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MacRumors
Aug 14, 2008, 10:29 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

PhoneNews claims (http://www.phonenews.com/macbook-air-revision-imminent-penryn-more-power-4126/) that Apple is preparing to release a new version of the MacBook Air imminently.

The external design is to remain the same, but the new MacBook Air is said to incorporate a new Penryn-class processor "from 2.0GHz and potentially beyond". To compensate, Apple will be including a higher capacity battery.In fact, the new revision of the MacBook Air will draw it much more in-line with the current MacBook internals. Expect to see SSD prices in-line with the current revision, however the hard drive version of the MacBook Air will likely be upgraded to 120 GB, and optionally 160 GB, due to falling prices for 1.8-inch hard drives.PhoneNews is not a typical source of Apple rumors, but appears to have a reasonable reputation (http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/14/macbook-air-with-penryn-launch-imminent/).

The timeframe for such an update is also reasonable with earlier reports (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/06/20/macbook-air-suitable-montevina-chips-due-later-this-year/) indicating that Intel was planning on a Penryn update to the custom MacBook Air processor. Several readers, however, had hoped that Apple would simply choose to utilize the more power-efficient chips at the same processor speeds in order to extend battery life.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/08/14/apple-to-update-macbook-air-to-penryn-soon/)



lord patton
Aug 14, 2008, 10:33 AM
I don't know if it will happen now, but soon I expect the base MBA to be $1500. Just speculation, of course, but seems to me that's its natural pricepoint.

brendanspah764
Aug 14, 2008, 10:35 AM
I think this will happen when all the iPod updates and MB/MBP updates are done with, then I can see this happening. Apple has got to do something to speed that baby up for the price people have to pay in order to get the MBA.

stukdog
Aug 14, 2008, 10:37 AM
I'm just waiting for Apple to do anything besides iPhone stuff. All the laptops and of course the Mac mini could sure use some attention.

Enough with the iPhone already.

wheezy
Aug 14, 2008, 10:37 AM
Do users of the MBA really need high power and super speed? To me the speed point it's at should be plenty fast, I'd rather keep a slower processor and get more battery life.

I don't own a MBA though so this is all just opinion. But, no one ever complains about too much power...

andrewdale
Aug 14, 2008, 10:38 AM
All I know is, I'm gonna buy one for my wife when the new year rolls around so we can get it written off for 2009.

I'll wait till after Macworld to make any final decisions.

krye
Aug 14, 2008, 10:38 AM
Yeh! This may be the Air I've been waiting for. I said I wouldn't think about it until the proc hits at least 2.0 and the hdd hit at least 120G. Sweet. Now if they pack 4G or RAM, then we're talking. (Just kidding, I don't think we'll be seeing 4G RAM for a long lomg time.) Anyway, this may finally be an Air that can run Aperture and Logic with ease.

commander.data
Aug 14, 2008, 10:40 AM
Well, Intel hasn't officially released small form factor Penryn chips for Montevina yet so either Intel is going to announce them soon, maybe at IDF, or Apple going to get another prerelease.

If Apple does you faster SP9400 2.4GHz or SP9300 2.26GHz chips than power consumption will go up since the TDP is 25W versus 20W in the existing chips. If Apple uses SL9400 1.86GHz or SL9300 1.6GHz chips than power consumption will go down since TDP is 17W. The SL series should still see a performance improvement because of the faster 1066MHz FSB and larger 6MB cache plus other Penryn architectural improvement compared to the Merom chips in existing MBA. The Montevina chips is also 65nm now so that should help too.

stephengiem
Aug 14, 2008, 10:40 AM
when i bought my macbook air, one of the cores in the processor died. i was pretty unhappy about it. it's a cool toy though.

Xavier
Aug 14, 2008, 10:42 AM
Interesting. Hope this comes true.

olliebraves20
Aug 14, 2008, 10:42 AM
I just want a MBP update.....it would be nice however if these updates were true I think it would make the Air a little more attractive

Apple Ink
Aug 14, 2008, 10:44 AM
I'd be really interested in the MBA after this
But Im sure the new MB/P will steal the show!:apple:

plumbingandtech
Aug 14, 2008, 10:46 AM
Do users of the MBA really need high power and super speed? To me the speed point it's at should be plenty fast, I'd rather keep a slower processor and get more battery life.

I don't own a MBA though so this is all just opinion. But, no one ever complains about too much power...

I also own one and I imagine it is more for the newer chips (inventory), small die size (.45) and the less heat that will be generated by them.

Edit: and the bus and mem speed boost as commander.data explain much better then me above.

SirOmega
Aug 14, 2008, 10:47 AM
If Apple does you faster SP9400 2.4GHz or SP9300 2.26GHz chips than power consumption will go up since the TDP is 25W versus 20W in the existing chips. If Apple uses SL9400 1.86GHz or SL9300 1.6GHz chips than power consumption will go down since TDP is 17W. The SL series should still see a performance improvement because of the faster 1066MHz FSB and larger 6MB cache plus other Penryn architectural improvement compared to the Merom chips in existing MBA. The Montevina chips is also 65nm now so that should help too.

That pretty much sums it up. The only thing I would add is that Penryn has the new deep power down state so that is one additional benefit that could mitigate some of the need for a larger battery.

Eidorian
Aug 14, 2008, 10:48 AM
Any update or price drop from Apple is a good thing.

wonderbread57
Aug 14, 2008, 10:50 AM
This is good news because then they can save the interesting updates for september. I really am interested to see what they can do with developing the touch platform.

BBCWatcher
Aug 14, 2008, 10:50 AM
I don't think anyone makes a 1.8 inch/5 mm height hard disk yet that exceeds 80GB. So if Apple remains stuck to that 5 mm height restriction, we won't see 120 or 160GB. I wish we would, though. The 80GB limitation is a big problem.

The MBA has some other annoying limitations. For example, it badly needs a second (and much less blocked) USB port. A socket for another 2GB of RAM would be most welcome (total 4). Hopefully Apple can also shave a few millimeters off the horizontal footprint.

I agree about the $1500 price point. I think a revised MBA (with those changes) needs to start at, say, $1599.

GQB
Aug 14, 2008, 10:51 AM
I'm just waiting for Apple to do anything besides iPhone stuff. All the laptops and of course the Mac mini could sure use some attention.

Enough with the iPhone already.

Understood, but remember the line from The Right Stuff...
'No bucks, no Buck Rogers'.
The development and expansion of the ecosystem is what will keep the computer end afloat or growing. The iPhone and mobile platform are what are breathing life into what is becoming a saturated, low growth market, not to mention providing the impetus for OS switchers.

UtahWJR
Aug 14, 2008, 10:52 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

Bill

Nieval
Aug 14, 2008, 10:53 AM
An update like this would be even more reason to drop the Macbook line given, ofcourse, that there's an accompanying price drop. From where i see it, it's only a matter of time until we see a 13" MBP..

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 10:54 AM
The external design is to remain the same,Yup. Apple doesn't change designs so frequently.

MacBook Air is said to incorporate a new Penryn-class processor "from 2.0GHz and potentially beyond".Hmmm…

1.87 GHz » 17 W
2.00 GHz » 18 W
2.13 GHz » 19 W
2.27 GHz » 21 W
2.40 GHz » 23 W
2.53 GHz » 25 W

I'd say that's possible, although I'd like to see lower clock speed options (≈1.6 GHz) for lower prices.

Apple might get the best bins from Intel, which would mean higher clocks for a certain W, but also really high prices.

This would explain why the MacBook Air is not mentioned in the AppleInsider article, since this revision is more slight.

Realistic specs
13.3" 1280·800 LED display
2.13 GHz and slower CPUs
1067 MHz FSB
2 GB DDR3, 4 GB BTO
80 GB HDD / 64 GB SSD, 128 GB SSD BTO
Same design, ports, etc. as before
Glass trackpad
Price drop likely, maybe to $1499/$1599

So for this coming holiday season, Apple will be refreshing all their iPods and all their portables with new features and/or new designs!

It's going to be a great September!

(Now… when's the next iPhone coming out? :p)

iOrlando
Aug 14, 2008, 10:54 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

Bill


1) Can you.....is it broken? If not..you will pay restocking fee. Nothing has been updated. Its all rumor. You have 14 days for something to come out.

2) Should you? I think it depends on number 1).

andreab35
Aug 14, 2008, 10:55 AM
Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_0_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5B108 Safari/525.20)

A member posted this info in the MBA forum a while ago today.
I found it very interesting. I am very excited for this and hopefully there will be a little price drop. :)

~Shard~
Aug 14, 2008, 10:56 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

You can return it, whether you should or not is your call - depends if you think this rumor is true and what the subsequent timing will be. If you can afford to wait another month or so, then perhaps it's worth rolling the dice and seeing if this in fact transpires.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 10:56 AM
An update like this would be even more reason to drop the Macbook line of laptops given, ofcourse, that there's an accompanying price drop. From where i see it, it's only a matter of time until we see a 13" MBP..There are still many reasons to get a MacBook over a MacBook Air. Price, specs, expandability.

thecartoonguy
Aug 14, 2008, 10:58 AM
I'm just waiting for Apple to do anything besides iPhone stuff. All the laptops and of course the Mac mini could sure use some attention.

Enough with the iPhone already.

I could not have said it better myself. While I am a fan of the iPhone, it's getting pretty tiresome reading about it so much. I guess I'm just tired of waiting for the laptop updates.

im_noahselby
Aug 14, 2008, 10:59 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

Bill

Only you can make that decision.

These are simply the faintest whispers of rumors and certainly don't point as real evidence towards a MacBook Air update within the next few weeks. All signs seem to point to MacBook and MacBook Pro updates at the time being.

New MacBook Air's will get updated, whether it is at the same time as the other MacBooks, two months from now, or MacWorld January is anyones guess.

How would you feel if you returned your machine, based on these rumors, only to be waiting till January for your new machine...

Gee4orce
Aug 14, 2008, 11:00 AM
I would expect them to increase the size of the SSD before anything else :confused:

Not sure the MBA needs a faster processor either - that's not what it's about. The UK 'Gadget Show' had a bake off between the MBA, a Toshiba and a Leveno (I think) sub-notebook, and the Air whooped the other two when it came to processor speed. They had a test of booting up and opening a photo in Photoshop - the MBA did it in 40 seconds, and the two Windows laptops were well over 2 minues, the Toshiba over 3 in fact.

So processor speed is not really the issue with the Air ! I suspect most people would just take the higher capacity battery and keep the 1.6GHz CPU ?

Gee4orce
Aug 14, 2008, 11:03 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

Bill

Apple have a reasonable returns policy - hold onto it until the new one comes out, and if it's only been a couple of weeks then you'll be able to swap it for a small fee. If it's longer than that, well, you've had a couple of weeks benefit from your laptop so that probably outweighs the minor improvements in a new model anyway - if it doesn't, then you probably didn't need to buy it in the first place.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 11:03 AM
I would expect them to increase the size of the SSD before anything else :confused:Hopefully there'll be a 128 GB option.

Not sure the MBA needs a faster processor either - that's not what it's about. The UK 'Gadget Show' had a bake off between the MBA, a Toshiba and a Leveno (I think) sub-notebook, and the Air whooped the other two when it came to processor speed. They had a test of booting up and opening a photo in Photoshop - the MBA did it in 40 seconds, and the two Windows laptops were well over 2 minues, the Toshiba over 3 in fact.

So processor speed is not really the issue with the Air ! I suspect most people would just take the higher capacity battery and keep the 1.6GHz CPU ?Apple might give an option. 1.6 GHz 17 W CPU with longer battery life or 2.13 GHz 21 W CPU with more performance.

Also, CPUs can throttle down when they're not used much, using much less heat than on load.

igazza
Aug 14, 2008, 11:04 AM
cant wait for some new products so over the iphone hype

macbook air with 2.0GHz + 160Gb id consider it :rolleyes:

Mykbibby
Aug 14, 2008, 11:05 AM
Uggh... I bought an air right when it came out... I don't want to see a big update.

Nieval
Aug 14, 2008, 11:05 AM
There are still many reasons to get a MacBook over a MacBook Air. Price, specs, expandability.

For the now i'd agree with you but down the road - this time next year or the year after that - Apple could very well expand the MBA by adding more ports, more expandibllity, etc. and still keep its current form factor. As for pricing, new technology is always expensive but it won't stay like that for long, Apple even said it themselves price drops are just around the corner.

SFStateStudent
Aug 14, 2008, 11:06 AM
I'm buying the MBA 1.8/64SSD next Tuesday b/c I need it, regardless of the release of the NEW MBA. I'll probably buy the new one after MWSF '09...:cool:

Apple Ink
Aug 14, 2008, 11:07 AM
Realistic specs
1. 13.3" 1280·800 LED display
2. 2.13 GHz and slower CPUs
3. 1067 MHz FSB
4. 2 GB DDR3, 4 GB BTO
5. 80 GB HDD / 64 GB SSD, 128 GB SSD BTO
6. Same design, ports, etc. as before
7. Glass trackpad
8. Price drop likely, maybe to $1499/$1599

9. So for this coming holiday season, Apple will be refreshing all their iPods and all their portables with new features and/or new designs!

10. It's going to be a great September!


1. Agreed
2. Agreed
3. Agreed
4. Maybe (soldered RAM would mean Apple'll have to travel the long way for options)
5. No. All Apple notebooks have seen capacity bumps in past updates and MBA is no exception! Expect a 120GB update!
6. Obviously
7. No idea
8. No. Integral updates have never seen price drops.
9. Agreed
10. Fully and Happily agreed!!!

NC MacGuy
Aug 14, 2008, 11:08 AM
Hope the weight doesn't increase. If not, I'll be getting a new & improved MBA to replace my old & slightly flawed week 1 MBA.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 11:08 AM
In fact, the new revision of the MacBook Air will draw it much more in-line with the current MacBook internals. Expect to see SSD prices in-line with the current revision, however the hard drive version of the MacBook Air will likely be upgraded to 120 GB, and optionally 160 GB, due to falling prices for 1.8-inch hard drives.Is there even a 120/160 GB HD that will fit in the MacBook Air? Last I heard 120 GB's were slated for early next year.

Maybe the CPU speeds are likewise exaggerated. :(

CyberBob859
Aug 14, 2008, 11:12 AM
There are still many reasons to get a MacBook over a MacBook Air. Price, specs, expandability.

If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.

I'm still thinking they're going to introduce a 13" MacBook Pro to handle some of the expandability of the MacBook but with more power, and a mini-laptop to handle the sub-$1000 market and for those people wishing for long battery life.

Apple Ink
Aug 14, 2008, 11:17 AM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.

I'm still thinking they're going to introduce a 13" MacBook Pro to handle some of the expandability of the MacBook but with more power, and a mini-laptop to handle the sub-$1000 market and for those people wishing for long battery life.

Seems like you arent around..... the MB/P are widely expected to receive a design change!

kjs862
Aug 14, 2008, 11:20 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_0_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5B108 Safari/525.20)

I want to get an air for sept when I go back to school, but now I don't know what to do.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 11:22 AM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.No it wouldn't.

The computing power and specs are still lacking.

Rumored Air vs. Current MacBook
2.0 GHz vs. 2.4 GHz
2 GB RAM vs. 4 GB RAM
120 GB HDD vs. 250 GB HDD
3 ports vs. More ports
No optical drive vs. SuperDrive
$1799 vs. $1599

Although I hope the MacBook Air replaces the MacBook, I'm having a hard time seeing it happen unless Apple did a spec drop (like iPod mini » iPod nano storage).

I'm still thinking they're going to introduce a 13" MacBook Pro to handle some of the expandability of the MacBook but with more powerI'm thinking the MacBook would take that place, just like how the iMac "took the place" of the low-end Power Mac G5.

and a mini-laptop to handle the sub-$1000 market and for those people wishing for long battery life.I'm thinking the mini-tablet will fit in between the MacBook and the iPod touch. I don't see how Mac OS X would fit in such a small device without significant compromises—and at that point there might as well be iPhone OS.

mashinhead
Aug 14, 2008, 11:23 AM
doesnt' matter the MBA is crippled by the hard drive being a 1.8 4200 rpm

ayeying
Aug 14, 2008, 11:31 AM
The MacBook Air currently isn't a real top performer in battery life and our chips uses 20 watts. I highly doubt apple would use a chip taking near 30 watts and still keep a "5 hour" battery life. They probably go with atom processors since the air is more of a portable machine rather than a desktop replacement.

Furthermore, 4GB ram is a nice touch. I need the ram. lol

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 11:31 AM
So, the MacBook Air is not going to get the rumoured custom chip-set like the MacBook and MacBook Pro (thread: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=532815)

Tallest Skil
Aug 14, 2008, 11:32 AM
Being a rumor, we don't even know if Apple has MADE their own chipset.

jlanuez
Aug 14, 2008, 11:33 AM
doesnt' matter the MBA is crippled by the hard drive being a 1.8 4200 rpm

It's hardly "crippled", I think it's afe to assume you don't use one on a daliy basis, correct?

I use the MBA everyday and it is great. If I need to do anything that requires any more power or screen real estate (which is very rare), we have a 24" IMAC Extreme too.

The MPA replaced a heavy 17" MPB I was lugging around.
The MPA is a shear pleasure to travel with, and that's what a laptop is for, right?

So (to me) the size/weight benefit sure are a fantastic trade off to processor speed /HD, etc...

I will also add that at the onset of making the switch, I was concerned about not being able to swap-out the battery as I'd been doing with my MBP (2 batteries) but it has been NO trouble at all.

Far from being "crippled" it is freedom of movement as it was built for! :D

Breegy
Aug 14, 2008, 11:33 AM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.


Surely they're going to upgrade the MBs to better specs as well...

Even if they are very close in specs, the MB would not become obsolete. The Air is a ultra-portable computer missing things like a disc drive, while MBs are complete computers with the same amount of power and the same utilities as a mid-range desktop if not better than that.

I would never buy an Air. But I do agree, September is going be be a great month. :D Happy Birthday to me and any other September babies out there from me and most likely (hopefully) Apple, too.

fstfrwrd
Aug 14, 2008, 11:33 AM
Seriously, if the MBA gets updated before the MBP does, I'm gonna ...


... send them a REALLY angry letter.

jlanuez
Aug 14, 2008, 11:36 AM
Uggh... I bought an air right when it came out... I don't want to see a big update.

Ditto, but I don't mind seeing some updates now. This way it will get us to another round of updates (even more improvements) for MacWorld 09', then maybe we can upgrade to a new one!

Tallest Skil
Aug 14, 2008, 11:37 AM
Seriously, if the MBA gets updated before the MBP does, I'm gonna ...


... send them a REALLY angry letter.

Yeah, you really have absolutely no room to talk. The MacBook Pros are the most often updated Apple hardware. The Air has not been updated for longer, the Mac Pro goes a year and a half between updates, and the Mac Mini has gone a year now.

Apple Ink
Aug 14, 2008, 11:38 AM
Seriously, if the MBA gets updated before the MBP does, I'm gonna ...


... send them a REALLY angry letter.

And why so? I would rather expect them to do that! And its probable that the MBA will be upgraded before the MB/P which will literally be revamped!

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 11:38 AM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.


Then maybe the MacBook will have a dedicated graphics card while the MacBook Air would not. :p

gglockner
Aug 14, 2008, 11:38 AM
I think the main problem with the MBA is that you can't get one with 4GB RAM. If you plan to run Parallels or VMWare Fusion, 2GB of RAM just isn't enough, and many business users need to run Windows at least sometimes.

Frankly, with 4GB of RAM, the MBA processor would be fast enough for most uses besides photo/video/audio editing. A faster HD would be nice but that's probably not an option considering the form factor.

OasisNYK
Aug 14, 2008, 11:41 AM
To those who think potential users are not interested in a speed bump - I am 100% for it, in fact it is one of the things keeping me from purchasing right now. A 1.6GHz processor is not enough power, neither is a 1.8GHz.

I understand many think this is not what the Air is about - but there is definitely a market for thin and light with a little more power to it. I dont need MBP power, but I dont want something that is clearly underpowered. 2GHz is fine, dont need more than that.

Obviously a storage boost and a HD speed boost would be welcome as well.

Other than that I think it is a great machine.

mac jones
Aug 14, 2008, 11:41 AM
As an AIR owner, I am aware that this very much needed.

The thermal characteristics of the present iteration are far from ideal as Apple rushed these to market (definitely)

The story is that Apple initially asked Intel for a Chip for a ridiculously thin notebook, and that Intel said they didn't have anything.

But later on Intel came back to Apple and sold them some shelved project they had lying around.

So basically , what we have in the Air now is an aborted attemp.

Time for the real thing maybe? :D

Shot22
Aug 14, 2008, 11:43 AM
Just received my Air yesterday - can/should I return it?

Bill

According to PhoneNews (via Engadget), "national retailers have been alerted to an imminent announcement of a new revision to the MacBook Air." If this is true, we should get leaks from such retailers soon to corroborate the news. If that happens, then you may want to consider returning it.

However, has Apple ever specifically notified retailers of a product launch ahead of time?

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 11:44 AM
Time for the real thing maybe? :D

So, I guess you can sell yours now and buy the new one when it comes out. ;)

Apple Ink
Aug 14, 2008, 11:46 AM
According to PhoneNews (via Engadget), "national retailers have been alerted to an imminent announcement of a new revision to the MacBook Air." If this is true, we should get leaks from such retailers soon to corroborate the news. If that happens, then you may want to consider returning it.

However, has Apple ever specifically notified retailers of a product launch ahead of time?

Apple generally does that in its own ways! Recently Appleinsider said that Apple had alerted resellers to stock up on iPods since they expect a shortage!

OasisNYK
Aug 14, 2008, 11:46 AM
According to PhoneNews (via Engadget), "national retailers have been alerted to an imminent announcement of a new revision to the MacBook Air." If this is true, we should get leaks from such retailers soon to corroborate the news. If that happens, then you may want to consider returning it.

However, has Apple ever specifically notified retailers of a product launch ahead of time?

Maybe not officially but they do warn them that stock will be low and to order what they need now. Maybe that is the type of announcement they are talking about?

The Air has had so many issues with the logic board/core shutdowns that I could see Apple just announcing a replacement for it without letting stock run down. They may not have a lot of stock out there now anyway.

swingerofbirch
Aug 14, 2008, 11:48 AM
I think what Apple *really* needs to update is the Mac mini. It's hard when switchers come to Apple and look for the cheapest Mac and see the Mac mini which is very under-speced. Dell has a small computer like the mini called a Studio Hybrid. It's not even possible to spec it out with the low features of the Mac mini. With an Intel Core 2 Duo at 2 GHZ, the smallest hard disk available is 160 GB. It includes a SuperDrive (with Blu Ray for 250 more), plus it has HDMI and a keyboard and mouse and is 549 (50 less than the lowest end Mac mini).

Of course having a Mac is all about the software. I know that. However, customers do care about specs. Customers care about the fact that they are paying a premium and only getting 1 GB of RAM and being told that if they try to upgrade the Mini's memory themselves later they'll void the warranty.

And some things like HDMI do just make for a better out of the box "it just works" experience. A lot of people buy Mini's with the intention to connect to their TV. Then they get it home and find out they need to buy a DVI to HDMI converter. A lot of them don't understand they lose sound in the process. And then they have to go out and buy a stereo cable to complete the whole thing.

Sorry I had to rant! If I could tell you where I worked, you'd understand why.

mac jones
Aug 14, 2008, 11:54 AM
Maybe not officially but they do warn them that stock will be low and to order what they need now. Maybe that is the type of announcement they are talking about?

The Air has had so many issues with the logic board/core shutdowns that I could see Apple just announcing a replacement for it without letting stock run down. They may not have a lot of stock out there now anyway.

I'm not sure it's that bad but I don't push mine. A lot of people do however, and I could see these things happening.

Mind you, it takes almost nothing to make the fan rev up to 6200rpm and the temps to reach 60C (this happens when just browsing with flash)

I've never had it happen myself but if the cores are really shutting down just watching Youtube then this update can't happen soon enough.

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 11:55 AM
Do you guys think we might see a new MacBook Air this Friday or next week?

mac jones
Aug 14, 2008, 11:57 AM
Do you guys think we might see a new MacBook Air this Friday or next week?

This is just a vague rumor. Don't act or plan on news like this.

Shot22
Aug 14, 2008, 11:58 AM
Apple generally does that in its own ways! Recently Appleinsider said that Apple had alerted resellers to stock up on iPods since they expect a shortage!

A change in supply is different than explicitly alerting retailers about a new product. If this "notice" was in fact about a supply shortage of MBAs, why didn't Apple just say it when they warned of iPod, MacBook, and MBP shortages?

motulist
Aug 14, 2008, 12:02 PM
Is it possible that Apple might include a variable speed processor control?

Meaning, would it be possible that they might sell you a machine that has a maximum speed of 2 GHz, and then give you a software control to lower it down to 1.6 GHz? Doing no-restart changes of your CPU's clock speed is probably too much to ask for without running into stability problems, but even if a restart is required it could still be very useful.

For instance, If you usually use your air in the office where you're always near an outlet then you'll keep your CPU speed set at max. But if you're gonna take your MBA on a long airplane flight then you can restart it in slow CPU speed to make the battery last longer.

Possible?

Likely?

OS X Dude
Aug 14, 2008, 12:15 PM
One firewire port or another USB port is what i'd want if i was buying one. If they could somehow fit one in, a DVD drive too. But then, we'd have the new aluminium MacBook, wouldn't we? :(

reallynotnick
Aug 14, 2008, 12:17 PM
For instance, If you usually use your air in the office where you're always near an outlet then you'll keep your CPU speed set at max. But if you're gonna take your MBA on a long airplane flight then you can restart it in slow CPU speed to make the battery last longer.


Correct me if I am wrong but they already do that, check the energy saver tab in system preferences.

I don't see why people complain about more speed as the processor should clock itself down when you don't need it and ramp itself up when you do. So really you are getting the same amount of work done on one battery just in a shorter amount of time. ;)

Oh and does this update mean the MBA will have the X4500 vs the X3100 in the current one?

OS X Dude
Aug 14, 2008, 12:17 PM
I think what Apple *really* needs to update is the Mac mini. It's hard when switchers come to Apple and look for the cheapest Mac and see the Mac mini which is very under-speced. Dell has a small computer like the mini called a Studio Hybrid. It's not even possible to spec it out with the low features of the Mac mini. With an Intel Core 2 Duo at 2 GHZ, the smallest hard disk available is 160 GB. It includes a SuperDrive (with Blu Ray for 250 more), plus it has HDMI and a keyboard and mouse and is 549 (50 less than the lowest end Mac mini).

Of course having a Mac is all about the software. I know that. However, customers do care about specs. Customers care about the fact that they are paying a premium and only getting 1 GB of RAM and being told that if they try to upgrade the Mini's memory themselves later they'll void the warranty.

And some things like HDMI do just make for a better out of the box "it just works" experience. A lot of people buy Mini's with the intention to connect to their TV. Then they get it home and find out they need to buy a DVI to HDMI converter. A lot of them don't understand they lose sound in the process. And then they have to go out and buy a stereo cable to complete the whole thing.

Sorry I had to rant! If I could tell you where I worked, you'd understand why.

That Dell is beautiful. And i never thought I'd say that about a Dell, but they're heading in all the right directions all of a sudden.

m4c1nt05h
Aug 14, 2008, 12:24 PM
One firewire port or another USB port is what i'd want if i was buying one. If they could somehow fit one in, a DVD drive too. But then, we'd have the new aluminium MacBook, wouldn't we? :(

agreed, except the DVD drive. i would sacrifice that for an option to get a 7200 rpm hard drive.

but yeah, i think then we'd have an aluminum MB. :rolleyes:

kornyboy
Aug 14, 2008, 12:27 PM
Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_0_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5B108 Safari/525.20)

This is good news for the MBA. Now that speeds will closely match the MacBook all they need is to make the battery easy to replace and it will likely appeal to a larger customer base.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 12:27 PM
Is it possible that Apple might include a variable speed processor control?

Meaning, would it be possible that they might sell you a machine that has a maximum speed of 2 GHz, and then give you a software control to lower it down to 1.6 GHz?I think current CPUs already do some sort of downclocking when more or less idle. The FSB can downclock to 1/2 its maximum speed. Certainly a CPU at 10% usage uses up less power than one at 100% usage.

I don't see why people complain about more speed as the processor should clock itself down when you don't need it and ramp itself up when you do. So really you are getting the same amount of work done on one battery just in a shorter amount of time. ;)Indeed.

The advantage to lower-voltage CPUs is that they have the same maximum speed as regular CPUs but use less power.

jgvl79
Aug 14, 2008, 12:31 PM
I will be waiting for this baby to come out!

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 12:31 PM
Do users of the MBA really need high power and super speed? To me the speed point it's at should be plenty fast, I'd rather keep a slower processor and get more battery life.

I don't own a MBA though so this is all just opinion. But, no one ever complains about too much power...


Price, batterly life, speed, and lack of ports is why I chose the macbook over the air. I mean come on 1.83ghz core duo? My 2 year old Dell that I just retired due to failing CD drive and a cracked LCD had that. But then again, I just bought my wife a mini with the same processor :o- a step up for her, she don't need power; as she doesn't run what I do. But then again a baseline mini with the applecare, iwork, and an apple keyboard was under $1000 (including my state's sales tax).

But seriously if the Air got a speed bump, and added 2 more USB and was only around $1400 or so with a standard 160gb drive - then maybe worth the price.

Apple keeps bringing all their lines close together, I mean if you really look at the specs (other than ports and the video card) - how much different is the new Air, the macbook, and the MBP. I can't see all the price differences between virtually the same machine.

I think more and more people will still choose the middle of the road macbook due to it being the best price that includes everything. But - just my opinion.

Air - to expensive, too few ports
Pro - not much different than a macbook.
macbook (top of the line white) - best choice for money (I would not pay extra for black - I just covered my white with an incase to protect it and got the keyboard cover with the black keys - looks pretty sweet).

what I think Apple should also do, is drop Applecare. I mean really. why make people pay for it. Just change the standard warrenty to the 3 years.

But I know someone in the insurance business, who's done a lot of research warrenties are set at a point of time just shy of when the thing will standardly start to fail. i mean if something standardly fails at one year, then the warrenty is usually 90 days or 6 months. All the extended care warrenty does is to compensate the company up front for something that will fail eventually - in the hopes that you do not do not keep the item for the full term.

One good note is that Apple atleast allows you to transfer that warrenty, should the item go to a new owner.

My friend got swindled by Dell. He bought second hand machine that had an extended warrenty. It broke, and he went to use the warrenty and was told - sorry extended warrenties are only valid to the original owner at the time the machine was sold new, extended warrenties are not transferrable.

He through the laptop away, as repairs were going to run him over $600 on a year old machine. A new comperable machine was only around $700.

AAPLaday
Aug 14, 2008, 12:36 PM
Yeah i like the dell studio hybrid too. Small sleek and well designed and with the option of blu ray ....

JesterJJZ
Aug 14, 2008, 12:38 PM
I'm just waiting for Apple to do anything besides iPhone stuff. All the laptops and of course the Mac mini could sure use some attention.

Enough with the iPhone already.

Yeah...it's almost a curse. I can't stand that thing.

morespce54
Aug 14, 2008, 12:50 PM
So, how soon is "soon"?

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 12:51 PM
So, how soon is "soon"?

Probably at the earliest "next week".

commander.data
Aug 14, 2008, 12:54 PM
1.87 GHz » 17 W
2.00 GHz » 18 W
2.13 GHz » 19 W
2.27 GHz » 21 W
2.40 GHz » 23 W
2.53 GHz » 25 W
Intel doesn't bin processors like that since that's a crazy amount of work to validate every clock speed at a different TDP. They simply have a TDP say 25W, and ramp the clock speed on the CPU until it reaches that TDP. That is why in small form factor Penryns, both the 2.26GHz and 2.4GHz Penryns have a 25W TDP. The 2.26GHz ones are just lower quality in that it already hits the 25W TDP at 2.26GHz.

AAPLaday
Aug 14, 2008, 12:55 PM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.

While this is true to a point i think the missing optical drive makes it unsuitable for most people as an mainstream laptop. Of course it all depends how many use a macbook as a primary machine and how many have a desktop as well. Certainly most switchers would be better suited to a macbook.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 12:59 PM
So, how soon is "soon"?September.

Intel doesn't bin processors like that since that's a crazy amount of work to validate every clock speed at a different TDP. They simply have a TDP say 25W, and ramp the clock speed on the CPU until it reaches that TDP. That is why in small form factor Penryns, both the 2.26GHz and 2.4GHz Penryns have a 25W TDP. The 2.26GHz ones are just lower quality in that it already hits the 25W TDP at 2.26GHz.I interpolated the TDPs to find out approximately how much TDP a 2.0/2.13 GHz CPU would take. I doubt Intel could clock the 17 W CPUs to 2+ GHz clocks unless they charged though the roof for them, and I don't think the Air can take a 25 W CPU.

urbanskywalker
Aug 14, 2008, 01:05 PM
That is the direction things are going, although its not clear if we get there in one leap.

While this is true to a point i think the missing optical drive makes it unsuitable for most people as an mainstream laptop. Of course it all depends how many use a macbook as a primary machine and how many have a desktop as well. Certainly most switchers would be better suited to a macbook.

Shot22
Aug 14, 2008, 01:06 PM
That Dell is beautiful. And i never thought I'd say that about a Dell, but they're heading in all the right directions all of a sudden.

I agree: it is a nice-looking computer. And cheaply-priced, too. But it has very modest specs (on the $500 unit, at least).

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 01:09 PM
If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.

I'm still thinking they're going to introduce a 13" MacBook Pro to handle some of the expandability of the MacBook but with more power, and a mini-laptop to handle the sub-$1000 market and for those people wishing for long battery life.

ya know, wasn't there a thread somewhere that indicated the new macbook design would resemble the air?

Could it be that the AIR will be the new macbook, and the current Air will be scrapped and redesigned to be a tablet?

Of course, now that I am almost totally switched from Windows to mac (with a few exceptions) - the way mac apps are packaged - I am beginning to see no need for a CD drive (other than permanate backups of my photos and home movies) - so with thumb drives hitting the capacity of 8 and 16 gb at reasonable prices, and time machine backups; really starting to look like external CD would be fine for me. just give me a big enough harddrive to rip a few DVD's while I am on the road. After all; VLC player plays the VOB files (so what if I have to load each segment separately into the player - when I am on the road, I don't have 2 hrs to watch a full movie at once anyway).

me - who once posted on this board that I hate external drives -rather have an all in one. But really, that was last year and well, things change. Yes, I would rather have everything built in, but I am see less of a need for it.

Minimum requirements:

2.0 or 2.4 ghz CPU
160 or 250 gb harddrive (I have a 250, but still running at a little less than 100 free)
2 or 4 gb ram (4 better due to new app requirements)
4 usb
mini dvi
audio in/out
Ethernet - for those times when you need more speed than wireless can provide.
Modem as a USB dongle ok, I have yet to use my USB modem - but in the business I am in, if we were on a mac base - then it becomes a necessity (connecting to older mainframes at hospitals).

I really do not use firewire as most peripherals are USB and not really much in the line of firewire anymore.

Apple can do it..

Oh, and keep the plastic case.. I hear too many complaints that the switch to aluminum is causing interfarence with the airport wireless (unless apple figures out how to make the entire laptop an antenna).

Shasterball
Aug 14, 2008, 01:10 PM
Where's the removable battery!

commander.data
Aug 14, 2008, 01:12 PM
I interpolated the TDPs to find out approximately how much TDP a 2.0/2.13 GHz CPU would take. I doubt Intel could clock the 17 W CPUs to 2+ GHz clocks unless they charged though the roof for them, and I don't think the Air can take a 25 W CPU.
My point was that I don't think it's possible to interpolate the data since Intel doesn't intend the TDPs to be continuous. I believe TDP is more related to voltage than frequency, and a 2.26GHz and 2.4GHz chip have the same TDP because they have similar voltages. As in a 2.26GHz needs a certain voltage to reach 2.26GHz, while a 2.4GHz chip could get to 2.4GHz at the same voltage, they have the same TDP since they are dissipating the same amount of heat from their similar power draw. If Apple took a 2.4GHz chip and underclocked it at 2.26GHz with lower voltage, then it's TDP may be lower than an "official" Intel binned 2.26GHz chip because it can use less voltage to sustain the same clock speed. But, of course you are really using a 2.4GHz chip, just running it at lower speed, so the price is higher. Which is why 17W TDP chips are more expensive than their 25W or 35W counterparts, since 17W chips are really higher-binned, higher-clock speed 25W chips run at lower clock speed.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 01:22 PM
ya know, wasn't there a thread somewhere that indicated the new macbook design would resemble the air?

Could it be that the AIR will be the new macbook, and the current Air will be scrapped and redesigned to be a tablet?The tablet is rumored to have an optical drive, unlike the Air. Also a touchscreen would increase the cost of the notebook.

I believe TDP is more related to voltage than frequency, and a 2.26GHz and 2.4GHz chip have the same TDP because they have similar voltages. TDP increases linearly with frequency but increases quadratically with voltage.

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 01:28 PM
That Dell is beautiful. And i never thought I'd say that about a Dell, but they're heading in all the right directions all of a sudden.


I just seen those studio hydrids advertised. they just came out this week in a flyer sent to me.

problem - its a Dell, so expect it to break/die in a year if not sooner. and expect rotten customer service. Oh, and it runs Windows.

Other than that, I have seen a lot of advertisements lately with shrinking machines keeping the same number of ports as your larger desktops. thanks to smaller sized hard drives with large rstorage capacity - I think we are going to see machines continue to get smaller and smaller. I mean look at the new Sony Vaio UX micro PC - however, I do no think it is worth the $3000 price tag.


I like how the reviewers are writing about that new Dell Hybrid. They are really ripping Apple. So, the mini needs a revamp - here is where Apple needs to step up.

Here is the article. Posted at:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/pcs/news/2008/07/29/Dell-Details-Studio-Hybrid-Desktop/p1

Text incase link does not work:

A few weeks ago Dell made its studio laptop line-up official so it seemed like only a matter of time before the desktop equivalent, the previously-leaked (in a rather blurry fashion) Studio Hybrid, was given a similar treatment. As expected that has now happened, with Dell stumping up the full details of its 'eco-friendly' desktop PC, set to rival the Mac mini, rather than the Eee Box as I wrongly speculated.





That's borne out by the choice of processors Dell has made; Core 2 Duo options rather than an Intel Atom CPU. However, despite using a more powerful CPU, the Hybrid does still keep its power draw down below 65W. Judging from the specs, we suspect that the system uses Intel's Centrino 2 (a.k.a. Montevina) notebook platform, rather than desktop components. But when it helps keep the power draw and heat output to a minimum without sacrificing performance that's a hardly much of a sacrifice.


The Studio Hybrid also boasts features such as HDMI output (alongside as a DVI port), coupled with the options of both a Blu-ray drive option and a TV tuner - all three features Apple doesn't offer anywhere in its Mac range, let alone the Mini which Dell is attempting to rival with this machine. A slew of USB ports, Draft-N WiFi and a card-reader give the Studio decent connectivity credentials, too.


Stylistically Dell also seems to be competing with Apple, offering a range of interchangeable case covers, from Blue, through orange to green - there's even a bamboo option. Unlike the Eee Box and its ilk, the Studio Hybrid should be powerful enough to sit as a replacement as a desktop, just without the space and power requirements.


Price-wise the Studio Hybrid is much more friendly than many a desktop, sitting at $499 (~Ł250) for the base spec, offering a 1.73GHz dual-core CPU, 2GB of RAM and a 160GB Vista-fitted hard drive. Obviously upping the spec will similarly raise the price.


Now if Dell can just get OSX running it might really have a Mac Mini rival in the making!



OUch - all those comparisons gotta hurt.

centauratlas
Aug 14, 2008, 01:29 PM
What I would like to see is an SSD Apple TV so that it is smaller and runs cooler. Oh well, wishing... (Anyone know of anyone who has replaced the HDD with an SSD, while I'm writing?)

freddiecable
Aug 14, 2008, 01:30 PM
I have a MBA and improvements from my prespectives are:

1. HD - 80GB is a bit to small. 120 or preferrably 160 GB would be perfect.
2. A second USB port would be very usable also.

RAM? well - i can run WMware without any problems. And i also run PS and Indesign and it works ok for work on the road. Not heavy stuff though. I have the 1.6 ghz version. If i was to choose between CPU and RAM I would prefer more RAM.

So basically bigger HD and second USB-port is on my wishlist.

MrCrowbar
Aug 14, 2008, 01:31 PM
Is it possible that Apple might include a variable speed processor control?

Meaning, would it be possible that they might sell you a machine that has a maximum speed of 2 GHz, and then give you a software control to lower it down to 1.6 GHz? Doing no-restart changes of your CPU's clock speed is probably too much to ask for without running into stability problems, but even if a restart is required it could still be very useful.

For instance, If you usually use your air in the office where you're always near an outlet then you'll keep your CPU speed set at max. But if you're gonna take your MBA on a long airplane flight then you can restart it in slow CPU speed to make the battery last longer.

Possible?

Likely?

They already do that. 2.0 GHz chips idle at 1.0 GHz and occasionally go up a bit if required. It's rare to see the processor run at full speed at all in laptops. If you want software to control it yourself, google "Coolbook".

CyberBob859
Aug 14, 2008, 01:31 PM
No it wouldn't.

The computing power and specs are still lacking.

Rumored Air vs. Current MacBook
2.0 GHz vs. 2.4 GHz
2 GB RAM vs. 4 GB RAM
120 GB HDD vs. 250 GB HDD
3 ports vs. More ports
No optical drive vs. SuperDrive
$1799 vs. $1599

.

I see three processor types coming up from Intel, and three possible MacBook lines

a) 1.6+ GHz Atom processor (possibly Dual-Core) for lower power, long battery life subnotebook with 95% keyboard and 10-11" screen for $899-$1199 (Current Asus, MSI Wind, HP, Lenovo, and Dell are rumored as offering this.)

b) 2.0 Ghz+ Penryn for general computing (Air, MacBook/Pro)

c) Nahalem + GPU for MacBook Pro

I am not a big Tablet fan because I see it as too limited, gimmicky, and risky. Whereas I see a big push from Windows and Linux mini-laptops on the "upper low end" price range that could attack Apple. I don't think they're just going to let these guys have this market without some type of response. And I believe the response they DON'T want is just to drop the price of the MacBook (although this could be the "margin pressure" the analysts were talking about.)

I think it's a no brainer that Nahalem will go to MacBook Pros, and with Snow Leopard, will be outstanding, but pricy, machines.

Which then leaves the difference between the MacBook and the Air. I was never a big fan of the Air, but there was enough of a difference in performance and style to keep two different product lines. If the performance difference becomes less significant, however, the style of the Air will win out over the general MacBook.

So, the Macbook won't be as stylish as the Air, won't be as powerful as the Pro, and may not be as cheap, lightweight or have as long a battery life as a subnotebook. There may be a market for that type of laptop, but it won't be a big one, IMO.

kidtronix
Aug 14, 2008, 01:31 PM
No chance of bigger display? The space around the screen is the deal killer for me.

Marx55
Aug 14, 2008, 01:40 PM
No FireWire, no purchase.
No true Ethernet port, no purchase.
Only one USB 2 port, no purchase.

The MacBook Air could be so great with those... A shame Apple did not get it!

CyberBob859
Aug 14, 2008, 01:42 PM
ya know, wasn't there a thread somewhere that indicated the new macbook design would resemble the air?

Could it be that the AIR will be the new macbook, and the current Air will be scrapped and redesigned to be a tablet?


That is what I think is going to happen.... to a degree, only I believe instead of a tablet, Apple offers a mini-laptop to compete directly with all the offerings coming out from Asus, MSI, Lenovo, and Dell (rumored), amongst others.

I see two product lines for consumers - smaller and lightweight or larger and lightweight. The current Air gives them the second. A mini-laptop gives them the first.

AAPLaday
Aug 14, 2008, 01:46 PM
I wonder how feasible it would be for the air to shrink to 12 inch since its an ultra portable. Or would the smaller design impact the keyboard layout too much?

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 01:52 PM
Whereas I see a big push from Windows and Linux mini-laptops on the "upper low end" price range that could attack Apple. I don't think they're just going to let these guys have this market without some type of response. And I believe the response they DON'T want is just to drop the price of the MacBook (although this could be the "margin pressure" the analysts were talking about.)Apple's response will be most likely a mini-tablet. The MacBook is in a different market, and the MacBook Air can't be shrunk and price dropped to any competitive price point without crippling Mac OS X.

I think it's a no brainer that Nahalem will go to MacBook Pros, and with Snow Leopard, will be outstanding, but pricy, machines.Nehalem replaces Penryn, it doesn't augment it.

Which then leaves the difference between the MacBook and the Air. I was never a big fan of the Air, but there was enough of a difference in performance and style to keep two different product lines. If the performance difference becomes less significant, however, the style of the Air will win out over the general MacBook.The performance difference won't get any smaller. The hard drive is 1/3 the size of the MacBook's. The CPU is 1/2 the TDP of the MacBook's. The price is considerably higher for less performance. There's no way the MacBook can be discontinued or replaced as things are now.

If Apple's going to replace the MacBook with the MacBook Air, they'd most likely have to lower the price of the MacBook Air steadily and push up the MacBook steadily. They will cross over without a problem because they are two different computers. Once the MacBook Air is at the low end and the MacBook is at the midrange to high-end, the MacBook can be replaced by the MacBook Pro (or they may just stay there).

So, the Macbook won't be as stylish as the Air, won't be as powerful as the Pro, and may not be as cheap, lightweight or have as long a battery life as a subnotebook. There may be a market for that type of laptop, but it won't be a big one, IMO.Cheaper than a MacBook Pro, more powerful than a MacBook Air and a subnotebook… the MacBook will have a significant market for the next few years at least. Beyond that… who knows. It may be replaced by the MacBook Air as I explained above.

guzhogi
Aug 14, 2008, 01:54 PM
What I'd like to see is slightly more powerful processor, another USB port (2 total), built-in ethernet, larger SSD drive and a major price drop. I work in an elementary school district and these would be great for student use. They're small, light, not very much the kids can mess around with, and w/ the SSD option, no moving parts. When 6 year olds are handling laptops, they can get a little rambunctious. And so can the teachers. :p

Just noticed, it is my 5th anniversary being a member of MacRumors this month! Yay!

tom burns
Aug 14, 2008, 01:58 PM
Enough with Dell...
It made a PC which is an iMac wannabe and now a PC that is a Mac mini wannabe...
What is gonna do next?
Change its logo to a pear?

Westsider 4 Mac
Aug 14, 2008, 02:18 PM
No FireWire, no purchase.
No true Ethernet port, no purchase.
Only a USB 2 port, no purchase.

The MacBook Air could be so great with those... A shame Apple did not get it!


I cannot agree more!:apple:

min_t
Aug 14, 2008, 02:20 PM
How imminent is imminent cause I'm thinking of buying the new macbook next month, but if I can get the 2nd gen macbook air, that would be great.

PDE
Aug 14, 2008, 02:49 PM
I have a MBP now and because of the GPU defect I'm dying to sell and get something else, but the MBA needs more than just a penryn upgrade for it to be a viable machine for travel/work

minimum 120gb hard drive
4gb ram
2 (!) USB ports
Better battery life

Why is that sooooo incredibly hard???

Bobjob186
Aug 14, 2008, 02:50 PM
No FireWire, no purchase.
No true Ethernet port, no purchase.
Only a USB 2 port, no purchase.

The MacBook Air could be so great with those... A shame Apple did not get it!

Weird that's called a macbook.

Shot22
Aug 14, 2008, 02:51 PM
So, how soon is "soon"?

How imminent is imminent

Well, my guess is within the next four weeks....But I'm still not sold on this rumor....

citi
Aug 14, 2008, 03:13 PM
No FireWire, no purchase.
No true Ethernet port, no purchase.
Only a USB 2 port, no purchase.

The MacBook Air could be so great with those... A shame Apple did not get it!

Agreed..except I could care less about the ethernet port. At a minimun, there should be a firewire port. It will be included on the next revision, like the removal of firewire 800 on the MBP. People screamed for it and they added it back. I'm not sure we will get a second usb. If they add Firewire, I may buy one, Since it's becoming clear we are not getting a 12 back. At least one with any real power.

Scepticalscribe
Aug 14, 2008, 03:29 PM
What I'd like to see is slightly more powerful processor, another USB port (2 total), built-in ethernet, larger SSD drive and a major price drop. I work in an elementary school district and these would be great for student use. They're small, light, not very much the kids can mess around with, and w/ the SSD option, no moving parts. When 6 year olds are handling laptops, they can get a little rambunctious. And so can the teachers. :p

Just noticed, it is my 5th anniversary being a member of MacRumors this month! Yay!

Couldn't agree more, that about sums up my aspirations for the MBA. Cheers.

Cheffy Dave
Aug 14, 2008, 03:48 PM
Do users of the MBA really need high power and super speed? To me the speed point it's at should be plenty fast, I'd rather keep a slower processor and get more battery life.

I don't own a MBA though so this is all just opinion. But, no one ever complains about too much power...

Yes Wheezy, but a better CPU, and Battery is a win-win IMHO, put a
faster/larger (5400)RPM H.D.D.in the same form factor and I say why not.
What's another Billion in profits among friends? :p:D:D

Cheffy Dave
Aug 14, 2008, 03:50 PM
I have a MBP now and because of the GPU defect I'm dying to sell and get something else, but the MBA needs more than just a penryn upgrade for it to be a viable machine for travel/work

minimum 120gb hard drive
4gb ram
2 (!) USB ports
Better battery life

Why is that sooooo incredibly hard???

Apparently, it might just happen, if it does, I'll take 3:rolleyes:

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 03:52 PM
Weird that's called a macbook.

And if the MacBook Air gets those features, Apple needs to make a dedicated graphics card on the MacBook as standard to differentiate the MacBook from the MacBook Air.

Cheffy Dave
Aug 14, 2008, 03:53 PM
the way mac apps are packaged - I am beginning to see no need for a CD drive (other than permanate backups of my photos and home movies) - so with thumb drives hitting the capacity of 8 and 16 gb at reasonable prices, and time machine backups; really starting to look like external CD would be fine for me.


Me too! I think the MBA ability to use any available CD/DVD on any machine is absolute genius!:apple::apple::apple::apple::apple:

Cheffy Dave
Aug 14, 2008, 04:01 PM
And if the MacBook Air gets those features, Apple needs to make a dedicated graphics card on the MacBook as standard to differentiate the MacBook from the MacBook Air.

I think that would be a given, I am so excited about a redo for the MBA and the new MB, that my current BMB will become my desktop computer, and I'll take a BMB (new) and get 3 MBA for my wife and 2 (Teacher) children.
AHHHHHH, an Apple Christmas!!!!, and the whole family on the same :apple: page.:rolleyes::cool:very:cool:

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 04:04 PM
AHHHHHH, an Apple Christmas!!!!, and the whole family on the same :apple: page.:rolleyes::cool:very:cool:

That's pretty cool. I hope Apple will surprise us all with the Mac updates this year. Maybe we will get something better than we predict (specs), who knows.

citi
Aug 14, 2008, 04:08 PM
And if the MacBook Air gets those features, Apple needs to make a dedicated graphics card on the MacBook as standard to differentiate the MacBook from the MacBook Air.


I think that the MacBook Air should get the dedicated graphics card to differentiate itself from the MacBook, then we would have our 12/13 inch Macbook Pro!

gmon750
Aug 14, 2008, 04:26 PM
Do users of the MBA really need high power and super speed? To me the speed point it's at should be plenty fast, I'd rather keep a slower processor and get more battery life.

I don't own a MBA though so this is all just opinion. But, no one ever complains about too much power...

I purchased my MBA a couple months ago. The speed and abilities are are just fine so long as you don't have the expectation of having the MBA be a desktop replacement and not something suited more for a MBP.

My needs for complete mobility outweighed any performance issues. I use my MBA to run VMware/XP and I consider it to be the best laptop I've owned in the last six years. I use OSX for email/surfing/iTunes, etc. and XP is used for running MS-only apps I use for software development on our corporate mainframe. Speed has not been an issue whatsoever because I don't expect it to run Crysis at 120fps.

Not having an extra USB port or built-in ethernet does not slow me down. Besides, I've always ended up breaking the ethernet ports on my other laptops because one-way or another, a wrong yank on the cable and it'll crap-out. Working wirelessly suits me just fine. I purchased the external CD drive and I have only used it once to load Windows XP on it.

If Apple decides to give it a speed boost, I for one welcome it. I just hope that the community does not give it too high an expectation that it can replace a MacBook Pro. Because it certainly will not do that. The graphics performance is fine for pencil-pushers doing business apps but certainly not for video editing/graphics design.

And since I do a lot of commuting by motorcycle, the MBA has been a godsend in terms of not having a bulkier laptop weigh me down on my back.

I would highly recommend a MBA but highlight it with an asterisk for safe measure.

Habib9
Aug 14, 2008, 04:27 PM
This is my first post. I live in Denmark, so English is not where I am at my best.

I see the differentiation between the three Macbook lines coming from the three general processor categories that will be delivered by Intel with the Montevina line-up: 17W, 25W and 35W TDP
http://anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3356&p=1

We have the 17 W TDP processors for the Macbook Air: Sufficiently powerful (1,86 GHz/6MB cache), incredibly small, way easier on the battery and even cooler than now - More true to the philosophy of the "Macbook Air"-vision than the current processors.

The All-new 25 W TDP processor category for the Macbook - Allowing for more "Macbook Air"-like Macbooks that are relatively cheap and full-featured; Both significantly cooler (temperature-wise and concerning design) and more powerful than today (2,53 GHz/6MB is a lot of processing power for 25 watts of power)

The 35 W TDP processor category will be reserved for the Macbook Pro which will get the most powerful processors possible in a package that is similar to the current offering; but finally distanced from the Macbook.. Even more so with the Macbook Pro having dedicated graphics.

Jason Lee
Aug 14, 2008, 04:37 PM
All I want is a removable battery! And not the stupid ghetto way!

I would HAPPILY trade my MacBook Pro for an Air. Can't wait for the next revision...

CWallace
Aug 14, 2008, 04:38 PM
A mildly-improved MacBook Air no more invalidates the existence of the MacBook then the MacBook invalidates the existence of the MacBook Pro.

Each model offers capabilities and capacities not found on the model below it in the line-up.

DaBrain
Aug 14, 2008, 05:27 PM
So, how soon is "soon"?

Ya gotta LOVE these rumors of an "imminent" update! The rumors on the MacBook and MacBook Pro have been going on for months and now we have a new imminent rumor--))) :rolleyes:

Advice: Don't hold your breath! They will get here when they get here--)))) ;) :eek:

nidserz
Aug 14, 2008, 05:55 PM
Well I hope this rumor is true. I was confused about which Mac portable to get for the school year for my birthday (October 5) as my HP laptop is dying. I just got a 20" iMac this summer and an updated MBA would be a great accompaniment. I was debating between the "new" Macbook/pro or the Air. The Air would fit my needs perfectly - portable for classes, library, taking notes, writing essays, and watching a few shows in bed.
A bigger HD and faster processor would be perfect. Better battery life wouldn't hurt either.

Come on Apple! September is gonna be a good month :)

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 06:10 PM
This is probably one of the best months for us Mac rumorers in a l-o-n-g time! :D


Advice: Don't hold your breath! They will get here when they get here--)))) ;) :eek:Too late for me… *passes out*

Stock-option
Aug 14, 2008, 06:16 PM
Well I hope this rumor is true. I was confused about which Mac portable to get for the school year for my birthday (October 5) as my HP laptop is dying.

What do u mean, your laptop IS DYING? He got cancer tumors? A device is either dead or alive.:D

Eric S.
Aug 14, 2008, 06:19 PM
Apple have a reasonable returns policy - hold onto it until the new one comes out, and if it's only been a couple of weeks then you'll be able to swap it for a small fee. If it's longer than that, well, you've had a couple of weeks benefit from your laptop so that probably outweighs the minor improvements in a new model anyway - if it doesn't, then you probably didn't need to buy it in the first place.

I believe you have 30 days to return, if a new model comes out in that time. Of course you do need to pay the restocking fee.

If this rumor is true, then the MacBook becomes obsolete. The Air would have the same size screen, keyboard, and now, computing power. All in a thinner design.

But still lack the ports and optical drive of the MacBook, still have a slower CPU even at 2.0GHz, and still be more expensive.

I'm still thinking they're going to introduce a 13" MacBook Pro to handle some of the expandability of the MacBook but with more power, and a mini-laptop to handle the sub-$1000 market and for those people wishing for long battery life.

The MacBook is an entry-level laptop, which the MBA is not. Apple is not going drop the MacBook in favor of the MBA any time in the near future.

kockgunner
Aug 14, 2008, 06:25 PM
And if the MacBook Air gets those features, Apple needs to make a dedicated graphics card on the MacBook as standard to differentiate the MacBook from the MacBook Air.

why get a macbook pro then?

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 06:28 PM
why get a macbook pro then?

The MacBook Pro will probably have a better graphics card than the MacBook and you can run 30" external display. Those are two reasons I could think of.

iMacmatician
Aug 14, 2008, 06:40 PM
The MacBook Pro will probably have a better graphics card than the MacBook and you can run 30" external display. Those are two reasons I could think of.Bigger display, higher resolution, more ports, and the GPU will still be better (think single-core vs. dual-core).

gcmexico
Aug 14, 2008, 06:54 PM
I hope this upgrade will remedy the core shutdown issues

ezekielrage_99
Aug 14, 2008, 07:05 PM
And if the MacBook Air gets those features, Apple needs to make a dedicated graphics card on the MacBook as standard to differentiate the MacBook from the MacBook Air.

Although I do agree to some extent, I think the MBA would benefit from more system memory and more VRAM. IMHO it's silly that on a Windows machine you can set the graphics memory for the Intel Integrated Video very easily while the same graphics card on the Mac you can't....

I'm using a Macbook ATM with 64MB of VRAM, I have 3GB RAM in the system so why can't (or shouldn't) I be able to allocate more VRAM when I have more than enough system memory :confused:

kabunaru
Aug 14, 2008, 07:15 PM
Although I do agree to some extent, I think the MBA would benefit from more system memory and more VRAM. IMHO it's silly that on a Windows machine you can set the graphics memory for the Intel Integrated Video very easily while the same graphics card on the Mac you can't....

I'm using a Macbook ATM with 64MB of VRAM, I have 3GB RAM in the system so why can't (or shouldn't) I be able to allocate more VRAM when I have more than enough system memory :confused:

MacBook: 128MB dedicated VRAM

MacBook Air: More than 144MB integrated VRAM

How about that?

bobbleheadbob
Aug 14, 2008, 07:18 PM
I want one and can't wait for this update if this is what happens. I wasn't that high on the first MBA version (at least for my needs, it's an impressive machine, nonetheless), but at some point, the upgrades to the MBA line should give me enough to be able leave my 17" MBP behind on the desk and just carry an Air.

Hopefully, by XMas, so I could take a new MBA to MWSF! :D

thecartoonguy
Aug 14, 2008, 07:20 PM
What do u mean, your laptop IS DYING? He got cancer tumors? A device is either dead or alive.:D

You sir must not have used a PC before :D

twoodcc
Aug 14, 2008, 08:00 PM
looking forward to seeing this update

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 08:09 PM
Enough with Dell...
It made a PC which is an iMac wannabe and now a PC that is a Mac mini wannabe...
What is gonna do next?
Change its logo to a pear?

Yeah its funny, since Dell can't run osx it will make a mac wannabe with higher options at a little less price and have people drool over the hardware and keep asking why Apple can't do it.

Face it - it is a Dell, which means crappy customer service and the thing will die in a few months to a year. I know... I had enough dell's personally; at work; and fixed enough for people.

Unless Dell changes face, the only thing going for it is hardware specs when it first comes out. After that is it just a same ol PC running windows with crappy support from both the OS vendor and the hardware vendor.

YES, I AM HARD ON DELL AFTER THE WAY I HAVE BEEN TREATED. But just Google and read the lawsuit filed by Coumo in NY. I am not the only one.... Oh and by the way - he won the lawsuit forcing Dell to settle with the entire state.

Hey, if I wanted to spend $1000-$1500 every 6 mos to a year replacing a broken machine, then I would buy a Dell. No, I want a desktop/laptop that will last more than 1 year, so I can get my money's worth out of it; without having to reformat the hard drive every 2 months -and replace broken parts every few months. Even to which, Dell does not honor warantees.

Personally, the only non-Apple hardware I thought was any good was IBM (reliability wise), then they went and sold out to lenovo and now they just stink as well.

ezekielrage_99
Aug 14, 2008, 08:12 PM
MacBook: 128MB dedicated VRAM

MacBook Air: More than 144MB integrated VRAM

How about that?

Nope what I was suggesting was the ability to set how much memory you can set for the integrated graphics not a dedicated card which just simply wont happen.

Mackan
Aug 14, 2008, 08:13 PM
2.0 GHz in MacBook Air? Let the fans begin...

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 08:17 PM
How imminent is imminent cause I'm thinking of buying the new macbook next month, but if I can get the 2nd gen macbook air, that would be great.

I have only been a switcher for a little while, but based on what I seen.

After the back-to-school promos are over and Apple sells out of current stock, you will see a bump in specs. Anything newly dramatic would probably wait until MWSF in January.

However recent articles about new hardware this fall and dropping margins in the quarter that would equal this fall - make me think history may change and could be we are in for a surprise in the next month or so.

So, stands to reason - if you need it now, but now. If not wait.

If you are looking for discounted prices - visit MACMALL.COM. They have some of the best options and prices I have seen, but based on what I seen on the internet - do not bank on getting your rebate check. I hear they are 50/50.

On that note, I bought my macbook from macmall - got a good price, they are in California - so they do not charge sales tax. Was send out next day from Ohio, and I got it a day later. I can refer you to someone in their sales dept.

I would have bought my mini from them, but my wife's computer (3 1/2 year old HP) died and she needed a new computer right away, so I drove an hour do Durham and bought it at the Apple Store and got it same day (had to pay sales tax though).

CyberBob859
Aug 14, 2008, 08:21 PM
Apple's response will be most likely a mini-tablet. The MacBook is in a different market, and the MacBook Air can't be shrunk and price dropped to any competitive price point without crippling Mac OS X.

This is where we disagree. I don't see a Mac Tablet coming. If so, Apple would have made the Modbook themselves instead of giving permission for another company to come out with a Tablet based on the MacBook. If they do make a Tablet, they stab their OEM partner in the back. I don't think it's going to happen.

A tablet based on the iPhone OS and UI won't provide enough power for people who want to do things like email and word processing on the road. If I have to drag a bluetooth keyboard around, I might as well get a laptop.

It won't be as portable as a phone or iPod. OK, better for photos, web surfing, and movies, but how much for carrying around yet another device?

It will be a hard sell for yet another specialty electronics item in the $500-$1000 range. Not in this economy. If nothing else, people will be looking for cheaper versions of what they know they can use. Which is one reason these lower-priced mini-laptops are getting attention, IMO.

Closest thing we get to a tablet is a hard-drive based iPod Touch, which is a good possibility, I think. But it's not a MacBook replacement.

Nahalem replaces Penryn, it doesn't augment it.

True, only if the price stays the same for the newer chip. I thought this was a higher priced chip that would go into higher-end systems. At least at first.

Cheaper than a MacBook Pro, more powerful than a MacBook Air and a subnotebook… the MacBook will have a significant market for the next few years at least. Beyond that… who knows. It may be replaced by the MacBook Air as I explained above.

But a lot of people don't necessarily buy computers based on the specs. If that was true, the Air couldn't hold a candle to the MacBook and wouldn't sell.

People who buy on max performance would never consider a MacBook, so the fact that it's cheaper won't mean anything to them. People buy the Air because they pick it up and wonder where the rest of the computer went. They don't care that it's underpowered and has a smaller hard drive than the MacBook. They'll gladly pay more because it's sexy, light, and does JUST ENOUGH for what they want.

People who buy strictly on price may not even consider an Apple product, but if they want something that matches the MacBook's style and again has JUST ENOUGH performance, some of these higher-end netbooks come close, whether they're made by Apple or not.

Look, I have a white MacBook. I love it. But when I bought mine, there was no MacBook Air, I didn't need the power of a MacBook Pro, and a cheap laptop was last year's Windows machine, with no style, poor performance, and lousy battery life. The MacBook was a perfect choice. Now there are more options. The market has changed, and the MacBook is getting squeezed on all fronts.

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 08:23 PM
What do u mean, your laptop IS DYING? He got cancer tumors? A device is either dead or alive.:D

Probably means what happened to my Dell laptop. One part Broke, then another, then another, now just wondering when it will crash for good all together.

My Dell died a slow death.

1. DVD+-Rw never burned DVD's from day 1 even with new software and all the firmware upgrades - even Dell could not figure it out.
2. Hard Drive took a hit, luckily reformatting it and reinstalling Windows fixed it as it got around the bad sector that caused a main Windows OS file to be corrupted and not boot.
3. Screen got fuzzy
4. Screen Ultimately cracked.
5. Paint wearing off keys
6. Constant pop-up "Your Battery can continue to charge normally, but it is reaching the end of its useful life" to which extent, I can now only run 15 min on the battery before my machine shuts off.

That is what I call dying. It still works, but on its last leg.

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 08:37 PM
This is where we disagree. I don't see a Mac Tablet coming. If so, Apple would have made the Modbook themselves instead of giving permission for another company to come out with a Tablet based on the MacBook. If they do make a Tablet, they stab their OEM partner in the back. I don't think it's going to happen.

A.

As much as I would love a real Apple tablet, and love some of the mockups/photoshops and would love to get my hands on one of them... I often thought about the comment you made. Unless Apple were to acquire Axiotron.

That said, Apple can still compete in the smaller pocket sized tablet/touch PC's out there. I mean look at the Sony VAIO UX and all the companies making similar. However, with them being the size of the iphone - it would compete heavily with the iphone. However, the price tag on one of these Sony's is $3,000. A way too expensive for me, but look whats built in:




http://www.digitaltechnews.com/news/images/sony_vaio_ux_premium_micro_pc.jpg

http://laptoping.com/wp-content/sony_UX_Premium.jpg

Weights and Measurements
Dimensions (Approx.) : 5.91”(W) x 3.74”(H) x 1.27-1.50”(D)16

Weight (Approx.) : 1.2 lbs with standard battery16

Hardware
Camera : 2 Built-in Cameras (front: 0.3M pixels and back: 1.3M pixels) Built-in microphone

Keyboard : 64 keys with 0.15mm stroke and 8.6mm pitch

General
Action Buttons : Mouse Left, Mouse Right, Scroll, Magnify Screen (Zoom In/Out), Capture, Center Button, Wireless LAN On/Off, VAIO Touch Launcher

Computer Type : Micro PC

Pointing Device : Pointer

Security : Biometric Fingerprint Sensor

Type of Use : Ultra Portable

Power
Battery Type : Standard Capacity Lithium-ion Battery (VGP-BPS6)

Estimated Battery Life : 1.5-3.5 hours7 (Standard Battery) 3.0-7.0 hours7 (Large Capacity Battery)

Power Requirements : 41W+10%

Solid State Drive
Capacity : Ultra ATA Format: NAND

Audio
Sound System : Windows® sound system compatible with Built-in monaural speakers

Service and Warranty Information
Limited Warranty Term : 1 Year Limited Warranty8, See actual warranty for details.

Online and Email Support : Support available from http://www.esupport.sony.com/EN/VAIO

Telephone Support : 1 year (toll-free technical telephone assistance, available 24/7)9

Graphics
Chipset : Mobile Intel® 945GMS Express Chipset

Processor : Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 950

Video RAM : 251MB Total Available Graphics Memory15

Processor
Front Side Bus Speed : 533MHz

L2 Cache : 1MB

Speed : 1.2GHz1

Technology : Intel® Centrino® Mobile Technology

Type : Intel® Core™ 2 Solo Processor U2200 Ultra Low Voltage

Networking/Modem
Bluetooth® Technology : Integrated Bluetooth® Technology5

Ethernet Protocol : Fast Ethernet (RJ-45) using Port Replicator or VGA/LAN Adapter

Ethernet Speed : 10Base-T/100Base-TX

Wireless LAN : Intel® PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (802.11a/b/g)3

Wireless WAN : Integrated Wireless Wide Area Network (WAN)13 accessing AT&T national wireless EDGE network with SmartWi™ technology. (Wireless WAN and Wireless LAN radio do not transmit simultaneously)

Inputs and Outputs
DC-In : 1

Headphone Jack : 1

Memory Stick® Media Slot : 1 - Supports Optional Memory Stick Duo™ media with MagicGate® functionality

Microphone Input : 1

Port Replicator Connector(s) : 1 (Bottom)

USB Port(s) : 1 (2.0 compliant)

Display
Resolution : 1024x600

Screen or Display Technology : Wide SVGA LCD, Touch Screen

Screen Size : 4.5”11

Software
Operating System : Genuine Windows Vista® Business12

Security and Anti-Virus Software : Norton 360™ All-In-One Security 60-day Trial

Sony® Original Software : VAIO® Touch Launcher *Please access VAIO® Help and Support from your PC for a complete list of software applications and trials.

Supplied Software : Microsoft® Works SE 9.0 w/ 60-Day, Trial Version of Microsoft® Office 200710 Microsoft® Streets & Trips 2006 Essentials PenPlus™ for VAIO

Memory
Installed : 1GB (1GBx1) PC2-3200

Maximum : 1GB

Speed : 400MHz

Type : DDR2

steve31
Aug 14, 2008, 09:10 PM
As much as I would love a real Apple tablet, and love some of the mockups/photoshops and would love to get my hands on one of them... I often thought about the comment you made. Unless Apple were to acquire Axiotron.

That said, Apple can still compete in the smaller pocket sized tablet/touch PC's out there. I mean look at the Sony VAIO UX and all the companies making similar. However, with them being the size of the iphone - it would compete heavily with the iphone. However, the price tag on one of these Sony's is $3,000. A way too expensive for me, but look whats built in:




http://www.digitaltechnews.com/news/images/sony_vaio_ux_premium_micro_pc.jpg

http://laptoping.com/wp-content/sony_UX_Premium.jpg

Weights and Measurements
Dimensions (Approx.) : 5.91”(W) x 3.74”(H) x 1.27-1.50”(D)16

Weight (Approx.) : 1.2 lbs with standard battery16

Hardware
Camera : 2 Built-in Cameras (front: 0.3M pixels and back: 1.3M pixels) Built-in microphone

Keyboard : 64 keys with 0.15mm stroke and 8.6mm pitch

General
Action Buttons : Mouse Left, Mouse Right, Scroll, Magnify Screen (Zoom In/Out), Capture, Center Button, Wireless LAN On/Off, VAIO Touch Launcher

Computer Type : Micro PC

Pointing Device : Pointer

Security : Biometric Fingerprint Sensor

Type of Use : Ultra Portable

Power
Battery Type : Standard Capacity Lithium-ion Battery (VGP-BPS6)

Estimated Battery Life : 1.5-3.5 hours7 (Standard Battery) 3.0-7.0 hours7 (Large Capacity Battery)

Power Requirements : 41W+10%

Solid State Drive
Capacity : Ultra ATA Format: NAND

Audio
Sound System : Windows® sound system compatible with Built-in monaural speakers

Service and Warranty Information
Limited Warranty Term : 1 Year Limited Warranty8, See actual warranty for details.

Online and Email Support : Support available from http://www.esupport.sony.com/EN/VAIO

Telephone Support : 1 year (toll-free technical telephone assistance, available 24/7)9

Graphics
Chipset : Mobile Intel® 945GMS Express Chipset

Processor : Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 950

Video RAM : 251MB Total Available Graphics Memory15

Processor
Front Side Bus Speed : 533MHz

L2 Cache : 1MB

Speed : 1.2GHz1

Technology : Intel® Centrino® Mobile Technology

Type : Intel® Core™ 2 Solo Processor U2200 Ultra Low Voltage

Networking/Modem
Bluetooth® Technology : Integrated Bluetooth® Technology5

Ethernet Protocol : Fast Ethernet (RJ-45) using Port Replicator or VGA/LAN Adapter

Ethernet Speed : 10Base-T/100Base-TX

Wireless LAN : Intel® PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (802.11a/b/g)3

Wireless WAN : Integrated Wireless Wide Area Network (WAN)13 accessing AT&T national wireless EDGE network with SmartWi™ technology. (Wireless WAN and Wireless LAN radio do not transmit simultaneously)

Inputs and Outputs
DC-In : 1

Headphone Jack : 1

Memory Stick® Media Slot : 1 - Supports Optional Memory Stick Duo™ media with MagicGate® functionality

Microphone Input : 1

Port Replicator Connector(s) : 1 (Bottom)

USB Port(s) : 1 (2.0 compliant)

Display
Resolution : 1024x600

Screen or Display Technology : Wide SVGA LCD, Touch Screen

Screen Size : 4.5”11

Software
Operating System : Genuine Windows Vista® Business12

Security and Anti-Virus Software : Norton 360™ All-In-One Security 60-day Trial

Sony® Original Software : VAIO® Touch Launcher *Please access VAIO® Help and Support from your PC for a complete list of software applications and trials.

Supplied Software : Microsoft® Works SE 9.0 w/ 60-Day, Trial Version of Microsoft® Office 200710 Microsoft® Streets & Trips 2006 Essentials PenPlus™ for VAIO

Memory
Installed : 1GB (1GBx1) PC2-3200

Maximum : 1GB

Speed : 400MHz

Type : DDR2 I had one of these. Sold it. Its cool but it was also painfully slow.

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 09:12 PM
this is kinda off, but kinda on topic in a way...

Since I first joined MR and started blogging, then changed jobs, then bought my first mac and begin the process of dumping windows for mac apps, the whole way I look at computing has changed.

I mean:

1. I dreaded external drives and wanted everything built in. Now that mac has time machine for backups, and jump drives are becoming 8gb and 16 gb at a reasonable price - external drives and not having a built in CD is not so bad. Especially the way mac apps are packaged in one DMG instead of having 10 or 100 cab files like Windows.

2. I never really saw the need for touch/tablet and thought they were a waste unless you were doing presentations and need to draw on a the screen. Now, with the cool apps like Omni (graffle, Dazzle), and Circus ponies, plus I have a livescribe pen and can see some real uses with that. well, if I can write on my computer natively into omni and circus ponies - then there is a plus and why a tablet would be good for me. Especially with going back to school and my new courses don't really have a lot of handouts and workbooks that need to be put in a 3 ring binder. I could just take notes on my laptop or live scribe and port them back in (would rather have a tablet than livescribe - but livescribe has this nice audio record thing).

3. Lan/Ethernet. Well I mostly use wireless except for my wife's mini. I find that runs faster with a cable plugged in rather than using airport (and her mini is only 4 ft from the router - must be the 3 monitors from the other computers causing interfarence). So for me, if I have enough (3-4 USB) then an ethernet dongle may not be so bad.

4. Modem - well, I really only use it for my specialize work apps where I dial directly into a mainframe. That said, I have a work supplied Dell desktop for that. I never actually used the USB modem I bought, so it may be a waste, but atleast I have it should I need it.

5. Expose - Can't live without it and I hate my job for not having it in windows. I mean, at work I have 2 19-inch monitors and they are cluttered with 10 apps running at once. Expose would sure be nice at work.

So truthfully, an Axiotron modbook would really be nice for me (but it needs to have a real keyboard). I mean with everyone clammering for apple to release a tablet, there is one already out there that Apple agreed to be marketed. Does anyone have the sales figures on how those are doing? We never hear about them and they seem like nice machinery. Has there been any problems with them? I mean it would be nice on the road, and then use an apple wireless keyboard and mouse while I am at home. However, with them being as heavy as a macbook, I can see why some people may not like it. I mean come on - why has the modbook been so silent for being very close to what people want - a tablet. it has all the ports and does all people are asking for - but just not in a 9-inch screen size people seem to want. if it was not over $2000, and I knew about it before I bought my macbook and my needs at the time warrented a tablet (like they are starting to) - I may have considered it. Does anyone know about its performance? the modbook sounds like a great machine, but we hear nothing about it.

Oh and one more thing - that two button mouse I once cried about..... Well, I can see still needing it on an imac or a mini. However thanks to whoever it was that pointed out a setting in the system preferences - I found my two fingered click was turned off. So I have gotten used to resting two fingers on the trackpad and clicking. Not so bad after all. Just I do not know what is wrong with my fingers. Scrolling on the trackpad does not seem to be as responsive as my old PC laptops, but one thing I do not miss... Tapping on the track pad. I tend to be a little heavy fingered and with PC's, tapping on the trackpad simulates a click - so sometimes I used to click when I did not want to.

Now my wife who is used to tapping on the pad gets a little annoyed with my macbook.

137489
Aug 14, 2008, 09:16 PM
I had one of these. Sold it. Its cool but it was also painfully slow.


I didn't say it was perfect. I was pointing out the fact where Apple could compete and not cut a partner's throat. I also was just pointing out the fact that apple could make a small, touch, ultra portable computer with enough ports and built in options.

I think with the smaller footprint of snow Leopord and the advances coming in that, apple could do one better than this Sony and still have the ports people are asking for.

GreyHare
Aug 14, 2008, 09:31 PM
I'm planning on getting an Air when the internal drive moves to SATA. Fewer pins, fewer things to break, and the likelihood that I could upgrade the drive in three years would be much higher.

chazz123
Aug 14, 2008, 09:55 PM
:D:D:D:D:D in my opinion i tink that apple should lower the pice a bit because u r LITERALLY paying MORE for LESS... maybe it would be worth it if they uped the processed to the point were its between macbook and macbook pro. and then posibly add a superdrive thing(maybe if they can) and add just a tad more hard drive space. or just make the whole thing SSD and have 64GB and 124GB.... thats what i would like to see possibly give or take a few things:apple:

ahaxton
Aug 14, 2008, 10:02 PM
I wonder how major would be a MBA update to Penryn? Would they make some major changes as to the effectiveness of the machine? Fix its dag on annoying flaws? The core shutdown made me go bonkers!

iMacmatician
Aug 15, 2008, 12:13 AM
This is where we disagree. I don't see a Mac Tablet coming. If so, Apple would have made the Modbook themselves instead of giving permission for another company to come out with a Tablet based on the MacBook. If they do make a Tablet, they stab their OEM partner in the back. I don't think it's going to happen.Not a tablet. A mini-tablet. Mac OS X is designed not for the touchscreen but the mouse, and all signs point to multi-touch support in the trackpad for the forseeable future.

A tablet based on the iPhone OS and UI won't provide enough power for people who want to do things like email and word processing on the road. What? Does word processing really take up that much power? Is there any reason why iWork can't be made into a mobile variant? And with iWork recommending 1 GB of RAM, the full version's not going to be easy on a mini-laptop.

And I bet a mini-tablet and a keyboard would actually be smaller than a Mac OS X mini-laptop, since the tablet doesn't need the high specs of a mini-laptop. Not to mention that device could have a built-in or clip-on small keyboard.

It won't be as portable as a phone or iPod. OK, better for photos, web surfing, and movies, but how much for carrying around yet another device?Neither is a mini-laptop. Both devices can't fit in the pocket, and don't have the power of a MacBook Air.

It's inevitable. A desktop OS crammed into a cheap mini-laptop will end up with big tradeoffs. Small screen means cramped windows and lots of scrolling, limited specs means limited apps, limited speed, and limited multitasking. An iPhone OS device, either mini-tablet or mini-laptop with a touchscreen, would have none of those limitations because iPhone OS was designed for an even smaller device. It's likely that iLife Mobile and iWork Mobile would run better on the iPhone OS device than the desktop versions would on a Mac OS X device with higher specs, since they're mobile variants. And Apple will inevitably make any handheld device as thin as possible, increasing the price per spec for either device.

It will be a hard sell for yet another specialty electronics item in the $500-$1000 range.Not if it has more features. And I'm not sure how well a mini-laptop would sell either, given that for that price I think it'll barely run iMovie (if at all). So much for iLife.

If nothing else, people will be looking for cheaper versions of what they know they can use. Which is one reason these lower-priced mini-laptops are getting attention, IMO.Is the MacBook Air a traditional subnotebook? Is the iPod a traditional media player? Is the iPhone a traditional smartphone? The reason why Apple's products are so good is precisely the other reason—they are different, and better. And in those cases Apple has taken an existing category and turned it upside down—not making "just another device." In fact, Apple might make something other than what both of us think.

And there are those who look for better versions of what they know they can use, a better version of the iPod touch with more features, maybe.

But it's not a MacBook replacement.The mini-tablet isn't a MacBook replacement any more than the mini-laptop you're talking about is a MacBook replacement.

True, only if the price stays the same for the newer chip. I thought this was a higher priced chip that would go into higher-end systems. At least at first.For the mobile variants, Nehalem will be a straight replacement of Penryn. For the desktop variants, yes, the initial Nehalems will go into the high-end.

But a lot of people don't necessarily buy computers based on the specs. If that was true, the Air couldn't hold a candle to the MacBook and wouldn't sell.That's because it's thinner and lighter. For those who don't need Air-like dimensions, why wouldn't they get a MacBook?

And specs matter, otherwise everyone would be buying MacBook Airs and not the other two laptop lines.

People who buy on max performance would never consider a MacBook, so the fact that it's cheaper won't mean anything to them. People who need more performance than a MacBook Air would consider a MacBook. Obviously price matters, or they'd just get a MacBook Pro.

People buy the Air because they pick it up and wonder where the rest of the computer went. They don't care that it's underpowered and has a smaller hard drive than the MacBook. They'll gladly pay more because it's sexy, light, and does JUST ENOUGH for what they want.But what if it doesn't do "just enough"? Again, what if they need more performance than the MacBook Air, or don't want to pay as much as the MacBook Air? The MacBook is the only option. And again, why aren't everyone buying the MacBook Air then?

And it's already been stated, the 2+ GHz CPU and the 120/160 GB HD are not likely to happen. The MacBook Air already has heat problems, and I haven't heard of a bigger than 80 GB HD coming this year. So the gap will increase when the MacBook ups its specs with the redesign.

The market has changed, and the MacBook is getting squeezed on all fronts.We will see whether the MacBook survives this year. I bet yes.

I had one of these. Sold it. Its cool but it was also painfully slow.Because it tries to fit in a desktop OS into a handheld form factor! That is why Apple will never release a Mac OS X mini-laptop. Vista on a handheld? Seriously?

atvbballrob
Aug 15, 2008, 12:45 AM
Nope what I was suggesting was the ability to set how much memory you can set for the integrated graphics not a dedicated card which just simply wont happen.

i 100% agree. The ability to customize such things would take macbooks to the next level.

OS X Dude
Aug 15, 2008, 04:56 AM
I agree: it is a nice-looking computer. And cheaply-priced, too. But it has very modest specs (on the $500 unit, at least).

I didn't earn the nickname MacMan for nothing lol, but if I had the choice of the Dell Hybrid or the Mac Mini, it'd be the Dell every single time. Even though i'd stick Debian on there to make it seem like OS X lol.

Bye Bye Baby
Aug 15, 2008, 05:05 AM
If Apple can add a SSD drive without costing thousands, drop a penryn chip with montevina and noto destroy battery life, then I am in.

The MBA is a great machiene for me, it just needs more power and a more reasonable price point. 1,500 bucks for all that and I don;t think Apple could keep up with demand.

andreab35
Aug 15, 2008, 05:27 AM
As much as I would love a real Apple tablet, and love some of the mockups/photoshops and would love to get my hands on one of them... I often thought about the comment you made. Unless Apple were to acquire Axiotron.

That said, Apple can still compete in the smaller pocket sized tablet/touch PC's out there. I mean look at the Sony VAIO UX and all the companies making similar. However, with them being the size of the iphone - it would compete heavily with the iphone. However, the price tag on one of these Sony's is $3,000. A way too expensive for me, but look whats built in:




http://www.digitaltechnews.com/news/images/sony_vaio_ux_premium_micro_pc.jpg

http://laptoping.com/wp-content/sony_UX_Premium.jpg

Weights and Measurements
Dimensions (Approx.) : 5.91”(W) x 3.74”(H) x 1.27-1.50”(D)16

Weight (Approx.) : 1.2 lbs with standard battery16

Hardware
Camera : 2 Built-in Cameras (front: 0.3M pixels and back: 1.3M pixels) Built-in microphone

Keyboard : 64 keys with 0.15mm stroke and 8.6mm pitch

General
Action Buttons : Mouse Left, Mouse Right, Scroll, Magnify Screen (Zoom In/Out), Capture, Center Button, Wireless LAN On/Off, VAIO Touch Launcher

Computer Type : Micro PC

Pointing Device : Pointer

Security : Biometric Fingerprint Sensor

Type of Use : Ultra Portable

Power
Battery Type : Standard Capacity Lithium-ion Battery (VGP-BPS6)

Estimated Battery Life : 1.5-3.5 hours7 (Standard Battery) 3.0-7.0 hours7 (Large Capacity Battery)

Power Requirements : 41W+10%

Solid State Drive
Capacity : Ultra ATA Format: NAND

Audio
Sound System : Windows® sound system compatible with Built-in monaural speakers

Service and Warranty Information
Limited Warranty Term : 1 Year Limited Warranty8, See actual warranty for details.

Online and Email Support : Support available from http://www.esupport.sony.com/EN/VAIO

Telephone Support : 1 year (toll-free technical telephone assistance, available 24/7)9

Graphics
Chipset : Mobile Intel® 945GMS Express Chipset

Processor : Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 950

Video RAM : 251MB Total Available Graphics Memory15

Processor
Front Side Bus Speed : 533MHz

L2 Cache : 1MB

Speed : 1.2GHz1

Technology : Intel® Centrino® Mobile Technology

Type : Intel® Core™ 2 Solo Processor U2200 Ultra Low Voltage

Networking/Modem
Bluetooth® Technology : Integrated Bluetooth® Technology5

Ethernet Protocol : Fast Ethernet (RJ-45) using Port Replicator or VGA/LAN Adapter

Ethernet Speed : 10Base-T/100Base-TX

Wireless LAN : Intel® PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (802.11a/b/g)3

Wireless WAN : Integrated Wireless Wide Area Network (WAN)13 accessing AT&T national wireless EDGE network with SmartWi™ technology. (Wireless WAN and Wireless LAN radio do not transmit simultaneously)

Inputs and Outputs
DC-In : 1

Headphone Jack : 1

Memory Stick® Media Slot : 1 - Supports Optional Memory Stick Duo™ media with MagicGate® functionality

Microphone Input : 1

Port Replicator Connector(s) : 1 (Bottom)

USB Port(s) : 1 (2.0 compliant)

Display
Resolution : 1024x600

Screen or Display Technology : Wide SVGA LCD, Touch Screen

Screen Size : 4.5”11

Software
Operating System : Genuine Windows Vista® Business12

Security and Anti-Virus Software : Norton 360™ All-In-One Security 60-day Trial

Sony® Original Software : VAIO® Touch Launcher *Please access VAIO® Help and Support from your PC for a complete list of software applications and trials.

Supplied Software : Microsoft® Works SE 9.0 w/ 60-Day, Trial Version of Microsoft® Office 200710 Microsoft® Streets & Trips 2006 Essentials PenPlus™ for VAIO

Memory
Installed : 1GB (1GBx1) PC2-3200

Maximum : 1GB

Speed : 400MHz

Type : DDR2

These things are pretty cool I have to admit. But personally, a tablet pc for me isn't all that I expected.
I have a full sized Gateway laptop that has all the tablet functions and for me, I didn't use them all that much. I actually found it a hassle. I type faster on the keyboard than I write on the screen! Right now on my tablet, I am using Linux, because Vista was painfully slow and glitchy.
But for Apple to come out with a tablet is up to them. Personally, I would never purchase another tablet. From a tablet, I'm just moving to the Air after this update comes.
Hopefully the Air will make a good difference between the current one. :D

clarksonknight
Aug 15, 2008, 07:12 AM
Now my wife who is used to tapping on the pad gets a little annoyed with my macbook.

You do know you can set your trackpad to perform clicks, right?

137489
Aug 15, 2008, 07:17 AM
These things are pretty cool I have to admit. But personally, a tablet pc for me isn't all that I expected.
I have a full sized Gateway laptop that has all the tablet functions and for me, I didn't use them all that much. I actually found it a hassle. I type faster on the keyboard than I write on the screen! Right now on my tablet, I am using Linux, because Vista was painfully slow and glitchy.
But for Apple to come out with a tablet is up to them. Personally, I would never purchase another tablet. From a tablet, I'm just moving to the Air after this update comes.
Hopefully the Air will make a good difference between the current one. :D

I have heard that Vista was painfully slow and glitchy using it as a tablet. For me a tablet is beginning to make sense, only for 2 reasons:

1. Presentations - But OmniDazzle has some cool features to handle that.

2. I work in an area, have a ministry, and also go to school - which require markups, pictures, whiteboarding, and also graphs and pictures to go along with my notes.

Whiteboarding has become an issue as we are spread out across the country - and webex is too expensive for personal use. Besides trying to get everyone together at once is a pain.

Notes - a lot of times my professor will draw something, and i will copy it down.

I guess with all I am hearing about tablets not being all that cracked up to what people expect - I should just stick to my live scribe and hope that they:

1) come out with a mac version of live scribe desktop before December, since their latest "news" is the end of the year for a beta version.

2) Put in an export to PDF that retains the audio. right now all you can do is copy and paste the imaged sheets to word or another app, but you lose the audio. they say many people have asked for this, so they are working on it.

livescribe does not work with VM, parallels, or crossover. the app works in parallels and Vm - but the problem is getting the USB cradle to work. Even if it is recognized, the data will not cross. With that said you can only use it on xp sp2, vista sp1 and bootcamp. My mac is too much setup the way I like it to partition it for bootcamp and re-install everything. BEside I like 2 os's side by side, not having to keep rebooting.

The reason I moved from MS one note, is that is it the only application that can read the files and it only runs on windows. I moved to circus ponies as I am getting rid of most to all my windows apps, and the software was less expensive and still have most of the features. OneNote also has this cache file and automatic backups (to the same disk) which tends to triple the amount of disk space used. If your notebook is 10mb, the cache can be 20-30mb as it captures and stores everything, and then the first time you open onenote in a day it does a backup - so then it adds another 10mb. before you know it, you are looking at 100mb of disk space gone just for a 10mb note book.

You may say that is not bad, but I had 34 gb of note books - so that meant 90% of a 100gb drive was just for onenote and its files. i had to keep deleting the backups and cache, and doing so it takes forever to load as it has to rebuild the cache before you can work with it. the optimization tool makes a copy of the cache to a temp cache and then grows the temp cache by 50%-60% to record all it is doing. the temp cache gets deleted when you restart one note. to think I actually ran my hard drive out of space a few times optimizing. and you can't work with onenote while optimizing.

137489
Aug 15, 2008, 07:18 AM
You do know you can set your trackpad to perform clicks, right?

thank you, another preference setting I did not know about.....

diamond.g
Aug 15, 2008, 07:19 AM
TDP increases linearly with frequency but increases quadratically with voltage.

That is only true if you don't have to increase voltage to increase frequency. What everyone has to remember is TDP is the maximum amount of heat a cooler is suppose to expect from a CPU. That doesn't mean the CPU always puts out the stated TDP. In most cases Intel CPU's don't even put out the TDP. Intel CPUs run really cool.

Dustman
Aug 15, 2008, 08:27 AM
It might be worth mentioning that Dell is offering high performance 128 GB SSD drives as a $500 bto option on their XPS line. That being said they are two very different laptops, and the XPS likely has a 2.5 inch (cheaper) drive.

clarksonknight
Aug 15, 2008, 08:34 AM
thank you, another preference setting I did not know about.....

No problem - I didn't find out about that one until about a year ago. If you set your trackpad up to detect clicks, you can also set it to detect a two-fingered tap as a right click. I have a number of friends who refuse to switch due to the "no right-click" myth.

137489
Aug 15, 2008, 08:51 AM
Since everyone is talking about the new Dell Studio Hybrid that is supposed to rival the mini. For kicks, I went online and built one (no I am not buying one). Color choice is free, with the exception of bamboo which will run you $130 (additional interchangable sleeves are $20 each). The specs below is a middle of the road machine, with the components I would need. Note, Dell is also going to USB external modem. I did not choose it, nor did I choose the blu-ray option.

Nor did I choose any extended care plans, tech teams, 24X7 call plans, etc.

I also did not choose the data safe online backup (so I get no backups?) What the... OSX has the built in...., oh wait in the summary after configuring it says I get 1 yr online for free limited to 3 gb. - rather have time machine that does my whole system and does not have my files floating on the net somewhere.

I also did not choose the Dell Tune up plan (I guess they know they got crappy systems with all these paid warrenty, on-call, tech team, tune up, etc plans that jack the price tremendously). I am only spec'ing out hardware components in this post.

Oh Gee, for $6 Dell will plant a tree for me :rolleyes: -how do I have a feeling that is not the case and the money will end up in Mr. Dell's back pocket.

Starting Price $1,069

Preliminary Ship Date: 8/26/2008

My Components
SYSTEM COLOR Sapphire edit
PROCESSOR Intel® Core™ 2 Duo T8100 (2.1GHz/800Mhz FSB/3MB cache)
OPERATING SYSTEM Genuine Windows Vista® Home Ultimate Service Pack 1
MONITOR No Monitor (System includes DVI and HDMI ports. VGA is not supported) edit
MEMORY 3GB Shared Dual Channel DDR2 at 667MHz (2 DIMM) edit
HARD DRIVE 250GB SATA Hard Drive (5400RPM) edit
OPTICAL DRIVE Slot Load CD / DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive) edit
VIDEO CARD Intel® Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100 edit
SOUND Integrated Sound Blaster® Audigy™ HD Software Edition edit
KEYBOARD & MOUSE Dell USB Multimedia Keyboard & Optical Mouse edit
WIRELESS NETWORKING Built-in Dell 1505 Wireless-N Networking edit
EXTERNAL MODEM No Modem Included edit
My Software & Accessories
SPEAKERS No Speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system) edit
ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE No Security edit
OFFICE SOFTWARE Microsoft Works 9.0 edit
My Service
WARRANTY & SERVICE 1Yr Ltd HW WRTY, InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis, 24x7 Phone Support edit
DATASAFE ONLINE BACKUP Included 3 GB DataSafe Online Backup for 1Yr edit
ENVIRONMENTAL OPTIONS Recycle my old system with Dell (FREE) edit
ALSO INCLUDED WITH YOUR SYSTEM
FLOPPY & MEDIA READER Dell 8 in 1 Media Card Reader
Network Card Integrated 10/100/1000 Ethernet
Labels Windows Vista™ Premium Tablet < - what is this?

So the price is about the same as a macbook......

Since VGA is not supported, you will have to buy a high end monitor or an LCD TV - so which means the monitor you have now, probably will not work. Add in price for that.....

For those wanting blue ray (blue ray bumped the price another $250

Sample image only Help Me Choose
Slot Load CD / DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive) [subtract $250]
Slot Load Blu-ray Disc Combo (DVD+/-RW & BD-ROM) [Included in Price]

So now I am up to $1,319 for this? I have not even added in my extended warrenty yet or the fact I will need a new monitor and can't use my old one..... oh and adding the bluray just pushed the estimated ship date another 3 days.

iMacmatician
Aug 15, 2008, 09:57 AM
If Apple can add a SSD drive without costing thousands, drop a penryn chip with montevina and noto destroy battery life, then I am in.Apple dropped the price of the SSD some time ago. They may keep those BTO prices for the coming update, and add a higher priced 128 GB option.

The MBA is a great machiene for me, it just needs more power and a more reasonable price point. 1,500 bucks for all that and I don;t think Apple could keep up with demand.Hopefully Apple will deliver just that, if this rumor is true!

CWallace
Aug 15, 2008, 10:31 AM
Intel is also preparing to launch their new SSDs (with capacities up to 160GB) which are hoped/expected to be at pricepoints below current ones.

137489
Aug 15, 2008, 12:01 PM
off topic,

This is funny... Dell is taking note of Apple so much, that they are now advertising on MacRumors. :eek:

ARN - I know there is good money in advertising, and now that you are not a nephrologist anymore your income dropped; but really - where is your loyalty?... :mad:

Just kidding...... :D I mean money is money right. ;) Servers, electricity, etc all costs - and I know you had to do a memory upgrade, I got hit with one of your maintenance pages the other day....

Would be cool if Apple started advertising here as well. Now would that be interesting, Apple advertising on a site about news leaks.....

iMacmatician
Aug 15, 2008, 12:10 PM
Fudzilla (http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8902&Itemid=1) says that the Penryn MacBook Air will be released at IDF San Francisco 2008, August 19~21. It mirrors the other rumors we've heard, but the release date is new.

According to one of our cloak and dagger bunch, expect that Apple will announce that they will introduce 2.0GHz Penryn that will grace a slightly revised MacBook Air with a high capacity battery at the Intel Developer Conference next week.

Our guys in the shadows are telling us that the new revision of the MacBook Air will build upon the good things that were successful the first time around, but will offer a faster Penryn- cored processor from Intel, as well as a cheaper SDD solution option or a 120GB/160GB hard drive if you don't select the SSD option.

In addition, the biggest news may be in the fact that the new version of the MacBook Air will carry a slightly higher capacity battery which will give the latest MacBook Air the ability to last a bit longer.

While we do think that it is possible that Apple may choose to work with Intel to make the Penryn announcement, we are just not sure about the IDF timing. With all of the other announcements that we suspect are pending shortly, we just can’t see that Apple will want to alter its strategy to announce at IDF in a effort to help Intel unless there is something in it for Apple, like maybe a better price on the Penryn or perhaps even access to a faster version of the processor ahead of other OEMs?

IDF is next week and we will just have to see what happens.IDF announcement in exchange for 2+ GHz ≈20 W Penryns?

I made a thread on it here (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=544830).

137489
Aug 15, 2008, 12:14 PM
No problem - I didn't find out about that one until about a year ago. If you set your trackpad up to detect clicks, you can also set it to detect a two-fingered tap as a right click. I have a number of friends who refuse to switch due to the "no right-click" myth.

ok, even with me not knowing about the system settings that are not on by default - I got over the right click issue by just getting a USB mouse (actually I had one laying around) - but seriously a 2-button USB mouse will cost you $10 for a basic one, and then go as high as $60 for wireless. So for as a little as $10, you can get around the annoyance of the "no right-click myth".

But yeah, now that I know about the system setting. the two-fingered right click setting was pointed out to me about a week or so ago. I since got used to it, and well -to tell you the truth; I like it better than having to move my whole hand to right click.

However, I still find a mouse quicker - but that is my preference - I use options in apps heavily, so I am always clicking on something.

CWallace
Aug 15, 2008, 12:37 PM
Well Apple launched the last Mac Pro update with no fanfare right before MacWorld 2008 so I could see Apple using IDF since it would allow Apple (and Intel) to showcase the new 22mm package 45nm CPUs and it would be a relatively "stealth" update for the MacBook Air so as to not draw attention away from the bigger MacBook (Pro) / iPod update rumored to be coming within a few weeks after.

I am sure there will be plenty of people - and analysts - who would mistake a dedicated MacBook Air launch as the actual updated MacBook launch and whine about how "useless" it is just as they did when the first model was rolled-out and then Apple's stock will drop 10%. :p

brettinlj
Aug 15, 2008, 12:44 PM
Interesting speculation about the IDF in San Francisco being a possible forum for Apple to announce the MBA. I notice that Steve Wozniak is a guest speaker scheduled to kick off the last day of the event at 8am in the morning on Thursday. I almost would consider the current MBA, but its just slightly below what I want in terms of performance so an update may be enough to get me on board.

For those of you that have a MBA, do you think it would be a suitable desktop replacement for a non-power user? I know its no Macbook Pro, but portability is every bit as important to me as features. I would be using it for school (business school) so most of my use would be a combination of office type applications and personal web-based application use (including video of course, but even my old 1.3Ghz Vaio can handle that). My partner has a MBP, so I could always connect to his optical drive if needed. Storage is not a biggie because we could share an external drive/time capsule.

I would intend to use VMware/XP. Basically, if you are a MBA user that needs another machine to perform some tasks, what are those tasks?

The Tall One
Aug 15, 2008, 02:16 PM
Don't care. You don't buy the MacBook air for the processing power.

Seriously. You either use your computer's processor or you don't. You're either a video editor or a writer. HDV rendering or Word Document Saving.

kjs862
Aug 15, 2008, 03:08 PM
Don't care. You don't buy the MacBook air for the processing power.

Seriously. You either use your computer's processor or you don't. You're either a video editor or a writer. HDV rendering or Word Document Saving.

Good point

rittchard
Aug 15, 2008, 03:38 PM
For those of you that have a MBA, do you think it would be a suitable desktop replacement for a non-power user? I know its no Macbook Pro, but portability is every bit as important to me as features. I would be using it for school (business school) so most of my use would be a combination of office type applications and personal web-based application use (including video of course, but even my old 1.3Ghz Vaio can handle that). My partner has a MBP, so I could always connect to his optical drive if needed. Storage is not a biggie because we could share an external drive/time capsule.

I would intend to use VMware/XP. Basically, if you are a MBA user that needs another machine to perform some tasks, what are those tasks?

The only thing my MBA hasn't been able to handle are a couple of hardcore 3D games, and even in that arena it's been remarkably powerful (I use Bootcamp to go to XP). I've left photo manipulation and music storage on my iMac, though, but that's mainly just because of the larger storage and screen. It's a remarkably powerful computer given the size, and if they are able to boost the processor power without increasing size/weight, I'm in!

Eric S.
Aug 15, 2008, 04:02 PM
The only thing my MBA hasn't been able to handle are a couple of hardcore 3D games, and even in that arena it's been remarkably powerful (I use Bootcamp to go to XP). I've left photo manipulation and music storage on my iMac, though, but that's mainly just because of the larger storage and screen. It's a remarkably powerful computer given the size, and if they are able to boost the processor power without increasing size/weight, I'm in!

I don't understand. If you have a MBA, aren't you already in? :)

Insulin Junkie
Aug 15, 2008, 04:31 PM
I'll be here waiting. =)

brettinlj
Aug 15, 2008, 06:12 PM
The only thing my MBA hasn't been able to handle are a couple of hardcore 3D games, and even in that arena it's been remarkably powerful (I use Bootcamp to go to XP). I've left photo manipulation and music storage on my iMac, though, but that's mainly just because of the larger storage and screen. It's a remarkably powerful computer given the size, and if they are able to boost the processor power without increasing size/weight, I'm in!

Thanks for the info! When I have time for 3D games, I boot up my seldom used desktop PC in the spare bedroom anyway. Given my usual computing missions, this might be the way to go. Especially if the new Macbooks/Pros don't come out until after the back to school promotion ends and the new MBA does.

alphaod
Aug 15, 2008, 08:29 PM
And to take make room for the bigger battery, Apple decides to remove all ports and replace it with 1 proprietary connector connected to a PCI-E x16 interface; this connector features a splitter that will allow DVI-I, 3 USB, FW400, FW800, mic, and stereo. :rolleyes:

Roller
Aug 15, 2008, 08:47 PM
With today's announcement of Lenovo's X301 (http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/15/lenovo-slips-out-the-new-thinkpad-x301-new-cpus-128gb-ssd-sti/), Apple can't afford not to update the MBA if they want to stay competitive.

kingshrubb
Aug 15, 2008, 09:49 PM
Will the MacBook Pros and MacBooks also be updated alongside the MacBook Air? I've been waiting for so long to get a MBP for college and can't wait much longer :(

winterspan
Aug 15, 2008, 10:31 PM
Great to finally get 45nm processors in the Air, but I'd much rather see an option for Penryn ULV (ultra low voltage) chips at ~1.4Ghz. Plenty of power for the basics, and 10W TDP instead of 17W for 1.6Ghz+ Penryn LV (low voltage)

arctic
Aug 15, 2008, 11:23 PM
With today's announcement of Lenovo's X301 (http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/15/lenovo-slips-out-the-new-thinkpad-x301-new-cpus-128gb-ssd-sti/)

Damn! To bad it runs windows.

Orlandooo
Aug 16, 2008, 05:27 AM
Damn! To bad it runs windows.

Are you serious? That looks aaaawful.

EMT123
Aug 16, 2008, 07:56 AM
I was in Best Buy last week and they no longer had the MBA on display. I'm guessing the refresh comes this Tuesday.(8/19/08)

iMacmatician
Aug 16, 2008, 09:29 AM
I was in Best Buy last week and they no longer had the MBA on display. I'm guessing the refreshed version comes out this Tuesday.That fits in with the rumor of a MacBook update next week.

arctic
Aug 16, 2008, 12:25 PM
Are you serious? That looks aaaawful.

Beauty is subjective. I love the IBM oldschool look. But it's not about that. Hardware that MBA owners want. Plus, American Specifications + Japanese Engineering!! ....then Vista boots up. :mad:

drsmithy
Aug 16, 2008, 01:09 PM
So the price is about the same as a macbook......

Why would you be comparing a desktop PC to a laptop ? :confused:

Since VGA is not supported, you will have to buy a high end monitor or an LCD TV - so which means the monitor you have now, probably will not work. Add in price for that.....

VGA is supported, you just need a DVI-VGA adapter.

Of course, the suggestion you need a "high end" monitor or LCD TV to get something with a DVI (or HDMI) port is ridiculously disingenuous. If anything, it is VGA ports that are becoming difficult to find.

137489
Aug 16, 2008, 08:12 PM
Why would you be comparing a desktop PC to a laptop ? :confused:



VGA is supported, you just need a DVI-VGA adapter.

Of course, the suggestion you need a "high end" monitor or LCD TV to get something with a DVI (or HDMI) port is ridiculously disingenuous. If anything, it is VGA ports that are becoming difficult to find.

Oh really? Most every LCD TV's I see now have a VGA port on the back (they just call it a PC port), and you can still buy LCD monitors that are VGA. Since CompUsa went out of business in my area, most people are buying monitors at Wal-Mart rather than paying the bloated prices in an office store. 90 % of those sold are VGA only and still give good quality.

Also, with Dell saying VGA is not supported, tends to lead me (and obviously a bunch of other people) to believe that sticking an adapter on it would not work. Hey, I am just going off of Dell's own website. of course, I talked to them in the past - they have no clue of even what their own website says as I argued over price, delivery dates, specs, etc. This is even at one of their kiosks with one Dell rep on the phone and another standing in front of me looking at the computer screen with me and the order I just placed. They came back and said, well those are just estimates and your order is wrong - here is the real deal. Oh really, so the delivery/ship date on the confirmation and receipt which is a contract - is just an estimate. and the price you just charged my Debit card is just and estimate and you reserve the right to credit more to my card for a replacment should you cannot get the part I just ordered?

Thus why I am never doing business with Dell. I just through it out there since so many people are talking about it, what a great deal it was and how it is going to blow the mini away. Not Really. Base model is less than the mini, but lacking. A comperable model will run you more the mini, and to get what you need - you might as well just get a macbook or mackbook pro - because those will be less expensive than this studio hybrid.

So which mean Dell's pricing is not that good. they start out lower than a mini, but by the time you add in the specs that you really need - you'd be better off buying a macbook that has that standard and paying less.

Also, here is a copy of an email chain with a go worker on Dell. All the company uses is Dell computers, and everyone's computer is a year to 2 years old at the most. Every employee who comes on board is given a brand new machine.

-------------------------------------------------------------

From: Scott Hervieux
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:42 PM
To: <Name ommitted>
Subject: FW: computer trouble

Oh and if you want a mac, let me know - I know a great sales guy at MACMALL in California who could give you a discount. They ship same or next day, the system will come preconfigured – so all you have to do it load your software. And because they are in Cali, no sales tax. And when in OSX – you will love the Expose button and wish windows had one (Expose lets you hit the button, all windows size down equally but keep running and updating the display. Then you just click on the one you want to switch to… So it is nice when I have 5 things running, I just hit the expose and watch them all. Then when one finished, I just click that screen to go to it and then expose back to watching it.

I really wish I had a mac for work……

Scott Hervieux

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: <name omitted for privacy>
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:40 PM
To: Scott Hervieux
Subject: RE: computer trouble

Ya, I wonder if it does have to do with the ms updates.

I think you are right on with the dell products, just talked to Ops and he stated I could get a company price on a Dell…NO THANK YOU.

I heard HP and Sony were the best bet because they are not just a bunch of random parts thrown together.

My VPC blew up yesterday,…I’m still trying to rebuild it with a new one..fun fun fun…
Thanks, <name omitted>


________________________________________
From: Scott Hervieux
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:34 PM
To: <name ommited>
Subject: RE: computer trouble

Probably MS updates.

1. My outlook slow
2. VPC – rebooted my cisco VPC for the 3rd time today as PCA keeps locking up or not launching
3. I can no longer open spreadsheets by double clicking them, I have to open Excel and browse to the spreadsheet.

What ever you do, don’t buy a dell. My friend had one, it died after one year (LCD backlight or inverter board went – was going to cost over $400 to repair and Dell cancelled the order twice)

My Dell laptop I was using as my backup work machine is dead (DVD drive never did burn DVD’s and also started making grinding noises- had to buy an external one, screen went fuzzy, LCD cracked)

The Dell desktop work gave me, well you know what happened in May. Only 3 months old – hard drive, motherboard, and power supply all blew separately.

All the Dell towers at my last company had power supply issues within one year, plus every single one of them had the front USB ports stop working on them.


I think Dell knows they have bad equipment, they started offering a 3 year warranty, 24X7 on call support, tech team, and tune up plans all for around $100 each.

I like HP, I had an HP tower for 3 ˝ years. I just retired it as it was too old. Never really gave too much problems (everything was centered around windows Media center or the fact it only had 512 ram).

Also, make sure you do not get Vista. While SP1 fixed a lot, I am still hearing on the blogs problems here or there. But MS told everyone to pull XP and stop offering it as a downgrade after June 18th – some companies will still downgrade though.

Newegg always seems to have the best prices.

But if it were up to me – GET A MAC AND RUN BOOTCAMP, PARALLELS, OR VM. For heavy intense stuff we do (like all the virtual PC’s) – I would go with boot camp to ensure I had the entire system resources.

YOU WILL LOVE OS X…..

Scott Hervieux
----------------------------------------------

From: <name Ommited>
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:22 PM
To: Interface Support
Subject: computer trouble

Hi All,

I’m having serious computer problems today…my computer just keeps shutting down with no warning. Happened 4 times already, it boots right back up so If I’m in a chat with you I’lll be right back.

Enough is enough..i’m buying a lap top this weekend…argh…

Thanks,

AppliedMicro
Aug 17, 2008, 11:27 AM
As is often the case, (some) expectations for a new revision of an Apple product seem a bit exaggerated. Here's my take:

- New form factor, smaller bezel etc.: Not going to happen. Apple does not change its machines' form factor so soon or often
- HD: depending on what's available on the market in sufficient quantities at reasonable prices. If anybody is making 120GB HD or if SSD prices have dropped enough, then the whole line will possibly be moved to SSD
- RAM: 4GB, hopefully (OS X needs it, and it's relatively cheap)
- CPU: Processing power is sufficient today, IMO. And name a subnotebook that does pack a similar amount of processing power in such a tiny and lightweight package, as Apple does with the MacBook Air? There isn't hardly any. Instead, competitors like Toshiba, Sony and Lenovo are mostly stuffing more ports and larger hard disks, PC Card slots and even some smallish optical drives in their subnotebook offerings - different interpretations of the "subnotebook" concept.

Also, the current MacBook Airs, or at least a considerable number of them have cores shutting down under high load. You're gonna tell me, Apple will move to CPUs with even higher TDP? Now, even though higher TDP does not necessarily mean higher power draw on average, and even though we haven't seen Core 2 Duo SP9300/9400 and/or SL9300/9400 in the wild, it still seems improbable if not infeasible to pack a 25W TDP CPU in such a tiny frame. Plus... it's really NOT going to help with battery runtime. Seems a bad decision, and I really do not hope they're gonna do that. And mind you, many people cannot even use the "full" 2x 1.8GHz for more than a few seconds/minutes today, because of core shutdown.

Here's what I think is a reasonable assumption. One that I personally am waiting / hoping for:

- same form factor
- CPU: Low Voltage Core 2 Duo SL9300 / SL9400 @ 17W TDP, 1.6 / 1.86 GHz, with improved battery runtime (that should be why they call it the "Air", shouldn't it?) - and you should be able to actually use the full 2x 1.86 GHz for longer periods, without thermal throttling or core shutdowns.
- HD: 120GB if available and / or larger-capacity SSD as an option. Maybe complete move to SSD, though that seems to be either quite expensive, or a step back from the present 80GB HD.
- RAM: 4GB seems possible
- Price: possibly small price drop (depending if they move to SSD completely)


Bottom line: Upgraded hard drive (options), longer battery runtime, maybe more RAM and/or maybe a small price drop - a rather conservative (but more likely, IMO) revision B...

AidenShaw
Aug 17, 2008, 09:18 PM
And name a subnotebook that does pack a similar amount of processing power in such a tiny and lightweight package, as Apple does with the MacBook Air?

If you define "tiny" as "thin", the MacBook Cube Air fits the bill. Otherwise, it's full size!

It is definitely not "tiny" if you consider the overall size, however. "Tiny" starts with 10" screens, and goes smaller from there.

AppliedMicro
Aug 17, 2008, 10:30 PM
If you define "tiny" as "thin", the MacBook Cube Air fits the bill.
It is definitely not "tiny" if you consider the overall size, however.
You're right, of course. That was a mistake in translation.

(I know there's a difference between the two... just didn't stick out to me while typing in a foreign language ;) )

Macinposh
Aug 18, 2008, 03:14 AM
- same form factor
- CPU: Low Voltage Core 2 Duo SL9300 / SL9400 @ 17W TDP, 1.6 / 1.86 GHz, with improved battery runtime (that should be why they call it the "Air", shouldn't it?) - and you should be able to actually use the full 2x 1.86 GHz for longer periods, without thermal throttling or core shutdowns.
- HD: 120GB if available and / or larger-capacity SSD as an option. Maybe complete move to SSD, though that seems to be either quite expensive, or a step back from the present 80GB HD.
- RAM: 4GB seems possible
- Price: possibly small price drop (depending if they move to SSD completely)


Bottom line: Upgraded hard drive (options), longer battery runtime, maybe more RAM and/or maybe a small price drop - a rather conservative (but more likely, IMO) revision B...


Exactly my toughts as well.. I think it will be a silent upgrade,as apple possibly wont make a scene because of the lack of advance in speed.
Merely a "cooler,roomier and even more affordable" or something.

Intresting is how Macbook and Macbook pro will continue to be more differentiated?
Quad core options for MBPs,HDMI and option for BR,perhaps?

darngooddesign
Aug 18, 2008, 10:10 AM
There are still many reasons to get a MacBook over a MacBook Air. Price, specs, expandability.

Significantly worse screen, no backlit keyboard (after having one in my PB for several years I now despise not having one in my MB), thicker and heavier design, which if you carry around a lot of other junk does make a difference.

DJY
Sep 7, 2008, 05:27 AM
I'm hanging out for them to update the MBA!

I don't think any updates that require changes to the physical casing are likely (as much as I'd love a swappable battery, or extra ports)...

but a speed bump and bigger hard drive options will see me grabbing one of these ASAP!


If only they will update it now please!

Macinposh
Sep 7, 2008, 05:45 AM
I'm hanging out for them to update the MBA!

I don't think any updates that require changes to the physical casing are likely (as much as I'd love a swappable battery, or extra ports)...


Smaller bezel dictates for one.
If they make the bezel smaller the footprint goes down close to the old 12" ibooks/Powerbooks.
And they cant upsize the screen as the 15" screen doesnt fit into the present casing.

Hopefully they make it smaller,had the chance to use the MBA for couple of days and it would be the perfect tool for me, if only the size would be a tad smaller..