Windows 7 RC Discussion [Archive]

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 07:58 AM

So the Release Candidate is officially released to MSDN/TechNet subscribers tomorrow [30th April] and the masses on the 5th May.

Torrent sites are happily hosting links to build 7100 which is apparently the build that has been shipped out to Microsoft partners already for testing, seems a fairly safe bet that 7100 is the RC release.

So, those running the RC, what do you think?

I'm loving the Window management shortcut keys. With multiple monitors they're a god send.

PSR (Problem Steps Recorder - run PSR.exe) is an excellent addition from a support point of view.

I'm really liking the new Task Bar.

Aero is very nice. Transparency when it's wanted works well, again with good keyboard shortcuts is very handy.

Snipping Tool is a nice update to the good old Print Screen button.

Search (like Spotlight) from the Start Menu works perfectly, and is nice and snappy!

I'm running on a dual core 3.0Ghz Core 2, 4GB RAM, ATi 2400 XT. 32-bit Win7 Ultimate.

Sky Blue

Apr 29, 2009, 08:05 AM

Snipping Tool is a nice update to the good old Print Screen button.

Wasn't that already in Vista?

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 08:05 AM

Wasn't that already in Vista?oh, er, possibly. I probably only ever used Vista for about a week :o

steveza

Apr 29, 2009, 08:35 AM

I'm only getting the offical RC off TechNet tomorrow so I can't really comment on it just yet. Only been using build 7000 up until now but I've found it excellent.

I'll be running it on my MBP (for business use) and for testing I'm using my i7 920 (12GB RAM, ATI HD 4850) both running 64bit.

rwilliams

Apr 29, 2009, 09:24 AM

I think that the Release Candidate is the best non-server version of Windows ever released. Seriously. Vista needed a service pack to even become worth the effort, and XP needed 2 service packs to become as solid as it is today. Stable, beautiful, fast, no obvious signs of bloat - just wonderful. And it has definitely learned from both the Vista disaster and Mac OS X. Driver support right "out of the box" is infinitely superior already to Vista and is more reminiscent of OS X's ability to recognize just about anything that connects to it, WiFi has been greatly simplified, install and boot times are much, much faster, and Aero is now less of a gimmick and is being put to much better use than in Vista. And it's truly gorgeous on a MacBook. :)

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 10:25 AM

Windows 7 might rock up in 2009, says MS veep (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/04/29/windows_7_bill_veghte/).

Might go retail sooner than expected. Might.

steveza

Apr 29, 2009, 10:44 AM

stainlessliquid

Apr 29, 2009, 10:57 AM

I dont like the snipping program because its not set to a shortcut key, making it pretty much useless.

Id be surprised if it went retail in the fall. Maybe winter 09. OEM's will want to wait until fall to release their Windows 7 computers, forcing MS to wait a couple months before they can release it in the stores. Doesnt matter much to me, once the OEM version comes out it will hit the torrent sites and you can use that as a trial for 120 days until you can buy the retail one (which should come out in less than 120 days).

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:00 AM

I dont like the snipping program because its not set to a shortcut key, making it pretty much useless.Regular old Print Screen still works.

jav6454

Apr 29, 2009, 11:02 AM

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:04 AM

I'm guessing if you have Win 7 Beta build 7000, in order to have this one you have to do a clean install.I think so. I'm sure I read somewhere there is a way round this. You're probably better off just going the clean install route though.

stainlessliquid

Apr 29, 2009, 11:05 AM

Regular old Print Screen still works.

I know, its easier to hit print screen and open up Photoshop or whatever than it is to open up the snip program and fiddle with it. Which makes it pretty useless. They should have just made it part of the OS with shortcut keys.

xUKHCx

Apr 29, 2009, 11:06 AM

Windows 7 might rock up in 2009, says MS veep (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/04/29/windows_7_bill_veghte/).

Might go retail sooner than expected. Might.

I think September is a good estimate for retail. Enterprise and OEMs before that.

I've been following windows 7 in the media for quite some time now. Haven't acutally downloaded it as I am on a capped download limit and have better things to spend it on then a beta OS, however it has been pretty clear for some time now that most in the know people expect it to come this year retail.

I have liked what I have seen so far and the reviews, show cases I have read have been quite promising. Having done one Vista upgrade way back when it first came out, total nightmare, and experienced one recently I am looking forward to windows 7.

I think so. I'm sure I read somewhere there is a way round this. You're probably better off just going the clean install route though.

Work around

http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/2009/04/07/delivering-a-quality-upgrade-experience.aspx

Although as edesignuk said it is probably best to go for a clean install.

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:07 AM

I know, its easier to hit print screen and open up Photoshop or whatever than it is to open up the snip program and fiddle with it. Which makes it pretty useless. They should have just made it part of the OS with shortcut keys.How many basic users have Photoshop?

I know what you're saying, but I still think the new screen capture tool is a pretty decent addition to the existing Print Screen.

flopticalcube

Apr 29, 2009, 11:12 AM

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:15 AM

Also looking forward to the smaller footprint for VMware.It's still quite "big". 13GB used on an Ultimate install (only additional things installed on that PC are AVG Free, Whiz FTP, and Firefox).

flopticalcube

Apr 29, 2009, 11:16 AM

It's still quite "big". 13GB used on an Ultimate install (only additional things installed on that PC are AVG Free, Whiz FTP, and Firefox).
I was thinking more of the RAM footprint. Isn't suppose to be even smaller than XP?

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:21 AM

I was thinking more of the RAM footprint. Isn't suppose to be even smaller than XP?I wouldn't go that far.

169007

That's just the PC sitting idle.

flopticalcube

Apr 29, 2009, 11:23 AM

Well, still better than Vista. Thanks for the info. Now let's hope they don't price gouge.

edesignuk

Apr 29, 2009, 11:26 AM

Something else I just thought to look at. 7100 (that we're assuming is RC) is good until "02/03/2010 00:59".

169013

chewietobbacca

Apr 29, 2009, 01:21 PM

Looking forward to W7. Haven't said that about an MS OS for a long time. Any idea on how it is as a gaming OS as compared to XP? Compatibility problems with older games? Also looking forward to the smaller footprint for VMware.

Not sure about RC but retail has XP mode on which is a virtualization of XP so anything that worked in XP will work in Win7

twoodcc

Apr 29, 2009, 01:50 PM

Something else I just thought to look at. 7100 (that we're assuming is RC) is good until "02/03/2010 00:59".

interesting. but retail could still be released before that time.

jaw04005

Apr 29, 2009, 02:49 PM

Not sure about RC but retail has XP mode on which is a virtualization of XP so anything that worked in XP will work in Win7

Specific versions only, and it's not included on the disc. You have to download it from Microsoft's site.

I'm not sure why Thurrott and others are making a big deal out of this. It's not like they bothered to integrate it with the operating system and dropped pre-Vista compatibility from Windows 7.

It's essentially the old Connectix's Virtual PC with an XP image.

I guess because they're bundled (XP and Virtual PC) and it's free to Professional, Enterprise and Ultimate customers is somewhat nice. Also, maybe they're excited because they believe this is where Microsoft is going with Windows 8? No non-virtualized pre-Vista programs?

Back on topic, 7100 is very stable for me here. I'm loving it. I noticed immediately that they've removed the "send feedback" link. It's locked down and in its final descent to RTM.

It's time to go bug squashing.

twoodcc

Apr 29, 2009, 08:10 PM

Specific versions only, and it's not included on the disc. You have to download it from Microsoft's site.

I'm not sure why Thurrott and others are making a big deal out of this. It's not like they bothered to integrate it with the operating system and dropped pre-Vista compatibility from Windows 7.

It's essentially the old Connectix's Virtual PC with an XP image.

I guess because they're bundled (XP and Virtual PC) and it's free to Professional, Enterprise and Ultimate customers is somewhat nice. Also, maybe they're excited because they believe this is where Microsoft is going with Windows 8? No non-virtualized pre-Vista programs?

Back on topic, 7100 is very stable for me here. I'm loving it. I noticed immediately that they've removed the "send feedback" link. It's locked down and in its final descent to RTM.

It's time to go bug squashing.

glad to hear it's working nicely for you. i'm still trying out 7000 on my macbook air. it's pretty good

edesignuk

Apr 30, 2009, 03:28 AM

Another thing I like - which may have been in Vista, I don't know. :o

Fast user switching is supported on domain member workstations. Very, very nice.

The amount of times I need to do something as an admin on someone's PC and can't because they've forgotten to log off. Being able to log in as admin without having to log them off is extremely useful.

drlunanerd

Apr 30, 2009, 03:35 AM

Saladinos

Apr 30, 2009, 03:39 AM

I'm not sure why Thurrott and others are making a big deal out of this. It's not like they bothered to integrate it with the operating system and dropped pre-Vista compatibility from Windows 7.

Exactly. IIRC, not many people complained about Vista's lack of software compatibility. It was the lack of hardware compatibility that was no good.

We're also going to get in to situations where devices with XP drivers only are usable by applications in the VM, but not those same applications running native.

It's a nice little addition, but it's not THAT good.

edesignuk

Apr 30, 2009, 03:40 AM

The "Run As" command helps in this situation.Sometimes it can, but a lot of the time it can't.

steveza

Apr 30, 2009, 03:51 AM

Sometimes it can, but a lot of the time it can't.Indeed - like trying to change network settings for someone who only has 'user' access to their machine. This was a nightmare back in the days when I was doing XP rollouts.

While I don't advocate torrent downloads those who are planning on getting one of the 'leaked' RC ISOs make sure they match these MD5 hashes. There are ISOs online that have a trojan injected into the image. It's only a few days to go so I would suggest waiting for the official download.

Windows 7 RC x86 ISO MD5=8867C13330F56A93944BCD46DCD73590
Windows 7 RC x64 ISO MD5=98341af35655137966e382c4feaa282d

drlunanerd

Apr 30, 2009, 05:28 AM

Indeed - like trying to change network settings for someone who only has 'user' access to their machine. This was a nightmare back in the days when I was doing XP rollouts.

...which you can change using Run As, from command line or UI :)

steveza

Apr 30, 2009, 05:29 AM

...which you can change using Run As, from command line or UI :)link or it isn't true :) . . . not that it really matters as I don't ever see users any more :D

MacRumorUser

Apr 30, 2009, 05:50 AM

I've been running 7 on my Hp2140 for a while, first with 7000, then 7058,7069,7077 and now 7100 RC...

It's a very good operating system overall, and it surprises me how well it runs on systems that would otherwise struggle with vista.

Haven't really encountered too many issues, and the ones that I have come across have been rectified with tweaks found by googling.

It'll probably be the first operating system from Microsoft that I'll actually buy.... Though I'm still not liking the 7 editions and pricing part.

Kebabselector

Apr 30, 2009, 06:31 AM

...which you can change using Run As, from command line or UI :)

...does depend on how locked down the group policies are.

SHIFTLife

Apr 30, 2009, 08:22 AM

steveza

Apr 30, 2009, 08:25 AM

Anyone have the RC running with Boot Camp? Can you load the x64 version, or do you need to use the x86 version? I'm downloading x86 now, but I'm having trouble getting back into my TechNet Subscriptions page to grab the x64...way overloaded at the moment.You an use the x64 version if your hardware supports it. I just got kicked out of TechNet - was just about to start dowloading :(

drlunanerd

Apr 30, 2009, 12:47 PM

I for one am not rushing to test it (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8026736.stm):

"We were able to shave 400 milliseconds off the shutdown time by slightly trimming the WAV file shutdown music.
"It's indicative of really the level and detail and scrutiny on Windows 7."

:rolleyes: ;)

steveza

Apr 30, 2009, 03:06 PM

Well that answers the 'will it be availble in '09 question': Windows 7 on Acer machines 23/10/09 (http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/news.phtml/23846/acer-confirms-windows-7-23-october.phtml)

jashsayani

Apr 30, 2009, 07:02 PM

I'm guessing if you have Win 7 Beta build 7000, in order to have this one you have to do a clean install.

Yeah, I am using Windows 7 Beta (Build 7000) on a netbook and wanted to upgrade to RC1 as I just got my hands on the disk. However, You need to do a clean install, that's what Microsoft said. You can upgrade to RC1, only if you are on Build 7077.

I think so. I'm sure I read somewhere there is a way round this. You're probably better off just going the clean install route though.

Finally, I found the way around this. Just go to /sources/ dir of disk and open sversions.inf file. Change the CliMin from 7077.0 to 7000.0

Now when you run Setup.exe, the installer will run.

Still have to upgeade though. Getting some sleep now.....

Chad H

Apr 30, 2009, 07:35 PM

I just installed the Windows 7 RC. My beta disc got corrupt so I had to temporarily switch to Vista. God its good to be back. I really like Windows 7 as good as OSX. Now, to me having a Mac with Windows 7 is the perfect machine. I still wouldn't want to own a PC . ;):apple:

roger6106

Apr 30, 2009, 08:58 PM

I do some web development, and I have to test my sites in different browsers including IE 6, 7, and 8.

1. Is it possible to access older Internet Explorers in Windows 7's Virtual Windows XP mode?
2. If so, which versions of Internet Explorer can be accessed?
3. Can the older IEs be run while running Windows 7 in a virtual machine on Mac OS X?

NoSmokingBandit

Apr 30, 2009, 09:12 PM

Hopefully Creative Labs will have fixed their SB Live! driver for win7. Their ******* drivers are the only thing keeping me on xp x64. The beta of win7 x64 is great, but im not going to download/burn/install the RC if my sound card isnt going to work.

kevin j

Apr 30, 2009, 09:20 PM

illegallydead

Apr 30, 2009, 09:36 PM

Running the RC (7100) now, 64-bit. For some reason I think I got a bad version of build 7057 (what I used to have) and it was just painful-god-awful-slow.

This build is AMAZING! The thing runs stupid fast, and I have only really had compatibility issues with Macdrive (but that is because the developers are either lazy or are ****ing idiots and have done almost zilch for 64-bit support)

If anyone has questions feel free to ask, but like I said, overall this thing runs like a dream. I may seriously consider going for a PC when my Macbook finally kicks the bucket (hopefully years down the road :D) partly because of money, and partly because Win7 is something that I would not mind running...

tubbymac

May 1, 2009, 03:29 AM

The Windows 7 Beta (build 7000) was already working well for me so I was dreading the thought of having to format and reinstall all my applications. I went ahead and did it anyway and am now on the Windows 7 Release Candidate 64 bit edition (build 7100).

The OS itself is impressively rock solid at this point. No crashes, no slow downs, no issues at all. Compared to my Vista desktop box the Windows 7 user interface is in a completely different league of snappiness. It looks like Vista except for the new Taskbar, but it's no longer a slug on the desktop graphics front.

One thing that bugged me about XP and Vista and even the Windows 7 Beta was that my notebook had the dreaded Intel Core 2 CPU whine / motherboard coil whine from Windows trying to constantly popping the CPU in and out of a power saving state as it operated. With the RC they finally tweaked something about the power settings and with quite a bit of work and disabling unused ports in the BIOS, my Windows notebook FINALLY, for the first time ever, is about as quiet as my Macbook under OSX. It's still not as good as OSX in this respect but it's getting closer.

It looks like they replaced the beta IE8 from build 7000 with the release IE8 in build 7100. I didn't really get to test it much as I use Firefox but it seemed stable. In the beta it would crash quite a bit.

The new built in DivX/Xvid codecs seem more stable than beta but can still hang Windows Media Player if you try to view some older DivX/Xvid content over the network. They need to fix that before retail as it's embarrassing that VLC and third party programs have more reliable codecs than Microsoft.

There's also a whole new set of trippy wallpapers that have been added and a slew of minor fixes/changes in how the UI and shortcut keys work. Seems everything is quite solid and polished at this point except for the new codecs and Windows Media Player. Not bad. If Microsoft doesn't do anything really stupid before retail this could be quite a successful Windows OS.

jashsayani

May 1, 2009, 04:11 AM

Something else I just thought to look at. 7100 (that we're assuming is RC) is good until "02/03/2010 00:59".

169013

Well, even the Beta (Build 7068) is good till "02/03/2010". The Time changes as per your installation time. Mine is "5:29 AM"

The screenshot has date in DD/MM/YYYY form due to regional settings....

http://snapshack.net/images/windowsver.png (http://snapshack.net/?v=windowsver.png)

steveza

May 1, 2009, 05:10 AM

The release candidate will expire in June 2010.

CrossFireXT17

May 2, 2009, 01:45 PM

hows this working on bootcamp on a macbook pro??? driver wise

NoSmokingBandit

May 2, 2009, 02:01 PM

Vista drivers are said to work 100% in 7 (and have worked perfect from my experience), so its going to be just as crippled as usual with Apple's shoddy driver package.

illegallydead

May 2, 2009, 02:53 PM

Vista drivers are said to work 100% in 7 (and have worked perfect from my experience), so its going to be just as crippled as usual with Apple's shoddy driver package.

It's working quite well for me. The only thing I am having issues with is the iSight camera, but it's not like I use it that much at all.

Anything that worked in Vista is working for me. Now, it may require "installing with recommended settings", but I can get most things to work just fine.

As mentioned before, the only REAL issue I have is with Macdrive. But that is not the fault of M$ or or Apple, that is just because the developers (seem to be) short-sighted morons who have more or less refused to give any sort of 64-bit support.

Tallest Skil

May 2, 2009, 02:58 PM

Yes, I realize that a clean install would be far better, but would it be possible to do a simple upgrade from Beta 7000 to the RC?

tubbymac

May 2, 2009, 03:47 PM

Yes, I realize that a clean install would be far better, but would it be possible to do a simple upgrade from Beta 7000 to the RC?

Yeap it's possible with a minor text edit of one file. Instructions can be found here:

http://www.blogsdna.com/3083/how-to-upgrade-windows-7-beta-build-7000-to-windows-7-rc-build-7100.htm

NoSmokingBandit

May 2, 2009, 09:16 PM

As mentioned before, the only REAL issue I have is with Macdrive. But that is not the fault of M$ or or Apple, that is just because the developers (seem to be) short-sighted morons who have more or less refused to give any sort of 64-bit support.

I use TransMac on x64 windows installs. Its not as nice as MacDrive, but it gets the job done.

jmpage2

May 2, 2009, 11:14 PM

Had a lot of trouble getting it to work but finally have build 7100 RC1 x64 working on my iMac.

I already had the x86 loaded via Boot Camp and the boot loader recognized the 7100 x64 version and let me install it.

A helluva lot of problems with drivers though. I loaded the LIMO patch which let me get x64 Boot Camp loaded. Then I downloaded the 2.1 drivers and installed those.

It showed that the coprocessor was an unknown device and sound wasn't working after the Boot Camp driver install. I manually loaded the Realtek drivers from the OS X cd and loaded the x64 Nvidia drivers for the northbridge manually and so far all of the hardware is recognized and sound works again.

Windows Experience gives this machine a healthy 6.2. I am just using the MS supplied drivers for my iMacs Radeon 4850 card for now, I might go check for an update from ATI in a few weeks though.

twoodcc

May 3, 2009, 10:43 AM

edit: so i have the 64 bit version installed on my white macbook. seems to work just fine

jmpage2

May 3, 2009, 11:29 AM

My Win7 partition doesn't show up under the OS X control panel. What do I need to do to make OS X the default partition at boot up?

Currently it is booting Win 7 every time I boot the Mac.

twoodcc

May 3, 2009, 11:35 AM

My Win7 partition doesn't show up under the OS X control panel. What do I need to do to make OS X the default partition at boot up?

Currently it is booting Win 7 every time I boot the Mac.

once you're in OS X, go to system prefs, startup disk, and select your OS X partition as startup disk. then you should be good

jmpage2

May 3, 2009, 08:02 PM

once you're in OS X, go to system prefs, startup disk, and select your OS X partition as startup disk. then you should be good

Okay, I did that, hopefully it works. I don't see the Win7 Boot Camp partition listed there too, isn't it supposed to show up? I have a BOOTCAMP disk on the OS X desktop but nothing showing up for it in the system prefs.

tubbymac

May 3, 2009, 09:19 PM

Okay, I did that, hopefully it works. I don't see the Win7 Boot Camp partition listed there too, isn't it supposed to show up? I have a BOOTCAMP disk on the OS X desktop but nothing showing up for it in the system prefs.

That's an Apple bug. For some reason it doesn't show Vista or Windows 7 partitions in system preferences on OSX.

illegallydead

May 3, 2009, 09:35 PM

I use TransMac on x64 windows installs. Its not as nice as MacDrive, but it gets the job done.

K thanks I will try that out.

I was able to get Macdrive to install (off of a Mod'd copy with a scripted installer) but it either had SERIOUS driver issues and caused Win7 to not start up, or it had a virus and caused it not to start up. Well, a system restore later (which works quite nicely now, I was impressed) and I was running again, but methinks I will either try Transmac or just deal with it until the Macdrive people pull their heads out of their @$$'s and offer real 64-bit support...

jmpage2

May 3, 2009, 11:22 PM

That's an Apple bug. For some reason it doesn't show Vista or Windows 7 partitions in system preferences on OSX.

Ah, that explains it, thanks!

Stridder44

May 4, 2009, 04:32 PM

Okay, I did that, hopefully it works. I don't see the Win7 Boot Camp partition listed there too, isn't it supposed to show up? I have a BOOTCAMP disk on the OS X desktop but nothing showing up for it in the system prefs.

Yeah, I've had this bug since day of using Windows 7. Don't worry, it's not just you. I just hold "option" when starting up as a quick fix in the meantime.

For those of you running the RC (build 7100), what do you think of it stability-wise? I've been using the x64 7068 build and have found it to be pretty flawless.

jmpage2

May 4, 2009, 04:59 PM

Anyone using REFIT too boot up Win 7 and OS X? I have a buddy using it to manage booting OS X, Windows XP and Linux and he's raving about it.

aidricksdad

May 4, 2009, 05:18 PM

i just installed 7 rc x64 last night so i havent played with it much but so far it is great, very fast, i did have some trouble with drivers and such but i got it worked out, got that silly watermark off and loaded up dvdfab and empire total war and im all set to go...

twoodcc

May 4, 2009, 05:23 PM

For those of you running the RC (build 7100), what do you think of it stability-wise? I've been using the x64 7068 build and have found it to be pretty flawless.

it's running great for me, but the bootcamp drivers don't seem to work for my macbook keyboard. other than that, i really like it so far

steveza

May 5, 2009, 03:23 AM

For those of you running the RC (build 7100), what do you think of it stability-wise? I've been using the x64 7068 build and have found it to be pretty flawless.As stable as all the previous versions :) I haven't had any issues at all so far. It's quicker than the previous builds though.

runebinder

May 5, 2009, 04:16 AM

Finally, public release is out, downloading now. Very interested to see how my new MBP is going to handle this :D

Seen on the release notes that although it's valid till June 2010, it'll start shutting down every 2 hours from 1st March 2010? That's a bit sly

Tex-Twil

May 5, 2009, 04:25 AM

Hi,
when I intend to run it in a vmware on my UMBP, do I need a 32 or 64bits version ?

For those who run it in bootcamp, where do you get the bootcamp drivers from ?

Thanks,
Tex

kirreip

May 5, 2009, 04:43 AM

Anyone using REFIT too boot up Win 7 and OS X? I have a buddy using it to manage booting OS X, Windows XP and Linux and he's raving about it.

I do. But I use it to boot vista (downloading Win 7 right now because I HATE VISTA!!! How can an OS be so buggy?)
rEFIt works flawlessly and is very handy. Give it a try if you are tempted as you can allways uninstall it easally.

MagicWok

May 5, 2009, 04:57 AM

Getting the release now. First time I'm letting a microsoft OS on my new machine. To be fair, I don't need it - but I am curious so I just waited for the RC.

Don't have to wait long... 10 mins to download the ISO, hitting 7MB/s +... Great servers they're hosting it on, I must say... :D

steveza

May 5, 2009, 05:52 AM

Don't have to wait long... 10 mins to download the ISO, hitting 7MB/s +... Great servers they're hosting it on, I must say... :DYeah this week anyway - when I finally got a connection last Thursday I could only get 300K.

OZMP

May 5, 2009, 06:02 AM

steveza

May 5, 2009, 06:09 AM

Hey all
I am having issues even getting it too boot from my W7 x64 disc, comes up with "select boot mode" shows ( 1 ) and ( 2 ), cant select either with either keyboard, doesnt change regardless of where it is plugged in.

Any advice appreciated,

Cheers,I have found that burning the ISO file with Disk Utility prevents this error. Otherwise there are guides on the web for how to get around this with Nero or whatever.

PeterQC

May 5, 2009, 07:12 AM

Des anyone tryed to use for gaming? that's what I want to try, with at least Counter Strike & Oblivion to test.

steveza

May 5, 2009, 07:15 AM

Des anyone tryed to use for gaming? that's what I want to try, with at least Counter Strike & Oblivion to test.Haven't tried those yet but I've been playing COD5 this weekend without any problems.

Chupa Chupa

May 5, 2009, 07:24 AM

Hi,
when I intend to run it in a vmware on my UMBP, do I need a 32 or 64bits version ?

For those who run it in bootcamp, where do you get the bootcamp drivers from ?

Thanks,
Tex

Depends. If you have a CD Mac then 32. If you have a C2D or i7 then either, but might as well give 64 bit a try as long as the apps you'll be using have 64 bit drivers.

The VMWare Fusion blog has posted an install guide here -> http://blogs.vmware.com/teamfusion/2009/05/windows-7-on-mac-with-vmware-fusion-a-practical-guide-revisited.html

Chupa Chupa

May 5, 2009, 07:34 AM

Seen on the release notes that although it's valid till June 2010, it'll start shutting down every 2 hours from 1st March 2010? That's a bit sly

Yeah, there is a Win 7 RC thread over at Fatwallet and the fanboys are going caveman on anyone who dares bring this up. From my totally non-biased perspective -- :rolleyes: -- I think its a valid point. A machine that turns itself off every 2 hours is not real useful, and if you have unsaved work left unattended, well...

I'm not sure why M$ took that step. Seems bass ackwards and bound to piss unsuspecting users off. Just what M$ needs right now. It's an RC for freaking sake. They should just let it expire on March 1 if that's what they intend rather than playing some sort of gotcha game.

But hey, a narcoleptic PC would make for a great "I'm a Mac" ad.

fountaineer

May 5, 2009, 11:04 AM

i've installed windows 7 rc1 fine on my unibody macbook pro. installing beta 1 was super easy and all drivers installed without one hassle. with this though the bootcamp disk is stuck at "removing old realtech audio driver" it's been more than 10mins.

any suggestions? should i should cancel redo, or if anyone suggests something else?

thanks

xavious85

May 5, 2009, 11:25 AM

Am I going to have to do any voodoo magic to get the x64 version working? I remember I had a x64 copy of Vista but couldn't get it to install so I had to opt for XP. Later I read there was a way to install the x64 version of vista but it required some work that I wasn't prepared to do.

sutom

May 5, 2009, 12:24 PM

Is the process of installing the RC via Boot Camp basically the same as with the Beta(s)? Are there any clear Win7 RC x64 + BootCamp on unibody MacBook guides?

There's plenty of info in the threads on this forum but I'm still pretty confused about what drivers etc I need to install this, as I haven't bootcamped before. e.g. do I apply the Boot Camp 2.1 update in OSX or Windows? I see the LIMO patch mentioned, and apparently the nvidia drivers from Windows Update stop screen brightness from working. I know I need to use my Leopard disc for the drivers, but beyond that..... :(

Thanks for any help

war eagle

May 5, 2009, 12:41 PM

steveza

May 5, 2009, 12:52 PM

I found that the 32 bit and 64 bit versions of W7 run at about the same speed so if you only have 4GB of RAM I would advise sticking with the 32 bit install. This eliminates many of the driver/application issues with the 64 bit install. When W7 goes RTM then there may be more compatible drivers and the 64 bit will be easier to use. If you have more than 4GB RAM then it's worthwhile to try and sort these issues out.

I've been testing the XP on W7 Beta this after and it works really well if you have any apps which require XP. I takes about 5 minutes to install - basically installs itself - and MS gives you a free copy of XP too.

neiltc13

May 5, 2009, 01:49 PM

I got 32 bit installed on my MacBook and just about everything is working. However, I cannot find a way to get my Apple Wireless Keyboard to pair with the computer, it either gives an error message or it times out. There was an earlier thread here suggesting that you add the HID Bluetooth Service, but for my keyboard that menu is blank.

I've also found that I cannot eject a CD under Windows 7, no matter how I try to do it.

jellybean

May 5, 2009, 01:57 PM

Running the RC on my Macbook now. Installation went v smoothly. Windows is running very fast and snappy. I love the clean UI and new taskbar. I love how you get previews of the app's windows when hovering over the icons in the taskbar. I wish the OS X dock done that!
Personally I feel Windows 7 matches OS X in many ways, and surpasses in some areas. But OS X still has iLife which blows all the Windows Live stuff out of the water. I really hope Snow Leopard pulls ahead.

t0mat0

May 5, 2009, 02:09 PM

Quick question - I read that you need a certain CPU to get the XP VM (the hypervisor II thing) working - which, if any Mac has compatible CPUs?

steveza

May 5, 2009, 02:21 PM

Quick question - I read that you need a certain CPU to get the XP VM (the hypervisor II thing) working - which, if any Mac has compatible CPUs?I think any of the 64 bit processors have the Intel VT technology. You can run the following command in Terminal to see if your CPU supports it: sysctl -a | grep machdep.cpu.features. You are looking for VMX in the lines of output. If that is there then the processor is fine. By the way XP on W7 will run on the 32 bit version of W7 so you don't have to install the 64 bit version to get this either.

t0mat0

May 5, 2009, 02:28 PM

I think any of the 64 bit processors have the Intel VT technology. You can run the following command in Terminal to see if your CPU supports it: sysctl -a | grep machdep.cpu.features. You are looking for VMX in the lines of output. If that is there then the processor is fine. By the way XP on W7 will run on the 32 bit version of W7 so you don't have to install the 64 bit version to get this either.

Anyone had a chance to test the XP through Windows 7 from a VMWare/Parallels VM versus the WIndows 7 download version? I'm just curious what compatibility Macs are going to have with Windows 7, and whether this is going tohave an effect on those using VMWare/Parallels currently for an XP VM.

steveza

May 5, 2009, 02:34 PM

Anyone had a chance to test the XP through Windows 7 from a VMWare/Parallels VM versus the WIndows 7 download version? I'm just curious what compatibility Macs are going to have with Windows 7, and whether this is going tohave an effect on those using VMWare/Parallels currently for an XP VM.I'm pretty sure that won't work as the virtual processor presented in VMware/Parallels does not support Intel VT. I can't test this at the moment because VMware won't let me delete my old boot camp VM.

Update: It really doesn't work. As expected you get an error saying that hardware virtualisation is not available.

war eagle

May 5, 2009, 02:53 PM

Got it installed. How do I get my external HD to work via USB? It wont read.

Thunder82

May 5, 2009, 03:02 PM

I had the past Win7 Betas running on my 17" unibody MBP just fine, but I'm having some big issues with the RC7100 release. Each time I install the beta via bootcamp, my OSX partition refuses to boot. Has anyone else seen this issue? I've wiped the drive several times, reinstalling OSX followed by Win7 and I get the same result each time. The Mac partition will boot to that apple logo and sit there for all of eternity. (The Win7 Partition works flawlessly though)

I'm baffled at how this could be possible, but it is. I've reverted back to the older Win7 beta and everything is great again. Any ideas?

steveza

May 5, 2009, 03:05 PM

Got it installed. How do I get my external HD to work via USB? It wont read.Did you already disconnect it and reconnect it again? My boot camp W7 doesn't read USB disks that are connected at startup.

spencecb

May 5, 2009, 03:07 PM

Just got a new iMac yesterday, and got Windows 7 RC installed this morning. Was super easy, and it downloaded the driver for my nVidia 120 perfectly.

Interesting to point out: I have a better overall "Windows Experience" score than my partner does. And he has a quad-core AMD with a slightly better GPU than mine. It's just funny to me because he is not too fond of Apple...doesn't hate the company (has an iPhone) but doesn't like the way they do certain things.

I never thought I'd be one to install Windows on my Mac, but I honestly have to say Windows 7 doesn't seem half bad. I really only did it in order to be able to install games that aren't made for OS X, so I'm sure I won't even be using it on a day-to-day basis. But it was by far the easiest Windows install I've ever seen.

spencecb

May 5, 2009, 03:08 PM

I've also found that I cannot eject a CD under Windows 7, no matter how I try to do it.

Not even if you right-click on the CD in My Computer? That's the only way I can do it...my eject key does not function under Windows 7.

Eidorian

May 5, 2009, 03:10 PM

I'm really enjoying all the driver support out of the box. You barely have to do anything with a P45 or 760/780G board. The HD4770 is supported too.

war eagle

May 5, 2009, 03:48 PM

I ran the Western Digital Data Lifeguard and it recognizes that my drive is hooked up via USB, but it's not coming up under devices like my primary HD is. Can someone help me?

Razeus

May 5, 2009, 04:01 PM

Downloading now. I was going to put my Vista 64 bit on Boot Camp this week too. Do I have to install Windows XP on my Boot Camp first, then apply Windows 7? Or will Boot Camp let me install Windows 7 64-bit from the get go?

Eidorian

May 5, 2009, 04:02 PM

ditzy

May 5, 2009, 05:05 PM

Just downloaded win 7. At the moment I have to say I'm quite impressed. It still looks like windows, but that has never been my problem with it. But it no longer feels like windows, which kind of feels liberating. I can't say I prefer it to Leopard, but I'll no longer swear if I have to do something in windows now. The performance has improved a lot.

kirreip

May 5, 2009, 05:14 PM

Cynicalone

May 5, 2009, 05:41 PM

spencecb

May 5, 2009, 05:43 PM

war eagle

May 5, 2009, 05:53 PM

I downloaded the ISO today but can't for the life of me figure out how to make the Windows 7 Disk. :o

I tried just burning the image to disk wasn't recognized by Boot Camp Assistant. Then I tried opening the disk image and dragging the files to the disc and burning it that way. Still didn't work in Boot Camp. I feel dumb, but what do I need to do to get Boot Camp to recognize the DVD? :o

Or more specifically what do I use to make an ISO disc?

You need to burn it as an iso. What it sounds like you are doing is just dragging the iso onto a blank disc and all that does is creates a data disc with the iso on it. If you have Toast or any other burning software it is fairly simple to do.

In other news I got the external to work I had to reformat it to FAT 32.. :( lost my stuff great!

Eidorian

May 5, 2009, 05:54 PM

I do believe you have to use Disk Utility to burn the disc. Not 100% sure.That's what I did. I just dragged it into the left side panel, highlighted it, and burned it to disc.

Cynicalone

May 5, 2009, 05:55 PM

I do believe you have to use Disk Utility to burn the disc. Not 100% sure.

I'm attempting that now, thank you. Perhaps I'm not to good at these things. :o

EDIT: That did it. Thank you. :)

flopticalcube

May 5, 2009, 06:10 PM

I'm running it now in VirtualBox on my MB and I must say I am extremely impressed. It boots up quicker than Vista and running idle uses very few resources. When booting Vista (pre-sp1) my fans would spin like a wind tunnel and the temps would move into the upper 70s. Now I get mid-60s booting up and the fans are much quieter. It appears to be more responsive than Vista as well. Overall user experience is about the same. Apple needs to up their game now with SL.

war eagle

May 5, 2009, 06:12 PM

Anyone on a unibody having trouble clicking on things? Sometimes it seems as if I have to click numerous times for things to work.. Like it clicks on something then clicks right off.

Eyedn

May 5, 2009, 06:24 PM

I never thought i would say this after my Vista experiences but i am really enjoying using windows 7, the UI has a couple o flash new features i.e multiple boxes at bottom of screen (which is soo handy). I just hope they can "refine" it a bit so it would run faster.

Skyldig

May 5, 2009, 06:47 PM

Overall I'm impressed.

Still having trouble with the shortcut keys (light adjustment, sound adjustment, eject-key ect.). I hope someone finds a workaround soon, since the OSX disc doesn't work.

gigadigit

May 5, 2009, 06:49 PM

I currently have vista ultimate and leopard using bootcamp. Can I install windows 7 on another partition as tripleboot? will bootcamp let me do that?

illegallydead

May 5, 2009, 06:56 PM

I currently have vista ultimate and leopard using bootcamp. Can I install windows 7 on another partition as tripleboot? will bootcamp let me do that?

Short answer: NO.

Long answer: yes, but it takes some hacking to get it to work right.

Just upgrade from Vista. If you want to be safe, download Winclone (http://twocanoes.com/winclone/) and clone your Vista install. Then install Win7, and if something goes wrong or you don't like it (doubtful) then you can put Vista back on there easy...

illegallydead

May 5, 2009, 06:58 PM

Overall I'm impressed.

Still having trouble with the shortcut keys (light adjustment, sound adjustment, eject-key ect.). I hope someone finds a workaround soon, since the OSX disc doesn't work.

Do you have the 64-bit version? In that case you need the 64-bit drivers. You will need to get ahold of a Leopard disk from a Macbook Pro or Mac Pro.

Might not hurt to have these disks even if you have 32-bit...

Cynicalone

May 5, 2009, 07:15 PM

Got it up and running now, very fast and smooth. I must say I'm impressed so far. I'm running on the lower end of the Mac experience the 1.86GHZ C2D MacBook Air, with the SSD.

-SD-

May 5, 2009, 07:16 PM

I installed the x64 version on the Mac Pro this morning. I'm really impressed with how quickly it downloaded; Microsoft's servers were pumping away.

Everything is running perfectly fine on the Windows side without using the drivers supplied on the OS X disc. The only problem I'm getting is that XSI Mod Tool is giving me an error message about OpenCL drivers/settings. I need to spend time investigating the exact problem with this tomorrow. Other than that, Visual C# and XNA Game Studio seem to be running perfectly fine.

I did a fresh install on a brand new 500GB HDD without using Boot Camp or formatting first. This has resulted in an extra 100MB partition being created which mounts on the OS X desktop (along with Windows) called 'System Reserved'. It would appear there are ways to stop this from happening but I didn't realise this until I had installed everything. A little annoying but surely there must be a way to hide or auto-eject just this one mounted drive on boot :confused:

Overall everything seems fine and I'll spend some more time with it over the coming weeks. I need to see how well it's going to run with Parallels as I really do hate having to reboot into Windows unless I have to.

:apple:

sd2009

May 5, 2009, 07:58 PM

xavious85

May 5, 2009, 08:29 PM

So I just tried playing Portal from Steam. All it does is play the intro movie in a small window and then it quits. I'm currently update Half-Life 2 through steam so I don't know how that works but I'm assuming it will be the same result.

Anybody else try Steam on Windows 7?

kanon14

May 5, 2009, 09:36 PM

OK I successfully installed Windows 7 RC x64 on my 15" UMBP 2.53 yesterday. Everything is running smoothly and I must say it feels even "snappier" than the beta (duh), except for one thing. Heat. I think the heat is actually *worse* than it was in beta. Does anyone experience the same overheating? Is there any, ANY way we can adjust the fan speed under Windows?

elgrecomac

May 6, 2009, 12:53 AM

This tread is not intended to flame but to be as factual as I could be, given that I own about $10,000 in Apple hardware and software and only use Windows for 3 apps that are industry standards for my profession: Visio, MS Project, AutoCad.

Having used the original release of Win 7 for many months on an every day basis and having recently installed Win 7 RC, I must tell you, the boys and girls in Washington State have finally got their s*** together. This is, BY FAR, the very best OS Microsoft has ever made.

Even though I am running both the 32 and 64 bit versions under Fusion on my MBP (17", 4gb RAM, 250gb disk, 2.66Ghz cpu)

1. Performance is very good...dare I say...excellent. I would love to try this either in Boot-camp or on a Dell laptop to see how it runs natively but I'm guessing it screams.
2. Look and feel remains solid. I have not noticed any screen 'twitchiness', blinking etc.
3. As with the initial release, Microsoft apps load incredibly fast, probably because they load some of the code when the system boots, but, hey, fast is fast.
4. The initial load/start time for the OS under Fusion is about 70 seconds...too long BUT how much of that is Fusion not being optimized for Win 7? Need to wait and see what VMware has up their sleeve.
5. The time to power down the OS is 14 seconds. Very acceptable.
6. installing apps is easy and uneventful.
7. File sharing with the 'host' MBP is easy to use.
8. The basic games are now working...big deal.
9. Switching to Unity mode is fast and works great so far.
10. Switching back to native mode from unity mode is a bit twitchy...screen flickers a bit. I bet this will be addressed when VMware officially release an upgrade that supports Win 7.
11. Apple wireless keyboard and mouse required no additional attention to work...they just, well, worked.

Does Apple have cause to be concerned?
Well, maybe. This is the REAL Vista. The one they SHOULD HAVE released.

Would I switch back to a PC because of Win 7?
No. It is a very good OS but I have no compelling reason to ditch OSX.

Will this product keep Apple's market share at the lowly single digits it has wallowed in for about 3 decades?
Hmm...tough one to answer but my guess is ...yes. Corporate America will drive this in the end but if the CIOs see what I am seeing, they are probably thinking what I am thinking.

:cool:

Tex-Twil

May 6, 2009, 01:06 AM

Well I've just install it in VMware but aero doesn't look to be supported :( How are the drivers in bootcamp ?

tdgrn

May 6, 2009, 01:14 AM

It took a little bit of work, but I have everything working with my RC install, finally... HA. I think the Beta install went just a little smoother, but not much, and I haven't really had time to play with it to fully test everything out.

elgrecomac

May 6, 2009, 01:22 AM

double post...apologies.

Skyldig

May 6, 2009, 02:19 AM

Do you have the 64-bit version? In that case you need the 64-bit drivers. You will need to get ahold of a Leopard disk from a Macbook Pro or Mac Pro.

Might not hurt to have these disks even if you have 32-bit...

Well. I have my Leopard disc that came with my MBP, but it says it isn't compatible with my windows installation. It closes the program after 1 or 2 seconds.

Is there a way to install it manually? Which files in which folders on the drive installs the bootcamp menu?

OZMP

May 6, 2009, 02:43 AM

I have found that burning the ISO file with Disk Utility prevents this error. Otherwise there are guides on the web for how to get around this with Nero or whatever.

I did :(

melchior

May 6, 2009, 02:44 AM

it's nice that you went to the effort of making a list, but really, the only thing you mention of any consequence is that it's faster. which is good.

i would therefore conclude that your experience has been the same as mine, i appreciate that xp is finally going to be allowed to drift into the sunset and make using windows more productive when i need to, but it's still nothing special, except that one may say half-jokingly that it's a great accomplishment for microsoft.

windows 7, much like snow leopard, the good stuff is under the hood, except with SL there is hope, in time, with developers on board of really doing something special in making use of available resources. so it's nice, but it's not particularly exciting.

steveza

May 6, 2009, 03:00 AM

x64 Win 7 / Macbook Pro Early 2008

During the Win 7 installation it says there are some required drivers. Unfortunately I can't access them because they're on the Leopard disc and I can't eject the Win 7 disc because Mac's don't have a real eject button :rolleyes:I have the same machine but I didn't get prompted for drivers during install. I've installed both the 64bit and 32bit versions.

Well I've just install it in VMware but aero doesn't look to be supported http://images.macrumors.com/vb/images/smilies/frown.gif How are the drivers in bootcamp ?There's no aero support in VMs. Boot camp drivers are fine for 32bit, with 64bit you might need to fiddle with it to get everything working. I use MacDrive which doesn't work with 64bit W7 yet.

war eagle

May 6, 2009, 03:22 AM

I have the same machine but I didn't get prompted for drivers during install. I've installed both the 64bit and 32bit versions.

There's no aero support in VMs. Boot camp drivers are fine for 32bit, with 64bit you might need to fiddle with it to get everything working. I use MacDrive which doesn't work with 64bit W7 yet.

64 bit worked just fine with my Boot Camp drivers. If yours arent working, i've heard you can download the 64 bit Vista drivers from Apple.

steveza

May 6, 2009, 03:37 AM

64 bit worked just fine with my Boot Camp drivers. If yours arent working, i've heard you can download the 64 bit Vista drivers from Apple.Yeah the updated download worked for most things but it gave me lots of error messages. MacDrive didn't work at all so I had to go back to 32bit which worked fine. Like I said before I don't see any difference with the 64bit version speed wise so with only 4GB RAM there isn't much point in messing around with it.

war eagle

May 6, 2009, 03:51 AM

Yeah the updated download worked for most things but it gave me lots of error messages. MacDrive didn't work at all so I had to go back to 32bit which worked fine. Like I said before I don't see any difference with the 64bit version speed wise so with only 4GB RAM there isn't much point in messing around with it.

Yea, I should have went down to the 32 bit to use MacDrive instead of reformatting my external HD and losing a few Time Machine back ups. Oh well :(

Razeus

May 6, 2009, 08:06 AM

Installed the 64-bit. Works great. Leopard is much faster though. I think the Windows menus (Contorl Panel, Start Menu) are a mess and too cluttered. The only issue I had was trying to eject my CD/DVD. I got an error message. I had to go into Leopard and eject the disc from there. However, I tried another DVD and it ejected fine this morning. I have it in sleep mode (closed my Unibody Macbook Pro screen) and we'll see what happens when I open it back up. Overall, works great though and probably their best OS yet. I hope Snow Leopard is on par and surely hope they fix the dock.

Skyldig

May 6, 2009, 08:34 AM

Has anyone gotten the keyboard features (volume and backlight control, eject button ect.) to work in the 64-bit version?

gathart

May 6, 2009, 08:43 AM

Would I switch back to a PC because of Win 7?

From the discussion on this board here it seems that many like very much. Is there then any compelling reason to continue with Apple??

steveza

May 6, 2009, 09:00 AM

From the discussion on this board here it seems that many like very much. Is there then any compelling reason to continue with Apple??I can't see W7 taking many Mac customers away but it might make the choice a bit more difficult for switchers. I really like W7 and I will encourage my customers to move to it as soon as possible but I still use OS X at home and probably will do for a long time.

theITGuy

May 6, 2009, 09:01 AM

I had been running the W7 Beta...after playing with the RC last nite it does seem snappier...

Cheers.

-J.-

aidricksdad

May 6, 2009, 09:47 AM

Macmel

May 6, 2009, 10:11 AM

Just installed it yesterday on my early 2008 MBP. So far it seems faster than Leopard on the same computer. Firefox is also faster and explorer 8 is amazingly fast.
Seriously, this one is on a similar level than Leopard.

bli625

May 6, 2009, 10:44 AM

steveza

May 6, 2009, 10:54 AM

Is anyone else having difficulty downloading the Windows 7 RC1?
I keep on getting stuck on this page for long amounts of time.

<snip>

I had it up for an an hour yesterday and then I tried it for another hour. This morning, I had it up for another half hour.The page it's trying to load is the passport login page. I've just tried it and it loaded in about 10 seconds.

ilovebananas

May 6, 2009, 10:57 AM

flopticalcube

May 6, 2009, 11:03 AM

I can't see W7 taking many Mac customers away but it might make the choice a bit more difficult for switchers. I really like W7 and I will encourage my customers to move to it as soon as possible but I still use OS X at home and probably will do for a long time.
I agree. Had W7 been more Vista-like I would have probably migrated even more things that I do under Windows to OSX; as it is, its a fine replacement for XP but not for OSX, at least for me.

bli625

May 6, 2009, 11:13 AM

Use firefox not Safari.

Thanks, that solved the problem.

willybeamish

May 6, 2009, 11:49 AM

Yeah, I've had this bug since day of using Windows 7. Don't worry, it's not just you. I just hold "option" when starting up as a quick fix in the meantime.

For those of you running the RC (build 7100), what do you think of it stability-wise? I've been using the x64 7068 build and have found it to be pretty flawless.

I am having the same problem with the Boot Camp partition not showing in the Start Up Disc options in system preferences, but unfortunately I am using the Apple wireless keyboard and holding the option key down doesn't bring up the boot selection screen. Is there anything I can do ... or am I forced to use a USB keyboard for now ?

For the record I have the Wireless Keyboard and Mighty mouse paired and working in Windows 7 ( The keyboard has occasional lag from the first keystroke input but is fine from then )

xavious85

May 6, 2009, 11:55 AM

Has anyone gotten the keyboard features (volume and backlight control, eject button ect.) to work in the 64-bit version?

Yes, install the drivers from your Mac OS Disc

iSlave

May 6, 2009, 01:35 PM

I can't see W7 taking many Mac customers away but it might make the choice a bit more difficult for switchers. I really like W7 and I will encourage my customers to move to it as soon as possible but I still use OS X at home and probably will do for a long time.

It does make the reasons for staying with Apple more difficult to justify. With Apples recent price hikes (in the UK at least), prehistoric specs for the money, and forced design changes (i.e. glossy screens on EVERYTHING bar the 17'' MBP at a further surcharge), it does provide a much more attractive prospect if your not one of the more fanatical Apple followers. Simply put, the more sophisticated, fast and stable Windows gets, the less argument there is for OSX.

macfan881

May 6, 2009, 01:36 PM

im really loving Windows 7 right now and thats hard thing to say since ive been a long mac user ive used windows xp and tried vista for a week unistalled it but windows 7 is so much better faster and better looking. Now the only thing that i think may hurt 7 is the fact that it looks to much like vista and may scare away alot of customers for a while. I plan on upgrading to 7 once it comes out.

ryannazaretian

May 6, 2009, 01:38 PM

Skyldig

May 6, 2009, 02:06 PM

I'm having the same problem with ejecting disks...

I had this happen on my install disk, OSX disk, and now the Office 2007 disk.

I have this problem too. It's avtually the last one I have. Any solutions so far anyone?

ryannazaretian

May 6, 2009, 02:12 PM

I have this problem too. It's avtually the last one I have. Any solutions so far anyone?

I haven't really been looking for a solution. I'm having really high DPC latency problems that I'm trying to fix so I can at least listen to music without the pop pop pop. I've tried about everything I know of.

EDIT: I actually think it's iTunes creating the latency on its own. Really weird...

valvehead

May 6, 2009, 02:21 PM

I downloaded both 32 and 64 bit versions. I'm going to try the 64 bit first (even though I only have 2 GB RAM). I have a couple of 64 bit apps that I want to try. I'm off to find a good disk imager to take a snapshot of my XP install...

I haven't really been looking for a solution. I'm having really high DPC latency problems that I'm trying to fix so I can at least listen to music without the pop pop pop. I've tried about everything I know of.

Concerning DPC latency problems (copied from my post in another thread):

Some good information from Timur in these threads:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=614302
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=629209

More info here:
http://www.rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=11699#p11699
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/1961838-post3.html
http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

In short, the biggest offender is KBDMGR.EXE. I have two shortcuts on my desktop: one to kill the process and one to start it again. In one of the links above (I think it's on the gearslutz link), there is info on how to create a batch file to stop the keyboard manager process.

war eagle

May 6, 2009, 02:33 PM

I must say that web browsing on the Mac >>>>>>>>>>>> Windows 7. My goodness it just seemed laggy as hell compared to browsing on OS X.

Eidorian

May 6, 2009, 02:37 PM

I'm starting to understand the new taskbar and libraries a lot more easily now.

war eagle

May 6, 2009, 03:04 PM

I'm starting to understand the new taskbar and libraries a lot more easily now.

Explain it to me please. This toolbar makes it very annoying to AIM if you are clicking.

ryannazaretian

May 6, 2009, 03:08 PM

I downloaded both 32 and 64 bit versions. I'm going to try the 64 bit first (even though I only have 2 GB RAM). I have a couple of 64 bit apps that I want to try. I'm off to find a good disk imager to take a snapshot of my XP install...

Concerning DPC latency problems (copied from my post in another thread):

Some good information from Timur in these threads:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=614302
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=629209

More info here:
http://www.rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=11699#p11699
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/1961838-post3.html
http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

In short, the biggest offender is KBDMGR.EXE. I have two shortcuts on my desktop: one to kill the process and one to start it again. In one of the links above (I think it's on the gearslutz link), there is info on how to create a batch file to stop the keyboard manager process.

Yep... I've tried all of that from Timur. I'll look at the other stuff.

jav6454

May 6, 2009, 03:59 PM

Well, I have/had the Windows 7 Beta build 7000 (official from MS). So, I decided to take the plunge and delete it and install a fresh Windows 7 copy, but this time, it's the updated RC build 7100. I did fresh copy instead of upgrade to get 'better' results.

So far, only some GUI and taskbar changes that I've noticed. Snappier, perhaps.

Intuitive? Not so much, same as any Windows OS... though it's improving.

Bugs, non that I know the Beta had. Other bugs? Very likely. I did however, manage to get the BSOD on Build 7100. I had just finished installing Command and Conquers: Generals and prep'd myself to play when the BSOD popped to say hi.

Edit - By the way I put in the 64-bit flavor of Windows 7

runebinder

May 6, 2009, 04:11 PM

Installed 64 bit version, problem I had was that the Graphics driver (got from Windows Update), stopped working and had to be recovered. This happened a few times.

So installed the 32 bit version, no issues with the graphics driver this time round, however the computer keeps freezing every minute or so for about 5 minutes, so opened task manager and as valvehead mentions, KBDMGR.EXE was spiking the processor to 100% during a freeze. So killed the process and all seems ok now.

Thanks for the pointer valvehead, was well annoying.

Signal-11

May 6, 2009, 04:17 PM

Yeah, there is a Win 7 RC thread over at Fatwallet and the fanboys are going caveman on anyone who dares bring this up. From my totally non-biased perspective -- :rolleyes: -- I think its a valid point. A machine that turns itself off every 2 hours is not real useful, and if you have unsaved work left unattended, well...

I'm not sure why M$ took that step. Seems bass ackwards and bound to piss unsuspecting users off. Just what M$ needs right now. It's an RC for freaking sake. They should just let it expire on March 1 if that's what they intend rather than playing some sort of gotcha game.

But hey, a narcoleptic PC would make for a great "I'm a Mac" ad.

I think this attitude is a little short sighted. At least this way, when March 1st rolls around and you haven't had a chance to upgrade or migrate off, you have a functional system with which to do that. There would be other ways, too, but this is two month, limited functionality grace period to figure things out.

I'm skeptical about anything MS does to the point of paranoia, but the ripping MS is getting for this is completely unjustified. The only thing they could have perhaps handled better would have been to announce this beforehand, not the day of the public RC release.

Signal-11

May 6, 2009, 04:40 PM

i would therefore conclude that your experience has been the same as mine, i appreciate that xp is finally going to be allowed to drift into the sunset and make using windows more productive when i need to, but it's still nothing special, except that one may say half-jokingly that it's a great accomplishment for microsoft.

I think XP is going to take a lot longer to die than people think. There are so software ecosystems that rely on XP, from huge enterprise to specialized niches, that you still have people DEMANDING that Microsoft sell them XP licenses. It's a little crazy. XP has been around for so long, it's the only thing people know.

I really like Windows7 but I'm having some trouble adapting to it as my knowledge of XP is hurting me. I keep expecting system behavior that has changed and it feels like half the configuration stuff isn't where it's supposed to be. The new control panel, in either view, is confusing to me because I don't know exactly what I'm looking for.

I'm learning to just hit Win and type, but since I still don't know Win7 terminology, I don't know what to type yet. Very nice that you can just type out commands there though. Not sure if it's better than Win+R yet.

Other minor issues: (Esc^2 ->) Win -> U -> U/R. Ingrained way for me to either reboot or shutdown. Handy when experimenting with displays and settings or just fooling around with hardware. Can't figure out a keyboard shortcut combo on Win7 to do this. Anyone?

The Homegroup networking. Is this between Win7 boxes only? Couldn't figure it out and had to turn it off in order to get filesharing to work again.

edwardlanti

May 6, 2009, 04:59 PM

hey guys how much hours are you guys getting with windows 7? Mines is weird on my unibody MacBook... Like it would say 50% left and it will say 50 mins.. Is that normal?

NoSmokingBandit

May 6, 2009, 05:02 PM

Other minor issues: (Esc^2 ->) Win -> U -> U/R. Ingrained way for me to either reboot or shutdown. Handy when experimenting with displays and settings or just fooling around with hardware. Can't figure out a keyboard shortcut combo on Win7 to do this.

That stopped working in Vista. I liked being able to sleep my comp with just a winkey-U-S, but no more....
I think if you hit winkey-D to go to the desktop then alt-F4 it will being up the shutdown dialog box.

orb1692

May 6, 2009, 05:16 PM

chewietobbacca

May 6, 2009, 06:44 PM

Seems as though Microsoft are still wanting people to buy new Hardware just so they can run their Os again...and so it begins:
http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/4872-cd-dvd-driver-missing-install.html

So that company screwed up with the drivers for their CD/DVD driver and/or its old and/or the motherboard isn't reading the CD/DVD and suddenly it's MS's fault?

It's a pretty common issue especially if you're running an old PC made by an OEM company that hasn't pushed out driver updates, and its why this is an RC - to get the final kinks finished out.

But hey, kudos points for hating MS i guess :rolleyes:

Explain it to me please. This toolbar makes it very annoying to AIM if you are clicking.

Which part of the toolbar? It took a bit for me to get used to the whole thing in general, but I've gotten the hang of it

PeterQC

May 6, 2009, 07:31 PM

hey guys how much hours are you guys getting with windows 7? Mines is weird on my unibody MacBook... Like it would say 50% left and it will say 50 mins.. Is that normal?

You mean the battery? it's completely normal. Windows on a Mac has absolutely no power management.

Stridder44

May 6, 2009, 07:44 PM

Is anyone else having difficulty downloading the Windows 7 RC1?
I keep on getting stuck on this page for long amounts of time.
http://i40.tinypic.com/2gy66j5.png
I had it up for an an hour yesterday and then I tried it for another hour. This morning, I had it up for another half hour.

It doesn't seem to work for me in Safari (Safari 4 beta to be exact). Opened Firefox and everything worked just fine. D/l'ing at 1.17 MB/s :D

Seems as though Microsoft are still wanting people to buy new Hardware just so they can run their Os again...and so it begins:
http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/4872-cd-dvd-driver-missing-install.html

Well if this one guy is having a problem, CLEARLY everyone is having the problem. :rolleyes: Take your head of your butt.

kastenbrust

May 6, 2009, 07:51 PM

You mean the battery? it's completely normal. Windows on a Mac has absolutely no power management.

Funnily enough Windows 7 beta was amazing at conserving my Macbook Pro battery power, but now Windows 7 RC has completely lost that?

Signal-11

May 6, 2009, 08:33 PM

It doesn't seem to work for me in Safari (Safari 4 beta to be exact). Opened Firefox and everything worked just fine. D/l'ing at 1.17 MB/s :D

Yeah, doesn't run in Chrome, either.

Also, this Win7/Vista bootloader is just goofy as hell. Very inconsistent.

McShizzel

May 6, 2009, 08:35 PM

Installed it into VMware Fusion but aero is unsupported in Fusion (come on VMware give us OpenGL support).

I know it doesn't mean much but check out my amazing :eek: Windows Experience Score under Fusion.

As for the OS, it seems to be running well no problems to report.

EDIT: I'm really digging the new wallpapers, very nice.

Keleko

May 6, 2009, 08:42 PM

I took some of the wallpapers and moved them to OS X because I liked them so much.

Mhaddy

May 6, 2009, 08:48 PM

Another for Win 7 RC on Parallels on Early 2008 2.8 Mac Pro. Install was quick and easy and everything seems to be running in tip-top shape. I do notice quite a few "hangs" -- Windows Explorer in particular. I don't know if I am having device/driver/something conflicts, but aside from that, seems pretty nice.

Eidorian

May 6, 2009, 09:54 PM

I took some of the wallpapers and moved them to OS X because I liked them so much.I move my OS X wallpapers to Windows too.

tubbymac

May 6, 2009, 09:55 PM

I know it doesn't mean much but check out my amazing :eek: Windows Experience Score under Fusion.

That score made me laugh. You have the top and low end of the scale covered at the same time, hah! :D

Signal-11

May 6, 2009, 09:59 PM

I did the same. Then again I move my OS X wallpapers to Windows too.

I dunno. There's never been OS X default backgrounds that are quite so trippy as this batch that came with Win7RC.

It's almost like the boys at Redmond are actually developing taste... and style. :eek:

Eidorian

May 6, 2009, 10:00 PM

I dunno. There's never been OS X default backgrounds that are quite so trippy as this batch that came with Win7RC.

It's almost like the boys at Redmond are actually developing taste... and style. :eek:Windows 7 does seem more "fun" to use.

OS X feels very clean and surgical to me. Windows 7 seems to take a lighter note this time around.

dsnort

May 6, 2009, 10:00 PM

It's almost like the boys at Redmond are actually developing taste... and style. :eek:

Links, or it didn't happen! :D

Signal-11

May 6, 2009, 10:14 PM

Links, or it didn't happen! :D

Here you go. (http://windows7-wallpaper.com/windows-7-rc1-wallpaper.html)

tubbymac

May 6, 2009, 10:24 PM

It's almost like the boys at Redmond are actually developing taste... and style. :eek:

I wouldn't go that far :D There have always been small pockets in Microsoft with some semblance of style (like the TV Media Center team), but the overall OS still looks like some plastic toy from Fisher Price.

Eidorian

May 6, 2009, 11:26 PM

I wouldn't go that far :D There have always been small pockets in Microsoft with some semblance of style (like the TV Media Center team), but the overall OS still looks like some plastic toy from Fisher Price.What's amusing is that the original Luna them for XP was called Fisher Price. Today OS X is called Fisher Price.

Can you point out the Fisher Price in 7? I can see where the Zune/Windows Media Center team's handiwork is on layout and design. The wallpapers are a nice touch as well.

NoSmokingBandit

May 6, 2009, 11:29 PM

XP is the poster-child for Fisher Price themes. The blue matte plastic look was cool for about the 3 seconds before you discover windowblinds.

I took some of the wallpapers and moved them to OS X because I liked them so much.
The windows 7 wallpapers are the best to ever ship with an OS, imo. They are just a lot of fun to use. Sounds odd, i know....

It's almost like the boys at Redmond are actually developing taste... and style. :eek:
lol.
Windows 7 does seem more "fun" to use.

OS X feels very clean and surgical to me. Windows 7 seems to take a lighter note this time around.
Thats a good way of phrasing it. Windows 7 feels like putting on your shorts and going for a swim in the middle of the day whereas OS X feels like a guy in a tux ushering you around to the different sections of the pool.

tubbymac

May 7, 2009, 12:04 AM

Can you point out the Fisher Price in 7? I can see where the Zune/Windows Media Center team's handiwork is on layout and design. The wallpapers are a nice touch as well.

The icons are where the Fisher Price color scheme is most prevalent. There's just too many colors on the taskbar by default and no consistent design style. If I was in charge I'd get one talented artist to redo every single icon on the taskbar so that it looked like it came from one artistic style instead of getting hundreds of artists that don't seem to talk to each other.

Compare it to the OSX icons on the dock which look very well together.

Eidorian

May 7, 2009, 12:16 AM

The icons are where the Fisher Price color scheme is most prevalent. There's just too many colors on the taskbar by default and no consistent design style. If I was in charge I'd get one talented artist to redo every single icon on the taskbar so that it looked like it came from one artistic style instead of getting hundreds of artists that don't seem to talk to each other.

Compare it to the OSX icons on the dock which look very well together.I can see where Microsoft has taken its own path with its icons. This hasn't changed much since Windows 98 though. It's nothing new.

Like I said before Apple likes to use more utilitarian and surgical colors.

The Taskbar looks fine here.

macfan881

May 7, 2009, 01:30 AM

I also love the new media streamer thing in WMP i can stream my whole mediea through my router and it even reconizes my ps3 wich is pretty sweet

ditzy

May 7, 2009, 04:38 AM

Seems as though Microsoft are still wanting people to buy new Hardware just so they can run their Os again...and so it begins:
http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/4872-cd-dvd-driver-missing-install.html

That's just inaccurate, any machine that runs Vista will run window 7, and probably better than it ran vista.
I have no problem with critiquing windows, but if the criticism is unfair, it's unfair.

ditzy

May 7, 2009, 04:48 AM

I can see where Microsoft has taken its own path with its icons. This hasn't changed much since Windows 98 though. It's nothing new.

Like I said before Apple likes to use more utilitarian and surgical colors.

The Taskbar looks fine here.

The task bar is an improvement over Vista. Much easier to use and I like the transparency. But I don't think it's as elegant as Leopard. Windows 7 more goofy in a good way. -Well I know what I mean any way.

dsnort

May 7, 2009, 05:34 AM

Here you go. (http://windows7-wallpaper.com/windows-7-rc1-wallpaper.html)

Thanks, those do look cool, but I was really just making a joke about Redmond developing "style". It was pretty poor attempt on my part....

Signal-11

May 7, 2009, 05:42 AM

Thanks, those do look cool, but I was really just making a joke about Redmond developing "style". It was pretty poor attempt on my part....

:( Sorry I didn't get the joke. I'm a little drugged up.

And I said almost! It's almost like they're developing a sense of style.

andrew upstairs

May 7, 2009, 05:51 AM

Been using the RC for a couple of days now. Not bad. No problems here (unibody Pro 2.66, running 64-bit version).

My only issue is learning how to not use touch-click. It took me a while to realize how to right-click too.

steveza

May 7, 2009, 06:40 AM

My only issue is learning how to not use touch-click. It took me a while to realize how to right-click too.Yup it would be wonderful if Apple finally released drivers for this.

Along a similar line my keyboard backlight is now permanently on and as I'm in a bright room the keys to turn it down/off are disabled. Doesn't really bother me, just strange that it started today.

war eagle

May 7, 2009, 08:39 AM

Got my first freeze last night. Pissed me off argh! First time my Unibody every froze and it just had to be windows lol..

I still like it though. The torrent downloads are grrreat!

RedRaven571

May 7, 2009, 08:40 AM

A quick question (without reading all 8 pages of this thread); has anyone run W7 via Fusion?

Thanks!

steveza

May 7, 2009, 09:06 AM

A quick question (without reading all 8 pages of this thread); has anyone run W7 via Fusion?

Thanks!Yes.

elgrecomac

May 7, 2009, 09:15 AM

A quick question (without reading all 8 pages of this thread); has anyone run W7 via Fusion?

Thanks!

here is what I had to say about running under Fusion:
This tread is not intended to flame but to be as factual as I could be, given that I own about $10,000 in Apple hardware and software and only use Windows for 3 apps that are industry standards for my profession: Visio, MS Project, AutoCad.

Having used the original release of Win 7 for many months on an every day basis and having recently installed Win 7 RC, I must tell you, the boys and girls in Washington State have finally got their s*** together. This is, BY FAR, the very best OS Microsoft has ever made.

Even though I am running both the 32 and 64 bit versions under Fusion on my MBP (17", 4gb RAM, 250gb disk, 2.66Ghz cpu)

1. Performance is very good...dare I say...excellent. I would love to try this either in Boot-camp or on a Dell laptop to see how it runs natively but I'm guessing it screams.
2. Look and feel remains solid. I have not noticed any screen 'twitchiness', blinking etc.
3. As with the initial release, Microsoft apps load incredibly fast, probably because they load some of the code when the system boots, but, hey, fast is fast.
4. The initial load/start time for the OS under Fusion is about 70 seconds...too long BUT how much of that is Fusion not being optimized for Win 7? Need to wait and see what VMware has up their sleeve.
5. The time to power down the OS is 14 seconds. Very acceptable.
6. installing apps is easy and uneventful.
7. File sharing with the 'host' MBP is easy to use.
8. The basic games are now working...big deal.
9. Switching to Unity mode is fast and works great so far.
10. Switching back to native mode from unity mode is a bit twitchy...screen flickers a bit. I bet this will be addressed when VMware officially release an upgrade that supports Win 7.
11. Apple wireless keyboard and mouse required no additional attention to work...they just, well, worked.

Does Apple have cause to be concerned?
Well, maybe. This is the REAL Vista. The one they SHOULD HAVE released.

Would I switch back to a PC because of Win 7?
No. It is a very good OS but I have no compelling reason to ditch OSX.

Will this product keep Apple's market share at the lowly single digits it has wallowed in for about 3 decades?
Hmm...tough one to answer but my guess is ...yes. Corporate America will drive this in the end but if the CIOs see what I am seeing, they are probably thinking what I am thinking.

NoSmokingBandit

May 7, 2009, 09:49 AM

Would I switch back to a PC because of Win 7?
No. It is a very good OS but I have no compelling reason to ditch OSX.

Most people will continue to use osx just because they have a mac, even if W7 is better for them anyway. Why spend $2000 on a laptop if you are going to run an OS that works perfect on a $700 laptop, right? Apple wont lose their marketshare simply because people need a reason to keep that expensive mac they bought.

steveza

May 7, 2009, 10:16 AM

Most people will continue to use osx just because they have a mac, even if W7 is better for them anyway. Why spend $2000 on a laptop if you are going to run an OS that works perfect on a $700 laptop, right? Apple wont lose their marketshare simply because people need a reason to keep that expensive mac they bought.Indeed the main threat here comes from people who are thinking of switching and people buying their own machine for the first time.

war eagle

May 7, 2009, 10:39 AM

Indeed the main threat here comes from people who are thinking of switching and people buying their own machine for the first time.

Why? What wil make it so different that the average user will pass on switching to OS X for it? I don't think very many people who didn't really keep up in the computing world even knew Vista sucked the way that it did and visually this isn't much of a difference from Vista so how will they distinguish?

steveza

May 7, 2009, 10:50 AM

Why? What wil make it so different that the average user will pass on switching to OS X for it? I don't think very many people who didn't really keep up in the computing world even knew Vista sucked the way that it did and visually this isn't much of a difference from Vista so how will they distinguish?It will come down to people actually using it and what they read in the press/online or hear from friends. It's all about perception - someone using XP who thinks Vista is horrible only has one other practical option so they will be inclined to investigate OS X. Now that W7 will have the perception of being a really good OS the average user would probably stick with Windows.

RedRaven571

May 7, 2009, 01:53 PM

here is what I had to say about running under Fusion:

Even though I am running both the 32 and 64 bit versions under Fusion on my MBP (17", 4gb RAM, 250gb disk, 2.66Ghz cpu)

I apologize, I am getting senile; I actually read your whole review (and was impressed enough that I created a new 40GB partition on my dual booting XP/Vista HP laptop and installed 7 today) but neglected to notice that you were running it in Fusion.

Thanks for posting; I think I will give it a try on my iMac!!

runebinder

May 7, 2009, 06:01 PM

Anyone else having issues with sound on Windows 7 32 Bit when playing games on MBP?

Music plays fine with no issues, however when playing games (tested UT3 and Grid so far), the sound cuts out after a minute or 2 and then doesn't restart till game is closed and reopened, then same thing happens.

Tried using Windows Updater through device Manager but says the realtek High Definition Audio is up to date. Had a look on the Realtek Website and found a driver dated 20/04/09 (the one in DM was January), R2.22 so downloading that atm and will see if that fixes it.

Any MBP users with 64 Bit had any issues with games? Wondering whether to give it a try again.

flopticalcube

May 7, 2009, 06:05 PM

Two finger trackpad right-click doesn't seem to be working in bootcamp. From what I have been experiencing, most of the problems are stemming from Apple's Vista drivers.

chris200x9

May 7, 2009, 06:18 PM

I really like it, though I'm kinda getting bored with it...linux has spoiled me...I seriously am freaking out over no terminal or repository :eek:

Andrmgic

May 7, 2009, 06:24 PM

I really like it, though I'm kinda getting bored with it...linux has spoiled me...I seriously am freaking out over no terminal or repository :eek:

Play with powershell it is more terminal-esque than the usual dosbox.

Cyberius

May 7, 2009, 07:08 PM

I can see where Microsoft has taken its own path with its icons. This hasn't changed much since Windows 98 though. It's nothing new.

Like I said before Apple likes to use more utilitarian and surgical colors.

The Taskbar looks fine here.

How did you get the Games Explorer pinned to the Taskbar? Does it have it's own jumplist?

pdxflint

May 7, 2009, 07:27 PM

mhnajjar

May 7, 2009, 07:40 PM

For some reason, the entire upper row of shortkeys stopped working on my MBA revB (brightness, volume).

I am also getting some driver issues in the device manager with coprocessor :rolleyes:

The secondary click wasn't working earlier, but it did after I restarting the machine.

Any idea when Apple is going to update these drivers?

Everything is working fine on my 3.06 iMac if I recall correctly!

mhnajjar

May 7, 2009, 08:51 PM

I just reinstalled the drivers and everything is working like a charm besides that coprocessor which would require an update .. but I won't bother trying to fix it since I am just testing this RC.

Signal-11

May 7, 2009, 09:03 PM

I've installed it on my MBP 2.2 via Virtual Box. Nice that the two-finger right-click seems to work normally... but, sorry to say, I'm really not excited about Win7. On one hand, it still feels very Windows-esque, only it's visually much more slick. Yet, again like when I first tried XP after some time on Win2k, things are just not where you'd expect them - it doesn't feel intuitive to me, and I see lots of things that just seem like Johnnie-come-lately copies of long-term existing OS X ideas. I would have liked to have seen some actual new ideas, but the whole thing still seems tied to the old legacy Windows 'style' down to the slightly jittery cursor arrow. Still feels like an old Cadillac with all the electric options and pretty sheet metal covering up old wiring and yesterday's technology. It's just an impression. The whole thing still feels dated and old, with a new coat of paint. Other than cheaper hardware in some cases, I still think I'd have to recommend Mac to my friends... the Mac interface is just more 'connected' and feels more natural. It's a hard thing to really explain, but once you've been on it for awhile, and all the little things you don't really think about become part of the way you work, it makes Windows, even Win7 feel frustrating to use.

It's just my $0.02. It's nice to know it's an improvement, but it's nowhere near any kind of reason to switch from Mac back to Windows in my book.

I'll keep trying it out with some legacy Windows software I've got and see how it settles in.

BTW: I don't get what all the fuss over wallpaper is. I certainly tend to use my own digital shots a lot, but lordy, there's a lot of stuff out there on the web for the asking, or the taking. Who limits themselves to the wallpaper/jpgs that come stock with an OS anyway? They're cool for the first week or so... but they're the first thing I usually get rid of...:)

Do you really think it's fair to speak to responsiveness and user interface issues running in VirtualBox?

I read your impressions and my feeling on this is that you went into this with your opinions already formed. That's okay if that's your thing, but then let's not pretend that you're really giving another OS a fair shake.

What aspects do you feel are cheaper imitations? Some people get this sense because they don't understand that even though windowing interfaces can be similiar in appearance, their underlying interaction and manipulation paradigm can be extremely different. If you understand the way the OS handles objects and the reasoning behind the way it was designed, you can adapt yourself to be more efficient in your interactions with it. This isn't to say that there aren't inconsistencies in any interface. Just that this is the first reaction of anyone who spends time only in one OS.

Long time Windows users will often say the same things you said. I'm willing to be your first reaction to the people who tell you things are unintuitive is that they're probably not making much of an effort. Are you making that an effort? Or are you being lazy and dismissive?

The fuss about the default wallpaper is that it's the default wallpaper.

dsnort

May 7, 2009, 09:09 PM

Do you really think it's fair to speak to responsiveness and user interface issues running in VirtualBox?

I may have missed something, but I don't see anything in his post that speaks to responsiveness. And does the user interface somehow change when NOT running in Virtual Box?

This has been my biggest question about Windows 7. I had a few stability issues with XP, but really, not that many crashes. It was plenty fast on good equipment. What I disliked most about XP, and Vista, is how clutzy and cludgy it is to work with, a real "reach around your right butt cheek to scratch your left ear" kind of thing.

Has that improved?

flopticalcube

May 7, 2009, 10:16 PM

One thing that's really nice to see is the near silent updates that go one in the background. I've had a few already in only two days. Furthermore, most of my XP and Vista-based programs and drivers appear to be working.

Digital Skunk

May 8, 2009, 12:23 AM

I am drooling to put this on my future Mac Pro and HP netbook.

I love software that runs like a dream... and I've been hearing a lot of Pros and reading a lot of good things about Win 7.

I'll keep reading this thread to learn more.

klas

May 8, 2009, 12:34 AM

I can't seem to find the answer to my question. I am just curious if Mini DP -> HDMI will carry audio in Windows 7 when using with mini. I know it's not implemented in OSX.

Signal-11

May 8, 2009, 12:51 AM

I may have missed something, but I don't see anything in his post that speaks to responsiveness. And does the user interface somehow change when NOT running in Virtual Box?

This has been my biggest question about Windows 7. I had a few stability issues with XP, but really, not that many crashes. It was plenty fast on good equipment. What I disliked most about XP, and Vista, is how clutzy and cludgy it is to work with, a real "reach around your right butt cheek to scratch your left ear" kind of thing.

Has that improved?

Yeah, I read "jittery mouse" and in skimming instead of reading, I mashed up pdxflint there with the typical fanboy. My bad.

I'm having a rough time doing certain things, particularly accessing configuration options. Until recently, I wasn't sure if this was my unfamiliarity with the system or if it was bad design. I'm starting to believe its the latter.

Still, the interface itself is a huge improvement over XP.

wesrk

May 8, 2009, 01:54 AM

AARRGGggg!! I wanted to try it, since I only use XP, but my optical drive issue is back and can't even burn the image.

illegallydead

May 8, 2009, 02:31 AM

AARRGGggg!! I wanted to try it, since I only use XP, but my optical drive issue is back and can't even burn the image.

You may consider attempting to get it to boot from a USB drive... Something worth looking in to if you really want to try this out... I know it's a headache to get to work, but still. If all else fails, just get an external drive. My superdrive started acting up and my new USB disk drive positively SCREAMS burning disks compared to any notebook-grade slot-loading crap out there ;)

I can't seem to find the answer to my question. I am just curious if Mini DP -> HDMI will carry audio in Windows 7 when using with mini. I know it's not implemented in OSX.

I think this is a hardware issue, not necessarily software. The question is if Apple built in an audio connection between the sound card and the video card. I would assume not, however; after all, if they were to go to the trouble of linking these components it would seem silly not to support the audio part of the connection in OSX...
I don't have a UniBook though (and am too lazy to look it up), so I cannot comment on if there is any way to make this work

wesrk

May 8, 2009, 02:52 AM

You may consider attempting to get it to boot from a USB drive... Something worth looking in to if you really want to try this out... I know it's a headache to get to work, but still. If all else fails, just get an external drive. My superdrive started acting up and my new USB disk drive positively SCREAMS burning disks compared to any notebook-grade slot-loading crap out there ;)

I might just go ahead and to that. I'm thinking of replacing the optical drive with a second hard drive. I just wanted to burn the disc to do it in a more proper way via bootcamp, but I'm just going to google this and see how to install it from a USB.
Not only for testing win 7, but also to install XP before/after/instead of, since I need a few apps that only run under windows.

PS. I read somewhere in this board but can't find the thread right now, that you can just extract the image into a new partition and just boot from it... is that possible? just asking.

ditzy

May 8, 2009, 07:37 AM

Do you really think it's fair to speak to responsiveness and user interface issues running in VirtualBox?

Long time Windows users will often say the same things you said. I'm willing to be your first reaction to the people who tell you things are unintuitive is that they're probably not making much of an effort. Are you making that an effort? Or are you being lazy and dismissive?

I start this stating that I like win 7, not as much as OSX, but believe it to be a huge improvement on Vista.
I think your Virtual Box statement is fair play. I think you have to be running an OS natively to get the best out of it, if you not you should be aware that you are running a crippled version of it.
But your point about intuitiveness isn't right. If something is intuitive it doesn't take effort. If you have to put a lot of effort into learning how to do it, it isn't intuitive.

Andrmgic

May 8, 2009, 09:00 AM

Imho, the reason that virtualbox (and parallels and vmware) impressions should be taken with a grain of salt is because this time around, aero actually changes the user experience rather than just glossing things up.

Desktop preview, mouse over preview, the ability to adjust the transparency of the windows and the taskbar, etc. all depend on the ability to run aero, which isn't currently possible in a virtualized environment.

That said, it should give you some idea of performance, but you won't get the whole picture without a native install :cool:

One of the big things they've done this time around is drastically reduce the memory footprint required by the aero interface, so it is kind of a shame not to have it on :D

Here's my win 7 desktop:
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2199/desktopoii.jpg

I just did a url link since this forum doesn't auto-thumbnail.

illegallydead

May 8, 2009, 11:35 AM

PS. I read somewhere in this board but can't find the thread right now, that you can just extract the image into a new partition and just boot from it... is that possible? just asking.

Not sure. I have not heard of that being done, but I don't see why it wouldn't work... You might have to fight with the disk in Disk Utility to get that space back when you are done, however...

Signal-11

May 8, 2009, 12:03 PM

I start this stating that I like win 7, not as much as OSX, but believe it to be a huge improvement on Vista.
I think your Virtual Box statement is fair play. I think you have to be running an OS natively to get the best out of it, if you not you should be aware that you are running a crippled version of it.
But your point about intuitiveness isn't right. If something is intuitive it doesn't take effort. If you have to put a lot of effort into learning how to do it, it isn't intuitive.

No, I don't think the responsiveness thing was fair because I was confusing you for someone else and directed an attitude at you that shouldn't have been. By the way, I'm sorry about that.

I do think the intuitiveness thing IS fair. When I first started using OS X, it took me a long time to figure out how to do quite a few basic things. From anchored shift selection to keyboard opening files in Finder, there are LOT of things that OS X just does differently that are not expected, predictable behaviors, despite the insistence of many that this is the way that things are meant to be. Eventually, I learned them, but it's not because they were more intuitive, it's because I had more of an open mind and willingness to learn. There's a lot of Windows fans who will complain and never internalize and adapt to another way of doing things.

runebinder

May 8, 2009, 05:54 PM

Unfortunately I've found 7 too flakey games wise, sound cuts out completely, games freeze up. Have ended kbmgr process, updated drivers for graphics and sound and disabled wireless, still no joy. UT3 and Grid are still problematic.

So have gone to Win XP SP3 and the games run fine in there with no glitches.

The only reason I want to run Windows on the MBP is because of gaming, figure for everything else I want to use Leopard as I'm learning the O/S and main reason for having bought an MBP. Still got 7 on my PC though

NoSmokingBandit

May 8, 2009, 06:03 PM

Thats ood. I've been using my Win 7 (7000 build) partition to game on and it has been perfect. Crysis, Mirrors Edge, COD4 all work great.

flopticalcube

May 8, 2009, 10:29 PM

2 finger right click is working now but I haven't been able to get n wifi going, only g.

runebinder

May 9, 2009, 12:36 AM

Thats ood. I've been using my Win 7 (7000 build) partition to game on and it has been perfect. Crysis, Mirrors Edge, COD4 all work great.

Strange. Are you uisng 32 or 64 bit? Also what hardware are you running it on?

Tuneboy

May 9, 2009, 10:11 AM

2 finger right click is working now but I haven't been able to get n wifi going, only g.

How have you made 2-finger click work? With me it is not even an option in the Boot Camp configuration anymore, if I had known this, I would have stayed with the 7000 just a bit longer before going to 7100.

Adjusting screen brightness is also not possible anymore but i believe this has somtething to do with my Nvidia drivers, no?

NoSmokingBandit

May 9, 2009, 11:07 AM

Strange. Are you uisng 32 or 64 bit? Also what hardware are you running it on?

I was using the x64 flavor. My rig:
Gigabyte ga-p35-ds3l mobo
E6750 2.66ghz Core2duo
xfx 8600gt 128mb (yes, it sucks for gaming)
4gb OCZ Reaper ram

I was using the onboard ALC888 audio too.

The best thing about installing 7 on this machine is that i didnt have to hunt for a single driver, everything worked perfectly after installing and updating once.

Signal-11

May 9, 2009, 11:34 AM

Anyone else having DHCP issues on Ethernet? Thing keeps dropping out randomly. Wrestled with it for hours until I just got sick of it and assigned a manual IP. Would prefer DHCP. No problems on the earlier builds, just 7100.

bindigok

May 9, 2009, 11:45 AM

I quickly scrolled through to see if anyone had fixed the no-sound issue. I am running Windows 7 through Parallels, but today when I ran Windows update it fixed the sound. I now have sound on Windows 7 when running it through Parallels (oh and I'm running the 64 bit version).

So far it is much better than XP or Vista, but still I hardly ever use it. Mac OS has almost everything I need - I only need Windows when I need to convert something for work like a microscope image.

flopticalcube

May 9, 2009, 12:00 PM

How have you made 2-finger click work? With me it is not even an option in the Boot Camp configuration anymore, if I had known this, I would have stayed with the 7000 just a bit longer before going to 7100.

Adjusting screen brightness is also not possible anymore but i believe this has somtething to do with my Nvidia drivers, no?
It just started working for me after the last MS update. I noticed that the trackpad is not the BC panel either.

cleanup

May 9, 2009, 02:46 PM

For all those who have issues/problems with burning a DVD or booting, use the better option:

Download a disk image mounter. Google "DAEMON Tools Lite."

Ta-da. Honestly, optical media is so yesterday!

Anyways, I'm LOVING Windows 7. It makes my PC oodles faster. You wouldn't know this thing is actually just a 2.2 Core Duo (notice the lack of '2') running at 2.6, with only 2 gigs of ValueRAM. It blazes through things. My friend's netbook runs it like a dream, with superfluous visual effects and window transparency and all. It runs faster on my MacBook than Leopard does.

Honestly, it's hard to keep loving Mac OS X so much when Windows 7 is this good. It's still Windows-ey, which may be a turn-off for some, but as long as you know your way around Windows, 7 is a godsend. It's a big operating system, for sure (in terms of HDD size), but it's blazing fast. And it multitasks brilliantly. XP always seemed to lag whenever you tried to do more than one thing at once. Vista was a bit better but in general, Vista was slow as molasses. Windows 7 so far has done everything better than XP or Leopard, that I've seen. For those who don't need the fancy-pants-ooh-look-a-time-machine features of Leopard, 7 is a much more viable solution, IMHO. And it was nice of Microsoft to offer it free and with updates until way after the official release date. I'll be picking up the retail version for sure.

Tuneboy

May 10, 2009, 01:29 AM

It just started working for me after the last MS update. I noticed that the trackpad is not the BC panel either.

I did all Updates, but still, no 2-finger rightclick, and still, no way of adjusting the backlight brightness... This way it's really not nice to work with this way (getting blind from the very bright LED backlight, not being able to right-click anything...)

runebinder

May 10, 2009, 03:07 AM

I did all Updates, but still, no 2-finger rightclick, and still, no way of adjusting the backlight brightness... This way it's really not nice to work with this way (getting blind from the very bright LED backlight, not being able to right-click anything...)

Weird, I had no issues with the tap to click and 2 finger tap to right click in 7, and had the option to set it in bootcamp control panel.

Did you install directly via the disk? If so try http://www.speedyshare.com/404462147.html, copy the bootcamp folder from the disk to the desktop, replace the bootcamp and bootcamp64 msi's from the download in the link and then run the set up file, worked perfectly for me

apfhex

May 10, 2009, 03:56 AM

After seeing a friend gush over how much they like Win 7 I decided to try out the RC on my MP. I gotta say that for Windows, they've actually done a good job. Suspiring number of little things they got right (of course still some big things they got wrong...again). It's quite fast and I do like the new Dock...er, taskbar :p :D because it IS more like OS X's Dock. Thing is, a lot of the new/improved features ARE things OS X has had for a long time now. I'm not complaining, they were right to do it, but they're still playing catch-up IMO.

Because I've had the "Select CD ROM boot type" problem with past Vista/Win7 ISOs, I used the Imgburn instructions from Jowie (http://jowie.com/blog/post/2008/02/24/Select-CD-ROM-Boot-Type-prompt-while-trying-to-boot-from-Vista-x64-DVD-burnt-from-iso-file.aspx) (wasn't necessary to create a separate ISO or disc first, just mounted the ISO with Virtual Clone Drive and burned it with modifications to a DVD+RW). Also I removed my other hard drives before installing because at least with Vista x64, it was UNABLE to be installed with all 3 hard drives in the machine, even though it recognized them all. :rolleyes: Don't ask me why. Anyway, I like to play it safe anyway and protect the rest of my data. I installed on the other half of the drive with my Boot Camp partition. Triple booting works fine (when I select Windows, it gives the option of Win7 or "Old version of Windows"). The partition doesn't show on my OS X desktop though.

Didn't have any problem installing Bootcamp drivers (2.0.1 for Vista x64 from a 2008 MP disc -> 2.1 from Apple.com) and they're all working, but I immediately went and updated to the latest Nvidia Geforce drivers and after some serious searching found the latest Realtek audio drivers (their own website doesn't actually work, not even in IE).

I copied over my Steam games (which took a REALLY long time considering it was from the other partition of the same drive - seriously, Windows is bad at file copy operations!) and got Fallout 3 running but the audio was all out of whack. Didn't have time to test out anything else. The only DX10 game I have is Far Cry 2 so when I get around to playing that I'll see if it works in Win7, otherwise I'm sticking to XP to avoid any other issues.

steveza

May 10, 2009, 05:42 AM

I did all Updates, but still, no 2-finger rightclick, and still, no way of adjusting the backlight brightness... This way it's really not nice to work with this way (getting blind from the very bright LED backlight, not being able to right-click anything...)You need to have completely and succesfully installed the boot camp software to enable these features. If this is seriously bugging you, use the 32bit version of W7 instead.

Edit: or try what runebinder said (http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=7592846&postcount=225) :)

Tex-Twil

May 10, 2009, 10:40 AM

So what's the status with the bootcamp drivers for Win 7 ?

Tex

ryannazaretian

May 10, 2009, 01:13 PM

So what's the status with the bootcamp drivers for Win 7 ?

Tex

I have everything fully working. It took some time to get it that way, but it's 100% working correctly. I even got the trackpad update to work, which didn't work in XP or Vista and caused me a lot of headache...

So far, I feel like I want to buy Windows 7 when it comes out.

Stridder44

May 10, 2009, 03:12 PM

So what's the status with the bootcamp drivers for Win 7 ?

Tex

Pretty much the same as it is in Vista; they work alright but they could work a lot better.

I'm sure with Snow Leopard (and hopefully Boot Camp 3.0) we'll see some big improvements and a lot of updated drivers for both 32 and 64-bit.

flopticalcube

May 10, 2009, 03:15 PM

Pretty much the same as it is in Vista; they work alright but they could work a lot better.

I'm sure with Snow Leopard (and hopefully Boot Camp 3.0) we'll see some big improvements and a lot of updated drivers for both 32 and 64-bit.
While I agree, I don't see why we have to wait for (and purchase) a new OS just to have the drivers upgraded. If its an advertised feature (and it is) which is not working properly (and it isn't), then Apple should fix it and give us an update.

Stridder44

May 10, 2009, 04:08 PM

While I agree, I don't see why we have to wait for (and purchase) a new OS just to have the drivers upgraded. If its an advertised feature (and it is) which is not working properly (and it isn't), then Apple should fix it and give us an update.

In an ideal world, yes. But unfortunately, I think if Apple was being supportive of Boot Camp at all they would have offered another update for it by now. :p Trust me, I wish they would.

ryannazaretian

May 10, 2009, 05:48 PM

In an ideal world, yes. But unfortunately, I think if Apple was being supportive of Boot Camp at all they would have offered another update for it by now. :p Trust me, I wish they would.

This is against the forum rules, but I must say it...

+1

They could have and should have released about 10 updates by now.

AuNate

May 11, 2009, 12:40 PM

Are you guys still seeing heat problems with 7 in bootcamp? How much battery life are unibody MBs getting in 7?

pdxflint

May 11, 2009, 01:44 PM

If I wanted to actually install Win7 via bootcamp, can I get some recommendations for partition size, and what drivers everyone thinks are necessary to run on a MBP.

I'm now using it with VirtualBox, which works pretty well, actually - including two-finger clicks, etc., and it is convenient to have the virtual machine 'configuration' running Win7, due to not having to deal with the drivers, etc. But I'd like to try in on the 'bare metal' to see how it feels in comparison. An earlier poster said virtualization didn't support Aero. What functionality is that, and how would I notice, because my install seems to look like everyone elses graphically, even in VirtualBox? If it's just visual, do we really need it? I've used Win2k for years, and XP for a couple... but this is a bit confusing to someone who's been away from Windows for a couple of years..

Also, for those of you saying you'll buy Win7 when it goes retail, which version are you talking about. Isn't Win7RC the 'ultimate' version, which would be somewhere around $300? How much will you lose dropping down to the $100-150 version. Isn't the basic version going to only support three running apps at a time? Is MS going to make huge disclaimers on all PCs running this version so consumers will know it's been crippled? What would be the version for serious personal usage? (not corporate network admin controlled)

pdxflint

May 11, 2009, 01:56 PM

This is against the forum rules, but I must say it...

+1

They could have and should have released about 10 updates by now.

I'm not sure why Apple has to be constantly updating Bootcamp to support Windows changes, especially betas. As long as Bootcamp does what it's supposed to do, and creates a Windows bootable partition on your Mac, isn't it doing what it's supposed to? Is it possible to now install Win7 on a Mac even without bootcamp? - something I thought I read recently...I can't remember where I saw it. I didn't know Apple 'officially' was supporting Windows. Who you gonna call when you have a problem with Windows on Mac? Apple, or Microsoft? Or some other third party? It's one reason I'm pretty happy with Mac in general - the ecosystem is closed, but it's harder for support folks to pass the buck, and point the finger... oh well, I'm now off-topic - sorry.

Signal-11

May 11, 2009, 02:08 PM

An earlier poster said virtualization didn't support Aero. What functionality is that, and how would I notice, because my install seems to look like everyone elses graphically, even in VirtualBox? If it's just visual, do we really need it? I've used Win2k for years, and XP for a couple... but this is a bit confusing to someone who's been away from Windows for a couple of years..

I missed the Vista boat, so I guess that puts you and me on the same boat in terms of the "newness" of Win7. Aero adds a LOT to the interface. On an old Pentium M 1.6 with no Aero, Win7 definitely has a Fisher Price feel. On my desktop, it works.

Also, for those of you saying you'll buy Win7 when it goes retail, which version are you talking about. Isn't Win7RC the 'ultimate' version, which would be somewhere around $300? How much will you lose dropping down to the $100-150 version. Isn't the basic version going to only support three running apps at a time? Is MS going to make huge disclaimers on all PCs running this version so consumers will know it's been crippled? What would be the version for serious personal usage? (not corporate network admin controlled)

The 3 app Windows Starter version will not even be available to the general public. Put it this way, Windows Starter is one step below Windows Home Basic, which as an American, you STILL won't be able to buy because it's marketed towards developing economies.

I don't expect that Win7 Ultra OEM will cost any more than Vista Ultra OE, which will run you $180 on Newegg. If MS prices the OEM versions anything like Vista, ~100USD will get the everything you need. From reading all the stuff about the versions, I still haven't figured out what the real difference is between Ultra and Pro.

Tex-Twil

May 11, 2009, 02:59 PM

I have everything fully working. It took some time to get it that way, but it's 100% working correctly. I even got the trackpad update to work, which didn't work in XP or Vista and caused me a lot of headache...

So far, I feel like I want to buy Windows 7 when it comes out.
ok so I"ve just installed the 64bits Win 7 on my UMBP. most of the drivers seems to work ok execpt the secondary click on the trackpad + the eject button on the keyboard. Any hints how to fix this ?

ryannazaretian

May 11, 2009, 03:11 PM

I'm not sure why Apple has to be constantly updating Bootcamp to support Windows changes, especially betas. As long as Bootcamp does what it's supposed to do, and creates a Windows bootable partition on your Mac, isn't it doing what it's supposed to? Is it possible to now install Win7 on a Mac even without bootcamp? - something I thought I read recently...I can't remember where I saw it. I didn't know Apple 'officially' was supporting Windows. Who you gonna call when you have a problem with Windows on Mac? Apple, or Microsoft? Or some other third party? It's one reason I'm pretty happy with Mac in general - the ecosystem is closed, but it's harder for support folks to pass the buck, and point the finger... oh well, I'm now off-topic - sorry.

My main beef is the driver support Apple gives for it's products under Windows. Sure they say to contact Microsoft if you're having a problem with your computer, but guess what, Microsoft doesn't make the drivers for the trackpad, keyboard, the chipset, or anything for that matter. When Apple goes the custom route for it's hardware, it needs to fully back it all up. The chipset has flaky support from nVidia. Almost everyone here will back me up in saying that the trackpad driver under Windows is unreliable, inconsistent, and hard to use. The keyboard is another issue that I have had some problems with. The Boot Camp manager has bad DPC latency issues, so if you were to do any audio work under Windows, then you would have to messed with kbdmgr.exe, the Boot Camp control panel. If you end this process, then it makes all the F keys unusable for changing brightness, ejecting, etc... Apple could easily release a good update and would stop all the fussing and fighting I have with Apple's support of Boot Camp, but instead, they release trackpad drivers like they did in December that completely killed trackpad use in Windows and I had to roll back the driver. I've called Apple many times over this and it's a known issue according to Apple Care, but where's the new update? We've gone almost 5 months without an update to the trackpad, and I was still stuck with the driver released on the Boot Camp disk back in October. You know the one right? Two finger click required 3 fingers, cannot select text at all, dragging was impossible, just numerous trackpad problems that would have been fixed within a few days by any other computer manufacturer, but with Apple, you just expect it to take a few months, maybe years, before you see a full performance and well working driver for Boot Camp.

I did however fix the trackpad problem in Windows, mostly... I think the EFI partition had some crap in it that didn't work well with the trackpad in Windows. But still, if this was the issue, then why didn't Apple tell me? Why am I forced to do everything possible to fix this obvious Apple problem on my own? Why can't the dang manufacturer of this laptop support their own product that they advertise can run Windows natively?

From Apple's website:
Can a Mac run Windows?
Yes. Every Mac includes Boot Camp, which lets you run Windows natively. Or you can purchase an applica tion such as VMware Fusion to run Mac OS X and Windows side by side.

Running VMware or Parallels is not an option when playing a graphic intensive game such as those on Steam or while trying to record audio as a professional, so I have to pretty much use Boot Camp. I bought this $3k machine expecting it to run Windows natively as they advertised back when I bought, and how they advertise it today.

This is why I think Apple needs to work on updating Boot Camp's drivers.

Also, it has been almost 8 months since they released this version of the MacBook or MacBook Pro, and they still don't have the Boot Camp drivers available on their website.

All of this is just plain unethical business practice, especially for Apple. I expect top quality support for purchasing Apple Care, not to just be brushed off and hope that I figure it out myself or just forget about me all together.

kevin j

May 11, 2009, 03:36 PM

Stridder44

May 11, 2009, 05:08 PM

This is against the forum rules, but I must say it...
+1
They could have and should have released about 10 updates by now.

Agreed, but how is this against the forum rules?

I'm not sure why Apple has to be constantly updating Bootcamp to support Windows changes, especially betas. As long as Bootcamp does what it's supposed to do, and creates a Windows bootable partition on your Mac, isn't it doing what it's supposed to? Is it possible to now install Win7 on a Mac even without bootcamp? - something I thought I read recently...I can't remember where I saw it. I didn't know Apple 'officially' was supporting Windows. Who you gonna call when you have a problem with Windows on Mac? Apple, or Microsoft? Or some other third party? It's one reason I'm pretty happy with Mac in general - the ecosystem is closed, but it's harder for support folks to pass the buck, and point the finger... oh well, I'm now off-topic - sorry.

Well obviously I don't expect them to support a beta OS, what I was talking about was supporting drivers for Vista 64/32 and XP 32 for their already released hardware. There are drivers there, yes, but they're all very old. OR, they'll only update drivers for newly released hardware. For example, they released some new improved driver for the Unibody MB/MBPs trackpad, meanwhile all the previous models get stuck with the crappy trackpad driver that works OK at best.

ok so I"ve just installed the 64bits Win 7 on my UMBP. most of the drivers seems to work ok execpt the secondary click on the trackpad + the eject button on the keyboard. Any hints how to fix this ?

You installed the Boot Camp 2.1 update right?

Signal-11

May 11, 2009, 05:12 PM

This is against the forum rules, but I must say it...

+1

They could have and should have released about 10 updates by now.

Well, let's hope that Apple doesn't stop at new Bootcamp features and improvements on Snow Leopard with the ability to read HFS+.

xJus10x

May 11, 2009, 05:22 PM

Hey guys could anyone link me how to, if possible, install Windows 7 via Boot Camp? Thanks

Tom B.

May 11, 2009, 05:24 PM

Hey guys could anyone link me how to, if possible, install Windows 7 via Boot Camp? Thanks

Try this (http://www.simplehelp.net/2009/01/15/using-boot-camp-to-install-windows-7-on-your-mac-the-complete-walkthrough/).

flopticalcube

May 11, 2009, 06:07 PM

Agreed, but how is this against the forum rules?

+1'ing

Useless posts. Do not bother making posts with only one or two words (e.g., LOL) or a smilie, or post simply to have the first reply in a thread. Such posts waste everyone's time and will be deleted. Posts saying "I agree", "+1", "me too", or the equivalent are also routinely removed.

NoSmokingBandit

May 11, 2009, 06:41 PM

It's quite fast and I do like the new Dock...er, taskbar :p :D because it IS more like OS X's Dock

I hope the taskbar is never as clumsy as the dock. All they did to the taksbar is take out all the redundancy (quick launch and running apps are no longer separate) and labels. It still functions like the Taskbar, which, imo, is tons easier to use than the dock. Window previews are ace, jump lists are perfect (though can be cluttered sometimes), window management is just amazing... I suppose they took the good features of the dock (aesthetics) and added the functionality of the taskbar.

Signal-11

May 11, 2009, 07:12 PM

I hope the taskbar is never as clumsy as the dock. All they did to the taksbar is take out all the redundancy (quick launch and running apps are no longer separate) and labels. It still functions like the Taskbar, which, imo, is tons easier to use than the dock. Window previews are ace, jump lists are perfect (though can be cluttered sometimes), window management is just amazing... I suppose they took the good features of the dock (aesthetics) and added the functionality of the taskbar.

I disagree with you on taskbar vs dock usability. They're not meant to do the same thing. To me, the Dock is more a launcher and not as much of an application or window switcher. It can do those things, but for that job, Expose in combination with Spaces can be much more efficient, particularly on a laptop. Just a swipe of the thumb. That's not even getting into multitouch gestures on the new portables.

For the way that Windows 7 handles windows and applications, Aero is better, but I find the overall general solution to window and app handling of OS X to be superior.

NoSmokingBandit

May 11, 2009, 08:41 PM

dsnort

May 11, 2009, 08:56 PM

Expose is a pain if you have a ton of windows open. The get so small that you have no choice but to mouse over each one to see what it is. The Taskbar has small tumbnails, but its at least organized by app instead of just pushed all around the screen and hovering over a thumbnail shows the window full-size. I didnt mind the dock/expose for a while, then i tried windows 7 and realized just how clumsy window management in osx really is. Everything just kind of floats around.

Most of my most recent experience with Windows has been XP, a little with Vista, no Win 7.

Dock vs. Taskbar? Personal preference, IMO. I prefer the dock and expose. You can open a lot of windows in a few apps with the taskbar fine, but when you open a few windows in a lot of apps, it blows. (Maybe they found a way around this in Win 7?)

There's more to Expose than just "Show All Windows", there's also "Show Current App Windows". Never have problems finding the page I'm looking for.

ryannazaretian

May 11, 2009, 09:39 PM

ok so I"ve just installed the 64bits Win 7 on my UMBP. most of the drivers seems to work ok execpt the secondary click on the trackpad + the eject button on the keyboard. Any hints how to fix this ?

Hmm... not sure, they just started working once I installed the drivers. From your description, it sounds like the Boot Camp manager program isn't running (The gray diamond in the taskbar). I really don't know what to suggest because it just worked for me. It's sad that the experience is different from person to person. If most people are using the same machine, such as you and I are using the MBP, then our experience should be identical.

Try to update Windows, that may help. Reinstall all the drivers. Reinstall Windows?

Also, just kind of adding more to my last post. pdxflint, I agree Apple shouldn't have to support Windows 7, but this has been an issue for me with Windows XP 32bit, Windows Vista 32bit, and Windows Vista 64bit. They should support those operating systems on their machines. To call and just get a response back to call Microsoft about my trackpad is not correct at all. From what I understand, Apple makes the trackpads, install them in their machines, slap their logo on it, and advertise it runs Windows natively. It all sounds like Apple's problem in this situation, and I have run into this problem many times.