IT - Revealed...

[MacRumors]

Time.com posted (http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,186660-1,00.html) an early article detailing what IT (Ginger) is... and it's a scooter... or sorts.

Our favorite quote:

One of the hardest truths for any technologist to hear is that success or failure in business is rarely determined by the quality of the technology. Betamax was better than VHS; the Mac operating system is superior to Windows.

[Kevin Leidecker]

I am really excited to see the Ginger and try riding one down the street! I am really hoping people give this product a chance and not be upset that it isn't a flying hovercraft!

I run a small pizza operation in the middle of a downtown high traffic area.. Can you say low cost quick delivery vehicle...


http://www.kevtv.com

[AmbitiousLemon]

ooooh neat.

i love that vision of the future, truly beautiful.

how about pictures and details and this lil beauty? cant wait to set my eyes on one, although i suspect i'll laugh at loud the first time i see a pizza delivery boy or mailman cruising down the sidewalk on one.

[iwantanewmac]

HAHA good joke!!!!.....................

[sweetaction]

I am glad it is not a toy. Finally something that can truly change the way the world works.

Good work.

[C_a_r_s_t_e_n]

Living in Oldenburg, Lower Saxony, Germany, this would be an adequate alternative to cycling.

In Oldenburg on the average each inhabitant possesses three bicycles. (!)

What a cool invention.

I want one!

[arn]

NY Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2001/12/03/technology/03THIN.html) has a better picture.

arn

[ryanweb]

What a bubble, another "breakthrough" device!
Do you think people will seriosly consider scooter of any kind?
What about bad weather?
What about if you have to drop off your child at school, and school is is only one mile away?
What if you have to carry something, not just a notebook?

And you have to carry this device to your office, or carry it in the subway?
This is ridiculous!

It is good for teenagers only and for delivery guys, may be, but it will never change "the course of human history"!

[eyelikeart]

I've been reading posts all over the internet about this for months now and I'm thinking it's a great idea. I'd love to get my hands on one as well, but not to the tune of $3000. The last time I spent that much is when I got my PowerBook G4 in March!

[menoinjun]

Sure-it sounds great, but what about carrying it after you get to the destination, and what about uneven or cobblestone streets? What about NY's bumpy sidewalks?

-Pete

[spikey]

agreed, if you had one in britain you would be kicked in or just laughed at.

But it is still an impressive piece of kit.

[Gelfin]

From the "Good Morning America" video, it seems it would handle uneven terrain just fine. Remember its ancestor is a wheelchair that can climb stairs. As others have noted, this is not a vehicle for every circumstance. Rather than thinking about the cases in which you wouldn't use one, though, imagine the difference in a major city if all the people who didn't really need to be in a car weren't in them.

I think the standard for "changing everything" is probably too high in people's minds. Imagine being shown a lightbulb in an age of oil lamps. Sure, it's better in many ways. Less fire hazard, longer lasting, more consistent light. But it requires this long wire running to every single home that wants to use it, from a huge energy-generating facility that does not yet exist, and the electricity itself is not without hazards. Why should people give up their oil lamps for the light bulb, which does essentially the exact same job but with added complications? Sure the light bulb is a neat invention, but it hardly changes the world.

And yet it undeniably has. This is the kind of potential people are talking about, and I think they're right. Advanced though they may be, at heart cars are pure Industrial Revolution technology. We -need- lighter weight, more personal transportation possibilities.

[jefhatfield]

since there was so much buzz (and leaks) about the segway (aka ginger) in the silicon valley, most everybody knew what it was, but not the fine details like the nickel metal hydride battery and the 5 cents a day operational cost and the actual retail value of three thousand dollars

so sorry for assuming everybody knew what it was or my amazement of people hearing about the ginger or "it" for the first time last week/month

at the height of the dot.com revolution, san jose and surrounding area was producing as many millionnaires a day as manhattan was

but after the dot.com and high tech (in general) slowdown, it is hard to imagine where in history more money could have been lost so fast...the valley turned into a money pit where people's funds disappeared very rapidly

so when the ginger was said to be the saviour of high tech, everybody here in northern california listened very intently because right now, any hope is all we have...we certainly don't have high stock values, that's for sure

let's suppose that bill gates' 150 million in 1997-98 invested in apple was only used as leverage to get his products firmly rooted into the mac world, then is it possible that apple inc's millions into segway (maker of ginger) will give apple some pull in this new two wheeled transport revolution?

and a revolution it will be...i think

[Chris George]

I see that at this point people posting to this list are generally positive about the Segway (was: Ginger). So far, it has been my observation that Apple supporters tend to be more positive than PeeCee goons. Just an observation.

I'm excited because it's devices like this that (when released at the right time) can foster new thinking and new solutions to (now) age old problems: Traffic congestion, the consumption of fossil fuels, cost of owning a vehicle, mva's, etc.

Yes, this new invention, if accepted may cause a few problems as well - where do you drive it? Do you need a license? Are there min. age restrictions? Version 1.0 of anything usually has some shortcomings - we have to remember, even Edison, Ford and Bell had their follies.

Another bit of trivia: the name. Segway (spelled phonetically). Here is the Dictionary.com definition:

se·gue
To move smoothly and unhesitatingly from one state, condition, situation, or element to another: “Daylight segued into dusk” (Susan Dworski).

I'm curious to see what ver. 2.0 will look like.

Thanks for listening,

Chris George
Edmonton, Canada

[jefhatfield]

because we think differently, we think ahead so that's why mac people like segway the best i think

also, apple has some money invested in this invention...millions

is the segway bigger than the macintosh was to us in 1984? i think so, but it is hard to think that a high tech vehicle could bring back all the money previously lost into an industry like high tech which lost so much so recently

but detroit and pennsylvania were largely built up around vehicles like the car and the train so it is possible that high tech, san jose especially, could get a real rebound from the segway since the vehicle is so computer intensive and small enough for someone like apple to start producing if they wanted to (and if somehow they were allowed to also)

i am not holdong my breath for a high tech recovery just yet for the next quarter, but segway could eventually get the high tech sector back in a profitable state again...that would be nice

[eyelikeart]

Originally posted by ptrauber
Sure-it sounds great, but what about carrying it after you get to the destination, and what about uneven or cobblestone streets? What about NY's bumpy sidewalks?

-Pete

But have u ever taken a drive down a New Orleans street or sidewalk? There are uneven streets and sidewalks, potholes, cracks, etc, etc....total HELL on a car's suspension. Wonder how well Ginger would hold up here?

[GPTurismo]

Remember, the first cars were slower than Horse Carriages, were way more expensive, were messy and required a lot of maintenance and money to maintain.

This is just the first step. As long as people don't shoot it down, the technology that makes Ginger work can evolve into something amazing.

[Obsidian]

what awaste of time. though it seems kind of neat, why in the hell would I want one? where is my 300zx with 20" wheels and dual 10" subs?

I woiuld never buy one. the last thing we need right now are fance scooters, we NEED cars usin ballard fuel cells, or drive magnets..

come back when you have a real invention.

(if this divice was that revolutionary, the govournment would have killed the people who made it and disposed of it months ago)

[Mirus]

Living in the "Great White North" (MN in this case) would make this practical about 4 months out of the year, and in those 4 months maybe 2 weeks total time when not raining, incredibly windy, etc... This is not something that you'll get on and ride around the street when it's -30 with a -50 wind chill. This is why Minneapolis has a decent skyway system. Sure, it'll have a niche market but I don't see it as "revolutionizing" anything. It has a top speed of 12-15mph (I can sustain 22mph on my mountain bike and even higher if I had "street tires"). Max distance on a full charge is 15 miles which means it'll run for an hour, doesn't seem practical for a delivery company unless you buy 3 or 4 keeping some charged while others are in use (great marketing scam), this also means that you'll have to centralize your hub so your deliverers don't get stuck and have to "hoof" it 5 miles while dragging this thing behind them. Personally, I think a standard 2 wheel scooter has more practicality, unless you're extremely overweight, lazy or professional where you wouldn't want to sweat in your Armani.

My 2 cents

[Obsidian]

This device is totally un practical. it only has a maximum of 27kp/h, and the battery only lasts one hour.
Inevitably, the device will be overpriced (like microshack), and will be next to useless.

What we need are cheaper, more efficent transportaion systems such as ballard fuel cells. We need to dispose of fossil fuels and stop destroying the planet.

I hate to sound like an environmentalist, but I live in BC, Canada, and when we went to San Deago two years ago, the smog and traffic jams all the way through cali were just plain horrible. (immagine 9 lanes of traffic on each side grid-locked for 20 miles in either direction!)

The problem lies in in the govournment. They make massive ammounts of money off of the oil monopolies, and do not wish to switch over becasue the infrastructure does not exist, and thus, the money is not there. No one is willing to opt for it because the cost is unfathomable. The answer being that the gov needs to subsidise cheaper more efficent energies! (such as more solar like the helios (which is run by powermacs :)

Anway, ill shut up. Please don't complain about this not being mac related :)

[although i guess none of this thread is]

[AmbitiousLemon]

i want to say that i totally agree with you there obsidian, but i just cant go that far. you are completely right about the need for clean energy sources, and cars are a major problem with the air quality. i grew up in southern california on the beach. the air quality because we were on the beach was always perfect, and we all hated going inland because ... well... because we could taste and see the air. northern california (where i live now) likes to pretend it has clean air but i can still taste the smog. europe is even worse. the air litterally made me sick and made traveling almost unbearable, and dont get me started on the water there.

but the segway is taking one very small and one very important step in the right direction. getting people out of cars and out of other fossil fuel devices (like those lil gold carts they have in factories for getting around) when it is possible. no one will buy a segway at $3000, but im sure the price will come down. its not the complete solution for a cleaner tomorrow but its wone important step.

and its one step that can actually be taken. like you talked about with the governments, we arent going to see cleaner cars for a long time. as long as the good'ol usa keeps dragging its heals no solar cars and no fuel cells. the president of the states wasnt even elected! he was put in place by his oil money and oil connections. and since in office he has actively reversing environmental standards. hate referring people to my website since its not ready for the public but i have a friend who wrote a really good article that ive posted http://www.ambitiouslemon.com/opinion/letter.htm in case you dont want to follow the link heres what it says. researcher at caltech loses funding for research into a more efficient solar cell because bush cuts funding for most research into clean energy.

by attacking the segway you are just playing into the oil companies plan. oooh its not a car its bad. i want my car with my big speakers and comfyy seat. ive never seen such a disgusting display of fat cat capitalism and consumerism in my life (ok that was way over stated). we should be embracing technologies that shake up the status quo, inventions that have utopian views of the future, inventions that were created to fulfil a function not to make its inventer rich.

[sevag1]

Retail price for IT is $8,000..

-sev

[AmbitiousLemon]

not sure exactly what u mean there but heres what the article said.

retail will initially be $8000 but drop to $3000 by the time its ready for the public.

[Obsidian]

Mabye I went overboard with the 300zx comment, but everyone, and I mean EVERYONE has a dream car, even if they are extremests...

I have to concur that the segway is a step in the right direction, but instead of electrical personal devices, I would rather see them inventing parts of a whole that may become a transportation system, such as futuristic electric trains the like that exist all over in Europe. But on the whole, I like the view that some people have of the future where urban centers do not revolve around the automobile and lanes of traffic. Instead, they are open courtyards where people walk through, and I guess, use PTV's like the segway. But in my oppinion, the segway, at this point in time, only has one niche, such as I noticed on the news earler tonight, and as you mentioned- to pull box carrages around in factories and warehouses.

I am not a conspiracy junkie, but if you like reading about suppressed inventions or the like - have I got a book for you! :)

A friend of mine reccomended this book to me, so I bought it, and it is just chalk full of interesting articles and stories about the stuff 'they' dont want you to know about.

beleive it or not, when I ordered this book first, from Chapters, a large Canadian book franchise, it took more than a month for a response; that respons was that thwy had no idea how i even ordered it in the first place, because it had never existed in the system library...

If you are interseted, the books title is:

Suppressed Inventions & Other Discoveries

by Jonathan Eisen

(if this is spam, i wont do it again, it just seemed relevant to the topic! :D )

[Obsidian]

2

[Obsidian]

4..
hehe sorry i just had to get a post ahead of you ;)

[Foocha]

I think everyone knew IT was likely to be some kind of Scooter - I was struggling to believe that was all there was to IT after all that hype, but there you go.

Computer companies getting into personal forms of transport have a very bad precident here in the UK, as anyone who remembers the Sinclair C5 will know.

Sinclair was a revolutionary computer company - they were the first to sell an electronic calculator, digital watch and home computer in the UK. They then went on to sell the Sinclair C5 personal vehicle, and the rest is history:

http://www.sinclairc5.co.uk/

Let's hope Apple doesn't take this opportunity to market the latest scate-scooter fad.

[AmbitiousLemon]

::head hung low::

as much as i love the potential of the segway, and really think it has many short term practical applications and long term revolutionary applications, for the life of me i just can imagine people scooting around on these as a form of transportation. not because of anything wrong with the segway (unlike some problems of the C5) but because of peoples reaction to it.

look at this thread so many people are laughing and saying how stupid it is. these people are a reflection of the ignorant close-minded masses.

so far segway is doing smart buisiness. they are targeting certain markets like factories and postal service. this allows them to sell product revice their design and slowly bring their product into the public awareness.

people will see their friendly neighborhood mailman buzzing down the sidewalks, over the bumpy potholed sidewalks and over the cobblestones and get used to them. the company will make smaller, cheaper, more refined models and sell them to the public slowly. also the targeting of the postal service is a great start for another reason. with government involvment in the segway from its infancy the government is more likely to accommodate the segway legally and infastructurally.

all thats side as hard as i try i just cant see people rushing out and buying these even at 1/3 the price. but like i said the company is being smart, the market niche is there, the potential for the future is great... please segway surprise me.

[joey j]

spikey> agreed, if you had one in britain you would be kicked in or just laughed at.

... but that would just be the British being, erm, British. You also
forgot to mention the possibility of it being stolen, Britain (in spite of
competition from, erm, probably every country in the world) having made
the practice readily identifiable with itself (albeit unintentionally) due
to its unfortunate exportation of convicts in the late 18th century (bad
move).

Not to mention the corporate thieves that Britain has exported (do they
have too many at home?) to various parts of the world, but that's a story
better told by the independent media... probably.

[Foocha]

Joey - you seem to have a very negative attitude about Britain and the British people.

I don't think this is fair, and I really hope you visit us here in Britain sometime and find out how hospitable we can really be.

Also, if we exported all our convicts in the 18th century - surely there wouldn't be any left now ;)

[joey j]

>Joey - you seem to have a very negative attitude about Britain and the
British people.

I disagree (and who more qualified to speak about my opinion than me?);
spikey was spinning his rant on the angle you note above so I looked like
the bad guy, the same way I was the stereotype-happy right-winger,
remember?


>I don't think this is fair, and I really hope you visit us here in
Britain sometime and find out how hospitable we can really be.

(okay, every country has ****** inhabitants).


>Also, if we exported all our convicts in the 18th century - surely there
wouldn't be any left now ;) [/B]

Hehe, crime is always a big growth industry in every country I know of :p