can arnold move the government slugs?

[jefhatfield]

arnold is now governor elect of california and he wants to make this state efficient again

he wants to cut waste and by 2006, pay off the huge defecit

this all sounds great in a speech, but he will have to encounter a new orgazational culture which is not used to being efficient and accountable for its actions...i believe he will find that he has limited powers to change the basic and long time structure of california government and he will find himself struggling in a sea of red tape

by 2006, people will call arnold on his promises and say, " hey, what about this you promised us?" and he will see that governor davis was more a victim of circumstance in an overbloated, slow system which happens to be right in the thick of a sluggish national economy

so who thinks arnold will get the slugs moving in the right direction?:p

[mcrain]

Who's to say that the people who are already there aren't good people trying to make the system work, but are bogged down, and Arnold isn't the slug?

[Desertrat]

Given the Gummint-gimme-a-free-lunch attitude of all too many of the people of California over the last 30 years, and the "We're happy to tax'n'spend!" attitude of the Lege, I'm not at all surprised by California's financial woes.

Folks out there asked for it, and they've darned well gotten it.

TANSTAAFL.

'Rat

[bousozoku]

If past actors as governors of California would be inspirational, I would say that a lot more will get done. California was in a pretty big mess before Reagan became governor, and it was a lot better off afterwards.

I believe that anyone who opposes progress will find their words being repeated by Schwarzengger for the news, so truth may actually make it into Sacto. and the slugs may find that the truth is their salt.

[mactastic]

Originally posted by Desertrat
Given the Gummint-gimme-a-free-lunch attitude of all too many of the people of California over the last 30 years, and the "We're happy to tax'n'spend!" attitude of the Lege, I'm not at all surprised by California's financial woes.

Folks out there asked for it, and they've darned well gotten it.

TANSTAAFL.

'Rat

Those "tax'n'spend" people were the ones who passed Prop 13. Or had you forgotten that? Or just chosen to ignore that inconvient fact to make your mean-spirited comments? Those "tax'n'spend" people are the same ones who voted by ballot initiative (not easily undone by the legislature or the courts) to both increase spending AND cut taxes. Polititians here are stuck with a bipolar mandate from the people. That is the major obstacle facing Californians, that our hard-fought progressive victories have been corrupted and turned against us to the benefit of special interests. Arnold can't change that, Davis couldn't, Wilson couldn't either.

And if the fault lies with all us Krazy Liberals, how come almost every other state "gummint" around the country is in the same fiscal boat as Ca. and ... gasp... the whole US? The same arguments used against Davis will be brought to bear against Bush soon. I sense some very hypocritical statements coming from conservatives soon defending Bush for the very same things they attacked Davis on.

[IJ Reilly]

Thank you, mactastic, you just saved me a bunch of typing. 'Rat, please don't waste your sincerity on such corny, superficial critiques of a state you don't even live in.

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by mcrain
Who's to say that the people who are already there aren't good people trying to make the system work, but are bogged down, and Arnold isn't the slug?

before i worked for the feds, i was a liberal democrat

after that, i started seeing some of the sides newt was getting at and i left a conservative democrat

i met too many civil servants with this "free lunch" attitude and they were the majority...mediocrity was awarded and excellence was punished...thank god the government does not make a computer or a car...he he:p

[zimv20]

maybe CA wouldn't have quite the financial troubles if the energy companies (enron et. al.) hadn't fleeced it out of $9 billion.

maybe if the FERC and the WH got on the case of those companies to repay that money, CA wouldn't have to cut all the programs it's going to have to.

and maybe this is just one more example of "so goes CA, goes the US".

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by zimv20
maybe CA wouldn't have quite the financial troubles if the energy companies (enron et. al.) hadn't fleeced it out of $9 billion.

maybe if the FERC and the WH got on the case of those companies to repay that money, CA wouldn't have to cut all the programs it's going to have to.

and maybe this is just one more example of "so goes CA, goes the US".

in my more idealistic days, i didn't think the dems would be involved in BIG BIZ corruption and kickbacks...many in california think that davis was getting a kickback or favor and he was involved in some energy scandal...people think or thought that davis was in the pocket of BIG energy...i hope this is not true and it could be a smear campaign of the gop to perpetuate this belief

[zimv20]

Originally posted by jefhatfield
many in california think that davis was getting a kickback or favor and he was involved in some energy scandal

wasn't it he and bustamante who brought the suit against enron to recover all that money?

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by zimv20
wasn't it he and bustamante who brought the suit against enron to recover all that money?

i wouldn't be surprised if they find gop fingers in that BIG energy cookie jar;)

[zimv20]

Originally posted by jefhatfield
i wouldn't be surprised if they find gop fingers in that BIG energy cookie jar;)

you saw this thread, (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40758) yes?

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by zimv20
you saw this thread, (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40758) yes?

oh no, the terminator is powered by enron and worldcomm

the gop always thought gore was powered by intel...because he was so pro silicon valley out here and while he didn't invent the internet, he championed legislation to give high tech a wide range of options

and without a smooth business path, the internet would still be arpanet

they love gore here in northern california

[Desertrat]

Awww, I'm so sorry...

I note that quite a few states have managed to balance their budgets without starting furors among the populace. Could it be that they didn't have a long history of screwing up?

Voters elect legislators and such as governors. Those folks make decisions. You mean to tell me that those lil ol' Texans from Houston out-city-slickered those oh-so-naive little Californians? The real question is, how did the opportunity arise? If those oh-so-wise Californians hadn't messed up their own energy system out there, Enwrong couldn't have shafted them.

But, heck. When things go wrong, blame somebody else, not yourselves. It's the modern way.

:D:D:D

'Rat

[zimv20]

according to abc news, the CA governor controls only 15% of the budget anymore. the fate of the remainder has already been mandated by referendum.

seems to me it's the short-sighted public that should take some responsibility. you can't simultaneously dictate spending and then demand the elimination of the car tax. something has to give.

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by Desertrat
If those oh-so-wise Californians hadn't messed up their own energy system out there, Enwrong couldn't have shafted them.

Let's see if I understand this bit of rustic logic correctly: A burglar isn't guilty of theft if I left my door unlocked.

[Desertrat]

Aw, the burglar is guilty, all right; but, you needn't make it easy for him. Basically, you *allowed* him to commit the crime.

Actually, I'd say that the Kali/Enron thing is more like leaving the keys in the ignition of an unlocked car. "Contributory negligence" or some such thing...

Look: The economic situation (electricity, budget, business-in-general) in California is, for many, quite harmful. For some, tragic. Regardless, it didn't happen in a vacuum; there was no outside conspiracy. Looking at the overall situation, there are a lot of willing, contributory victims who refused to realize what they were getting themselves into. Too many people have commented and predicted what has come about, and it's really hard to have much sympathy for those who refuse to listen to warnings.

:), 'Rat

[mactastic]

Does it make any difference to you that the energy deregulation legislation actually was written under a conservative administration? Before you go blaming "tax'n'spend" liberals for everything, stop and get all your facts. There is plenty of blame to go around, trying to make it an us-vs-them issue won't solve it.

[mactastic]

Originally posted by IJ Reilly
Let's see if I understand this bit of rustic logic correctly: A burglar isn't guilty of theft if I left my door unlocked.

Or another way of putting it... "She was dressed provocatively. She was asking for it."

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by mactastic
Does it make any difference to you that the energy deregulation legislation actually was written under a conservative administration? Before you go blaming "tax'n'spend" liberals for everything, stop and get all your facts. There is plenty of blame to go around, trying to make it an us-vs-them issue won't solve it.

I don't think this matters much for the point 'Rat was trying to make ("Californians are stupid," isn't an overly dramatic paraphrase), but it certainly does implicate Republicans as being charter members of the so-called "free lunch" crowd.

[zimv20]

Originally posted by IJ Reilly
Let's see if I understand this bit of rustic logic correctly: A burglar isn't guilty of theft if I left my door unlocked.

further, he's friends w/ the chief of police, who wants to let him go. the arresting officer isn't so sure, so he's fired and replaced by the chief's friend.

though the burglar made off w/ all your electronic equipment, he returns a Dave Matthews CD case, without the CD.

but on the bright side, you are allowed to repurchase the CD w/o having to pay sales tax on it.