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MacRumors
Dec 23, 2003, 09:26 PM
BBC News (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3344595.stm) reports that the iPod is "flying off shop shelves" with demand clearly outstripping supply.

Some British shops have been left to take post-Christmas sales despite Apple "doing all it could to increase production".

This echos consumer and retailer experiences in the United States with many locations selling out of the popular Apple peripheral. An AdAge article (pay content) (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/12/20031222220838.shtml) had previously noted that Apple executives had predicted that they would sell out its iPod inventory this holiday season, suggesting that Apple was unable to further ramp up production.

arn
Dec 23, 2003, 09:26 PM
Is the iPod the in-demand holiday gift this season?

I haven't been in the market for one ... others have trouble finding one?

arn

Head Wound
Dec 23, 2003, 09:29 PM
Maybe they are spending all there extra production time on new iPods? :D

zulgand04
Dec 23, 2003, 09:31 PM
Hey thats awsome there selling like crazy but not so good they cant meet demand.

-Neal

alset
Dec 23, 2003, 09:33 PM
Wes (a member of this site) told me that the iPod was the hottest XMas gift in the UK (his locale). That was about a week ago, so I guess it's true.

Dan

sonofslim
Dec 23, 2003, 09:34 PM
well, i've been shopping for iPod accessories and i've been to a lot of stores have run out of carrying cases and other stuff. so if that's any indication of iPod demand, then i'd say it's pretty high...

Stella
Dec 23, 2003, 09:37 PM
Excellent the iPod is doing well, shame Apple couldn't keep up with demand.

My brother will get a mp3 player, as will my step Dad for christmas, but not iPods, too expensive. Shame Apple couldn't have released cheaper iPods sooner... but if they do next month, better late than never.

With the iPod doing so well... how long will it take before online Music Stores stop using WMA crap and use AAC? I remember one of them saying.. "when AAC is more popular, then we will revise our decisions".. when is popular, popular - Apple already have the largest market share of MP3 players.. will 50, 60% be enough for them.

I'm sure they could negioate with Apple about using the Fairplay DRM... Apple should realize, the more Music Stores that support AAC, the more iPods sold - people won't have to rely on iTMS as their single source.

OK, the iTMS is only there is sell iPods, but so could other music stores.. This is a very real weakness of iPod and Music Store - only one Music Store is compatible, and not everyone likes iTunes... so they don't have any alternatives.

Macette
Dec 23, 2003, 09:37 PM
i didn't have any trouble getting one a week ago for my brother, but i wouldn't want to be trying in the centre of any major (australian) city today. some of the suburban places still have a few though.

Grimace
Dec 23, 2003, 09:41 PM
Well, this would make sense for a space bump at MWSF.

15GB $299
30GB $399
50GB $499

2GB $99
4GB $149

pivo6
Dec 23, 2003, 09:41 PM
I was going to try and buy myself one for Christmas, but thought I might wait out MWSF. Now it looks like I couldn't get one if I tried.

if the rumors are true for newer iPods, I hope that Apple can supply them in sufficient numbers.

kb9000
Dec 23, 2003, 09:43 PM
Not too surprising, I suppose...

Many of my [PC using] friends want an iPod for themselves, when in the past those sort would scoff at mine.

They still think that simply using iTunes for their existing music will cost them money per song_ :confused:

j33pd0g
Dec 23, 2003, 09:45 PM
I had typed some long winded paragraph about Apple executives, but decided not to go with it. I'll just say congratulations Apple. They're getting their product and name out there. The iPod is holding it's own against flimsy competition.

warcraftmaster
Dec 23, 2003, 09:48 PM
"Apple's digital jukebox" i hate how that sounds , its sound like delll or some other crap player that are out there
it should be called iPod and that is it.
not a d*mm "digital jukebox" the iPod does so much it should be only call a iPod



just my 2 cent:)

dongmin
Dec 23, 2003, 10:00 PM
So I guess the next questions is What will Apple do to keep the iPod current for next year's Xmas?

With the advertising blitz and the publicity generated by the iTMS, Apple was successful in keeping the iPod at the front of the public's consiousness. I'm curious about what new amazing feature (music videos? album art? wireless, anywhere iTMS?) will make the iPod next Xmas' must-have gadget. Any guesses?

Macmaniac
Dec 23, 2003, 10:03 PM
Well this is good news/ bad news/ Its good to see that iPods are flying off the shelves, however its a shame that Apple did not have enough in production to meet demand. Hopefully demand will be high next year as well. 2 Million here we come.

Gymnut
Dec 23, 2003, 10:08 PM
The Dell DJ must be looking pretty lonely on those store shelves.

Grimace
Dec 23, 2003, 10:08 PM
The Apple Store still seems to have a healthy supply.

The 10GB and 40GB models have 1-2 day ship times. The 20GB model has a 1-3 day ship time.

Time to clear out the stock for the upgraded models!!!

pbooktebo
Dec 23, 2003, 10:20 PM
I was in the Palo Alto Apple Store yesterday, and a clerk told me that they were out of 10 and 20 GB models, and that some people were upgrading to 40 GB models.

She said that she had heard that 3rd party places were also out.

Of course, even with the tech slump, Palo Alto is a bit richer than many areas. However, I'm impressed that they're selling so well. It's also nice that they had inventory until 1-2 days before Christmas, as I expect they met most of the holiday demand.

Go Apple!

Ktulu
Dec 23, 2003, 10:28 PM
Originally posted by Gymnut
The Dell DJ must be looking pretty lonely on those store shelves.

Speaking of the Dell DJ, does anyone know what kind of sales its' been getting around the country/world. As much as I would love to see it happen, I'm sure the iPod is not the only player selling this holiday season.

TomSmithMacEd
Dec 23, 2003, 10:28 PM
Originally posted by Gymnut
The Dell DJ must be looking pretty lonely on those store shelves.

If they even sold those in stores. I would just feel ashmed if I got a Dell DJ for christmas. Sort of like I'm not good enough to get the best, I have to just try to be. And as far as I know you can still buy the iPOd's at the local best Buy and they had some at the Minneapolis store... I think it is more of a problem in UK.

~Shard~
Dec 23, 2003, 10:30 PM
Wow, this is excellent for Apple! Sure, it's a problem if they've ran out and can't meet consumer demand, but it's a good kind of problem!

Good strategy too - Apple sells out of iPods for Christmas, then come MWSF, releases the new iPods/mini-iPods or whatever at lower prices. And then more people will start buying them!

Well, this definitely proves that Apple isn't losing money or made a mistake by not releasing the rumored mini-iPods before Christmas - the current ones are selling amazingly on their own!

crees!
Dec 23, 2003, 10:38 PM
Originally posted by kb9000
Many of my [PC using] friends want an iPod for themselves, when in the past those sort would scoff at mine.

They still think that simply using iTunes for their existing music will cost them money per song_ :confused:

You seriously need to talk to your friends. I had to do the same with mine as well. They don't care too much to look into all the details and they need someone like you and me to straighten them out.

Essefgy
Dec 23, 2003, 10:40 PM
Maybe individual stores are out of stock, but Apple isn't. I ordered one last night from the online store (20GB) and have already gotten confirmation it's been shipped.

Sounds like the media are trying to scare people again. Tomorrow's story will be that radiation from the iPod might cause brain damage.

elgruga
Dec 23, 2003, 10:47 PM
All best selling stuff sells out at christmas - its great to see Apple in this position.

Apple have a serious chance at becoming a major music industry player, possibly even a major label, because the old rules are gone, and he who controls the download, controls all of the business.

The new low-price iPod (if true) will be the big move.

CD's and all that record business crap is shakier by the minute.

Most artists HATE their record companies, (I used to work in the biz), and would love to get their product out direct to the fans.

Next? The film biz. Buy a DVD? Why, when you can d/l it.......

I just want Apple to be successful so they will always make a cool laptop for me.

And did I hear of a powerbook G5 soon?!!!!!!

~Shard~
Dec 23, 2003, 10:47 PM
Originally posted by Essefgy
Tomorrow's story will be that radiation from the iPod might cause brain damage.

It does?!?! OH DEAR GOD!!!
<jumps out nearby window>
<continues to listen to iPod en route to the hospital because it's just so damn cool>

iMeowbot
Dec 23, 2003, 10:48 PM
Originally posted by zulgand04
Hey thats awsome there selling like crazy but not so good they cant meet demand.

They haven't been impossible to find, just difficult, especially the smaller capacity models. A tight supply could well be a marketing decision rather than a reflection of manufacturing ability; that kind of ploy works out pretty well when a product becomes a status symbol, and it also makes sense to clear the lower models out of the channel if there is a new low end iPodlet in the works.

ViRGE
Dec 23, 2003, 10:49 PM
Unfortunately for Apple, I don't think it's anything on Apple's end that's the problem as much as it is for one of their suppliers. Remember: Apple basically consumed 2 years of the world's production of 1.8" HDs on iPods. If there is a shortage, it's likely because Toshiba(or whoever has been the supplier) can not come up with more drives in time, and QC reasons would likely keep Apple from switching to Hitachi or something. A sell-out is always great, but this is perhaps the worst kind of sell-out: component based instead of final production based.

Potus
Dec 23, 2003, 10:51 PM
I tried to buy th 10G iPod at an Apple store today: they were out. So I ended up ordering a refurbed 10 G (old style) from Small Dog. I'm actually glad I did that as I find the new buttons more difficult to use. Plus I'm saving $130.00.

stingerman
Dec 23, 2003, 10:52 PM
Originally posted by Essefgy
Maybe individual stores are out of stock, but Apple isn't. I ordered one last night from the online store (20GB) and have already gotten confirmation it's been shipped.

Sounds like the media are trying to scare people again. Tomorrow's story will be that radiation from the iPod might cause brain damage.

The third party retail outlets were responsible for keeping their own inventories and they had other opportunities to order more. From the press articles, Apple was evidently acting in more than good faith by shipping even more iPods even after their inventory order deadline was passed. So if stores were running out of iPods, it is because they and not Apple underestimated demand. Apple has had same day shipping for most of December till today on all iPod orders from their online store.

So this means that Apple can fill the great demand and many buyers may have turned to the online store when they couldn't find it in retail. But, this means even more: All these depleted inventories need to be refilled at the over 8000 retail stores and this time around, many of these stores will order greater quantities since they had such a great experience with selling the iPod. So, Apple's distribution channel should multiply many fold. And the second quarter shipments should be huge as well. Add to this new iPods, AOL coming online and the imminent huge Pepsi promotion and iPod sales should be brisk for some time to come.

elgruga
Dec 23, 2003, 10:55 PM
BTW Shard, God created a universe because he/she/it was bored.

Thats why the evil/good thing.
Evil is to keep us from getting lazy - also why Bill gates exists - to show us how bad things can get.

Is it - could it - is there any way at all that Apple could start to WIN the old battle with Wincrap again?

This iPod news has got me excited, (along with Panther, ipods, Powerbooks, G5 64 bit, FC Pro, iTunes, iPhoto - and not a Gates product in sight.

mac15
Dec 23, 2003, 11:00 PM
wow, thats insane. I can't tell if they are running low on supplies. They are damn hard to come by in Australia ayways

stingerman
Dec 23, 2003, 11:10 PM
Originally posted by mac15
wow, thats insane. I can't tell if they are running low on supplies. They are damn hard to come by in Australia ayways

What about the online store? Are they still showing inventory?

gwuMACaddict
Dec 23, 2003, 11:10 PM
Originally posted by TomSmithMacEd
I would just feel ashmed if I got a Dell DJ for christmas. Sort of like I'm not good enough to get the best, I have to just try to be.

HAHAHAHA!

this is awesome news for apple, bad news for me... i wanted discounts! ;)

Sabenth
Dec 23, 2003, 11:13 PM
i was in a local apple center in melbourne the other day buying a .mac a bloke in front of me bought 3 iPods without battering an eye lid... so there you go

spoon
Dec 23, 2003, 11:17 PM
Apple in Chile is pretty small (it does have a couple of "official" (?) Apple Stores in a couple of big malls though), and a friend just told me he tried to buy it and they told them they where sold out.

IN ALL OF CHILE. Waiting for shipment from the US.

iPods dissapearing from store shelves all around the world? Any more experiences from any other countries besides the already mentioned ones?

SiliconAddict
Dec 23, 2003, 11:18 PM
Originally posted by j33pd0g
I had typed some long winded paragraph about Apple executives, but decided not to go with it. I'll just say congratulations Apple. They're getting their product and name out there. The iPod is holding it's own against flimsy competition.

Flimsy? Yes. Rule them out at this point? Nope. Most of these other serious, sorry buymusic.com is a freaking joke, services have only been around a few months along with their associated devices. Its going to be summer when things get interesting.

Apple has a definite advantage on all sides. Name/device awareness, established online store, (When did iTMS open?!?), major product placement, and now if rumors hold true a cheaper iPod for the masses.

This doesn't mean things can't drastically change in a year. Give these other services time to actually establish themselves before you totally write them off. I'm still interested in seeing how well Dell's devices sells over the holiday season but beyond that its going to be next Christmas season when things get really interesting. I'm starting to wonder if Dell many be seriously kicking around the idea of going retail. Online sales are all well and fine but there is nothing like having an honest to god product in a retail store to sell devices a major advantage Apple has over Dell.

All in all this is great news for Apple. As others have pointed out its too bad they can't keep pace with the demand but on the bright side its better then having overstock after the holiday season.

revenuee
Dec 23, 2003, 11:40 PM
Here in Hamilton and lower Horseshoe area

the radio was booming with "iPod the coolest Mp3 player, and iTunes the best Jukebox Software" commercials for the last few weeks as i've been driving around.

i went into a few electronic stores and they told me it was the hot ticket item this year .... i ordered my online of the Canada Apple store website ... arrival on the 24th, just in time for Xmas

Keynoteuser
Dec 23, 2003, 11:42 PM
My wife works at our local Apple Store. I was in there a few days ago and they had stacks of those things. She said they are selling like crazy, basically flying off the shelves. They aren't sold out yet, but unless they get more shipments in for the after Christmas rush, I imagine they probably will sell out. Steve's got to be smiling over all this. If the rumors are true and a $99 iPod comes out, nothing else will ever touch it. It WILL be the new Walkman/Discman. Xerox, Kleenex, iPod. :)

Stella
Dec 24, 2003, 12:05 AM
Retards
:eek:

Seriously, were do people get these, insane... ideas from?

I mean, a JukeBox program that charges you money to manage you own music - per song..

:confused:


Too much beer and weed if you ask me!! :-)


Originally posted by kb9000

They still think that simply using iTunes for their existing music will cost them money per song_ :confused:

~Shard~
Dec 24, 2003, 12:12 AM
Originally posted by elgruga
BTW Shard, God created a universe because he/she/it was bored.

Thats why the evil/good thing.
Evil is to keep us from getting lazy - also why Bill gates exists - to show us how bad things can get.


Thanks for the insight elgruga, you make a good point. I still stand by my signature though. ;) :cool:

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 12:20 AM
Originally posted by elgruga
BTW Shard, God created a universe because he/she/it was bored.


The great Prophet has spoke ... LOL j/k :D

eazyway
Dec 24, 2003, 12:33 AM
Originally posted by Essefgy
Maybe individual stores are out of stock, but Apple isn't. I ordered one last night from the online store (20GB) and have already gotten confirmation it's been shipped.

Sounds like the media are trying to scare people again. Tomorrow's story will be that radiation from the iPod might cause brain damage.


The media is dead right on this one. I bought 3 iPods at the Thanksgiving and have followed the sales here in Canada. EMJ a wholesaler has had 5 shipments of iPods come in during December from Apple and they today have 6 ..... 10 GB fr iPods left in stock. Best Buy stores are sold out. The Compusmart online stores have 1-2 week shipping dates. The walk in stores are all sold out.

Other retailers Carbonation , CPUsed etc have only a couple left on the shelves. (the 10 GB seems to be the least popular.)

Buying from the Apple store is now your best bet but they cannot deliver before Dec 29 th. I imagine there are still units being produced as we go that are shipping to dealers. Hard to say were Apple makes more money. From the dealers shipping in bulk or shipping one on one from on line.


I would imagine that Apple's first priority would be to stock their own stores especially the newer ones such as Toyko ...

frankly
Dec 24, 2003, 12:35 AM
Two things.

My local Best Buy still has iPods in stock.

Apple couldn't buy the amount of good press coverage they are getting by keeping inventory supplies tight. The more articles we see about the iPod selling out because it is the hottest Christmas gift, the more people that will add one to their list.

Win win.

Later, Frank

JoeMacDaddy
Dec 24, 2003, 12:37 AM
I was at the Apple store at Willow Bend today and iPods were being reserved for pick up by people calling the store to get them. I thought that strange until I read this post. They must be THE THING for teenagers and adults this year.

All I can say is WOW! Apple will be selling tons of these and the newer iPods next year.

eazyway
Dec 24, 2003, 12:39 AM
Originally posted by Stella
Excellent the iPod is doing well, shame Apple couldn't keep up with demand.

With the iPod doing so well... how long will it take before online Music Stores stop using WMA crap and use AAC? I remember one of them saying.. "when AAC is more popular, then we will revise our decisions".. when is popular, popular - Apple already have the largest market share of MP3 players.. will 50, 60% be enough for them.

I'm sure they could negioate with Apple about using the Fairplay DRM... Apple should realize, the more Music Stores that support AAC, the more iPods sold - people won't have to rely on iTMS as their single source.

OK, the iTMS is only there is sell iPods, but so could other music stores.. This is a very real weakness of iPod and Music Store - only one Music Store is compatible, and not everyone likes iTunes... so they don't have any alternatives.


If you own an iPod ,iTMS is the only one I would want to use. You can rip CD's and you can buy music from other stores in MP3 format that will run on the iPod.

The ACC is a free that any store can chose to adopt unlike WMA which is not.

balconycollapse
Dec 24, 2003, 12:41 AM
How does everyone else feel about this?

iTMS opened in April. They were making money albeit little off the music store but more off the iPods sales just from mac users - until October when they as far as i can tell doubled the number of downloads and likely iPod user base. All the WMA music services i believe will cannabalize each other but not have any effect on iTMS. Worst case scenario if Apple eventualy ended up capturing only 10 percent of downloaders, with the other 90 percent going to 10+ other services, could apple still continue to operate for as long as they want because the mac user base won't use anything else? I guess my question is in the future can a mac user base support iTMS all by itself indefinately. If so won't this base be a consistent disproportianate largest number of downloaders from any service and always make it look like the others have less membership because there are simply too many to choose from among windows users. As in one piece of pie for windows users divided so every one gets a small sliver and the biggest slice going to apple itms even though its only a 10percent slice.

Does that make sense (sorry i'm half asleep)? Your thoughts?

Kingsnapped
Dec 24, 2003, 12:50 AM
I got my 10gig in Milwauke on Saturday. The store there was running low on the 10s, but had plenty of 20s and 40s though. Dammed if I could find a dock, a good case or nice speakers in stock though.

eazyway
Dec 24, 2003, 12:53 AM
Originally posted by Kingsnapped
I got my 10gig in Milwauke on Saturday. The store there was running low on the 10s, but had plenty of 20s and 40s though. Dammed if I could find a dock, a good case or nice speakers in stock though.

You should have bought a 20 .... the extras ..... dock , remote and case with the 10 gb is more than the 20 gb with those items included.

macnews
Dec 24, 2003, 12:54 AM
Still have iPods here. Hmmm, maybe I will start a re-seller businesss - anyone want an iPod?

Too bad these aren't priced like the tickle-me elmo's a few years ago. You could really be buying up a stash and reselling the suckers!

I'm just glad the rumors seem to be more frequent (and thus maybe true?) about a $100 iPod in Jan. I will have to buy my wife one so she will leave mine alone. Of course this will only inspire some of her co-workers to buy one (they already want mine but price is a hold back).

graydecember
Dec 24, 2003, 12:59 AM
.

eazyway
Dec 24, 2003, 01:02 AM
Originally posted by balconycollapse
How does everyone else feel about this?

iTMS opened in April. They were making money albeit little off the music store but more off the iPods sales just from mac users - until October when they as far as i can tell doubled the number of downloads and likely iPod user base. All the WMA music services i believe will cannabalize each other but not have any effect on iTMS. Worst case scenario if Apple eventualy ended up capturing only 10 percent of downloaders, with the other 90 percent going to 10+ other services, could apple still continue to operate for as long as they want because the mac user base won't use anything else? I guess my question is in the future can a mac user base support iTMS all by itself indefinately. If so won't this base be a consistent disproportianate largest number of downloaders from any service and always make it look like the others have less membership because there are simply too many to choose from among windows users. As in one piece of pie for windows users divided so every one gets a small sliver and the biggest slice going to apple itms even though its only a 10percent slice.

Does that make sense (sorry i'm half asleep)? Your thoughts?


You are absolutely right. With a 10 % market share of iPods down the road Apple can easily support the iTMS and even make a little profit.(The user base of iPods will grow with time. It now is over 2M and growing. In 5yrs with 200M MP3 players in use a 10% share is 20M or 4 m per year. Still good revenue. People will likely keep the iPods for 5-6yrs before upgrading.(some will need new batteries during this time)

catalystx
Dec 24, 2003, 01:24 AM
Originally posted by stingerman
The third party retail outlets were responsible for keeping their own inventories and they had other opportunities to order more. So if stores were running out of iPods, it is because they and not Apple underestimated demand. Apple has had same day shipping for most of December till today on all iPod orders from their online store.

I work at a reseller and we ordered hundreds of all three models in late November and still have only received a handful of the 10 and 20s but all of the 40s, so it's not just our fault. Our rep from Apple told us last Friday that there's a huge shipment coming from China this week so there'll be plenty available right after Christmas.

It's too bad Apple couldn't have more supply because they'd sure be making more money, but maybe they are anyways since they make the most profit from the abundant 40s. People have usually been willing to pay extra when they realize they get the dock and remote plus twice the space for only $100 more than the 20.

bertagert
Dec 24, 2003, 01:36 AM
Originally posted by graydecember
it seems like windows users are having horrible problems with their ipods. I'm very concerned. my brother's computer won't recognize the ipod suddenly (after several months of perfect use), and there seems to be no cure. Apple support wants to charge above and beyond the warantee and he feels it's extortion..

I don't think the problem is bad. I have a 15 gig working on win 98 with no problems what so ever. Seven of my friends have ipods on windows (2000/XP) and aren't having problems either.

Usually, if the Ipod doesn't show up as a removable hard drive, then its a windows problem (firewire/usb card driver prob).

foniks2020
Dec 24, 2003, 02:10 AM
Originally posted by bertagert
I don't think the problem is bad. I have a 15 gig working on win 98 with no problems what so ever. Seven of my friends have ipods on windows (2000/XP) and aren't having problems either.

Usually, if the Ipod doesn't show up as a removable hard drive, then its a windows problem (firewire/usb card driver prob).

Typically when something goes wrong after having worked for a long time... you've installed something new which created the conflict. Ask your friend if he/she has installed any new software in that time. Reinstall iTunes or uninstall the new stuff and then reinstall iTunes.

good luck.

ITR 81
Dec 24, 2003, 02:11 AM
BB and CompUSA here are both sold out of all iPods.
CompUSA sold out yesterday according to my friend that works there. They first sold out of the 20-30-40GB ver first and then the 10GB sold out. They had just got in 50 new iPods just over the weekend and sold those all in just a few days.

He said the more the media says the iPod is running out of stock the more folks asked for them. Most of the calls he said ask: "Do you still have any iPods in stock and if not who else may have them?".
He said he got alot of that today.

I recently asked a mostly PC forum about what they thought of new mini cheap iPod and about 15 of them said this is what I've been waiting for.

Looks like Apple has got another hit on it's hands now and now is the time to open more iTMS in Jan. to help capitalize on this and to help keep AAC the choice of for end users.

Winamp 5 now supports AAC and if anything that tells me AAC is gaining support on PC 3rd party side.

Most people like me have found out recently the iPod in the car is like taken your whole CD collection with you without having to carry all the CD's.

Direct connection iPods seem to be next car audio thing. For under $100 bucks you can have one too. Basically you need a iPod to RCA output cable to connect directly to your head unit and connect to the TransPod FM which doubles as iPod holder and cig. lighter charger and can also do FM modulation if you need it.

JW Pepper
Dec 24, 2003, 02:12 AM
What you Chaps fail to realise is that iPod distribution is severly limited in Great Britain. There are only a few outlets yet there are 60 million people living here which is about 25% of the US population.

To meet demand each utlet owould have had to have forseen the enormus demand and have committed a fortune to stock. Consequently, there is almost no stock in the retail chain.

Quite frankly why these are not being distributed thgroughout Dixons is a grave error. Dixons alone would quadruple the sales in the UK. I don't like them, but it is just a simple fact that they domonate the retail electronics sector.

balconycollapse
Dec 24, 2003, 02:34 AM
Just for the academics of it JW pepper care to elaborate on Dixons? is this some sort of Wal-Mart equivalent for Britain?

James Craner
Dec 24, 2003, 02:46 AM
I would not say Dixons is the wal-mart of the UK, as wal-mart tends to use the stack em high sell them cheap retail strategy, However Dixons has an outlets in just about every city and town in the UK. Dixons with its sister company's Comet and PC World dominate elecrical retailing in the UK, and are infamous for having poorly trained staff, who don't know what they are talking about.

ntg
Dec 24, 2003, 03:22 AM
Originally posted by James Craner
I would not say Dixons is the wal-mart of the UK, as wal-mart tends to use the stack em high sell them cheap retail strategy, However Dixons has an outlets in just about every city and town in the UK. Dixons with its sister company's Comet and PC World dominate elecrical retailing in the UK, and are infamous for having poorly trained staff, who don't know what they are talking about.

...and are the same ones who will then try to convince the average Brit that Apples are not worth buying (even to the extent of having the machines in-store, but switched off!)

THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO GET A UK APPLE STORE (or ten!!)

Nig.

ViRGE
Dec 24, 2003, 03:30 AM
Originally posted by ITR 81
Winamp 5 now supports AAC and if anything that tells me AAC is gaining support on PC 3rd party side.
FYI, Winamp5 supports AAC, but not the m4a container Apple uses, so it can't play iTunes stuff. Winamp instead uses its own semi-proprietary format of a raw AAC file, with ID3 tagging padded in there like it is with MP3s, which iTunes doesn't understand either(even if iTunes could read the raw file, it doesn't know how to deal with ID3 tags in an AAC file).

caveman_uk
Dec 24, 2003, 03:38 AM
Originally posted by JW Pepper

Quite frankly why these are not being distributed thgroughout Dixons is a grave error. Dixons alone would quadruple the sales in the UK. I don't like them, but it is just a simple fact that they domonate the retail electronics sector.
I was at Stansted Airport (one of Londons three main airports) last week and the Dixons Duty (Tax) free store there had 40GB ipods in stock at £339. Which was a shame as I had just bought one full price in the UK (£399) :mad: You are right to say that I haven't seen ipods in the normal high street Dixons.

To my mind the most widespread Apple seller in the UK must be John Lewis. It's worth remembering that the UK has no AppleStores like the US has (can we have one please?) we only have resellers and the online store...

gotohamish
Dec 24, 2003, 04:06 AM
Originally posted by Ktulu
Speaking of the Dell DJ, does anyone know what kind of sales its' been getting around the country/world. As much as I would love to see it happen, I'm sure the iPod is not the only player selling this holiday season.

Interestingly, I saw a Dell TV commercial where you got either a free scanner, printer or MP3 player - but it was some little flash player, not even their own player!!!

Easy as Dell they say!?

desdomg
Dec 24, 2003, 04:06 AM
Here in Madrid, Spain they still sit in shops - dust filled. Apple has a really poor presence here. If only they would start opening stores outside the US. If you go to the Corte Inglés which is the main department store here they do have an Apple department, which even contains a G5, but the iPods on show/for sale are actually the 2G models still at the old prices! When will Apple take the rest of the world seriously?

mac15
Dec 24, 2003, 04:22 AM
Originally posted by stingerman
What about the online store? Are they still showing inventory?

not sure, I was just looking at Actual Apple stores

cgmpowers
Dec 24, 2003, 04:25 AM
I hadn't planned on purchasing someone an iPod but after numberous hints at one (heh, didn't know he really wanted one at first) then I finally broke down and decided to get him one.

I went to my local Apple Store in the mall and they were out of 10 GB models (but had some 20 GB's and I don't recall if there were 30 GBs, if any..).

As I'm walking out of the store, a customer had just entered to return (actually exchange) her 10 GB unopened iPod which was to be a gift..for a 20 GB.

We both ended up happy.

A few days ago I recall seeing other stores, like Famous Barr (May Company) having a lot (but don't recall which models). Best Buys in my area (two stores) seemed to not be sold out but then again..I don't know what models.

Apple Store in my city, though, was nearing being sold out...I am sure by this morning (Christmas Eve) all will be sold.

krossfyter
Dec 24, 2003, 04:28 AM
Originally posted by ITR 81


Most people like me have found out recently the iPod in the car is like taken your whole CD collection with you without having to carry all the CD's.

Direct connection iPods seem to be next car audio thing. For under $100 bucks you can have one too. Basically you need a iPod to RCA output cable to connect directly to your head unit and connect to the TransPod FM which doubles as iPod holder and cig. lighter charger and can also do FM modulation if you need it.


definitly. it was this music collection in a compact device that clinched it for me in getting an iPod 5 weeks ago. i purchased the belkin car adapter, rca cable and a cable that goes from the rca to the cd changer connection.... whatever thats called.
im the first in my town to do this i bet.

winmacguy
Dec 24, 2003, 04:35 AM
Originally posted by spoon
Apple in Chile is pretty small (it does have a couple of "official" (?) Apple Stores in a couple of big malls though), and a friend just told me he tried to buy it and they told them they where sold out.

IN ALL OF CHILE. Waiting for shipment from the US.

iPods dissapearing from store shelves all around the world? Any more experiences from any other countries besides the already mentioned ones?

As far as I know we still have them available in NZ since they have not been very heavily promoted although they have been selling fairly well. When i went into the Auckland University Campus Tech store last Thursday they said that if I bought and they ordered it it would take a day to come from Apple NZ (couriered across town) I havent tried to buy from the online store though

LoonyPandora
Dec 24, 2003, 04:40 AM
They are still in stock at our store... no 20Gigs though, they just fly off sooo quickly...

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 04:51 AM
haven't bothered checking any stores ... did all my shopping online this year.

but after going out later last evening to run a few errands ... i hate to see what the mall and streets are like during the day

docpsycho
Dec 24, 2003, 04:53 AM
Yup,! I work in a Nor Cal Beset Buy and we have been out for 4 days. We got a shipment of 15 in monday night. all gone within the 1st hour if business.

ITR 81
Dec 24, 2003, 05:09 AM
Originally posted by krossfyter
definitly. it was this music collection in a compact device that clinched it for me in getting an iPod 5 weeks ago. i purchased the belkin car adapter, rca cable and a cable that goes from the rca to the cd changer connection.... whatever thats called.
im the first in my town to do this i bet.

I plan to do a direct hookup for my new GTO once it gets here. I'm only hoping the factory radio or CD changer allows for this because if so then I won't ever use a CD again unless it's a brand new CD that I just bought that hasn't been ripped yet.

loneAzdgari
Dec 24, 2003, 05:10 AM
Yea, the iPod is pretty popular here in the UK. There is an article about it in practically every paper every week. All the journalists have them so they're always mentioned in their columns. I had to wait 5 weeks to get my 3G 15GB iPod. By the time it had arrived Apple had updated the range, I could have got 5GB more for £25 less. But I'm still very happy with it!

We should see 2 million iPods sold in a few months at this rate!!

So much for Apple's innovation being bad for business. I doubt Dell has sold 100,000 of their iPod clones, let alone 1.5 million!

winmacguy
Dec 24, 2003, 05:28 AM
Originally posted by loneAzdgari
Yea, the iPod is pretty popular here in the UK. There is an article about it in practically every paper every week. All the journalists have them so they're always mentioned in their columns. I had to wait 5 weeks to get my 3G 15GB iPod. By the time it had arrived Apple had updated the range, I could have got 5GB more for £25 less. But I'm still very happy with it!

We should see 2 million iPods sold in a few months at this rate!!

So much for Apple's innovation being bad for business. I doubt Dell has sold 100,000 of their iPod clones, let alone 1.5 million!

I know this isnt a first post but Merry Christmas to everybody its currently 12.30 am 25th of December 2003 on this side of the Pacific ( 200 Kms west of the International dateline :) )

Ill be getting my iPod and my first ever Apple product purchase just after christmas :)

pkradd
Dec 24, 2003, 05:35 AM
Apple mosty likely will introduce revised iPods next month. I suppose they stopped making (or I should say have had their vendor stop making) the old models to make way for the new. Add the rumored new MiniPod and they'll have a terrific 2004 in the MP3 player market. One report says the new MiniPods will be flash-based, not HD based. We'll see.

d.f
Dec 24, 2003, 05:42 AM
i am new to iPods, so i haven't a clue how it works..

1) I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress.... Can the iPod do this...?

2) Also using Mac OS9 how do you copy a CD to your PC Hard drive. Mine won't copy, it just has the files as 4k 'shortcuts' and tells me they are Apple CD Player files....

any advice..?

thanx

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 05:51 AM
Originally posted by d.f
i am new to iPods, so i haven't a clue how it works..

1) I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress.... Can the iPod do this...?

2) Also using Mac OS9 how do you copy a CD to your PC Hard drive. Mine won't copy, it just has the files as 4k 'shortcuts' and tells me they are Apple CD Player files....

any advice..?

thanx

First ... iPod is 10 GIG, 20 GIG, and 40 GIG ... so you can store that much onto it

so if you don't want to compress then 1 CD is 650 MB

to fill up 10 gig you need about 15 CD, about 30 for the 20 gig and 60 for the 40 gig

as far as coping music ... download iTunes for OS 9 off of apple.com or download.com and then just click on the CD and "convert to ___" i use wav, some like aiff but i found CD's reburned in aiff don't play in some CD players

good luck

Token
Dec 24, 2003, 05:53 AM
When trying to order an iBook G4, a retailer here in Denmark told me "Apple is swallowed in succes and can't keep up with the consumer demand". Significantly, most of their sales was outside the graphic/print sector: many other sectors, especially universities (dual g5's en masse) and private consumers.

Seems like Apple is doing well.. :-D

Token
Dec 24, 2003, 05:57 AM
1) I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress.... Can the iPod do this...?


You will nees to find a player that support some lossless codec, like FLAC. It will compress your cd's to something like 320MB. I think there is a Rio player that does that.

Alternatively a player like the iRiver iHP-120 will record pure wav-files, as well as mp3-files in 320kb quality (with optical line in/out !].

Wes
Dec 24, 2003, 06:01 AM
Originally posted by caveman_uk

To my mind the most widespread Apple seller in the UK must be John Lewis. It's worth remembering that the UK has no AppleStores like the US has (can we have one please?) we only have resellers and the online store...


John Lewis has sold the most iPods in Europe, as per my mother who works there.

EDIT: And they got a new big shipment a few days ago, and it was sold out. In the 2 minutes I was in the department last Sunday, 2 40 gigs walked out the door.

JW Pepper
Dec 24, 2003, 06:22 AM
One reason for the success of Sony and Windows is that you can buy them anywhere. Apple should note this and concentrate on providing more routes to market for this product. the iPod is the Walkman of the naughties.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 06:28 AM
Originally posted by JW Pepper
. the iPod is the Walkman of the naughties.

Similar point was made in the New York Times Magazine a few weeks back

Great article ... i recommend reading it to anyone if they can get their hands on it

Swift
Dec 24, 2003, 06:54 AM
Anybody remember those? Can it be that Apple has a hit of similar proportions on its hands? If so, then the rumors of a premium, maybe video iPod, and low end, cheap iPods in colors would be coming at just the right time.

AND -- time to clear up the battery problem. Go to the MSNBC Tech section, and there's a story about the iPod battery brothers -- without a single mention of the moves Apple has made to meet the problem, or any attempt to see how common (not) battery failure is after 18 months. (My 5 GB iPod, bought the day after the announcement, is chugging along) Hmm. Wonder what the "MS" stands for in MSNBC.

CrackedButter
Dec 24, 2003, 07:00 AM
I sold my 15GB iPod a few weeks back and since then i have bought a Lacie HD for backing up my stuff.

I don't need a big iPod now and a smaller one would go down a treat.

Lancetx
Dec 24, 2003, 07:09 AM
Originally posted by ITR 81
BB and CompUSA here are both sold out of all iPods.
CompUSA sold out yesterday according to my friend that works there. They first sold out of the 20-30-40GB ver first and then the 10GB sold out. They had just got in 50 new iPods just over the weekend and sold those all in just a few days.

I just happened to stop by my local Fry's Electronics last night and saw that all of the 10 & 20GB models were sold out and they only had maybe 8 40GBs left. Just a couple of weeks ago at this same location they had around 20-30 of each model in stock.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 07:15 AM
iPod + Belkin Card Reader seems the ideal solution to Digital Photographers that don't have or want to carry a laptop with them in the field to dump their pictures onto

for comparison (in Canadian Dollars) 20 gig iPod + Belkin Card Reader = 750$

vs. 20 Gigs worth of compact flash cards at about 8000$

how much would you rather spend?

for backing up your hard drive, the iPod may not seem like the ideal solution, and i guess if you don't have X gigs of mp3 and don't wanna carry around empty space the bigger iPods may not be the solution ... but there are other uses

razorme
Dec 24, 2003, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by d.f
i am new to iPods, so i haven't a clue how it works..

1) I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress.... Can the iPod do this...?

2) Also using Mac OS9 how do you copy a CD to your PC Hard drive. Mine won't copy, it just has the files as 4k 'shortcuts' and tells me they are Apple CD Player files....

any advice..?

thanx


Yes, you can play back your CDs on the iPod uncompressed. As another poster said, download iTunes and use it to import your CDs. Choose the AIFF format to import the music uncompressed.

This will use up a lot of space on your iPod though. iTunes for OS 9 is an older version which I don't believe supports the newer AAC compression. If you can get access to OS X and the latest iTunes, you can use AAC compression and see if you like it.

Another thing to consider is the iPod spins up the hard drive to load the 32 MB of RAM with music. This is about 5 songs with MP3s, but with uncompressed audio, the hard drive will be starting and stopping (or runs continuously?) and will seriously reduce battery life.

JayBee
Dec 24, 2003, 07:59 AM
My folks decided that they could afford to get me a 20gig iPod for Xmas this year - well, actually they decided they could afford the 10gig, but I had a spare £50 in my account ;)

Anyway, I tried to get one from the online store a few weeks ago, and the damn thing just would not accept any of my card numbers. Numerous attempts and chatting to a store rep (top bloke, very helpful and supportive, rang ME back several times to see how things were getting on) left me with over ten rejected orders. Grr.

However, I was determined, so gave up on the online route and decided to go for the high street retail stores. First call was John Lewis in Glasgow. Spent about 10 mins lusting over their 40gig display model, playing with it etc, then went to the counter to ask for a 20gig model. The guy behind the counter kinda laughed half heartedly and said "we WISH!". Seems that they ran out about a week earlier, and had been taking back orders since then. The guy's chat was that even IF Apple managed to get a delivery to them before the 25th, they would pretty much all go out to back order customers. In the last day of stock alone, they shifted 20 units in the morning, and had been taking the same number of orders pretty much daily.

Next stop was Virgin Megastore. These guys have some iPods for sale over the counter in some stores, but not in Glasgow. A quick chat with the counter staff told me that the Edinburgh store was also sold out of all but a few 40gig iPods. Dang.

I then headed for a small Apple vendor called Scotsys. I've dealt with these guys before, and they're pretty marketing focussed - any time I walk in all they do is try and sell me more stuff. Anyway, I walk in and ask for a 20gig iPod. Turns out THEY'VE been sold out for about a week too. The sales rep proudly claims that he "sold the last 20gig iPod in Scotland", and then goes on to try and sell me a 40gig model. "Could you be persuaded to buy a 40gig?" he asks. "Could you sell it for the price of a 20?" I respond before heading back into town...

So, finally, I head into Dixons - I had to get a present for my Mum from there, just a wee CD player. So I chat to the guy to see if they have these in stock, and almost as a throwaway say "Yeah, I saw you had some 40gig iPods behind the counter. Any 20gigs in stock?". His face lights up at the thought of his commission bonus, and he scurries off to say "I'll check - I think we found some this afternoon".

When he said "Found", he wasn't kidding. Turns out they had ordered some 40gigs, and a couple of the boxes were 20s by mistake. I snapped one up, and while I was paying for it the other one was sold too. The counter kid was actually a mac owner, so we chatted for a bit about the current selling trends. Seems that Dixons have been selling iPods retail like hotcakes - it was the only player that they had sold out of in the run up to Xmas, and that was only partly due to bad supply. If they had sold as many of any of the other players they stock, they'd have had the same problems.

"We've stopped putting them on display out of the boxes" the kid laughed, "we just have to box them back up after twenty minutes!"

Seriously, this is some GREAT news for Apple, and bear in mind that the UK is now loaded with iPods WITHOUT the iTMS yet. Imagine what's going to happen in Q1 2004 when Apple launches a mini iPod and iTMS Europe.

Remember, you don't create a market by creating supply, you create it by creating demand. That's exactly what Apple has done, and they've managed to clear stock in the UK with minimal advertising, minimal store presence, and minimal support.

Wait until Q2. iPod will be the ONLY player to be seen with - it's the Walkman all over again. I can't actually wait for people to refer to the "iPod" section of a store, or the "Rio iPod" or whatever. Sony was the overpriced also ran before the Walkman. Here we go again...

:)

slowtreme
Dec 24, 2003, 08:02 AM
The ACC is a free that any store can chose to adopt unlike WMA which is not. WMA is Free (to use) but not free to crack. The problem with WMA is not the quality of the file or the encoding. Instead the DRM is MS based. The lisence for the DRM is where the money comes in.

It's NO DIFFERENT THAN APPLE. AAC is an open standard and free to use as compression. If you want to playback files with Apple's DRM you'll need to license that code from Apple as well.

This isn't rocket science.

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by graydecember
compassionat.net

nice portraits

odenshaw
Dec 24, 2003, 08:10 AM
whether or not there's a fix (and if you know of one, please email me!), I *hope to GOD* all these ipods flying off the shelf aren't going to pcs that have this same problem, because it will prove to be a catAstrophe for apple.



No Need to worry mate!

Apple can blame it on terrorism
We aRe! on Orange Alert (http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/index.jsp) Folks!!

Frozone
Dec 24, 2003, 08:25 AM
This post is somewhat off topic, but we will all live!

Okay, for Christmas i'm getting just money and I can buy whatever I want. And I was planning on getting an iPod. I have about 4 or 5 hundred dollars, but every place that I can find around South Georgia/North Florida that actually carries iPod's seem to be sold of of them. So if ya'll were me would you...

Get a 20 Gig iPod with accessories

or

Get one of the 'rumored' 2/4 Gig iPods
Get Panther
And use whatever money is left on Ram

Ohh, keep in mind I don't have a TON of songs, but i'm sure I could get a lot!

boxcar
Dec 24, 2003, 08:27 AM
This Is AWESOME!!!

i'm sorry but the more people using/talking about apple products the better. We have the edge on competitors... The Apple name is associated now with cool and hip, as well as quality products. There's no chance Dell or some other punk can compete with that.

word to apple... let's go to war!

macFanDave
Dec 24, 2003, 08:28 AM
I was at Wendy's yesterday and I saw a guy with an Apple Rep shirt on. He said he worked at a CompUSA in the north part of Houston. When I asked him how iPods were doing, he said, "We've run out."

So, I can't say whether it is generally true, but this is just one story to suggest that it MIGHT be.

zac4mac
Dec 24, 2003, 08:28 AM
Good post, JayBee -

I got a 5GB when they were announced, daily use for 3 years and still going strong. 15GB this spring when the 3G's came out.

Until three weeks ago, there were 3 iPods at my work(~1000 people). Since then, I've seen several new additions. Even my dept's(R&D) VP. I loaned him my iTrip, 'cause he was complaing about his Belkin, and he got all excited about how well it worked. Always good to score points.

Major home run, Apple.

Z

D*I*S_Frontman
Dec 24, 2003, 08:38 AM
i am new to iPods, so i haven't a clue how it works..

1) I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress.... Can the iPod do this...?

any advice..?



Before you start loading uncompressed CDs into your iPod, you really should give the AAC compression scheme a try. It is excellent--not remotely comparable to mp3. The difference between a high bitrate AAC and an uncompressed CD is so slight that the earbud headphones that come with an iPod probably can't even communicate the difference to your ears. So unless you are using studio-grade headphones and doing critical audio engineering in a quiet room, you would be much better off using the iPod in the way it was designed.

Perspective check: people used audio cassettes for what, over three decades? People still managed to enjoy their music, even with the high noise floor and omnipresent tape hiss. To my ear, mp3 sounds about equivalent to cassette minus the hiss. AAC sounds like a CD missing perhaps a SLIGHT bit of auditory depth. Both STOMP on cassette. Mp3/AAC players don't skip with the frightening regularity of a Walkman CD player-type of device, either.

If you want to listen to uncompressed CDs, seeing that you can only put a few on any commercially available mp3/AAC player you might as well just carry them around and use a CD player (and deal with the skips). I would much rather carry EVERY SONG I OWN around with me anywhere I go on something that a) plays for several hours at a pop, b) doesn't skip, c) sorts my music any way I like, and d) is only a little larger than a box of Chicklets.

tny
Dec 24, 2003, 08:39 AM
Originally posted by carletonmusic
Well, this would make sense for a space bump at MWSF.

15GB $299
30GB $399
50GB $499

2GB $99
4GB $149

There's no 50GB hard drive to put in an iPod, so you won't see a 50GB iPod.

<a href="http://sdd.toshiba.com/main.aspx?Path=/818100000007000000010000659800000000/81820000010d000000010000659c000003b7">Toshiba's</a>
website lists the drives available (click on "see all drives" for the 1.8 inch hard drives):

5 GB
10 GB
15 GB
20 GB
30 GB
40 GB

You won't see a 2G/3G iPod in any size other than those, unless (a big unless) Toshiba provides Apple (one of their big competitors in the laptop market) hard drives well before they announce them. I have NO idea what they'll use for the mini-iPods, as the obvious choices, the Hitachi microdrive, or flash memory, are both at current prices too damned expensive.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 08:40 AM
Iceman06

Well the 2/4 gig is just that rumored

so i would wait to see what Jan has to offer ...

but if you just want to use the iPod for music the smaller size is probably Ideal

~Shard~
Dec 24, 2003, 08:42 AM
Originally posted by Kingsnapped
I got my 10gig in Milwauke on Saturday. The store there was running low on the 10s, but had plenty of 20s and 40s though. Dammed if I could find a dock, a good case or nice speakers in stock though.

It all comes down to personal preference, but I would have gone for the 20 or 40 GB models. If you do the math and price it out, buying a 10 GB, then buying the wired remote, carrying case and dock separately works out to about the same cost as the 20 GB model, with which you receive all those items included. Well, the 20 GB still costs a bit more, but still the extra cost is minimal when you consider you're doubling your capacity.

Whatever works for ya though!

tny
Dec 24, 2003, 08:43 AM
Originally posted by razorme
Yes, you can play back your CDs on the iPod uncompressed. As another poster said, download iTunes and use it to import your CDs. Choose the AIFF format to import the music uncompressed.

This will use up a lot of space on your iPod though. iTunes for OS 9 is an older version which I don't believe supports the newer AAC compression. If you can get access to OS X and the latest iTunes, you can use AAC compression and see if you like it.

Another thing to consider is the iPod spins up the hard drive to load the 32 MB of RAM with music. This is about 5 songs with MP3s, but with uncompressed audio, the hard drive will be starting and stopping (or runs continuously?) and will seriously reduce battery life.

Excellent posting. A good compromise would be to encode at a higher bitrate than standard in AAC: that way your compression won't be quite as lossy.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 08:45 AM
A little of topic but

iPod watch - Shanghai, Anchorage, Memphis, Winnipeg, Mount Hope, Burlington - and now on the Fedex Delivery truck to my house ... just in time for Christmas

rjstanford
Dec 24, 2003, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by tny
Excellent posting. A good compromise would be to encode at a higher bitrate than standard in AAC: that way your compression won't be quite as lossy. I actually find that a high bit rate (320kbps or greater) MP3 sounds better than a high bitrate AAC. I think that WMA has the best sound at 64k, AAC has the best at 128k, but MP3 seems slightly crisper at 320k. Of course, at that point there really isn't a whole lot between them. Still, when there's not really compelling quality difference, I will always take the usefull openness of something like MP3 (easier to move around, toss onto CDs for the car, et cetera). Yes, its still not FLAC quality, but its a lot smaller and more portable, and it sounds pretty darn acceptable for background listening.

-Richard

latergator116
Dec 24, 2003, 09:26 AM
2GB $99
4GB $149

I think $100 is a bit too much for only 2 gigs. I'd say $100 for 5 gigs

germ war
Dec 24, 2003, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by revenuee
First ... iPod is 10 GIG, 20 GIG, and 40 GIG ... so you can store that much onto it

so if you don't want to compress then 1 CD is 650 MB

to fill up 10 gig you need about 15 CD, about 30 for the 20 gig and 60 for the 40 gig


You should probably mention that not EVERY CD is 650 MB. A full 74-minute CD is about that size, but anything less is going to have a smaller file size.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by latergator116
I think $100 is a bit too much for only 2 gigs. I'd say $100 for 5 gigs

Remember that it is not just capacity

but also the actual tech that goes into the Player

assuming, as suggested that it would be flash
I think that a flash memory player would be more expensive to produce then then a hard drive based one ... at least based on the prices of media cards (SD, CF, Memory STICK, etc)

arn
Dec 24, 2003, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by latergator116
I think $100 is a bit too much for only 2 gigs. I'd say $100 for 5 gigs

See, now you're just getting greedy. :)

What's the largest capacity MP3 player at $100 on the market right now?

It's about 128MB of storage... which puts into perspective how realistic a 2GB device at $100 is.... not to mention a $100 5GB device.

arn

frankly
Dec 24, 2003, 09:38 AM
Originally posted by latergator116
I think $100 is a bit too much for only 2 gigs. I'd say $100 for 5 gigs

Are you for real???

64MB flash players are selling for that much. The lowest I have seen is $75 and the lowest for 128MB is $100 and run up to $170.

I think people would be pleased beyond belief if they could instead get 32 times or 16 times the storage capacity for the same price (or less).

You need to do a little price comparison before you say that price is too high.

Later, Frank

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by germ war
You should probably mention that not EVERY CD is 650 MB. A full 74-minute CD is about that size, but anything less is going to have a smaller file size.

Fair enough,

then 74 minutes is 650 MB then 1 minutes is about 8 MB (give or take)

at 10000 MB (10 GIG) then thats 1250 minutes (give or take)

EDIT : On the iPod watch - it arrived ... woo hoo

rtype
Dec 24, 2003, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by crees!
You seriously need to talk to your friends. I had to do the same with mine as well. They don't care too much to look into all the details and they need someone like you and me to straighten them out.
I've had to explain even to my very literate computer geek friends that iTunes is a good audio player on the PC, not just a way to buy songs from Apple. They really could have done a better job with making that obvious.

ptlpc
Dec 24, 2003, 10:08 AM
10G iPods are sold out in Philly area. I'm in a west suburb and NO ONE has a 10G. I was buying one for my son and waited too long. So, I am actually glad because the 2G will suit him better. Was this "Story" about the minis a "leak" to help appease those of us who didn't get one? Perhaps. I for one will be glad to save the $150-200!

$100 for Mp3 Player made by Apple?
You bet your Christmas Goose!

latergator116
Dec 24, 2003, 10:10 AM
See, now you're just getting greedy.

What's the largest capacity MP3 player at $100 on the market right now?

It's about 128MB of storage... which puts into perspective how realistic a 2GB device at $100 is.... not to mention a $100 5GB device.


Ok, $150? that seems reasonable if a 10 gb costs $300

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by latergator116
Ok, $150? that seems reasonable if a 10 gb costs $300


If

499 for 40
399 for 20
299 for 10

Then

199 for 5
179 for 4
150 for 2

Any opinions?

SiliconAddict
Dec 24, 2003, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by elgruga
BTW Shard, God created a universe because he/she/it was bored.



Some people paint and collect art. I betting God makes universes in his/her/its spare time. Think sim city but on a bigger scale. *walking tour of gods house* Over there you have universe X where I decided Gates was going to be a lowly towel boy for Jobs. I gave Gates a massive inferiority complex so as you can see Jobs can kick him around a lot and he just sits there and takes it.

Over there you have universe Y my favorite. Jobs has taken over the Hawaiian islands and established the small nation Applonia who's primary export is Apple computers.

Then you have Universe Z over there. I'm not a big fan of that one. Gates is supreme ruler of the world. Jobs has been killed and stuffed and is in the Smithsonian museum. I'm going to give it another 10 years. If things don't change I'm going to set up a big shrink and collapse the universe in on itself and start again.

Vashti
Dec 24, 2003, 10:41 AM
Hey y'all. After lurking for months, you guys just inspired me to register. I have been seriously considering buying an Ipod in a month or two when I get my new laptop. I liked the idea of having most of my music in one place, perhaps even selling my very extensive cd collection. You guys have been saying that the quality difference is not noticeable unless you have better earphones. I value music very music and probably would have bought high quality headphones. So - will the music be less clear than my cds? For a person who puts a very high premium on music sound quality, would I be okay using my ipod instead of my various cd players? Thanks for the help!

(Hey, this posting stuff isn't so hard after all. Not bad for a technophobe.)

micvog
Dec 24, 2003, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by arn
I haven't been in the market for one ... others have trouble finding one?

I bought a 20GB from Robinsons-May (20% off on a pre-Thanksgiving sale) and a 20GB from Amazon a week later (~5% off list with no sales tax).

About 1.5 weeks ago I tried buying a 10GB for my Dad but Amazon and the local Robinsons Mays, CompUSAs and Best Buys were out of stock... even of the 20GB model. Luckily Apple e-mailed me a $25 coupon code that morning and I ordered a 10GB from the online Apple Store at 2PM Pacific Time. It shipped the same day.

I know a number of people that bought iPods (all PC users, including myself). My next "PC" will be a Mac... hopefully Apple will get a lot of switchers from the iPod.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 10:49 AM
Apple selling point for it's Computers

"You like the iPod?, like how it looks?, like how easy it is to use?, well our computers are iPod; BIGGER"

LOL

meh, needs work

EDIT; how about

"Apple Desktops and Notebooks, think iPod: BIGGER"

micvog
Dec 24, 2003, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by Vashti
For a person who puts a very high premium on music sound quality, would I be okay using my ipod instead of my various cd players? Thanks for the help!

Using the stock earphones I can't tell the difference between a CD and 192-bit AAC (which is what I used to rip my entire collection). I consider myself to be VERY sensitive to sound quality - I have thrown out CDs because their sound quality annoyed me so much (I am also cheap - so I don't throw things out easily).

That being said, using Sound Check or the Equalizer produces, IMO, unacceptable results. I get a click-sound between each track using Sound Check, and the Equalizer introduces a lot of distortion. The solution is not use either option.

I have ordered a pair of Sennheiser (PX200?) headphones to go with my iPod. If you are interested, I will post my results with those which I expect to be an improvement over the stock earphones.

micvog
Dec 24, 2003, 10:56 AM
Apple senior vice president Ron Johnson was quoted as telling a US newspaper that an iPod was being sold in Apple stores worldwide every 10 minutes in the run-up to Christmas.

Looks like there is an error in the BBC article. My understanding from the FastCompany article was that the iPod/every 10 minutes was just for the Chicago store... and not all Apple Stores. Is that correct?

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by revenuee

"Apple Desktops and Notebooks, think iPod: BIGGER"

how about

"It's like having the power of
1 million ipods at the tip of your fingers"

or

"apple computers; ipod easy"

or

"if you thought the ipod was sexy and easy,
i wonder what you would think of her mother."

Photorun
Dec 24, 2003, 11:01 AM
Um... like them selling out is a bad thing?!? Buffalo Galleria store was sold out of all but the 40 GB, out of a lot of the accessories too.

OT I agree with Shard's sig... excellent!

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 11:02 AM
Originally posted by beatle888
how about

"It's like having the power of
1 million ipods at the tip of your fingers"


i can hear Jeff Goldbloom already :)

SiliconAddict
Dec 24, 2003, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by ptlpc
I for one will be glad to save the $150-200!


And this folks is why these things will FLY off the shelf at the speed of light.

SiliconAddict
Dec 24, 2003, 11:05 AM
A suggestion? A 2GB-5GB hard drive based iPod with an SD slot for SS storage? So lets say you are jogging or doing some thing where moving parts are bad you could go out and buy a 256MB SD card pop it into your iPod compile a play list and the iPod would treat the 128MB, 256MB, 512MB, etc stick as extended cache. Storing as much of your playlist as possible on the card and running it from that card until it hits the last song stored on the card and at which point it spools more of the playlist to the card. *shrugs* Just a thought. Heck it might even extend the battery life on the iPod.

the_mole1314
Dec 24, 2003, 11:09 AM
Well, the Apple Store in Richmond a week ago still has tons of 40s and 20s, but not a lot of 10s, and the Apple Store in Cleveland (Legacy Village) still has some in stock. Target, Best Buy, and other places are all sold out. They're falying off the shelves to the point where CompUSA, Best Buy, Target, and Circut City have stopped putting them in their ads!

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 11:10 AM
Originally posted by revenuee
i can hear Jeff Goldbloom already :)

with those eyes...those huge eyes.

ipod + imac + you = (insert compliments in flying text here)

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 11:12 AM
Who said that there wasn't a MUST HAVE gift this season?
=-=
On average, two retail music CD's take up one-gig of hard drive space.

What is the thinking behind small gig iPods?

Is there a file compression utility that can decrease the file sizes so that you can stuff and play more music files into those limited gigs?

I really don't know. I simply use iTunes and acres of hard drive space.

Thank you for your enlightenment.
=-=
HAPPY HOLIDAYS !!!
JJ

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
Who said that there wasn't a MUST HAVE gift this season?
=-=
On average, two retail music CD's take up one-gig of hard drive space.

What is the thinking behind small gig iPods?

Is there a file compression utility that can decrease the file sizes so that you can stuff and play more music files into those limited gigs?

I really don't know. I simply use iTunes and acres of hard drive space.

Thank you for your enlightenment.
=-=
HAPPY HOLIDAYS !!!
JJ

your funny, right?

:) happy holidays

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by beatle888
your funny, right?

:) happy holidays

I'm serious.
=-=
JJ

rtype
Dec 24, 2003, 11:22 AM
Originally posted by revenuee
Apple selling point for it's Computers

"You like the iPod?, like how it looks?, like how easy it is to use?, well our computers are iPod; BIGGER"

LOL

meh, needs work

EDIT; how about

"Apple Desktops and Notebooks, think iPod: BIGGER"

"The new Powerbook: it's the iPod of laptops."

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 11:22 AM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
I'm serious.
=-=
JJ

No really... your kidding right?


When i say "Mp3"

nothing sparks in your mind?

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
I'm serious.
=-=
JJ

well, ok then, i'll enlighten you. the mp3 format is a unique compression algorithm that scans every note of the song and puts them into a "pile". so lets say one song has 100 C Major notes, the "C Major pile" will contain 100 items in that pile. unless of course song two has 50 C Major notes, then as you can probably guess, the C Major pile would contain 150 items. this happens to the sound frequency as well...thats how the ipod reproduces the sound of the instrument. now the lyrics are a different story...think of the ipod as a huge dictionary...it really has every word used by most rock, rap and country artist...this isnt really that extensive but still impressive. so lets say a song has the word "shotgun" in it, well the ipod will search its "common" dictionary (since this word is use in most genres) and applies the correct frequency to the lyric...then it searches its vocal database made up of ten vocalists...(come to find out that in the popular music industry theres only ten distinct voices...five of which weird al recorded for apple)....and presto, you have your song.

now since all this info is stacked in "piles", all the mp3 format has to do is record how many times a certain number of notes, or what vocal sound to use at a specified frequency....this makes the file size much smaller and you can fit more songs onto a hard drive.

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 11:37 AM
Originally posted by revenuee
No really... your kidding right?


When i say "Mp3"

nothing sparks in your mind?

Seriously. I simply use iTunes to download from the retail CD onto the 120 gig hard drive in my QuickSilver G4-733 Panther latest version.

My iTunes Music folder shows everything as MP3. For instance: Metallica (Black) track 04 The Unforgiven.mp3 is 14.7 MB.

I'm a text and graphics person. Not a DJ. I was happy that iTunes can play my CD's without a lot of fussing with conversions.

I am not happy that the defaults use acreage of hard drive space.

Can you suggest a quick "How-To" get more tunes into smaller space?
=-=
Thanks in advance.
JJ

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 11:38 AM
Originally posted by beatle888
well, ok then, i'll enlighten you. the mp3 format is a unique compression algorithm that scans every note of the song and puts them into a "pile". so lets say one song has 100 C Major notes, the "C Major pile" will contain 100 items in that pile. unless of course song two has 50 C Major notes, then as you can probably guess, the C Major pile would contain 150 items. this happens to the sound frequency as well...thats how the ipod reproduces the sound of the instrument. now the lyrics are a different story...think of the ipod as a huge dictionary...it really has every word used by most rock, rap and country artist...this isnt really that extensive but still impressive. so lets say a song has the word "shotgun" in it, well the ipod will search its "common" dictionary (since this word is use in most genres) and applies the correct frequency to the lyric...then it searches its vocal database made up of ten vocalists...(come to find out that in the popular music industry theres only ten distinct voices...five of which weird al recorded for apple)....and presto, you have your song.

now since all this info is stacked in "piles", all the mp3 format has to do is record how many times a certain number of notes, or what vocal sound to use at a specified frequency....this makes the file size much smaller and you can fit more songs onto a hard drive.


Really? i didn't know that

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 11:41 AM
it's true. it even works this way in the alternate universes x, y and z that SiliconAddict pointed out.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 11:46 AM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
Seriously. I simply use iTunes to download from the retail CD onto the 120 gig hard drive in my QuickSilver G4-733 Panther latest version.

My iTunes Music folder shows everything as MP3. For instance: Metallica (Black) track 04 The Unforgiven.mp3 is 14.7 MB.

I'm a text and graphics person. Not a DJ. I was happy that iTunes can play my CD's without a lot of fussing with conversions.

I am not happy that the defaults use acreage of hard drive space.

Can you suggest a quick "How-To" get more tunes into smaller space?
=-=
Thanks in advance.
JJ

I apologize for seeming snooty with my remarks it just caught me off guard

Yes you can fit about 150 songs in mp3 format into a CD that normally holds 20 songs.

A quick how to

Your best bet is to use the easy to follow instructions in the iTunes help ... Apple content writers do a great job explaining it better then i could ever hope to

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 12:10 PM
Originally posted by revenuee
I apologize for seeming snooty with my remarks it just caught me off guard

Yes you can fit about 150 songs in mp3 format into a CD that normally holds 20 songs.

A quick how to

Your best bet is to use the easy to follow instructions in the iTunes help ... Apple content writers do a great job explaining it better then i could ever hope to

Good advice, here's what I found:
iTunes and Music Store Help

Saving a copy of a song in a new file format

You can convert a song to a different file format while keeping a copy of the original. For example, you can save a copy of a compressed song file such as MP3 or AAC in an uncompressed song format (AIFF or WAV).

When converting from a compressed to uncompressed file format (for example, from MP3 to AIFF) you shouldn't notice any reduction in sound quality. However, when converting between compressed formats (for example, MP3 and AAC), you may notice a reduction in the sound quality. For the best results, if you want your music encoded in a different file format, you should import the music again from the original source using the new encoding format.


To convert a song's file format:

1 Choose iTunes > Preferences, then click the Importing button at the top of the window.

2 From the Import Using pop-up menu, choose the encoding format that you want to convert the song to, then click OK to save the settings.

3 Select one or more songs in your library, then choose Advanced > Convert Selection to MP3, Convert Selection to AAC, Convert Selection to AIFF, or Convert Selection to WAV. (The menu item changes to show what's selected in your Importing preferences.)

To convert all the songs in a folder or on a disk, hold down the Option key and choose Advanced > "Convert Selection to," then choose the folder or disk containing the songs you want to convert. All the songs in the folder or on the disk will be converted except songs you purchased from the Music Store. (Purchased songs are encoded using a protected AAC format that prevents them from being converted.)

The song in its original format and the newly converted song appear in your library.
=-=
So when I download from CD in the future, I should use AAC?
-
JJ

beatle888
Dec 24, 2003, 12:15 PM
different users will have different preferences. i myself use mp3 and select the highest quality option.

sorry, i thought you were just kidding earlier.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 12:15 PM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
=-=
So when I download from CD in the future, I should use AAC?
-
JJ

Apple and those who use it claim that it is better quality ... so yes, i think it is your best option ... and remember to delete the original files off of your computer

you'll save tons of disk space

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 12:24 PM
Originally posted by revenuee
Apple and those who use it claim that it is better quality ... so yes, i think it is your best option ... and remember to delete the original files off of your computer

you'll save tons of disk space

... ummm, convert from MP3 to ACC (.m4a) the 15,488,622 byte file became 15,560,507 bytes. Slightly larger. 0.1 meg. About the same quality, slightly less.

I will try again with a direct from CD download into iTunes. Stand by...
=-=
JJ

MacFan25
Dec 24, 2003, 12:41 PM
I'm glad to hear that the iPods are selling so well. A couple days ago, on NBC's Today Show, they had a report on the hot gifts this holiday season, and sure enough, the iPod was one of them. :)

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
... ummm, convert from MP3 to ACC (.m4a) the 15,488,622 byte file became 15,560,507 bytes. Slightly larger. 0.1 meg. About the same quality, slightly less.

I will try again with a direct from CD download into iTunes. Stand by...
=-=
JJ

Fascinating results: the same file as a downloaded from CD as an AAC (my bad earlier) .m4a is now 15,557,705, still slightly larger than an MP3.

However: the whole album folder size is smaller: Original folder as MP3: 158.1 MB, redownload as AAC: 144 MB.

As a CD: Metallica (Black) is 632.1 MB

... the fresh downloaded as AAC: slightly better sound quality than MP3.
=-=
Please accept my thanks for the help and training.

The best holiday gift is Help.

HAPPY HOLIDAYS !!!
=-=
JJ

paulypants
Dec 24, 2003, 01:09 PM
I bought a 10GB and a 20 GB iPod both
personalized from the Online Store on Friday December 13th. To my surprise the 20GB showed up on the 15th, the 10GB came on the 17th. Thanks Apple! :)

Santaduck
Dec 24, 2003, 01:12 PM
Although a longtime apple user since the early 80's, I recently got an adjunct wintel machine, and was updating it for use with my iPod, since iTunes (4.1.1 in Win XP) was acting funny, so I assumed it was using Quicktime, so I went to QT panel and chose to update it)...

(Apple Server Overload?)
and either it's holiday net congestion, or the apple QT update servers are overloaded-- probably due to the huge sales of iPods to windows users, who are updating iTunes & QT. Is there any way to check such traffic?

Almost every one of my QT components come back with a 'possibly overloaded server' message... i keep clicking "try again" and eventually I can download the QT component, then it goes to the next one. Wow. Lotta new ipods out there...


____
Also note that iTunes 4.2 for Windows is listed at the apple discussion area http://discussions.info.apple.com/WebX?13@40.4RTUapEMsvj.0@.599abd46
although 'check for update' claims 4.1.1 is the latest version for windows...

corey
Dec 24, 2003, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
For instance: Metallica (Black) track 04 The Unforgiven.mp3 is 14.7 MB if one song is taking up 14.7 megs on your hard drive, how are two cds taking 1 gig? my quick math says your cds have about 32 songs each!?!?!

dynamicd
Dec 24, 2003, 01:33 PM
Why would anyone mark this as a negative thing on the main page??? Selling out of ipods is clearly a good thing for Apple.

JJTiger1
Dec 24, 2003, 01:53 PM
Originally posted by corey
if one song is taking up 14.7 megs on your hard drive, how are two cds taking 1 gig? my quick math says your cds have about 32 songs each!?!?!

I started using iTunes when it was first released. The files were imported as AIFF or WAV, so I got a copy of what is on the CD. Really large filesizes.

Somewhere over the years, all of those files on my computer were converted to MP3. Probably during an update of iTunes.

But I was not aware of the change.

Until today, I was still under the impression that those files were still as large as I imported them. (not "downloaded" per se, another my bad).

I had not checked to see the current filesizes, until today. D'oh!!

I'm using iTunes 4.2 (72) so I think that I'm up to date.
=-=
So, now we all know that we should import as AAC so as to maximize the sound quality, and utilization of hard drive space.
=-=
JJ

shen
Dec 24, 2003, 02:29 PM
Originally posted by dynamicd
Why would anyone mark this as a negative thing on the main page??? Selling out of ipods is clearly a good thing for Apple.

but if your trying to buy, it is bad for you.....

frankly
Dec 24, 2003, 03:17 PM
The funniest part of this whole phenomenon is that I can remember when Apple introduced the iPod. They said they were going to announce a ground breaking new device and when they showed it there were soooooooo many naysayers with comments like:

"groundbreaking, it is just an MP3 player!"

"it is waaaay too expensive"

etc.

I'm glad that they are all having to eat crow now :)

Later, Frank

OutThere
Dec 24, 2003, 03:45 PM
I'd think that this will give apple fair warning for next Christmas to get their iPod production/stores way up.

eazyway
Dec 24, 2003, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
I started using iTunes when it was first released. The files were imported as AIFF or WAV, so I got a copy of what is on the CD. Really large filesizes.

Somewhere over the years, all of those files on my computer were converted to MP3. Probably during an update of iTunes.

But I was not aware of the change.

Until today, I was still under the impression that those files were still as large as I imported them. (not "downloaded" per se, another my bad).

I had not checked to see the current filesizes, until today. D'oh!!

I'm using iTunes 4.2 (72) so I think that I'm up to date.
=-=
So, now we all know that we should import as AAC so as to maximize the sound quality, and utilization of hard drive space.
=-=
JJ


You did not import the files asa AAC or MP3 . If you open your iTunes preferences you can tell it how to import the files from a CD. Select AAC for better quality. An AAC file or MP3 files for a normal song is around 4 MB. That means youcan get abour 250 files per GB.


BTW THE IMPORT IS ONE STEP . AIFF files on your haed drive may have the MP3 tags but thet are not AAC or MP3 files yet.

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by zac4mac
Good post, JayBee -

I got a 5GB when they were announced, daily use for 3 years and still going strong. 15GB this spring when the 3G's came out.

Until three weeks ago, there were 3 iPods at my work(~1000 people). Since then, I've seen several new additions. Even my dept's(R&D) VP. I loaned him my iTrip, 'cause he was complaing about his Belkin, and he got all excited about how well it worked. Always good to score points.

Major home run, Apple.

Z

165 people in my company, I was the only iPod owner. Colleague bought a Zen piece of crap and came to check out my iPod. Returned the Zen and showed up the next day with a 10GB.

The next week, 2 others bought one and my assistant plans on buying one in January. A few others want one if a ower priced model comes out.

2 people have been questioning me about Macs. Sadly, my advice is to wait until the iMac has some ba**s. Technology in it is too old.

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 04:10 PM
Originally posted by latergator116
Ok, $150? that seems reasonable if a 10 gb costs $300

The 5GB drive probably costs Apple about the same as the 10GB. So you want to pay $150 for a product that costs Apple pretty much what the 10GB does? What features don't you want?

dockability
remote
backlighting
same size screen
same size battery (OK, not a good one)
no Firewire
carry case
PDA type features
games

Sure, a number are more or less worthless but that's what make an iPod and iPod. The 5GB for much less than the 10GB model is just a dream.

jero
Dec 24, 2003, 04:11 PM
3 of my cousins all got one. i had the chance to get one but instead i opted for a digital camera. i will pick one up myself whenever the next gens come out.

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by micvog
My next "PC" will be a Mac... .

What took you so long?

Welcome.

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by micvog
Apple senior vice president Ron Johnson was quoted as telling a US newspaper that an iPod was being sold in Apple stores worldwide every 10 minutes in the run-up to Christmas.

Looks like there is an error in the BBC article. My understanding from the FastCompany article was that the iPod/every 10 minutes was just for the Chicago store... and not all Apple Stores. Is that correct?

The x iPods sold every minute quotes are based on total iPod sales rom ALL Apple resellers.

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 04:17 PM
Originally posted by beatle888


"if you thought the ipod was sexy and easy,
i wonder what you would think of her mother."

Brilliant!

iPods mom has got it going on
iPods mom has got it going on
iPod, can I come over after school...

hayesk
Dec 24, 2003, 05:51 PM
Originally posted by eazyway
You did not import the files asa AAC or MP3 . If you open your iTunes preferences you can tell it how to import the files from a CD. Select AAC for better quality. An AAC file or MP3 files for a normal song is around 4 MB. That means youcan get abour 250 files per GB.

Just a little note for those interested:

Uncompressed audio from a CD is approximately 1200kbps. Other formats (MP3, AAC) are whatever you want them to be. I use 192 kbps AAC. Therefore I get about an 6:1 compression ratio.

bigjohn
Dec 24, 2003, 06:02 PM
I was just at the Old Town Pasadena Apple Store, the salesgirl said they had sold out of iPods yesterday (12/23) and were currently getting rush deliveries of iPods from other stores in the area.

the_dalex
Dec 24, 2003, 06:28 PM
Originally posted by beatle888
well, ok then, i'll enlighten you. the mp3 format is a unique compression algorithm that scans every note of the song and puts them into a "pile". so lets say one song has 100 C Major notes, the "C Major pile" will contain 100 items in that pile. unless of course song two has 50 C Major notes, then as you can probably guess, the C Major pile would contain 150 items. this happens to the sound frequency as well...thats how the ipod reproduces the sound of the instrument. now the lyrics are a different story...think of the ipod as a huge dictionary...it really has every word used by most rock, rap and country artist...this isnt really that extensive but still impressive. so lets say a song has the word "shotgun" in it, well the ipod will search its "common" dictionary (since this word is use in most genres) and applies the correct frequency to the lyric...then it searches its vocal database made up of ten vocalists...(come to find out that in the popular music industry theres only ten distinct voices...five of which weird al recorded for apple)....and presto, you have your song.

now since all this info is stacked in "piles", all the mp3 format has to do is record how many times a certain number of notes, or what vocal sound to use at a specified frequency....this makes the file size much smaller and you can fit more songs onto a hard drive.

Ummm... I don't even know where to begin with this one. Where did you hear this?

rdowns
Dec 24, 2003, 07:04 PM
Originally posted by the_dalex
Ummm... I don't even know where to begin with this one. Where did you hear this?

I read it on the Internet. It must be true.

revenuee
Dec 24, 2003, 09:35 PM
No wonder this thing sold out this year ... it is amazing ... wire the dock and rests in the corner of my desk charging wile i'm not using it ...

fits nicely in any pocket or on my belt with the carring case .... the remote is a pleasure to use ...

I've notice ... although the song files are hidden when the dock is mounted as a firewire drive


if you open terminal you can surf the drive and find (extract) all the songs you want

sure the the software solutions are ideal ... but this was somethings i was curious about when i was reading posts about people having trouble extracting their songs from their iPod

xtremdav45
Dec 25, 2003, 01:22 AM
I agree with this article. Even though I live in Southern California, not Britain, I tried to buy a 10 GB iPod on Tuesday for myself, and no stores had them in stock, I had to buy online, and I wont get it til Friday, one day later than I wanted. I CANT WAIT!

iomar
Dec 25, 2003, 11:43 AM
This sound good! But I am still waiting for the lower end models. I think I will hear something on this MacWorld Expo at SF.

~Shard~
Dec 25, 2003, 11:57 AM
Originally posted by iomar
This sound good! But I am still waiting for the lower end models. I think I will hear something on this MacWorld Expo at SF.

Yep, that's what I'm waiting for!

MOM
Dec 25, 2003, 01:44 PM
From Apple's hometown newspaper:

http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/business/technology/7569501.htm

Its says iPods are hard to find, except maybe the high end.

~Shard~
Dec 25, 2003, 02:37 PM
This is a probably another reason why the rumored mini-iPods weren't released before Christmas - Apple was too busy manufacturing as many of the existing iPods as they could to meet the Xmas demand - and they still weren't able to keep up with it! Plus, why release the mini-iPods when the existing ones are selling so well on their own! My guess is now, in the background, Apple is slowly ramping up the mini-iPod production, and when they are officially released, and start selling like hotcakes (never understood that expression, btw....), this will give them more time to catch up on the existing iPod supplies, as they will not be in such high demand.

pkradd
Dec 25, 2003, 04:09 PM
Here ya go:

SELL LIKE HOT CAKES - "Hot cakes cooked in bear grease or pork lard were popular from earliest times in America. First made of cornmeal, the griddle cakes or pancakes were of course best when served piping hot and were often sold at church benefits, fairs, and other functions. So popular were they that by the beginning of the 19th century ‘to sell like hot cakes’ was a familiar expression for anything that sold very quickly effortlessly, and in quantity." From "Encyclopedia of Word and Phrase Origins" by Robert Hendrickson (Facts on File, New York, 1997)

xtremdav45
Dec 25, 2003, 06:05 PM
Its says iPods are hard to find, except maybe the high end.

Well I tried many stores in Los Angeles and the only ipods instock were 20 and 40 GB models.

Grimace
Dec 25, 2003, 07:25 PM
How much good would it have done Apple to have a whole lot more available??

a.) they couldn't have cleared their stock as easily for a possible upgraded model at MWSF

b.) the most in-demand products aren't always the most plentiful. If you hear, iPods are really hard to find, you may think - crap, I gotta get one of these before they are ALL sold out!

just my thoughts...

sushi
Dec 25, 2003, 08:05 PM
Originally posted by rdowns
I read it on the Internet. It must be true.
ROTFMLOL...

Yep, beatle888's explanation is way way way out there...as in not even close.

Sushi

beatle888
Dec 25, 2003, 08:23 PM
well i might of been a bit off, but the part about weird al recording five of the voices for apple is absolute truth.

pkradd
Dec 25, 2003, 08:25 PM
Apple could only guess the need for iPods during the Holiday season. They were simply not prepared for all the positive press about the device. They only have it made by a single vendor. Other products such as CD players, computers (PC) can be produced by more then one vendor for a company. Flat screen tv's (Plasma, LCD and DLP) were in short supply as well. It happens.

~Shard~
Dec 25, 2003, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by pkradd
Here ya go:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SELL LIKE HOT CAKES - "Hot cakes cooked in bear grease or pork lard were popular from earliest times in America. First made of cornmeal, the griddle cakes or pancakes were of course best when served piping hot and were often sold at church benefits, fairs, and other functions. So popular were they that by the beginning of the 19th century ‘to sell like hot cakes’ was a familiar expression for anything that sold very quickly effortlessly, and in quantity." From "Encyclopedia of Word and Phrase Origins" by Robert Hendrickson (Facts on File, New York, 1997)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



That's what I love about this site - you learn something new everyday. :cool:

sushi
Dec 25, 2003, 11:19 PM
Originally posted by beatle888 well i might of been a bit off, but the part about weird al recording five of the voices for apple is absolute truth.
Yeah, right?!

Reference please.

Sushi

~Shard~
Dec 25, 2003, 11:27 PM
Originally posted by sushi
Yeah, right?!

Reference please.

Sushi

I agree, I'd love to find out more about this claim. :cool:

iggyb
Dec 26, 2003, 12:04 PM
Two things...

First off, it's a shame Apple wasn't able to meet consumer demand. Granted, it's nice that they sold out, but not so good if many of those consumers went out and bought WMA player alternatives.

Second, it surprises me that they sold so well in a country that can't purchase songs from iTMS. I sure hope Apple has an international iTMS soon.

revenuee
Dec 26, 2003, 12:18 PM
Originally posted by iggyb
Two things...

First off, it's a shame Apple wasn't able to meet consumer demand. Granted, it's nice that they sold out, but not so good if many of those consumers went out and bought WMA player alternatives.

Second, it surprises me that they sold so well in a country that can't purchase songs from iTMS. I sure hope Apple has an international iTMS soon.

Well i'm not sure how it works in UK, Australia, or another one of the countries ... but here in Canada it's not illegal to download music from P2P or Web sites .... if you can find it .. .you can have it

iggyb
Dec 26, 2003, 12:23 PM
Well i'm not sure how it works in UK, Australia, or another one of the countries ... but here in Canada it's not illegal to download music from P2P or Web sites .... if you can find it .. .you can have it


As I understand it, though...isn't it illegal to upload the files?

pkradd
Dec 26, 2003, 12:37 PM
iggyb,

Apple like any other manufacturer of a
"hot" item for the Christmas season, simply underestimated the demand. It happens all the time. Almost every Christmas there's a product that sells-out, whether it be a Cabbage Patch Doll or an iPod. Apple's vendor could only manufacture so many units. As far as a single iTMS "internationally", that simply won't happen. There will be stores for individual countries just like the U.S. I expect SJ to announce iTMS for several countries at MWSF. Also it is not necessary to use iTMS to fill up an iPod. Most buyers will use iTunes to transfer their CD collection to the iPod I believe. iTMS is just a bonus.

It will be interesting to know how many iPods were sold in the past quarter. I'm betting that close to a milion were sold.

iggyb
Dec 26, 2003, 12:49 PM
pkradd -

Thank you for your input. I don't think Apple was necessarily ignorant in the shortage, but I have read news in the past where they didn't keep up with demand before, especially in PowerBooks. I understand that it's a tricky line to walk between demand and supply, but given that it seems that running short on supply for a product that your company believes will bring more converts over can block the number of future switchers.

I guess I should've said that there should be more iTMS in different countries, rather than an international iTMS. Granted, it's a bonus, not a necessity. However, I find it to be one he// of a bonus! Being able to purchase songs a la carte at a reasonable price is revolutionary. Taking away that benefit for the iPod takes away from its value. Obviously, the iPod is still one great machine (and the UK folk seem to agree), but it's kinda like buying a top of the line car without A/C.

Also, before I get flamed here, I realize that Apple is working with the regulations in those respective countries to release iTMS. I'm just wanting it to happen sooner! :)

revenuee
Dec 26, 2003, 01:09 PM
Originally posted by iggyb
As I understand it, though...isn't it illegal to upload the files?

Exactly

although with the resent tax added i'm staring to think that it's not illegal anymore ... because the royalties go from mp3 player purchase anyway

JJTiger1
Dec 26, 2003, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by iggyb

I understand that it's a tricky line to walk between demand and supply, but given that it seems that running short on supply for a product that your company believes will bring more converts over {snippage}


... and once in a while the demand will be over-estimated.

Lisa, Newton, Nu-bus ... and a long list of other technologies that didn't quite make the charts. People stayed away ... in droves.
=-=
Now, if the iPod could do video games ...
Now, if the iPod could do Palm PDA tasks ...

... ever more reasons to buy an improved iPod.
=-=
Happy Holidays
JJ

revenuee
Dec 26, 2003, 01:44 PM
Originally posted by JJTiger1
=-=
Now, if the iPod could do video games ...
Now, if the iPod could do Palm PDA tasks ...

... ever more reasons to buy an improved iPod.
=-=
Happy Holidays
JJ

This has been looked at and discussed to death on the forums ... LOL

i wouldn't mind a way to input data without a computer but until there is a mini keyboard support thats not gonna happen ...

pkradd
Dec 26, 2003, 02:08 PM
I think the iPod is successful because it does what it does - play music, very, very well. Games, contact lists, et al are not the selling point. When you have a device that tries to do too much, it winds up doing everything just a little worse then a dedicated one. Let's keep the iPod a music machine. Video can come to another device (or to your laptop). Just my opinion of course. In regards to getting enough iPods into the marketplace I believe Apple was at the mercy of a single manufacturer. Also, it's possible that production was EOL'd to make way for new upgrades. Although I believe Apple will introduce new low-cost MiniPods (hate that name) rather then any update to the current iPod at MWSF. My feeling is that an update to the iPod will occur in the Spring, possibly containing a color screen. There's no need to do anything with the current gen. as it is selling very well. But time will tell!

vouder17
Dec 26, 2003, 03:51 PM
in the apple centre in Johannesburg ,south africa they sold out all the 25 ipods apple gave them in under 3 days.Ipods in South africa cost approx. $450(R3150) for the 10 GB so there must be guite a serious demand for them.That really sucked cos my dad was gonna get me one for x-mas.

rdowns
Dec 26, 2003, 04:27 PM
Found this on iPodLounge

It still beat our overestimating expectations,' said Kawika Holbrook, assistant manager at the Apple Store at Westfield Shoppingtown Valley Fair, noting his store had sold thousands since Thanksgiving. Plus, fate may have conspired against a few iPod lovers. A large FedEx MD-10 airplane that caught fire Thursday in Memphis had a load of iPods on it, Holbrook said. 'The picture was being passed around the Net, and we were like, 'No!' 'Apple has not said whether any iPods were damaged, or whether that affected late-season availability."

http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/n364fe/photo.shtml

winmacguy
Dec 26, 2003, 05:06 PM
Originally posted by iggyb
Two things...

First off, it's a shame Apple wasn't able to meet consumer demand. Granted, it's nice that they sold out, but not so good if many of those consumers went out and bought WMA player alternatives.

Second, it surprises me that they sold so well in a country that can't purchase songs from iTMS. I sure hope Apple has an international iTMS soon.

Thats why I am waiting for Steve's announcement at MWSF as I figure this would be an ideal time to announce iTMS international since they should have completed all of the necessary negotiations for DRM and now enough people should have received iPods in their christmas stockings to create a serious world wide demand for iTMS if it wasnt there already. This would also serve to continue to momentum of global sales for iPods in the bulid up to the 100 million Pepsi promo at the Superbowl. I see 100million song down loads from iTMS as being easily achieveable inside a year from now one considering the xtra 1 million iPod owners world wide who would only have to down load 100 songs each to get to 100 million songs.

winmacguy
Dec 26, 2003, 05:15 PM
Originally posted by iggyb
As I understand it, though...isn't it illegal to upload the files?
At th moment under our current laws it is illegal to download and copy music in NZ

Shifty
Dec 26, 2003, 09:16 PM
I cannot get an iPod anywhere in London. Most shops have seriously sold out.

pkradd
Dec 27, 2003, 01:08 AM
The promotion to kick off in February will actually receive only about 25 percent response maximum. In other words, about 25 million downloads will actually be used (if that many). No promotion of this kind ever has the public cash-in on the full amount. In addition DRM is not the problem with opening iTMS in other countries. It is that each artist/label in each country has different agreements then the U.S. There are enormous legal problems. Don't forget it took Apple over a year to set up the rights for the U.S. Also, each country is going to have to have their own computer system to supply songs to customers, set up accounts, etc. The tracks will not be downloadable from the U.S. system. I expect an annoucement at MWSF on availability in the UK, France, Australia, Germany and Canada.

d.f
Dec 27, 2003, 08:16 AM
Originally posted by Vashti
Hey y'all. After lurking for months, you guys just inspired me to register. I have been seriously considering buying an Ipod in a month or two when I get my new laptop. I liked the idea of having most of my music in one place, perhaps even selling my very extensive cd collection. You guys have been saying that the quality difference is not noticeable unless you have better earphones. I value music very music and probably would have bought high quality headphones. So - will the music be less clear than my cds? For a person who puts a very high premium on music sound quality, would I be okay using my ipod instead of my various cd players? Thanks for the help!

(Hey, this posting stuff isn't so hard after all. Not bad for a technophobe.)

This is my main stumbling block..

I confess to being a bit of a snob, but i think it's fair to say that the difference in sound quality it equal to listening to a 'mini-system' and then listening to a £1000 seperates unit....

but for playing the music through a computer or 'in ear' headphones the difference is minimal. IMO

JJTiger1
Dec 27, 2003, 08:37 AM
Originally posted by rdowns
A large FedEx MD-10 airplane that caught fire Thursday in Memphis had a load of iPods on it

That's a long stretch of logic/conjecture: Apple is in the San Francisco Bay area. Oakland is in the San Francisco Bay area. The airplane from Oakland crashed. Therefore a load iPods got scortched???
=-=
FedEx will not publically release info of the cargo contents of that MD-10, or any other airplane that they operate.

Strong crosswinds contributed to the crash of the heavily loaded cargo jet.

If there had been iPods as part of the cargo shipment, an iPod would be in it's box, within an outer-box, within a sealed shipping container containing hundreds of other boxes.

The MD-10 freighter airplane transports dozens of sealed shipping containers, very few bulk/loose items. Fire needs air, and there is very little air between the sealed containers, and very little air between boxes within the sealed containers.

Cargo damaged by fire would be adjacent to the airplane's fuselage shell that was sprayed by escaping fuel from the cracked wing fuel tank, and damaged engine pylon.

The fire damage looks worse than it actually was. My un-named sources (airplane mechanics) say that the cargo survived pretty much intact. None the less, the airplane is a write-off. Salvage is in progress. The freight has been removed from the airplane and has already been sorted and sent off to the customers.

Sniff the box for any kerosene/Jet Fuel smell to verify how close your iPod was to the flames.
=-=
Go to Fedex.com for more info about your shipment info.

Be sure to have "Airway Bill" numbers at hand to track your shipment.

Your shipper should be able to provide you with an "Airway Bill" number.
=-=
FedEx hauls US Post Office/USPS Postal Shipments which require an optional-extra cost Postal shippping/tracking number.
=-=
Happy Post-Boxing Day.
JJ

pkradd
Dec 27, 2003, 11:53 AM
From Mac Daily News Dec. 25:

Kawika Holbrook, assistant manager at the Apple Store at Westfield Shoppingtown Valley Fair, notinged his store had "sold thousands since Thanksgiving. Plus, fate may have conspired against a few iPod lovers. A large FedEx MD-10 airplane that caught fire Thursday in Memphis had a load of iPods on it, Holbrook said. 'The picture was being passed around the Net, and we were like, 'No!'' Apple has not said whether any iPods were damaged, or whether that affected late-season availability," Fortt writes.

alandail
Dec 27, 2003, 01:47 PM
I got an iPod for christmas - so did my mom and we love ours. My sister-in-law told me thanksgiving that her daughters wanted a MP3 player for christmas - I told her the only one to get them is an iPod. She didn't listen to me, ended up getting them something else (don't know the brand), and they hate them. They love my iPod, though.

JayBee
Dec 27, 2003, 01:53 PM
mmmmmm.... new iPod for xmas. That and I'm getting promoted and married this coming year.

w00t for 2004 :D

beatle888
Dec 27, 2003, 05:27 PM
congratulations

micvog
Dec 27, 2003, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by rdowns
What took you so long?

Welcome.

Thanks for the welcome.

Regarding your question, I have no excuse. Call it stupidity... being cheap... whatever you want. Seeing Longhorn finally pushed me over the top.

dongmin
Dec 28, 2003, 02:32 PM
Originally posted by pkradd
It will be interesting to know how many iPods were sold in the past quarter. I'm betting that close to a milion were sold. it's shaping up to be quite a quarter for Apple with Power Macs shipping in volume, PowerBooks finally being updated in October, and iPods 'selling like hotcakes.' One million iPods mean $350-400 mil in iPod revenues alone. Add 500,000 PowerMacs ($1.2-1.5 bil), 300,000 PowerBooks ($600 mil), 200,000 iBooks ($240 mil), and 150,000 eMacs/iMacs ($225 mil). So with just the PCs and iPods, Apple could be in the $2.5 bil range in revenues. In the quarter before that, Apple did $1.7 bil.

On a different note, with the iPod channels being close to clear, Apple should be readying the next big release. The iPod shortages during this holiday season definitely bodes well for new iPods for MWSF. I'm siked.

JGowan
Dec 30, 2003, 12:37 AM
I went to my local CompUSA and using TAP, traded up from the 30GB to the 40GB recently!

It wasn't like the old days though when you traded up and walked out minutes later with a bigger ipod (I've had the 5, 10, 15, 20 & 30 with the plan) ... I had to leave my ipod there and they had to "approve" the situation. I was without an ipod for about 10 days.

Finally, they called me. The Apple rep there told me that I had gotten the last 40GB ipod and that they only had a few 10GB ipods left.

Wahoo!

JGowan
Dec 30, 2003, 01:21 AM
Originally posted by d.f
I have tons of CD's but hate MP3's. Can i store my music without compression onto the iPod. There are actual HD recorders out there (Yammaha) which copy direct and don't compress?
any advice..?As someone has already stated, you'd only be able to archive about 60 CDs onto Apple's biggest unit of 40GB... man, what a waste.

You are looking at MP3s all wrong. Perhaps you're only familiar with 128kbps files... maybe you just need to experiment with different bit rates to find one that will allow you to make the most of your IPOD space.

Have you ripped any CDs using AAC at 160 or even 192? AAC is MUCH better than MP3

I can't imagine you not being able to find a high enough rate so that you can put your "tons of CDs" all on the 'pod.

To date, I've got 9505 songs (or 875 Albums) on my new 40gigger!

875 CDs VS 60 CDs... it's your choice.

JGowan
Dec 30, 2003, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by iggyb
... it's a shame Apple wasn't able to meet consumer demand. Granted, it's nice that they sold out, but not so good if many of those consumers went out and bought WMA player alternatives.That's a big "IF". In my opinion, those that couldn't find ANY sized ipod, will most likely wait until more come shortly after the New Year.

I think people who are specifically hunting the IPOD know their value over all the others. If Grandma bought little Jimmy a Nomad instead of an iPod, you can bet Jim's gonna take that sucker back as soon as can.

FYI to All Grandmas: Save your receipts for your "little Jimmys".

OutThere
Dec 31, 2003, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by beatle888
well, ok then, i'll enlighten you. the mp3 format is a unique compression algorithm that scans every note of the song and puts them into a "pile". so lets say one song has 100 C Major notes, the "C Major pile" will contain 100 items in that pile. unless of course song two has 50 C Major notes, then as you can probably guess, the C Major pile would contain 150 items. this happens to the sound frequency as well...thats how the ipod reproduces the sound of the instrument. now the lyrics are a different story...think of the ipod as a huge dictionary...it really has every word used by most rock, rap and country artist...this isnt really that extensive but still impressive. so lets say a song has the word "shotgun" in it, well the ipod will search its "common" dictionary (since this word is use in most genres) and applies the correct frequency to the lyric...then it searches its vocal database made up of ten vocalists...(come to find out that in the popular music industry theres only ten distinct voices...five of which weird al recorded for apple)....and presto, you have your song.

now since all this info is stacked in "piles", all the mp3 format has to do is record how many times a certain number of notes, or what vocal sound to use at a specified frequency....this makes the file size much smaller and you can fit more songs onto a hard drive.


Wow! I really am enlightened, and I just thought that the Mp3 format broke down the sound wave form into a choppier block, losing sections from the originally smooth wave form to save space! What a sillyhead I must be!