Apple to Allow iPhone Subsidies? [Archive]

MacRumors

Jun 7, 2008, 04:52 PM

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

FinancialTimes reports (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/6da5faa8-33f0-11dd-869b-0000779fd2ac.html) that the next Apple iPhone will be sold at "significantly lower prices" than the current one. According to the author, Apple has agreed to allow mobile carriers to subsidize the iPhone:Apple has bowed to pressure from mobile phone operators and agreed they can subsidise the latest iPhone, expected to be unveiled by Steve Jobs, Apple’s chief executive, on Monday.The article does not cite specific sources and reports this information as if it were fact. Historically, the Financial Times has been a reliable source of information of Apple rumors. They were the first to report (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/12/26/apple-in-online-film-rental-deal-with-fox-studio/) on Apple's movie rental service that debuted at Macworld 2008.

This report may confirm earlier reports (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/06/02/3g-iphone-thinner-thicker-or-both/) that the 3G iPhone would start around $200 after subsidies. It is believed that the iPhone would still cost $399 at Apple Retail stores, but when activated with a 2 year contract at AT&T, the customer would receive a $200 credit or rebate.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/06/07/apple-to-allow-iphone-subsidies/)

Yankees 4 Life

Jun 7, 2008, 04:54 PM

it better be a cash rebate and not a store credit

avigalante

Jun 7, 2008, 04:55 PM

irvingdizzle

Jun 7, 2008, 04:55 PM

Hopefully it's true.

Mad Mac Maniac

Jun 7, 2008, 04:57 PM

it better be a cash rebate and not a store credit

i'm sure it would be cash... who would want $200 of at&t store credit.... ??

and BAD ASS!

iDAG

Jun 7, 2008, 04:59 PM

The $200 rebate would be good if you wanted the new iPhone and an iPod nano... :rolleyes: I would like a "free" iPod nano!

zvandiver

Jun 7, 2008, 05:00 PM

i'm sure it would be cash... who would want $200 of at&t store credit.... ??

and BAD ASS!

In the past ATT has used preloaded Visa cards as rebates. They can be used almost anywhere.
Zane

JasonK

Jun 7, 2008, 05:00 PM

Good to see apple is considering playing nice with others. They tend to be the bully on the playground these days it seems.

Springer23

Jun 7, 2008, 05:00 PM

Admonitor

Jun 7, 2008, 05:02 PM

That would certainly make it fit in more as a genuine contender in the UK..pretty much every phone here is subsidised by the carrier.

LoCarbHotrod

Jun 7, 2008, 05:06 PM

Mykbibby

Jun 7, 2008, 05:08 PM

YES!!!! I just sold my phone on eBay for 500 dollars! I can get a new phone + extra cash! Life is good...

macduke

Jun 7, 2008, 05:08 PM

Now this is the kind of rumor I like to hear! I made my genius bar appointment at the exact time that the keynote starts so I can get my replacement iPhone and pick up a 3g if its available. Wouldn't the store be closed then if that were the case? Then I will jailbreak and unlock my old iPhone to sell to somebody for at least $250 (since unlocking is supposed to bump up the price on ebay by $100. Then get the new one for $200, netting $50 in the process to get a new case. Wow, wouldn't that be ideal? Doubt it will end up that perfect though.

dohspc

Jun 7, 2008, 05:08 PM

Hoping ATT will give existing iPhone customers the discount. I will gladly trade in my 16gig for the cut! :cool: It would be even crazier if they gave it to us for free with trade in, I guess you will need to goto the ATT store on fantasy island for that one.

corywoolf

Jun 7, 2008, 05:10 PM

This sounds good, I just hope Apple doesn't allow independent resellers to sell the iPhone anytime soon. The overall satisfaction of customers would go down because lots of resellers don't take the time to properly train the salesmen as well as Apple and (presumably) at&t train their employees. I like the idea of subsidies, but unless at&t is giving back the $200, I can't see Apple doing that anytime soon. If multiple carriers in the USA were allowed to sell the device, then it would make more sense for at&t to offer a subsidy. at&t has a monopoly on the iPhone at the moment and I am sure they want to take advantage of that while they still can. Sure offering a subsidy would open the device to a larger market, but does that lower income target market currently purchase expensive data plans? It makes sense if at&t is just trying to get a stronghold on the device before it becomes available on other carriers (in the USA). I would think at&t would be holding out on playing this card until right before the exclusivity contract ends. It makes sense to get as many customers signed to yearly contracts as possible before the iPhone is on Verizon and T-Mobile.

tadekk

Jun 7, 2008, 05:10 PM

And for new customers, free on the higher priced plans, and just £100 on the lower plans, and pay as you go for £269!

I don't believe in free upgrade for current customers (but £100 sounds reasonable, but why would they need you to trade your old iPhone? will they be still available as refurbs?).

However, if the 16GB model will be available in PAYG, I'm buying one (this or maybe a 12 month contract, huh O2?), especially if they throw unlimited web/wifi bolt-on for, say £10-12/month (I know there is one already but it's pathetic 200MB)...

zombitronic

Jun 7, 2008, 05:12 PM

it better be a cash rebate and not a store credit

I wouldn't mind Apple Store credit. I'd use it, eventually. Maybe sooner than later, if they come out with something else awesome on Monday.

iNelson

Jun 7, 2008, 05:15 PM

YES!!!! I just sold my phone on eBay for 500 dollars! I can get a new phone + extra cash! Life is good...

So are you now without a phone and paying for a phone plan?
Seems risky... if you are paying for a plan.

Also, does anyone know if Apple will let me trade in a malfunctioning phone/device (still under warranty) for a better model if I pay the difference?

My iPhone is acting silly and I'm thinking it may get swapped by Apple (based in internet searches of my problem), but if there's a 3G iPhone on Monday... If not, perhaps they'll let m upgrade to a 16 GB model.

Maybe someone has had experience with this type of transaction.

nicksoper

Jun 7, 2008, 05:16 PM

I am looking forward to Vodaphone bringing the iPhone to South Africa, and if the rumors are true - 3G, GPS etc.. I'll sign up, even if it is for a 24 month contract.

bushido

Jun 7, 2008, 05:18 PM

its probably how all the subsided phones in germany are. U r gonna pay less and sign up for a 2 years contract and as more expensive the plan is the less expensive is the phone itself.

i hope its possible to get it for around 199 $ so i can not just get the phone but a nintendo wii too :D

carlosbutler

Jun 7, 2008, 05:22 PM

On the uk News sites today they are, reporting the new phone will be a Free update to existing customers of the iphone, as long as you trade in the original one and sign a new 18 month contract.

And for new customers, free on the higher priced plans, and just £100 on the lower plans, and pay as you for £269!

which sites were stating these unbelievable - student friendly - prices??? please let me know, tbh we all need to really just wait untill monday. no point of finding out that these could be an option, but not true...

matt550

Jun 7, 2008, 05:23 PM

I hope this is true, that would be awesome. As a 1st gen iPhone owner I hope we dont screwed.

geerlingguy

Jun 7, 2008, 05:25 PM

Loge

Jun 7, 2008, 05:26 PM

Good to see apple is considering playing nice with others. They tend to be the bully on the playground these days it seems.

Seems like it is the carriers who are the bullies.

JW008

Jun 7, 2008, 05:26 PM

Also, does anyone know if Apple will let me trade in a malfunctioning phone/device (still under warranty) for a better model if I pay the difference?

My phone was malfunctioning a couple of weeks back and when Apple said they would replace it I asked if I could upgrade to the 16 GB and they told me it was only direct replacements...

Sucks, I know...

jingbugle

Jun 7, 2008, 05:27 PM

If the phone were to be somehow unlocked?

geerlingguy

Jun 7, 2008, 05:29 PM

So are you now without a phone and paying for a phone plan?
Seems risky... if you are paying for a plan.

Also, does anyone know if Apple will let me trade in a malfunctioning phone/device (still under warranty) for a better model if I pay the difference?

My iPhone is acting silly and I'm thinking it may get swapped by Apple (based in internet searches of my problem), but if there's a 3G iPhone on Monday... If not, perhaps they'll let m upgrade to a 16 GB model.

Maybe someone has had experience with this type of transaction.

I know of a few people who did this; they just bought a cheap AT&T phone without a SIM card and stuck their own SIM card in it. They'll use that until they get the new iPhone.

DVS33

Jun 7, 2008, 05:33 PM

No love to the loyal current Iphone owners.

acrafton

Jun 7, 2008, 05:34 PM

I don't see how this helps Apple or ATT unless the new IPhone will come in an unlocked variety . .otherwise why offer and rebate or subsidy? If you want a legit IPhone and it is locked, you have to go to ATT anyway at whatever the price is. . .AND sign a two year contract. Why give a subsidy for something you have no choice about?

I could see this scenario:
Option 1 - pay full price at apple (say $499) for an unlocked IPhone
Option 2 - pay full price at apple or att for an unlocked IPhone and get a $200 rebate if you activate (and lock) it to ATT for two year

What am I missing here re the subsidy?

joeshell383

Jun 7, 2008, 05:36 PM

OK, so I buy someone a iPhone as a gift... I have to pay a full $400 and then they get $200 back after they activate it???

bushido

Jun 7, 2008, 05:40 PM

OK, so I buy someone a iPhone as a gift... I have to pay a full $400 and then they get $200 back after they activate it???

i still think its gonna be like that

the more expensive plan u describe to the less expensive will be the iPhone itself. That's how all the phones with contract are being sold in germany. Like i got my old Nokia N80 for 99 $ and a 20 $ plan but if i would have taken a 50 $ plan the phone itself would have been 1 $

Stella

Jun 7, 2008, 05:43 PM

No love to the loyal current Iphone owners.

Apple want you to prove your loyalty by buying the next iphone ;-)

mtfield

Jun 7, 2008, 05:47 PM

No love to the loyal current Iphone owners.

anyone who bought the current iphone is still eligible to receive any subsidy! this is because you didn't get a subsidy on your last phone so that subsidy is still available on your account! go to your wireless.att.com page and hit the check for upgrade button and you'll see that you can get the upgrade at the subsidized price, you'll just have to renew your contract

Ryan Trevisol

Jun 7, 2008, 05:50 PM

I wouldn't mind Apple Store credit. I'd use it, eventually. Maybe sooner than later, if they come out with something else awesome on Monday.

Heck ya! I'm planning on getting an iMac on Monday or Tuesday anyway. :)

Vaphoron

Jun 7, 2008, 05:55 PM

graymccarty

Jun 7, 2008, 05:59 PM

At least you guys don't have to deal with 3 year contracts and limited data plans that still cost an arm & a leg.

Mac Attack 360

Jun 7, 2008, 05:59 PM

Waait. I'm kinda confused. When I read the article it said "carriers". Does this mean the iPhone will be on multiple carriers(in the US) or it meant the current carriers around the world? Because I'm also confused if the current iPhone has to stay with AT&T or if all the iPhones in the next four years have to stay with AT&T?

thechidz

Jun 7, 2008, 06:02 PM

god I hope ebay buyers dont hear about this before mine sells in 20 hours:o

MacCurry

Jun 7, 2008, 06:02 PM

GradientMac

Jun 7, 2008, 06:02 PM

I would hope so- I'd be able to afford one much sooner.

jellomizer

Jun 7, 2008, 06:03 PM

it better be a cash rebate and not a store credit

Well lets be realistic though. $200 store credit would be about 3 or 4 months of free service. Which is still a good deal. If you don't want it that way then just get it at the AT&T store.

Doctor Q

Jun 7, 2008, 06:04 PM

OK, so I buy someone a iPhone as a gift... I have to pay a full $400 and then they get $200 back after they activate it???I guess you have to sell them the gift for $200 so they'll break even.

theGAPkid

Jun 7, 2008, 06:05 PM

On the uk News sites today they are, reporting the new phone will be a Free update to existing customers of the iphone, as long as you trade in the original one and sign a new 18 month contract.

And for new customers, free on the higher priced plans, and just £100 on the lower plans, and pay as you for £269!

Which news site?

PAYG would be well good. Means I dont have to find one unlocked. Plus it would be safer too

thechidz

Jun 7, 2008, 06:05 PM

Fahrwahr

Jun 7, 2008, 06:11 PM

I thought an iPhone would make a great Father's Day gift, but if the subsidy with a contract is $200, that's only $8.33 / month over a 24-month period. Meanwhile, both of my parents are on a really old (think BellSouth Mobility) plan that provides somewhere between 50 and 100 minutes a month (and they tend to use maybe only five to twenty minutes of them) for only $20 / month. Spending an extra $40 / month over a 24-month period would result in almost $1,000 (probably over that with taxes) in extra plan charges for one phone. Wow, what a deal. :rolleyes:

53399

Jun 7, 2008, 06:19 PM

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53399

Jun 7, 2008, 06:20 PM

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53399

Jun 7, 2008, 06:21 PM

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53399

Jun 7, 2008, 06:22 PM

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smithruls

Jun 7, 2008, 06:23 PM

If you are on AT&T and want the subsidy, all you have to do is renew your contract for another 2 years. I did that with the first generation iphone.

dohspc

Jun 7, 2008, 06:24 PM

anyone who bought the current iphone is still eligible to receive any subsidy! this is because you didn't get a subsidy on your last phone so that subsidy is still available on your account! go to your wireless.att.com page and hit the check for upgrade button and you'll see that you can get the upgrade at the subsidized price, you'll just have to renew your contract

Hmm my account only says this "You can take advantage of our no-commitment pricing option. This line may be eligible for an equipment discount on 03/02/2009 More Details"

Dorfdad

Jun 7, 2008, 06:25 PM

So if its 399.99 Can't we sign a 2 year deal and just get the phone from AT&T for 99.99?? Why rebate us just make the phone cheaper for us...

greekpaz22

Jun 7, 2008, 06:27 PM

So if its 399.99 Can't we sign a 2 year deal and just get the phone from AT&T for 99.99?? Why rebate us just make the phone cheaper for us...

Because no company wants to give you an instant rebate or drop the price. They want to try and see if you'll forget to collect. Also, I would assume it makes it easier to keep everything straight (i.e. to make sure Apple gets what is due to them and the rest comes out of ATT's pocket back to you).

Stig McNasty

Jun 7, 2008, 06:29 PM

Ok, so which site is it that has the UK info, mentioned further up the thread by Springer? Also, are there any rumours about, say, Orange getting the iPhone in the UK - or any other carrier for that matter?

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 06:30 PM

rlmccormick

Jun 7, 2008, 06:32 PM

What about existing iPhone/AT&T customers?

EDIT: But then again, when you upgrade any other phone outside your selected upgrade time period - you usually end up paying full retail anyway. So after revisiting, I don't believe there will be any type of subsidy for existing iPhone/AT&T customers. Ah! - the price of bleeding edge technology... :eek:

This shouldn't be the case with iPhone owners since we paid full price for the phone and did not receive a subsidy. Of course time will tell, 2-days to be exact.

k2director

Jun 7, 2008, 06:39 PM

Good to see apple is considering playing nice with others. They tend to be the bully on the playground these days it seems.

Are you referring to Apple bullying cel phone carriers? Give me a break. Huge carriers are the bullies, and Apple has simply changed the game, so that they don't hold all the cards over cel phone manufacturers.

danielwsmithee

Jun 7, 2008, 06:39 PM

Because no company wants to give you an instant rebate or drop the price. They want to try and see if you'll forget to collect. Also, I would assume it makes it easier to keep everything straight (i.e. to make sure Apple gets what is due to them and the rest comes out of ATT's pocket back to you).Your missing the biggest reason though. People who unlock iPhones. If AT&T provided a direct subsidy on the initial price of the iPhone everyone who bought the phone and hacked it to unlock it would be getting a free $200 gift from AT&T. With it tied to activation they are only subsidizing the people who sign contracts.

Rocketman

Jun 7, 2008, 06:40 PM

I am a lil' confused, isn't AT&T the only US carrier with the 3g network right now? Why would you want a 3g iPhone unlocked so that you can use it on the EDGE network at T-Moblie or Verizon etc.

It is just wishful thinking that maybe the other carriers will adopt the 3g Network as well? Or, just for the new features of the new iPhone? :confused:

To date unlocking has been the only way for 149 countries to experience iPhone. One estimate is almost a million iPhones were exported and unlocked.

I call that pre-release market research. :)

Rocketman

Leopard=God

Jun 7, 2008, 06:44 PM

This would be great if it were true. What's that saying? Like, "If it works, why change it?" A lot of people have been buying iPhones even at their price of $400 and I mean A LOT of people I think we're at like 10 million right now. Why would they want to lower the price and drastically decrease their profits, when they could keep it at the same price and actually get MORE money because they're making the phone available to more countries..I don't think Apple will change the price of the iPhone even though this company seems pretty confident. From it to go from its original $600 price to $200 with NEWER technology, doesn't seem reasonable. However, it would be cool if it did in fact get to be $200, I know I'd get one...finally

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 06:45 PM

To date unlocking has been the only way for 149 countries to experience iPhone. One estimate is almost a million iPhones were exported and unlocked.

I call that pre-release market research. :)

Rocketman

I understand that, but I mean in the states. From what I read, AT&T are just now getting their 3g network up, nobody else has it here in the US? If thats true, then what is fueling all the hype about unlocked 3g iPhones in the US? :confused:

Kwill

Jun 7, 2008, 06:47 PM

What about existing iPhone/AT&T customers?

EDIT: But then again, when you upgrade any other phone outside your selected upgrade time period - you usually end up paying full retail anyway. So after revisiting, I don't believe there will be any type of subsidy for existing iPhone/AT&T customers. Ah! - the price of bleeding edge technology... :eek:

True, but that is because the first phone was subsidized. However, this is not the case with the first iPhones. We paid full retail so we are still entitled to one subsidized phone within the 2-year period. :rolleyes:

Hmm. Apparently there's an echo in here. :)

mikes63737

Jun 7, 2008, 06:51 PM

It is believed that the iPhone would still cost $399 at Apple Retail stores, but when activated with a 2 year contract at AT&T, the customer would receive a $200 credit or rebate.

$200 Rebate (AKA Check) = Great.
$200 Apple Store Credit = OK, but probably not going to happen.

$200 AT&T Credit = Won't buy a new iPhone.

ChrisA

Jun 7, 2008, 06:52 PM

So if you want an un-locked phone you pay $399 to apple but if you are happy with AT&T you get the same phone for $200.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 06:53 PM

$200 Rebate (AKA Check) = Great.
$200 Apple Store Credit = OK, but probably not going to happen.

$200 AT&T Credit = Won't buy a new iPhone.

Couldn't the $200 AT&T credit be applied to your cell phone bill? What's wrong with that?

Kwill

Jun 7, 2008, 06:54 PM

For the time being I still only want the iPhone for mobile web and email. I really wish they would come out with a plan for like $40-45 with about 100-200 minutes in addition to some sort of subsidy and I'd be all over it.

Such a plan does exist for the iPhone but it is not advertised. ;)

Sign up for the regular iPhone plan.
Take your first bill to the AT&T Mobility location.
Ask to switch to the "retention plan" (fewer minutes for about $10 less)

Kwill

Jun 7, 2008, 06:58 PM

Couldn't the $200 AT&T credit be applied to your cell phone bill? What's wrong with that?

What AT&T does is issue an expiring AT&T branded debit card with the VISA logo. It is supposed to work something like the Starbucks or any other gift card, only it can be used anywhere.

I was issued one for another phone purchase. However, have never been able to get through to activate it. A URL is provided for on-line activation, so I did it there. But when I went to use the card at a restaurant, it was declined. :(

chazzonline

Jun 7, 2008, 06:59 PM

Though i am a Verizon customer i am ready 2 shed out 175$ contract termination fee if AT&T gives 200$ rebate on the iPhone ..

I hope it has GPS as it wud be a gr8 feature on the iPhone ..

imwoblin

Jun 7, 2008, 07:00 PM

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from everything I've read, the 3g iPhone is going to be locked down tight to either ATT in the USA or to overseas respective carriers so I highly doubt Apple will sell an unlocked version. Because ATT signed an exclusive with Apple, there is no way you could buy an unlocked one from Apple to use with another carrier. You want a 3g iPhone, you sign a 2 year contract with ATT. Existing users can get the same deal as new users, you just need to sign up for 2 more years. Just my opinion.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 07:01 PM

chazzonline

Jun 7, 2008, 07:08 PM

Leopard=God

Jun 7, 2008, 07:08 PM

I think it's fake but what do you guys think?

http://www.engadget.com/2008/06/07/the-3g-iphone-not-unboxed/

Sweetbike40

Jun 7, 2008, 07:09 PM

So if its 399.99 Can't we sign a 2 year deal and just get the phone from AT&T for 99.99?? Why rebate us just make the phone cheaper for us...

I wonder if this would be a possibility? $99 for a iPhone??!!! I would take any size. Even 4g. Then i would keep my 16G Touch. I just want the iPhone so i have easier access to the web and email. I'm not so much concerned about the gig size of the phone.:D:eek::D:eek:

imwoblin

Jun 7, 2008, 07:12 PM

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from everything I've read, the 3g iPhone is going to be locked down tight to either ATT in the USA or to overseas respective carriers so I highly doubt Apple will sell an unlocked version. Because ATT signed an exclusive with Apple, there is no way you could buy an unlocked one from Apple to use with another carrier. You want a 3g iPhone, you sign a 2 year contract with ATT. Existing users can get the same deal as new users, you just need to sign up for 2 more years. Just my opinion.

True, there is no way Apple is going 2 release a unlocked iPhone .. Either way u have 2 get a AT&T connection .. the question is what happens 2 exsisting iPhone customers who want 2 get a new phone !

Existing customers will just have to sign up for 2 more years of ATT service.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 07:16 PM

I think it's fake but what do you guys think?

http://www.engadget.com/2008/06/07/the-3g-iphone-not-unboxed/

Fake, its all over in the other forums...

Sweetbike40

Jun 7, 2008, 07:19 PM

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Existing customers will just have to sign up for 2 more years of ATT service.

I don't think it works like that. I've tried to upgrade my phone in the past before the contract was up and couldn't get as much as a discount. Even if i signed another 2 year contract. They make you wait til the end or a month before the end of the contract before they give the you highest discount allowed.

chazzonline

Jun 7, 2008, 07:20 PM

pmoeser

Jun 7, 2008, 07:20 PM

Seems like it is the carriers who are the bullies.

I note that the article says Apple bowed to pressure.

Steve doesn't bow to pressure from potential business partners. Never has and only ever did back down on the cash back when he dropped the price of the iPhone because of PR reasons.

Steve has taken on the entire computer industry and won in favour of Apple.

Steve took on Disney and Hollywood and won in his favour.

Letting carriers subsidise the new phone is in Steve and Apple's interests. The original model will have paid for the R&D and now they they have larger profit margins.

Go Steve, Go iPhone 3G!

AJ1BostonMASS

Jun 7, 2008, 07:22 PM

im slightly confused does that mean I can have an iphone with verizon? Because there has been a rumor about that for a while

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 07:25 PM

All this mess about the "ENTRY TICKET"....who cares?? The MAIN $$$-sucking will be the monthly fee....that's the real way you pay the phone....at least in Italy......2 years COMPULSORY.....
Actually, many italians won't care about national carriers and will take assault of UK and USA stores to buy the iphone at low price and **** the 2-years-contract (if they continue to allow you to activate or SHOULD I SAY NOT ACTIVATE the contract AT HOME.....noobz :rolleyes: ). The only good way to buy an iphone (2g or 3g), in the opinion of many Italians, is this:
1) go to USA (or find a friend/relative), for other purpose of course
2) use the power of the strong EURO against the Dollar
3) buy iphone and don't activate the contract
4) use ziphone (by Italian "zibri") to one-click-unlock the iphone
5) and you're done :D

Many have done so...and many have done it with O2 UK iphone for RIDICOLOUS 169£ that is 210euros....some people take low cost airlines to london just to buy some iphones :D
In the end, WE DISLIKE contracts, we are the country of PRE-PAID simcards, no contracts! Our carriers are aware of this so I'm afraid they will force us to sign the contract IN THE SHOP, NOT AT HOME.....but there are plenty of foreign countries to explore :D

ps: sorry for my English

macerroneous

Jun 7, 2008, 07:26 PM

To date unlocking has been the only way for 149 countries to experience iPhone. One estimate is almost a million iPhones were exported and unlocked.

I call that pre-release market research. :)

Rocketman

I'm just a speculator, (I mean guesser) but I think there are more like 3 million iphones taken out of the US. (The number was something like 1.4 million as of 12/31 and Apple and ATT have been pretty mum on the subject ever since.) The ONLY way to tie this phone to a carrier is to offer a rebate, due to the ease with which hackers managed to unlock it. Apple was counting on revenue sharing from their carriers, but we all know they don't get that revenue if the consumer doesn't sign up.

SO... I believe the new business plan calls for Apple to get its cash upfront, but sacrifices the revenue sharing by actually INSISTING the carrier give a rebate. ie We still pay top dollar for a phone, Apple gets its cut upfront, the carrier comes out even because it doesn't have to share revenue. The Russian and Nigerian pirates will pay more, because they don't have a carrier to offer a rebate. Everybody's happy.

BTW, if you care, I've been posting this for months. Also, I'm a fanbois.

imwoblin

Jun 7, 2008, 07:28 PM

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I think both Apple and ATT will have to acknowledge iPhone 1.0 users and give them the same deal as new customers. After all as everyone has said, we paid full price for the original iPhone. If they game us, they will have a lot of pissed off iPhone 1.0 users.

Dagless

Jun 7, 2008, 07:32 PM

Here's an idea - if we complain about it enough maybe they'll give us more money back from the first batch of iPhones? :rolleyes:

But seriously. Subsidised is what they do in the UK. As soon as the 8gb iPhone hit £169 it flew off the shelves. Even just £100 is all it needs, I'd still buy one.

macerroneous

Jun 7, 2008, 07:32 PM

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 07:35 PM

The lower is the price, the lesser chance they will let you go home without signing a 2-year contract....that's how I see it....
In fact, I see the £169 UK iphone as sort of a miracle....I can't think at those lucky people who took an iphone for miserable 210euros......

geekygrammy

Jun 7, 2008, 07:44 PM

I was wondering... I want to get an iPhone, but my Mom doesn't want one; if we both switched to AT&T on a family plan, could we do the $60/month one, and I get an iPhone with the $20 extra iPhone data plan?
My husband and I have the same situation. I have an iPhone and pay an extra $20. per month for the data plan.

BossHoggin

Jun 7, 2008, 07:47 PM

A 16GB 3G iphone priced at $400 would be amazing!!!!!!!!!!

thaitillidie

Jun 7, 2008, 07:50 PM

This just doesn't make any sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! In that case WHO WOULD EVER BUY THE PHONE FROM AN APPLE STORE unless...the phone is being released unlocked. Even then it still doesn't make any sense.

I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy rubbish comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Contrary to popular belief and the way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty stuff...in much the same way they've done to Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l puppy (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

Why would you ever want to open it up to the world?? I'm beginning to think this is more of a popularity move than a money-making move by Apple.

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece o'***** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a mess of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

quagmire

Jun 7, 2008, 07:55 PM

As I remember when Apple updated the iPhone to 16 GB, buying the new one would continue the old ones contract at no charge. I hope it is something similar for the 2G iPhone( 2nd generation). If I get penalized for technically breaking the contract of my launch day 8 GB iPhone because I want the new iPhone, I won't be buying the new iPhone.

arn

Jun 7, 2008, 07:55 PM

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 07:59 PM

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:01 PM

This just doesn't make any ****ing sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! In that case WHO WOULD EVER BUY THE PHONE FROM AN APPLE STORE unless...the phone is being released unlocked. Even then it still doesn't make any ****ing sense.

I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy ******** comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Contrary to popular belief and the way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty ****...in much the same way they've done to Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l son of a b*tch (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

Why would you ever want to open it up to the world?? I'm beginning to think this is more of a popularity move than a money-making move by Apple.

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred ****ing ollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your ****ing minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece of **** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a butt-****ing of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

While your concerns are valid, as a business model for a COMPANY... it is retarded to think that Apple should purposely remain small in order to isolate themselves from hackers.

J

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:02 PM

This just doesn't make any ****ing sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! In that case WHO WOULD EVER BUY THE PHONE FROM AN APPLE STORE unless...the phone is being released unlocked. Even then it still doesn't make any ****ing sense.

I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy ******** comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Contrary to popular belief and the way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty ****...in much the same way Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l son of a b*tch (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

Why would you ever want to open it up to the world?? I'm beginning to think this more of a popularity move than a money-making move by Apple.

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred ****ing dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your ****ing minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece of **** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a butt-****ing of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Are you still here!?!?! :eek:

Quit your swearing and grow up! Every post I read of yours makes me wish you still had your Moto Razr! :mad:

I'm sure your firm warning has Steve-o shaking in his shoes! :rolleyes:

Technology to the masses IS a good thing, if it is too cheap for you, I am sure they will accept however much extra money you want to give them for your new iPhone. ;)

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:02 PM

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR.

First 3 months "wow you've got one of those"

After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

pmoeser

Jun 7, 2008, 08:04 PM

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:05 PM

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR.

First 3 months "wow you've got one of those"

After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

Would that be so bad? As a stockholder, I say no. :rolleyes:

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:06 PM

This just doesn't make any ****in' sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! In that case WHO WOULD EVER BUY THE PHONE FROM AN APPLE STORE unless...the phone is being released unlocked. Even then it still doesn't make any ****in' sense.

I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy ******** comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Contrary to popular belief and the way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty ****...in much the same way they've done to Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l son of a b*tch (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

Why would you ever want to open it up to the world?? I'm beginning to think this is more of a popularity move than a money-making move by Apple.

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred ****in dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your ****in minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece of **** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a butt-****ing of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

I just wrote the same thing. I got the RAZR the first day it was out for $500 or what ever it was than it dropped to be a $50 piece of junk every one had

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:06 PM

Would that be so bad? As a stockholder, I say no. :rolleyes:

yes it would because how much profit could be made doing that?

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:06 PM

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR.

First 3 months "wow you've got one of those"

After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

The difference is that RAZR is (was) ONLY Fashion/Design/Status/"Wow_you've_got_it", whereas iphone is SUBSTANCE so who cares that it isn't a unique and rare item...you just have to enjoy it on your own....

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:10 PM

The difference is that RAZR is (was) ONLY Fashion/Design/Status/"Wow_you've_got_it", whereas iphone is SUBSTANCE so who cares that it isn't a unique and rare item...you just have to enjoy it on your own....

call me sick but i am one of those people who gets the newest best thing and wants to be like "hey i got it" and get the response "hey let me c that/wow/OMG"

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:10 PM

Mamma mia in my life I would never expect to read complainings about a price because it is TOO LOW!! :D

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:10 PM

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR.

First 3 months "wow you've got one of those"

After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

If you are hoping to use your MOBILE PHONE to convince people of how cool you are maybe you could use the $200 credit for therapy.

J

pmoeser

Jun 7, 2008, 08:11 PM

I just wrote the same thing. I got the RAZR the first day it was out for $500 or what ever it was than it dropped to be a $50 piece of junk every one had

Early adopters have always subsidised the masses. Always have and always will

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:12 PM

yes it would because how much profit could be made doing that?

HAHAHA, are you serious? Subsidies are paid by the phone company, Apple gets their money. Millions and millions of iPhone sales expands Apples reach. I don't think that offering subsidies will bankrupt Apple.

As for all the whining about "I want one, but I don't want anybody else to have one because that makes ME less cool" That's just silly. :rolleyes:

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:13 PM

If you are hoping to use your MOBILE PHONE to convince people of how cool you are maybe you could use the $200 credit for therapy.

J

thanks for the advice but i will probably use it to buy another cool device.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:13 PM

If you are hoping to use your MOBILE PHONE to convince people of how cool you are maybe you could use the $200 credit for therapy.

J

Now there is some advice! ;) :D

DaBrain

Jun 7, 2008, 08:13 PM

This just doesn't make any ****in' sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! In that case WHO WOULD EVER BUY THE PHONE FROM AN APPLE STORE unless...the phone is being released unlocked. Even then it still doesn't make any ****in' sense.

I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy ******** comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Contrary to popular belief and the way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty ****...in much the same way they've done to Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l son of a b*tch (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

Why would you ever want to open it up to the world?? I'm beginning to think this is more of a popularity move than a money-making move by Apple.

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred ****in dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your ****in minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece of **** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a butt-****ing of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

What's with your foul language? Can't you express your thoughts errr I mean your anger in an appropriate way? Here have a chill pill! :rolleyes:

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:14 PM

HAHAHA, are you serious? Subsidies are paid by the phone company, Apple gets their money. Millions and millions of iPhone sales expands Apples reach. I don't think that offering subsidies will bankrupt Apple.

As for all the whining about "I want one, but I don't want anybody else to have one because that makes ME less cool" That's just silly. :rolleyes:

i am just a sick person. But if the phone costs $200 to make and we pay $200 how is that profit

mattwolfmatt

Jun 7, 2008, 08:16 PM

Excuse my ignorance, but does "subsidies" mean (if it's true) that iPhone will be available on the Verizon network? That would rule.

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:17 PM

Excuse my ignorance, but does "subsidies" mean (if it's true) that iPhone will be available on the Verizon network? That would rule.

no it does not mean that necessarily

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:17 PM

call me sick but i am one of those people who gets the newest best thing and wants to be like "hey i got it" and get the response "hey let me c that/wow/OMG"

Sick :D
Apart from jokes, I obviously don't agree with you and all the people like you. I prefer the good old "read reviews, evaluate and if it's worth buy, because only of SUBSTANCE". No fashion-addicts or people who find satisfaction in showing off their last phone :rolleyes: I've grown up a little since elementary school...

Sweetbike40

Jun 7, 2008, 08:17 PM

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR.

First 3 months "wow you've got one of those"

After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

Who cares who else has it? I don't get this way of thinking.

powermac_daddy

Jun 7, 2008, 08:19 PM

it's coming out... just wait.

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:19 PM

i am just a sick person. But if the phone costs $200 to make and we pay $200 how is that profit

Ok, now it makes sense to me. I apologize for my earlier distasteful remark directed towards you.

At the time, I was not aware of the fact that you simply are not that bright.

Apologies.

J

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:19 PM

Who cares who else has it? I don't get this way of thinking.

sorry

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:20 PM

Who cares who else has it? I don't get this way of thinking.

Freud would call it a need for compensation of something else that is missing :D

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:20 PM

i am just a sick person. But if the phone costs $200 to make and we pay $200 how is that profit

First of all, this is all just speculations until Monday.
Second, where did you get the information that it costs $200 to make an iPhone?
Third, I will say it again, subsidies are paid by the carrier to Apple, to help (entice) the consumer. APPLE GETS THEIR MONEY, they don't care who's pocket it came from.

:rolleyes:

StingerT125

Jun 7, 2008, 08:22 PM

I hope this it true. This rebate would really be welcome.

jmpmntwnty3

Jun 7, 2008, 08:22 PM

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 08:23 PM

First of all, this is all just speculations until Monday.
Second, where did you get the information that it costs $200 to make an iPhone?
Third, I will say it again, subsidies are paid by the carrier to Apple, to help (entice) the consumer. APPLE GETS THEIR MONEY, they don't care who's pocket it came from.

:rolleyes:

excuse my ignorance on the last part.
and its actualy $250

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/iphone-only-costs-250-to-make-rest-of-price-is-fanboy-tax-229664.php

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:24 PM

First of all, this is all just speculations until Monday.
Second, where did you get the information that it costs $200 to make an iPhone?
Third, I will say it again, subsidies are paid by the carrier to Apple, to help (entice) the consumer. APPLE GETS THEIR MONEY, they don't care who's pocket it came from.

:rolleyes:

FOURTH: Carriers will suck plenty of money out of you in the next 2 years (at least) for the monthly fee of the plan. It's like I give you a present that will force you to give me ten times the money back!!

So nobody looses nothing, no one gives presents...

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:26 PM

Does the subsidized price apply to current AT&T customers eligible for an upgrade? My contract is up, and has been up for about 6 months now. I've just been waiting on the new iPhone. So if I renew my contract, do I get the $200 rebate?

If this article is true then I would imagine that every one and their mom are going to be eligible. I still have a year in my contract because I bought an iPhone on launch day. I highly doubt that Apple would tell me "tough luck". The contract I have will just jump forward 2 more years (3 total) or would start over back at 2.

I used to hate contracts but since ATT has the iPhone, I no longer care. I will be with them for as long as they are the carrier.

Now I am curious if I will be allowed to trade in my current phone. That would rule.

J

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:30 PM

excuse my ignorance on the last part.
and its actualy $250

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/iphone-only-costs-250-to-make-rest-of-price-is-fanboy-tax-229664.php

January 2007 numbers. Quick technology lesson:

**** gets cheaper to make when you a) make a whole lot of them AND b) the tech behind it is a bit older. (I do understand there will be SOME brand new tech in the phone but most of it is very similar).

IF the phone ends up being $399 with a $200 rebate. You will pay $199 BUT APPLE WILL MAKE $399 because ATT will PAY THEM.

So let's say the phone costs $200 to make, Apple gets $199 profit. Follow?

J

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:32 PM

excuse my ignorance on the last part.
and its actualy $250

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/iphone-only-costs-250-to-make-rest-of-price-is-fanboy-tax-229664.php

Ok, I am going to have a stroke in a minute :eek:

I read your link and that is all fine and dandy BUT...

It's funny how the article breaks down all the individual technologies that take to make an iPhone.

Some of the holes in this defense...

This is all related to the first gen iPhone, which I don't believe we are discussing...
Its funny there is no mentions of R&D costs, Software costs, Advertising costs, etc.

Like I said before if it really is too cheap for you, offer them some extra money maybe you'll get a iPhone t-shirt (So EVERYONE knows you have one, even when you're not using it)

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:35 PM

Like I said before if it really is too cheap for you, offer them some extra money maybe you'll get a iPhone t-shirt (So EVERYONE knows you have one, even when you're not using it)

Hah. I am almost certain if I made a shirt that said "I paid $500 for this shirt" and put it on sale for $400, people would be infuriated and demand I take the extra Benji.

J

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:35 PM

If this article is true then I would imagine that every one and their mom are going to be eligible. I still have a year in my contract because I bought an iPhone on launch day. I highly doubt that Apple would tell me "tough luck". The contract I have will just jump forward 2 more years (3 total) or would start over back at 2.

WAIT WAIT WAIT.....this is non-sense! You signed a 2-years contract for the last iphone and you must COMPLETE IT till the end! IF you want to INTERRUPT the contract, you should PAY a PENALTY!! (say 300$). Then you are free again and you can do the NEW contract for the 3g iphone. IT'S CRUEL but it's like things should work! That's why I hate contracts, it's fool to BOND YOURSELF for TWO LONG years in such a rapid changing market!!

Now I am curious if I will be allowed to trade in my current phone. That would rule.

I hope it for you but I think it wouldn't be fair! And neither Apple nor AT&T are supposed to make you this FAVOR!!

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:37 PM

WAIT WAIT WAIT.....this is non-sense! You signed a 2-years contract for the last iphone and you must COMPLETE IT till the end! IF you want to INTERRUPT the contract, you should PAY a PENALTY!! (say 300$). Then you are free again and you can do the NEW contract for the 3g iphone. IT'S CRUEL but it's like things should work! That's why I hate contracts, it's fool to LINK YOURSELF for TWO LONG years in such a rapid market!!

I hope it for you but I think it wouldn't be fair! And neither Apple nor AT&T are supposed to make you this FAVOR!!

I bet you a $200 rebate you are dead wrong.

(edit) And it isn't a favor when you pay $100+ a month for service.

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:40 PM

I bet you a $200 rebate you are dead wrong.

So I can take a phone with 2-year-contract and then after one year cry like a baby "ueeee! ueeeee! Me want new one!!"...is this the seriety of contracts in USA?? Compliments! Bravi! Now I know why you have so many lawyers....

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:43 PM

So I can take a phone with 2-year-contract and then after one year cry like a baby "ueeee! ueeeee! Me want new one!!"...is this the seriety of contracts in USA?? Compliments! Bravi! Now I know why you have so many lawyers....

I love the noise I make when I cry! :D

imwoblin

Jun 7, 2008, 08:44 PM

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

Only a complete moron or someone who has more money than sense would pay full retail for a 3g iPhone (current iPhone ATT contract customers). If ATT & Apple tell me I have to wait until my contract is up to get the current deal (subsidy), I'll wait till my current contract is up and then buy the latest greatest thing that's available. Let's hope they have some love for us lemmings who waited 5 hours in line on launch day a year ago.

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:45 PM

(edit) And it isn't a favor when you pay $100+ a month for service.

It wouldn't be a favor if it was WRITTEN FROM THE BEGINNING in the contract! For example, there are some PROFESSIONAL or BUSINESS contracts in Italy where IT IS WRITTEN "every 18months I will give you a new phone and you give me back the old one". I don't think this is written on your contract.....so it would be a FAVOR.

louisvillesown

Jun 7, 2008, 08:48 PM

I haven't read all the posts..but in my opinion if the phone does come with a subsidy then those who are still in contract, with their existing iphone will be available for the rebate. With the first iPhone no discounts were given with the new contract. I used to work for AT&T and am now in the boat of many of the people on here. Like I said it goes by when your last discount on a phone was as far as getting the discounted rate. If you upgraded to an iphone or just started out with one, you could have went in the next day and upgraded again to any regular phone with the new customer discount.

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:51 PM

mikes63737

Jun 7, 2008, 08:52 PM

Couldn't the $200 AT&T credit be applied to your cell phone bill? What's wrong with that?

AT&T should not be allowed to deal with money. From my experience with them, they always mess up our bill somehow (always overcharge for included stuff), and when I ordered a prepaid phone from them (to use with my iPhone's SIM while camping so I don't break my iPhone) they double-billed me twice (charged once, charged the same thing again, took the second charge off, and then placed the same charge on a third time, and took the third one, leaving only the first charge), causing two overdrafts for the same order, which wouldn't have happened if they only charged me once! Also, my dad got a replacement phone from their insurance service and they charged him the $50 deductible every month.

Also, when they mess up, they refuse to admit responsibility. I called customer service about the prepaid phones and they want me to spend more money to send my bank statements via fax (I don't have a fax machine, but they don't care!) to prove that they actually messed up. It's so annoying, in fact, that I've just given up on trying to get my overdraft money back. (Only $20 because I have overdraft protection.) So I'm sure they'd mess up the $200 thing just because of past experience.

I've had T-Mobile before, and I've never had a problem with them. So I hope T-Mobile gets the iPhone and subsidizes it.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 08:55 PM

Exactly. The lack of a subsidy on the original iPhone makes this situation a bit different for all of us iPhone 1g purchasers. We had to sign a contract just to use this cool, new phone. Actually, looking backing on it, that was dumb of us!

J

Yes, that is what I am thinking, but you will of course have to extend your current contract for 2 years from the point of purchase of the new iPhone. But, yes, you should get that subsidy this time around... :)

(BTW, no stroke, it might have just been a blood clot in my brain or something ;))

Wigletbill

Jun 7, 2008, 08:57 PM

Exactly. The lack of a subsidy on the original iPhone makes this situation a bit different for all of us iPhone 1g purchasers. We had to sign a contract just to use this cool, new phone. Actually, looking backing on it, that was dumb of us!

J

Ok, I am tired of cannibalizing this thread but I went to attwireless.com and clicked upgrade phone. It then allowed me to opt into a FREE phone with a 2-year contract, therefore proving the point that:

Because the original hardware was not subsidized all us 1g iPhone owners officially have a hardware discount waiting for us. Which means someone will owe me a $200 gift card. Wigletbill FTW! :)

Back to lurking.

J

gianly1985

Jun 7, 2008, 08:57 PM

I haven't read all the posts..but in my opinion if the phone does come with a subsidy then those who are still in contract, with their existing iphone will be available for the rebate.

Exactly. The lack of a subsidy on the original iPhone makes this situation a bit different for all of us iPhone 1g purchasers.
J

U.S.A, the land of RETROACTIVE promotions. :)
Someday I'm gonna move...

JasonK

Jun 7, 2008, 08:59 PM

WAIT WAIT WAIT.....this is non-sense! You signed a 2-years contract for the last iphone and you must COMPLETE IT till the end! IF you want to INTERRUPT the contract, you should PAY a PENALTY!! (say 300$). Then you are free again and you can do the NEW contract for the 3g iphone. IT'S CRUEL but it's like things should work! That's why I hate contracts, it's fool to BOND YOURSELF for TWO LONG years in such a rapid changing market!!

I hope it for you but I think it wouldn't be fair! And neither Apple nor AT&T are supposed to make you this FAVOR!!

New Contracts written with ATT void the old contract and begin a new term. What Louisvillesown is talking about is within the contract however, because no subsidies were originally recieved by the buyer. (LOUISVILLESOWN) am I right on this?

acrafton

Jun 7, 2008, 09:01 PM

10 million iPhones in 2008, that's why, it helps because it will sell more iPhones

Selling them unlocked would sell more IPhones which I doubt we will see on Monday.

Fonzijr1964

Jun 7, 2008, 09:04 PM

Ok, I am going to have a stroke in a minute :eek:

I read your link and that is all fine and dandy BUT...

It's funny how the article breaks down all the individual technologies that take to make an iPhone.

Some of the holes in this defense...

This is all related to the first gen iPhone, which I don't believe we are discussing...
Its funny there is no mentions of R&D costs, Software costs, Advertising costs, etc.

Like I said before if it really is too cheap for you, offer them some extra money maybe you'll get a iPhone t-shirt (So EVERYONE knows you have one, even when you're not using it)

but we know the iPhone will most likely be the same thing with a 3G and GPS chip so it will end up about the same price

JW008

Jun 7, 2008, 09:05 PM

Two things:

First, the iPhone won't be in the hands of everyone--there's still that pesky little $20/month fee--that's still a hefty price for most people.

Second, the way I would assume the subsidy would work would be that it is based off of how long you keep the two-year contract--if you cancel it early, you will have to pay not only for the contract cancellation, but also a pro-rated amount for the subsidy on the phone.

Chupa Chupa

Jun 7, 2008, 09:13 PM

Most likely this is how it will work for U.S. ATT customers w/ Gen 1 iPhones IF the story about subsidized phones is true:

You pay full boat like everyone else for the phone then:

if you want to continue with your current contract., i.e., 1 year left, swap out the ATT SIM from the old phone to the new one and done. The Gen 1 iPhone has a 3G SIM. You will not get the rebate from ATT b/c you are keeping your original contract. This was the procedure when people upgraded their Gen 1 4GB to 8GB or 16GB.

if you want the $200 rebate then you'll "sign" a new 2 yr contract. Your existing contract will become null and void and you will NOT have to pay a penalty. The penalty is only if you cancel the contract AND leave ATT.

jackjason

Jun 7, 2008, 09:13 PM

Just because a few things are up in the air regarding an upcoming event or adventure doesn't mean that you can't let yourself get all jazzed up about it! Uncertainty is its own kind of excitement, and you should get comfortable with it. Sure, things could fall through and your plans might not come to fruition, but so what? At least you enjoyed that happiness and anticipation. Plus, you will feel more grounded and comfortable about not knowing every little thing in the future.

Chupa Chupa

Jun 7, 2008, 09:21 PM

First, the iPhone won't be in the hands of everyone--there's still that pesky little $20/month fee--that's still a hefty price for most people.

I know of no other smartphone that doesn't also have a data fee. ATT's is fairly low compared to T-Mob and Verizon. The $20 data fee is not going to stop anyone who wants an iPhone. If you don't need a smartphone then that is a different issue, but the iPhone w/o data is nothing but a pretty brick. Might as well just get a Touch and "free" phone.

megfilmworks

Jun 7, 2008, 09:28 PM

IMHO, I read this as:

If you buy the iPhone full fare then you can elect to have a 2 year contract on activation. If so then you get an Apple rebate or credit. If you don't want a contract, no rebate or credit.

If you buy it at ATT then you are only charged the reduced price (if you sign up for the contract) or pay full if not.

If you have a current contract ATT has always just extended the contract from the time of purchase if you want the reduced price.

Also, I was under contract to ATT (for a Razr) when I bought my iPhone on iDay. I am now currently NOT under contract. They never tacked on additional months to my original contact which expired 2 years form my Razr purchase.

zepharus

Jun 7, 2008, 09:29 PM

YES!!!! I just sold my phone on eBay for 500 dollars! I can get a new phone + extra cash! Life is good...

What retard bought that?

JW008

Jun 7, 2008, 09:31 PM

I know of no other smartphone that doesn't also have a data fee. ATT's is fairly low compared to T-Mob and Verizon. The $20 data fee is not going to stop anyone who wants an iPhone. If you don't need a smartphone then that is a different issue, but the iPhone w/o data is nothing but a pretty brick. Might as well just get a Touch and "free" phone.

I agree 100%, but I guess my point is that if someone is willing to pay the monthly data fees, then they are willing to pay a higher up-front price. Those of us who own 1G iPhones obviously fall into this category. My only point is that knocking $200 off the initial price of the phone won't attract a significant amount of new people because of that monthly fee...

El Carbonite

Jun 7, 2008, 09:39 PM

If you think you can't upgrade or aren't sure - log into your AT&T account online. I bought an iPhone on launch day and it says I'm eligible for an upgrade. :D

/dev/toaster

Jun 7, 2008, 09:43 PM

If they don't allow existing customers to upgrade via a subsidied contract I will be rather pissed.

suckhinder

Jun 7, 2008, 09:45 PM

first they got their subprime loans, then they got their the Bush stimulus check, then they got that "$99 down" used car, and now they want subsidized iphones. I hope Jobs puts out a low end model just for these folks. A pink colored student-version subsidized iphone would be nice.

5teve

Jun 7, 2008, 09:45 PM

Subsidised mobile phones are common place in the UK mobile phone market. Most often then not, you can pick up the latest mobile phone handset free with a certain contract. There are some phones, though, that you do have to pay a certain amount for (smartphones, etc.) but nothing as high as £269.

If the 2G iPhone can come in at a subsidised price of £99 with an 18-month contract tied to it in the UK with the handful of new features for it that are being widely speculated, this thing will kick up a vast media frenzy and definitely be this year's top-selling product -- not to mention a serious threat to other companies with mobile phones in the same market.

Either way, we'll see what happens on Monday. ;)

Zachster7

Jun 7, 2008, 09:50 PM

I talked to an ATT rep today who said that because I was a new customer when I signed up last year at the iphone launch, I purchased the iphone at full retail, so if the new iphones are subsidized I will be eligible for the reduced cost because I never received a subsidy to begin with... hope this makes sense...

Long time lurker first time poster....hey everyone!

zombiedictator

Jun 7, 2008, 09:51 PM

If you think you can't upgrade or aren't sure - log into your AT&T account online. I bought an iPhone on launch day and it says I'm eligible for an upgrade. :D

I switched from Verizon to AT&T because of the iPhone, which I bought on 6/30/07 and registered a few days later. I logged into my AT&T account and it says I'm eligible for an upgrade on 3/2/09. This doesn't really make sense. Usually they bribe you into signing a 2-year contract with a subsidized phone. I paid $600 for an 8GB and now they're telling me "tough crap"?

I don't know. I hope I'm not left in the dust with a subsidization. If they are, screw em. I got screwed on the $200 price drop and I won't allow that to happen again.

I talked to an ATT rep today who said that because I was a new customer when I signed up last year at the iphone launch, I purchased the iphone at full retail, so if the new iphones are subsidized I will be eligible for the reduced cost because I never received a subsidy to begin with... hope this makes sense...

Long time lurker first time poster....hey everyone!

Did you check the AT&T site and see whether or not you are eligible?

I wonder if maybe the site is wrong and just assumes you got a subsidy when you signed the contract. But if that's the case, it's a pain in the butt if I have to go to an AT&T store Monday when I have an Apple store a mile from my house.

jawporta

Jun 7, 2008, 09:52 PM

T-Mobile lets you extend your contract when upgrading your phone. So we should all have a year left, if they give us a deal for signing on another two years that would be cool.
:cool:

What about existing iPhone/AT&T customers?

EDIT: But then again, when you upgrade any other phone outside your selected upgrade time period - you usually end up paying full retail anyway. So after revisiting, I don't believe there will be any type of subsidy for existing iPhone/AT&T customers. Ah! - the price of bleeding edge technology... :eek:

brywalker

Jun 7, 2008, 09:53 PM

S600MBUSA

Jun 7, 2008, 10:00 PM

It's funny how some people attack Apple for putting out expensive products, and then when there is a possibility that they reduce the price on something, people complain!

To those of us who aren't concerned with some nouveau riche, intellectually weak elitism, an outstanding and improved product for less money is a good thing. This is the natural evolution of things. The technology improves, and prices come down. Rational people rejoice.

If you're so obsessed about being fawned over by the very "plebs" for whom you want Apple's products to too expensive, so that you can feel superior, you need to grow up and attempt to find some other way to distinguish yourself other than conspicuous consumption.

biketire

Jun 7, 2008, 10:16 PM

The $200 rebate would be good if you wanted the new iPhone and an iPod nano... :rolleyes: I would like a "free" iPod nano!

why would you need an ipod nano when you have an iphone? lol

Kwill

Jun 7, 2008, 10:16 PM

Excuse my ignorance, but does "subsidies" mean (if it's true) that iPhone will be available on the Verizon network? That would rule.

No. It means AT&T can pay (or subsidize) part of the upfront cost - expecting to recoup it over the 2-yr contract.

Kwill

Jun 7, 2008, 10:26 PM

why would you need an ipod nano when you have an iphone? lol

An old Nano remains in my car, which is controlled via DICE (http://diceelectronics.com/vehicle_selector.htm) from the dash/steering wheel.
My iPhone remains on my person with BT enabled for handsfree calling. Not having to plug/unplug iPhone keeps me from forgetting it and allows playlists to continue from where they left off after returning to my vehicle.

Syrus28

Jun 7, 2008, 10:37 PM

To existing iPhone owners... There is no way there would be a "trade-in" program or any sort of discount for buying the 1st one. Why? Lets look.

1.) Apple never does trade-ins. When a updated product comes out, you pay the full price just like everyone else.

2.) Cell Phone companies never do trade-ins (unless a product is defected). Why would they want your "old" iPhone? They will make you pay the price everyone else is paying.

On the positive side, existing iPhone owners are available for the subsidized price, since you never got it before.

cleric

Jun 7, 2008, 10:39 PM

Hurray!

If the new iPhone is indeed unlocked as sold by Apple for $400 or even $500, its a bargain rather than paying more with AT&T (Deathstar company).

Right now I have 2 - 16GB iPhones with T-Mobile and my bill is less than $81/month including taxes. I get faster Edge data rates at 120 KB/s, 1000 minutes anytime, and weekends + evenings free.

Faster than who I get a 180KB/s in Minneapolis on ATT. My brother has a T-Mobile iPhone and gets speeds similar to you.

Are you using the t-zones data plan?

As for 3g on T-mobile its a joke only going to be voice at first.

Now regarding the subsidy I suspect if its true what people are saying that ATT has given out visa debit cards before then thats what we can expect to get our subsidy on after registering.

rlmccormick

Jun 7, 2008, 10:41 PM

Hmmpf. A two hundred f*uckin dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your f*uckin minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece o'***** 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a butt-******** of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

I think it's entirely possible for ATT to sell the iPhone at $200 under contract. They sell the Blackberry Curve for $99 after all. I'm not sure how the manufacturing cost of the new Curve compares to the iPhone but the difference probably isn't more than $100.

Rocketman

Jun 7, 2008, 10:42 PM

It's funny how some people attack Apple for putting out expensive products, and then when there is a possibility that they reduce the price on something, people complain!

Early adopter
Low Price
Fully featured

You can't have all three. :)

Apple originally charged high prices and full boat for services, then when they reduced the hardware cost, early adopters whined, so they were rebated $100 product credit. That was a gift.

Now the device will still be high priced as compared to smart phones but will have the traditional discount for commiting to high priced recurring service contracts.

That is the way it is now.

Some day soon we will have internet wireless everywhere and VOIP everywhere and the double pay for phone and data will also be eliminated. But not today. The networks are still deploying and need the capital input.

Soon.

Rocketman

Mackan

Jun 7, 2008, 10:50 PM

So at the WWDC, will Steve Jobs say:

"We now allow subsidies on the iPhone. Before we were too greedy, and just wanted to rip you off, but now we understand that we will sell more iPhones if it becomes cheaper. We will still continue to try to rip you off whenever possible, though."?

Will he also say:

"We tried to make the iPhone as exclusive as possible, with revenue sharing from our carrier partner, but now we understand it will not work in all countries. We will still continue to do it wherever possible, though."?

Somone at WWDC yells:

"Hey Steve, that is all good.. no one here would ever criticize you, but what about selling the iPhone unlocked, everywhere, for a reasonable price, with warranty? Since the iPhone is so revolutionary, almost godly, it will sell like gasoline!"

Steve: "Uh... Boom!"

louisvillesown

Jun 7, 2008, 10:50 PM

New Contracts written with ATT void the old contract and begin a new term. What Louisvillesown is talking about is within the contract however, because no subsidies were originally recieved by the buyer. (LOUISVILLESOWN) am I right on this?

For the most part I believe. It would be ridiculous by ATT if they do not allow the rebate when one is within contract with a current iPhone. I am pretty confident that they will allow it however. The only thing I am not sure about is what they will do with the length of your contract. It will be the same thing as the last phone with signing a new 2 year contract. Only thing is will they start it on the purchase of the new iPhone or back track it to the iPhone 1 purchase. Only reason I wonder this, is because they did that with the release of the 16 gig iPhone. Those who were just upgrading from an 8 gig were able to have there contract prorated back to the date of the 8 gig purchase.

strangelogic

Jun 7, 2008, 10:55 PM

I switched from Verizon to AT&T because of the iPhone, which I bought on 6/30/07 and registered a few days later. I logged into my AT&T account and it says I'm eligible for an upgrade on 3/2/09. This doesn't really make sense. Usually they bribe you into signing a 2-year contract with a subsidized phone. I paid $600 for an 8GB and now they're telling me "tough crap"?
...

Did you check the AT&T site and see whether or not you are eligible?

I wonder if maybe the site is wrong and just assumes you got a subsidy when you signed the contract. But if that's the case, it's a pain in the butt if I have to go to an AT&T store Monday when I have an Apple store a mile from my house.

You must have changed something on 3/2/2008? I bought my iphone on day one and AT&T says I'll be eligible for an upgrade in November 2008 -- but their site is wrong because the date it is showing is the date I got my phone number changed, and made no other changes to my contract - so their computer probably re-set the clock just 'because'...

I just hope the new one is available in large numbers quickly...

Intarweb

Jun 7, 2008, 10:55 PM

corywoolf

Jun 7, 2008, 11:08 PM

im slightly confused does that mean I can have an iphone with verizon? Because there has been a rumor about that for a while

Verizon operates on a CDMA network, the iPhone is for GSM networks only at this time. So probably not until Apple's 5 year exclusivity contract with at&t expires.

imwoblin

Jun 7, 2008, 11:08 PM

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

I find it HYSTERICAL that idiots are asking/want a rebate for a one year old cell phone. Have you lost your mind? Get a grip on reality. You should be thankful you got a $100 rebate last year when you CHOSE to get a new electronic gadget.

Us idiots aren't asking for a rebate for a one year old phone, we are asking for a rebate on a NEW 3g iPhone with a new two year contract.

j763

Jun 7, 2008, 11:23 PM

Frankly, I'm dismayed...

There's far too little speculation here as to when the new iPhone will start shipping. I expect better of MR forum users. :)

I couldn't care less about videoconferencing and other such nonsense, just 3G (GPS would be nice) and "...and they're available immediately".

JasonK

Jun 7, 2008, 11:30 PM

For the most part I believe. It would be ridiculous by ATT if they do not allow the rebate when one is within contract with a current iPhone. I am pretty confident that they will allow it however. The only thing I am not sure about is what they will do with the length of your contract. It will be the same thing as the last phone with signing a new 2 year contract. Only thing is will they start it on the purchase of the new iPhone or back track it to the iPhone 1 purchase. Only reason I wonder this, is because they did that with the release of the 16 gig iPhone. Those who were just upgrading from an 8 gig were able to have there contract prorated back to the date of the 8 gig purchase.

Thanks. I appresciate your response. People in here forget they are talking to people, not machines. Name calling people idiots is rude. No one comes on here to be picked on... play nice! New iphone is coming!!!:rolleyes:

JBaker122586

Jun 7, 2008, 11:36 PM

god I hope ebay buyers dont hear about this before mine sells in 20 hours:o

My biggest fear is mine selling tomorrow, the person not paying right away, seeing the new iPhone announcement, and deciding not to pay at all.

TwinCities Dan

Jun 7, 2008, 11:48 PM

Some day soon we will have internet wireless everywhere and VOIP everywhere and the double pay for phone and data will also be eliminated. But not today. The networks are still deploying and need the capital input.

I share this vision... :)

I can hear the ads:

"Beginning April 2012, all cellphones will turn wifi, don't worry we will give you a coupon for a conversion box" :D

hiimamac

Jun 7, 2008, 11:50 PM

My phone was malfunctioning a couple of weeks back and when Apple said they would replace it I asked if I could upgrade to the 16 GB and they told me it was only direct replacements...

Sucks, I know...

Ahhhhm iPhone, iPhone, iPhone, iPhone, alas, so much for the PRO CREATIVE user.

Macbook = could never run a game but could run motion and OPEN_GL went as high as 171% with Leopard (see barefeats.com), then Apple crippled it and its down to 70%, same with mini mac. Crush those (creatives) that made Apple who they are. But what do they care, the bread and butter is iPod/iPhone. One would think you could use a iMac (like in days past) for design work, not so, not with the glossy screen and the terrible firewire (Texas Instruments only in Mac Pro and MBP) and lots of trouble for video audio users - so one has to wonder, as they grow larger, when they will let go of their fear of the "pro" using a cheap machine to get the job done.

See here for AUDIO problems and NON TEXAS INSTRUMENTS FIREWIRE, which actually had changed in the MBP for a little while, then they went back to T.I.

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/166225-imac-mb-mbp-agere-firewire-chipsets-can-troublesome-okt-07-till-feb-08-a.html

So if apple is going to offer rebates, lets hope they offer more carriers and that the iPhone can be like a normal phone, i.e., no more NIGHTMARE genius bar appointments, phone stops working, you bring it in, swap out the SIM card and get a new phone, standard policy on all phones for 1 year.

And what's up with Insurance? Normally new phones to market have about a 6 month waiting period then you can get insurance, people do make mistakes - time to make the iPhone like a real phone, real warranty, insurance, swap sim card.

Hopefully, some other things this Monday besides the iPhone and while I think it will be announced, I don't know if it will be available on Monday, or even next week at all.

twoodcc

Jun 7, 2008, 11:50 PM

this sounds good to me. hopefully i'll qualify to get the phone at the lower price

JasonK

Jun 7, 2008, 11:52 PM

My biggest fear is mine selling tomorrow, the person not paying right away, seeing the new iPhone announcement, and deciding not to pay at all.

If you are in an area that Craigslist is popular, USE IT! I sold my 8GB quickly for $350 yesterday after having it posted for 20 minutes. When you add up all the fees, shipping, etc., you save alot of money.

lamar777

Jun 7, 2008, 11:53 PM

What about existing iPhone/AT&T customers?

EDIT: But then again, when you upgrade any other phone outside your selected upgrade time period - you usually end up paying full retail anyway. So after revisiting, I don't believe there will be any type of subsidy for existing iPhone/AT&T customers. Ah! - the price of bleeding edge technology... :eek:

That would be true but in that circumstance the original phone was probably subsidized. Sure Apple may have received a cut of my bill over the last year but that would be unknown to me and If I decide to buy a new phone next week I absolutely expect to get the same deal as anyone else.

hiimamac

Jun 8, 2008, 12:02 AM

this sounds good to me. hopefully i'll qualify to get the phone at the lower price

So, if you're one year into your contract does this mean you can't resign for another two (2) years and would have to by the phone at full price?

Glad my contract is up. Hope this is true.

buckdutter

Jun 8, 2008, 12:04 AM

I think it's entirely possible for ATT to sell the iPhone at $200 under contract. They sell the Blackberry Curve for $99 after all. I'm not sure how the manufacturing cost of the new Curve compares to the iPhone but the difference probably isn't more than $100.

at&t pays between $285 and $345 for Curves, and sells them for $350. Subsidized they are generally $99, so $199 for an iPhone sounds about right.

Attonine

Jun 8, 2008, 12:06 AM

The more I think about the idea of subsidies applied to iPhone sales the more I realize how much of a coup Apple may have pulled off. Originally there was no subsidy, but the Telcos paid Apple part of the monthly contract. I can see the Telcos justification that this was the price to be paid for a sole supplier deal for a new, hot product. Now ,if the rumours are correct, the Telcos will be sucking up this monthly contract payment, and the subsidy. And what's more, the original reports seem to suggest that it was the Telcos pressuring Apple to let them pay this extra cost. I find this quite amazing, companies are willing to pay twice for the privilege of selling an Apple product.

Baron58

Jun 8, 2008, 12:14 AM

The way I figure it, for all these years Apple and its operating systems have been spared from being a target of hackers and cyber criminals NOT because their fortresses are so secure and impenetrable but because they've occupied a nice, cozy li'l niche at the top of the food chain.

Well, you figure wrong. Please stop spreading this misinformation.

JW008

Jun 8, 2008, 12:16 AM

DiamondMac

Jun 8, 2008, 12:17 AM

Any rebate at all is a huge, huge plus for me, even if it were just an Apple store credit which I don't think it would be such

I still am on the "I will believe it when I see it" train of thought as getting $200 back is just like....wow, what a nice, nice surprise for my bank account

Toadkillerdog

Jun 8, 2008, 12:22 AM

Well, you figure wrong. Please stop spreading this misinformation.

You're right, Apple has been at the bottom of the food chain (not the top) and as they get market share, then hackers will target them more. He had it backwards.

Dmac77

Jun 8, 2008, 12:22 AM

Finally, I will be able to get one. My mom has said hell would freeze over the day i get a phone over $200. Please Steve let me have the Jesus Phone, PLEASE!

AJ1BostonMASS

Jun 8, 2008, 12:47 AM

Verizon operates on a CDMA network, the iPhone is for GSM networks only at this time. So probably not until Apple's 5 year exclusivity contract with at&t expires.

o well that sucks but thanks for answering it

zync

Jun 8, 2008, 12:54 AM

I've been with this company well before it became Cingular---that being said, I'm pretty sure I've upgraded phones before the contract was up.

Think about this logically--Apple wants to sell 10+ million iPhones this year. AT&T wants to get as many people under contract for as long as they can. This is just me inferring--but a sizable number of people who will buy the 3G iPhone are people who have bought an iPhone in the past year. Apple will get their money through subsidies. AT&T will get their money through the extended contract. Customers get a cheap(er) iPhone. Who's losing on this deal?

Me. I got a new phone when the iPhone came out to tide me over until the 3G version came out. I'd have kept my old T616 as it was a great phone, but the nubbin' joystick stopped working from gathering dust in my pocket. Since the iPhone wasn't subsidized, I used the subsidy on the new phone because I figured out version two would also not be subsidized. If it's subsidized now, I'll be annoyed, but I'll still buy it because it was my fault for making assumptions.

I really doubt that they're going to subsidize it though. I would think original iPhone customers are going to be pissed. The very early adopters will be twice shunned.

iDrum

Jun 8, 2008, 01:13 AM

It's true. I have a family member who works for AT&T and he says the iPhone will be subsidize; $200 off the purchase price with 2-year contract. Can't wait.

macnews

Jun 8, 2008, 01:16 AM

I so hope this is true. If the new iphone comes out with some great apps, 3g, gps AND subsidies - YES! I'm there!

jmadlena

Jun 8, 2008, 01:34 AM

I don't know if AT&T will subsidize the new iPhone, and I don't really care. My contract isn't up for another couple of months, and I don't want to wait to save $100 or however much it may be.

If they do want to subsidize it I don't care if first genertion iPhone owners get upset. You had a great phone for an entire year; you had the hottest product of them all. Since they had to pay a lot (that is subjective, of course) why should everyone have to pay a lot? How long should Apple wait to drop the price or allow AT&T to subsidize it? One generation? Two? Either way, someone will get upset, so do it when it fits the business plan.

Customers feel that they are entitled to everything nowadays.

alphaod

Jun 8, 2008, 01:37 AM

I want to know is can I buy an unlocked unsubsidized iPhone?

Also, does anyone know if Apple will let me trade in a malfunctioning phone/device (still under warranty) for a better model if I pay the difference?

Only if they don't have what you need in stock and they can't fix your problem with a replacement of the same kind.

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 01:57 AM

I really doubt that they're going to subsidize it though. I would think original iPhone customers are going to be pissed. The very early adopters will be twice shunned.

I have to disagree. First of all, early adopters will likely get some benefit for upgrading. I am hearing some rumors flying around about trade ins etc. that might get people discounts. Think about the ipod. What about people who get a new ipod, and then a while later a new and better one comes out, for cheaper than theirs?

The bottom line is that, while the first iphone was great, it didn't have the power to go as mainstream as apple would have liked yet. The Iphone can be to the phone industry, what the ipod was to portable music. The way for the iphone to achieve such a stance, is through making it a product that appeals to everyone. Most people I know think the iphone is great, but they see the price and decide they can get similar features for cheaper. The reality is that most phones don't meet the standard of the iphone, but on paper many do. People that aren't dedicated to apple are going to look at the other similar options on the table, and choose the cheaper. Apple will look even better when it is priced along the lines with its competitors, instead of being the top of the line, so far up, that many just can't reach.

The iphone is a work of art, and I bet the newest one will be even better. Take note though, that in a time in America especially, when people are needing to be frivolous due to a struggling economy, every extra penny spent is a big deal. Regular people are making the transition from junky old flip phones, to new phones with data plans and sleek features. Regular people want a deal. I guarantee that if this iphone is subsidized to 199 american dollars, it will be the most popular phone for the next year without question. If you recall the junky moto razr, that everyone liked for some odd reason, started at a premium, and lowered its price as it got more popular. the same will go for the iphone (though i doubt apple will ever let an iphone be sold for less than $199).

stagi

Jun 8, 2008, 01:59 AM

zync

Jun 8, 2008, 02:20 AM

I have to disagree. First of all, early adopters will likely get some benefit for upgrading. I am hearing some rumors flying around about trade ins etc. that might get people discounts. Think about the ipod. What about people who get a new ipod, and then a while later a new and better one comes out, for cheaper than theirs?

The bottom line is that, while the first iphone was great, it didn't have the power to go as mainstream as apple would have liked yet. The Iphone can be to the phone industry, what the ipod was to portable music. The way for the iphone to achieve such a stance, is through making it a product that appeals to everyone. Most people I know think the iphone is great, but they see the price and decide they can get similar features for cheaper. The reality is that most phones don't meet the standard of the iphone, but on paper many do. People that aren't dedicated to apple are going to look at the other similar options on the table, and choose the cheaper. Apple will look even better when it is priced along the lines with its competitors, instead of being the top of the line, so far up, that many just can't reach.

The iphone is a work of art, and I bet the newest one will be even better. Take note though, that in a time in America especially, when people are needing to be frivolous due to a struggling economy, every extra penny spent is a big deal. Regular people are making the transition from junky old flip phones, to new phones with data plans and sleek features. Regular people want a deal. I guarantee that if this iphone is subsidized to 199 american dollars, it will be the most popular phone for the next year without question. If you recall the junky moto razr, that everyone liked for some odd reason, started at a premium, and lowered its price as it got more popular. the same will go for the iphone (though i doubt apple will ever let an iphone be sold for less than $199).

I bought a 20GB second generation iPod two months before it came out. I didn't get anything for that. There has never been an iPod upgrade program, unless you count returning it within 15 days or you're under warranty and yours is dead.

In fact, I can't think of a single Apple product that has ever allowed even paying for an upgrade much less a trade-in. Those rumors that you're hearing, I believe, are just rumors.

The bottom line is that this phone still sells on eBay for a premium. I don't get where you think that the first iPhone wasn't as "mainstream as Apple would have liked." The iPhone is pretty much sold out in it's primary market and demand is higher than ever. Apple knew it wouldn't do as well in Europe, but it seems to be sold out there as well. The only problem with selling iPhones is keeping stock in stores—and if you're going to quote rumors, there might not even be enough version 2s to do that.

There's no reason, other than stupidity, for AT&T to subsidize it at this point. If it starts to sell poorly, then it should be subsidized, but until then they should pocket that money. I believe the Razr actually did follow that model, which is why it started off so expensive. I'm not positive on that so don't quote me.

Not everyone needs a smartphone. This is not a phone for everyone. The feature set and price align it quite well with the rest of the phones in its market.

I'm not saying that it won't happen, but at this point it would be a stupid move on AT&T's part.

winterspan

Jun 8, 2008, 02:33 AM

1) The iPhone 3G will (almost surely) NOT be sold unlocked in the USA. Where is everyone getting this idea?
2) The iPhone 3G is NOT compatible with T-Mobile's (USA) 3G network, although it can be used with their 2.5G GSM/EDGE network, so it would be a waste to use it with them.
3) The iPhone 3G will NOT be compatible AT ALL with Verizon's and Sprint's CDMA2000 (CDMA) network. The iPhone runs on GSM(TDMA) and UMTS(W-CDMA).

Sure offering a subsidy would open the device to a larger market, but does that lower income target market currently purchase expensive data plans? It makes sense if at&t is just trying to get a stronghold on the device before it becomes available on other carriers (in the USA).
If you want a legit IPhone and it is locked, you have to go to ATT anyway at whatever the price is. . .AND sign a two year contract. Why give a subsidy for something you have no choice about?
Why would they want to lower the price and drastically decrease their profits, when they could keep it at the same price and actually get MORE money because they're making the phone available to more countries..

AT&T makes their money from the monthly fees and contract lock-ins. iPhone customers on average spend TWICE as much per month as normal phone owners. And remember, people don't like to switch providers often. If they are happy, it is difficult to pull them away. In other words, iPhone customers that are new to AT&T are a gold mine for AT&T. They would READILY throw a $200+ subsidy on there to get people to move over. Even better, T-Mobile not only doesn't have a 3G network yet, but when it launches it won't be compatible with the iPhone, Thus AT&T is the only real option for iPhone users. Remember, Apple get's the same amount of money.. It's AT&T that is footing the cost of the subsidy.

This just doesn't make any f*uckin' sense!! What kind of country, backwoods-ass business move would it be to allow a carrier to discount a phone by $200 when Apple would still be selling the same freakin' product at FULL RETAIL VALUE in its own freakin' stores??! *snip* ...I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'.... *snip*

Calm down. It's actually very simple. If you buy from the Apple store at $399, then you would get a $200 rebate when you sign a contract with AT&T.
On another note, does anyone else find it incredibly ironic that this guy is ranting about "backwoods-ass" companies while using sentences such as "...I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'..."??

That would certainly make it fit in more as a genuine contender in the UK..pretty much every phone here is subsidised by the carrier.
its probably how all the subsided phones in germany are. U r gonna pay less and sign up for a 2 years contract and as more expensive the plan is the less expensive is the phone itself.

Nearly all phones in America are purchased directly from the mobile carrier on a subsidy with a new contract agreement or contract extension. The difference is that even expensive smartphones phones only see $100-$200 subsidies, where as in the UK/Europe you can get high-end phones like the Nokia N95 for FREE on contract. America has a less competitive environment because of the conflicting network technologies being used.

Hurray! If the new iPhone is indeed unlocked as sold by Apple for $400 or even $500, its a bargain rather than paying more with AT&T (Deathstar company). Right now I have 2 - 16GB iPhones with T-Mobile and my bill is less than $81/month including taxes.
Why would it be sold unlocked? And besides, a T-Mobile is worthless for the iPhone 3G, as their 3G network (whenever they finish it) will NOT be compatible with the new iPhone. You'll still be stuck on EDGE.

im slightly confused does that mean I can have an iphone with verizon? Because there has been a rumor about that for a while
Excuse my ignorance, but does "subsidies" mean (if it's true) that iPhone will be available on the Verizon network? That would rule.
Nope. The 3G iPhone will not be compatible at all with Verizon's (or Sprints) network. Besides the fact that AT&T almost surely has a multi-year exclusivity agreement, there has been no indication of any kind that Apple will make a Verizon-compatible CDMA/EV-DO phone ever, though in the future Verizon and AT&T will use similar technology (2-3 years from now)/

I am a lil' confused, isn't AT&T the only US carrier with the 3g network right now? Why would you want a 3g iPhone unlocked so that you can use it on the EDGE network at T-Moblie or Verizon etc.

Nope, AT&T is the only carrier in the USA with a UMTS/HSPA 3G network. Both Verizon wireless and Sprint have 3G networks, but they use the competing CDMA/EV-DO technology. T-Mobile USA is currently building a UMTS/HSPA 3G network, but it will not be compatible with the iPhone 3G.

dumb dumb dumb. Now it will be like the RAZR. First 3 months "wow you've got one of those" After that "I've got one too and so does everyone in a 10 mile radius"

Oh, Grow up! For god sakes, are you in junior highschool? Everyone deserves an iPhone!

But if the phone costs $200 to make and we pay $200 how is that profit
The mobile phone carrier, e.g. AT&T, and NOT Apple covers the subsidies...

PowerFullMac

Jun 8, 2008, 02:36 AM

That must mean the ones you get from Apple Stores will be unlocked or on pay-as-you-go, or WTF is the point of even selling them there?

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 02:52 AM

I bought a 20GB second generation iPod two months before it came out. I didn't get anything for that. There has never been an iPod upgrade program, unless you count returning it within 15 days or you're under warranty and yours is dead.

In fact, I can't think of a single Apple product that has ever allowed even paying for an upgrade much less a trade-in. Those rumors that you're hearing, I believe, are just rumors.

The idea is that people that are already on contract could also benefit from extending their contract longer. You don't seem to understand that the iphone isn't just and apple product. Decisions by apple are dependent on the phone companies as well. Name me one other apple product dependent on another company's choices, more than the iphone. If any benefits are given to early iphone owners, who wish to upgrade, it will likely be out of At&t's pocket.

The bottom line is that this phone still sells on eBay for a premium. I don't get where you think that the first iPhone wasn't as "mainstream as Apple would have liked." The iPhone is pretty much sold out in it's primary market and demand is higher than ever. Apple knew it wouldn't do as well in Europe, but it seems to be sold out there as well. The only problem with selling iPhones is keeping stock in stores—and if you're going to quote rumors, there might not even be enough version 2s to do that.

There's no reason, other than stupidity, for AT&T to subsidize it at this point. If it starts to sell poorly, then it should be subsidized, but until then they should pocket that money. I believe the Razr actually did follow that model, which is why it started off so expensive. I'm not positive on that so don't quote me.

Not everyone needs a smartphone. This is not a phone for everyone. The feature set and price align it quite well with the rest of the phones in its market.

I'm not saying that it won't happen, but at this point it would be a stupid move on AT&T's part.

Yes the iphone is selling well. But it is still losing. The iphone is supposed to sell 10 million units in America in 2008. It has only sold 1/5 of that. It is still in high demand, however it would be higher at a lower price point. You may have 400 bucks (or more) to get an iphone, but average consumers don't. The iphone can sell 3 times as much as its selling now, if the price is lowered. Right now the iphone is being beaten by blackberry (you can quote me on that.) I know a lot of people who just bought blackberry's cause they could get them so much cheaper than an iphone, and couldn't make sense of paying a few hundred more since they already had ipods. Apple branding and great features make for an automatic top selling product. Those two things alongside a very reasonable price result in a product that owns the market.

Also, understand that AT&T subsidizing the iphone is a minimal loss, that enables them to make tons more money in the future. The monthly plans are huge moneymakers for the cell companies. The iphone very well may be selling "enough" units. AT&T and Apple are not interested in the iphone just selling "enough." They want the iphone to hijack individuals from all of their other carriers to jump on the the opportunity to have the newest coolest gadget. AT&T would be more than interesting in subsidizing the iphone, in order to move more people to AT&T.

nomar383

Jun 8, 2008, 02:55 AM

Okay, I didn't read all the posts so I hope this hasn't been brought up. But... Don't all AT&T customers sign a new two year contract when buying an iPhone? My question then would be... who exactly won't qualify for this rebate? Only existing customers wouldn't qualify? That would be a load of crap.

And how could Apple not offer the rebate, but AT&T will? Doesn't that just stop all purchases of iPhones from Apple stores? Hmmmmm

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 03:00 AM

1)
Oh, Grow up! For god sakes, are you in junior highschool? Everyone deserves an iPhone!

Amen to that. I just want to commend you on the best post ive seen all day. The bottom line is, the iphone shouldn't be a luxury, it should be something all can enjoy. Imagine if all your friends had iphones. Imagine live video-chatting with all your friends over your iphone (rumored to be a feature in the 3g). It would be amazing.

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 03:02 AM

the iphone is apple's biggest accomplishment in years. Why shouldn't we all have it?

severe

Jun 8, 2008, 03:26 AM

1)Calm down. It's actually very simple. If you buy from the Apple store at $399, then you would get a $200 rebate when you sign a contract with AT&T.
On another note, does anyone else find it incredibly ironic that this guy is ranting about "backwoods-ass" companies while using sentences such as "...I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'..."??

Holy cow, that was funny.

zync

Jun 8, 2008, 03:34 AM

The idea is that people that are already on contract could also benefit from extending their contract longer. You don't seem to understand that the iphone isn't just and apple product. Decisions by apple are dependent on the phone companies as well. Name me one other apple product dependent on another company's choices, more than the iphone. If any benefits are given to early iphone owners, who wish to upgrade, it will likely be out of At&t's pocket.

The iPhone is solely an Apple product, that's why I don't seem to understand that it isn't. Apple sells them to AT&T and gets a cut of the contract in addition. End of story. Original iPhone owners who want a new phone will have to do what any other AT&T customer has to do to get a new phone. You don't seem to understand that AT&T is in the business of making money. Any way they can nickel and dime you they will. If they can sell you a phone at $400 they will until they can't push them anymore.

Yes the iphone is selling well. But it is still losing. The iphone is supposed to sell 10 million units in America in 2008. It has only sold 1/5 of that. It is still in high demand, however it would be higher at a lower price point. You may have 400 bucks (or more) to get an iphone, but average consumers don't. The iphone can sell 3 times as much as its selling now, if the price is lowered.

Understand that that is Apple's stated goal, not AT&Ts. AT&T doesn't care how many are sold in a year, as long as they're moving the stock. Considering that the first shipment is rumored to be 3 million units they will surely sell them all out, even at $400 each—regardless of Apple's goal.

Average consumers just got a $600 check they didn't count on. Some people will hoard it—most actually—while some will spend it. I probably could afford it without the check—not that I'm making gobs of money after finishing college, buying a house, getting married, and keeping up with my car payment and bills.

There are people still willing to spend that money and I reiterate that it would be stupid for AT&T to subsidize the phone and lose out on that money until that money stops coming in. I'm not saying it won't happen, I'm saying that it's a dumb business move. I think you're not listening to this point.

Right now the iphone is being beaten by blackberry (you can quote me on that.) I know a lot of people who just bought blackberry's cause they could get them so much cheaper than an iphone, and couldn't make sense of paying a few hundred more since they already had ipods. Apple branding and great features make for an automatic top selling product. Those two things alongside a very reasonable price result in a product that owns the market.

Again, this is an AT&T call. It makes no difference to them as long as both are selling. I'm sure they're rather sell the iPhone over the Blackberry though, as they're not paying that extra subsidy. The iPhone is perfect for cell companies actually. There's no subsidy but there's still a contract lock-in, plus you're required to keep the data-plan.

You did hit one thing straight on the head, though. Apple products make for a top selling product. You only left out that they also command a high price, that people are willing to pay. The only reason they need to drop the price is when the iPhone ceases to sell or the stock is too high and selling at a low rate. Then they might wish to branch out to target the lower demographic.

Also, understand that AT&T subsidizing the iphone is a minimal loss, that enables them to make tons more money in the future. The monthly plans are huge moneymakers for the cell companies. The iphone very well may be selling "enough" units. AT&T and Apple are not interested in the iphone just selling "enough." They want the iphone to hijack individuals from all of their other carriers to jump on the the opportunity to have the newest coolest gadget. AT&T would be more than interesting in subsidizing the iphone, in order to move more people to AT&T.

The monthly plans are huge moneymakers. This is true as it's their primary source of income. As far as contracts go, I'm sure if someone conducted a study they'd find that people generally stick with their carriers even when out of contract. It's familiar and people like to stick with familiarity. Besides, it's a pain in the ass to deal with switching over to another company, even with number portability. I've been with AT&T for about ten years and I've only had four phones thus far. I know people exist that change carriers, but I don't think it's as big of a problem as these cell phone companies think.

If you can make money without spending money, you should take that route until it stops being feasible. Otherwise, you made a stupid decision. Now, for Apple, that makes sense because their goal is not only to sell units, but to also have the most popular unit. They're competing against other phone manufacturers. AT&T is competing against other telecoms. If you want a Blackberry you can get it from AT&T, if you want an iPhone you can get it from AT&T. To them it doesn't matter. They need to only worry about their phone plans.

The only way I can see AT&T subsidizing the iPhone is if Apple pressures them to do it. That might happen. And AT&T might refuse.

zync

Jun 8, 2008, 03:43 AM

Springer23

Jun 8, 2008, 03:50 AM

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 03:58 AM

The iPhone is solely an Apple product, that's why I don't seem to understand that it isn't. Apple sells them to AT&T and gets a cut of the contract in addition. End of story. Original iPhone owners who want a new phone will have to do what any other AT&T customer has to do to get a new phone. You don't seem to understand that AT&T is in the business of making money. Any way they can nickel and dime you they will. If they can sell you a phone at $400 they will until they can't push them anymore.

Understand that that is Apple's stated goal, not AT&Ts. AT&T doesn't care how many are sold in a year, as long as they're moving the stock. Considering that the first shipment is rumored to be 3 million units they will surely sell them all out, even at $400 each—regardless of Apple's goal.

Average consumers just got a $600 check they didn't count on. Some people will hoard it—most actually—while some will spend it. I probably could afford it without the check—not that I'm making gobs of money after finishing college, buying a house, getting married, and keeping up with my car payment and bills.

There are people still willing to spend that money and I reiterate that it would be stupid for AT&T to subsidize the phone and lose out on that money until that money stops coming in. I'm not saying it won't happen, I'm saying that it's a dumb business move. I think you're not listening to this point.

Again, this is an AT&T call. It makes no difference to them as long as both are selling. I'm sure they're rather sell the iPhone over the Blackberry though, as they're not paying that extra subsidy. The iPhone is perfect for cell companies actually. There's no subsidy but there's still a contract lock-in, plus you're required to keep the data-plan.

You did hit one thing straight on the head, though. Apple products make for a top selling product. You only left out that they also command a high price, that people are willing to pay. The only reason they need to drop the price is when the iPhone ceases to sell or the stock is too high and selling at a low rate. Then they might wish to branch out to target the lower demographic.

The monthly plans are huge moneymakers. This is true as it's their primary source of income. As far as contracts go, I'm sure if someone conducted a study they'd find that people generally stick with their carriers even when out of contract. It's familiar and people like to stick with familiarity. Besides, it's a pain in the ass to deal with switching over to another company, even with number portability. I've been with AT&T for about ten years and I've only had four phones thus far. I know people exist that change carriers, but I don't think it's as big of a problem as these cell phone companies think.

If you can make money without spending money, you should take that route until it stops being feasible. Otherwise, you made a stupid decision. Now, for Apple, that makes sense because their goal is not only to sell units, but to also have the most popular unit. They're competing against other phone manufacturers. AT&T is competing against other telecoms. If you want a Blackberry you can get it from AT&T, if you want an iPhone you can get it from AT&T. To them it doesn't matter. They need to only worry about their phone plans.

The only way I can see AT&T subsidizing the iPhone is if Apple pressures them to do it. That might happen. And AT&T might refuse.

You make some good points that I do "somewhat" agree with. A point that I want to make though, is that AT&T wants to use the Iphone as a reason for people to switch. You make an excellent point of noting that people tend to get comfortable with their carriers, and usually don't switch. The reality today is that all the major carriers have similar comparable phones, so to switch for a phone makes little sense. This is completely different though, since the Iphone came into play. Apple's brand is huge right now, and AT&T wants to use it to get customers. If the iphone wasn't great for AT&T, then apple wouldn't be able to milk AT&T for so much revenue.

While being the only carrier in the U.S. to host the iphone is reason enough for people to switch over, I think a subsidy would be wise, because it makes it all the more convincing for people to switch. 200$ off the price of a product is big to some people. You mention that AT&T needn't waste money because the iphone is not their problem. THe iphone is their problem, because it is one of the huge things that sets them apart from the other companies. Also, for all the people that subsidy brings in, is a hunk load of additional revenue, and loads of new customers who will likely get "comfortable" with AT&T, and be unlikely to leave. AT&T is looking to get more people locked into contracts. The AT&T exclusive iphone is a good way to get that done.

EDIT: Furthermore I want to complement you Zync, on making some great points. I agree that extra money being spent by a company is unnecessary. Personally, I just think a subsidy that will heavily increase the amount of subscribers for AT&T is wise for them.

PodHead

Jun 8, 2008, 04:00 AM

I understand that, but I mean in the states. From what I read, AT&T are just now getting their 3g network up, nobody else has it here in the US? If thats true, then what is fueling all the hype about unlocked 3g iPhones in the US? :confused:

I agree %1,000. The keyword that a lot of people are over looking and focused on at the same time is UNLOCKED. Of course we know better but the average consumer doesn't. They see UNLOCKED and 3G and they "heard" that's better. End of story, that's all they need to know.

zync

Jun 8, 2008, 04:09 AM

You make some good points that I do "somewhat" agree with. A point that I want to make though, is that AT&T wants to use the Iphone as a reason for people to switch. You make an excellent point of noting that people tend to get comfortable with their carriers, and usually don't switch. The reality today is that all the major carriers have similar comparable phones, so to switch for a phone makes little sense. This is completely different though, since the Iphone came into play. Apple's brand is huge right now, and AT&T wants to use it to get customers. If the iphone wasn't great for AT&T, then apple wouldn't be able to milk AT&T for so much revenue.

While being the only carrier in the U.S. to host the iphone is reason enough for people to switch over, I think a subsidy would be wise, because it makes it all the more convincing for people to switch. 200$ off the price of a product is big to some people. You mention that AT&T needn't waste money because the iphone is not their problem. THe iphone is their problem, because it is one of the huge things that sets them apart from the other companies. Also, for all the people that subsidy brings in, is a hunk load of additional revenue, and loads of new customers who will likely get "comfortable" with AT&T, and be unlikely to leave. AT&T is looking to get more people locked into contracts. The AT&T exclusive iphone is a good way to get that done.

EDIT: Furthermore I want to complement you Zync, on making some great points. I agree that extra money being spent by a company is unnecessary. Personally, I just think a subsidy that will heavily increase the amount of subscribers for AT&T is wise for them.

On this we agree. I think it is wise for AT&T to attract customers with a subsidy and I agree that it would work. It would probably be huge. I just think that they need to keep the price the same right now while the demand is high and the supply may be low. Once Apple bridges the gap with the supply, they could drop the price to get quick—well, guranteed long-term—money.

Good points made on your side as well. I think we're in accord and I hope I didn't offend. Sometimes I'm a little abrasive in my arguments.

Of course, it would still piss me off if they did subsidize it right away as I'm not eligible for the subsidy! :D

sananda

Jun 8, 2008, 04:19 AM

News reporters reporting free upgrade and possible pay as you go on o2

http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2008/06/05/payg-apple-3g-iphone-plus-free-upgrade-for-existing-customers-game-on-o2/

http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/news/index.cfm?newsid=13305

http://techdigest.tv/2008/06/rumour_o2_gets.html

This is being reported all over the uk phone sites!!!!!

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=494122

know-it-all5

Jun 8, 2008, 04:22 AM

On this we agree. I think it is wise for AT&T to attract customers with a subsidy and I agree that it would work. It would probably be huge. I just think that they need to keep the price the same right now while the demand is high and the supply may be low. Once Apple bridges the gap with the supply, they could drop the price to get quick—well, guranteed long-term—money.

Good points made on your side as well. I think we're in accord.

Of course, it would still piss me off if they did subsidize it right away as I'm not eligible for the subsidy! :D

There is some truth to that point. The rules of supply and demand are very real, and if the price gets lower when supply is already lower, then that would leave a lot of people waiting, and disappointed. The reality is that apple hasn't had iphones available on their site for about a month. This could be cause of lack of supply, or cause they don't want any bummed customers. The reality is, i am sure they have learned their lesson, and will have plenty of supply available when iphone 3g arrives. The priority to apple and at&t though, is to get as big of a wave of people to get it immediately as possible. a products biggest sales (especially in apple case) tend to be just after they come out (minus holidays). If a subsidy is able to send a larger number of people over to AT&T in the first days of the new iphone, then i feel like everybody wins. The bottom line is, a ton of people bought the first iphone at full price. I feel like after a year, the time has come for the iphone to be subsidized. Turn the iphone from being common, to standard. Get it in everyones pocket.

GoodWatch

Jun 8, 2008, 04:22 AM

Yeah, yeah, yeah, but still no sign, no syllable as to when the Iphone will land in my country :confused: When hell freezes over perhaps?

Chundles

Jun 8, 2008, 04:24 AM

Yeah, yeah, yeah, but still no sign, no syllable as to when the Iphone will land in my country :confused: When hell freezes over perhaps?

The Netherlands has been announced.

GoodWatch

Jun 8, 2008, 04:29 AM

The Netherlands has been announced.

When? Where? What operator? :confused:

Chundles

Jun 8, 2008, 04:37 AM

When? Where? What operator? :confused:

S*it - sorry mate, I could have sworn I saw and announcement for the Netherlands at the same time that Scandinavia and the Baltic states was announced.

I'll keep searching.

GoodWatch

Jun 8, 2008, 04:43 AM

S*it - sorry mate, I could have sworn I saw and announcement for the Netherlands at the same time that Scandinavia and the Baltic states was announced.

I'll keep searching.

There have been rumours floating around since last September. But without an EDGE network, there's not much use for all but the basic functions. Most, if not all, carriers have switched to UMTS or HSPDA by now.

surferfromuk

Jun 8, 2008, 05:00 AM

For those confused about the subsidy...

This basically means Apple will sell about 10 Million Iphones to the Telco's in 2008 ( yep, you better believe this phone is going to be HARD to get hold off in the next few months if this is true!) and about 30 million in 2009. The telco's will pay Apple for the phones now knowing after the 'sell out price drop' of May, that they can sell as many as they can get hold of...

They'll still sell 40 million iPods putting Apple's tech into the hands of another 100 million people by the end of 2009.

10% of those will at some point, so impressed with their iPhone/Touch, buy a Mac - equating to 10 Million NEW Mac sales on top of the current 10 Million...this will significantly propel Mac sales forwards for some time...

All of this doesn't even take into account that there will be both a larger and a smaller Touch device as well...

End Result :

Apple Wins - Apple BOOMS!

TonyHoyle

Jun 8, 2008, 05:00 AM

News reporters reporting free upgrade and possible pay as you go on o2

http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2008/06/05/payg-apple-3g-iphone-plus-free-upgrade-for-existing-customers-game-on-o2/

http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/news/index.cfm?newsid=13305

http://techdigest.tv/2008/06/rumour_o2_gets.html

This is being reported all over the uk phone sites!!!!!

All 3 of those quote their source as macworld. That's an old rumour that hasn't been confirmed or denied. It's certainly possible - it's in line with the costs of other phones - but until O2 confirm it it's still a rumour.

vaprof

Jun 8, 2008, 05:56 AM

moveteam

Jun 8, 2008, 05:57 AM

There have been rumours floating around since last September. But without an EDGE network, there's not much use for all but the basic functions. Most, if not all, carriers have switched to UMTS or HSPDA by now.
It's gonna be the 3G iPhone ;)

I find it ironic that the carrier who got the deal in Scandinavia (in this case Denmark), is the only carrier with EDGE (plus a crap HSPDA network) which has to sell the iPhone. It would be so much better with 3 or TDC/Vodafone.

moveteam

Jun 8, 2008, 06:00 AM

So... if I buy an iPhone at the Apple Store for $399, will it be unlocked? Or do I have to sign up for AT&T if I want to use the phone capabilities? I spend a lot of time overseas (half in USA, half in DE) and would really not be wedded to an AT&T contract (or their roaming charges in Europe).
No I understand it this way:

You go to the Apple Store, buy the phone for $399 or $499. To get your $200 rebate you have to activate the iPhone through iTunes. The iPhone itself is probably still locked to AT&T, but just unlock it with the pwn-method to use it.

swagi

Jun 8, 2008, 06:06 AM

Sheeesh...

read through 9 pages and just want to say:

Could the cry-baby early adopters please shut up? You received a nice product, had it for a year now. You also got money back after really ridiculous crying!

Now it seems to me, that you feel betrayed, Apple will not offer you a FREE 3G iPhone?

You knew that the iPhone will see an update in the next 24 months. You knew that well before you signed this AT&T contract. You also knew, that technology cheapens every day. Now do me a favor

Stop that ridiculous whining! You won't get any special treatment! Get over it!

And NO, APPLE HAS NOT FOOLED YOU TO BUY A STUPID REV A PRODUCT! (sorry for the caps, it had to be said)

BOT: Sure it will be subsidized. And it's perfectly logical, that AT&T credit will be the form of subsidy. Any other decision would be plain stupid. iPhone makes money on the monthly plan. Just like any other mobile.

If the iPhone wasn't sold in the Apple Store, there would be no discussion. You'd only see the discounted price in AT&T stores.

BongoBanger

Jun 8, 2008, 06:14 AM

Sheeesh...

read through 9 pages and just want to say:

Could the cry-baby early adopters please shut up? You received a nice product, had it for a year now. You also got money back after really ridiculous crying!

QFT.

If you want to get the latest and greatest then you pay a premium. In the meantime the world moves on and unless you cough up more cash you get left behind. That's just the way it works.

Chupa Chupa

Jun 8, 2008, 06:38 AM

Why would Apple bow to the pressure of the phone companies if the iPhone is
selling so well and has been a hit. I would think that with the success of the iPhone Apple could be calling the shots.

Dont get me wrong though I would be very happy with a $200 subsidy, happy to sign a new 2 year contract.

It has nothing to do with the success of the the iPhone, and everything about how much revenue the CellCos can make with it.i.e., is is profitable enough to even bother carrying. Apple needs the CellCos, so it has to bend if it wants them to carry it.

Generally CelCos. don't want to fork over $ to Apple each month. Apple's
original concept was this:

Sell the phone @ full boat direct to the public
CellCo. will not have to outlay any $ for new customers but will have to give Apple a % of revenue generated by the phone's use.

As we've seen, the problem with this is that people buy the phone and then don't sign up with the "official" carrier. They unlock the phone and stick in a SIM from another company. The "official" CellCo doesn't get any revenue b/c they didn't get a customer.

So in order to incentivize customers to sign up they go back to the "subsidy" model. Customer pays Apple full price, and if they go with the "official" carrier the carrier will give them back $X. Apple's cut of the revenue is then reduced by this amount or maybe even more. This also gets the initial cost of the phone low enough to entice customers put of by a $400 phone. More people that buy in, more revenue for the cellcos (and maybe Apple too).

sr5878

Jun 8, 2008, 06:38 AM

I'm eligible and I sold my rev a iPhone for more than I paid.... now time to sit back and enjoy the keynote.... :)

Twinnie

Jun 8, 2008, 06:39 AM

Amen to that. I just want to commend you on the best post ive seen all day. The bottom line is, the iphone shouldn't be a luxury, it should be something all can enjoy. Imagine if all your friends had iphones. Imagine live video-chatting with all your friends over your iphone (rumored to be a feature in the 3g). It would be amazing.

I wouldn't get all excited about video-calling, it's not that great at all. It's been out in Japan for a long time and personally I've had it myself for over two years (here in England) and I think I've used it two or three times as a novelty, it's just more trouble than it's worth. When you make a voice call you can talk to them and sit there doing something else with your hands but if you make a video call you have to sit there looking at the phone, staring at somebody moving there lips who would probably rather be doing something else other than staring at you. It might be handy for a girlfriend or something but then she needs to have a video phone as well, not to mention that a lot of plans include specific video and voice minutes so you won't get as many.

sr5878

Jun 8, 2008, 06:41 AM

snip
So in order to incentivize customers to sign up they go back to the "subsidy" model. Customer pays Apple full price, and if they go with the "official" carrier the carrier will give them back $X. Apple's cut of the revenue is then reduced by this amount or maybe even more. This also gets the initial cost of the phone low enough to entice customers put of by a $400 phone. More people that buy in, more revenue for the cellcos (and maybe Apple too).

I hadn't thought of the whole jailbreaking and unlocking thing, and I think you might have figured out exactly why AT&T would be inclined to subsidize the phone.

They make their money from selling the plans, not the phone. If everyone buys the phone but uses TMO or sends it back overseas, AT&T loses.

You get a gold star, sir. Brilliant.

chickenninja

Jun 8, 2008, 06:46 AM

ya know this is kinda nice, lets me save me money in the short term, maybe even long term. i just hope that the money they put asside they use to buy me a pony one day. i dont care if you can "hear me now" or even if you can hear me "all round the world" cause im ridin pony!
cant wait for monday, from steve im hoping to get a unicorn. if i do il post pics of the glitter it leaves around the house.

n8236

Jun 8, 2008, 06:48 AM

Com'on guys, i'm sure it's the first time you bought cell phones.

Existing users ALWAYS get the short end of the stick because if you're doing any type upgrade u gotta pay the full or premium price. There's a reason why people keep switching carriers to get the deepest discounts.

The reason why new customers get the subsidies is because they are NEW and new contracts generate all types of commission for them.

I want the iPhone 2.0, but if i had to guess, the new subsidized will NOT be given to existing customers UNLESS they renew their contracts. So I would assume for those who want the new iPhone, but don't want to renew, it was cost an arm and a leg.

Saladinos

Jun 8, 2008, 06:52 AM

Yes the iphone is selling well. But it is still losing. The iphone is supposed to sell 10 million units in America in 2008. It has only sold 1/5 of that. It is still in high demand, however it would be higher at a lower price point. You may have 400 bucks (or more) to get an iphone, but average consumers don't. The iphone can sell 3 times as much as its selling now, if the price is lowered.

Was the target 10M in the USA alone? I doubt it. Jobs said 1B phones sold last year, and they wanted 1%. That's where the 10M target comes from, and is hence a worldwide target (unless every single person in the USA bought 3-4 phones last year).

OllyW

Jun 8, 2008, 06:54 AM

Why would Apple bow to the pressure of the phone companies if the iPhone is selling so well and has been a hit.

The iPhone has sold really well in the USA but hasn't been very successful in Europe, where phones are subsidised by varying amounts, depending on the monthly contract.

In the UK, on similar monthly rates to O2's iPhone plans (£35 plus) nearly all other competing phones would be free if signing up to an 18 month contract. If O2 are allowed to subsidise the iPhone the sales should really take off, as shown when they reduced the price by £100 to clear out old stock a few weeks ago.

If the subsidy is in the form of a rebate it will encourage more people to sign up for the contract and not unlock them to use on other phone networks.

Sweetbike40

Jun 8, 2008, 06:56 AM

why would you need an ipod nano when you have an iphone? lol

iPod Nano is better in the gym AND in the car. The touch screen is terrible in those situations. Dangerous actually. With the Nano, i don't even have to look at it and it's tiny.

sr5878

Jun 8, 2008, 07:00 AM

Saladinos

Jun 8, 2008, 07:06 AM

iPod Nano is better in the gym AND in the car. The touch screen is terrible in those situations. Dangerous actually. With the Nano, i don't even have to look at it and it's tiny.

The iPhone headphone have a play/pause button, and if you double-tap the home button, you can get iPod controls, even when the device is locked. Then push the top-right of the screen from inside your pocket for next song.

You can also use the volume controls when it's locked.

kornyboy

Jun 8, 2008, 07:10 AM

Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

I like it and hope they do it for existing iPhone users as well. This would let me get a new iPhone a little quicker.

sr5878

Jun 8, 2008, 07:11 AM

i disagree. i wouldn't buy a nano specifically for the car, but i would definitely prefer the tactile buttons while driving. i have a griffin itouch controller hooked up to my phone in my car so that i have the 'clickwheel' controls available while driving.

Dagless

Jun 8, 2008, 08:00 AM

I find it HYSTERICAL that idiots are asking/want a rebate for a one year old cell phone. Have you lost your mind? Get a grip on reality. You should be thankful you got a $100 rebate last year when you CHOSE to get a new electronic gadget.

Incredible isn't it? I bought my iMac 2 years ago for £700, why won't Apple give me a discount on a new iMac?
That kind of logic doesn't work and is only carried along by some people with entitlement issues. Nobody is owed a new phone, nobody is owed a discount on a new one simply because they bought an older phone from a year ago.

BongoBanger

Jun 8, 2008, 08:14 AM

Subsidised mobile phones are common place in the UK mobile phone market. Most often then not, you can pick up the latest mobile phone handset free with a certain contract. There are some phones, though, that you do have to pay a certain amount for (smartphones, etc.) but nothing as high as £269.

It's worth pointing out that the handsets are subsidised by the carriers, not the handset manufacturers. In the case of the iPhone it'll be O2 (in the UK) that determines the level of subsidy. For this reason I think that you will only get the rebate after activation on their network so if you buy it to unlock it you won't get any money back at all.

Chupa Chupa

Jun 8, 2008, 08:33 AM

I want the iPhone 2.0, but if i had to guess, the new subsidized will NOT be given to existing customers UNLESS they renew their contracts. So I would assume for those who want the new iPhone, but don't want to renew, it was cost an arm and a leg.

Well, it will cost regular price which is the current price of an iPhone today. I'm not sure that is an "arm and a leg." Besides if you are short $ you can always unlock your 1st gen iPhone and sell on eBay for $400 and use that to buy a new Gen 2 phone.

elcid

Jun 8, 2008, 08:35 AM

I am really interested in how they pull off selling at the apple store while getting the rebate.

zombiedictator

Jun 8, 2008, 08:55 AM

Incredible isn't it? I bought my iMac 2 years ago for £700, why won't Apple give me a discount on a new iMac?
That kind of logic doesn't work and is only carried along by some people with entitlement issues. Nobody is owed a new phone, nobody is owed a discount on a new one simply because they bought an older phone from a year ago.

Stop making false analogies.

No other industry that I know of gives you a discount for locking you into a contract except the cell phone industry. People don't feel entitled to a subsidy in this situation; they're just saying if there is one they shouldn't be penalized for being early adopters, which are Apple's best customers. If Apple is willing to subsidize, but they tell me I have to wait 6 months, that doesn't change the fact that I'm eligible for a subsidy, just not right now. We're not asking for something they aren't willing to give, we're just asking for it now instead of having to wait for some arbitrary deadline which never should have been set in the first place since we never got a discount on the first phone.

Before the iPhone, anytime you signed a new contract, whether it's being a new customer, switching providers, or just renewing, you got a discount on your new phone. The only exception to this rule was the iPhone. So if discount = locked contract and we never got a discount, doesn't that mean that if we want a discount now they should be able to give it to us as long as we sign a locked contract? Yes.

thaitillidie

Jun 8, 2008, 09:20 AM

Question: when's the last time you saw an "on sale" sign in an Apple store or on their website?

Apple doesn't do the rebate or discount thing. They don't do it now. They haven't done it in the past. And they never will! They don't need to. So this idea of AT&T offering them is absurd! Apple's an elite brand whether you want to admit it or not. They design premium products -- in form and function -- that command premium prices. That's what elite brands do -- duh! And that's the way it needs to stay!!!

Have sales of the v.1 iphone -- or ANY Apple product for that matter -- stalled? I'm no Apple historian but I don't think so! So why would you lower the price on a newer product with newer technology when the earlier version of that same product was selling like hotcakes in the first place?? And I don't think anybody who truly appreciates the virtues of top-of-the-line technology would have an issue paying a premium price to play.

Even though it lacks certain key features that should be there, anybody with the v.1 iphone right now knows that it still has that "special something" that you can't quite put your finger on (no pun intended) that no other phone has -- not even those "iphony" clones that are starting to flood the market.

So why shouldn't we be willing to pay $599 or even $699 for what it SURE to be THE ultimate must-have gadget?! And I don't think Apple is gonna screw us like it did the first time around by omitting key features that should be expected from a 2nd gen iphone. Matter o' fact I think there's gonna be at least 1 new feature that hasn't been discussed that's gonna blow everybody away!

Or at least there had better be at least 1 new feature that hasn't been discussed that's gonna blow everybody away lol!

So stop all the crying about discounts and rebates and subsidies! If you want the coolest phone on the planet, let's all show Apple our appreciation by paying out of our yahoos for it!!

jsgreen

Jun 8, 2008, 09:22 AM

...No other industry that I know of gives you a discount for locking you into a contract except the cell phone industry.

Most subscription-based products give discounts for long-term contracts. I sell contact center operational software that costs millions of dollars to big corporations and as a matter of course offer discounts according to how many years my clients committ to a contract.

Heck, even magazine subscriptions offer discounts for longer contracts.

sananda

Jun 8, 2008, 09:33 AM

Apple doesn't do the rebate or discount thing.

i got a £100 rebate when i bought my ibook and ipod with the higher education discount; it seems to happen every year.

Have sales of the v.1 iphone -- or ANY Apple product for that matter -- stalled?

i think there were lower than anticipated sales of iphones in the uk. there had to be a sale to move the unsold stock. but they flew out of the door with the £100 discount.

arkitect

Jun 8, 2008, 09:34 AM

Before the iPhone, anytime you signed a new contract, whether it's being a new customer, switching providers, or just renewing, you got a discount on your new phone. The only exception to this rule was the iPhone. So if discount = locked contract and we never got a discount, doesn't that mean that if we want a discount now they should be able to give it to us as long as we sign a locked contract? Yes.

Exactly.
I have no problems about signing a new 18 month contract with O2 — if that means a discount on the new iPhone…

bmh16

Jun 8, 2008, 09:50 AM

iPod Nano is better in the gym AND in the car. The touch screen is terrible in those situations. Dangerous actually. With the Nano, i don't even have to look at it and it's tiny.

Applications will be released to make an iPhone better than an iPod at changing songs etc. I should think. I have an app on my jailbroken iPod Touch called Pocket Touch, look it up, it's quality, and i wouldn't be surprised if it could be improved on even more by integrating it into the actual iPod on the iPhone!

beeh

Jun 8, 2008, 10:00 AM

If the rumors are true and you get 5Mp camera, true GPS, plus a 16GB iPhone! for $400, that's an awesome deal...no subsidy needed in my opinion.

Padraig

Jun 8, 2008, 10:32 AM

If the rumors are true and you get 5Mp camera, true GPS, plus a 16GB iPhone! for $400, that's an awesome deal...no subsidy needed in my opinion.

If Apple could deliver the phone, unlocked, at that price (or even 400-500 euro) they would have an enormous hit on their hands. I've always maintained that the current model is very cheap for what you get, the tariffs are what's killing it.

Twinnie

Jun 8, 2008, 10:43 AM

If Apple could deliver the phone, unlocked, at that price (or even 400-500 euro) they would have an enormous hit on their hands. I've always maintained that the current model is very cheap for what you get, the tariffs are what's killing it.

Yeah, I agree with that. Here in the UK I can get a tariff with all the same stuff as the iPhone minus the visual voicemail for £10 less per month, and get the phone subsidized as well, on a one year contract. That's what bothers me the most, the two year contract. Signing up for an expensive contract is difficult to stomach for me, but at least I can just pay off the contract normally and be done with it. With a two year contract that's twice as much to pay and mobile phone technology moves pretty quickly and will go a long way in two years. I have a phone that's around 20 months old and it's very old compared to what I see in the shops now.

nep61

Jun 8, 2008, 11:00 AM

What AT&T does is issue an expiring AT&T branded debit card with the VISA logo. It is supposed to work something like the Starbucks or any other gift card, only it can be used anywhere.

I was issued one for another phone purchase. However, have never been able to get through to activate it. A URL is provided for on-line activation, so I did it there. But when I went to use the card at a restaurant, it was declined. :(

I got a $50 Rebate (AT&T card with a VISA Logo) when I updated a previous phone... tried to use it after activation, merchant said it "wouldn't go through."

Next time I tried, it worked just fine... :D

One suggestion to all out there who eventually get these Rebate cards... (if that's how this plays out, come Monday:cool:) ) Either use the amount all at once , or use it in even amount increments...
The biggest catch with these cards is the "leftover change" that remains on the card after you use them to pay for something...

You know how difficult it can be to spend that last $3.82 on the card? Especially if you haven't kept track of the balance... Most people will get lazy and forget about the "Small Change" and that's ALSO what AT&T hopes will happen...

Merchants like you to use one form of payment on purchases... Just a "heads-up"....

Can't wait for Monday... !!!!!!!!!!:apple::apple::apple: