necropheliac or moron? (Sally Anne Bowman Murder) [Archive]

Abstract

Feb 21, 2008, 07:47 AM

Before someone says something smart....something that will contribute to the convo, I want to say something that may be inappropriate. I haven't read the article yet, but saw her photo. She's hot.

Ok, continue...

EDIT: Ewwww......

iBlue

Feb 21, 2008, 07:57 AM

xUKHCx

Feb 21, 2008, 07:59 AM

I agree the way I see it is that either way he is going to end up going to prison (rape) this case is just about determining if it was him that kill her.

scotthayes

Feb 21, 2008, 08:30 AM

This case is revolting. I don't care if he killed her or not, having "sex" (term used loosely) with an unconscious woman is a vile and very disturbing thing to do. It's better that this guy (again, term used loosely) not be out walking amongst the rest of us.

GROSS!

Could not agree more. This pile of s*** should never be allowed out of prison. In fact he should be placed with the general population in the 'Scrubs' or the 'green' and leave them to deal with him.

stomer

Feb 21, 2008, 08:38 AM

I agree the way I see it is that either way he is going to end up going to prison (rape) this case is just about determining if it was him that kill her.
If she were already dead, is it rape? It should at least be attempted rape.

He's been charged with murder and he's going to have a hard time convincing the jury that it wasn't him. But, if he isn't found guilty of murder, then I wonder if he'll be found guilty of other charges, if indeed there are any.

If he didn't murder her, but is found guilty, well, that wouldn't be a massive injustice but rather a just punishment for being such a disgusting moron.

brad.c

Feb 21, 2008, 08:59 AM

It's a moot argument in my mind, as the penalty for both crimes should be the same.

scotthayes

Feb 21, 2008, 09:09 AM

As far as I know, and I may be wrong, but I believe that necrophilia is not illegal in the UK.

sreedy

Feb 21, 2008, 09:13 AM

If he didn't murder her, but is found guilty, well, that wouldn't be a massive injustice but rather a just punishment for being such a disgusting moron.

But if he didn't do it and he's found guilty then there will still be a murderer out there! He's going to go down for something but only the killer should be going down for murder!

xUKHCx

Feb 21, 2008, 09:32 AM

If she were already dead, is it rape? It should at least be attempted rape.

He's been charged with murder and he's going to have a hard time convincing the jury that it wasn't him. But, if he isn't found guilty of murder, then I wonder if he'll be found guilty of other charges, if indeed there are any.

If he didn't murder her, but is found guilty, well, that wouldn't be a massive injustice but rather a just punishment for being such a disgusting moron.

What I was saying was that if his version of events was found to be true and she was unconisous at the time then that is rape. If he is found to be lying and she was dead then that is necrophila. If he is lying and it found to be that he killed her then it is murder and necrophila/rape depending when he committed the act, end result = prision.

As far as I know, and I may be wrong, but I believe that necrophilia is not illegal in the UK.

It is ilegal was introduced as a specific offence in 2004 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3675057.stm), although it probably fell under a different law before then.

Abstract

Feb 21, 2008, 09:46 AM

I don't care if he killed her or not, having "sex" (term used loosely) with an unconscious woman is a vile and very disturbing thing to do.

You don't care if he killed her or not?

He either committed rape+necrophilia, or rape+necrophilia+murder. Unfortunately, his punishment is going to be similar regardless of which one he did (maybe 10 years in jail). After all, he seems crazy enough for people to just feel bad for his mental state.

QCassidy352

Feb 21, 2008, 09:47 AM

So at BEST, he's a would-be rapist (and accidental necrophiliac). Nobody's going to lose any sleep when this guy gets locked away.

stomer

Feb 21, 2008, 09:48 AM

What I was saying was that if his version of events was found to be true and she was unconisous at the time then that is rape. If he is found to be lying and she was dead then that is necrophila. If he is lying and it found to be that he killed her then it is murder and necrophila/rape depending when he committed the act, end result = prision.
If he's not guilty of murder but is guilty of necrophilia, would it be possible for him to walk free having already served a certain amount of time in prison? The maximum jail term for necrophilia is 2 years.

Abstract

Feb 21, 2008, 09:57 AM

But I think I read somewhere that he actually thought she was alive at the time, but was a bit dizzy and passed out on the ground woozy from overdrinking. He's an accidental-necrophiliac, but actually a rapist. His intent was rape. Can he be found guilty of necrophilia if there was never any intent to sleep with a dead person? He thought he was raping a live person.

Ok....going to bed now.

stomer

Feb 21, 2008, 10:00 AM

But if he didn't do it and he's found guilty then there will still be a murderer out there! He's going to go down for something but only the killer should be going down for murder!
You're right. My sentiments are that this guy should go to jail. The murderer, whether it's him or not, should definitely also brought to justice.

scotthayes

Feb 21, 2008, 10:00 AM

It is ilegal was introduced as a specific offence in 2004 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3675057.stm), although it probably fell under a different law before then.

Thankfully I was wrong.

However not nice to see the maximum sentence of 2 years

Offence of Necrophilia (http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2003/ukpga_20030042_en_5#pt1-pb18-l1g70)

xUKHCx

Feb 21, 2008, 10:07 AM

2 years is very low imo.

Although there would have to be a case to determine if she was a live or dead at the time he committed the act. In which case he would probably argue that she was dead. 2 years vs. life. Either way he is screwed and rightly so. I think that it is a case of intended rape but he could get away with necrophilia.

This of course assumes he is found innocent of the actual murder.

side note: the wording of the law is specifically aimed at males, does that mean women can't be convicted of necrophilia, or having sex in toilets, exposure + probably more.

iBlue

Feb 21, 2008, 10:11 AM

You don't care if he killed her or not?

He either committed rape+necrophilia, or rape+necrophilia+murder. Unfortunately, his punishment is going to be similar regardless of which one he did (maybe 10 years in jail). After all, he seems crazy enough for people to just feel bad for his mental state.

bad choice of words on my part maybe. I just think the whole thing is revolting regardless of if he was the one who killed her or not. he's just very very sick. I don't have any pity for him either.

sreedy

Feb 21, 2008, 10:23 AM

2 years is very low imo.

Agreed, I think if he turns out to not be the murder then they'll hit him with attempted rape or something else, as 2 years for that is not good enough!

stomer

Feb 21, 2008, 10:25 AM

2 years is very low imo.
I'm not so sure. It's not a subject I care much about, however, necrophiliacs are clearly not a danger to society and the benefit of locking them up for 2 years is questionable. I wonder if psychotherapy would be a more effective help them, as well as being cheaper than having them in jail for 2 years.

sreedy

Feb 21, 2008, 10:37 AM

I'm not so sure. It's not a subject I care much about, however, necrophiliacs are clearly not a danger to society and the benefit of locking them up for 2 years is questionable. I wonder if psychotherapy would be a more effective help them, as well as being cheaper than having them in jail for 2 years.

You see this is why I think this guy can't claim necrophilia, as in court he said he thought she was unconscious...... which makes it rape as that's what he thought he was doing.

From the BBC "Mark Dixie, accused of killing Sally Anne Bowman, said he did not realise she was dead until after he had sex with her body, the Old Bailey heard."

I agree that purposely finding a dead body and doing "stuff" to it is less of a danger to society, so maybe 2 years is just.

iBlue

Feb 21, 2008, 10:39 AM

You see this is why I think this guy can't claim necrophilia, as in court he said he thought she was unconscious...... which makes it rape as that's what he thought he was doing. ...

I think he's trying to save his reputation, which is actually quite funny, in a creepy sort of way.

stomer

Feb 21, 2008, 12:02 PM

You see this is why I think this guy can't claim necrophilia, as in court he said he thought she was unconscious...... which makes it rape as that's what he thought he was doing.
If he thought she was unconscious but she was actually dead then he is guilty of attempted rape and necrophilia, but not rape itself. Necrophilia and rape are mutually exclusive, otherwise there'd be no need for a specific law against Necrophilia. Reading the Sex Offences Act. 2003, basically, rape is defined as person 'A' having sex with person 'B' without person 'B's consent. The frame of mind of person 'A' is never mentioned so therefore irrelevant.

If his version of events is true, I don't think it's clear that he raped her, although he certainly, by his own admission, attempted rape. It would probably make a difference to his sentence if he were to be found not guilty of murder.

If the law views attempted rape as rape, then I'm completely wrong.

Obviously, IANAL.

GFLPraxis

Feb 21, 2008, 05:50 PM

"I'm not a necropheliac, I was trying to rape her!"

Which does the law penalize stronger, rape or necrophilia? Moron either way.

ezekielrage_99

Feb 21, 2008, 05:55 PM

another link (http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7230672.stm), one where you can see more of her. (you sickos!)

This case is revolting. I don't care if he killed her or not, having "sex" (term used loosely) with an unconscious woman is a vile and very disturbing thing to do. It's better that this guy (again, term used loosely) not be out walking amongst the rest of us.

GROSS!

I trend to agree, it seems as though they a trivialising a serious event... I find it disturbing that he's disgusted with himself for raping a corpse but he seems as thought he'd be ok with it if she just past out.

Another pro for the death penalty or chemical castration.

Muncher

Feb 21, 2008, 08:45 PM

Did he actually kill her before raping her? I guess that seems logical, but you never know. I'll give him a couple of points for what I think is honesty, but he needs to be locked up for a loooong time.

EDIT: If she hadn't died, I'd have said she was hot, but it doesn't seem appropriate.

angelneo

Feb 21, 2008, 09:42 PM

If it is possible for him to be so drunk and high to not notice the freakin pool of blood when he is making out, it is also possible that he is that drunk and high to kill her. I think either he is in denial, or he is desperate enough to come up with that lie.

Raid

Feb 21, 2008, 10:14 PM

Whatever the reason, whatever the circumstances he absolutely meant to do harm to this girl ... even if she was a corpse at the time. Positively repugnant behavior. I hope karma catches up to him for some payback.

NC MacGuy

Feb 21, 2008, 11:15 PM

Realized there was something wrong when she didn't react to him biting her face??

Maybe he should have taken up boxing instead of raping.

Plymouthbreezer

Feb 22, 2008, 01:16 AM

Creep for sure.

Shame for her, she was bangin'. :(

edesignuk

Feb 22, 2008, 08:01 AM

Guilty. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7254628.stm)

mactastic

Feb 22, 2008, 01:23 PM

How do you not notice that your "partner" (term used loosely) has several stab wounds and, presumably, extensive hemorraging?

What a sick ****. What prompts someone to say "oh hey, that chick is passed out and topless... I'm gonna go get me some"? Glad he'll be put away for a good long time.