Why do some apple user hate the MBA

[Heavenkittykat]

So I'm an apple convert. My first laptop is MBA. I had it for six months and I'm completely happy with it. It replaced my sony vaio sz and it tops it performance and speed wise. When I bought it last march many people are against me on buying it (including apple employees in the apple store). But I still bought it because its right for my needs.

I couldn't be happier with my purchase. However it puzzles me because everytime I visit the macforums outside of the Macbook air thread, many people bash the MBA calling it a "useless underpowered machine" or something similar along those lines. I don't understand why some other apple users themselves hate the MBA like it's kinda like the "black sheep" of the apple notebook lineup. Can anybody explain to me why this is the case?

[Grizzly Adams]

Because while they enjoy their products, they can't understand why someone would want a computer with lower specs and a higher price. I love my MBA and wouldn't trade it for anything else in the apple lineup. It does exactly what I need in a size and portability factor that I couldn't do without.

Everyone that I have met IRL that also has a MacBook has been curious as to how I like it and how I do without standards like an optical drive. I have even had some people strike up a conversation with me because I was holding it.

[Mikebuzzsaw]

Cause most people who frequent this forums only care about more power. Faster specs is always better.. even if they don't utilize the computer to it's full potential.

[Hawkeye411]

Funny ... I was just browsing through eBay and came across an MBA for sale and I thought ... why would anyone pay that much for a used, underpowered computer.

What are the odds that I would then happen across this thread ... hmm ... strange ..

Anyway .. glad to hear that your happy with your MBA :)

Cheers.
:):apple:

[*Sandy*]

Its nice to look at and crappy to use, core shutdowns, fans all the time Heat issues, very beautiful package, BUT not useful.

Sold mine a month after release and went back to a Macbook ;)

[nick9191]

Because they're ignorant ;)

[Digital Skunk]

Because most people are consumers in the mindless sense of the word. If it's a new Apple product they just want it even if they don't have a need or use for it.

Many MBA owners or former owners bought it and didn't know what it was for, or had no idea about the market it filled and how to use it for what it was built for. The employees didn't want to sell you one most likely because it was your first Mac, and there's a good chance you would have returned it and picked up a Macbook or just been an Apple basher.

I would love to own one eventually, but I need to make sure I am not wasting my money first, since i have a desktop and portable.

The MBA is a wonderful ultra slim, wireless, secondary machine, and better built than any Apple machine next to the Mac Pro and iMac. Anyone that can't see that is very shortsighted.

[gooddeal]

From: Bobjob186- Blackbook is more diverse. Allows you do to handle more if you need to. Air is limited, however if you can handle the limitations then it's phenominal. It's like a 2 seater roadster, it's fun as heck until you need to pick your parents up from the airport with their bags or go to home depot for 2x4s. But if you don't have an airport near you or never do hardware stuff, it's the best thing ever.

I like this analogy. People (who are just bashing the Air) are crazy. They need to learn the intent of a product. I like to drive my G coupe. I have no doubt that some people who love SUVs would think that I'm crazy to pay a lot of $$ for a useless car that I cannot transport anything.

I got the Air 3 months ago. I like it, so, I decided to sell my 6 months old Macbook w/ 4GB of RAM one month later.

[gonyr]

In my case, it's because I was hoping for a netbook like the msi wind or the asus eee. The mba is neither small nor cheap. My hopes were dashed for another year. Oh well, there's always mwsf 2009.

[swiftaw]

Because it is a niche product. Those that don't fit into that niche do not understand the point of it. I personally love mine, it's so much nicer to carry that around all day that it was my 15" Powerbook G4.

[dogsbody]

Well, I work in an APR over here, and we've had an awfully large amount of people in who come in just to look at it. Admittedly, most of them go off with a MacBook or MacBook Pro as the Air turns out not to be what they are looking for. But we have still sold a lot of them, people still come in specifically for them, and the ones that have them are over the moon with them.

We all thought it was the sleekest, sexiest piece of Apple design in a long while and were like a crowd of over-excited schoolboys when the first demo model arrived way back.

I thought I'd never buy one, personally, but having borrowed our demo model to do some quick typing for a magazine article in the local café, I found it was both glorious to carry and awesome to use.

MBA's are great machines - and perfectly suited for mobile users. My friend uses his on photo shoots with Lightroom and a 3G USB dongle - he is more than happy with it. :apple:

[CalmEnvy]

It's just not for everyone, I know I wouldn't pay anything near the amount there asking for it (but then again I don't care about how thin a laptop is). I'm perfectly fine with the MacBook's size.

[PkennethV]

also, some people don't need something that small...I use my 17" MBP during breakfast at the table, on my desk, on the couch, in bed (heck i even use it in bed with a 6x11 graphics tablet, though i admit that is something no one else i know does:rolleyes:).

[Sesshi]

So I'm an apple convert. My first laptop is MBA. I had it for six months and I'm completely happy with it. It replaced my sony vaio sz and it tops it performance and speed wise.

Perhaps it's because we don't have the same blinkers. Or maybe it's the Born-Again-Switcher thing of comparing a two/three-year-old Windows machine against a current Apple one. I use my current SZ's pretty much every day - which have significantly higher performance than the Air. The Air - when I have to (i.e. when I need an OS X machine that's actually truly portable). For me, the Air should be an exact fit as a regular user of lightweight / ultraportables on the move - but it just struggles to do even the little that I ask of it without a notable degree of fuss / compromise.

[donga]

simply put: different strokes for different folks ;)

[Heavenkittykat]

I actually bought my SZ a year before I bought my MBA. The reason why the performance of air is better than my SZ is probably because of OS X. With vista I have to have so many anti-spyware, anti-virus etc. installed which slows it down significantly.

Perhaps it's because we don't have the same blinkers. Or maybe it's the Born-Again-Switcher thing of comparing a two/three-year-old Windows machine against a current Apple one. I use my current SZ's pretty much every day - which have significantly higher performance than the Air. The Air - when I have to (i.e. when I need an OS X machine that's actually truly portable). For me, the Air should be an exact fit as a regular user of lightweight / ultraportables on the move - but it just struggles to do even the little that I ask of it without a notable degree of fuss / compromise.

[Heavenkittykat]

Perhaps it's because we don't have the same blinkers. Or maybe it's the Born-Again-Switcher thing of comparing a two/three-year-old Windows machine against a current Apple one. I use my current SZ's pretty much every day - which have significantly higher performance than the Air. The Air - when I have to (i.e. when I need an OS X machine that's actually truly portable). For me, the Air should be an exact fit as a regular user of lightweight / ultraportables on the move - but it just struggles to do even the little that I ask of it without a notable degree of fuss / compromise.

And also I forgot about the portability and battery. The SZ might be considered an ultraportable but my MBA is much more portable for me. In addition the battery life in the SZ is significantly less than the the MBA and since I planned to use my laptop everyday to take notes in class. My MBA is more useful to me.

[Abstract]

I love the concept of the MBA, and in a way, I love the product itself.


I'm never going to buy an MBA. I'm much more likely to buy myself a 15" MBP plus the upcoming Lenovo S10 netbook/Dell Mini 9/Samsung whateverit'scalled next time I upgrade and buy new systems. I'll probably never buy a desktop again, and hence, am not really the target consumer for the MBA. It doesn't serve my needs at all. However, the MBA clearly has its place in the market for those with a particular computer setup, particularly if you have a more powerful desktop and want mobile computing capabilities using both a full-sized keyboard and large screen. You can argue that a 12" MBA would have been better, but unless the MBA adopted the 4:3 aspect ratio (like the old 12" PowerBook), I find 12" widescreen laptops too cramped if what I'm looking for is a screen that provides eye comfort. A netbook would certainly be out of the question.

Liking the MBA is not a matter of fanboy-ism. I'm certainly not a fanboy, as other people here can attest. It's a good computer that will satisfy most users with a specific computer setup. However, I've also bashed the MBA for what it isn't. For someone who will always have a laptop as his main system, the large length and width of a 13" laptop, or even a 12" laptop, means that there isn't much benefit of owning an MBA if my main computer is a 15" or 17" MBP. For a laptop owner, this is where netbooks come into play.

If you enjoy the MBA, then great.

[quasinormal]

Hate is a very divisive word. It is not about hate- it is about preferences and needs.

Some of us were disappointed because of our expectations. I personally wanted;
- Something smaller- More like the eee pc than a Macbook.
- Built in 3G HSDPA support.
- Firewire port [s]
-a price more like a eee pc than MBP.
- a bigger hard drive.

To me the Air seemed more like an enticement to PC users, than a Mac aimed at committed Mac users. Because it is a portable it will be seen by others and is an obvious status symbol to the typical fashion victim.

That said, I will be buying one when it gets native 3G support, just like I'll be buying a iPhone when having one doesn't mean being held to ransom by the telecommunications companies and Apple.

[The Awesome]

Can anybody explain to me why this is the case?

Some of the flak comes from 12" PB owners. They wanted the smaller footprint of their G4 (and most of the PowerBook/MBP goodies) yet all that Steve gave them was an "anorexic" MacBook with a little bit of MBP.

I personally would have wanted a MacIntel 12" (or a modern version of the very expandable, excellent battery life Pismo) though I still think the MBA is damn sexy - no other current laptop I can think of right now comes close. :)

[sushi]

Because it is a niche product. Those that don't fit into that niche do not understand the point of it.
There you go.

Niche products will always be seen this way.

[Heavenkittykat]

I love the concept of the MBA, and in a way, I love the product itself.


I'm never going to buy an MBA. I'm much more likely to buy myself a 15" MBP plus the upcoming Lenovo S10 netbook/Dell Mini 9/Samsung whateverit'scalled next time I upgrade and buy new systems. I'll probably never buy a desktop again, and hence, am not really the target consumer for the MBA. It doesn't serve my needs at all. However, the MBA clearly has its place in the market for those with a particular computer setup, particularly if you have a more powerful desktop and want mobile computing capabilities using both a full-sized keyboard and large screen. You can argue that a 12" MBA would have been better, but unless the MBA adopted the 4:3 aspect ratio (like the old 12" PowerBook), I find 12" widescreen laptops too cramped if what I'm looking for is a screen that provides eye comfort. A netbook would certainly be out of the question.

Liking the MBA is not a matter of fanboy-ism. I'm certainly not a fanboy, as other people here can attest. It's a good computer that will satisfy most users with a specific computer setup. However, I've also bashed the MBA for what it isn't. For someone who will always have a laptop as his main system, the large length and width of a 13" laptop, or even a 12" laptop, means that there isn't much benefit of owning an MBA if my main computer is a 15" or 17" MBP. For a laptop owner, this is where netbooks come into play.

If you enjoy the MBA, then great.

Yes I do very much understand the disappointment of other apple users who are expecting a different type of laptop after the "ultraportable macbook" was rumored. However what I cannot understand is some people can call the MBA "useless and crappy underpowered machine" even though they haven't used it and even though it obviously works well with other people targeted by this "niche product"

[PowerFullMac]

The MBA sucks and all it does is shows how Apple can sell you anything for a stupidly high price even though they put thinness wayyy over functuality, something Apple loves doing these days.

Why do I say this? Look at the specs for the entry-level MacBook: 2.1GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 1GB RAM, 120GB HD for £700. Now, look at the entry-level MacBook Air specs: 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM (which you can get on the MacBook for a extra £30), 80GB HD... For £1,200!

Now, which do you think is better value?

[Heavenkittykat]

The MBA sucks and all it does is shows how Apple can sell you anything for a stupidly high price even though they put thinness wayyy over functuality, something Apple loves doing these days.

Why do I say this? Look at the specs for the entry-level MacBook: 2.1GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 1GB RAM, 120GB HD for £700. Now, look at the entry-level MacBook Air specs: 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM (which you can get on the MacBook for a extra £30), 80GB HD... For £1,200!

Now, which do you think is better value?


I beg to differ. Apple is not the only manufacturer selling ultrathin and ultralight laptops for a high price. This is not because they wanted to make their consumers laughing stock, the simple answer is that it costs so much more to make a product much thinner and lighter than a regular one because of the parts they use and because of the innovative engineering involved in being able to compress a functional machine in a very thin package.

How can you justify your statement that MBA sucks? Do you own it? Have you tried it? I for one have used mine for 6 months and its a fully functional and very portable machine. I am a light user and I travel a lot. I don't care if my applications open 2-3 seconds later than it would have been if I own a machine with higher specs. What I care about is the WEIGHT and PORTABILITY. I carry my laptop every day in my backpack walking miles around a very big campus and carrying it to every class I have.

[yetanotherdave]

Because it gives the "apple are over priced style over substance" crowd a lot of a good argument. You cannot argue that it is very overpriced for the spec.
I don't hate it, I wouldn't buy it, for the money I would absolutely get a MBP without giving the MBA a second glance, but a laptop is my only computer, and the MBA wouldn't meet my requirements.

[PowerFullMac]

I beg to differ. Apple is not the only manufacturer selling ultrathin and ultralight laptops for a high price. This is not because they wanted to make their consumers laughing stock, the simple answer is that it costs so much more to make a product much thinner and lighter than a regular one because of the parts they use and because of the innovative engineering involved in being able to compress a functional machine in a very thin package.

How can you justify your statement that MBA sucks? Do you own it? Have you tried it? I for one have used mine for 6 months and its a fully functional and very portable machine. I am a light user and I travel a lot. I don't care if my applications open 2-3 seconds later than it would have been if I own a machine with higher specs. What I care about is the WEIGHT and PORTABILITY. I carry my laptop every day in my backpack walking miles around a very big campus and carrying it to every class I have.

Even if that is true, the price is still stupid for the specs they provide you with! Most thing the MacBook has low specs for £700, so another laptop with even worse specs for over £1k is just stupid! No matter how thin it is!

Yes, I have used it, it sucks. Using the trackpad makes my hand hurt, as does typing.

But despite all this, people still buy them! Ridiculous!

[mosx]

I actually bought my SZ a year before I bought my MBA. The reason why the performance of air is better than my SZ is probably because of OS X. With vista I have to have so many anti-spyware, anti-virus etc. installed which slows it down significantly.

Thats not true. You don't have to have any anti-spyware or anti-virus in Vista.

The only way you can get any viruses or spyware in Vista is if you go to a site you probably shouldn't be visiting, download a file against Firefox or IE's warnings that its a bad file, run the file despite Windows warnings.... you get the idea?

The reason the MBA performs better than the SZ is because the SZ uses ULV CPUs while the MBA uses a full blown Core 2 Duo.

I don't "hate" the MacBook Air. I do think it should be significantly cheaper than it is. They should have also put in ULV Core 2 Duos rather than the regular one. The design of the MacBook Air basically prohibits it from running at full speed. You have core shutdowns, CPU throttling, etc. It would have been better to include a ULV C2D. A ULV C2D running at full speed is faster than a standard C2D running at 800MHz with 1 core disable and throttling itself due to heat problems.

[Heavenkittykat]

Even if that is true, the price is still stupid for the specs they provide you with! Most thing the MacBook has low specs for £700, so another laptop with even worse specs for over £1k is just stupid! No matter how thin it is!

Yes, I have used it, it sucks. Using the trackpad makes my hand hurt, as does typing.

But despite all this, people still buy them! Ridiculous!

okay yes it does sound to be overpriced. However buying them is not totally ridiculous specially if you have the money. Like what I've stated before, if one happens to be a person with enough money to spend and who values portability and style and happens to be a light user then the MBA will be good buy for him/her. Every ultraportable in the market usually has the same price or most of the time even more expensive than the MBA. In addition MBA runs with OSX!

[Heavenkittykat]

Thats not true. You don't have to have any anti-spyware or anti-virus in Vista.

The only way you can get any viruses or spyware in Vista is if you go to a site you probably shouldn't be visiting, download a file against Firefox or IE's warnings that its a bad file, run the file despite Windows warnings.... you get the idea?

The reason the MBA performs better than the SZ is because the SZ uses ULV CPUs while the MBA uses a full blown Core 2 Duo.

I don't "hate" the MacBook Air. I do think it should be significantly cheaper than it is. They should have also put in ULV Core 2 Duos rather than the regular one. The design of the MacBook Air basically prohibits it from running at full speed. You have core shutdowns, CPU throttling, etc. It would have been better to include a ULV C2D. A ULV C2D running at full speed is faster than a standard C2D running at 800MHz with 1 core disable and throttling itself due to heat problems.


Well the tech support of sony is the one who told me to get an anti-spyware and anti-virus programs. Although I could attest for a fact that sony's tech support sucks big time. In addition to that my SZ takes forever to boot up, the battery dies easily and the programs take forever to load.

[PowerFullMac]

okay yes it does sound to be overpriced. However buying them is not totally ridiculous specially if you have the money. Like what I've stated before, if one happens to be a person with enough money to spend and who values portability and style and happens to be a light user then the MBA will be good buy for him/her. Every ultraportable in the market usually has the same price or most of the time even more expensive than the MBA. In addition MBA runs with OSX!

Tell ya what, it all boils down to this:

If you want style/thinness over functionality, and you have loads of money to burn, buy the Air. If, however, you want something that does more than just e-mail and internet without beach-balling, spend £100 more and get a MacBook Pro.

[Abstract]

Even the 17" MBP is a niche product, really. It just happens to be for a different consumer. An MBA user could just as easily say, "OMFG! Why would anybody look to a 17" MBP if they're looking for portable computing! Just buy a 15" MBP and an external LCD, or get a desktop!!" Of course, MBA owners don't question the necessity of other niche products such as the 17" MBP because, they understand what a "niche" is.

I like the MBA, but I like the 17" MBP just as much. If I switched to a desktop + laptop computing setup, I would consider getting the MBA (although it's not guarantee I'd get it). However, that's not how I roll, so I'd never consider an MBA.

For those people who buy the MBA as their primary computer, it's because their computing needs aren't high. People just don't understand how this could be, but it's true. ;) Even 2.5 years ago, the MBA would have been considered a very fast computer. The original MacBook was a 1.8 GHz Core Duo, which is probably slower than the MBA's 1.6 and 1.8 Ghz Core 2 Duo. So really, should people buy the MBA if they're only interested in sending emails and posting on MR? I think people with 2 year old MacBook Pros will say "No, because I did a lot more than that 2 years ago".

Computers continue to get faster and Faster and FASTER, but for many people, their computing needs haven't increased over time. Rather than buying a faster machine every 2 years, what's wrong with buying something lighter, or sleeker, if your needs haven't increased? :confused:

Answer: Nothing. ;)

[Sesshi]

I actually bought my SZ a year before I bought my MBA. The reason why the performance of air is better than my SZ is probably because of OS X. With vista I have to have so many anti-spyware, anti-virus etc. installed which slows it down significantly.

And also I forgot about the portability and battery. The SZ might be considered an ultraportable but my MBA is much more portable for me. In addition the battery life in the SZ is significantly less than the the MBA and since I planned to use my laptop everyday to take notes in class. My MBA is more useful to me.

It's a little bizarre. Even my oldest SZ - a 600-series model - goes for at least two hours longer than the Air. And my TZ's make the Air seem even more like a bad joke in terms of battery life, as well as connectivity.

Perhaps you never discovered how to enable the IGP (big switch on the front panel)? In which case I suppose the Mac really was the best solution for you...

[PowerFullMac]

Actually, as comouters get more powerful, the software gets more complex and needs more resources to run, so if you get a low-end computer you will need to buy another one after one or two years if you want to update to the latest OS.

Of course, if you dont care about updates, get the MBA.

I, personally, couldnt justify spending so much money on a computer with such low spec, no matter how thin or light it is.

In fact, here is another good point, if you want a computer for basic computing thats easy to carry around, why not get a £200 Eee PC with that Linux thingy on it??? Not as thin but smaller and almost as light, and much cheaper!

[dogsbody]

Tell ya what, it all boils down to this:

If you want style/thinness over functionality, and you have loads of money to burn, buy the Air. If, however, you want something that does more than just e-mail and internet without beach-balling, spend £100 more and get a MacBook Pro.

Don't hate the player, hate the game ;)

[cube]

Form over function, as usual.

- No gigabit ethernet
- No FireWire
- No built-in optical drive
- Only one (and bad) USB port
- No card reader
- No ExpressCard slot

Samsung X360 is way better hardware.

[Schtumple]

Form over function, as usual.

- No gigabit ethernet
- No FireWire
- No built-in optical drive
- Only one (and bad) USB port
- No card reader
- No ExpressCard slot

Samsung X360 is way better hardware.

I agree, but not so much on the card reader, ethernet port and optical drive part, those aren't really needed if you travel alot.

[PowerFullMac]

I agree, but not so much on the card reader, ethernet port and optical drive part, those aren't really needed if you travel alot.

Oh yeah, I cant believe I forgot about the MacBook Air not even having a optical drive!

Now, that IS ridiculous!

[cube]

I agree, but not so much on the card reader, ethernet port and optical drive part, those aren't really needed if you travel alot.

Precisely if you travel, you need the card reader for loading the photos from your camera if this cannot be done by hooking it up (like my main one).

Gigabit ethernet is needed for network backup.

[deltaiscain]

Because some people that hate them are idiots, and GHz newbies. If they see something with less than 2-3GHz, they think it can not even surf the web normally, because it has less than 2GHz. totally insane. Plus they do not know the difference between different cpu's, like core duo, the intel core xeon processor, etc. for example a 2.4GHz xeon processor is way more powerful than a 3GHz core duo processor.

[glennm0270]

Form over function, as usual.

- No gigabit ethernet
- No FireWire
- No built-in optical drive
- Only one (and bad) USB port
- No card reader
- No ExpressCard slot

Samsung X360 is way better hardware.

Consider that there are some people who need none of the things in this list and are able to do their work without them quite nicely. For over 4 years I led the development of a large software application (hundreds of thousands of lines of C++) that performs at enterprise levels (hundreds of millions of txns per hour) on a Windows laptop with lower specs than the 1.8GHz MBA (and much worse battery life). I had no difficulties whatsoever, never missed any of the items in the list above. For me, the MBA would be a performance upgrade in every respect. It's not relevant that there are other, more powerful computers out there...sure there are...but I don't need them.

Now, within that group of people, there are people who have enough disposable assets that the price of the MBA is not a significant purchase. From personal experience, I know that ticks some people off. I wish that wasn't true, and I don't think that having extra cash puts any of those people into any kind of "oooh we're special" category...but I don't think it deserves other people's disdain.

Finally, within that group of people, there are those that would much rather have OSX than Windows...thereby totally disqualifying any of the "I'd rather have a Samsung/Sony/Dell/ASUS" considerations. In that sense, they can't match the MBA specs...after all, software is a part of the laptop as much as hardware is. And, some of those people just like how the MBA looks (same way they like how a Tesla roadster or a Merc or a Lexus looks).

For that group of people, the MBA could be a nice fit. You might call those a "niche market" :)

Now, to the question posed by the OP: Why do people who aren't in that niche hate the MBA? For some people, it's just that they can't identify with anyone who doesn't want the absolute most power for the least money they can spend, regardless of whether they need the power, and regardless of how the cheaper laptop works (e.g. is it heavier, does it run Windows vs. OSX, etc). That doesn't make those "non-niche" people bad--it just means that they don't understand the other person's point of view.

For others, it's a matter of not agreeing with the idea of buying something because it looks nice. I'm not talking about buying something *just* because it looks nice. I mean, it has to meet my functional requirements first, but within that constraint, I'd like to buy something that I think looks nice. For some of those people, they think that's the same thing as buying it *just* because it looks nice, and therefore they look at the "niche" person with contempt. Again, that doesn't make the "non-niche" person bad, it just means that they think that a person that values form may not always make sure there's sufficient function (in the purchaser's eyes) to go with it. Sadly, the real world does give them plenty of evidence to believe that's true!

And, finally...to be honest, it just makes some people unhappy that there are things that other people can afford that they can't. That's an unfortunate spot to be in, and it's going to be a source of unhappiness for those people for a lot of things, not just the MBA. There are plenty of people who can afford things I can't, and there are people who can't afford things that I can. If you measure your happiness against those standards, you can't ever win.

Lots of philosophical BS here, but the main thing it boils down to is that there are people who think you're stupid if you don't think the same way they do.

[gooddeal]

The MBA sucks and all it does is shows how Apple can sell you anything for a stupidly high price even though they put thinness wayyy over functuality, something Apple loves doing these days.

Why do I say this? Look at the specs for the entry-level MacBook: 2.1GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 1GB RAM, 120GB HD for £700. Now, look at the entry-level MacBook Air specs: 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM (which you can get on the MacBook for a extra £30), 80GB HD... For £1,200!

Now, which do you think is better value?

Well, I totally understand by reading your signature. It seems that you're one of those people who don't care if you eat a 99 cents hamburger or a $20 steak...they're all beef, so, there's no reason they need to spend extra money.

[PowerFullMac]

Well, I totally understand by reading your signature. It seems that you're one of those people who don't care if you eat a 99 cents hamburger or a $20 steak...they're all beef, so, there's no reason they need to spend extra money.

No, not at all... Well, maybe a bit.

But would you spend $20 on a 99c hamburger?

[gooddeal]

No, not at all... Well, maybe a bit.

But would you spend $20 on a 99c hamburger?

Nope...but that's your perception. Steak <> Hamburger as MBA <> MB.

It's difficult to make people to believe in something that they don't believe. There're people who rather buy an Acura TSX than a loaded Accord V6 for about the same price. You get less power with TSX but you get a better refinement inside the car. Another good example is a Lexus ES v. a loaded Camry.

If you have no problem carrying an extra 2lbs and you don't need those extras on the Air (aluminum case, illuminate keyboard, backlit screen), a regular MB should be good for you.

[PowerFullMac]

Nope...but that's your perception. Steak <> Hamburger as MBA <> MB.

It's difficult to make people to believe in something that they don't believe. There're people who rather buy an Acura TSX than a loaded Accord V6 for about the same price. You get less power with TSX but you get a better refinement inside the car. Another good example is a Lexus ES v. a loaded Camry.

It all comes down to buying a computer with the same power as a £200 Eee PC for over £1k... If you have money to burn, fine, it will work very well impressing your friends for a few days.

[mhnajjar]

The only thing I hate about the MBA is the core shutdown. If it did not suffer from that, then I would be more than happy. Oh, did I mention heat!

Apple should manage a better heat management system than the implemented one.

MBA 2G is hopefully going to solve these issues.


MBA = look - advertised performance (I am not asking more than what is supposed to handle)

MBA = no youtube videos unless you are willing to get burned and suffer heart attack from the slowness of the machine!

[Digital Skunk]

No, not at all... Well, maybe a bit.

But would you spend $20 on a 99c hamburger?

WOW!

That's the best way I have ever heard it, and the only way to turn that meaningless comment around. Good job PFM! :D And I do agree, especially about the iPhone 3G.

The Air is definitely like spending $20 on a steak made from hamburger meat, except some french chef made it with his bare hands, so now it's worth something.

[deltaiscain]

Oh yeah, I cant believe I forgot about the MacBook Air not even having a optical drive!

Now, that IS ridiculous!

yes i really need a cd drive, so i can play bf 2142 on it. wow. oh, wait, the macbook air can't handle it. so why do i need a cd drive? plus the mba is meant as a secondary computer, not primary. so if you need to access a cd on it, you can use the remote cd drive sharing option. And unlike you, seemingly, i almost never use my cd drive. i think i used it 3-5 times, so i wouldn't miss it at all.

[chameleon81]

Because while they enjoy their products, they can't understand why someone would want a computer with lower specs and a higher price. I love my MBA and wouldn't trade it for anything else in the apple lineup. It does exactly what I need in a size and portability factor that I couldn't do without.



So you didn' t have any computers before u bought your MBA? Or u had one and were always complaining?

[pol0001]

I think the MBA is more than well equipped for the average user as long as you're not a gamer. What is keeping me from buying one is the lack of sufficient HD space. I upgrade my MacBook to 250 GB and have only 70 GB free.

[PowerFullMac]

I think the MBA is more than well equipped for the average user as long as you're not a gamer. What is keeping me from buying one is the lack of sufficient HD space. I upgrade my MacBook to 250 GB and have only 70 GB free.

Its amazing how quick HDs fill, aint it? I got a 120GB HD and started with nothing transferred but a few songs, and a few months later I only have 30GB left!

[sushi]

Its amazing how quick HDs fill, aint it? I got a 120GB HD and started with nothing transferred but a few songs, and a few months later I only have 30GB left!
I have a 500GB that will soon be filled up. :eek:

[Chappers]

Oh yeah, I cant believe I forgot about the MacBook Air not even having a optical drive!

Now, that IS ridiculous!

I used to use an optical drive all the time - now I rarely use it apart from the odd occasion that I played a DVD for my son whilst we awaited a DVD player for the TV. I've burnt two DVD's and will edit some movies of my son and put those on a DVD at some point, but thats it so far in 6 months of owning this MB.

Flash memory is cheap and convenient and so are external drives. I wouldn't miss not carrying around an optical drive.

Optical drives don't carry quite the importance they did.

Welcome back mosx - what happened?

[sushi]

I'm one of those people ^^
One nice thing about the PowerBook G4 12 inch is that it is a full featured laptop with optical drive.

I got my Dad one and he loves it. It has worked well over the years.

[neilhart]

I am frequently amused at how much emotion is expressed over the MBA. I own one but then I also own numerous computers including 17" MBP. Apple OSX is in my opinion is a pleasure to live with and it runs best on Apple hardware (as compared to hackentoshes).

Emotion over the retail cost of Apple products is also amusing. Why not sell products at what the market will bear? I am also amazed at how many people will pay for extend warranty support (again why not sell it if people are willing to purchase it?).

The never ending cry for more performance creates a churn in used Apple hardware that is usually in near perfect condition at fractions of the original cost. Set back and enjoy.

The shine goes off these products so quickly for so many it is amusing (the oringinal iphone for example). I love Apple and the excitement and distress in the market that it causes.

Neil

[Abstract]

Computers continue to get faster and Faster and FASTER, but for many people, their computing needs haven't increased over time. Rather than buying a faster machine every 2 years, what's wrong with buying something lighter, or sleeker, if your needs haven't increased? :confused:

Answer: Nothing. ;)
Actually, as comouters get more powerful, the software gets more complex and needs more resources to run, so if you get a low-end computer you will need to buy another one after one or two years if you want to update to the latest OS.

I think you're thinking about this the wrong way. I asked what was wrong with someone who bought their next computer system (say in Sept, 2010) because it's lighter and sleeker, if his/her computing needs don't change. Of course, even if software becomes more complex over those 2 years (like you said), any new computer you buy in 2010 will naturally keep pace with OS updates. All computers in 2010 will be faster than nearly ALL computers today, so whether you need a faster computer or not, your next system will likely be faster. If what you do on a computer hasn't become more complex, and you don't want a smaller screen or keyboard, then you may as well give a greater consideration to thickness and weight rather than CPU power, as your new system will be faster regardless of which you choose.


Form over function, as usual.

- No gigabit ethernet
- No FireWire
- No built-in optical drive
- Only one (and bad) USB port
- No card reader
- No ExpressCard slot

Samsung X360 is way better hardware.

Go outside and ask random people that you meet if they need all that stuff. Most people will say "No", and these are the people who would be fulfilled by an MBA.

Also, the MBA is actually cheaper than the Lenovo and Sony ultra-thin portables, and is faster than the X300. If the MBA doesn't lack any of the ports you need from the Sony and Lenovo, you may as well get the cheaper MBA. Why would someone care that the Sony has 3 USB ports if he/she only uses one his/her MacBook?

You may be thinking that I'm a particularly simple computer user with very basic needs. No. I run simulations which simulate photon transport through "materials" (i.e. anything that exists on Earth, and anything which doesn't even exist (yet), and yet is something I can describe) because sometimes it's difficult to physically do in real life. The simulations are processed on a small cluster of 40-something multi-core Intel CPUs hooked up together. A job take around 10 days, and I need months of processing to get enough data.

Despite my heavy needs, the MBA would be adequate as none of that processing could ever be done on a laptop or desktop!! On ANY laptop with a good sized screen and keyboard, I can write LaTeX documents, check email, browse the net, and draw schematic diagrams for journal papers. Would be great if it was lightweight and looked great. There aren't many of these types of laptops for less money than an MBA. ;)

WOW!

That's the best way I have ever heard it, and the only way to turn that meaningless comment around. Good job PFM! :D

It's cute, and kind of funny.....except that the analogy didn't make any sense. ;)

[11800506]

I'd say that the main reasons why the MBA is so comparatively expensive for its lack of hardware is because the expensive for engineering it to be so thin is built into the cost. Not everyone needs a full-featured laptop when traveling and for those people a thin and light computer is extremely valuable because it's so easy to travel with.

[PowerFullMac]

Go outside and ask random people that you meet if they need all that stuff. Most people will say "No", and these are the people who would be fulfilled by an MBA.

That may well be true, but also ask people if they want to buy the equivalent of a £200 webbook for over £1k, and see what they say.

It's cute, and kind of funny.....except that the analogy didn't make any sense. ;)

Yes it does, check what I wrote above in this post... The MBA is a £200 computer for over £1k... A 99c hamburger for $20! :p

[Scott6666]

Its nice to look at and crappy to use, core shutdowns, fans all the time Heat issues, very beautiful package, BUT not useful.

Sold mine a month after release and went back to a Macbook ;)

My issues as well. I wanted to like it.

[Abstract]

But that assumes the MBA and netbook are the same, and you're just paying more for the MBA. They're not the same at all. The netbooks are pretty much only meant for using the internet for short periods of time.

If you want lightweight AND a good-sized screen at normal resolution, using a normal-sized keyboard, a Dell Mini 9 isn't going to cut it.

I just think that most of the things you've said are completely unfounded, as if you decided to just make stuff up like a 14 year old who doesn't care if he's completely wrong, as long as it sounds good coming out of the mouth.

But if you want to tell us, again, that the MBA is only as good as a netbook, go ahead. But for those people who know that:

-Intel Core 2 Duo ≠ Atom (or VIA)
-a comfy 13.3" laptop with 1280 x 800 resolution ≠ a cramped 9" screen with 1000 x 600 resolution.
-a good, full sized keyboard ≠ a miniscule keyboard with compromised key positioning (function keys on the middle row....WTF?)


....then good luck. And I'd have some idea, since I'm actually interested in the Dell Mini 9, a netbook which I just cut up.

[PowerFullMac]

Netbooks work great for internet and basic office apps on the move, which is what the Air is for.

Yes, the Air has a bigger screen and keyboard, but is that worth £1,000 more?

[11800506]

Netbooks work great for internet and basic office apps on the move, which is what the Air is for.

Yes, the Air has a bigger screen and keyboard, but is that worth £1,000 more?

Do those netbooks have Core 2 Duo processors, and are the .76 inches thin? Are they made of aluminum and have backlit keyboards? Netbooks and the MBA are NOT the same at all. Netbooks aren't as sturdy and the MBA can do more than what it is given credit for. The MBA is great for travelers who need something light and have space restraints. Something such as the Dell Mini9 is not very thin at all.

[glennm0270]

Netbooks work great for internet and basic office apps on the move, which is what the Air is for.

Yes, the Air has a bigger screen and keyboard, but is that worth £1,000 more?

And it runs OSX, which the others don't.

"Worth" is always a relative term, not an absolute. A lifejacket would be worth $0 to a multimillionaire stranded in the desert...but he might pay $1M for a glass of water. A glass of water would be worth $0 to a man drowning in the middle of Lake Michigan...but he would likely pay pretty much everything he owned for a lifejacket. :)

So, is the difference "worth" it? Obviously, to some people. Obviously not, to you.

On the other hand, the systems you have referenced would be worth absolutely nothing to me...but that doesn't mean you're an idiot for wanting to have them. :D

[PowerFullMac]

Do those netbooks have Core 2 Duo processors, and are the .76 inches thin? Are they made of aluminum and have backlit keyboards? Netbooks and the MBA are NOT the same at all.

Nope, they have Atoms, but for what its made for, it will work fine.

Its not as thin, but its smaller... It depends what one you buy for the backlit keyboards... And it dosent really matter if its made aluminum or anything else, it still has a case and it covers the circuits, therefore it does what its made for.

[Mitch1984]

I think it's a nice Laptop, but you can get a more powerful MacBook Pro for less money.

[Heavenkittykat]

It's a little bizarre. Even my oldest SZ - a 600-series model - goes for at least two hours longer than the Air. And my TZ's make the Air seem even more like a bad joke in terms of battery life, as well as connectivity.

Perhaps you never discovered how to enable the IGP (big switch on the front panel)? In which case I suppose the Mac really was the best solution for you...

I don't know what you are trying to say by your last sentence. The SZ model that I had was SONY VAIO SZ 320 P/B. It is not a premium version of the SZ and I bought it last December 2006. Here is the link for the tech specshttp://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/model-documents.pl?mdl=VGNSZ320PB. When I bought this computer I clearly remember that advertised battery life for it was 3 hours only. In which case it usually last for 2.5 with normal usage.

[Heavenkittykat]

Consider that there are some people who need none of the things in this list and are able to do their work without them quite nicely. For over 4 years I led the development of a large software application (hundreds of thousands of lines of C++) that performs at enterprise levels (hundreds of millions of txns per hour) on a Windows laptop with lower specs than the 1.8GHz MBA (and much worse battery life). I had no difficulties whatsoever, never missed any of the items in the list above. For me, the MBA would be a performance upgrade in every respect. It's not relevant that there are other, more powerful computers out there...sure there are...but I don't need them.

Now, within that group of people, there are people who have enough disposable assets that the price of the MBA is not a significant purchase. From personal experience, I know that ticks some people off. I wish that wasn't true, and I don't think that having extra cash puts any of those people into any kind of "oooh we're special" category...but I don't think it deserves other people's disdain.

Finally, within that group of people, there are those that would much rather have OSX than Windows...thereby totally disqualifying any of the "I'd rather have a Samsung/Sony/Dell/ASUS" considerations. In that sense, they can't match the MBA specs...after all, software is a part of the laptop as much as hardware is. And, some of those people just like how the MBA looks (same way they like how a Tesla roadster or a Merc or a Lexus looks).

For that group of people, the MBA could be a nice fit. You might call those a "niche market" :)

Now, to the question posed by the OP: Why do people who aren't in that niche hate the MBA? For some people, it's just that they can't identify with anyone who doesn't want the absolute most power for the least money they can spend, regardless of whether they need the power, and regardless of how the cheaper laptop works (e.g. is it heavier, does it run Windows vs. OSX, etc). That doesn't make those "non-niche" people bad--it just means that they don't understand the other person's point of view.

For others, it's a matter of not agreeing with the idea of buying something because it looks nice. I'm not talking about buying something *just* because it looks nice. I mean, it has to meet my functional requirements first, but within that constraint, I'd like to buy something that I think looks nice. For some of those people, they think that's the same thing as buying it *just* because it looks nice, and therefore they look at the "niche" person with contempt. Again, that doesn't make the "non-niche" person bad, it just means that they think that a person that values form may not always make sure there's sufficient function (in the purchaser's eyes) to go with it. Sadly, the real world does give them plenty of evidence to believe that's true!

And, finally...to be honest, it just makes some people unhappy that there are things that other people can afford that they can't. That's an unfortunate spot to be in, and it's going to be a source of unhappiness for those people for a lot of things, not just the MBA. There are plenty of people who can afford things I can't, and there are people who can't afford things that I can. If you measure your happiness against those standards, you can't ever win.

Lots of philosophical BS here, but the main thing it boils down to is that there are people who think you're stupid if you don't think the same way they do.


I vote this for the best answer! You hit the mark and you completely answered my question with perfect sense. Thank you

[southcounty949]

I agree w/ the last few posts. Most people don't get why we would pay more for less specs. I really don't care. It's my money and I wanted a thin laptop that I could easily bring everywhere. It suits everything I need it for. My friend recently told me... "How the heck do you get by without having a CD drive"... I replied..."What's a CD?"...lol. I honestly have only had to use my roommate's computer once, and it was to install adobe acrobat. I use MP3's for music, and I use a jump drive to store files that I'd need for presentations. It suits my needs perfectly. BTW, this is my ONLY computer. I use this as my main computer.

[Heavenkittykat]

I agree w/ the last few posts. Most people don't get why we would pay more for less specs. I really don't care. It's my money and I wanted a thin laptop that I could easily bring everywhere. It suits everything I need it for. My friend recently told me... "How the heck do you get by without having a CD drive"... I replied..."What's a CD?"...lol. I honestly have only had to use my roommate's computer once, and it was to install adobe acrobat. I use MP3's for music, and I use a jump drive to store files that I'd need for presentations. It suits my needs perfectly. BTW, this is my ONLY computer. I use this as my main computer.

We have basically the same usage. I bought a superdrive with my MBA when it was on sale but I haven't used it yet except to install Microsoft Office. I always wanted an apple thin portable laptop. I've been itching to switch to Mac a long time ago but they don't have an ultraportable at that time. So, I soon as I found out about MBA, I bought as soon as I can.

[gooddeal]

We have basically the same usage. I bought a superdrive with my MBA when it was on sale but I haven't used it yet except to install Microsoft Office.

I'm glad that I don't buy the supertdrive because I've never had a need to use it for the last 3 months.

[Heavenkittykat]

I'm glad that I don't buy the supertdrive because I've never had a need to use it for the last 3 months.

yeah good for you. And if you need to install anything, there is that remote disc feature you can always use.

[sushi]

there is that remote disc feature you can always use.
That is a nice feature for sure.

[gooddeal]

yeah good for you. And if you need to install anything, there is that remote disc feature you can always use.

That's what I used when I "clean" installed OSX and Office.

[CyberBob859]

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-10040316-1.html?tag=TOCmoreStories.0

Most telling line is:

MacBook Air could see a minor refresh and potential price cut to increase its value proposition as build plans have slowed from earlier robust levels as customers have opted for MacBook or MacBook Pro instead.

[sushi]

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-10040316-1.html?tag=TOCmoreStories.0

Most telling line is:

MacBook Air could see a minor refresh and potential price cut to increase its value proposition as build plans have slowed from earlier robust levels as customers have opted for MacBook or MacBook Pro instead.
Most interesting.

Looks like Apple is trying to adapt to the market these days.

[gotzero]

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-10040316-1.html?tag=TOCmoreStories.0

Most telling line is:

MacBook Air could see a minor refresh and potential price cut to increase its value proposition as build plans have slowed from earlier robust levels as customers have opted for MacBook or MacBook Pro instead.

Based on the price I just picked up an air for, I would say this is being priced in the market... I would have never gotten an MBA at anywhere near list or refurb price with netbooks around.

I am going to become an unlikely user of the platform. I am spending a ton of time walking around lately, and do not need the power of my MBP during the day. I am looking forward to the smaller/lighter platform, although a bit saddened that this will likely mean no new EEE for the me. The 1000h seemed to be perfect, and now $450, a pricepoint the air will never compete with.

[Roller]

Most interesting.

Looks like Apple is trying to adapt to the market these days.

I think that it would be impossible for them to do otherwise and maintain the Air as a viable product. There are HDD, SSD, and processor options that weren't available when the Air was introduced, nor were there competing products like the Envy. One thing I think Apple will leave untouched for now is the external design, so I'm not expecting any additional ports.

Still, for people like me who've been waiting for an updated Air with more storage, a less trouble-prone processor, and maybe more RAM, this could be enough, though it'll be interesting to see how it's differentiated from the revised MacBook.

[Sesshi]

I don't know what you are trying to say by your last sentence. The SZ model that I had was SONY VAIO SZ 320 P/B. It is not a premium version of the SZ and I bought it last December 2006. Here is the link for the tech specshttp://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/model-documents.pl?mdl=VGNSZ320PB. When I bought this computer I clearly remember that advertised battery life for it was 3 hours only. In which case it usually last for 2.5 with normal usage.

Yes - I'm not surprised. Which is why I posted in the way I did about the blinkered Born-Again-Switchers predictably comparing obsolete machines against a brand new Apple :rolleyes:

That sounds somewhat hostile, but would you compare a 10 year old sports sedan and a new smaller softtop on an equal footing? No, and it's dumb to do so, even if you you realised you wanted a softtop all along.

[The Awesome]

One nice thing about the PowerBook G4 12 inch is that it is a full featured laptop with optical drive.

I got my Dad one and he loves it. It has worked well over the years.

One compound word says it all: Full-featured :)

With Apple's increasing market share, they can satisfy more Apple users by releasing, without removing the Mac Mini and MBA, an expandable Cube and a true replacement for the PB G4 12". I know Steve wants to avoid the Centris/Performa/Quadra mess-up Apple had back then but I think they can pull it off now that they have a better naming scheme and better niche management (e.g. the MacBook Air neither cannibalizing the MB nor the MBP).

For the MBA haters:

I have absolutely no beef against the MBA. I think its reasonably priced for something so thin and elegant. Most people wouldn't need FireWire, an extra USB port nor an optical drive (my Presario's combo drive failed 3 weeks ago and I haven't given any thought about replacing it... I just network my laptop to my brother's cool 24x DVD-RAM drive when I do need to use an Optical Drive... which is rarely).

Hating the MBA for being more expensive and having less power/ports than the MB is out of line. Steve/Apple never said it was better than the MB nor did it say that it was more useful. It SERVES A useful NICHE.

And for the GHz newbs out there: two 1.6 cores with a X3100 with 2GB of RAM are enough for most things... my 1.6 Celeron, GMA 950, 1.5GB Hackintosh can run Tiger and Vista pretty well.

Be open-minded 'cause not every body's a speed freak and some people do prefer form over function.

But yes, you can hate the MBA for the posers out there that just buy the MBA coz it makes them popular/noticeable. :D

[Sesshi]

But yes, you can hate the MBA for the posers out there that just buy the MBA coz it makes them popular/noticeable. :D

Yup. It's the sole reason it hangs around these days. It may be crap, but it does get looks.

[-hh]

The MBA is a wonderful ultra slim, wireless, secondary machine, and better built than any Apple machine next to the Mac Pro and iMac. Anyone that can't see that is very shortsighted.

Because it is a niche product. Those that don't fit into that niche do not understand the point of it....

Exactly right on both.

I think it's a nice Laptop, but you can get a more powerful MacBook Pro for less money.

Great, but is it as light & small?

Nope. That's the trade-off.


I agree w/ the last few posts. Most people don't get why we would pay more for less specs....

What they're missing is that there are different specs, and they're simply not bothering to acknowledge the ones that they don't care about.

The bottom line is that if they're willing to haul 3-4 extra pounds in order to get more "Power" or to save $500, they're free to do so. But that doesn't give them the right to dicate what my personal priorities have to be.

And of course since this is an obvious nod to the MBA, there's going to be readers who think that I'm out of touch or stupid.

Thanks, but FYI: my perspective here comes from the fact that I've accumulated well over a half million real air miles. I've learned to value techniques to travel "Fast and Light", which is facilitated by being willing to carry less weight. Sometimes that costs money. Sometimes it costs features. There is no free lunch.

If you want to carry something bigger/heavier, that's fine by me...just so long as you don't ask me to carry it for you and don't block my way ... because I'll be able to make that tight connection, with all my baggage. What kind of value do you wish to put on that?



-hh

[Bobjob186]

After reading all the posts in the thread it seems to me that a lot of the posters have not used a macbook air more than just at the apple store. If they had, they wouldn't be writing this garbage. So for the OP I'll answer your question with a quote from George Bernard Shaw.

"Hatred is the coward's revenge for being intimidated"

[sushi]

One compound word says it all: Full-featured :)
Simply put.

The MBA is good and fills a need for a small market area.

[akm3]

The MBA sucks and all it does is shows how Apple can sell you anything for a stupidly high price even though they put thinness wayyy over functuality, something Apple loves doing these days.

Why do I say this? Look at the specs for the entry-level MacBook: 2.1GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 1GB RAM, 120GB HD for £700. Now, look at the entry-level MacBook Air specs: 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM (which you can get on the MacBook for a extra £30), 80GB HD... For £1,200!

Now, which do you think is better value?

Repeat after me:
"Features are not equal to benefits"
And "Value is not dictated solely by CPU Frequency, RAM and Hard drive space"

[ishopukisfake]

Some people don't like it because they see it as massively overpriced for something with limited functionality.

I can see it is for a specific market and I think with the next upgrade of processor speed and hard drive space it will become a really good product. Laptops with disk drives will eventually fade out I think, with apps, music videos all downloadable. 13.3 inches is a little too small though. A laptop with 15 inches, high resolution 1600 x 1200 roughly pixels and without disk-drive, thick and as light as air would be very cool.

[The Awesome]

Repeat after me:
"Features are not equal to benefits"
And "Value is not dictated solely by CPU Frequency, RAM and Hard drive space"

Very well put.

I've met people who bought a MacBook over a Dell M1330 just to get the keyboard they felt was better for them...

...then they wondered where the right-click went. :p

[SFStateStudent]

It meets my needs and this is my 2nd MBA...:eek:

[ishopukisfake]

I think the main reason for any ecessive hostility towards the MBA is jealousy from not being able to afford it is interesting to hear that mac store employees are being told to advise other options, this is because it's not a heavey workhorse computer, and many expect to use it for all of their
Multimedia processing and storage. It's designed primarily for mobility and to be as cutting edge in that department as possible.

[quasinormal]

After reading all the posts in the thread it seems to me that a lot of the posters have not used a macbook air more than just at the apple store. If they had, they wouldn't be writing this garbage. So for the OP I'll answer your question with a quote from George Bernard Shaw.

"Hatred is the coward's revenge for being intimidated"

And George Walker Bush said;

"See, we love—we love freedom. That's what they didn't understand. They hate things; we love things. They act out of hatred; we don't seek revenge, we seek justice out of love."

[Roller]

I think the main reason for any ecessive hostility towards the MBA is jealousy from not being able to afford it is interesting to hear that mac store employees are being told to advise other options, this is because it's not a heavey workhorse computer, and many expect to use it for all of their
Multimedia processing and storage. It's designed primarily for mobility and to be as cutting edge in that department as possible.

The Air may have been cutting edge (in addition to its slicing capabilities, that is) when it came out, but that's no longer true, as there are a number of capable, lightweight alternatives on the Windows side that sport larger drives, more ports, and so on.

Not that this lessens the value of the MBA for current owners: if the Air is meeting their needs, it'll continue to do so until their requirements change.

But for someone like me who wants a ~3 pound Mac OS laptop and isn't willing to live with the Air's limitations (primarily storage), waiting makes sense. I'm counting on Apple updating the MBA between October and MW Expo, but if that doesn't happen, I'll look at the MB or MB Pro.

[jdos2]

Mine just has too many problems for me to use as I'd like. It's not a good desktop for me. Not 'hating' it, but it's not useful when it goes into the heat-lockup-mode during presentations (that was the bad one- embarrass me in front of co-workers).
And then Apple geniuses saying things are as they are supposed to be.


Truthfully, I bought it because the case is immensely strong compared to the MacBook Pro I have (which bows out in front from simply being used so much), and for the the MBA is awesome. Just too bad it can't churn for a bit on Entourage/Terminal/Microsoft Communicator/Excel/Word/PPT before throttling so badly I can't use it.
Perhaps someday Apple will make one in that form factor that does what I need it to do.

I have found someone to buy mine, though, who, after using it for a weekend, is happy with it.

So... "Horses for Courses," or the "Different Strokes" argument.

[MACENZ]

Hate is a very divisive word. It is not about hate- it is about preferences and needs.

Some of us were disappointed because of our expectations. I personally wanted;
- Something smaller- More like the eee pc than a Macbook.
- Built in 3G HSDPA support.
- Firewire port [s]
-a price more like a eee pc than MBP.
- a bigger hard drive.

To me the Air seemed more like an enticement to PC users, than a Mac aimed at committed Mac users. Because it is a portable it will be seen by others and is an obvious status symbol to the typical fashion victim.

That said, I will be buying one when it gets native 3G support, just like I'll be buying a iPhone when having one doesn't mean being held to ransom by the telecommunications companies and Apple.

I totally agree with this because the way Apple moves in the market I will not be surprised if Apple comes out with a iPhone that has a 5.0mp camera and better tools and hardware etc.

That being said the Macbook Air is only geared toward one target market. That is why I will never own one. For a laptop that is not much thinner then the Macbook and has just enough power to run is sad.

If I had all the money in the world I would buy one just to drop it from my condo balcony and watch it explode!:p

[Digital Skunk]

The Air may have been cutting edge (in addition to its slicing capabilities, that is) when it came out, but that's no longer true, as there are a number of capable, lightweight alternatives on the Windows side that sport larger drives, more ports, and so on.

It was that way since the beginning. The Sony TZ was around 2 pounds and it still had an optical drive in it and two USB ports and even a built in broadband card.

Now Sony offers it with an external optical drive and BOTH a SSD and 1.8" HDD. Something I may do with my 17" since I don't burn much.

It's by far the best laptop I have seen on the market for portability and functionality. And after using it for a while it's still quite easy to type on at 11.1"

The Air is still a great option, and in typical Apple fashion it is behind the curve, (buy refurbished for $1500) but still worth the price with a good deal.

The next iteration may just have the atom and a bigger hard drive along with NO bugs, but I doubt much on connectivity will change. Especially since it was really meant to be a wireless machine. Personally, they can take the USB port off and I'd be happy.

On another note, if you are deciding between the MBAir and the MB or MBPro then just grab one of the full featured lappies. If you hesitate, then the Air isn't for you. You have to go in knowing what the machine is all about ENTIRELY, and know that you want it.

[aleksandra.]

It was that way since the beginning. The Sony TZ was around 2 pounds and it still had an optical drive in it and two USB ports and even a built in broadband card.

Now Sony offers it with an external optical drive and BOTH a SSD and 1.8" HDD. Something I may do with my 17" since I don't burn much.

It's by far the best laptop I have seen on the market for portability and functionality. And after using it for a while it's still quite easy to type on at 11.1"

Please don't compare 11.1" to 13.3". There're many people out there who wouldn't be fine with as small a screen as you are happy with. My favorite thing about Air is that it has the best proportion of screen size to weight, as far as I know. For you definition of "ultra-portable" might be small size and low weight. For some people it's just size. For me it's weight that makes it. Air is barely bigger than A4 format.

If we take a look at 13.3" computers with similar weight, there're a few conclusions:
1. Most of them have removable optical drive - meaning: they're heavier when you put it in, but they're always advertised with the lowest weight for obvious reasons, so it's practically the same as if they given you an external drive (just substract $99 from the price of the laptop and you can compare to the Air);
2. Most of them don't have better battery life - again, usually the values given show the maximum time you can get with additional battery, but without the weight of this battery (consider the basic option and the time it gives you, then compare to the Air);
3. When you choose options making them similar to the Air (LED, SSD, equivalent CPU and RAM), substract $99 if the CD/DVD drive is attached and go on with basic battery, you find out that most of them are also more expensive.


The Air is still a great option, and in typical Apple fashion it is behind the curve, (buy refurbished for $1500) but still worth the price with a good deal.

The next iteration may just have the atom and a bigger hard drive along with NO bugs, but I doubt much on connectivity will change. Especially since it was really meant to be a wireless machine. Personally, they can take the USB port off and I'd be happy.


Well, I hope there'll be a good CPU there and more SSD options ;).

[gooddeal]

Please don't compare 11.1" to 13.3". There're many people out there who wouldn't be fine with as small a screen as you are happy with.
Yeah, I used to use this T(X) back in 2004. It was like $2300 during that time. The screen is a bit too small. It's o.k about 50% of the time.

People just don't understand how difficult it's to make the laptop as thin as the Air. If you think that a 1"+ thick laptop look as nice as the Air, that's good for you.

It's easy and cheap to make a 13.3" laptop around 5 lbs and up. That's why Sony has the Z for around 3.5lbs but for a lot more money than the typical 5-6lbs lappy.

[Digital Skunk]

.....

Oh believe me, I'd rather use the 13.3 inch LED of the Air, but when I said: "It's by far the best laptop I have seen on the market for portability and functionality."

I meant both of the things that computer makers have to make a compromise on. The TZ is as good as it gets when it comes to having a full featured laptop that is also small.

I'd rather not have all the bells and whistles of the TZ to lower weight and price, because fully loaded it's $3500 or so. It's still around 3 lbs. and still has a proven 5 hours of battery life with standard battery though. With the heavier extended battery, it doubles it... but the price gets close to that of a loaded Mac Pro.

Nothing really compares to it, even Air admirers should take a step back and think about how the machine was made and engineered to incorporate all of those features and still be 3 lbs. The only downside to it is it's processor running at 1.2GHz.

I think Apple did it right by making the Air 13.3" and giving it a full sized . backlit keyboard. I'd like it if it was a pound lighter, but meh. There's really nothing I'd change with the Air. I wouldn't even make the HDD bigger IMHO. Maybe the option of having a removable battery is all I'd want.

[aleksandra.]

Oh believe me, I'd rather use the 13.3 inch LED of the Air, but when I said: "It's by far the best laptop I have seen on the market for portability and functionality."


I'm sorry, but what I meant is that such a small screen defeats any functionality the laptop might otherwise have had, at least for me.

Nothing really compares to it, even Air admirers should take a step back and think about how the machine was made and engineered to incorporate all of those features and still be 3 lbs. The only downside to it is it's processor running at 1.2GHz.

I agree it's well done, though I'm by far more impressed by VGN-Z11 (13.3" and 1.5kg) - unfortunately it's not Sony's idea of portability, so there's little hope of it shedding some weight by making the optical drive external. Though Intel's new SSD would likely work with it... it'd be too expensive, however.

[Sesshi]

Nothing really compares to it, even Air admirers should take a step back and think about how the machine was made and engineered to incorporate all of those features and still be 3 lbs. The only downside to it is it's processor running at 1.2GHz.

Not really a downside - since the processor actually works, unlike the Air. In fact, as Coolbook users know to get it to work as well as the TZ you have to ramp it down to practically the TZ's speeds in any case.

[xparaparafreakx]

Cause most people who frequent this forums only care about more power. Faster specs is always better.. even if they don't utilize the computer to it's full potential.

And these are the same people that talk of power but don't have a Mac Pro

I think a lot of Macbook users can't leave us Air users alone. Always got to bring up how their machine was only $950 and more powerfull then an Air.

Leave us alone or come over and watch my Mac Pro eat your Macbook for breakfast.

[Phrasikleia]

It seems as though laptop manufacturers are trying to find the magic combination of features/portability/price. You can have any two.

[puffnstuff]

There is not advantage to the macbook air. It's not that portable the damn thing is the size of a macbook. Not that light it weighs 3 pounds. So why pay $700 more for something that is just thin? The day the air came out I thought it was stupid for the air to be 13.3". Apple needs an ultraportable to have a well rounded line up.

[costabunny]

Well I love the air - does exactly what I want it to and not brimming with extras I dont want (like ports to catch dirt, spinny annoying optical drive etc)

It is far more portable than MB's that I have used and yes I like the looks too..

Stop knocking it - If you havent owned one, SHUT UP! lol

Its like Ford owners knocking Toyota - give up and be happy with what you have.

[aleksandra.]

There is not advantage to the macbook air. It's not that portable the damn thing is the size of a macbook. Not that light it weighs 3 pounds. So why pay $700 more for something that is just thin? The day the air came out I thought it was stupid for the air to be 13.3". Apple needs an ultraportable to have a well rounded line up.

I know I'm repeating myself, but portability isn't only about size. It's about weight as well. Are you so brainwashed by Apple's advertising of Air's thinness that you can't see it's almost a kilogram lighter than MacBook? It's Air's key feature - specs are worse than MacBook's, footprint's similar, weight is only 60% that of the MB. There're other differences like LED, backlit keyboard, SSD option, but I think it's only a matter of time until they make it to other notebooks.

[puffnstuff]

I know I'm repeating myself, but portability isn't only about size. It's about weight as well. Are you so brainwashed by Apple's advertising of Air's thinness that you can't see it's almost a kilogram lighter than MacBook? It's Air's key feature - specs are worse than MacBook's, footprint's similar, weight is only 60% that of the MB. There're other differences like LED, backlit keyboard, SSD option, but I think it's only a matter of time until they make it to other notebooks.

I don't know if you read my post but I noted the weight as well. Shaving off some of the size will also shave off some of the weight you know.

[Ardchoille]

I have nothing really new to add, except to say that the MBA is perfect for me.

I need a light laptop since I travel around a lot and it is easier to carry than my previous MB. I primarily do email, write reports, and browse. It functions as my full time computer. I have not found the lack of an optical drive any problem at all (it would be nice to have more than one USB, but I have a USB extension with four ports and no need to plug it in separately). Almost everywhere I am in meetings, I plug it in, so the battery life is unimportant to me. I like the keyboard and trackpad.

It does get a little warm watching Youtube, but I have never had it shut-down. It is possible that I am susceptible to vanity from the responses it gets in meetings from others, but that's Apple products period.

I want a full-size keyboard so the smaller offerings are of no interest to me (e,g, asus eee), and besides they do not run MacOS, so they are not an option for me. I write my reports in AppleWorks or iWork; never use MS products. I have no use for more power or a larger hard drive.

I have been using Apple computers since 1983 and this is the continuing evolution. I think most negative comments are from people who cannot believe that people want different things from a computer than they want. In my mind, it is the best computer from Apple since the //c, which still worked fine when I got rid of it a few years ago.

[bytodaystandrds]

Everyone loves the Air!

What I hate about it is the absolutely(for what it really is) unfair price.
Let's all expect a considerable drop in $...

...and maybe the "Air" suffix...
reminds me of all those kitschy sneakers...
... so close to that Michael Jordan badge...:D

[Phrasikleia]

Everyone loves the Air!

What I hate about it is the absolutely(for what it really is) unfair price.
Let's all expect a considerable drop in $...

...and maybe the "Air" suffix...
reminds me of all those kitschy sneakers...
... so close to that Michael Jordan badge...:D

It surely cost Apple a pretty penny to develop the MBA, so the early waves of customers are going to help them recoup costs by paying very high prices. The intrinsic value of the machine's components and casing might not be a lot, but that's only a fraction of Apple's total expenses on the project.

[*Sandy*]

I had one the minute they were released, but the fans are just plain a PITA, moved back to the MB, Nice to look at but the MBA is not for me.

[RichardF]

I would think it's because it doesn't fit their needs or rather what they perceive to be their needs.

The MBA is best laptop out there IMHO. It's a real laptop not a laptop meant to be a desktop replacement.

[lsvtecjohn3]

not me I love my MBA
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a383/lsvtecjohn3/ipoor.jpg

[Phrasikleia]

not me I love my MBA
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a383/lsvtecjohn3/ipoor.jpg

Cute, but someone needs a spellchecker. I count five errors, not including the missing capitalization of "apple". :eek:

[Abstract]

Yeah, and they accidentally put "i" before some of those words. Silly buggers.

[ntrigue]

Coming from a MBP that Geekbench'd at 3300 ...

... I am thoroughly pleased with my MBA at 2460.

Sure I see the spinning-beach-ball every once in a process but it doesn't disturb my productivity. I use Pixelmator instead of CS4 and have never had a slowdown.

[MooneyFlyer]

I've been considering an MBA since they came out. I'm a slightly different user profile than most people that have been posting. I travel ~110 work days a year and ~175,000 air miles. Currently for work I carry a Lenovo X41 which is a little over 3 lbs, 12.1", XP, and "average" battery life (with a new battery and everything turned down it's about 3.5-4 hrs). And, perhaps most importantly, it is rugged. My current laptop has traveled over 300,000 air miles and been beaten up. For those that don't travel much, in my experience, a few pounds in your bag makes quite a difference -- especially trudging around Asia on trains/etc for weeks at a time with luggage.

So, the MBA would seem to meet my needs. But, I've been put off by the comments and reviews that I've found on the net. For me the size and weight are fine as is the disk space (80GB+) and OS X (big improvement actually). The tricky parts are:
Connectivity: This matters!
- 1 USB is ok, I can survive with a mini-hub for the times where I'd like to charge my iPhone and use the in-room ethernet (wireless isn't always available). Does require me carrying a dongle and mini-hub though. (more stuff)
- mini-DVI: This is a problem because it means another dongle to carry for presentations. Most projectors only have a VGA input. Again, not a big deal but lose this and you are screwed.
Battery life:
- I've had a tough time getting an estimate for the battery life for my profile. This means processor on the lowest setting (if this is possible), screen turned down, no wireless, nothing in the ports, no movie playing, no iTunes, etc. (Yes, I'm the guy that uses email, docs, and presentations...). I'd really like this to be 5+ hours. The new Dell claims 19 hrs (!) for a 2.2 lb machine. That is a game changer -- though I suspect the box is disposable after a year. In any case, the best review I've seen for the MBA was approaching 5 hrs -- but haven't been able to confirm that.
- Also, the battery charge time would be a slight problem. Quite often I'm trying to get every bit of juice in the box before hopping on the next long flight or train ride. From what I've read it takes a long time to charge this battery. For people sitting at home and charging over night, no problem -- but try not having access to a plug for ~24 hrs and see how this works when you need a quick power up.

One other smallish problem for me is the port drop down box. Some big companies in Asia require you to secure most of your ports with security tape before going in to their facilities -- usually everything except for the monitor port. Certainly all USBs, cameras, etc. If you do not have these secured when you attempt to leave, you will not be taking your laptop with you -- no exceptions. (imagine the room with the giant magnet in it). It is harder to get out of these companies (like Samsung) than it is to get into most airports. I haven't figured out if their security tape will go over just the USB WITH NO CHANCE OF COMING OFF and without covering the mini-DVI allowing me to give a presentation on a projector.

So, yes, I'm willing to pay more money for a small laptop that is "under powered" -- but it fits my use model very well.

I'm eagerly waiting the MBA update but suspect I'll be disappointed. The rumored larger disk sounds nice as does the 60W power supply. But, if the processor speed goes up I suspect battery life won't... a 12" MB would probably be a great box for me if they would re-release it.

I'd be very interested in hearing from others use the MBA in this use model.

Thanks

[Cheffy Dave]

I have no Idea, the only thing I can think of is they have never had one in their hands. I am smitten, since i went to the Apple store and spent some time with one. I had no feelings one way or the other before I went, now, when the next version is released October 16, I'm in, especially with a 120 Gb HDD:D

[aleksandra.]

- I've had a tough time getting an estimate for the battery life for my profile. This means processor on the lowest setting (if this is possible), screen turned down, no wireless, nothing in the ports, no movie playing, no iTunes, etc. (Yes, I'm the guy that uses email, docs, and presentations...). I'd really like this to be 5+ hours. The new Dell claims 19 hrs (!) for a 2.2 lb machine. That is a game changer -- though I suspect the box is disposable after a year. In any case, the best review I've seen for the MBA was approaching 5 hrs -- but haven't been able to confirm that.

The new Dells claim up to 19 hrs battery life for a machine starting at 2.2 lb. Meaning you can buy additional battery to swap or attach (I'm not sure about this model), not super-capacity one.

Edit:
More precisely:

19 hour battery life resulted from testing a Dell Latitude E6400 configured with solid state drive, Mobile Intel® GMA 4500MHD graphics, 9-cell primary battery, and 12-cell slice battery. Battery life varies by configuration, operating conditions, and other factors.

http://www.dell.com/downloads/global/products/latit/en/latitude_landing_e6400_battery_life.pdf

[MooneyFlyer]

The new Dells claim up to 19 hrs battery life for a machine starting at 2.2 lb. Meaning you can buy additional battery to swap or attach (I'm not sure about this model), not super-capacity one.

Edit:
More precisely:



http://www.dell.com/downloads/global/products/latit/en/latitude_landing_e6400_battery_life.pdf

Thanks for clarifying -- very appropriate additions.

[RichardF]

I'd be very interested in hearing from others use the MBA in this use model.

Thanks


Hi there - I travel quite a bit too (about 17-20 flights/ year to Europe and South East Asia). Wholeheartedly agree about the importance of shaving-off weight when you are moving around.

Here are my thoughts on the topics you mentioned:

1) Yes, indeed, if you need to have several USB devices connected *at the same time* then you need a small USB-hub.
In my case, I just alternate when I do have several things to plug in but that's rare: a USB thumb drive, the USB cable to my camera and my iPhone. That's it. Not really an issue for me.

What do you need to connect to your laptop via USB currently?

2) Indeed, mini-DVI to VGA adaptor: have a couple in two different bags to lessen the likelihood you'll be without one when you need it.

3) I haven't tested the battery under the use you described: I do turn off BT when I don't use it, but I have WiFi on at all times. I will test it like you use it and report back. As it is I can get 3.5 hours easy with WiFi and about 5 apps running (I have SSD on my MBA).

4) You are correct, it does take some time I have noticed but note: charging takes more time on 220V (outside of the US) than on 110V it seems, which is odd. If anyone has any theory why, I'd love to read it.

If you find yourself away from a plug for a while, carry a battery with a 110V plug like not necessarily this one but this is an example (http://www.amazon.com/Black-Decker-CPI100B-Laptop-Cordless/dp/B000SZVMRW/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1222175145&sr=8-5). It's more weight but better than no juice at all when you need it. I haven't use one of these myself but photographers friends (also sensitive to total weight carried around) do and they never go out with it.

5) The tape would have to be cut small to cover the USB port alone but it is feasible and you could even do it yourself beforehand.

6) I recommend the SSD as opposed to the HDD which spins "only" at 4,200 rpm (hence the spinning beach ball if you try and multitask).

You won't believe how light and pleasant it is to carry around but, yes, do wait for mid-october/ the next refresh before jumping and then some more if you can in order to avoid the eventual problems generally associated with the first batch produced.

Hope this helps.

[PowerFullMac]

That iPoor thing is very funny! :p

[joopdor]

I am a long time macrumors reader, but this topic made me REGISTER to the forum. Here's why, it inspired me for a story on how Apple will become the next Sony. LINK (http://www.joopdorresteijn.com/Archive/blind-mavericks-why-apple-will-be-the-next-sony/)

[RichardF]

I am a long time macrumors reader, but this topic made me REGISTER to the forum. Here's why, it inspired me for a story on how Apple will become the next Sony. LINK (http://www.joopdorresteijn.com/Archive/blind-mavericks-why-apple-will-be-the-next-sony/)


Very nice write-up there. I agree with the analysis.

People populating internet boards and discussing the MBA in real life to criticizes it, don't get it IMHO and don't even own one I might add. It may need tweaking but Apple is pulling the whole industry in the direction of their choosing...again. REV B wil better etc. as usual. I like thin!

Remember Ford: “If I’d asked my customers what they wanted, they’d have said a faster horse”.

[bartzilla]

So I'm an apple convert. My first laptop is MBA. I had it for six months and I'm completely happy with it. It replaced my sony vaio sz and it tops it performance and speed wise. When I bought it last march many people are against me on buying it (including apple employees in the apple store). But I still bought it because its right for my needs.

I couldn't be happier with my purchase. However it puzzles me because everytime I visit the macforums outside of the Macbook air thread, many people bash the MBA calling it a "useless underpowered machine" or something similar along those lines. I don't understand why some other apple users themselves hate the MBA like it's kinda like the "black sheep" of the apple notebook lineup. Can anybody explain to me why this is the case?

Well I wouldn't use the word useless but I'd go for "underpowered" - at least for my needs. To me as well, the cut down number of ports is a step too far, especially when you consider other manufacturers making similar kit seem to have managed. But that's just my feelings, it doesn't mean the product is "useless", just not something I would buy.

Were my needs less about power and more about portability then I'd probably have a different view. I think the apple store employees might be right to ensure people understand the compromise they're making when they buy a MBA but assuming it fits your needs there is nothing wrong with buying it.

[MooneyFlyer]

Very nice write-up there. I agree with the analysis.

People populating internet boards and discussing the MBA in real life to criticizes it, don't get it IMHO and don't even own one I might add. It may need tweaking but Apple is pulling the whole industry in the direction of their choosing...again. REV B wil better etc. as usual. I like thin!

Remember Ford: “If I’d asked my customers what they wanted, they’d have said a faster horse”.

Agreed.

I work for an emerging company attempting to bring a disruptive technology to market. The reason we have an opportunity is because the existing technologies are attempting to "sustain" their advantage -- ie, "give me something that is 10% [faster, smaller, better, etc.]." This makes it difficult for the current leaders to truly innovate to the next level because it is not what their customers are asking for and it is quite expensive to put the resources on the "next generation" problem with no real revenue expected for years.

There's a great book on this (probably many) called "The Innovator's Dilemma" (Clayton M Christensen) (http://books.google.com/books?id=SIexi_qgq2gC&dq=the+innovators+dilemma&pg=PP1&ots=AhtNdEJ5Bo&sig=c-agtwdzuhmOyEehOfqmLKjr7aI&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result#PPP1,M1). It's a very good read if you are interested in these types of things.

The author gives many examples of the (then) current day leaders either completely failing or not leading in the next round (anyone remember Wang, DEC, the steam shovel, etc.?)

One potential point -- Apple has always seemed to buck this trend and I tend to believe they will do it again. Sometimes it is best to "not listen" to your customers.

In any case - this discussion has been useful for me because it is giving me a bit more confidence that, for my use model, this box might fit the bill. Come on MBA UPDATE -- the waiting game continues.

[puffnstuff]

I think people are mad because the Air is not really marketed well. The macbook is the budget laptop. Macbook pro is more for professional designers,etc. Macbook Air is ? it cannot be marketed as an ultraportable it is big and heavy. I was shocked when I felt how heavy it is. What is it made of?

[Abstract]

(snip long post)

Personally, if I were you, I'd stick with Lenovo. In fact, I'd probably think about either the X200 or X300. I'd consider the Sony TT, HP Elitebook 2530p, Asus U2E, but if Lenovo has worked for you, I'd stick with it. They have ports galore, will probably be as physically "sturdy" as any of them, but I wouldn't bet the farm on being able to throw an MBA around without consequence. Sure, plastic breaks/cracks while aluminium dents. However, it takes a lot to crack the plastic on some of these laptops, while I think dents can be pretty easy to cause on aluminium. I don't think that sturdy design was what Apple designers were thinking of when they design Apple laptops. Great for general use, but not for what you described. I could easily survive with an MBA. You probably can't.

Also, you need a battery that's changeable yourself, and one that's easy to get into and repair if it really comes down to that. And some of the Sony and Asus models really do get around 7 hours of real-world battery life. The MBA's battery life is good, but not THAT good.

I think it would be irresponsible for someone to recommend a Mac, when what you need is to stick with Lenovo for what you do. They don't have the reputation they do because their stuff isn't sturdy.

[polaris20]

I certainly don't hate the MBA, though I wouldn't buy one......unless I already had an iMac or Mac Pro. To me it really makes sense as a companion laptop to a more powerful main machine. I can't imagine using it as my only machine, whereas you definitely could with the MB or MBP.

When I am away from the office, I never use the optical on my current laptop, nor do I ever jack into hardwire. So from that standpoint, I don't find it limiting.

[Dagless]

It's probably a brilliant device for people who want a thin laptop, but I don't. I want more power than what the MBA can give me so I'll be looking into a MB (size) or MBP (£100 more for a powerhouse) instead.

If I was given a MBA I'd keep it. But from my own money I'd rather buy one of Apple's other laptops.

[puffnstuff]

I was looking at the sony x505 specs

Width
10.2 in
Depth
8.2 in
Height
0.8 in
Weight
1.7 lbs

Thinner,smaller and lighter then the macbook air and made 4 years ago. If mac made something with those kinda specs I would buy it.

[Digital Skunk]

I was looking at the sony x505 specs

Width
10.2 in
Depth
8.2 in
Height
0.8 in
Weight
1.7 lbs

Thinner,smaller and lighter then the macbook air and made 4 years ago. If mac made something with those kinda specs I would buy it.

What is the processor speed, HDD space, battery life etc?

Curious to know because most people compare the Air to the TZ, which does out spec the Air in a lot of ways, but carries a slower processor, smaller keyboard and screen, and higher price tag.

[yoppie]

Nothing to add to this discussion except the fact that I would like to own a MacBook Air. It's a great second computer if you don't need all the extras. Hopefully the new year will bring me one. :)

[puffnstuff]

What is the processor speed, HDD space, battery life etc?

Curious to know because most people compare the Air to the TZ, which does out spec the Air in a lot of ways, but carries a slower processor, smaller keyboard and screen, and higher price tag.

You can't really compare the x505 performance wise to the air because its 4 years old.

Intel pentium M 1.1 ghz
20 gb hard drive
4hr battery
512 ram

I just like the form factor of the x505. If they could cram everything from the Air into something like the x505 that would be nice. The whole point of the Air was that it is suppose to be light as Air at least thats what I thought.

[synth3tik]

IMO

There is a sever lack of I/O
The MBA is very ugly (keyboard is no exception)
Besides being ugly the MB style keyboard is just horrible to use
The thing is way over priced for the functions it really can do
Other companies are releasing sub-notebooks that are better then the MBA (this usually takes other companies a few tries)

If I decided that I need a sub notebook I will most likely shoot for the Dell. It is just a better deal then the MBA, and there is I/Os.....

[RichardF]

IMO

There is a sever lack of I/O
The MBA is very ugly (keyboard is no exception)
Besides being ugly the MB style keyboard is just horrible to use
The thing is way over priced for the functions it really can do
Other companies are releasing sub-notebooks that are better then the MBA (this usually takes other companies a few tries)

If I decided that I need a sub notebook I will most likely shoot for the Dell. It is just a better deal then the MBA, and there is I/Os.....


What are you doing on a forum dedicated to the MBA? Just saying...

[aleksandra.]

IMO

There is a sever lack of I/O
The MBA is very ugly (keyboard is no exception)
Besides being ugly the MB style keyboard is just horrible to use
The thing is way over priced for the functions it really can do
Other companies are releasing sub-notebooks that are better then the MBA (this usually takes other companies a few tries)

If I decided that I need a sub notebook I will most likely shoot for the Dell. It is just a better deal then the MBA, and there is I/Os.....

I suppose it's just a matter of preference.

Air is beautiful.
I like Air's and MacBook's keyboards very much indeed. Most comfortable ever.

I agree it's expensive and wish it wasn't, but comparable notebooks are no cheaper.

I'd never buy something as horrible as Dell Mini or many other sub-notebooks.

[gooddeal]

IMO

If I decided that I need a sub notebook I will most likely shoot for the Dell. It is just a better deal then the MBA, and there is I/Os.....

...go buy your beautiful Dell w/ Vista. This is not a place for you.:eek:

[Roba]

I think that maybe you you got a dud or you didn't know how to use your computer properly. Your computer was actually rated a battery life of 3 hours 50 mins in speed mode to 6 hours in stamina mode.
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:VauuV00xCT8J:www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay%3FcatalogId%3D10551%26storeId%3D10151%26langId%3D-1%26productId%3D11040262+VGN+SZ320P+B+battery+4+hours&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=uk
With Sony you should be able to get more battery life than the rated battery life that Sony gives your laptop. My laptop was rated 3 hours in speed mode (probably in performance mode with full brightness) to 6 hours in stamina mode.

Also you had the low entry model with a smaller capacity battery and not a premium black model with an LED screen which was also a bit lighter.

You claim that the MBA has better performance but just look at these test results here they do not back up what you are claiming. The battery life test was also done in speed mode and not stamina mode-
http://www.pcmag.com/image_popup/0,1871,iid=217459,00.asp
I own a premium SZ7/C and can get over 6 hours battery life with wifi on using 30% brightness in stamina mode in power saver. I should be able to pull of at least close to 7 hours with wifi of just doing office work.

I don't think that the MBA can get quite as much battery life as that.

I don't use any anti virus because i am careful about what i download.

Getting back to the topic though i don't hate the MBA i have owned about 4 Mac laptops but don't currently as there is none right for me. I would have liked the MBA to have been a smaller MBP instead and then i would have bought one. I tried a MB but they were not right for me.

Just look at the specs of the new Sony Z the premium SZ's replacement. The Z weighs 3.3lbs and the specs are great. For me Apple's portable range is a bit lacking.




I don't know what you are trying to say by your last sentence. The SZ model that I had was SONY VAIO SZ 320 P/B. It is not a premium version of the SZ and I bought it last December 2006. Here is the link for the tech specshttp://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/model-documents.pl?mdl=VGNSZ320PB. When I bought this computer I clearly remember that advertised battery life for it was 3 hours only. In which case it usually last for 2.5 with normal usage.

[snberk103]

At the risk of hijacking the thread..... My wife is about to take delivery of her MBA. It will be her travelling system - the MBP will now stay home and act as a desktop system. I am her "tech support". Is there anything I need to know that is specific for the MBA? We both have MBPs, and I'm not uncomfortable diagnosing and fixing the minor issues that crop up. And to be honest, there are darn few issues! She uses it for internet research, and uses MS Office. Thats about it. She will use it mostly when she travels by air, the rest of the time she will use the MBP.

I can't think of anything that would be specifically a problem, but wanted to check with those of you with MBA experience. I've already bought her a USB hub and the USB-ethernet adapter.

I am sure she will Not become a MBA hater. The form factor of the MBA is perfect for her - light and small. All the tech stuff just bores her.

Thanks in advance...

[The Awesome]

At the risk of hijacking the thread..... My wife is about to take delivery of her MBA. It will be her travelling system - the MBP will now stay home and act as a desktop system. I am her "tech support". Is there anything I need to know that is specific for the MBA? We both have MBPs, and I'm not uncomfortable diagnosing and fixing the minor issues that crop up. And to be honest, there are darn few issues! She uses it for internet research, and uses MS Office. Thats about it. She will use it mostly when she travels by air, the rest of the time she will use the MBP.

I can't think of anything that would be specifically a problem, but wanted to check with those of you with MBA experience. I've already bought her a USB hub and the USB-ethernet adapter.

I am sure she will Not become a MBA hater. The form factor of the MBA is perfect for her - light and small. All the tech stuff just bores her.

Thanks in advance...

I've only heard about core shutdowns and of course, the non-replaceable battery (if she flies business or first class then you'll need the MagSafe plane adapter).