Late 2008 Macbook Pro HIDDEN PERFORMANCE DEFECT

lscangus · Nov 28, 2008

Everyone, please do this following experiemnt.

You will need 3 different software.

Prime95
Coretemp
Video Card Stability Test

Please boot to windows
Launch Prime 95, setup a 2 thread process
Open Coretemp

Now you will see your processor speed running at both core 100% With the Max CPU speed

Now, keep P95 open, and now launch Video Card Stability Test, and press start
Now you will see a 3D graphic on the left spinning.

And now notice the CPU speed in your Coretemp starts to throttle.

Mine does. Lets see whether yours will throttle or not?

This may well be one of the explaination of why the MBP has quite disappointing 3D Game performance. The computer runs finr with 100%CPU, or 100% GPU. Buti f both run at 100% together, the computer throttles itself. Please do spend some time to carry out this test. As snow leopard is the OS which we will all use in the future, which utilize full 100% CPU and GPU performace.

Angus

Ampidire · Nov 28, 2008

Um, this seems like pretty normal behavior to me, it's throttling because they're both on the same heatpipe and heat kills components.

The only game I could think of that might actually replicate this could be crysis; since it's actually optimized for multi-threaded proc's; but I play WoW and such on mine at 100fps for a few hours at a time with no slow downs at all, in OS X, but still...

You're digging pretty deep here imo.

Also 100% load on all components in just daily OS tasks (like snow leopard would help do on the GPU) would be ridiculous. Just doing word, itunes, firefox, and such leaves my CPU at say 10% max.... you've got to be kidding me that this is some how a defect...

Eidorian · Nov 28, 2008

Ampidire said:
Um, this seems like pretty normal behavior to me, it's throttling because they're both on the same heatpipe and heat kills components.

The only game I could think of that might actually replicate this could be crysis; since it's actually optimized for multi-threaded proc's; but I play WoW and such on mine at 100fps for a few hours at a time with no slow downs at all, in OS X, but still...

You're digging pretty deep here imo.

Also 100% load on all components in just daily OS tasks (like snow leopard would help do on the GPU) would be ridiculous. Just doing word, itunes, firefox, and such leaves my CPU at say 10% max.... you've got to be kidding me that this is some how a defect...

I think we've been over this one before too.

Might want to add Company of Heroes to that list as well.

cathyy · Nov 28, 2008

Left 4 Dead would easily hit 100% CPU usage.

Ampidire · Nov 28, 2008

Yeah, and this could also be very much the fault of Boot Camp drivers...

This isn't a defect; any laptop with a will to live would do this.

Prime95 hits a different level of load than L4D or any game would hit, as it's constant, never letting up, using everything the CPU has, all the instructions possible, etc.. a game wouldn't and doesn't do that.

And trying to run a full graphics benchmark isn't entirely run on the GPU the CPU does still have to work at that too, less, but still; so you're asking way too much of the CPU while it's hot; so it throttles, so it can cool down, and still complete the same tasks, albeit a little slower, but it does do that.

cathyy · Nov 28, 2008

Comes pretty dang close though.

But yea, I see your point. Pretty much nothing is going to be utilising 100% CPU usage forever.

lscangus · Nov 28, 2008

Anyone did the test?

Coz i think it is a bit wired... I know it throttles in order to survive. But, one thing i didn't say is the CPU actually didn't meet the 105'C magic temperature. Now that is strange.

Angus

7even · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
Anyone did the test?

Coz i think it is a bit wired... I know it throttles in order to survive. But, one thing i didn't say is the CPU actually didn't meet the 105'C magic temperature. Now that is strange.

Angus

Wouldn't you want it to throttle before reaching the "maximum-temp-before-risk-of-chip-getting-damaged" 105 degrees?

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

7even said:
Wouldn't you want it to throttle before reaching the "maximum-temp-before-risk-of-chip-getting-damaged" 105 degrees?

Why would u want it to throttle anyway? do you want a computer which rates 2.8Ghz running at half at that?

Angus

Ampidire · Nov 29, 2008

do you want your laptop chip to damage itself by reaching it's thermal load temp? i don't think so...

i'd rather it live...

this isn't some apple specific thing either, it's the design of the chip and it's chipset that contribute to this behavior, it's how they're made.

i can guarantee you'd rather your laptop boot tomorrow than have to throw out another 2500~ cause you fried it and it's your own fault.

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

Ampidire said:
do you want your laptop chip to damage itself by reaching it's thermal load temp? i don't think so...

i'd rather it live...

this isn't some apple specific thing either, it's the design of the chip and it's chipset that contribute to this behavior, it's how they're made.

i can guarantee you'd rather your laptop boot tomorrow than have to throw out another 2500~ cause you fried it and it's your own fault.

Well i think some of your logic is wrote, but you have missed the most important point. The point is because "may be" Apple didn't make their cooling system properly to cater the chip that Apple put in it, and that causes a degrading in speed and reliability. And it will be great if people can test this out and trying to figure out the real cause of this. Of course, it do it so it will survive, but do you want your computer to throttle back to 1 Mhz to survive? I bought a 2.8Ghz computer, not a sort of sometimes "theoretically" 2.8Ghz computer

Angus

gnasher729 · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
Anyone did the test?

Coz i think it is a bit wired... I know it throttles in order to survive. But, one thing i didn't say is the CPU actually didn't meet the 105'C magic temperature. Now that is strange.

Angus

I think the 105 degree Celsius switch isn't slowing down the processor - it turns the processor off. When you reach that temperature, Intel decided that your computer cooling system is broken, and to avoid damage to the expensive CPU, it is turned off.

7even · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
Why would u want it to throttle anyway? do you want a computer which rates 2.8Ghz running at half at that?

Angus

Seriously? The only reason the CPU is throttled at high temperatures is for protection. If you want to run Prime95 and the Video Card Stability Test at the same time, perhaps you should invest in a laptop cooler. You have two very hot chips sitting next to each other basically under one heatsink, where do you expect the heat to go ... ?

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

gnasher729 said:
I think the 105 degree Celsius switch isn't slowing down the processor - it turns the processor off. When you reach that temperature, Intel decided that your computer cooling system is broken, and to avoid damage to the expensive CPU, it is turned off.

No it won't. I had one Unibody MBP has a cooling problem which reaches 107'C.

Angus

7even said:
Seriously? The only reason the CPU is throttled at high temperatures is for protection. If you want to run Prime95 and the Video Card Stability Test at the same time, perhaps you should invest in a laptop cooler. You have two very hot chips sitting next to each other basically under one heatsink, where do you expect the heat to go ... ?

well, thats' why i just want to know how everyone's unibody MBP did. Is it just mine, or it is a design fault.

Angus

Eidorian said:
I think we've been over this one before too.

Might want to add Company of Heroes to that list as well.

Remember the post i had last time. I can confirm that the one i had before has a defect on the cooling, as well as on the battery cover and on the speakers. This one i think is fine. As i did test it with a few games in windows. and so far no throttling.

Is there any better way to test it?

Angus

synth3tik · Nov 29, 2008

Simply put commercial grade processors are not designed to run at 100% continuously

neonblue2 · Nov 29, 2008

Can anyone prove PC laptops don't do the same thing with similar or stronger components? This just seems like pretty obvious behaviour to me.

alphaod · Nov 29, 2008

Tell me what application uses 100% CPU and 100% GPU at the same time?

kolax · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
Of course, it do it so it will survive, but do you want your computer to throttle back to 1 Mhz to survive? I bought a 2.8Ghz computer, not a sort of sometimes "theoretically" 2.8Ghz computer.

If you wanted a computer to run at a constantly high processing frequency, then you should have bought a desktop.

The 2.8GHz processor in the MacBook Pro really does generate a lot of heat. It won't be as big an issue in the 17" model though.

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

Kilamite said:
If you wanted a computer to run at a constantly high processing frequency, then you should have bought a desktop.

The 2.8GHz processor in the MacBook Pro really does generate a lot of heat. It won't be as big an issue in the 17" model though.

If apple reli did made a mistake in designing their notebook, it will be a problem no matter what they are making

Angus

kolax · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
If apple reli did made a mistake in designing their notebook, it will be a problem no matter what they are making

Angus

Okay, would you rather have a portable power laptop like the MacBook Pro that is extremely thin and light, or the likes of the hugely thick (something like 4x as thick as the MacBook Pro and extremely heavy) Toshiba Qosmio X305

SnowLeopard2008 · Nov 29, 2008

Why do people get so pissed off at the beautifully designed Apple computers and try their very best to find a fault? As alphaod said, WHICH DAMN APP uses 100% CPU AND GPU at the same damn time? How often do you use that in a NOTEBOOK?

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

Kilamite said:
Okay, would you rather have a portable power laptop like the MacBook Pro that is extremely thin and light, or the likes of the hugely thick (something like 4x as thick as the MacBook Pro and extremely heavy) Toshiba Qosmio X305

I am sure there is a way to get everything to work properly in a thin and light notebook. and to be honest, is their responsibility to get things to work properly. I am not arguing with you whether the computer should run properly, as i buy my MBP is to USE, not just a piece of thing to show off to friends, and it seems there are a lot of people who buy it for this purpose it seems. I am looking for possible results, and solution. Not excuses

Angus

kolax · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
I am sure there is a way to get everything to work properly in a thin and light notebook. and to be honest, is their responsibility to get things to work properly. I am not arguing with you whether the computer should run properly, as i buy my MBP is to USE, not just a piece of thing to show off to friends, and it seems there are a lot of people who buy it for this purpose it seems. I am looking for possible results, and solution. Not excuses.

Okay, when you find a way to get all this power into a thin light case without generating heat issues, let us know

And you've failed to answer the questions a lot of people have been asking - name one single application that uses both 100% CPU and 100% GPU usage.

lscangus · Nov 29, 2008

Kilamite said:
Okay, when you find a way to get all this power into a thin light case without generating heat issues, let us know

And you've failed to answer the questions a lot of people have been asking - name one single application that uses both 100% CPU and 100% GPU usage.

that has been answered by some members in this page already. Like Life 4 dead

Angus

kolax · Nov 29, 2008

lscangus said:
that has been answered by some members in this page already. Like Life 4 dead.

100% CPU usage yes, but not 100% GPU usage. I encode video all the time and my CPU usage is 100%.

Tell me an application which uses 100% CPU and GPU.

Late 2008 Macbook Pro HIDDEN PERFORMANCE DEFECT

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