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KJmoon117
Jul 30, 2008, 08:19 AM
I realized that I have a deep interest for photography after I started to play around a lot with my friend's Rebel XTi and my dad's Nikon D80 and now I'm thinking about investing in my own DSLR.

So far I have my mind set on the Canon Rebel XTi (body) yet I'm confused on the lens. I will mainly use this camera to take pictures of landscapes, cities, people (portraits), and anything else that comes my way. I'm doubtful that I'll be taking picture of sports but I want to leave my options open. Now I won't be shooting for clients (cept myself heh) and I would like to stay in a tight budget since I'm only in 10th grade.

Now I was thinking of the XSi kit lens but I'm wondering if this lens will satisfy my needs, if there are other lens out there that I should look at, and opinions would be nice.

Thank you,
KJ



matperk
Jul 30, 2008, 08:21 AM
For doing landscapes I have absolutely no issues with the kit lens. If there's possibility you'll do indoor stuff (low light) or sports, I would look at getting something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-50mm-1-8-Camera-Lens/dp/B00007E7JU

From what I've heard it's pretty good. It's fixed but great in low light.

Kebabselector
Jul 30, 2008, 08:25 AM
The kits lens often gets slated but personally get it, then learn how to get the best out of it. Once you've mastered the camera/kit then look at lenses.

pigbat
Jul 30, 2008, 08:26 AM
The lens matperk suggested is a great lens for the money. I just replaced my kit lens with:

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-17-85mm-4-5-6-Stabilized-Digital/dp/B0002Y5WXO

matperk
Jul 30, 2008, 08:28 AM
The lens matperk suggested is a great lens for the money. I just replaced my kit lens with:

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-17-85mm-4-5-6-Stabilized-Digital/dp/B0002Y5WXO

damn. I wish I could afford that... :rolleyes:

KJmoon117
Jul 30, 2008, 08:34 AM
The lens matperk suggested is a great lens for the money. I just replaced my kit lens with:

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-17-85mm-4-5-6-Stabilized-Digital/dp/B0002Y5WXO

Thanks guys :D

If taking picture of my friends while inside a restaurant/house/etc is what you mean by indoors then I'll take a look at the lens. But as side from that, I'm more of an out doors person so I don't think I'll be taking much pictures in doors.

For the 17-85mm, I saw the review for that on Cameralabs and then I went to check the price and lmao, that's really out of my budget seeing that I'll be buying an extra 80$ battery pack + 2~4GB CF Card ><'

But is there an 'all-purpose' lens that I can start out and would the XSi kit lens be good for that? Because I'll be carrying around my camera around the city a lot and carrying an extra lens seems risky at the moment.

Thanks,
KJ

OreoCookie
Jul 30, 2008, 08:35 AM
For landscapes, you could get Tokina's famous 12-24 lens. Since a successor has been introduced, you should be able to get this lens at a reasonable price. It has very good image quality and its built quality is close to L glass (Canon's professional lenses). If you add the nifty fifty, you should have a nice combo which is much better in quality than the kit lens.

Edit: I just saw your reply: what is your budget?

KJmoon117
Jul 30, 2008, 08:53 AM
For landscapes, you could get Tokina's famous 12-24 lens. Since a successor has been introduced, you should be able to get this lens at a reasonable price. It has very good image quality and its built quality is close to L glass (Canon's professional lenses). If you add the nifty fifty, you should have a nice combo which is much better in quality than the kit lens.

Edit: I just saw your reply: what is your budget?

My total budget is ≈800$ total with body, 1 extra battery, and a 2~4GB CF (not sure on the size either, I hear 2GB is sufficient but I'm the kind of guy who likes to have room when it comes to memory), and lens.

But I think when the Rebel XS comes out to the States (if it hasn't already) then the XTi body might go down in price.

Btw, what exactly is a "nifty-fifty"? Like a lens that's fixed at 50mm? and why is it a must have in every photographers kit?

OreoCookie
Jul 30, 2008, 09:07 AM
My total budget is ≈800$ total with body, 1 extra battery, and a 2~4GB CF (not sure on the size either, I hear 2GB is sufficient but I'm the kind of guy who likes to have room when it comes to memory), and lens.
That's a bit tight.
The XTi's body sells for $570 on bhphoto which leaves you with next to nothing for a lens. I'd rather suggest you save up a little more until you can afford something you actually want. With the budget you have, you have no choice but going for the kit lens or some crappy alternative which isn't really that much better.

If you insist on getting a camera now, at least get the nifty fifty 1.8/50 mm lens.

I also think that you might not need a second battery right away. I know that the XTi is nowhere near as good as the Nikon D80 (which is my weapon of choice) as far as battery life goes, but I have never exhausted one set of batteries, even after 600 photos taken during a wedding.

pigbat
Jul 30, 2008, 09:38 AM
I used the kit lens for years before I upgraded and it served me fine. I'd still be using it today if something hadn't gone wrong with it.

I'd also wait on the second battery pack. I haven't run out of battery during a shoot yet.

KJmoon117
Jul 30, 2008, 09:45 PM
I'll reconsider on the extra battery pack but so far I'm thinking about buying the XSi kit lens and the 50mm f/1.8.

That should amount to something around $800~$900 and I'll try and save up to $1,000 and see how much more options I have.

My last question is though, how big should the CF be? If I'll be shooting switching from JPEG and RAW.

Thanks,
KJ

ManWithhat
Jul 30, 2008, 11:51 PM
Reposting my advice from a similar thread.

Here's my advice to you (and to my friend who just got his camera with the same advice). Go to eBay and search 'dell coupon'. Look for an E&A (Electronics and Accessories) coupon for 10% off that doesn't exclude cameras (ask the seller if need be) -- you should get it for about $4-10 and it'll give you $50+ off. Anyways, buy XTi from Dell ($489ish shipped).

Also here's a great starter lens. It's an updated version of what the XTi comes with and it has IS.
http://sigma4less.com/canon-zoom-wid...imported-.html

It's $120 and it is imported . . there's no difference between the imported and US versions of lenses besides that you may have to send the lens internationally for the warranty if something were to happen instead of New York.

It's a great starter setup, most definitely. Keep in mind that with DSLRs or SLRs in general, it's the lens/glass that makes the image quality and not so much the camera. So start a small lens fund and add to it monthly if you want to expand your lens collection and improve your shot quality.

huskydsl
Jul 30, 2008, 11:54 PM
If your purpose is to learn to become a great photographer, then i recommend spending just enough to get the camera and the cheap 50mm f/1.8 fixed lens. Using a fixed lens will force you to learn about composition by making YOU move rather than just zooming in and out like average folks. Spend the rest of the money on a community camera course. Some city's parks departments offer them cheap in summer. Community centers do as well. Have fun.

huskydsl
Jul 30, 2008, 11:55 PM
OH, the best walkabout lens is probably the 24-70 f/2.8 L... but I think it's well more $ than the camera itself.

Cave Man
Jul 31, 2008, 12:26 AM
OH, the best walkabout lens is probably the 24-70 f/2.8 L... but I think it's well more $ than the camera itself.

On a crop camera? I think most people wouldn't believe so.

Cave Man
Jul 31, 2008, 12:27 AM
My total budget is ≈800$

For that much money, you should consider getting the XT and the Sigma 17-70. Otherwise, with the XTi you're pretty much stuck with the kit lens or nifty.

miles01110
Jul 31, 2008, 01:29 AM
Personally I don't think the 50mm f1.8 is that great in low light. Has major focusing issues.

ManWithhat
Jul 31, 2008, 08:25 AM
For that much money, you should consider getting the XT and the Sigma 17-70. Otherwise, with the XTi you're pretty much stuck with the kit lens or nifty.

If he follows my advice, the XTi and the 18-55mm IS would be around $630 with taxes and shipped.

Scarlet Fever
Jul 31, 2008, 08:41 AM
Personally I don't think the 50mm f1.8 is that great in low light. Has major focusing issues.

For a lens of its price, its capabilities at low light don't really matter. It's a brilliant beginners lens. It's taught me a lot.

KJmoon117, I reckon you should get the 400D (XTi, whatever its called there) with the kit lens and a 50mm f/1.8. You'll get some basic zoom with the kit, as well as the ability to play around with depth of field with the 50mm. Once you've started with that, you'll want to spend every earned dollar on photographic equipment.

Also, set up a flickr or deviantart account. There are a lot of people there with some great advice.

seamuskrat
Jul 31, 2008, 08:48 AM
My costco has the camera, kit lens, battery and data card for $999 with a $100 instant rebate. Skighty more than your budget but a solid package and good company to buy from.

That's a bit tight.
The XTi's body sells for $570 on bhphoto which leaves you with next to nothing for a lens. I'd rather suggest you save up a little more until you can afford something you actually want. With the budget you have, you have no choice but going for the kit lens or some crappy alternative which isn't really that much better.

If you insist on getting a camera now, at least get the nifty fifty 1.8/50 mm lens.

I also think that you might not need a second battery right away. I know that the XTi is nowhere near as good as the Nikon D80 (which is my weapon of choice) as far as battery life goes, but I have never exhausted one set of batteries, even after 600 photos taken during a wedding.

KJmoon117
Jul 31, 2008, 09:17 AM
Well this is where it all goes to hell ><', I currently live in Korea so many of the suggested stores and such I have no access to.
I have an access to an APO address (friend's :D) but shipping is a very risky process that I don't want my future dSLR to be involved in atm.

However, I went to the retailer in Korea to check up on the price, here is what I got.

Canon Kiss X (400d/XTi) - $540 (Body only)
Canon 50mm f/1.8 - $120
4GB CompactFlash - $35 (Brand, speed, etc doesn't matter atm)
XSi Kit Lens (18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS) - $800 or $80 (Salesperson told me that the total kit was $880 and w/o the body it was $800, but that's impossible -_-)

[Yet my Korean isn't the best so there were obvious screw ups i.e. XSI Kit Lens]

Which totals to about ≈$695, so next time I'll have to go in there to get an exact price check on the 18-55mm, but is the XTi kit lens really that bad as said by others? How does it compare with the XSi and if the difference in price worth it?

Thanks,
KJ

~ I think the camera body is cheaper in Korea seeing that it's very close to Japan yet the lenses seem more expensive, i.e 50mm costs $40 more here than in the States :/

Phrasikleia
Jul 31, 2008, 09:44 AM
is the XTi kit lens really that bad as said by others? How does it compare with the XSi and if the difference in price worth it?

I never had the older kit lens that comes with the XTi, so I can't say how bad it is, but all the reviews of the new version (which I do have) say that they are like night and day. For starters, the new kit lens has stabilization and enables me to take shots handheld as slow as 1/4s (!). It's also quite a bit sharper than the old kit lens, as this review (http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/canon_18-55_3p5-5p6_is_c16/page3.asp) shows. (Regarding sharpness, they say: "It distinctly outperforms the more expensive 17-85mm at wide angle, and matches it over most of the rest of its range; however this is tempered by a slightly disappointing performance at telephoto.")

ChrisBrightwell
Jul 31, 2008, 10:19 AM
So far I have my mind set on the Canon Rebel XTi (body) yet I'm confused on the lens. I will mainly use this camera to take pictures of landscapes, cities, people (portraits), and anything else that comes my way. I'm doubtful that I'll be taking picture of sports but I want to leave my options open. Now I won't be shooting for clients (cept myself heh) and I would like to stay in a tight budget since I'm only in 10th grade.

I'd go with the kit lens for general shooting and the 50mm f/1.8 II for waist-up to shoulder-up portraits and low-light shooting.

Between those two, you should be able to figure out what you want out of a lens (or lens combination) and invest your money more wisely.

JBmac
Jul 31, 2008, 10:35 AM
I use a Nikon D40X, and I have the kit lens, a Sigma 17-35 wide angle lens, a 1.8 Nikon 50mm, and the 70-200 VR Nikon Telephoto lenses. I mention this because the lens I use the most is a Lensbaby 2.0 and Lensbaby 3G selective focus lenses. I have more fun, and takes tons of pictures with those 2 lenses. I have the Wide Angle and Telephoto adapter, and also the Macro lens adapters too. I have to shoot in Manual Mode, so it forces me to learn more about what I am doing, and to focus (or not to focus) on making better compositions. Good Luck with whatever you choose!

scuzy
Jul 31, 2008, 02:00 PM
the Tamron 17-50mm is a nice lens for starter.

Edge100
Jul 31, 2008, 03:29 PM
For a lens of its price, its capabilities at low light don't really matter.

Huh?

The whole point of fast glass is to be able to shoot in low light (well, that an to get OOF effects, which, frankly, the 50/1.8 isn't all that great at either, unless you like pentagon-shaped bokeh).

The 50/1.8 is an absolute dog at focusing in low light. If that is why you're buying it, don't waste your time.

Not to mention the fact that on a crop sensor body, it's too long to be a walkaround.

If you're just learning, stick with the kit lens, which will allow you to learn the camera functions and to compose photographs. They wont be super contrasty or super sharp, but you'll learn. Then move up to a decent prime or zoom lens (or two).

KJmoon117
Jul 31, 2008, 11:06 PM
At the moment I'm going to aim with the XTi with the nifty fifty seeing that learning proper composition should be the first thing.

Yet because of that, I think I'll be investing in the EF 18-55mm IS later. But I have been hearing that the IS and the new kit lens is soo much better (thanks guys) than the XTi, so I guess I'll just save for the IS.

Thanks,
KJ