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MacRumors
Jan 2, 2008, 04:11 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

As further evidence to the authenticity of GearLive's (http://www.gearlive.com/) iPhone 1.1.3 firmware photos and videos (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/12/30/more-leaked-iphone-1-1-3-firmware-details-evidence-and-videos/) that were leaked over the weekend, Hrmph.com dug up (http://hrmpf.com/wordpress/223/apple-patent-shows-details-of-iphone-113-firmware) a patent application that was published in August of last year that clearly shows Apple's describing how one might allow customization of icons, and specifically describes varying the positions (wobbling) of the icons to indicate that the icons may be moved by the user.

http://images.macrumors.com/article/2008/01/02/wobble_300.png

Hrmpf compiled an animated gif demonstrating (http://hrmpf.com/wordpress/223/apple-patent-shows-details-of-iphone-113-firmware) this wobbling effect, which looks identical to the 1.1.3 demo video. While it's certainly possible the images/video could simply be based on this patent application, it was not widely publicized at the time, and the description of wobbling icons is only obvious in retrospect.

One interesting description of the original patent application is that Apple suggested that icon movement could be elastic, allowing users to "throw" icons into the indended location. Upon breaking contact with the touch-sensitive display, the respective icon may resume varying its position. In some embodiments, the respective icon can be “thrown,” so that the final position of the respective icon is different from the point at which the icon is released. In this embodiment, the final position can depend on a variety of factors, such as the speed of the “throw,” the parameters used in a simulated equation of motion for the “throw” (e.g., coefficient of friction), and/or the presence of a lay out grid with simulated attractive forces.
The leaked version of the firmware does not have this capability according to GearLive (http://www.gearlive.com).

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/01/02/apples-wobbling-home-screen-icons-in-1-1-3/)



MarlboroLite
Jan 2, 2008, 04:13 PM
lol imagine if the iphone actually looked like that brick!:eek:

miketcool
Jan 2, 2008, 04:16 PM
lol imagine if the iphone actually looked like that brick!:eek:

Using that hand and making it to that scale as well? I am sure deep in some R&D lab there is a prototype that looks like that. Either that, or Apple knew some copycat company would make an iPhone wannabe with those proportions...

Drumjim85
Jan 2, 2008, 04:17 PM
While it can't be "thrown", it is attached to a grid, so when released it could not end up where you last touched it ..

Flight102280
Jan 2, 2008, 04:19 PM
Is there a gps, voice dial, voice recorder, flash based safari (that doesnt crash), video camera, camera flash, mms, ichat, custom background, gif picture support, iphone games, louder speaker phone, copy and paste patent somewhere in there? If so please let us know, I have an iphone but Im starting to miss my Nokia each day, I dont use maps, stock, clock button, notes, or even you tube (on my phone) that much. And I HATEEE web apps (on the edge network).

tennismanclay
Jan 2, 2008, 04:20 PM
looks cool, i will be getting my iphone next christmas, so hopefully every missing feature everybody is talking about will be in there by then. (above post) although i doubt it. But seriously apple how long does it take to put in small stuff like mms that i use almost everyday. I know of 2 people at my school that chose a sidekick or something over a iphone because the iphone cant take video and and cant handle pictures in text messaging. I hate my razor, but at least it can take video and copy and paste text. Im not against apple at all, i just think its silly that a phone can be times invention of the year, but it cant take a video. Apple has done a great job on the iphone, it just seems they need to update the little features everybody wants.


i love how technology advances.:rolleyes:


-clay

thesdx
Jan 2, 2008, 04:21 PM
I think the jiggling icons are quite cool. It adds that extra touch (no pun intended) that Apple always seems to put in their interfaces.

Drumjim85
Jan 2, 2008, 04:23 PM
Is there a gps, voice dial, voice recorder, flash based safari (that doesnt crash), video camera, camera flash, mms, ichat, custom background, gif picture support, iphone games, louder speaker phone, copy and paste patent somewhere in there? If so please let us know, I have an iphone but Im starting to miss my Nokia each day, I dont use maps, stock, clock button, notes, or even you tube (on my phone) that much. And I HATEEE web apps (on the edge network).

1. how could apple patent a camera flash or mms ?
2. if they could / would / did ... it would be in a different patent application..

Nicky G
Jan 2, 2008, 04:25 PM
This offers some insight into how long it takes a relatively basic GUI technology to make it from patent application into an actual device.

qntmfred
Jan 2, 2008, 04:25 PM
AppleInsider had a post about this in August
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/07/08/28/apple_files_for_world_patent_on_customizable_iphone_interface.html

jb510
Jan 2, 2008, 04:26 PM
This patent, especially the "throwing" part, reminds me of the BumpTop desktop.

http://bumptop.com/

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/131

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0ODskdEPnQ

Flight102280
Jan 2, 2008, 04:27 PM
1. how could apple patent a camera flash or mms ?
2. if they could / would / did ... it would be in a different patent application..


Hopefully for the next iphone, you can use ichat and have video conference kinda like the nextel phones :apple:

twoodcc
Jan 2, 2008, 04:37 PM
cool. looks like this is coming to the iPhone soon. looking forward to it

Masquerade
Jan 2, 2008, 04:38 PM
this patent is patetic. they got a lot of things that can do with core animation also why shake icons remembers me mariopaint???

swrdfghtr
Jan 2, 2008, 04:42 PM
This patent can't be valid. There's clear prior art: Weebles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weebles) wobbled, although they did not fall down.

Stella
Jan 2, 2008, 04:43 PM
1. how could apple patent a camera flash or mms ?
2. if they could / would / did ... it would be in a different patent application..

You've not seen other patents that have been approved but obviously prior art?! :D

macuserfan22
Jan 2, 2008, 04:45 PM
What about the already existing ability to move and change icons on the Music screen (Artist, Podcast, Genre, etc.)? Apple can just use that technology for this purpose...

shawnce
Jan 2, 2008, 04:47 PM
You've not seen other patents that have been approved but obviously prior art?! :D

Patents can cover a very similar but unique implementation of existing related prior art / patent. ...granted some patents do get granted that really shouldn't given prior art and being obvious.

SheriffParker
Jan 2, 2008, 04:48 PM
Nobody better try to copy this wobble business.

chr1s60
Jan 2, 2008, 04:53 PM
Looks like 1.1.3 is the real deal. Now there is quite a bit of evidence out there. We know about it Apple, please let us have it now.

Doctor Q
Jan 2, 2008, 04:58 PM
It's interest to see how companies meet the challenge of keeping patents generic enough to (a) claim as broad an idea as possible and (b) hide details about their intended use of the idea while they (c) stay specific enough so that the patent will hold up as a novel invention.

Words like "varies positions of one or more icons in the plurality of icons in response to detecting the predefined user action" and "varying the positions of the one or more icons about respective average positions" seem to have accomplished that.

evilyankeefan
Jan 2, 2008, 05:13 PM
Kind of surprised Apple didn't stay consistent and make the icons bounce like they do in the dock when opening stuff. I admit the mass wobbling is quite appealing vs. a mass bounce.

Then again, they could update Leopard to make the dock icons wobble too.

lookmark
Jan 2, 2008, 05:20 PM
Kind of surprised Apple didn't stay consistent and make the icons bounce like they do in the dock when opening stuff. I admit the mass wobbling is quite appealing vs. a mass bounce.

Then again, they could update Leopard to make the dock icons wobble too.

That's not consistent in the slightest. Wobbling visualizes a very different function than bouncing: showing that iPhone apps on the home page are in "reconfiguration" mode vs. launching an app.

ben5959
Jan 2, 2008, 05:34 PM
i think that this proves that apple planned to put games on the iphone all along, look at the icon that the finger is touching, it says game, oh wait, nevermind the finger is taking the game away never to bring it back!!!!!!!!!!! i want games on my iphone, not stupid wiggling icons, it just makes me feel like ive had a few drinks too many. thumbs down for me.

HornetOSX
Jan 2, 2008, 05:35 PM
This patent can't be valid. There's clear prior art: Weebles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weebles) wobbled, although they did not fall down.

+2 Funny


I'm still chuckling:D

happydude
Jan 2, 2008, 05:38 PM
thanks for "wobbling icons" apple . . . how about some real work toward internal GPS, copy/paste, document editing (iphone pages app), 3G, etc. so . . . yeah . . . still waiting for iphone v. 2.

InkMaster
Jan 2, 2008, 05:39 PM
sigh... this is lame :( no more surprises left for 1.1.3 :(

japanime
Jan 2, 2008, 05:41 PM
What about the already existing ability to move and change icons on the Music screen (Artist, Podcast, Genre, etc.)? Apple can just use that technology for this purpose...

I was unaware of this feature until reading your post. (Yeah, I failed to RTFM :D ) Quite useful. Thanks for pointing it out!

iJawn108
Jan 2, 2008, 06:11 PM
i home this comes to the ipodtouch :cool:

evilyankeefan
Jan 2, 2008, 06:13 PM
That's not consistent in the slightest. Wobbling visualizes a very different function than bouncing: showing that iPhone apps on the home page are in "reconfiguration" mode vs. launching an app.

Good point. Wasn't thinking of it from a function perspective, just a visual notification.

MikeTheC
Jan 2, 2008, 06:16 PM
*groans*

Oh, I wish to God the U.S. TPO would stop granting software patents. This is just silly.

RafMac
Jan 2, 2008, 06:30 PM
It's interesting that thedrawing also has Clear and Hold Buttons. It may be a new iPhone 2 design with new software??

Willis
Jan 2, 2008, 06:38 PM
Hmm... Apple seem to drag their heels a bit with functionality with the iPhone... bah... still looks like a nice update

uNext
Jan 2, 2008, 06:38 PM
People are exicited over wobbly icons?
Are you kidding me?
What is so special about arranging your icons?

How about apple uncripples the iphone makes it a apple based smartphone
and makes the bluetooth on it more useful.

I have a treo 680 that automatically connects to my car bluetooth system for hands free operation with the iphone it does not connect automatically i have to manually do it....OHH YEAH DID I MENTION BLUETOOTH SUCKS ON THE IPHONE?

And i wont get started with other major flaws..apples knows exactly who to go after....

If wobbly icons make people piss on themselves then no wonder apple gives us lil eye candy treats but horribly fail at pening the iphone for productivity. At the end of the day major key points are disregarded for some eye candy.

What a shame the iphone could be the best gadget on top of it being the best out there already. But **** man
wobbly icons over other features? lol

SFC Archer
Jan 2, 2008, 06:58 PM
Is there a gps, voice dial, voice recorder, flash based safari (that doesnt crash), video camera, camera flash, mms, ichat, custom background, gif picture support, iphone games, louder speaker phone, copy and paste patent somewhere in there? If so please let us know, I have an iphone but Im starting to miss my Nokia each day, I dont use maps, stock, clock button, notes, or even you tube (on my phone) that much. And I HATEEE web apps (on the edge network).

I am so tired of this whinin, bitching, moaning and complaining about something that has been known since June 29th. If it doesnt fit your need then buy the friggin Nokia, Crackberry or Treo that will fit your pathetic way of life. Christ I am surprised your were able to give up the bottle or tit. Not every dang thing in life is going to be YOUR way so get over it.

GPS...Learn to read a map
Voice Dial...Not needed, pull over if driving
Voice Record...Why? you want to hear yourself whine some more
Flash...Used in Ads and spam...Why?....not needed!
Video Camera...Buy one or else you cry about the quality of something that will be worthless if activated...and we don't need to watch your self made porn.
Camera Flash...For what? Use a dang camera if you want flash
MMS/iChat...use your stupid phone as a phone and learn how to communicate again, or use email as it was designed, to send friggin pictures of you whinin

I can go on and on and on...if it doesnt fit your needs then dont buy the stupid phone and why do you want a louder speaker...you dont seem to want to use the phone anyway.

Wow...this is so amazing that users just can't get over the fact that this is a different digital device and thus it works DIFFERENT!!! Adapt and overcome and get a friggin life!!!

Happy New Year!

mdriftmeyer
Jan 2, 2008, 07:05 PM
To each there own. Who cares that they have activated object tracking on the screen that includes rotation? Are we going to bust a nut when they activate on-the-fly scaling proportional to having too many icons, on screen, thus requiring a uniform reduction in scale?

Doctor Q
Jan 2, 2008, 07:19 PM
It's lucky that the wobbling icons don't set off the motion sensor! :D

Mackan
Jan 2, 2008, 07:23 PM
How can you get a patent like that approved?

The General
Jan 2, 2008, 07:30 PM
It's lucky that the wobbling icons don't set off the motion sensor! :D

They should make the icons wobble from the motion sensor. :)

Masquerade
Jan 2, 2008, 07:32 PM
Remember that internet explorer: mac 5? Microsoft implemented for the first time the unique and great way of customization for toolbars as we know today in OS X. ( Apple copied that for all OS X using cocoa sheets). :)

Project
Jan 2, 2008, 07:35 PM
So this thing is probably 2 years old (filed mid 06). Shows just how far ahead Apple is thinking with some of this UI stuff for the iPhone.

chr1s60
Jan 2, 2008, 07:35 PM
People are exicited over wobbly icons?
Are you kidding me?
What is so special about arranging your icons?

How about apple uncripples the iphone makes it a apple based smartphone
and makes the bluetooth on it more useful.

I have a treo 680 that automatically connects to my car bluetooth system for hands free operation with the iphone it does not connect automatically i have to manually do it....OHH YEAH DID I MENTION BLUETOOTH SUCKS ON THE IPHONE?

And i wont get started with other major flaws..apples knows exactly who to go after....

If wobbly icons make people piss on themselves then no wonder apple gives us lil eye candy treats but horribly fail at pening the iphone for productivity. At the end of the day major key points are disregarded for some eye candy.

What a shame the iphone could be the best gadget on top of it being the best out there already. But **** man
wobbly icons over other features? lol

How is the browser and video on your Treo? Nowhere near as nice as the iPhone. If you don't like what the iPhone has to offer stick with that Treo and stop worrying about what Apple gives or doesn't give the iPhone.

pamon
Jan 2, 2008, 07:36 PM
now that we know what's on the firmware update, release it already...

enough hype on 1.1.3

ArtOfWarfare
Jan 2, 2008, 07:48 PM
thanks for "wobbling icons" apple . . . how about some real work toward internal GPS, copy/paste, document editing (iphone pages app), 3G, etc. so . . . yeah . . . still waiting for iphone v. 2.

I just realized this... the iPhone opens the office documents... but I don't think it opens iWork documents. Am I the only one who finds that ironic?:D (I don't actually own an iPhone so I can't actually test to see the iPhone can't play keynote slideshows...)

SolRayz
Jan 2, 2008, 07:48 PM
I see the iPhone as a work in progress and look forward to these updates. I'm just glad that the engineers at Apple make a valiant effort for quality and take there time to get things right, unlike most other company who rush poorly designed products into the market that have zero usability. Apple is way ahead in the cellphone market, despite some deficiencies. The iPhone is in a class of its own no one can touch right now.:D

ArtOfWarfare
Jan 2, 2008, 07:54 PM
GPS...Learn to read a map
Voice Dial...Not needed, pull over if driving
Voice Record...Why? you want to hear yourself whine some more
Flash...Used in Ads and spam...Why?....not needed!
Video Camera...Buy one or else you cry about the quality of something that will be worthless if activated...and we don't need to watch your self made porn.
Camera Flash...For what? Use a dang camera if you want flash
MMS/iChat...use your stupid phone as a phone and learn how to communicate again, or use email as it was designed, to send friggin pictures of you whinin

Apple advertises the iPhone as the only thing you need in your pocket. You're suggesting that people should carry their iPhone, a map, a camera, and a recorder with them even though Apple says you shouldn't need all these other things. What unapple like thoughts you have.

island
Jan 2, 2008, 07:59 PM
When I hop in my M3 everything works without me looking or touching. Maybe you should stick with a Treo if you like it so much. :)

People are exicited over wobbly icons?
I have a treo 680 that automatically connects to my car bluetooth system for hands free operation with the iphone it does not connect automatically i have to manually do it....OHH YEAH DID I MENTION BLUETOOTH SUCKS ON THE IPHONE?

rstansby
Jan 2, 2008, 08:04 PM
I see the iPhone as a work in progress and look forward to these updates. I'm just glad that the engineers at Apple make a valiant effort for quality and take there time to get things right, unlike most other company who rush poorly designed products into the market that have zero usability. Apple is way ahead in the cellphone market, despite some deficiencies. The iPhone is in a class of its own no one can touch right now.:D

I couldn't agree more. I think it is obvious that Apple had a lot of great ideas for the iPhone. They could have tried to apply every idea and they would have ended up with a phone that has a bulky user interface like a PC. Instead they released a phone that does the important things well. Now that the iPhone is in the hands of users, Apple is adding the features that people want the most. All phones have issues that could be improved. This is the first phone I've owned that has actually been improved after I bought it. Forget version 2, anyone with an version 1 iPhone is going to get improved features for free through updates.

SFC Archer
Jan 2, 2008, 08:09 PM
Apple advertises the iPhone as the only thing you need in your pocket. You're suggesting that people should carry their iPhone, a map, a camera, and a recorder with them even though Apple says you shouldn't need all these other things. What unapple like thoughts you have.

It is the only thing I need in my pocket. I have OPENED my MIND and adapted. I used to carry a PDA w/Camera, An MP3 player and a TREO. I used the Treo as a phone cause that was all it was good for and even then it sucked. I couldnt buy music with or watch videos on the MP3 and the PDA was my Calender, Address Book and Video player because the Treo wouldnt work right. All of that is now in the iPhone and works perfectly since I got it on iDay.

Almost every single car made, now has GPS in it and gives you directions while driving. Google on the iPhone gives me a great reference to where things are because "I can read Maps" and know how to navigate without being "told" how to get there. If I see the "Kodack" moment then I take a picture. The rest of the time I use a camera for a camera if I want family pictures or scenery,etc...not a thumb nail that "ALL" cell phones take. And never in my life have I had a need to "record" myself or someone else. I can spell, write and know how to make notes if I need to remember something. NONE of these things are Necessary to have on any phone when there are better out there and designed for that use. You Will NEVER get all of this stuff that everyone dreams about in one package...it is just not possible and to have it work to the expected level, and still be thin and all that other crap that people want.

And sorry to disappoint you, but I am proud to NOT be an apple fanboy! I am realistic and have learned to use what I have to the best that it can be used. If it aint there and I need it "Then I BUY the DEVICE that has it" not sit here and whine about every missing thing that doesn't meet my personal needs.

Based on my needs and use....the iPhone has EVERYTHING that I need and/or use on a daily basis and I haven't got lost, missed a picture or had to record myself yet.;)

chr1s60
Jan 2, 2008, 08:10 PM
Apple advertises the iPhone as the only thing you need in your pocket. You're suggesting that people should carry their iPhone, a map, a camera, and a recorder with them even though Apple says you shouldn't need all these other things. What unapple like thoughts you have.

Reading a map can be done in the maps application in iPhone. GPS is nice, but really isn't needed nor is carrying a map. Apple also never addressed the iPhone replacing a recorder or a video camera. With what the iPhone already has it replaces the need to carry a few objects. Some of the constant demands for GPS, voice recorder and video camera seem pretty dumb to me since the addition of them wouldn't really be of high enough quality to replace the need for another device.

SFC Archer
Jan 2, 2008, 08:22 PM
Reading a map can be done in the maps application in iPhone. GPS is nice, but really isn't needed nor is carrying a map. Apple also never addressed the iPhone replacing a recorder or a video camera. With what the iPhone already has it replaces the need to carry a few objects. Some of the constant demands for GPS, voice recorder and video camera seem pretty dumb to me since the addition of them wouldn't really be of high enough quality to replace the need for another device.

Amen Chr1s, rstansby and SolRayz (applause)...I agree with all of your posts 100%.

Users fail to realize that the more garbage you throw into one device lowers the quality of not only pictures or battery life or a multitude of other problems or that the more you put into one device increases the odds of crash's and application freezes...look at the Treo.

I agree with the taking time to develope, test and try (cause there are still some issues) to get it right the first time. A video camera on a phone is So So So pointless...the quality is not worth even trying to watch...look at some of those utube videos that are just downright terrible.

The iPhone is not perfect and NO cell phone, smartphone or whatever the next gadget is will be perfect for everyone. That is why you have a CHOICE and can buy the device that will fit your needs!

Again...Great posts!

rstansby
Jan 2, 2008, 08:38 PM
now that we know what's on the firmware update, release it already...

enough hype on 1.1.3

Well if you watch the video you will see that the phone crashes while using this firmware. So I hope Apple waits until it is finished before they release it.

Roller
Jan 2, 2008, 08:45 PM
This has all the makings of a new "classic" line:

"Are those your icons wobbling or are you just happy to see me?" :)

uNext
Jan 2, 2008, 09:19 PM
How is the browser and video on your Treo? Nowhere near as nice as the iPhone. If you don't like what the iPhone has to offer stick with that Treo and stop worrying about what Apple gives or doesn't give the iPhone.



Is that all you and m3 dude can do?

I mean seriously wobbly icons over other updates that are needed?
I can see you have yet to leave toddler stages and found the adult version of fisher price toys.

One day you will know phones and productivity reach far beyond being cool and stretch farther then music and video.

I was not saying the iPhone is a piece of crap (I LOVE IT-TREO 680 SUCKS COMPARED TO IT) but 4 iphones that i have had none of them connected automatically to my bluetooth headset plus other issues with it maybe i am 1 unlucky basterd i simply stated that whats the major point of wobbly icons?> lol
i mean if that feeds your ambition on a daily basis good for you.....

BRING ON THE GOOD STUFF APPLE I BELIEVE IN YOU

happydude
Jan 2, 2008, 09:44 PM
People are exicited over wobbly icons?
Are you kidding me?
What is so special about arranging your icons?

How about apple uncripples the iphone makes it a apple based smartphone
and makes the bluetooth on it more useful.

I have a treo 680 that automatically connects to my car bluetooth system for hands free operation with the iphone it does not connect automatically i have to manually do it....OHH YEAH DID I MENTION BLUETOOTH SUCKS ON THE IPHONE?

And i wont get started with other major flaws..apples knows exactly who to go after....

If wobbly icons make people piss on themselves then no wonder apple gives us lil eye candy treats but horribly fail at pening the iphone for productivity. At the end of the day major key points are disregarded for some eye candy.

What a shame the iphone could be the best gadget on top of it being the best out there already. But **** man
wobbly icons over other features? lol

i agree!! why is apple focusing on "wobbling icons" yes, icandy crap grabs attention, but when it comes down to it, i'd rather apple focus on real applications to better the functionality vs the look. for people saying more functions bulk up and bring down quality of the iphone . . . wrong. the gps chip, small as ****, isn't going to bulk up the phone and they should let users decide if they want it on or off - negating casual batter use issues. isn't the addition of wobbly icons bulking up the OS? if it comes to bulking up the phone/OS for things people will use (if they choose to) - i'd chose any of copy/paste, multiple sms, ichat, gps, document editing over wobbly icons. i just think apple should focus this wobbly energy on something more concrete.

happydude
Jan 2, 2008, 10:06 PM
I am so tired of this whinin, bitching, moaning and complaining about something that has been known since June 29th. If it doesnt fit your need then buy the friggin Nokia, Crackberry or Treo that will fit your pathetic way of life. Christ I am surprised your were able to give up the bottle or tit. Not every dang thing in life is going to be YOUR way so get over it.

GPS...Learn to read a map
Voice Dial...Not needed, pull over if driving
Voice Record...Why? you want to hear yourself whine some more
Flash...Used in Ads and spam...Why?....not needed!
Video Camera...Buy one or else you cry about the quality of something that will be worthless if activated...and we don't need to watch your self made porn.
Camera Flash...For what? Use a dang camera if you want flash
MMS/iChat...use your stupid phone as a phone and learn how to communicate again, or use email as it was designed, to send friggin pictures of you whinin

I can go on and on and on...if it doesnt fit your needs then dont buy the stupid phone and why do you want a louder speaker...you dont seem to want to use the phone anyway.

Wow...this is so amazing that users just can't get over the fact that this is a different digital device and thus it works DIFFERENT!!! Adapt and overcome and get a friggin life!!!

Happy New Year!

but apple CAN make a device that includes many of what you are poo pooing above. and why not? it seems just like a couple years ago people thought, why have a phone not attached to a cord on your wall? what purpose would it serve to have it with me all the time. if i need to call someone, i have these things called quarters i can plop into a "payphone" and call anyone i want. well, guess where we are now. technology marches on. the iphone is great as it is, but hey, it can always be better. why are you so focused on having a stagnant phone that won't in the future include things it doesn't now. just because you see no use for an additional feature doesn't mean the other 5 million owners/users won't.

things you poo pooed:
GPS: amazing to be able to geocache with my iphone. or get directions if i'm lost in the dark and it is harder to see street signs. or not to have to pay for a thousand dollar upgrade in my car for it. or not to have to buy a map if i'm driving through a state and i want to make a side trip.
Voice Dial: why not make that easier for people. my stupid ass razr does, i'm sure the iphone can . . .
Voice record: i can't personally think of some reason i would need that. doesn't mean others wouldn't . . .
Flash: many websites have flash on them (for better or worse) that aren't ads or spam. would be nice to view those as well. perhaps on a 3G enabled phone (hint: in the future) so page loading time wouldn't lag as much. also perhaps have the ability to turn flash capability on and off if you don't want it.
Video: yeah, video quality would suck on a big screen, but it would be neat to have a video of my kids on my phone that i could show other people instead of lugging out a laptop i had to dump video onto that i had to take from a digital camcorder. isn't that the purpose of the camera on the iphone anyway? who actually downloads the picture to their computer for fullscreen viewing? same for video - good enough for camera, barely palatable if you want to store it on your computer, but for anything else buy an actual camera or video camera.
camera flash: yeah, i agree that would be a waste to add to the iphone. that's one thing that would actually bulk it up and bog it down. but how about a better light meter and white balance sensor?
MMS/iChat: common, that would be freakin awesome to be able to ichat on the phone. it is a communication device afterall- let us use ichat like we do on our computers. if you are so hot and bothered people want more communications functionality on a mobile communication device, i'm sure you are just as mad that apple has a communication program on their desktop computers meant for desktop things. or do you get upset when they upgrade Pages or iLife - desktop applications meant for desktop computers. ichat definitely makes sense for the iphone.

again, common, man, the iphone is great but could be better. it's just technologic evolution. apple strives to make devices that will make people's lives easier. all the above would. the technology is there, the know-how is there. it's just up to apple to decide they want to do it and how to get it done. many people laughed when apple crammed an entire computer into the original bondi blue imac. now where are we?! there's nothing wrong with people wanting more and better. after all, it is what apple has set out to do in the past and will continue to do with everything they create - including the iphone.

KingYaba
Jan 2, 2008, 10:14 PM
Jiggling sounds a bit stupid if you ask me.

iJawn108
Jan 2, 2008, 11:17 PM
this'll be useful in feb when there's 20 billion iphone/ipodtouch apps

igalld011
Jan 3, 2008, 04:19 AM
They should add the ability for the keyboard to orient to the horizontal position. :rolleyes:

SFC Archer
Jan 3, 2008, 09:36 AM
but apple CAN make a device that includes many of what you are poo pooing above. and why not? it seems just like a couple years ago people thought, why have a phone not attached to a cord on your wall? what purpose would it serve to have it with me all the time. if i need to call someone, i have these things called quarters i can plop into a "payphone" and call anyone i want. well, guess where we are now. technology marches on. the iphone is great as it is, but hey, it can always be better. why are you so focused on having a stagnant phone that won't in the future include things it doesn't now. just because you see no use for an additional feature doesn't mean the other 5 million owners/users won't.

You misunderstand me...im not "poo pooing" on apple or any company that will/can create a device that meets or comes close to meeting/having all that users desire. Im tired of all the whiners, whining about the same stuff over and over and over and over. Get over it, when Apple or any other company determines that it is important enough, then they will incorporate it, IF it will be of value to the majority and the company. Whining about it missing each and every time a new thread comes out is SOOOOO STUPID! Technology is good and it will get better with time and patience. Allow the company's to develope, test and incorporate it correctly, not throw it all into a big kettle and come out with a piece of crap(Treo). Trust me my friend....out of the 5 million users you state above...I am not the only one that feels this way. Apple will incorporate and update continously, just have patience and look forward to the next update and meanwhile, enjoy what is currently offered. Why do you think current cell users average buying a new cell phone every year? Could it be because they are bored with it? It has no new "apps"? It is no longer cool? Or some other reason...With the iPhone you no longer need to do that because of the software base. New updates will actually save you money and still create interest for longer periods of time thus allowing you to keep the same phone longer. Just think about it.

GPS: amazing to be able to geocache with my iphone. or get directions if i'm lost in the dark and it is harder to see street signs. or not to have to pay for a thousand dollar upgrade in my car for it. or not to have to buy a map if i'm driving through a state and i want to make a side trip.

GPS is amazing...I have served with the U.S. Army for 24 years and grew up using a map and compass in the infantry. During Desert Storm, the Army was the first to incorporate GPS and was a life savior due to no terrain features and very difficult navigation with maps. GPS was then developed for civilian use and is now incorporated into "almost" every new vehicle purchase, again, its a great product and does what it is intended to do while driving in your examples above. If you have an older car then one can purchase Tom Tom or the like for very little money now days and have a far more accurate and reliable device. For a cell phone to have GPS IMHO is redicoulous and just not needed...it reduces the battery life, requires additional hardware, with this is the probability of increase in software/hardware issues. The current Google Maps is awesome and gives me step by step by step directions and has not been wrong yet. The only thing google maps does not do is tell you your location (which if true, will be remedied here with the next update) and it does not talk...so what. It works and with it, I have never been lost, taken a wrong turn or had a problem with it. Its already there.

Voice Dial: why not make that easier for people. my stupid ass razr does, i'm sure the iphone can . . .
Voice record: i can't personally think of some reason i would need that. doesn't mean others wouldn't . . ..

Here I agree with you...voice dial would be a needed immediate improvement because of the safety factor involved with people driving and trying to type/lookup. Too many accidents because of phones/laptops and people trying to use them when they should be focused on driving. Voice Recorder is just not needed in my opinion...others may use it for dictation, but the "majority" could care less about it.

Flash: many websites have flash on them (for better or worse) that aren't ads or spam. would be nice to view those as well. perhaps on a 3G enabled phone (hint: in the future) so page loading time wouldn't lag as much. also perhaps have the ability to turn flash capability on and off if you don't want it.

For the future, I can agree with you. In this country, for the majority, 3G is still in its infancy and just being brought to the public. If flash were to be activated at this time, then people would really start screamin, cryin and whinin because of the slow loads and then then they would all be cryin for WiMax and 3G would be "Edge" of today. In this aspect...no one will ever be happy and I dread the years of heartache and bellyachin about this subject. Suffice it to say...the iPhone is NOT a laptop/computer and thus should be used and looked at in the aspect of a tool to do a quick internet "whatever" and move on, not the end all to all internet work/activity.

Video: yeah, video quality would suck on a big screen, but it would be neat to have a video of my kids on my phone that i could show other people instead of lugging out a laptop i had to dump video onto that i had to take from a digital camcorder. isn't that the purpose of the camera on the iphone anyway? who actually downloads the picture to their computer for fullscreen viewing? same for video - good enough for camera, barely palatable if you want to store it on your computer, but for anything else buy an actual camera or video camera.
camera flash: yeah, i agree that would be a waste to add to the iphone. that's one thing that would actually bulk it up and bog it down. but how about a better light meter and white balance sensor?

I do have video of my kids on my iPhone...I used my Sony camcorder and converted the video and put it on my iPhone...great quality...30 fps and its as long as I want. Obviously alot of people take pictures with their phones and then scream bloody murder and post up all the forums when they get wiped out because "they DIDNT store it on their computer" I say again that the camera on any phone is for that "Kodak Moment" and that any other time I use my Cyber Shot for the quality and then email those to whom I want to show. We agree on the flash....Software update would fix the ability to correct lighting/contrast and will probably come in time.

MMS/iChat: common, that would be freakin awesome to be able to ichat on the phone. it is a communication device afterall- let us use ichat like we do on our computers. if you are so hot and bothered people want more communications functionality on a mobile communication device, i'm sure you are just as mad that apple has a communication program on their desktop computers meant for desktop things. or do you get upset when they upgrade Pages or iLife - desktop applications meant for desktop computers. ichat definitely makes sense for the iphone.?

Here, I draw the line...iChat/instant messaging is just totally stupid for a phone. My major concern and reasoning here is the straight up safety factor. Its bad enough that users text while driving and with that at least it slows down the use a little so that some attention is paid to driving, but you open up instant IM you got problems, because people will use it on a continous basis while driving and end up killing some innocent family just returning from Christmas Vacation and all of their new toys are laying all over the road because you wanted to chit chat by typing instead of calling (iPHONE) and talking to the other end. This is so common sense and even SMS should be somehow limited. This is a PHONE after all, use it as such and save the IM for the laptop when and where its safe. People are so afraid to "Talk" to each other anymore because it demands social skills and the ability to communicate. Typing is so easy to avoid the Social aspect and looses all emotion in its use...for example look at how many get offended in these forums because emotion and intent can not be displayed with a keyboard. Again, don't get me wrong...I use IM all the time in gaming and when I am on my laptop, where I cannot hurt anyone. It is a great tool and I use it daily, but feel that it would be a great danger to society and would increase the lack of social communication in our younger generations.
MMS is just plain outdated and over-rated. If you want to send a picture....email it, that is what the system was designed for. I have never in my 40+ years sent an MMS and never had the need or desire to. I use email which when IMAP'd properly works perfectly on my iPhone. I mean gee whiz, how much easier can it be then taking a picture and right there on the picture is the option to send it via email...gimme a break, MMS is old news and that is why Apple left it behind.


again, common, man, the iphone is great but could be better. it's just technologic evolution. apple strives to make devices that will make people's lives easier. all the above would. the technology is there, the know-how is there. it's just up to apple to decide they want to do it and how to get it done. many people laughed when apple crammed an entire computer into the original bondi blue imac. now where are we?! there's nothing wrong with people wanting more and better. after all, it is what apple has set out to do in the past and will continue to do with everything they create - including the iphone.


I appreciate your good natured comments and the opportunity to debate with you. You have some great input and at least a common sense approach to reality. I agree with you that the iPhone could be better and eventually it will be alot better...but, It will never be perfect for every user and that is my purpose behind my "rant". Those that post the same sob story thread after thread after thread is just wore out...all right we get it, got it and its recorded for the millionth time, lets let it go and move on. When Apple feels something needs to be added...then they will add it if they feel it will benefit both the user and the company. If they feel it is just going to clog up or degrade the device then it will probably never come to pass. The world needs a little patience and understanding and sooner or later all good things will come to those that have patience, otherwise users are just going to continue to be unhappy and we get to read their same old sob stories everytime a new thread is started. If it is not on the iPhone and a user feels it is needed for "his" use, then don't blame Apple or the iPhone...just buy the device that meets those needs. Each company makes a device based on their assumption of the market, needs and use behaviors of its customers so let them do their business...obviously Apple is doing right by the majority...look at the stock, sales records and demands. More great things are coming to the iPhone, both cool and functional...Just be patient.

Again, thanks for the chat and have a Super New Year!

happydude
Jan 3, 2008, 09:56 AM
Here, I draw the line...iChat/instant messaging is just totally stupid for a phone. My major concern and reasoning here is the straight up safety factor. Its bad enough that users text while driving and with that at least it slows down the use a little so that some attention is paid to driving, but you open up instant IM you got problems, because people will use it on a continous basis while driving and end up killing some innocent family just returning from Christmas Vacation and all of their new toys are laying all over the road because you wanted to chit chat by typing instead of calling (iPHONE) and talking to the other end. This is so common sense and even SMS should be somehow limited. This is a PHONE after all, use it as such and save the IM for the laptop when and where its safe. People are so afraid to "Talk" to each other anymore because it demands social skills and the ability to communicate. Typing is so easy to avoid the Social aspect and looses all emotion in its use...for example look at how many get offended in these forums because emotion and intent can not be displayed with a keyboard. Again, don't get me wrong...I use IM all the time in gaming and when I am on my laptop, where I cannot hurt anyone. It is a great tool and I use it daily, but feel that it would be a great danger to society and would increase the lack of social communication in our younger generations.
MMS is just plain outdated and over-rated. If you want to send a picture....email it, that is what the system was designed for. I have never in my 40+ years sent an MMS and never had the need or desire to. I use email which when IMAP'd properly works perfectly on my iPhone. I mean gee whiz, how much easier can it be then taking a picture and right there on the picture is the option to send it via email...gimme a break, MMS is old news and that is why Apple left it behind.



though i still disagree on the ichat thing. surely people are stupid and text while driving. i wouldn't have a problem with it if they ended up only injuring or killing themselves. but when they take out a family loaded presents as you so colorfully described above, that i also take issue. but, the whole talking on a cell phone in the car is still a huge problem as well, not just texting while driving. some states are taking that into their own hands and looking at outlawing any form of cell phone use while driving (mandating only headset use is only a political move to look tough - headsets do not reduce the number of accidents since it is the act of talking on the phone, not holding the phone, that causes distraction and accidents). but i don't think it is up to apple to decide that they need to create a product based on safety worries. i for example, ride the train and bus to work at least a couple times a week. why should i be denied a great addition because some moron takes out little jimmy and tina with their xmas presents? i also hate talking on the phone in crowded public (i.e. on the train). my conversations are my business and i don't want others listening in on my personal matters. so while in crowded public - the bus, train, a mall, waiting in line at the movie theatre, etc., ichat would be perfect.

i'm sorry if you've decided not to embrace the "art" of texting/ichat and i can see you have a cultural problem with it - borderlining on being old and curmudgeony :p - but it is the way a significant portion of the populace communicates these days. i, for example, missed out on the whole Facebook craze and can't understand why the youth wants to communicate that way. but it doesn't mean people shouldn't. if it works for them, great. hopefully they still do have face to face converasations and get outside for some fresh air now and then. but, ichat on the iphone, to me and to lots of others, makes a lot of sense. expanding the communications capabilities of a communications device just seems like a no brainer. hopefully people won't use it while driving. i'm sure some dumbass will and then they'll sue apple because this is america and obviously apple made them do it, but that's free will and an open market.

SFC Archer
Jan 3, 2008, 10:10 AM
though i still disagree on the ichat thing. surely people are stupid and text while driving. i wouldn't have a problem with it if they ended up only injuring or killing themselves. but when they take out a family loaded presents as you so colorfully described above, that i also take issue. but, the whole talking on a cell phone in the car is still a huge problem as well, not just texting while driving. some states are taking that into their own hands and looking at outlawing any form of cell phone use while driving (mandating only headset use is only a political move to look tough - headsets do not reduce the number of accidents since it is the act of talking on the phone, not holding the phone, that causes distraction and accidents). but i don't think it is up to apple to decide that they need to create a product based on safety worries. i for example, ride the train and bus to work at least a couple times a week. why should i be denied a great addition because some moron takes out little jimmy and tina with their xmas presents? i also hate talking on the phone in crowded public (i.e. on the train). my conversations are my business and i don't want others listening in on my personal matters. so while in crowded public - the bus, train, a mall, waiting in line at the movie theatre, etc., ichat would be perfect.

i'm sorry if you've decided not to embrace the "art" of texting/ichat and i can see you have a cultural problem with it - borderlining on being old and curmudgeony :p - but it is the way a significant portion of the populace communicates these days. i, for example, missed out on the whole Facebook craze and can't understand why the youth wants to communicate that way. but it doesn't mean people shouldn't. if it works for them, great. hopefully they still do have face to face converasations and get outside for some fresh air now and then. but, ichat on the iphone, to me and to lots of others, makes a lot of sense. expanding the communications capabilities of a communications device just seems like a no brainer. hopefully people won't use it while driving. i'm sure some dumbass will and then they'll sue apple because this is america and obviously apple made them do it, but that's free will and an open market.

Well said...obviously being human we all have opionions and neither are right or wrong. They all have merit and purpose to both of our beliefs and values. I can see your point while on a train/bus and can see no flaw with that method of use and you also make a great point about keeping your conversation private and not entertaining the whole world (this has bothered me at times even more when you cant see the headphone and think the individual is talking to you). However, I still feel that SMS is fine for this purpose as that is how I use it if I am in a meeting or need a "quite" conversation. Ultimately, Apple is the decider and we will all have to live with what they do/don't add to our iPhones. All military installations have outlawed cell phone use while driving on base which I support 100% and wish it was incorporated and enforced on our roads.

Careful...i might mistake my old age comment as personal:eek: LOL....I support IM'ing and again say its a terrific tool....WHEN its safe and not a temptation to devert ones attention from details that could cause disaster. As I said, I use it daily...just feel that SMS is fine for the iPhone, after all, its a phone not a computer. Please don't get started on all of this lawsuit garbage that this country uses...we no longer have a judicial system, its now a "How can I get rich?" scheming system:mad:

Have a great day!

biecacka
Jan 3, 2008, 10:58 AM
Looks like 1.1.3 is the real deal. Now there is quite a bit of evidence out there. We know about it Apple, please let us have it now.

i agree....enough is enough give it to us. even Jan. 15th seems too long to wait. we are all like apple fiend's

biecacka
Jan 3, 2008, 11:09 AM
I see the iPhone as a work in progress and look forward to these updates. I'm just glad that the engineers at Apple make a valiant effort for quality and take there time to get things right, unlike most other company who rush poorly designed products into the market that have zero usability. Apple is way ahead in the cellphone market, despite some deficiencies. The iPhone is in a class of its own no one can touch right now.:D
i agree one thing that apple is doing very well is providing us with updates from time to time. some will say they are minimal but each person's priorities are different so with due diligence i am sure your important updates will come. i think apple did say something like "the iphone will continue to be a work in progress" which was a way for them to excuse themselves from any "mistakes" in our eyes.

Buran
Jan 3, 2008, 11:43 AM
I personally want to have IM on the iphone and will install ApolloIM when it is official via the SDK (or whatever equivalent is available). I don't text/IM while driving (and I have a phone that can do both right now), so the crying that it just makes drivers dumber isn't my problem; it's like complaining that listening to music or playing computer games makes people dumber. Leave those of us who are responsible alone.

Everyone has different wants and needs and putting people down for wanting a feature is just silly. If widget X has a feature you don't need, just don't use the feature. I am not an investor so I won't use the stocks widget, but I'm not complaining the phone has a stock widget.

The only thing I am waiting for right now is more storage space, then I'll order an iphone.

Doctor Q
Jan 3, 2008, 01:51 PM
If you haven't seen this motion effect in Leopard, try this in Safari: Open the Help menu.
In the search box, type the word: show
In the list of search results, hover over one of the "Menu Items" lines.
Watch the motion of the blue arrow that appears to point out a menu item that contains the word "show."
This works in other applications too.

I like it better than rapid wobbling. It's more elegant, and less likely to be visually annoying.

LoganT
Jan 3, 2008, 05:12 PM
People are exicited over wobbly icons?
Are you kidding me?
What is so special about arranging your icons?

How about apple uncripples the iphone makes it a apple based smartphone
and makes the bluetooth on it more useful.

I have a treo 680 that automatically connects to my car bluetooth system for hands free operation with the iphone it does not connect automatically i have to manually do it....OHH YEAH DID I MENTION BLUETOOTH SUCKS ON THE IPHONE?

And i wont get started with other major flaws..apples knows exactly who to go after....

If wobbly icons make people piss on themselves then no wonder apple gives us lil eye candy treats but horribly fail at pening the iphone for productivity. At the end of the day major key points are disregarded for some eye candy.

What a shame the iphone could be the best gadget on top of it being the best out there already. But **** man
wobbly icons over other features? lol

You do know that Apple is developing an SDK for the iPhone (and iPod touch I'll add). The icons wobble so you can move them, and when you install more applications then what fits the home screen you can move them to a different screen (kind of like spaces in Leopard).

tennismanclay
Jan 3, 2008, 09:09 PM
Im tired of all the whiners, whining about the same stuff over and over and over and over. Whining about it missing each and every time a new thread comes out is SOOOOO STUPID!


Nobody makes you read these forums. :p




Here, I draw the line...iChat/instant messaging is just totally stupid for a phone. My major concern and reasoning here is the straight up safety factor. Its bad enough that users text while driving and with that at least it slows down the use a little so that some attention is paid to driving, but you open up instant IM you got problems, because people will use it on a continous basis while driving and end up killing some innocent family just returning from Christmas Vacation and all of their new toys are laying all over the road because you wanted to chit chat by typing instead of calling (iPHONE) and talking to the other end. This is so common sense and even SMS should be somehow limited. This is a PHONE after all, use it as such and save the IM for the laptop when and where its safe. People are so afraid to "Talk" to each other anymore because it demands social skills and the ability to communicate. Typing is so easy to avoid the Social aspect and looses all emotion in its use...for example look at how many get offended in these forums because emotion and intent can not be displayed with a keyboard. Again, don't get me wrong...I use IM all the time in gaming and when I am on my laptop, where I cannot hurt anyone. It is a great tool and I use it daily, but feel that it would be a great danger to society and would increase the lack of social communication in our younger generations.

I agree with your safety concern, but i sure would like to be able to chat with my friends, instead of texting, when im sitting in a doctors office, or in a long car ride or something. Ill just say i think you would be in the 5 percent who think adding an ichat app would be bad.

MMS is just plain outdated and over-rated. If you want to send a picture....email it, that is what the system was designed for. I have never in my 40+ years sent an MMS and never had the need or desire to. I use email which when IMAP'd properly works perfectly on my iPhone. I mean gee whiz, how much easier can it be then taking a picture and right there on the picture is the option to send it via email...gimme a break, MMS is old news and that is why Apple left it behind.

Although a lot of people have iphones/smartphones that can do email and stuff, 90 percent of the people i know either have phones that dont have email capability or they just dont want to use email on a razr. I use mms pretty often, wether its a funny video someone just took with there phone and wants to send to me, or a picture. Im just saying in your case i can see how mms wouldnt be useful, but in mine and a lot others it would, nor would it be that hard to implement.


Have a great year everyone

SFC Archer
Jan 4, 2008, 09:03 AM
Nobody makes you read these forums. :p

You are so right...but I do and the complainers continously post the same old hum drum complaints on each and every thread...They have every right to do this as I do to complain about them! If you want to complain about something then justify it and support it...start a discussion, debate, validate...do something other then just complain, support your grievance and make it interesting.

I agree with your safety concern, but i sure would like to be able to chat with my friends, instead of texting, when im sitting in a doctors office, or in a long car ride or something. Ill just say i think you would be in the 5 percent who think adding an ichat app would be bad.

Again I was just giving supporting reasons why I felt that way. Obviously it was just that, an opinion not an end all to the IM request...eventually it will be there and patience will be rewarded with that app. I also use IM but on my laptop while gaming or helping others with the iPhone that email me for assistance. Nothing wrong with IM, its just a danger to idiots that to do it while driving and there are more and more of them all the time. I don't care if I am only 5% that care about safety and saving lives, but be forewarned...If I see you or anyone texting or using a laptop while DRIVING...I will instantly report you!

Although a lot of people have iphones/smartphones that can do email and stuff, 90 percent of the people i know either have phones that dont have email capability or they just dont want to use email on a razr. I use mms pretty often, wether its a funny video someone just took with there phone and wants to send to me, or a picture. Im just saying in your case i can see how mms wouldnt be useful, but in mine and a lot others it would, nor would it be that hard to implement.

Here...you stated an opinion and supported it....I agree with you...for some this is the way they are used to using the system. For me, I use email as it was designed to be used and have never used MMS cause I didnt want to send crappy stuff to my contacts...they get the best I can do. Great opinon!

Have a super Day!!!

collinsra
Jan 5, 2008, 07:34 PM
Just watching the video was the coolest thing ever.

haw-i-ya
Jan 8, 2008, 07:08 PM
Anyone have an idea when this is going to be released? Look's like a great update since they will soon have games running on it (as in not hacked on:p)!