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MacRumors
Jan 16, 2008, 05:56 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)


http://images.macrumors.com/article/2008/01/16/183740-DSC_0015_300.jpg

Amidst all the Apple announcements, we neglected to mention that Microsoft officially launched Mac Office 2008 yesterday. Alongside the release, they've relaunched the Mactopia website (http://www.microsoft.com/mac/). Microsoft Office was made available for preorder last week, and is now shipping.

Macworld provides (http://www.macworld.com/article/131559/2008/01/word2008.html?t=201) a look at Macworld Expo:
Surprisingly, Word gets several major enhancements in Office 2008, the first version of Microsoft’s productivity suite to run natively on both PowerPC- and Intel-based Macs. Those changes include a new document format, a simplified toolbar, and a new toolbox that combines palettes for managing formatting, clip art, iPhoto images, research, and bibliographies. But the biggest improvement is the addition of a new view option called Publishing Layout.



Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/01/16/microsoft-launches-mac-office-2008/)



zwida
Jan 16, 2008, 05:58 PM
Just in time for me to buy sometime in 2009, I think.

And hopefully the last Office I ever buy. Perhaps they'll be a different way of looking at these issues in 4 years (or so...).

thebassoonist
Jan 16, 2008, 06:00 PM
i'm pretty excited to check it out, especially since i will get it for free.

elcid
Jan 16, 2008, 06:00 PM
Steve thanked them, you should too.

They have done so much short of giving them away. If you are paying full price for this software you aren't paying attention.

Kedrik
Jan 16, 2008, 06:01 PM
After the mac/pc add at the keynote, one of the next announcements was office 2008 and Steve thanking MS. I thought it was a funny start. The backhanded jab that it was the FINAL app. to go native was funny as well.

thegoldenmackid
Jan 16, 2008, 06:03 PM
personally, after having it, I really prefer the older version, if only it was intel native.

Roderick Usher
Jan 16, 2008, 06:05 PM
The backhanded jab that it was the FINAL app. to go native was funny as well.
Would be funnier if it were accurate - Quicken is a major app, and it still isn't native, though a replacement (http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/01/16/sneak_preview_quicken_for_mac_overhaul_due_out_this_fall.html) is in the works.

Anyway, ~David posted a bunch of good Office 2008 screenshots here:

http://www.jcxp.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25292

MacsRgr8
Jan 16, 2008, 06:06 PM
Nice to know:

Office v X was one of the first major apps to have made the transition from OS 9 to native OS X.

Office v 2008 was one of the last major apps to have made the transition from PPC to UB.

greenbreadmmm
Jan 16, 2008, 06:08 PM
is there going to be any 30 day trial of this?

sethro
Jan 16, 2008, 06:09 PM
I've been using both Microsoft Office 2008 and Microsoft Office X, but I find Microsoft Office X a lot faster. Office X has much faster load times on my Macbook and uses less resources than Office 2008.

I don't mean to take a jab at Office 2008, it has a new UI and much more features than any other Office release for the Mac platform, but I was expecting more from a Intel native release. Anyone else feel the same?

MacsRgr8
Jan 16, 2008, 06:14 PM
I've been using both Microsoft Office 2008 and Microsoft Office X, but I find Microsoft Office X a lot faster. Office X has much faster load times on my Macbook and uses less resources than Office 2008.

I don't mean to take a jab at Office 2008, it has a new UI and much more features than any other Office release for the Mac platform, but I was expecting more from a Intel native release. Anyone else feel the same?

Note: the loading time of an app is not the most important speed issue of an app.
An app like PowerPoint MUST now operate at excellent speed using large media files on an Intel Mac, and the load time of it is not too important.

Get a Mac SE30 with System 6.0.1 on it. That boots a hell of a lot quicker than a Mac Pro 3.2 GHz.

Darkroom
Jan 16, 2008, 06:14 PM
i installed it already, and it seems much stronger than 2004, but start up of Word seems a bit sluggish... not very snappy... takes 8 bounces after start up, then about another 10 seconds of a static splash screen... it might be something with my computer, because it's really not acceptable for Word to take longer to start up that Photoshop or Illustrator.

FoxyKaye
Jan 16, 2008, 06:16 PM
Amidst all the Apple announcements, we neglected to mention that Microsoft officially launched Mac Office 2008 yesterday.
I'm. So. Excited. :rolleyes:

Gods I hope this is the last time I have to buy Office for our organization. Maybe in a few more years the M$ hegemony in this area will finally be broken. M$ is truly the Ma Bell of desktop computing.

BWhaler
Jan 16, 2008, 06:17 PM
I bought it yesterday and installed it.

I haven't had much time to use it, but initial impressions are:

1. It's faster, but not crazy fast
2. New interface is weird. Sometimes better, sometimes a train wreck.
3. No scripts is a disastrous decision. This was my last "lock-in" to the MSOffice world, and now that it is gone, it will speed my move to iWork.

I hope this is the last version of Office I need to buy. Yes, MSOffice was 140 bucks which isn't too bad, but there really isn't much there that is new that excites me that I can't do in iWork. And there is a ton in iWork which I can do which is exponentially better.

The obvious exception to this is Excel which can do some key things Numbers cannot. (Pivot tables, speed, less bugs and quirks, etc.) While I will use Excel until I see what is new in the next version of Numbers, I actually prefer Numbers since it is more intuitive and I love the templates.

With all of that said, MSOffice is key for the Apple ecosystem, so I welcome it.

kcmac
Jan 16, 2008, 06:20 PM
I've been using both Microsoft Office 2008 and Microsoft Office X, but I find Microsoft Office X a lot faster. Office X has much faster load times on my Macbook and uses less resources than Office 2008.

I don't mean to take a jab at Office 2008, it has a new UI and much more features than any other Office release for the Mac platform, but I was expecting more from a Intel native release. Anyone else feel the same?
I see absolutely no reason to get it. I have 2004. It looks like it could eat up 1/2 of my 12" PB screen with menus alone. And the thing is, I still have a G4 and bare feats pretty much showed that the old version is faster than the new version.

psychofreak
Jan 16, 2008, 06:22 PM
After using this for a day, I will still use Pages as my primary word processor, and Numbers as my primary spreadsheet app (I don't make presentations), but Word and Excel are good to have for compatibility reasons, and they're not too shabby. At last NeoOffice has competition in the heavyweight suite arena.

Digital Skunk
Jan 16, 2008, 06:23 PM
I am very glad that MS's development team got the right idea with Word and the rest of the Office suite. SIMPLICITY, which was a major flaw in the previous program. They made it look a lot like Pages which was a much better app to use if you didn't do too much professional/business/niche feature work.

I may still be using iWork and Pages months from now because of the high price of Office, the plethora of niche features that I won't be using, and iWorks ability to handle graphics and media which still makes Keynote the king of presentations.

My girlfriend is a teacher, so I am sure that she will be using it like crazy.

Punkwaffle
Jan 16, 2008, 06:25 PM
I should have Office 2008 sometime this week and am excited about using it. Especially the new Entourage, looks like it spanks mail and iCal all over the place.

My question is will there be a My Day app for the iPhone come February? It seems like an obvious path for this mini-app. And if there isn't, how hard would it be for a developer to make this?

TheMacPotato
Jan 16, 2008, 06:26 PM
Its a very good deal. Just £89 on the Amazon UK site for the full version which isn't limited to just students now. I'm tempted.

superleccy
Jan 16, 2008, 06:29 PM
I hope these new file formats don't take off. If they do, then I'll have to upgrade.

I'm perfectly happy with Office 2004. Runs fast enough for me on my MBP under Rosetta. I only really use Word and Excel, but I use them quite intensively. I use Entourage just as an archive for my pre-Mac emails, and PowerPoint only when I absolutely have to.

I've got better things to spend my money on - even if it is cheaper this time round.

SL

Dillenger
Jan 16, 2008, 06:29 PM
I too would like to demo this before I buy, if anyone has a link please post it.

yzp
Jan 16, 2008, 06:30 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)


http://images.macrumors.com/article/2008/01/16/183740-DSC_0015_300.jpg

Amidst all the Apple announcements, we neglected to mention that Microsoft officially launched Mac Office 2008 yesterday.

did macrumors REALLY neglect to tell us about MS' release? ;)

Bradley W
Jan 16, 2008, 06:32 PM
_

DeSnousa
Jan 16, 2008, 06:38 PM
So is it worth the upgrade from Office 2004 for a student?

Virgil-TB2
Jan 16, 2008, 06:44 PM
... Microsoft Office was made available for preorder last week, and is now shipping ...Meh.

Seriously underwhelming product from my point of view.

We've already decided where I work that every demo we're asked to give for Office is going to include at least 15 minutes talking about iWork.

Our IT department has talking this over a lot and the majority consensus is that since the users are going to need to learn and entirely new interface and use entirely new file formats, there just isn't any percentage in sticking with Office exclusively. We won't stop people from using it, but we are going to be steering anyone we can away from it.

We have a lot of secretarial staff in their mid forties and they don't like change. If we are going to go through the pain of endless tutorials and help sessions, we might as well go with the better, easier to use product.

iWork baby! :D

megatronbomb
Jan 16, 2008, 06:46 PM
The startup time of Word seems slower than the old version... but it works, so I guess that's a good thing. Honestly I haven't noticed any major improvements yet, but I just installed it last night and I haven't had to write anything up yet.

Virgil-TB2
Jan 16, 2008, 06:47 PM
Steve thanked them, you should too.

They have done so much short of giving them away. If you are paying full price for this software you aren't paying attention.They are still sticking it to people with the 400 dollar edition though. Why have multiple editions at all? They throw in exchange support and a crappy image viewer and all of a sudden it jumps from 150 bucks to 400?

The recent price sales are out of desperation IMO.
MS is not doing anyone any favors here.

Yankees 4 Life
Jan 16, 2008, 06:50 PM
i hope its good.

jasonklee
Jan 16, 2008, 06:51 PM
i installed it already, and it seems much stronger than 2004, but start up of Word seems a bit sluggish... not very snappy... takes 8 bounces after start up, then about another 10 seconds of a static splash screen... it might be something with my computer, because it's really not acceptable for Word to take longer to start up that Photoshop or Illustrator.

i thought i was the only one with this problem. word 2004 was much faster, ironically.

Amigori
Jan 16, 2008, 06:53 PM
I bought it yesterday and installed it.

I haven't had much time to use it, but initial impressions are:

1. It's faster, but not crazy fast
2. New interface is weird. Sometimes better, sometimes a train wreck.
3. No scripts is a disastrous decision. This was my last "lock-in" to the MSOffice world, and now that it is gone, it will speed my move to iWork.



I agree with your post and my copy of 2008 is ordered. Yes, Microsoft dropped VBA from Office, but they it replaced with Applescript. Here's the developer link to read about the new macro system. Also, Regular and Special Eds. support Automator actions and workflows.

Office 2008 Developers (http://www.microsoft.com/mac/developers/default.mspx)

psychofreak
Jan 16, 2008, 06:54 PM
The apps are pretty fast, but they take ages to start up. Hopefully updates will bring the speed of Pages

FiveMonkies
Jan 16, 2008, 06:56 PM
I can't understand why I had exchange under my student version and now all of a sudden I have to pay for the more expensive version to continue using exchange. BS to me.

Virgil-TB2
Jan 16, 2008, 06:56 PM
I should have Office 2008 sometime this week and am excited about using it. Especially the new Entourage, looks like it spanks mail and iCal all over the place.

My question is will there be a My Day app for the iPhone come February? It seems like an obvious path for this mini-app. And if there isn't, how hard would it be for a developer to make this?When the developers were asking for early feedback, I said almost this exact thing. That the "MyDay" feature looked so much like the "Today" screen on WinMobile that it was "obvious they were trying to lure people into using Windows Mobile software." (can you tell i didn't like it? :) ).

Her reply was that the similarity/resemblance had not occurred to her. :eek:

Personally, I can't see the use of the thing unless that is what it's for.

Virgil-TB2
Jan 16, 2008, 07:01 PM
The apps are pretty fast, but they take ages to start up. Hopefully updates will bring the speed of PagesYeah. Even on a mid-range iMac, Pages starts up so fast I sometimes think I must have left it running.

On the other hand, Pages can be deadly slow with larger documents. A book-length document on a less than super-duper machine can be a bit on the excruciating side.

Abstract
Jan 16, 2008, 07:14 PM
I really want this app.

For real work, you really do need Excel. Nothing works better. Maybe one day, Numbers will replace Excel for me, and I'll be able to save in a MS format very reliably, but for now, Excel (2004) spanks Numbers, and Entourage is Entourage.

Numbers looks prettier, though, and iCal is already included. Some people don't like change.

iMikeT
Jan 16, 2008, 07:17 PM
Meh. I'll stick with iWork.

Macula
Jan 16, 2008, 07:19 PM
Can someone elaborate on the bibliographical capabilities?

Thanks.

MattG
Jan 16, 2008, 07:30 PM
Meh...I just hope Entourage is better and faster for all of us Mac users stuck in an Exchange environment. I still can't get Apple Mail to work with it so this is all I've got.

chelsel
Jan 16, 2008, 07:39 PM
I hope these new file formats don't take off. If they do, then I'll have to upgrade.


They've already bitten me and forced me to upgrade.

Dreamer2go
Jan 16, 2008, 07:44 PM
lol
a lot of you guys seems skeptical about this release.
Is it because you guys hate microsoft a lot or something?

Personally, as a windows switcher since last summer, I'm excited to receive an upgrade to Office 2004.
Having using Office 2007 for Windows a few times, I think that 2004 definitely lacked something.
Based on the videos I watched and screenshots I saw (also previews), I am excited for this new release. Just ordered in Amazon. Should arrive in a few days.

dawnrazor
Jan 16, 2008, 07:44 PM
Anyone else think its 'interesting', that the student and teacher edition, that required photo ID to purchase has been replaced by a Home and Student edition, that requires no special ID to purchase. Yet the price differential between the regular edition and this H and S edition is still considerable.


How the heck is going to buy the regular edition?

tcoleman
Jan 16, 2008, 07:54 PM
Steve thanked them, you should too.

They have done so much short of giving them away. If you are paying full price for this software you aren't paying attention.

Yeah, either that or you're not American. :p

twoodcc
Jan 16, 2008, 07:54 PM
so maybe i'll get it sometime

wallaby
Jan 16, 2008, 07:56 PM
Is there any significant reason to upgrade to 2008 over 2004? People have already stated that Word starts faster in 2004 so the development on the intel platform apparently hasn't made any difference. Word in 2004 isn't exactly speedy, either. What are the major differences in Word and Excel 2008?

Roderick Usher
Jan 16, 2008, 08:02 PM
I agree with your post and my copy of 2008 is ordered. Yes, Microsoft dropped VBA from Office, but they it replaced with Applescript. Here's the developer link to read about the new macro system. Also, Regular and Special Eds. support Automator actions and workflows.

Office 2008 Developers (http://www.microsoft.com/mac/developers/default.mspx)
Eric Schwiebert commented (http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=4698898&postcount=179) that the MacBU would continue to examine how to implement macro support. VBA's on its way out - MS doesn't even sell distribution licenses anymore - so a total replacement is the best option, but AppleScript's viability for this doesn't seem clear (especially since, and correct me if I'm wrong, anything implemented in AppleScript is DOA when encountered by Office 2007, unless there's some sort of translator).

Obviously the ideal solution would be something compatible with the .NET languages employed in Office 2007, but I can't imagine the work that would take.

stoutboy1
Jan 16, 2008, 08:07 PM
Those that have already installed student 2008, did you have to uninstall 2004 to install 2008? Or does it work like an upgrade?

flipshot
Jan 16, 2008, 08:10 PM
Its a shame that Office 2008 isn't part of the ultimate steal offer. I'll probably wait and see if its offered in the Home User Program then I can get it for £15 but its usually a couple of months after release before its offered.

rogerm
Jan 16, 2008, 08:10 PM
Its a very good deal. Just £89 on the Amazon UK site for the full version which isn't limited to just students now. I'm tempted.

I really have to applaud Microsoft for introducing a "home" license for their software now. It's $130 here in the States on Amazon and you can install it on up to 3 Macs in your household. This is a great deal, and for the first time, MS Office is really affordable for the home user (that is not a student or teacher) that uses Word and Excel just a few time a month. Although I love OpenOffice, I think I will actually buy MS Office for my 2 Macs.

I really hope that Microsoft is setting a precedence here and that other big companies like Adobe will follow their example. I always wanted Photoshop for the Mac, and if it were available for $130 as a home license you can install on multiple Macs, I would totally buy it.

Stinkypalm
Jan 16, 2008, 08:18 PM
I have had no start up speed issues at all:

Word - 5 sec
Excel - 5 sec
Powerpoint - 8 sec
Entourage - 4 sec

Stinkypalm
Jan 16, 2008, 08:20 PM
I really have to applaud Microsoft for introducing a "home" license for their software now. It's $130 here in the States on Amazon and you can install it on up to 3 Macs in your household. This is a great deal, and for the first time, MS Office is really affordable for the home user (that is not a student or teacher) that uses Word and Excel just a few time a month. Although I love OpenOffice, I think I will actually buy MS Office for my 2 Macs.

I really hope that Microsoft is setting a precedence here and that other big companies like Adobe will follow their example. I always wanted Photoshop for the Mac, and if it were available for $130 as a home license you can install on multiple Macs, I would totally buy it.
Agreed and no silly Online Activation on this.

supersoyary
Jan 16, 2008, 08:20 PM
hahaha. i dont know if anyone noticed it, but in the macbook air video tour, the disc that was used to demonstrate remote disc was ms office mac 2008. a lot of people probably missed that. i sure did.

kaiwai
Jan 16, 2008, 08:28 PM
I love Office 2008, but now I'm in a spat of confusion. I love iWorks, but at the same time, I also now like Office 2008.

I need Office 2008 to a certain degree because of compatibility but at the same time, when it comes to writing documents from scratch I prefer to use Pages. Its a difficult thing to weigh up.

I'm wondering there fore, when iWorks '09 is going to come out, and whether it'll get to the point where by Numbers can be a viable alternative to Excel and Pages improves in 'teh snappier'.

I think in the end once Numbers matures, it'll come down to price, and the value of compatibility to the end user. Lets be honest, iWorks at the current price is a bargin that can't be turned down easily lol

ElCambo
Jan 16, 2008, 08:35 PM
Are they going to upgrade msn messenger too? It came with office 2008 but its just the same version as before.

idunnokyd
Jan 16, 2008, 08:38 PM
Those that have already installed student 2008, did you have to uninstall 2004 to install 2008? Or does it work like an upgrade?

You can run both 2004 AND 2008 at the same time! :D If you have Office 2004 already don't remove unless you need the space.

So if you need VB for macros use 2004. Apple Script is in there for 2008 if you want to expand into apple programming.;)

ElCambo
Jan 16, 2008, 08:40 PM
Once I installed 08 it searches for previous versions and then removed them for me.

11800506
Jan 16, 2008, 08:42 PM
Does anyone know when MS is going to update Office 2004 for compatibility reasons because I have Office 2007 on my pc and the .docx format isn't compatible with Office 2004 yet. Also, what format does Office 2008 use?

davebarnes
Jan 16, 2008, 08:49 PM
So is it worth the upgrade from Office 2004 for a student?

There are only 2 reasons (in my opinion) to upgrade to MS Office 2008.

1. You are force to. People (who control your income) keep sending you files that have the new extensions of: docx, pptx, xlsx.

2. There is one new feature in 2008 that you can not live without. No one seems to have shown any of these.

P.S. I did buy MS Office 2008 at Amazon on pre-order because:
a. My partner uses Entourage and is hoping for some better features.
b. $131 USD is "mouse nuts" for our business.

idunnokyd
Jan 16, 2008, 08:54 PM
Does anyone know when MS is going to update Office 2004 for compatibility reasons because I have Office 2007 on my pc and the .docx format isn't compatible with Office 2004 yet. Also, what format does Office 2008 use?

They released it last month. Dec 18 2007 to be exact. You can find it here:

http://www.microsoft.com/mac/downloads.mspx

The file is called: Microsoft Office Open XML File Format Converter for Mac 0.2.1 (Beta)

You might want to update your office while your at the MS/Mac update site.:)

Rocketman
Jan 16, 2008, 09:20 PM
I want one thing.

I want a MICROSOFT published app or utility that reads and writes all past file formats. ALL.

THAT would be MBU Mac like.

Call it the capitulation to the archivists.

Please call me Rocketman, and contact me MICROSOFT to confirm my request. All others annoy Microsoft.

dukebound85
Jan 16, 2008, 09:22 PM
There are only 2 reasons (in my opinion) to upgrade to MS Office 2008.

1. You are force to. People (who control your income) keep sending you files that have the new extensions of: docx, pptx, xlsx.

2. There is one new feature in 2008 that you can not live without. No one seems to have shown any of these.

P.S. I did buy MS Office 2008 at Amazon on pre-order because:
a. My partner uses Entourage and is hoping for some better features.
b. $131 USD is "mouse nuts" for our business.

im pretty sure the $131 "mouse nuts" is the home and student version. meaning you cant use for commercial use. might want to be careful if you say get an audit....

Chris204
Jan 16, 2008, 09:32 PM
I got it today... installing right now.

DiamondMac
Jan 16, 2008, 09:33 PM
Finally got around to using it today. Very average and the speed time was not what I expected in load-times

Digital Skunk
Jan 16, 2008, 09:37 PM
I really have to applaud Microsoft for introducing a "home" license for their software now. It's $130 here in the States on Amazon and you can install it on up to 3 Macs in your household. This is a great deal, and for the first time, MS Office is really affordable for the home user (that is not a student or teacher) that uses Word and Excel just a few time a month. Although I love OpenOffice, I think I will actually buy MS Office for my 2 Macs.

I really hope that Microsoft is setting a precedence here and that other big companies like Adobe will follow their example. I always wanted Photoshop for the Mac, and if it were available for $130 as a home license you can install on multiple Macs, I would totally buy it.

There's Photoshop Elements and Premier Elements if you want Photoshop. I don't think Adobe would sell the full version of PS CS3 for anywhere near $130.

MacFly123
Jan 16, 2008, 10:04 PM
WHO CARES??? Lol... Seriously, why would I spend $400 when there is iWork, Neo Office, Open Office, and a bunch of others??? Microsoft sucks :p

Airforce
Jan 16, 2008, 10:17 PM
Installed and loving it.... :)

skinbubble
Jan 16, 2008, 10:19 PM
So is it worth the upgrade from Office 2004 for a student?

I have HAD to use the Office 2007 for the PC at school. There are several nice things about it. But you have to get over the MASSIVE overhaul of the whole suite. I hope that the Mac version is better laid out than the PC version. So, in conclusion, Yes. Specifically if you use Excel or PowerPoint. The Word part is the most pain in the butt part of the suite.

diehldun
Jan 16, 2008, 10:34 PM
im pretty sure the $131 "mouse nuts" is the home and student version. meaning you cant use for commercial use. might want to be careful if you say get an audit....


Has (or does) Microsoft ever carried out an audit before regarding this issue? :confused:



Anyways, I'm still trying to justify either staying put with Office v.X, or upgrading to Office 2008 after all these years. And honestly, in my case, besides being able to "use the newest", I can't think of any compelling reason... yet. But in the end, I'll probably get it.

11800506
Jan 16, 2008, 10:49 PM
I have HAD to use the Office 2007 for the PC at school. There are several nice things about it. But you have to get over the MASSIVE overhaul of the whole suite. I hope that the Mac version is better laid out than the PC version. So, in conclusion, Yes. Specifically if you use Excel or PowerPoint. The Word part is the most pain in the butt part of the suite.

Yeah. I have Office 2007 and it is nice, but you just have to get over that it is completely different than Office 2003. Once you get used to it, it is easier to use than the previous version. I just wonder if the Mac version is also easier.

TimTheEnchanter
Jan 16, 2008, 10:49 PM
Bought 2004 on Black Friday, got the $100 rebate the other day, now waiting for my free 2008 Office Media Edition upgrade to show up. Basically bought it for the iView Media Pro (or whatever they're calling it now) software included. So I have 2004 and full 2008 for about $35. :D

chewietobbacca
Jan 16, 2008, 11:41 PM
the bibiliography feature is the greatest thing ever for a student... automatic formatting of sources? win!

dukebound85
Jan 16, 2008, 11:45 PM
Has (or does) Microsoft ever carried out an audit before regarding this issue? :confused:



Anyways, I'm still trying to justify either staying put with Office v.X, or upgrading to Office 2008 after all these years. And honestly, in my case, besides being able to "use the newest", I can't think of any compelling reason... yet. But in the end, I'll probably get it.

i would assume so for buisnesses/schools what not. make sure they have enough licenses per machine etc as well. i dunno id rather be safe than sorry

kuwisdelu
Jan 17, 2008, 12:02 AM
Meh. I could get MS Office '08 for about $30 through my school, but who cares? I'll stick with NeoOffice unless I'm forced to switch for one reason or another. I don't see the point when there's a great open-source alternative.

bdkennedy1
Jan 17, 2008, 12:27 AM
Ummm... I thought Steve said it was available Tuesday during his keynote.

darwinian
Jan 17, 2008, 12:40 AM
I think that the Mac BU at MS is so independent from Microsoft Proper that it deserves a second look. Having said that, if the program's speed isn't optimized, then I'll stick to LaTeX and Keynote, and if I must, OOo.

the bibiliography feature is the greatest thing ever for a student... automatic formatting of sources? win!

BibTeX. :)

skinbubble
Jan 17, 2008, 01:10 AM
Yeah. I have Office 2007 and it is nice, but you just have to get over that it is completely different than Office 2003. Once you get used to it, it is easier to use than the previous version. I just wonder if the Mac version is also easier.

I will find out soon! The Excel part of th suite is quite nice!! There is tons of features that will help anyone you uses Excel! I like what I see, at least at school on PCs.

Frosty1
Jan 17, 2008, 01:13 AM
hey

Ya I just got office 2008 and I definitly like it better then 2004. Its noticably faster and the interface is almost like 2007 for PC, which I fin to be better than 2003 as well. It does take sometime to get used to but its Devi it'll a good upgrade.

Typing this on my toucclh so sry for mistakes.

Detektiv-Pinky
Jan 17, 2008, 01:26 AM
I think that the Mac BU at MS is so independent from Microsoft Proper that it deserves a second look. Having said that, if the program's speed isn't optimized, then I'll stick to LaTeX and Keynote, and if I must, OOo.



BibTeX. :)

Have you ever tried out Lyx? http://www.lyx.org

Thats what I use for any kind of academic writing and I love it. There are even people who do their slides with it :eek:

justagirl2
Jan 17, 2008, 01:33 AM
i've never posted anything before but i just got a macbook for christmas and along with it, office 2004. there used to be that link on the home page about upgrading to 2008 for really cheap if you had recently bought 2004. but now it isn't there!!! did i miss it??? am i too late??

Cloudsurfer
Jan 17, 2008, 01:42 AM
You'd expect Microsoft to go ahead and make Messenger a more up to date instant messenger, ditching the brushed metal theme and making it look more streamlined. But no, they decided to leave it for what it is.

Philsy
Jan 17, 2008, 02:14 AM
Another word processor that pretends to be a DTP programme...

It's a shame Pages doesn't open and save .doc files as a default instead of a propriety format that no one else can open - then there'd be less reason to need Word. Any reason why Apple didn't do this?

HLdan
Jan 17, 2008, 02:32 AM
Note: the loading time of an app is not the most important speed issue of an app.
An app like PowerPoint MUST now operate at excellent speed using large media files on an Intel Mac, and the load time of it is not too important.

Get a Mac SE30 with System 6.0.1 on it. That boots a hell of a lot quicker than a Mac Pro 3.2 GHz.


I have to agree with Sethro, I just got Mac Office 2008 at the Macworld Expo yesterday and while it's pretty nice on features (aside from the lack of VB Macros) the load times of the apps are slow.
It's really disappointing because I have a 2.8Ghz iMac.
Office 2007 on Windows loads near instant on the entire suite. Hopefully with updates the launch times will be better but I hate seeing the Windows version launch near instant and the Mac version launches like the whole suite like it's running in Rosetta.

Philsy
Jan 17, 2008, 02:38 AM
.
Office 2007 on Windows loads near instant on the entire suite. Hopefully with updates the launch times will be better but I hate seeing the Windows version launch near instant and the Mac version launches like the whole suite like it's running in Rosetta.

I've been told that is because windows preloads the office apps by default, unless you set things otherwise.

nomoredinobones
Jan 17, 2008, 02:47 AM
So is it worth the upgrade from Office 2004 for a student?

Definitely one to avoid for students. How am I supposed to write my thesis without EndNote compatibility? They've shafted a ton of academics (at least those of us who aren't culturally acclimatized to LaTex) by dropping Visual Basic support, or whatever it was that the Endnote Cite-While-You-Write feature required for use. Office 2004 is sucky under Rosetta as well, I should have just bought a used PPC Powerbook instead of this shiny, shiny MBP.

Word 2004 is tolerable I guess (my boss is using it) and for presentations Keynote is way better than PPT anyway.

samh004
Jan 17, 2008, 03:13 AM
I've got it and I must say the interface has improved so much, it's so nice, but I still think it takes about the same time to load on my MacBook as the non-universal version did.

TheMacPotato
Jan 17, 2008, 03:30 AM
WHO CARES??? Lol... Seriously, why would I spend $400 when there is iWork, Neo Office, Open Office, and a bunch of others??? Microsoft sucks :p

erm no it costs just $130 for a home user. iWork is not a fully fledged office suite. Sure slag of MS as much as you like, MS word is the industry standard.

MattyP30
Jan 17, 2008, 03:43 AM
i really need the reference manager sofwtare I use to become compatible before I can use word - I've had to keep my old install of word until endnote becomes compatible!

koobcamuk
Jan 17, 2008, 03:53 AM
Are they going to upgrade msn messenger too? It came with office 2008 but its just the same version as before.

They're making windows live messenger soon apparently.

Blue Velvet
Jan 17, 2008, 03:58 AM
But the biggest improvement is the addition of a new view option called Publishing Layout.



Oh, goody. All you pre-press people, stand by for the inevitable onslaught of 'publishing layouts'.

TheHareBear
Jan 17, 2008, 05:29 AM
I contacted the (UK) Ultimate Steal people to find out when Office for Mac 2008 would be added to the Ultimate Steal offer.
The first response was along the lines of not currently, but keep checking back.
I then asked when it was likely to be decided upon and just received this response:
"There are currently no plans to add Office for Mac to the Ultimate Steal online store. We apologize for any inconvenience."

I have just asked if there is anyone I could write to to ask it to be added and said that I was sure they would make a lot more sales that way.

Andy

kaiwai
Jan 17, 2008, 05:37 AM
They're making windows live messenger soon apparently.

I heard the rumours too - version 7, and apparently it will finally include video support, 2p2 file transferring etc.

Tyrannosaurs
Jan 17, 2008, 05:51 AM
erm no it costs just $130 for a home user. iWork is not a fully fledged office suite. Sure slag of MS as much as you like, MS word is the industry standard.

with the new "home and student" edition pricing, the benefits of using what is a close to an industry standard as exists (Office) more than outweigh the very small price difference.

anyone know how many licenses the home and student version covers? 2004 student used to cover 3, is this the same for 2008? if not then the iWork pricing looks good once you have 2 or 3 machines.

dukebound85
Jan 17, 2008, 06:35 AM
wow talk about a massive upgrade in size over v.x

went from 200megs to close to 1 gig for student/home editions of each

also, which the cpu usage is down from v.x the ram usage is ALOT higher

Consultant
Jan 17, 2008, 06:50 AM
Office 2008 is already installed on the demo Macs at the Apple Store I went to yesterday.

xUKHCx
Jan 17, 2008, 06:54 AM
wow talk about a massive upgrade in size over v.x

went from 200megs to close to 1 gig for student/home editions of each

Office 2004 is ~600 MB on mine and 2008 is ~800MB not too bad

zirngast99
Jan 17, 2008, 07:10 AM
Definitely one to avoid for students. How am I supposed to write my thesis without EndNote compatibility? They've shafted a ton of academics (at least those of us who aren't culturally acclimatized to LaTex) by dropping Visual Basic support, or whatever it was that the Endnote Cite-While-You-Write feature required for use. Office 2004 is sucky under Rosetta as well, I should have just bought a used PPC Powerbook instead of this shiny, shiny MBP.

Word 2004 is tolerable I guess (my boss is using it) and for presentations Keynote is way better than PPT anyway.

Just can fully agree - in academia you will be lost with this shiny "Office for Dummies" - MS obviously is going for my granny as a potential costumer. She definitly needs all those "help me, I'm lost"-features and doesn't want to be bothered with VBA code.

If you are doing some form of business studies, you need VBA support (at least this holds true for me) AND the cross-plattform compatability. So Apple Script is no real option. Here in Europe (Austria) we use quite a lot of vba-based plug-ins for excel...

How am I supposed to collaborate wirh my friends on some topic? "Hey guys, you need to buy a Mac?" Guess, this wont work well.

I read the blog of some guy from MS business unit for Mac, explaing why they didn't bother to (just couldn't) reprogram VBA - REALLY :p felt sorry for him and his mates... Life is soooo hard to those people; it was just not possible to give it only a new interface. No, from scratch they would have to do it - soo bad!!

Anyway they came up wih this glorious idea of just giving Office some new nobodyneedsitanyway "features" and a new - how cool is that - file format that uses much less space! Now I can store a minimum of 1.000.000.000 excel files instead of 900.000.000! Thank's MS! Appreciate that very much (and I'm going to get a 1 TB external Harddrive to multiply that by 1.000.000)
(http://www.schwieb.com/blog/2006/08/08/saying-goodbye-to-visual-basic/)

I'm sure that the lack of VBA puts every academic/corporate Mac-user in a very lonely positon....

jfremani
Jan 17, 2008, 09:24 AM
My boss snagged this bad boy and I can confirm that the app launch time is very sluggish. Also, have had difficulties getting the data analysis tool pack installed, for regressions.

scuzy
Jan 17, 2008, 09:39 AM
Anyone know when this wil lbe available on MSDN or Software Assurance on microsofts site? Or will it be on the Home use program ?

Virgil-TB2
Jan 17, 2008, 10:00 AM
I really want this app.
For real work, you really do need Excel. Nothing works better. Maybe one day, Numbers will replace Excel for me ... From the MacWorld review of Excel 2008:


Appearances can be deceiving, however—Excel 2008 is a major rewrite, designed to run natively on Intel-powered Macs as well as PowerPC-based machines. This release of Excel also offers some new features, though it drops at least one major area of functionality. As a result, Excel 2008 may leave you feeling somewhat underwhelmed.

And MacWorld is basically just a marketing engine that drives web ads. I don't think they've even heard of the concept of "critical review," and they usually go out of their way to be especially kind to Microsoft.

I think if even they are "underwhelmed," there is definitely reason for concern.

... and Entourage is Entourage.The very existence of Entourage is one of the main reasons to avoid Office IMO. :p

But seriously, even if you like Entourage, (and lots of people do), what good is a PIM app that can't be easily backed up? I mean that's the stuff you really, really, want to back up, right?

Another word processor that pretends to be a DTP programme...

It's a shame Pages doesn't open and save .doc files as a default instead of a propriety format that no one else can open - then there'd be less reason to need Word. Any reason why Apple didn't do this?It doesn't do it by default, but at least it does it.

I often use Pages as a sort of "Word cleaner."

You can open an old word document, rationalise the styles in just a few moments work in the styles sidebar, and then export as Word. You end up with a significantly cleaner, leaner Word document.

The only problem is you have to save the document in Pages format before you can do the export, and it will take you a while to go through all your Word documents. So in the end, you start to wonder why the heck you are bothering with the last (export) step, and why not work in Pages altogether?

Roy
Jan 17, 2008, 10:44 AM
i've never posted anything before but i just got a macbook for christmas and along with it, office 2004. there used to be that link on the home page about upgrading to 2008 for really cheap if you had recently bought 2004. but now it isn't there!!! did i miss it??? am i too late??


You said it. Too late. The offer ran for several months, but now it's over.

stoutboy1
Jan 17, 2008, 12:24 PM
i've never posted anything before but i just got a macbook for christmas and along with it, office 2004. there used to be that link on the home page about upgrading to 2008 for really cheap if you had recently bought 2004. but now it isn't there!!! did i miss it??? am i too late??

You're not to late at all. You have until Feb 14th 2008 to submit your info for the upgrade. You can still get the form here.

http://www.microsoft.com/mac/go/promotions/supersuitedeal/default.mspx

Expect a long wait. I submitted my form the 15th of November and the status says backorderd and that it'll ship march 3rd. Oh well, I made $80 upgrading. Thanks Microsoft.:D

ddl
Jan 17, 2008, 12:44 PM
I purchased Word 2004 for my wife recently. I registered for the 2008 upgrade but when I checked the status today it says backordered and will ship in March! Come on. This is a joke. The order along with countless others has been in for more than a month and they are not shipping until March!

ascender
Jan 17, 2008, 01:04 PM
First impressions?

Sluggish.

Roy
Jan 17, 2008, 01:10 PM
You're not to late at all. You have until Feb 14th 2008 to submit your info for the upgrade. You can still get the form here.

http://www.microsoft.com/mac/go/promotions/supersuitedeal/default.mspx

Expect a long wait. I submitted my form the 15th of November and the status says backorderd and that it'll ship march 3rd. Oh well, I made $80 upgrading. Thanks Microsoft.:D


Eligibility Requirements
If you acquire a qualifying Microsoft® Office 2004 for Mac product listed below between November 1, 2007 and January 14, 2008 you are eligible to
receive Microsoft® Office 2008 for Mac Special Media Edition for the cost of shipping and handling ($6.99 US/ $10.00 CDN), plus applicable taxes.


Correction: I missed this part: "and along with it, office 2004"

gothamm
Jan 17, 2008, 01:14 PM
what does intel native mean?

psychofreak
Jan 17, 2008, 01:18 PM
what does intel native mean?

When Apple changed their computers to Intel, applications needed to be re-coded to run without a 'translation layer'.

stoutboy1
Jan 17, 2008, 01:18 PM
Eligibility Requirements
If you acquire a qualifying Microsoft® Office 2004 for Mac product listed below between November 1, 2007 and January 14, 2008 you are eligible to
receive Microsoft® Office 2008 for Mac Special Media Edition for the cost of shipping and handling ($6.99 US/ $10.00 CDN), plus applicable taxes.


Correction: I missed this part: "and along with it, office 2004"

Are you just adding more info or are you correcting me? The person stated that they got their computer and software for christmas. That said I assumed they got it before January 14th. If you bought it before january 14th you can submit your info before feb. 14th. But thanks for the clarification.

I see your correction now. You still have good info there anyway.

mountainbiker80
Jan 17, 2008, 01:25 PM
I definitely feel the same. I did not see any acceptable speed increases in the Apps. Also, Excel 08 corrupted its own Normal template, leaving me unable to view, edit, or print Excel sheets. I tried uninstalling '08 and downgrading back to '04, but the uninstaller failed. After 3 hours of installing/uninstalling, I got no where. I then tried to put '04 back on...the Normal template was still corrupted. HOW is this possible!?

I'm a network administrator and I run Windows Server boxes all day long...and it never ceases to amaze me the amount of crap that MS releases. My job wouldn't exist to the same extent if Microsoft wasn't so flawed.

I have now removed all MS software from my Mac. I'm a complete and 100% convert to iWork 08. There are limitations, especially as my company is dependent on Sharepoint, etc. Thankfully I have Remote Desktop access for the things I have to do on Windows. But, I wouldn't trade my iWork in now for Office...now that I'm used to it. It just works, and I'm SO tired of having to "trick" Word etc. into printing something the way it should have been in the first place.

I refuse to reinstall Office.

I've been using both Microsoft Office 2008 and Microsoft Office X, but I find Microsoft Office X a lot faster. Office X has much faster load times on my Macbook and uses less resources than Office 2008.

I don't mean to take a jab at Office 2008, it has a new UI and much more features than any other Office release for the Mac platform, but I was expecting more from a Intel native release. Anyone else feel the same?

errol
Jan 17, 2008, 01:28 PM
As a tax accountant, coming home and trying to use the office 2008 excel on the mac, seems much more cumbersome than it's windows counterpart, which I'm forced to use everyday.

Granted, I'd still love to be able to use a mac at work and would dream of running office 2008 :D

Frosty1
Jan 17, 2008, 01:42 PM
come to think about it all the apps do still tend to take a bit to load, which is weird cuz when I first installed Office 2008 they opened fast. But after restarting there almost as slow as 2004

SheriffParker
Jan 17, 2008, 01:46 PM
First impressions?

Sluggish.

Guess I won't be upgrading anytime soon. :)

gothamm
Jan 17, 2008, 01:49 PM
When Apple changed their computers to Intel, applications needed to be re-coded to run without a 'translation layer'.

cool? so...faster?

superleccy
Jan 17, 2008, 02:36 PM
Definitely one to avoid for students. How am I supposed to write my thesis without EndNote compatibility?
Endnote indicate they are working on a compatible version.
Word 2008 was released in January of 2008. No current versions of EndNote are compatible with Word 2008 due to changes in the way third party addins are supported. Until we develop a version that works directly with Word 2008, you would need to run "Unformat Citations" with Word 2004 (or Word X) and save the documents as RTF files (rather than .doc or docx files) and use the "Scan Paper" feature to work with Word 2008. if you no longer have Word 2004, contact our technical support team to assist in unformatting your citations. When we develop a version of Endnote that has CWYW compatibility with Word 2008, this page will be updated.
http://www.endnote.com/support/en_wpchart_mac.asp

SL

dr_lha
Jan 17, 2008, 02:43 PM
First impressions?

Sluggish.
Slower than Office 2004 under Rosetta?

jasonklee
Jan 17, 2008, 02:44 PM
for me, typing and the insertion point are sluggish.

mountainbiker80
Jan 17, 2008, 02:57 PM
It was about 6's for me as far as speed on my 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo iMac 24" 2GB RAM and comparable MacBook...definitely no noticeable speed increase. I liked the new GUI in Word and Excel, but Entourage is just a freaking mess compared to the Apple Apps.

I wish to all heaven I hadn't put my office on a Windows Server 2003 box and gone with OS X Server with a 2nd MS Terminal Server for MS-based apps. Grrr...

Slower than Office 2004 under Rosetta?

Gaelic1
Jan 17, 2008, 03:30 PM
I've been using both Microsoft Office 2008 and Microsoft Office X, but I find Microsoft Office X a lot faster. Office X has much faster load times on my Macbook and uses less resources than Office 2008.

I don't mean to take a jab at Office 2008, it has a new UI and much more features than any other Office release for the Mac platform, but I was expecting more from a Intel native release. Anyone else feel the same?

I too use Office X and find it works quite well for all my needs. I can't imagine paying what they are asking for the new one since I don't see a corresponding benefit.

psychofreak
Jan 17, 2008, 03:32 PM
They really have to hurry up with the next Mac Messenger, its not acceptable that we only have horrible apps for our MSN A/V needs...

Manic Mouse
Jan 17, 2008, 03:35 PM
They really have to hurry up with the next Mac Messenger, its not acceptable that we only have horrible apps for our MSN A/V needs...

Adium isn't horrible and apparently A/V is in the works.

psychofreak
Jan 17, 2008, 03:39 PM
Adium isn't horrible and apparently A/V is in the works.

Adium is great, but I have a feeling it will be a very long time until we get good A/V with it (heck, the file transfers are still ridiculously slow)...

Mindflux
Jan 17, 2008, 03:41 PM
Adium is great, but I have a feeling it will be a very long time until we get good A/V with it (heck, the file transfers are still ridiculously slow)...


Adium would be even better if it remembered privacy preferences.

Manic Mouse
Jan 17, 2008, 03:42 PM
Adium is great, but I have a feeling it will be a very long time until we get good A/V with it (heck, the file transfers are still ridiculously slow)...

Good point, but we can always hope.

Anyway, I should have Office 2008 sitting waiting for me when I get home tomorrow. I'm actually quite excited, there's something disconcerting about not having it on a computer (new Mac user here)...

iWork is pretty fantastic, except numbers which is useless for scientific work so I can't wait to finally have Excel!

I just hope it isn't as slow as people on here are making out. I'll soon see. Can you choose not to install MSN and Entourage?

cubbie5150
Jan 17, 2008, 03:47 PM
First impressions?

Sluggish.

Yup... it's S L O W....especially starting-up an app. I think '04 versions of Word & Excel opened faster via rosetta on my MBP...

ascender
Jan 17, 2008, 04:09 PM
Yip, sorry, I never really qualified that comment!

I'm running it on a 2.8 iMac with 4Gb RAM and I don't think loading the apps and documents is any faster than the previous version. Seems to take ages to get going with anything. Disappointing really.

I've got work to do this weekend though so I'll have longer with it then to see if things improve.

Airforce
Jan 17, 2008, 04:13 PM
I agree with the slow loading. It's the same way on my 2GHZ Core Duo Macbook with 2GB of ram. After I load it up, I just keep it in the memory. It doesn't bug me. I'm never in that much of a hurry anyways :p

jfremani
Jan 17, 2008, 04:25 PM
It's like Windows Vista had a kid and called it Office:Mac. I'm reverting back to just using XP + Office 2003. I wish they made Excel 2003 to run natively on intel macs. This is just too bloated.

Nosoforos
Jan 17, 2008, 04:32 PM
I find it amazing to see that I am now regretting that I installed office 2008, which I did mostly expecting a speed improvement being an Intel app.

It is almost ridiculous how slow the apps load. It takes more than 30 secs to start Word! office 2004 was even faster....

stoutboy1
Jan 17, 2008, 05:16 PM
I purchased Word 2004 for my wife recently. I registered for the 2008 upgrade but when I checked the status today it says backordered and will ship in March! Come on. This is a joke. The order along with countless others has been in for more than a month and they are not shipping until March!

I get the same estimated ship date 3/3/08. I guess one way to look at it is that we are lucky, we get the free upgrade but maybe by that time they will have worked out a few bugs.:)

Side note: My $100 microsoft black friday rebate said that it would be shipped out on the 28th of January and I recieved it on the 10th of January. Maybe the ship date is real conservative and we can expect it sooner. (doubt it, but here's to hoping.)

Shotglass
Jan 17, 2008, 05:23 PM
Office:mac 2008 is done. So? It still sucks a*se, right?

Frisco
Jan 17, 2008, 05:24 PM
I find it amazing to see that I am now regretting that I installed office 2008, which I did mostly expecting a speed improvement being an Intel app.

It is almost ridiculous how slow the apps load. It takes more than 30 secs to start Word! office 2004 was even faster....

Very sad indeed. Word 2003 on XP loads in a nano second.

Dustman
Jan 17, 2008, 05:34 PM
With regard to the complaints with speed, how fast is it on PPCs? Am I only going to see a speed increase if I have an Intel?

psychofreak
Jan 17, 2008, 05:36 PM
With regard to the complaints with speed, how fast is it on PPCs? Am I only going to see a speed increase if I have an Intel?

The speed will decrease marginally on PPC Macs...

nomoredinobones
Jan 17, 2008, 07:01 PM
Endnote indicate they are working on a compatible version.

http://www.endnote.com/support/en_wpchart_mac.asp

SL

All right--but I've alread been waiting two years for an Intel-native Word, and I feel like the wait jsut got a while lot longer. And by "When we develop a version of Endnote that has CWYW compatibility with Word 2008" they most likely mean I will have to buy Endnote AGAIN. So. Irritating. IMO, it is a serious ball-dropping for MS and they should reintro support.

Dillenger
Jan 17, 2008, 07:21 PM
So I took the plunge, well where I work took the plunge and bought Mac Office 08. So far the one thing I miss over 04 is you cannot open 2008 in two windows like I could with 04. For instance I would have my email open in one window and the calendar open in another. with 2008 this is not possible, or I'm doing something wrong.

Project
Jan 17, 2008, 07:29 PM
PowerPoint is the best package of the bunch. Much improved. I need it for compatibility reasons and it displays .pptx files 99.9% perfectly. However, for creating decks myself, Keynote still rules all.

ddl
Jan 18, 2008, 04:04 AM
I get the same estimated ship date 3/3/08. I guess one way to look at it is that we are lucky, we get the free upgrade but maybe by that time they will have worked out a few bugs.:)

Side note: My $100 microsoft black friday rebate said that it would be shipped out on the 28th of January and I recieved it on the 10th of January. Maybe the ship date is real conservative and we can expect it sooner. (doubt it, but here's to hoping.)

I too got my check on Friday but never got a notice of when it was coming. The odds are the CD or DVD they send will have been burnt when they froze the code last month with no fixes. Hopefully (and I use that term wistfully) they will come out with an update we can download by the time we get our stuff. I assume you too took advantage of the black Friday sales special by MS. I ended up opting for the Home/Student edition where I got 3 legal copies for upgrading. I didn't see the need for any of the extras and I often need to open MS documents that just don't display correctly in Pages or NeoOffice.

ddl
Jan 18, 2008, 04:23 AM
I too got my check on Friday but never got a notice of when it was coming. The odds are the CD or DVD they send will have been burnt when they froze the code last month with no fixes. Hopefully (and I use that term wistfully) they will come out with an update we can download by the time we get our stuff. I assume you too took advantage of the black Friday sales special by MS. I ended up opting for the Home/Student edition where I got 3 legal copies for upgrading. I didn't see the need for any of the extras and I often need to open MS documents that just don't display correctly in Pages or NeoOffice.

I just went to the Mactopia Web site and left a comment on their forum. I'll let you you know if the moderator posts the message and what the reply is.

jfremani
Jan 18, 2008, 10:48 AM
The official word from Microsoft is that Office 2008 no longer supports data analysis functions. HAHAHAHA what a joke. So, basically it lost key features and runs about 1000 times slower. Now, that's progress. We are getting rid of this.

Heads up to anyone who assumed they could use Excel 2008 for basic financial regressions or anything requiring data analysis toolpacks.

DiamondMac
Jan 18, 2008, 11:06 AM
I find it amazing to see that I am now regretting that I installed office 2008, which I did mostly expecting a speed improvement being an Intel app.

It is almost ridiculous how slow the apps load. It takes more than 30 secs to start Word! office 2004 was even faster....

Agreed. The most shocking part, imo, of Office '08

I was very annoyed at how long it took for me to load '04 Word and expected '08 to be faster....WRONG....even worse which is downright pathetic

Roderick Usher
Jan 18, 2008, 11:06 AM
The official word from Microsoft is that Office 2008 no longer supports data analysis functions.
Link?

Dillenger
Jan 18, 2008, 11:08 AM
Well, I guess I will be leaving 2004 on my machine, I'm glad it wasn't my $ that bought the 08 version. Hopefully through upgrades they will fix a few of must haves that MS took out.

jfremani
Jan 18, 2008, 11:48 AM
Well, I guess I will be leaving 2004 on my machine, I'm glad it wasn't my $ that bought the 08 version. Hopefully through upgrades they will fix a few of must haves that MS took out.

I have no link. This was a verbal communication with an IT guy. I would love it if he were mistaken. I'll do some googling.

DesignerOnMac
Jan 18, 2008, 12:00 PM
Just received an e-mail informing me that it is back ordered and I will not get it until MARCH!!!! WTF! Thanks M$$$$$

nemaslov
Jan 18, 2008, 12:24 PM
Anyone notice a big difference in Entourage? I am one who likes it and it's been great but when I updated to Leopard, it sometimes acts wonky, slow in opening and such, so I hope it is improved in Office 2008. I would love to hear Entourage comments for those who have used the new one with Leopard.

Manic Mouse
Jan 18, 2008, 12:52 PM
It seems fast enough on my MacBook. I'll need a few days to full evaluate it and play around with the features but I think it's pretty good...

jfremani
Jan 18, 2008, 03:33 PM
Has any one gotten a data analysis tool pack or the regression function to work with Office:Mac 2008? It seems to be missing.

Manic Mouse
Jan 18, 2008, 03:41 PM
Has any one gotten a data analysis tool pack or the regression function to work with Office:Mac 2008? It seems to be missing.

I was looking for the ANOVA tests too and couldn't find them. I actually didn't realise you could use Excel for statistical analysis until after I'd gotten rid of my old computer and got my Mac. I'd like to give it a whirl but it may have to simply be some t-tests or something.

Hopefully the analysis tool pack will be released soon. I'd like to use it for the paper I'm working on! :mad:

EDIT: I shouldn't complain too much, Numbers can't even do error bars on graphs...

Roderick Usher
Jan 18, 2008, 04:13 PM
Has any one gotten a data analysis tool pack or the regression function to work with Office:Mac 2008? It seems to be missing.
I just found this discussion on USENET:

http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.mac.office/browse_frm/thread/bf50e0c52c628771#442e79c436310373

It seems to boil down to the fact that the Data Analysis add-in is VBA-based, and so it's not available with Excel 2008.

jodders
Jan 18, 2008, 05:21 PM
Silly question I think,but should office come with Access?

jfremani
Jan 18, 2008, 05:41 PM
I just found this discussion on USENET:

http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.mac.office/browse_frm/thread/bf50e0c52c628771#442e79c436310373

It seems to boil down to the fact that the Data Analysis add-in is VBA-based, and so it's not available with Excel 2008.

That is really sad. I wonder if Microsoft left this important function out of the mac version as to not help Apple take market share of university and business machines.

Weezy F Baby
Jan 18, 2008, 05:53 PM
I've heard it takes a long time to load the programs. Is this true?

Kilamite
Jan 18, 2008, 07:10 PM
I love it. I had to try out the beta to see if it was worth the money, and had been using that for a few months so I am already used to it.

Word is great - I love the new interface. Excel, I like the interface but I hate how the text box at the top is above the main window and isn't attached.

I hate applications that have detached tools - I want everything to be in place and secured, so when I resize the window, I don't have to drag a toolbox out of the way.

In terms of loading - it takes an annoying while to load, but if I quit it, then load it again it loads almost instantly (1-2 seconds).

Worth the money though.

Quillz
Jan 18, 2008, 07:17 PM
I've heard it takes a long time to load the programs. Is this true?
The first time, yes, but now they load very quickly.

Quillz
Jan 18, 2008, 07:17 PM
That is really sad. I wonder if Microsoft left this important function out of the mac version as to not help Apple take market share of university and business machines.
Microsoft is phasing VBA out of Office in general, regardless of platform.

Roderick Usher
Jan 18, 2008, 08:53 PM
Microsoft is phasing VBA out of Office in general, regardless of platform.
Well, they stopped selling VBA licenses, but they've included compatibility in Office 2007. You're right though - their long-term goal is a migration to .NET-based languages.

I take the MacBU at their word when they say that porting VBA to Intel would have been a massive endeavor that would have substantially delayed Office 2008. Eric Schwiebert's post on the subject (http://www.schwieb.com/blog/2006/08/08/saying-goodbye-to-visual-basic/) has been linked to before; the idea that there was some directive from outside the MacBU instructing them to deliberately omit this functionality in order to hurt Apple is tinfoil-hat lunacy. He's also stated that they're continuing to examine ways to implement macro support - they know as well as we do that AppleScript is only a stopgap solution, and an incomplete one, since cross-platform compatibility means that an Excel 2007 user can send a script/macro-enabled spreadsheet to an Excel 2008 user with confidence (and vice-versa), and we're nowhere near that at present. Now that the grind of getting their stuff over to Xcode and making everything Universal is gone, I'm sure they have time to focus on solid improvements.

RRutter
Jan 18, 2008, 09:14 PM
i'm pretty excited to check it out, especially since i will get it for free.

I got it for free as well... Well I didn't get the whole office program, but I got a new black MacBook for Christmas, and a friend of mine put new programs on it; three of the new programs he put on my MacBook were Microsoft Word, Microsoft Excel, ad Microsoft Powerpoint; and the icons of these three programs are the same as they look on the front box that Jobs showed at the MacWorld 2008 Keynote.
:apple:

phuong
Jan 18, 2008, 10:16 PM
hmm, Solver is missing. was it written in VBA?
Goalseek is missing as well. Goalseek is a very simple function. it should be included in Excel code.
what's going on?

Tyrannosaurs
Jan 19, 2008, 04:38 AM
Silly question I think,but should office come with Access?
not on the mac, there's never been a mac version.

on the PC it's only in the professional version so it's not core suite but the reality is it sucks majorly anyway. yes it would be useful to have it so you could write / use it cross platform but beyond that it's horrible and there are better things out there on both PC and mac platforms.

StevieMooey
Jan 19, 2008, 07:39 AM
I've been using Word 2008 and Powerpoint 2008 these past few days, buying Office 2008 on preorder from Amazon.

First thoughts: The load time of Word is annoyingly slow, but Powerpoint loads alot faster.

The GUI is beautiful. A real achievement. My workflow has been really streamlined already. Word seems a little snappier now, and so it should! Powerpoint in particular is stunning, snappy, and streamlined.

There is no typing lag like there was with 2004/ Rossetta, which is enough for me really. Perhaps the biggest difference is this really feels like a piece of mac software now. I look forward to the updates!

Mooey

Manic Mouse
Jan 19, 2008, 09:47 AM
Will we see some kind of implementation of the analysis toolpack do you guys think?

basqarl
Jan 19, 2008, 10:19 AM
I have moved my questions/comments from another thread to this one as it is more appropriate....

As a newcomer who does not comprehend the more technical details in this thread, please forgive me if my question about Office 2004 and Office 2008 seems redundant or naive.

I am waiting to purchase my first Mac for a possible MBP refresh; if nothing happens by the end of January, I'll make my purchase regardless. (Running a Dell Inspiron 8500 on its last legs... and I won't bore you with the reasons for the MBP...)

In anticipation of my Mac, I purchased Office 04 in time to be able to upgrade to Office 08 for only the shipping charge. Of course, since I do not own my Mac as of yet (husband thinks I'm crazy to buy software prior to computer), I haven't opened my Office 04 to send in the UPC, etc., for the "free" upgrade. But if I am to get the upgrade I need to open the Office 04 and send in the proof of purchase, etc., postmarked by Feb. 14.

So, what would be your recommendations? (I use a PC with Word at work but want a Mac---) Should I just return the Office 04 and stick with iWork once I make my purchase? Keep Office 04 and send for the "free" Office 08 since I probably won't see a 'deal' like this again? If I keep Office, should I (or can I) install Windows on my Mac so that Word will perform better?

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks in advance!

jsw
Jan 19, 2008, 10:27 AM
So, what would be your recommendations? (I use a PC with Word at work but want a Mac---) Should I just return the Office 04 and stick with iWork once I make my purchase? Keep Office 04 and send for the "free" Office 08 since I probably won't see a 'deal' like this again? If I keep Office, should I (or can I) install Windows on my Mac so that Word will perform better?

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks in advance!I think you'd be crazy not to open '04 and get the rebate, especially as you probably can no longer return it.

I'm sure Word '08, running natively, will be faster than Word '04, running emulated, even given Microsoft's propensity to bloat their code. That said, '04 runs fine on my (slower) two year old Intel iMac, so it would work for you, albeit not as fast as '08. I see no reason to install Windows to run Word.

However, if I were you, I'd install Office '08, as it will surely, in the long run, be a better bet than '04, and the price is right.

basqarl
Jan 19, 2008, 10:44 AM
Thank you so much for your quick response!

I do not yet have my MBP :D (as per my previous post) so I cannot install anything yet. I purchased Office 04 through Newegg and can still return it (unopened), so the question is, is 2008 even worth it or should I stick to iWork? I do need Excel, which I do not currently have even on my ancient Dell 8500.

And, does having Windows have anything to do with how well Office for Mac runs? (Is that even a viable question? In otherwords, would this program even run on Windows installed into Mac?)

Again, sorry for the naivety.

I think you'd be crazy not to open '04 and get the rebate, especially as you probably can no longer return it.

I'm sure Word '08, running natively, will be faster than Word '04, running emulated, even given Microsoft's propensity to bloat their code. That said, '04 runs fine on my (slower) two year old Intel iMac, so it would work for you, albeit not as fast as '08. I see no reason to install Windows to run Word.

However, if I were you, I'd install Office '08, as it will surely, in the long run, be a better bet than '04, and the price is right.

MacFly123
Jan 19, 2008, 09:38 PM
erm no it costs just $130 for a home user. iWork is not a fully fledged office suite. Sure slag of MS as much as you like, MS word is the industry standard.

Well it sure does everything I have ever needed and more and what's funny is I am in the "Industry" and I haven't had Microsoft Office or Word for years and some how I get along just fine, better actually thanks to a beautiful interface and simplistic beautiful design :)

phuong
Jan 19, 2008, 09:51 PM
In terms of loading - it takes an annoying while to load, but if I quit it, then load it again it loads almost instantly (1-2 seconds).

Worth the money though.

It seems to me this is because parts of it is still in the RAM, in the form of "Inactive" memory.
This is a feature of OSX therefore it is also true for every apps, not just MS Office 2008.
I opened Word and Excel, then close them without quitting. I then use some other programs for awhile. When i need to use Word again, my mouse becomes a beachball for about a minute before i can use it. I only conclude that Word takes about a minute to load itself into the RAM

Roy
Jan 19, 2008, 10:14 PM
It seems to me this is because parts of it is still in the RAM, in the form of "Inactive" memory.
This is a feature of OSX therefore it is also true for every apps, not just MS Office 2008.
I opened Word and Excel, then close them without quitting. I then use some other programs for awhile. When i need to use Word again, my mouse becomes a beachball for about a minute before i can use it. I only conclude that Word takes about a minute to load itself into the RAM

I have Word X on my main hard drive and it used to take a long time for it to load. But as I have continued to follow the updates of OS X, the times for Word to launch kept getting shorter and shorter. My G4 Digital Audio 466 is 7 years old this month and I am running OS 10.4.11. From the time I click on the Word icon in my dock until I can start typing on a new blank Word X document is 4 seconds.

I have Word 2004 on an external firewire drive, but I have not checked the launch time for it.

phuong
Jan 20, 2008, 01:47 AM
i'm sorry i thought we were talking about Word 2008. i must have been in the wrong topic.

Roy
Jan 20, 2008, 11:17 AM
i'm sorry i thought we were talking about Word 2008. i must have been in the wrong topic.

I'm sorry also that you are so sorry. How would you know that Word 2008 was slow unless you had something to compare it to. If you have nothing to compare it to, then how do you know it's slow? Being slow is a relative thing. If all previous versions of Word took at least 5 minutes to load/launch, then if Word 2008 took 2 minutes to load/launch, then wouldn't it be relatively fast compared to previous versions of Word?

So you can go back to being sorry or realize this is a comparative topic between different versions of Mac Office.

Daveoc64
Jan 20, 2008, 05:10 PM
I'm sorry also that you are so sorry. How would you know that Word 2008 was slow unless you had something to compare it to. If you have nothing to compare it to, then how do you know it's slow? Being slow is a relative thing. If all previous versions of Word took at least 5 minutes to load/launch, then if Word 2008 took 2 minutes to load/launch, then wouldn't it be relatively fast compared to previous versions of Word?

So you can go back to being sorry or realize this is a comparative topic between different versions of Mac Office.

Precisely.

There's no point having a thread unless you discuss what's better/worse than 2004 and other products (like iWork).

I find it really helpful as I don't have Office 2008 yet, so it's good to get some opinions.

Rodimus Prime
Jan 20, 2008, 06:06 PM
once you get used to the ribbon in the new office it really is easier to use than word 04 and a much needed improvement.

It just takes getting used to. Kind of like how a lot of people when they first start using OSX think it is worse than windows but once they get used to it and adjusted they start seeing all the pluses it has over windows.

gescom
Jan 20, 2008, 06:08 PM
I think Office gets better with every release. It just takes a bit to learn the new features.

phuong
Jan 20, 2008, 06:30 PM
How would you know that Word 2008 was slow unless you had something to compare it to.


I'm sorry are you high? The person i answered to said that it took him long time to load Word. Then he quit it, and reload again, and it loaded faster. I told him that that was likely a feature of the OS, not the Apps itself. Although I could be wrong. So before you jump me please take a few seconds to look at what you are responding to.

Now you want me to compare, I compare for you.

Let's talk about WordX.
WordX is PPC. It takes 4 seconds to load.
Word08 is Intel. It takes over 1 minutes to load

let's talk something off topic here. something memory hungry.
Photoshop CS3 loads instantly.
So does Lightroom.
Word08 loads in over 1 minutes.

Word07 also loads instantly, although it is under Fusion.
Word07 has Ribbon and VBA.
Word04 loads in about a minute. It has VBA.
Word08 doesn't have VBA.

So i conclude that Word08 is slow.
However i can't conclude yet if it is worse or better than other versions. This takes time.

Roy
Jan 20, 2008, 06:54 PM
I'm sorry are you high? The person i answered to said that it took him long time to load Word. Then he quit it, and reload again, and it loaded faster. I told him that that was likely a feature of the OS, not the Apps itself. Although I could be wrong. So before you jump me please take a few seconds to look at what you are responding to.

Now you want me to compare, I compare for you.

Let's talk about WordX.
WordX is PPC. It takes 4 seconds to load.
Word08 is Intel. It takes over 1 minutes to load

let's talk something off topic here. something memory hungry.
Photoshop CS3 loads instantly.
So does Lightroom.
Word08 loads in over 1 minutes.

Word07 also loads instantly, although it is under Fusion.
Word07 has Ribbon and VBA.
Word04 loads in about a minute. It has VBA.
Word08 doesn't have VBA.

So i conclude that Word08 is slow.
However i can't conclude yet if it is worse or better than other versions. This takes time.

Thanks for the comparative information. Very interesting.

BTW, "High on Life".:)

jfremani
Jan 20, 2008, 08:15 PM
I think Office gets better with every release. It just takes a bit to learn the new features.


Where's the feature that allows you to run basic regressions or any of the other functions that data tools analysis tool packs allowed you to do in previous releases of word? They are pretty common and important functions that appear to be left out.

Burnsey
Jan 21, 2008, 01:01 AM
I installed office 08 on my 2.33ghz MBP with 2gigs of ram and it's significantly faster than office 04. I don't know why it's slower for you guys. The apps open quickly:

-Word: 5 seconds to open

-Excel: 4 seconds

-Powerpoint: 8 seconds

by contrast, office 2004:

-Word: 8 seconds

-Excel: 5 seconds

-Powerpoint: 6 seconds

In addition word is quicker at opening large documents, also scrolling through them has become smooth as butter, compared the the choppy and laggy scrolling of the old one. Backspacing (holding) has become smooth as butter as well, and so has general tasks like highlighting large texts and changing fonts. Toolbars are faster. An example (in leopard) would be the spotlight in Help, which is instant, compared to 2004 which was very slow and laggy. Also opening many documents at once is much much faster. Finally the applications quit faster too, pretty much instantly. The whole thing feels much faster, like in windows.

My only complaint is the text curser in word, which still lags a bit, but not as much as before. Also 08 seems to use more ram than 04 (judged based on one blank document), which is a bit annoying but not much.

overall I could barely use Office 2004, and Office 2008 is significantly better in speed at least.




it's all good.

MacsAttack
Jan 21, 2008, 02:09 AM
My only complaint is the text curser in word...

What? Dose a paperclip pop up and start inserting foul language? :D

Rafox2
Jan 21, 2008, 05:19 AM
I really love Office and it seems more professional than iWork but something botters me.
I was excited about Excel because I'm doing Statistics right now. At the university we use Office 2007 (windows) and use Data analysis for random number generation. The previous Office for mac could do this but the on the new one I can't find it!! How ?!?!

jfremani
Jan 22, 2008, 11:40 AM
I really love Office and it seems more professional than iWork but something botters me.
I was excited about Excel because I'm doing Statistics right now. At the university we use Office 2007 (windows) and use Data analysis for random number generation. The previous Office for mac could do this but the on the new one I can't find it!! How ?!?!

If you've read the thread, you'd know that you can't do this anymore. Microsoft figures we're all grandmas and don't do data analysis. They didn't bother to rewrite the code (not in VBA) to do this. Didn't fit the master plan of bloat. Besides, I doubt they want schools and finance institutions to switch over to macs because of MS Office:mac 2008.

I was disappointed, too.

exigentsky
Jan 22, 2008, 12:46 PM
For those who don't know, Lyx is usually even better for long documents once you get the hang of it. Anyway, this is good news except for the VB Script.