut it for me with lots of 320KBps music, video podcasts etc, and 10,000+ photos. 250GB would be a better start or enable or have an additional USB that supports Airdisk/server.

Was also a fully fledged Airport Extreme - it would be much easier to justify buying it if it also worked as a AE.

Ran cooler or was taller to be cooler - it runs VERY hot these days and I worry its not going to last more than a couple of years under such heat.

A small backlit lcd display would be nice to know its current state and for simple diagnostics.

I also wonder if Apple might one day make it an HDMI/Audio switcher so that I can plug my DVD player etc through it to save me one less issue/task because I can really see my iPod touch becoming a super home remote when the SDK comes out.

Quoted for sheer insanity. A 250GB 2.5" HD, four or five gig-E ports, a backlit LCD display, and receiver functionality? AND IT WOULD BE COOLER AND CHEAPER?

I, for one, would buy it.

CalfCanuck
Jan 5, 2008, 01:33 PM
After reading this thread, I'm surprised no one is talking about Apple RAISING the price of the ATV and turning it into a combo Blu-Ray player and digital hub.

Since there are relatively few next generation DVD players out there (beyond PS3 and x-Box), the bulk of homes throughout the world will be buying these new DVD players over the next few years. So we're talking about 100's of millions of units shipping. Get a decent slice of this market, even if it is only the high-end segment, and things for ATV might start looking better.

If Apple created a great unit, they could sell a bunch of ATV's to people who might not be interested in downloadable video at the present time. But once all these ATV "Blu-Ray players" are hooked up to TVs, then Apple can begin to educate the new users on the benefits of downloadable video - creating new users who might not be existing Apple fans.

Given the other threads about Blu-Ray, will we see an announcement like this at MWSF?

alchemistmuffin
Jan 5, 2008, 02:55 PM
After reading this thread, I'm surprised no one is talking about Apple RAISING the price of the ATV and turning it into a combo Blu-Ray player and digital hub.

Since there are relatively few next generation DVD players out there (beyond PS3 and x-Box), the bulk of homes throughout the world will be buying these new DVD players over the next few years. So we're talking about 100's of millions of units shipping. Get a decent slice of this market, even if it is only the high-end segment, and things for ATV might start looking better.

If Apple created a great unit, they could sell a bunch of ATV's to people who might not be interested in downloadable video at the present time. But once all these ATV "Blu-Ray players" are hooked up to TVs, then Apple can begin to educate the new users on the benefits of downloadable video - creating new users who might not be existing Apple fans.

Given the other threads about Blu-Ray, will we see an announcement like this at MWSF?

You know, Apple might actually make fun of Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, stating that customers want something that they don't have to choose, and with that case, could announce the new service for iTunes store, which is the option to purchase feature length movies and TV shows in HD format, which can be played in native HD resolution when played on TV via :apple:TV.