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3rdpath
May 22, 2002, 02:14 PM
since i'm quite sure we won't stop the fighting in the middle east...and i believe that change in the world starts with the little deeds we do on a daily basis....

i was wondering what conscious decisions macrumors posters have made to make the world a better place.

feel free to pat yourself on the back!

things i do:

recycle
use an electric mower and no leafblower
don't buy sweatshop goods( to my knowledge)
spend more time with my daughter than without her each day.

i guess what i'm hoping for is the exchange of ideas...cause i know i could do more.

jelloshotsrule
May 22, 2002, 02:21 PM
don't eat meat (well, free range turkey at thanksgiving)
recycle.
use a pretty fuel efficient car (30+ mpg)
try to avoid sweatshops. so damn hard though... even converse all stars have been shipped off to sweatshops now.


sounds about it to me.

Hemingray
May 22, 2002, 02:23 PM
1. Working at school, I print out our packets as double-sided to reduce paper usage.
2. I try and conserve electricity and water whenever possible.
3. Try to keep myself fit, which affects my self-esteem and ultimately my attitude towards others.

These are all little things of course, but if all of us do little things like that it makes a bigger difference! Even if only we do something and no one else around us does, we're still making a difference no matter how small it is.

Mr. Anderson
May 22, 2002, 02:30 PM
Recycle
Pick up trash in the street when I'm walking the dog
Walk, bike as much as possible to aviod using the car (living in Old Town makes this easier since everything is within walking distance). But it might also be attributed to having a dog to some degree. Sort of does double duty....

jelloshotsrule
May 22, 2002, 02:36 PM
3rdpath (or anyone)

do you know of any t shirt manufacturers that are totally sweatshop free? i ask because i know hanes has had some problems... and i'm sure others have too.

generally i buy blank t shirts (in bulk) and then put designs/phrases/lyrics on them...

just curious if there's a particular brand i should be trying harder to support.

of note: over the summer (last summer) i lived in harlem. well, the idea came up b/w myself and my brother that often times it's the poor inner city folks who are buying over priced nikes and things like that, which are clearly sweatshopped. so we went around with a camera, in harlem, and in central park. and asked people about sweatshops. what they knew, what brands they bought, if they'd pay 10 bucks more for non sweatshop shoes... and most didn't know the facts. most bought cheap shoes for themselves and high priced for their kids, and most WOULD pay 10 bucks more for non sweatshops... it's very interesting. most people just don't know... hmm

britboy
May 22, 2002, 02:53 PM
I bike to university every day, and use public transport wherever possible.
Split my rubbish into three bins: bio, plastics, everything else.
Only eat chicken for meats.
Give kids a piece of my mind when i see them just dropping their waste on the street, when there's a bin less than 5m away (that get's on my nerves, sorry)

Jelloshotsrule~ have you tried t-shirts by Fruits of the Loom? (i think that's what they're called)

3rdpath
May 22, 2002, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
3rdpath (or anyone)
do you know of any t shirt manufacturers that are totally sweatshop free? i ask because i know hanes has had some problems... and i'm sure others have too.


mt next batch of t's will be from The Recycled Trash co. # 800-53trash.

they make all their clothes from the the waste of other manufacturers( up to 50% of cotton is thrown away in the manufacturing process...). i haven't seen them yet but they are highly recommended by my favorite source of eco news--a mag called " a real life"(802-893-7040). they also recommend patagonia and ecosport.

btw, very interesting on the nike research. it really shows that knowledge ( and access to information) is the key to change.

spuncan
May 22, 2002, 03:56 PM
New Balance produces goods in the U.S. but gets the parts from elseware
My Ev Safe stuff
Recycle
Don't trash computers or TV's just keep them to mess with or donate.
No longer send mail only electronically (hey it counts :) )
I would like to get fuel efficiant car when I buy one 1 month till drivers ed :D
but they lack in performance so Im waiting till Fuel Cells.

Mr. Anderson
May 22, 2002, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by spuncan
but they lack in performance so Im waiting till Fuel Cells.

You will be waiting years for a truly efficient Fuel Cell car, but that would be a nice thing to have. The technology just isn't there yet, but it holds huge promise. Now if we can just get more efficient solar panels, so much energy is going to waste....

3rdpath
May 22, 2002, 11:15 PM
i was looking into one of the electric rav4's that toyo sells here in california--until i found out they were around $48,000.00. i'm all for green transportation, heck, i'll even pay a premium but NOT that much.

if you've never ridden in an electric car-its a weird experience.....your mind keeps waiting for the sound of an engine -then you just zoom quietly down the street. too cool.

Mr. Anderson
May 22, 2002, 11:19 PM
Originally posted by 3rdpath
if you've never ridden in an electric car-its a weird experience.....your mind keeps waiting for the sound of an engine -then you just zoom quietly down the street. too cool.

Once we go to an all electric and fuel cell automobile, it will reduce the amount of sound pollution as well. Which will be very strange.

AlphaTech, what are you going to do on your electric Harley when it won't make any noise? That will be wierd:D

3rdpath
May 22, 2002, 11:29 PM
Originally posted by dukestreet
Once we go to an all electric and fuel cell automobile, it will reduce the amount of sound pollution as well. Which will be very strange.


i so look forward to that day. noise pollution is my pet peeve. first the autos and trucks( and harleys...) then those friggin leafblowers. i swear my neighbor bought all of his gardening tools based upon their incredible loudness.....and he just blows all the stuff into the street...maybe thats why i'm so anti-gun...he'd be dead and i'd be in prison.:eek:

Backtothemac
May 23, 2002, 12:25 AM
I posted something similar in another thread, but here goes.

Introduce yourself to a person of a differnet race. Go to a church of a different denomination. If your athest, go to a church on weekend. Find a homeless person and buy them lunch. Take the time to live life. My mother died at 39, and the lesson that I learned is don't sweat the small stuff, and everything is small stuff. Make the world a better place by being a better person. That means, love as much as possible, and learn as much as possible. Experience that which you do not know.

For EX: One weekend I went to an all Black church in Birmingham. Although I am 3/4 Native American, I look white. You would think that I would be shunned right? No, I was welcomed with open arms, and had one of the most awesome exeriences that I have ever had in a church.

Adopt a pet, and fill its life with love.

alex_ant
May 23, 2002, 01:04 AM
To those of you who:

1) Recycle
2) Aspire to use electric energy instead of that derived from fossil fuels

I hope you realize that recycling is highly inefficient and uses tons of energy. Your goal, my goal, and everyone's goal should be to simply consume less.

Likewise, if the power plant in your neighborhood is fossil-fueled, the use of your electric car / lawn mower / whatever is actually doing more damage to the environment than it would if it had its own gasoline-powered ICB. There are some cases this is not true, as with e.g. the Honda Insight (which is powered in part by kinetic energy), but generally, it is.

I'm going to offend everyone here with the following paragraphs. There is a trend in the USA (and indeed in much of modern society the world over), a product I believe of materialism and consumerism, to try to justify one's actions by saying, "well, I do my part. I bought a station wagon instead of an SUV. I recycle... mostly. I usually turn off the lights when I'm not using them..." and so on. I'm sorry, but this is rubbish.

If you really, really cared about the environment, that fact would be reflected in your actions. VERY few people really do care about the environment a great deal. "I care about the environment!," you say. Well, that's great. What is that, you say? Your electricity supply is derived from coal? You have two computers running constantly? You throw your computers away when you're done using them? You throw away batteries, too? You have a big-screen TV, and an extra-large refrigerator? You eat meat? You shower, and you flush the toilet after every piss? You wash your hands several times per day? With SOAP? You buy your food from a supermarket, from where it comes packed in layer upon layer of non-biodegradeable plastic? You throw away what you don't eat? You smoke? You own a leaf blower, a tiller, a lawn mower, a weed-whacker, or other powered gardening tool? You have and use a washing machine? You don't know who your city councilpersons or your state representatives are? You're not familiar with the processes of your local, state, or federal governments, such that you would be able to play a part in changing the often disgraceful environmental policies at these levels? You're not even up to speed with current environmental laws, statues, rules, bills, and proposals? I'm sorry. You are not doing your part.

You need to revise your statements - instead of saying "I care about the environment," you need to say "I care about the environment to the extent that I am not inconvenienced." That's what it all boils down to, isn't it?

I'm just as guilty as all of you are, but I don't try to justify my sorry practices with phrases like, "well, it's the little things that count." I am 100% clear on the fact that I am a terrible, gluttonous citizen of civilization, and I am indeed ashamed of this fact, but I will never try to pretend that I am not. In short, you all should feel as sorry for yourselves as I feel for myself. You have three choices: 1) Make like Ed Begley Jr., and start doing your part to the maximum extent realistically possible (the ideal option), 2) be hypocrites, or 3) be like me, sorry and apathetic but not blind to the fact that the environment is completely ****ed and getting worse every day and you're doing what amounts to essentially nothing to help. "Pat yourself on the back" my ****ing arse. You're all sad and pathetic. (And so am I).

Alex

3rdpath
May 23, 2002, 02:05 AM
b2tm,
you said a threadful. and if i may steal your line" can i get an amen...".

alex,
you make some good points but your anger is unproductive. and you tend to judge everyone else by your own admitted inaction....which is unfair. if anyone should be angry, it should be ed begley-he's doing more than anyone else......but he walks the walk and quietly talks the talk.

there's a lesson in there somewhere.

jelloshotsrule
May 23, 2002, 02:10 AM
Originally posted by 3rdpath
mt next batch of t's will be from The Recycled Trash co. # 800-53trash.

they make all their clothes from the the waste of other manufacturers( up to 50% of cotton is thrown away in the manufacturing process...). i haven't seen them yet but they are highly recommended by my favorite source of eco news--a mag called " a real life"(802-893-7040). they also recommend patagonia and ecosport.

btw, very interesting on the nike research. it really shows that knowledge ( and access to information) is the key to change.

i'll look into that.

i'm also gonna try to find some socially aware web sites... for instance adbusters.org and see if they have links to sweatshop free/eco friendly shops... or if they recommend brands...

as i said, converse even recently moved to sweatshops. in nyc i was still able to find the made in usa all stars and got a pair, while my brother got a few so as to have some. too bad they're uncomfortable... hmm. and vans moved to sweatshops about 4 years ago... uggh.

i did get the recent 'vegetarian times' magazine and they have a place that has all leather/animal free goods. and i'd bet they'd be sweatshop free... if you're interested, let me know and i'll find and post the link....

jelloshotsrule
May 23, 2002, 02:42 AM
i just checked out ecosport t shirts online...

dang. they're 17 bucks for one... i can usually find em for like 4 bucks a pop..... hmmm...

gotta find the recycled trash ones.... you think it's true that these places are probably sweatshop free or what?

alex_ant
May 23, 2002, 02:43 AM
Originally posted by 3rdpath
alex,
you make some good points but your anger is unproductive.
I'm glad you seem to agree with me. Would you rather I adopted a positive attitude? "We're pissing all over the environment, but I turn my lights off when I leave the room! Happy happy! I'm going to pat myself on the back now, because I'm special, and I deserve it! And hey, I found a piece of litter on the ground today - I picked it up and put it in the trash! I am truly 'green' now! Hooray!"

I have every right in the world to be angry, not least at myself, and I'm going to take full advantage of that fact. Any environmentalist who adopts a peace-love-earth attitude in the face of 1) widespread personal irresponsibility & apathy, and 2) mass corporate corruption of the eco-political system, is a ****ing disgrace who is doing more harm than good.
and you tend to judge everyone else by your own admitted inaction....which is unfair.
My post was not intended to apply to everyone, nor did it. My guess, though, is that it covered about 99.98% of all Macrumors readers, including both you and I.
if anyone should be angry, it should be ed begley-he's doing more than anyone else......but he walks the walk and quietly talks the talk.

there's a lesson in there somewhere.
Which is what? Stay quiet and let people trash the environment while you sit in solitude in your solar-powered eco-hut? Ed Begley does great things for the environment, but our culture is such that the consumer rules, and that damaging the environment is a matter of individual liberty. Ed Begley would turn himself into a pariah, and be seen as a complete hippie wank-job, if he used his celebrity status (more or less) to speak out loudly. Which, I'm guessing, is part of the reason he doesn't.

Alex

krossfyter
May 23, 2002, 03:00 AM
everyone knows that all people have good points and band points. i often times make it my duty to highlight the good points in people. i try my best to uplift. if i have something bad to say about a person i try not to say anything at all. i want to make everyone feel like they are special when i meet them or ones that i have known for a while. because everyone is in thier own way. now if you feel like gaging because of this post go ahead just do it in style!!!

but yeah man....thats my little part in helping out the world.


positivity is contagious.



dig it.

krossfyter
May 23, 2002, 03:14 AM
i respect anyone who tries to do for thier world out of a caring heart. if they think they are doing good....i respect that. but im unconvinced that most environmentalisms goals will be meet. i just think if the world system is going to decay then its going to decay...and there is nothing we can do about it. if its going to get more rosie then it will do that regardless of how much trash seems to corrupt it. i believe its independent of our "lifestyle" actions.... and this does not include intentional actions such as nukes.

however..... i know i might be wrong and i cant really speak objectivly on this subject....so i am simply stating my opinion. i just havent recieved any info to change my opinion for some reason.

wsteineker
May 23, 2002, 04:09 AM
First, I'd like to say that this is one of the more thoughtful threads I've seen on this board. I applaud all of you for taking the time to make it special.

Second, about B2TMs post. Beautiful post. I try to do the same thing with my spiritual life. I know you've visited other denominations, but have you ever visited other religions? I attended a Temple service on Yom Kippur last year, and it was one of the most rewarding experiences of my life. It was made all the more powerful when, a few months later, I learned of my family's Jewish heritage.

Finally, my list. I do recycle, but I try to do other things that allow me to avoid using new goods at all. I buy a lot of my tech good used. No new materials or energy are used for these items, and they're usually good as new. When I do have to buy new, I try to limit my shopping to companies that release environmental impact reports and that have a proven track record when it comes to environmental issues (i.e. Patagonia). Also, I don't buy more than what I need. I find that this really helps with the amount of waste I produce. I bike to school and keep my car well tuned. This cuts down on the pollution level drastically. I volunteer for domestic violence and women's rights, and I only eat free range meat. Organic vegetables too. And I try to be kind. Smiling and actively showing concern for the world and her people has such a massive impact. Try smiling at a stranger sometime. See if it doesn't change your world a little bit. And I also try to remember that we're all the same. Forget about color or creed, we're all human and we're all fallible. Just my $.02. :)

krossfyter
May 23, 2002, 04:52 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac
I posted something similar in another thread, but here goes.

Introduce yourself to a person of a differnet race. Go to a church of a different denomination. If your athest, go to a church on weekend. Find a homeless person and buy them lunch. Take the time to live life. My mother died at 39, and the lesson that I learned is don't sweat the small stuff, and everything is small stuff. Make the world a better place by being a better person. That means, love as much as possible, and learn as much as possible. Experience that which you do not know.

For EX: One weekend I went to an all Black church in Birmingham. Although I am 3/4 Native American, I look white. You would think that I would be shunned right? No, I was welcomed with open arms, and had one of the most awesome exeriences that I have ever had in a church.

Adopt a pet, and fill its life with love.



i overwhemlmingly agree with you. thanks for sharing that.

Macmaniac
May 23, 2002, 07:33 AM
Buy a Honda Civiv Hybrid, recycle, everyone own a mac, put limits on emmissions, plant trees.

britboy
May 23, 2002, 07:48 AM
Originally posted by Macmaniac
Buy a Honda Civiv Hybrid, recycle, everyone own a mac, put limits on emmissions, plant trees.

... and get Bush to stick to the Kyoto Agreement.

wsteineker
May 23, 2002, 08:28 AM
... and get Bush to stick to the Kyoto Agreement.

Or just avoid voting Republican altogether. :)

Mr. Anderson
May 23, 2002, 08:43 AM
Originally posted by wsteineker


Or just avoid voting Republican altogether. :)

This is not allowed to turn into a political thread.....we've got a good one going already

http://www.macrumors.com/forums/showthread.php3?threadid=5028

Backtothemac
May 23, 2002, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by wsteineker
Second, about B2TMs post. Beautiful post. I try to do the same thing with my spiritual life. I know you've visited other denominations, but have you ever visited other religions? I attended a Temple service on Yom Kippur last year, and it was one of the most rewarding experiences of my life. It was made all the more powerful when, a few months later, I learned of my family's Jewish heritage.

Yes, I have been to differnet denominations, and different religions. I too have attended Temple, I have been to Shamman ceromonies, and have been to Mosque as well. I have tried to delve into as many religions as possible. The one common trait in them all, is peace, and love. It is sad that so many people miss that message.

As far as the arguing going on here. It is in our nature to argue, however, lets do so with a little tact, and dignity. Understanding that if we open our minds, we might just learn something, and make the world a better place. ;)

wsteineker
May 23, 2002, 09:05 AM
My bad. :) Chalk it up to youthful exuberance. Won't happen again, as the lesson is learned.

Mr. Anderson
May 23, 2002, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac
As far as the arguing going on here. It is in our nature to argue, however, lets do so with a little tact, and dignity. Understanding that if we open our minds, we might just learn something, and make the world a better place. ;)

I didn't notice any arguing, or are you talking about the forums in general? I'm all for open minds, btw. If I can make some one look at something different, change perspective on them, then I consider it a good thing. I like to encourage out of the box thinking as much as possible.

wsteineker
May 23, 2002, 09:12 AM
Insightfulness seems to be your newest endeavor, B2TM. Though I do have a feeling that you've been at it for some time now. As for your religious experimentation, I applaud you again. I to have had the privilege of not only multiple Christian denominations, but the aforementioned Temple service as well as several Mosques. I've also been privy to a few Buddhist, Hindu, and even Zoroastrian ceremonies. Truly life changing. You're right about the unifying principles, you know. Each of these religions has taught me to love and respect my fellow man and the world that we all share. Peace is always the message, and I feel blessed to have received it from so many different messengers.

Backtothemac
May 23, 2002, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by dukestreet


I didn't notice any arguing, or are you talking about the forums in general? I'm all for open minds, btw. If I can make some one look at something different, change perspective on them, then I consider it a good thing. I like to encourage out of the box thinking as much as possible.

Actually I should have said tone rather than arguing. I scanned through the first page of the thread, and there was a rough tone to some degree. Also, I think in the forums in general are very well discussed. Every once in a while someone will get nuts over something, and then all H#ll breaks loose. Anyway, I am in philosophical mode today, so please forgive me for my lets all hug and make love rants today
;)

wsteineker
May 23, 2002, 09:14 AM
What's wrong with hugging and making love? ;)

Mr. Anderson
May 23, 2002, 09:14 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac
Anyway, I am in philosophical mode today, so please forgive me for my lets all hug and make love rants today
;)

Well, I did the macs and philosophy thread, but I don't think there's been a Macs and Love thread. Since you're in the mood today, why not go to general and start it up?

Do you love your mac????

Backtothemac
May 23, 2002, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by dukestreet


Well, I did the macs and philosophy thread, but I don't think there's been a Macs and Love thread. Since you're in the mood today, why not go to general and start it up?

Do you love your mac????

Will do. That should be a fun one.

jelloshotsrule
May 23, 2002, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac
For EX: One weekend I went to an all Black church in Birmingham. Although I am 3/4 Native American, I look white. You would think that I would be shunned right? No, I was welcomed with open arms, and had one of the most awesome exeriences that I have ever had in a church.


as i mentioned in another thread sometime... i went to a primarily black catholic church in harlem last summer and it was a great experience. they get so into it. the clapping and all that... wonderful..


ps. just gotta say, a vote for gore wouldn't have done much better for the environment. ok

3rdpath
May 23, 2002, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
ps. just gotta say, a vote for gore wouldn't have done much better for the environment. ok

i think the important point is not to rely on our politicians to lead us forward. we're going to have to change the world on our own. and it may be a slow almost imperceptible change but every little bit is important.

and the $17.00 t-shirts....therein lies the rub. non-sweatshop goods can cost a lot more. i've just gotten in the habit of buying fewer items. they usually last longer anyway.

i enjoy the racial diversity here in los angeles. on my street i have freinds who are hispanic, asian, black, armenian and an elderly couple who are concentration camp survivors- her family picture is in the museum of tolerance here in l.a. i think theres a lot more peace and understanding on this planet than we're lead to believe from the nightly news...i don't think we'll ever see: " racially mixed neighbors have cook-out and talk about their kids, pictures at 8:00...."

it is a beautiful world.

jelloshotsrule
May 23, 2002, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by 3rdpath
i think the important point is not to rely on our politicians to lead us forward. we're going to have to change the world on our own. and it may be a slow almost imperceptible change but every little bit is important.

and the $17.00 t-shirts....therein lies the rub. non-sweatshop goods can cost a lot more. i've just gotten in the habit of buying fewer items. they usually last longer anyway.

i enjoy the racial diversity here in los angeles. on my street i have freinds who are hispanic, asian, black, armenian and an elderly couple who are concentration camp survivors- her family picture is in the museum of tolerance here in l.a. i think theres a lot more peace and understanding on this planet than we're lead to believe from the nightly news...i don't think we'll ever see: " racially mixed neighbors have cook-out and talk about their kids, pictures at 8:00...."

it is a beautiful world.

we can't let our politicians drive us, but i'm saying on the grand scale, we have to drive our politicians to get the big things done. sure, it starts with small, i'm just saying that we have to force the change.

yeah, i know it'll be more expensive. just kinda surprising at how much more... and i agree, reducing use is big. i plan to bring like 3 pairs of shorts and 3 pairs of pants with me to school, and not too many shirts. and i'll give most of the rset away. it's way too easy to get caught up in getting new stuff....

"throw it all away"

oh yes, beautiful world indeed... beautiful day out here where i'm at too...