Its in, Fox, AP, MSNBC, McCain confirms picking of Sarah Palin as VP

[clevin]

discredited lieberman rumors

Update, its Palin. scroll down for discussion!

http://uberdesi.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/palin_sarah.jpg

WIki for Sarah Palin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Palin

[Cleverboy]

That would be interesting.
I was just reading this article earlier today:
Avoiding a Lieberman Disaster
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/28/AR2008082801773.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

McCain has said that he wouldn't pick a "pro-choice" candidate, so... if he does... YIKES. It would certainly help him smooze with disaffected Clinton voters, even though his Supreme Court picks would ultimately nullify any MEANING in that regard. Honestly, if he doesn't pick Romney, he's going to have a conservative revolt. Even conservative friends of mine are anxious to see McCain pick Romney.

Karl Rove has allegedly been very disturbed by the idea of Lieberman:
Republican strategist Karl Rove called Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman (I-Conn.) late last week and urged him to contact John McCain to withdraw his name from vice presidential consideration, according to three sources familiar with the conversation.Lieberman dismissed the request, these sources agreed.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/08/28/politics/animal/main4391723.shtml

Interesting ads though. That would be a first. Busted by Google Adwords.

EDIT:

The link in the ad displays (www.JohnMcCain.com/lieberman) which doesn't actually exist (404 page if navigated directly).
The REAL Url that the ad points to is:
http://www.johnmccain.com/citizens/?sid=google&t=joel&r=co

Which redirects to:
http://citizens.johnmccain.com/Site.aspx

VERY interesting indeed.

--The landing page features that Hillary switcher and runs all the "pro-Hillary" McCain ads.
It DOES seem to "add up", however disingenuous the reasoning.
Further more... I just looked at the text of the page. It features a quote from Joe Lieberman.
Citizens for McCain is an organization within the McCain campaign for people who put country before political party and support the candidate for President who has a proven record of bipartisanship.

"I have worked with John McCain for many years in the U.S. Senate and know from experience that he can unite Democrats, Republicans and Independents like no one else in this country. He did it in the United States Senate and he can do it as President of the United States."

Thank you for your willingness to help me expand this new organization. Together, we will make history.
Joe Lieberman

I wonder if McCain feels he's already united the party enough to do something like this.

~ CB

[Ntombi]

Oh, I hope so.

Add that dyspeptic, unlikable, warmonger to the ticket, and I'll do the happy dance!



ETA: CB, That's an old quote (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/06/1119343.aspx).

[atszyman]

Could the Dems turn it into an add to court the religious right?

McCain used to be pro-choice, Lieberman is pro-choice. If the GOP doesn't have a pro-life ticket, why not vote for the ticket that's not going to be 4 more years of the other crap we've been putting up with?

Of course they could be a little more eloquent than me.

[Cleverboy]

Oh, I hope so.
Add that dyspeptic, unlikable, warmonger to the ticket, and I'll do the happy dance! ETA: CB, That's an old quote (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/06/1119343.aspx). Got it. So, "Senator Lieberman joins McCain's Team" is a reference to his spearheading of the "Citizens for McCain" group. --Which makes perfect sense now. Now placing "I feel silly" badge on my head. :) I guess this type of news would be far too entertaining for me.

My fiance was commenting that he might pick a woman as vice. I guess Sarah Palin's name has been floated. She's substantially younger, pro-life, and a supporter of traditional (man and woman) marriage.
http://gov.state.ak.us/

~ CB

[Lyle]

MSNBC reports that Tim Pawlenty is not the pick, and that he's not in Dayton (the site for McCain's announcement) today.

I'm still assuming that after all the smoke and mirrors it's still going to be Romney.

[clevin]

MSNBC reports that Tim Pawlenty is not the pick, and that he's not in Dayton (the site for McCain's announcement) today.

I'm still assuming that after all the smoke and mirrors it's still going to be Romney.

im thinking either Romney, or AK governor, the strange woman.

[Lyle]

im thinking either Romney, or AK governor, the strange woman.Now both FOX and MSNBC are saying it's neither Pawlenty nor Romney.

So I guess that leaves Sarah Palin, Tom Ridge, Joe Lieberman, ... ?

[SwiftLives]

I'm hearing Palin as an attempt to draw Hillary supporters away.

Not sure she's the wisest pick, since she's under investigation in AK.

And Lieberman will only serve to royally tick off the base. Why would a presidential candidate pick someone who is so completely opposed to everything he believes in? Do they agree on anything other than the war? I just don't see why McCain would pick someone who would undo most of what he's worked to accomplish if he ever left office.

[Cleverboy]

If its not Romney... and its not Lieberman... then its Palin.

And, if Palin has no serious issues, than that will deal a SIGNIFICANT blow to the Democratic ticket, by giving the APPEARANCE of catering to voters deciding based on gender. A loss by the first viable mixed gender ticket in U.S. history, would deal YET ANOTHER blow to the feeling (and reality) that women suffer from a huge mount of gender-bias in the media and politics. How many times can feminists say, "Yes, but she's not the RIGHT woman." and still save face? My guess... not that many? Some women are already railing about Biden for trying to muzzle Anita Hill and allowing Thomas a cake-walk to confirmation by suppressing other witnesses to his sexist behavior.

Only time will tell how "serious" a blow a decision like this would be.
Not sure she's the wisest pick, since she's under investigation in AK.You mean an investigation that could be protested like this?
How dare her want to get rid of this cop who tasered her 11 year old nephew and threatened to kill her father. Who the hell does she think she is?
This is a disgrace and she should be impeached. The democrats are right on this one. And I’m sure that 11 year old boy had it coming. And I’m sure the officer had good cause to say he was going to put a bullet in Mr. Palin’s head. And as far as drinking on duty in his squad car, …well so what. What could possibly go wrong with a drunk cop driving around confronting criminals and traffic offenders?
With Governor’s like this running around trying to keep cops like this off our streets and highways, what’s next? Firing good teachers who are child molesters? I can hear the indignation ringing off of this one already, although the reality might be much more complicated and negative (http://palininvestigated.blogspot.com/).

~ CB

[g4cubed]

I believe it's Palin. And I also think it's a good choice being she's a true conservative, and a woman.

[Cleverboy]

ABC is reporting that its not Palin.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/08/mccain-vp-conte.html
But one person who will not be there: Palin. The Governor's spokesperson, Sharon Leighow, tells ABC News she's going to the State Fair in Anchorage, Alaska.

So that means:

[NO] - Romney (reported by Fox sources)
[NO] - Pawlenty (according to Pawlenty)
[NO] - Palin (reported by ABC)
[???] - Lieberman
[???] - Ridge

~ CB

[Ntombi]

I don't know. I don't know of any feminists who would vote for McCain, with his record, just because of Palin, and don't talk to me about those idiotic PUMAs, either. Just because a candidate (running mate) is a woman doesn't make her someone who will stand for women.

I'd vote for a pro-choice, pro-feminist man over an anti-choice, "traditional values" woman 100% of the time. And this isn't even almost close. Even if you just look at Biden vs. Palin, Biden blows her out of the water. And Biden didn't stifle Anita Hill :confused: He gave her a lot of room to present her side, unlike some of the others on the committee, and he ended up voting against Thomas' confirmation. I have no issues with him on that front. And if they try to bring it up, they'll be reminding people that several justices will need to be appointed by the next president, and what a joke of a justice Thomas was. Except it's not funny.

I realize that there are some who would vote based on gender, just like there are some who will vote based on race, but I would hope that they are in the minority.

[SwiftLives]

Ridge then?

I'm starting to think we're all being hoodwinked, and that the VP selection will be one nobody saw coming. Cantor from VA?

Palin would pretty much negate the argument against Obama that he's inexperienced. She's only been governor for two years, and was mayor of the city of Wasilla before that. I'm pretty sure that would translate to even less experience than Obama.

McCain is doing a great job at building the excitement and publicity for his VP pick (and taking the thunder away from Obama's speech last night).

Fascinating.

[g4cubed]

... Just because a candidate (running mate) is a woman doesn't make her someone who will stand for women. Very true but many will vote for her because she is a woman.


I'd vote for a pro-choice, pro-feminist man over an anti-choice, "traditional values" woman 100% of the time.
But you have to look at it from the republican side they're pro life.

[Thomas Veil]

ABC is reporting that its not Palin.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/08/mccain-vp-conte.html
Wait a minute...she and her family landed in Ohio yesterday...to go to the state fair in Anchorage today??

Yeah. :rolleyes:

[Ntombi]

Very true but many will vote for her because she is a woman.

But you have to look at it from the republican side they're pro life.

Yes, but I was addressing the point of that pick trying to grab Hillary supporters, who are pro-choice, by and large.

[g4cubed]

Yes I understood that but some will vote that way just because they believe Hilary was unfairly treated.
Just my observation.

[Lyle]

I'm starting to think we're all being hoodwinked, and that the VP selection will be one nobody saw coming.Same here. Not sure what to think now that Palin appears to be out.

[blackfox]

Same here. Not sure what to think now that Palin appears to be out.

Not that it means anything necessarily, but CNBC reports that it's Palin.

[Cleverboy]

Wait a minute...she and her family landed in Ohio yesterday...to go to the state fair in Anchorage today??
Yeah. :rolleyes:Two senior Republican sources said they had been told Palin was McCain's choice. But those accounts came amidst conflicting reports about whether Palin had arrived here on a chartered plane last night or was still in Alaska.The plane's flight information and registration can be found using freely available flight tracking tools on the Internet. They show that the plane, a Gulfstream IV, landed at Hook Field municipal airport about a half-hour outside of Dayton at 10:07 pm last night.Karl Rove, President Bush's former top political advisers, said on Fox News that picking Palin would "shake up" the traditional coalitions in both parties. He called Palin a "breath of fresh air," and said picking her would be an indication that McCain is hoping to make a direct appeal to women voters, especially those who voted for Sen. Hillary Clinton, not Sen. Barack Obama, during the Democratic primary.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/29/AR2008082901112_2.html?hpid=topnews&sid=ST2008082901128&s_pos=
Oh, the conflicting reports! Is it Palin? Is it?

~ CB

[clevin]

since now mitt romney is out, I bet its the crazy woman from alaska. hopefully she got indicted soon after the nomination, :D

[Lyle]

Not that it means anything necessarily, but CNBC reports that it's Palin.OK. I give up. ;)

[clevin]

huffingtonpost is reporting sarah palin too, citing a GOP insider source.

http://images.huffingtonpost.com/gen/32609/thumbs/s-PALIN-large.jpg

now all guests on DR show are talking about crazy woman too.

[és:]

So, who wants to tell us about her?

[blackfox]

I have to say that if it is Palin - then McCain has made an interesting choice (and gamble) - that will make a lot of people pause.

Having a woman on his ticket, could prove persuasive to some Hillary supporters (or women in general). Palin is also somewhat of a "maverick" in GOP circles, which can reinforce McCain's claim as such. Palin is also reliably socially-conservative, so the Fundies won't be spooked.

Still, McCains arguments against Obama due to his lack of experience, will falter considerably - seeing as she has next to none. Also - I couldn't help but think of the relative likelihood of a shortened McCain presidency, and Palin having to be a sudden POTUS. It would be historic, and she might do well - but it is a little scary to consider...

[Pittsax]

No offense to Sarah Palin, but this pick smacks of pandering. McCain knows he needs to compete with Obama, so he picks a woman. Never mind the fact that she is two years removed from being mayor of a small town in Alaska.

This is going to make things interesting for the VP debate though. Biden has to avoid looking like he's beating up on a woman.

[kavika411]

As a person who cares deeply about judicial reform, fiscal policy and NAFTA-related issues, my response to this news was to immediately run a Google image search on Sarah Polin to find out if she is smoking hot.

[gibbz]

No offense to Sarah Palin, but this pick smacks of pandering. McCain knows he needs to compete with Obama, so he picks a woman. Never mind the fact that she is two years removed from being mayor of a small town in Alaska.

This is going to make things interesting for the VP debate though. Biden has to avoid looking like he's beating up on a woman.

+1 This is another example of McCain having moldable stances based on what the political scene dictates. He harped on Obama being an "elitist", yet didn't know how many homes he owned, and when asked about, fell on the good old "I was a POW" sword. He has done nothing but bash the lack of experience of Obama, so logically he picks a 44 year old unknown who was recently a mayor in a small town in Alaska. This clearly reeks of trying to counter Obama's minority status by choosing a female as a running mate. 90% along Bush's line is not a maverick.

[clevin]

As a person who cares deeply about judicial reform, fiscal policy and NAFTA-related issues, my response to this news was to immediately run a Google image search on Sarah Polin to find out if she is smoking hot.

actually, Ms Palin never has a bad picture, hard to find an ugly one.

[blackfox]

This is going to make things interesting for the VP debate though. Biden has to avoid looking like he's beating up on a woman.

This is an interesting point - and possibly a shrewd tactical move by the McCain camp.

[clevin]

if McCain wants to attract Hillary supporters, he should have picked a more modest, slightly older, and pro-choice woman, rather than a feisty hot model like Palin....

[fivepoint]

Seems like a good strategic choice. Just from one perspective... at the vice-president debate, Biden is going to be able to be "Biden" at his best. He's going to have to tone it down a bit so it doesn't look like he's verbally abusing potentially the first female to hold the VP or P spot.

She is staunchly pro-life, and that is what the social conservatives were waiting for. She is also a staunch fiscal conservative (think slightly watered down version of Ron Paul) which will capture those votes as well.

Not to mention...
http://bp2.blogger.com/_uExTzMIDd1Y/R2O5nKq9_tI/AAAAAAAAATE/At2bb_K_3ao/s400/Sarah-Palin-Vogue.jpg

[scotthayes]

If I were an American or could vote in this election (how I wish I could) selecting her would give me huge concern (even if I didn't disagree with 95% of what Republicans stand for) to me the VP should be equal to the President. Somebody with just 24 months experience of running such a sparsely populated state could be just a heartbeat away from becoming President. SCARY...

This is a cynical pick by McCain to try and grab the women who are pissed that it's not Hillary.

[clevin]

She is staunchly pro-choice, and that is what the social conservatives were waiting for. She is also a staunch fiscal conservative (think slightly watered down version of Ron Paul) which will capture those votes as well.


typo?

[Lyle]

Joe Scarborough (or maybe someone on his panel) points out that "I guess we need to learn how to pronounce her last name." :D

All of the initial talking points that they're giving about her sound good, but I'm still not sure what to make of this choice. Biden will obviously have to handle the VP debate carefully, but I can't imagine that she can go toe-to-toe with him (although I'd love to be surprised).

[fivepoint]

typo?

Oops. I'll change it. thanks.

[Lyle]

Somebody with just 24 months experience of running such a sparsely populated state could be just a heartbeat away from becoming President.Or worse, you could have a first-term Senator with zero executive experience in charge. ;)

[g4cubed]

...to me the VP should be equal to the President. Somebody with just 24 months experience of running such a sparsely populated state could be just a heartbeat away from becoming President. SCARY...
So by that standard Obama shouldn't even be running.

edit: lyle beat me to it

[Cleverboy]

Not to mention... That Photoshop mock-up will be a HUGE reason why female Democrats vote McCain in November. That mock-up is SEXIST.

For female P.U.M.A.s, they will vote for McCain for three specific reasons:

1. Experience
2. To Send a Message to the Democratic party establishment
3. To elect a woman to the 2nd highest office in the nation

If McCain loses now, it will be the second largest LOSS in feminist history.

~ CB

[clevin]

That Photoshop mock-up will be a HUGE reason why female Democrats vote McCain in November. That mock-up is SEXIST.

For female P.U.M.A.s, they will vote for McCain for three specific reasons:

1. Experience
2. To Send a Message to the Democratic party establishment
3. To elect a woman to the 2nd highest office in the nation

If McCain loses now, it will be the second largest LOSS in feminist history.

~ CB

i guess this is another symbolism vs. issue, for symbolism, barack got nomination after all

for issue, Palin is a man in woman's skin, for symbolism, she might be first femail vp..

who knows, we will see.

[fivepoint]

That Photoshop mock-up will be a HUGE reason why female Democrats vote McCain in November. That mock-up is SEXIST.

For female P.U.M.A.s, they will vote for McCain for three specific reasons:

1. Experience
2. To Send a Message to the Democratic party establishment
3. To elect a woman to the 2nd highest office in the nation

If McCain loses now, it will be the second largest LOSS in feminist history.

~ CB

Jeezez man... it was a joke. Do you think I actually thought that poor photo-shop image was a reason to have her as VP? Sheesh! I guess I need to be a bit more liberal with my smiley face placement.

[Full of Win]

Woot - I think we Republicans just won. All we need is a few % here and there - and the prize is OURS. :)

Oh, and as far as politicians go, she ain't bad too look at either.

[g4cubed]

Jeezez man... it was a joke. Do you think I actually thought that photo was a reason to have her as VP? Sheesh! I guess I need to be a bit more liberal with my smiley face placement.

I didn't see any smilies. :rolleyes: ;)

[Cleverboy]

Jeezez man... it was a joke. Do you think I actually thought that photo was a reason to have her as VP? Sheesh! I guess I need to be a bit more liberal with my smiley face placement.I'm just talking about the media. Stop taking everything personally. And, yes... the "just a joke" defense won't wash with the feminists. --But, don't sweat it, its the Democrats that will need to thread the needle. Republican voters can say anything they like at this point. Democrats just found out that their new "solid ground" of unity has become thin ice.

~ CB

[JG271]

A very interesting choice, what a landmark election this is going to be!

I think it'll either backfire or boost his election chances significantly, I'm thinking the latter at this time. It'll be interesting to see the voters reaction.

[blackfox]

Or worse, you could have a first-term Senator with zero executive experience in charge. ;)

Though I am oversimplifying - there is a weird, mirrored symmetry to the opposing tickets now.

You have Obama - young, fresh, charismatic, political "outsider" and a historic minority candidate.

You have Biden - Long government history, extensive political experience.

then:

You have McCain - long government history, extensive political experience.

You have Palin - young, fresh, charismatic, political "outsider" and a historic minority candidate.

So I am interested to see how various lines of attack will work here (by both parties). Perhaps it will move on to the issues...where, of course, things are much different.

[Beric]

As a conservative, I'm pretty happy with the choice. Would have preferred Huckabee probably, but Palin doesn't have much political baggage, because she is less well-known. She also proves that conservative women do exist, can be good leaders, and aren't "oppressed" by men, whatever the media says.

And by the way, about the earlier discussion of pro-life/pro-choice/anti-choice, to a large percentage of conservatives, people who accept abortion are "pro-death". Take that into consideration.

[miloblithe]

Interesting. A picture of Palin visiting a a wounded soldier in Landstuhl, Germany is on her wikipedia page that wasn't there this morning.

Here's to betting this is the most edited page of the day!

[stubeeef]

I like the choice, as a Gov she has more executive branch experience than any of the other 3 in the running.
She is pro-life (which all of us anti death penalty folks ought to be) and recently knowingly gave birth to a downs baby.
She has good street cred with the conservative while actually being somewhat independent (against anwar, sold the governors jet, has some popular energy views).
So now the dems can call the repubs racist, and the repubs can call the dems sexist.

[Pittsax]

I like the choice, as a Gov she has more executive branch experience than any of the other 3 in the running.
She is pro-life (which all of us anti death penalty folks ought to be) and recently knowingly gave birth to a downs baby.
She has good street cred with the conservative while actually being somewhat independent.
So now the dems can call the repubs racist, and the repubs can call the dems sexist.
Isn't she also under state investigation?

And while 1.5 years as governor of Alaska is technically executive branch experience, how much experience is it really?

[zap2]

Woot - I think we Republicans just won. All we need is a few % here and there - and the prize is OURS. :)
.

I doubt it....American's want something new....Wait for the debates, Obama is eat McCain alive, and while I know little of Pain's skills, I'd be impressed in she could stand up to Biden(if she had a history of being skill in a debate as Biden does, I'd beat we'd be hearing about it)

[Pittsax]

I doubt it....American's want something new....Wait for the debates, Obama is eat McCain alive, and while I know little of Pain's skills, I'd be impressed in she could stand up to Biden(if she had a history of being skill in a debate as Biden does, I'd beat we'd be hearing about it)
I think there's no doubt Biden can debate circles around her. As I said before, his biggest concern is to defeat her intellectually without appearing to talk down to her/patronize her. If he sticks to the issues, he'll be fine.

The only way I see this really helping McCain is in his attempt to divorce himself from Bush. There are more qualified women out there he could have picked from -- Christine Todd Whitman comes to mind -- but her ties to Bush would have been toxic.

[g4cubed]

Isn't she also under state investigation?

And while 1.5 years as governor of Alaska is technically executive branch experience, how much experience is it really?

A heck of a lot more than Obama who will be President.

[stubeeef]

interesting that she beat the incumbent repub gov in the primary, NOW THAT IS GOING AGAINST THE MACHINE! THAT TAKES SOME KA-HUNES! can u say maverick?
She against anwr, got rid of the gov jet, gave birth to a downs baby (conviction)
I don't think she is under investigation, although all politicians should be, but she got rid of the other repub gov that was under investigation while fighting the party for the nomination.
She is financially conservative in a BIG way.
She is pro gun, pro life which some hillary fans will not be able to embrace.
It sure does steal the limelight and blunt the bump from last night imho.

[atszyman]

This seems to completely remove the "experience" question if we're to believe that one of the primary concerns of the VP pick is someone who is ready to be the president on a moment's notice.

Not to mention that if we're going to make the election about experience we have one person on each side eligible to run who has experience in the job. If we really wanted the most experienced candidates this election would be George H.W. Bush versus Jimmy Carter.

So with the experience question coming to a draw, we're left with debates on the issues, which I can see hurting McCain more than Obama.

McCain's choice was strategic in that it will solidify AK for him, only a whopping three EC votes but by picking Palin, it should, in theory solidify his lead there in a way that could not be guaranteed by Pawlenty or Romney with MN or MA respectively.

As for courting Clinton voters, it might work but seeing as how much the GOP hammers the experience issue, it might be seen as blatant pandering for womens' votes which could actually hurt him in the long run, but will more than likely just end up in a wash.

[blackfox]

Too soon to tell, really, but I feel like my head (and perhaps many voters) heads will explode from now till Nov from all the irony.

btw, though perhaps inconsequential - Palin evidently supports alaskan drilling, including ANWAR. She was once the head of the Alaskan Conservation Society(?!), and her husband works for BP on the North Slope.

She does, however, seem to be independent of big oil interests, as her tenure has shown - and seems to be very ethical, as evinced by her pushing of an ethics reform bill and the position she has taken with Stevens.

[scotthayes]

Isn't she also under state investigation?


Yup, but it's only a tiny little issue of abuse of office by trying to get her ex brother-in-law fired from his job as state trooper.

AP Story (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gWi6yTVfPyJeiTBsQ33SSUiobt8wD92I9NIO0)

[stubeeef]

She has infinitely more experience than BHO, she has actually done things, not just voted present.

[zap2]

A heck of a lot more than Obama who will be President.

I wouldn't say it more.

And for me its a non issue. She gets how to lead, and so does Obama.

But for the McCain campaign, who was been screaming how Obama's so young and isn't ready to lead, Palin is very similar in that aspect.

Also I think this shows McCain is concerned about the picture Obama's campaign is painting(and its pretty true) that McCain is so similar to Bush. So McCain picks someone with few ties to Bush.

[stubeeef]

btw, though perhaps inconsequential - Palin evidently supports alaskan drilling, including ANWAR.

i thought and heard, not read, she was against ANWR.

PS, i heard wrong, you are right (I want drilling there too, but thought her not wanting it would help her with SOME independants).

[blackfox]

She has infinitely more experience than BHO, she has actually done things, not just voted present.

Well, that charge could be leveled at McCain also - unless "voting present" becomes awesome if you do it for decades instead of years. Right?

[atszyman]

\The only way I see this really helping McCain is in his attempt to divorce himself from Bush. There are more qualified women out there he could have picked from -- Christine Todd Whitman comes to mind -- but her ties to Bush would have been toxic.

I don't see her as being tied to Bush. She wrote the book It's My Party Too (http://www.amazon.com/Its-My-Party-Too/dp/B000OCXHKO/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1220024841&sr=8-3) which seemed to be directly against some of the shifting of the party done by the Bush administration.

I guess the whole mess just got more interesting.

[zap2]

She has infinitely more experience than BHO, she has actually done things, not just voted present.

Lets be honest, stop with the scary tactics. Obama has proven himself in the senate, he's a leader. He proved that before he got to washington. He's ready to lead, he's focused on the issues. McCain isn't focusing on those. He trying to scary votes away from Obama, without using the issue that matter in this election.

You wanna talk issues, Obama there, he's ready to take McCain. And Biden ready to take Palin.

[Cleverboy]

A heck of a lot more than Obama who will be President.Not even close. Obama has several years in elected government office as an Illinois state legislature. People seem to remember that only when they want to criticise his record. They forget it when they want to contest that he doesn't have a bi-partisan record or that he's got a long tickertape of experience in public service. He's time in the senate pales in comparison. Read Palin's experience before her upset victory in Alaska. Really. "heck of a lot" is a ridiculous and embarassing assertion.

~ CB

[zioxide]

She has infinitely more experience than BHO, she has actually done things, not just voted present.

********. Experience is an awful argument. There's only four people in this country who have the experience to be President. And their names aren't Obama, Biden, McCain, or Palin. They're Carter, George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush.

There is no other job in this country that even compares to it.

[Lyle]

Yup, but it's only a tiny little issue of abuse of office by trying to get her ex brother-in-law fired from his job as state trooper.

AP Story (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gWi6yTVfPyJeiTBsQ33SSUiobt8wD92I9NIO0)Wow. This guy sounds like a piece of work:
In 2005, before Palin ran for office, the Palin family accused [Palin's ex brother-in-law] of drinking a beer while in his patrol car, illegal hunting and firing a Taser at his 11-year-old stepson. The Palins also claimed [he] threatened to kill Sarah Palin's father.

If any of those allegations are shown to be true, I don't think this controversy is anything she needs to worry about.

[scotthayes]

i thought and heard, not read, she was against ANWR.

PS, i heard wrong, you are right (I want drilling there too, but thought her not wanting it would help her with SOME independants).

Even the right wings favourite news station is confirming she is is favour of drilling ing ANWR... Time for a McCain flip-flop on ANWR


A little quote from her...

“I am pleased to see Senator Obama acknowledge the huge potential Alaska’s natural gas reserves represent in terms of clean energy and sound jobs,” Palin says in the release. “The steps taken by the Alaska State Legislature this past week demonstrate that we are ready, willing and able to supply the energy our nation needs.”

[blackfox]

i thought and heard, not read, she was against ANWR.

In the blitz of her nomination this morning, I went through youtube looking for speeches/interviews, so I could get a better idea of her. I stumbled across an interview this year where she supported exploration in ANWAR. She made a decent argument, btw...depending on your assumptions.

[Cleverboy]

Geraldine Ferraro weighs in:
http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/08/29/this-might-do-it-for-mccain/
This Might Do It for McCain
By Geraldine Ferraro

It’s going to be a very interesting campaign. I must say that several months ago I said that it would be great if there was a woman on the ticket — that I felt that John McCain would have to pick someone, especially if Hillary was the nominee. But without Hillary being the nominee it’s really quite equally as important because people are looking for a smart campaign and I think this might do it.

There are a lot of women who are disaffected by how Hillary was treated by the media, by how she was treated by the Obama campaign, by how she was treated by the Democratic National Committee — [Democratic party chairman] Howard Dean not speaking up when sexism raised its ugly head in the media. They’ll be looking to see what happens now.

~ CB

[blackfox]

Somehow I knew Ferraro would come up in short order...

[olliebraves20]

********. Experience is an awful argument. There's only four people in this country who have the experience to be President. And their names aren't Obama, Biden, McCain, or Palin. They're Carter, George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush.

There is no other job in this country that even compares to it.

That is the most true statement made yet on this thread.....

[stubeeef]

Well, that charge could be leveled at McCain also - unless "voting present" becomes awesome if you do it for decades instead of years. Right?

I said earlier she has more executive experience than any of the other 3!.

on a sexist note, these two don't hurt Cindy McCain and Palin.

[r.j.s]

********. Experience is an awful argument. There's only four people in this country who have the experience to be President. And their names aren't Obama, Biden, McCain, or Palin. They're Carter, George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush.

There is no other job in this country that even compares to it.

While your statement may be mostly true, experience does mean something. I'd like a President that has actually led anything - preferable some kind of company. Experience isn't everything, but you can't just dismiss it either.

[TheQuestion]

So, who wants to tell us about her?

I am a lifelong Alaskan. This is the worst choice for a VP EVER. She has identified herself on a tough ethics platform, but it is involved in an ethics scandal for firing a state commissioner, who would not fire her former brother-in-law state trooper. She raised taxes on the oil industry 400% - who are now fleeing the state. She wants to pay an Canadian pipeline company, $500 million to begin work on a natural gas pipeline to the midwest. She NO foreign policy experience and very little significant CEO experience. This is a great day for Obama (who I don't really support).

[clevin]

its symbolism vs. symbolism.

first round, symbolism of black beat symbolism of female.

now McCain presents a chance for a second round, I can't wait to see the result!

On a side note, Palin represents nothing common as American woman as a whole, This is purely symbolism, unlike Hillary who has zillions more real issues.

[kavika411]

...but I feel like my head ... will explode from now till Nov from all the irony.

Ironic, indeed. WWAMD? What Would Alanis Morissette Do?

What's funny is that Republicans and Democrats - in these first few hours of grasping this VP pick - both seem to be having a WTF!? moment. My impression is that Republicans are then slowly starting nod their head in agreement, whereas Democrats are showing concern. That's not me making an attack, just an observation.

[MrSmith]

I can't be bothered to read this whole thread but here's the first impression from this non-American. The Democrats have a black candidate so the other side get a woman. Am I close?

[scotthayes]

I can't be bothered to read this whole thread but here's the first impression from this non-American. The Democrats have a black candidate so the other side get a woman. Am I close?

Kinda hit the nail on the head... With the addition that... "Well the dems didn't do it so we will"

A totally cynical pick from my point of view

[Cleverboy]

I am a lifelong Alaskan. This is the worst choice for a VP EVER. She has identified herself on a tough ethics platform, but it is involved in an ethics scandal for firing a state commissioner, who would not fire her former brother-in-law state trooper. She raised taxes on the oil industry 400% - who are now fleeing the state. She wants to pay an Canadian pipeline company, $500 million to begin work on a natural gas pipeline to the midwest. She NO foreign policy experience and very little significant CEO experience. This is a great day for Obama (who I don't really support).From a Hillary Clinton support forum...
The Obama camp has already come out with derogatory comments on Mac and Palin. It's HER day, their day.

The MAC camp stood down yesterday and let Obama have his historic moment, even made an ad on it, Mac offering congrats to Obama.

But the Obama camp doesn't have the GRACE and mutual respect and regard to allow Gov. Palin to have HER moment in the sun.

Experience VS. Change? How about: Class VS Pettiness?

One more reason, folks, one more reason.
Someone had to create a graphic.
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6844/overfinalam8.gif

Bill Burton came out and criticized McCain's pick. I'd JUST said, that the best thing Obama could do would be the compliment McCain's choice, and give it a DAY or TWO before questioning her. Apparently, they thought otherwise. Ouch. At least Obama isn't saying it. That's the only thing that would be worse.

~ CB

[TheQuestion]

Someone had to create a graphic. From a Hillary Clinton support forum...

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6844/overfinalam8.gif

~ CB

She did however stop the "bridges to nowhere" to her credit. But they were already killed by congress.

[SFStateStudent]

McCain - Palin ticket is looking pretty good! The Obama people gave HRC the cold shoulder and picked Biden. What a mistake; they basically alienated HRC supporters and women voters, basically splitting the Democratic Party. The DNC was not about smoozing the HRC supporters and delegates, but it was about Obama, Obama, Obama. :(

[clevin]

Man, this lady's speech ability sucks big time, like a high school president election speech..

[scotthayes]

Be interesting to see if her son is taken off front line duties when he is due to be deployed to Iraq.

[TheQuestion]

Man, this lady's speech ability sucks big time, like a high school president election speech..

Not that I support her, but you're not getting it. She has a 90% approval rating in Alaska for bringing down the good ol' boy network. Her "unpolished" speaking style is what works for her.

[olliebraves20]

Man, this lady's speech ability sucks big time, like a high school president election speech..

Well I'm supposing that since your oratory skills must be well accomplished as you have room to judge her then maybe just maybe you can get yourself a job helping her with her speech delivery techniques......just a thought.....

[Aranince]

I am a lifelong Alaskan. This is the worst choice for a VP EVER. She has identified herself on a tough ethics platform, but it is involved in an ethics scandal for firing a state commissioner, who would not fire her former brother-in-law state trooper. She raised taxes on the oil industry 400% - who are now fleeing the state. She wants to pay an Canadian pipeline company, $500 million to begin work on a natural gas pipeline to the midwest. She NO foreign policy experience and very little significant CEO experience. This is a great day for Obama (who I don't really support).


In 2005, before Palin ran for office, the Palin family accused [Palin's ex brother-in-law] of drinking a beer while in his patrol car, illegal hunting and firing a Taser at his 11-year-old stepson. The Palins also claimed [he] threatened to kill Sarah Palin's father.

Yea...

[OutThere]

My theory: She and McCain had an affair and she decided to use it as leverage, threatening to ruin his bid for presidency by revealing it all if he didn't pick her as his VP candidate. It certainly wouldn't be out of character for Saint Johnny. :D

Why else would he pick a nobody like her? And he certainly does have a thing for beauty pageant queens.

[scotthayes]

Well I'm supposing that since your oratory skills must be well accomplished as you have room to judge her then maybe just maybe you can get yourself a job helping her with her speech delivery techniques......just a thought.....

Mine are and she really does suck at public speaking. She is very mono-tone and have to say has a voice that is very shrill.

[blackfox]

The Obama camp has already come out with derogatory comments on Mac and Palin. It's HER day, their day.

The MAC camp stood down yesterday and let Obama have his historic moment, even made an ad on it, Mac offering congrats to Obama.

But the Obama camp doesn't have the GRACE and mutual respect and regard to allow Gov. Palin to have HER moment in the sun.

Experience VS. Change? How about: Class VS Pettiness?

One more reason, folks, one more reason.
What a bunch of bollocks.

McCain launched an attack ad within hours of Biden's pick.

It is true that McCain was deferential during the DNC - gracious, even. I expect the Obama camp will extend the same courtesy to the RNC next week.

What crap...

[clevin]

Well I'm supposing that since your oratory skills must be well accomplished as you have room to judge her then maybe just maybe you can get yourself a job helping her with her speech delivery techniques......just a thought.....

lol, you don't need to BE MLK to feel his speed being GOOD. Since when people can't judge a speech? if so, how can those Fox news crooks judge Clintons' speeches and Obama's speech 24/7?

[olliebraves20]

Mine are and she really does suck at public speaking.

Somehow I knew that you would say that....haha

[madfresh]

this pick also makes McCain the new "change" candidate. McCain goes for a young, up and coming female for his ticket....while Mr. Change Obama went with the old white who has been in DC forever....

she's hot too

[scotthayes]

Somehow I knew that you would say that....haha

and how did you know I would say that?

[TheAnswer]

She just mentioned Hillary...

I knew Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton was a friend of mine. Governor, you're no Hillary Clinton.

[Diatribe]

You guys do know that Republicans pay people to act as Dems on forums to spread that kind of stuff, right?
I wouldn't worry about it too much. ;)

[bbotte]

She is not bad looking, McCain's wife should be scared, he has a habit of working with good looking women then marrying them. Can the President marry the Vice President after they are elected? Or is that a Conflict of interest? :D

[Cleverboy]

She just mentioned Hillary...
I knew Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton was a friend of mine. Governor, you're no Hillary Clinton. She just effectively said (paraphrasing), "Thanks to Geraldine Ferraro, thanks to Hillary Clinton... 18 million cracks, vote for me, and we'll shatter it." Her oldest child is being deployed to Iraq.

BOINK.

~ CB

[clevin]

She just mentioned Hillary...

I knew Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton was a friend of mine. Governor, you're no Hillary Clinton.

now thats a killer :D

but yet, I doubt McCain's target is ALL Hillary supporters, so...

[Diatribe]

this pick also makes McCain the new "change" candidate. McCain goes for a young, up and coming female for his ticket....while Mr. Change Obama went with the old white who has been in DC forever....

she's hot too

Yeah, because the VP is the change agent in politics and not the President or the Senate... that's why we should all blame good ol' Dick and not Bush...

God I LOVE when people focus on persons and perceptions rather than issues. Always makes me feel the world is going some place. :rolleyes:

[olliebraves20]

lol, you don't need to BE MLK to feel his speed being GOOD. Since when people can't judge a speech? if so, how can those Fox news crooks judge Clintons' speeches and Obama's speech 24/7?

This is laughable.....as long as you are advocating judging people's speech (I'm not saying that you can't I'm just saying that it's harder then you think to give a speech in front of millions) I'm assuming that also transfers over to written speech as well....so here is my thought....

I think instead of speed you meant SPEECH.....and you flipped two words around in the sentence after that... you meant "Since when CAN'T PEOPLE judge a speech" As for fox I suggest a new invention that is out and might help you not have to watch something you don't want to....it's called a remote.....

[clevin]

This is laughable.....as long as you are advocating judging people's speech (I'm not saying that you can't I'm just saying that it's harder then you think to give a speech in front of millions) I'm assuming that also transfers over to written speech as well....so here is my thought....

I think instead of speed you meant SPEECH.....and you flipped two words around in the sentence after that... you meant "Since when CAN'T PEOPLE judge a speech" As for fox I suggest a new invention that is out and might help you not have to watch something you don't want to....it's called a remote.....

really, my bad, what should I expect from a GOP other than personal insult?

her speech sucks. my opinion. Altho you have a bunch of attacks, I still feel Im entitled to say that as I wish.

[zap2]

McCain - Palin ticket is looking pretty good! The Obama people gave HRC the cold shoulder and picked Biden. What a mistake; they basically alienated HRC supporters and women voters, basically splitting the Democratic Party. The DNC was not about smoozing the HRC supporters and delegates, but it was about Obama, Obama, Obama. :(

Voters shouldn't be voting on the gender/race/etc of the president, they should be voting on the issue. If supports of Hilary care what she stood who, there is not choice here. If they were voting based on gender, then they need to rethink they're reasons for voting.

[Thomas Veil]

No offense to Sarah Palin, but this pick smacks of pandering.My feelings exactly.

She just mentioned Hillary...

I knew Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton was a friend of mine. Governor, you're no Hillary Clinton.Great. :D

First impression: she comes across as "Obama lite". She's talking about change and reform, and the words are there, but it's not the same thing.

She talked about Iran's "nucular" weapons, which prompted me to put my face in my hands and mumble, "Oh God, she's no smarter than Bush."

And I notice they are showing some of the crowd surrounding the podium, but they are not showing the whole room. Guess they couldn't fill the place after all.

[Abstract]

If McCain bit the dust tomorrow, would anybody want Palin running the USA? No? Me neither.

[olliebraves20]

and how did you know I would say that?

Well it's human nature my friend.....after I inquired about your own capability to give a speech I didn't expect you to come back with something about how your own skills might not be top notch....no, you came back with how you do have good speech ability .....predictable...true or not true who knows...it's just a predicable answer.....

[olliebraves20]

really, my bad, what should I expect from a GOP other than personal insult?

her speech sucks. my opinion. Altho you have a bunch of attacks, I still feel Im entitled to say that as I wish.

You certainly are entitled to say what you like....I for one am not arguing that at all....I'm just saying that if you can judge so can I....those were not attacks on you....that was just me judging what you said....and I'm entitled to say what I wish....

[zioxide]

This is laughable.....as long as you are advocating judging people's speech (I'm not saying that you can't I'm just saying that it's harder then you think to give a speech in front of millions) I'm assuming that also transfers over to written speech as well....so here is my thought....

I think instead of speed you meant SPEECH.....and you flipped two words around in the sentence after that... you meant "Since when CAN'T PEOPLE judge a speech" As for fox I suggest a new invention that is out and might help you not have to watch something you don't want to....it's called a remote.....

You probably should make sure you use proper sentence structure and grammar when you criticize somebody else for doing the same thing.

[scotthayes]

Well it's human nature my friend.....after I inquired about your own capability to give a speech I didn't expect you to come back with something about how your own skills might not be top notch....no, you came back with how you do have good speech ability .....predictable...true or not true who knows...it's just a predicable answer.....

You are more than welcome to come over to England and listen to me.

Could you point out for the moment you inquired about my public speaking ability? Saying "I knew you'd say that" is not an inquiry.

[g4cubed]

But for the McCain campaign, who was been screaming how Obama's so young and isn't ready to lead, Palin is very similar in that aspect..But she's only the VP and that only comes into play if he kicks. Not to say it couldn't happen as he's up there in age. ;)

Not even close. Obama has several years in elected government office as an Illinois state legislature. People seem to remember that only when they want to criticise his record. They forget it when they want to contest that he doesn't have a bi-partisan record or that he's got a long tickertape of experience in public service. He's time in the senate pales in comparison. Read Palin's experience before her upset victory in Alaska. Really. "heck of a lot" is a ridiculous and embarassing assertion.

~ CBIf I'm not mistaken she the only one with the executive experience the other three have none. So I'm not sure what you're talking about here. Not to ridiculous.

[Prof.]

A woman. Hmhmm.

Having a woman as VP isn't gonna make him win the election.

[Cleverboy]

Voters shouldn't be voting on the gender/race/etc of the president, they should be voting on the issue. If supports of Hilary care what she stood who, there is not choice here. If they were voting based on gender, then they need to rethink they're reasons for voting.
That's a nice thought, but its WAY to "simplistic" to think women vote on gender and blacks are voting on race. What happening is that the "gender/race" issue is factoring into an issue called "equal access/progress". If there HAD been a woman or a black president, neither group would care that much... so, there's the gaping hole in that argument. Hillary supporters needed to to be convinced that she wasn't the RIGHT woman, not that women didn't deserve serious consideration for the statement her nomination would make about the progress of equal rights.

Every time a Democrat misjudges gender/race as an appeal solely on the solidarity of a class of people, they make a mistake. Democrats need to acknowledge the need for progress, RESPECT the candidate in question, and ONLY THEN move to criticizing the issues and specifics of that candidate. To do otherwise is to court alienating that group.

Hillary supporters care about pro-choice as a stance, but they there ARE conservative feminists (as Sarah Palin demonstrates with her membership in Feminists for Life). She is a mother, and an experienced and passionate servant of the public.

Obama was appealing to some Republicans to actually vote AGAINST their political interests, purely because of what he represented as a "uniter" and an "inspirer" of the people towards higher purpose and more representative government.

Both McCain and Palin represent trailblazers on governmental transparency and ethics reform. If there is a reason for Democrats to vote against their political interests, THIS would be it. The only foolish aspect, is that this election will likely determine the make-up of the Supreme Court for the next cycle, which could spell the end of the last moderate voices on the bench... moving the entire make-up into the pocket of the conservative groups of the country.

It's a shame Obama had to pick his vice first. McCain was apparently waiting for that to happen, simply to counter it effectively with either Romney or Palin. Palin is an EXCELLENT choice, given Obama's choice. A counter move that is really a tough blow that should NOT be countered too quickly by Democrats.
If I'm not mistaken she the only one with the executive experience the other three have none. So I'm not sure what you're talking about here. Not to ridiculous. I actually found out afterwards that she's a two-term small town mayor as well. That shifts things a little more in her favor, but seriously... 1.5 years of executive experience doesn't really compare to 8 years drafting over 800 bills in the Illinois state senator. When Obama got to the senate, it wasn't really "on the job training" as much as Palin had to do as a governor. That said, she apparently did good.
http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/06/13/obamas-voting-record-in-the-illinois-state-senate/
You didn't qualify "experience" as "executive experience" before, so... yes, "ridiculous". "Executive experience", not ridiculous at all.

~ CB

[és:]

If McCain bit the dust tomorrow.


Oh, come on. That's only got a 74% chance of happening.

[scotthayes]

So let's look at her pubic speaking ability.

1. Mono tone
2. Shrill
3. Very poor sentence structure
4. Body language, vast majority of the time one of her hands was following her notes. Unless she was talking about Alaska (she is obviously comfortable doing that)
5. Her favourite words seems to be "and"


That is what I picked up from watching her speech.

[madfresh]

Yeah, because the VP is the change agent in politics and not the President or the Senate... that's why we should all blame good ol' Dick and not Bush...

God I LOVE when people focus on persons and perceptions rather than issues. Always makes me feel the world is going some place. :rolleyes:

that's how the election process works...

[olliebraves20]

You are more than welcome to come over to England and listen to me.

Could you point out for the moment you inquired about my public speaking ability? Saying "I knew you'd say that" is not an inquiry.

Thank you for invitation though I have to decline....

"I knew you would say that" would infer that whoever was going to respond to my comment was most assuredly going to build up their own skill set. So by responding "I knew you would say that" I'm saying "of course your skills are pristine I mean why wouldn't they be"....it's sarcasm......

[madfresh]

Obama has already put out a statement saying that her lack of experience is disturbing. I can't believe he took the bait - wow. By condemning her as unacceptably inexperienced, he is not only condemning himself by extension (since his reasons for saying she's inexperienced are basically the same ones republicans use against him), but he is also simply highlighting the fact that she has executive experience, and he doesn't.

McCain can now EASILY use Obama's own words to argue against himself, and then point out that his own VICE-Presidential pick has more experience than the democratic PRESIDENTIAL pick.

[SFStateStudent]

Voters shouldn't be voting on the gender/race/etc of the president, they should be voting on the issue. If supports of Hilary care what she stood who, there is not choice here. If they were voting based on gender, then they need to rethink they're reasons for voting.

I see your point, but why turn a blind eye on 18 million voters? Regardless of the gender, the issue of HRC voters was never addressed by Obama. The Democrats continue to marginalize the woman's vote and it's catching up with them. Palin brings women voters, the NRA vote, the Union vote, the Military vote, and the Native American vote (her husband is Yup'ik Eskimo, as are her five children). The Republican Party has had the Native American Vote since Richard Nixon; I'm pretty sure all those NDN casinos are lining up right now to give the maximum possible campaign donation to the McCain - Palin ticket. IMHO...

[madfresh]

So let's look at her pubic speaking ability.

1. Mono tone
2. Shrill
3. Very poor sentence structure
4. Body language, vast majority of the time one of her hands was following her notes. Unless she was talking about Alaska (she is obviously comfortable doing that)
5. Her favourite words seems to be "and"


That is what I picked up from watching her speech.

Sarah Palin does not have the same shrieking banshee voice, nor testicle retracting cackle of Hillary Clinton, which is good

[Cleverboy]

Obama has already put out a statement saying that her lack of experience is disturbing. I can't believe he took the bait - wow. By condemning her as unacceptably inexperienced, he is not only condemning himself by extension (since his reasons for saying she's inexperienced are basically the same ones republicans use against him), but he is also simply highlighting the fact that she has executive experience, and he doesn't. Yeah... bad move. It's Obama's campaign though. Kind of a DUMB MOVE, I have to say.

~ CB

[bbotte]

I see C-Span's ratings going through the roof if they are elected. The more pics I see of her on CNN right now the hotter she gets! She is down right gorgeous in some of her pictures.

[olliebraves20]

Yeah... bad move. It's Obama's campaign though. Kind of a DUMB MOVE, I have to say.

~ CB

Probably a knee jerk reaction that his advisors have to be pulling their hair out over

[gibbz]

Obama has already put out a statement saying that her lack of experience is disturbing. I can't believe he took the bait - wow. By condemning her as unacceptably inexperienced, he is not only condemning himself by extension (since his reasons for saying she's inexperienced are basically the same ones republicans use against him), but he is also simply highlighting the fact that she has executive experience, and he doesn't.

McCain can now EASILY use Obama's own words to argue against himself, and then point out that his own VICE-Presidential pick has more experience than the democratic PRESIDENTIAL pick.

Actually, you overstate things. The campaign said this:

"Experience is being taken off the table considering you're putting someone within a heartbeat of the presidency with the thinnest foreign policy experience in history," spokesman Bill Burton said.


This implies that McCain needs to stop his attacks on "experience" based on his pick. This again shows a hypocritical side of McCain. You are crazy if you are seriously saying that Palin has more experience than Obama. She has been governor since Dec. 2006 - less than 2 years. Before that she was a mayor. I am sick of all of this talk of "experience". Experience is simply what people name their mistakes. No one is truly prepared to be POTUS.

[bobber205]

I hope most women in the country see this for what it is:
a sad last ditch effort that's insulting to boot.

And yeah. She's very inexperienced. 18 Months as governnor? Please. Experience isn't everything, something that I have to agree with thinking Obama is as close to the next coming as christ as we'll get, but her policies are old hat.

This is just McCain responding to Obama and Biden.
Biden will chew her up and spit her out in the debate.

[mactastic]

Ms. Quayle-in is going to have to step up her prep for her debate with Biden. That's going to be a slaughter. And Biden isn't the kind of guy who's going to talk down to her -- he'll simply debate circles around her. I can't imagine she's looking forward to that night.

So, McCain picks someone who highlights HIS weaknesses, just as Obama did -- and was roundly criticized for. She's young, an ideological hard-right conservative, a DC outsider, and a woman. All things McCain isn't.

Having said that, she's a solid pick from an optics standpoint, although she has no substance behind the flashy exterior. However she has nearly ZERO experience, which will negate any attempt by the right to paint Obama as inexperienced. She's got her own ethics problems, and even if they are easily defensible, as we've seen with the Rezko accusations, that doesn't mean they will be off the table as attacks. Both the top and the bottom of the GOP ticket will have ethics scandals raised as issues.

[atszyman]

No one is truly prepared to be POTUS.

Actually there are two people in this country with the necessary experience and eligibility to be the POTUS. If this election were all about experience it would be Jimmy Carter versus George H.W. Bush.

Let the one term Presidents fight it out.

[bbotte]

http://livingalaska.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/sarah_palin2.jpg Miss Wasilla 1984 ->http://wonkette.com/assets/resources/2006/12/Miss%20Wasilla%201984.jpg
http://www.palmerelks.org/images/wwp-photo2.jpg

LOL
http://images.cafepress.com/product/133832122v6_240x240_Front_Color-LightPink.jpg

Women and Machine Guns! FTW!
http://bp2.blogger.com/_L2DBb_zR1rs/Rn8LxS2w3TI/AAAAAAAAAEw/x2OnQo3EhTQ/s400/Sarah+with+troops+(and+tank).jpg

McCain ould croak at any moment and she would be our President, I will watch every state of the union address and anytime she is on TV!

[mactastic]

Oh, and she makes me want to cross my legs when she speaks.

(Come on, if it's fair to say about Hillary, it's fair to say about Quayle-in!)

[BoyBach]

If McCain bit the dust tomorrow, would anybody want Palin running the USA? No? Me neither.


A 72 year-old guy with cancer's insurance policy is an unheard of, inexperienced 44 year-old who is under investigation for abuse of power.

This election campaign gets stranger and stranger...

[blackfox]

The whole reaction to her "hotness" really puts the whole "glass ceiling" into perspective here...

I stand by my earlier posting involving my head eventually exploding over the next few months...

[OutThere]

I hope most women in the country see this for what it is:
a sad last ditch effort that's insulting to boot.

And yeah. She's very inexperienced. 18 Months as governnor? Please. Experience isn't everything, something that I have to agree with thinking Obama is as close to the next coming as christ as we'll get, but her policies are old hat.

This is just McCain responding to Obama and Biden.
Biden will chew her up and spit her out in the debate.

Agreed.

Her experience is a joke. City council in nowheresville Alaska, and then a wee bit of being governor of an irrelevant state. People are easily taken up with her being picked as a campaign maneuver, but McCain is getting old and we have to consider that there is a possibility that she'd need to take the lead...which is horribly frightening.

I also look forward to her being absolutely ripped to shreds by Biden in a debate. The thought brings a smile to my face. :)

[macDonalds]

Sarah Palin: inexperienced, yes, but I think it was a smart move to pull over the Hillary supporters. Let's face it - Hilary's supporters do not want to vote for Obama and are looking for a reason to go McCain. Now they have it.

[madfresh]

Actually, you overstate things. The campaign said this:


This implies that McCain needs to stop his attacks on "experience" based on his pick. This again shows a hypocritical side of McCain. You are crazy if you are seriously saying that Palin has more experience than Obama. She has been governor since Dec. 2006 - less than 2 years. Before that she was a mayor. I am sick of all of this talk of "experience". Experience is simply what people name their mistakes. No one is truly prepared to be POTUS.


By making that argument, they are highlighting the fact that Obama has only been a Senator for a few years, and has zero executive experience. Palin has been an executive for about as long as Obama's been a legislator, so if you damn one, you damn the other.

So it doesn't take it off the table, the more he talks about it the more it highlights the fact that the inexperienced one on the Obama ticket is at the top, and the inexperienced one on the McCain ticket is on the bottom.

[Aranince]

So let's look at her pubic speaking ability.

1. Mono tone
2. Shrill
3. Very poor sentence structure
4. Body language, vast majority of the time one of her hands was following her notes. Unless she was talking about Alaska (she is obviously comfortable doing that)
5. Her favourite words seems to be "and"


That is what I picked up from watching her speech.

Because the ability to speak, speaks volumes about leadership abilities and stance on issues.:rolleyes:

[obeygiant]

I also look forward to her being absolutely ripped to shreds by Biden in a debate. The thought brings a smile to my face. :)

Kinda the same way Cheney ripped Edwards to shreds in their debate.:)

[Cleverboy]

Because the ability to speak, speaks volumes about leadership abilities and stance on issues.:rolleyes: Indeed. If the Obama team were ever so foolish as the criticize her ability to speak, it would be a train wreck of bad press.

From Digg comments, why she's a good pick:
1. She would be the only candidate with executive experience (McCain, Biden, Obama only have legislative experience)
2. Appeals to conservatives
3. Will channel the women vote, and Hillary supporters' in particular
4. Charismatic, smart, principled, dedicated, American all the way
5. Younger than Obama
6. Wow factor: will definitely embellish the ticket ;)
McCain has also been smart about keeping his choice secret to the end - experience counts I guess. That's a pretty sharp list right there. It will be interesting to see what the Romney supporters have to say in the end.

~ CB

[scotthayes]

Because the ability to speak, speaks volumes about leadership abilities and stance on issues.:rolleyes:

Not at all, I'm just saying she really sucks at public speaking

[zioxide]

By making that argument, they are highlighting the fact that Obama has only been a Senator for a few years, and has zero executive experience. Palin has been an executive for about as long as Obama's been a legislator, so if you damn one, you damn the other.

Well, Obama was also a state senator from 1996-2004 in the 5th largest state (by population, 12.8 million) in the country. That's a bit more than being mayor of a town of 5,000 people in Alaska.

[macDonalds]

She is so freaking hot. She has my vote.

[clevin]

I just hope Obama campaign be careful in attacking this lady and dont come across as sexists.

[TheAnswer]

She is so freaking hot. She has my vote.

:rolleyes: Looks like her Cougar status has the potential to mobilize the young male right wingers like they haven't been since early 1930's Germany.

[Pittsax]

Not at all, I'm just saying she really sucks at public speaking
I won't comment on her voice, because that's not really something you can help. But compare Biden's "unveiling" speech to Palin's. she only really did the following:

Spent 5-10 minutes (at least it seemed that way) introducing her family. At least we know she'll get the snowmobile racing bloc. And I was glad she didn't mention the fact her son has Down's syndrome.
She worked her way up from being a PTA member, to city council, to mayor, to governor. Which, for me, only emphasized that she's not too far removed from being a PTA board member
She didn't like the "bridge to nowhere" even though Ted Stephens campaigned for her in her gubernatorial race.
Her son is going to "Eye-rack" too, so take that Joe Biden!
Have you heard? John McCain was a POW!
John McCain is the only candidate who "actually fought for America." This to me was the most important line, because it emphasizes the GOP's belief that military force/service is everything.

[bradl]

Sarah Palin: inexperienced, yes, but I think it was a smart move to pull over the Hillary supporters. Let's face it - Hilary's supporters do not want to vote for Obama and are looking for a reason to go McCain. Now they have it.

Which to me is a lot like crying over spilled milk. It sounds like unbelievable bitterness because their lady didn't get the nomination. Edwards, Giuliani, Jackson, and many others didn't get the nod in their respective party's nomination, but did they become so incessantly bitter about it? No, they helped and supported the person that did. This is how the election process goes, and should be.

As far as going for McCain because Palin is there, that definitely smacks of pandering. plus with a lot of the Blues being pro-Roe vs. Wade, this will hurt in the end.

Perhaps those bitter Hillary supporters should look past the superficial fact that McCain chose a woman and look at the platform she's standing on before making such a (IMHO, foolish) decision.

BL.

[Pittsax]

I just hope Obama campaign be careful in attacking this lady and dont come across as sexists.
I think they need to just attack her on the issues. If they want to pull a Hillary Clinton whine-fest about it, then fine. But if they stick to making valid points, the return criticism won't stick.

In fact, if I were the Obama campaign, the first time they are charged with being sexist, I would bring up the Christine Todd Whitman's of the GOP who would have made excellent candidates, but McCain chose someone who was totally inexperienced in a way that I have never seen in a presidential race.

[SFStateStudent]

That's a pretty sharp list right there. It will be interesting to see what the Romney supporters have to say in the end. ~ CB

The big problem with Mitt Romney is his relationship with the Mormon Church. The Christian Right Wing continues to view the Mormon Church as cult and not a true Christian religion.

[Aranince]

In fact, if I were the Obama campaign, the first time they are charged with being sexist, I would bring up the Christine Todd Whitman's of the GOP who would have made excellent candidates, but McCain chose someone who was totally inexperienced in a way that I have never seen in a presidential race.

Like someone else in this race...

[scotthayes]

I won't comment on her voice, because that's not really something you can help. But compare Biden's "unveiling" speech to Palin's. she only really did the following:

Spent 5-10 minutes (at least it seemed that way) introducing her family. At least we know she'll get the snowmobile racing bloc. And I was glad she didn't mention the fact her son has Down's syndrome.
She worked her way up from being a PTA member, to city council, to mayor, to governor. Which, for me, only emphasized that she's not too far removed from being a PTA board member
She didn't like the "bridge to nowhere" even though Ted Stephens campaigned for her in her gubernatorial race.
Her son is going to "Eye-rack" too, so take that Joe Biden!
Have you heard? John McCain was a POW!
John McCain is the only candidate who "actually fought for America." This to me was the most important line, because it emphasizes the GOP's belief that military force/service is everything.

Great list... Did anyone notice the POW:MIA flag on the stage before Obama's speech on Wednesday???

[olliebraves20]

Like someone else in this race...

How easy people forget....

[bbotte]

The big problem with Mitt Romney is his relationship with the Mormon Church. The Christian Right Wing continues to view the Mormon Church as cult and not a true Christian religion.

Is there anything false about that?

[Thomas Veil]

If McCain bit the dust tomorrow, would anybody want Palin running the USA? No? Me neither.Exactly. And that's a problem the Obama campaign doesn't have.

Hmm...last person that ran for vice president that nobody had ever heard of was -- Dan Quayle. :eek:

This implies that McCain needs to stop his attacks on "experience" based on his pick.My interpretation too. McCain may've just done Obama a favor.

I hope most women in the country see this for what it is:
a sad last ditch effort that's insulting to boot.Be nice if Hillary came out and said so. If I were her, this would piss me off. It's just so calculated and phony.

She is so freaking hot. She has my vote.Oh God. That's even worse than, "I'm voting for the guy I'd like to have a beer with." Now it's "I'm voting for the VPILF."

Heard just a little of Rush Limbaugh talking about this. It's hilarious listening to him try to sing the praises of somebody he, like us, knows almost nothing about.

[bobber205]

She is so freaking hot. She has my vote.

Apparently McCain has the same idea. :D

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r248/bobber205/Picture-10.png

[TheAnswer]

How easy people forget....

Maybe this will jog their memories...

Obama was also a state senator from 1996-2004 in the 5th largest state (by population, 12.8 million) in the country. That's a bit more than being mayor of a town of 5,000 people in Alaska.

[yrsonicdeath]

Apparently McCain has the same idea. :D

Are those boy scouts planted behind McCain?

[Cleverboy]

Heard just a little of Rush Limbaugh talking about this. It's hilarious listening to him try to sing the praises of somebody he, like us, knows almost nothing about. Actualy, Limbaugh was one of the first entities in the public eye to praise her as a potential choice:
http://www.zimbio.com/Sarah+Palin+for+Vice+President/articles/5/McCain+Palin+ticket+gets+boost+Rush+Limbaugh
Rush Limbaugh has not only mentioned Gov. Palin as a VP candidate for the second time this week, but he has even gone so far as to design a McCain-Palin logo and post it on his homepage (also attached as a picture). You can click here to read his full comments on the subject (and another look at that amazing graphic). Hopefully, this won't become subscriber only stuff tomorrow.

Also, be sure to check out my new column contrasting Gov. Palin with Sen. Obama. The newest argument we need to refute is the idea that Palin should only be placed on the ticket if Clinton beats Obama. This is hogwash and no different than saying that someone should be placed on a ticket only because of their gender (an idea which we reject).
Broadcast Date: February 28, 2008
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_022808/content/01125113.guest.html

~ CB

[Pittsax]

Just as an aside, you gotta love the media on this. Andrea Mitchell (is anyone else sick of her?) was going on and on about how McCain's savvy has kept the media from talking about Obama's speech last night. Um...no. It's not McCain's fault that you spent two hours talking about Palin BEFORE she came out to speak -- and given her scant biography, it was the same things over and over and over.

[stevento]

Wow this was announced after I went to class, and now I'm just getting out and there's already 7 pages about it.
I think this is an attempt to steal Hillary's votes.

[Pittsax]

Wow this was announced after I went to class, and now I'm just getting out and there's already 7 pages about it.
I think this is an attempt to steal Hillary's votes.
So...is it working?

[yojitani]

Strange, strange choice. The dems seem to have the stronger ticket by far... so what are they going to do to shoot themselves in the foot this time?

Stevento - just read your sig. So you are just skipping right past Obama? Strangeness all around, eh?

[GorillaPaws]

She is pro-life (which all of us anti death penalty folks ought to be)

That's a pretty bold claim that should be made/defended in it's own thread. It's certainly possible to be anti-death penalty and pro-choice without contradicting oneself--if that's what you're implying. Seems a bit tacky to throw that out there in such an unrelated context.

I have mixed feelings on this choice. I think it was probably a good move on McCain's part, although I do wonder how effective he will be a getting the "feminist" crowd to vote for for his ticket (which was clearly a factor in his decision) given the the whole abortion issue.

The fact that she has such limited experience is probably a good thing for McCain in the end since it will be difficult for Obama's campaign to challenge her on her record, it being so small. Because of this, the Obama campaign will have to really tiptoe on what they can challenge her on and how they do it as others have mentioned. If she avoids taking clear positions on issues, then there really won't be much to be objectively critical of and thereby make attacks on her look sexist.

[Cleverboy]

Wow this was announced after I went to class, and now I'm just getting out and there's already 7 pages about it.
I think this is an attempt to steal Hillary's votes.This thread was originally about a false tip that McCain's pick might be Lieberman... but yeah, all the new pages have been a Palin pig-pile. This is a BUZZ-worthy pick. Had Obama picked Clinton, there would have been a different pick... and a different narrative from the McCain camp.

~ CB

[Mike Teezie]

Sarah Palin. Obvious pandering, and a 4th and 10 hail mary. Just this past July, Palin questioned what the Vp's job was, and if it was even productive:

Link (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12969.html)

Get Hillary out there now. Palin is pretty much the anti-HRC, and I feel like it would be rather easy for Hilary to discredit this pick as nothing more than pandering.

[fivepoint]

I just hope Obama campaign be careful in attacking this lady and dont come across as sexists.

And now you guys know how it feels. Conservative critics can't say a word about Obama without double-checking every little thing to make sure no one can misconstrue what they said as a racial attack.

Really sad. Political correctness in this country has gotten way out of hand. Measure people on the quality of their character and the work they do...

However, personally, I think BHO has done a good job of keeping race out of the... race. He hasn't made it about black vs. white, and he deserves a lot of respect for that.

[GorillaPaws]

And now you guys know how it feels. Conservative critics can't say a word about Obama without double-checking every little thing to make sure no one can misconstrue what they said as a racial attack.

Really sad. Political correctness in this country has gotten way out of hand. Measure people on the quality of their character and the work they do...

However, personally, I think BHO has done a good job of keeping race out of the... race. He hasn't made it about black vs. white, and he deserves a lot of respect for that.

The big difference here is that McCain's base is much less sensitive to charges of racism/feminism. If McCain ever said something that could be construed as racist, it likely wouldn't affect his support base nearly as much as if Obama said something that construed as sexist. I'm not saying that conservatives aren't sensitive to racism and feminism, but you've got to admit that those issues tend to be more of a Democrat thing.

[seenew]

I wish the ballot was like a blind taste test.
No names or parties on the ticket, just a list of political stances in two columns (or three or four) and you pick the column you agree with most.

Then we could get rid of all this BS and talk about what matters. ;)

[Lancetx]

Well, after reading up extensively on Palin and listening to her speech this morning, I'm no longer one of the undecided voters. McCain just earned my vote with this pick, and that's something I honestly didn't see forsee happening. I only wish she was at the top of the ticket instead of just the VP candidate.

[kavika411]

The big difference here is that McCain's base is much less sensitive to charges of racism/feminism. If McCain ever said something that could be construed as racist, it likely wouldn't affect his support base nearly as much as if Obama said something that construed as sexist. I'm not saying that conservatives aren't sensitive to racism and feminism, but you've got to admit that those issues tend to be more of a Democrat thing.

I respectfully disagree. Democrats appeared uninterested to the point of boredom when Biden said the following of Obama:

"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,"

[clevin]

I wish the ballot was like a blind taste test.
No names or parties on the ticket, just a list of political stances in two columns (or three or four) and you pick the column you agree with most.

Then we could get rid of all this BS and talk about what matters. ;)

absolutely, But altho I like the idea, that can only work if people can decide what issues should be on there...

[fivepoint]

The big difference here is that McCain's base is much less sensitive to charges of racism/feminism. If McCain ever said something that could be construed as racist, it likely wouldn't affect his support base nearly as much as if Obama said something that construed as sexist. I'm not saying that conservatives aren't sensitive to racism and feminism, but you've got to admit that those issues tend to be more of a Democrat thing.

I don't deny that at all! They are definitely less OVERLY-sensitive about it. :)
But you're right, it would affect Obama's base more than McCain's.

[fivepoint]

I respectfully disagree. Democrats appeared uninterested to the point of boredom when Biden said the following of Obama:

"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,"

I don't think anyone would deny that liberals are more sensitive about it when the words are coming out of the mouth of a conservative. If those same words would have been said by Bush, or McCain, etc. , there would have been hell to pay.

[GorillaPaws]

I don't deny that at all! They are definitely less OVERLY-sensitive about it. :)
But you're right, it would affect Obama's base more than McCain's.

The actual asymmetry of that point despite the appearance of being more-or-less symmetrical, really plays to the McCain campaign's advantage if they're able to somehow exploit it. The more I think about it, the more I think this was a wise move for McCain.

[NT1440]

its sad that this is probably going to get all those crazy voters that are looking only to get a woman into office. This is deffinatly going to get mccain more votes, which i think is very disturbing seeing as all mccains policies remain the same.

[Mike Teezie]

its sad that this is probably going to get all those crazy voters that are looking only to get a woman into office. This is deffinatly going to get mccain more votes, which i think is very disturbing seeing as all mccains policies remain the same.

No way. You have to give women a little more credit than that.

[bbotte]

Seriously where is Austin Kutcher? We are being "punked", right?

[atszyman]

I respectfully disagree. Democrats appeared uninterested to the point of boredom when Biden said the following of Obama:

"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,"

Shortly after that statement he dropped out of the presidential race. I don't think that the Dems were uninterested, he was just quick to apologize and drop out so the media didn't bother to make it linger.

[GorillaPaws]

Here's a thought, there's been a fair amount of discussion over the past few months about how much the racist voters who would normally have voted democrat are now going to go republican because of Obama's race.

To turn this around. Do you think that there is a significant number of sexist republican voters who would rather vote for an all-male democrat ticket than see a woman in the white house? I'm thinking not, but I'd be interested to hear what you guys have to say.

[leekohler]

No way. You have to give women a little more credit than that.

I agree. Just because he nominated her, doesn't mean the issues have suddenly changed. I don't think that the same women who wanted Hillary are suddenly going to switch over to McCain. I really don't. Many of those women will look at her the way many of us gays look at gay conservatives- with much suspicion. I'm not making judgments, just sayin'.

[fivepoint]

The vast majority of people in this country, right or wrong, usually pick a candidate based on one or two issues or facts. I don't agree with it, but most people aren't "in to" politics, and simply vote for the person who seems the best at that time, or who agrees with them on one particular issue.

It's not a slam against women to say that many would switch over the the McCain ticket because of a woman VP. I agree that it's not the best reason for someone to choose a side, but either is "that person will give me better medicare" or "that person says they don't like corporations. either do i."

Sometimes simply relating to someone is enough for you to feel more comfortable with them and trust them to do something such as lead the country. I realize it isn't pretty, but YES many people will vote McCain just because his VP is a woman. Just like many people will vote for BHO because he is black, and some people won't vote for him because he is black.

This is why candidates try so hard to appear to be "normal, down-to-earth people" they want to seem similar to you. Not like they grew up somewhere different, with different values, and with a different worldview.

Someone of the same sex would make many women in this country feel more at ease. Not to mention the whole "first time ever" thing. It is powerful stuff.

[Diatribe]

gay conservatives

And there is me thinking that was an oxymoron... :D

[bobber205]

Well, after reading up extensively on Palin and listening to her speech this morning, I'm no longer one of the undecided voters. McCain just earned my vote with this pick, and that's something I honestly didn't see forsee happening. I only wish she was at the top of the ticket instead of just the VP candidate.

Honestly, what is so awesome about her? What about her makes you wish a person with so little experience and no new ideas should be VP or President?

Or are we being trolled?

[mactastic]

I don't think anyone would deny that liberals are more sensitive about it when the words are coming out of the mouth of a conservative. If those same words would have been said by Bush, or McCain, etc. , there would have been hell to pay.
Please... If Obama had mixed up Sunni and Shia, there would have been hell to pay. if Obama had said that Iraq shared a border with Pakistan, there would have been hell to pay.

Both sides pick and choose their blind spots when it comes to their candidates.

[kavika411]

Shortly after that statement he dropped out of the presidential race. I don't think that the Dems were uninterested, he was just quick to apologize and drop out so the media didn't bother to make it linger.

I appreciate your response. I am interested in whether you think Biden's comment should have been commented on more in the media. I am not setting you up for an argument; I'm simply interested.

[leekohler]

And there is me thinking that was an oxymoron... :D

Nope- in fact we have one or two here, who shall remain nameless. I don't happen to be one of them, however. I have a very conservative gay friend here in the city. I love him to death, but sometimes I want to put his head through a wall...:)

[bradl]

Someone of the same sex would make many women in this country feel more at ease. Not to mention the whole "first time ever" thing. It is powerful stuff.

I can agree with everything you said in your post, but this kinda stands out. It sorta backfired on Mondale/Ferraro in '84, because I don't think the people at the time were ready for something like this (I was 10 at the time, playing with my Transformers, so I didn't give a ****! ;) ). They were just starting to get use to the concept of Tom and Helen Willis (http://www.tvland.com/photogallery/jeffersons/index.jhtml?imgNum=12&pageNum=1&button=13), so seeing a woman with the potential to be in such a high position at that time was hard for some to take (outside of Mondale screwing some things up). This time around, especially after the Decade of the Woman, it is a lot more commonplace and easier to handle. It's tough to be the first to break the mold, but once it's done, it's all downhill.

BL.

[Cleverboy]

Here's a thought, there's been a fair amount of discussion over the past few months about how much the racist voters who would normally have voted democrat are now going to go republican because of Obama's race.

To turn this around. Do you think that there is a significant number of sexist republican voters who would rather vote for an all-male democrat ticket than see a woman in the white house? I'm thinking not, but I'd be interested to hear what you guys have to say.When it comes to alienation from the "other", race trumps sex. Women make of 51% of the population of this country. Blacks account for only 10% of that population at best. While there might be a fear that some other race or gender might push for expanded "rights" for their classification, that's less likely in conservative circles, where there is a strong appreciation of religion, family values, and entrepreneurialism.

The negative images conjured up by Democratic initiatives like affirmative action, gay marriage, and "free speech" (the kind you don't want to hear)... are FAR more "scary" to a pool of chauvinistic males than the concept of a woman as Vice President, who is pro-life, against gay marriage, and a member of the NRA.

While racist liberal white males might vote for McCain to avoid voting for a black man, most sexist conservative males will probably be more than fine supporting their family values and a war hero like McCain who chooses a strong female governor with a kid in the war, shoots a gun, and rides a snow mobile.

~ CB

[atszyman]

I appreciate your response. I am interested in whether you think Biden's comment should have been commented on more in the media. I am not setting you up for an argument; I'm simply interested.

I think it was hammered pretty well in the media at the time. The reason you didn't hear more about it was that he was gone very quickly after making that remark.

I've even seen the remark re-dredged up now that Biden is the VP nominee.

If the question is whether it should come up more often now? Of that I'm not sure. There are comments made by both candidates that seem to get glossed over in the media that if you stuck them in their opponents mouth, you'd probably be seeing a lot more of, but the media seems to pick and choose what they can to make sure that this race remains as close as possible up to election day. If it were ever to be a blowout, I don't think the news channels would know what to do with themselves, when they can't get the polls close enough to warrant 24-hour coverage.

[clevin]

I think the pick is risky, the assumed appealing to Hillary supporters, is small for one thing, more importantly, will collapse instantly when Hillary stands out and call it fake. I am pretty sure DNC will ask Hillary to do it.

if they are for issues, they won't vote for Palin

if they are for Hillary, they won't replace Hillary with this lady

if they want to punish DNC, and can hold their nose, they might do it, but there is really not that many people in this category.

Now, obviously sometimes small number of people are enough to change the balance in some battleground states. We will have to wait and see.

Hillary is the one who are punished for this ****** pick, she has to delay the healing process, and stands up for DNC and BO, Dems really own her too much, and now have to ask her for more contribution....

Its disheartening, I won't be surprised if many Hillary supporters just stay home and skip the election, since they are abused by both side....

[GorillaPaws]

When it comes to alienation from the "other", race trumps sex. Women make of 51% of the population of this country. Blacks account for only 10% of that population at best. While there might be a fear that some other race or gender might push for expanded "rights" for their classification, that's less likely in conservative circles, where there is a strong appreciation of religion, family values, and entrepreneurialism.

The negative images conjured up by Democratic initiatives like affirmative action, gay marriage, and "free speech" (the kind you don't want to hear)... are FAR more "scary" to a pool of chauvinistic males than the concept of a woman as Vice President, who is pro-life, against gay marriage, and a member of the NRA.

While racist liberal white males might vote for McCain to avoid voting for a black man, most sexist conservative males will probably be more than fine supporting their family values and a war hero like McCain who chooses a strong female governor with a kid in the war, shoots a gun, and rides a snow mobile.

~ CB

I pretty much agree with everything you so eloquently articulated, although I've got a picture in my mind of the older conservative republican veteran who refuses to allow the possibility of a female commander-in-chief.

[kavika411]

I think it was hammered pretty well in the media at the time. The reason you didn't hear more about it was that he was gone very quickly after making that remark.

I've even seen the remark re-dredged up now that Biden is the VP nominee.

If the question is whether it should come up more often now? Of that I'm not sure. There are comments made by both candidates that seem to get glossed over in the media that if you stuck them in their opponents mouth, you'd probably be seeing a lot more of, but the media seems to pick and choose what they can to make sure that this race remains as close as possible up to election day. If it were ever to be a blowout, I don't think the news channels would know what to do with themselves, when they can't get the polls close enough to warrant 24-hour coverage.

Well said. Thanks for the response.

[g4cubed]

...You didn't qualify "experience" as "executive experience" before, so... yes, "ridiculous". "Executive experience", not ridiculous at all.

~ CB

My bad for that, and glad you see it's not all that far off.

[miloblithe]

When it comes to alienation from the "other", race trumps sex. Women make of 51% of the population of this country. Blacks account for only 10% of that population at best. ...
~ CB

USA
white 79.96%, black 12.85%, Asian 4.43%, Amerindian and Alaska native 0.97%, native Hawaiian and other Pacific islander 0.18%, two or more races 1.61% (July 2007 estimate)
note: a separate listing for Hispanic is not included because the US Census Bureau considers Hispanic to mean a person of Latin American descent (including persons of Cuban, Mexican, or Puerto Rican origin) living in the US who may be of any race or ethnic group (white, black, Asian, etc.); about 15.1% of the total US population is Hispanic

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html#People

[g4cubed]

Miss Wasilla 1984 ->http://wonkette.com/assets/resources/2006/12/Miss%20Wasilla%201984.jpg


She reminds me of Marcy from Married with Children. :D

[leekohler]

She reminds me of Marcy from Married with Children. :D

Interesting- Marcy is a lesbian. :)

[GorillaPaws]

She reminds me of Marcy from Married with Children. :D

I was going to say Faye Valentine the porn star. I'd post a pic but it's hard to find one that's appropriate for this site :D

[TheAnswer]

She reminds me of Marcy from Married with Children. :D

I was going to say Faye Valentine the porn star. I'd post a pic but it's hard to find one that's appropriate for this site :D

More like Tina Fey...

132334

[Hello.there]

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/594/2gue0d0dh7.jpg

[Diatribe]

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/594/2gue0d0dh7.jpg

Classic. :D

[leekohler]

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/594/2gue0d0dh7.jpg

That was awesome!

[Cleverboy]

USA
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html#PeopleOk... 13%? It's the same point. But, sorry... not 10%. Keeps changing, dang it.

~ CB

[Hello.there]

Jeez, this Palin woman is, um, extraordinary (http://startelegram.typepad.com/politex/2008/04/governors-water.html):

Palin was in Texas at a forum on energy with Texas Gov. Rick Perry and executives from four other states.

The governor's water broke during the energy conference but she stayed and gave a 30-minute speech before boarding an Alaska Airlines plane home to deliver the baby.

Palin gave birth to Trig Paxson Van Palin Friday at 6:30 a.m.

No word on why Palin was so determined to make sure young Trig wasn't born a Texan.

[clevin]

Jeez, this Palin woman is, um, extraordinary (http://startelegram.typepad.com/politex/2008/04/governors-water.html):

Palin was in Texas at a forum on energy with Texas Gov. Rick Perry and executives from four other states.

The governor's water broke during the energy conference but she stayed and gave a 30-minute speech before boarding an Alaska Airlines plane home to deliver the baby.

Palin gave birth to Trig Paxson Van Palin Friday at 6:30 a.m.

No word on why Palin was so determined to make sure young Trig wasn't born a Texan.

thats..... abnormal.

[és:]

thats..... abnormal.

It's either really strange or the most elaborate excuse for pissing yourself that I've ever heard.

[mactastic]

thats..... abnormal.
I'm not sure it is. It would be her 5th kid, so she'd be pretty comfortable with the whole process. And really, the water breaking isn't necessarily a sign of impending delivery. Now, if she was speaking while having contractions 4 minutes apart, THAT would be extraordinary!

[Hello.there]

It's either really strange or the most elaborate excuse for pissing yourself that I've ever heard.

:D

It is her baby, right?

[OutThere]

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/594/2gue0d0dh7.jpg

Love it. :D

[bbotte]

Is this not the most comedic headline for this story?! I mean come on, "taps" LOL
http://gallery.me.com/bbotte/100023/photo1220046089610/web.jpg

[Peterkro]

This woman isn't one of the Palins of Python by any chance? That might actually make the US elections interesting.

[fivepoint]

More like Tina Fey...


I was thinking more along the lines of Laura Roslin from Battlestar Galactica. Either way... I LIKE! :)
(Is that even ok to say? Probably not. I take it back. But seriously... Laura Roslin.)

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44970000/jpg/_44970617_palin_afp226b.jpg
http://www.daemonstv.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/nup_107035_0234.thumbnail.jpg
http://wizbangblog.com/images/2008/05/alaska_gov_sarah_palin_to_meet_with_mccain_vp_search_team/sarah-palin-thumb.jpg
http://pics.livejournal.com/for_my_pics/pic/000a2edy

[beatzfreak]

Throw in the voice and she reminds me of Megan Mullally.:)

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/coolestpics/NBCTCA06Mullally-1.jpg

[scotthayes]

thats..... abnormal.

Surely the thing to do when your water breaks is to get to hospital not give a 30 minute speech. Surely the health of the baby comes before a speech.

[Aranince]

Maybe this will jog their memories...


Did Obama do anything worth while during that time?

[Dont Hurt Me]

We need a 3rd party.

[leekohler]

We need a 3rd party.

Really? I haven't even been to my first party of the evening yet! Oh wait...:)

[Prof.]

I just watched Palin's speech. Well, part of it. Her voice is so nasally and high-pitched, it's painful to listen to her. I had to turn it off. The part I did hear tho is her talking about how her son enlisted in the US army on 9-11 of last year. I say to that... "BIG Woop!". Thousands of men and women enlisted in the army. What makes her son any different or special than the other brave servicemen and women? Nothing!!!.

And as for McCain picking a female to be his VP? He only did that to sway the undecided Hillary voters to the dark... err... republican side. and get the Males to vote for him cuz Palin is a "GILF".

[Thomas Veil]

Some great stuff out on the internets:

From the Cafferty blog: (http://caffertyfile.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/29/mccain-vp-pick-younger-less-experienced-than-obama/)

Rebecca from Santa Barbara, California writes:
As a life-long Republican soccer mom living in an affluent community, I was impressed with Senator Obama’s acceptance speech last evening. Having my morning latte with a few of my Republican friends, I almost spit my coffee out when I heard the news. Is McCain really putting the best interests of our nation first? To me, he is pandering to women, trying to obtain their vote. It seems he wants another ‘trophy’ to parade around with. What is wrong with this man?....

Mitch from Michigan writes:
I think McCain’s selection of Sarah Palin as V.P. is very similar to Bush’s nomination of Harriet Miers to the Supreme Court. It shows how much a McCain presidency would be like the Bush presidency with the selection of totally unqualified individuals for government posts. We’ve seen the disastrous results of such picks by Bush. We can not let McCain continue this saga....

Christine writes:
I am a true-blue Hillary supporter, but I am sure Hillary did not mean to put 18 million cracks in the glass ceiling so that a pro-life, pro-gun, home-schooling nobody from the frozen tundra of Alaska could slide in. Go Obama.

Doug writes:
Had I known that being a hockey mom, being under 45, and having virtually no political experience was the desired VP running mate for McCain, I would have asked my wife to throw her hat into the ring… McCain has just handed the presidency to Obama.Paul Begala: (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/08/29/begala.palin/index.html)

Palin a first-term governor of a state with more reindeer than people, will have to put on a few pounds just to be a lightweight. Her personal story is impressive: former fisherman, mother of five. But that hardly qualifies her to be a heartbeat away from the presidency.

For a man who is 72 years old and has had four bouts with cancer to have chosen someone so completely unqualified to become president is shockingly irresponsible. Suddenly, McCain's age and health become central issues in the campaign, as does his judgment.Republican strategist Ed Rollins:
(http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/08/29/rollins.palin/index.html)
...She is blunt, outspoken and charming. And don't assume she can't stand toe-to-toe with Joe Biden. She is a great debater. And she was runner-up for the Miss Alaska title, won Miss Congeniality in that contest and plays the flute....Omigod...Joe Biden can't play the flute, and is anatomically capable of even having been considered for Miss Congeniality! The election is lost, lost do you hear???? :p

[beatzfreak]

Palin criticized Hillary for playing the sexist card in the primary, so she won't be able to do that when dems come down hard on her.

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=F9Y8FKAsxmk

[Aranince]

I still find the Obama camp whining about her inexperience funny when their own man doesn't have experience either.

People will over look the problems to get what they want. Look at the iPhone and Mobile Me.

[mactastic]

I still find the Obama camp whining about her inexperience funny when their own man doesn't have experience either.

People will over look the problems to get what they want. Look at the iPhone and Mobile Me.
It's not about her lack of experience. It's about the hypocrisy of the McCain supporters going on and on about Obama's lack of experience, then picking an inexperienced person for their ticket.

It's just more evidence that McCain will say anything and pander to anyone in his bid for power.

[TheAnswer]

Did Obama do anything worth while during that time?

He obviously represented the 150,000+ people in his district well enough that he was able to convince the majority of a state of 12.5 million people to have him represent them in the U.S. Senate.

I'll take that over the two-term mayor of town with a population of 5,000 who couldn't win her bid for Lieutenant Governor, but later won the Governorship after a glowing recommendation from Ted Stevens.

[leekohler]

It's not about her lack of experience. It's about the hypocrisy of the McCain supporters going on and on about Obama's lack of experience, then picking an inexperienced person for their ticket.

It's just more evidence that McCain will say anything and pander to anyone in his bid for power.

Exactly- the GOP can't play the "experience" card anymore. Sorry, but that one's done.

He obviously represented the 150,000+ people in his district well enough that he was able to convince the majority of a state of 12.5 million people to have him represent them in the U.S. Senate.

I'll take that over the two-term mayor of town with a population of 5,000 who couldn't win her bid for Lieutenant Governor, but later won the Governorship after a glowing recommendation from Ted Stevens.

Exactly- and Arinance, if you really want to know what Obama has done for our state, please go to his website and take a look:

http://obama.senate.gov/

[mactastic]

Exactly- the GOP can't play the "experience" card anymore. Sorry, but that one's done.
Funny thing is, while there were critical takes on Biden from people on the political left here, it seems like everyone on the right has fallen neatly into line with Palin. I have yet to see anything critical of Palin from anyone on the right here. So many of them expressed so much concern about Obama's lack of experience, but those same folks seem more than happy to give someone with even less experience than Obama a pass...

[TheAnswer]

Some great stuff out on the internets:

Omigod...Joe Biden can't play the flute, and is anatomically capable of even having been considered for Miss Congeniality! The election is lost, lost do you hear???? :p

You'd think with Bill Clinton out of the Oval Office for 8 years now that the Republicans could drop the whole flute playing issue. :D

[leekohler]

Funny thing is, while there were critical takes on Biden from people on the political left here, it seems like everyone on the right has fallen neatly into line with Palin. I have yet to see anything critical of Palin from anyone on the right here. So many of them expressed so much concern about Obama's lack of experience, but those same folks seem more than happy to give someone with even less experience than Obama a pass...

Typical of conservatives. Just look at their track record ignoring all the rest of their "moral failings" while criticizing the same things in others.

[Aranince]

Exactly- and Arinance, if you really want to know what Obama has done for our state, please go to his website and take a look:
http://obama.senate.gov/


Sworn into office January 4, 2005, Senator Obama serves on the Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee, which oversees our nation’s health care, schools, employment, and retirement programs. He is a member of the Foreign Relations Committee, which plays a vital role in shaping American policy around the world, including our policy in Iraq. And Senator Obama serves on the Veterans’ Affairs Committee, which is focused on providing our brave veterans with the care and services they deserve. In 2005 and 2006, he served on the Environment and Public Works Committee, which safeguards our environment and provides funding for our highways.

During his eight years in the Illinois state Senate, Obama worked with both Democrats and Republicans to help working families get ahead by creating programs like the state Earned Income Tax Credit, which in three years provided over $100 million in tax cuts to families across the state. Obama also pushed through an expansion of early childhood education, and after a number of inmates on death row were found innocent, Senator Obama enlisted the support of law enforcement officials to draft legislation requiring the videotaping of interrogations and confessions in all capital cases.

Se he lowered taxes and got support of law enforcement to draft a legislation. That is an awful lot for 8 years of work.

[mactastic]

Se he lowered taxes and got support of law enforcement to draft a legislation. That is an awful lot for 8 years of work.
All Palin appears to have done during the past 8 years is eat mooseburgers.

I mean, if we're just going to willfully ignore stuff right in front of us and all...

[Macaddicttt]

Can someone please explain to me why it's only the Democrats who have to "prove themselves"? Obama has to "prove" that he's ready, heck even "prove" that he's patriotic, yet when the Republicans nominate someone with even less experience, conservatives accept her immediately. This is ridiculous. If anyone's only excuse for not voting for Obama was experience, then there is no way that they can vote for McCain now. But I'm sure they will. :mad:

Why don't Republicans have to "prove" themselves. They've run this country into the ground for eight years, let's have McCain prove that he'll do any better. He should be on the defensive, not Obama, especially after this ridiculous VP pick. :mad:

[mactastic]

And of course there is this hypocrisy (http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/258971) from the McCain camp...
"She won millions of votes.

"But isn't on his ticket.

"Why?

"For speaking the truth.

"On his plans:

HILLARY CLINTON: "You never hear the specifics."

ANNCR: "On the Rezko scandal:

HILLARY CLINTON: "We still don't have a lot of answers about Senator Obama."

ANNCR: "On his attacks:

HILLARY CLINTON: "Senator Obama's campaign has become increasingly negative."

ANNCR: "The truth hurt.

"And Obama didn't like it.

JOHN MCCAIN: "I'm John McCain and I approved this message."
So why isn't Romney on McCain's ticket? He won millions of votes, but he isn't on the ticket. Why? For speaking the truth.
On his politics:
In last week's Republican debate, Romney criticized McCain (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/05/conservative.backlash/index.html) for a recent endorsement, saying, "I'd also note that, if you get endorsed by the New York Times, you're probably not a conservative."
On immigration:
"What he describes is technically true (http://www.azstarnet.com/sn/related/219312), which is his plan does not provide amnesty because he charges people $5,000 to be able to stay."

The truth hurt.

And McCain didn't like it.

[stevento]

Stevento - just read your sig. So you are just skipping right past Obama? Strangeness all around, eh?

i support obama vicariously, only by associating with hillary.

[Macaddicttt]

i support obama vicariously, only by associating with hillary.

What did Obama do to you?

[mactastic]

What did Obama do to you?
He was presumptuous enough to think he could be POTUS...

[Macaddicttt]

He was presumptuous enough to think he could be POTUS...

Wasn't Hillary, too? Don't you have to be to run?

[mactastic]

Wasn't Hillary, too? Don't you have to be to run?
That's kinda my feeling... anyone who thinks they are worthy of being elected POTUS has a pretty damn high opinion of themselves. You have to be pretty presumptuous to ask for -- and receive -- millions of donor dollars.

It's always been a crap line of attack, but we've seen it used by many in this forum, not to mention the GOP at large.

[Macaddicttt]

That's kinda my feeling... anyone who thinks they are worthy of being elected POTUS has a pretty damn high opinion of themselves. You have to be pretty presumptuous to ask for -- and receive -- millions of donor dollars.

It's always been a crap line of attack, but we've seen it used by many in this forum, not to mention the GOP at large.

To my point above. If Obama has to "prove" himself, so should everyone else. It's absolutely ridiculous.

[yg17]

And of course there is this hypocrisy (http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/258971) from the McCain camp...

So why isn't Romney on McCain's ticket? He won millions of votes, but he isn't on the ticket. Why? For speaking the truth.
On his politics:

On immigration:


The truth hurt.

And McCain didn't like it.

The Obama campaign needs to take that ad, change the names and pictures, and release it.

[mactastic]

The Obama campaign needs to take that ad, change the names and pictures, and release it.
No, they really don't. It was a stupid ad when McCain ran it, and it would be a stupid ad if Obama ran it.

But it would be a good question for an intrepid reporter to ask McCain. "Senator, Mitt Romney received millions of votes, yet he isn't on your ticket. Is that because the truth hurt?"

[bbotte]

No, they really don't. It was a stupid ad when McCain ran it, and it would be a stupid ad if Obama ran it.

But it would be a good question for an intrepid reporter to ask McCain. "Senator, Mitt Romney received millions of votes, yet he isn't on your ticket. Is that because the truth hurt?"

agreed. It would be great to watch him squirm..

[blackfox]

ah. Ok. Had some time to process this news since my morning posts...

Really, after thought, this seems like another case of the GOP doing a superior marketing job than the Democrats, at expense of the actual utility of their ticket.

Palins' choice, if modulated correctly in the coming months, could prove masterful in allowing the GOP to avoid issues of substance and have a fighting chance in Nov.

Say what you want about Obama, but he is at least attempting to engage on the issues...

[quagmire]

This is scary if this is valid,

John McCain first met Sarah Palin only six months ago and had just one conversation with the Alaska governor before offering her the vice presidential slot on the Republican ticket, the Arizona senator's campaign said Friday.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/

[EricNau]

Props to McCain for trying; it was a good strategy in principle, but Palin isn't going to cut it.

The Mayor of Sacramento has more political experience than Palin, but I don't see her running for President.

[Mike Teezie]

This is scary if this is valid,



http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/

Pretty scary. From what I am getting from CNN, they met this past Wednesday (as in 2 days ago) and bam, she's the VP pick.

They've had a phone conversation, and one other brief meeting, and that's it. Looking for a link now.

[Cleverboy]

Really, after thought, this seems like another case of the GOP doing a superior marketing job than the Democrats, at expense of the actual utility of their ticket.

Palins' choice, if modulated correctly in the coming months, could prove masterful in allowing the GOP to avoid issues of substance and have a fighting chance in Nov.Palin serves as a "lightning rod". Basically, she takes away a lot of negative attention McCain might otherwise get... with his birthday today, she has taken away the negative attention that would otherwise be spent "covering" his birthday, placing him within spitting distance of the lifespan of the average male. Democrats have already stepped into the trap by criticizing the positivity of the historic pick for vice president.

The most disturbing aspect of McCain's pick, is that already she does not appear as an equal partner, but an affectionate and grateful recipient of a prize she never expected. Within the two months before the general election, most of America will not have NEARLY enough to get to know her... and moreover, elect her as a ready successor to the office of President. What kind of mettle does she have? What type of spine? How does she handle herself in any number of circumstances? For so much importance to be placed in the office and in her abilities as the commander-in-chief, this will be an interesting pick if America decides it wants to say "Yes" to a shot-gun wedding.

~ CB

[kavika411]

No, they really don't. It was a stupid ad when McCain ran it, and it would be a stupid ad if Obama ran it.

But it would be a good question for an intrepid reporter to ask McCain. "Senator, Mitt Romney received millions of votes, yet he isn't on your ticket. Is that because the truth hurt?"

Are you consistently against hypocritical politicians. ;)

[buffalo]

Please... If Obama had mixed up Sunni and Shia, there would have been hell to pay. if Obama had said that Iraq shared a border with Pakistan, there would have been hell to pay.

Oh please... Obama didn't know how many states are in the Union, and there was no hell to pay. Mistakes happen.

[EDIT... addition]

Exactly- and Arinance, if you really want to know what Obama has done for our state, please go to his website and take a look:

http://obama.senate.gov/

With $1 million dollars a day to spend, I sure hope he has done something!

[stevento]

that's a really good point mactastic

[jplan2008]

I still find the Obama camp whining about her inexperience funny when their own man doesn't have experience either.


Put aside experience for a second. When asked about the Iraq war, she said she "hadn't given it much thought" because she had been concentrating on running Alaska.

--This is a U.S. citizen who "hasn't given much thought" to a major war her country is involved in, that has cost trillions of dollars and thousands of U.S. lives.
--This is a world citizen who hasn't given much thought to an invasion of a country that cost at least hundreds of thousands of lives in that country.
--This is the leader of the Republican party in her state that hasn't given much thought to the stance and role of her party in that major war.
--This is a mother, whose son enlisted in the arms forces nearly a year ago, and hasn't given much thought to the conflict that he certainly from the beginning had to expect he'd be sent to.
--This is a governor, who is commander-in-chief for her national guard who hasn't given much thought to the conflict that her guard troops have been or could be or will be sent to, nor the consequences on her state considering that guard troops from many states have had multiple tours of duty and has constrained their abilities at home

I'd question why someone wanted to be a precinct captain in a national election if they were so apathetic to the country's affairs -- and she wants to be vice president of the U.S.. (of course, she could be lying, and really just disagrees with McCain on the issue, but lying and not speaking her opinion on such an important issue would be just as bad)

This woman has not only given a lot of thought to, but has spoken out about what any woman, even a rape victim, can do with her own body, and what kinds of domestic arrangements couples can and should have, none of which is her damn business. But she hasn't even formed an OPINION on an issue that is EVERYONE'S business, but especially hers, as mother of an enlisted man, as an elected official, as governor, and as a person who is running to be VICE PRESIDENT of the United States?

Before Barack Obama went to Washington, he still read about, learned about, took (the correct) stand on, and spoke out about, this and other national and international issues. And I certainly think he can learn everything remaining to learn for an ingoing president faster than Georges H. or W. could. And now he's also served on the Senate Foreign Relations committee. To say the two have the same level of experience is ridiculous -- she hasn't even shown interest, other than in her own state, including padding its coffers by supporting oil drilling. Nationally, her interests are upholding the "rights" of gun owners, and denying rights and privacy to everyone else.

A big insult on the part of McCain -- that women want to see a role model and the highest office for a woman to-date who plays a role in the campaign just in "social issues," and as "an outsider." And insulting that they're implying that her lack of experience and even interest in international affairs as person second-in-command to a 72-76-year-old somehow compares to Obama's experience, vision (whether you agree with it or not), and understanding of affairs as first-in-command.

[Mike Teezie]

Put aside experience for a second. When asked about the Iraq war, she said she "hadn't given it much thought" because she had been concentrating on running Alaska.

--This is a U.S. citizen who "hasn't given much thought" to a major war her country is involved in, that has cost trillions of dollars and thousands of U.S. lives.
--This is a world citizen who hasn't given much thought to an invasion of a country that cost at least hundreds of thousands of lives in that country.
--This is the leader of the Republican party in her state that hasn't given much thought to the stance and role of her party in that major war.
--This is a mother, whose son enlisted in the arms forces nearly a year ago, and hasn't given much thought to the conflict that he certainly from the beginning had to expect he'd be sent to.
--This is a governor, who is commander-in-chief for her national guard who hasn't given much thought to the conflict that her guard troops have been or could be or will be sent to, nor the consequences on her state considering that guard troops from many states have had multiple tours of duty and has constrained their abilities at home

I'd question why someone wanted to be a precinct captain in a national election if they were so apathetic to the country's affairs -- and she wants to be vice president of the U.S.. (of course, she could be lying, and really just disagrees with McCain on the issue, but lying and not speaking her opinion on such an important issue would be just as bad)

This woman has not only given a lot of thought to, but has spoken out about what any woman, even a rape victim, can do with her own body, and what kinds of domestic arrangements couples can and should have, none of which is her damn business. But she hasn't even formed an OPINION on an issue that is EVERYONE'S business, but especially hers, as mother of an enlisted man, as an elected official, as governor, and as a person who is running to be VICE PRESIDENT of the United States?

Before Barack Obama went to Washington, he still read about, learned about, took (the correct) stand on, and spoke out about, this and other national and international issues. And I certainly think he can learn everything remaining to learn for an ingoing president faster than Georges H. or W. could. And now he's also served on the Senate Foreign Relations committee. To say the two have the same level of experience is ridiculous -- she hasn't even shown interest, other than in her own state, including padding its coffers by supporting oil drilling. Nationally, her interests are upholding the "rights" of gun owners, and denying rights and privacy to everyone else.

A big insult on the part of McCain -- that women want to see a role model and the highest office for a woman to-date who plays a role in the campaign just in "social issues," and as "an outsider." And insulting that they're implying that her lack of experience and even interest in international affairs as person second-in-command to a 72-76-year-old somehow compares to Obama's experience, vision (whether you agree with it or not), and understanding of affairs as first-in-command.

That's pretty damning stuff - I'd like to see an ad. If I were good with FinalCut, I might try to make one myself!

Do you have a link to where she said that?

[Aranince]

--This is a U.S. citizen who "hasn't given much thought" to a major war her country is involved in, that has cost trillions of dollars and thousands of U.S. lives.
--This is a world citizen who hasn't given much thought to an invasion of a country that cost at least hundreds of thousands of lives in that country.
--This is the leader of the Republican party in her state that hasn't given much thought to the stance and role of her party in that major war.
--This is a mother, whose son enlisted in the arms forces nearly a year ago, and hasn't given much thought to the conflict that he certainly from the beginning had to expect he'd be sent to.
--This is a governor, who is commander-in-chief for her national guard who hasn't given much thought to the conflict that her guard troops have been or could be or will be sent to, nor the consequences on her state considering that guard troops from many states have had multiple tours of duty and has constrained their abilities at home


Hasn't given much thought to the war? She went to Iraq to visit the soldiers, they've been playing footage all day.

[clevin]

funny how both campaign now trying to praise Hillary anyway they can.

I say, BSBSBS

Leave her alone, fight your own fight. What is disheartening? means they don't care anymore, doesn't mean they gonna be fooled by a cheap Palin trick, and doesn't mean they have high desire to get involved in Obama's campaign neither. All you can hope is they vote or dont vote, you can most definitely forget active involvement part.

[NT1440]

Hasn't given much thought to the war? She went to Iraq to visit the soldiers, they've been playing footage all day.

a visit does not mean she has policy, it means she knows how to use PR people

[obeygiant]

10 REASON WHY SARAH PALIN WINS MCCAINS ELECTION

John McCain has picked Alaska governor Sarah Palin as his running mate, and already there is quite a buzz on the internet that this choice is going to give his campaign a big boost. The following are ten reasons why this appears likely to be true:

1) Unlike the extremely uninspiring choice of Joe Biden by Barack Obama, the choice of Sarah Palin is absolutely electrifying the Republican base. In the minds of many Republicans this is a game changing choice, and the Republicans have not had something like this to get excited about in ages.

2) Sarah Palin is a mother of five, and this will help the Republicans to do much better with "soccer moms" which is always a key demographic.

3) Sarah Palin could also draw in some of the Hillary Clinton supporters who felt incredibly snubbed and disrespected by Barack Obama.

4) Sarah Palin's husband is a union member, and that will help McCain's campaign with blue collar workers who will be so key in states like Michigan and Ohio.

5) On September 11, 2007, the Sarah Palin's eldest son Track joined the Army. He serves in an infantry brigade and will be deployed to Iraq in September 2008. This will help McCain among the military and among military families.

6) On April 18, 2008, Sarah Palin gave birth to her second son, Trig Paxson Van Palin, who has Down syndrome. This will help McCain's campaign with groups that advocate for the disabled. Plus there is the sympathy factor.

7) McCain now has a chance to get social conservatives excited. Many social conservatives have been very suspicious of McCain, but Palin is strongly pro-life, a supporter of capital punishment, and belongs to Feminists for Life, and this will give social conservatives much more of a reason to come into McCain's camp.

8) In 1984, Palin was the runner-up in the Miss Alaska pageant, and as much as that shouldn't count, Americans are more shallow than ever. Americans prefer good looking people, and as sad as it is, the fact that she is attractive will win votes.

9) A poll published by Hays Research on July 28, 2008 showed Palin's approval rating at 80%. She has had consistently high approval ratings in Alaska, and that is a huge difference from the Republicans in Washington.

10) Speaking of the Republicans in Washington, this choice signals even more of a move away form the Bush administration, and this can only help McCain.

Did the glass ceiling with 18 million cracks in it just burst?

:)

[NT1440]

Did the glass ceiling with 18 million cracks in it just burst?

:)

nice how theres no substance there at all. yes it makes a good story, but i dont see any reasons why thats good for the country at all. nothing but popularity