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beestigbeestje
Dec 1, 2008, 06:50 PM
I'm having lots of trouble recording live bands with Logic pro 8
I'm recording with an Presonus Firestudio project and a Presonus Firepod, set up as an aggregate device in audio/midi setup.
I tested it first at home with blank audio regions, and it recorded fine on my internal harddrive. ( 16 channels of simultanious audio) But when I tried to record the band that evening, Logic pro freezed an gave me the "disk is too slow or system overload error". Then I tried just recording 2 channels, and it didn't work either.The computer acted very strange, very unresponsive. Disabling the sudden motion sensor didn't help either, because I mostly record in very loud environments, and the vibrations could spark the head of my internal drive...
So I assumend my internal harddrive just wasn't fast enough, although I had read that you could easely record up to 24 channels simultaniously with the internal drive.


I've bought an external harddrive. The Lacie 2big dual in a striped RAID configuration, (2 bay harddrive) connected via eSata to my macbook pro, so I thought my worries would be long gone with such a speedy harddrive.
But even now Logic pro gives me the same error, recording 16 audiotracks at once. After an hour of trying things to work again and restarting my whole system, I could record to the external for a longer period. In logic I could see that Harddrive usage spiked constant to red.

So, basically, I'm trying to record 16 audiotracks simultaniously in logic pro with 2 audio interfaces, configured as aggregate device. I'm recording to an Lacie 2big Dual. (2disk RAID) in a striped RAID configuration using diskutillity.

The 2 drives in the external are 7200rpm and the external is connected via eSata to my macbook pro.
I'm running 10.5.5
Have the latest drivers for the audio interfaces.
Oh yeah, samplerate I'm recording to is 44,1 khz and 24 bit

Could anyone please help me with this, it is driving me crazy...



xparaparafreakx
Dec 1, 2008, 07:19 PM
Run Activity Monitor while you are using logic pro and look at the CPU use.

beestigbeestje
Dec 2, 2008, 04:04 AM
Run Activity Monitor while you are using logic pro and look at the CPU use.

Cpu usage doesn't go over 40%, I checked it.

beestigbeestje
Dec 3, 2008, 05:07 PM
If this could ring a bell to anybody,

I only get the error while recording when all the instruments and mics are plugged in to the soundcards.
I don't get the error if I record from the inputs of the soundcards, when nothing is attached to it, so recording blank regions.

..
thank you

Christopher11
Dec 4, 2008, 08:19 AM
well you've definitely got a great setup, good God. I don't think this should be happening. If this doesn't happen when there's no signal, then that's a clue. How hot are your levels? Could that be it? Also, are you monitoring through effects? If the CPU never goes over 40% (wish i could say that), then i think this is a problem you can resolve.

Have you tried this forum

http://community.sonikmatter.com/forums/

?

They're pretty knowledgeable over there.

xparaparafreakx
Dec 4, 2008, 01:03 PM
Have you try recording only one audio interface and see if it still chokes.

beestigbeestje
Dec 4, 2008, 02:01 PM
Have you try recording only one audio interface and see if it still chokes.

With one audio interface plugged-in, I have zero problems when recording.
The harddrive isn't choking at all..
When I use the 2 audio units at the same time, I can record blank regions without the harddrive choking, but, when I plug in mics, instruments,.. Logic says the harddrive is choking and the "disk is too slow error" occurs.

beestigbeestje
Dec 4, 2008, 02:09 PM
well you've definitely got a great setup, good God. I don't think this should be happening. If this doesn't happen when there's no signal, then that's a clue. How hot are your levels? Could that be it? Also, are you monitoring through effects? If the CPU never goes over 40% (wish i could say that), then i think this is a problem you can resolve.

Have you tried this forum

http://community.sonikmatter.com/forums/

?

They're pretty knowledgeable over there.

I'll check that forum right away, thanks!
I keep the levels always as loud as possible, without going into red. Could that be it? It sound a bit unbelievable.. I thought that, when levels were too loud, the ad/da convertors would clip and there would be digital distortion, not some sort of "harddrive slowlyness or something"?
I tried software monitoring, but I'm getting weird noise ad distortion on the outputs of the soundcards, sound like crap, don't know what is causing this too... could be I am overlooking something..
But I don't use any plugins while recording

Christopher11
Dec 4, 2008, 09:27 PM
Hey. Yeah, it's strange. To the hard drive, tracks of "blank" audio with no signal is still audio... same file size, for example, no matter how loud or soft. So it's interesting that it does this only when there is audible signal, but it's actually good that you included that detail, because that's what is going to clue those guys into what's going on, i think. Good luck.

xparaparafreakx
Dec 5, 2008, 12:29 AM
I know this might be too much work but if you have Live 7 or not, download the demo. Try recoding on Live 7 to see if you get the same hard drive problem. You will know when Live 7 goes crazy or your audio quality goes down.

beestigbeestje
Dec 6, 2008, 05:04 PM
I know this might be too much work but if you have Live 7 or not, download the demo. Try recoding on Live 7 to see if you get the same hard drive problem. You will know when Live 7 goes crazy or your audio quality goes down.

Well, I'm not really familiar with the user interface of Ableton live.

Could it have something to do with te clocksource ? It is set to device, and the presonus firestudio project's internal clock is used to sync.

TheSeal
Feb 5, 2009, 11:41 AM
I'm having the exact same problem. I get the 'disk too slow' error when I record my band's practices. I use a Presonus Firestudio Project into my Macbook Pro (2.2 intel, 2 GB ram). It will work for a while, maybe 10-15 minutes then start giving me the error. It works fine when there is no noise but as soon as we start playing it dies. I run 6 mics in and none of them clip. Even if I use 2 mics sometimes it gives the error. I thought it might be a ram issue so I restart occasionally. This didn't solve the problem.

Did you ever find a solution???

ChrisA
Feb 5, 2009, 11:47 AM
If this could ring a bell to anybody,

I only get the error while recording when all the instruments and mics are plugged in to the soundcards.
I don't get the error if I record from the inputs of the soundcards, when nothing is attached to it, so recording blank regions.

..
thank you

Silent audio compress real well and requires less Disk IO. Your problem is the disk as the CPU is only at 40%

"Everyone" always recommend that you never try and record audio data to the system start-up disk. Buy a fast Firewire disk drive and use that for recording. You may even need one of those RAID-0 "stripped" drives to support the data rate you want.

In any case the internal drive in a notebook computer is just not up to the task.

TheSeal
Feb 5, 2009, 01:07 PM
Thanks ChrisA. I was hoping that wasn't the case. How does an external work in this situation? I connect it to my laptop and record into the logic file from that drive? The signal would go from my Presonus box through my laptop and out to the drive then...and that's faster than the internal drive. Excuse my ignorance, I'm learning this as I go.

What hard drive RPMs are appropriate for writing 8 channels at once?

ChrisA
Feb 5, 2009, 02:24 PM
Thanks ChrisA. I was hoping that wasn't the case. How does an external work in this situation? I connect it to my laptop and record into the logic file from that drive? The signal would go from my Presonus box through my laptop and out to the drive then...and that's faster than the internal drive. Excuse my ignorance, I'm learning this as I go.

What hard drive RPMs are appropriate for writing 8 channels at once?

Quick answer disk drives are MUCh slower then the cables used to connect them.

RPM tells you how fast the drive spins. What you care about is how many bits fly under the read/write head per second and this is the product of the "bit density" and the tangential speed of the track on the drive. tangential speed depends on the RPM and how far the track is from the center of the disk. So make matters worse drive makers might change the bit density depending on distance from the center of the drive. OK the point is RPM tell you nothing it's just an easy to under stand number that is used for marketing drives to people. Ignore it and look further down the spec sheet to where it talks about "sustained IO rate".

sustained IO rate is the native speed of the platters and heads. Almost always this speed is much, much slower then the "interface speed". Interface speed says how fast data moves over the cable and into the drives on-board cache.

The other problem with recording to the internal drive is that the internal drive is also dong otherthings and is being shared. It acts as a swap file and programs load from it whereas the external drive ONLY has your audio files on it.

TheSeal
Feb 5, 2009, 03:46 PM
I didn't know that about hard drives. I always thought it was related to disk speed. A nice bit of misleading marketing here.

Are there specs you would recommend for this? USB 2.0, firewire, Brand of drive to look at, an IO rate that I should stay above?

This is really helpful, I've been having these problems for months and could never figure out what the deal was. It's really distracting when you are trying to play music and have to keep attending to your laptop. Losing good takes is frustrating.

What do you record ChrisA?

zimv20
Feb 5, 2009, 04:18 PM
Are there specs you would recommend for this? USB 2.0, firewire, Brand of drive to look at, an IO rate that I should stay above?


for 6 mics, at i'm assuming 44kHz or 48kHz sampling rate w/ 24-bit word depth, a firewire 400 drive will work fine. 7200 RPM is typical, but try to find one with 8 meg of buffer as opposed to 4.

i like the OWC drives (http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/firewire/1394/USB/EliteAL/400+USB2/) for remote work and backup. (in the studio, i use a second internal SATA drive).

i've not used USB2.0 for audio, perhaps others here can chime in. the only downside about the firewire 400 is in future-proofing.

LWalker1
Feb 28, 2009, 02:26 PM
Hi guys,
Im having the same problem as theseal mentions.
When i record with my internal microphone logic seems fine...
When i tried to record 3 channels of audio through my Yamaha o1x a get the message "Disk too slow"
Anyone got any ideas??
Cheers

gig2web
Mar 14, 2009, 05:23 PM
I have gotten skunked several times now in the field with the "system overload yada yada" error.... it seemed to have a sensitivity to the smokin'-ness of the jam... shutting down invariably in the peak moments :eek:

I am starting to think about power-draw and vibration as possible variables....

I spent last week making sure all my system and software are up to date.... tried drives that have been reliable in the past..... last nights outing had only one drop.... maybe three minutes into first set...

I am also looking at HD standalone recorders.... but I really don't need any more gear...

sagnier
Mar 16, 2009, 03:58 AM
its a bug. you're probably stuck with it.

gig2web
Mar 17, 2009, 10:35 AM
Do you have any other info? Similar experience? Who's bug? (Apple or presonus? or for me Mackie)

HD recorder is sounding like my solution...

For the disk too slow stuff to an external drive...... nine times out of ten it has been a from a non-Mac formatted drive as the culprit... Just erase the drive using disk utility and format with Mac OS extended...

If USB2 make sure your machine sees it that way.... USB1 is not fast enough....

noisegeek
Mar 18, 2009, 08:57 AM
Would be interesting to see if you get this resolved as that is quite strange.

Ive just hit exactly the same problem from out of nowhere.

Im recording 80+ tracks @ 48k / 24 bit via 2x rme hdsp madi pci cards direct into logic using a dedicated internal 500gb 7200rpm drive.

Had no problems at all, then now, all of a sudden Im getting this same error.

Ive mailed some people at apple, so if I hear anything useful back Ill post up here also, but I do not see why you would be getting this error with your set up and amount of tracks :confused:

After all my macbook pro can handle 56 channels on the internal no problems.

ChrisA
Mar 18, 2009, 12:05 PM
I have gotten skunked several times now in the field with the "system overload yada yada" error.... it seemed to have a sensitivity to the smokin'-ness of the jam... shutting down invariably in the peak moments :eek:

I am starting to think about power-draw and vibration as possible variables....

I spent last week making sure all my system and software are up to date.... tried drives that have been reliable in the past..... last nights outing had only one drop.... maybe three minutes into first set...

I am also looking at HD standalone recorders.... but I really don't need any more gear...

Are you writing the audio data to the disk in some compressed format? Only a few formats are not compressed. Silence compress a LOT but loud, complex music simply does not compress well and more data must be written to the disk.

The other think is the drivers for the audio interface. When one person can do 40 tracks and another can't do 16 I wonder if they are using the same audio drivers. There can be huge differences in the competence of the software engineers who wrote the drives.

beestigbeestje
Apr 10, 2009, 05:11 PM
Thanks Everyone for the input!

I can assure u it has nothing to do with harddrive speed.
I still get the "disk too slow" error even on my 2-disk Raid harddrive

But, If I set the I/O buffer of Logic pro to 1024 samples, Logic does nog freeze anymore.
And if I record at 96khz , setting the buffer down to 256, the harddrive perfomance indicator won't go into red anymore.
But this I still can't officially confirm, cause sometimes it works, sometimes it does not, it is a very weird problem in Logic pro
I have tried Cubase in the meanwhile and have encountered zero problems.
I would really like to stay with logic pro, because of the plugins, user interface, bla bla bla..

Ploki
Apr 13, 2009, 08:11 AM
which version of logic are you using?
i was recording 6 tracks 96khz 24bit on a 5400rpm disk, with 4gigabytes of free drive on my MBP.
and it went without a hitch for 2 hours (chuncks of 15minutes, than breaks).

oh yeah,buffersize 128.

logic 8.0.2, osx 10.5.6

echo audiofire8 connected with fw400>fw800 cable.

few ideas:
have you tried changing the "Clock source" in Audio/Midi setup? you may have a bad clock in presonus? (changing the master device basically)
Maybe Scripts are being ran in background.
Do you have enough memory? maybe your system is trying to page onto hard drive while recording.

beestigbeestje
Jun 9, 2009, 06:28 PM
which version of logic are you using?
i was recording 6 tracks 96khz 24bit on a 5400rpm disk, with 4gigabytes of free drive on my MBP.
and it went without a hitch for 2 hours (chuncks of 15minutes, than breaks).

oh yeah,buffersize 128.

logic 8.0.2, osx 10.5.6

echo audiofire8 connected with fw400>fw800 cable.

few ideas:
have you tried changing the "Clock source" in Audio/Midi setup? you may have a bad clock in presonus? (changing the master device basically)
Maybe Scripts are being ran in background.
Do you have enough memory? maybe your system is trying to page onto hard drive while recording.

I'm running Logic 8.0.2 and the latest version of leopard.
Het problem stil is not gone.. I tried a couple of weeks ago to record a band again.. failed yet again.
The common " disk too slow or system overload" error, then I increased the buffersize, and now everything seemed stable, But there was lot's of crackle in the audio. First I thought it was comming from the outputs of the ssoundcard itself, but just to be shure I checked it by listing to the audio itself in the finder via the build in output. The crackling was In the audio itself.
So you can choose for the " disk too slow or system overload" error by setting the buffer size lower.
Or, you can choose crackled audio with no interruptions on a higher buffersize.



I'm also strongly considering a standalone ADAT recorder. :(

My last hope : Snow leopard

myca
Jun 9, 2009, 08:02 PM
I'm running Logic 8.0.2 and the latest version of leopard.
Het problem stil is not gone.. I tried a couple of weeks ago to record a band again.. failed yet again.
The common " disk too slow or system overload" error, then I increased the buffersize, and now everything seemed stable, But there was lot's of crackle in the audio. First I thought it was comming from the outputs of the ssoundcard itself, but just to be shure I checked it by listing to the audio itself in the finder via the build in output. The crackling was In the audio itself.
So you can choose for the " disk too slow or system overload" error by setting the buffer size lower.
Or, you can choose crackled audio with no interruptions on a higher buffersize.



I'm also strongly considering a standalone ADAT recorder. :(

My last hope : Snow leopard

Try this program

BoomRecorder (http://www.vosgames.nl/products/BoomRecorder/)

It's great for field recording and uses little CPU overhead, if you're just recording live to edit and mix at a later date you can import all the audio tracks into a Logic session (or any other DAW) after the recording.

noisegeek
Jun 10, 2009, 06:07 AM
Silly question, but have you tried recording to just one disk, or just to your internal?

I finally found out via lots of trial and error that my problem was purely down to the disk being to slow. Basically topping out at 84 channels per drive.

Now I know you are only trying to record 16 channels, but maybe there is a disk buffer problem with using the raid configuration?

Just a thought

:confused:

djm042
Jun 10, 2009, 01:41 PM
I'm running Logic 8.0.2 and the latest version of leopard.
Het problem stil is not gone.. I tried a couple of weeks ago to record a band again.. failed yet again.
The common " disk too slow or system overload" error, then I increased the buffersize, and now everything seemed stable, But there was lot's of crackle in the audio. First I thought it was comming from the outputs of the ssoundcard itself, but just to be shure I checked it by listing to the audio itself in the finder via the build in output. The crackling was In the audio itself.
So you can choose for the " disk too slow or system overload" error by setting the buffer size lower.
Or, you can choose crackled audio with no interruptions on a higher buffersize.


I'm curious if your Logic project was set to record to a drive other than the boot drive. You can check that by loading the song in Logic, and going to File -> Project Settings -> Recording, and setting the recording folder (under "Core Audio").

Otherwise.. hmm... I'm kinda stumped. :confused: :(

patrick0brien
Jun 10, 2009, 04:15 PM
I get this error every time I've launched a master of any significant tracks, whether of audio or midi contents. It shows up once, I deal, then it doesn't show up again - until I relaunch another master.

To me, this particular situation smacks of a bug.

System:
Logic 8.0.2
MacPro 4x3core Xeon
Recording to second internal drive, 1tb 3gbps 7200RPM drive
10GB RAM
MOTU 828 MkII Interface

beestigbeestje
Jun 11, 2009, 06:58 AM
Silly question, but have you tried recording to just one disk, or just to your internal?

I finally found out via lots of trial and error that my problem was purely down to the disk being to slow. Basically topping out at 84 channels per drive.

Now I know you are only trying to record 16 channels, but maybe there is a disk buffer problem with using the raid configuration?

Just a thought

:confused:

The latest session I've tried to record was on my internal disk. Cause using an external drive or my RAID configuration just gives me the same errors.
Presonus has updated their drivers and software a couple of days ago so maybe this will bring the solution ! It's still in beta .. but who knows.
I'll also try this "boom recorder" application.
I have another gig coming up so I surely hope the problem is gone by then.
I've also bought a firewire 400 to 800 adapter and see how it goes..

beestigbeestje
Jun 11, 2009, 07:03 AM
I'm curious if your Logic project was set to record to a drive other than the boot drive. You can check that by loading the song in Logic, and going to File -> Project Settings -> Recording, and setting the recording folder (under "Core Audio").

Otherwise.. hmm... I'm kinda stumped. :confused: :(

Mostly I do it like this :
I open a project "new"
I configurate everything so it see's my aggregate device.
Than I arm all of the track and click record.
Now Logic asks me to set the recording destination.
Than I record a piece, and save my project.

Sometimes I set my recording path first, sometimes I forget..

noisegeek
Jun 21, 2009, 03:49 PM
You still getting these problems?

Ive figured out that my problem was literally the drive was too slow. Ive got the external FW800 drive maxed out at 85 tracks, any more and I get the drive to slow issues...

Another thing to check is what is the cache size of the drive you are using? As this is as important, if not more so than the rpm of the drive.

anp27
Jul 6, 2011, 03:45 PM
I got the 'disk too slow' message recently... I mistakenly thought that the stock hard drive that came with my MBP Quad i7 was a 7200 rpm drive, its actually a 5400 rpm one. So I guess my disk was actually too slow!!

Doctorbonny
Jul 11, 2011, 03:55 PM
Thanks Everyone for the input!

I can assure u it has nothing to do with harddrive speed.
I still get the "disk too slow" error even on my 2-disk Raid harddrive

But, If I set the I/O buffer of Logic pro to 1024 samples, Logic does nog freeze anymore.
And if I record at 96khz , setting the buffer down to 256, the harddrive perfomance indicator won't go into red anymore.
But this I still can't officially confirm, cause sometimes it works, sometimes it does not, it is a very weird problem in Logic pro
I have tried Cubase in the meanwhile and have encountered zero problems.
I would really like to stay with logic pro, because of the plugins, user interface, bla bla bla..

I recently had the same "disk is to slow message" with logic pro 9, while recording 8 tracks with the firestudio. What I don't understand is that it happened after 6 months of recording in exactly the same way. After the first time it happened, it just randomly comes back, sometimes with a superloud blasting sound from the monitors:eek:

beestigbeestje
Nov 22, 2011, 02:44 AM
Hi everyone!

Just wanted to say that all is fine now since I purchased another presonus firestudio project. They sync and Logic sees it as one big soundcard.
Apparently, firepods and firestudios don't go well together.

It's actually the whole "aggregate device" setup that doesn't work well with logic. Pops and clicks and system overloads..