iPhone AIM - So Close... Yet... Still So Far?

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

DaringFireball points (http://daringfireball.net/linked/2008/march#fri-07-iphone_hig) out an interesting bit of information from the iPhone SDK documentation that could have implications on the effectiveness of a native AIM chatting clientOnly one iPhone application can run at a time, and third-party applications never run in the background. This means that when users switch to another application, answer the phone, or check their email, the application they were using quits. It’s important to make sure that users do not experience any negative effects because of this reality. In other words, users should not feel that leaving your iPhone application and returning to it later is any more difficult than switching among applications on a computer.
From my brief research this does not appear to be an artificial limit placed on "3rd party applications" vs Apple applications, however. It appears that all applications are also subject to this limitation. Which simply means that only one "app" runs at one time on the iPhone. Now, Apple appears to get around this limitation in ways -- allowing music to be played in the background and also certain alerts to appear (such as SMS) -- but these may be based on special OS X services (not full apps) running in the background.

But what does this mean for an application like AIM or iChat where you want to be always available? I'm not sure. Off hand, I'd say a small time developer might not be able to accomplish a true ever-present AIM client, but Apple may have some ways to work around this, at least for a developer as big as AOL.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/iphone/2008/03/07/iphone-aim-so-close-yet-still-so-far/)

[arn]

one interesting point is the unofficial 3rd party AIM clients seem to work in background, but not sure if that's just because they aren't playing by the rules.

arn

[joshysquashy]

Surely a company like AOL will create a service to run in the background, keeping you connected, and poping up when someone msgs you?

That would be the obvious solution, but can these apps also install services?

Anyone with a Dev Kit know the answer?

[bdj21ya]

I don't think they mean what you've said here. I'd *guess* that there will be a way to store on suspend and reload into memory on reload.

[idonotliketostu]

i think apollo works in the background?

[Andrmgic]

i think apollo works in the background?

So does MobileChat, both even feature wifi and EDGE keep-alive to keep it from disconnecting even if the phone goes to sleep.

[jakaj]

So does MobileChat, both even feature wifi and EDGE keep-alive to keep it from disconnecting even if the phone goes to sleep.

MobileChat does not have EDGE keep-alive, and AFAIK Apollo's doesn't work on newer firmwares (I think I read this on these forums somewhere).

[Icebird]

It's because jailbroken apps are running as root with full access to everything. When the SDK comes out, assuming nothing changes between now and June, the apps running now are running in "user" mode which would not have access to functions such as running as a service (which apps that are running on jailbroken iphones are able to). That's the difference.

I think they've chosen to do this because, at least in my experience, if you have a jailbroken iPhone, and you open a lot of apps, especially multiple ones that are running in the background, the battery life sinks so fast it's not even funny. I went one morning to an afternoon and lost more than 25%. After you reboot, all the apps are forced to close until you re-open them, but until then, you keep losing massive amounts of battery life.

Apple just wants to have one application open at a time so when it closes, it'll free up all that extra memory and make sure it's not pinging or constantly using the Locate Me function, thereby draining battery. Just my opinion though.

[idonotliketostu]

MobileChat does not have EDGE keep-alive, and AFAIK Apollo's doesn't work on newer firmwares (I think I read this on these forums somewhere).



It does work, you just have to edit the HOST file in the etc folder.

[rjohnstone]

People still use AIM? Why?
It's a terrible app.

A lot of people have since migrated to MSN or Yahoo.
And since they both play nice with each other, the Microsoft haters don't have to use an MSN client to talk to other MSN peeps.
Hell GTalk is better than AIM.

[Rhinestorm]

People still use AIM? Why?
It's a terrible app.

A lot of people have since migrated to MSN or Yahoo.
And since they both play nice with each other, the Microsoft haters don't have to use an MSN client to talk to other MSN peeps.
Hell GTalk is better than AIM.

All my friends use AIM. People only change when all their friends switch. Sure, one of my friends can start using MSN but I'll still be using AIM with everyone else.

[admanimal]

Given the fact that AIM is one of the flagship apps for the iPhone SDK, it is obvious that AOL has the connections to make it function exactly how we expect it to.

[MacFanBoyIIe]

People still use AIM? Why?
It's a terrible app.

What planet are you on?

[rjohnstone]

What planet are you on?
Earth... and I hate all things AOL.

[idonotliketostu]

I love aim!

I can't stand MSN or any other IM services.

[amemoryoncelost]

I just use adium, so I can use them all! But really, about 98% of my friends use aim, so that's basically all I need, but have a few using Y! and msn...

[thegman1234]

I just use adium, so I can use them all! But really, about 98% of my friends use aim, so that's basically all I need, but have a few using Y! and msn...

Adium is the best. Connects to the AIM network, and is a great app as well. Very customizable, very personal. I love it. I'm hoping Adium gets built for the iPhone.

[Luap]

People still use AIM? Why?
It's a terrible app.

A lot of people have since migrated to MSN or Yahoo.
And since they both play nice with each other, the Microsoft haters don't have to use an MSN client to talk to other MSN peeps.
Hell GTalk is better than AIM.

Purely your opinion, and yours only.
Im no fan of AOL either, but if anything good did come of it, then AIM was one. iChat after all is merely a glorified AIM client. I find MSN awful. I don't speak "Smilie" which all the kids on there go gooey for. And Yahoo, well.. I cant even remember what its like and don't know anyone who uses it either.
But its all better than IRC! How antiquated is that.. Reminds me of my early online experiences using a C64. Yes, really.

Back on topic.. I'd certainly like a good AIM client for my currently unhacked iPhone. I don't even care if it can't be used in the background. After all, how chatworthy can you be if its in the background anyway?? Either you are available for conversation, or you are not. If not, use email! iPhones are quite good for email too ;)

[thegman1234]

Purely your opinion, and yours only.
Im no fan of AOL either, but if anything good did come of it, then AIM was one. iChat after all is merely a glorified AIM client. I find MSN awful. I don't speak "Smilie" which all the kids on there go gooey for. And Yahoo, well.. I cant even remember what its like and don't know anyone who uses it either.
But its all better than IRC! How antiquated is that.. Reminds me of my early online experiences using a C64. Yes, really.

Back on topic.. I'd certainly like a good AIM client for my currently unhacked iPhone. I don't even care if it can't be used in the background. After all, how chatworthy can you be if its in the background anyway?? Either you are available for conversation, or you are not. If not, use email! iPhones are quite good for email too ;)

Commodore 64, wow lol. I'm too young for that.

You make a good point, however many people like to be left messages while they're not available for chat. Also multitasking such as changing a song or reading an email while being available for IM is necessary IMO. Leaving AIM to check the map shouldn't sign you off.

[wildmilne]

Commodore 64, wow lol. I'm too young for that.

You make a good point, however many people like to be left messages while they're not available for chat. Also multitasking such as changing a song or reading an email while being available for IM is necessary IMO. Leaving AIM to check the map shouldn't sign you off.

I think AOL is primarily an american thing...everyone i know overseas is on MSN or Yahoo.

[thegman1234]

I think AOL is primarily an american thing...everyone i know overseas is on MSN or Yahoo.

However in the case of the iPhone, AIM is the client currently being developed... at least in America afaik lol.

[sdschwendener]

The real question is when will apple release ichat on the iphone which handles multiple types of IM services.

it only makes sense especially if they move to a 3G and moorestown chip.

Remember iphone firmware 2.0 is still far off.. Apple may very well have many goodies to surprise us with.

[intoxicated662]

I can barely get yahoo messenger to work and even logging in to www.aim.com isn't the best. Can't even see your buddylist or much really

[hidehide]

That means 3rd party app still surpass sdk app :)

[EarthDawn]

Earth... and I hate all things AOL.


Me too ,,.... but AIM is the standard for most and all my friends and contacts are with them as well ....

like others have said its hard to switch when everyone you know is still on AIM ....

I cant wait to have the iPhone app. for Aim/iChat

[sanford]

Me too ,,.... but AIM is the standard for most and all my friends and contacts are with them as well ....

like others have said its hard to switch when everyone you know is still on AIM ....

I cant wait to have the iPhone app. for Aim/iChat

AIM is used a lot by Mac users because of its compatibility with iChat, which will not interoperate with MSN or Yahoo.

And all text-based IM is about the dumbest, most annoying way to communicate with someone when you want something that begs more immediate response than e-mail. It was great when it was the best personal computing technology could support. Apple pioneered widespread implementation of voice and then video over IM networks, even including cameras in almost all Macs, first returning to the convenience and tradition of the telephone, then improving upon it with video. Now iChat, AIM, Skype, MSN, Yahoo, I'm sure there are others all support quality voice and video communications for free, and still people who use IM mostly refuse to use these much-improved features.

E-mail is much the same as posting a letter, but faster and far more convenient, while still allowing for a gap in reply. You can even make the case that the ubiquity of e-mail has the potential to improve literacy, so long as people aren't too lazy with their compositions all the time. SMS is a fast if not outstandingly convenient way to get a short message to someone when you don't have the time or are not in the place for a phone call. Text-based IM is a children's trend that began with children or adult computer-centric types and has unfortunately persisted. You can actually do other things with a voice-based IM system; even walk around with a wireless headset. All for free. Constantly switching back and forth from your work to typing messages into a window, when two far betters ways to go at it via the same computer application or widely available, is about the most obstinate, idiotic failure to incorporate into routine life useful advances in modern technology I've yet experienced.

Text-based IM wastes time and contributes to attention deficit and concentration issues, even in adults -- no, not ADD or ADHD or any other pop, nebulously defined behavioral syndrome of the moment; I'm talking about the plain, old ability to focus and stick to something until you've seen it through.

[EarthDawn]

WOW... very well said !!!!

[aloofman]

Now iChat, AIM, Skype, MSN, Yahoo, I'm sure there are others all support quality voice and video communications for free, and still people who use IM mostly refuse to use these much-improved features.


The last time I checked (someone can correct me if I'm wrong), iChat and Skype were the only ones that could do video and audio chat at the same time on the Mac. My recollection is that Yahoo Messenger couldn't do audio during a video chat.

Then again, I stopped using chat clients at home quite a while ago, so maybe I'm behind the times.

[batchtaster]

It was great when it was the best personal computing technology could support.

Newer <> better.

I still write emails in plain text. I refuse to get involved in polluting people's mailboxes with hideous fonts, bad formatting, inconsistent sizing and other such nonsense. It's useless frippery, pisses people off and makes it hard and annoying to read. Communicate simply and clearly.

If you want to actually talk to someone, use a phone (you know these things actually do that?). Video and audio chat is still regularly spotty enough on any service, particularly when networks and services are all different, that you cannot reliably predict whether it will work, let alone whether the person will be in any kind of presentable state.

Text IM's strength is its asynchronicity. Send a text message, person reads it when they read it, and responds it if/when they get around to it. Just like SMS except without all the paying of money. And there are more of those sent than phone calls. I am also curious how you think they would accomplish video chat on this iPhone.

ObTopic: Apple announced during the WWDC keynote that they would not be allowing background apps, but they would be hosting a "push" service for all applications. This would apply not just to messaging apps, but to any app that wants to make use of background notifications: the third-party sends an event to Apple's server, which then pushes it to your iPhone. A single background process, part of the OS, that handles everyone's alerts, notifications, etc. Thus, this AIM client could handle incoming messages while not running, as long as they're using Apple's official methodology.