iPhone 3.0 to Get MMS, Tethering, and Finally... Copy and Paste?

[OllyW]

Rotating applications with the accelerometer is also pretty slow. Other phones, such as the Pre or Storm, are much quicker, and give a more responsive feel.

It's works really quick in the iPhone TV adverts. ;)

[wardev]

U know wat???? After reading 4 pages of comments I have figured this one thing out...

Despite the fact that the iPhone was the phone that was an iPod, phone, and miniature computer with an incredibly responsive touchscreen and amazing UI. we have still managed to complain about something!! The MR community can do anything!! WE ARE SUPERIOR!!!!

[TuffLuffJimmy]

U know wat???? After reading 4 pages of comments I have figured this one thing out...

Despite the fact that the iPhone was the phone that was an iPod, phone, and miniature computer with an incredibly responsive touchscreen and amazing UI. we have still managed to complain about something!! The MR community can do anything!! WE ARE SUPERIOR!!!!

Are you saying there's nothing to complain about? It's not like everyone here is saying it's the worst phone ever.

[bruinsrme]

U know wat???? After reading 4 pages of comments I have figured this one thing out...

Despite the fact that the iPhone was the phone that was an iPod, phone, and miniature computer with an incredibly responsive touchscreen and amazing UI. we have still managed to complain about something!! The MR community can do anything!! WE ARE SUPERIOR!!!!

You can put all the engine, transmission and paint on a luxury car but would you put manual roll down windows and just an AM radio in it. you would if yu were apple.
IMO that is what they did with the iphone, they left out too many should haves.

[Compile 'em all]

How would copy and paste do this? and if you don't want background apps don't let them run in the background. Just kill it when you're done.

Your line of thinking is pretty much how MS thinks and is why most of their products are garbage. Having the user "let" and "kill" apps will just make things more complex since they user now will need to start "worrying" or "thinking" about what is running and what not. I am not arguing that having background tasks is something I don't want but this mentality you are demonstrating is exactly what separates Microsoft and other companies from Apple and the way they go about their products.

[automan98]

I would like to see copy and paste on the iPhone. While there's a lot of frustration with not having copy and paste there are so many other critical enhancements and bug fixes to make. I would much rather see copy and paste not implemented or put on hold to have other features and updates. I don't get the copy and paste obsession. It's not as if it was ever on the device. Nice to have, but not as critical as addressing other areas.

[bruinsrme]

Your line of thinking is pretty much how MS thinks and is why most of their products are garbage. Having the user "let" and "kill" apps will just make things more complex since they user now will need to start "worrying" or "thinking" about what is running and what not. I am not arguing that having background tasks is something I don't want but this mentality you are demonstrating is exactly what separates Microsoft and other companies from Apple and the way they go about their products.

Cmon you're holding back, tell us how you really feel:p

[kdarling]

... is exactly what separates Microsoft and other companies from Apple and the way they go about their products.

Okay, so one company protects its customers from too much complexity and choice. The other requires the customer to think and choose for themselves.

Which way is better depends on the customer. My wife needs simple things. As for me, I have no problem manually shutting down apps in return for extra abilities.

Somewhere in-between would be nice.

[iSurgeon]

What star trek world do you live in??? Most cell phones don't do email. Everyone I know sends photo texts with MMS, not email. And there are no problems between (major) carriers. And it's not 1990...Most phones didn't get MMS until 5/6 years ago.


All of my family and friends ARE able to send photos to me via email ... they just need to learn about their cell phones' capabilities. They tell me they can't do it, but, with a little research, they've found that they, in fact, CAN send photos via email. Just because people don't know how to do it doesn't mean it can't be done. I'm sure there are crappy cell phones out there that can't, but none of the people I want to get photos from can't do it.

AT&T's solution to the lack of MMS is laughable. After I got the first SMS notification of an awaiting MMS message, I called the sender and told them to email it to me. Email is so much easier to deal with. It doesn't require a cellular connection and I can view it on a computer. And let's face the facts ... if you have AT&T, you shouldn't count on cellular service.

MMS was already a dinosaur, albeit a very popular one, when it was first introduced. You weren't supposed to take the "so 1990s" statement literally. It's a statement us old folks use to say that something is antiquated. Here's another example. If you see someone wearing an out-of-date fashion, you might say "Mr. Peabody, set the Wayback Machine to the 1990s!", even though the clothing might only be a few years old.

And if people don't like the way the built-in Mail app sends photos, let me introduce you to a place I like to call "The App Store". There are alternatives!

[bruinsrme]

All of my family and friends ARE able to send photos to me via email ... they just need to learn about their cell phones' capabilities. They tell me they can't do it, but, with a little research, they've found that they, in fact, CAN send photos via email. Just because people don't know how to do it doesn't mean it can't be done. I'm sure there are crappy cell phones out there that can't, but none of the people I want to get photos from can't do it.

AT&T's solution to the lack of MMS is laughable. After I got the first SMS notification of an awaiting MMS message, I called the sender and told them to email it to me. Email is so much easier to deal with. It doesn't require a cellular connection and I can view it on a computer. And let's face the facts ... if you have AT&T, you shouldn't count on cellular service.

MMS was already a dinosaur, albeit a very popular one, when it was first introduced. You weren't supposed to take the "so 1990s" statement literally. It's a statement us old folks use to say that something is antiquated. Here's another example. If you see someone wearing an out-of-date fashion, you might say "Mr. Peabody, set the Wayback Machine to the 1990s!", even though the clothing might only be a few years old.

And if people don't like the way the built-in Mail app sends photos, let me introduce you to a place I like to call "The App Store". There are alternatives!

heard that all before and to be honest if its old technology it works very well. Not everyonehas free email/internet access on their phones. ATT charges users to access anything involving the internet. But media net includes MMS from non email acccounts.
Until the providers give all subscribers free email access then MMS will stil be a viable service. Regardless since the iphone is so leaps and bounds ahead of all the other phones well just do without.

[destroyboredom]

I'll take the wait and see approach to the 3.0 update.

However I am willing to bet that cover flow gets added to least one more app. Contacts maybe? I don't use CF but apple seems to be in love with it lately.

[joeshell383]

All of my family and friends ARE able to send photos to me via email ... they just need to learn about their cell phones' capabilities. They tell me they can't do it, but, with a little research, they've found that they, in fact, CAN send photos via email. Just because people don't know how to do it doesn't mean it can't be done. I'm sure there are crappy cell phones out there that can't, but none of the people I want to get photos from can't do it.


Well good for you.

[parobbie]

CUPS printing over wifi?

[bruinsrme]

CUPS printing over wifi?

excellent....that would be nice

[X38]

This could be implemented as an app, yes... unless you mean app management, which would require an OS upgrade. Of course, it would be limited to managing its own files due to the sandbox restrictions, and therefore wouldn't be of much use - UNLESS its purpose was to enable transfer of arbitrary files from one place to another, via an iPhone or iPod touch.

I meant file management as you guessed, not app management. Just enough of the finder to save email attachments to folders, load attachments from folders, open files from folders in the appropriate applications, and move files to and from computers or memory sticks that the iphone is connected too. Please pardon my ignorance if such an application already exists.

[X38]

Er - has everyone mostly missed the Magenetometer info?



If it's true, that is HUGE potentially.
Tonchidot
Enkin ( who have been *very* quiet for a few months. GOOG / AAPL buy out? http://androidguys.com/?p=2174 http://www.intomobile.com/2008/04/22/interview-enkin-augmented-reality-for-googles-android.html)
Sat Nav
Google Latitude
Google Maps
Google Street View

Your phone new v3 iPhone would know which direction you were facing. And where you were. Add in strong GPU, and a video camera?

Wow. Castles in the sky just got hinted to be closer. We'll see. But I say that Enkin would push C&P desire into a cocked hat.
If Google can help do Mars and Earth in Google app, if there wasn't a competition legal problem, why not branch out into mapping?

Enkin video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2V6MNp_tWG0

No, didn't miss it. Have been hoping for just that. Very excited about it. Hope it's true. Would go a long way towards convincing me to upgrade from my first generation iphone. Lots of interesting possibilities.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Your line of thinking is pretty much how MS thinks and is why most of their products are garbage. Having the user "let" and "kill" apps will just make things more complex since they user now will need to start "worrying" or "thinking" about what is running and what not. I am not arguing that having background tasks is something I don't want but this mentality you are demonstrating is exactly what separates Microsoft and other companies from Apple and the way they go about their products.

oh you're right. Thank god Apple isn't giving us options! :rolleyes:
It's adorable that you said I'm like Microsoft, that's a good way to make anything I say seem like nonsense (in this forum). Next you'll start calling someone a fanboy, right?

It's great that they don't give us:
copy/cut/paste
MMS
video recording
a good camera
app multitasking (at least daemons!)
push notifications
SMS forwarding

Thank god they don't give us options! At least the app store has forty fart apps, two hundred flashlights and a thousand tip calculators.

[rockosmodurnlif]

I'll take the wait and see approach to the 3.0 update.

However I am willing to bet that cover flow gets added to least one more app. Contacts maybe? I don't use CF but apple seems to be in love with it lately.
They certainly do don't they? I don't use it either though.

But how many apps are people carrying on their phones that they need folders? I only have two screens. Am I abnormal?

The only backgrounding I'd like is audio not from an iPod being able to play in the background.

[Michael CM1]

CUPS printing over wifi?

I have no clue what "CUPS" is, but I definitely think printing would rock. I just got an HP printer with built-in WiFi, and it sho is nice to finally have a printer that works on all three computers (2 Macs, 1 Dell). Apple should definitely be able to work in IP printing at some point soon.

As for the poster who recently mentioned adding cover flow, who wants to bet the Mail app gets it soon? That may actually be useful if it works fast.

[3goldens]

What will be there be to complain about I wonder after they, Apple, have finally given us everyting we want on the os of the ipone.

reduce the rate plan, the service?

I cant wait to see their strategy after everything is released and available, whenever that will be.

[headfuzz]

I would like to see copy and paste on the iPhone. While there's a lot of frustration with not having copy and paste there are so many other critical enhancements and bug fixes to make. I would much rather see copy and paste not implemented or put on hold to have other features and updates. I don't get the copy and paste obsession. It's not as if it was ever on the device. Nice to have, but not as critical as addressing other areas.

I'm sure it's been pointed out before but copy and paste, MMS, video recording and tethering have been available for the iPhone for ages now. You just had to jailbreak the device to install these applications. Apple could have pleased a lot of customers a long time ago by either buying the rights to these pieces of software and/or hiring the developers, the way they did with the folk that created Cover Flow; or at very least not have been so ridiculously restrictive with the App Store.

None of the Apps in question (Clippy, Swirly MMS, Cycorder and PDANet respectively in my case, though there are others out there) would have diverted Apple's resources from fixing other parts of their OS and apps.

Waiting for the 3rd major release of the OS to implement what have been pretty much industry standard functionality for this class of phone for several years now is ridiculous.

[firewood]

It's great that they don't give us:
copy/cut/paste
MMS
video recording
a good camera
app multitasking (at least daemons!)
push notifications
SMS forwarding

Thank god they don't give us options!


They certainly did give you an option. You weren't forced to buy an iPhone. You could have got a WinMob, PalmOS, Android or Berry phone with many of the above features.

But which phone is selling better? That points at the decisions which provided the best, on average, option to the market.

[iSurgeon]

Well good for you.

Yes, it is! Thanks!

[RobbRock]

This is probably a noob question but is the software going to be released on tuesday or on a later date?

[firewood]

The bulk of the postings here just prove the thesis of the Innovator's Dilemma. Listen to your customers and the vast majority of them (have no imagination whatsoever and) will suggest ideas that are about to become obsolete and eventually drive your company into bankruptcy.

Henry Ford once said: "If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse."

...add to that MMS, cut & paste, and dual buggy whip holders...

[sunfast]

This is probably a noob question but is the software going to be released on tuesday or on a later date?

Afraid not - Tuesday is just a preview, we won't see the software for a while

[swagi]

U know wat???? After reading 4 pages of comments I have figured this one thing out...

Despite the fact that the iPhone was the phone that was an iPod, phone, and miniature computer with an incredibly responsive touchscreen and amazing UI. we have still managed to complain about something!! The MR community can do anything!! WE ARE SUPERIOR!!!!

Well, could be due to the fact, that the Jesus phone doesn't work as in the commercials. Safari freezes, extreme keyboard lags and sometimes 2-3 seconds, 'til the screen rotates - these are some of the things I experienced during my short time with my wife's iPhone.

And the MMS and C&P-debate - oh, come on. Just stop it, will ya. Those features are left out, and if you need them, go and grab another handset. There are plenty on the market, you know. (Disclaimer: I'm in the market to upgrade, but loss of MMS is a deal breaker for me. So I guess if 3.0 doesn't deliver, I'll get a Pre, Storm, G1, Omnia HD or Xperia).

[swagi]

All of my family and friends ARE able to send photos to me via email ... they just need to learn about their cell phones' capabilities. They tell me they can't do it, but, with a little research, they've found that they, in fact, CAN send photos via email. Just because people don't know how to do it doesn't mean it can't be done. I'm sure there are crappy cell phones out there that can't, but none of the people I want to get photos from can't do it.

AT&T's solution to the lack of MMS is laughable. After I got the first SMS notification of an awaiting MMS message, I called the sender and told them to email it to me. Email is so much easier to deal with. It doesn't require a cellular connection and I can view it on a computer. And let's face the facts ... if you have AT&T, you shouldn't count on cellular service.

MMS was already a dinosaur, albeit a very popular one, when it was first introduced. You weren't supposed to take the "so 1990s" statement literally. It's a statement us old folks use to say that something is antiquated. Here's another example. If you see someone wearing an out-of-date fashion, you might say "Mr. Peabody, set the Wayback Machine to the 1990s!", even though the clothing might only be a few years old.

And if people don't like the way the built-in Mail app sends photos, let me introduce you to a place I like to call "The App Store". There are alternatives!

I don't know about the U.S. tariffs, but I guess some of your relatives will be quite pissed, when they find out that sending a MMS is way cheaper for them then sending data over the net.

Not everybody has a data flatrate, you know.

[t0mat0]

Could we see 2.2.2 ?
2.2.1 came "out of nowhere" last time.
http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/01/27/iphone-221-firmware-released/

2.2 in December giving:
Google Street View, Public transit & walking directions, address of dropped pin, some general bug fixing, podcasts available for download in iTunes application, better Safri stability, Home button going to 1st screen
isual Voicemail messages

[skinnylegs]

The iPhone has been out for almost two years and I don't see much of a difference between the initial offering and the current iteration. I'm sad to say my iPhone is looking a bit.....dated.

IMHO the current UI is pretty ugly. The default Home screen overwhelms you with icons and if you choose to move unused icons/apps. over to another screen, you're left with this *beautiful* black background. How about allowing for some nice wallpapers and make that the center of attention? Furthermore, how about letting me decide *where* I want to put the 3-4 icons I want on my primary screen. Honestly, I'd even like to see an option for turning off the bottom "bar" of icons (whatever you call that area). I'm not a programmer but I don't think it would require that much of a leap to accomplish what I have described and it would allow me to make the iPhone *my* phone.

I don't really use what I refer to as fringe applications very often and I must admit that I'm pretty happy with the core applications such as the phone itself, Mail, text messaging and Safari. I'm sure there's room for improvement but overall I think Apple gets it in terms of core apps.

The last thing I want to speak to is MMS. This feature should be available on the iPhone and any argument otherwise is pretty lame. Feel free to talk in *theory* but the *reality* is that for "sharing the moment", most people use MMS.

EDIT:

I just saw a video on the Sprint Pre and I must admit that I was pretty impressed. I'm not ready to ditch my iPhone but if 3.0 underwhelms.....

[mwarner]

They certainly did give you an option. You weren't forced to buy an iPhone. You could have got a WinMob, PalmOS, Android or Berry phone with many of the above features.

But which phone is selling better? That points at the decisions which provided the best, on average, option to the market.

I reject this logic. The iPhone is selling well because of the outstanding UI. Apple has historically raised the bar in all of its products in overall design, simplicity, and clean UI. We as Apple customers have the right to complain about shortcomings to Apple products and to encourage them to get it right in the 2nd or 3rd iteration of their product line. When/if Apple responds, I can only see a benefit to them with increased sales beyond what they see now. Telling people to buy the "other guys'" product if they are not happy is the ultimate cop-out and is doomed for failure. Apple has surpassed its competition in overall design and it makes no sense to expect customers to fall back to an inferior product for some features that have been shown can be implemented on the iPhone.

[parobbie]

[QUOTE=Michael CM1;7270186]I have no clue what "CUPS" is, but I definitely think printing would rock. I just got an HP printer with built-in WiFi, and it sho is nice to finally have a printer that works on all three computers (2 Macs, 1 Dell). Apple should definitely be able to work in IP printing at some point soon.

Common Unix Printing System, open source set of print drivers which Apple bought the rights to several years ago, as far as your HP goes they've made a start with a free app that will print your pic directly from iphone, but it doesn't go far enough imop, would like to be able to walk into any recognized wifi, with any printer (within reason) modern printers, recognize it on the fly i.e. download necessary drivers, you will already be connected to the network so should have access to a high speed internet connection, and print email, attachments, notes, photos w/basic manipulation, etc...

[kdarling]

But which phone is selling better? That points at the decisions which provided the best, on average, option to the market.

Well, that would make the Blackberries the best. They're back up to double the sales of mobile OSX.

Even WinMo outsold mobile OSX in Q4 '08. And outsold it for the year as well.

Coming up are devices like the Palm Pre, Toshiba TG01, Samsung Omnia HD, HTC Diamond2 series, etc. Pretty nice gizmos, with better and better UIs all the time. Most are VGA or WVGA, with 3-5 MP cameras. The Omnia HD can take 720p movies at 24fps.

As iPhone users mature into power smartphone users, they're going to be looking to get those needs met. Apple has a hit with entry users. The question is how, or if, they'll go after power users as well. Perhaps they won't. Or perhaps they'll surprise us and add some totally unique capabilities. (Fingers crossed)

[preservative]

How about:

TV-OUT the whole GUI
Activity Monitor
Better Office Support
Mail Digital ID's cryptographic support
Drag and drop to the iphone
Use as storage device

A million more...

[tys]

My prediction:
It won't have MMS.
It won't have Copy and Paste (or it will but it will be really screwed up)
Tethering will be like all AT&T phones and cost $30 a month with a 5Gb cap.


What's the current data cap? I currently use PDANet for tethering (great app!)
I understand our "unlimited data plan" is not really unlimited.
Is 5GB/month a lot? I really have no idea. Under "usage" my phone says 1.8GB received. Is that in the last month or since the last reset? It says my last reset was July 2007 which doesn't make sense since it's a 3G iPhone bought it July 2008!
I ask because I'm considering ditching my Comca$t service and just using the iPhone for internet, and tethering my computer occasionally as needed.
I have Wifi at work, so I can always download big stuff there.

Thanks,
tys

[lftrghtparadigm]

The iPhone has been out for almost two years and I don't see much of a difference between the initial offering and the current iteration. I'm sad to say my iPhone is looking a bit.....dated.

IMHO the current UI is pretty ugly. The default Home screen overwhelms you with icons and if you choose to move unused icons/apps. over to another screen, you're left with this *beautiful* black background. How about allowing for some nice wallpapers and make that the center of attention? Furthermore, how about letting me decide *where* I want to put the 3-4 icons I want on my primary screen. Honestly, I'd even like to see an option for turning off the bottom "bar" of icons (whatever you call that area). I'm not a programmer but I don't think it would require that much of a leap to accomplish what I have described and it would allow me to make the iPhone *my* phone.

I don't really use what I refer to as fringe applications very often and I must admit that I'm pretty happy with the core applications such as the phone itself, Mail, text messaging and Safari. I'm sure there's room for improvement but overall I think Apple gets it in terms of core apps.

The last thing I want to speak to is MMS. This feature should be available on the iPhone and any argument otherwise is pretty lame. Feel free to talk in *theory* but the *reality* is that for "sharing the moment", most people use MMS.

EDIT:

I just saw a video on the Sprint Pre and I must admit that I was pretty impressed. I'm not ready to ditch my iPhone but if 3.0 underwhelms.....

I love the brilliant iPhone users who refer to the dock as "that bar with four icons", and who NEED to change the black background to a battery draining hi resolution color image of whatever hentai crap they feel necessary, and who need to share there moments (but sadly can't) without MMS....

....even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.

[lftrghtparadigm]

Well, that would make the Blackberries the best. They're back up to double the sales of mobile OSX.

Even WinMo outsold mobile OSX in Q4 '08. And outsold it for the year as well.

Coming up are devices like the Palm Pre, Toshiba TG01, Samsung Omnia HD, HTC Diamond2 series, etc. Pretty nice gizmos, with better and better UIs all the time. Most are VGA or WVGA, with 3-5 MP cameras. The Omnia HD can take 720p movies at 24fps.

As iPhone users mature into power smartphone users, they're going to be looking to get those needs met. Apple has a hit with entry users. The question is how, or if, they'll go after power users as well. Perhaps they won't. Or perhaps they'll surprise us and add some totally unique capabilities. (Fingers crossed)

Since Apple goes after large markets, not microscopic fringe loony tunes (720p 24fps???? There are about 8 people in the US that might even pretend to want that on their mobile phone), then no.

[lftrghtparadigm]

The bulk of the postings here just prove the thesis of the Innovator's Dilemma. Listen to your customers and the vast majority of them (have no imagination whatsoever and) will suggest ideas that are about to become obsolete and eventually drive your company into bankruptcy.

Henry Ford once said: "If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse."

...add to that MMS, cut & paste, and dual buggy whip holders...

Yep. The only time Apple listens to customers feature requests are for BUG fixes, not anything new.

New is never what the masses were expecting, because they purely lack any imagination. The only things missing in their opinion are the logical holes in the current design.

"Logical" is also a huge stretch here considering almost 2 full years on the iPhone which I drain daily and now program for, I have never once needed Copy & Paste or MMS.

Now, move up to a real version of OSX and then yes C&P will be number one on the list.

[OllyW]

....even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.

That only works in the USA and the iPhone is sold all over the world.

[swagi]

I love the brilliant iPhone users who refer to the dock as "that bar with four icons", and who NEED to change the black background to a battery draining hi resolution color image of whatever hentai crap they feel necessary, and who need to share there moments (but sadly can't) without MMS....

....even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.

Reality Check:
The receiver has to check his eMail to receive it, while MMS is delivered to the phone without any user incentive.

Receiving MMS is free, at least in nearly every country except the U.S., receiving eMails is not, if you aren't on an unlimited data plan.

Find better arguments...:cool:

[str1f3]

I love the brilliant iPhone users who refer to the dock as "that bar with four icons", and who NEED to change the black background to a battery draining hi resolution color image of whatever hentai crap they feel necessary, and who need to share there moments (but sadly can't) without MMS....

....even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.


I understand what you're saying but static wallpaper can't affect battery life all that much. I would also say that even the mail application mentioned has a serious flaw in that you can only send one picture at a time. I realize apple is trying to keep the email file size down but nobody is going to send an email with 40 photos from their phone.

Everybody is saying what they want in the phone which is hilarious! WTH does MMS have to do with an SDK? Or tethering? These are the kind of features that apple would mention during an iPhone release, not during an OS demonstration.

What apple does need to do is redesign the OS. it looks dated against something like the pre and needs some kind of folder structure. I would expect background apps and push notifications to be a given. I would also want developers to get far deeper access to the phone than they are currently getting. There is no reason apple shouldn't grant full access to the camera amongst other things.

[tys]

"Logical" is also a huge stretch here considering almost 2 full years on the iPhone which I drain daily and now program for, I have never once needed Copy & Paste or MMS.

Why don't people understand that different users have different needs/wants?
I've wished for copy and paste almost daily for a year and a half: every time I had to find a pen, scribble something down, then switch apps and type it back in on the phone's tiny keyboard! Now I've got copy and paste (Thanks to Clippy!) and use it several times a day.
On the other hand, I have NO USE whatsoever for MMS, but I understand that other folks want it. Why can't Apple just make an MMS app, charge a buck for it, let AT&T charge whatever they charge per message and be done with it?

tys

[lftrghtparadigm]

Why don't people understand that different users have different needs/wants?....Why can't Apple just make an MMS app, charge a buck for it, let AT&T charge whatever they charge per message and be done with it?

tys

Because they don't matter. Good Grief. Why do people, customers and non, assume their needs/wants make any difference whatsoever? Its makes NO difference, at all. This is not easy for some to accept.

I understand what you're saying but static wallpaper can't affect battery life all that much.
You are guessing, the answer it yes it can, all you need to do is use a jailbroken phone for your answer.

What apple does need to do is redesign the OS. it looks dated against something like the pre and needs some kind of folder structure. I would expect background apps and push notifications to be a given. I would also want developers to get far deeper access to the phone than they are currently getting. There is no reason apple shouldn't grant full access to the camera amongst other things.

Agreed.

Reality Check:
The receiver has to check his eMail to receive it, while MMS is delivered to the phone without any user incentive.

Receiving MMS is free, at least in nearly every country except the U.S., receiving eMails is not, if you aren't on an unlimited data plan.

Find better arguments...:cool:

This is completely incorrect in every way describable. The receiver does nothing but receive the photo as they normally would. All the (iPhone) sender has to do is choose the correct e-mail for the particular contact (assuming you've added the necessary e-mail address as you would, being someone obsessed with need for MMS).

How it works outside the US isn't my concern. Japan has 3G that puts ours to shame, but I don't moan over how inadequate the iPhone is (here) because of it.

[2strokedude]

What star trek world do you live in??? Most cell phones don't do email. Everyone I know sends photo texts with MMS, not email. And there are no problems between (major) carriers. And it's not 1990...Most phones didn't get MMS until 5/6 years ago.

BTW - does anyone else here want the nike+ sensor built into the iPhone (like the iPTouch)? I know it requires a hardware upgrade, but then you have the ultimate device.

i remember my moto razor receiving and sending email(pics) when they first came out. That was in the year 2001. ????

[kdarling]

This is completely incorrect in every way describable. The receiver does nothing but receive the photo as they normally would. All the (iPhone) sender has to do is choose the correct e-mail for the particular contact (assuming you've added the necessary e-mail address as you would, being someone obsessed with need for MMS).

As he said, that only works where email-to-MMS gateways exist.

He was also talking about receiving MMS. Since the notification is basically a silent ring page, it is true push (unlike email) and uses no extra cpu or battery while waiting.

How it works outside the US isn't my concern. ...

Dont' worry, that's clear from your posts.

[lftrghtparadigm]

As he said, that only works where email-to-MMS gateways exist.

He was also talking about receiving MMS. Since the notification is basically a silent ring page, it is true push (unlike email) and uses no extra cpu or battery while waiting.



Dont' worry, that's clear from your posts.

Its also Not Apple's problem that every particular carrier does not have their own gateway for type of simple function.

Go ahead and blame the Apple and the iPhone, but this falls on the carriers and no one else.

[Jasonxe9]

That is a great list. This is my post but I thought I would add my input.

-Custom alarms. From what I read programs like Awaken cannot make an alarm program because the alarms are locked down. It would be nice if you could select a full song to wake up to.

-Full Bluetooth support - The ability to sync via bluetooth, listen to music via bluetooth. I would gladly purchase some stereo bluetooth headphones if my iphone supported it.

-Subfolder syncing via activesync - Currently I am connecting to my work exchange server. I will get new email notification if there is an email in the root folder. I have a subfolder called "Mail from Management". I have to manually go in and wait for the iphone to sync this folder and sometimes that can take several minutes.

-MMS - As many have posted it is best when people send you an MMS message. I have gotten several and the AT&T website is a pain.

Thats just my wish list. I very much look forward to the update and also will be happy for a hardware upgraded phone. Thanks for reading. Hope I didn't fall too off topic.

=====

_ Cut&Paste (come on the 1984 Mac128k had this feature)
_ Double click to select a word
_ Video recording
_ Global Search
_ Bluetooth enabled (or teathered) keyboards
_ Bluetooth syncing
_ Bluetooth music listening
_ Horizontal text input in all applications
_ Sync notes and to dos
_ Ability to sync documents and edit them
_ Flash
_ Laptop tethering
_ Streamlined email reading between accounts
_ Push notification
_ Quickly back up all application data on phone
_ A Finder that allows for categories
_ List View for applications
_ No limit on the number of applications installed
_ List Docs as well
_ iChat video conferencing official ap
_ Turn by Turn navigation (ala TomTom)
_ MMS
_ VOICE DIALING !!!

[Schtumple]

Tethering is the only feature I'm after, the rest I'm not really bothered about, I've never really cried out "Why oh why do I not have copy and paste" and O2s website isn't exactly a major pain to navigate to when you receive a MMS, I've only received 2 since getting my iPhone and I doubt I'll receive enough to make it a worthwhile feature...

[sd2009]

Because they don't matter. Good Grief. Why do people, customers and non, assume their needs/wants make any difference whatsoever? Its makes NO difference, at all. This is not easy for some to accept.

Haha yeah! ******* the customer's wants and needs. Apple don't make products for customers!

[DELLsFan]

Some features I'd like to see (already mentioned here):

Bluetooth enabled (or tethered) keyboards

Bluetooth music listening (A2DP)

Horizontal text input option for all applications

Laptop tethering (AT&T will most likely charge extra for the privilege, but I agree with stately ... I don't agree it's appropriate. After all, Unlimited data = Unlimited data. Period. It's bad enough "unlimited data" conveniently doesn't include SMS messaging. One of the biggest scandals perpetrated by all cell carriers - not just AT&T - is consensus on gouging of their customers for SMS usage. It's unconscionable, and this needs to change.)

Streamlined email reading between accounts (aka 1 in-box to rule them all ... a la Mac Mail style)

Turn by Turn navigation (a la TomTom, yes - TomTom, not Apple)

Voice Activated Dialing (It's past time. What's been the hold up on this?)

Looking forward to the preview. Kinda makes me wish I didn't JUST buy the iPhone 3G. Would hate to miss out on features dependent on upcoming hardware changes.

[kdarling]

Laptop tethering (AT&T will most likely charge extra for the privilege, but I agree with stately ... I don't agree it's appropriate. After all, Unlimited data = Unlimited data. Period.

The legal wiggle they seem to use these days, is a claim that "unlimited" means our internet access is unrestricted. Not the data amount. :rolleyes:

It's bad enough "unlimited data" conveniently doesn't include SMS messaging. One of the biggest scandals perpetrated by all cell carriers - not just AT&T - is consensus on gouging of their customers for SMS usage.

Common misconception.

SMS is not data carried by the internet. It is basically a phone call over inter-carrier networks. How much do you pay per voice minute? 10 cents? Okay, so the minimum cost per SMS should be that much.

But an SMS is more complicated for the carrier, because it also has to store and forward messages later if the recipient isn't immediately available. This uses computing power, control bandwidth and storage resources.

[fleshman03]

The legal wiggle they seem to use these days, is a claim that "unlimited" means our internet access is unrestricted. Not the data amount. :rolleyes:



Common misconception.

SMS is not data carried by the internet. It is basically a phone call over inter-carrier networks. How much do you pay per voice minute? 10 cents? Okay, so the minimum cost per SMS should be that much.

But an SMS is more complicated for the carrier, because it also has to store and forward messages later if the recipient isn't immediately available. This uses computing power, control bandwidth and storage resources.

Yeah SMS .... You get milked with those costs.

I think all of us should read this (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/28/business/28digi.html?_r=4).

. “Operating costs are relatively insensitive to volume,” he said. “It doesn’t cost the carrier much more to transmit a hundred million messages than a million.”

[skinnylegs]

I love the brilliant iPhone users who refer to the dock as "that bar with four icons", and who NEED to change the black background to a battery draining hi resolution color image of whatever hentai crap they feel necessary, and who need to share there moments (but sadly can't) without MMS....

....even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.

Slow down there, Mr. Wizard.....

It was rather comical that I forgot the "bar thing" is called a dock. I have several Mac laptops and a number of desktops and I do know what a dock is. For whatever reason, I don't associate docks with phones. Eh....it was early in the morning and I'll write it off to either that or a pre-senior moment.

Now that we have that out of the way, yeah...I'd love to have the *option* of placing a hi-res picture of my choosing as a desktop background even if it does drain my battery quicker. In all of my years I've never heard the word "hentai" used so I looked it up and for whatever its worth, I'm not into anime or porno so it is highly unlikely "henai crap" would end up as my desktop background. I *am* into surfing and I *do* enjoy photography (primarily beach scenes) so those are the kind of pictures one would find as my desktop wall. I might even throw a picture of my g/f on there. 'Nuff said. My point is that this is a small request which would allow allow iPhone users to customize their iPhone in some small measure. I actually find it rather ironic. Have you ever seen the original Macintosh commercial. Seems rather Orwellian to me considering that there are approximately 5 million iPhones out there and they all look almost identical. But maybe I digress.....

I do find it amusing when bright guys like you buy into the BS that MMS is absent because it is dated technology or the same task can be easily accomplished with email. MMS is absent for neither of those reasons. Maybe iit's time *you* hit Google. Oh yeah...I am well aware of how to send a picture by way of number+carrier specific suffix. I do it all the time. I also send pictures to my friends who have iPhones using my mail program. Easy enough but what is the solution for friends of mine who *don't* have iPhones and *don't* have cell phones with data packages and they want to send me a picture? Capesh? Once again, I really don't want someone shoving a way to do something down my throat. It's all about choice.

Last point.....

At the end of the day, I still choose my iPhone given the current crop of smartphones. That said, I'd rather throw a sledgehammer at a movie screen then sit with the mindless masses blindly accepting what's being drilled into me.

Rant over.....

[DELLsFan]

Complicated or not, it no longer costs me (and many others who have left "Ma Bell" for VOIP-based telephony) 10 cents a minute. I no longer use the per-minute charges (the phone companies still gouge to those less fortunate) as a basis for comparison, because there is no comparing an unlimited plan with pay-to-play schemes. Just ask AOL about this.

Complicated or not, companies like AT&T will need to innovate (more than they do now) to retain customers. This means abandoning a 1970 model price structure and competing with VOIP-like providers if they intend to keep a profitable landline business.

It seems to me the cell companies with inter-carrier, bandwidth, and storage issues need to offset their expenses by competitive and profitable pricing models. They have all rejected this approach and instead prefer not to innovate, but rather to immolate their consumers with outrageous pricing schemes. Tech Crunch last summer (http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/07/01/atts-text-messages-cost-1310-per-megabyte/) stated it succinctly: "If 160 bytes of SMS data costs twenty cents then 1MB (1,048,576 bytes) of data would cost 131,072 cents, or $1,310.72."

These numbers put even the printer ink industry scam business to shame! We shouldn't tolerate either. I don't believe the cell companies have $1310.72 worth of overhead per equivalent megabyte consumed by their customers. Those that believe this to be true, I have real estate for sale, just for you. :cool:

The SMS pricing scheme is totally out of control, justified by nothing but greed, and needs to change for every carrier. Tethering may have it's own unique challenges and cost implications to carriers, but color me skeptical these costs warrant anywhere close to that extra $60 for which these plans sell.

[w0by]

I hope iPhone will indeed have MMS capabilities. It's absolutely absurd that I can't send MMS through a 3G network on the worlds "most advanced" and "most wanted" phone. This should've been available the minute the phone came out.

[joeshell383]

Thats just my wish list.
=====

The master list in one of the four iPhone sticky threads.

[o7m0]

i would be happy with flash, and be able to ready any language

[swagi]

This is completely incorrect in every way describable. The receiver does nothing but receive the photo as they normally would. All the (iPhone) sender has to do is choose the correct e-mail for the particular contact (assuming you've added the necessary e-mail address as you would, being someone obsessed with need for MMS).

How it works outside the US isn't my concern. Japan has 3G that puts ours to shame, but I don't moan over how inadequate the iPhone is (here) because of it.

You are kidding me, aren't you?

O.K., let me put it Muppets way:

Now let's talk about the receiver. You know, Kermit made this nice little piccy of his new favorite toy and he wants to share. So he sends it to two of his friends. One to Ralph via MMS and one to Fozzy via eMail.

>pling<
Oh, look. Ralph's phone just said, that he received a MMS. Now let's look at this pic.

Hmmm...Fozzy looks a little sad, doesn't he. Hey Fozzy, what's up?

*snob*
Ralph just received a pic of Kermit's new toy. I also want this picture :-(

Well, Fozzy, did you check your eMails?

*Fozzy grabs his phone - opens up eMail - waits about 30 seconds until eMail is syncronized*
Wohooo - I also received it. And look, Ralphie, my pic has the better quality!

-----------cut-------------

Maybe you get it now. MMS is on the receivers' phone instantly without any additional cost.

That's what I'm talking about. And don't get me going on about how to teach my mom to use eMail on her phone.

[kdarling]

Complicated or not, it no longer costs me (and many others who have left "Ma Bell" for VOIP-based telephony) 10 cents a minute.

Sure, because you're using packet switched data, not circuit switched. Certainly VOIP over shared paths is the way of the future, but it's not here yet for cell phones. We have to wait for LTE to be used for voice.

Tech Crunch last summer[/URL] stated it succinctly: "If 160 bytes of SMS data costs twenty cents then 1MB (1,048,576 bytes) of data would cost 131,072 cents, or $1,310.72."

Cute but meaningless. The opposite bogus example is VOIP over a per-KB data connection. Someone who says more during a call would get charged more.

One more time: SMS is sent over circuit switched connections, which cost by time, NOT per amount as in packet switched data connections.

SMS and voice connections are as if you had a road reserved all to yourself. The connection is not shared, thus you are charged full rate for it.

Data connections are different.. they're shared with everyone else, which is why the bandwidth depends on how many other data users are on the same cell site, and your charge is based on how much data you send or receive (how much of the connection bandwidth you use).

[tri3limited]

CSS Signatures would do me a treat! Like the idea of a 'springboard' app storage folder. Would love pages, keynote and numbers ported as it would help spread the application suite as well as let me get work done on the go (with a storage folder (stacks?))... Speaking of which a mini-displayport would be incredibly useful to output presentations to projects and second displays. Some image adjustments with a basic port of iPhoto.

Only a few requests short of making my MBP a mobile phone aswell!!

[firewood]

Haha yeah! ******* the customer's wants and needs. Apple don't make products for customers!

That's more correct than you think. Apple already has the money from last year's customer's purchases. New products are for next year's customers who will want something different.

Very few new car buyers have ever even ridden a horse. Have you?

[pyromaniaque]

You can tether your iphone now. In fact, I'm currently using a tethered connection.
I use PDANET to tether my iphone.

http://lifehacker.com/5086490/the-best-way-to-tether-your-iphone-to-your-laptop-for-free

OR

http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2008/10/16/how-to-tether-with-pdanet/

And there are jailbreak apps that allow MMS, if I'm not mistaken.

[JFreak]

SMS is more complicated for the carrier, because it also has to store and forward messages later if the recipient isn't immediately available. This uses computing power, control bandwidth and storage resources.

SMS is 160 characters = 160 bytes, so one megabyte holds +6500 messages! It was originally limited to 128 bytes and only later increased to 160) Originally it was meant to be a tool for cell technicians, but it got mainstream because somebody saw a business case.

SMS is delivered as a digital burst on an asynchronous subchannel. IOW, non-guaranteed bandwidth. It means that nobody guarantees how long it takes to get it delivered and therefore the cost for the delivery is minimal.

[Bye Bye Baby]

I want push. And turn by turn navigation. I want to use my mobileme alias etc. Copy and paste perhaps. MMS doesn't concern me, but happy if others get it.

[Mr. Giver '94]

Apple knows what we want. They just don't want to give it to us partly because they want to release things slowly and partly because they like to piss off people for no reason. That's Apple for ya!

[preservative]

You can tether your iphone now. In fact, I'm currently using a tethered connection.
I use PDANET to tether my iphone.

http://lifehacker.com/5086490/the-best-way-to-tether-your-iphone-to-your-laptop-for-free

OR

http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2008/10/16/how-to-tether-with-pdanet/

And there are jailbreak apps that allow MMS, if I'm not mistaken.

Yeah and you'll get bricked by the provider for the privilege i.e. you can't dial out...

[Theaser]

I hope iPhone will indeed have MMS capabilities. It's absolutely absurd that I can't send MMS through a 3G network on the worlds "most advanced" and "most wanted" phone. This should've been available the minute the phone came out.

Not the world, the US at most. A lot of people already started looking at better alternatives, it might be too late for Apple already.

They should have reviewed the iPhone before announcement and ask themselves, 'What can we do better?' Apparently, if one application came out, it must be perfect. Like the good camera quality of the iPhone camera, but you can't be perfect on everything and some features like Video Recording is on the most basic phone with a camera. Video recording is CRITICAL. I would like to catch snippets of great moments, and not trying to shoot a 2 hour Hollywood film. Please Apple, if Cycorder could shoot video, you can make it happen with our current iPhones.

So why didn't Apple have tethering, MMS, video recording? Because they thought it wasn't perfect or came up with alternatives that did not work for most users.

[Eso]

...even though by sending a picture attached e-mail to the persons phone number @ carrier specific suffix, you do exactly that, but that's too much effort for someone busy whining.

There's several problems with this.

1.) You have to know which carrier your contact is on.

2.) You have to know the "carrier specific suffix" for that particular carrier.

3.) Your contact gets an MMS from an email account they probably won't recognize.

4.) Your contact will either, a) have to create a new text message and get your number from address book/recent calls or, b) easily reply to your MMS message in which case your SMS conversation just shifted to your non-push email.

5) Your contact will have to remember always to send MMS messages to your email and not your phone number

There are so many problems with this system that depend not only you, but on the people you message that this is not a viable alternative to standard MMS messaging. I believe the only people that will think it is are those that do not send or receive MMS messages. Let me give you a personal example of how I run into each of these problems. Suppose I want to send an MMS to my friend Dan from work:

1) I don't know his carrier. In fact I only know the carrier of 3 people in my address book, and only that because they are on AT&T and calls are free - important because I talk to them a lot. So I guess I have to text message Dan and ask him his carrier. He'll probably ask me why I want to know when he answers, so I am prepared to explain that I want to send him an MMS but I have an iPhone.

2) He's on Verizon, OK. Now I hop over to Safari so I can look up the cryptic email address I have to send it to. Even for AT&T I'm pretty sure it's txt.att.net and mms.att.net for SMS and MMS, respectively, but I am not certain so I'd have to look that up too. Now, what phrase to search for? I type out "how to send text message from email verizon" and wow look at that, I've got it. Of course, I can't copy and paste so I'll just have to remember it's vtext.com. Great, it's .com not .net so I hope I don't get confused with the one carrier specific suffix that I do know.

3) I head over to my mail client to write a new email to dan'snumber@vtext.com ("or was that vtxt.com?" flashes through my head). Oh wait, my mistake, I can't attach a picture from the mail app, of course! I head over to the camera roll to find the picture I want to email. Oh boy, it's a good thing the iPhone multitasks - oh wait... I compose the email and am sure to include a line that says "Oh by the way, this is Eso" that way he isn't completely confused when he gets a random message from an email account.

4) My email is sent, but no reply yet from Dan. Has he sent a message to my email and it hasn't been pulled from the server yet? Is he busy right now and hasn't replied at all? I don't know! I go to check my email, but nothing yet. I don't really think email is appropriate for IM'ing, so I decide to send him a text message from my phone so he'll reply to the right one: "Hey Dan, I just send you a pic from my email but reply to this text."

5) Sweet, Dan just sent me a text back - "I sent you a multimedia message. You can view my message w/in the next 7 days via the web at www.viewmymessage.com/2 using MSG ID 348fjsuj28 Password crypticAShell". No problem, let me just copy and paste the info and switch to Safari. Oh wait...

No one ever remembers to send me MMS to my email, and when I remind them to, it's always followed by the inevitable, "What's your email again?".

O.K., let me put it Muppets way:

Now let's talk about the receiver. You know, Kermit made this nice little piccy of his new favorite toy and he wants to share. So he sends it to two of his friends. One to Ralph via MMS and one to Fozzy via eMail.

>pling<
Oh, look. Ralph's phone just said, that he received a MMS. Now let's look at this pic.

Hmmm...Fozzy looks a little sad, doesn't he. Hey Fozzy, what's up?

*snob*
Ralph just received a pic of Kermit's new toy. I also want this picture :-(

Well, Fozzy, did you check your eMails?

*Fozzy grabs his phone - opens up eMail - waits about 30 seconds until eMail is syncronized*
Wohooo - I also received it. And look, Ralphie, my pic has the better quality!

Hey Fozzy, how did you know to expect a picture? Oh wait, you didn't. But hey look, 15 minutes later you have a new badge on your mail icon! I am sure the first thing you think is that it is probably an MMS from a friend as opposed to an automated bank statement, monthly newsletter, or some other type of email that makes up 95% of your inbox!

Seriously, get real.

[Twitcho]

MMS would be amazing. I really hope that this becomes true.

Cut and Paste would be nice as well, but for me it is not a necessity.

[Syrus28]

My biggest issues are copy-paste and MMS. I haven't ever felt the need for copy-paste (never had it on a phone) but I could certainly see me using it if it were present. On the MMS issue, it's quite embarrassing at this point. "iPhone - the world's most advanced phone - that can't send a picture message". Really Apple?

[Syrus28]

So why didn't Apple have tethering, MMS, video recording? Because they thought it wasn't perfect or came up with alternatives that did not work for most users.

Implementing video recording, tethering, and MMS are standard affairs, there's no million $$$ R&D that goes into this stuff. People aren't waiting for the next "MMS revolution" in the iPhone... We're waiting for a phone that can simply send/receive one. The same goes for tethering and video recording - it's been done before, no need to fix what isn't broke, especially in this case.

[DELLsFan]

Sure, because you're using packet switched data, not circuit switched. Certainly VOIP over shared paths is the way of the future, but it's not here yet for cell phones. We have to wait for LTE to be used for voice.

Cute but meaningless. The opposite bogus example is VOIP over a per-KB data connection. Someone who says more during a call would get charged more.

One more time: SMS is sent over circuit switched connections, which cost by time, NOT per amount as in packet switched data connections.

SMS and voice connections are as if you had a road reserved all to yourself. The connection is not shared, thus you are charged full rate for it.

Data connections are different.. they're shared with everyone else, which is why the bandwidth depends on how many other data users are on the same cell site, and your charge is based on how much data you send or receive (how much of the connection bandwidth you use).

I believe you misunderstood the context with the telephony point I was making. You illustrated a 10 cent/minute voice charge premise that I respectfully reject. I don't pay 10 cents/minute for any personal telephony calls I make - whether it be circuit-switched or via data packets, landline, or cellular. While I appreciate your example, it was nevertheless moot.

I'll defer to your knowledge on how SMS actually works, but really - I don't care if the technology is voice-over-carrier-networks, data-packets-via-VOIP, some combination of the two, or tin can with string! I don't know what you meant by LTE, but it seems to me, Skype via Wi-Fi is right here, right now. Only licensing, agreements, and lawsuits prevent technology from maturing on our smart phones. True, not all phones have Wi-Fi, but I am talking about the iPhone here - not a Motorola Star-Tac. :o

My overriding concern is that consumers are being milked like cows on SMS charges by the cell carriers. Tech Crunch's article put these charges in a perspective I appreciate. Unchecked, the carriers will continue to get away with exorbitant package and per-use charges on SMS usage. They'll continue to charge high prices for cheap bandwidth wrapped in profitable, unlimited data package schemes, and they'll probably get away with adding another 20 or 30 dollars to any iPhone tether feature released too. That doesn't make it right.

You know, Nielsen Mobile (http://www.telephia.com/html/press%20releases/iPhone3GandSmartphoneStats.html) reported that as of Q2 2008, more than 26 million mobile subscribers used a smart phone device. RIM accounted for 31.1% of this market share, HTC - 20.6%, Palm - 16.9% and Apple trailed in fourth place at 12.2%. That sure is a lot of smart phones and quite a bit of subscriber revenue there, isn't it? As this number grows, I hope the old-style, pay-to-play pricing schemes are exposed for what they really are and changed to meet the consumers' demands, not the carriers'. Isn't that worth more to all of us than what Copy/Paste and MMS will do for the iPhone? :apple:

[alpinadvl]

NOBODY HAS MENTIONED THIS YET.... BUT DID YOU CONSIDER :

....follow me on this one....

1st: iPhone 3.0 features are being announced - right? (business-like features, mms, copy and paste <--- i know, this is more of a basic feature)

2nd: Rumors of "Pro" section for iphone apps - sounds right, right?
(very very likely)

3rd: AT&T exclusivity runs out fairly soon

4th: lead time for FCC registration to product availability approximately 6 months.... which leads to one thing to tie all this in (and answer the Palm Pre) - and that is :

iPhone "PRO"

... with slide out keyboard? (to "capture" all those other users out there)


..... anyone else think that is a realistic possibility ? I do?

[TuffLuffJimmy]

NOBODY HAS MENTIONED THIS YET.... BUT DID YOU CONSIDER :

....follow me on this one....

1st: iPhone 3.0 features are being announced - right? (business-like features, mms, copy and paste <--- i know, this is more of a basic feature)

2nd: Rumors of "Pro" section for iphone apps - sounds right, right?
(very very likely)

3rd: AT&T exclusivity runs out fairly soon

4th: lead time for FCC registration to product availability approximately 6 months.... which leads to one thing to tie all this in (and answer the Palm Pre) - and that is :

iPhone "PRO"

... with slide out keyboard? (to "capture" all those other users out there)


..... anyone else think that is a realistic possibility ? I do?

Stop! Right now! Don't get my hopes up! I would sell myself on the streets to get an iPhone with iWork and a slide out keyboard.

[Digital Skunk]

Stop! Right now! Don't get my hopes up! I would sell myself on the streets to get an iPhone with iWork and a slide out keyboard.

I would switch to AT&T if they gave me that and added some sort of insurance against theft and clumsiness.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

I would switch to AT&T

Not going to lie that's probably just as low as I said I'd go. :D

[kdarling]

iPhone 3.0 features are being announced - right? (business-like features, mms, copy and paste <--- i know, this is more of a basic feature)

Okay. New iPhone features (Exchange, SDK) were announced last March as well.

AT&T exclusivity runs out fairly soon

Unknown, but mid-2010 if you believe the latest rumors.

lead time for FCC registration to product availability approximately 6 months

Totally false. IIRC, the time from the first iPhone's FCC application, to approval, was about six weeks. This can be made even less (down to a day) with outside tester help. You can start selling the moment it's approved.

[Trajectory]

... with slide out keyboard?

Ugh. No thanks. I love the iPhone's compactness and sleek design, and I don't have to worry about some flimsy tiny pull-out keyboard breaking off, either.

I have no problem with the iPhone's on-screen keyboard -- it works quite well and is FAR more flexible in that the keyboard can change depending on the app (like having a ".com" key when entering a URL). That's impossible with a physical keyboard.

Every other smartphone has a tiny physical keyboard. The iPhone is better because it doesn't.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Ugh. No thanks. I love the iPhone's compactness and sleek design, and I don't have to worry about some flimsy tiny pull-out keyboard breaking off, either.

I have no problem with the iPhone's on-screen keyboard -- it works quite well and is FAR more flexible in that the keyboard can change depending on the app (like having a ".com" key when entering a URL). That's impossible with a physical keyboard.

Every other smartphone has a tiny physical keyboard. The iPhone is better because it doesn't.

I'm talking about an iPhone Pro. you can keep your virtual keyboard. I just type faster on a real keyboard. Since when would the keyboard be flimsy and fall off? since this doesn't happen with most smart phones as they're put together well I'd expect an even better keyboard from Apple.

[kdarling]

I believe you misunderstood the context with the telephony point I was making.

Yes sir, I did understand. Heck, we use video Skype daily to talk to family and friends around the world. Love it.

My point is that it's not possible to make direct comparisons between SMS and internet data. SMS is like buying corn by the ear. You pay the same whether it's got one kernel or 160. Data is like paying for a bag of popcorn. You're buying per kernel count (weight). Totally different things.

Another reason they're totally different is that waiting for a push message over a data connection costs extra battery power. Sometimes a lot of it. SMS doesn't do that.

"If 160 bytes of SMS data costs twenty cents then 1MB (1,048,576 bytes) of data would cost $1,310.72."

1MB of SMS = 6500 texts = reason to get the unlimited messaging plan for $20, isn't it? Lots cheaper and renders their calculations moot :)

In the same vein, the fact that 5GB/month would cost $25,600 on the ATT $5/MB plan, simply means that it's far cheaper to get the $30 per month data plan.

[kdarling]

Every other smartphone has a tiny physical keyboard. The iPhone is better because it doesn't.

Side slider keyboards are often around 3.5" x 1.3" , which is not tiny at all.

And they don't obscur the screen while you're using them.

(Personally, I prefer a vertical slider like the i730 or Pre. Easy to use one-handed, too.)

[joeshell383]

Maybe you get it now. MMS is on the receivers' phone instantly without any additional cost.

That's what I'm talking about. And don't get me going on about how to teach my mom to use eMail on her phone.

If MMS is integrated into the SMS app and works the same way SMS does the pic/vid with play button would show up in the preview bubble like texts do, so you would see the pic as soon as you picked up your phone (which would be right when it was sent)!!!

I really like this idea! Apple would need to implement an SMS/MMS preview on/off setting that is accessible whether or not the passcode lock is enabled. Also, when looking at SMS/MMS in the log the MMS photos/videos should just be a link that goes to opens it up to a full size screen (with back arrow), so the log still remains manageable.

Sure, because you're using packet switched data, not circuit switched. Certainly VOIP over shared paths is the way of the future, but it's not here yet for cell phones. We have to wait for LTE to be used for voice.

http://www.informationweek.com/news/telecom/voip/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=215900218&subSection=News

[kdarling]

http://www.informationweek.com/news/telecom/voip/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=215900218&subSection=News

Thanks. Pretty neat. I see that they're using a fixed IP address. That solves the problem of being able to easily ring up the phone wherever it is. (I think that Verizon charges something like a $500 one-time fee to give a fixed IP, and you still need a $20K server to use it.)

That works, at least within the ATT footprint. Go outside of ATT coverage and it's no go.

It'll be interesting to see if VOIP over EDGE with shared bandwidth, or worse, over GPRS, makes the grade.

[iMaggot]

Boy do i hope this is true :D

[iSurgeon]

Love it or hate it, MMS is needed.

Maybe someday everyone will have phones with access to e-mail. Now is not that time. We need MMS.

Steve Jobs et al disagree that MMS is needed. I used to vehemently believe that MMS was needed, but I was short-sighted. All modern cell phones have email access (that's not to say that all cell phones for sale today are modern, however).

Remember when every computer had a floppy drive? The original iMac changed that. I bought one, even though I thought a floppy drive was a necessity. It turns out Steve was right & I was wrong. Five years ago, no one would have purchased a computer without an optical drive. Now, the last three computers I've purchased didn't have one. I bought an external drive "just in case", but I've used it less than five times.

Steve's opinion appears to be "MMS is outdated. We're going to force the issue.". He thinks the iPhone has enough clout that it can change the rules of the game. He's probably right. I don't think we'll see Flash anytime soon, either. I think Apple has other plans.

Apple made a revolutionary phone not by conforming to existing standards, but by creating new standards. It seems ridiculous that a so-called modern web-enabled phone would ship without MMS and Flash, but now I think Apple may change everything and have the last laugh.

We don't need floppy drives. We don't need CDs or DVDs. We don't need MMS and we don't need Flash. Pardon the Simpsons reference, but Steve Mobs "is like a god who knows what we want". If we had needed MMS and Flash, Steve would have given it to us.

Who's still using a rotary dial phone?

[kironin]

Just add copy and paste, and I'll be a happy camper.

me too.

It's something that everyday I find myself needing. Extra typing truly sucks when I shouldn't have to.

but I am not holding my breath.


Tethering if it happens will just be another charge rather than a feature.

[pavvento]

There sure are a lot of people complaining about a possible tether charge. I don't understand the problem. You have unlimited data for your phone, not your computer. If you go to an all you can eat buffet YOU can eat all you want from your plate. Does that Mean 3 other people can eat for free off of your plate because it's unlimited?

[jctevere]

Steve Jobs et al disagree that MMS is needed. I used to vehemently believe that MMS was needed, but I was short-sighted. All modern cell phones have email access (that's not to say that all cell phones for sale today are modern, however).

Remember when every computer had a floppy drive? The original iMac changed that. I bought one, even though I thought a floppy drive was a necessity. It turns out Steve was right & I was wrong. Five years ago, no one would have purchased a computer without an optical drive. Now, the last three computers I've purchased didn't have one. I bought an external drive "just in case", but I've used it less than five times.

Steve's opinion appears to be "MMS is outdated. We're going to force the issue.". He thinks the iPhone has enough clout that it can change the rules of the game. He's probably right. I don't think we'll see Flash anytime soon, either. I think Apple has other plans.

Apple made a revolutionary phone not by conforming to existing standards, but by creating new standards. It seems ridiculous that a so-called modern web-enabled phone would ship without MMS and Flash, but now I think Apple may change everything and have the last laugh.

We don't need floppy drives. We don't need CDs or DVDs. We don't need MMS and we don't need Flash. Pardon the Simpsons reference, but Steve Mobs "is like a god who knows what we want". If we had needed MMS and Flash, Steve would have given it to us.

Who's still using a rotary dial phone?

While I agree that MMS may not be needed, nor do we "need" many other things the iPhone currently offers. You sound like someone who praises Steve Jobs as if he knows everything, and everything he does is good. I think we should have MMS because I paid $600 for something that doesn't do what a $20 phone can do. It might not be a necessity but it is something nice to have. And by saying apple created new standards by not including MMS is ridiculous. To create new standards, the old ones have to be improved upon. Not including MMS and making it so that we have to send our pictures via email and look at MMS's sent to us on a website sounds a heck of a lot easier than just simply having the picture appear in the text conversation and being able to send one back, doesn't it?

Your right, I guess I don't need to look at the thousands of things that use flash. And maybe I don't need to send or receive MMS's, but I want to, and I should expect it if products 1/30th of the price can provide those features. I'm sorry if my post comes out as blunt; but I am sick and tired of people praising and worshiping Steve Jobs for providing out of date hardware at a grossly overpriced cost that can't do things products that came out years ago for much cheaper can do only to adopt it soon after and rape consumers.

[jctevere]

There sure are a lot of people complaining about a possible tether charge. I don't understand the problem. You have unlimited data for your phone, not your computer. If you go to an all you can eat buffet YOU can eat all you want from your plate. Does that Mean 3 other people can eat for free off of your plate because it's unlimited?

So then I would assume that you think routers are unjust as well and we should pay more money monthly to our service providers? It would be a different story if you took your iPhone and set it as an access point for anyone that wanted to use it for data throughput. But if I want to use the UNLIMITED data plan that I pay for on my laptop I should be able to without paying more money. What is that charge even for, to offset the increased bandwith that I will be using when I already pay for unlimited? Give me a break... I think that all the complaints about the possible tethering surcharge is legitimate. Sorry to chew you out, I see where you are coming from. But I think that cellular companies in America have gone too far and are getting too greedy. In 2008 AT&T saw an 18% increase in wireless sales to $11.8 billion which allowed the company to fish a net income of nearly $3.5 billion... Still think that we should be forced to pay more money monthly for tethering?

[celtikmind]

While I agree that MMS may not be needed, nor do we "need" many other things the iPhone currently offers. You sound like someone who praises Steve Jobs as if he knows everything, and everything he does is good. I think we should have MMS because I paid $600 for something that doesn't do what a $20 phone can do. It might not be a necessity but it is something nice to have. And by saying apple created new standards by not including MMS is ridiculous. To create new standards, the old ones have to be improved upon. Not including MMS and making it so that we have to send our pictures via email and look at MMS's sent to us on a website sounds a heck of a lot easier than just simply having the picture appear in the text conversation and being able to send one back, doesn't it?

Your right, I guess I don't need to look at the thousands of things that use flash. And maybe I don't need to send or receive MMS's, but I want to, and I should expect it if products 1/30th of the price can provide those features. I'm sorry if my post comes out as blunt; but I am sick and tired of people praising and worshiping Steve Jobs for providing out of date hardware at a grossly overpriced cost that can't do things products that came out years ago for much cheaper can do only to adopt it soon after and rape consumers.

I acquiesce. :D

[Vip]

Please Please apple solve the ability to see email sent from iPhone on Entourage using Exhange 2003. I don't want to spend money on updating Exchange 2008! :mad::mad::mad:

[DELLsFan]

... 1MB of SMS = 6500 texts = reason to get the unlimited messaging plan for $20, isn't it? Lots cheaper and renders their calculations moot :)

In the same vein, the fact that 5GB/month would cost $25,600 on the ATT $5/MB plan, simply means that it's far cheaper to get the $30 per month data plan.

Sure, if you accept the premise that AT&T is charging a fair and reasonable price. I don't. It isn't even close. Come on now, you don't really think it costs AT&T and the other carriers 20 cents per SMS message, do you? :rolleyes:

[diamond.g]

Sure, if you accept the premise that AT&T is charging a fair and reasonable price. I don't. It isn't even close. Come on now, you don't really think it costs AT&T and the other carriers 20 cents per SMS message, do you? :rolleyes:

If you were a shareholder would you feel differently?

Can't fault them for going after "free" money, after all isn't that apart of capitalism?

[iSurgeon]

While I agree that MMS may not be needed, nor do we "need" many other things the iPhone currently offers. You sound like someone who praises Steve Jobs as if he knows everything, and everything he does is good. I think we should have MMS because I paid $600 for something that doesn't do what a $20 phone can do. It might not be a necessity but it is something nice to have. And by saying apple created new standards by not including MMS is ridiculous. To create new standards, the old ones have to be improved upon. Not including MMS and making it so that we have to send our pictures via email and look at MMS's sent to us on a website sounds a heck of a lot easier than just simply having the picture appear in the text conversation and being able to send one back, doesn't it?

Your right, I guess I don't need to look at the thousands of things that use flash. And maybe I don't need to send or receive MMS's, but I want to, and I should expect it if products 1/30th of the price can provide those features. I'm sorry if my post comes out as blunt; but I am sick and tired of people praising and worshiping Steve Jobs for providing out of date hardware at a grossly overpriced cost that can't do things products that came out years ago for much cheaper can do only to adopt it soon after and rape consumers.


Who dares question the boss we fired 10 years ago, and then brought back! Steve Mobs is all-knowing. He and the great folks at Mapple know what you need even before you do. We should flay anyone who disagrees! Flay him! Flay him, I say!

Lack of MMS does SEEM like it's out-of-date ... just like the lack of a floppy drive on iMac makes it SEEM out-of-date.

The iMac can't even read floppies for cryin' out loud! Problem? No. Who wants to use floppies anyway? Not me. I cast them aside. Painful? At first. After everyone started realizing that floppies were no longer universally accepted, they gradually made the transition. Do you really want to be using floppies again?

Think of the "Missing MMS" as an early adopter tax. It's much easier to follow a beaten path than to be a trailblazer. If anyone misses MMS, Flash, and/or a physical keyboard, I hear the Blackberry Storm is wonderful, in a "beaten path" kinda way.

Besides, who needs MMS when there are over FIFTY Fart apps for the iPhone? My email follows me everywhere. My phone number does not. Also, the carriers don't control my email like they do SMS/MMS. Also, spam filters are more robust on email than on MMS.

I empathize with your struggles to live without MMS ... but it's really only problematic because your contacts are living in the past and have not "moved on". It'll get easy. It always does.

[kdarling]

Steve Jobs et al disagree that MMS is needed.

Actually...

Unlike Flash or Java, Jobs has never said one word against MMS.

The whole idea that Apple is anti-MMS, is something made up by people who are trying to somehow explain away iPhone shortcomings.

If missing MMS equals Jobs hating it, then I guess Jobs must really hate native video recording, turn by turn navigation and lots of other things that he's never mentioned either.

It's like watching a Monty Python skit, about a group of 1800's islanders finding a seaman's chest washed ashore. Oh look, God has given us this wonderful box with amazing stuff inside. But... it has no coconuts in it! Therefore God must not want us to have coconuts. Coconuts must be A Bad Thing. Quick, tell everyone!

:rolleyes:

[kdarling]

Sure, if you accept the premise that AT&T is charging a fair and reasonable price. I don't. It isn't even close. Come on now, you don't really think it costs AT&T and the other carriers 20 cents per SMS message, do you? :rolleyes:

Well...

1) They do have a multi-billion dollar infrastructure to build and support, and tens of thousands of employees to pay. It will cost a lot more than normal to deploy 4G, too.

2) Do you accept the premise that Apple needs to charge so much for their devices, MobileMe, and developer royalties? Or is the billions of profit they've made okay?

3) I don't really care. Especially since you can buy unlimited texting :)

The price itself is not the main point of my posts. My point is that you cannot equate the way SMS is charged, with the way data connections are charged. They're totally different technologies, with different advantages, and different purposes.

Regards.

[Digital Skunk]

I'm talking about an iPhone Pro. you can keep your virtual keyboard. I just type faster on a real keyboard. Since when would the keyboard be flimsy and fall off? since this doesn't happen with most smart phones as they're put together well I'd expect an even better keyboard from Apple.

Not only would I have to agree, but I would point that poster to the HTC Touch Pro2 which gives you BOTH a touch keyboard and a pull out real keyboard for punching out REAL documents and emails.

Also, with the larger screens on many pro smartphones they've been able to add much more user friendly keys that are easier to press and locate without looking. The Touch Pro 2 doesn't even have that awful "option" and "shift" buttons, the period is a dedicated key, and the numbers have their own line above the letters.

If it were to come out on Sprint's network, it'd be a serious choice between it and the Pre, with Windows Mobile being a big reason to not consider the Touch Pro.

Oh, and yes, pull out/slide up keyboards have NEVER been flimsy. They only got flimsy in the minds of iPhone users when Steve said no one needed them anymore.

[joeshell383]

Especially since you can buy unlimited texting :)


That is the bottom line. If one chooses to continue sending messages via e-mail, they are fine to do so. (As with SMS, MMS can be disabled on the account for those who are afraid of receiving messages). For someone who has unlimited SMS/MMS, or is willing to pay per use, the details of how the data is delivered is meaningless, and there are no disadvantages, but the benefit of EASY picture/video messaging is tremendous.

Think about SMS. All of the same arguments against MMS could have been made about SMS if it had not be included. i.e. "Why don't you just e-mail the person?" Duh! It is easier to SMS! (At least until push IM comes along, then short messages and pics might be easy enough to transfer, but even then there are still issues with people on the receiving end who don't have IM installed and enabled on their phones.)

[Goldfinger]

There's one little thing that I would like to see (along with copy and paste and flash support) and that is SMS delivery status/reports!

Oh and MMS would be nice, email is not a serious alternative, almost nobody has email/internet on their phone. Data is expensive, especially on pre-paid plans that are used by 80% of the population.

[MacViolinist]

A Few Things That Should Be Mentioned:

1. Apple has a long history of deciding which technologies they want to play ball with. Along with that goes (out the window) the technologies that Apple doesn't want to play ball with.

MMS is a tech Apple doesn't want to play ball with.

2. Push will make an appearance when Apple finds a way to make it somewhat profitable.

3. Let's be generous here and assign all the people who are griping about what the iPhone lacks a whopping 1%. You are still a self-selected 1% of all iPhone owners/users/people-who-emo-threaten-to-get-another-phone/cancel your contract -ers.

Umm. Get a sense of perspective. Any company that can sell a product that keeps 99% of its customer-base happy is doing pretty well. There is no compelling business reason to shake things up in order to provide features or services that 1% are griping about––especially if it may involve problems that will affect everyone.

4. 1% is extremely generous. Those who are really pissed off about lacking features are really more like 1/100 of a percent, if that.

5. If you bought an iPhone hoping that MMS would magically appear, you are the same frigtard that bought an original Bandi Blue iMac in 1997 hoping that floppy drives would magically appear in the USB ports. You are also the same frigtard that got really pissed when Apple decided to go with USB instead of FireWire on the new MacBooks.

6. Newsflash!!!! Apple has an agenda. Apple needs and wants to make money. That's what publicly-traded companies do. This fantasy that Apple is scouring these boards for product ideas is, well, fantasy.

Apple conducts actual market research. The company knows what most people care about. You are not most people. Most people do not care about the things that you apparently die for. Does that make Apple a bad company? Maybe it does. I'm not here to answer that.

7. If you want a phone with X feature, go get one. There are plenty out there. What all of you (yes, you, oh incredible .01 percent) seem to want is for Apple to cater to all of your whiney-ass "needs."

Apple is never going to listen to you.

Just stop. For the love of Vishnu's left tit, please just stop.

[DELLsFan]

Well...

1) They do have a multi-billion dollar infrastructure to build and support, and tens of thousands of employees to pay. It will cost a lot more than normal to deploy 4G, too.

2) Do you accept the premise that Apple needs to charge so much for their devices, MobileMe, and developer royalties? Or is the billions of profit they've made okay?

3) I don't really care. Especially since you can buy unlimited texting :)

The price itself is not the main point of my posts. My point is that you cannot equate the way SMS is charged, with the way data connections are charged. They're totally different technologies, with different advantages, and different purposes.

Regards.

1) Indeed, but I would argue the pricing plans in place provide the capital means to reinvest, pay employees, and support said infrastructure AND kick back some profit to shareholders. Given how much growth AT&T Mobility has seen since the iPhone was released and given how all other competition to this market is shut out with that 5 year contract with Apple, I should think they'll have squirreled away quite enough to invest in and implement 4G. There is no need to fleece consumers for more than is necessary.

I think the brilliance of AT&T's board has overlooked the possibility that after their 5 years are up, Apple will probably have courted one or more competitors to host plans for the future generations of the iPhone. Who will stand out above the rest when these negotiations begin in earnest and real competition forces their hand? Mr. 20 cents a minute, or Mr. Reasonable & Truly Unlimited Plan? :cool:

2) I think the billions they've made reflect a great credit to their leadership and success with products and services people obviously are willing to buy. This said, no one forces me to buy Apple products. The quality and utility of a product or service are what I determine will make it worth it to purchase. I personally think Apple products are still overpriced, but we are seeing this slowly change as they gain market share. As an example, the cost of configuring a new Mac with additional RAM used to be scandalous. Now it's arguably tolerable. This change didn't happen overnight. Neither will the Cupertino market ideology, but it must as supply and demand warrant. So it follows that eventually, AT&T will change their pricing structure if less people are buying their product or regulators or legislation intervene to protect the consumer from unfair price gouging. True, no one forces me to SMS or buy an SMS package. Still ... I think lines need to be drawn in the sand at some point as technologies advance. It isn't jealousy of AT&T's wealth I decry. I decry the means in which some of this profit is obtained. I am not alone.

3) Well, thanks for playing, but not everyone cares to shell out that extra dough for a service that costs the provider relatively little to nothing to offer.

My point IS the cost, regardless of the technology behind the product. Unless people start questioning things like pricing (package or a la carte), the status quo will never change. I think the cell carriers would be wise to actually compete for and retain my business, not dismiss it as a statistic.

Cheers! :apple:

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Apple conducts actual market research. The company knows what most people care about. You are not most people. Most people do not care about the things that you apparently die for. Does that make Apple a bad company? Maybe it does. I'm not here to answer that.

Actually Apple doesn't conduct market research or do surveys or show off their products to a few people and judge their reactions. Steve and Ive have both said this.

[MacViolinist]

Actually Apple doesn't conduct market research or do surveys or show off their products to a few people and judge their reactions. Steve and Ive have both said this.

That's funny.

[dukebound85]

Actually Apple doesn't conduct market research or do surveys or show off their products to a few people and judge their reactions. Steve and Ive have both said this.

hmm link?

seems silly not too tbh

[TuffLuffJimmy]

That's funny.

Yep. Apple's a pretty headstrong company.

[kdarling]

3. Let's be generous here and assign all the people who are griping about what the iPhone lacks a whopping 1%. You are still a self-selected 1% of all iPhone owners/users/people-who-emo-threaten-to-get-another-phone/cancel your contract -ers.

Apple themselves said (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/iphone-unlocked/250000-unlocked-iphones-have-been-sold-313741.php) that almost 20% of the original iPhones were unlocked (and that doesn't count just jailbroken, which was more). Those owners wanted something Apple wouldn't give.

The owner surveys for the iPhone have listed "Very Satisfied" at 79% (http://apple20.blogs.fortune.cnn.com/2008/04/01/iphone-scores-79-in-customer-satisfaction-survey-rim-trails-at-54/) to 85%. That leaves at least 15% who are not, presumably because of something that they wish worked better or something they wish was included.

Judging from the evidence, 1% is way low for the number of owners who would gripe about something.

[OllyW]

Judging from the evidence, 1% is way low for the number of owners who would gripe about something.

When you are making up "facts", you can use any figure you like. ;)

[TuffLuffJimmy]

hmm link?

seems silly not too tbh

http://mosaic.arizona.edu/node/267
If you'd like I can look for a link that's more relavent, but I believe Steve said it during that interview with Mossberg.

[kdarling]

3) Well, thanks for playing, but not everyone cares to shell out that extra dough for a service that costs the provider relatively little to nothing to offer.

As a contractor to phone companies, who programs some of the backend systems, I have to disagree that it costs relatively little or nothing. If that were so, everyone could do it.

And, seriously, "thanks for playing"? Most people stopped using that back in the mid-80s. (I've been online for three decades.)

My point IS the cost, regardless of the technology behind the product. Unless people start questioning things like pricing (package or a la carte), the status quo will never change. I think the cell carriers would be wise to actually compete for and retain my business, not dismiss it as a statistic.

I agree. When possible, people should take their business to whatever's best for them.

That goes for the phone makers, as well as the carriers.

[MacViolinist]

Apple themselves said that around 20% of the original iPhones were unlocked (and that doesn't count just jailbroken, which was more). Those owners wanted something Apple wouldn't give.

The owner surveys for the iPhone have listed "Very Satisfied" at 79% to 85%. That leaves at least 15% who are not, presumably because of something that they wish worked better or something they wish was included.

Judging from the evidence, 1% is way low for the number of owners who would gripe about something.

Point in your favor. And a bow to some research. Just curious, what are the numbers for those who are "only" satisfied?

Also, are those numbers limited to feature satisfaction or are quality of service issues counted?

But that's all aside from the point I was specifically making about the MacRumors gripers.

All of them who bitch and moan about the lack of MMS, C&P, etc. really don't amount to much of anything.

So please don't hassle me out of context.

kthxetcplz.

[MacViolinist]

Actually Apple doesn't conduct market research or do surveys or show off their products to a few people and judge their reactions. Steve and Ive have both said this.

That's quite a bit of stuff for a company not to do.

To be specific, Apple doesn't do extensive product testing. There is some conjoint and max/dif in select markets. I know for a fact that it does a LOT of market research.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

That's quite a bit of stuff for a company not to do.

To be specific, Apple doesn't do extensive product testing. There is some conjoint and max/dif in select markets. I know for a fact that it does a LOT of market research.

Do you have a link to this "fact" that you just made up off the top of your head without any evidence?

[DELLsFan]

... I have to disagree that it costs relatively little or nothing. If that were so, everyone could do it.

Or since each carrier IS doing it ... maybe all the carriers aGREED their so-called, incredible expenses justified the high package and a la carte pricing? No ... I don't buy it. IMO, it's unmitigated profit. Period.

... And, seriously, "thanks for playing"? Most people stopped using that back in the mid-80s. (I've been online for three decades.)

Maybe I liked the 80's? :p While we're being serious, YOU were the one that said you didn't care. I took your word for it. I count myself among others that do. There are some like me that don't need 30 years of wisdom and experience to figure out when they're being had.

SMS pricing borders on the criminal, IMO and I think it's about time the carriers were called to the carpet to justify it. Tethering is another kettle of fish, but I look forward to frying it with the best of them when and if this feature is ever released for the iPhone.

/salute :apple:

[Mr. Mustard]

I've had the "Jesus Phone" since the day it came out and still have never really neeeded copy and paste. Seriously whats the big deal?

[TuffLuffJimmy]

I've had the "Jesus Phone" since the day it came out and still have never really neeeded copy and paste. Seriously whats the big deal?

You're one person. You probably upgraded from a Razr. And you obviously don't do any work or anything productive with your "Jesus Phone".

[Lara F]

You're one person. You probably upgraded from a Razr. And you obviously don't do any work or anything productive with your "Jesus Phone".

Medical apps don't require copy and paste. Not saying the iPhone shouldn't have it (and can understand the impatience/frustration), but I certainly don't need it to work or be productive in the hospital.

For my part, my "need to have in 3.0" feature is background apps/multitasking. I'd be really disappointed if there wasn't some solution there.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Medical apps don't require copy and paste. Not saying the iPhone shouldn't have it (and can understand the impatience/frustration), but I certainly don't need it to work or be productive in the hospital.

So you're hoping they don't add cut/copy and paste?

[jakotatio]

I personally think it would be really cool if they added the option to send text messages and emails in landscape. MMS I could live without.

[tys]

Medical apps don't require copy and paste. Not saying the iPhone shouldn't have it (and can understand the impatience/frustration), but I certainly don't need it to work or be productive in the hospital.


I use my iPhone in the hospital and copy&paste makes me much more productive. Suppose someone emails or texts me a question about a drug I'm not familiar with: I can copy the name and paste into epocrates and look it up.
The most useful thing is text-paging colleagues via the hospital pager system which uses a web interface. I keep a list of pager numbers in notepad and can copy numbers directly into Safari to send a page. I even copy&paste frequently used messages. Before copy&paste, I'd have to write things down on a piece of paper (or my scrub pants!) and then type them back in manually, at least 3-4 times/day. It saves me a ton of time.
I'm using the Clippy app for jailbroken phones.

tys

[Randman]

I'd be happy with a limited copy and paste, for now.

[dwsolberg]

How would copy and paste do this? and if you don't want background apps don't let them run in the background. Just kill it when you're done.

Trouble is, that 99% of people wouldn't know to do this. The other 1% are largely represented here.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Trouble is, that 95% of people wouldn't know to do this. The other 5% are largely represented here.

So how is it your issue if 5% of the iPhone user base don't know how to use their phones? Let Apple worry about that.

EDIT: That was a pretty lame change you made to your post, btw.

[kdarling]

(re: killing apps) Trouble is, that 99% of people wouldn't know to do this.

Sure they would, if the UI is done right. Like on the Pre. You can easily see what apps are running, and swipe away (kill) the ones you don't need as much anymore.

An enhancement would be to have some kind of toggled indicator for each app card, as to how much resources that they're using. Getting a slowdown? Just look visually for the culprit. Even my wife, the ultimate non-techie, could figure it out then.

[Lara F]

I use my iPhone in the hospital and copy&paste makes me much more productive. Suppose someone emails or texts me a question about a drug I'm not familiar with: I can copy the name and paste into epocrates and look it up.
The most useful thing is text-paging colleagues via the hospital pager system which uses a web interface. I keep a list of pager numbers in notepad and can copy numbers directly into Safari to send a page. I even copy&paste frequently used messages. Before copy&paste, I'd have to write things down on a piece of paper (or my scrub pants!) and then type them back in manually, at least 3-4 times/day. It saves me a ton of time.
I'm using the Clippy app for jailbroken phones.

tys

Those are good examples - they just haven't applied to me. I do keep a list of beeper numbers for my fellow residents on my iphone and refer to it all the time (as well as call schedules), but usually page by phone.

That said, contrary to how my prior post was interpreted I do hope copy & paste comes. I might not need it much for work atm but who knows, maybe a month later I'll be wondering how I did without it.

[koh-kun]

I wish there were an easier way to change SMS & email tones…

[MistaBungle]

^Yes! I really hope that is coming!

[paola105]

So if 3.0 is announced on Tuesday, when will it be released? I'm thinking of getting the iPhone soon and don't know whether to get it now and update to 3.0 later, or wait until version 3.0 is released. :confused:

[jctevere]

So if 3.0 is announced on Tuesday, when will it be released? I'm thinking of getting the iPhone soon and don't know whether to get it now and update to 3.0 later, or wait until version 3.0 is released. :confused:

Well, 3,0 is being previewed Tuesday, so chances are it won't be released until at least another month, ranging up to 3 months max. It won't matter if you buy and iPhone now or when it comes out, you will be able to upgrade to it for free regardless. However, if the rumors are true, Apple may come out with a new iPhone hardware in the upcoming summer months (June - Aug) I am not really sure what it will include but rumors consist of faster processor, more powerful graphics and of course more ram and flash memory. If you can't wait until then, but it now; otherwise, I would suggest waiting.

[jctevere]

So if 3.0 is announced on Tuesday, when will it be released? I'm thinking of getting the iPhone soon and don't know whether to get it now and update to 3.0 later, or wait until version 3.0 is released. :confused:

Well, 3,0 is being previewed Tuesday, so chances are it won't be released until at least another month, ranging up to 3 months max. It won't matter if you buy and iPhone now or when it comes out, you will be able to upgrade to it for free regardless. However, if the rumors are true, Apple may come out with a new iPhone hardware in the upcoming summer months (June - Aug) I am not really sure what it will include but rumors consist of faster processor, more powerful graphics and of course more ram and flash memory. If you can't wait until then, but it now; otherwise, I would suggest waiting.

[t0mat0]

Issues of being able to update the contract do occur also.

[bryantsiphone]

I love how every one is like well can you phone do all the things lacked (the things that should be included in this new os) and im like not yet the phone is only 2 years old, how long has your phone company been around?

[kdarling]

I love how every one is like well can you phone do all the things lacked (the things that should be included in this new os) and im like not yet the phone is only 2 years old, how long has your phone company been around?

The iPhone had a head start: No legacy phones or phone OS to support. Plenty of other phones to look at for examples of what to, or not to, copy. Other phones paid for most of the R&D in parts. They also waited until displays and cpus got powerful enough to look good.

A smart company would've made a list of features that other phones have. Then work down that list. Forwarding texts should've been high on that list, for example.

However, you're right, no one can do everything at once. So they deserved some slack... at first. Funny how many people claimed that c&p, video and MMS was "coming just a couple months" after the 2007 launch.

[shaunymac]

The iPhone had a head start: No legacy phones or phone OS to support. Plenty of other phones to look at for examples of what to, or not to, copy. Other phones paid for most of the R&D in parts. They also waited until displays and cpus got powerful enough to look good.

A smart company would've made a list of features that other phones have. Then work down that list. Forwarding texts should've been high on that list, for example.

However, you're right, no one can do everything at once. So they deserved some slack... at first. Funny how many people claimed that c&p, video and MMS was "coming just a couple months" after the 2007 launch.


Believe me, I know. Everyone initailly thought that mms was kinda "left out" for some reason or another and then everyone got bashed for wanting it. :confused: Heck, tons of people still use it but I dont bc I paid $500 bucks for a phone. :o. Att's web service definitely sucks like some have mentioned and if I happen to get pictures sent to me via text, which is a rarity now that everyone knows that I can't see them, I dont even bother to look at them bc the cray username and password they give you to retrieve your image works 50% of the time.

If video came, that would be kinda cool. It kinda comes in handy every now and then on my jailbroken phone. It's definately not something to be proud of much like the camera but none the less, its there. I always keep a 5D with me so I my camera only gets used by young family members.

If they dont do something like mms or a functional c&c, there is no reason for me to go back. My phone will stay jailbroken. If you ever do it, you will love it. Mine looks just like my mac. I love it. :D

What I would love: The ability to use my phone in disk mode like an iPod. That would be sweet.

[NXTMIKE]

Flash support in the iPone/iPod Touch 3.0 update? I've heard Adobe and Apple were working together on something for this, but this topic has been stagnant for a while :(

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Flash support in the iPone/iPod Touch 3.0 update? I've heard Adobe and Apple were working together on something for this, but this topic has been stagnant for a while :(

Because Apple refuses to work with Adobe on this, because at Apple they think they know what's best for their customer.

[gikku]

email attachments, pleeease! :cool:
multiple pic attachments in mail, a limit of one pic per email is ridiculous.

[SaudiMac]

my wish list:
Arabic support (and other languages are still missing).
copy and paste
offline maps (seriously google maps is a piece of crap, their maps of saudi arabia are useless, no navigation and no POI)
some sort of background processing

[OllyW]

A Few Things That Should Be Mentioned:

1. Apple has a long history of deciding which technologies they want to play ball with. Along with that goes (out the window) the technologies that Apple doesn't want to play ball with.

MMS is a tech Apple doesn't want to play ball with.

2. Push will make an appearance when Apple finds a way to make it somewhat profitable.

3. Let's be generous here and assign all the people who are griping about what the iPhone lacks a whopping 1%. You are still a self-selected 1% of all iPhone owners/users/people-who-emo-threaten-to-get-another-phone/cancel your contract -ers.

Umm. Get a sense of perspective. Any company that can sell a product that keeps 99% of its customer-base happy is doing pretty well. There is no compelling business reason to shake things up in order to provide features or services that 1% are griping about––especially if it may involve problems that will affect everyone.

4. 1% is extremely generous. Those who are really pissed off about lacking features are really more like 1/100 of a percent, if that.

5. If you bought an iPhone hoping that MMS would magically appear, you are the same frigtard that bought an original Bandi Blue iMac in 1997 hoping that floppy drives would magically appear in the USB ports. You are also the same frigtard that got really pissed when Apple decided to go with USB instead of FireWire on the new MacBooks.

6. Newsflash!!!! Apple has an agenda. Apple needs and wants to make money. That's what publicly-traded companies do. This fantasy that Apple is scouring these boards for product ideas is, well, fantasy.

Apple conducts actual market research. The company knows what most people care about. You are not most people. Most people do not care about the things that you apparently die for. Does that make Apple a bad company? Maybe it does. I'm not here to answer that.

7. If you want a phone with X feature, go get one. There are plenty out there. What all of you (yes, you, oh incredible .01 percent) seem to want is for Apple to cater to all of your whiney-ass "needs."

Apple is never going to listen to you.

Just stop. For the love of Vishnu's left tit, please just stop.


He who laughs last, laughs longest. :D

:p