Apple Ordering Components and Flash RAM for New iPhone?

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/04/09/apple-ordering-components-and-flash-ram-for-new-iphone/)

A couple of new reports indicate that Apple has started mobilizing parts for their next generation iPhone. A Commercial Times (http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20090408PB205.html) report claims that Taiwan-based component suppliers have started shipping parts for the new Apple iPhone that is expected to begin shipping in June.

Meanwhile, DigiTimes (http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20090409PD219.html) claims that Apple has already placed orders for 100 million 8 Gigabit NAND Flash chips (mostly) from Samsung Electronics. This large order could tighten worldwide supplies of Flash memory.

While the iPhone was not specifically cited as the reason for the large order, the timing seems to correspond to rumors of a new iPhone refresh this summer.

Article Link: Apple Ordering Components and Flash RAM for New iPhone? (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/04/09/apple-ordering-components-and-flash-ram-for-new-iphone/)

[syklee26]

still waiting for 1TB iPhone...

[fishmoose]

8 gigabyte? No 32 gig then?

[Shookster]

100 million 8 Gigabit NAND Flash chips

Wouldn't an 8 Gigabit chip just be 1 GB? I'm guessing you mean 8 GB but even so, the current iPhone is 16 GB so it seems strange to order 100 million 8 GB chips.

[coolfactor]

8 gigabit or Gigabyte? That's an important distinction.

But 100 million... wow! That's a lot.

[Bonte]

8 GB would be for the low cost version in China, there will probably be room for 2 chips per device. Can samsung and others produce enough chips for a cheap iPhone, iPods and a new tablet?

[Bonte]

Wouldn't an 8 Gigabit chip just be 1 GB? I'm guessing you mean 8 GB but even so, the current iPhone is 16 GB so it seems strange to order 100 million 8 GB chips.

Digitimes clearly mentions Gb, so maybe its not measured per physical chip but per GB. :confused:

[ZunePod]

You do know these these can be assembled in blocks, so they are making 4*8GB which is 32GB. Specifically, these chips are half the physical size of the ones found in the current iPhone 3G. So technically, you could update your iPhone to be 32GB.

Also, 100/4 (because of 4 being in a block) = 25 Million. All the iPhones won't be 32GB so then that narrows the 32GB load to about 8 Million.

[icantbelieveit]

You do know these these can be assembled in blocks, so they are making 4*8GB which is 32GB. Specifically, these chips are half the physical size of the ones found in the current iPhone 3G. So technically, you could update your iPhone to be 32GB.

Also, 100/4 (because of 4 being in a block) = 25 Million. All the iPhones won't be 32GB so then that narrows the 32GB load to about 8 Million.

Ah ok, that explains it, thanks :)

[ZunePod]

Ah ok, that explains it, thanks :)

You understand it also? Wow!

[arn]

Gb = Gigibit.

So, 100 million 8 Gb chips is enough for 12.5 million 8 GigaByte iPhones.

arn

[sjo]

You do know these these can be assembled in blocks, so they are making 4*8GB which is 32GB. Specifically, these chips are half the physical size of the ones found in the current iPhone 3G. So technically, you could update your iPhone to be 32GB.

Also, 100/4 (because of 4 being in a block) = 25 Million. All the iPhones won't be 32GB so then that narrows the 32GB load to about 8 Million.

no, it's gigaBIT not gigaBYTE. so for 32GB device you need 32 of 8Gb chips. 100m 8Gb chips would be sufficient for 3.125m 32GB device. which seems an awfully low number. more likely is that there is not going to be a 32GB iphone. they could make a mix of 8GB and 16GB phones, or 8-9m devices which sounds more plausible.

remember that these can be (or are) used in other devices as well, eg, in touch.

[johnnyjibbs]

Wow! That's a lot of chips. It really suonds like they're destined for Nanos and Shuffles though - I'm sure they'll be moving toward 16 and 32 in the new iPhone.

[edesignuk]

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=683207

[twoodcc]

can they fit 2 x 8 GB flash clips in the iPhone?

[Bentov]

8 GB would be for the low cost version in China, there will probably be room for 2 chips per device. Can samsung and others produce enough chips for a cheap iPhone, iPods and a new tablet?

One chip in the phone, two in the touch; that is why the max storage in the touch is always twice as much as the max storage in the phone. So either the leak is wrong, or the Chinese iPhone will only be 8GB, which I can't believe.

On the other hand, Apple may figure that they can't make 32GB phones for the whole world, so China only gets 8GB phones .

*Edit* I will have to research this more, I didn't get the whole, apple orders them and then they are put together the size they want from the other post*

[winmacguy]

8 gigabit or Gigabyte? That's an important distinction.

But 100 million... wow! That's a lot.

Apple's NAND RAM requirements account for about 30% of total global production of NAND RAM so yes that would be alot. It is actually a big enough order to effect the global pricing of NAND RAM buy about 10%.

[scottness]

I'd like to see a 32GB iPhone. It's ok if it's fatter.

[neilw]

Allow me to be the first to officially cringe at the use of the term "Flash RAM" in the article title.

[ZunePod]

no, it's gigaBIT not gigaBYTE. so for 32GB device you need 32 of 8Gb chips. 100m 8Gb chips would be sufficient for 3.125m 32GB device. which seems an awfully low number. more likely is that there is not going to be a 32GB iphone. they could make a mix of 8GB and 16GB phones, or 8-9m devices which sounds more plausible.

remember that these can be (or are) used in other devices as well, eg, in touch.

In the Digitimes post it says 8Gb, this easily be a typo, seen as 3.125M 32GB iPhones isn't really sufficient.

Plus Samsung don't even offer 8 GigaBIT NAND chips, they only offer 8GigaBYTE NAND chips.

This was last time I checked.

[wizard]

No matter how you slice it a hundred million of anything is a lot. Of course the accuracy of the reports is questionable, especially when the industry has moved to 128 Mb flash and beyond.

Apple would be lucky to move ten million of them in the near future on an iPhone. I suspect that much of the activity being reported on is for a new class of device. If the device is large enough they might be able to save a few dollars by implementing lower density devices spread over a motherboard. The problem is such an arraingement won't fatten on board storage the way people want.


Dave

[sjo]

In the Digitimes post it says 8Gb, this easily be a typo, seen as 3.125M 32GB iPhones isn't really sufficient.

Plus Samsung don't even offer 8 GigaBIT NAND chips, they only offer 8GigaBYTE NAND chips.

This was last time I checked.

yes they do, samsung semiconductor nand products:

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=158
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=159
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=672

and it is customary to quote the chip sizes in BITs, so most likely not a typo.

[wizard]

Allow me to be the first to officially cringe at the use of the term "Flash RAM" in the article title.
Easyly the worst post in the thread as there simply is no such thing. It is not like the difference between GB & Gb which even the manufactures tend to confuse. Generaly Flash is marketed by the bit, thus if you want 16GBof flash storage you need a 128Gb device.

Dave

[ziggyonice]

This large order could tighten worldwide supplies of Flash memory.

Good 'ol Apple!

[koobcamuk]

This article is so confusing.

[Crispy Duck]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

[ZunePod]

yes they do, samsung semiconductor nand products:

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=158
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=159
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/productList.do?fmly_id=672

and it is customary to quote the chip sizes in BITs, so most likely not a typo.

It's still not enough to cater for the 32GB iPhones.

[ZunePod]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

Very Likely

[MattJessop]

And Safari just got snappier.

[Daschund]

This article is so confusing.

Life is so confusing... :-)

[Crispy Duck]

If I hear the Safari getting snappier *joke* one more time I think I might scream. It's seriously old and not funny.

[talkingfuture]

Good to see more progress on the next iPhone, I just wish the rumours hadn't started so far out from June.

[moniker]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

About 3.14 on the moniker probability scale.

[drakeshipway]

They said: "Oh Apple, what are you up to? Just like we saw right around this time last year in preparation for Apple's new iPhone 3G and updated iPod touch, Apple is placing huge orders of NAND chips thereby threatening the supply in demand by other tier-one vendors. This time we've got DigiTimes confirming earlier reports that Apple is cornering the market on flash memory -- specifically, the Taiwanese rumor rag is reporting orders of "100 million 8Gb (8 gigabit, not gigabyte) NAND flash chips mostly with Samsung Electronics." That's twice the size of the order reported last year. The tiny memory chips are then recombined during manufacturing into the larger 16GB, 32GB, and so on capacities we expect to find in our handheld consumer electronics. Anyone still doubting new Apple handhelds in June?"

[Crispy Duck]

About 3.14 on the moniker probability scale.

3.14 out of what? :D

[themoonisdown09]

If I hear the Safari getting snappier *joke* one more time I think I might scream. It's seriously old and not funny.

Yeah, it is very old. I guess you just have to accept the fact that someone will say it every time.

[ZunePod]

They said: "Oh Apple, what are you up to? Just like we saw right around this time last year in preparation for Apple's new iPhone 3G and updated iPod touch, Apple is placing huge orders of NAND chips thereby threatening the supply in demand by other tier-one vendors. This time we've got DigiTimes confirming earlier reports that Apple is cornering the market on flash memory -- specifically, the Taiwanese rumor rag is reporting orders of "100 million 8Gb (8 gigabit, not gigabyte) NAND flash chips mostly with Samsung Electronics." That's twice the size of the order reported last year. The tiny memory chips are then recombined during manufacturing into the larger 16GB, 32GB, and so on capacities we expect to find in our handheld consumer electronics. Anyone still doubting new Apple handhelds in June?"

I don't think anyone is.

[yorkshire]

I'm still hoping for a 32GB iPhone. Lets hope some 32GB chips are being ordered as well.

[SactoGuy18]

We'll see a 32 GB iPhone by July 2009 and a 64 GB iPod touch by September 2009. I would NOT be surprised that Apple offers a 128 GB iPod touch, which will mean the end of the iPod classic line.

[Wild-Bill]

They are 8 gigabit 2 Gigabyte chips:

DigiTimes hears that the company has placed an order for 100 million 8Gb (2GB) chips from Samsung and is reportedly spurring a supply shortage. Combined with orders from Nokia and Sony, the demand may leave little for other customers until "at least" the end of May.

That outta clear up the confusion.

[themoonisdown09]

I would NOT be surprised that Apple offers a 128 GB iPod touch, which will mean the end of the iPod classic line.

Not necessarily. I wouldn't think they would get rid of the iPod classic just yet. The low end iPod Touch costs more than the iPod classic. I think it would be a bad move to get rid of it so soon.

[jonnysods]

If I hear the Safari getting snappier *joke* one more time I think I might scream. It's seriously old and not funny.

+1

I hate the word 'snappier' now because of this forum!

[diamond.g]

I find it interesting that there are so many differing conversions for 8Gb...

[Schizoid]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

Well, from this thread you can probably guess the facts that:
a) Apple are ordering things
b) Safari isn't very snappy
and of course...
c) A bit is different to a byte

[Lesser Evets]

Why is anyone confused about the memory?

They just put in multiple chips to get higher memory. The chances of a 32 GB iPhone are extremely high.

....Snappi?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe3FG4EOgyU

[DELLsFan]

So I guess these all come in from overseas, right? I guess "Silicon Valley" is just a buzzword these days - since it appears most (if not all) of any silicon is being processed into chips outside the U.S. :(

[B2k1977]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

I'd be happy to. It's called wait and see like everyone else but in the meantime speculate along w/ everyone. It's kind of like when you buy a lottery ticket. You probably won't win but it's nice to talk about what you WOULD do with all that money! LOL :rolleyes:

[Ted13]

All I know is about the end product: for the iPhone to be 32GB there needs to be a SINGLE 32GB flash RAM chip. The 32GB iPod Touch has two 16GB chips inside, but the iPhone has space for a single chip only.

[donileo]

there definitely seems to be a mistake with that Digitimes plubication.
They state demand for the 8gb nand went up with Apples Monstrous 100 million order however if you look at the source for this article which is the table and the graph underneath the link you will find that demand prices for 8gb nand stayed the same while it is the 16gb nand spot prices that went up.
for the april period.

Seems like they meant to say 100 million units of 16gb nand were ordered and it makes more sense.

[koobcamuk]

Life is so confusing... :-)

It is, but I am trying to simplify my life - hence using Macs not Windows :)

[Vip]

So many chips and no fish... hmmmm

[lazyrighteye]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

[JonHimself]

We'll see a 32 GB iPhone by July 2009 and a 64 GB iPod touch by September 2009. I would NOT be surprised that Apple offers a 128 GB iPod touch, which will mean the end of the iPod classic line.

To keep the cost down (relative to the Touch) AND to switch all of their players over to flash, could Apple keep the form factor of the iPod Classic (maybe a bit smaller) and just use the flash chips to make up 128GB? I'm sure if they could fit that many in the nano then we'd likely see the iPod form factor slowly phased out but if they can't cram them into the nano, why wouldn't they just keep the iPod Classic and add flash memory? I want lots of storage but don't necessarily want the Touch (I have an iPhone)

[sterlingindigo]

still waiting for 1TB iPhone...

+! :D

Flash ram ≠ Flash. :p

[jholzner]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

Call ATT and ask when you are eligible for an upgrade. That should answer your question.

[iMacoo7]

Call ATT and ask when you are eligible for an upgrade. That should answer your question.

I have been beating this subject on a few different posts, it all depends when they are eligible to upgrade, ATT clearly states that you CAN upgrade as long as you sign a new 2 year contract.

On another note, Apple is almost on the same road map as last year of purchasing materials for the next iphone. Now all we need are some kind of pictures to start seeping out!

[AsianChexMix]

Call ATT and ask when you are eligible for an upgrade. That should answer your question.

First post...I hope to make it count.

I tried calling AT&T and I asked them this due to the fact that this happened with the release of the 3G iPhone. Back when 3G was released, they allowed any iPhone user eligible for upgrade regardless of where they stood in the contract. I'm sure it depends where you stand in your contract. If you got the 3G iPhone on it's release, then you should be fine. If not, then that's where it get's sticky.

They said since they have no idea of these rumors being legit, they can't comment on it. I've talked with two reps and they said that if they did it once, they are most likely to do it again but nothing is set in stone. I was going to call back once more later this afternoon asking the same question and see what the response was because it seemed like the lady just got pissy at me. This has put my "sell first gen iPhone unlocked to buy 3G iPhone (which I will unlock) and sell 3G right around new iPhone being released" plans on hold for a bit.

[strausd]

We'll see a 32 GB iPhone by July 2009 and a 64 GB iPod touch by September 2009. I would NOT be surprised that Apple offers a 128 GB iPod touch, which will mean the end of the iPod classic line.

That definitely would not end the iPod classic. If they had a 128GB iPod touch, it would cost like $500 compared to $250 for the classic.

[doubleusn]

All I know is about the end product: for the iPhone to be 32GB there needs to be a SINGLE 32GB flash RAM chip. The 32GB iPod Touch has two 16GB chips inside, but the iPhone has space for a single chip only.

Hi

While I agree this has been the case so far, I wonder if newer design/engineering in the next iPhone will allow for more mem chips.

We have seen rumors of low power draft-n and if it and the BT chip, and the 3G chip all get combo'd into one, yet even smaller chip, does it create space for more mem chips?

Don't know, but it does seem possible that advances in mem chips, layout design, radio chips, with maybe even a slight mod to how they taper the device (like the air) it may be possible to get to higher storage amounts, via more real estate inside.

Cheers
-wsn

[psxndc]

I was going to call back once more later this afternoon asking the same question and see what the response was because it seemed like the lady just got pissy at me.

I wouldn't bother calling back. The people in the call centers don't know a thing about what's coming down the pipe - maybe they do a week before it drops, but they will always give you the "we haven't heard anything about that yet, so I can't comment" line. This is true for all carriers, for all phones.

The most info I ever got out of a rep was when I was canceling my T-Mo account for the iPhone and the lady told me something very exciting and better than the iPhone was coming out in the fall (she wasn't being a jerk - she was genuinely excited). It turns out she was probably talking about the Storm.

Anyway, long story short (too late), customer reps are usually the worst source of info. MacRumors and BoyGeniusReport will scoop customer service reps by months.

[Cousin Dirk]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

I think we'll have to wait and see on that one. O2 in the UK has a history of letting people out of contracts to sign up to a new 18-month contract with a new iPhone - they let any O2 customer out of a contract early if they wanted to buy the original iPhone when that came out, and they did the same with existing iPhone customers when the 3G came out (admittedly without a huge amount of stock to back that one up). Makes you wonder why they're so keen on 18-month contracts when they let you out after 12 in line with the iPhone product cycle...

Hopefully they'll do the same thing this year, but there'd be no point in speaking to any customer service rep at this point - they won't get any concrete info at least until the next iPhone is announced. Just keep your eyes on the rumour sites and see what leaks.

[iTouche]

So can someone sum up... how likely is there to be a 32GB iPhone, this summer?

Extremely unlikely.

I'm no expert on how flash is manufactured, but if they say these are fused together to make final products then I'm sure they are right. Eitherway, the 8Gbit is all manufacturing details that we shouldn't have to care about.

What you DO want to know is actually provided on Samsung site MLC NAND product page, which lists all final products. This currently lists 128Gbit (16GByte) chips as the maximum available. According to the specs, these have the same dimensions as the Toshiba MLC chips used in current Touch/iPhone.

So unless Apple redesigns the PCB or resize the enclosure, what we will get next are 16GB iPhones (single flash chip) and 32GB (two flash chips) Touch.

[Michael73]

I'd be willing to bet that iPhone memory goes larger. When was the last time apple released a product without some kind of speed or memory size enhancement? From a marketing perspective, this is what the vast majority of people look at to determine whether a newly released product is "better." Seriously, if you get thousands of Apple store employees trying to explain to people walking in the door that they should buy the new iPhone because it has a magnetometer you're going to see A LOT of glazed over eyes. :eek:

[igazza]

apple will make a 64GB iphone

you heard it here first :D

[Crispy Duck]

apple will make a 64GB iphone

you heard it here first :D

I would sell my first-born for that (if I had one).

[7egend]

At launch you are going to see 2 versions of iPhones, the iPhone and the iPhone Pro, the iPhone will carry the standard 8GB storage and be basically the exact same 3G phone we've been carrying for a while only at a slightly reduced price point and featuring OS 3.0, and maybe a casing redesign.

The iPhone Pro on launch will come in 16GB only size and feature a lot of the rumors, a few months later to re-initiate hype and sales they will introduce the new iPhone Pro 32GB model.

100 million units is not enough to build 3 different devices especially when the launch date is relatively close. A Later introduction is almost certain. If the chips are in fact 8Gb, then it's going to take 32 of them for the 32GB iPhone, which is enough to make 3.1 million, but demand will be higher for the lower storage devices cause of the affordability.

But, if there is an introduction of all three devices at once more than likely the number of devices will be as follows on launch day:

3.2 Million 8GB iPhones
2.5 Million 16GB iPhones
1.2 Million 32GB iPhones

Now if this is a worldwide release on the same day...well...there probably is nly enough for 8GB and 16GB models, but this all pure speculation..

[ma2ha3]

i cant wait for the spec.
i probably would not buy it. but i would like to find out more about the new iphone.

i had the first generation iphone x2 , but gave away to relative teenage kids, because i do not find the phone various gimmick useful for old guy like me, i just go back to plain old nokia which just make calls and nothing else, i really do not think so much feature, and iphone are huge, they take up a lot of space in my jean pocket.

teenage kids love it though.

old people probably pass...............

[AuburnTigerr]

First post...I hope to make it count.

I tried calling AT&T and I asked them this due to the fact that this happened with the release of the 3G iPhone. Back when 3G was released, they allowed any iPhone user eligible for upgrade regardless of where they stood in the contract. I'm sure it depends where you stand in your contract. If you got the 3G iPhone on it's release, then you should be fine. If not, then that's where it get's sticky.

They said since they have no idea of these rumors being legit, they can't comment on it. I've talked with two reps and they said that if they did it once, they are most likely to do it again but nothing is set in stone. I was going to call back once more later this afternoon asking the same question and see what the response was because it seemed like the lady just got pissy at me. This has put my "sell first gen iPhone unlocked to buy 3G iPhone (which I will unlock) and sell 3G right around new iPhone being released" plans on hold for a bit.

The only problem with that is that first generation iPhone buyers did not have the price subsidized. They paid full value for the phone so when the 3G came out, it was no skin off AT&T's back to allow upgrades. With the 3G, it was subsidized so AT&T may not be as willing to allow those upgrades. Now I'm not sure what goes on behind the scenes between Apple and AT&T, but it's something to consider when thinking about possible upgrades by 3G owners.

[Aqueus]

apple will make a 64GB iphone

you heard it here first :D

I want one! lol

[str1f3]

I don't know what this means and I don't care. I just know I want my 64gb iPhone (I'll settle unhappily for 32gb). There is no way they can introduce video recording in the next iPhone and have it remain at 16gb. And yes apple, I will be willing to pay a $100 above the 32gb for 64gb!

[calisurfboy]

Your not looking at the bigger picture here people....

Apple, to combat jailbreak phones and phones running on other communications networks will require new purchasers to implant chips into their hands. For the phone to function you have to hold your hand with the chip to the Iphone for it to function. They will be synced and communicate higher up with a super computer buried 100 feet below Apple HQ in California.

I'm willing to do it if I still get that upgrade discount for having a 1st gen Iphone. :D

In all seriousness, though, how far between an announcement like this and seeing the final result in a product on the shelf? Is it a matter of weeks or is it months? I know ipod nanos are usually updated in September, can the chips be used in them or is that too far in the future or a different chip?

[stevenpriolo]

We'll see a 32 GB iPhone by July 2009 and a 64 GB iPod touch by September 2009. I would NOT be surprised that Apple offers a 128 GB iPod touch, which will mean the end of the iPod classic line.

I can't see the iPod classic being discontinued. But I can see apple updating it to flash memory instead of the "classic" harddrive form it has now.

[indigo144]

Thanks for clearing up the confusion Bill. :confused: (I thought 2 bytes = 16 bits)

They are 8 gigabit 2 Gigabyte chips:


DigiTimes hears that the company has placed an order for 100 million 8Gb (2GB) chips from Samsung and is reportedly spurring a supply shortage. Combined with orders from Nokia and Sony, the demand may leave little for other customers until "at least" the end of May.


That outta clear up the confusion.

[stagi]

can't wait to see what the new version brings, I mainly want a better battery!

[diamond.g]

Thanks for clearing up the confusion Bill. :confused: (I thought 2 bytes = 16 bits)

Yeah AFAIK 8 bits = 1 byte. So the 8Gb chip is actually 1 GB. But I could (and seem to be) wrong.

[Island Dog]

I find it hard to believe if the iPhone gets a hardware revision, that they will not bump up the store.

But you never know....

[angemon89]

So many chips and no fish... hmmmm :D

[coolpal]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

You should be able to tell that yourself.. just login to your account on att.com and click on upgrade your device... it will tell you when you are eligible for upgrade... it is usually after 20 months into a 24 month contract.

The first time around, att did not technically subsidize iPhone so it had special treatment when 3G came out. Every 1st gen iphone holder was made upgrade eligible since they didn't technically get a discount from att on the device.. but with 3G iphone, it's like any other device (smart phone) they sell... there will most likely be no exceptions this time around..... but again, if you are really lucky, apple might try to get some deal cut with att to sell more iPhones. Keep your fingers crossed.

For me, I am still holding on to 1gen refurb iPhone I bought to replace a discounted htc tilt I got with new contract. ( I sold the tilt on ebay for >350 profit, which made my iPhone better than free;) )..... I hope my wait was worth it.

pal :)

[yegon]

I'm completely happy with my 3G and the upcoming 3.0 update. All the purported new features of the next one, while nice, don't tempt me in the slightest tbh, couldn't give a monkeys about upgraded camera/video etc......but if it was 64gb, yes please!!! As much as I'd like it, not going to happen till 2010 though, not a chance, financially or strategically it'd make no sense.

[Stormbringer]

I'm getting sick of these daily iPhone rumours. A few more and I will kill myself in impatience! :D

[thogs_cave]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

Good question. Of course, then I have to ask myself if it would be worth it, or should I wait until I can get out from under AT&T's thumb? It's pretty damn expensive to run a 3G through them now...

Personally, I might wait to replace my 3G with the (rumor now started by me) 5G iPhone that will contain 512G of Flash, quad-core CPU and GPU, and have a dock to be your desktop unit. The ultimate realization of the old PowerBook Duo. :eek:

[yorkshire]

I'm getting sick of these daily iPhone rumours. A few more and I will kill myself in impatience! :D

I seem to recall last year these rumours were hourly rather than daily. It will probably get much worse. That said, I like them as I'm jumping in this year, as long as the water's warm.

[electronboy]

Start mobilizing a _truly_ unlimited data plan that includes SMS!

Or, just offer a discounted, limited data plan and let me add a SMS plan as I see fit.

They can include diamonds in the thing and I'm not gonna bite--nor will millions more--until the SMS fleecing stops.

[rstansby]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

Of course you will, but you will pay more for the phone than people who aren't in a contract.

[guzhogi]

My guess is that these are 8 Gb (gigabit) chips meaning 1 GB (gigabyte) chips. If that's the case, then that means that's enough chips for 12.5 million iPhones, max (saying they're all 8 GB (Gigabyte) models). But, logically, they'll be used in far fewer iPhones for 16 GB & maybe 32 GB iPhones. Since as the amount of chips/drive space used in the iPhone goes up, the fewer number of iPhones you can make (yay inverse relationships!).

Personally, I'm not much of a speculator. I'm more of a "let's wait & see what happens) kind a guy. I might get the new iPhone, but only if the plans are somewhat affordable. No $100/month for all the goodies kind of stuff.

[iMacoo7]

First post...I hope to make it count.

I tried calling AT&T and I asked them this due to the fact that this happened with the release of the 3G iPhone. Back when 3G was released, they allowed any iPhone user eligible for upgrade regardless of where they stood in the contract. I'm sure it depends where you stand in your contract. If you got the 3G iPhone on it's release, then you should be fine. If not, then that's where it get's sticky.

They said since they have no idea of these rumors being legit, they can't comment on it. I've talked with two reps and they said that if they did it once, they are most likely to do it again but nothing is set in stone. I was going to call back once more later this afternoon asking the same question and see what the response was because it seemed like the lady just got pissy at me. This has put my "sell first gen iPhone unlocked to buy 3G iPhone (which I will unlock) and sell 3G right around new iPhone being released" plans on hold for a bit.

You are actually dead on! To add insight of what I have posted about the upgrade situation time and time again. ANYONE can call and see when they are eligible to upgrade and will be told when they are eligible.
The difference with upgrading to a new model iphone is that a new 2 year contract has to be signed in order to get the subsidized pricing.
I have several friends that work for ATT from Customer support- Tech support.
Although a couple seem to know some sort of notation that there is a new iPhone on the horizon , the story has been the same for me and continues to be the same.
From what I understand, Anyone that received their iphone on the day of the launch (Like I did) can upgrade right now if an iphone popped out and also get it with the subsidy as long as the 2 years is renewed.
I have been eligible since the end of February 2009 for an upgrade with a subsidy of any phone ATT sells. But for the iPhone the 2 years is also required.....

[HiRez]

I think the average iPhone user (and make no mistake, the iPhone is now a mainstream product, not a tech geek toy) will probably be fine with 8 GB. Heck, I consider myself a tech geek and I'm still using the original 8 GB iPhone and haven't really felt stifled by it, memory capacity wise. I've got several thousand photos, a mix with about 500 songs, several dozen apps, and usually a movie or two loaded and I still have room to spare. Most people don't own thousands of digital song tracks or need more than a few movies on their phone, so I would really question whether Apple should be producing too many 32 GB iPhones, or even 16 GB at this point. Plus, Apple has shown in the past that they want to reserve the high-end storage space for the Touch, so until we see a 64 GB Touch, I wouldn't look for a 32 GB iPhone.

[Stormbringer]

As a non-iPhone owner (yet:D), can someone tell me how much memory the iPhone uses?

So how many is really free (the OS should take some space) and how much space take the applications of a medium user?

[mikeinternet]

SSD is fast on it's way to being the drive of choice in all Apple products. These specifically for any mobile device.

[freddiecable]

i hope for an 8GB iPhone Nano 2.8 or 3.0" screen.

[iphonerain]

I heard that the one they'll be releasing in June will have a higher megapixel camera. Do you guy think that's true??

[spacevator]

Thinks about this! If Apple were to use these 1 GByte NAND chips in an iPhone/iPod touch, it would take 16 chips to make a 16GB iPhone, let alone 32 chips to make a 32GB iPhone. These devices do not have the room.

Now if you were building a bigger device that needed fast cheap NAND, say a 10 inch ultra-portable....

[chowmein]

the article says flash RAM not storage... maybe 100 million iPhones with 1GB ram?

[Stormbringer]

I heard that the one they'll be releasing in June will have a higher megapixel camera. Do you guy think that's true??Do you think Apple would embarrass themselves with a high-end smartphone with 2MP in 2009?

[spacevator]

Think about this! If Apple were to use these 1 GByte NAND chips in an iPhone/iPod touch, it would take 16 chips to make a 16GB iPhone, let alone 32 chips to make a 32GB iPhone. These devices do not have the room.

Now if you were building a bigger device that needed fast cheap NAND, say a 10 inch ultra-portable....maybe

[The General]

8 bits = 1 byte
8 megabits = 1 megabyte
8 gigabits = 1 gigabyte

[iMacoo7]

All I want to know is if 3G users, with a year left on their contract, will be elligible to upgrade in June (with contract extension, of course).

Take this for what it is worth. Check with ATT by calling or logging into your account. You should see your eligibility for upgrade there. At the bottom of where it says eligible or not, it clearly states that if upgrading to an iPhone it will be a mandatory renewal of the 2 year contract. I would not worry about what others are saying as I see it, most are just throwing out false information.
Everyone on this forum is different in the aspect of when they purchased their 3G iphone.
So the upgrade situation is different for each person.
If you call or log onto your account you will see the information to your question there.Call ATT. Call at random times and just ask
"If there is a new iphone released this summer, and I am eligible to upgrade, If the new iPhone is subsidized will I be able to upgrade to the new version upon or renewing a new 2 year agreement"
You will be told "If there is a new iphone that comes out , you will indeed be able to upgrade and receive the subsidy pricing upon renewing a new 2 year contract agreement.

[HiRez]

Do you think Apple would embarrass themselves with a high-end smartphone with 2MP in 2009?
I don't see why not. They embarrassed themselves with a 2 MP, non-adjustable, no-flash camera in a $600 device two years ago, why not again?

I'm mostly joking but seriously, I wouldn't expect too much. Megapixels are overrated anyway. The more of them you cram into a small sensor, the more noise you get, that's a fact. More noise generally negates any advantage you get from having more pixels (and just increases your file size and upload/download times) so it's a loser's game. Unless they are increasing the sensor size, which I don't see as likely on something the size of an iPhone, I don't think upping the pixel count is wise. I could see maybe 3 MP at most.

[diamond.g]

SSD is fast on it's way to being the drive of choice in all Apple products. These specifically for any mobile device.

What do you mean?

[Manie Frizzle]

I don't see why not. They embarrassed themselves with a 2 MP, non-adjustable, no-flash camera in a $600 device two years ago, why not again?

I'm mostly joking but seriously, I wouldn't expect too much. Megapixels are overrated anyway. The more of them you cram into a small sensor, the more noise you get, that's a fact. More noise generally negates any advantage you get from having more pixels (and just increases your file size and upload/download times) so it's a loser's game. Unless they are increasing the sensor size, which I don't see as likely on something the size of an iPhone, I don't think upping the pixel count is wise. I could see maybe 3 MP at most.

totally off topic here but i must ask. does this mean that if i lower the MP on these point and shoot cameras, i will get less noise? assuming they have good lens.

[Stormbringer]

I don't see why not. They embarrassed themselves with a 2 MP, non-adjustable, no-flash camera in a $600 device two years ago, why not again?

I'm mostly joking but seriously, I wouldn't expect too much. Megapixels are overrated anyway. The more of them you cram into a small sensor, the more noise you get, that's a fact. More noise generally negates any advantage you get from having more pixels (and just increases your file size and upload/download times) so it's a loser's game. Unless they are increasing the sensor size, which I don't see as likely on something the size of an iPhone, I don't think upping the pixel count is wise. I could see maybe 3 MP at most.Everybody keeps saying that, and it's correct of course... But, you can't compare the iPhone camera with the 5MP phones back in 2007 (Nokia N95, SE K850i for instance). And what I've seen, every megapixel upgrade has been an overall quality upgrade. With cameraphones of course, not regular camera's. Surely that's not due to the megapixels, but the new 2MP-phones are still incomparable with the 5MP ones.

Having said that, could someone respond to this please:
As a non-iPhone owner (yet:D), can someone tell me how much memory the iPhone uses?

So how many is really free (the OS should take some space) and how much space take the applications of a medium user?

[pr5owner]

I'd like to see a 32GB iPhone. It's ok if it's fatter.

there are 32GB microSD's, what makes you think it will be fatter?

[powers74]

8 bits = 1 byte
8 megabits = 1 megabyte
8 gigabits = 1 gigabyte


This is surely for a 10 incher, I mean my poor old sawtooth doesn't even have a gig of ram! though a gig in an iPhone would be pretty sweet!

[yegon]

As a non-iPhone owner (yet:D), can someone tell me how much memory the iPhone uses?

So how many is really free (the OS should take some space) and how much space take the applications of a medium user?

With nothing installed, my 16gb has 14.6gb free. IME most apps take very little space but their are some obvious exceptions.

[lostngone]

there are 32GB microSD's, what makes you think it will be fatter?

Geeezz, he just likes'em fat... :eek:

[optophobia]

Of course you will, but you will pay more for the phone than people who aren't in a contract.

How did you reach this conclusion ?

People who owned a 1st gen iPhone who upgraded to the 3G, paid the SAME as those who were not in contract.....

[Sehnsucht]

Wow! That's a lot of chips. It really suonds like they're destined for Nanos and Shuffles though - I'm sure they'll be moving toward 16 and 32 in the new iPhone.

I know what they're doing! The new iPhone will have 32GB storage and an additional 8GB of RAM!!! :eek: :eek:

:D

[Stormbringer]

With nothing installed, my 16gb has 14.6gb free. IME most apps take very little space but their are some obvious exceptions.Sounds good, thanks! :)

[HiRez]

totally off topic here but i must ask. does this mean that if i lower the MP on these point and shoot cameras, i will get less noise? assuming they have good lens.No, because it's still using the same sensor, in which the size of each light-gathering element is fixed. Of course if you're looking at a smaller image it might appear less noisy because shrinking it can hide some of the noise, but well...it's smaller. If you only need an image smaller than what the camera's maximum is, you should experiment with having the camera downsize the image vs. doing it yourself in Photoshop, iPhoto, or whatever. Some in-camera algorithms are pretty good nowadays, but you might get better results reducing it in the computer. Also, if you're going to make adjustments to the photo (red eye removal, retouching, white balance, sharpening, etc.), it's normally better to do that stuff before you reduce the size, so you can work with as many pixels as possible.

[forgetaboutpro]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11 Safari/525.20)

If I hear the Safari getting snappier *joke* one more time I think I might scream. It's seriously old and not funny.

Agreed, but chill out dude...

[Eduardo1971]

still waiting for 1TB iPhone...
...and 4G.
:cool:

[xnu]

to be installed on the board of the new Mac Tablet. There is more room and they will be integrated into the board for power savings and manufacturing. Lower density, cheaper to buy....80gb and 120gb models hopefully.

I completely made this up, but I am wishful....

[iPhoneNYC]

It seems like every day I post about how I can't wait for the new iPhone. Articles like this just seem to say that "it is in the works."

[Double J]

I think the "Gb" in the original article may have been a misprint -- I mean even the Shuffle is 4 GB, so they would need four chips just for the Shuffle? Doesn't sound right, unless the memory is for something else entirely (iPod that's small enough to fit completely in your ear? To change songs you shake your head. Volume up and down are left and right nostril.)

[Powerbooky]

In my dreams I'm already unpacking the new iPhone with whopping 100GBytes of storage. I don't care how many chips they have to use for that.
:rolleyes:

[8CoreWhore]

These are 8Gb = 1GB. The chips in the Shuffle are 4GB. So why such low GB? Why such low density? These may have nothing to do with storage, but may be RAM. Right now the iPhone 3G has 128MB of RAM - this would increase that about 8X. Like any other computer, more RAM means much better performance, applications, user experience, etc. ;)

[Sehnsucht]

These are 8Gb = 1GB. The chips in the Shuffle are 4GB. So why such low GB? Why such low density? These may have nothing to do with storage, but may be RAM. Right now the iPhone 3G has 128MB of RAM - this would increase that about 8X. Like any other computer, more RAM means much better performance, applications, user experience, etc. ;)

That sounds awesome...1GB of memory in a phone...:eek: I posted something earlier about the iPhone having 8GB of RAM...but I was joking...I'm pretty sure flash NAND for storage isn't even remotely similar to DRAM. Beats me. :confused:

[bruinsrme]

100 million chips isn't that many especially when they are being stacked.

[powers74]

I don't know what I'm talking about. I just saw RAM. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nano-RAM) is the crap we really need to be excited about.

[sushi]

All I know is about the end product: for the iPhone to be 32GB there needs to be a SINGLE 32GB flash RAM chip. The 32GB iPod Touch has two 16GB chips inside, but the iPhone has space for a single chip only.
This is true for the current model. That is why the iPod touch has twice the memory capacity since it has two memory slots where as the iPhone has one slot.

The next version of the iPhone maybe different and have 2 memory slots.

That definitely would not end the iPod classic. If they had a 128GB iPod touch, it would cost like $500 compared to $250 for the classic.
Some folks prefer the classic interface. So we may see the classic with an SSD replace the HD, or even change to a flash memory type system before we see the Classic discontinued.

SSD is fast on it's way to being the drive of choice in all Apple products. These specifically for any mobile device.
SSD and flash memory are not one in the same.

A SSD device basically replaces a HD. So any device that has a hard drive with a SATA interface can be changed to an SSD with a SATA interface. That is what we are seeing in the MBA, MB and MBP lines. With older computers that have a PATA interface, a SSD with PATA interface can be used to replace the HD as well.

Flash memory devices on the other hand, access their memory in a much different manner.

Regarding the new iPhone, I would be surprised if we don't see a 32GB model this summer. Will it be via 2x16GB or 1x32GB chips? We won't know until we see the architecture of the new iPhone. Gut feeling says that it will still have one memory slot due to space considerations. Of course cost is another issue in that the 32GB chips will need to be cheap enough for Apple to use them in the new iPhone.

It's a long time to June ...

[Stormbringer]

Regarding the new iPhone, I would be surprised if we don't see a 32GB model this summer. Will it be via 2x16GB or 1x32GB chips? We won't know until we see the architecture of the new iPhone. Gut feeling says that it will still have one memory slot due to space considerations. Of course cost is another issue in that the 32GB chips will need to be cheap enough for Apple to use them in the new iPhone.

It's a long time to June ...I fully agree. By the way, the only difference between the two models is this memory capacity and nothing else, or am I wrong?

Yes, and you can get a white iPhone if you choose the big storage...

[viccles]

It's a long time to June ...

It's not that long. It's already April :)

[sushi]

I fully agree. By the way, the only difference between the two models is this memory capacity and nothing else, or am I wrong?[/SIZE]
With the current iPhone, that is correct.

There is one memory slot. Just different capacity chips are used.

On a side note, the iPod touch has twice the capacity because it has two memory slots.

It's not that long. It's already April :)
It's all a matter of perspective. Yes, it's only 2 months, but that two months can stretch to an eternity. :)

[kdarling]

the article says flash RAM not storage... maybe 100 million iPhones with 1GB ram?

No, they just misused the term RAM. It's NAND Flash ROM.

A lot of net reporters these days have no real tech background and after a while, terms lose their actual meaning.

Think about this! If Apple were to use these 1 GByte NAND chips in an iPhone/iPod touch, it would take 16 chips to make a 16GB iPhone, let alone 32 chips to make a 32GB iPhone. These devices do not have the room.

They're not used as separate 1GB pieces. They are stacked together inside a single chip enclosure to make one larger memory.

[adamgalas]

Though June 8 is less than 2 months away, let us recall the Iphone law of time dilation. The closer one gets to the release of the next generation the slower times appears to move.

On a personal note, I am so excited at the prospect of Augmented reality I can hardley breath.

I can't wait to get my own Iphone in July 2010, (4th gen). I will definetely spring for the 64 Gig model.

I can't wait to see what kind of star trek magic Steve and Company come up with:)

[iMacoo7]

I don't know what I'm talking about. I just saw RAM. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nano-RAM) is the crap we really need to be excited about.

Now that sounds nice! Referring to the link in your post. Seems that might be apart of Apples roadmap for future iPhones

[iMacoo7]

Though June 8 is less than 2 months away, let us recall the Iphone law of time dilation. The closer one gets to the release of the next generation the slower times appears to move.

On a personal note, I am so excited at the prospect of Augmented reality I can hardley breath.

I can't wait to get my own Iphone in July 2010, (4th gen). I will definetely spring for the 64 Gig model.

I can't wait to see what kind of star trek magic Steve and Company come up with:)

My thoughts exactly!!:D:D

[iphones4evry1]

Any possibility that this flash memory is for the new Apple netbook/tablet device ?

Perhaps several chips per computer would mean no hard drive is necessary. It would not need as much memory as a full computer because it is only a netbook/tablet and would be advertised as such. Perhaps ten chips per device; meaning 80GB. Ten million initial devices could be sold. (hey, only ten million iPhones were sold in the first year)

[rstansby]

How did you reach this conclusion ?

People who owned a 1st gen iPhone who upgraded to the 3G, paid the SAME as those who were not in contract.....

I own a first generation iPhone. There was no contract, so I can upgrade to a 3G at any time for the subsidized cost. The iPhone 3G was always sold with a contract in the US. Why don't you call ATT right now. Tell them you lost your iPhone 3G and see if they will give you a new 3G for $199

[rstansby]

Any possibility that this flash memory is for the new Apple netbook/tablet device ?

Perhaps several chips per computer would mean no hard drive is necessary. It would not need as much memory as a full computer because it is only a netbook/tablet and would be advertised as such. Perhaps ten chips per device; meaning 80GB. Ten million initial devices could be sold. (hey, only ten million iPhones were sold in the first year)

I don't mean to single you out, but it is amazing the assumptions people are making in this thread. People who don't even understand the difference between "bit" and "byte".

[scottness]

I don't mean to single you out, but it is amazing the assumptions people are making in this thread. People who don't even understand the difference between "bit" and "byte".

Yeah, I'm loving the creativity. It's pure entertainment. I'm even more excited to see what the reality is, though. When I can hold it in my hands...

[moniker]

3.14 out of what? :D

Forgot to mention that the moniker probability scale, improbabilically enough, is between 1.61 and 4.08.

[ryankroonenburg]

My thoughts exactly!!:D:D

Couldn't agree more!

[-hh]

Thinks about this! If Apple were to use these 1 GByte NAND chips in an iPhone/iPod touch, it would take 16 chips to make a 16GB iPhone, let alone 32 chips to make a 32GB iPhone. These devices do not have the room.

Now if you were building a bigger device that needed fast cheap NAND, say a 10 inch ultra-portable....

I've been thinking along similar lines: a bigger motherboard = more room.

However, the key question is going to be if they're cheap enough to be worth taking that approach, as xnu mentions:


to be installed on the board of the new Mac Tablet. There is more room and they will be integrated into the board for power savings and manufacturing. Lower density, cheaper to buy....80gb and 120gb models hopefully.

I completely made this up, but I am wishful....

So what's the answer to the question of the unit cost of this chip? I did one quick search and possibly found a $3 suggestion. Running with that (for lack of anything better):

Any possibility that this flash memory is for the new Apple netbook/tablet device ?

Perhaps several chips per computer would mean no hard drive is necessary. It would not need as much memory as a full computer because it is only a netbook/tablet and would be advertised as such. Perhaps ten chips per device; meaning 80GB...

The catch here is that they're 8Gb (bit), not 8GB chips, so for 80GB, you need 80 chips.

At $3 each, that would be $240. Given Toshiba's 1.8" hard drives retail for very very roughly $1 per GB, this price point is not cost-competitive...but that doesn't mean that it doesn't have other potential advantages which may offset (eg, reliability, final assembled cost, power consumption, etc).

Net bottom line is that the tablet netbook may have some potential here.


-hh

[iMacoo7]

Interesting....http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10217858-37.html

[viccles]

Interesting....http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10217858-37.html

Excellent :D