PDA

View Full Version : Apple releases iChat AV Final for Jaguar ($29.95)


MacBytes
Oct 28, 2003, 03:53 AM
Category: Apple Software
Link: Apple releases iChat AV Final for Jaguar ($29.95) (http://www.apple.com/ichat)

Posted on MacBytes.com (http://www.macbytes.com)

Approved by arn

Blaaze
Oct 28, 2003, 06:15 AM
That price is a little high. Understanding what it does and is capable of doing, it might be worth it for some.

My notion is that Apple sets it high to encourage Panther sales. Might as well get a whole new OS right? But that's my opinion.

Maybe they could have let the user choose if they wanted to shell out the extra for iChatAV in Panther. But then again, many wouldn't adopt this great program because they're paying *extra*. Apple seems to do that a lot in their operating systems. They bundle a lot of stuff that people might not actually need, but they leave it in there for the user to discover and eventually the user doesn't know how they lived without these features.

random aside: Some people use Apple as plural, while I use it as singular?

irmongoose
Oct 28, 2003, 07:58 AM
Well, Steve Jobs did say that they will be charging for Jaguar iChat AV as an incentive for people to upgrade to Panther.

And, Apple is a group of people, not separate individuals, and thus should be used as a singular.



irmongoose

pgwalsh
Oct 28, 2003, 11:10 AM
Is the software included with the iSight?

chewbaccapits
Oct 28, 2003, 11:17 AM
I think thats the moost single arguement right now with the iSight....for 140-something you think you would get the software!

ITR 81
Oct 28, 2003, 11:32 AM
I think the iChat A/V software should be bundled with iSight even if it raises the prices 10 bucks more. It's a firewire cam and most companies don't even have one on the market atleast not until sometime next yr.

Is the iSight Firewire 400 or 800 or is it both?

I think offering the software also separate is good idea too because you will have alot folks not upgrading because they think the price is too high but want new verison of iChat. This will make them go out and buy new upgrade then just get iChat upgrade. But if they have EDU account then they shouldn't even think about it hell what would it cost 16-18 bucks? About same price as audio CD.

shadowfax
Oct 28, 2003, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by chewbaccapits
I think thats the moost single arguement right now with the iSight....for 140-something you think you would get the software! well, again, apple has never backed away from taking even rather extreme steps to get you to keep up with their latest stuff.

and there are still some freaks that don't think OS 9 is dead...

crees!
Oct 28, 2003, 11:46 AM
Not sure if this was specifically mentioned in a previous post.

In my opinion I think they should have 2 versions. One basic, for free, no audio/video, and then the AV which you pay for. If they want to go that route paying for something such as this. iChatAV should definitely be bundled with iSight at no extra charge. A $30 incentive for purchasing iSight.

Flowbee
Oct 28, 2003, 11:50 AM
Originally posted by crees!
In my opinion I think they should have 2 versions. One basic, for free, no audio/video, and then the AV which you pay for.

A good idea. Like Quicktime/Quicktime Pro.

whocares
Oct 28, 2003, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by crees!
In my opinion I think they should have 2 versions. One basic, for free, no audio/video, and then the AV which you pay for. If they want to go that route paying for something such as this. iChatAV should definitely be bundled with iSight at no extra charge. A $30 incentive for purchasing iSight.

That's already the case. You can revert to iChat (not the AV version) provided with Jaguar and use that for free.

windwaves
Oct 28, 2003, 12:06 PM
how great can it be when you can only use it with others who are running the same software ? it is extremely limited. Plus, lets not forget that our dear windoze friends have had this for a while. This is one thing - one of the few - where Apple was way behind. We did have third party apps, which worked decently though.

jxyama
Oct 28, 2003, 12:10 PM
Originally posted by crees!
Not sure if this was specifically mentioned in a previous post.

In my opinion I think they should have 2 versions. One basic, for free, no audio/video, and then the AV which you pay for. If they want to go that route paying for something such as this. iChatAV should definitely be bundled with iSight at no extra charge. A $30 incentive for purchasing iSight.

default jaguar comes with iChat. that's just a AOL IM compatible chat app.

i agree iChat AV should be bundled with iSight. maybe putting in a CD might be redundant because people from now on will either upgrade to Panther or buy a machine with Panther loaded. maybe an online download key to get the iChat AV...

iPod comes with iTunes. so iSight should come with iChat AV.

jxyama
Oct 28, 2003, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by windwaves
how great can it be when you can only use it with others who are running the same software ? it is extremely limited. Plus, lets not forget that our dear windoze friends have had this for a while. This is one thing - one of the few - where Apple was way behind. We did have third party apps, which worked decently though.

i agree that apple was a bit slow in coming up with it. however, the fact you can only use it with others with the same software/hardware has its advantages. the most notable being it lets apple control the configurations - thus there's hardly anything that can go wrong when two iSight enabled iChat AVs try to connect.

it definitely follows in the great Apple line of "instant usability, right out of the box."

but again, i agree, the fact it's limited in the user base is a bottleneck. i imagine the popularity will increase once a certain critical mass of people sign up. until then, we have to rely on "must have the best and the latest" gadget geeks to make iSight more popular. :D

QCassidy352
Oct 28, 2003, 12:24 PM
i have ichat AV (with panther) and I hate it... went back to AIM in minutes. I can't understand wtf apple is thinking with ichat, but I wouldn't use it for free, let alone for $30. ugh.

ennerseed
Oct 28, 2003, 12:37 PM
Originally posted by crees!
In my opinion I think they should have 2 versions. One basic, for free, no audio/video, and then the AV which you pay for.

Isn't that exactly what iChat(no AV) is?

railthinner
Oct 28, 2003, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by QCassidy352
i have ichat AV (with panther) and I hate it... went back to AIM in minutes. I can't understand wtf apple is thinking with ichat, but I wouldn't use it for free, let alone for $30. ugh.

Can you elaborate on what it is you don't like?

Does using ichat AV require a .mac account?

chicagdan
Oct 28, 2003, 12:54 PM
Guys -- bear in mind that even though iChat AV is now 1.0, the beta still works through the end of the year. I just received the following e-mail from Apple:

Your iChat AV beta software will expire in January 2004, but you can upgrade now to continue chatting with friends, family, and colleagues in full-screen video with full-duplex audio. iChat AV is now part of Mac OS X version 10.3 “Panther” along with over 150 other new features, like Exposé for instant access to any open window or desktop file, and a new Finder for easy access to everything you need no matter where it lives. Mac OS X Panther costs only $129 and is available today from the Apple Store. Shop online or visit an Apple Store near you.

If you wish to continue using iChat AV with Mac OS X Jaguar (v10.2.5 and later), you can purchase and download the upgrade online at the Apple Store for $29.95.

Bunzi2k4
Oct 28, 2003, 12:57 PM
ichat av doesn't require a .mac account, it can use aim or .mac. i'm not that impressed with ichat av for panther (i use it all the time cuz aim for mac sux). unless you have a lot of friends who have macs, u shouldn't buy this, and can u still download the beta? my friend uses the beta al the time.

davy the bunny
Oct 28, 2003, 01:07 PM
Looks like you can't download the beta anymore, not even from the download page. It is listed on the Apple downloads page but when you click the link to download, you get Apple's "Looking for Something at Apple" page. Did iChat come with Jaguar? Are you guys sure about that? I really didn't think that it did. In that case I can see why we would need 2 different versions of iChat.

jayscheuerle
Oct 28, 2003, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by shadowfax
well, again, apple has never backed away from taking even rather extreme steps to get you to keep up with their latest stuff.

and there are still some freaks that don't think OS 9 is dead...

Do you mean freaks as in it's their primary operating system? Isn't that still over 70% of Mac users?

Or do you mean freaks in terms of their being delusional as to how much support OS9 is going to continue to receive?

Many people who use Macs know nothing about OSX. Some know just enough to know that it's the next greatest thing, but it isn't effecting them. Other's find that it's still easier for them (or only possible for them) to do their work in OS9.

C'mon, you don't have to call them "freaks". They'll be onboard when either they 1) buy new hardware, 2) need new software, or 3) need to work with others who only accept new software.

Personally, I'd rather be compelled to upgrade than forced...

chicagdan
Oct 28, 2003, 01:16 PM
Well, then iChat AV beta is clearly gray market software ... Apple will still let you use it through the end of the year if you can find it. So it seems to me that this is a case where peer-to-peer file sharing is 100 percent legit.

Perhaps a prominent Mac site should post the file and see what Apple says. I'm really surprised that they continue to push the $30 product because once you buy it, I think you become less likely to pay another $130 for Panther. A soft sell is the smart sell, in this case. If you pay $30, they should at least offer a rebate if you decide to buy Panther within a certain time frame.

1macker1
Oct 28, 2003, 01:32 PM
So is ichat AV beta useless?

seconds after i posted this....i get a e-mail from apple saying iChat AV beta expires Jan,2004. Creepy.

robotrenegade
Oct 28, 2003, 01:39 PM
thats so not worth it.

Superdrive
Oct 28, 2003, 02:15 PM
Do people understand the facts here?
•Free iChat with Jaguar
•Free iChat AV with Panther
•If you purchase an iSight, you pay $30 to continue using iChatAV for Jag.
•If you purchase an iSight, and you have Panther, you pay nothing extra.
•Apple does not give iChat AV away with the cameras as a perk to the ones that own Panther. It is simple as that.
•iChat or iChatAV(Panther), are both free and work with any AIM account. .Mac is not needed.
•If you do not own an iSight or other camera, nothing changes with your iChat. You should simply revert back to iChat under the iChat application menu.

greenstork
Oct 28, 2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Flowbee
A good idea. Like Quicktime/Quicktime Pro.

Ummm, they have this already. If you own Jaguar, you got a free copy of iChat without the AV. If you own Panther, you get the AV for free. I couldn't see any situation that you would need to download a non-AV copy unless you accidentally deleted it.

ITR 81
Oct 28, 2003, 02:32 PM
Wintel folks may had it before us but it's not as perfected as Apples ver. unless they recently have came out with something better.

I've tried doing calls on Xp machine and it was always garbled up for some reason..and the video sometimes it would be so pixelated and framerates sucked so bad you might as well just not even use it. Hell if you watch Tech Tv you can see how bad it is and they are using broadband so that isn't the issue. So they either got bad software or bad cam. Either way i look at it Apple solved both those issues.

I'm guessing one day iChat will be sold to Window users as the iSight cam.


iChat needs a way to search for other iChat users which make it easier to have video chat.

greenstork
Oct 28, 2003, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by QCassidy352
i have ichat AV (with panther) and I hate it... went back to AIM in minutes. I can't understand wtf apple is thinking with ichat, but I wouldn't use it for free, let alone for $30. ugh.

You are aware that for $30 that there is audio and video involved? Some folks, myself included, try to keep AOL software off our computers.

A company that think's it's okay to change settings on my computer without permission (http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/10/24/1337201&mode=thread&tid=111&tid=120&tid=126&tid=172&tid=187) is not okay with me. I usually stay away from companies like AOL, Real, etc.

jayscheuerle
Oct 28, 2003, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by greenstork
I couldn't see any situation that you would need to download a non-AV copy unless you accidentally deleted it.

What if you deleted it on purpose?

D'oh!! :eek:

withnail
Oct 28, 2003, 03:30 PM
Originally posted by irmongoose

And, Apple is a group of people, not separate individuals, and thus should be used as a singular.


<pedantic>
...unless the people he's talking about are using British English, where the correct treatment would be the plural form, not the singular.
</pedantic>

pgwalsh
Oct 28, 2003, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by windwaves
how great can it be when you can only use it with others who are running the same software ? it is extremely limited. Plus, lets not forget that our dear windoze friends have had this for a while. This is one thing - one of the few - where Apple was way behind. We did have third party apps, which worked decently though. I thought you could do this with Yahoo IM for Mac and PC?

Anonymous Freak
Oct 28, 2003, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by Superdrive
•If you do not own an iSight or other camera, nothing changes with your iChat. You should simply revert back to iChat under the iChat application menu.

Not quite. I use audio-only in iChatAV more often than video. Partly because I know more people without cameras than with, and partly because I don't feel like being seen all the time, even if I want a voice chat.

Finally, audio-only has less of a delay (even on the same LAN, video has a noticeable delay,) and works just fine over my 3G cell phone connection. (For that matter, VIDEO even works, although it starts looking like abstract art when I lose packets.)

Side note: I find it odd that iChatAV drops the video quality instead of lowering the frame rate on low-speed connections. When I connect through my Sprint Vision phone, I get a full 15fps, but sometimes it looks like I'm talking to a LEGO man. You'd think they'd rather keep the quality of the picture high, but drop the frame rate. Oh well, at least it maintains audio quality.

iHack
Oct 28, 2003, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by pgwalsh
I thought you could do this with Yahoo IM for Mac and PC?

Yeah, you can. But it really sux. Provided you (and your buddy) have a mac and broadband, iChat AV beats anything out there. Only problem is my Mac buddies use dial-up, while some of my PC ehh, ehh, "friends" have broadband.
The non-Apple alternatives have terrible image quality, even over broadband. Like looking at a pixelated stamp. yuck. I'm trying to convince my sister in Palo Alto, CA, to get a Mac. iChat AV would be really cool, as my family only gets to meet her only a few days every year (I'm in the Netherlands).
The only drawback is that my parents and brothers would come to my house to iChat with my sister all the time. But hey, that's a small price to pay...

M.

pgwalsh
Oct 28, 2003, 05:09 PM
doh!

Phil Of Mac
Oct 28, 2003, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by davy the bunny
Did iChat come with Jaguar? Are you guys sure about that? I really didn't think that it did.

It did! And you couldn't even buy it for 10.1!

SaveMeFlash
Oct 29, 2003, 11:11 AM
I think they should have learned not to do this after the iMovie and iPhoto fiasco - it's just wrong to offer it free and then start charging users later. Why can't they just say they're going to charge for it from the start? Further, Apple needs to get this pervasively deployed on Mac and Windows, then sell iSights (which are wonderful). That means give it away.

mrsebastian
Oct 29, 2003, 11:33 AM
why is everyone freaking out about paying for ichat av. no matter what you pay for it. when you buy panther, you're getting a package deal for a bunch of software including the op system and lots i-apps. if you are running jaguar and just want ichat av, then go buy it, or more sensibly spend the extra $90 and get panther which is much better than jaguar anyway.

SaveMeFlash
Oct 29, 2003, 06:54 PM
I don't think anyone's freaking out - it's just that I bought iSight and now I've got to pay to use it. I doubt that you'd go fort that with your digital camera, your iPod, etc. As for Panther, I'll upgrade when I damn well please, not when Apple coerces me into it.
Kevin
The cost of living has just gone up another dollar a quart. -- W.C. Fields

Phil Of Mac
Oct 29, 2003, 06:56 PM
You knew this was coming when you bought your iSight, man. Now is not the time to be freaking out.

shadowfax
Oct 29, 2003, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
You knew this was coming when you bought your iSight, man. Now is not the time to be freaking out. totally. Steve Jobs spelled it out that when the beta expired it would cost you. he never even implied that the iSight would allow you to get it free for jag.

SaveMeFlash
Oct 30, 2003, 10:14 AM
but when I walked into the Apple store and bought iSight, I didn't think to consult Steve about whether there would be follow-on costs. I just looked at the box, tried it on one of the computers in the store and bought it, just like a digital camera, a cell phone, a GPS device, etc - all of which I own, none of which charges for the software. My point, gentlemen, is that the iSight is less unlike a computer and more like a digital device and therefore, the software needed to run iSight should be free to iSight owners because we paid for it as part of the purchase of a digital device. Steve & Co. may charge whatever the hell they want for IM functionality on the desktop but as of January, he will be rendering my hardware digital device unusable. Consider the statement "As of January, Jaguar will cease to work but, oh, Panther is available." What would you think of that? I think as of January, Steve and I are going to have a problem.
Kevin
"It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of what he was never reasoned into." Jonathan Swift

pgwalsh
Oct 30, 2003, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by SaveMeFlash
but when I walked into the Apple store and bought iSight, I didn't think to consult Steve about whether there would be follow-on costs. I just looked at the box, tried it on one of the computers in the store and bought it, just like a digital camera, a cell phone, a GPS device, etc - all of which I own, none of which charges for the software. My point, gentlemen, is that the iSight is less unlike a computer and more like a digital device and therefore, the software needed to run iSight should be free to iSight owners because we paid for it as part of the purchase of a digital device. Steve & Co. may charge whatever the hell they want for IM functionality on the desktop but as of January, he will be rendering my hardware digital device unusable. Consider the statement "As of January, Jaguar will cease to work but, oh, Panther is available." What would you think of that? I think as of January, Steve and I are going to have a problem.
Kevin
"It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of what he was never reasoned into." Jonathan Swift I agree... I don't listen to all of Steve's keynotes, so I may have missed it. My sister and I are interested in the iSight, but think it's silly we have to pay a separate fee to use it with Apples own software... If Apple was in MS position they'd charge more for everything and screw us harder... It's encoded into Steve's gene's. Only because Apple has a smaller market share do they listen to customers when they're really upset. Example is the iLife apps... Excuse is iDVD.

Think about how much they charge for a pro computer and you don't get a friggin monitor or speakers... ha ha ha..