Silencing My Camera

[wawanarchist]

Over the next week I will be shooting as a stills photographer at a local movie shooting. I have been talking to the director, and we are both concerned about the shutter noise being picked up by the boom mics. The simple solution for shooting outside is using my 70-200 2.8is and staying far back, but for the inside shots, I need a way to quiet my camera. I have looked all over for a 'sound blimp' for my Canon XTi (400d) but have found nothing, any ideas? My budget is $150.

[FX120]

I know that on the models with live view, while using live view (mirror locked up), you can release the shutter with much less noise.

[compuwar]

My budget is $150.

A. Get a bigger budget and rent a camera/blimp combo.
B. Have them do the occasional re-take or practice pre-take of a scene for stills.
C. Try something like this: http://www.whistlerweddingphotos.com/blimp.html
D. Buy a point and shoot with an electronic shutter that you can turn all the sounds off on.

[compuwar]

I know that on the models with live view, while using live view (mirror locked up), you can release the shutter with much less noise.

Shutter noise is still the same, and what goes up (the mirror) must come down- and must go up in the first place, so you'll have the same noise, just spaced out some and likely not quiet enough for a set.

It's possible that just taking shots when nobody is speaking might be good enough for some sound editing if it's ok with the post-production crew. But the best bet on a low budget is just to do a few extra takes for the photographer.

[wawanarchist]

Damn, Not the answers I hoped for, but I assumed my camera would not be nice enough to have blimps made for it... My budget is so limited because we're already renting a 70-200 for $70 and I had to upgrade to a battery grip $90 and a new battery for the extended shooting $40... So I can't really afford to rent a new camera, Looks like I might have to settle for asking for retakes, any other ideas?

[Cliff3]

What about this thing? Adorama link (http://www.adorama.com/CZM.html) and Galbraith link (http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/content_page.asp?cid=7-3408-3436) It looks like it will be pretty roomy for your body, but maybe if you stuff it with some more foam?

[AlaskaMoose]

Shutter noise is still the same, and what goes up (the mirror) must come down- and must go up in the first place, so you'll have the same noise, just spaced out some and likely not quiet enough for a set.

It's possible that just taking shots when nobody is speaking might be good enough for some sound editing if it's ok with the post-production crew. But the best bet on a low budget is just to do a few extra takes for the photographer.

There is a sound reduction feature for Live View, at least on the 40D. However, there still is some noise left from the shutter. On Live View, the mirror has already been flipped out of the way, so the only sound left is from the shutter moving. In the 40D (Live View mode), you can reduce noise as follows:

-Mode 1: Mirror stays locked and out of the way, and the shutter's noise is reduced, but it allows for continuous shooting (burst).
-Mode 2: This mode reduces shutter noise further (only a slight click is heard), but continuous shooting is not possible.

I don't know if he can do the same with his XSi. Maybe he should read the manual further?

[Pikemann Urge]

From what I've been told by people who do this kind of work a blimp is a must unless the film crew gives you explicit permission to do otherwise. In theory doing without a blimp is okay but in practice you might find out it's better to actually have one.

If, say, you're shooting stage rehearsals, something like a camera muzzle will do fine. That merely reduces camera noise. A blimp pretty much totally eliminates it.

[arogge]

You really need a sound blimp unless you've been told otherwise. One method of reducing the noise is to wrap the camera body in a towel or anything else that muffles sound. The problem is that this blocks access to the camera and it's still not totally quiet. The Silent Mode shooting or shooting with the mirror raised is not quiet enough for your subject.

[arogge]

Adorama link (http://www.adorama.com/CZM.html)

That looks interesting, and the price tag isn't too bad. :cool:

[wheelhot]

Hmm, I thought the 40D and above has some shutter function which is meant to reduce the noise produced by the shutter (for shooting without people noticing)? As far as I know, this feature is not found on the 450D and below

[arogge]

The shutter always makes the same amount of noise. The Silent Mode reduces the noise from the mirror slap, which is still noisy in some conditions.

[AlaskaMoose]

Hmm, I thought the 40D and above has some shutter function which is meant to reduce the noise produced by the shutter (for shooting without people noticing)? As far as I know, this feature is not found on the 450D and below

Yes it does as I explained above. All you hear is a very faint "clik" sound. It's very quiet, but as others have said, he may have to use a "blimp." No idea of what this was until I look at a photo of one :)

[AlaskaMoose]

The shutter always makes the same amount of noise. The Silent Mode reduces the noise from the mirror slap, which is still noisy in some conditions.

No, it doesn't (at least not the 40D).

[ppc_michael]

I appreciate your concern for this problem. I shot a film not too long ago, and some of the audio on our best takes were ruined by the shutters of photographers that were there.

It was all fixable, but it's certainly an annoyance in post. Thank you for making sure you have that taken care of. ;)

[jake-g]

You could rent a 5dmk2. Seems to work well for single shots.

[arogge]

No, it doesn't (at least not the 40D).

The Silent Mode slows the shutter action, but the most significant sound-reduction is in the mirror slap. The clicking of the shutter mechanism is much less of an annoyance than the slapping of the mirror. The difference between using Silent Mode and shooting at 8 fps with the mirror-lockup active is negligible.

[wheelhot]

You could rent a 5dmk2. Seems to work well for single shots.

Wow, as far as I heard the 5dmk2 is still not widely available, yet it is already available for rents?

[wawanarchist]

What about this thing? Adorama link (http://www.adorama.com/CZM.html) and Galbraith link (http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/content_page.asp?cid=7-3408-3436) It looks like it will be pretty roomy for your body, but maybe if you stuff it with some more foam?

I sent the director the links, see what he thinks... I'm gonna hate shooting in these things, but I guess its necessary, thanks for sending the links.

I appreciate your concern for this problem. I shot a film not too long ago, and some of the audio on our best takes were ruined by the shutters of photographers that were there.

It was all fixable, but it's certainly an annoyance in post. Thank you for making sure you have that taken care of. ;)

I heard that it was a problem, and both the director and I are working very hard to make this as much of a success as possible, last thing we need is a shutter sound in the middle of dialouge... This is proving to be quite a hastle though.


Thank you all for the tips about keeping my mirror up, but I need complete silence, cutting it in half is not enough, a shutter sound could ruin a dramatic moment, or make dialogue hard to understand, so I'm looking for the best I can afford. Thanks for all of the advise though, I look forward to trying everything listed here.

[wheelhot]

Oh and it seems in the midst of shutter noise discussion we forgot about the focusing noise.

Okay, to the OP, what lens are you currently using or have at your disposal?

Here are 2 things I suggest, use MF if your lens is not a USM lens but this will be a hassle cause MF is slower then AF, get/rent USM lens, its fast and its silent.

[FF_productions]

If all else fails, you can snap a shot right after the directors calls "Cut", or even the director directing the cast, lots of good shots come with that.

Let's hope those devices can silence the camera so you don't have to use work-arounds.

[hhlee]

i've been following this thread with interest... looking forward to seeing how well it works or does not work come shoot day.

[wawanarchist]

Oh and it seems in the midst of shutter noise discussion we forgot about the focusing noise.

Okay, to the OP, what lens are you currently using or have at your disposal?

Here are 2 things I suggest, use MF if your lens is not a USM lens but this will be a hassle cause MF is slower then AF, get/rent USM lens, its fast and its silent.

The two main lenses I will be using are my

Tokina 28-80 2.8 Af Pro... Its a pretty quiet lens, and has great MF, so we'll see how it works, I plan to use it for most indoor shooting

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8 L IS USM... Enough said. This lens rocks and will be used for all outdoor shooting, and as much indoor shooting as possible. I have not seen the location yet (out shooting a Jeep trek on the day...) so I'll have to wait until Monday to see the set.

I'll keep everyone updated on how this turns out, the director has still not gotten back to me about the blimp suggested here.

[tcphoto]

There is no better way than with the blimp. You have to silence the mirror and shutter noise and it's not an item that is widely produced. It costs what it costs. If it's that big of a deal, perhaps the Producer can rent one and bury it in the other expenses.

[compuwar]

There is no better way than with the blimp. You have to silence the mirror and shutter noise and it's not an item that is widely produced. It costs what it costs. If it's that big of a deal, perhaps the Producer can rent one and bury it in the other expenses.

They don't make a blimp for the 400D, so you also have to include a camera rental in the equation, increasing the cost.

[Regis27]

You could try making your own blimp:
http://www.whistlerweddingphotos.com/blimp.html

or what about using one of those waterproof cases for diving and putting foam inside?

[Digital Skunk]

Get a point and shoot camera....

Like Compuwar said. The cheapest solution you can find.

[wawanarchist]

Get a point and shoot camera....

Like Compuwar said. The cheapest solution you can find.

My XTi may not be a pro camera, but theres no way a POS Point and shoot can stand up to it. My director seems to be somewhat drunk right now, so I'll have to wait until tomorrow for any definitive answers, but as of now we will commence shooting with no blimp and see how it goes.

I have a feeling outdoor shots will be fine. With my 70-200 I can get far back and my shutter will be masked by normal outdoor noises. Indoors we may have to resort to shooting each scene twice, or skip stills on less important scenes. The cast gets into town on Monday night, I'll get to see the location then. Pictures and updates will follow. Filming begins tuesday (right after I buy my new iMac)

[wheelhot]

I have a feeling outdoor shots will be fine. With my 70-200 I can get far back and my shutter will be masked by normal outdoor noises. Indoors we may have to resort to shooting each scene twice, or skip stills on less important scenes. The cast gets into town on Monday night, I'll get to see the location then. Pictures and updates will follow. Filming begins tuesday (right after I buy my new iMac)

Great! except for the bold part, do you need the iMac urgently? Cause if not wait till after MacWorld, then you could get a discount if the update is not that mind blowing or you could get a brand new - fresh from the oven iMac :cool:

[wawanarchist]

Great! except for the bold part, do you need the iMac urgently? Cause if not wait till after MacWorld, then you could get a discount if the update is not that mind blowing or you could get a brand new - fresh from the oven iMac :cool:

If there is a new iMac from macworld, it should come out on tuesday, after the keynote. It is my plan to wait for the new one.

[arogge]

I was somewhat doubtful about the effectiveness of the Cranston Camera Muzzle, but now I'm interested in buying at least one of them. How much reduction in sound can I expect? Is the camera LCD still usable for Live View with the plastic cover over the screen? How would I change memory cards from the back of the camera? I did a quick search, but I only got copies of old informational releases with short reviews and didn't find what I needed, like a manufacturer's Website. Are there opinions on this Camera Muzzle product from actual use? Where is the product's Website?

[Pikemann Urge]

Arogge, the Camera Muzzle can be ordered from at least two places. Links at the bottom of this review:

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/content_page.asp?cid=7-7894-8326

I find it okay. It's not magic. It muffles the sound, not deadens it. I ordered mine from Roberts as I could not find it here in Melbourne.

I have an idea about noise-free cameras that don't need blimps or mufflers. That camera does not exist. But the micro 4/3 SLRs with interchangable lenses are close to it (and you should be able to use existing lenses, such as Nikon's wonderful 105mm f/1.8, with an adapter).

[arogge]

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/content_page.asp?cid=7-7894-8326

But, how quiet is it? What does the camera sound like when using this product? How do you open the memory card compartment?

Is there some documentation other than a 3-year-old cursory review from which I can learn more about this Cranston product? The links on that R.G. page don't work. Adorama has the product, but before I go to that store, I'd really like to see a complete product description with specifications.

[S-Man]

I, too was thinking perhaps you could fab up your own 'blimp' out of some type of box, like tupperware, lined with HD foam (which you can get at craft/fabric stores) and you could make a tube for the lens out of PVC and put foam on the outside of that.
The XTi/400D's shutter is already pretty darn quiet, (kind of a "ss-kzz") so it shouldn't be difficult to really muffle it further. Also, I think they make a wired shutter release for them so if you use one of those, you don't have to worry about pressing the shutter button through the box.
I have an Idea in my head, but execution is a different thing...

The 70-200 2.8L IS is an awesome lens. I'm totally in love with it.
With the battery grip, you shouldn't have to change batteries all night, and if you get like an 8-gig CF card, you should be fine all night as well.

As for the "silent mode" on DSLR's, as far as I know, only the MKIII's have this feature, and it's kind of a small 'click- ta' (http://media.the-digital-picture.com/Sounds/Canon-EOS-1D-Mark-III-Soft.mp3) sound. It's actually called the "Soft Feature".
Go HERE (http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-Digital-SLR-Camera-Reviews.aspx) and they have sounds of a bunch of different Canon's.

Definitely keep us updated as to how this turns out.

[ajpl]

I realise the OP has probably done the job by now, but I'd thought I'd add some pointers for future reference as I've done a fair bit of stills work on films.

Blimps, I've never used one, as shooting during a take is something I'd have no interest in doing. Several reasons, you can get in the way or distract the actors, you may need to be where the camera is if you want to reproduce the shot accurately, you cannot direct the subject, the lighting will be set up for when the film camera is...lots of reasons. So I usually shoot after last take of any set-up. Now some 1st ADs [assistant Directors] will say there's no time to do stills between set ups, there invariably is, but you have to be able to work quickly. Very quickly. If you get this issue, it will indicate you are working with an idiot, who doesn't know the job properly and you will have to work extra hard to get your shots. Sadly these fools also usually think being a 1st AD is a way of becoming a director. The 1st AD's job is more that of a set manager/organiser/logistics, very little to do with film directing and the good ones know that. The 1st AD is your most important friend, so even if they are an idiot try not to piss them off. Though I did tell when to get stuffed once, as he was a particularly talentless numptie.
Shooting stills is a thankless task at best of times, as you are normally completely irrelevant to to the task at hand, i.e. getting the film made, but ironically are of vital importance in getting a film sold. And everyone thinks their job is the most important, when in fact all the jobs are important, even the runners'.

To do a good job , you need to take images that look like how the DoP wants the film to look [much easier with RAW] and the hard bit, to be able tell the story of a scene in single take or even better capture a defining moment/aspect of the film.
I will take actors to one side and do my own set ups if necessary or rejig the blocking of a scene to suit a stills image. A film is made up of shots that are spliced together to tell a story, you have to learn to do it in a single shot.
I suggest reading the script, thoroughly, speak to the director/producer/DoP about look/feel/intent..etc and remember the producer is the boss, not the director. I also always watch the monitor during takes so a to get a sense of how film is being shot and to see what moment if any I need to recreate for stills.

You need to be able to work very long hours, be able to get on with tired and stressed people and be very patient. Hurry up and wait is what you end up doing. Though being an actor is the most boring job, as you have to wait for the rest of us to get setup.

[ajpl]

Get a point and shoot camera....

Like Compuwar said. The cheapest solution you can find.But although they may be very quiet, they usually emit red beams onto subjects when it's a bit dark! :eek: Not a good way to impress the camera crew.
Also the low light sensitivity is usually awful and the results poor at anything bar base ISOs and as film sets tend to be somewhat lacking in light unless outdoors, you will struggle.

I forgot to mention this above, a camera with very good high ISO ability is a must if shooting indoors or on set as films are lit for 1/50th and wide-ish apertures like T1.2/T2 are not unusual to be used.
BTW, a T stop is like an F stop, but accurately measured. IIRC, an F-stop is the theoretical amount and the T-stop the actual amount of light passing through the aperture. T is for transmission.