FlightTrack real-time flight tracker/mapper released

[bkazez]

Hello,

I wanted to give a quick plug for FlightTrack, a new flight tracking app for iPhone and iPod touch. It's helpful for tracking your own flights and itineraries while on the go, or keeping tabs on family and friends en route. It also features really cool real-time flight maps so you can see exactly where your incoming flights are.

http://www.benkazez.com/flighttrack/

Enjoy!
Ben
--
Ben Kazez
FlightTrack - Track your flights on iPhone and iPod touch.
http://www.benkazez.com/flighttrack/

[OrangeCuse44]

Congrats on getting your app out there. May I offer a couple of suggestions? You tout the map view as a big feature, why not include a screen shot of it? Also, I would be afraid $4.99 may be too high of a price for an app of this nature. Hopefully I'm wrong! Good luck.

[Pooshka]

What about non-U.S. international flights???

[aawil]

It looks like a very well done app to me. Although the other poster may be right about pricing. Time will tell, good luck with it. :)

[ucfgrad93]

Looks pretty good to me. Congratulations and good luck.:D

[bkazez]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone! I'm attaching a screenshot of the flight tracker maps.

Regarding non-US international flights, I would love to see this feature as well, and our data provider is working on readying this for a release in the future. Stay tuned!

Ben
--
Ben Kazez
FlightTrack - Track your flights on iPhone and iPod touch.
http://www.benkazez.com/flighttrack/

[vrflyer]

Good luck on this app, although @ $4.99 it might be to steep for many.;)

[lunarmac]

Yeah it looks good.
Reminds me of a souped up version of Flight Status back in my Palm Treo days (that was free by the way :)

Anyway, I agree that the price might be too high when another flight tracker from SplashData is only 2.99 but then again there is another one for 4.99. I see the sweet spot would be the at 3.99 or just undercut both for 1.99. But again you can always try to ramp up interest by doing a one day freebie :)

Good luck and great work.

[Pooshka]

- Added gate numbers & baggage claim info for most flights.
- Dramatically improved flight delay and cancelation updates.
- Expanded to full international coverage.

[cjm3113]

I purchased this application. Tried it out the other day, wife was on a flight..was amazed by the accuracy.

Great application, well worth the money.

[brezz]

Anyone else having problems getting the app to work? It was working well for me until I downloaded v.2 and now it keeps telling me I'm offline (even though my internet and other apps are working). I emailed Ben and he mentioned others might be having this problem too.

Brian

[bkazez]

In case anyone has been having trouble with version 2.0, just wanted to let you know that turning ON 24-hour time (and then turning it off again) fixes the bug where "Search Error" appears repeatedly. The 24-hour time setting is in Settings > General > Date & Time. And Brian was instrumental in finding this!

Ben

[MikePA]

Neat app, terrorists must love it.

[JNB]

Neat app, terrorists must love it.

Brilliant comment. This info has been publicly available online for years. Try googling for "flight tracking." :rolleyes:

[MBHockey]

Neat app, terrorists must love it.

I really don't even need this app, but I'm buying it just to spite you.

[MikePA]

It's irrelevant whether the information has been available or not, it's how convenient it is to access and how current the information is.

[MikePA]

I really don't even need this app, but I'm buying it just to spite you.
Ow, I'm hurt. L.

[JNB]

It's irrelevant whether the information has been available or not, it's how convenient it is to access and how current the information is.

Um, as I already said, just google it. Entirely as convenient and real-time as the iPhone app (since it draws from exactly the same databases). Or is it just easier to make snap judgements?

[MikePA]

Um, as I already said, just google it. Entirely as convenient and real-time as the iPhone app (since it draws from exactly the same databases). Or is it just easier to make snap judgements?

You are saying getting this information via an iPhone over the cellular network anyplace and anywhere is just as convenient as using a browser over a wired/wireless connection? Right.

I guess if someone doesn't toe the line and agree with you and the other spiteful buyer than they're wrong. Talk about snap judgements.

[JNB]

You are saying getting this information via an iPhone over the cellular network anyplace and anywhere is just as convenient as using a browser over a wired/wireless connection? Right.

I guess if someone doesn't toe the line and agree with you and the other spiteful buyer than they're wrong. Talk about snap judgements.

Funny, I was getting the same info from websites on my iPhone as well (mobile Safari, remember?) since July of last year. You don't need an app to do it. You don't even need an iPhone (Blackberry, WinMobile, etc.). Every airline has real-time mobile flight tracking on their website, none of which requiring a traditional Ethernet connection.

Oh, FTR, this is one of five iPhone apps that do the same basic task.

So, if you believe that this particular app is somehow enabling terrorists in a way they haven't previously or as readily had available for over a decade, you've been severely under-informed.

The operative phrase here is "going off half-cocked."

[MikePA]

The operative phrase here is "going off half-cocked."
You have your opinion, and I have mine. Our opinions almost match. I think people who don't see the difference are "half" something too.

[cjm3113]

I don't really see how this would benefit a terrorist anyways.

[yg17]

It's irrelevant whether the information has been available or not, it's how convenient it is to access and how current the information is.

Achmed: But Osama, I would shoot this missile at the plane, but I can't conveniently get the flight tracking information.
Osama: What do you mean?
Achmed: Well, I have to get my big 'ol laptop out, wait for it to wake from sleep mode, try to find an open WiFi hotspot, google a website where I can get the information, and then finally, once I have it, I can launch that missile. But having to do all that is just a huge pain in the ass.
Osama: You're right, sounds like a hassle. We'll postpone the attack until an iPhone app comes out!


You know, if inconvenience was enough to stop a terrorist, we wouldn't even need airport security. Just throw a screaming baby on each flight and that will keep them away :rolleyes:

[northy124]

Looks nice but $4.99, a bit steep isn't it?

[cjm3113]

Looks nice but $4.99, a bit steep isn't it?

$5 is steep? Let's see what else you could buy for $5.

-5 McChickens
-A plain white t-shirt
-A cheap paperback book
-Some batteries

I don't know if you live in the same world I live in, but you cannot buy anything for $5 anymore, yet people talk about $5-$10 applications like they are expensive.

[northy124]

For something I can get for free online I'd say it is steep.

[cjm3113]

For something I can get for free online I'd say it is steep.

May I ask (if you do not mind saying) what applications you have purchased? Only things that are not available free online? It's about convenience. I mean, isn't that what the iPhone is all about?

[MikePA]

Irrelevant naive rubbish removed from quote

Who'd think terrorists would use Facebook to spread their message or Google Earth to plan the attacks in India.

I also didn't say inconvenience would stop a terrorist. Try actually reading what I wrote next time.

[yg17]

Who'd think terrorists would use Facebook to spread their message or Google Earth to plan the attacks in India.

I also didn't say inconvenience would stop a terrorist. Try actually reading what I wrote next time.


It doesn't even matter anyways because the data isn't quite real-time. I've looked at the Flight View data on my phone before while waiting for someone at the airport, and it said the plane was still in the air by the time we were at the baggage claim. The data's not real time, it's behind probably about 10 minutes or so. By the time Flight View says a plane is at position X, it's actually long past position X.

Besides, even if it was real time, look at the screenshot. Nothing is to scale. The plane is the same size as New Mexico. The accuracy and scale on that map isn't high enough to give you anything close to an exact position of the plane.

[slappy sam]

Who'd think terrorists would use Facebook to spread their message or Google Earth to plan the attacks in India.

I also didn't say inconvenience would stop a terrorist. Try actually reading what I wrote next time.

I see your point. The facebook and google earth apps are pretty much made for terrorists.

[eplchamps0304]

It doesn't even matter anyways because the data isn't quite real-time. I've looked at the Flight View data on my phone before while waiting for someone at the airport, and it said the plane was still in the air by the time we were at the baggage claim. The data's not real time, it's behind probably about 10 minutes or so. By the time Flight View says a plane is at position X, it's actually long past position X.

Besides, even if it was real time, look at the screenshot. Nothing is to scale. The plane is the same size as New Mexico. The accuracy and scale on that map isn't high enough to give you anything close to an exact position of the plane.

If its not real time, then what is the point of the app then?

[yg17]

If its not real time, then what is the point of the app then?

It's probably only about 5 to 10 minutes behind. The point of this app isn't to be an air traffic controller, the point is to see when flights have departed, arrived and if they're in route, approximately where they are and when they'll arrive. If you need real time, then go apply for a job as an air traffic controller or sit outside the airport with binoculars because that's probably the only way you'll ever get 100% real time flight information

[dmr727]

The FAA data the app is getting isn't quite real-time. As others have already noticed, it's intentionally about 5 minutes behind. But it's great to track flights if you're picking someone up at the airport. I just use flightaware.com on my Blackberry, personally.

This is not a security risk in any way, shape or form either.

[MikePA]

The FAA data the app is getting isn't quite real-time...it's intentionally about 5 minutes behind.
Why?

[JNB]

Why?

The FAA's ASDI feed is is supposed to average about 5 minutes behind "actual," for many reasons. Data refresh rates, volume (remember the thousands of aircraft in the system at any one moment), security and other factors all impact this. I have seen as little as <2 minutes, and as much as 7 minutes+. For most civil purposes, this is sufficient to qualify as real-time. Also, not every flight is necessarily trackable (certain flights are excluded by request from the database).

Even the FAA's (and DoD TRACON) internal systems can be several seconds behind true real-time because of update rates, etc.

[MikePA]

The FAA's ASDI feed is is supposed to average about 5 minutes behind "actual," for many reasons. Data refresh rates, volume (remember the thousands of aircraft in the system at any one moment), security and other factors all impact this. I have seen as little as <2 minutes, and as much as 7 minutes+. For most civil purposes, this is sufficient to qualify as real-time. Also, not every flight is necessarily trackable (certain flights are excluded by request from the database). Even the FAA's (and DoD TRACON) internal systems can be several seconds behind true real-time because of update rates, etc.

FlightTrack advertises it provides 'live flight tracker maps'. The use of the word 'live' implies this information is 'real time' and it is not.

The reason there is no security risk is because this application does not provide real time flight information, despite the characterization by the author who started this thread. I assumed the author would know what kind of information his application was providing and 'real time' data was my concern.

The flight information provided to this application is delayed at least 5 minutes. Why? Because of security concerns. It's not delayed 5 minutes because of any altruistic or patriotic instincts of the authors of such software, because of data volume or refresh rates, the number of planes in the air, or any other such guesses by the MacForum illuminati who arrogantly ridiculed my posts about security. It's because the FAA wont give them access to the data.

There are 2 classes of users of flight data, as defined by the FAA;

Class 1 which is 'near real time' and is restricted to businesses who actually dispatch and/or plan flights.

Class 2 is everyone else and this data is delayed at least 5 minutes. The following is taken directly from this FAA document (http://www.fly.faa.gov/ASDI/asdidocs/ASDI_MOA_01Jun06.pdf).

"As a result of the aviation-related attacks of September 11, 2001 in the United States, the FAA reviewed security risks related to the ASDI/NASSI feed and determined that only Subscribers that are Class One Users (See Section 5.2) are authorized to receive the full near real time ASDI and NASSI data set (this includes Direct Subscribers with Class One Indirect Subscribers). Subscribers that are Class Two Users (See Section 5.3) are not authorized to receive near real time flight tracking and position messages. Class Two Users are only authorized to receive the full ASDI and NASSI data set that has been time-delayed at least 5 minutes. The scope and content of ASDI/NASSI data that will be available to government users and research and development organizations will be determined by the FAA on a case-by-case basis. Sections 7.1 and 7.2 of this MOA describe the responsibilities of the FAA and Direct Subscribers, including limits on redistribution of the ASDI and NASSI data. "

[dmr727]

As you've pointed out - even the Class One is only 'near' real time. Like JohnNotBeatle said, there are going to be inherent delays that cannot be overcome, at least with the technology they're using now.

And c'mon - the FAA put in the five minute delay to placate some stupid politician that thought real time tracking data would somehow be a security risk to begin with. It's really not. Someone explain to me how a terrorist would use this 'near' real time data for anything useful to them?

[MikePA]

...there are going to be inherent delays that cannot be overcome, at least with the technology they're using now.
Since the FAA can get this information to the air traffic controllers across the country, they could have provided it but they decided not to. It's not a technology issue.

And c'mon - the FAA put in the five minute delay to placate some stupid politician that thought real time tracking data would somehow be a security risk to begin with. It's really not. Someone explain to me how a terrorist would use this 'near' real time data for anything useful to them?

Because you don't agree with, or understand it, it must be a stupid reason and not a security risk. Amazing, truly amazing.

[dmr727]

Since the FAA can get this information to the air traffic controllers across the country, they could have provided it but they decided not to. It's not a technology issue.

Because you don't agree with, or understand it, it must be a stupid reason and not a security risk. Amazing, truly amazing.

First of all, ATC isn't using this information - it's the other way around. And second, you didn't answer my question. Tell me where the security risk is if the data isn't 100% real time.

[MikePA]

First of all, ATC isn't using this information - it's the other way around.
Try and read what I wrote.

ATCs get real time information.
Class 1 is near real time.
Class 2 is delayed at least 5 minutes.

If the FAA can provide real time information to ATCs they could have provided it to everyone else. They didn't and not because of a technical limitation. The logical conclusion is there must be some other reason.

Tell me where the security risk is if the data isn't 100% real time.

Pure sophistry. I have no idea what the reasons are for not providing real time information, but obviously FAA security experts have reasons. I am not so arrogant to think I know more than they do nor to assume it's the result of politics. BTW, it's real time information or it's not. There's no such thing as 100% real time.

[yg17]

Try and read what I wrote.

ATCs get real time information.
Class 1 is near real time.
Class 2 is delayed at least 5 minutes.

If the FAA can provide real time information to ATCs they could have provided it to everyone else. They didn't and not because of a technical limitation. The logical conclusion is there must be some other reason.



Pure sophistry. I have no idea what the reasons are for not providing real time information, but obviously FAA security experts have reasons. I am not so arrogant to think I know more than they do nor to assume it's the result of politics. BTW, it's real time information or it's not. There's no such thing as 100% real time.

The logical conclusion is that it's expensive to provide real-time information due to the bandwidth and server horsepower required. Providing ATC real time information so 2 planes don't crash into each other is worthy of the expense, providing real time information so Joe Blow can track a plane on his iPhone is not worthy of that expense.

[dmr727]

Try and read what I wrote.

ATCs get real time information.
Class 1 is near real time.
Class 2 is delayed at least 5 minutes.

If the FAA can provide real time information to ATCs they could have provided it to everyone else. They didn't and not because of a technical limitation. The logical conclusion is there must be some other reason.


I read what you wrote. You just don't understand how this works. First of all, ATC *is* the FAA. ATC gets its data from primary and secondary (although mostly secondary) radar returns. Since you like to say that data is either real time or not, I'll put it this way - this data is *not* real time. It takes time for the radar to sweep through the airspace.

The FAA database is being populated from data *from* ATC. Therefore, this data is also not real time. This is the part that I think is confusing you. The data stream being used by tracking sites (for either Class One or Two) is coming FROM air traffic control - not the other way around.

[MikePA]

The FAA database is being populated from data *from* ATC. Therefore, this data is also not real time. This is the part that I think is confusing you. The data stream being used by tracking sites (for either Class One or Two) is coming FROM air traffic control - not the other way around.

I understood this. I didn't think an FAA db supplied the ATCs. Thanks.

The logical conclusion is that it's expensive to provide real-time information due to the bandwidth and server horsepower required.
Then it's not a technical reason, it's a financial reason.

All this discussion misses the point of this thread, which was started by the author of the software, who claimed the information displayed is real time. It is not real time, it's not even Class 1 data, it's Class 2.

[dmr727]

I understood this. I didn't think an FAA db supplied the ATCs. Thanks.


Then I guess I don't understand what your issue is with this. None of it is technically real time because the technology to make it real time hasn't been implemented yet.

But for this app's intended purpose, it's real time enough. Just like what ATC sees is real time enough for them. Are you just being pedantic for the sake of being pedantic, or what?

As far as security, I don't claim to know better than the TSA or the DHS (the FAA isn't involved in security), but it's fair to ask the question - what exactly does adding a five minute delay really do? Nobody seems to be able to answer this.

[MikePA]

Then I guess I don't understand what your issue is with this. None of it is technically real time because the technology to make it real time hasn't been implemented yet.
My issue is documented, again, below.

But for this app's intended purpose, it's real time enough. Just like what ATC sees is real time enough for them. Are you just being pedantic for the sake of being pedantic, or what?
I think words have meaning. When the author of the app says it's real time data and the description of the app calls it live data, I believed him, which prompted my comment re: terrorists liking the app.

As far as security, I don't claim to know better than the TSA or the DHS (the FAA isn't involved in security), but it's fair to ask the question - what exactly does adding a five minute delay really do? Nobody seems to be able to answer this.
The document I posted a link to is from the FAA, not TSA or DHS, so the FAA is involved. Given the propensity of terrorists to hijack planes and do other things that can kill large numbers of people, I'd think it'd be common sense not to tell them the exact coordinates of a commercial flight. Apparently, it's not common sense.

[eplchamps0304]

If its not real time, then the app should say so.

[dmr727]

The document I posted a link to is from the FAA, not TSA or DHS, so the FAA is involved. Given the propensity of terrorists to hijack planes and do other things that can kill large numbers of people, I'd think it'd be common sense not to tell them the exact coordinates of a commercial flight. Apparently, it's not common sense.

Well, the FAA is involved insofar as it's their technology. But they're not the ones making the rules. We'll just have to agree to disagree about the security thing. And I never said I have any common sense anyway. ;)

The irony here is that the five minute delay probably helps me more than just about anybody, so I'm not complaining that it's there. Heh!

[iFerd]

I bought this app just after Christmas and have found it very useful for my travel needs.

I didn't search like I should have, but are there threads like this one for other flight tracking applications? Ones that go on and on about potential contributions to terrorism? Why this one?

[return7]

$5 is steep? Let's see what else you could buy for $5.

-5 McChickens
-A plain white t-shirt
-A cheap paperback book
-Some batteries

I don't know if you live in the same world I live in, but you cannot buy anything for $5 anymore, yet people talk about $5-$10 applications like they are expensive.

Thanks for understanding the value of time put into apps, especially great ones like this. $5 is very little especially given the developer probably pays the data provider a substantial amount of the proceeds just to get the information. :) I couldn't have put it better myself.

[shigzeo]

i think considering the information is freely available if you know where to go, it does force the price to be frowned on a bit... helpful or not.