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View Full Version : Think the 160GB 1.8" iPod Drive can be crammed in an Air?




AirmanPika
Jan 15, 2008, 01:32 PM
I know its really too early to know for sure but I wonder if the 160GB Drive from the iPod Classic 160 could possibly be crammed into the MacBook Air. I hope that apple didn't slim down too much and just left the 160GB out due to supply reasons. I'd be tempted to swap the drive with my 160GB iPod drive if I could make it fit and if the interface was the same on both. 80GB is just too little space.



marclapierre13
Jan 15, 2008, 01:51 PM
I know its really too early to know for sure but I wonder if the 160GB Drive from the iPod Classic 160 could possibly be crammed into the MacBook Air. I hope that apple didn't slim down too much and just left the 160GB out due to supply reasons. I'd be tempted to swap the drive with my 160GB iPod drive if I could make it fit and if the interface was the same on both. 80GB is just too little space.

Thats a great idea. Although I am not a fan of the MBA, and wont buy one, this would be an awesome option for anyone considering the MBA.
Although, after the price of a iPod and MBA, you are in the same price range as the MBP

biturbomunkie
Jan 15, 2008, 01:54 PM
i doubt it. otherwise apple would have done it.

also, are you willing to void your $1800 laptop's warranty?

heatmiser
Jan 15, 2008, 01:55 PM
If the MBA uses a 1.8", I don't see why not. You'd have to wait for guides to show up first though, unless you were particularly experienced and particularly adventurous.

AirmanPika
Jan 15, 2008, 02:07 PM
Thats a great idea. Although I am not a fan of the MBA, and wont buy one, this would be an awesome option for anyone considering the MBA.
Although, after the price of a iPod and MBA, you are in the same price range as the MBP

Very true, but since I already have the iPod and its only got 56GB on it I might as well do a swap as the benifits are worth it in my case.

As for the warranty...I upgraded the harddrive in my Macbook Pro to 250GB and its at service now getting the LCD and Battery replaced. I guess it depends on what you do to the machine and who the tech is that looks at it but as long as you don't break anything just opening the unit doesn't necessarily void the warranty.

Opening it probably won't be an issue. I'm good at that kind of stuff. While it is a 1.8" Drive though, the 160GB drive is thicker so we'll see. Apple may have designed the thing for only the 80GB Thickness.

djellison
Jan 15, 2008, 02:24 PM
The 80gb and 160 gb iPod Classics are not the same thickness, which I think is down to the drive- there's only 3 mm in it - but the MBA seems like it's on the bleeding edge of packaging, and thus that 3mm might be 3mm too far.

Doug

kenyatta
Jan 15, 2008, 02:34 PM
If the MBA uses a 1.8", I don't see why not. You'd have to wait for guides to show up first though, unless you were particularly experienced and particularly adventurous.

Same thing here. Waiting to see the take-aparts show up before deciding to buy one.

Also, I'm not exactly sure how much faster this drive would be but Samsung has a 5400rpm 1.8" drive (http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=60&subtype=68&model_cd=266&tab=fea). Might make for a nice replacement.

polevault139
Jan 15, 2008, 02:53 PM
How much would the 5400 rpm hard drive deplete battery life. Depending on how much you need to access it I could see 30-60 minutes of battery time gone.

CWallace
Jan 15, 2008, 02:54 PM
How thick is the 160GB unit?

If the 80GB unit uses one 80GB platter and the 160GB unit uses two, it might be too tall to fit. Remember the MacBook could not use just any 2.5" SATA HDD - it had to be under a certain height limit.

spaceballl
Jan 15, 2008, 03:06 PM
They are both 1.8" drives, but they have different thicknesses, hence the reason the 160gb iPod is a bit thicker. Man i wish they would have offered that as an option, though. I'd buy the MBA if i could get more disk space!

as far as cramming it in there, doubtful, if not impossible... bummmmmmer

dehgenog
Jan 15, 2008, 03:29 PM
How much would the 5400 rpm hard drive deplete battery life. Depending on how much you need to access it I could see 30-60 minutes of battery time gone.

Everything I've read about this question lends itself to the idea that going from 4200rpm to 5400rpm improves battery life. The decrease in read times actually overcomes the extra energy needed to spin the drive.

dehgenog
Jan 15, 2008, 03:30 PM
They are both 1.8" drives, but they have different thicknesses, hence the reason the 160gb iPod is a bit thicker. Man i wish they would have offered that as an option, though. I'd buy the MBA if i could get more disk space!

as far as cramming it in there, doubtful, if not impossible... bummmmmmer

Pretty sure the thickness is added battery capacity, not a thicker disk drive.

spaceballl
Jan 15, 2008, 03:34 PM
Pretty sure the thickness is added battery capacity, not a thicker disk drive.
reeeally? can we get this confirmed - if you're right, i'd buy a MBA and stick a 160 in there

AirmanPika
Jan 15, 2008, 11:50 PM
Well I've been doing some more research on this. First important thing to find out will be exactly what interface the Air hard drive is...PATA ZIF or CE-ATA. Based on the presentation pics I believe its PATA ZIF

The second part is determining exactly which hard drive the 160GB iPod uses. Seems the toshiba 160GB Drive I initially figured it was uses a CE-ATA Interface which is not likely what apple uses on the iPod. The guts on both iPod classics are likely the same except the hard drive and the 80GB one uses a ZIF PATA Interface if I recall correctly. Samsung does happen to make a 160GB PATA 1.8" Drive but I can't find any specs on it as the only model info I got for it is that its a Spinpoint N2 160GB.

Also of note is that the 80GB drive in the Air is definitely NOT the one in the iPod classic. That drive is only 3600RPM not 4200RPM like in the Air. Of course Toshiba and Samsung both make 80GB 4200 RPM Drives that range from 5-8MM height with PATA and CE-ATA Interfaces so its hard to pinpoint a specific model.

I would open up my ipod and look myself but I'm having a hell of a time trying to get it open. I'm not gonna bend or scratch this thing.

AirmanPika
Jan 16, 2008, 04:17 PM
OK found more info. Thanks to an image on AppleInsider I found the MacBook Air hard drive is a Samsung HS082HB Hard Drive with a PATA ZIF Interface and its 5mm thick.

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=60&subtype=68&model_cd=306&tab=fea

http://images.appleinsider.com/apple-macbook-air-33.jpg

From what I have determined all the larger 1.8" hard drives (100-160GB) are 8mm thick so the questions left are...

Is there room in the MacBook Air for an 8mm Drive?

Is the iPod 160GB Drive PATA ZIF and is it 4200 RPM?

If both are a yes then I might have me a new notebook soon.

one1
Jan 16, 2008, 04:23 PM
i doubt it. otherwise apple would have done it.


Yeah? Then what would they have done with REV B's?

Apple can't just shove the biggest thing in there and put it out the door. They have to have room to sell their Rev B books. If 3mm were what made the difference, Apple would have made room inside the case (and they likely did).

Now you really want to get me talking, show me remote disk to an Ipod as a slave drive.

xfiftyfour
Jan 16, 2008, 05:14 PM
Apple can't just shove the biggest thing in there and put it out the door. They have to have room to sell their Rev B books.
That's absurd. Apple isn't going to cripple their current machines just so that they have room to grow. They're going to offer whatever is readily available (taking into account cost and supply factors) and assume (correctly) that technology will have improved by the time they're ready to release an update.

one1
Jan 16, 2008, 06:53 PM
Fine, then tell me why something the size of a toothpick was allowed to make the difference between 80g and 160g.

aethelbert
Jan 16, 2008, 07:14 PM
Pretty sure the thickness is added battery capacity, not a thicker disk drive.
No, the thickness is a dual platter drive. The battery is bigger because the case is bigger and the HDD doesn't take up the whole width.

ShinyToy
Jan 16, 2008, 11:00 PM
How about waiting till you can get a 128 gig flash drive and pop that in there. Should be out in a couple of months.

heatmiser
Jan 16, 2008, 11:10 PM
That's absurd. Apple isn't going to cripple their current machines just so that they have room to grow. They're going to offer whatever is readily available (taking into account cost and supply factors) and assume (correctly) that technology will have improved by the time they're ready to release an update.

No, he's right. Apple's never going to offer the biggest hard drives or most amount of memory as standard. If they did, they wouldn't have stuff to absurdly overcharge people to for the privilege of upgrading.

There are 320gb drives on the market now, but you're never going to see them as "standard" on the MBP (nevermind the MB) until stores are regularly selling 640gb+ drives. In fact, the standard drive size on an MBP is 120gb, and it's even less (80gb) on the Macbook.

Apple isn't any different from any other manufacturer; they all put small drives and small sticks in their computers, and ask you to pay for the upgrade.

AirmanPika
Jan 18, 2008, 07:59 PM
Sigh so much for that idea. My poor 160GB is now scratched and slightly battered for the sake of curiosity.

Samsung Spinpoint HS161JQ 4200RPM, 2MB Cache, CE-ATA Interface (needed to be PATA ZIF to fit the macbook air)

http://www.reimuchan.com/160gbipodhd.jpg

clarkcamp
Apr 4, 2008, 12:08 AM
Well, my hard drive died after i crashed on my bike last week. i tried upgrading to a 100 gb drive that is 8mm tall, and yes, the 3 mm difference makes a huge difference. The bottom casing of the Macbook Air wouldnt close with it in. Also, no one has the 5mm drives in stock so my MBA is currently driveless. It sucks.

zainjetha
Apr 4, 2008, 01:04 AM
Get it back in your iPod Classic 160GB and make sure it works, dammit!

What are the other options of a harddisk that would fit MBA, if they increase HDD space i will be onto them like flies, two of them straight up: one for my dad and myself..

pilotError
Apr 4, 2008, 07:47 AM
HS082HB is the biggest drive at 5mm according to the Samsung Site. The 100+ drives are all 8mm. This drive has an 8MB buffer though. Most of the others are 2MB.

Guess we'll have to wait until the shrink the disks or make cheaper flash drives.

The search is on for 5mm drives!

jflamm
Apr 4, 2008, 08:08 AM
If Apple had made the Air 3mm thicker it could have accommodated not only the 160 but the new 5400RPM 120G drives that are coming shortly and will be an option in the ThinkPad X300.

What again is the advantage of being the thinnest?

vendettabass
Apr 4, 2008, 08:21 AM
Doesnt the iPod 160GB have 2x the 1.8 drives used in the MBA?

hotdamn
Apr 4, 2008, 09:16 AM
What again is the advantage of being the thinnest?

is that a rhetorical question?
because if not, then yes, the advantage of being the thinnest is being the thinnest.
also, you can use the front ledge to shave. yay!

krye
Apr 4, 2008, 12:36 PM
It won't fit. The single platter 80G drive in the Air is 5 mm thick. The double platter 160 is 8 mm thick. It won't fit. You have to wait for the single platter 120 G drives to ship later this year. Sorry.

Source:
http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/33706/135/

sparkstack
Apr 4, 2008, 12:58 PM
are you willing to void your $1800 laptop's warranty?
Last i checked removing the bottom of the case doesn't void the warranty, and unless the OP has claws for hands i highly doubt he will break anything in the process of unplugging the original HD and plugging in the ipod HD. IIRC the iPod HD is thicker than the MBA drive though, but i don't know if the thickness quoted for the MBA drive includes the rubber case that surrounds it.

If i had a 120Gb iPod drive i would probably try it..

shrtmkr
Apr 4, 2008, 01:01 PM
My 2 cents is on, apple engineers designed this machine especially for SSD drives. So we will only see the 80GB HDD for rev a.

clarkcamp
Apr 5, 2008, 05:51 AM
HS082HB is the biggest drive at 5mm according to the Samsung Site. The 100+ drives are all 8mm. This drive has an 8MB buffer though. Most of the others are 2MB.

Guess we'll have to wait until the shrink the disks or make cheaper flash drives.

The search is on for 5mm drives!

I've looked everywhere and no one has the 5mm drives in stock. Oh well, ill just have to wait until I can get one until my MBA is back. If anybody finds one instock, let me know please.

Jackhamma
Sep 1, 2008, 12:16 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/18/mtron-announces-a-1-8-inch-128gb-ssd/

not really sure if I want to spend almost as much money on an SDD than I did for my MBA... thinkin' about it... X.X

Abstract
Sep 1, 2008, 01:10 AM
My 2 cents is on, apple engineers designed this machine especially for SSD drives. So we will only see the 80GB HDD for rev a.

Bingo.

The use of HDD drives was probably always meant to be a temporary situation for this particular machine. The MBA was really meant to be used with an SSD drive. Maybe this is why it's capable of using a HDD drive at all. Maybe Apple was thinking of making it even thinner, but purposely made the casing large enough to fit an HDD drive, as it's still a necessary evil today. However, once SSDs become cheaper and more commonplace, the machine design could be updated to make it even thinner.

There could be a few more millimetres for Apple to trim off in the future. ;)

Insulin Junkie
Sep 1, 2008, 06:07 AM
If they do bump up the specs of the MBA and decide to feature a 160GB HD it'd bring me a lot closer to considering one to be my next computer. It's primarily the HD size that's been the deal breaker for me so far.

Then again by the time I've gotten good wear out of this computer they're probably going to have 160GB SSD's by then, which is even better.

itou
Sep 27, 2009, 09:51 AM
Sigh so much for that idea. My poor 160GB is now scratched and slightly battered for the sake of curiosity.

Samsung Spinpoint HS161JQ 4200RPM, 2MB Cache, CE-ATA Interface (needed to be PATA ZIF to fit the macbook air)

http://www.reimuchan.com/160gbipodhd.jpg

so it doesn't work?? i'm confused.

wywern209
Sep 27, 2009, 06:50 PM
wow.. thread resurrection. no it doesn't work.

reallynotnick
Sep 27, 2009, 06:55 PM
wow.. thread resurrection. no it doesn't work.

But would the new ones work now that they are the 'thin' models? I assume the HDD is slimmer.

crx7
Aug 21, 2010, 12:16 PM
Swapped my 80gb for a MK1634C:

XBench results:
Results 58.99
System Info
Xbench Version 1.3
System Version 10.6.4 (10F569)
Physical RAM 2048 MB
Model MacBookAir1,1
Drive Type TOSHIBA MK1634GAL TOSHIBA MK1634GAL
CPU Test 121.54
GCD Loop 201.49 10.62 Mops/sec
Floating Point Basic 101.21 2.40 Gflop/sec
vecLib FFT 82.92 2.74 Gflop/sec
Floating Point Library 166.47 28.99 Mops/sec
Thread Test 122.03
Computation 121.44 2.46 Mops/sec, 4 threads
Lock Contention 122.63 5.28 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test 130.88
System 118.75
Allocate 148.35 544.81 Kalloc/sec
Fill 101.85 4952.06 MB/sec
Copy 114.90 2373.28 MB/sec
Stream 145.76
Copy 136.73 2824.09 MB/sec
Scale 138.75 2866.61 MB/sec
Add 158.62 3379.04 MB/sec
Triad 151.12 3232.76 MB/sec
User Interface Test 122.05
Elements 122.05 560.16 refresh/sec
Disk Test 19.04
Sequential 74.08
Uncached Write 74.85 45.96 MB/sec [4K blocks]
Uncached Write 73.46 41.57 MB/sec [256K blocks]
Uncached Read 71.20 20.84 MB/sec [4K blocks]
Uncached Read 77.05 38.73 MB/sec [256K blocks]
Random 10.93
Uncached Write 3.23 0.34 MB/sec [4K blocks]
Uncached Write 44.10 14.12 MB/sec [256K blocks]
Uncached Read 48.41 0.34 MB/sec [4K blocks]
Uncached Read 76.97 14.28 MB/sec [256K blocks]

halledise
Aug 21, 2010, 03:08 PM
I know its really too early to know for sure but I wonder if the 160GB Drive from the iPod Classic 160 could possibly be crammed into the MacBook Air. I hope that apple didn't slim down too much and just left the 160GB out due to supply reasons. I'd be tempted to swap the drive with my 160GB iPod drive if I could make it fit and if the interface was the same on both. 80GB is just too little space.

why bother?

old technology.

if you're stuck for space go for a 128gb SSD - I believe a 'Runcore' is the brand of choice.

crx7
Aug 21, 2010, 04:54 PM
Because the RunCore is $400+

ouimetnick
Aug 21, 2010, 10:17 PM
That's absurd. Apple isn't going to cripple their current machines just so that they have room to grow. They're going to offer whatever is readily available (taking into account cost and supply factors) and assume (correctly) that technology will have improved by the time they're ready to release an update.

I know this thread is old. Someone brought it back to life. I just want to say something about the above post. BS. Applr could have stick a USB port, more RAM, and an iSight camera into iPad. They could have put a speaker in the iPod touch when it first launched. They could have put MMS and video recording in the iPhone back in 2007. They could have put a Core i3, i5, or i7 in the 13" MBP. They chose not too, so they could add it later.