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job
Oct 26, 2003, 10:05 AM
Is it?

You now have a generation of youths who grew up listening to the bubblegum pop of the '90s and who currently think bands like Good Charlotte are rock. I'm interested to hear what everyone thinks.

medea
Oct 26, 2003, 11:23 AM
no rock is not dead, there are plenty of bands that are "rock" you just don't hear them on mtv or the (mainstream) radio.

Co.
Oct 26, 2003, 03:06 PM
No, Rock is very much still alive...

A better question would be, is Punk still alive?
The majoraty of youth think Good Charlotte is Punk, not Rock...



:confused:

job
Oct 26, 2003, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by medea
no rock is not dead, there are plenty of bands that are "rock" you just don't hear them on mtv or the (mainstream) radio.

isn't that a problem though?

kids grow up not knowing how much they are missing.

Horrortaxi
Oct 27, 2003, 09:43 AM
There is still some good music out there, but you're not likely to hear it. Blame the music industry. They're the ones who benefit from all the sugar-coated crap out there.

Co., no punk is not alive anymore. You could argue that it died in the early 80's (or in 1977, you could argue whatever you want) but in the last 10 years it's been dug out of the grave and the rotting corpse of punk has been dressed in new clothes and generated a lot of income for a lot of people. I was ready to kill when it was just Green Day (by far the worst offenders) and Offspring doing it but it gets worse every year. The candy coating gets thicker and sweeter.

How bad are things? I went to see Rob Zombie about a year ago. I like Rob Zombie well enough but the reason I went was because the Damned were opening and I hadn't seen them in a while. They got a terrible reaction from the 5000 16 year olds in attendance. "Who are these old guys?" "This isn't Punk!" Idiots. Between songs they actually had to give history lessons and explain that there were a few punk bands in the beginning and they were one of them. It was really sad and the Damned quit the tour the show after that (only 4-5 shows into a huge tour). The sad irony is that the kids dissing the Damned paid $50 to see Green Day.

Edit: The Damned got a decent reaction when they played Smash It Up--everyone thought it was an Offspring song.

iGav
Oct 27, 2003, 03:38 PM
Originally posted by job
Is it?

You now have a generation of youths who grew up listening to the bubblegum pop of the '90s and who currently think bands like Good Charlotte are rock. I'm interested to hear what everyone thinks.

The same could be said about the 80's as well.... what with Bon Jovi, or Heart or any other iffy poodle haired, tight leather/demin trousered hero's... heheh!

It depends what you define as rock I suppose... certainly bands like Nirvana, Pearl Jam etc etc, killed 80's cock rock like the Motley Crew etc etc, and to me, they were more important, more vital, more influential and more intelligent than MC and their ilk ever will be...

Rock will never die, it'll just keep reinventing itself.... the same way as pop will eat itself!

wolfpacker
Oct 27, 2003, 07:29 PM
Rock seems to reinvent and reinvigorate itself every few years. The Internet and digital music has changed the way a lot of people seek out and hear music. I'm more excited about new bands now than I've been in a decade. Bands like White Stripes, Kings of Leon, Interpol, Strokes, Jet, The Music, Spoon, etc.

true777
Oct 28, 2003, 02:28 AM
stuff such as L7's "**** List" (though that's some years back, too) to me is definitely rock, and good rock. Atari Teenage Riot to me is punk that's contemporary, interesting, and not lame. There are young bands in San Francisco where I live (and I'm sure in other places) doing old-style punk without being despicable though they're not fantastically interesting, either.
And death metal / grindcore is still alive, too.

But if you mean stuff such as Deep Purple, Steppenwolf, Led Zeppelin or Eric Clapton, then by definition, there can be nothing like it in the same genre now, because their sound could be so straightforward, simple, and pure BECAUSE it was new. Bands doing rock now have to add something to that in order to not just copy the original sound, to make it new and fresh. But by doing so, they take away from the purity, simplicity & punch of original rock.

krossfyter
Oct 29, 2003, 03:41 AM
very true im glad to hear someone on hear connetcts contemporary punk with atari teenage riot and distinquishes it as not lame.


well i avoid the mtv mainstream bug and try my best into dwelving into the underground rock world because most the time thats where the treasure offbeat ***** is at.... the stuff that will change the scape of music and the stuff that is hidden because of got da*n corporate radio.


i often times love going to
www.theprp.com

to get the 411 on up an coming loud, moody and progressive bands.

from there ive become aquainted with bands like...

hoobustank (when they were not mainstream... when they had horns in thier music)

dredg (great contemporary prog rock band)

the mars volta (another contemporary prog rock band that i like to call todays led zepplin... if they ever got big)

queens of the stone age
codeseven
quitterarmy
dog fashion disco
killswitchengage

and a bunch of others.



anyways my point is that if you peak behind the wall that is corporate radio/mainstream radio etc. you will see real life and art... the real voice of unfabricated passion.

krossfyter
Oct 29, 2003, 03:52 AM
whats up with atr now a days?

iGav
Oct 29, 2003, 04:06 AM
Originally posted by krossfyter
whats up with atr now a days?

I thought they'd split???

after PWEI split in 96, I switched to ATR because I was in need of a band that captured the PWEI spirit.... I needed a fix!! heheh!

krossfyter
Oct 29, 2003, 01:19 PM
i think they did. it looks like alec empire is solo right now.

TrenchMouth
Oct 29, 2003, 03:05 PM
go download a perfect circle and tell me rock is dead.

btw, why arent we getting Thirteenth Step on iTMS? why is is that some of these bands have held off putting their latest on the site, i would buy the whole album the second its availible but its been more than a month now. might just have to get the cd, or do something illegal...

job
Oct 29, 2003, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by TrenchMouth
go download a perfect circle and tell me rock is dead.

right, i own all of tool's albums and just recently bought both albums from a perfect circle. but that isn't really what i was asking.

does a perfect circle really enjoy big name recognition as bands like nirvana or the rolling stones did in their heyday?

sure, people who enjoy music similar to a perfect circle will know who they are, but will the vast majority of people? my guess is no.

instead, pop culture has become so sensationalized that people are more interested in what jessica simpson says than who johnny cash was (reference to someone i know who knew what episode of jessica simpson's show was playing but had no idea who johnny cash was. crazy.)

i guess the term 'rock' is also a bit subjective, since there are so many types/definitions.

krossfyter
Oct 30, 2003, 02:53 AM
exactly a perfect circle is a "perfect" example. thier new album is phenominal. in this world full of money obsessed ********* artists it is compelling to draw inspiration from people who are in the industry for music, not money. thier songs show musicians and music lovers alike that real music is possible in this industry and the band shows that success is possible.

TrenchMouth
Oct 30, 2003, 11:06 AM
I can see where you are coming from with the idea that APC doesnt get the fame that Nirvana did when it was in its heyday, but does that mean that rock is 'dead'? Just people its not mainstream does not mean it is dead. surely rock will have a following that appreciates its essence. taking the broadest term of rock one could conclude that it is anything but dead. just listen to bands like APC and Postal Service, Jerry Cantrell, Dntel, Radiohead. All of these people are proof that rock is not dead.

i think where this argument eats itself is where you describe the difference between alive and dead. if by "dead" you mean it is not mainstream, then sure, its dead and maybe for the better. if by "alive" you mean its done for the music and not fore the money then its as alive as ever (save linkin park and limpbiskit which should be banned by anyone with taste [/opinion]). and if you do in fact mean "alive" by doing it for the music rather than money then pop is as dead as it gets.

the nature of rock is not static. it will change with every generation, but it will always be alive because it is a proven method of transmiting a message. just because we have movies doesnt mean we arent going to read books.

gwuMACaddict
Nov 16, 2003, 09:24 PM
as long as aerosmith continues to tour and release new cd's, rock is not dead.

Awimoway
Nov 17, 2003, 12:40 AM
Rock enjoyed a brief renaissance in the early 90s and then died again.

But creativity comes in spurts. There will be yet more Ages of Rock (not Rock of Ages :D ) in the future. The kids who listen to throwaway pop are never the ones who grow up to be the next great rockers anyway. But the music exchange (Napster, P2P, iTMS, etc.) explosion of the last 7 or so years can only boost more discriminating kids' exposure to great rock from past eras.


My fear is that whenever someone asks if rock is dead and I agree is whether the real question is "Are we old?" ;)

mike3k
Nov 17, 2003, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by Co.
No, Rock is very much still alive...

A better question would be, is Punk still alive?
The majoraty of youth think Good Charlotte is Punk, not Rock...

:confused:

Real punk died with The Ramones, The Sex Pistols, and The Clash. Nothing today can be considered real punk.

MrMacMan
Nov 17, 2003, 11:17 PM
I'm gonna sound like an echo and repeat what krossfyter said.

Mars Volta
queens of the stone age

A perfect circle is ok... but I don't like it that much dunno why...

BTW, A Band called The Rapture is on Tour with Mars Volta.

I went to the concert and they stole the show for a good reason, they kicked ass.

:p

manitoubalck
Nov 18, 2003, 02:38 AM
Rock Lives!! Kiss, AC/DC, Metallica, Pink Floyd:rolleyes:, The stones, Dire Straits. The Eagles.

When artists were know buy the music they wrote not the clothes they wear, and the boobs they have.

joeyjojoe
Nov 18, 2003, 03:50 AM
Originally posted by manitoubalck
Rock Lives!! Kiss, AC/DC, Metallica, Pink Floyd:rolleyes:, The stones, Dire Straits. The Eagles.

When artists were know buy the music they wrote not the clothes they wear, and the boobs they have.

I'm sorry did you say KISS isn't memorable for the insane costumes?

How can you say rock is dead? What defines rock and why don't the current radio bands live up to that definition? Even if you don't like the new bands on the scene, R.E.M., Metallica, Aerosmith, Black Crowes, etc. are still making music.

job
Nov 19, 2003, 04:54 PM
Originally posted by joeyjojoe
How can you say rock is dead?

I'm not. I'm just wondering if rock and music in general has taken a back seat, say, to what <insert current sex kitten here> wore at her latest concert.

What defines rock and why don't the current radio bands live up to that definition?

I've already stated that rock can taken on numerous forms, depending on what you listen to and what you think 'rock' is.

Even if you don't like the new bands on the scene, R.E.M., Metallica, Aerosmith, Black Crowes, etc. are still making music.

Right, but if I ask you average 12~15 year old if they listened to the latest from R.E.M., et al. he/she would probably look at me weird. Sure, those bands are still making music, but are they selling as much as they used to?

I guess music does change with time as new bands enter the scene while other fade away.

sethypoo
Nov 20, 2003, 04:26 PM
Rock is not dead when a great new band like Blink-182 can collaborate with a great band like The Cure, as they did on their latest album.

Check out "All Of This." Robert Smith of The Cure + Blink-182 = Greatness.

Also: buy "Feeling This" by Blink-182, they are number 10 in the iTMS right now, let's send them to the top.

Thanks!
Seth :D

Edited: Here's the link for "Feeling This":
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=3592513&selectedItemId=3592485

Horrortaxi
Nov 20, 2003, 07:03 PM
Originally posted by sethypoo
Rock is not dead when a great new band like Blink-182 can collaborate with a great band like The Cure

I'll have to hear it just because of Robert Smith, but one of the nails in rock's coffin says "Blink 182" on it.

gwuMACaddict
Nov 20, 2003, 10:53 PM
i just got back from the kiss/aerosmith concert at the MCI center in washington dc...

rock is soooo not dead. not at all.

:D :D

LethalWolfe
Nov 20, 2003, 11:26 PM
Rock, punk, metal, whatever you think is dead is not. Just because it isn't on a Clear Channel ok'd play list doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And genres and styles evolve so, for example, the Punk of today might not sound like the Punk of 1982, but that doesn't mean the Punk of today isn't Punk (and no, I'm not talking about pop punk bands). If a genre doesn't grow and evolve then that's when it dies, IMO. I don't want to hear the same music today that I heard 20 years ago.


Lethal

sethypoo
Nov 21, 2003, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by Horrortaxi
I'll have to hear it just because of Robert Smith, but one of the nails in rock's coffin says "Blink 182" on it.

This is exactly the kind of thing to say to make people think rock is dead.

I don't get people who hate "new school" stuff.....you know, "old school" was once new too.:(

Horrortaxi: listen to Blink-182's new album- it shows serious maturity. They realized that a band can't live on songs about d*ck and fart jokes forever, so they got the picture and made a truly great album.

I, personally, feel that this album will go down as one of the great rock albums of all time. Give it a good listen before you attempt to make witty statements about rock's "coffin".

Dangerboy
Nov 21, 2003, 04:57 AM
Here's the problem -- y'all are looking at this from an emotional and not a subjective POV.

Let me explain. Is rock dead? As far as the record companies -- you know, the guys who decide who gets into high rotation on MTV, radio and what have you -- are concerned, it's deader than dead. Really. Want proof? Look at all the boybands, Britney-Christina-Jessica-whatever "singers" (and I use this term loosely) that gets shoved down the collective throats of the public. BUT -- this stuff sells. This stuff sells a lot. Someone's buying this crap and if someone's buying, the record companies are more than happy to take their money.

I'm not saying this stuff is rock, let alone art -- anyone remember the Spice Girls? -- but it does sell.

Once the record companies get their meathooks into anything, it stops being as good as it was. That being said, rock died in the '50s once people started calling it rock. Personally, I like old stuff. Old (thin, pre-fat and stoned and on the bowl) Elvis, Little Richard and Buddy Holly. Rock before anyone knew what it was. Draw a line from that to White Lion, you'll scratch your head, and wonder what went wrong. Rock is now a preserved corpse under glass, much like what Soviets did with Lennin's body, only rock wears gaudier clothes.

Look at rap -- it used to be great, but now it's all bling-bling and pimp-this and ho-that. For the most part, there's no way anyone can say that a band is as good, or better than, when they started. Ditto that with punk -- Offspring? Punk? Bah, I say!

Granted, I am a crusty late 20-something-soon-to-be-30, but I remember when listening to The Cure was all the reason enough to get your ass kicked in high school, and I saw what happened when a little song called Smells Like Teen Spirit suddenly put "alternative" and "college" (formerly the music known as "What-is-this-crap?!" by most) music in the limelight and everyone -- even Metallica -- started wearing flannel.

There's always going to be a band or someone who does something original. Something that, despite what everyone else is doing, is doing that gets back to what are the roots of a genre are. But don't expect to see them on MTV or hear them on anything outside a college station or KCRW.

It sounds elitist, but from what I've seen, most people are idiots and wouldn't know anything of worth if it fell out of the sky and rotated on their collective faces.

gwuMACaddict
Nov 21, 2003, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by Dangerboy
Is rock dead? As far as the record companies -- you know, the guys who decide who gets into high rotation on MTV, radio and what have you -- are concerned, it's deader than dead.

i see your point... but just because these bands arent getting the airplay doenst reallly worry me too much. aerosmith hardly didnt have a number one hit until the 9lived album in the early 90's. does that mean that they werent rocking out until then? heck no. rock doesnt always need the airplay to survive.

Dangerboy
Nov 21, 2003, 01:49 PM
Originally posted by gwuMACaddict
i see your point... but just because these bands arent getting the airplay doenst reallly worry me too much. aerosmith hardly didnt have a number one hit until the 9lived album in the early 90's. does that mean that they werent rocking out until then? heck no. rock doesnt always need the airplay to survive.

Absolutely -- and in the case of Aerosmith, there's no way you can't deny that they're an active, vital force in rock. But original stuff coming from the rock genre is few and far between these days.

A few years back, MTV did a special on the death of heavy metal. What constiuted heavy metal, at least in the program, were late-'80s-early-'90s hair bands like Warrant, Poison, and so on (bands I didn't mind seeing go). One of the guys from Warrant made the observation that at their label, a huge promo picture of them had been replaced by a huge promo picture of Pearl Jam or Soundgarden when the whole alternative-rock thing hit, and that's when he knew his time was over.

There's always going to be bands that do rock. But it's the record companies that have marginalized the rock market, because they latch onto whatever the next big thing is and ride it to death and most people don't know any better.

The irony is that the record companies are trying to make a generation of music conusmers think of their products as art, not a commodity, to stop file-sharing, but a commodity is the way the music industry has always looked at music.

random1
Nov 21, 2003, 01:59 PM
"Rock is dead,
Long live rock"
-Pete Townshend

The fact that this lyric appeared in the 70's shows how timeless, and ultimately how wrong, the question is.
Popular music might be as bad or even worse than it was in the mid-80's, and sooner or later, an alternative, or somewhat retro sound will shine through and history will repeat itself.

gwuMACaddict
Nov 21, 2003, 03:06 PM
Originally posted by Dangerboy
Absolutely -- and in the case of Aerosmith, there's no way you can't deny that they're an active, vital force in rock. But original stuff coming from the rock genre is few and far between these days.


i can definitely agree with this. a few years ago i really thought that buckcherry was going to revitalize the rock scene. if you haven't listened to these guys, i really recomend that you check them out. they split up after two albums and i dont know what their story is now... mix of aerosmith/ac.dc/rolling stones to me.

but youre right in that i cant really think of any new, younger bands that are carrying the torch. the musicality and lyrics are just falling apart... if anyone has any good recomendations of new bands they ought to post them here.

:D

coopdog
Nov 22, 2003, 12:17 AM
Rock now, the main stream, is ****. I listen to the whiney bitches on all the modern rock stations here and it's all ****. It starts out all whiney and they have to spread out the words to fit with the music like that ****ty popular blink 182 song. So it starts out all mellow and "hey girl' **** like that. Then now I am yelling! Que the hard guitar solo, "hey we can be mellow and be pop but we are ****ed up too!" Ahhh Im yelling, im so angry!

(I don't know what I am angry at, my producer told me to put that in. Oh and maybe even slip **** in there just for the hell of it.)

Rock is ****er and ****er day by day. It's all poetic rap for me now.

It makes me so angry! :mad:

manitoubalck
Nov 22, 2003, 01:34 AM
Does Fleetwood Mac count as rock? or more of a country band. Either way great music and they're touring Aus Next year

joeyjojoe
Nov 22, 2003, 03:25 AM
I would label Fleetwood Mac as "folk".

If you guys are searching for new(er) rock-esque music, look into: Black Crowes, Marcy Playground (forgive them for the one radio song and you'll get on famously), 3 Doors Down (bland/meaningless yet fun rock), Hot Hot Heat, White Stripes (who despite having a limited sound, have a great guitar player).

I'm sure there are more, and many that I haven't even heard of. These are just my recommendations for those of you in a musical rut.

wolfpacker
Nov 22, 2003, 09:13 AM
I would label Fleetwood Mac as "folk".

And you'd be wrong :)

They seem clearly a rock band to me. The early stuff was a hard English Blues and then one Buckingham/Nicks joined, it turned into a hybrid with California country rock (a la the Eagles). But it ALWAYS had the rock guitar.

Anyway, Rock is not dead. I don't think you can judge a genre by whether dinosaurs like Aerosmith and the Mac are still touring, but by what new music is out there. And there is tons of great new rock being produced, from White Stripes to Ryan Adams to the Strokes to Yeah, Yeah, Yeahs to the Darkness to the Mars Volta to A Perfect Circle to many dozens of great new rock bands.

Horrortaxi
Nov 22, 2003, 10:16 AM
Originally posted by gwuMACaddict
if anyone has any good recomendations of new bands they ought to post them here.

Well, there is ... umm... and The ... er...um...and that guy who...

I guess there is nobody carrying the torch. In the past when things have gotten really crappy and unbearable (think mid 70's and late 80's) we've gotten some revolutionary stuff as a response. Maybe we're gearing up for the next Sex Pistols or Nirvana. It's about time for something like that.

sethypoo
Nov 22, 2003, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by Horrortaxi
Well, there is ... umm... and The ... er...um...and that guy who...

I guess there is nobody carrying the torch. In the past when things have gotten really crappy and unbearable (think mid 70's and late 80's) we've gotten some revolutionary stuff as a response. Maybe we're gearing up for the next Sex Pistols or Nirvana. It's about time for something like that.



Maybe the world is coming to an end and everythingis spiraling down and getting worse and worse and oh my God what is going on?

I agree, where is the next Nirvana?

Ah well, Incubus and Blink-182 are good enough for me, as is the White Album and Sgt. Peppers.:D

Dangerboy
Nov 22, 2003, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by sethypoo
Maybe the world is coming to an end and everythingis spiraling down and getting worse and worse and oh my God what is going on?

I agree, where is the next Nirvana?

Ah well, Incubus and Blink-182 are good enough for me, as is the White Album and Sgt. Peppers.:D

If you looks at the times that the Sex Pistols and Nirvana came around, they were a backlash against what was considered popular music at the time.

In the case of the Sex Pistols, it was disco and bloated arena-rock. In the case of Nirvana, it was the whole hair-band thing that was getting out of control.

History will repeat itself, but I think it'll be a few more years before things get interesting again -- it's only been about 11 years since Nirvana released Nevermind. But the next time around, I think, and I hope, the decentralized distribution that online retailers like iTMS will let a band to cut out the usual suspects and not have to kowtow to TRL.

Dangerboy
Nov 22, 2003, 08:07 PM
Originally posted by wolfpacker
And you'd be wrong :)

They seem clearly a rock band to me. The early stuff was a hard English Blues and then one Buckingham/Nicks joined, it turned into a hybrid with California country rock (a la the Eagles). But it ALWAYS had the rock guitar.

Anyway, Rock is not dead. I don't think you can judge a genre by whether dinosaurs like Aerosmith and the Mac are still touring, but by what new music is out there. And there is tons of great new rock being produced, from White Stripes to Ryan Adams to the Strokes to Yeah, Yeah, Yeahs to the Darkness to the Mars Volta to A Perfect Circle to many dozens of great new rock bands.

Isn't that what the problem is -- defining what "rock" is, exactly? What falls under the definition of "rock" today isn't necessarily what Alan Freed was spinning in the '50s.

I think what the problem is that most of this stuff sounds the same -- and that's really what's stifling the genre. When rock first came out, it was on the fringe. Now it's mainstream and how rebelious can anything be if your parents like it too?

The "rock" of today is derivative and all pretty much sounds the same. Heavy on the guitars (like what Bob Mould was doing, followed by The Pixies and proto-grunge bands), usually with some hip-hop-type influcence (sounding like poor imitators of The Beastie Boys without the witty word play and humor). And they're always angry about something. You'd think these guys would be able to buy SOME happiness with an advance on thier record...

When I was a freshman in college, one of the upperclassmen at the student paper I worked on wrote a column about how much music sucked then. I kind of took offense at the time, but you know what? Now that I'm about as old as she was, I can see where she was coming from.

gwuMACaddict
Nov 23, 2003, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by sethypoo

Ah well, Incubus and Blink-182 are good enough for me

i dunno... since when is blink182 rock? i thought they were more of a bland, peppy, happy, punk rock? i could be wrong... rock to me is a lot more blues based... fleetwood mac is an excellent example, as someone posted earlier.

Awimoway
Nov 24, 2003, 12:05 AM
And that's the problem. Nobody has the same definition for rock. For some, it's anything with an electric guitar. For others, it must be on-the-fringe rebellion, expressed musically. I know I've seen people list groups in this thread as evidence of rock that I most definitely do not accept as rock.

So the question itself is a little flawed. A better question, that many have inadvertantly answered, is "how do you define rock?" People can only evaluate rock in terms of their own definition.

And even that's not enough. Someone could say that rock is defined by its edginess. But that same person, because of their age, might refuse to see that music of this era (if they're older) or a previous era (if they're younger) was edgy in its time, among people of its generation.

sketchy
Nov 26, 2003, 03:10 PM
[originally posted by iGAV [/i]

Rock will never die, it'll just keep reinventing itself.... the same way as pop will eat itself!

I love Pop Will Eat Itself.

Their Early stuff is like 80's College Rock, then they went New Wave, techno, then Industrial in the early 90's. they need to release a new album.

I think that 'Rock' is out of mainstream. Well -- rock as I remember it. Not Metal, grunge, or industrial lite (stabbing westward, filter) But Rock like Bryan Admas, John Mellencamp, and Tom Petty has moved on. mainly to the country station.

There is not much of a market for that brand of Rock. Most people who want to hear that and not hear anything with a new wave feel or pop feel have left to the country stations.

Everything evolved in the early 90's and mid 90's. Metal and 'Cock Rock' died out when grunge hit the scene. With Grunge and Boy Bands taking over rock started to die. Mid 90's and grunge was no more. Metal tried to get its foot in the mainstream door, but it never happened.

Then the Hybrid took over. In metal, pop, rap, all mainstream like music. Metal w/ Rapping (Linkin Park, Limp Biscuit, ( I think I spelled that wrong), korn, etc), hard rap - eminim, crossover rap - Puffy-Diddy, pop country - Shania Twain, Rock/Rap - No Doubt and whoever...etc.

I think we are ripe for something new. A new genera, a new breakthrough. MTV plays the same stuff all day, there is very little variety. there are a bunch of whiny-wanna be punk bands that all sound the same.

I think beat music (EBM, Electronic, Trance) is becoming more mainstream, but I think Outkast might be a conversion band.

They mock their own genera. On SNL they had backup dancers, it was like "hehe -- we got fly dancers" When Missy Elliott was on the next week she was like "These are part of my act. I need them to go out and sing. They are important"

They are doing more then rap. I think they are a great pop band, and an original one. I think people will want originality, and will soon demand it. I'm tired of boy bands

sketchy
Nov 26, 2003, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by gwuMACaddict
a few years ago i really thought that buckcherry was going to revitalize the rock scene.
:D

I think that is what needs to be argued. there will always be bands who produce rock music. The eagles are still releasing CD's. But the Scene is so incredibly weak. You used to be able to go to Rock clubs.. where they played Rock music and people danced to it.

the blurring of styles has caused a mess in the genera classing system.

blink 182 ans Sum 41 are pop/punk -- which I classify as rock.
American Idol -- how many rock songs were performed that just sound cheesy in the auditions.

Most "modern rock" is cheesy or/and winey

job
Nov 30, 2003, 12:26 PM
i actually thought the most recent blink album was not that bad. it seems they have gotten more serious about their music instead of inserting random **** and fart jokes in their songs.

Well, there is ... umm... and The ... er...um...and that guy who...

I guess there is nobody carrying the torch. In the past when things have gotten really crappy and unbearable (think mid 70's and late 80's) we've gotten some revolutionary stuff as a response. Maybe we're gearing up for the next Sex Pistols or Nirvana. It's about time for something like that.

and there's the problem. would you guys consider radiohead as rock?

Horrortaxi
Nov 30, 2003, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by job
would you guys consider radiohead as rock?

Not in the AC/DC sense, but what else are you going to call them--if you have to categorize in the first place? Radiohead reminds me of a lot of mid-80's bands. They were doing something different, had a large cult following and were known to the masses but weren't complete industry tools. I'm thinking about bands like The Cure, Depeche Mode, Echo and the Bunnymen. They did their own thing and managed to have pretty long careers. People who tried to neatly categorize these bands gave themselves headaches.

I think it is pretty pointless to categorize things as "rock" or "not rock" because the criteria will vary from person to person. I'll say that Radiohead is worth listening to though. You could do worse things with an hour of your life than listen to a Radiohead CD.

SilvorX
Dec 7, 2003, 02:56 AM
GOOD rock is dying, you can see it happening with some of the bands breaking up. My favourite modern rock band (which is heck alot better than any crud I hear on the popular music radio station) is breaking up in a few weeks, theyre freaking awesome but I guess they just weren't that popular :(

as Neil Young once said: "rock and roll will never die"

TrenchMouth
Dec 9, 2003, 12:58 AM
with this whole "what is rock?" stuff you could really get into semantics which will get us no where (that is assuming that this was going someplace to begin with). "Rock" is anything that you can 'rock out' to. lol. Why dont we just leave it at that.

I dont think it should be limited to any one 'type' of music. Sure there is classic rock, and indy, and industrial, and metal and so on. but who cares? the point is to 'rock out' and to tell you the truth i could have much more fun 'rocking out' listening to Hey Ya by Outkast than the latest Audioslave album. Rock is great because its all-inclusive. its influence is in so many things that even if it did ever 'die' (which doesnt make much sence to begin with) its DNA is all over the damn place. Its far from 'dead' its just not what you might have rememberd it as.

Awimoway
Dec 9, 2003, 07:27 PM
White Stripes
The Hives
The Vines
The Strokes
Jet


Nah, rock ain't dead.

Jetson
Dec 9, 2003, 11:57 PM
*Please Delete*

germ war
Dec 19, 2003, 10:53 AM
Rye Coalition is going to be the best "new" rock band you haven't heard of next year. They've got 3 full-length albums under their belt, and just this last year they signed a deal with Dreamworks. They're in the studio with Dave Grohl right now, and I'm curious to see how it all turns out since I've been following their band for upwards of 5 years now.

spiraliv
Dec 19, 2003, 04:04 PM
This is an incredibly inane and silly topic to bring up. It will keep popping up forever and ever as people get older and less hep to what's good and new, until Star Sun crashes into Planet Moon and they team up to crash into Planet Earth, killing us all. And people will still be asking… IS ROCK DEAD??????

god.

g30ffr3y
Dec 19, 2003, 04:09 PM
robert smith + blink 182 = a f ing travesty as far as im concerned... robert smith, considered a forefather of goth has NO F ING BUSINESS working with half wits like blink 182... oh, and i agree that APC and radiohead dont get the mainstream cred they deserve... and if you think rock is dead, check out the new dimmu borgir album...

esternullo
Dec 20, 2003, 01:51 AM
Originally posted by job
Right, but if I ask you average 12~15 year old if they listened to the latest from R.E.M., et al. he/she would probably look at me weird. Sure, those bands are still making music, but are they selling as much as they used to?

I guess music does change with time as new bands enter the scene while other fade away.

its because 12 - 15 year olds are the perfect target market, they are young, dumb, and naive...

"Hey, I want to own the kid younger and younger." -- Mike Searles, former president of Kids-R-Us

so as long as young people are told that if they don't listen to Good Charlotte, then they will never be a cool punk rocker, then i think most popular "rock" bands will degress to absolute s***.

the decline of rock music is directly linked to consumerism...

there's my conspiracy theory

esternullo
Dec 20, 2003, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by g30ffr3y
robert smith, considered a forefather of goth

what about Rozz Williams, or Peter Murphy?

or, Bela Logusi...

Horrortaxi
Dec 20, 2003, 10:38 AM
Originally posted by esternullo
what about Rozz Williams, or Peter Murphy?
Peter Murphy won't go near the G word, which I find really amusing. Andrew Eldritch will get very nasty with you if you call him a goth. I find that even more amusing.

Rozz Williams--you may have something there. He certainly looked the part. He was on Christian Death's only good record, but was that really goth record? Did they even have goths in 1982 or whenever Only Theater of Pain was released? This leads to the ultimate question. It's the question I've thought about for years and years: What the hell is a goth anyway? It's a look and a scene but apart from that I can't see anything substantial there.

esternullo
Dec 20, 2003, 12:04 PM
Originally posted by Horrortaxi
This leads to the ultimate question. It's the question I've thought about for years and years: What the hell is a goth anyway? It's a look and a scene but apart from that I can't see anything substantial there.

I saw the new episode of South Park, and Stan gets depressed and goes goth...

the whole goth scene is summed up in abouta total of 5 minutes throughout the episode...

"I'd rather be a whiny ***** than a faggy goth" - Butters

i have been labeled as a goth, but i think it is to vague of a term...

tjwett
Dec 20, 2003, 03:26 PM
i'm with a lot of the people on this thread. most of the music that pollutes the airwaves and puke, MTV, is just pure steaming $h!t. maybe i'm a bit of a music snob but i literally can't find a single, solitary thing out there in the pop world that is worth a listen. even stuff like Radiohead and Coldplay, which a lot of people are getting all chubby over, to me just sounds like bubblegum crapola. on the other side of it all is the fact that yes, there is a ton of awesome rock music out there. it's just not created with the plan of making money so it's not in your face all the time. it's created and released by passionate musicians who realize that music is not a haircut. look to labels like TouchandGo, K Records, Kill Rockstars, Warp, Thrill Jockey, etc. to find music that is made by musicians for people who love music. ok i'm stopping now because this subject just gets me angry. byeee.:)

Horrortaxi
Dec 21, 2003, 10:25 PM
Originally posted by esternullo
"I'd rather be a whiny ***** than a faggy goth" - Butters

i have been labeled as a goth, but i think it is to vague of a term...

I loved that. Once again South Park takes the words right out of my mouth.

If by "vague" term you mean "completely meaningless" then I agree completely.

mrjamin
Dec 22, 2003, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by mike3k
Real punk died with The Ramones, The Sex Pistols, and The Clash. Nothing today can be considered real punk.

couldn't agree more. The stuff labelled as punk today is (imho) crap.

Mac-Xpert
Dec 22, 2003, 10:20 AM
I would like to take this thread a step further:

"New music is dead"

Because all I hear on the radio these days is recycled (sampled) 70's & 80's pop/rock with a added dance beat. Or covers. Or supposed new music that sounds like things you have heard a million times before.

Record companies should stop focusing only at 10-15 year olds and start releasing good records again that music fans of 25+ will like. There is a whole market not well served.

E~3
Dec 25, 2003, 01:12 AM
With so many replies and opinions flying around this thread I didn't really bother to read past the first page( sorry guys ) so im not really sure if this has been said....

But I would simply say this....

ROCK WILL NOT DIE (IN THE MAINSTREAM and Underground) AS LONG AS THERE ARE BANDS THAT COME WITH A FRESH! AND ECLECTIC! SOUND SUCH AS BANDS LIKE...

The Rolling Stones
Led Zepplin
Queen
Jimmy Hendrix
Lynard Skynard
Pink Floyd
Black Sabbath
Guns And Roses
Nirvana
Pearl Jam
Tool
Korn
Blink 182
The White Stripes
Hatebreed
and
Linkin Park

The success of these bands came from the originality of the sound, although maybe based heavily on one particular niche of rock still broke free enough to spice things up with outside influences and blaze their own path with music spawned from the depths of their OWN SOUL... NOT directly inspired from the latest trend.

Rock Will Never die in my mind...

good luck to all and happy holidays as well.


~E3

phreakout13
Jan 7, 2004, 05:53 PM
anyone listen to emo? It ruined my best friend and now all she wants to do is talk about days of the week and make herself cry. Punk died when emo was invented.

kettle
Jan 7, 2004, 06:44 PM
STRAPPING YOUNG LAD:)
-City
or if you want it a bit more Metal/Floyd then try Devin Townsend - Ocean Machine or Terria

Screamo
Jan 8, 2004, 07:50 PM
I am thirteen and a few people have made comments about the youth of today, and so I thought I would raise my two cents. I was adopted recently by a very young lady (18). Since she has become my mother we have compared various times our generations high and low points. She has introduced me to many bands in which I probably would never have heard of, and I have done the same. I used to be into emo. It became very annoying after a while. The singers usually had no talent at all, and the lyrics were very thin. There is currently a band making their way that have started their own genre. This band is Thursday. As a joke they referred to themselves as "screamo" and the name became known by accident. They have really well written lyrics, and their sound is hard to classify, it is really the listeners definitions that matter in these cases. They have wonderful ways with their instruments, and they will literally stop you in your place live. Thrice do not scream as loud as Thursday, and they aren't as heavy usually. They have amazing lyrics also. Both groups sounds must be heard and not explained really. The last band is Coheed & Cambria. These three bands are now touring together. I don't recommend Co & Ca as an intro into this sound. They go perfectly with Thrice and Thursday even though they have a more melodic sound to them. I go to a private school, and there isn't much room for showing off your true character in a uniform. Yet it is very notable how many kids are now into rock. There are so many piercings (5 Myself), and spikes on everyone. The band influences vary from each of them.. but no matter what form rock will take.. it will not die. I am in to every genre of rock.. I am only speaking about screamo because I am currently playing it on a greater demand. I am very much into Nirvana, Pixies, Stone Temple Pilots, Nine Inch Nails (greatly), Lacuna Coil, Finger Eleven, 30 seconds to mars, etc.

Give new music a try.. I request the following songs to be heard.. but of course it won't appeal to everyone. Not in order of favourite...

Thursday - For The Workforce, Drowning / Between Rupture And Rapture / Signals Over The Air / Asleep In The Chapel / War All The Time / M. Shepard (All available on the new album "War All The Time")

Thrice - Cold Cash, And Colder Hearts / All That's Left / Silhouette / Stare At The Sun / Paper Tigers / The Artist In The Ambulance (All available on the new album "The Artist In The Ambulance")

and when you're ready:

Coheed & Cambria - In Keeping Secrets Of Silent Earth: 3 / Cuts Marked In The March Of Men / Blood Red Summer / The Velourium Camper II: Backend Of Forever / 2113 (All available on the new album "In Keeping Secrets Of Silent Earth: 3")

I personally love every track.. I have never looked back on the purchase of any of these albums. I have put them all on a mini disc.. and it may be the only one I never had to pass through any track. Rock has always been the pure release in my life.. I hope you people enjoy hearing these bands. Have a Great Day!

One last thing... No one has mentioned Incubus! They are always changing their sounds, and they do it so well. If you are able to get your hands on the track Megalomaniac don't waste any time. Don't be so glum chum they will revive rock on February 3rd with their release of "A Crow Left Of The Murder" I certainly can't wait.

~ Love Jenny

p.s. Music is music.. just because you think something sucks doesn't change that it is an opinionated perspective. Everyone is different.

LizardKing73
Jan 8, 2004, 08:26 PM
Is rock dead?
It once was. Name 20 good bands that have come out in the past 10 years. Kinda hard to do.... but if it were 1975, it'd be rather simple. I can only think of a few that have come out in the early 90's. Radiohead, Nirvana.... wow I can't even think of anything else. Through the mid-ninties pop culture took over the world. It was like, once Kurt Cobain died, it seemed all good rock went with him.
Although lately, it seems I'm hearing bands that I actually like (I normally listen to the classic stuff to blues and jazz). Some are underground and not an extreme amount of people know about them-- the Yeah Yeah Yeahs, Interpol, Cursive --but then I hear bands like Jet and Hot Hot Heat and more than a few people know them. They are rather retro, and that's the part that confuses me. The lastest "fad", I guess you can say, is being retro. Guys are growing out their hair like in the 60s and 70s. More people are into the older rock. Wearing tie-dye and Converse All-Stars seem to be "in" (sadly-- real rockers should wear that, not preppy Abercrombie shoppers... by the way I'm in high school). So my question is, not including the underground bands that are awesome, are the retro bands that ARE good just part of the retro "fad", or has the music industry realized they aren't giving a fair chance to good musicians and is rock coming back because of that?

SilvorX
Jan 13, 2004, 02:41 AM
As time changes, peoples' conception of rock changes, now days people concider stuff like linkin park rock at times *cringes*, I concider very little of today's music actual rock except bands like U2, sometimes aerosmith, and other bands of the sort, although theyve been playing for well over 20 years now, people wonder why I like "terrible" music when theyre huge fans of stuff like sum 41, 50 cent, avril lavigne, etc..