How do we as a society deal with Child molesters?

[Backtothemac]

This is an issue that every year takes more and more of my brain power to sort through. What do we do these people? How do we get more proactive in finding them, and removing them from society before they prey on people.

Samantha Runion. That little girl's story did, and continues to rip at my soul. What punishment is fitting?

Lets keep this civil, lets be calm, and discuss an issue that is very powerful, emotional, and actually get somewhere.


*Note, if ANYONE attempts to hijack this thread, or becomes rude and vulgar, I will personally notify the mods that will bring the wrath of the Gods down on you :D *

[SlyHunter]

You can't do anything "before" unless your psychic.
Maybe if they were genetically tested before birth and then aborted, but I wouldn't recommend that idea.

[Desertrat]

No personal expertise, but I've read of clues available to psychologists, which most lay people recognize only after the fact. It could be useful--but rather insulting and an invasion of privacy, I guess--to run checks on people in certain positions. Teachers? Preachers? Scout leaders? (I'm not advocating; I'm just pointing out certain "Before" methods that could reduce the problem.)

Our system is based (supposed to be, anyway) on punishing after misdeeds, not preventing misdeeds in the first place. Cops function primarily as janitors, cleaning up after messes have been made.

From what I've read, the drive to molest overpowers any fear of punishment.

As to punishment? I see that crime as one of the worst and most obscene betrayals of trust and innocence. Just put me down as very old-fashioned and primitive, and leave it at that.

'Rat

[Krizoitz]

If you could predict behavior before it happened well then you could change things, stop them from commiting crime.

Since we can't I say we punish them to the fullest extent, child-molestors and rapists are the worst ever.

[Backtothemac]

Well, look at Dru. Her killer has been charged with several rapes, and attempted rapes, but yet he was out on the streets. Should rape carry a punishment of life with no parole?

I personally think child molestation should carry the death penalty, but I don't know if others will agree with me on this or not.

[SlyHunter]

I just had an evil, very evil thought.
Think 10-20 years from now on tv news report just in.

Scientist have just discovered that due to a minor glitch in programing there was an offset of 1 digit in the DNA analyzer and as such instead of aborting future child molesters they were killing all those with blue eyes. So if you ever wondered about the shortage of blue eyed baby's now you know.

[SlyHunter]

Well, look at Dru. Her killer has been charged with several rapes, and attempted rapes, but yet he was out on the streets. Should rape carry a punishment of life with no parole?

I personally think child molestation should carry the death penalty, but I don't know if others will agree with me on this or not.
Guy accross the street from me when I was a kid got divorced from his first wife for molesting his daughter. Got his butt sent to the hospital when he tried to molest a daughter by his second wife. He's now old found Jesus and still married to that woman. All his daughters grew up and seem well adjusted. He's never been to jail except for DUI or public intoxication and he don't do that anymore either.

Apparently even child molesters can be rehabilitated. I'm for the death penalty if the person has no hope of parole or being freed from jail again and/or if the person is judged to be incapable of being rehabilitated. Other than that we should be careful of who we execute.

In this case he only did it when he was drunk, but I know alcohol is no excuss.

[Neserk]

The best way to prevent child molestation is to prevent domestic abuse. The bigget indicator of someone become a child molestor is someone who grew up in a home where there was domestic abuse.

Now I'll go look and see if I can find any online links to studies. Don't hold your breath. The good stuff never makes it to the internet. It hangs out in college/university libraries on the shelves in the Journals.

[poopyhead]

I don't know how to prevent a child molsester from molesting the first time
but
child molestors usually make their tendencies known in adolence and early adulthood
and research has consistently proven that they cannot be rehabilitated
I think the first step to solving the problem is creating an open dialog in society, a dialog in which the abused will not be subjected to even more abuse if they come forward. If such a dialog was to be openly discussed many of the children and adults who have suffered would be more willing to come forward thus at least notifying others to the actions of their abusers.
secondly I think we as a nation need to start treating child molestation and incest as a crime
peoples lives are destroyed every day by sick bastards
if the abused do come forward they are often ostracized, told by their parents/family member/law enforcement that it is a family problem, or in the rare case where there is prosecution the offender gets only minimal time in prison (even less if it is inscest). Often times first offenders are released with no time served and only a restraining order keeping them from molesting the same child twice.
Child molesters are murderers. They murder not the physical child but childhood and the kids future, they kill the soul. As such I think all child molesters, first offenders along with rapist, should be encarcerated indefinately. Child molestation carries too high a price on the children of america and society in general to be treated as it is by the american judicial system. Cocaine dealers, pot growers, and tax evaders often time receive more punishment than those who rape the future of america.

I still think that child molesters should be slopply castrated with a rusty pair of lefty safety scissors (rightys for the leftys) by those who they molested when they become adults.

[G5orbust]

Child molesters and rapists are the scum of society.

I think they should be exempt from the law preventing "cruel and unusual punishment".

[skunk]

As such I think all child molesters, first offenders along with rapist, should be encarcerated indefinately.
And if it isn't a safe conviction? What then?

I still think that child molesters should be slopply castrated with a rusty pair of lefty safety scissors (rightys for the leftys) by those who they molested when they become adults.
And if it isn't a safe conviction? What then?

[SlyHunter]

Being placed on a publicized listing of sexual offenders is inhumane but happens as a consequence to their crime. Even ones who met girls in bars and found out later they were under age are on that list, or some who just innocently patted a rear or an arm and were falsely accused. Yes and allot of them were guilty as sin. Irregardless they all can't go anywhere, live anywhere without someone announcing to everyone in the area they are sexual offenders or predators. I am surprised we havn't heard anything in the news about their homes burning down or their corpses found in the middle of the street by a neighborhood watch vigilante committee. But then if it did happen would the press publicize the fact since it goes against their agenda of promoting the listings?

[zimv20]

i'm not familiar w/ the case b2tm brought up -- what are the particulars of how the man went free?

[Desertrat]

zim, some rapists get plea bargain deals because of the difficulty in proving full-bore rape to a jury. This commonly results in both a relatively short sentence and then an early-out for good behavior. A guy gets sent up a time or two, beginning in his early twenties; commonly he's on the street again while in his late 30s or in his 40s.

I don't know the inside of the minds of rapists, but I'll comment that some guys, as they get older, get into the "Lolita" thing...I think that's part of why we read about some guy in his 50s or even older who molests or rapes younger girls.

There have been many efforts to improve our various states' systems of family abuse of whatever sort. For all the flaws, the systems are certainly better than they were some 20 or 40 years back, as near as I can tell.

A downside vignette of modernity: Florida law requires the names of any accused be held in the computer for two years, regardless of innocence. Public record about a complaint. A couple was accused of child abuse, the complaint saying that two-year-old "Herman" was left alone all day, locked in the bathroom. That was indeed true. Herman was the pet raccoon of this childless couple. However, there was no provision in the law that their names be erased from the computer, no longer publicly accused of child abuse.

The reason the law had no provision for erasure was a fear of corruption in the record keeping...

'Rat

[Backtothemac]

i'm not familiar w/ the case b2tm brought up -- what are the particulars of how the man went free?

It is really pretty. Attempted Agrivated Rape, Agrivated Rape, Attempted Kidnapping, and yes, Kidnapping.

Here is a link to his bio http://www.doc.state.mn.us/level3/OffenderDetail.asp?OID=108212
Notice, the words "no longer under supervision".

Here is a link to what he has done since.
http://crime.about.com/cs/currentcases/a/rodriguezprelim.htm
Notice, released last May after serving 23 years! November killed Dru.

They found her body yesterday.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,117398,00.html

Someone in another thread said that justice had been served in this case. How? That is the point. WE as a society failed this girl, her family, and her friends.

[Sun Baked]

Then there's the sexual deviant for years who was unable to control it, and it was found he had a brain tumor.

When it was removed his urges stopped, and years later when the tumor grew back -- so did his sexual urges.

According to some people he's a danger to society and should be killed.

Even though the doctors can point to a brain tumor as the cause of his problems twice.

But he is also a sexual deviant with a history and many states would love to see him behind bars for life...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2003-07-28-pedophile-tumor_x.htm

[poopyhead]

And if it isn't a safe conviction? What then?


And if it isn't a safe conviction? What then?

are they child molesters or rapists?
if yes then castrate and indefinately incarcerate the bastards
if no
set them free

i was not attempting to set forth some sort of legislative statute that would hold true in all ocasions. Nor was I attempting to create an empirical set of standardized procedures. I was simply attemting to voice what I feel should happent to child molesters.

What is a safe conviction?
what is an unsafe conviction?
where do you feel reasonable doubt ends and an unsafe conviction begins?

I guess if you were to hold me to what I said previously, I would in an attempt to prevent those who did not commit the crime from having to go through the punisment to have a mandatory appeal simalar to a death penalty case.

[Backtothemac]

Then there's the sexual deviant for years who was unable to control it, and it was found he had a brain tumor.

When it was removed his urges stopped, and years later when the tumor grew back -- so did his sexual urges.

According to some people he's a danger to society and should be killed.

Even though the doctors can point to a brain tumor as the cause of his problems twice.

But he is also a sexual deviant with a history and many states would love to see him behind bars for life...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2003-07-28-pedophile-tumor_x.htm

This person should still be locked up. No doubt about it. Obviously he should be punished for the crimes, however, he is a threat to society because when his cancer comes back, boom. So does the crime. Tough case. I am not looking for acceptions like these, but the norm like Dru's killer.

[Sayhey]

Lets keep this civil, lets be calm, and discuss an issue that is very powerful, emotional, and actually get somewhere.


B2TM,

I appreciate the attempt to discuss an important issue that tends to degenerate into a "string 'em up" shouting match. I don't have a lot of answers on this topic, but in honor of your attempt I'll throw in my two cents.

I don't think the answer to your question about what to do before an attack is in the realm of new laws. I think it is more in the area of education of parents about the dangers that children face from pedophiles and the kind of precautions we need to take. There is no way that I know of to identify pedophiles before they commit a crime, and as a civil society based on laws it is perhaps even more dangerous to start down the road of punishing people before they commit a crime. There maybe early warning signs of such behavior that we can identify for treatment but I don't know what they are or how to go about it. Such treatment would have to be voluntary and the reality of most such criminal's lives is that they have been abused themselves, as Neserk has pointed out, most often by the very parents that would have to ok treatment.

On the punishment side, I do think there is ample evidence that much longer prison terms or commitment time is necessary because of the very likely rate of reoccurrence of these crimes by such individuals. I do not support, however, mandatory sentences in this or any other crime. All we need is overzealous prosecutors who start throwing 18 year-old boys in jail for 25 years to life for having sex with their 17 year-old girlfriends. There is a critical function of society to protect children from abuse and a little common sense should go a long way. I leave the discussion about the death penalty out, because, as we have discussed in the past, I don't support its use in any case.

One very good development is that we, as a society, are increasingly refusing to sweep child abuse in family situations into the dark closet it has so often been relegated. Perhaps if we can get at these early causes we can make some headway in stopping the development of such individuals.

I'm sorry I can give so little to your discussion, but for what it is worth, those are my thoughts.

[Backtothemac]

I am sorry everyone. I mean to ask what can we do after they commit a crime to ever keep them from committing another. Dru's killer had already served 23 years. Yet he got out to rape and kill. That is the problem. Should violent criminals be locked up for life? Yes, some that are truely refomed would have to suffer for those that don't but, it would keep society safe.

[skunk]

I am sorry everyone. I mean to ask what can we do after they commit a crime to ever keep them from committing another. Dru's killer had already served 23 years. Yet he got out to rape and kill. That is the problem. Should violent criminals be locked up for life? Yes, some that are truely refomed would have to suffer for those that don't but, it would keep society safe.
This man should have been better assessed before release. 23 years is a long time.

[Sun Baked]

How far are you willing to go to keep society safe?

Are you willing to give up a lot of your freedom, because putting the government in charge of your life will make you safe?

How much are you willing to pay to keep yourself safe?

Another tenth to third of your take-home pay. Would that be enough to keep people who drink, use weapons to commit crimes, violently/sexually assault people, etc. locked up for the rest of their lives.

Of should we use slave labor in the prisons so society doesn't have to be burdened by everybody we need lock up to keep ourselves safe?

The lawyers would say you're on the slipperly slope, when you start going after one class of people as a supreme danger to society. Because somebody will always point out another group just as dangerous and deadly as the group you're trying to eliminate.

[poopyhead]

This man should have been better assessed before release. 23 years is a long time.

I beleive he was assessed
and was beleived to still constitute a danger to society as he was likely to re commit
however
you are not able to hold people longer than their sentence requires
legally they have "paid their debt to society" and futher holding is impropper
california attempted to create a law in which extreme sexual predetors would be held in a mental health facility after their sentences were officaily over
the initial batch of felons were able to skirt this "regulatory function" by citing ex post facto law
in that when they were origionaly convited the regualtory holding did not apply thus they were not further held

[skunk]

you are not able to hold people longer than their sentence requires
legally they have "paid their debt to society" and futher holding is impropper
Over here, we have a quaint sentence of being "detained at Her Majesty's Pleasure". Indefinite detention, subject to reports and reassessment.

[poopyhead]

How far are you willing to go to keep society safe?

Are you willing to give up a lot of your freedom, because putting the government in charge of your life will make you safe?

How much are you willing to pay to keep yourself safe?

Another tenth to third of your take-home pay. Would that be enough to keep people who drink, use weapons to commit crimes, violently/sexually assault people, etc. locked up for the rest of their lives.

Of should we use slave labor in the prisons so society doesn't have to be burdened by everybody we need lock up to keep ourselves safe?



supprisingly this has a relatively easy answer
the vast majority people in american prisons are non violent (at least when they went in) offenders
many of these are drug users
If we simply stop incarcerating those whose crimes are aginst themselves and possibly use home incarceration against other non violent felons then we can open up large numbers of cells for those who truly deserve punishment
there are a crap load of child molesters but they are not nearly as prevalent as drug users
one of the problems with child molesters and rapists is their high propensity to re offend
thus while the problem is great and their victims are many the relative number of criminals is small

[Backtothemac]

I think we need to really look at these people. I would gladly give another 10% of my income to have these people locked up for the rest of their lives. But why not execute them? If they are a true violent threat to the safety and welfare of society, why not just end it for them and us?

[poopyhead]

I think we need to really look at these people. I would gladly give another 10% of my income to have these people locked up for the rest of their lives. But why not execute them? If they are a true violent threat to the safety and welfare of society, why not just end it for them and us?

while in many ways I would love for them to be dead and often times I would personally love to torture them, I at the same time feel that that would be morally wrong
If they die at their own hands or the hands of others like them I am (unfortunately) all for it

i personally feel that government has the duty to protect its citizenry (lock up criminals) but at the same time I do not feel it is necessarily the govts job to punish
I believe this right belongs to a power outside of humanity
therefore I do not feel that execution of anyone, even the most vile of humanity, is the proper role of government

often times when dealing with questions such as this I find it difficult to separate my vile passions (for death and torture) from what I know to be morally correct
I am only glad that in decisions such as this it is not my temporary emotion that seals the fate of the accused
I only hope that someday a proper remedy is discovered and the people of america and the world will be freed from the degenerate lusts of base individuals who seek to ingratiate themselves at the cost of anothers life and soul

[skunk]

I agree. The government's job is protection, not retribution.

[Backtothemac]

I agree. The government's job is protection, not retribution.

http://www.adc.state.az.us/DeathRow/DRowTZ.htm#TOWERY

Ok, what punishment is befitting what my brother, yes, my brother did? I personally think he deserved death for what he did. Now, imagine if the victim was 5, and was anally raped. Then strangled, then left beside the road naked. That is what happend to Samantha Runion. Her killer. Prior convictions, prior accusations, and where was he? Walking the street.

My prayer is that Samantha passed out from the pain, and never truely felt the horror of what happened to her.

So, what would befit my brother?

[jefhatfield]

I am sorry everyone. I mean to ask what can we do after they commit a crime to ever keep them from committing another. Dru's killer had already served 23 years. Yet he got out to rape and kill. That is the problem. Should violent criminals be locked up for life? Yes, some that are truely refomed would have to suffer for those that don't but, it would keep society safe.

i think there is a loophole for the most criminally insane perpetrators...when they serve their time, but they still are deemed dangerous to society by experts in the field, they can then become "patients" and be checked into the low security atascadero state facility...they are no longer convicts per se and are free to roam in the grounds and participate in constructive activities and are watched by a non violent and supportive staff

it's only that they can't get out into society because, even after their sentence is up and they are released from the prison/jail system, they are still too dangerous...some have received enough professional help enough to the point that they re-entered society and didn't commit crimes

many patients, however, remain in the state facility and society is better off since some people cannot be cured with the knowledge we currently have in medicine

[zimv20]

It is really pretty. Attempted Agrivated Rape, Agrivated Rape, Attempted Kidnapping, and yes, Kidnapping.
ah, yes, this case. i have heard of it.

most of what we're doing in this thread is looking at this specific case but making general comments about the crime in the large. what i'd like to do is find out the specifics of this case (though your links are good, they don't contain the exact info i'm looking for).

we know he served 23 years (and was that the sentence?). first, did he serve his full sentence? second, what kind of parole was there? third, were there other protections in place which weren't followed?

after knowing that, it'll be easier to determine what went wrong. if some recommended guideline wasn't followed, then maybe we can say it's an error of enforcement, not structure.

if all procedures were followed correctly, then we must question the structure -- was the sentence too lenient? should there have been some kind of psychological (or other) rehabilitation? should there be more post-release followup, mandatory counseling, etc.?

it's difficult to point to one case and make the judgement that the entire process is broken. (e.g. maybe such crimes recur 1% of the time [which is still 1% too much]). this is, as i'm fond of pointing out, a sample size problem.

such crimes are horrible, yes, and it's easy to conclude that we must, in such cases, suspend our legal system, morals or ethics. i have my own feelings about this (in a word: don't), but this is where the rationality of "conducting ourselves in a manner befitting a great, free society" is at cross purposes with the raw emotion of "this is just so ****ing wrong."

i tend to lean more to the rational. then again, this happened to no one i know. i'd like to think i'd maintain my anti-capitol punishment stance should the unthinkable happen to someone i loved, but i don't know if i could.

[Backtothemac]

Excellent post. From what I know he served 23 years for aggrivated Rape, and kidnapping. He beat the hell out of the woman, kidnapped her, and left her for dead. From what I have heard he thought he had killed her, and he served 23 years of a 25 year sentence. He basically faked out the parole board. See, that is where I think the system is broken. He was out for less than 8 months when he killed Dru. If someone is in for 23 years, they will never, never ever hold a legit job, and be able to provide for a lifestyle of normalicy. So, should we just keep them in forever? Even if it is .5% of all that are released, that is way too many, however, the statistics show that most violent criminals are repeat offenders.

That is th point of my posts. Should we keep them locked up forever?

[zimv20]

Excellent post.
thank you :-) i had a nice day w/ friends, full of grilling and meetings (theater)


That is th point of my posts. Should we keep them locked up forever?
i have a really hard time w/ that notion. some people can be rehabilitated. some cannot. some have the very best of intentions, but when thrown back into the situation they had been in, fall into old patterns.

there's no easy answer to the question, "does it serve society's greater good to be overzealous wrt incarceration, knowing we've got some innocents and some who could otherwise contribute?"

there's no fullproof way of knowing, and where people disagree regards on which side to err. i think the parole board thing is a little shaky -- how well do the people making the decision really know the person? how much of those good intentions can be faked?

i also think the war on drugs has worn out our prison system. i saw a piece a couple weeks ago about the california jails -- the money had run out and people were being released after a couple days of being processed. the cops were furious and frustrated, 'cuz they kept bringing in the same people. very moving was the video of literally a line of smiling people coming out, saying they knew when they were picked up, they'd be back out in a matter of hours or days. some said they were going to go right back to what they were doing.

slight rant: i think it's ridiculous to lock up minor drug offenders, especially w/ mandatory sentencing. i know a great number of good people who hold jobs, pay taxes, contribute positively to society, and do some drugs. no way should these people serve any jail time, imo. and to lock up these people instead of violent offenders (like some of those above) is completely ludicrous.

back on topic: the system is broken in some very basic ways. in this particular case, it'd be interesting to know how much of that brokenness contributed to dru's death.

[Backtothemac]

Well, I think there are several problems. 1st, we need major drug reform in the US. At the very least Mary Jane should be legal, and taxed very heavily. If you are caught with Jane that is not state taxed, life, no parole, no option. Make it so bad that people with have to purchase from the state. Make it good stuff to, and use the hemp to further a new industry with new jobs in the US.

Second, really rehabilitate people. That is the problem now, the system is set up to punish. You owe a debt to society. No, society owes you the debt for your plight. Help people learn the VALUE of life, and all that comes with it. Felons of minor crimes should not lose the right to vote, or be branded forever in life. That will reduce the prison population, and educate them while they are there.

You cannot reward them, but I am talking about minor crimes. Violent criminals need serious psyc help, that could require years, and should only be release on the notion that if they violate, then the psyc that recomended their release with share the jail time if the violate again. That would cut down of pushing people through the system.

[zimv20]

At the very least Mary Jane should be legal, and taxed very heavily.
i guess i'm a little surprised this is your position. i don't have a definite position on legalizing pot; i don't smoke, so i've no personal vested interest. i think we should at least move to a canadian or nederlander-style of decriminalization.

[blue&whiteman]

most child molesters were themselves molested as children. its a very vicious circle that must be stopped. the way to help stop it would be better awareness among children. educate kids more on what is good and bad touching and tell them what to do if anything happens to them. encourage them to come forward rather than just let it happen.

I understand things like this are already done to a certain extent but I feel the point really needs to be spread wider and stronger to children. kill the root. kill the source.

[zimv20]

most child molesters were themselves molested as children.
is that true?

[blue&whiteman]

is that true?


many of the cases I have read about had some mention of the offender being abused as a child. there are 3 kinds of abuse that can all lead to this behavior and they are mental, physical and of course sexual. in many cases its sexual.

I feel as angry as all of you toward them but as a buddhist I cannot wish death upon them. over 80% of all criminals on average were abused in some way as a child.

abusive people almost never come from normal non-abusive homes.

i'm sticking with the fighting it at the roots level stance.

[skunk]

So, what would befit my brother?

If that is your brother, you have a heavy load to bear. A very nasty piece of work indeed.

Long-term incarceration with long-term treatment may not often produce the desired result, but in my opinion judicial murder brings the whole system into disrepute.

[Backtothemac]

If that is your brother, you have a heavy load to bear. A very nasty piece of work indeed.

Long-term incarceration with long-term treatment may not often produce the desired result, but in my opinion judicial murder brings the whole system into disrepute.

LOL. Yea, that is my brother. And, my load is easy. I personally feel that he does deserve death for what he did, but his sentence is going to likely be changed to life with no parole because he was sentenced by a judge. Not a jury.

Not exactly fair.

[Backtothemac]

Here is another example where the system fails.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,117493,00.html

[poopyhead]

most child molesters were themselves molested as children. .

THIS IS NOT TRUE
this is part of the same mindset that leads to further victimization of the abused
people who were abuse have less than a 10% higher incidence of child molestation than the general population
this is negligible
this is not that ten percent of the abused become the abusers this is people who were abused have a 10 percent greater chance of becoming child molesters than the general population

I have lead a group for people who were victims of child molestation and/or rape
most of the people I know who were molested are impotent, afraid of sex, and afraid of close physical contact with anyone
many of the others are widely considered sluts
because they long for someone to love them
and sex is the only way they have been taught to please people
but
THEY ARE NOT CHILD MOLESTERS

[poopyhead]

is that true?NOOOOO!

[blackfox]

This is a difficult issue to deal with, so I believe I'd rather posit some more questions in the hopes that someone knows the answers
1) Are these kind of crimes more prevalent in the US than other '1st world' countries? - if so, then we might want to look at our culture for causes, as we do venerate youth and beauty so (look at brittney spears)
2)Has there always been an undercurrent of these crimes over the years, or is this a recent phenomenom? - If it is recent, then again we might look at culture...
On an aside, I do not support the death penalty for anyone, but feel that prison is a good place for punishment. Molesters and rapists often occupy the lowest positions in prison society, and will be likely to receive their comeuppance. I might possibly support castration for repeat-offenders...sorry I could not offer more and that what I did offer was so sloppy - but it was a rough weekend, brain still recovering...

[blue&whiteman]

THIS IS NOT TRUE
this is part of the same mindset that leads to further victimization of the abused
people who were abuse have less than a 10% higher incidence of child molestation than the general population
this is negligible
this is not that ten percent of the abused become the abusers this is people who were abused have a 10 percent greater chance of becoming child molesters than the general population

I have lead a group for people who were victims of child molestation and/or rape
most of the people I know who were molested are impotent, afraid of sex, and afraid of close physical contact with anyone
many of the others are widely considered sluts
because they long for someone to love them
and sex is the only way they have been taught to please people
but
THEY ARE NOT CHILD MOLESTERS

easy there. this is a forum to share thoughts, not to bash thoughts.

I was simply giving my opinion which comes from the cases I have read about.

I take capitals as yelling so I take offense to you post. if i'm taking you the wrong way then i'm sorry.