The truth about Steve Jobs health !

[fredsarran]

Hi,

Since a while, I know that Steve Jobs is ill and not well (is it really cancer ?). I have seen some of his "keynotes" events where it was obvious he was ill but otherwise he was OK.

In the last "keynote" event "Lets Rock" (09/09/08) he seemed really in a bad shape. Sure he is ill and not cured (even thought he says he is cured), he can still smile and speak about what he believes in, with some energy.

I am not convinced that he is getting better. He is amazingly slim and weak (you can see the lack of strength in his arms, specially at the end when he is waving to the audience, in the last "keynote" event).

Let resume : He has cancer and he is under treatment. Cancer can be rarely cured and if he could get cured, he would already be cured. Now he is weak from the cancer but as well from the treatment. We should all be worried that he could die soon (he does reassure the shareholders at the beginning of his last "keynote", about his health, but that is for business purposes).

I believe, that he gets all his strength from, his family, but specially from Apple. The company that is part of him. Apple without him, is not Apple anymore.

Has a "emotional and loving" fan of Apple, I am worried to what Apple will be without Steve Jobs. I admire this guy a lot.

We should all get together, maybe making a list of names, to send to Apple, to show our gratitude and support towards Steve Jobs and the hard time that Apple will face at some point.

Please comment and let me know.

Long live Steve Jobs and Apple :apple: :)

[arkitect]

Wow.
You really have been suckling at the Kool-Aid keg… or perhaps just really naive.

:rolleyes:

SJ is no saint… just read up about him.

Will Apple, Inc go under without him?
If it does it deserves to.

Ever thought that just perhaps Apple might be a better company without him and his freakish control?

Why does everyone assume that when he goes it'll be Scully, Spindler and Amelio all over again.

[Yaboze]

Steve has to be replaced one day, I just hope it's many years from now.

I'm not sure what is going on with Steve, he is looking rather thin and frail lately. But, if he is going through with chemo, he'd most likely lose the hair he still has, so I don't think he is. He could be using another treatment, but nobody knows but him and his family.

It seems that every appearance he is looking worse, but it's really his own personal business.

People are concerned not because they are nosy, but people care about Steve and what he brings to Apple. Historically, Apple doesn't do too well without him, so I hope he has a good successor if needed and has drawn up long term plans for the company.

[rfrankl]

The truth? It just seems like your opinion to me. Are you a doctor?

[fredsarran]

Wow.
You really have been suckling at the Kool-Aid keg… or perhaps just really naive.

:rolleyes:

SJ is no saint… just read up about him.

Will Apple, Inc go under without him?
If it does it deserves to.

Ever thought that just perhaps Apple might be a better company without him and his freakish control?

Why does everyone assume that when he goes it'll be Scully, Spindler and Amelio all over again.

You are right to some extent. I read a lot about him, even seen a movie about him.

I think that he is a control freak and actually mean with charging nearly every thing Apple comes out with (software updates).

But nevertheless, the company succeeded because of who he is. Apple reflects him. Without his "bad" side, the "good creative" side would be nothing.

[fredsarran]

The truth? It just seems like your opinion to me. Are you a doctor?

Yes it is my opinion. And I am looking for the truth :) And I do work in the Social Care sector as a therapist :)

[MacsRgr8]

Why does everyone assume that when he goes it'll be Scully, Spindler and Amelio all over again.

You name 3 names who were Apple CEO's, and none of 'em could do it.

Steve came back, and because of his control freakiness and vision, he was able to turn the cr@ppy Apple from the latter part of the century into one amazing company.
Why do you think that an eventual Steve successor won't be a John Sculley again? Seemed such a gr8 move at the time...

ATM Apple needs a "Steve". Someone bold enough to take on whatever seems impossible. Mac OS 9 to Mac OS X transition, PPC to Intel, "introduce another MP3 player to the market..", "try to get into the Cellphone business? crazy!!"
Put a John Sculley there, and none of this would have happened because he listens to his shareholders, and doesn't want to swim upstream.

Once Apple has grown hugely, and there are no more really new groundbreaking stuff to introduce... the Steve can pass it on to Phil, or Jonathan... or whoever. We need him now.

[Apple Corps]

How in the world do you know he is "not cured"??????

The highly novel surgery that has been reported on re-routes portions of his digestive anatomy.

The reported side effect - as explained by a UCLA surgeon - is an ongoing loss of weight around 15% - 20%. Add to that his vegan diet and he looks gaunt and much thinner than he used to.

His interview with The New York Times was clear - the cancer has not returned. I'll go with what Steve and the medical experts in the field have reported.

[CorvusCamenarum]

Why does everyone assume that when he goes it'll be Scully, Spindler and Amelio all over again.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't he forced out when he left? I'd imagine that barring a similar incident in the future, when he does decide to leave of his own volition, he will be able to choose to whom he's passing the reins and can groom said person accordingly.

[arkitect]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't he forced out when he left? I'd imagine that barring a similar incident in the future, when he does decide to leave of his own volition, he will be able to choose to whom he's passing the reins and can groom said person accordingly.

my point exactly.
Why will it be doom and gloom and not well planned.

That is why I say it doesn't mean a repeat of Sculley et al.

[WardC]

Well, I guess you can have a look and judge for yourselves, in my opinion - he is not looking that great and I hope the cancer doesn't get the best of him. Our thoughts are to Steve and his family, let's hope he's not really as sick as he appears to be.

http://www.wardcurry.com/steve.jpg

[Apple Corps]

Well, I guess you can have a look and judge for yourselves, in my opinion - he is not looking that great and I hope the cancer doesn't get the best of him. Our thoughts are to Steve and his family, let's hope he's not really as sick as he appears to be.

http://www.wardcurry.com/steve.jpg

The cancer was surgically removed and has not recurred - there are many many many cancer survivors.

Lets not assume that Steve has an active cancer problem - I explained the side effects in my post.

[Apple Corps]

Steve's comment during a post event interview:

"I'm doing fine, really," Jobs said, throwing out an off-hand remark that all recent rumors and speculation over his well-being was spawned by "hedge funds with a big short position in Apple."

[jaw04005]

Steve's comment during a post event interview:

"I'm doing fine, really," Jobs said, throwing out an off-hand remark that all recent rumors and speculation over his well-being was spawned by "hedge funds with a big short position in Apple."

He also mentioned he could stand to gain a few pounds. Talk about rehashing an issue over and over — Jobs has said repeatedly he's OK. You don't hear CNBC speculating that Steve Balmer has hypertension because he appears overweight, do you?

Lord.

[fredsarran]

Well, sure he will say he is fine :) Can you see him saying he is not and soon to die ?? I would have said the same if I was at his place (especially if I was CEO of such a great company), that does not mean I am getting better or that the problem is resolved.

[rekhyt]

The cancer was surgically removed and has not recurred - there are many many many cancer survivors.

Lets not assume that Steve has an active cancer problem - I explained the side effects in my post.

I think he is ok... Looks a bit thin though. In the first pic he looks like he is... Gritting his teeth?

[fredsarran]

It is often the treatment that kills, not the cancer itself.

[sishaw]

Wow.
You really have been suckling at the Kool-Aid keg… or perhaps just really naive.

:rolleyes:

SJ is no saint… just read up about him.

Will Apple, Inc go under without him?
If it does it deserves to.

Ever thought that just perhaps Apple might be a better company without him and his freakish control?

Why does everyone assume that when he goes it'll be Scully, Spindler and Amelio all over again.

Because he's the one with the creative vision. Without his vision, Apple becomes an overpriced box. Those who do not learn from the past....

[Igantius]

re: another Sculley - it was Jobs that persuaded him to come over from Pepsi and Apple also suffered from their feuding.

Because he's the one with the creative vision. Without his vision, Apple becomes an overpriced box. Those who do not learn from the past....

I think that's highly arguable and overlooks the far from visionary things Job did in his first spell at Apple - e.g. attempting to cancel the Macintosh project, making a lot of questionable decisions in the Lisa Project, the famous visit to Xerox PARC was orginally squashed by Jobs, he let his personal feelings get in the way with dealing with the legendary Jef Raskin (such as Jef's suggestion that Apple should visit PARC).

Michael Malone's excellent, Infinite Loop is well worth a read for the good and bad.

[Chappers]

Steve wears black - its very slimming :)

[fredsarran]

Steve wears black - its very slimming :)

True :)

[Trip.Tucker]

Yes it is my opinion. And I am looking for the truth :) And I do work in the Social Care sector as a therapist :)

Oh well since you work in the social care sector and have had access to his medical records, you MUST know the truth.

[IJ Reilly]

As anyone who'd got a nodding familiarity with cancer knows, nobody is considered "cured" of cancer until their risk of recurrence drops statistically to the level of the general population. This takes anywhere from five to ten years, depending on the type, size and location of the tumor. Until then, if you remain cancer-free, your cancer is considered to be "in remission." At this stage, I doubt very much that any oncologist is telling Steve Jobs that he has been "cured."

[WardC]

It should have read more like this:

http://www.wardcurry.com/steve2.jpg

[belvdr]

As anyone who'd got a nodding familiarity with cancer knows, nobody is considered "cured" of cancer until their risk of recurrence drops statistically to the level of the general population. This takes anywhere from five to ten years, depending on the type, size and location of the tumor. Until then, if you remain cancer-free, your cancer is considered to be "in remission." At this stage, I doubt very much that any oncologist is telling Steve Jobs that he has been "cured."

That's interesting; I never knew that. Hopefully you're not speaking from experience.

[maxrobertson]

This speculation is totally foolish and unfounded. The most logical explanation is also the one that makes sense: that Steve Jobs had the whipple procedure (a major part of stomach stapling) which decreased his weight. Is that so hard to believe? What void do you people have in your lives that you have to constantly think about whether or not Steve Jobs is going to die soon. What would he die of? His cancer was operable and pancreatic cancer doesn't spread quickly. It's time to drop this.

It should have read more like this:

http://www.wardcurry.com/steve2.jpg

You are one of the lamest people I have ever met on the internet. Do you know how many lame people there are on the internet? :D

[IJ Reilly]

That's interesting; I never knew that. Hopefully you're not speaking from experience.

The bottom line is, with the exception of cancers which have known genetic patterns or environmental causes, medical science really doesn't know a whole lot about why some people get it and others don't. What they do know is the rates of cancers in the general population, and the recurrence rates over time for people who've been treated for the disease. The longer a cancer patient goes without a recurrence, the less likely they are to have one. Eventually those odds drop to about the same as someone who never had the disease. Assuming they survive that long, at that point but not before, they will be considered "cured."

[Le Big Mac]

That's interesting; I never knew that. Hopefully you're not speaking from experience.

On the other hand, pancreatic cancer tends to kill people very quickly if it's not caught. So either the surgery got all of it, or so much of it that it hasn't recurred.

[WardC]

OK, I really don't want people to get the wrong message from what I was trying to say. I dearly do love Steve, both as a person, a personality, a revolutionary, a CEO, and a visionary genius. I would hate to see him go, and the last thing I want to see if for him to die a horrible painful death to pancreatic cancer, and have the whole community of us see him go before his time. That said, I do NOT want to see Steve die, at all, soon or later, because I am one of his biggest fans actually.

The point of that I was posting was pure satire. The truth is, I do believe that Steve is indeed in grave health, and I don't think it's right to lie about it if he is (gravely ill), and hide purposefully and strategically it in such a way from the public, when anyone can see (at this point) that he is not "spunky, witty, and agile" Steve of 2 or 3 years ago, and his health has declined in a swift and very quick fashion...he's "lost it" very fast. Very easy to see this. SO -- my point was to show that Steve is obviously trying to allay the public and really try to diffuse what he would like the public to think of as "myth" about his health decline, which obviously appears to be a reality which is rapidly consuming every part of him. It doesn't take a "Genius" to see this.

[fredsarran]

OK, I really don't want people to get the wrong message from what I was trying to say. I dearly do love Steve, both as a person, a personality, a revolutionary, a CEO, and a visionary genius. I would hate to see him go, and the last thing I want to see if for him to die a horrible painful death to pancreatic cancer, and have the whole community of us see him go before his time. That said, I do NOT want to see Steve die, at all, soon or later, because I am one of his biggest fans actually.

The point of that I was posting was pure satire. The truth is, I do believe that Steve is indeed in grave health, and I don't think it's right to lie about it if he is (gravely ill), and hide purposefully and strategically it in such a way from the public, when anyone can see (at this point) that he is not "spunky, witty, and agile" Steve of 2 or 3 years ago, and his health has declined in a swift and very quick fashion...he's "lost it" very fast. Very easy to see this. SO -- my point was to show that Steve is obviously trying to allay the public and really try to diffuse what he would like the public to think of as "myth" about his health decline, which obviously appears to be a reality which is rapidly consuming every part of him. It doesn't take a "Genius" to see this.

Ah man :) You are so right. I agree with every word you say. I admire Steve a lot. Despite his maniac side of things, he is a genius.

[Diatribe]

Geez people. He is a strict vegan, have you ever seen vegans? He is not any thinner than the ones I have seen.

[Muncher]

Because he's the one with the creative vision. Without his vision, Apple becomes an overpriced box. Those who do not learn from the past....

I think Jon Ives shares some of that vision...

[IJ Reilly]

On the other hand, pancreatic cancer tends to kill people very quickly if it's not caught. So either the surgery got all of it, or so much of it that it hasn't recurred.

This isn't correct. There's two types of pancreatic cancer. The most common kind is extremely deadly. If Steve had been suffering from this form, he'd probably be dead by now, no matter when they caught it. At the time he was reported to have been treated for the rarer and far less deadly type.

OK, I really don't want people to get the wrong message from what I was trying to say. I dearly do love Steve, both as a person, a personality, a revolutionary, a CEO, and a visionary genius. I would hate to see him go, and the last thing I want to see if for him to die a horrible painful death to pancreatic cancer, and have the whole community of us see him go before his time. That said, I do NOT want to see Steve die, at all, soon or later, because I am one of his biggest fans actually.

The point of that I was posting was pure satire. The truth is, I do believe that Steve is indeed in grave health, and I don't think it's right to lie about it if he is (gravely ill), and hide purposefully and strategically it in such a way from the public, when anyone can see (at this point) that he is not "spunky, witty, and agile" Steve of 2 or 3 years ago, and his health has declined in a swift and very quick fashion...he's "lost it" very fast. Very easy to see this. SO -- my point was to show that Steve is obviously trying to allay the public and really try to diffuse what he would like the public to think of as "myth" about his health decline, which obviously appears to be a reality which is rapidly consuming every part of him. It doesn't take a "Genius" to see this.

Not only is this wrong, I find myself resenting the implications. I presume you've never known someone who's been through a difficult surgical procedure. Trust me, you don't just jump out of your hospital bed and play a round of tennis. These kinds of surgeries mess your insides and they stay messed for years at least, and often for the rest of your life. Depending on the severity, you may very well never be your old self again. But this does not mean that you are "gravely ill" -- not by a long shot.

[queshy]

Heh, I wonder what Arn thinks about this...

Anyways, he is getting older, and people gain and lose weight all the time. What is certain is that he is experiencing weight loss.

Why, though, is the question. He is a vegan - but he has always been (although he sometimes eats fish).

The whipple procedure is a huge one -- and can definitely cause weight loss. He could also be on anti-depressants (for X, Y, and Z reasons, who knows?).


I really admire him as a person, and I care about him more than I care about Apple.

[IJ Reilly]

A "frail old man?" These commentaries only seems get worse.

Piece of advice: If you do know someone who's been through major surgery, do them a big favor -- stay as far away from them as possible. They'll have enough to cope with without dealing with someone who makes depressing judgements.

[queshy]

A "frail old man?" These commentaries only seems get worse.

Piece of advice: If you do know someone who's been through major surgery, do them a big favor -- stay as far away from them as possible. They'll have enough to cope with without dealing with someone who makes depressing judgements.

I removed that part of my post because it seems to bother you.

But what is wrong with speculation? People go through up and down cycles all the time in terms of their weight - and older people often lose muscle mass and it gets converted into fat. Muscle weighs more than fat. Jobs isn't that old - which is why that possibility isn't very likely - but again, what's wrong with speculation? He could be malnourished, i.e. doesn't want to eat either because cancer treatments are making him that way or he is having having continued effects from the whipple procedure. If you wikipedia this procedure , you will see that it's really an invasive procedure.

[belvdr]

Trust me, you don't just jump out of your hospital bed and play a round of tennis.

That just tickled me. I can only imagine some sickly grandma getting out of the hospital and heading straight for the courts. :)

[IJ Reilly]

I removed that part of my post because it seems to bother you.

Only because it's offensive.

But what is wrong with speculation? People go through up and down cycles all the time in terms of their weight - and older people often lose muscle mass and it gets converted into fat. Muscle weighs more than fat. Jobs isn't that old - which is why that possibility isn't very likely - but again, what's wrong with speculation? He could be malnourished, i.e. doesn't want to eat either because cancer treatments are making him that way or he is having having continued effects from the whipple procedure. If you wikipedia this procedure , you will see that it's really an invasive procedure.

You've essentially answered your own question. The type of procedure Steve Jobs required is not the kind a person recovers from quickly. It's probably not the type of procedure that anyone ever recovers from completely, at least to the extent that life resumes as it was before. Major alterations to the digestive system are extremely difficult adjustments. They affect what you can eat, how much you can eat, how often you eat, when you eat. Without going into details, I know this from first-hand experience.

That just tickled me. I can only imagine some sickly grandma getting out of the hospital and heading straight for the courts. :)

You might try to imagine something else.

[fredsarran]

Heh, I wonder what Arn thinks about this...

Anyways, he is getting older, and people gain and lose weight all the time. What is certain is that he is experiencing weight loss.

Why, though, is the question. He is a vegan - but he has always been (although he sometimes eats fish).

The whipple procedure is a huge one -- and can definitely cause weight loss. He could also be on anti-depressants (for X, Y, and Z reasons, who knows?).


I really admire him as a person, and I care about him more than I care about Apple.

Thats interesting, I did not know he was a vegan. Now I am dissapointed :rolleyes: Just because I love meat and I do not understand the reasons to be vegan, besides if he was allergic to tons of stuff.