O2's iPhone Discounts Spur Sales [Archive]

MacRumors

Apr 21, 2008, 11:02 PM

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

MobileToday (http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/iPhone_sells_out_after_mid_week_price_reduction.html) reports that O2's £100 price drop on the iPhone last week (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/04/15/o2-discounting-8gb-iphone/) successfully spurred sales. O2 stores in Newcastle, Birmingham, and London reportedly sold out on the day of the price cuts, while Carphone Warehouse stores noticed a sharp uptick in sales:‘We usually sell one or two a day, but yesterday we sold about 20 – it was like launch day again.'
Customers are reassured that O2 expected more stock to be delivered this past weekend. Apple is said to be in talks (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/apple-france-telecom-reportedly-talks/story.aspx?guid=%7BE18CE0C4-FA60-4450-977D-48593BB1D8E3%7D&dist=msr_1) with France Telecom to similarly drop the price of the iPhone in France, due to poor initial sales.

Earlier reports (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/04/18/clearing-inventory-for-radically-different-3g-iphone/) have claimed that the price cuts were put in place to clear inventory ahead of the expected 3G iPhone. An Italian report (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/04/21/unlocked-3g-iphone-to-launch-in-italy/) today pinpoints the 3G iPhone release in the next few weeks.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/04/21/o2s-iphone-discounts-spur-sales/)

Grimace

Apr 21, 2008, 11:03 PM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.

arn

Apr 21, 2008, 11:07 PM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

DMann

Apr 21, 2008, 11:10 PM

"We usually sell one or two a day"? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.

Once 3G hits the market, 10M will be reached and surpassed by the end of 2008.

zap2

Apr 21, 2008, 11:14 PM

And Apple begins to get "it"

Europe's market is a lot different then the US's

Now, give us a 3G iPhone, and everyone will be happy :p

Zwhaler

Apr 21, 2008, 11:16 PM

Let's hope they don't complain and say they were duped into clearing out old stock...

Kidding. But lets get this 3G iPhone on the road already.

zync

Apr 21, 2008, 11:18 PM

Let's hope they don't complain and say they were duped into clearing out old stock...

Kidding. But lets get this 3G iPhone on the road already.

Let's get it today! It's Tuesday where I am.

chickenninja

Apr 21, 2008, 11:22 PM

i still think they should be free.

zainjetha

Apr 21, 2008, 11:26 PM

I think this will boost sales enormously. people buying it and then jailbreaking it... ..

however, it appears that Apple Store is not taking part in £100 reduce/discount....

WHY???

Grimace

Apr 21, 2008, 11:59 PM

I think this will boost sales enormously. people buying it and then jailbreaking it... ..

however, it appears that Apple Store is not taking part in £100 reduce/discount....

WHY???

It's an O2 subsidy.

gugy

Apr 22, 2008, 12:05 AM

damn, give me the damn 3G iPhone with 32gig now for $499! ;)

ebouwman

Apr 22, 2008, 12:05 AM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.

Ya but who are the quoting? I'm pretty sure it's not a company exec, it's probably a quote from some guy working at a retail outlet, and god knows where, or how big of a store.

Grimace

Apr 22, 2008, 12:09 AM

Ya but who are the quoting? I'm pretty sure it's not a company exec, it's probably a quote from some guy working at a retail outlet, and god knows where, or how big of a store.

Very true. It was a random sales associate. Another employee said that they usually sell 30 per day. I don't think Apple will have any problem reaching 10M iPhones in 2008 but it would be nice to start early on the 3G portion! (clearing out old 2.5G stock at a discounted rate sure seems to do the trick too.)

randomrazor

Apr 22, 2008, 12:38 AM

no sh:apple:t sherlock ... i get tired of people trying to feel like they have all th e inside info on the iPhone.... I think everyone and their dog has stated that the iPhone is coming out in a few weeks... tell us something we don't know for once :D

Lycanthrope

Apr 22, 2008, 12:48 AM

aLoC

Apr 22, 2008, 01:15 AM

So there's nothing wrong with it, it's just too pricey for folks. Perhaps they should not discontinue the lower capacity models in the coming months.

irun5k

Apr 22, 2008, 01:36 AM

I think 3G + the SDK/AppStore will really help things. Many people had said that it was not the greatest idea to release a non-3G phone in Europe. But, I guess at least it established the desired partnerships and retail channels.

Even with the price cut, I'm surprised anybody is buying the thing across the pond right now. Pretty much anybody and everybody expects a 3G variant by summer.

ballmerretard

Apr 22, 2008, 01:46 AM

I can't wait for the 3G iphone, I've waited so long already!

edwdcook

Apr 22, 2008, 01:54 AM

Aren't all these people going to be pissed when then new 3G phones are released in a few weeks?

Jowl

Apr 22, 2008, 02:03 AM

Aren't all these people going to be pissed when then new 3G phones are released in a few weeks?

While I'm sure some will be, I was going to buy on then upgrade to 3G, passing on the 2.5G to the other half. The only thing that stopped me is I have 3 months left of my current mobile contract. I do think the £100 off is good deal though.

As it's been said before, Apple got it wrong in Europe - certainly the UK. We expect easy SMS to multiple people (yes, now fixed), MMS, at least a 3mp camera phone that can record video and 3G. With our subsidised phones we can send&recieve files/mp3s/pictures via Bluetooth too. We expect to be able to be able to do most of that at least from a top-end phone we have to pay for in full.

Bye Bye Baby

Apr 22, 2008, 02:08 AM

You don't need to be a brain-surgeon to work-out why iPhone sales have been slack in Europe. For me the lack of 3G isn't the big issue it's rather just the pricing and the weakness of the dollar. They are so cheap for us to buy in the USA and so easy to unlock that paying full price in £ or € just isn't an option.

Finally someone who has said what most people are thinking. It is price my dear boy! First and foremost and then the fact that what you get is not what the market actually wants, i.e. no 3g.

Iphone was really expensive in Europe up until the price cut. Now it is a good, perhaps I should say better, price for what it is.

Imagine what sales would be if they sold an 8gig 3g phone, no contract, for the same price. I do think that :apple: would almost sell their promised 10 million units in a week, nay I say the first day?

If only...

Bye Bye Baby

Apr 22, 2008, 02:11 AM

Aren't all these people going to be pissed when then new 3G phones are released in a few weeks?

I just bought an 8gig at the new price, knowing full well the benefits and the immanence of the new model. However, price will be an issue, at least for me. I think I would also like to wait for perhaps the second iteration of the 3g, perhaps if next year Apple shifts to intel processors?

And you can always upgrade your phone with existing contract. When the price of the new 3g drops! :p

scharf10

Apr 22, 2008, 02:15 AM

By chance my previous contract ended on the day before the price cut, so I walked in on the Wednesday and picked up the 2nd last one they had in the store at the cut price.

If my previous contract was longer I would have just waited on the 3G iPhone, but I know myself that i'll just upgrade once I've saved enough money after its release.

On a side note, one of the other shop workers was just away to head to another local 02 store to get more iPhones, so they must have been selling a fair few and that was only by 10:30ish in the morning.

Scharf.

cal6n

Apr 22, 2008, 02:28 AM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

Slower than expected by whom, exactly?

More than a year ago, a few Europeans posted predictions that this level of pricing would be necessary in Europe before the iPhone was accepted by the mainstream. We were ridiculed and, in some cases, treated very rudely by posters who, having no understanding of the market here, insisted that the situation would be the same as in the US.

Those posters know who they are and an apology would be nice.

Probably not worth waiting for, though... :rolleyes:

*edit* And yes, Arn, 3G may help address it, but if the price goes back up, the sales figures will go back down.

swagi

Apr 22, 2008, 02:28 AM

While I'm sure some will be, I was going to buy on then upgrade to 3G, passing on the 2.5G to the other half. The only thing that stopped me is I have 3 months left of my current mobile contract. I do think the £100 off is good deal though.

As it's been said before, Apple got it wrong in Europe - certainly the UK. We expect easy SMS to multiple people (yes, now fixed), MMS, at least a 3mp camera phone that can record video and 3G. With our subsidised phones we can send&recieve files/mp3s/pictures via Bluetooth too. We expect to be able to be able to do most of that at least from a top-end phone we have to pay for in full.

+1 for Germany

While I seriously am thinking about buying one for my quite technophobe wife, the obvious shortcomings of the iPhone stop me from buying one for myself.

The Nokia N95 is available with 8 GB for 1 € with a not so shabby contract here. The N96 just around the corner. So Apple better give me MMS and easy file sharing with my friends and my computer via Bluetooth. They better give me better options to edit profiles, select custom ringtones for special people, groups and stuff. And they should finally give me a tethering option to use my data connection on my laptop. I've done that with my 3G phone quite some time, when I'm on the road.

I don't give a damn about media player features and I could care less about mobile Safari, as Nokias WebKit isn't too shabby. Mobile Safari won't make me pay 300 bucks more on a phone with so many shortcomings!

Project

Apr 22, 2008, 02:46 AM

Jim Campbell

Apr 22, 2008, 02:47 AM

We were ridiculed and, in some cases, treated very rudely by posters who, having no understanding of the market here, insisted that the situation would be the same as in the US.

You might be happy with an apology; I'm not settling for anything less than cold, hard cash.

Cheers!

Jim

OllyW

Apr 22, 2008, 02:55 AM

Slower than expected by whom, exactly?

More than a year ago, a few Europeans posted predictions that this level of pricing would be necessary in Europe before the iPhone was accepted by the mainstream. We were ridiculed and, in some cases, treated very rudely by posters who, having no understanding of the market here, insisted that the situation would be the same as in the US.

Those posters know who they are and an apology would be nice.

Probably not worth waiting for, though... :rolleyes:

*edit* And yes, Arn, 3G may help address it, but if the price goes back up, the sales figures will go back down.

I know exactly what you mean. I commented on some of the early iPhone threads, making the point that I thought they had got it wrong for the European market and received plenty of abuse.

I've still got the iPhone forums excluded in the forum spy to stop me getting into trouble :)

It's now been on sale in the UK for 5 months. O2 had to make big improvements to the price plans back in March as the original contracts were rubbish. This obviously didn't improve sales enough so now they have cut the price of the phone by over a third. Let's hope they are finally starting to get it!

cal6n

Apr 22, 2008, 02:56 AM

You might be happy with an apology; I'm not settling for anything less than cold, hard cash.

Cheers!

Jim

lol :) I've always been easy to please, though...

redwin11

Apr 22, 2008, 02:57 AM

Are people really so silly enough to go out and buy the iPhone now?

Why don't people do a bit of research before buying any new piece of hardware, let alone if it's being discounted.

As for the slow European sales, i can't vouch for other countries, but paying almost £300 for a mobile phone (which is essentially what it is being mass-marketed as, despite doing a whole lot more) is simply not an option for most people.

iSlave

Apr 22, 2008, 03:06 AM

Hmmm....carving off £100 from the price leads to an increase in sales? Would've thought!? What next? A bear ***** in the woods? :o

weckart

Apr 22, 2008, 03:08 AM

Judging from the posts on UK hardware forums, many of the people buying these are dyed-in-the-wool Apple haters who do not have a data plan, rendering the lack of 3G or otherwise moot, but do like the responsive user interface, abundance of apps and mediaplayer aspects and, now, the price.

The price point was judged to be fine at £169, not at £269. I did not notice a single post that mentioned that the contract was being bought. Every phone was jailbroken. If this is an O2 subsidy, then unless O2 is contractually obliged to shift a certain volume of iPhones, this will cost it dearly.

One or two buyers posting already owned the N95 and did mention that the latter's interface compares unfavourably with the iPhone's in terms of responsiveness and ease of navigation.

Brianstorm91

Apr 22, 2008, 03:08 AM

redwin11

Apr 22, 2008, 03:18 AM

It's still no use to me; £30/month for the cheapest contract? I don't even spend £10/month on my phone, and that's including line rental.

I know very well that you get unlimited this and that, but what's the use in paying for an unlimited amount when it would be cheaper for me to just pay as I use it.

That pretty much sums up a large proportion of phone users over here - there's no real necessity for mobile internet/email access anytime, anywhere - certainly when it comes at a premium.

Sure it'd be a nice addition to have on your phone, but personally I can wait until I get home or in the office. And 99% of us already own an iPod, thanks.

Dagless

Apr 22, 2008, 03:36 AM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

Exactly. Whilst it isn't scientific all my phone fanatic friends won't look twice at an iPhone till it matches their current phones with wireless data speeds. Which is pretty much just 3G (no HSDPA reception here).

Fozziebear40

Apr 22, 2008, 03:36 AM

Are people really so silly enough to go out and buy the iPhone now?

The iPhone is now £30 cheaper than an iPod Touch.... 'go figure' :D

I did, contract enhancement and now £100 off, sure. I don't need 3G and I presume it is only good if you live in a big urban area I believe so not worth waiting for.

I presume any new iPhone would have the same software and screen size regardless.

iSlave

Apr 22, 2008, 03:37 AM

I bought an iPhone in March, and immediately unlocked it. I sold it recently and thankfully made a small profit, just before the price cut. While there's no denying it's an incredible device, I have to echo what previous posters have said about how necessary it is overall.

Also, I have to mention that on more than one occasion I was stared at by groups of chavs while out in public using it, which makes me wonder if having an iPhone is actually a threat to your personal security in this country!! With our record of knife crime, you have to question if it's worth it.

Anyway, now I have a Blackberry Pearl 8120. Great phone, only £130 and very cheap on either payg or simplicity with a data bolt-on. Just in case you really do need to check your email away from home...

redwin11

Apr 22, 2008, 03:41 AM

I presume any new iPhone would have the same software and screen size regardless.

That's very presumptuous.

But of course, if the current iPhone does everything you require, then you've got yourself a good deal in proportion to what it was previously being sold for.

redgaz26

Apr 22, 2008, 03:47 AM

Fozziebear40

Apr 22, 2008, 03:47 AM

That's very presumptuous.

I know ;) sort of justifying getting the phone now. I just thought with the SDK and the stuff that is being programmed for it now it would have to be compatible?

iSlave

Apr 22, 2008, 03:50 AM

"how necessary it is overall"????
what does that mean??????
I bought mine on launch day over here and don't regret it for a minute. no one needs to have it. you buy it if that's what you want.
600 mins 500 texts and unlimited internet for £35 is as good as you'll get anywhere for a high end phone!!!

Very true, as you said, you buy it if that's what you want. However, you might not actually need all that, which is why I was questioning how necessary it all is.

LukeHarrison

Apr 22, 2008, 03:55 AM

I know somebody who had been debating whether to part with his hard-earned cash for an iPhone for a long time, and yet as soon as he heard about the discount, he rushed out and bought one, so I can imagine that it's doing nothing but good for both Apple and O2.

(Maybe not so much O2 in this case, he unlocked it and uses T-Mobile :p)

Me, I love my phone, but I'm gonna upgrade when the PowerPhone G5 is released.

Glenny2lappies

Apr 22, 2008, 03:56 AM

I was posting from my shiny new iPhone, but my typing went titsup:)

So, for me it was exactly the right thing to swing me into buying it. I went into my local O2 on the Thursday -- the second day of the new price -- and they'd sold out on the first day. According to the salesman, they'd sold more iPhones this week than on the launch day!

So I went to my local Carphone Warehouse; sold out. According to that salesman they had 4500 in their warehouse inventory which was down to 1500 by the Friday.

I finally got it and am delighted with it. It's everything I thought it would be and even makes phone calls.

Yep, chuffed to bits. Sure, there's missing bits, but the bits it does well, it does *really* well. The N95 couldn't hold a candle to this.

I've a feeling that the new one will be more expensive. Having said that, with the numbers they've been flogging in the last week I wonder if the prices will be kept lower? Still, it's Steve we're talking about, so I won't be daft!

210

Apr 22, 2008, 03:59 AM

I also think the price is more the issue than the lack of 3G with the iPhone. I'm sure I'm one of many that don't really care about the 3G (although it would be nice) and prefer a cheaper iPhone. I'm just waiting for my contract to expire until I switch over to O2.

The 2.5G iPhone may remain at the same price whilst the 3G iPhone will be the older higher price when it's out. How much money I have at the time will be the deciding factor on which one I'll buy

sunfast

Apr 22, 2008, 04:04 AM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

Much slower. I live and work in London and I just don't see iPhones. I'm surprised if O2 are genuinely pleased with their sales.

redgaz26

Apr 22, 2008, 04:06 AM

Hopefully apple take note of what's happened since the price drop. If they keep the price low enough thousands more will be sold.
Will be very interesting to see how much the new version will be????

lloydi

Apr 22, 2008, 04:06 AM

Are people really so silly enough to go out and buy the iPhone now?

Apparently so ... I must be one of those silly people, because I went for it.

Y'see, I spend maybe £10 every two months on a pay as you go. A contract is no good to me because it's more expensive than I need it to be and I don't want lock-in for 12 months, and definitely not 18 months.

I also needed a new phone, and I want it to sync flawlessly with my MacBook Pro. I had previously been carrying around an iPod Touch and a Sony Ericsson phone. A cheap iPhone that I can then unlock and use with my existing SIM is great. No 3G? No big deal. I have internet access at home and work, can use wireless around the house on the phone and rarely feel in such desperate need to use data on the go. So for me, it's been a really good deal. So people who have not bought until now, knowing a 3G phone is around the corner are not necessarily stupid. For my usage, I think I've gotten a great deal.

djellison

Apr 22, 2008, 04:22 AM

No pay as you go option - no sale.

I don't want, need, require or feel like getting shafted with a <£400 a year contract. I use perhaps £20 - 50 per year on my current Orange PAYG phone.

I'm not prepared to hack, crack, rip or unlock the thing, it's expensive enough thanks, it should be available on ANY plan, with working visual voice mail. I wouldn't mind moving to O2 to get it - but I refuse to get a contract - I just don't need it.

It also needs 3G, a better camera, video recording ability,MMS, proper bluetooth etc.

Doug

abrooks

Apr 22, 2008, 04:24 AM

LeviG

Apr 22, 2008, 04:31 AM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

The 3G iPhone may not necessarily address it, the UK (and the rest of europe) seems to like the cheap (but expensive out of contract) phones when on expensive contracts, unless the 3G iPhone follows the Italy rumour, its unlikely that apples several hundred pound plus a contract is going to appeal to the same amount as in the US.

As to the sales - I wonder how many are being unlocked, the 8GB iPhone is cheaper than the iPod touch at the moment. Another thing is how many phones are kept in stock, I don't know any company that has an excess of slow moving products in stock. So if theres only 20 phones in stock and they sell out its completely different to if theres 200 phones and they sell out.

cervaro

Apr 22, 2008, 04:36 AM

Needs 3G, 5mp camera and unlocking from the off if they expect to charge £269 for the base model in the UK.

chickenninja

Apr 22, 2008, 04:50 AM

i hope they plan a really special occasion for the release, ya know the imacs birthday is coming up!

lewchenko

Apr 22, 2008, 05:48 AM

Its still too expensive.

£169 is almost $340.

There are almost no other phones available in any network store that will cost you that much money from the offset, plus you have to sign up with an 18month 'expensive' contract or Jailbreak it.

The iphone will NEVER hit mass market in the Uk with a start price that high. It may well be better than an N95 from Nokia... but they are now FREE on even low price contracts.

If the phone is jacked back up in price ro £269 in June, then I fear it will be the same again - hardly any buyers. 3G is nice... providing you get a free data plan to go with it. Knowing O2 they will stiff you for another £10 per month for a truly reasonable data usage plan once 3G arrives.

99% of people use their mobiles to simply make calls. The younger generation love photos and music. There are many many cheap phones which do all those things for FREE, and in some areas do them better than the iphone.

Apple needs to take a good look at the euro market before June... otherwise it will forever be known as iflop over here.

emir

Apr 22, 2008, 05:55 AM

i agree with the ones who say European iPhone needs photo,music etc... sharing with bluetooth, better camera with video(video can come with 2.0) and 3g. But my point is i don't want 3G because i don't have 3G in my country(Turkey) so the 169 price is absolutely amazing for me. And i will go to O2 in London on Saturday but when i heard that they sold out i just scared. Because i only have one shot since i don't live in UK, and that shot is depending on O2s stocks. What do you think? Will they have plenty of stocks until this Saturday?

mr1970

Apr 22, 2008, 05:57 AM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.

The mobile phone market here in the UK, as others have noted, is markedly different to that in the US - one of the very few markets where we are more competitive & technically advanced. The two key points to note here are:

- as noted a thousand times, 3G phones have been out in the UK for a few years so a 2G phone (albeit a very nice one) was never going to set the heather on fire

- selling a couple of a particular model a day in a London mobile phone shop isn't a great surprise - there is a massive density of mobile phone shops here, hugely more than I saw in New York or Chicago recently, for example. My ex ran a number of phone stores and success or failure was definitely measured on very tight targets - 7 phones a day = disaster, 9 = OK, 12 = triumph, 15 = team night out. It's a very, very fluid market; personally I've averaged something like 1.5 different phones per year for the last 10 years. Can't remember the last time I kept a phone for a whole year.

All of which said, as an Apple fetishist for 4 years now I bought the iPhone the day after it came out in the UK, and it remains the finest piece of technology I've ever used. Couple of obvious gripes (3G & no task list - who the hell makes a smartphone without a task list???!!!) but it is massively better than the competition. I also have a WM5 Palm Treo from work so I'm reminded every day of just how surreal the level of performance difference actually is.

k2k koos

Apr 22, 2008, 05:58 AM

I agree with other posters here that Europe will be a better prospect for Apple once the 3G phone hits, we've had 3G networks for a while, there's other 3G phones out there, and we simply don't need a phone that works on an older network technology.

There is another concern though, that not only affects the iPhone, and that's WiFi. While having Wifi build in is fantastic, the fact that a lot of WiFi networks are not free spoils it, and there is no 'roaming' charge possible yet either, when I find myself on a T-mobile hotspot, while being a BT openzone customer for example, I need to pay both companies seperately. When traveling around , that is just not practical, so either these networks need to be free of charge (fat chance ), or enable some kind of roaming function, that no matter who you're with, all you need to do is just turn on your iPhone, iPod touch , laptop etc, and of you surf, not having to worry or deal with setting up yet another account....

Once WiFi is liberated from that constraint, it will take off and truly work for all of us.:apple:

BongoBanger

Apr 22, 2008, 06:16 AM

The 3G iPhone may not necessarily address it, the UK (and the rest of europe) seems to like the cheap (but expensive out of contract) phones when on expensive contracts, unless the 3G iPhone follows the Italy rumour, its unlikely that apples several hundred pound plus a contract is going to appeal to the same amount as in the US.

As to the sales - I wonder how many are being unlocked, the 8GB iPhone is cheaper than the iPod touch at the moment. Another thing is how many phones are kept in stock, I don't know any company that has an excess of slow moving products in stock. So if theres only 20 phones in stock and they sell out its completely different to if theres 200 phones and they sell out.

Absolutely agree with everything that has been said in this post. 3G, whilst an issue, was never a deal breaker in itself. The iPod touch price comparison is also a very good point especially as it's worth noting that 16GB iPhones still aren't selling well.

I expect this to be an initial demand surge which will quickly tail off once this tranche of demand has been met.

iZac

Apr 22, 2008, 06:23 AM

The funny thing is that i Paid £270 for an iPod Touch, but i refused to pay £270 for an iPhone. Now, if i got an incredible subsidy on the monthly payments, then i would have been more able to accept it. In the UK, its practically demanded that the phone is free on contract, or no more than £50, if we're going to be paying so much into the networks pocket.

The iPhone should be marketed as a Pre-Pay phone, which you can just dump any SIM you like in. That way you can either choose the benefits of a contract with the unlimited date etc, or just be a tight ass pre-pay user who always gets his mates to phone him.

Edit: I know that the iPhone can just be unlocked easily (i myself have done a few) but to the average consumer, they either dont know how to do that, or feel its far too risky (also the O2 employees get very rude when they even get a whiff that you might unlock the phone.)

Eric Lewis

Apr 22, 2008, 06:27 AM

why not sell Unlocked ones..in countries that cannot resolve this carrier issue

ie...CANADA!

mkjj

Apr 22, 2008, 07:09 AM

Even if they were selling 1 per day isn't there about 2,000 Carphone Warehouse outlets in the UK? That's 2,000 units per day and a decent contribution to the 27,000 Apple needs considering the size of the population

650 CPW shops in the UK according to website, 2,200 in 11 countries.

Still, say average 15 a day, x 650 shops 9,750 per day, not bad going.:)

kornyboy

Apr 22, 2008, 07:36 AM

Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

I agree. Price looks like it may have also been affecting it quite a bit as well. Compairing what they were selling it for in the US vs. Europe, there was a huge difference. Logically there would be some price differences due to the costs to ship to those countries but I don't think that it completely justified the price difference.

elcid

Apr 22, 2008, 07:36 AM

Let's hope they don't complain and say they were duped into clearing out old stock...

Kidding. But lets get this 3G iPhone on the road already.

The good thing is everyone on these boards know this fact. The people who are buying them now aren't on here.

...yet.

Splutterbug

Apr 22, 2008, 07:58 AM

My current contract is coming up so an iphone is one of my options, but so is getting a phone and a PS3 for free on more or less the same tariff. Price is a huge problem, I don't expect to be paying over £150 for a phone, it's a much more attractive deal now but now you have the fear of an imminent upgrade and what you buy being out of date. May well go for the free PS3 and see how the iphone price is in a year

Lycanthrope

Apr 22, 2008, 08:01 AM

Well I'm buying one even though I know there's a 3G coming along soon. I sold my last US-bought 8GB model for €375 without even having to advertise it, even when the 3G is out the old 8GB models will easily fetch €300 here in Belgium (they're selling for €699 in some stores...)

Failing that I'm sure my wife would appreciate it :D

But the point isn't that the pricing is too high in Europe - HTC/QTEK models are more expensive even - the issue is that it's so cheap to buy in the USA for Europeans that we don't even consider buying here, we ask our friends visiting The States. For my first iPhone a friend in California bought it and posted, cost was €100 than buying one in UK. If the $ was stronger then more iPhones would sell in Europe.

iZac

Apr 22, 2008, 08:01 AM

The good thing is everyone on these boards know this fact. The people who are buying them now aren't on here.

...yet.

Most new sales are going to those buying them on the cheap, unlocking and selling them. Either eBay or just bulk to other countries that dont have the iPhone yet. O2 employees are even telling buyers, where other O2 stores are, so they can stock up.

The Phazer

Apr 22, 2008, 08:09 AM

Yep, price was always the problem.

Frankly, if the iPhone is ever going to be a mega success in the UK it needs to be free on the £45 tarriff, and no more than £50 on the £35 per month.

The phone should retail unlocked for about £270 (given the Touch Apple must make money on that), and on a £35 - £45 a month tarriff people expect £250 + worth of subsidy towards handset costs.

(of course, given that people should be signing the legally binding contracts before they take the phone out of the shop...)

Phazer

L3X

Apr 22, 2008, 08:36 AM

*BREAKING NEWS*

I just heard from a very reliable source that the 3G iPhone WILL be released sometime in the next few months.

...take it to the bank! :rolleyes:

JGowan

Apr 22, 2008, 08:46 AM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.It's very interesting that the WWDC is in early June and that the iPhone originally was available on June 29, 2007. This allows Steve time to release the new iPhone (hopefully day of his Keynote) which will generate big sales for the next 2.5 weeks to, hopefully, keep him on his one-year projection.

I believe that an overall price reduction on Edge versions along with v.2 of the software will help stimulate growth in even the Edge versions, however, I wouldn't be surprise to see a video camera or bigger HD or both on those as well.

Also, domino effect is sure to come into play here... once Johnny comes into the office just after he is able to download a dozen or more primo software packages from the software store, people at the office are going to say "I didn't the iPhone would do that"... boom... sales.

With all that I must add, Steve said, I believe, was "Our GOAL is garner 1% of the market (or 10M phones sold)" -- GOAL, people. I can't believe so many around the 'net say that Apple's stock will fall if they don't meet the 10M number. Of course, they're probably right because people are generally lemmings, especially in the stock market.

seedster2

Apr 22, 2008, 09:06 AM

The 3G iPhone may not necessarily address it, the UK (and the rest of europe) seems to like the cheap (but expensive out of contract) phones when on expensive contracts, unless the 3G iPhone follows the Italy rumour, its unlikely that apples several hundred pound plus a contract is going to appeal to the same amount as in the US.

As to the sales - I wonder how many are being unlocked, the 8GB iPhone is cheaper than the iPod touch at the moment. Another thing is how many phones are kept in stock, I don't know any company that has an excess of slow moving products in stock. So if theres only 20 phones in stock and they sell out its completely different to if theres 200 phones and they sell out.

Couldn't agree more.

A lot of domestic speculators only considered the iphone's simplicity of use and disregarded all the other externalities that impact sales. Apple's approach was dead in the water before they even started. The high unsubsidized handset cost, coupled with the carriers' exhorbitant fees (in order to recoup profit sharing losses) was doomed in a market where users are accustomed to free N95's and PAYG. It makes me wonder if it was pure arrogance or bad market research prior to launch:confused: They missed a golden opportunity with europeans having strong economy and a thirst for mobile phones. Oddly the many that said it would be a huge success are no where to be found.

BongoBanger

Apr 22, 2008, 09:12 AM

Also, domino effect is sure to come into play here... once Johnny comes into the office just after he is able to download a dozen or more primo software packages from the software store, people at the office are going to say "I didn't the iPhone would do that"... boom... sales.

Maybe, the problem is people have been doing that with S60 for years so it's not a new thing.

With all that I must add, Steve said, I believe, was "Our GOAL is garner 1% of the market (or 10M phones sold)" -- GOAL, people. I can't believe so many around the 'net say that Apple's stock will fall if they don't meet the 10M number. Of course, they're probably right because people are generally lemmings, especially in the stock market.

Not really, if you make public statements on sales targets then the city will hold you accountable for them.

James17

Apr 22, 2008, 09:18 AM

I paid £133 for a brand new 8GB 1.1.4 unlocked iPhone from Ebay and let me tell you why. I had a 3G 5MP LG Viewty which I paid £0 for when I got it as an upgrade on T-Mobile. I sold it for £187 and paid £320 for an iPhone from a reputable seller. Logically that works out at £133 out of my own pocket which is by far a good deal. I pay £21.25 a month for £180 credit and unlimited data on T-Mobile. I refuse to pay the ridiculous prices O2 charge and be tied to a 18 month contract.

morespce54

Apr 22, 2008, 09:32 AM

...The Nokia N95 is available with 8 GB for 1 € with a not so shabby contract here. The N96 just around the corner. So Apple better give me MMS and easy file sharing with my friends and my computer via Bluetooth. They better give me better options to edit profiles, select custom ringtones for special people, groups and stuff. And they should finally give me a tethering option to use my data connection on my laptop. I've done that with my 3G phone quite some time, when I'm on the road...

Exactly. IMHO, many peoples over there haven't paid for a cellphone in quite a while. I mean, they're almost paying you to use their phone (with a 1 year contract, in France). I agree that they don't have all the fancy-touchy-sexy feels but still. If you want to make it an upstream gadget, better:
a) lower the price or/and
b) put way more functions into the phone, at least make it 3G. Who cares about battery life :eek: We've all learned from iPods that you wont use it more than 2 years anyway. ;)

nick9191

Apr 22, 2008, 09:35 AM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.
Thats not country wide :rolleyes:

Mackan

Apr 22, 2008, 09:36 AM

why not sell Unlocked ones..in countries that cannot resolve this carrier issue

ie...CANADA!

The reason is greed. Apple tries to get too much profit from the iPhone. Now they start to put themselves into a corner. Should they start to sell unlocked phones in some countries? But still keep their current profit margin (very high)? Then the unlocked ones must be sold for a really high price. And make them only work in that country to not piss off carriers in other countries selling locked ones? Make the warranty valid only if you are in that country? But if it is too high priced, no one will buy it anyways?

Yeah, well... if they just released an unlocked phone, no contract needed, in all countries they sell iPods in... with a more "normal" 25 % profit margin per phone or so, things would be okay... they would get enough money. People would buy it, and continue to buy loads of it because the phone is actually so nice and cool.

But it is greed. They want loads of money. They want control, they want to expand, they want world domination? Oh wait, that's what all companies want in the end. ;)

IscariotJ

Apr 22, 2008, 10:02 AM

Apple would have sold a lot more in the UK, if they hadn't restricted themselves to O2. Not only that, it should have been 3G from day one. Oh, and a higher MP camera would have helped.

I know of several people who would buy an iPhone, if only if it wasn't O2 ( unfortunately, not everyone wants to unlock it ).

Hopefully, the new model ( and the rumour that it will be available to multiple carriers in Italy ) will signal the end of the exclusive deals.

wolfie37

Apr 22, 2008, 11:39 AM

"We usually sell one or two a day"?!!? That stinks. Apple needs to sell over 27,000 per day to get to 10M units (worldwide) in 2008.

Lets assume that 2 a day is a smaller Carphone Warehouse store, they have 750 stores so thats 1500 a day minimum (remember the other store said they sold 30 a day) that means CPW have sold 270,000 since launch not counting any peak times such as Christmas or launch day. Add in O2 sales at their shops, Apple store sales and online sales and that low estimate figure looks like 500,000 since launch. Extrapolate that to the end of the year and we are looking at a UK low-estimate sales figure of 1.1m (again not taking into account ay promotions or holiday sales boosts). Thats a healthy contribution to the 10million worldwide sales by year end.

Glenny2lappies

Apr 22, 2008, 11:50 AM

Apple would have sold a lot more in the UK, if they hadn't restricted themselves to O2. Not only that, it should have been 3G from day one. Oh, and a higher MP camera would have helped.

I've never understood the fixation with camera quality. Certainly when compared with the complete rubbish that is *every* other mobile device's intarwebs browser. Take the 'wonderful' N95 for instance; it doesn't even have a touch screen so selecting a URL is a matter of tabbing through; it doesn't zoom in and out; it's a dire browser.

Yet that gets forgotten about.

Similarly for the music browser. iTunes on the iPhone is a pleasure to use. Not sure about the other phone devices.

As soon as we get the application environment opened up in June, the iPhone will make all other phone/PDAs look like an X-box up against 'ping-pong'.

Hopefully, the new model ( and the rumour that it will be available to multiple carriers in Italy ) will signal the end of the exclusive deals.

That's not going to happen in the UK for at least 2 more years. I'm sure Apple's contract with O2 will last that long.

Bottom line; the iPhone is exclusive. We don't want just any chav having one. Bit like PCs vs. the Mac.

redgaz26

Apr 22, 2008, 11:53 AM

Lets assume that 2 a day is a smaller Carphone Warehouse store, they have 750 stores so thats 1500 a day minimum (remember the other store said they sold 30 a day) that means CPW have sold 270,000 since launch not counting any peak times such as Christmas or launch day. Add in O2 sales at their shops, Apple store sales and online sales and that low estimate figure looks like 500,000 since launch. Extrapolate that to the end of the year and we are looking at a UK low-estimate sales figure of 1.1m (again not taking into account ay promotions or holiday sales boosts). Thats a healthy contribution to the 10million worldwide sales by year end.

very valid point:D:D
i work in one of Scotland's largest train stations and from the launch up until a couple of weeks ago i think i saw two iphones, in the last few weeks ive seen loads.
always brings a smile to my face:D:D(sad I know)

"We don't want just any chav having one."
class!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

psychofreak

Apr 22, 2008, 11:55 AM

very valid point:D:D
i work in one of Scotland's largest train stations and from the launch up until a couple of weeks ago i think i saw two iphones, in the last few weeks ive seen loads.
always brings a smile to my face:D:D(sad I know)

You're lucky, I always get that jealous feeling when I see people with an iPhone. I'm just so desperate for one...hopefully I'll be able to wait out for and then afford a 32GB model.

jbernie

Apr 22, 2008, 12:12 PM

I think if I were Apple, I would have focused the Edge models on the US market only, 3G has been around way too long in most if not all of western Europe that an Edge phone can be viewed as a downgrade despite the cool oo its Apple buzz.

I understand that the initial issue with 3G was battery life related and for the US market where 3G coverage can be spotty in many major cities going with Edge on AT&Ts network was a good decision, but for Europe/Asia/Oceania 3G is expected porbably demanded in such a device.

I would expect western Europe sales to get a significant boost once the 3G model is released.

happydude

Apr 22, 2008, 12:14 PM

sounds like the european market has been slower uptake than expected. I guess the 3G iPhone will help address that.

arn

should also spurn a new interest in the u.s. market

Mock Turtleneck

Apr 22, 2008, 12:25 PM

+1 for Germany

While I seriously am thinking about buying one for my quite technophobe wife, the obvious shortcomings of the iPhone stop me from buying one for myself.

The Nokia N95 is available with 8 GB for 1 € with a not so shabby contract here. The N96 just around the corner. So Apple better give me MMS and easy file sharing with my friends and my computer via Bluetooth. They better give me better options to edit profiles, select custom ringtones for special people, groups and stuff. And they should finally give me a tethering option to use my data connection on my laptop. I've done that with my 3G phone quite some time, when I'm on the road.

I don't give a damn about media player features and I could care less about mobile Safari, as Nokias WebKit isn't too shabby. Mobile Safari won't make me pay 300 bucks more on a phone with so many shortcomings!

Just for starters, this message reeks of entitlement. Apple doesn't need to provide any features that they don't deem fit, nor do you need to purchase the device if it doesn't meet your need.

For starters, yes, MMS hopefully will be added in the near future, as for file sharing with your friends and computer...that is a useless feature as the iPhone has no ability to be used as a portable data device. The iPhone has never been advertised as a data storage device so why would Apple add file sharing abilities to the iPhone?

Adding custom ringtones to a user, easily done in current software revisions, thus that feature has already been added.

Data tethering is something that I would imagine is not permitted in Apple's Contracts, most unlimited data plans would be hurt or removed if we had users connecting their laptops through their iPhones all the time. From Apple's point of view it's better to protect the Internet Experience on the iPhone rather than let those agreements for data with their carriers disappear.

If you don't care about the Web Browsing abilities or the iPod abilities, perhaps the iPhone is not for you!

Regards,

The Mock Turtleneck

twoodcc

Apr 22, 2008, 12:27 PM

makes me think that the price cuts are just to sell more iPhones, and not really clear inventory

DevilInDisguise

Apr 22, 2008, 12:42 PM

Delta-NC

Apr 22, 2008, 01:45 PM

hey

just wanted to know if a tourist cud just go into the o2 or cpw store and buy an iphone with cash? cos i have a frnd who wud be in the UK for a few days and want him to get an iphone for me

wud they sell it to him just like that? or r there more things involved?

The only restriction is you have to pay by Credit or Debit card. However they only charge you for the phone using it. From then you can walk out the door and do as you wish. You do not have to sign anything, and have no obligations.

Delta-NC

Apr 22, 2008, 01:47 PM

L3X

Apr 22, 2008, 02:04 PM

May as well mention while I am here. I have only ever seen one person with an iPhone, me, and I returned it for a full refund less than 24 hours later. Was far to slow to be useful to me. Waiting for 3G.
I've seen maybe 6 people in the past year with an iPhone. I know many more people have them but they are not using them when I see them obviously.

Two of my co-workers have them. (I work in an IT dept)

Several other co-workers want them, but don't want to spend the money.

Blackberries are much more prevalent in the "IT" field.

/dev/toaster

Apr 22, 2008, 02:45 PM

I've seen maybe 6 people in the past year with an iPhone. I know many more people have them but they are not using them when I see them obviously.

Two of my co-workers have them. (I work in an IT dept)

Several other co-workers want them, but don't want to spend the money.

Blackberries are much more prevalent in the "IT" field.

Out here, I see 6 people a day with an iPhone. (Not counting my coworkers who have them)

A large portion of the company I work for has them, but then again we are already a very heavy Mac shop. We are down to 2 hard core Windows users :P

BongoBanger

Apr 22, 2008, 02:57 PM

Lets assume that 2 a day is a smaller Carphone Warehouse store, they have 750 stores so thats 1500 a day minimum (remember the other store said they sold 30 a day) that means CPW have sold 270,000 since launch not counting any peak times such as Christmas or launch day. Add in O2 sales at their shops, Apple store sales and online sales and that low estimate figure looks like 500,000 since launch. Extrapolate that to the end of the year and we are looking at a UK low-estimate sales figure of 1.1m (again not taking into account ay promotions or holiday sales boosts). Thats a healthy contribution to the 10million worldwide sales by year end.

Sorry, that's not the case. Sales aren't flat averaged - they peaked and then fell away quite considerably. In addition your figure of 500K is way too high.

skunk

Apr 22, 2008, 03:03 PM

Sorry, that's not the case. Sales aren't flat averaged - they peaked and then fell away quite considerably. In addition your figure of 500K is way too high.Until actual sales figures are published, your anecdotal guesstimate is no more valid than anyone else's.

DevilInDisguise

Apr 22, 2008, 03:25 PM

The only restriction is you have to pay by Credit or Debit card. However they only charge you for the phone using it. From then you can walk out the door and do as you wish. You do not have to sign anything, and have no obligations.

wud this be both at an o2 and cpw store? wat about the apple store?

does CPW have more stores then o2? cos then i can just ask my friends to go to a cpw as he can find one of them easily

weckart

Apr 22, 2008, 03:54 PM

650 CPW shops in the UK according to website, 2,200 in 11 countries.

Still, say average 15 a day, x 650 shops 9,750 per day, not bad going.:)

Too optimistic. There are some concrete figures on Macbidouille.com about the number of sales on day 2 of the discount - some 5400 were sold by CPW throughout the UK, compared with 1300 Nokia 2310s and some 450 N95s.

Ordinarily, I would have expected the sales to be in the low hundreds prior to the discount. The figures may go up a little over the first week or two as people hear about the discount, but the longer the sale goes on the more these figures will tail off.

BongoBanger

Apr 22, 2008, 04:04 PM

Until actual sales figures are published, your anecdotal guesstimate is no more valid than anyone else's.

I'm basing it on Orange France's published sales figures - 70,000 in month one dropping to about 10,000 over the next two months then to about 5,000 for the next two. These figures have been disclosed and - given that the business model is the same in France as it is in the UK - there is no reason to suppose O2's sales pattern is any different.

swagi

Apr 22, 2008, 04:10 PM

Just for starters, this message reeks of entitlement. Apple doesn't need to provide any features that they don't deem fit, nor do you need to purchase the device if it doesn't meet your need.

For starters, yes, MMS hopefully will be added in the near future, as for file sharing with your friends and computer...that is a useless feature as the iPhone has no ability to be used as a portable data device. The iPhone has never been advertised as a data storage device so why would Apple add file sharing abilities to the iPhone?

Adding custom ringtones to a user, easily done in current software revisions, thus that feature has already been added.

Data tethering is something that I would imagine is not permitted in Apple's Contracts, most unlimited data plans would be hurt or removed if we had users connecting their laptops through their iPhones all the time. From Apple's point of view it's better to protect the Internet Experience on the iPhone rather than let those agreements for data with their carriers disappear.

If you don't care about the Web Browsing abilities or the iPod abilities, perhaps the iPhone is not for you!

Regards,

The Mock Turtleneck

First of all, yeah, that's why I said I don't consider an iPhone for myself. And I guess the article was about the slow European uptake of the phone, wasn't it. I'm a little geeky, I was in the T-Mobile store the first day, so yeah, I was interested. But the price/performance ratio just is not right.

So I'm fully acknowledging my right not to buy the iPhone. If Apple doesn't care about my money...well so be it. Bad for me as a shareholder, and even worse for my cash waiting for some new gadgets.

Considering File sharing with friends and a computer: Well, my iPhone first of all should double as portable data device. Heck, nearly every Bluetooth capable phone on the market allows me to pair it and access the filesystem.

Second my phone generates data. I currently have 2GB in my Nokia phone. Nokia has a damn good Windows integration, so every soundclip, video and pic I CREATED (caps for emphasis) with my phone get downstreamed to the Windows comp as soon as pairing occurs. I also do this by hand on Mac OS X. So just for novelty sake I attached a pic I made with my Nokia, I wouldn't want to miss (my new car :D ).

And Data tethering is actively promoted by o2 in Germany, when they sell you the phone. E.g. they actively promote their o2 Connection Manager for OS X (current version 2.1), which allows for easy tethering.

But, Mock Turtleneck, you are definitely right. In current performance, the iPhone is not meant for me. Basically I could use an ugly brick, as long as its killer app is working properly. And that is making and receiving calls with great battery time (Nokia 6310 anyone?).

Maybe iPhone Rev. B will make me buy. Currently I'm in the process of terminating my contract, so in 3 months I have to buy a new phone. Well, maybe o2 Germany will give me an offer, I can't resist. Maybe Apple will.

In short - these are the reasons why Apple lost my money. I consider myself a rather typical European mobile user. So I'm a perfect example as to why the iPhone does not sell in Europe.

Mock Turtleneck

Apr 22, 2008, 04:49 PM

First of all, yeah, that's why I said I don't consider an iPhone for myself. And I guess the article was about the slow European uptake of the phone, wasn't it. I'm a little geeky, I was in the T-Mobile store the first day, so yeah, I was interested. But the price/performance ratio just is not right.

So I'm fully acknowledging my right not to buy the iPhone. If Apple doesn't care about my money...well so be it. Bad for me as a shareholder, and even worse for my cash waiting for some new gadgets.

Considering File sharing with friends and a computer: Well, my iPhone first of all should double as portable data device. Heck, nearly every Bluetooth capable phone on the market allows me to pair it and access the filesystem.

Second my phone generates data. I currently have 2GB in my Nokia phone. Nokia has a damn good Windows integration, so every soundclip, video and pic I CREATED (caps for emphasis) with my phone get downstreamed to the Windows comp as soon as pairing occurs. I also do this by hand on Mac OS X. So just for novelty sake I attached a pic I made with my Nokia, I wouldn't want to miss (my new car :D ).

And Data tethering is actively promoted by o2 in Germany, when they sell you the phone. E.g. they actively promote their o2 Connection Manager for OS X (current version 2.1), which allows for easy tethering.

But, Mock Turtleneck, you are definitely right. In current performance, the iPhone is not meant for me. Basically I could use an ugly brick, as long as its killer app is working properly. And that is making and receiving calls with great battery time (Nokia 6310 anyone?).

Maybe iPhone Rev. B will make me buy. Currently I'm in the process of terminating my contract, so in 3 months I have to buy a new phone. Well, maybe o2 Germany will give me an offer, I can't resist. Maybe Apple will.

In short - these are the reasons why Apple lost my money. I consider myself a rather typical European mobile user. So I'm a perfect example as to why the iPhone does not sell in Europe.

You will get no argument from me that the price / performance ratio on the iPhone does find itself lacking, it's truly a very specialized device that Apple doesn't seem interested in taking beyond it's nitch market. With that being said, I am an iPhone owner and user myself, I replaced my HTC Wizard Device with one.

I suppose with how you described file sharing between you and your computer I just wonder why you wouldn't want to sit down at your Computer (Desktop/Laptop) and just plug in the Sync Cable or slip the iPhone into its dock so that you could not only complete the tasks you mentioned, but also start the charging process.

The data paring between iPhoto and iTunes is seamless on the iPhone, at times annoyingly seamless. The lack of video creation support on the iPhone is something I will agree with you on, I'd love to shoot some live action and sync that back to the Mac, perhaps one day!

BTW, off topic but congrats on your new car! I picked a new one up last night myself and will toss a shot from my iPhone on here. :) (Technically it's my wife's new car but I'm paying the bill so...)

When data tethering comes into the picture, I suppose I can only and did base my opinions off the US market, EU country providers must take a more liberal stance on it...I know the majority of US providers are more interested in selling you a 3G data card than letting you use your phone's unlimited connection for your laptop. I've known people who have been kicked off their unlimited data plans for tethering too much data traffic.

As a fellow Apple Shareholder, I can hope that Apple does consider feedback as to what will make their product more appealing overseas, however as with most things it seems Apple designs and thinks purely out of the box...as long as that out of box experience is firmly rooted here in the US....

Hopefully with iPhone 3 you will find a product that will meet your needs a bit closer, if not, there is always the post 3G revisions down the road!

Enjoy your new car! :)

The Mock Turtleneck

Max_Walker

Apr 22, 2008, 04:50 PM

I've just bought the £169 8GB and unlocked it for use with Orange. Data on the move and visual voicemail would be nice but not £35 per month nice.
If you make the decision to unlock you clearly exclude these two key features and hence the arrival of 3G isn't going to change that. So why did I do it ?

Well, my Orange SIM has a old but still excellent deal that combines PAYG and direct billing. Initially the Unlocks available would only unlock to other O2 or O2 network using cards ( ie. TESCO PAYG). Now that any SIM works, the phone adds PDA type functionality to it and features not on my Nokia + ipod capability.

The next generation iphone, if it comes with a £35 per month contract will still not be worth it to me, given my pattern of use. Unfortunately the data charging in the UK is not good on other networks and, if you need it, O2 is good compared with what's on offer elsewhere in the UK.

What might make the difference, well, if the iphone connected to my laptop by bluetooth and the data package was the same, it would give you the same as a vodaphone data card (currently £15 + per month) and a phone functionality. I can do data with my Nokia 6310 - which is years old , so why not the iPhone !!

Max_Walker

Apr 22, 2008, 05:02 PM

Having just read Mock Turtleneck's post it struck me that Apple needs to look at the market again to focus on who it is looking to 'convert'. Is it the Blackberry market ? - I'm not so sure.

I think its the Nokia 6310 owner - like me and i guess 'SWAGI- those that want a business phone first and foremost. They want excellent battery life and data capable, but they also open to changing to the next generation of phone when it comes along, providing it makes a compelling case. As I said above, hooking laptop to phone seamlessly is one of those issues.

mikey.f

Apr 22, 2008, 06:57 PM

Amazing, what a difference does £100 make :). I am getting ready to hear all the complaining in two or so months, when the 3G iphone (hopefully) arrives and these "early" adopters will whine that apple screwed them...

DevilInDisguise

Apr 22, 2008, 08:05 PM

ok very simple question again..

i have a friend whos going to the uk for a few days n i want him to get me an iphone so i can unlock n use it..

now can he buy the iphone from the cpw stores and even an o2 store?

plus since u guys say he needs to buy using a credit or debit card, is that it, or do they do some verification or such on his credit rating and wont give him an iphone as hes not a resident of uk??

ur reply is much appreciated..

Delta-NC

Apr 22, 2008, 09:04 PM

wud this be both at an o2 and cpw store? wat about the apple store?

does CPW have more stores then o2? cos then i can just ask my friends to go to a cpw as he can find one of them easily

This was at an O2 store and I believe the "card only" rule was dictated by Apple so I expect the Carphone Warehouse will be the same.

They do not however make you sign any agreement. You are under no obligation whatsoever and they CAN NOT charge your card for anything other than the initial cost of the iPhone.

It is basically Apple snooping on customers, this way they can know who bought the phone and never activated it, but from a legal stand point you are not obligated to. You could for example have bought the iPhone and then thrown it in the bin outside the shop.

The store staff will likely have no idea, nor care, where you friend is from or what he does with the iPhone. :)

DevilInDisguise

Apr 22, 2008, 09:45 PM

thanx for ur reply.. very informative..

just one more thing.. would any mobile phone shop be selling iphones in the UK just like CPW or is it just CPW and the o2 stores?

Delta-NC

Apr 22, 2008, 11:41 PM

Yep, it is only available at Carphone Warehouse, O2 stores, and Apple stores. O2 and CPW should be pretty easy to find in most large towns.

wolfie37

Apr 23, 2008, 12:49 PM

Sorry, that's not the case. Sales aren't flat averaged - they peaked and then fell away quite considerably. In addition your figure of 500K is way too high.

If you read my posting properly I was extrapolating from a CPW employee who said they usually sold 1 or 2 a day, whilst the Oxford Street store said they usually sold 30 a day. I took the low figure and deliberately made no attempt to factor in peaks, merely taking into account the reported (albeit anecdotally) sales figure. So using that I extrapolated to that 500k figure. You can't say it is way too high anymore than I can say it is scientifically accurate, it was purely a mathematical exercise based on the very limited data available to try to estimate a sales figure. Bearing in mind that CPW are the least popular of the 3 retailers for the iPhone it is possible that my figure is way too low. Any information you have to suggest my figure is "way too high" would be most welcome.

BongoBanger

Apr 23, 2008, 04:52 PM

If you read my posting properly I was extrapolating from a CPW employee who said they usually sold 1 or 2 a day, whilst the Oxford Street store said they usually sold 30 a day. I took the low figure and deliberately made no attempt to factor in peaks, merely taking into account the reported (albeit anecdotally) sales figure. So using that I extrapolated to that 500k figure. You can't say it is way too high anymore than I can say it is scientifically accurate, it was purely a mathematical exercise based on the very limited data available to try to estimate a sales figure. Bearing in mind that CPW are the least popular of the 3 retailers for the iPhone it is possible that my figure is way too low. Any information you have to suggest my figure is "way too high" would be most welcome.

I did read your post which is why I corrected you. Your assumption is based on anecdotal estimates and that sales will remain flat throughout the year giving a figure of 500K UK sales to date with potential volume of 1.1 million.

If you look at O2's sales figures - well, what Apple allow them to say, and the actual Apple results for Q2 it's not hard to draw the conclusion that 500K to end of March is far too high. The figure is more likely 350K.

wolfie37

Apr 24, 2008, 04:23 AM

I did read your post which is why I corrected you. Your assumption is based on anecdotal estimates and that sales will remain flat throughout the year giving a figure of 500K UK sales to date with potential volume of 1.1 million.

If you look at O2's sales figures - well, what Apple allow them to say, and the actual Apple results for Q2 it's not hard to draw the conclusion that 500K to end of March is far too high. The figure is more likely 350K.

Again I didn't assume sales would remain flat, as I said originally taking the low figure (ie not taking into account that sales go up at certain peak times) I speculated on a figure based on that anecdotal statement, which is as much as we have to go on currently. From that I extrapolated a figure, I was clear throughout what I was basing it on. It was a bit of speculation using the very small piece of information we have, a best guess if you like. I didn't give it any more scientific basis. You're figure of 350k is based on??? Your guess?? Your hope???? O2's figures suggested 100k by mid January which I included in my best guess.

Of course with Apple's figures released since then showing 1.7m sales in Q2 we can then make different guesses on sales. However Q2 is from January so doesn't include the launch or Christmas sales in UK.

So tell me how you have come up with your 350k figure?

BongoBanger

Apr 24, 2008, 11:27 AM

02's figures of 190K sold by end January coupled with a similar attrition rate used for Orange France.

It's not difficult.

jetsetter

Apr 24, 2008, 01:35 PM

skunk

Apr 24, 2008, 01:44 PM

I would get the £169 version. I don't find the speed of EDGE too much of a hindrance, and the features promised by the forthcoming rash of applications using the SDK will be largely applicable to both models of phone, I imagine. I got the phone the day it came out at £269, and I could not be happier with it.

beast

Apr 24, 2008, 02:14 PM

Have to admit guys i'm not ace on this one.
I'm out of contract and intend moving to o2 regardless of the i-phone,however i would like to have one. Do i get the £169.00 deal or wait for the 3 g {i'm not sure how much advantage the 3 g will have for me over the Edge model} if anyone can enlighten me and convince me it would be worth the wait ,i would be very grateful for any help,Cheers!

Basically I think you should try using the iPhone with the edge network in an O2 store to see what you make of the speed... I personally don't find it too bad. With respect to 3G, no doubt that it will be quicker but it also depends on how good the 3G coverage is where you live.
I'm guessing the 3G iPhone won't offer anything radically different from the current generation and they will definitely both run the iPhone 2.0 firmware.

So really it's up to you, £169 is a good deal..... but remember that you are going to be tied to this phone for around 18 months and will you still enjoy it when a newer version comes out?

jetsetter

Apr 24, 2008, 04:16 PM

BongoBanger

Apr 24, 2008, 04:17 PM

LeviG

Apr 24, 2008, 05:32 PM

Wait. EDGE is rubbish in a lot of areas.

what is edge, it doesn't even exist where I live, however 3G and I assume the faster HSPDA does :rolleyes:

If I want a touchscreen with gprs speed connection my p900 can do that and has done for about 5 years :rolleyes:

zync

Apr 24, 2008, 06:18 PM

Wait. EDGE is rubbish in a lot of areas.

I agree. It should only be a few months and the speed difference will be huge. Granted, the phone will cost more, but not more than the original launch price.

Wait. Don't listen to people who tell you it's fine for them. Use it in the store and then imagine it 3-20x faster—20x if it's a strong HSDPA network. Real world, you're probably looking at 5x faster. Some places are up to 7.2Mbps vs. EDGE at like 384kbps if you're lucky. Plus, who knows what else they might add. And battery life may even be better.

Delta-NC

Apr 25, 2008, 09:46 AM

wolfie37

Apr 25, 2008, 05:17 PM

02's figures of 190K sold by end January coupled with a similar attrition rate used for Orange France.

It's not difficult.

So the ones sold by Carphone Warehouse and Apple Stores don't count???

BongoBanger

Apr 25, 2008, 05:56 PM

So the ones sold by Carphone Warehouse and Apple Stores don't count???

No, they do. Pay attention.

wolfie37

Apr 26, 2008, 08:15 AM

No, they do. Pay attention.

so ,
1. why didnt you include them?
and
2 why do you seem annoyed at what started off as a bit of speculation on what the UK figures might be (I was even thinking of France or Germany)?

BongoBanger

Apr 26, 2008, 12:10 PM

wolfie, I did include them and I'm a bit exasperated because you seem to be asking the same question over and over again.

Read up on the numbers, it should be apparent that UK iPhone sales have been relatively weak after the launch period. Based on this I estimate total Uk sales of about 350K to end March with an end of year total of, say, 650K unless a new model is launched.

wolfie37

Apr 27, 2008, 06:49 AM

G3 is like broadband
EDGE is like dial-up

Where are all these superfast 3G connections?? I've played around with 3G phones over the past couple of years and I just don't see it. It is very ropey indoors, latency is poor and just isn't reliable or fast. When I first got my iPhone I did a side by side test in my house with a friends 3G phone, my iPhone on EDGE pulled down the BBC homepage faster than his 3G phone. When I switched onto WiFi it was an absolute joke comparing 3G with it.

3G is not like broadband, WiFi is broadband. 3G is an overrated technology which has failed to takeover on the way it was predicted.

psychofreak

Apr 27, 2008, 06:52 AM

Where are all these superfast 3G connections?? I've played around with 3G phones over the past couple of years and I just don't see it. It is very ropey indoors, latency is poor and just isn't reliable or fast. When I first got my iPhone I did a side by side test in my house with a friends 3G phone, my iPhone on EDGE pulled down the BBC homepage faster than his 3G phone. When I switched onto WiFi it was an absolute joke comparing 3G with it.

3G is not like broadband, WiFi is broadband. 3G is an overrated technology which has failed to takeover on the way it was predicted.

Remember that Mobile Safari has great rendering speeds, so with 3G it will be faster to load the page than another 3G phone with an awful browser.

Delta-NC

Apr 27, 2008, 11:10 AM

Where are all these superfast 3G connections?? I've played around with 3G phones over the past couple of years and I just don't see it. It is very ropey indoors, latency is poor and just isn't reliable or fast. When I first got my iPhone I did a side by side test in my house with a friends 3G phone, my iPhone on EDGE pulled down the BBC homepage faster than his 3G phone. When I switched onto WiFi it was an absolute joke comparing 3G with it.

3G is not like broadband, WiFi is broadband. 3G is an overrated technology which has failed to takeover on the way it was predicted.

I have two friends who use 3G as a primary form of internet connection (that being, on their computers not their phones) and it works just fine. They certainly arn't complaining about it. They get 2.5M which is actually more than my wired internet.

In comparison returned my iPhone within 24 hours because EDGE was just so slow that I knew I would never bother using it, and I certainly wasn't going to pay £35 a month for it!