the iWalk that would not die...

[Wry Cooter]

Noticed the following Apple PDA rumors still being shuffled about

http://www.macobserver.com/article/2002/06/04.11.shtml

http://www.business2.com/articles/mag/0,1640,40364,FF.html

http://www.oqo.com/

Isn't this old news? Same ole Same ole? Is this merely Business 2.0 being slow to pick up on an old OQO press release, and a mac site desperate for hits trying to spin it yet again? That was several months ago it seems I last heard of the oqo.

The OQO runs winXP. Hard to back out of their flash site on a 56kmodem, so I have no idea of its tech specs.
Think you could hack it to run OS X or BSD?

Maybe there will be a touchscreen tablet at MWNY, but I doubt the form factor will resemble this in the least. I'm betting on something bigger. (I think they should create a touch screen eMacs and iMacs for vertical niche markets, if they can get the iMac price down enough.

[Backtothemac]

Oh, eye is going to have a field day in here. Look, as much as we all would be happy to max out our credit cards, I just don't think that it will happen. Steve has said on many occations that there will not, not, be an Apple branded PDA for consumers, pros, aliens, or anyone. Lets ignore the rumors, and be more constructive.

[Mr. Anderson]

Give him some credit, b2tm, these are newer stories, with a little bit more information. Its interesting to see that Jobs turned Bell down, you have to wonder why. When it is finally released, I'd love to see one, but I can't imagine it being more than an expensive toy....

[Backtothemac]

Originally posted by dukestreet
Give him some credit, b2tm, these are newer stories, with a little bit more information. Its interesting to see that Jobs turned Bell down, you have to wonder why. When it is finally released, I'd love to see one, but I can't imagine it being more than an expensive toy....

Duke, you are correct on that. I did not even bother to read the reviews until your post. Man, it does actually look like they are up to something. I know that I would love to have one. Well, lets just hope.

[boobers]

i suppose OQO will use a windows OS. Too bad as i'm sure Bell prefers the MacOS. However if Apple puts out their own PDA.(which i'm sorta keen on depending on its feature set-i'd like,
Audio input
camera module(or camera)
QT playback
MP3 playback
fully wireless web access
20gig drive minimum


(on top of the ordinary monochromatic features of pda's of today like address book and text editor, game of pong etc...)
If Apple makes their own palm OS they could licence it to OQO so their would be some competition in a smaller realm of the market.

However i suppose its possible to run X with a stylus. Man that would be cool..to have OSX in your pocket.
:D
boobers

only problem is i need a screen thats about 4x5 inches and it must be horizontally positioned like a computer monitor..Can you do that for me Apple? huh? can ya please?

[Macmaniac]

Where is eye? He is going to have a field day!!! Or he is just choosing to ignore this post.

[cjw]

ignoring it, no doubt

[elgruga]

This thing is a computer that has been chopped up.
You buy it and then you get to buy all the bits.....like a keyboard, and some sort of CD/CDRW drive and a monitor....oh and a pair of thick reading glasses so you can see the the miniscule type on the tiny screen.

One day, when humans are only 6 inches high, this thing will be a big hit.

In the meantime, I will stick with my Pismo, a cell-phone, and an iPod.

OQO? fuggedabahtit.

[eyelikeart]

so u guys really miss me?! :D

yes...I've chosen to ignore it...

but...since I'm here...

why don't u guys just give the PDA thing a rest already?! :eek: :rolleyes:

[topicolo]

Wouldn't it be cool if Jobs released a MacOS X based Smartphone? I mean, Jobs said that he's not going to develop a pda, but what about releasing a smartphone like those that M$ are making? Sure, it's a play on words, but it could happen :-).

[Timothy]

I just can't understand why so many of you consider it sage to be anti-PDA. I think eye would be embarrassed to be so dogmatically against any discussion of a PDA. Eye, take your minions to other threads if you are not interested in the discussion. There's no need to continually ask others to stop speaking about things that clearly interest them; we'll not ask the same of you. Deal?

Again, for the record, Apple ignores the PDA to its long-term detriment. It is not a matter of if Apple will ever re-enter the ultra-portable market, its a matter of when. Period.

Those of you who continually quote the "Apple said...SJ said...blah blah blah" have put too much stock in obscure and/or off-the-cuff remarks. Computing is a way of life, and will become more and more so; the PDA is a natural extension of the desktop and laptop.

This topic will never die...and I'll do my best to ensure that that is so.

[Wry Cooter]

I would just like to go on record to the kneejerk reactionaries with a reminder that this thread was started by me in a similar vein... I posted as I couldn't beleive it was being used as "news" or web page fodder, because the OQO stuff is over six months old for one, among other reasons.

I am however a big fan of the Apple Tablet idea.....;)

[green68]

If apple had just announced this identical product all Mac fanatics and Steve Jobs would be saying it was the most revolutionary device ever created. But they didn't, so it must be a bad idea:)!

I've often bordered on being a "Mac fanatic" but reading news and threads like this remind me why I am getting tired of Apple's elitist marketing and the people that buy into it.

Of course the irony for me, I'd buy an Apple PDA in a second, and I'll probably die using MACS, still bitching about high prices and slow processor updates.

[cryptochrome]

The OQO (which runs XP, btw) isn't really a new idea. It's just a hard one to implement. The core idea is "it's a pain to synchronize a bunch of devices all the time". This is true. Handy as the iPod may be, it's a fairly simple device that you synchronize every now and then. The same may not be true of the iPad, the iPhone, your iEnterain, your mac, or whatever, and synching them all would be even more of a pain, even if it's automatic you still have to connect them.

But putting them all together in one device is overkill, and forces unnecessary limitations (not the mention the inherent advantage of multiple devices for multiple people). I think Apple has the right idea for making devices play well together instead, and lumping functions together where appropriate.

This is why I think the iPod will be rendered largely obsolete by later digital hub devices, aside from it's role as a portable large drive. We'll have one home entertainment device to handle all entertainment center functions (music library with equalization, dvd/cd playback and burning, PVR, receiver). A few peripheral devices for very general (iPod and other drives, Airport Base Station) or very specialized (small general market still/video cam) functions. Your processing and info routing hub (a Mac). And one mobile device to handle all mobile stuff (music player, basic audio/video recording, mobile phone/communications/browsing, pda functions, ebook, basic office stuff, full display). The trick would be getting them to share their abilities (i.e., your personal mobile device could wirelessly link to your computer to borrow its raw processing power and intelligently store/ask for files, and to your home entertainment center to update it's internal music library).

[arn]

Originally posted by green68
If apple had just announced this identical product all Mac fanatics and Steve Jobs would be saying it was the most revolutionary device ever created. But they didn't, so it must be a bad idea:)!


I don't know if everyone thinks it's a "bad" idea...

but you're right... if apple made a similar device, tons of Apple-people would instantly love it and want one.... myself included.

But... there is some logic to it... Windows XP doesn't serve any purpose in my day-to-day life. Having a small device that runs Windows XP does me about as much good as a small device that runs Amiga OS.

Not that there's anything wrong with it - but I can't integrate it into my life...

now... put Mac OS X, or a custom OS that was designed to work with Mac OS X... well, then we're talking..

Regarding the PDA battle... I've not made it a secret that I am/was a huge Newton fan. The Newton OS and Newton was Apples best and most innovative product ever. If Apple were to make a PDA, I would buy it... site unseen... I know that sounds fanatical... but it's true... and there are many others who would do the same.

arn

[New Guy]

Right now I have no real need for a PDA – Apple branded or otherwise – but would like a new toy if the right one came around. I believe Apple is just biding it's time before releasing a version of their own. They want Apple to be the next Sony, remember. The fact that SJ said they wouldn't doesn't sway me much – especially after yesterdays announcement that the eMac is now available for consumers. SJ said the CRT was dead and the eMac would be education only.

Don't believe everything that comes out of Cupertino. The climate in silicon valley changes so fast that what was unthinkable yesterday is very plausible today.

Enjoy!

[Marvenp]

At times Apple and/or SJ can be egotistical, arrogant and outright stupid. I am the Creative Director for a technology company in Japan and have been living here for 17 years. I've found one truth to be constant; mobility is crutial! The surge in mobile phones and convergence devices prove it beyond any debate.

I have a DP 1Ghz Silver Tower with 1.5GB ram, 3 x 72GB Ultra SCSI HDs and an 22" Cinema Display on my desk at the office. Then I have a PB G4 with 1GB ram and 48GB HD in my briefcase. Guess which one gets used more. I am constantly travelling, meeting clients, demoing our solutions etc... etc... I need raw power but I need it to be portable. And with the way our lifestyles are changing, that seems true for the rest of the world as well.

Besides, it absolutely idiotic for SJ to talk about winning over Wintel users if they (Apple) are not exploring ALL markets. The biggest reason why people use Windows is because they're everywhere. They feel confident that whatever they buy will in someway be compatible with past and for that matter, future purchases.

I was just at a conference in Tokyo yesterday and the theme was: Streaming Media Japan / Content Management Forum. Almost very exhibitor at the conference built thier solutions around WMP. QuickTime was nowhere to be found. Even Real and Adobe where there. The general feeling among most attendees was yeah, QT may be better but most people have WMP installed on thier machines. Where going after the masses.

Microsoft is at every conference no matter how insignificant it may seem. They are exploring every opportunity to market thier piece of crap OS no matter what the platform. If Apple doesn't adopt a new attitude, they can forget about that other 95% of the market. It's events like the one I mentioned that will win over Wintel users, not MacWorld! Most the people attending MacWorld are already Mac users, daaah.

It's getting the Mac OS out there in as many forms as possible and on as many devices as possible that will gain customer confidence. Apple (Steve) GET YOUR BLOATED HEAD OUTTA YOUR ASSES!

[matznentosh]

I swear to god, I had a dream just last night Apple came out with a small laptop like device with a touch screen and it looked just like this thing! The only thing that was different is that in the dream it had the handwriting recognition built in, and of course it ran OS X.

Do you think dreams predict future MacWorld conferences?

[eyelikeart]

it was that Steve Jobs said NO PDA!!!!

oh wait a minute....that wasn't a dream....it really happened...:rolleyes:

[kansaigaijin]

seriously, I had a dream last night, trying to get my brother in-laws windowsXp pc connected to my base station, which i bought so he and the mother in law could share the Yahoo DSL. Makes me laugh at trying to do anything with windows on a playing card size screen, you must be joking! A brand new OS like XP can't find the base station in the next room, and it won't switch languages like OSX will, so it is dificult to help him or oka-san.

OQO pitched a deck of cards? sounds like the iPod. Remember Ink is coming soon, it will be dificult for apple not to do a eMac and put it in a portable device when it is a big hit. I think the eMac lauch is the new marketing strategy.

[AudiA4]

Originally posted by eyelikeart
it was that Steve Jobs said NO PDA!!!!

oh wait a minute....that wasn't a dream....it really happened...:rolleyes:

Wow, eyelikeart, here are some other quotes for you:

The eMac is for educational users only.

The CRT is dead.

.......all the while Jobs is (internally?) bemoaning the fact that he has totally missed the whole PDA/Portable device market - which Apple started and which continues to expand. It's THE digital hub device.

[robodweeb]

Originally posted by AudiA4


Wow, eyelikeart, here are some other quotes for you:

The eMac is for educational users only.




I guess you missed the announcement ... the eMac is shipping for non-educational consumers ... I just bought one, from the Apple Store, today for my mother ...

[kansaigaijin]

ya I think that was his point. and mine,

Sweet unit huh?

[Marvenp]

You people are still missing the point! Dream or not PDA or not, the best way to attack an enemy is from all sides. A direct frontal attack would never work with a behomoth like MS. The Mac OS needs to be seen on as many devices as possible.

Very few people doubt that the Mac OS is superior to Windows (at least around me) but the fact still remains that Windows is everywhere and on everything. Do you think MS cares if PDAs sell or not? They just care about getting thier OS out there on whatever is selling.

Apple should adapt a similar strategy.

[eyelikeart]

yeah...

I'm going back to my first plan of ignoring this thread...

have fun without me!! ;) :cool: :rolleyes:

[robodweeb]

... but they are not mind-numbingly stupid ... they have a pretty good grasp of parts of the market and they are trying to hit a moving target ... sometimes they miss ...

As others have pointed out, ubiquitous and mobile access - to the Internet, to one's desktop/digital hub, etc. - are a huge trend in this industry. To remain competitive, Apple needs to move in this direction. PDAs are not the only way to go ... they were a few years ago, then that niche fell victim to its own success and stagnation set in.

It is this stagnation that Steve Jobs rejected with his oft-quoted "no PDAs" comment ...

Timothy is correct about the detriment to Apple should Apple be ignoring this trend. I don't think they are. OK, I desperately hope they aren't. If Apple hasn't released a product aligned with this trend, it's because it isn't ready for prime time yet. And, to be fair, they've had other things to work on and - all in all - I'm pretty happy with the results ... Apple is achieving considerable technological goals on a relatively regular schedule and they're doing it in a fiscally responsible manner. Releasing a product before it's ready is something with which Apple has had some experience (fortunately, not recently), so I don't begrudge them a little time ...

So, when something is eventually released, it will just work. It likely will distinguish itself from the current PDA niche is some marketable fashion, but it will probably "walk like a PDA and quack like a PDA". The most popular themes, for such a product, I've seen are:

1. Standalone tablet device - touch-sensitive LCD
2. Detachable tablet device that also "docks" with a more stationary Mac at home/office to become a display (how many of us use a display when we're away from our Macs?) and auto-syncs files with the stationary Mac
3. OQO-like device with a smaller display that docks with a home/office Mac and uses its display
4. Tablet device - standalone or detachable - that is not touch-sensitive, but uses an Apple stylus that is similar to an Anoto pen for Inkwell/Wacom-style input onto paper that is mirrored to the tablet for archiving and interactivity

All of these are described as using 802.11, Firewire, Bluetooth, Inkwell, and - of course - OS X ... some include ways to interoperate - to some degree to attract their users - with the Windows world ...

For all I know, maybe Apple plans to meet this trend with a line of OS X-powered clothing ... a G5 belt, with polymer batteries in your shoes, Airport-compatible antenna threads interwoven in shirts, a ring that mimics a 3D glove/mouse/chord keyboard, and a high resolution, no-flicker pair of LCD Ray-Bans ...

Whatever they eventually release - and they *will* release something - it will be easy to claim it's not a PDA ... PDAs are so 1990s anyway ...

Now, given all that ... Apple, would you please, pretty please let us know that you are, at least, working on such a product? I really, really need a couple of them ASAP to support my family's daily lives ... it's hard to continue to resist other ubiquitous and mobile devices when you are so silent about this ...

[kansaigaijin]

Marv,

I think everyone but Eye agrees with you. I was trying to say not to believe everything Apple says, AudiA4 made it much better,

I think the Apple brand should be out there as long as the products are on message, or a Steve says, "true to themselves" and not the return of that Performa crap.

[Marvenp]

Kansaigaijin,

Are you in Japan or is that just your handle? Just curious.

On another note, I'd like to make the distinction that I was referrring to the Mac OS whereas everyone else is speaking of Apple creating a PDA product. I think is was in poor judgement for Apple not to consider the OQO device as another way to market the Mac OS. Whether device sells or not Apple would have gained another platform. As it stands now, MS just got one more product they can point to and say EVERYONE USES WINDOWS.

So unless Apple has plans for making a similar device of thier own, the decision was stupid.

Tired of beating this dead horse so I'll leave this thread alone for now.

[Spock]

If Apple is going to release anything like that it will be a cell phone or a net/phone iApp www.iphone.org still points to www.apple.com Steve did say alot that their will be no PDA BUT!!
he also said at Macworld SF that today was the death of the CRT
and they released the eMac?? I hate to say it but you can't rely on what Steve says.

[(iii)]

The OQO (if they *really* are going to manufacture it) will be a killer system.

Think about it: 1 GHz in the Palm of your hand, with a colour screen and more inputs and outputs then you can shake a stick at.

From mounting a couple to a wall as webservers to a video iPod... At around $1000, this machine is going to be hot.

Mac OS or not, iWalk or not, OQO is a winner. Go for it OQO!

[kansaigaijin]

no I don't think it is a good idea to launch product only to have them fail.

since someone asked I will use another Japanese co for an example: Honda returned to formula 1 and is not doing too well. apparently they would rather show reliability than power and speed. They don't want people seeing their engines blow up on TV.

Cubes are nice and they are holding their value here in Japan but most non-Mac lovers think of them as a big flop, not the very cool thing they are. My mother in-law wants a computer, must be a laptop because the house is just too small.

OQO? flash in the pan

[sjs]

Imagine that device running OSX Jaguar! With Rendezvous and Airport it would be recognized by your network (or others). With Ink you would not need a keyboard. With iChat you would be in touch. All the abilities of iBook and iPod, plus Blackberry and Palm to an order of magnitude!

I can see it!!

Eye cannot!!

[boobers]

come on thats a dead giveaway..a pda(or what ever you choose to call it) would benefit greatly from this feature. ITS A NO BRAINER..
Slugger

[AmbitiousLemon]

rendezvous and remote desktop as well... imagine the possibilities...

[boymerang]

pointing to the eMac as a sign that the CRT is in fact, not dead, is a little misleading.

i'm don't think Steve-o was being quite so black and white on the matter. he didn't say "we will never, ever, produce another CRT". what he likely meant was that the CRT no longer factored into apple's display plan. and it would likely still be that way had everyone not collectively jizzed over the release of the much bally-hooed eMac (as hideous as that thing is). suffice to say that it was unlikely they intended to offer it to the public originally...and probably did so because of the positive response from people. even the little note on their website is almost appologetic "i'm sorry, but now you can buy one...again, sorry."

is apple going to release a cellphone/pda/digitalcamera/model/actor ? i doubt it. will the release a PDA thing eventually? yeah. soon? nah. when they iron out the details of bluetooth, and it starts shipping as standard equipment in every machine - then you'll probably see them start working back into the direction of wireless devices. i don't think you'll ever see a cellphone from them though - not for a long while. companies can't just release zany products because a few people think it would be really cool. apple will also not release a blue-tooth enabled fridge (iFreeze) that syncs with your personal grocery assistant (iShop), and why? because they're not Willy Wonka's Computer Factory churning out dubious digital delights. if they're going to enter yet another consumer market, they're going to do it slowly, and they're going to it with a bit of glamour, a bit of sex, and a few advances thrown in.

they're not going to make the same mistakes twice (one would hope).