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View Full Version : More $$$ for Iraq this year?




mactastic
Apr 21, 2004, 02:47 PM
Link (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4790545/)

Intense combat in Iraq is chewing up military hardware and consuming money at an unexpectedly rapid rate — depleting military coffers, straining defense contractors and putting pressure on Bush administration officials to seek a major boost in war funding long before they had hoped.

Since Congress approved an $87 billion defense request last year, the administration has steadfastly maintained that military forces in Iraq will be sufficiently funded until early next year. President Bush's budget request for the fiscal year that begins Oct. 1 included no money for Iraqi operations, and his budget director, Joshua B. Bolten, said no request would come until January at the earliest.

The military already has identified unmet funding needs, including initiatives aimed at providing equipment and weapons for troops in Iraq. The Army has publicly identified nearly $6 billion in funding requests that did not make Bush's $402 billion defense budget for 2005, including $132 million for bolt-on vehicle armor; $879 million for combat helmets, silk-weight underwear, boots and other clothing; $21.5 million for M249 squad automatic weapons; and $27 million for ammunition magazines, night sights and ammo packs. Also unfunded: $956 million for repairing desert-damaged equipment and $102 million to replace equipment lost in combat.

Rep. Curt Weldon (R-Pa.), vice chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, charged that the president is playing political games by postponing further funding requests until after the election, to try to avoid reopening debate on the war's cost and future.

Weldon described the administration's current defense budget request as "outrageous" and "immoral" and said that at least $10 billion is needed for Iraqi operations over the next five months.

"There needs to be a supplemental, whether it's a presidential election year or not," he said. "The support of our troops has to be the number one priority of this country. . . . Somebody's got to get serious about this."

Rep. Chet Edwards (D-Tex.), who returned from Iraq on March 23, said senior Army officers and contractors told him "serious problems" will surface this summer if Congress does not approve more spending by June. Without the additional funding, food concession contracts will have to be renegotiated and operations and training bases in the United States will have to be cannibalized to finance operations in Iraq.

"If one American soldier in Iraq loses his life because Congress and the administration were afraid of the political consequences of another supplemental appropriations bill, shame on everyone who should be a part of that process," Edwards said.

The strains are beginning to show. Last month, all four military services began spending money halfway through the fiscal year that they were not supposed to touch until July, a senior Republican Armed Services Committee aide said. The military has asked Congress eight times in the past few months for permission to shift $619 million to urgent combat needs from less-pressing programs, Sen. Jack Reed (D-R.I.) said.

Scrambling to fill its needs, the Pentagon last week diverted 120 armored Humvees purchased by the Israel Defense Forces to Iraq. Yesterday, the Army announced a $110 million contract for still more armored Humvees.

But even that will not be enough, said Robert F. Mecredy, president of the defense group at Armor Holdings. As the two-front uprising in Iraq began taking its toll last month, the company's O'Gara-Hess & Eisenhardt Armoring Co. subsidiary cranked up its Ohio defense plant, turning out 214 heavily armored Humvees in March, revving up for 220 this month, even building its own bulletproof-glass operation to augment faltering suppliers.

But by September, Mecredy said, O'Gara's funding from the Army will be running out. Mecredy arrived in Washington yesterday for a week of intensive congressional lobbying. To keep Humvee production at the Army's requested rate, he said, Armor Holdings will need $354 million more by Oct. 1, the beginning of fiscal 2005.
Bush administration officials have not wavered in their contention that money is actually plentiful. Dov S. Zakheim, who left his post as Pentagon comptroller last week, told reporters earlier this month that there may be a temporary spike in spending in the coming months but that costs would then steadily decline. By borrowing from military personnel, operations and maintenance accounts for the final half of 2005, the Pentagon may be able to bridge the gap, said Rep. John M. Spratt Jr. (S.C.), the ranking Democrat on the House Budget Committee. But budget chicanery of that magnitude would be unprecedented, he added.

"Whether they can do that if the requirement is $50 [billion] or $60 billion remains to be seen," Spratt said. "It's no way to run a budget."

Will Bush act to support the troops, or will he leave them short on money and equipment because of his political needs?



zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 03:05 PM
i wonder how much these figures would change if more US troops are needed

mactastic
Apr 21, 2004, 03:07 PM
i wonder how much these figures would change if more US troops are needed

Well according to 'Rat, all you do is snap your fingers and it happens. I wonder if Rummy's getting ready to snap his?

skunk
Apr 21, 2004, 03:12 PM
Well according to 'Rat, all you do is snap your fingers and it happens. I wonder if Rummy's getting ready to snap his?
I wish somebody would snap Rumsfeld's fingers for him...

miloblithe
Apr 21, 2004, 03:32 PM
No no. You've all misunderstood. Iraqi oil production will pay for the occupation.

mactastic
Apr 21, 2004, 03:38 PM
No no. You've all misunderstood. Iraqi oil production will pay for the occupation.

Yeah I've heard that. Doesn't square with the facts though.

zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 03:38 PM
No no. You've all misunderstood. Iraqi oil production will pay for the occupation.
iow, the US expenditures are all loans?

IJ Reilly
Apr 21, 2004, 03:47 PM
No no. You've all misunderstood. Iraqi oil production will pay for the occupation.

No, that was the rebuilding, not the occupation. Nobody ever said oil revenue would pay for that. Not to worry, it's not going to cost over $50 billion anyway.

To this administration, nothing is above politics. They just need to keep reminding us how John Kerry is weak on defense, and everything will turn out great.

skunk
Apr 21, 2004, 03:50 PM
iow, the US expenditures are all loans?
May I remind you that with the current US budget deficit, ALL US expenditures ARE loans....

zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 04:01 PM
May I remind you that with the current US budget deficit, ALL US expenditures ARE loans....
<sounds of applause>

Sayhey
Apr 21, 2004, 04:39 PM
May I remind you that with the current US budget deficit, ALL US expenditures ARE loans....

Well ... there is that... ;)

Thanatoast
Apr 21, 2004, 04:52 PM
so, is the republican goal here to cause a train wreck? four hundred billion this year, plus another fifty supplemental, just for defense? regardless of circumstances, the US can't keep up this level of spending on the military and still retain a viable economy. i think the current administration needs to be reminded of all the crowing they did when the soviet union spent itself out of existence. history repeating and all, but this isn't even history, it's just barely retro...

zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 05:22 PM
so, is the republican goal here to cause a train wreck?
i believe the secret WH plan is to devalue the dollar so much ($1.50/euro) that there'll be a scramble to buy the US debt.

zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 05:38 PM
on abcnews right now -- it's costing the US $4.7 billion / month for the military to be in iraq.

estimates for keeping in iraq, for 3 months, some 20,000 troops who were supposed to go home, is $700 million extra.

skunk
Apr 21, 2004, 05:47 PM
on abcnews right now -- it's costing the US $4.7 billion / month for the military to be in iraq.
The last month must have been double that, then. Lost equipment, widows' pensions, etc.

numediaman
Apr 21, 2004, 06:00 PM
The last month must have been double that, then. Lost equipment, widows' pensions, etc.

If the British government is going to continue to support the war, it seems that they should pay their fair share, don't you think? And being that we want the British to feel like equal partners (we wouldn't want to insult them, would we?) they should be pay an equal amount, right?

What say you skunk and amnesiac1984? :D

mactastic
Apr 21, 2004, 06:07 PM
If the British government is going to continue to support the war, it seems that they should pay their fair share, don't you think? And being that we want the British to feel like equal partners (we wouldn't want to insult them, would we?) they should be pay an equal amount, right?

What say you skunk and amnesiac1984? :D

You know, the big 'joke' about Gulf War I is that we almost made money off that war. Shrub's daddy knew enough to work the international community to pay for that military action rather than putting the US in the postion of having to foot the entire cost. Shrub didn't take that lesson to heart, and believed all the BS being fed to him from 'welcomed with open arms' to 'Iraqi oil will pay for everything'. In the process he alienated most of those who might have been willing to help out. Our 'coalition of the willing' is dwindling fast, and we (the American taxpayer) are footing the bill AND providing the bodies as a result of his miscalculation.

Don't panic
Apr 21, 2004, 06:29 PM
I wish somebody would snap Rumsfeld's fingers for him...

or, why not, FROM him...

skunk
Apr 21, 2004, 06:58 PM
or, why not, FROM him...
Well that's what I meant! :rolleyes:

skunk
Apr 21, 2004, 07:02 PM
If the British government is going to continue to support the war, it seems that they should pay their fair share, don't you think? And being that we want the British to feel like equal partners (we wouldn't want to insult them, would we?) they should be pay an equal amount, right?

What say you skunk and amnesiac1984? :D
I'm sure we're paying for our own upkeep. Let's keep it that way. After all, it's George's friends, not Tony's, who are getting all the perks.

pseudobrit
Apr 21, 2004, 08:15 PM
I'm sure we're paying for our own upkeep. Let's keep it that way. After all, it's George's friends, not Tony's, who are getting all the perks.

Has Tony any friends left?

blackfox
Apr 21, 2004, 11:23 PM
I, of course am no fan of the 'War' or of our ballooning budget deficits...but considering Bush got us into this mess, the least he could do is properly fund the troops, even if it costs him politically...(as long as I'm dreaming I'd like a pony...). I find this disgusting beyond words...

zimv20
Apr 21, 2004, 11:56 PM
the least he could do is properly fund the troops, even if it costs him politically...
i think bush made two grave errors in assuming:
1. war will go according to plan
2. war can be done on the cheap

some commander in chief, huh?

amnesiac1984
Apr 22, 2004, 04:39 AM
If the British government is going to continue to support the war, it seems that they should pay their fair share, don't you think? And being that we want the British to feel like equal partners (we wouldn't want to insult them, would we?) they should be pay an equal amount, right?

What say you skunk and amnesiac1984? :D

Its a fair point but there's no way we could afford, we are not nearly as big as the US. Anyway, as skunk said, bush's buddies are gettin gall the money anyway. Maybe Tony's plan is to start a Grand Prix in Iraq and so help out Bernie Ecclestone (is that the right guy?) :p

numediaman
Apr 22, 2004, 08:13 AM
Its a fair point but there's no way we could afford, we are not nearly as big as the US. Anyway, as skunk said, bush's buddies are gettin gall the money anyway. Maybe Tony's plan is to start a Grand Prix in Iraq and so help out Bernie Ecclestone (is that the right guy?) :p

You've got me thinking: maybe we can pay for this thing through corporate sponsorships. We'll let Disney open a Fallujah Disney World; we can have Rev. Schuller build a new Crystal Cathedral in Najaf; how about a Six Flags Great Iraq in Basra; the possibilities are endless. Give the Iraqis what they really want, Janet Jackson and Justin Timberlake.

skunk
Apr 22, 2004, 10:05 AM
the possibilities are endless.
"Thief of Baghdad" Theme Park?
See Sinbad Bush in "the Flying Carpetbagger"