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Cave Man
Feb 19, 2008, 10:16 PM
Ok, not really. But it can be. And for pretty cheap.

For those who've been following this forum for the past few weeks you've seen a couple of threads about connecting a 3.5" drive to the Apple TV. I have done it, and it works.

First thing I did was to put the ATV drive image onto the 3.5" drive using a commonly-employed method (http://www.appletvhacks.net/2007/03/23/apple-tv-harddrive-upgrade-process/). I have an image of my original 1.0 ATV drive sitting on my Mac's hard drive. After I put the image onto the 3.5" drive, I used iPartion to expand the Media partition of the drive. This made a clone of my original 40 gig ATV drive, except for the larger Media partition.

Balamw (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=430735) turned me onto the 2.5" to 3.5" IDE adapter and I found one at PC Connection (http://biz.pcconnection.com/IPA/Shop/Product/Detail.htm?sku=347377) for only $4.70. I had to punch a hole in this adapter with a pin (below the 'x' in photo atv1.jpg) to take a pin from the ATV logic board, but that's all I really had to do. I connected a standard ribbon cable that ships with all IDE internal drives between the adapter and an old IBM 80 gig drive that I had laying around, gave it a power source, and that was it.

All one would have to do is buy a 750 gig PATA drive (the largest currently available), the adapter and a cheap external enclosure to power the 3.5" drive - all for about $160. Put the ATV and new drive in a place that would be protected from accidents and you'd have a lot of hard drive space. Who knows, you might even be able to initialize two 750 gig drives as a single 1.5 TB volume using master/slave configuration off of the drive. Tiger (the ATV's OS) supports it, so I suspect it would work.

My ATV has been put back together with its rather anemic 160 gig hard drive. Not sure if I'll go ahead with a permanent mod. But who knows? Now that we have 720 content and Handbrake 0.9.2 with AC3 audio, it might be worth while. :D

And I guarantee you, if I were buying an ATV today I'd pick up the 40 gig model and spend the savings on a 750 gig external drive.



Cave Man
Feb 22, 2008, 01:37 PM
(Edit: please ignore - usb cannot supply juice to 3.5" drives.)

Does anyone know if the USB port on the ATV is powered? I'm going to need a power source for my 3.5" drive and would like to tap that port if if supplies voltage.

TIA

Cave Man
Mar 5, 2008, 08:57 PM
I'm curious to know if there are any crazy people out there (besides me). I came across this bridge:

http://www.cooldrives.com/sahadradtoid.html

It allows a SATA drive to be connected to a PATA interface. Since the 2.5" PATA drives max out at 250 gigs, it might be possible to put a 2.5" SATA drive (current largest is 500 gigs) into the ATV. I'm not sure if there's enough room for this adapter (and perhaps other one above) plus the SATA drive. Hmm....

Michael CM1
Mar 5, 2008, 09:05 PM
Or you could not play McGyver and just put external hard drives on your AirPort Extreme Base Station and put all your videos on there. In essence, I have a 1040 GB ATV by doing this (not counting HDD space on the iMac).

Cave Man
Mar 5, 2008, 09:14 PM
Or you could not play McGyver and just put external hard drives on your AirPort Extreme Base Station and put all your videos on there. In essence, I have a 1040 GB ATV by doing this (not counting HDD space on the iMac).

I don't like to stream. My AC3+AAC movies stutter when streaming. Plus, I don't want to compete for bandwidth with other wireless users in my home. Finally, I love to tinker! :D

Cave Man
Mar 29, 2008, 04:19 PM
(Edit 5/15/2008: The PATA2SATA controller doesn't work with a ribbon. Instead, pick up Syba's controller (http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295), for less than $15 at various places.)

Ok, so maybe 750 gigs isn't enough. :) I think I'm going to need 1 TB. Of course no such drive exists with a PATA interface that the ATV has. So...I needed a SATA interface, preferably eSATA so that I can buy a fanless stand-alone aluminum enclosure eSATA drive.

I bought the StarTech IDE to SATA adapter (PATA2SATA (http://www.startech.com/Product/ItemDetail.aspx?productid=PATA2SATA&c=US)) from PC Connection ($28) and connected it to the 44-pin to 40-pin adapter (http://www.startech.com/Product/ItemDetail.aspx?productid=IDE4044&c=US). I had to provide it a source of current, apparently both 12v and 5v - it's not documented. (I don't suppose anyone knows of 12v and 5v lines that are accessible in the ATV?) I connected it to a 2.5" SATA drive that I had imaged my Apple TV hard drive on and it booted up just fine.

The adapter is smaller than the hard drive, so it should fit without any trouble at all. However, I need a right-angle at the logic board's PATA interface to clear the bottom panel, so I'll need to buy a 44-pin M/F extension ribbon. I've found a source, but shipping is more expensive than the cable. At any rate, I'm going to see how this works out and I may make it a permanent solution.

MikieMikie
Mar 29, 2008, 04:24 PM
Nothing like a true man of courage.

Volante
Mar 29, 2008, 09:11 PM
Very interesting. :)

lowonthe456
Mar 30, 2008, 05:56 PM
Or you could not play McGyver and just put external hard drives on your AirPort Extreme Base Station and put all your videos on there. In essence, I have a 1040 GB ATV by doing this (not counting HDD space on the iMac).



can you elaborate on this? I currently have an airport express but could go that route. I haven't yet purchased an :apple:tv becuase the 40 gig fits my price point but i'd ideally want to rip *ALL* of my DVD's into my :apple:tv to make it a media server.

I get disappointed tho as it seems more and more that a mini is a better investment becuase of the weak hd capacity of the :apple:tv. I don't have a bunch of money to spend so I want to spend it wisely.

OlBlueHair
Mar 30, 2008, 09:10 PM
can you elaborate on this? I currently have an airport express but could go that route. I haven't yet purchased an :apple:tv becuase the 40 gig fits my price point but i'd ideally want to rip *ALL* of my DVD's into my :apple:tv to make it a media server.

I get disappointed tho as it seems more and more that a mini is a better investment becuase of the weak hd capacity of the :apple:tv. I don't have a bunch of money to spend so I want to spend it wisely.

I have airport express, which is G, not Wireless N, and it streams fantastically with zero problems...Here is what I do:

Mac Pro has a 500 GB external connected to it. Leave the computer on. Stream to your 40 GB Apple TV. That's all there is to it.

tronic72
Mar 30, 2008, 09:51 PM
I have airport express, which is G, not Wireless N, and it streams fantastically with zero problems...Here is what I do:

Mac Pro has a 500 GB external connected to it. Leave the computer on. Stream to your 40 GB Apple TV. That's all there is to it.

I agree 100%. No need for that sort of storage unless you like to take your ATV away (holiday house, nanna's house etc)

My 2c

alFR
Mar 31, 2008, 07:38 AM
I agree 100%. No need for that sort of storage unless you like to take your ATV away (holiday house, nanna's house etc)

Or unless you've got a laptop which isn't on all the time, gets taken to work/away with you on business etc. etc. In that case you're either looking at buying a mini to act as a server or syncing your content to the ATV (or both).

pilotError
Mar 31, 2008, 07:48 AM
I thought the ATV Hacks open up the USB port so you can add any standard USB drive to it...

Got to love a hacker though! Just upgraded the CPU in my iMac, messed up my wireless though :o

Cave Man
Mar 31, 2008, 09:08 AM
Or unless you've got a laptop which isn't on all the time, gets taken to work/away with you on business etc. etc. In that case you're either looking at buying a mini to act as a server or syncing your content to the ATV (or both).

Not to mention competition for bandwidth. We have three wireless Macs in our house. Smoother ff/rr, etc. And if 720/DD content becomes available, it might be ugly over wireless.

Just upgraded the CPU in my iMac, messed up my wireless though :o

Did you check your antenna wires?

ratter
Mar 31, 2008, 07:04 PM
I came || this close to hacking into my 40GB ATV soon after I got it. But when I looked at what I had around...an unused G4 ibook and a 500GB external drive, I ended up using the iBook as the media server with the media stored on the 500GB drive. Stowed it all down in the basement next to the furnace.

The iBook is connected via 100BaseT ethernet to my N network. My main machine is a MBP, which I didn't want to dedicate to media server duties. I rip DVD's on the MBP and copy them to the iBook via file sharing and then use screen sharing to remotely add the movies to iTunes on the iBook.

Performance is great. It only takes a couple of seconds for a movie to start, and ffwd/rwd works very well. Skipping between chapters is instantaneous. And I also like the fact that if I decide that I want a second ATV in another room, it's just another 200$ and all my media is ready to go and I don't have to hack the 2nd ATV.

I have 60ish DVDs ripped so far. It's nice to still have 300+ GB left on the external. Plus, I can use the external for normal backup duties too.

ceehjayem
Apr 1, 2008, 01:45 PM
This is a pretty cool trick. I have over 250GB of videos at the moment and would like to at least have a TB just for my videos. Awesome work.

dynaflash
Apr 8, 2008, 10:49 PM
Cave Man, did you every go ahead with your mod ? I am looking into something similar and like that sata to pata bridge chip you linked to.

Cave Man
Apr 8, 2008, 11:09 PM
Cave Man, did you every go ahead with your mod ? I am looking into something similar and like that sata to pata bridge chip you linked to.

I've just spent the last hour trying to get it to work, but I've encountered a problem that I can't figure out. If I connect the SATA controller directly to the logic board (via a 44-pin to 40-pin adapter), my SATA drives boot just fine (both 2.5" and 3.5" eSATA). But if I put a 44 pin ribbon cable between the logic board and the adapter, then the ATV acts as if the drive is missing (question-mark drive icon). I metered the voltage off the 44-pin adapter and if it's connected directly to the logic board I get 5v through the line (from the ATV's 44-pin bus - see photo). However, with the cable in place, the voltage drops to 4.2v. I wonder if that is enough to cause the problem? It may be that there's insufficient voltage through the cable to power the SATA controller.

At any rate, I connected my 500 gig Seagate eSATA drive to it (sans ribbon cable) and it worked perfectly well. It was amazing how fast I could forward/reverse scan and jump between chapters. It was also nice to see 460 gigs available. :D I want this to work, but I need to resolve the voltage problem.

BTW - StarTech informs me the SATA controller only needs the 5v line; the 12v line is apparently a dead end.

zainjetha
Apr 8, 2008, 11:26 PM
How come its 750 and ur TV shows 450? Id much rather get a mac mini and hook it to a 1TB external and go from there.

Oh and keep my warranty.

Cave Man
Apr 8, 2008, 11:30 PM
How come its 750 and ur TV shows 450?

You might re-read my previous post. I have a 500 gig eSATA drive.

Id much rather get a mac mini and hook it to a 1TB external and go from there.

I have that, too (see my sig). But the ATV is much more convenient for our TV setup. Plus, it autodetects if I'm using my DD receiver or just the TV, then selects the proper audio track (AC3/AAC). The Mini (or any Mac) cannot do that.

Oh and keep my warranty.

You must be new to the ATV. Mine's over a year old - and out of warranty.

vansouza
Apr 8, 2008, 11:43 PM
What is the USB port for on the :apple:TV? I thought it was for an external drive... was I wrong...?

Cave Man
Apr 8, 2008, 11:49 PM
That USB port is for "diagnostic" purposes only (according to Apple). But you can mod the ATV's OS to permit it to take an external drive. Not sure how its performance is, though. I can't imagine it's as fast as PATA or SATA (which is extremely fast).

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 05:35 AM
Awesome Cave Man ... Simply Awesome. SO I assume you spent the 16 bucks on the controller then. :)

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 05:56 AM
I was thinking eSata as well. with a proper setup and a dremel, you could have a decent hack allowing you to simply plug into an external eSata drive enclosure (which are becoming very plentiful). Nice.

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 07:14 AM
EDIT: sorry, just reread and realized you are already trying to use a ribbon cable hence the power issue. Sorry.

Sorry to keep in hitting on this, but I am very interested. Cave Man it looks like your using basically this http://biz.pcconnection.com/IPA/Shop/Product/Detail.htm?sku=347377 right off the connector on the atv logic board. which of course means everything is pointing straight up (actually down, but considering your atv is upside down of course in your picture, its actually up). Which of course means the bottom of the atv cannot be re-attached at this point. Ultimately of course the final solution would be great if the bottom could be reattached to the atv and most of the connectors kept inside the atv except for a hole made for the cable to the remote drive ( eSata is my thought here). So instead of the adapter you ended up using, I wonder if something like this http://damnsmalllinux.org/store/accessories/40_44pin_cable could be used since you could fold the extra ribbon cable up inside the atv and possibly fit your PATA to SATA Bridge http://www.cooldrives.com/sahadradtoid.html inside as well. Since the atv's internal drive wouldnt be needed, do you think there would be room ? I realize that this does not solve your voltage issue, but I am curious on your thoughts on this. Would be great to just have an eSATA connector coming out of the atv. Then any external drive with eSATA, USB 2.0 interface would be extremely easy to work with. USB 2.0 for the drive formatting on the mac, and the eSATA interface to plug into the atv.
Thoughts ?

Cave Man
Apr 9, 2008, 09:06 AM
EDIT: sorry, just reread and realized you are already trying to use a ribbon cable hence the power issue. Sorry.

No worries, dyna. I have to get a right-angle off of the logic board. The 5" 44-pin M/F cable is what's killing me. I have an email in to StarTech to see if they can tell me why I'm getting a voltage drop to 4.2 and if that's why I'm having problems. Otherwise, yes, it should all fit inside the ATV, sans hard drive.

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 09:14 AM
cool. what pata to sata bridge are you using there? Doesnt look like the one at http://www.cooldrives.com/sahadradtoid.html that you linked to previously.

Cave Man
Apr 9, 2008, 09:18 AM
Awesome Cave Man ... Simply Awesome. SO I assume you spent the 16 bucks on the controller then. :)

Expenses so far:

SATA controller - $28 (PC Connection)
44-pin to 40-pin adapter - $4.70 (PC Connection)
Internal SATA to eSATA cable - $6.00 (PC Connection)
44-pin M/F ribbon cable - $15.95 ($7.95 for the cable, $8.00 to ship :( - CablesOnline.com).

Total - $55 (and still not there yet...)

cool. what pata to sata bridge are you using there? Doesnt look like the one at http://www.cooldrives.com/sahadradtoid.html that you linked to previously.

It's the one linked in post #6, StarTech's PATA2SATA.

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 12:17 PM
Cool, thanks Cave Man. Got fired up and ran over to Computer Revolution during lunch and picked up a pata to sata adapter/bridge for 14.99 and a 44 to 40 pin adapter for another 14.99 (there was a cheaper one, but it was bigger so I went with the smaller one.) No male to female cables in stock though, so will have to order one. I guess that leaves me about where your at right now in terms of can hook it up but need the cable to work to complete the job. Am going to run a test setup tonight without the cable just to verify that my components work decent. Anxious to hear what StarTech says about the cable hosing it up.

digitalnicotine
Apr 9, 2008, 01:08 PM
You're braver than me! I'm going to go for this option. More expensive, but I've had great success with this brand, and I like that it matches the form factor of the :apple:TV, and has a built in USB 2.0 powered hub. It's also Time Machine ready.

G-Mini by G-tech (http://www.g-technology.com/Products/G-MINI.cfm).

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 01:19 PM
Completely different setup. You will still be streaming, but worse than streaming right from your computer as you will be streaming in two directions from the drive on the AEB to the host computer running itunes then back across the network to the AppleTV. That solution provides probably the worst performance unfortunately. The atv will not stream directly from an airdisk.

dynaflash
Apr 9, 2008, 05:40 PM
Okay, so inspecting my stock atv logic board to hdd ribbon cable, I notice a hole in it that must be interrupting a signal from one of the pins. Is it possible that by not using that stock ribbon cable it is messing something up ? Of course that would not explain why it works connected directly to the logic board. Hmmmm.

digitalnicotine
Apr 9, 2008, 05:43 PM
Completely different setup. You will still be streaming, but worse than streaming right from your computer as you will be streaming in two directions from the drive on the AEB to the host computer running itunes then back across the network to the AppleTV. That solution provides probably the worst performance unfortunately. The atv will not stream directly from an airdisk.

Thanks for the info. I see what you mean. :)

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 12:19 AM
Update: as Cave Man has, i have successfully run the atv off of an eSATA capable MyBook 750 GB remote hard drive as its boot drive, seems to work fine though am still missing the right angle (ribbon cable) to be able to close up the atv. Instead of a new cable I ordered a gender adapter and will attempt to use it with my stock atv cable. If this gets finished off this means that the atv can store as much as whatever eSATA capable remote hard drive you want to use . With the advantage of no software hacks so you can simply update as normal whenever apple puts out an update. Nice. :)

usarcher
Apr 10, 2008, 07:50 AM
Awesome work:eek: One question I have though is it possible to do this with the newer 2.0.1 release?

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 08:01 AM
The atv software version doesn't matter at all. It should work just fine with any version, unlike the many software hacks. As far as the atv is concerned its all the same. Just like putting a bigger harddrive in your computer.

Cave Man
Apr 10, 2008, 08:41 AM
Instead of a new cable I ordered a gender adapter and will attempt to use it with my stock atv cable.

Dyna - My M/F ribbon cable came with removable pins (i.e., it was really a F/F cable). I put these pins on my ATV's ribbon cable and the problem persisted. I sure hope you get it to work for you. Do you have a link to SATA bridge are you using?

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 08:48 AM
Hmm, no I don't have it handy. I can search for it. But I bought it over the shelf. Not a brand I recognize tbh. Physically it looks to be about 2/3 of the size of yours. One question, I do have is where were you getting power for your bridge ?

Cave Man
Apr 10, 2008, 09:01 AM
Pins 41 and 42 give 5v, and pins 43 and 44 provide ground. The 44-pin to 40-pin adapter has a 2-wire molex connector to it, with the red line connected to pin 41 and the black line to pin 43. I cut these wires and soldered them to the power connector that came with the SATA bridge, thus providing it 5v. The 12v line of the SATA bridge is unused.

For some reason, I'm losing voltage over that 5" of ribbon and apparently 4.2v is insufficient to drive the bridge. If you look at the photo in post #18, you can see where the power wires are connected to the adapter (bottom of photo), where they're soldered (electrical tape), and connected to the bridge (at its top).

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 09:07 AM
Ah, I thought so, but wanted to verify how you were doing it. Thanks. I hope to try mine out as soon as I get the gender adapter. I actually thought about removing the pins from an old drive I have and using them myself just to see.

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 09:10 AM
The 12v line of the SATA bridge is unused. My bridge only has the 5 volt connector.

Cave Man
Apr 10, 2008, 09:32 AM
Pending the outcome of your efforts, I may end up tapping into the ATV's power supply. I'm pretty sure the three blue wires are 5v lines (since this is effectively a notebook computer), but will meter to be sure. Where did you order your gender adapter?

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 09:37 AM
good idea. I actually bought it over the counter at Computer Revolution.

Cave Man
Apr 10, 2008, 10:56 AM
I actually bought it over the counter at Computer Revolution.

Well, this is confusing me, then...

Instead of a new cable I ordered a gender adapter and will attempt to use it with my stock atv cable.
:confused:

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 11:10 AM
heh, as usual I got a bit confused and thought you meant the pata to sata bridge (spend too much time between HB, work and this project I think). I ordered the gender adapter from http://www.cablesonline.net/44pinmalidc2.html yesterday.

dynaflash
Apr 10, 2008, 11:19 AM
BTW Cave Man (or anyone else) do you notice a small hole in your stock atv ribbon cable, its about the width of one of the internal wires? Mine has one which I have to believe is blocking the signal from one of the wires. It has always been there ever since I first opened it up. Its not in that center lead thats blocked off (the one you had to open up with a pin) its about two thirds of the way across.

TBi
Apr 10, 2008, 11:22 AM
BTW Cave Man (or anyone else) do you notice a small hole in your stock atv ribbon cable, its about the width of one of the internal wires? Mine has one which I have to believe is blocking the signal from one of the wires. It has always been there ever since I first opened it up. Its not in that center lead thats blocked off (the one you had to open up with a pin) its about two thirds of the way across.

I've seen that hole before on apple IDE cables. I think it stops the cable from being used backwards, I.E. if you plug the wrong end into the board it won't work. It doesn't have any adverse effect on performance though.

dynaflash
Apr 11, 2008, 01:35 PM
Cave Man, did you actually try playing a movie with your sata setup ? Or just boot it up.

I have been hearing that those ata to esata bridges are very slow, like slower than usb or pata. I did not try to really operate . but am thinking I might give it a whirl before going too much further and make sure it gives the performance I expect.

Cave Man
Apr 11, 2008, 01:43 PM
Dyna,

I played an episode of "24" for a few minutes, doing ff and rew to test its responsiveness. It was very quick and smooth. No issues for me.

dynaflash
Apr 11, 2008, 01:52 PM
Cool. Will try mine tonight. Maybe all pata to sata bridges are not created equal.

Koola
Apr 13, 2008, 06:52 AM
Cave Man,

Have you solved the "voltage drop over the cable" problem yet?

I'm really debating doing this. I've located a short 40pin to 44pin adaptor (http://linitx.com/viewproduct.php?prodid=10219) and a IDE to SATA adaptor (http://linitx.com/viewproduct.php?prodid=11623) but really want to know if the above problem still persists.

You had any better luck dynaflash?

Cave Man
Apr 13, 2008, 01:34 PM
I've not had time to work on it. I was hoping dyna would have the solution because I may have to tap the power supply, which I'd rather not have to do.

Koola
Apr 13, 2008, 02:13 PM
I've not had time to work on it. I was hoping dyna would have the solution because I may have to tap the power supply, which I'd rather not have to do.

As would I not like to tap the PSU.

From looking more at your problem, your doing this:

Logic_board --> 44pin_cable --> 44pin_adaptor --> SATA_adaptor

Right? or are you using a cable like I linked to above?

dynaflash
Apr 14, 2008, 07:19 AM
Havent had a chance to hook up and try it yet. Still waiting on my cable. Also got hosed up trying to image my 500GB eSata drive this weekend and ran out of time. Hope to maybe get something done this week.

Cave Man
Apr 14, 2008, 10:54 PM
rom looking more at your problem, your doing this:

Logic_board --> 44pin_cable --> 44pin_adaptor --> SATA_adaptor

Right? or are you using a cable like I linked to above?

Yes, that's what I'm doing. I have 5" of ribbon and about 5" of wire, and am apparently losing 0.8v over that length.

Cybix
Apr 14, 2008, 11:04 PM
curious, is there a reason why you don't just want to plug an external HDD into the Apple TV's usb? pretty easy to setup. I've got two drives hanging off mine, a 1T and a 500GB, works well... no need to open the ATV either.

Cave Man
Apr 14, 2008, 11:10 PM
The most significant reasons for me are (1) Apple updates breaking the mods for the USB port (which are transparent with eSATA), and (2) the speed of eSATA over USB. When I was running on eSATA it was really fast to ff/rew (1x, 2x, but not so much with 3x), and jumping to the next chapters (caching).

Cybix
Apr 15, 2008, 12:04 AM
The most significant reasons for me are (1) Apple updates breaking the mods for the USB port (which are transparent with eSATA), and (2) the speed of eSATA over USB. When I was running on eSATA it was really fast to ff/rew (1x, 2x, but not so much with 3x), and jumping to the next chapters (caching).

Thanks for that, you've made it clear.

Having the drive on USB sure can be a bit slower sometimes, and cleanly unmounting the drive after you've finished viewing is a pain (I do it in nitoTV).

I've got around 700+ divx encoded movies, so performing apple updates regularly isn't for me...

dynaflash
Apr 15, 2008, 07:08 AM
The most significant reasons for me are (1) Apple updates breaking the mods for the USB port (which are transparent with eSATA), and (2) the speed of eSATA over USB. When I was running on eSATA it was really fast to ff/rew (1x, 2x, but not so much with 3x), and jumping to the next chapters (caching).
Ten Four that Cave Man. I hacked mine a while back mainly to try using 5.1 AAC in MKV which was all we had at the time. Now with the new 5.1 AAC in mp4 I have no reason to hack it ( I like my atv updates ) so this eSATA solution if it works should be the bomb (I hope).

I did have a hell of a time trying to use my original 40 GB hdd which only had 1.0 on it from back when I first upgraded to a 160 since the upgrade to 2.0 (which I did with my 160 installed) Now for whatever the reason the 40 GB atv drive will boot, but absolutely no action from the remote whatsoever, its just stuck on the Movies menu. No way to force a reset afaik without the remote. I would like to make sure my 40GB drive maintains the latest atv rev on it for a backup (as well, for imaging other drives 40 gb is quicker than 160 gb), but it appears its broke for > 2.0 . I wonder if its because the 2.0 update had the efi firmware update in it as well. What rev image did you use to update your esata drive Cave Man ?

dynaflash
Apr 15, 2008, 07:10 AM
One other question Cave Man: in your short test, did you notice how the eSata drive worked with the atv sleeping ? I know in stock form it keeps power to the drive so it can accept iTunes synching etc.

Cave Man
Apr 15, 2008, 09:25 AM
One other question Cave Man: in your short test, did you notice how the eSata drive worked with the atv sleeping ? I know in stock form it keeps power to the drive so it can accept iTunes synching etc.

No, I didn't try it after it slept. Probably a good idea.

Cave Man
Apr 15, 2008, 09:49 AM
I've got around 700+ divx encoded movies, so performing apple updates regularly isn't for me...

That's the beauty of eSATA. Since it is your boot drive, when there's an update (and when a fix for your particular setup becomes available), just turn off the ATV, put the eSATA drive on your Mac, and copy the necessary files over. Much easier than patchstick, imo.

Cave Man
Apr 15, 2008, 10:40 PM
I would like to make sure my 40GB drive maintains the latest atv rev on it for a backup (as well, for imaging other drives 40 gb is quicker than 160 gb), but it appears its broke for > 2.0 . I wonder if its because the 2.0 update had the efi firmware update in it as well. What rev image did you use to update your esata drive Cave Man ?

I have my original 40 gig ATV 1.0 drive image stored safely on a CD. I did a factory restore, then connected it to my Mac and zeroed the free space. A 2 hour pass through StuffIt resulted in a compressed image of 444 mb.

dynaflash
Apr 15, 2008, 10:53 PM
Ah, saw your thread on that as well. Nice work. So I got my 40GB drive to work again and updated it to 2.0.2. So thats fine. Just re-imaged my 500 GB eSATA and popped open the atv to run it with the eSATA to test the sleeping before my gender adapter gets here tomorrow and "BANG" fricken question mark hard drive on the tv. Suddenly its like the drive isnt there. So back to the drawing board. Either A. I hosed up the drive imaging or b. my sata controller crapped out one way or another. Hmmmm. The quest continues.

dynaflash
Apr 16, 2008, 09:43 AM
Hmm, so more issues I think. My original test was with the sata drive removed from the mybook enclosure and hooked directly to the atv (much like your pictures cave man). I cannot however get it too boot the remote drive when the drive is in the case and connected via the eSATA interface. Maybe an incompatiblity with the mybook eSATA board in the mybook case (I know wd mybook interface boards tend to suck)? So ... the testing continues. Cripes this is worse than testing HB encodes ;)

iFizz
Apr 16, 2008, 10:11 AM
...Cripes this is worse than testing HB encodes ;)

I wouldn't say that. At least you are actively troubleshooting something. With HB encodes you spend most of your time trying to figure out how to twiddle your thumbs in opposite directions while you wait for the encode to be finished! Boring....

Cave Man
Apr 16, 2008, 10:18 AM
Hmm, so more issues I think. My original test was with the sata drive removed from the mybook enclosure and hooked directly to the atv (much like your pictures cave man). I cannot however get it too boot the remote drive when the drive is in the case and connected via the eSATA interface. Maybe an incompatiblity with the mybook eSATA board in the mybook case (I know wd mybook interface boards tend to suck)? So ... the testing continues. Cripes this is worse than testing HB encodes ;)

Mine booted with my Seagate eSATA drive in its enclosure. Does your drive in the eSATA enclosure spin up when you turn on the ATV? I'm pretty sure eSATA drives require an "on" signal from the SATA controller. Without it, the drive won't even power up.

dynaflash
Apr 16, 2008, 11:22 AM
Mine booted with my Seagate eSATA drive in its enclosure. Does your drive in the eSATA enclosure spin up when you turn on the ATV? I'm pretty sure eSATA drives require an "on" signal from the SATA controller. Without it, the drive won't even power up.
Nope, it doesnt even spin up. Frustrating.

dynaflash
Apr 17, 2008, 06:56 AM
Okee Dokee, so back in business with the (admittedly pos) mybook. Turns out the pata to sata bridge I had been using would not work with whatever sata controller WD uses in the mybook case (I have no clue why) or something. Either way I found what seems to be a decent bridge for $19.99 which seems to work great and appears to be physically smaller than the pata2sata bridge that your using cave man (though I see yours has two sata outputs, this only has one). So now all is well using the sata to esata cable right into the back of the mybook enclosure. seems to be fine when the atv sleeps. I couldn't resist so I went ahead and synced over 160 GB of HB goodness last night. Your right cave man, playback and fast forward, rewind and jumping chapters is instantaneous. Nice. Fedex tells me my gender adapter is due to arrive today, so tonight I plan to get the ribbon cable into the mix to finalize the mod.

One thought on getting the esata cable passed through the atv case is that I have left the rubber pad off of my atv since way back when I first upgraded it to 160 gb. I use four stick on furniture leg felt pads from home depot on the bottom of the atv as feet stuck right to the metal base. Which seems to help with cooling btw (using my manual thermometer). Since the back of the atv is more than full of ports already and I will need to find a place to get the cable out of the atv, I am thinking I will cut a hole in the bottom of the metal base and exit it there, the felt pads I use are about a 3/16" thick which is marginal to allow room for the cable under the base, but with taller feet, I think it will work fine. I would rather mod that metal base than the rest of the case as its already full of holes as it is.

What were your plans cave man for passing the esata cable through the case ?

Cave Man
Apr 17, 2008, 08:36 AM
Glad you got it working. It sure seems to perform quite nicely with eSATA. My plan for the cable was to bend a lip on the back edge of the bottom panel of sufficient size that I could get the eSATA cable out of the back. But I haven't got to that point yet - still trying to figure out this cable/voltage issue. Hopefully, you'll get it to work.

dynaflash
Apr 17, 2008, 09:01 AM
still trying to figure out this cable/voltage issue.
Not to sound stupid or anything, but is there any chance you had the ribbon or adapter installed backward ? I only ask this because in one of my many test installs directly into the board, I had the bridge installed "backward" into the 44 - 40 pin adapter, the leds on the bridge lit up etc, but I got the question mark drive icon on the tv (which I think is what you are experiencing). After messing about I turned the bridge 180 degrees and bang, it worked. I was fooled into not checking that first though because the indicator lights on the bridge were lit up so I figured it was installed correctly. Possibly with the cable installed it was the same scenario ? Just seems very odd that 5" of ribbon cable would reduce the voltage a sufficient amount to render the bridge inoperable especially considering that cable has to supply 5 volts to the stock laptop drive in the atv (and it seems to me at least that the laptop drive should draw as much if not more current than the sata bridge), but I will see hopefully tonight.

dynaflash
Apr 17, 2008, 10:58 PM
Okay, so I got my gender changer, hooked it all up and nothing. sata card lit up but got the flashing question mark drive on the screen :( Removed the cable and plugged straight into the logic board and it worked fine again. Now a couple of things I am wondering about. in looking at the 44 pin side of the 44 - 40 pin adapter where number 19 is blocked out (where cave man's picture shows we opened it up with a pin) well since the adapter is actually being used backwards from its intended use, thats not really number 19 I dont think, but the logic board pin still goes in and makes contact so all is well when plugged into the logic board directly. So introduce the ribbon cable and plug that adapter into the end of the ribbon cable which has 19 blocked off and now I dont think we are getting a signal out of whatever lead is the inverse of 19. It obtuse to explain but as I sat there looking at what was blocked off, it occurred to me that those were opposite where the adapter plugs in where the atv drive used to go. Its late and its hard to wrap my head around it, but it seems like we need a 44 pin ribbon cable with the logic board ends on both ends instead of a drive and on both ends so nothing is blocked off. Basically we want all of the pins on the logic board to connect directly to their counterparts at the other end with the cable attached to make that stupid bend with nothing blocked off.

As far as the voltage drop goes, it just seems hard to believe that we are losing that much voltage from that little cable, plus my hitachi 160 gb drive specs out 5 volts @ 600 ma in order to run. You would think that if that cable is dropping that much voltage the hard drives would have issues. Damn, too bad there isnt a 90 degree adapter we could use and lose the ribbon cable altogether. Thoughts ?

Cave Man
Apr 17, 2008, 11:17 PM
Well:

1. It's a bummer you're having the same problem as I am, but...

2. It's kind of refreshing that we're both having it. That means there is an issue here that needs resolved.

I, too, am quite tired and am heading to bed. Perhaps a couple of days of thinking are in order. Also, I have the 5" of ribbon plus about 5" of red/black wire. It's surprising that there'd be a voltage issue, but it apparently is. I should remeter that just to make sure, though.

We're getting close - I think it's just going to take a bit more time. I hope to get on this again this weekend.

dynaflash
Apr 18, 2008, 08:56 AM
Tossing out a thought:

So, how about the 44 pin to 40 pin adapter right to the logic board as before.

Then use a short 40 pin ribbon cable with the logic board ends on both ends (so there is nothing blocked off on one end) to the pata/sata bridge. That way we can use the heavier power wire right off the logic board adapter to the pata/sata bridge which may have less voltage drop if thats the issue.

The vampire style connectors should be easy enought to take apart and reattach onto the 40 pin ribbon cable at whatever length is needed. By using the logic board ends on both ends, we should be able to insure that we have a one for one pinout from the logic board to the pata/sata adapter which we know works when plugged in directly. Also maybe some benefit as the larger ribbon cable looks like the internal wires are a bit heavier gauge and might carry the current with less reistance/voltage drop ? Downside is a bit more clumsy to fold into an acceptable shape to get that esata cable out the back.

For lack of something better I will try to fab up this solution this weekend as a test and see what happens. Sooo close yet so far.

iFizz
Apr 18, 2008, 09:02 AM
Really appreciate what you guys are doing. Keep it up!

Cave Man
Apr 18, 2008, 09:09 AM
Tossing out a thought:

So, how about the 44 pin to 40 pin adapter right to the logic board as before.

Then use a short 40 pin ribbon cable with the logic board ends on both ends (so there is nothing blocked off on one end) to the pata/sata bridge.

The problem is the adapter still protrudes beyond the bottom of the ATV. If you look at image ATV4.jpg of my OP (with the 3.5" PATA drive), you can see it sticks out too far.

AliensAreFuzzy
Apr 18, 2008, 09:09 AM
I've been following this thread a little bit, and I was looking around online for solutions. I think that this (http://linitx.com/viewproduct.php?prodid=10219) cable might solve your problem with the voltage drop since you don't need the 44 pin extension cable.

Cave Man
Apr 18, 2008, 09:13 AM
I'd be willing to give it a try if there's a US source for it. Any idea where it could be had?

AliensAreFuzzy
Apr 18, 2008, 09:17 AM
I'd be willing to give it a try if there's a US source for it. Any idea where it could be had?

I also found this (http://www.mini-box.com/HDD-Cable-Adapter) one. But it's quite a bit longer. You could, however, pretty easily trim the power leads

dynaflash
Apr 18, 2008, 09:50 AM
One other thought here ( apologize, I am just brainstorming here at work ):

According to this http://ocliteracy.com/techtips/ide-cable-select.html which includes among other things this:
"Pin 28 on the IDE ribbon cable is used for cable select. If a drive sees this signal as grounded, it's the master, but if it floats (unconnected), it is the slave" .

That "hole" i was talking about in the ATV cable is in fact the 28th pin which would indicate that it would be a "Slave" in the atv configuration in other words there is no ground signal from it. When we hook up directly to the logic board, that pin is *not* interrupted as it is with that cable. So even though the atv drive has no problem with this, the sata to pata bridge might be since that pin is connected when we connect right to the board and according to the ide pin out that would be a ground.

As well, there is also the matter of the number 20 pin ( I errantly called it 19 earlier) which is blocked off on the ribbon cable but has a pin in the logic board.

So other than the possible voltage drop issue supplying the pata to sata bridge, the only other inconsistencies I can see are these two pins which are blocked in the atv cable but not in our tests right to the board. Hmmm...


Edit: That number 20 pin may not even have any signal in the logic board, but there is a pin for it in the logic boards connector anyway.

dynaflash
Apr 18, 2008, 10:00 AM
The problem is the adapter still protrudes beyond the bottom of the ATV. If you look at image ATV4.jpg of my OP (with the 3.5" PATA drive), you can see it sticks out too far.

Very true, I just thought it might work well as a test as I have a couple of these ribbon cables lying about and figured we could at least deterimine if there was a ribbon cable configuration that would allow it to work. Not a final solution, but might answer a few questions. If indeed it worked and there was no off the shelf 2.5" cable, frankly I am interested enough in it to buy an ide cabling kit and make my own.

Cave Man
Apr 18, 2008, 10:51 PM
That "hole" i was talking about in the ATV cable is in fact the 28th pin which would indicate that it would be a "Slave" in the atv configuration in other words there is no ground signal from it. When we hook up directly...

Hmm. When I connected a 3.5" PATA drive to it, the drive was set as master.

Cave Man
Apr 18, 2008, 10:52 PM
Very true, I just thought it might work well as a test as I have a couple of these ribbon cables lying about and figured we could at least deterimine if there was a ribbon cable configuration that would allow it to work.

I've tried that with a PATA drive and it worked just fine. For my setup, I think the issue is the voltage drop. Have you metered your 5v line when it works and when it doesn't work?

Cave Man
Apr 18, 2008, 10:53 PM
I also found this (http://www.mini-box.com/HDD-Cable-Adapter) one. But it's quite a bit longer. You could, however, pretty easily trim the power leads

I'll have to try that one later. Their server is down for maintenance. :mad:

dynaflash
Apr 19, 2008, 12:48 AM
Hmm. When I connected a 3.5" PATA drive to it, the drive was set as master.
Right, but my concern is that the bridge might need that ground even though the drive does not. The only other pin not used with the stock atv ribbon is that number 20 which I verified is a dead end, no ground and no signal.

As far as the voltage thing goes, I think tomorrow I will just go ahead and tap that blue wire if its 5volts and run a decent lead up to the bridge using the stock atv cable just to verify one way or another. I cannot leave the atv open like that, but its killing me to put it back together with the now anemic 160GB hard drive in it. ;)

dynaflash
Apr 20, 2008, 10:40 AM
Got it working with ribbon cable. :)

The problem is I had to switch around the end of the cable meaning remove the connector rotate it 180 degrees and re-attach it. I am now using a 40 pin cable between the 44pin adapter and the bridge, to see what I mean visualize everything plugged right into the logic board. Now take your cable and fold it so that the ends are straight though on a one to one. as if the pins went right through like directly into the logic board. you will notice the mark for pin one on the connectors is on the alternate row. At least in my case with the cable I used switching that end around gave me a one to one pinout. I used a cutout int the base and four standoffs to remount the base with more room to clear the adapter height (as cave man pointed out earlier).

So now I am permanently running the ATV eSATA :) Next step will be to get it working right with a 44 pin laptop ribbon so I can get everything inside without the standoffs and close it up like stock. Though really that will be mostly cosmetic actually. I don't have any pics right now but will try to post some later.

Cave Man
Apr 20, 2008, 01:20 PM
Dyna,

That is truly fabulous. Can you post a few pics of this cable mod and setup? If I understand you correctly, you removed the ribbon connector on one end of your ATV cable and flipped it around? You're still using your gender adapter as well? I'm going this route, too, as soon as I get what you've done in place.

Good work. :)

dynaflash
Apr 20, 2008, 05:30 PM
If I understand you correctly, you removed the ribbon connector on one end of your ATV cable and flipped it around?
Yep. [Edit: no, I used a 40 pin ribbon cable, not the 44 pin atv cable, I tried that and destroyed it in the process, so was committed to the 40 pin I had. So right now I am 44-40 pin adapter -> 40 pin ribbon cable (one end flipped 180) -> set of pins to go to male -> eSata bridge etc. etc.]
You're still using your gender adapter as well?
I had to remove the pins out of my old 44 pin gender adapter and hand pin the end of the 40 pin ribbon cable to get a male end to go into the bridge.

Family stuff today, will try for pics tomorrow.

dynaflash
Apr 21, 2008, 06:53 AM
k. no pics yet. But I did have one issue. For some reason this morning before leaving for work I did see the alternating white, yellow light flashing on the front of the atv. Turned the tv on and there was the question mark drive icon flashing :(. So, I simply restarted the atv and hit the power button on the mybook, it booted up fine . Was on all day yesterday with no issues. I think there may be issues with the power management firmware or something on the mybook. Not sure. Will take more troubleshooting I think. I would imagine if you had a drive with no power button of its own, you would be fine. Tough to say right now.

One note, my harmony remote is set to put the atv to sleep when I power everything off. Don't know if this is pertinent in this setup.

Cave Man, you have any luck this weekend ?

Cave Man
Apr 21, 2008, 12:54 PM
Cave Man, you have any luck this weekend ?

No, nothing this weekend. Nice weather + honeydolist = no free time...

I may also go the route you are as well. I'll see about getting some stand-offs and mill some wooden sides in my shop. I have plenty of scrap cherry, walnut and oak laying around, so it shouldn't be too much trouble. It's too bad the 3.5" drives don't take just 5v. Easier to power and wouldn't put out so much heat.

dynaflash
Apr 21, 2008, 01:31 PM
Well, I do not think I am using the optimum solution. I do think it is possible though. Like you its a matter of time to devote to this. I think I am kind of in the middle right now. Ultimately I see no reason a 44 pin ribbon cannot be used if its setup right. Which means it can be fully enclosed As much like stock as possible. Due to the lack of 44 pin cables over the counter (that and the fact that I hosed up the ends on my atv cable) I have resorted to getting everything ironed out with the much cheaper and more plentiful 40 pin ribbon cables. One other thing about the ribbon cable I used, none of the holes in any of the ends is blocked off as well as that number 28 CSSelect wire. Everything is connected from end to end. That helped eliminate possible causes of failure I think.

dynaflash
Apr 23, 2008, 11:40 AM
Okay so I took it back apart and may now have a better solution than my hand pinned 40 pin cable. This cable http://www.cablesonline.net/644fetomaide.html does the same thing in the smaller 44 pin cable size, as well it allows us to move the adapter that prevents the atv from being closed up. I just ordered it.

So this should work unlike the atv cable. The thing is, if you try to use a standard ide cable it cannot work as unlike the drive that is normally attached to the end of the cable, the bridges all have the exact same pin arrangement. Drives otoh are actually "paralleled" which means that the even and odd numbered rows are reversed. If you were to plug your drive directly into the logic board socket as we are with the bridge, the drive would not work either. Pin 1 on the logic board would actually plug into pin 2 on the drive, 3 becomes 4, and on and on. cave man, I really believe that you were likely suffering from this as opposed to the voltage drop you suspected initially. The cable linked above is a 44 pin version of the 40 pin cable that I handpinned and worked. So I do think its likely the answer. Notice in the description:

"This Cable is used to extend 2.00mm, 44 pin Laptop Hard Drive cable." meaning it maintains the row arrangement exactly as it is on the logic board whereas a regular ide cable parallels it reversing the two rows.

BTW, since that initial weird no hard drive incident, the eSATA drive has been working flawlessly. Approx 340 GB loaded up on it and the wife and kids have been using it almost daily with no glitches at all. We are close I thi nk ...

Cave Man
Apr 23, 2008, 01:20 PM
Dyna,

That is great to hear - I sure hope you are right. (And I appreciate you being the Guinea pig on this. :) )

Please let us know how it works. I'm leaving town for a few days, but hope to get this done in the next couple of weeks (pending your results).

Thanks - CM.

dynaflash
May 4, 2008, 12:25 AM
Good News. It works great. No need to tap that power supply (at least not for the sata bridge I am using) :). So it isn't as messy as my hand made 40 pin cable and folds up neatly in the atv. Only caveat is it required a small mod to the "shroud" around the logic board pins as the connector on the ribbon cable is a touch wider than the shroud allows (though possibly a different brand of the same cable would be narrower ?). Not a huge deal to be sure, but worth noting. Still have to mod my base and secure the card to get it closed up. Hoping to get to that tomorrow. Will snap a couple pics hopefully and get them posted. Have been running it (sans base, and upside down) all day and it works just fine. The only thing I am curious about is if that card and cable will have any effect on the airflow from the atv's fan once its closed up. I wouldn't think it would. But who knows ? Afaik this is somewhat uncharted territory.

Cave Man
May 4, 2008, 08:36 AM
Great work, dyna. Can't wait to see your photos.

dynaflash
May 5, 2008, 11:08 PM
Okay, finally got around to some pics. Here are the components I ended up using:

44 pin hard drive extension cable ( NOT a standard laptop hdd cable) http://www.cablesonline.net/644fetomaide.html for $9.99 U.S.

44 pin to 40 pin pata converter (same as cave mans) http://www.cablesonline.net/44pinto40pin.html $6.99 US.

Pata to Sata Bridge (local over the counter for me, you can order it online here): http://www.nanosys1.com/hd-cnt-cu-satahd-ide.html $19.99 US

Sata to eSata Cable: Take your pick, many available all over the place I bought mine over the counter for about $10.00 US.

Only real modification for this part was that the width of the connector for the 44 pin ide extension cable was greater than the "shroud" around the header in the logic board. So instead of searching for another cable (by now I was very tired of ordering things only to find they didn't work) I merely broke off the end of that shroud which is very easy as its just a brittle plastic and has no real function. Its right at each end so the plastic part of the cable connector can hang over a bit.


Here's some pics of the cable and adapter assembly.

dynaflash
May 5, 2008, 11:28 PM
So here are a couple of shots of the base closed up and the atv running with the WD MyBook 500GB eSata drive. I know, the quality of workmanship sucks on the base, but installed its not bad. Note by routing out the bottom like this you need some kind of feet. Fortunately I had always kept the rubber pad off of the base of mine and used those felt stick on furniture pads as feet anyway. I figured with the perforated metal bottom it would only promote airflow.

So, to echo Cave Mans early perfomance reports, I could not be happier. I went ahead and did a factory restore back to 1.0, then did the update just to make sure there was no issues. All went smooth as silk. You can see from the About screen that I have already synced more than I ever could with a standard pata drive and have plenty of room left. Its been running for a few days now and there have been no problems so far. In fact movies seem to play back smoother with extreme settings (placebo effect ?) and definitely tend to ffw and rew much smoother with no lag at all. I don't imagine that the 7200 rpm 32 mb cache drive hurts much in that area :).

One advantage I see here is that when the drive get's too full, just buy bigger eSata external, image it and reformat this one and use it in my system for other things as its fully unmodified.

DeanCorp
May 6, 2008, 03:03 AM
Excuse my ignorance but why can't you just use an ATV Patchstick and enable USB support. I have a 1.5TB connected to my ATV through USB + 160GB internal. No modifications required. No voiding of warranty. What am I missing?

dynaflash
May 6, 2008, 06:36 AM
Cave Man covers that earlier in this thread. This mod requires no software hacks that can be broken by an update. My atv has been out of warranty for some time so thats not an issue. As well, the eSata interface as well as the original pata interface is considerably faster than the USB interface .

But, thats just my preference. Glad your USB hack works well for you.

Cave Man
May 6, 2008, 02:37 PM
Excellent dyna - I've just ordered my crossover ribbon. Hopefully it'll be here on Friday. It'll give me something to do, other than mow the grass and other honeydo things.

dynaflash
May 6, 2008, 02:43 PM
Awesome, should work just fine. I Posted a more detailed thread over at the HB Tiki Bar which might be a bit more helpful for those that havent followed this one.

http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5999

Cave Man
May 9, 2008, 10:58 PM
Well, I'm beginning to think my PATA2SATA card has issues with ribbons. I rec'd the 44-pin crossover ribbon and when it's connected my eSATA drive does not boot. However, if I have the adapter/PATA2SATA directly connected to the ATV's ATA bus, the eSATA drive boots just fine. Here's a screen shot with a 1 TB eSATA drive connected.

I think I'm going to have to get that other card - what do you think, dyna?

dynaflash
May 9, 2008, 11:11 PM
I think that sucks. I can only assume your pata to sata bridge has some kind of an issue. Assuming you have everything I have besides my bridge, it is the only logical conclusion :( . Honestly, the wife and kids have been watching it most of the evening and now going on two weeks and it is working wonderously with nothing changed from my pics. I can only assume that your bridge has some kind of an issue with the cable. I know you have everything oriented correctly. So that has to be it.

Hang in there. Trust me ... once it works its freaking awesome :)

dynaflash
May 9, 2008, 11:15 PM
As well I see from your pics that you have wired power directly from the power supply, so that shouldn't be an issue (am I seeing the pic correctly ? ) . I don't know what else to say. One note on getting the bridge I have, its smaller and should fit better into the atv case than your bridge. Hope that lessens the disappointment at least a bit. Those screenshots I posted are literally taken right before I last hooked it up so I know there was nothing changed afterwards.

Sidebar: I would wager you had to trim that shroud. Correct ?

Cave Man
May 10, 2008, 12:02 AM
OK, I don't know WTF is going on. I changed the jumpers from single drive to master/slave with the drive connected as slave on the SATA connector. It booted just fine. I thought, "too good to be true." So I rebooted. And it rebooted just fine. "Sweet" I said. "Third time's a charm!" No boot. WTF? Reboot - nothing. Repeat 4 more times and nothing. I got junk coming across the TV as illustrated in the attached photo. What the hell could be going on? I don't understand why it boots twice in a row, then not for 6 more attempts. Could it be my connection? I'm going from the PATA2SATA with an iSATA to eSATA cable, then from that cable to the SATA drive via an eSATA cable. Is there a length limitation to SATA cabling?

And yes, I had to mod the shroud to get the ribbon on...

dynaflash
May 10, 2008, 10:09 AM
Looks like some kind of debug/diagnostic screen. Thats really odd. :(

Cave Man
May 10, 2008, 02:46 PM
I'm pretty much convince now that I have a bad ribbon cable, an issue with the PATA2SATA card, or a combination of both.

I have tried a direct SATA connection to the drive and it will not boot.
I have tried the ribbon in both directions and it will not boot.
I have metered the power to the SATA card and it is now getting 5 V with the ribbon between the logic board and the 44-pin/40-pin adapter.

I think I'm just going to have to buy dyna's SATA adapter to see if it will work. In the meanwhile, I managed somehow to get a login screen on the Apple TV. I had to do a factory restore to get it to go away.

I have also built a small footer that's about 1.5" high to accommodate an eSATA port. I had some walnut laying around and just milled it to size in the shop. It attaches to the ATV via three of its four bottom screws. Eventually, the aluminum panel will go on the bottom with rubber feet for ventilation. I think it'll look nice, if I can ever get past this controller issue...

dynaflash
May 10, 2008, 11:26 PM
Cool looking footer :) As far as your experiences with the login screen, that debug screen and your pata2sata card I have no clue why its not working. FYI I never changed any master/slave jumpers on my WD just used it right out of the box.

I *really* hope you get it to work. Believe me, I understand how frustrating it is when your so close. You would think your bridge should work fine with that ribbon cable, the pinout is exactly the same as the logic board. Afaik your bridge shouldn't know the difference. <perplexed>

Cave Man
May 11, 2008, 12:03 AM
Dyna - The bridge you're using is out of stock at the source you provided. They tell me it'll ship in a week (yes, someone was there on a Saturday and called me after my order!). Can you tell me its height (along with the 44/40-pin adapter) out of the bottom of the ATV? If it's less than 1.5", I won't even have to use the ribbon cable.

I am committed to getting this done. I am astounded by the performance increase with the eSATA drive. 2x FF is really, really smooth. I suspect it's more about the 7200 rpm and 32 mb cache of the drive, and less so the SATA interface.

BTW - the jumpers were changed on the PATA2SATA, not on the hard drive.

dynaflash
May 11, 2008, 09:38 AM
without measuring it I can guarantee you its more than 1.5 ". That new pic they have is misleading.

Yes, the performance increase is definitely impressive.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 07:36 AM
Cave Man, as I said in my more detailed post in the HandBrake tiki bar http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5999

I do believe that my pata-sata bridge is this one http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295 from Syba. It looks *exactly* like it down to the chip identifers I can make out in their pictures. Maybe there is another source were you can get it quicker. Just a thought.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 02:04 PM
Cave Man, for what its worth there is a new dev snapshot of HB out. Frankly, its more stable than 0.9.2 and has some cool new features http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6059 despite the announcement warnings. Just an fyi while you are waiting for your bridge ;)

AliensAreFuzzy
May 12, 2008, 02:21 PM
I am really temped to do this to my :apple:TV. I just have to decide if I want to void my warranty this soon.;)

Cave Man
May 12, 2008, 02:38 PM
I do believe that my pata-sata bridge is this one http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295 from Syba. It looks *exactly* like it down to the chip identifers I can make out in their pictures. Maybe there is another source were you can get it quicker. Just a thought.

Hey dyna,

I found it at another source and it should ship today. It's $16.20 including shipping from:

http://www.outletpc.com/c5573.html

They also have a 44-pin to 40-pin adapter with +5v.

http://www.outletpc.com/c6608.html

I suspect it'll be here in a couple of days.

I'll give the new HB build a try tonight. Thanks for the heads-up.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 02:56 PM
Those are good prices. Cool. Am excited to hear how it works. Hope you enjoy the new HandBrake, the audio is alot more flexible among other things. Oh, and x264 uses vaq which basically means there is little to no macroblocking, which has always plagued x264. But, I digress ...

Cave Man
May 12, 2008, 02:56 PM
I am really temped to do this to my :apple:TV. I just have to decide if I want to void my warranty this soon.;)

It's a bit nerve-wracking to do, but man is it fast. I am simply amazed at how quickly 2x ff goes with sync'd content on a 7200 rpm 32 mb eSATA drive. Very responsive.

Now all we need is for HB to take Blu-Ray video and smash it down to 720 HD with AAC/AC-3.

Get to work, dyna. :D

NightStorm
May 12, 2008, 03:49 PM
It's a bit nerve-wracking to do, but man is it fast. I am simply amazed at how quickly 2x ff goes with sync'd content on a 7200 rpm 32 mb eSATA drive. Very responsive.

Now all we need is for HB to take Blu-Ray video and smash it down to 720 HD with AAC/AC-3.

Get to work, dyna. :D
Take a look at the HB forum... :eek:

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 04:57 PM
Take a look at the HB forum... :eek:

Aw nightstorm, you spoiled the surprise ;)

NightStorm
May 12, 2008, 06:39 PM
Aw nightstorm, you spoiled the surprise ;)

I didn't say which part of the forum though... :p

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 06:42 PM
You're a sick man ... a sick man.

Cave Man
May 12, 2008, 07:15 PM
OK, quit teasing. Please, PLEASE, PLEASE tell me where the link is on HBF for Blu-Ray to Apple TV!

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 07:23 PM
Well, as all things its a work in progress, but it *appears* that the progress is coming much faster than anticipated http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6046 Note the *unencrypted* part.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 07:24 PM
I just encoded an unencrypted blu-ray clip to atv. awesome ... simply awesome ...

Cave Man
May 12, 2008, 07:41 PM
Dyna,

Can you tell me if this will permit me to install a Blu-Ray drive (reader only) in my Mac, then convert a Blu-Ray movie, such as "Pirates of the Caribbean" into a 720HD/AC3/AAC file compatible with my Apple TV? If so, all the more reason for an eSATA solution for the ATV.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 07:49 PM
Well, realize as I said, there is *no* decrypting capability. None whatsoever. So you would have to rip it first.
Plus, with the stock atv software at least, your are limited to 540p afaik. er, at least at 29 fps. At 24 fps you could get 720p if you decrypt it first.

dynaflash
May 12, 2008, 07:58 PM
Cave Man, its in its infancy, but realize there is alot of reasons coming up to push forth with the atv eSata mod. :)

Mac_Max
May 13, 2008, 01:34 AM
One thing you guys could do is get one of these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812232002). If you want to be fancy, you can use a relay to turn on the external PSU when the Apple TV turns on.

Basically the 5v from the mini will control on/off for the 3.5" HD.

Something like this would do the trick:

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pumrelswitki.html

Cheaper examples of both the USB -> ATA adapter and the relay kit exist. The relay can also be made from parts.

Cave Man
May 13, 2008, 09:20 AM
I don't want USB - it's too slow.

dynaflash
May 13, 2008, 09:21 AM
um. why ? I mean the esata drive is controlled via a signal through the bridge from the atv. afaik that would not really help with anything I am aware of. Um, and we are not using this with a mini, its an AppleTV.

Cave Man
May 16, 2008, 12:22 AM
OK, I am now enjoying eSATA on my ATV. It looks like the StarTech PATA2SATA bridge is not doable. The one dyna found seems to be the solution to the problem I had. My eSATA drive now running my ATV using the Syba bridge (SY-IDE-SATA (http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295)) purchased for $11.89 from OutletPC (http://www.outletpc.com/c5573.html).

The walnut base that I made in my shop has an eSATA plate on the back. The corners were rounded with a 3/8" round-over bit, but the ATV looks to be more like a 1/2" round-over. I may get it right one day, but for now I'm going to just enjoy it as is.

The ribbon cable did give me some trouble at first. For some reason, it would only start the boot, but not finish it. I connected the bridge and adapter directly to the ATV's PATA connector and it booted just fine. Put the ribbon in between again and it's now booted four times without a problem. Not sure what could have caused that, but it seems to be stable.

Of course, the three principal advantages of this mod are:

1. A lot more storage space compared to any internal drive.
2. Extremely fast operation; even 3x ff is silky-smooth. The drive I have is a 7200 rpm with 32 mb cache and the SATA controller is 1.5 gb/s. It blows USB drives out of the water.
3. If you ever need to retrieve files off the ATV (say, oh, I don't know, maybe a high-def movie rental just to peek at it) or mod the OS, it's very easy. Just buy an enclosure that has both eSATA and USB (or FW) and go between the ATV and your Mac. No patchstick mods or anything else.

I also discovered that Disk Utility's restore function can be used to create a bootable OSBoot partition on the ATV's drive. I dragged and dropped the 2.0.2 disk image that I downloaded from Apple, and Disk Utility built me a bootable partition in less than 3 minutes.

Attached are a few images of my completed setup.

Koola
May 16, 2008, 06:05 AM
That's an awesome looking setup Cave Man. Weird about the controller, I guess it's an issue with power requirements when the cable is added :S

northy124
May 16, 2008, 06:08 AM
Dam thats nice & is that Robocop on the screen?

NightStorm
May 16, 2008, 07:50 AM
Dam thats nice & is that Robocop on the screen?
Are you serious? :confused:

northy124
May 16, 2008, 07:58 AM
It looks like it might not be but I regonise it from somewhere futuristic or are you on about something else.

iFizz
May 16, 2008, 08:29 AM
Dam thats nice & is that Robocop on the screen?

Wow. I'm officially old. :eek:

dynaflash
May 16, 2008, 11:20 AM
Way cool Cave Man :) So now we have two different methods to mod the case, one low profile and one with a nice female socket in the back. Awesome! Gotta say it would be tough to go back to the pata drive now. Its an excellent mod and I would do it again in a heartbeat. btw, two days ago I synced another 100 + GB of HB goodness to my AppleTV eSata and it is smooth like butter :)

MikieMikie
May 16, 2008, 11:43 AM
Caveman & Dyna,

You guys rock!

I am tres jealous. :D

I have enjoyed watching you two work through this, and I appreciate your sharing it. Well done.

-- Mikie

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 2, 2008, 09:34 AM
So I decided to go ahead and do this to my :apple:TV. I've got all the hardware working and hooked up and I loaded the software following one of the guides. But when I plug turn it on, it boots to the restore menu. I try a Factory Restore and it goes through the progress bar and restarts, but then it just sits at the Apple logo. I'm going to try to go through the software load again sometime this week.

dynaflash
Jun 2, 2008, 09:43 AM
Have you tried this ? Unplug both the atv and the hard drive. Plug the hard drive in first, and when you hear it spool up. Then plug in the atv. It seems like if the atv cannot find its startup drive (like you forgot to fire up the esata drive) once that question mark logo hits it quits looking. Make sure the eSata drive is running before you fire up the atv.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 2, 2008, 09:51 AM
Have you tried this ? Unplug both the atv and the hard drive. Plug the hard drive in first, and when you hear it spool up. Then plug in the atv. It seems like if the atv cannot find its startup drive (like you forgot to fire up the esata drive) once that question mark logo hits it quits looking. Make sure the eSata drive is running before you fire up the atv.

I'm not getting the question mark, it's just sitting on the Apple logo. I know it can see the drive because it will let me to a restore and I can hear the drive working.

dynaflash
Jun 2, 2008, 10:39 AM
OH, thats weird. Well, at least you know your getting the drive detected and in fact working. Maybe something in error with how you imaged the drive ?

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 2, 2008, 04:01 PM
OH, thats weird. Well, at least you know your getting the drive detected and in fact working. Maybe something in error with how you imaged the drive ?

I'm thinking that's probably it. I'm going to try to reimage the drive later this week.

dynaflash
Jun 3, 2008, 07:19 AM
On the plus side, at least its wickedly easy to do since you no longer have to open up your atv case to attache your drive to your mac. :)

ckurowic
Jun 3, 2008, 07:55 AM
Or unless you've got a laptop which isn't on all the time, gets taken to work/away with you on business etc. etc. In that case you're either looking at buying a mini to act as a server or syncing your content to the ATV (or both).

Right on. I tried streaming with one of my G3 B&W units and it stuttered pretty bad. Now I've got a 1GHz iMac G4 running OS X server and it works great for streaming. Though, I do not like QTSS very much. I know you can simply use iTunes to stream, and I suppose that is the best way to go. Unless of course you need to view the videos from outside of your LAN. :)

saltyzoo
Jun 4, 2008, 01:49 PM
Very cool. I think I missed something though. How did you go from having a circuit board sticking out at 90 degrees, to a nice small wooden extension?

dynaflash
Jun 4, 2008, 02:00 PM
Using the 44 pin hdd extension cable allows you to lay the sata bridge wherever you want. You can actually close up the atv since the bridge is no thicker than the internal hdd your are removing. Cave added the wooden "footer" so he could use a female eSata socket on the back of the atv instead of just having the eSata cable come right out the back like in my mod.

saltyzoo
Jun 4, 2008, 02:05 PM
Using the 44 pin hdd extension cable allows you to lay the sata bridge wherever you want. You can actually close up the atv since the bridge is no thicker than the internal hdd your are removing. Cave added the wooden "footer" so he could use a female eSata socket on the back of the atv instead of just having the eSata cable come right out the back like in my mod.

Makes sense. You could probably fit the external drive circuitry and the drive in his "footer" too, and just shoot a jack out to allow it to be plugged into a pc for other uses? You might have heat issues with that I suppose. It is kind of handy to have the drive external. I'm just thinking out loud about making it more tidy.

dynaflash
Jun 4, 2008, 02:14 PM
For me, one of the main attractions was the eSata drive being external. I have it hidden out of the way and there is no heat from the drive affecting the atv (which we all know runs plenty hot anyway). Plus, servicing the drive via your mac is about as easy as it gets if thats your thing as all eSata capable external hard drives I have ever seen also have a handy usb port which allows for easy hooking up to your mac if need be.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 4, 2008, 03:56 PM
For me, one of the main attractions was the eSata drive being external. I have it hidden out of the way and there is no heat from the drive affecting the atv (which we all know runs plenty hot anyway). Plus, servicing the drive via your mac is about as easy as it gets if thats your thing as all eSata capable external hard drives I have ever seen also have a handy usb port which allows for easy hooking up to your mac if need be.

I think what I'm going to do is actually a combination of what you and Cave Man did. I'm going to have a little tail sticking out of the back of the atv that has a eSATA female jack on it. That way I won't have to build a footer, but I also won't have the long eSATA cable hanging out when I move it.

Cave Man
Jun 10, 2008, 01:54 PM
I'm thinking that's probably it. I'm going to try to reimage the drive later this week.

How's the build going for you?

Cave Man
Jun 10, 2008, 01:55 PM
Well, realize as I said, there is *no* decrypting capability. None whatsoever. So you would have to rip it first.
Plus, with the stock atv software at least, your are limited to 540p afaik. er, at least at 29 fps. At 24 fps you could get 720p if you decrypt it first.

Dyna,

Do any of the Windoze free-ware apps decrypt Blu-Ray discs? I have Win XP on my Hackintosh.

dynaflash
Jun 10, 2008, 02:15 PM
afaik the only one is anydvd HD. Never tried it myself though.
[Edit: realize you said freeware, anydvd HD is pay ware I believe]

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 10, 2008, 02:26 PM
How's the build going for you?

I haven't really had much time to work on this at all. I was busy all weekend and have had to do a lot after work during the week. I'll probably try to reimage tomorrow.

EDIT: actually I might try to squeeze in the imaging this afternoon, sometime between podcast recording and softball.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 11, 2008, 06:25 PM
So I tried imaging the drive again today. It gave me similar errors to what happened the first few times I tried imaging it. It happens when I try to resize the Media partition on the larger drive. Terminal process is below (disk8 is ATV drive, disk9 is larger drive)
EDIT: I am doing this on a 2.0 CD MBP running 10.5.3


dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ dd if=/dev/disk8 count=1335 of=/dev/disk9 bs=1024k
1335+0 records in
1335+0 records out
1399848960 bytes transferred in 662.853847 secs (2111852 bytes/sec)
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ diskutil eject disk9
Disk disk9 ejected
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ gpt recover disk9
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ diskutil eject disk9
Disk disk9 ejected
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ gpt remove -i 4 disk9
disk9s4 removed
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ diskutil eject disk9
Disk disk9 ejected
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ gpt show disk9
start size index contents
0 1 PMBR
1 1 Pri GPT header
2 32 Pri GPT table
34 6
40 69632 1 GPT part - C12A7328-F81F-11D2-BA4B-00A0C93EC93B
69672 819152 2 GPT part - 5265636F-7665-11AA-AA11-00306543ECAC
888824 1843192 3 GPT part - 48465300-0000-11AA-AA11-00306543ECAC
2732016 974041119
976773135 32 Sec GPT table
976773167 1 Sec GPT header

dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ diskutil eject disk9
Disk disk9 ejected
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ gpt add -b 2732016 -i 4 -t hfs /dev/disk9
/dev/disk9s4 added
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$ diskutil eraseVolume "Journaled HFS+" Media /dev/disk9s4

DiskManagement setuid-tool failure
dan-druschs-macbook-pro-15:~ dandrusch$

Cave Man
Jun 11, 2008, 07:07 PM
If I understand correctly, you're using dd to do a byte-by-byte copy from one physical drive to another? I think dd will give you troubles if you do that. Have you imaged your ATV drive to a disk image file first, then to the new drive?

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 11, 2008, 09:46 PM
If I understand correctly, you're using dd to do a byte-by-byte copy from one physical drive to another? I think dd will give you troubles if you do that. Have you imaged your ATV drive to a disk image file first, then to the new drive?

That was how I tried it the first time. This was given as an option in the Engadget article on cloning the ATV drive.

Cave Man
Jun 12, 2008, 06:23 AM
I've never had any luck with that method, for some reason. I've only tried doing it to clone a Mac HD, though. I was trying to save my Win XP partition and couldn't get it to work for me.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 12, 2008, 07:40 AM
I've never had any luck with that method, for some reason. I've only tried doing it to clone a Mac HD, though. I was trying to save my Win XP partition and couldn't get it to work for me.

What method did you use?

Cave Man
Jun 12, 2008, 08:58 AM
Here's what I've done:

1. Factory restore of the ATV's hard drive to delete all unnecessary files from the Media partition.

2. Connect the ATV hard drive to my Mac with a USB drive adapter.

3. Launch Disk Utility and zero out the Media and OSBoot partitions. This allows for 98% compression of the disk image to be made in the next step.

4. Unmount and image the disk using dd: dd if=/dev/diskX of=ATVdisk.img bs=1024k

This took about 2 hours on my old Mini and generated a 37 gb image file on my Mac's hard drive in my home directory. At this point, I used OS X's archive utility (right-click, compress) to compress the disk image to less than 500 mb, small enough to put on a CD. This step is not necessary if you never plan to reimage the drive, but I'd used it many times so it might be worthwhile to do so.

5. Connect the new drive to your Mac and do the dd reverse: dd if=ATVdisk.img of=/dev/diskX bs=1024k

This has always worked for me.

dynaflash
Jun 12, 2008, 09:11 AM
I actually do it the old fashioned way basically following this http://wiki.awkwardtv.org/wiki/Prepare_a_Hard_Drive#Acquiring_the_necessary_images

Having said that, I am intrigued by Cave's method. Have to give it a try when I switch to a bigger eSata drive. Only about 120 GB left on the 500 GB :)

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 12, 2008, 09:12 AM
^^ I might try that tonight. I've got a 500GB drive I'm using right now, but I should be getting a 750GB or 1TB drive very soon.

dynaflash
Jun 12, 2008, 09:17 AM
Nice thing there is you actually create the media partition instead of back it up. So you only backup OSBoot, EFI and Restore which are considerably smaller and transfer much quicker.

Stick with it. Like all things, once its done it is well worth it. And unless your run out of room, you won't have to go through any jacking around just because apple decides to push a little atv software goodness, you'll be golden.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 12, 2008, 07:16 PM
Ok, so now I've got it booting up to the original 1.1 software. But now I've got a new problem. I can't update the software. It will download it and I say update now, it reboots, and it's still 1.1. I tried doing a factory restore, but it just boots up even when holding - and menu.

Cave Man
Jun 12, 2008, 07:37 PM
Try this, it worked for me:

1. Download the 2.0.2 disk image from here (http://mesu.apple.com/data/OS/061-4632.2080414.gt5rW/2Z694-5428-3.dmg).

2. Once downloaded, mount your new ATV hard drive on your Mac and launch Disk Utility. In Disk Utility, click on the OSBoot partition of your ATV drive and erase it. Note, this is the OSBoot partition only and not the entire drive.

3. Use the Restore function of Disk Utility to build your 2.0.2 OSBoot partition by dragging the 2.0.2 image to the Source box and your ATV's OSBoot partition to the Destination box.

Whole process should only take a couple of minutes and you should now have an Apple TV with 2.0.2 bootable.

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 12, 2008, 09:29 PM
I think I've finally got it! Now just to get the case worked out.

EDIT: I just realized how long it's going to take to transfer 500GB over ethernet...

dynaflash
Jun 12, 2008, 10:29 PM
I think I've finally got it! Now just to get the case worked out.
Most excellent! congratulations :) If you just use the esata cable out the back, its really a breeze. Cave's solution requires a bit more craftsmanship though.
EDIT: I just realized how long it's going to take to transfer 500GB over ethernet...
Ah yes, but such a nice problem to have ;)

Cave Man
Jun 13, 2008, 12:09 PM
I think I've finally got it! Now just to get the case worked out.

Great news. Did you get the autoupdate to work, or was it the restore method?

EDIT: I just realized how long it's going to take to transfer 500GB over ethernet...

Some problems are nice to have, eh?

AliensAreFuzzy
Jun 13, 2008, 01:04 PM
Great news. Did you get the autoupdate to work, or was it the restore method?

I ended up doing the restore method... for both the new one and the original... forgetting to change a 2 to a 1 can make a big difference:o

I'm still looking for a 1TB drive to use because I have 534GB in TV shows alone.

dynaflash
Jun 14, 2008, 08:05 AM
Only issue I have here (and its an admittedly small one) is that if the power goes out and comes back on, the atv is left with the flashing question mark hard drive icon. Presumably this is because at least in my case, the atv must fire back up first and tries to access the drive before the drive gets powered up. A quick restart of the drive solves it and restores full eSata goodness :) . Minor but worth noting.

dynaflash
Jul 2, 2008, 04:30 PM
Just a late footnote: wife wanted a bigger HD tv. So we got one and grabbed another atv. Of course I had another set of components already in stock for this mod. No sooner did I open the new atv than I tore out the hokey stock hdd and performed the eSata mod.

Happy to report all was flawless and now I am happily running a 500 GB and 1 TB atv here and all is well. :)

Cave Man
Jul 2, 2008, 04:32 PM
Just a late footnote: wife wanted a bigger HD tv. So we got one and grabbed another atv. Of course I had another set of components already in stock for this mod. No sooner did I open the new atv than I tore out the hokey stock hdd and performed the eSata mod.

Where can I get a wife like that? :)

Happy to report all was flawless and now I am happily running a 500 GB and 1 TB atv here and all is well. :)

So jealous, so jealous...

Cave Man
Aug 23, 2008, 09:32 AM
Well, I finally bought the 750 gb eSATA drive for my ATV. I didn't want to have to resync everything, so here's what I did:

1. Used 'dd' in terminal to put my original 40 gb ATV disc image onto the 750 gb drive.
2. Used iPartition to increase the Media partition to the volume's capacity (694 gb :D).
3. Used Disk Utility to erase both the OSBoot and Media partitions.
4. Used Disk Utility's Restore function to put the ATV 2.0.2 disc image from Apple onto the OSBoot partition.
5. Used Carbon Copy Cloner to clone my old eSATA drive's Media partition to the new drive's Media partition.

Plugged it in and the ATV booted just as the old drive. No resyncing, no rejoining the network, nor any of that other stuff that comes with a clean install. Now, back to all that high-def video Dolby Digital transcoding... :eek:

almostinsane
Aug 23, 2008, 01:05 PM
So I tried imaging the drive again today. It gave me similar errors to what happened the first few times I tried imaging it. It happens when I try to resize the Media partition on the larger drive. Terminal process is below (disk8 is ATV drive, disk9 is larger drive)
EDIT: I am doing this on a 2.0 CD MBP running 10.5.3

[/code]

I had the same problem when I added a 250GB drive into my Apple TV. Here is how to fix it.

Instead of typing this:

diskutil eraseVolume "Journaled HFS+" Media /dev/diskXs4

And getting this error:

DiskManagement setuid-tool failure

Type this:

newfs_hfs -J -v Media /dev/diskXs4

(Replace X with your drive number)

Eject the disk and it will have expanded the media partition and will work perfectly. All in all it only takes 20 minutes to upgrade the HD in the Apple TV. Just backup the OSBoot partition only, restore it to the new drive, and then create and expand the Media partition.

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 10:21 PM
So I replied on dyna's thread on the Handbrake forums and I thought I'd reply here as well. I've gotten pretty far but am stuck when trying to get the AppleTV to boot. I set up the drive multiple times and I know it's correct. The partitions and everything are correct, the EFI and Restore partitions are correct, everything should be set. I did a restore from the 2.0.2 image from Apple using Diskutility as shown earlier in the thread to make OSBoot a bootable copy of 2.0.2 and all the files show up correctly. When I plug everything in to the AppleTV and try to start it up the drive spins up and I can hear it doing something, but the Apple logo shows up and never goes away. Sometimes it flashes on and off like it's restarting, but I left it for a good 40 minutes and it never got past that logo. The media partition is correct though empty, but from my understanding that shouldn't make a difference. Here's what my drive looks like, which should be right:

/dev/disk2
#: TYPE NAME SIZE IDENTIFIER
0: GUID_partition_scheme *372.6 Gi disk2
1: EFI 34.0 Mi disk2s1
2: Apple_Recovery 400.0 Mi disk2s2
3: Apple_HFS OSBoot 900.0 Mi disk2s3
4: Apple_HFS Media 371.3 Gi disk2s4

and

iMac.local root$ gpt show /dev/disk2
start size index contents
0 1 PMBR
1 1 Pri GPT header
2 32 Pri GPT table
34 6
40 69632 1 GPT part - C12A7328-F81F-11D2-BA4B-00A0C93EC93B
69672 819200 2 GPT part - 5265636F-7665-11AA-AA11-00306543ECAC
888872 1843200 3 GPT part - 48465300-0000-11AA-AA11-00306543ECAC
2732072 778690663 4 GPT part - 48465300-0000-11AA-AA11-00306543ECAC
781422735 32 Sec GPT table
781422767 1 Sec GPT header

What do you guys think? Is there something I'm missing?

Cave Man
Aug 27, 2008, 10:40 PM
OK, a little info please.

1. You have done the eSATA hack using a PATA to SATA controller? Which one?
2. How are you building your disk's file structure? Are you using dd to put a disk image onto it? If so, have you tried to boot without resizing the Media partition?

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 10:50 PM
OK, a little info please.

1. You have done the eSATA hack using a PATA to SATA controller? Which one?
2. How are you building your disk's file structure? Are you using dd to put a disk image onto it? If so, have you tried to boot without resizing the Media partition?

Yes. I used the Syba controller listed in Dynaflash's how-to post on the Handbrake forums. I used all the parts he listed in the post.

I have images of the EFI partition and the Recov. partition on my computer from when I imaged my original drive. Quite a while ago I replaced the 40GB drive for a 250GB drive and am now trying to go larger. I'm using the same method I used back then which worked on the 250GB drive, it just doesn't seem to want to boot past the Apple logo on my eSATA drive. I tried swapping my enclosure to another one but that didn't seem to change anything either. I'm at a loss and I need to get this thing going so I can get the living room back together!

I've tried to boot with the smaller Media partition, I've tried to boot with no media partition, and I've tried resizing it. It seems like everything I try makes for the same result. Looks like the drive is doing something (and the light on both the drive enclosure and bridge blinking makes it seem like data is being transfered) but the Apple logo is as far as I get.

EDIT: I'm using a Western Digital SATA drive, has anybody else tried using one of those? Is there a problem with the drive maybe?

Cave Man
Aug 27, 2008, 11:00 PM
Yes. I used the Syba controller

OK, that's the one that works for sure.

I have images of the EFI partition and the Recov. partition on my computer from when I imaged my original drive.

(Notes plural use of 'images') Did you image the entire drive, or did you image each individual partition? If you did individual images, this is likely the problem. I have come to the conclusion that the EFI and recovery partition have to be at specific places on the drive. If they're not there, you will not be able to boot.

EDIT: I'm using a Western Digital SATA drive, has anybody else tried using one of those? Is there a problem with the drive maybe?

During my testing, I used a WD 80 gb notebook SATA drive and it worked just fine, so I doubt that's the issue.

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 11:03 PM
(Notes plural use of 'images') Did you image the entire drive, or did you image each individual partition? If you did individual images, this is likely the problem. I have come to the conclusion that the EFI and recovery partition have to be at specific places on the drive. If they're not there, you will not be able to boot.


Yes they are separate images. I checked the layout of the partitions on my working 250GB internal drive and the external SATA drive and all the locations are exactly the same. I was going to do a whole image but I don't have the 40GB drive anymore, only the 250GB drive and it takes a REALLY long time to do a single image of a 250GB drive. Looking at the layout of the drives, I don't think the placement is a problem just because it's exactly the same between the two.

Cave Man
Aug 27, 2008, 11:07 PM
I'm not sure I can help you with that. I have only worked with the entire disk image, not the individual partitions. That's a bummer, though; eSATA is really nice.

Cave Man
Aug 27, 2008, 11:09 PM
Maybe I should ask the obvious: Did you try to do a factory restore before resizing the Media partition?

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 11:14 PM
Maybe I should ask the obvious: Did you try to do a factory restore before resizing the Media partition?

No, I can't get the AppleTV to boot at all in order to have the option to do a factory restore. Maybe tonight I'll try to do a full image?

Cave Man
Aug 27, 2008, 11:18 PM
You've tried simultaneously holding the - and menu buttons for 6 seconds?

dynaflash
Aug 27, 2008, 11:20 PM
Well, we might as well work on this here instead of two forums.

EDIT: I'm using a Western Digital SATA drive, has anybody else tried using one of those? Is there a problem with the drive maybe?

As my pics and article show. I am using both a 500 gb wd mybook and a 1 TB mybook. So I know it can work with those drives.

I am going to go on a limb and say its either the bridge, or something about that drive imaging. Though its late and I cannot figure out what could be wrong with the drive image.

To verify: are you getting a flashing logo, or a flashing no drive (question mark) icon ?

Also, just for kicks did you try running it in "upside down test mode" without the ribbon cable just to rule that out ?

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 11:20 PM
Hey do you still have your 40gb image file? If I send you a server to use can you upload it so I can use that, an image that is known working?

Vortec4800
Aug 27, 2008, 11:47 PM
You've tried simultaneously holding the - and menu buttons for 6 seconds?

Didn't know that would do anything. I'll give it a shot and let you know what happens.

Well, we might as well work on this here instead of two forums.



As my pics and article show. I am using both a 500 gb wd mybook and a 1 TB mybook. So I know it can work with those drives.

I am going to go on a limb and say its either the bridge, or something about that drive imaging. Though its late and I cannot figure out what could be wrong with the drive image.

To verify: are you getting a flashing logo, or a flashing no drive (question mark) icon ?

Also, just for kicks did you try running it in "upside down test mode" without the ribbon cable just to rule that out ?

Good idea. It could be the bridge, but it's the one you listed in your thread and it at least sees the drive as it spools up and the Apple logo shows up. I'm getting a steady Apple logo (the Apple itself) and that's it. Sometimes it goes away and comes back after a few seconds, but that's it.

If the image is less than 17GB zipped up then put it here:

http://idisk.mac.com/cory.imdieke-Public

dynaflash
Aug 27, 2008, 11:52 PM
I'm getting a steady Apple logo (the Apple itself) and that's it. Sometimes it goes away and comes back after a few seconds, but that's it.

Hmm, then methinks its your drive formatting or something. If it were hardware you should just get a flashing no drive icon.

If the image is less than 17GB zipped up then put it here:

http://idisk.mac.com/cory.imdieke-Public
Um, no offense, but I am not uploading an atv drive image anywhere. Sorry. Besides, I thought earlier you said the one you have is right from your original 40GB atv drive ?

edit: Maybe cave man has some more ideas on your drive imaging. I think he has done it about as many ways as it can be done. ;)

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 12:05 AM
Hmm, then methinks its your drive formatting or something. If it were hardware you should just get a flashing no drive icon.


Um, no offense, but I am not uploading an atv drive image anywhere. Sorry. Besides, I thought earlier you said the one you have is right from your original 40GB atv drive ?

edit: Maybe cave man has some more ideas on your drive imaging. I think he has done it about as many ways as it can be done. ;)

Is there personal data stored on the image? I have two images, one for the EFI and one from the recovery partition. Cave Man said I should try one large image with the whole drive instead but I don't have the 40gb drive anymore just the 250gb drive and that's a huge image file and a really long time to make a block by block image of 250gb.

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 12:12 AM
Is there personal data stored on the image?
Huh ? Well first its illegal. Second, if I were to want to do it I surely wouldnt upload it to an apple server.

Frankly I would just try the 250 GB image transfer.

Actually I used three images when I did it. boot.dmg, efi.dmg and recovery.dmg I think you are missing the OSBoot part. At any rate you should have all of those available to you on your 250 GB drive don't you ?

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 12:23 AM
Huh ? Well first its illegal. Second, if I were to want to do it I surely wouldnt upload it to an apple server.

Frankly I would just try the 250 GB image transfer.

Actually I used three images when I did it. boot.dmg, efi.dmg and recovery.dmg I think you are missing the OSBoot part. At any rate you should have all of those available to you on your 250 GB drive don't you ?

They are available, but he said there may be a problem with the location of each partition on the drive and a single image would take care of that. I've repartitioned and done the drive quite a few times and I just can't get it to boot. I don't know what else to try or do.

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 02:38 AM
You've tried simultaneously holding the - and menu buttons for 6 seconds?

So I just tried this and it makes the AppleTV reboot, but it never gets to the restore menu. Just keeps rebooting and again, showing the Apple logo.

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 08:25 AM
I think there is something funky with your drive partitions. I don't have my drive hooked up to my mbp so I cannot verify exactly what it is. But have you gone through this :

http://wiki.awkwardtv.org/wiki/Prepare_a_Hard_Drive#Adding_the_OSBoot_and_Media_partitions

Note at the top of this part:
"The OSBoot and Media partitions have to be added and formatted first, otherwise diskutil gets confused by the EFI and Recovery partitions.

First add the OSBoot partition. "

Now, earlier you said you do not have the OSBoot image. Just EFI and Recovery as I recall. I really think you should consider grabbing fresh images off of your 250GB atv. Grab all three. And follow the instructions to the tee in that article above. Its the one I used and those guys know what they are talking about. When I was having hardware issues figuring out the cable and bridge, I must have done my drive like five times not knowing if that might not be the problem. Those instructions above were invaluable.

I always kick myself for not writing down precisely step by step how it did it but I pretty much followed their guide.

Remember:
"There is a little bit of voodoo involved in recreating the partitions on the new disk, because of strange behavior of diskutil. The OSBoot and Media partitions must be created and formatted before the EFI and Recovery partitions are on the disk. Otherwise, diskutil gets confused and does some strange things to the partition table. This method should take less than 10 minutes to complete, because only the EFI and Recovery partition are duplicated from the factory disk. The OSBBoot partition and Media get initialized by the Apple TV Factory Restore procedure."

Otherwise, if all else fails just image the new drive with the entire 250 GB drive from your atv. Yes, it will take some time, but its pretty much a set it and forget it type of deal.

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 12:31 PM
I think there is something funky with your drive partitions. I don't have my drive hooked up to my mbp so I cannot verify exactly what it is. But have you gone through this :

http://wiki.awkwardtv.org/wiki/Prepare_a_Hard_Drive#Adding_the_OSBoot_and_Media_partitions

Note at the top of this part:
"The OSBoot and Media partitions have to be added and formatted first, otherwise diskutil gets confused by the EFI and Recovery partitions.

First add the OSBoot partition. "

Now, earlier you said you do not have the OSBoot image. Just EFI and Recovery as I recall. I really think you should consider grabbing fresh images off of your 250GB atv. Grab all three. And follow the instructions to the tee in that article above. Its the one I used and those guys know what they are talking about. When I was having hardware issues figuring out the cable and bridge, I must have done my drive like five times not knowing if that might not be the problem. Those instructions above were invaluable.

I always kick myself for not writing down precisely step by step how it did it but I pretty much followed their guide.

Remember:
"There is a little bit of voodoo involved in recreating the partitions on the new disk, because of strange behavior of diskutil. The OSBoot and Media partitions must be created and formatted before the EFI and Recovery partitions are on the disk. Otherwise, diskutil gets confused and does some strange things to the partition table. This method should take less than 10 minutes to complete, because only the EFI and Recovery partition are duplicated from the factory disk. The OSBBoot partition and Media get initialized by the Apple TV Factory Restore procedure."

Otherwise, if all else fails just image the new drive with the entire 250 GB drive from your atv. Yes, it will take some time, but its pretty much a set it and forget it type of deal.

Those are the instructions I followed, but like you said there's no telling what could have happened to the partition table during the process. I started grabbing an image of my 250gb drive last night before I went to bed and it's still going, the image is about 200gb so far so it looks like I have another 50 or so left. When that's done I'll put it on the new drive and hopefully that will take care of the problem.

One thing I didn't like about those instructions was a couple of the steps don't work in 10.5.X which I'm using. It tells you a few different methods of doing those steps that do work but they aren't very specific and every time I tried it something different would happen. I thought I ended up getting it right in the end, but a full image like this will guarantee that it's correct.

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 10:57 PM
I'm going to transfer the image to the new drive overnight tonight and will hopefully have good news on my progress tomorrow afternoon. The image process took just over 11 hours.

Hey dyna, I've got an unrelated question for you that I'm sure you'd know the answer to: I've got a bunch of movies I encoded from DVD using Handbrake and the AC3 passthrough (before AAC + AC3 was an option) and I was wondering if there was a way to have Handbrake take a movie like that and encode the AAC audio to basically convert it to an AAC + AC3 encode. Is that a possibility? Does that even make sense?

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 11:17 PM
I was wondering if there was a way to have Handbrake take a movie like that and encode the AAC audio to basically convert it to an AAC + AC3 encode. Is that a possibility? Does that even make sense?
Nope. Sorry. I mean, you *could* do it. But frankly it would be alot easier to just re-encode the source. Especially if you use a dev snapshot. You would gain some other benefits as well besides the aac + ac3 audio.

You must have built an svn version before we added the aac track. Afaik we never had a public release that only had AC3 in mp4 without an aac option.

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 11:18 PM
You must have built an svn version before we added the aac track. Afaik we never had a public release that only had AC3 in mp4 without an aac option.

:)

I really wanted AC3...

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 11:24 PM
:)

I really wanted AC3...

Hehe, didn't we all. :) Well, now you want aac and ac3 .... and vaq in x264. Welcome to the endless world of reencoding :)

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 11:34 PM
Hehe, didn't we all. :) Well, now you want aac and ac3 .... and vaq in x264. Welcome to the endless world of reencoding :)

Yep, oh well. Tis the way of technology.

...What's vaq?

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 11:37 PM
Yep, oh well. Tis the way of technology.

...What's vaq?

reduces the "macroblocking" you get in dark scenes with x264 big time. Though we are derailing this thread a bit. Trust me, the reencoding time is worth it.

Vortec4800
Aug 28, 2008, 11:38 PM
reduces the "macroblocking" you get in dark scenes with x264 big time. Though we are derailing this thread a bit. Trust me, the reencoding time is worth it.

Very cool, will have to use that for all my future encodes and maybe reencode some of my favorites... Any idea on when you guys will do a public release with the vaq and such? A week, a month, 3 months, etc?

dynaflash
Aug 28, 2008, 11:41 PM
Very cool, will have to use that for all my future encodes and maybe reencode some of my favorites... Any idea on when you guys will do a public release with the vaq and such? A week, a month, 3 months, etc?
Not for a while, but now we periodically release compiled dev snapshots. They are in the announcement at the top of each HB forum.

FritzsCorner
Aug 29, 2008, 05:30 PM
Cave Man/Dynaflash,

Thank you for all the hard work you have put into this and for sharing it with the ATV community. I just placed an order for all of the components and can't wait for them to arrive to give this a shot. I have been using the patch stick with a USB drive hack for a few months now and it is less than ideal. While it works 95% of the time it always seems to have troubles the other 5% of the time when my wife is using it. ;) After doing hours of research on the best Hard Drive hacks I think this looks to be the clear winner and a great candidate for the much coveted wife approval and "Ronco" award. "Set it and forget it".

Thanks again. I will report back in the next couple weeks with my progress.

Cave Man
Aug 29, 2008, 09:55 PM
Good luck on your build. We'll be here to help as much as you need it. What size drive and what enclosure did you pick?

FritzsCorner
Aug 30, 2008, 04:14 PM
I have a 500GB WD Mybook eSata drive that I have on hand that I am going to use to start with. I will eventually move up to a 1TB drive if everything works out as planned.

Vortec4800
Aug 30, 2008, 05:24 PM
Success!

Well, sort of. I've gotten it to boot for the first time on my 1TB external SATA drive. It did a full factory restore and I got the main menu and everything is perfect. Except for the fact that I can't close the case because I had to nix the extension cable and plug the bridge directly in to the AppleTV.

It sounds like this is a common problem, the ribbon cable not working, what was it that fixed the problem? I ordered the correct cable, the F12-X06M hard drive extension cable so I think it should work properly, but for whatever reason when the ribbon cable is plugged in I get nothing further than the Apple logo.

So, experts, what's the answer to the ribbon problem? Sounds like you've all had it, what do I need to do to fix it?

Cave Man
Aug 30, 2008, 05:52 PM
Did you get this crossover cable (http://www.cablesonline.net/644fetomaide.html)? It's required for the board interface.

Vortec4800
Aug 30, 2008, 05:57 PM
Did you get this crossover cable (http://www.cablesonline.net/644fetomaide.html)? It's required for the board interface.

Yes, unless they shipped me the wrong cable (and put the wrong part number on the bag it came in) that's the cable I ordered. Is there any other reason that cable might not work correctly?

Vortec4800
Aug 30, 2008, 09:51 PM
So I'm at a loss. No matter what I do the bridge won't work with the cable. I'm thinking maybe I'll order the bridge from the other place, instead of the place where it's a bit cheaper. The first bridge I got had the same chipset and all but wouldn't even work as well as this one does, so maybe the two that are supposed to be the same at a different price actually aren't the same afterall. Here are some pictures I took, just incase there was a glaring mistake that I've been missing.

Cave Man
Aug 31, 2008, 09:25 AM
Yes, unless they shipped me the wrong cable (and put the wrong part number on the bag it came in) that's the cable I ordered. Is there any other reason that cable might not work correctly?

Are you sure you have the cable on the correct direction for the drive? The first time I tried it, the cable was connected backwards.

So I'm at a loss. No matter what I do the bridge won't work with the cable. I'm thinking maybe I'll order the bridge from the other place, instead of the place where it's a bit cheaper.

Dyna and I have the exact same bridge - from Syba. Are you saying yours isn't the exact same? My other bridge did not work with a cable, only if it was directly connected to the ATV logic board.

dynaflash
Aug 31, 2008, 05:31 PM
Are you sure you have the cable on the correct direction for the drive? The first time I tried it, the cable was connected backwards

Might be an illusion, but to me it looks backward (180 off).

Vortec4800
Aug 31, 2008, 09:43 PM
Are you sure you have the cable on the correct direction for the drive? The first time I tried it, the cable was connected backwards.



Dyna and I have the exact same bridge - from Syba. Are you saying yours isn't the exact same? My other bridge did not work with a cable, only if it was directly connected to the ATV logic board.

I'm not sure if it's the same, that's why I ordered the other one to double check. With the bridge turned the other way on the cable it doesn't even power up, so I think it's connected correctly. Do you guys have any other ideas on why the bridge wouldn't work with the cable connected to it assuming the bridge is the same one you guys have?

Cave Man
Aug 31, 2008, 11:13 PM
If the power LED is coming on, you're connected properly. It's gotta be that bridge.

Koola
Sep 1, 2008, 07:45 AM
It looks to me that your using one too many adapters.

It's possible to just use a 44 pin female to 40 pin female cable adapter (available here (http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=209)) to connect the logic board and the IDE-SATA Adapter without that extra adapter.

I'm guessing your SATA controller doesn't like the extra resistance the cable and adapter introduces.

Cave Man
Sep 1, 2008, 01:20 PM
It doesn't look like that adapter provides a 5v line, which is required to power the SATA bridge.

dynaflash
Sep 2, 2008, 08:13 AM
Do you guys have any other ideas on why the bridge wouldn't work with the cable connected to it assuming the bridge is the same one you guys have?
Other than being hooked up wrong, nope. At least in my case as soon as it was hooked up with the that cable/bridge then "Voila!" working atv (x2).

dynaflash
Sep 2, 2008, 08:14 AM
When hooking up the power especially. Beware: http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5999&start=25#p39474

Vortec4800
Sep 3, 2008, 11:55 PM
reduces the "macroblocking" you get in dark scenes with x264 big time. Though we are derailing this thread a bit. Trust me, the reencoding time is worth it.

Pulling the thread a bit off-course for a moment again, I downloaded the snapshot and have a few movies I want to encode. Will the default AppleTV preset do this or is it something else I need to turn on or enable that's off by default? I see all kinds of stuff that's off, detelecine, VFR, denoise, deblock, decomb and so on.

Cave Man
Sep 4, 2008, 12:01 AM
Probably ought to just use the ATV preset. Make sure you update them before doing it. If you're just testing, it ought to be good enough.

I take it the new board arrived?

Vortec4800
Sep 4, 2008, 12:08 AM
Probably ought to just use the ATV preset. Make sure you update them before doing it. If you're just testing, it ought to be good enough.

I take it the new board arrived?

No not yet, should be here the end of the week. For the time being it's being used on top of my entertainment center upside-down with the card sticking out the top. I'm hoping the new card takes care of it because if that doesn't work then I don't know what to try.

Vortec4800
Sep 13, 2008, 02:42 AM
I got the new board, and while it is actually a different model from a different brand (with different versions and markings on the PCB) the end result is the same. Plugged directly into the ATV it boots right away but with the cable it just shows the Apple logo and restarts endlessly. I think maybe I'll just make some room in my cabinet and keep the ATV in up-side-down mode all the time. If it's hidden away, I guess I don't really care and I get 1TB eSATA AppleTV goodness without pulling any more of my hair out. Maybe one day Apple will get their heads on straight and release a high-capacity version of the device or a HDD company will release a 1TB notebook drive that will fit right in there.

Cave Man
Sep 13, 2008, 08:58 AM
Wow, that's a bummer you're having problems with it. Are you using the Syba (http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295) adapter?

Vortec4800
Sep 13, 2008, 07:03 PM
Wow, that's a bummer you're having problems with it. Are you using the Syba (http://www.syba.com/Product/Info/Id/295) adapter?

Yeah, same one. Don't know what else the problem could be, it has to be something strange with my AppleTV. Maybe mine is an older hardware revision with a slightly different motherboard or something, I don't know. Oh well I guess, doesn't really matter.

rw3
Sep 13, 2008, 08:01 PM
I'm currently working on getting the new Samsung 500GB M6 SpinPoint 2.5" inside the AppleTV....wish me luck.

FritzsCorner
Sep 14, 2008, 09:07 PM
Well looks like I have the same issue as Vortec800. I can get mine to boot up just fine with the Sybase adapter plugged directly into the ATV, but it doesn't work with the extender cable. It will keep rebooting and one time I got it to go to the recovery screen but not any further. I will keep looking into it and see what I can find.

dynaflash
Sep 14, 2008, 11:23 PM
The cable thing sucks. I don't know what to say, it has worked for me twice with no issues.

Only thing i can think is that with the cable the orientation is wrong (still looks that way to me on vortec's pics). Hmm, all parts being equal I cannot figure out what the issue is.

For the record, my first atv is like the second one shipped to my state or something, I got it right when they first came out, so I don't think its anything having to do with older models.

FritzsCorner
Sep 15, 2008, 10:56 AM
Looking at Vortec's pics it seems to be reversed from how I have it hooked up as well. On mine the cables red stripe is located on the right hand side towards the rear of the ATV. I can tell it is correct as the Syba board gets power and shows disk activity for a bit then the ATV will reboot. Every once in a while it will work long enough to get it to the recovery prompt but then it just drops connection again after the reboot. I don't have anything to test the voltage unfortunately, so my troubleshooting for now is limited to verifying everything is connected properly. I may see if I can purchase a similar cable from another vendor if I am not able to make any progress.

I appreciate all your help!

Vortec4800
Sep 15, 2008, 11:29 AM
Looking at Vortec's pics it seems to be reversed from how I have it hooked up as well. On mine the cables red stripe is located on the right hand side towards the rear of the ATV. I can tell it is correct as the Syba board gets power and shows disk activity for a bit then the ATV will reboot. Every once in a while it will work long enough to get it to the recovery prompt but then it just drops connection again after the reboot. I don't have anything to test the voltage unfortunately, so my troubleshooting for now is limited to verifying everything is connected properly. I may see if I can purchase a similar cable from another vendor if I am not able to make any progress.

I appreciate all your help!

I tried turning the cable around and it didn't make a difference. The pins pass straight through regardless of the orientation, and the device powers up which means it's plugged in correctly.

These are the exact symptoms I was having as well, where it would restart endlessly and made it to the recovery menu a couple rare occasions. I've tried different cables (same model and vendor though) different bridges different everything and it doesn't change a thing. If you make any progress let me know, I'm sure it would fix mine too.

deorg
Sep 26, 2008, 05:07 PM
I would like to do this hack, but I do want to use a small HDD like the one with the original ATV, because I would like to hang up the ATV in a wall... Does anybody know which is the biggest (most capacity) HDD that works with ATV and still let me close the case.

thx

Vortec4800
Sep 26, 2008, 06:17 PM
I would like to do this hack, but I do want to use a small HDD like the one with the original ATV, because I would like to hang up the ATV in a wall... Does anybody know which is the biggest (most capacity) HDD that works with ATV and still let me close the case.

thx

Last I looked the largest 2.5" PATA drive you could buy was 250gb, which is what I had in my ATV before doing the SATA mod. Maybe someone else can chime in if they know of a larger drive that has come out recently, seems like all the new 2.5" technology is going into SATA drives.

techound1
Oct 21, 2008, 04:53 PM
I've got my ATV and 1TB 3.5" SATA in front of me and I'm ready to do some surgery. Anyone have any last minute adds that would be helpful before I plunge on it?

Thanks!

Cave Man
Oct 21, 2008, 09:29 PM
1. Take your time.
2. Test it first without the cross-over cable. It seems to be the source of most problems.
3. Be prepared to do a bit of trouble shooting.
4. Have fun!

techound1
Oct 31, 2008, 03:28 PM
Hoorah! Everything worked right out of the gate. 900+gb hard drive AppleTV makes me very happy!

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this concept.

Cave Man
Oct 31, 2008, 03:39 PM
Congrats on your build! That makes 4 or 5 of us who have successfully done it now.

Now you need to get some high-def content on there. :)

techound1
Oct 31, 2008, 03:41 PM
Now you need to get some high-def content on there. :)

LOL. I'm currently transferring 22,000+ songs over. We'll see if the both the ATV and I have the energy left!

Next stop (big plans, anyway) - put the ATV in a specktone retro II case.

dynaflash
Oct 31, 2008, 11:47 PM
"Go Big or Go Home" I always say ;) Congratulations and welcome to the world of AppleTV - Rex. :)

ElvisThePelvis
Dec 11, 2008, 10:55 AM
Try this, it worked for me:

1. Download the 2.0.2 disk image from here (http://mesu.apple.com/data/OS/061-4632.2080414.gt5rW/2Z694-5428-3.dmg).

2. Once downloaded, mount your new ATV hard drive on your Mac and launch Disk Utility. In Disk Utility, click on the OSBoot partition of your ATV drive and erase it. Note, this is the OSBoot partition only and not the entire drive.

3. Use the Restore function of Disk Utility to build your 2.0.2 OSBoot partition by dragging the 2.0.2 image to the Source box and your ATV's OSBoot partition to the Destination box.

Whole process should only take a couple of minutes and you should now have an Apple TV with 2.0.2 bootable.

Does know how to get the latest OSBoot image? I still can't get my 1TB drive to update properly. Strangely enough, my original 40GB drive won't upgrade either.

NEVERMIND: Found it:

http://mesu.apple.com/version.xml

Cave Man
Dec 11, 2008, 11:01 AM
I think this (http://mesu.apple.com/data/OS/061-5651.20081119.32VtA/2Z694-5573-24.dmg) is 2.3.

mmccaskill
Dec 11, 2008, 02:14 PM
Does the very first post still apply? I just bought an AppleTV and would love to use eSATA to connect my new 1TB drive to my AppleTV.

Is there a simple step-by-step guide for this?

ElvisThePelvis
Dec 11, 2008, 03:48 PM
I think this (http://mesu.apple.com/data/OS/061-5651.20081119.32VtA/2Z694-5573-24.dmg) is 2.3.

That did the trick, which led to this:

http://img.skitch.com/20081211-8xkbtayy6859w3fa8cc1c4i3d5.jpg

So now I wait for 600GB or so of media to sync.

I did not follow the path here exactly. I used the original appleTV 44 pin cable to a male 44 pin to male 40 pin custom PCB (straight pass through). Then into the SYBA SY-BIR-IDESA Bi-directional IDE/SATA Adapter (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186032&nm_mc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel&cm_mmc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel-_-Content-_-text-_-). I used power adapter with a Molex end to power the bare 7200 RPM Seagate 1TB drive and the SATA adapter using the cable provided with the SATA adapter.

Since I use the original AppleTV cable, which is now just routed out of the bottom of the case, I can swap out the original 40GB drive with the 1TB drive quickly for testing...or as is often the case breaking.

Thanks for the info, this post carried me through when I could not figure a out of my hacking adventure.

edit: 44 pin and 40 pin were backwards.

descartes
Dec 11, 2008, 05:34 PM
amazing mod. meanwhile i'm still chugging along at 40gb

dynaflash
Dec 11, 2008, 07:06 PM
Since I use the original AppleTV cable, which is now just routed out of the bottom of the case, I can swap out the original 40GB drive with the 1TB drive quickly for testing...or as is often the case breaking.


Interesting twist. So, do I understand you correctly that the AppleTV 44 pin ribbon cable exits your case and everything else is outside the ATV ?
If, so, did you fashion some sort of case for the pcb board, adapter and bridge ? Just curious on your implementation.

ElvisThePelvis
Dec 11, 2008, 08:49 PM
Interesting twist. So, do I understand you correctly that the AppleTV 44 pin ribbon cable exits your case and everything else is outside the ATV ?
If, so, did you fashion some sort of case for the pcb board, adapter and bridge ? Just curious on your implementation.

Yes, the 44 pin ribbon cable is hanging out of the bottom of the case. The PCB board is bare right now. I'll post better pics once the sync is done...in a few days. :D I will build a case for it soon, I'm trying to decide between wood or some type of plastic casting.

Here is a view of the main connection though:

http://img.skitch.com/20081212-j55kq63wrh5eek6mdqip4a3c6w.jpg

dynaflash
Dec 11, 2008, 08:53 PM
Haha, nice. That pcb board looks somewhat familiar, I saw one similar during my parts search, but wanted everything except the hdd inside the case. I like your moxy. Congrats ! You will never regret it. Have fun. :)

ElvisThePelvis
Dec 13, 2008, 11:37 AM
Haha, nice. That pcb board looks somewhat familiar, I saw one similar during my parts search, but wanted everything except the hdd inside the case. I like your moxy. Congrats ! You will never regret it. Have fun. :)

Do you remember where you saw that type of board?

dynaflash
Dec 13, 2008, 01:05 PM
hmm, maybe general nanosystems, not sure tbh.

Cave Man
Dec 18, 2008, 09:50 AM
For those who might be interested, you should avoid Macally enclosures for this mod. I put my 750 gb ATV drive in a Macally PHR-S100SUA enclosure (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817347016) only to discover that after a few hours of inactivity it would disconnect itself from the ATV, leaving the '?' on my screen and requiring a reboot. So I put the drive in their G-S350SUA enclosure (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817347017) and had the same problem. Needless to say, I've since returned the drive to my Rosewill RX81-MP-SC-BLK (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182122) enclosure and have not had any problems with it.

tobi-wan-kenobi
Dec 24, 2008, 02:14 AM
Plus, it autodetects if I'm using my DD receiver or just the TV, then selects the proper audio track (AC3/AAC). The Mini (or any Mac) cannot do that.
.

Hi I am currently considering what whole-house system to use in a house I am just having built. So now I can still run cables etc. The above statement raised my interest. Can you elaborate?

I want all the gadgets to be located in the utility room.
At the moment I am considering an AirportExpress for all the rooms that have in-ceiling speakers. Actualy there is an upstairs and downstairs, so for the upstairs I will have 2xAE so I can have to loops. Together with to Mac-minis I will be able to play different songs or the same song in the different zones(upstairs/downstairs).

Now I am thinking maybe it would be better to buy ATVs instead, they cost just a little more but can also be used for video.

Now to the above: Can ATV detect if it is a pure audio trac? And the route it through the audio out and if it is a video track use the HDMI?

Any advice on my dilemma? Sorry should probably start a new thread, so just interested in the statement above.

Cave Man
Dec 24, 2008, 02:20 PM
It means that the ATV will send DD over HDMI or optical, and analog over the RCA ports. If your receiver has an optical port, then it'll take DD or AAC/MP3 over that port and handle it just fine. Same for the HDMI audio line.

TheStork
Dec 28, 2008, 03:17 PM
Cave Man & dynaflash,

Please publish a summary of the mod. I've read the whole thread and my head hurts from trying to follow what works/doesn't work. I'm afraid that, if I go backwards to figure out what works, I'll screw it up.

TIA.

--The Stork

P.S. Somewhere in this thread someone asked about the large 2.5" hard drives. Largest one I could find is 500GB (SATA) - Newegg.com has three of them.

dynaflash
Dec 28, 2008, 09:03 PM
Cave Man & dynaflash,

Please publish a summary of the mod. I've read the whole thread and my head hurts from trying to follow what works/doesn't work. I'm afraid that, if I go backwards to figure out what works, I'll screw it up.


For me, this is how it shook out.
http://forum.handbrake.fr/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5999

TheStork
Dec 29, 2008, 08:07 PM
dynaflash,

I read the whole thread over at the Handbrake forum. Is your first post the recent version? I guess I'm asking is, if I follow your instructions in the first post, I should be good to go?

TIA.