Gateway vs. Apple

[arn]

CNet reports (http://news.com.com/2100-1040-955300.html?tag=fd_top) that Gateway is taking on the iMac head on with a series of new TV ads:

Gateway's TV ad parodies earlier iMac ads and two short Pixar trailers. The Pixar trailers have featured an iMac jumping around the screen, something the Profile 4 does in the new Gateway ads. As a narrator touts Profile 4's advantage over Apple's computer, Gateway's all-in-one PC does flips and backflips over three iMacs.

[Mr. Anderson]

The Poway, Calif.-based PC maker also plans a series of magazine ads that pit the two computers against one other, capped with the headline: "It's a close contest. Until you turn them on."

All their comparisons are based on an iMac using OSX.1.4 - which isn't good for Apple. If it had been jaguar, things might be a bit different.

D

[Captnroger]

I find it a bit ironic that Gateway thinks their machine does anything better than any other typical PC. They should be pitting their machine against other PC manufacturers, not the iMac. It really is an Apple to Oranges comparison in my opinion.

And using the 'sticking out the tongue' thing in their ad, what is with that? Can't they come up with their on innovative ads? Jeez...

link to article on Cnet: http://news.com.com/2100-1040-955300.html?tag=fd_top

[sparkleytone]

not the wisest of marketing choices. if i was any size company i would not want to piss off apple legal.

gateways computers are total pieces of crap anyways, and if they go as far as to parody Apple's ads, then hey guess someone has been losing sales. I love talking to people who work for these companies that crap on Apple and their products.

The main reason Gateway will not stay afloat. Its run by idiots down to the floor salespeople.

[Captnroger]

And the USA report has a mis-print. "$1299 as the starting price for the new 17" iMac." Yeah, RIGHT...if you think there's a shortage now, imagine the shortage if it started at $1299!

[aromac]

damn its ugly. it has the cheap pc look.

[djniche]

I agree this marketing campaing will fail for sure. It's like comparing a mercedez benz (imac) with a cluncky ford espire.
It's seems to be a desperate attemp to get some attention to the company and get some sales. I really doubt people would go out there and get these pcs as they did with the 17" imacs. there is a big waiting list on these. I have one and love it.

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by aromac
damn its ugly. it has the cheap pc look. I agree.. It is rather ugly. I didn't read too much detail, but it doesn't look like the display moves like the iMac. That's a major bonus of the iMac imo.

[dhdave]

Man that gateway is a dog. But did anybody else look at the .pdf file of the side-by-side comparison? (Available on Gateway's website). The Gateway uses a Geforce 2mx with 32mb and the FPS are almost 3 times what the iMac's are. Honestly that is pretty scarry. I know most hardcore gamers wouldn't look twice at either system, but still.... I didn't realize there was THAT much of a disparity. Apple MUST fix that.

dh

[dhdave]

I didn't realize they were using 10.1.4 in the comparison. I bet times would have been better with 10.2.

dh

[Shrek]

Looks like it's time for Apple to retaliate and launch it's own ad campaign comparing the iMac and the Profile.

Take that Gateway! And that! A left and a right! POW!!! :p

[bobindashadows]

By targeting an ad campaign against a particular competitor, it's simply admitting that they are a threat/true competition. And we all know parody is the highest form of flattery.

[Shrek]

Originally posted by Captnroger
And the USA report has a mis-print. "$1299 as the starting price for the new 17" iMac." Yeah, RIGHT...if you think there's a shortage now, imagine the shortage if it started at $1299!

Uh, dude the new iMac is $1299. Where have you been? Click here (http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore/). :p

edit: Oh nevermind, you're talking about the 17". My bad. :p

[oldMac]

Oh man... watch iMac sales go through the roof when Gateway starts showing these ads.

Seriously, if you were unbiased and saw the Gateway sitting next to the iMac, which one would you buy?

This is a huge win for Apple. Gateway is now admitting that they're a threat.

[beatle888]

Originally posted by bobindashadows
By targeting an ad campaign against a particular competitor, it's simply admitting that they are a threat/true competition. And we all know parody is the highest form of parody.

sure, but gateway will air their ads more. possibly making it
look like their campaign idea in the first place.....honestly ive
only seen that cute imac ad twice AT MOST on tv. I dont
think this is good for apple, but im not saying it's horrible.

[dricci]

Apple will just start airing more switcher commercials, possibly the celebrity ones which will be more rememberable than any of gateway's lame attempts. I'm surprised by this, actually, it's almost as if they're taking one last gasp of air before going under or getting bought out by a bigger PC maker.

[IJ Reilly]

With their "switch" ads, Apple is admitting that Microsoft is the team to beat. With their new ads, Gateway is admitting Apple is the team to beat. Interesting.

IJR

[LimeiBook86]

Honestley I think Gateway is out of thier minds! The iMac kicks the "Profile 4's" @$$!!!!! I mean what the hell kind of a name is "Profile 4" thats like some experiment gone horribly wrong!!!! That thing is butt-ugly! Plus the screen can't move! HA-HA! I haven't seen the ad yet, is there one, and where can I see it, I want to know how stupid Gatway thinks Apple is. The iMac can BURN DVD's the Gateway cxan't, the iMac is cool looking the Gateway isn't, what the heck do theck think they are doing, it's like comparing Apple's and Oranges! Go find some loser PC company and go fight them Gateway, cuz you gonna be killed by the iMac! Get your lawyers ready Apple here comes the BIG ONE! AAAAHHHHH!

[petee]

Confession;
I know that Gateway is a less than stellar PC group but I was waiting to see their new Profile line before buying an iMac. After seeing the specs though, the Gateway is underpowered (GF2 MX is "very poor" compared to the GF4 MX series) no DVD burner, and ugly to boot. I will be buying a 17" iMac for sure.

[chubakka]

Start up time... we know that 10.2 fixed that.

The quake test resolution is set low so that the iMacs superior graphics processor is taken out of the equation. If they had run the test at a higher resolution the Geforce would have smoked the Profile.

a PDF test? that's just weird... and ummm... who cares?

and an Explorer Javascript test? Explorer is a Microsoft product... nuff said.

I wonder if the ad shows any range of movement in the profile... because I'm pretty sure the viewing angle is fixed... it must look really goofy trying to jump over iMacs.

[Thirteenva]

Did i read that pdf correctly? If i did it shows that they tested the profile 4 versus a 700mhz imac not the 800mhz one.

The profile 4 is fugly. Looks like an lcd with an consumer dvd player screwed to its chin. What a mess.

I think its pretty sad that gateway lacks the innovation to think of a new product to boost sales rather than copying the all in one design of the imac then trying to pass it off as superior.

[Rocketman]

Originally posted by arn
CNet reports (http://news.com.com/2100-1040-955300.html?tag=fd_top) that Gateway is taking on the iMac head on with a series of new TV ads:
[/i]

The link for the report itself is

http://www.etestinglabs.com/main/reports/gateway.pdf

[LimeiBook86]

Look what I did :D :
http://www.homepage.mac.com/ibook238/.Pictures/gatewayvsmac.jpg

[plehrack]

The ad sure implies that the screen moves, I saw it this morning on CNBC. This ad tipifies some of the differences between Apple and PC's, the ainimation is third rate at best, as is the design. What a joke.

My overall impression of motive is not to take marketshare from Apple but to try to lure switchers over to Gateway. "Same lame operating system, new lame design". Nice Gateway, bye, bye...

Peter Lehrack

[srobert]

Profool shmells! how dare they include the word "style" in their slogan... but then again it might just be a mater of taste.

[User X]

Has anyone ever seen a pc boot up to a running state in 18sec. I can't belive that. I have a pIII 850 dell latitude at work running Win 98 and It takes so long to boot up I turn it on and walk away for a while because I can't stand how slow it is. My 867 G4 at home boots up in half the time and it is even faster now with 10.2 . I know that there is a big difference between a pIII 850 and the 2.4gz P4 and maybee XP helps but that is unbelivable. Can anyone confirm this?

Gateway's lack of originallity will be there undoing. What will they come out with next...a pocket size MP3 player? There are too many crap PC makers out there and this is a desperate attempt by one of them to stay a float.

I think I am starting to take these things personally.

[Kid Red]

As negative as the ad may be, this is VERY good for Apple. This ad is saying hey, the iMac rocks and if you like it check out our PC. The ad will also-

-further expose the imac
-further show that macs are computers like PCs
-add creditablity that macs are a viable alternative to PCs, so when gateway has this spot and then an apple switch spot comes on afterwards, looks good for us.
-any publicity is good publicity


When you compare your product to another, you're saying they were the best and the only option until now. That still says a lot for the imac.

[pgwalsh]

When I first installed XP it booted really fast. Now that I have a large amount of apps on it, it's much slower. But I would say that when I first installed it took close to 18 seconds. I know it was under 30 seconds. However, XP sucks and I have all kinds of problems with it. I rather have W2K than XP and OS X than W2K.

[crossed-over]

I just saw the ad this morning too. The screen does move, as you can tell from the gateway website. There's a little virtual product profile where you can spin the computer around and look at it... sound familiar?

This kinda reminds me of those guys who ran track in high school who wore all the fancy clothing and shoes and touted their skills, but when the race was finally over had finished last.

Pathetic Gateway. Pathetic.


A

[LimeiBook86]

I haven't seen the ad yet... does anyone have a link!?:rolleyes:

[petee]

This is a lot of free publicity for Apple... I don't think that we should have to worry that people will think that Gateway innovated the all-in-one design. Not many innovations come from cows... except finding new ways to produce excrement.

[User X]

I just booted up my pIII 850 and it took 2min and 4sec. I have an imac G3 333 that boots much faster than that.

....I know, I should get back to work.

[yogi477]

I hope this just drags gateway down further and those tests suck they are so obviously aimed so as to give an untrue picture of system performance, I mean who ever heard of a PFD opening test. I probably will never get to see the adverts as I am in the UK, but I hope this backfires on Gateway and sends them down.

[LimeiBook86]

www.cnet.com says:

update Gateway has a message for Apple Computer's iMac: Step aside.

Yeah sure! :rolleyes: Apple will NEVER give up with out a fight!

[beno]

iMac customers are people who:

a) are fundamentally uninterested in Windows, or
b) are fed up with Windows

Which of these groups are the geniuses at Gateway targetting?

Incomprehensible :confused:

[sockdoggy]

Originally posted by LimeiBook86
www.cnet.com says:

[B] update Gateway has a message for Apple Computer's iMac: Step aside.

Don't you get away from these type of people after graduating from high school?

Ohhhhh...... I'm sure Steve is shivering in his boots. Get a life Gatewacker.

[Capt. Obvious]

<aapl_response_ad_1>

cue music: Who - Won't Get Fooled Again

fade in on profile4
* voice-over (JeffG): A monkey in a silk suit...

cross-fade to steve ballmer's UberChimp video
|track-sync: {meet the new boss}
*|voice-over(JeffG): ...is still a monkey.
|track-sync: {same as the old boss}

fade to black

fade in to apple logo on black background
*|track-sync: {final five chords}
fade out

</aapl_response_ad_1>

[srobert]

http://homepage.mac.com/srobert/.Pictures/Other%20pics/profool_quickie.jpg

Please don't jusge the art too severly. I din't think a gateway spoof was worth putting too much time on. ;-)

[PretendPCuser]

OK kiddies, here's a basic lesson that i learned/read somewhere. Of course, there are reasons to break the rules, but the rule in advertising is don't mention your direct competition by name in YOUR advertising. Gateway obviously does, so they felt that there was a legitimate reason to do so. What could this reason be? Gateway realizes it's machines would not fare well against comparatively powered PCs? The iMac marketing is starting to create a buzz that they want to ride on the coattails of?

Now, i'm going to go out on a limb and start some smack talk from our side of the fence that was so in vogue in the late nineties:

Gateway is doomed. They are probably closest to Apple in the PC realm. Retail stores, now an imac-type, and now some wanna-be advertising... i'll make the prediction that since they are competing with other PC makers and now they add Apple to their list of competitors...well, unless Billy G. gave them a large infusion of cash, i'm putting my opinion out there that Gateway will file within 2 years.

Anybody wanna join the fun?

[Capt. Obvious]

Originally posted by PretendPCuser Gateway is doomed. ...[ I]'m putting my opinion out there that Gateway will file within 2 years.[/B]

The amazing thing is that they haven't filed yet. They're on their knees, gasping - have been so for months. This ad campaign is one last, desperate attempt before the lights go out.

[King Cobra]

I must say, Gatelaid seems to be piling so much crap on top of themselves (with the help of their friendly cow) that their world is beginning to sink and drown. I'm not saying that because I'm a Mac user, but because...

When you take a look at Gateway, what you see is a variation of Apple's best products in their own variation. Their own variation is simply a Mac with the price down, a terrible software OS, and a poorly-designed hardware casing. Second, when you see their own switch promotions, you are really watching Gateway's variation of Apple's most honest switch ads (with the arguable exception of Ellen Feiss (sp?)) with amateur advertising, zero heart, and all desperation. Finally, when you combine these two together, along with all the past instances of so called "rip-offs" of Apple's hardware/software/advertising, you are looking to be handed a very heavy stack of papers, with the words "law" and "testify" somewhere on them.

The only thing keeping Gateway alive is people failing to realize this. Once people do, Gateway will drown much quicker, because the cow will faint and fall down, causing an earthquake and a waterspout, flooding the Gatelaid empire.

[bobindashadows]

Originally posted by User X
Has anyone ever seen a pc boot up to a running state in 18sec. I can't belive that. I have a pIII 850 dell latitude at work running Win 98 and It takes so long to boot up I turn it on and walk away for a while because I can't stand how slow it is. My 867 G4 at home boots up in half the time and it is even faster now with 10.2 . I know that there is a big difference between a pIII 850 and the 2.4gz P4 and maybee XP helps but that is unbelivable. Can anyone confirm this?

Gateway's lack of originallity will be there undoing. What will they come out with next...a pocket size MP3 player? There are too many crap PC makers out there and this is a desperate attempt by one of them to stay a float.

I think I am starting to take these things personally.
actually, yes i have. My friend has an athlon 1.2 Ghz (i think, might be 1.4) that he built himself, and it starts up on windows 98 in about 10 seconds.

[boom-boom]

I am sorry I have to say this but... Just looking at the figures in the report Apple should be worried. Yes the machine looks butt ugly but that has never bothered pc buyers in the past, and it isn't a beige box sitting on the desk!! Style wise the iMac wins hans down, but speed does matter.

chubakka said further up the forum:

Start up time... we know that 10.2 fixed that.

The quake test resolution is set low so that the iMacs superior graphics processor is taken out of the equation. If they had run the test at a higher resolution the Geforce would have smoked the Profile.

a PDF test? that's just weird... and ummm... who cares?

and an Explorer Javascript test? Explorer is a Microsoft product... nuff said.

but they don't have to redo the report every time Apple make an update to their OS!

Taking a quick shifty over at toms hardware guide:

http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/02q2/020522/index.html

the Geforce4 mx in not much better than Geforce2 mx, and the iMac still got smoked maybe Apple should not try palming off second rate tech making people think they are getting something nearly as good as the Geforce4 Ti.

Next point PDFs, well the os is built on the god damn things (well postscript anyway!)

Oh and lets not forget the Javascript test using MSIE well Apple must like the product or the money Microsoft give them as Apple seem to like it enough to ship their product with it.

In regards to price well just looking at the sites it seems like you can have two 1.7GHz Profile 4s for the price of the iMac they tested. When you look at the Apple site you can see they base their headings not of Fast Faster Fastest but wether it has a superdrive or not!!! I would prefer more speed for my money and have a superdrive!

Apple must not ignore Gateway, this computer will be advertised alot! The only place I see Apple ads in Europe is in Apple mags, isn't that preaching to choir? It has a competitive price and spec abit ugly but as I said at the begining millions of people buy uglier machines and will continue to!!!

[porovaara]

For the record for a machine to be certified XP compatible by big brother it must make it to the start screen in 30 seconds if only one user, or the login screen if multiple users. This is time from power on, through post, cold boot and loading of the OS.

Although XP "cheats" and delays loading lots of DLLs and such it really needs until after you are "in" the OS. Still it an effective way to may perceived boot time faster.

[jrbohorquezg]

Imitation is the best form of flattery...

[ladrums1000]

I went to the Gateway site and they have a PDF file which lists the benchmark comparisons between the Gateway Profile 4 (probably the ugliest computer I have ever seen) and the imac. The test results were done from E Testing labs, which is owned by Ziff Davis. I went to the Ziff Davis site, and they have nothing but good things to say about the imac, and in fact had this statement

"Given the new specs, the iMac's performance held no surprises. On most of our tests, the 800MHz G4 processor outscored a 700MHz G3 by about 30 percent to 40 percent and lagged behind a dual-procesor 800MHz Power Mac by a broader range of 10 percent to 40 percent. An Ah-inspiring design!

I would be interested to see what imac they used to compare computers. Also, I would be interested in seeing ALL the benchmark tests, not just the ones they showed. Either way, I would rather have a machine that is a little slower, but looks better, especially if the faster computer looks like the Profile 4. I love how the profile 4 screen tilts maybe a few inches at the most, and only up and down.

It's obvious that they design guys mac wouldn't hire went over to gateway to design that awful piece of shiat!

Makes me proud to be an Apple computer owner!

[LimeiBook86]

Originally posted by sockdoggy


Don't you get away from these type of people after graduating from high school?

Ohhhhh...... I'm sure Steve is shivering in his boots. Get a life Gatewacker.
What the hell was that all about?:rolleyes:

[ladrums1000]

Additional info from post above. Just as I suspected. I went to etestinglabs website and found out some very interesting facts. Just as I suspected, Gateway gets to choose which tests are released in the report, which is total BS if you ask me. I know Gateway won't release tests where their computer lost, which was probably most of them. Here are some excerpts directly from the etestinglabs site:

"The final report is usually the climax of our testing process, and we produce quite a few of these reports every week. The reports we've posted on our Web site, however, represent only a small fraction of the tests we've performed and the test reports we've written—the fraction that our clients have chosen to publish. Each client determines, for each test, whether to have us post its test report. Clients also may request that we remove reports that are no longer current, and we attend to such requests immediately.

many clients elect to not make their reports available to the public. We maintain strict confidentiality for these clients and honor their right to not publish information about their tests and test reports.

For those clients who choose to have us post their reports, we build one or more individual pages within our Reports area—in effect, we create mini-sites for those clients. These clients can link from their own Web sites directly to their pages within the eTesting Labs site.

This hosting of test reports highlights the fact that a respected, independent testing provider ran the tests. Clients can direct customers, shareholders, and others to this page, where we've listed their reports along with those of some of the world's best-known companies.

I SMELL A RAT, or is it a cow?

[iTurd]

Gateway's ad agency did all the editing on Macintoshes. The ad agency deserves an Oscar for the act they put on to kiss Gateway Executives a$$.

No serious designer/video editor has ever gone through their entire career without a Mac.

[chubakka]

First off... OSX doesn't crash so how often do you need to start it up anyway?
The gateway is running XP so start up time is much more important... it'll be crashing and rebooting alot.

Second... if the geforce card isn't a factor... then why did they run it at such a low resolution?

Explorer is still embedded into the Windoze OS code... and until Explorer is FIXED for the mac... it's gonna be slow.... that's not Apple's fault... it's Microsoft's.

And the PDF test... would a 104 page PDF opening on Gateway Profile in a little over 4 seconds versus the Apple's a little under 8 seconds make me not want a 17 inch widescreen over the FrankenMac Gateway?

Put them side by side and see which computer would get the attention...
AND which would get purchased. The 2 top end models are priced exactly the same... and the iMac has a superdrive.

[boom-boom]

In reply to ladrums1000 which company in the world would say their product was utter trash in a report!!! Why do Apple only test their product with Biotech programs? Like I would ever use that when writing an email to my wife!! And do I have to learn the programing language then write the software myself just to get the performance?

In reply to iTurd: It was probably created on an Mac!!

[vniow]

If there's one computer personality I hate more than that Dell guy, it's that frelling cow, and that thing is uglier than Janet Reno in a lace and leather nightgown, but they sure as hell are getting a lot of attention over it. This is a little different than the EMachines iMac ripoff a couple years ago and that ugly triangle shaped thingie a couple months ago. The difference is that Gateway is going to market this thing until they file for bankruptsy. The tests may be rigged and it may not have the versatility of the iMac, but that $999 base price looks pretty tempting if I'm going for a cheap space saving all-in-one computer. I've written off the EMachines and that triangle thingie when they came out because there wasn't a lot of hoopla around it, but this POS Gateway is a little different in that respect. I just hope Apple can retaliate if this Profile4 takes off like it shouldn't but with a good marketing scheme, I'm a bit skeptical. :(

[peterjhill]

Look at the specs for the new gateway. Let me do a side by side:

Apple============GateWay
700 MHz G4---------------Celeron 1.7
256k L2--------------------128k L2
128MB SDRAM------------128MB DDR SDRAM
40GB UltraATA------------20GB UltraATA
No Floppy Drive-----------.00144 GB Floppy Drive ;-)
24x CD-RW-----------------24x CDR
Mac OS X 10.2-------------WinXP home
1299 999
15" TFT----------------------15" Flat Panel

I would rather have the mac, than the crippled celeron

[srobert]

I went on gateway's website to check how could they acheive to build a machine that cheap... here is what I found under the carpet.

It starts at $999... compared to $1200 for an imac... $300 not too shabby but...

theres seem to be some key components missing... I click on customize to make it up to par...

I want the hard drive to be upped to 40 Gigs, just like the imac base model.
Kaching!!! +$50

I also want the ability to be able to burn CDs, just like on the imac base model (CD-RW)
Kaching!!! + $80

I might also want to add the "not included" 56k modem
Kaching!!! + $30

Well, afeter adding the missing accessories, it's still cheaper than an imac at $1,184.00 by about $100 but I would'nt have popped a gasket over it. Sure my imac don't have a 1.44" diskette drive but dang, I haven't felt the need for one in about 5 years. Do these still exists???

Also, my imac comes with a COMPLETE and stable OS.

Here are some fine prints from Gateway's site concerning the installed OS:

"Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition: Windows® XP Home Edition is a consumer operating system and does not support peer to peer networking of more than five computers, domain authentication, Encrypted File System or remote system management."

Dang!

I bet that if I teared the guts out of the imac just like a Profool, I'll get it down to $999.

What's more, the way it's build, their "flat screen" looks more like a "fat screen to me". Remember when they first introduced the imac, Ive's said that they almost fell for the trap of designing a flatter version of the original imac with a flat screen in front and the guts attached behind the screen? I'm glad they avoided that ugly trap... too bad gateway walked right in.

And about ripping Apple's advertising, they should also try to steal the "think different" slogan.... naaaahhhh... Make that "Think ************"

[topicolo]

Originally posted by User X
Has anyone ever seen a pc boot up to a running state in 18sec. I can't belive that. I have a pIII 850 dell latitude at work running Win 98 and It takes so long to boot up I turn it on and walk away for a while because I can't stand how slow it is. My 867 G4 at home boots up in half the time and it is even faster now with 10.2 . I know that there is a big difference between a pIII 850 and the 2.4gz P4 and maybee XP helps but that is unbelivable. Can anyone confirm this?

Gateway's lack of originallity will be there undoing. What will they come out with next...a pocket size MP3 player? There are too many crap PC makers out there and this is a desperate attempt by one of them to stay a float.

I think I am starting to take these things personally.

it takes 20 seconds to boot up to a full working desktop in WinXP on my duron 700.

[whiskeybravo]

Cm'on, this isn't serious folks! Yes, I think Apple should be a bit concerned about the speed issue, don't we all want faster iMacs? But still, directly from the gateway site, no DVD Burner option, so add $300-400 for an external, speakers, $25 option. 80GB drive $100 option. How quickly does this machine cost just as much as a 17" iMac? Even then, 17" widescreen? not available. Adjustable monitor? not available. OSX? Not available. iMovie? N/A. iDVD? N/A. etc....

I'm still happy to be a machead. 18 years of Mac-use and counting! (yup, 1984, 128k flamethrower!)

[topicolo]

Guys, we should be more objective here. Sure, we all love the mac, but we can't let that bias our discussion if we really want to examine how these new ads will affect Apple's sales of the iMac. Personally, I think Gateway made a stupid mistake in targeting the iMac specifically--why target a platform that has 3.4% when you can go after Dell, HP, or IBM? This is evidence that Gateway's management is smoking some good **** and they're running the company while they're high. The new ads could actually prop up sales for the mac, since it does seem pretty obvious that the mac is the better product when compared to that profile 4. Then again, Apple can't afford to lose sales to anyone, so the situation is dicey at best.

Here's to hoping that the new Gateway ad campaign backfires! :cool:

[chewbaccapits]

...a couple of us are going to our local Gateway store tonight.....We're going to tip it...Interested?

[spinner]

I am not entirely sure how this is news. I told you guys this a couple of days ago.

I don't think that this will hurt Apple at all. In fact, I think the extra FREE exposure will be good.

Besides people who are going to buy a Mac are going to buy a Mac regardless of what crap Gateway puts out. They want a stable, reliable alternative to the throw away garbage that is produced by the other computer manufactures.

[chubakka]

Does it have built-in firewire? Is that even an option?

This won't hurt Apple's marketshare... it is competition for the back-to-school-crowd though. But if Junior is given a choice between the
$1999 Gateway and the $1999 iMac... which on is he gonna choose?

The $999 Profile isn't cheaper... it's UNDER equipped.

[User X]

I didn't know that PC's could boot that fast. I guess I have a real piece of crap Dell laptop.I am sure it would help if you had a 10,000RPM hard drive (don't know how fast the HD is in this thing). Maybee XP would help but the company won't put the money into it. I wonder how fast the new G4's boot in 10.2. I am going to time my quicksilver when I get home. Any body got a boot up time for there machine?

[KVH]

On the topic of boot times, my Digital Audio 667 boots in 45sec timed. From a cold start. 10.1.4. Anyone else care to share?

[jrbohorquezg]

Guy, I have to tell you that I'm sold...

I just put my 4-days-old DP867 Mhz PowerMac on ebay, and I'm off to CompUSA to place my order for my new GateWay.

yeah, right.

[srobert]

Here is a longer, more complete review from Cnet:

http://computers.cnet.com/hardware/0-1018-405-20262327.html?tag=rev-rev

Extract: "High but awkward style - While the iMac appears light and playful, the Profile 4, which is covered in a matte-black finish and silver accents, feels ponderous and clumsy, like a big bottle of 1980 vintage Drakkar Noir. Good luck finding any matching furniture at IKEA."

It's reted at this point 7/10 by CNet and 36% by users. The imac did 8/10, with a Editor's choice label and a 93% user opinion :-)

Interesting Note:

Remember that weird 180+ fps quake 3 from the profool benchmark Pdf? Well, CNet only acheived 59 fps on the Profool they tested... Interesting.

I'm keeping an eye on PCMagazine, they rated the imac 5/5... let's see hoe the Profool does.

[ibookin']

I think Gateway is wrong in trying to do this. Not only will they piss off Apple Legal, but they may also hurt profile sales by comparing hte profile to the iMac in a TV ad, where looks count. Consumers will look at both machines and see that the iMac looks like it was actually designed by someone, and the Gateway looks like a piece of trash. The kind of people who are buying an iMac or a Profile care about how their computers look, and the iMac looks better on TV and in person. For most consumers, the Gateway ads will actually make them mre likely to buy an iMac.

At least that's what I hope will happen.

[Taft]

Originally posted by srobert
Interesting Note:

Remember that weird 180+ fps quake 3 from the profool benchmark Pdf? Well, CNet only acheived 59 fps on the Profool they tested... Interesting.


Another interesting bit is the apps they use for web page and PDF loading. I know they tested on 10.1.4, but on Jaguar here are my impressions.

First, OS X doesn't even come with Adobe Acrobat. Someone made the comment that OS X is built on PDF, and the Gateway beat it. Well, adobe has its own rendering engine. OS X come with its own tools for examining (and creating!) PDFs. The problem could lie in the Acrobat application, not the computers. They should have benchmarked creating PDFs...oh, wait...XP doesn't come with the ability to do so.

Second, under Jaguar, IE is probably the slowest of the four I've used. OmniWeb, Mozilla, and Chimera all beat it hands down in load times and rendering. Again, Gateway's dominance could have nothing to do with the hardware.

This is the problem with benchmarking. So much is dependant on software. Others have pointed out flaws in the 3D tests. The fact that Gateway selected these tests really makes me wonder. I'd be interested to see the rest of the benchmarks, esp some more "raw" tests.

Taft

[daRAT]

Originally posted by User X
Has anyone ever seen a pc boot up to a running state in 18sec. I can't belive that. I have a pIII 850 dell latitude at work running Win 98 and It takes so long to boot up I turn it on and walk away for a while because I can't stand how slow it is. My 867 G4 at home boots up in half the time and it is even faster now with 10.2 . I know that there is a big difference between a pIII 850 and the 2.4gz P4 and maybee XP helps but that is unbelivable. Can anyone confirm this?

Gateway's lack of originallity will be there undoing. What will they come out with next...a pocket size MP3 player? There are too many crap PC makers out there and this is a desperate attempt by one of them to stay a float.

I think I am starting to take these things personally.

Yes, my XP Pro Gateway tower does boot quicker by far, than my Cube, 9.X or 10.1.5 (I haven't got my Jag copy yet :) ).

If you got "customize" the Profile 4 SE on Gateway's site to match the middle iMac, (include the next cpu upgrade too), it comes out to 1500$, same as the iMac.

What is going to attract buyers, especially corporations is you can get MS Word standard, and the Office for a low additonal cost. Most if not all government contracts we deal with require word, excel document format, and it is a industry wide standard, due I will admit to the flood of the software from MS into the market. This won't change anytime soon.

Apple has an oppurtunity here to really make a great impression. Ignore Gateway, the testing was as lame as Apple testing the Xserve using Photoshop. Apple sould bundle WordPerfect Suite or MS Office on all mid-level machines, and as a additional cost item on all lower end machines. Also, offer either WordPerfect or MS Office, give the buyer a choice.

Then do independant testing of thier own in real world applications, such as Photoshop filters, Word search and replace, Web Browser scrolling and large file copying. Not to mention the mp3 ripping, quicktime movie compling etc.

These will sell well, I doubt we will buy them, and we buy all Gateways, have for years, Apple has to do nothing but take the high road here, and just keep making soild machines at a reasonable price.

my 2 bits, thanks folks :]

[daRAT]

Originally posted by topicolo
Guys, we should be more objective here. Sure, we all love the mac, but we can't let that bias our discussion if we really want to examine how these new ads will affect Apple's sales of the iMac. Personally, I think Gateway made a stupid mistake in targeting the iMac specifically--why target a platform that has 3.4% when you can go after Dell, HP, or IBM? This is evidence that Gateway's management is smoking some good **** and they're running the company while they're high. The new ads could actually prop up sales for the mac, since it does seem pretty obvious that the mac is the better product when compared to that profile 4. Then again, Apple can't afford to lose sales to anyone, so the situation is dicey at best.

Here's to hoping that the new Gateway ad campaign backfires! :cool:

I couldn't agree more, it is bizarre that they are targeting a specific model:rolleyes: I have never seen a computer maker do this before, has anyone here seen it?

I rarely see a Mac ad, the switch ones, and there was only one I saw, I muted, (they lame ads also). Apple must target larger population areas.

The Gateway ones though, I bet my TV will be muted most of the time.

I almost got throw out of a Gateway store for opening a display model case while it was being used...heh...but thats another story
:D

[ejb190]

The comparison data brings to mind a favorite quote:

"First get your facts; then you can distort them at your leisure." -- Mark Twain

[Macmaniac]

Here Here ejb190, right on! Apple should do something about those ads pronto. I will keep my eye out for em, I can here a lawsuit right now- Apple sues Gateway for misinformation in ad campaign!!


Lets start a grass roots campaign by posting that eairlier picture on Gateway stores all around the nation!!!!!!

[synergy]

Originally posted by Macmaniac
Here Here ejb190, right on! Apple should do something about those ads pronto. I will keep my eye out for em, I can here a lawsuit right now- Apple sues Gateway for misinformation in ad campaign!!


Lets start a grass roots campaign by posting that eairlier picture on Gateway stores all around the nation!!!!!!

Goto law school first and then talk about law suits. There isn't one here.
Not a legit one anyways.

I think this helps Apple since people will want to go compare the iMac now.
Goatway doesn't have the easy to use apps as Apple does. Sure if I want to run 100 different variants of porn downloading software the PC is for me.
No I don't do biotech either. I do do email and my Mac does it just fine.

Goatway just added to Apples ad campaign. Maybe someone paid off a goatway executive to run such a stupid self defeating ad. The whole thing with computers now is people are not looking for the fastest and greatest. They want a computer that does what they need to and does it in an easy way.

Selling a computer on speed is not as big as it used to be. Especially since Intel themselves ran into a Mhz wall with their high end Itanium processor that they are not talking much about now.

[daytona63]

srobert, that was an extremely funny post - I actually laughed out loud!

Your analysis was right on to boot. Let's not even mention that the Profool (that's great, did you coin that?) doesn't include any iApp-like applications. What a POS. And if the screen doesn't move, it just downright sucks. Even if does, there's no way that it moves like my iMac's. This feature alone convinced me to buy this thing.


- daytona63

[Rajj]

Look at the stock quotes at the bottom of the screen on that page;)

Apple: 15.53
Gateway: 4.00


Nuff said:p

[topicolo]

Originally posted by User X
I didn't know that PC's could boot that fast. I guess I have a real piece of crap Dell laptop.I am sure it would help if you had a 10,000RPM hard drive (don't know how fast the HD is in this thing). Maybee XP would help but the company won't put the money into it. I wonder how fast the new G4's boot in 10.2. I am going to time my quicksilver when I get home. Any body got a boot up time for there machine?

Nah, I just have a 7200rpm hard drive. It is faster than a normal 4200rpm to 5400rpm laptop drive, but it's mainly XP. Microsoft actually did make improvenets to the startup times in XP and it's actually pretty good. If you use the hibernate function, it'll copy all of the contents of your ram to your hard drive and start up again using the ram contents, making startup even faster. The ugliness of the OS negates all of that good startup stuff tho.

[JLove16]

According to their information, set screen resolutions to 1024x768 on all the computers. The 17" iMac native resolution is 1440x900. This may have been one reason why the 17" iMac performed so slowly (that and the fact they weren't using Jaguar). Afterall, it has a Geforce 4 instead of a Geforce 2.

[voicegy]

Now THAT'S why I'm a member here...this thread has been an out and out laugh fest to read! Thanks for all the pics and the wild comments...this is when the best of y'all come out, when that stupid COW company thinks they can compete with the beauty of the iMac.

My 2 cents...yes, this THING looks like a 10 year old prototype that they found in the Apple reject dustbin.

The beauty of all this? The iMac will now enjoy more publicity. I know if *I* were not familier with the Apple line up and I saw it in one of Gateways' ads, I'd be asking myself "Hey, what's that?! I want one!"

hahahaha! Gateway stock now trading at 4 bucks...

[akos33]

Just from a PC persons point of view, Mac has GREAT software and OS, but the hardware SUCKS bigtime (that's a fact) and are WAY overpriced, until some better hardware comes out I'll stick with my PC.

As for Gateway, Yupp, that is the UGLIEST thing I've ever seen, I'm sure the ad will backfire. On the otherhand this may force Apple to lower prices and that's a good thing.

PS. My PC with Win XP doesn't crash, but it's not as smooth as OS X. DS

[blackpeter]

I just saw this ad on Monday Night Football. Beautiful! I think it's so funny that Gateway feels threatened by Apple enough to wage an ad campaign against them. Bring it on beyatches!

[srobert]

Originally posted by daytona63
srobert, that was an extremely funny post - I actually laughed out loud!

Yup... I made it up... but it was on the easy side. As for a Gateway alias, someone came up with a real funny one: GateLaid. I laughed this one out loud.

[jaguar451]

Hopefully "competition" (used in the loosest way) will make the iMac better. Some random thoughts:

- The Ads could be good for both Gateway and Apple (although I wouldn't do the ads if it were up to me): validate the AIO concept that it isn't just Gateway, position as "best" AIO for WinTel, as well as best performing AIO. Gives the iMac more visibility, though, and again, I wouldn't do this ad.

- The 17" iMac had 256MB RAM vs 512 for the Profile, an old even for the Mac IE, and as noted earlier, wasn't native format. Would be interesting to see results in native video format with 512MB RAM and 10.2.1....

- As for the tests themselves, for the market that they are going after, restarting the computer, browsing the internet, and watching games seems to be in line with what people do. Don't underestimate what people will believe, and WinTel users do a lot of re-booting in Win95/98 (target market is folks with older machines who probably haven't updated the OS. )

- The iMac _IS_ slower than it should be, IMO. The Profile has DDR RAM, a 533Mhz FSB, 7200RPM Hard Drive, so I would expect it to do better.... Plus IE on OS X is default and slow.

- Their specs in the $999 computer sound just fine for a person looking for a small footprint computer for email, internet access, and word processing where money is more important than features....

- I would expect a performance comparison / retort on apple.com in the not too distant future that uses AltiVec, 10.2, and maybe IE 5.2.1....

[bobindashadows]

Whose up for some cow tipping? C'mon, anybody with a local gateway store! We could all leave a bunch of tipped over cows in front of the store an hour before they open... haha that would be awesome

[voicegy]

Originally posted by bobindashadows
Whose up for some cow tipping? C'mon, anybody with a local gateway store! We could all leave a bunch of tipped over cows in front of the store an hour before they open... haha that would be awesome

hahahaha! Beautiful! I'm in San Diego and Poway (GateLaid's headquarter location) is just up the road apiece! Let's go!

[ShawnJoyce]

Joe Wilcox is the ANTI-MAC EVANGELIST. Read all of his articles. They are completely against the Macintosh platform.:mad: :mad: :mad:

[G4scott]

This is funny... I remember seeing an ad for a mouse in the back of a Macworld, it said: "We have to be crazy to design a product for less than 5% of the market share" Well, gateway must be moronic for pitting their product against a product with such a small market share...

Sure the hardware might be faster, but it's no good if all you can do is start up, open PDF's, and use java in IE...

I'm going to go to my local gateway store, and see the thing in person and ask some questions...

I like how they're using a design rejected by Apple, and are touting it as better... I almost laughed...

As for Apple's response, I believe that they won't say much about it, but if they do, it's either going to be all out war, or it's going to be a small, low-key commercial that says something to just shove it all right back up gateway's dairy-air...

Seriously, this is like ford saying "Our car has 4 wheels, and will beat the pants off of a BMW in the time it takes to change the tires, roll down the window, and re-fill the washer fluid... As for driving, uh, well... Did we mention you can refill the washer fluid faster?

I don't think Apple has much to worry about...

[eskilling]

Just out of curiosity, is there a link to Gateway's commercial?

[jaredbkt]

What would be some good questions we can ask when we go into a Gateway store to see this "horrid little thing" in person? I want to stump the sale people with real questions that are intelligent and make them think too. I know the iApps but what else? I want to make them think I'm looking at a PC and an iMac. Any ideas?

[vniow]

You could ask why the Gateway still has legacy ports while the iMac did away with them years ago and somehow survived.

[G4scott]

"So, without the DVD burner, do I have to give all my home movies to my friends and family on a couple thousand floppies?"

"Why can't the screen move more?"

"What else can it do faster than a Mac than open PDF's, startup, and use Java?"

"I don't worry about startup times with a Mac, because it doesn't crash, or need to be restarted as much. When I'm not using it, I just put it to sleep. Does windows startup faster because I should expect it to crash more?"

"Would it hurt me to use this computer if I'm lactocent tolerant (sp???)"

"Does it have built in wireless networking"

"Can it run Apache web server right out of the box?"

Just a few questions for the guys at the gateway stores :p

[bombensington]

Let me just say that first of all, I agree, and the new Profile 4 looks like a piece of cow poop, and isn't all that exciting. I love my new iMac!

But...I think that Gateway isn't trying for that tech savvy market with their new campaign. I think it's more about getting the "switcher" to switch to Gateway, not Mac.

You probably know this type of person, my grandma is a prime example. She didn't grow up with computers, she needed to read the instructions on how to work the mouse (this is a fact). She doesn't understand all that technical mumbo-jumbo - she sees the side-by-side comparison table (put out by Gateway, of course) and it says they are the winner - she doesn't really know why. The dumb@$$ salesperson at Gateway will probably tell her that no one on Earth uses a Mac and since everyone uses Windows-based PCs, she should too. Jump on the crappy OS bandwagon! The only thing she wants it for is to e-mail her bridge club and make homemade birthday cards for her grandkids.

To get to the point - this is the type of person I think Gateway is targeting - the computer-illiterate person getting their feet in the water for the very first time. Sneaky and underhanded as it may be, they probably think they are getting away with something - if only they hadn't made such an ugly hunka junk that no one will buy.

[bretm]

Originally posted by jaredbkt
What would be some good questions we can ask when we go into a Gateway store to see this "horrid little thing" in person? I want to stump the sale people with real questions that are intelligent and make them think too. I know the iApps but what else? I want to make them think I'm looking at a PC and an iMac. Any ideas?

Well, I walked into Gateway store today after reading this.

"Can I help you?"

"Yeah, I'm really a mac user, but I wanted to see this thing."

"Ok. Well just let us know if you have any questions"
The store salesperson hurried away and nobody in the store even glanced at me for 20 minutes - I was the only person in the store in the middle of a weekday afternoon!

Well, there I was live in person. A meek little mac user just waiting to be wowed. I wasn't threatening. But nobody dared try to convince me of the benefits of this thing over the imac.

Here's a good question... "Why in the hell does the top end without a dvd burner cost $2000 bucks?"

So after touching it, I can tell you that in no way does it rotate, tilt or move. It will tilt if you break the crappy plastic stand. Please don't mistake the stand for a hinge.

The CD drawer is flimsier than a laptop drawer and possibly smaller. The first PC user that tries to use it as a cupholder will surely break it.

The screen is cheap plastic, but big and nice. The mouse is a flimsy piece of plastic. It has a freakin floppy drive in the front. You'd think they'd give up on these things. That alone makes it look old.

It runs like a banshee. Lets not fool ourselves anymore. PCs are ridiculously snappier and faster than macs. Period. Done. End of story. My roommates 1.2 ghz win98 box is infinitely faster at simple tasks than an 800mhz imac running jaguar. Rendering and photoshop aside, surfing and using his computer is a delay-free process. There is no measurable time to open applications. That's what I want on a mac. Make it so number 1!

So I went immediately over to CompUSA and drooled over the dual gig which finally feels snappy. But I still see apps launch. There's still bouncing. But it sure felt better.

Let me say something else about the Gateway store. Ergonomics were better at compusa. Yep. There weren't any chairs at Gateway that I remember, but the desktop was around my knees! After 20minutes I had developed what felt like full blown carpet tunnel. Either the mouse, or the fact that I was hunching over to be level with the computer.

Bottom line, these machines are cheap. Apple thew their latest technology and ergonomic designs into the imac. Gateway put it's cheapest parts and some cheap plastic into a machine that is nothing more than a 17" non-titing and non-rotating screen with a drive on the front of it. Also, the speakers are cheap and locked in place. At least apple figured out that pulling the speakers away made for better sound.

It's trash. Extremely overpriced for the poorly designed piece of plastic it is. The picture was more impressive.

[bretm]

Originally posted by topicolo


it takes 20 seconds to boot up to a full working desktop in WinXP on my duron 700.

I did my laptop today. G4 400mhz. 10.1.5. From chime to completion of login to useable state (the desktop comes up a good 40 seconds before things are ready to go...) was around 4 minutes.

[bretm]

Originally posted by crossed-over
I just saw the ad this morning too. The screen does move, as you can tell from the gateway website. There's a little virtual product profile where you can spin the computer around and look at it... sound familiar?

This kinda reminds me of those guys who ran track in high school who wore all the fancy clothing and shoes and touted their skills, but when the race was finally over had finished last.

Pathetic Gateway. Pathetic.


A

The one in the store today didn't move. Not at all. I can't see why they would've locked it in place at the store, but it might be possible. It does not rotate for sure.

[vniow]

Well, I walked into Gateway store today after reading this.


Finally some first hand experience. I was kinda hoping it would look worse in person than in pictures.:D

Oh, and totally in agreement with you with being overpriced and under-quality. My aunt has one that they bought a few months ago for $1800, with a 1.7P4, 16x CD-RW and a 17" monitor (not even a flat screen for $1800!) and it just started acting funny a couple days ago

quote from her e-mail:This computer is going bonkers!!!!! And driving me crazeeeee!!

[theaz]

Nice work Gateway. Keep up the advertising: your only hurting yourself :)

[Snowy_River]

Originally posted by jaguar451

- Their specs in the $999 computer sound just fine for a person looking for a small footprint computer for email, internet access, and word processing where money is more important than features....


Uh, the $999 model doesn't come with a modem... how is this fine for email and internet access? While I will grant that it does have ethernet, and therefore could be used with DSL/Cable, it's still cutting out a significant part of the low end users. (Willing to pay $30 more per month for internet access, but quibbling over a one time extra expense of a couple hundred dollars?)

[#Johnny5]

Apple could revamp the $1299 iMac to hit the price point that Gateway is going for:

Replace 40GB harddrive with 20GB (-$50)
Replace CD-RW drive with CD-ROM drive (-$80)
Replace the G4 processor with a Celeron [or G3?] (-$100*)
Charge the consumer for shipping, rather than fit the bill (-$65)
Add a floppy drive, and several dated ports (+25*)
Remove all the iApps: iMovie~50, iDVD~50, iTunes~30, iPhoto~30 (-160*)
Remove AppleWorks (-60)
Include M$ Works Suite (if M$ made it for Mac) (+90)

Let's see... that's

$1299
-50
-80
-100
-65
+25
-160
-60
+90
= $899

Seems that Apple's Profile4-comparable iMac hit a pricepoint a full $100 less than Gateway's, after you level the playing field.

Now, if Apple were to go all the way, and actually build something comparable to the Profile, they'd also have to:
Replace the high-quality raw materials and workmanship with crap (priceless)
Replace the easy-glide monitor with one that's stuck (priceless)
Replace OS X with a sh**y monopoly-based OS (priceless)
Replace the sleek, sexy, beautiful design with... that ugly thing (priceless)

I think the Profile4 should feel pretty stupid jumping over and sticking its mediocre drive out at the iMac. I wonder what the sequal to the commercial would look like, after all the grandmas and high-school kids saw this even-comparison.

I think Apple can be safe to just sit back and laugh at the adds, because GATEWAY is the one making the comparisons to the obviously superior (and beautiful) iMac.


That's all.
Peace.

[#Johnny5]




*The prices that are asterisk-ed are estimates. All the other info are from Apple, Gateway and Buy.com, for M$ Works.

[Snowy_River]

Originally posted by bretm

There is no measurable time to open applications.


I've never seen a computer that has no measureable time (exageration understood) to open apps. I've worked on 2 GHz PCs running everything from Win98 to WinXP, and I've always been able to notice time taken for apps to launch. Sometimes, with some apps, it seems like it's a matter of walking away while the app does what ever it does.

Now, I've seen this on Macs, too. I'm not saying that I don't want faster Macs, or that I think that PCs aren't faster at many things than Macs (though I have yet to do my own side-by-side comparison where I was satisfied that the models I was comparing were, by some reasonable definition, comparable). No, I'm just saying that I haven't seen such a stunning difference in hardware speed to say that the Mac is impossibly out dated. It's just a little behind, that's all.:D

[Snowy_River]

Oh, and, for what it's worth, my 600MHz iBook (Late 2001), running OS X 10.1.5 (my copy of Jaguar hasn't arrived yet :) ) started up (from sound of the chime to the rising of the Dock) in 1 min 41 seconds. I look forward to seeing how 10.2 will change this.

[digitalgiant]

Originally posted by bombensington
Let me just say that first of all, I agree, and the new Profile 4 looks like a piece of cow poop, and isn't all that exciting. I love my new iMac!

But...I think that Gateway isn't trying for that tech savvy market with their new campaign. I think it's more about getting the "switcher" to switch to Gateway, not Mac.

You probably know this type of person, my grandma is a prime example. She didn't grow up with computers, she needed to read the instructions on how to work the mouse (this is a fact). She doesn't understand all that technical mumbo-jumbo - she sees the side-by-side comparison table (put out by Gateway, of course) and it says they are the winner - she doesn't really know why. The dumb@$$ salesperson at Gateway will probably tell her that no one on Earth uses a Mac and since everyone uses Windows-based PCs, she should too. Jump on the crappy OS bandwagon! The only thing she wants it for is to e-mail her bridge club and make homemade birthday cards for her grandkids.

To get to the point - this is the type of person I think Gateway is targeting - the computer-illiterate person getting their feet in the water for the very first time. Sneaky and underhanded as it may be, they probably think they are getting away with something - if only they hadn't made such an ugly hunka junk that no one will buy.

Word ****ing UP!!!!! Dude you are so right on!
:D ;)

[dnelsongb]

Foolish mortals. The only ones that are being fooled here are the poor saps that are paying for these commercials.

Oh well, you know what they say, its better to burn out than to fade away.

POP ----- Silence

That was the sound of the Last Open Neon Sign in a Gateway Country Store.

Good bye Gateway, you won't be missed.

[Gus]

Does anyone have a link to this friggin ad? I really want to see it.

Gus

[dnelsongb]

Its only a commercial that I've seen so far. I saw it while the Packers beat the Browns tonight. May the Browns could use these Gateway thingy things.

[onemoof]

My Dual 867 boots to the login window in 64 seconds. After typing my password and clicking the log in button it takes under 4 seconds to get to a usable state on the desktop.

[nickmcghie]

This reminds me of a ViewSonic ad in a MacWorld magazine years ago. In the ad, the 17" ViewSonic monitor was pitted side-by-side again an Apple 1710AV display. Undernearth huge pictures of each monitor was a MacUser rating. The two monitors were rated the same for everything except for audio, where the Apple monitor was rated higher! Also, the Apple just looked so much nicer. The only selling point of the ViewSonic was that it was $200 cheaper ($799 vs. $999 or something like that.. I don't remember). All I remember is that after seeing the ViewSonic ad, I wanted the Apple monitor so badly!!! :)

I hope Gateway's new ad campign will have the same result! ;)

[macidiot]

I don't know how long it would take on an imac, but I just tested on my dual 1Ghz running 10.2. From pushing the power button to having a full desktop(auto login enabled), it took about 50 seconds. From the time my monitor woke from lowpower(actually showing boot screen), it took about 20 seconds. Seems pretty fast to me.

2 things. First, why the hell do I care about this? Since I've had this mac and configured it(some reboots from software installs), I've rebooted exactly... never. One time I did have to relaunch the finder(I was doing something in terminal and long story short, I blame it on Microsoft :D ) And, that's rebooting. Until I just tested the boot time, I cold booted my computer exactly twice. Once when I turned it on for the first time and once after I installed more RAM (768MB)

As for the second thing. I highly recommend that you never cold boot this thing. Its loud just running normally. But when it cold boots, WHOA. Sounds like a Boeing when it brakes its turbines at landing. Some sort of afterburner bat-fan comes on for about 3 seconds. Kind of scared me actually.

Oh and for the guy that lusted after the 1710av monitor. That thing was a lemon. I have 2 of them if you are interested. Actually, the monitor I got afterwards was a Viewsonic 21". Works like a champ(using it right now).

FYI, I highly recommend upgrading to 10.2 ichat and some of the other stuff is worthless, but the speed and other tweaks(searching in any finder window rocks) are great. And it only cost me $2700 to upgrade! But that was the Big Box edition. The one that comes in the 3'x3'x2' box. And comes with a big silver tower thingy...
:eek:

[arlecchino]

I don't think too many people walk into a computer store without doing some research or looking at various models. Even if I were a PC user thinking of "switching", I'd look at an iMac if I had seen one of those switch ads (I mean, if it's so easy and for years all I've heard of is how easy, intuitive and crash-free the Mac experience is, what's a couple of minutes to see what one is like?)

The iMac is just a different beast (and it is a beast v. a cow). Frankly, Gateway's test have little relevance... my guess is that if the Gateway won more or at least blew the doors off the iMac in other tests, they would have published them. When have you seen an independent test that doesn't have at least THREE Quake tests... and a boot up test, c'mon... who cares!?! I hardly ever shut my computers off, except my Windows machines, which for whatever reason, will have blue (or sometimes orange?) screens of death when I wake them up from sleep (even though I haven't touched them in a day or two).

Plus talk about fear, I fear every time I install something on Win95 and WinME that the machine just won't startup again (or startup in "protected mode"). Adjusting control panels is always done with apprehension, because if the machine is working, I don't want to screw it up. Never had that problem with a Mac... if I adjust something and it doesn't work, I just adjust it back! :)

As is, I spend hours of diagnosis when there is a problem with Windows and that's just getting it to work on my LAN. Forget about trying to get it logged into my Mac (running Samba)... sometimes it shows up in the Network Neighborhood, sometimes it doesn't, don't quite know why, but adjusting any logical parameter doesn't do anything, rebooting twenty five times doesn't do anything... but everytime I want to log into the Windows machine, I just click "Connect to Server" on the Mac, type in the SMB name and I log right in! :D

-A

[peterjhill]

I would rather use my old Ti99/4A than to have to use a gateway. Dell, at least, has gotten better. I like their Optiplex line (for a PC). I pity the person that falls for Gateway's lame marketing. I will celebrate when the finally go out of business (no offense to the hard workers at Gateway. I hope they are smart enough to look for another job now, and not go down with the Titanic.

[Macmaniac]

If you want to see this ad tune into CNN, I saw it 3 times today!!!
Boy does it look ugly!(Note they show more iMacs then the Performance4)

Lets all hope this ad backfires!!!

[chubakka]

In the apple window commercial... the point was to show the adjustability of the LCD display... with out being boring. The pixar animation promo doesn't make the iMac do anything it can't really do (other than hop around) all the movements of the arm and screen are actual. The animation never distorts the construction of the iMac.

The Profile cannot bend on it base's legs. The commercial gives the impression that the computer is as versatile as the iMac in screen postioning. Obviously they've taken creative license... if they were to use the actual movement range of thier computer... it would at most wiggle in place. I know it's a silly point...

[BongHits]

apple needs to make an ad with the imac bitch slapping the **** out of the profile with it's screen (swing it from side to side, then crush the profile with it's half dome :D) then it could end with "But can your profile do that?" and spit out it's cd drive.

[BongHits]

Originally posted by peterjhill
Look at the specs for the new gateway. Let me do a side by side:

Apple============GateWay
700 MHz G4---------------Celeron 1.7
256k L2--------------------128k L2
128MB SDRAM------------128MB DDR SDRAM
40GB UltraATA------------20GB UltraATA
No Floppy Drive-----------.00144 GB Floppy Drive ;-)
24x CD-RW-----------------24x CDR
Mac OS X 10.2-------------WinXP home
1299 999
15" TFT----------------------15" Flat Panel

I would rather have the mac, than the crippled celeron
dude did u pick the worst gateway possible? a celeron processor with 20 gb HD? umm...from my understanding the profiles are equipped with the newest P4 (2.6 to 2.8 ghz) p800 RDRAM 80 or 120 gb HD...its actually a decent PC...but that doesn't change the fact that its a PC. I think the best part of having an apple computer is all about the user experience...if the profile 4 ran os x it'd actually be a decent computer...although it still looks like the inside of my toilet after some good ol mexican food...:eek:

[chubakka]

Those specs are for thier "competitive" bottom of the line Profile.
The iMac for only $300 more is a steal.

By the way... I was just reading about somewhat of a scandal in the pc/intel world... apparently a major benchmarking software was constructed to skew to Intel over amd... intel was leaning on analysts to make the intel p4 sound more powerful than it really was.

http://www.vanshardware.com/articles/2002/08/020826_Unwind/020826_Unwind.htm

[jaguar451]

Originally posted by Snowy_River


Uh, the $999 model doesn't come with a modem... how is this fine for email and internet access?

Missed that missing modem - thanks for pointing it out.

The customize option on Gateways site lets you add a modem for $30 when ordering the system.

$1,029

Still close to 30% more to go with the iMac.

[peterjhill]

Originally posted by BongHits

dude did u pick the worst gateway possible? a celeron processor with 20 gb HD? umm...from my understanding the profiles are equipped with the newest P4 (2.6 to 2.8 ghz) p800 RDRAM 80 or 120 gb HD...its actually a decent PC...but that doesn't change the fact that its a PC. I think the best part of having an apple computer is all about the user experience...if the profile 4 ran os x it'd actually be a decent computer...although it still looks like the inside of my toilet after some good ol mexican food...:eek:

The article is comparing this, the 999 gateway with this mac, the 1299 imac. So yes, I did pick the worst one possible, because that is what the article was comparing.

Gateway has also priced the Profile 4 competitively against the three major flat-panel iMac models, undercutting the low-end iMac by $300. Gateway offers four consumer Profile 4 computers and two business models. Apple offers four iMacs.

[iJon]

it may just be me but i think this is pathetic. you know a company is hurting pretty bad when they compare computers by boot up times. boot up times doesnt mean ****. i am pretty tempted to go take one of our imacs with jaguar up to the gateway store and compare them. once i put jaguar on this machine it boots up pretty damn fast, faster than my 2ghz wintel running xp. anyways, i learned one key thing when i was at an apple seminar in dallas. gateway was going near out of business but aol time warner gave them like 200 million dollars to help stay afloat. thought that was pretty interesting. they also mentioned steve jobs is really only scared or worries about 1 pc company. not dell, not gateway, or compaq, but sony. they are pushing good technology out hte door for a less price. they also told us that when firewire came out sony messed with it a little bit so they can call it ilink and not have to pay a royalty on the product. its amazing what these apple people tell you at a seminar. anyways, gateway doesnt stand a chance.

iJon

[kaltsasa]

I just got the jag upgrade with my sisters imac and i installed it on mine(i have ordered my upgrade but didnt want to wait but i am definitly legal) i also work at uw-plattville resnet, we use only gateway on our campus and they are crap, 7 powersupplies went bad this summer plus many other problems, even my pc using freinds think it is crap. also i am no the macintosh documentation consultant for us-p resnet. very cool

[DavidFDM]

I used to have a lot of respect for Gateway. Wired ran a great article about them and they genuinely appeared to care about their employees and community. My old company had a Gateway for the accountant. I once had to open the case to add some RAM and was impressed by the quality construction. Then, Gateway purchased the intellectual property of Commodore/Amiga. I thought they might be able to do something interesting. Several friends of mine have had their Gateways go south on them. Between that and these iMac comparison ads, it is sad to see a company collapse.

[King Cobra]

>(srobert) As for a Gateway alias, someone came up with a real funny one: GateLaid. I laughed this one out loud.

You like that, huh? :D :D :p

>(iJon) it may just be me but i think this is pathetic. you know a company is hurting pretty bad when they compare computers by boot up times.

Eventually PC comparisons will be done by shut down times. :rolleyes:

I saw the advertisement on Netscape.com a while back and didn't save the advertisement. It featured that crappy thing bouncing from left to right with it's silver attire and all. My reaction:

"SON OF A
http://www.riaa.com/graphics/PA1.gif"

[MacBandit]

So everyone knows. The reason the iMac did so poorly in the Quake test is because they tested it in Classic. The system comes with OSX as the booting system and they do not officially make Quake for OSX so they started it up it brought up Classic and they ran there tests there.

Check out www.xlr8yourmac.com today 08/27/02.

[kaneda]

Funny, PC world will never be perfect...Apple has great software, but no hardware...PC has good hardware but crappy software...

Apple's product design are perfect...PC! Man! Ugly piece of junk!

[bretm]

Originally posted by onemoof
My Dual 867 boots to the login window in 64 seconds. After typing my password and clicking the log in button it takes under 4 seconds to get to a usable state on the desktop.

So I mentioned my PB 400 took over 4 minutes. Seems right on. You have a dual 867. That would roughly be 400mhz x 4. The OS recognizes the dual, so I'd say that's a legit comparison.

[yada88]

Originally posted by petee
Confession;
... After seeing the specs though, the Gateway is underpowered (GF2 MX is "very poor" compared to the GF4 MX series) no DVD burner, and ugly to boot.

Know before you speak. The Geforce 4 mx and Geforece 2 mx are both terrible, nearly identical graphics cards. The Geforce 4mx is no great improvement over the g2mx. Of course, the ti's are a different story.

Oh, and by the way guys, most people who want a DVD burner are going to buy a mac, because if they are doing work that they are going to need to burn to DVD, they're going to use Mac OS. No one doing serious video editing uses a pc. So saying that it is really going to hold them back is comples B$.

One more thing, while the profile 4 is ugly, I would like to go on record saying I THINK THE IMAC IS UGLY. While the design is innovative, and it is a great idea for apple to sell more systems, I don't think the system is aesthetically pleasing. I mean come-on! How big is that bowl on the bottum!?! It has 3x the volume of a ti powerbook. There has to be a more efficient use of space. The "mound" is just too large".

While it is nice to be able to move the screen, it is really just a novelty. How often do you really move your screen in a given day? Except when you are just smiling at your imac and moving it around, it is not very usefull.

[yada88]

Originally posted by onemoof
My Dual 867 boots to the login window in 64 seconds. After typing my password and clicking the log in button it takes under 4 seconds to get to a usable state on the desktop.

I have an Athlon XP 1900+ system with 512mb of DDR ram boots in 34 seconds including BIOS. Login takes about 5 to 6 seconds. Oh, and by the way, the system cost me under 1000$ to build last september. How much does a dual 867 cost now? Gateway has a point when they say that the system has a faster boot time.

[bretm]

If Toyota was run like Gateway we'd see this press release...

In a recent discovery today, it was noted that for much less, a Toyota gives more bang for the buck than a Porsche. Compare the facts... The Porsche seats only 2 while the Toyota seats 4! Both have the same size engine. The Toyota however is 2 feet longer than a porche! The Porsche, 2 doors. The Toyota - 4 or 5 if you count the easy access hatchback model. It also has a larger glovebox and gets better mileage.

For $30,000 more, and less access to compatible parts we can't see why anyone would purchase the Porsche. Toyota parts are available in every auto parts store and cost less...

Well you get the idea. Apple should put pin stripes on all models.

However - it's pretty twisted when the Toyotas start passing the Porsches on the highway. Let's get some horsepower Apple.

[bretm]

Originally posted by yada88

Oh, and by the way guys, most people who want a DVD burner are going to buy a mac, because if they are doing work that they are going to need to burn to DVD, they're going to use Mac OS. No one doing serious video editing uses a pc. So saying that it is really going to hold them back is comples B$.

Well I'm in the professional video editing business. I've burned more DVDs for home videos than for professionals. To me, DVD is still the consumer world. But that could just be my market. I've had more friends and relatives inquire into getting a DVD made than all the clients I've tried to harangue into putting their projects on DVD.

And a hell of a lot more professional video editing is done on the PC. Sad but true. The King Daddy of NLEs, Avid, only produces it's top end systems on NT/2000. Avid Symphony and Avid | DS. Their jump into the HD world has only been on NT.

When Avid almost ditche the mac platform years ago, post houses were forced to jump to NT to get the latest versions of composer. It's just been recently that Avid has brought the two composer lines back into sync with each other. Still no Symphony or DS on the mac. Avid Xpress DV went 2 versions without a mac version.

I don't have any numbers for you, but you just don't see macs in the post houses anymore. Final Cut Pro is slowly making a pretty good dent in that, but it's still considered prosumer and DV even though it's scaleably to uncompressed HD.

[chubakka]

no modem...
20 gigs less HD space...
no CD-RW...

devil's in the details...

if you add the things above... the Profile costs $1159

hmmm... now what happens if we look at the eMac with the same specs... AND a combo drive... ooo lookie... $1099

it's not lcd, but the screen is bigger... if you can't adjust the LCD on a Profile... you might as well get the cheaper eMac

oh and the Profile low end with specs that match the lowend iMac and a combo drive costs... $1259

like I said... it's not cheaper... it's underequipped to SEEM cheaper.
people need to stop whining about how expensive Macs are. The consumer line is very competitive.

[srobert]

with a few simple tweaks you can speed up boot time.

If you're not connected to an active network, (or even if you are, but want speedier startups) go to System Preferences-->Date & Time--->Time Synchronization, and turn off "Network Time Synchronization". This will prevent the long delay at startup caused by the system searching for network time servers. Also, remove any Login Items that you don't use.

[srobert]

Thus far I only found 3 websites reviewing both the imac and Profool and these aren't mac sites. Thus far, imac wins everywhere:

........................Imac...........Profile
ZDnet............7.8/10..........7.1/10
CNet.................8/10.............7/10
TechTV...............4/5................3/5

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by yada88


Know before you speak. The Geforce 4 mx and Geforece 2 mx are both terrible, nearly identical graphics cards. The Geforce 4mx is no great improvement over the g2mx. Of course, the ti's are a different story.

Oh, and by the way guys, most people who want a DVD burner are going to buy a mac, because if they are doing work that they are going to need to burn to DVD, they're going to use Mac OS. No one doing serious video editing uses a pc. So saying that it is really going to hold them back is comples B$.

One more thing, while the profile 4 is ugly, I would like to go on record saying I THINK THE IMAC IS UGLY. While the design is innovative, and it is a great idea for apple to sell more systems, I don't think the system is aesthetically pleasing. I mean come-on! How big is that bowl on the bottum!?! It has 3x the volume of a ti powerbook. There has to be a more efficient use of space. The "mound" is just too large".

While it is nice to be able to move the screen, it is really just a novelty. How often do you really move your screen in a given day? Except when you are just smiling at your imac and moving it around, it is not very usefull.


Don't insult fellow members unless you know of what you speak. No the GF4MX does not offer any of the cool vertex shaders or any of the other stuff that the latest generation of graphics cards offers but it IS a lot faster then the GF2MX. In fact the GF4MX is as fast and sometimes faster then the GF2Ti.

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/Graphics/radeon_8500/index2.html

[nero007]

Originally posted by onemoof
My Dual 867 boots to the login window in 64 seconds. After typing my password and clicking the log in button it takes under 4 seconds to get to a usable state on the desktop.

I have a dual 450 and it took me 63 seconds to startup the computer running 10.2. (That is including login time)

[groundhog troll]

They have my money (NOT) for one of these pieces of garbage. Gatesway imac immation.

[King Cobra]

I think someone has too much time on their hands! :D :rolleyes: :p

>(yada88) One more thing, while the profile 4 is ugly, I would like to go on record saying I THINK THE IMAC IS UGLY.

Are you talking about the 17 inch model? I originally thought likewise, but lighter, until I saw the WideMac in person. My father thought is was cool, and even said it. He also said he liked/wanted an eMac, but he already has a satisfying iMac G3 and OS 9. (Hey, pops, you have no idea what you are missing if you don't have a G4 and OS X muhahahahaha!)

Many people had the same misconceptions about the old iMac G3. However:
(1) Your assumptions aren't worth d[explicit]k until you see it in person, and
(2) I'm using that original iMac right now to type this. Truly, it's old, but it works. Plus, the "pinstripe" job certainly brings back the old and fancy times.

[2Step Garage]

yahoo.com (http://yahoo.com)

Check out that ad for the Gateway all in one.. thing... it jumps around the yahoo home page like the iMac Pixar animation.... this is really rediculous.

[AthensBoy]

hehe

They let you put feedback on the ad. :D

[bobindashadows]

At the http://www.gateway.com/products/desktops/prf4/sweepstakes/yahoo.shtml, where it shows the two lines next to each other, it says "Equipped with an Intel® Pentium® 4 processor option, up to 17" display and top-of-the-line NVIDIA graphics..."
Top of the line?! You can't even configure it past a GeForce2 MX. Sure it's a nice card, but you can't upgrade it more? Give me a break...

[User X]

www.yahoo.com

I just put in my 2 cents. I don't think they will like it.

[dnte42]

Ah, what a funny thread.

I don't suppose I can really add anything that hasn't been said before, except this...

The letters in Gateway are easy rearranged to spell getaway...coincidence, or helpful advice?

[AthensBoy]

Subliminal messaging maybe?

[Balin64]

In response to bretm post:

"It runs like a banshee. Lets not fool ourselves anymore. PCs are ridiculously snappier and faster than macs. Period. Done. End of story. My roommates 1.2 ghz win98 box is infinitely faster at simple tasks than an 800mhz imac running jaguar. Rendering and photoshop aside, surfing and using his computer is a delay-free process. There is no measurable time to open applications. That's what I want on a mac. Make it so number 1!"

I very much respect your opinion; but in my experience using Winchoke machines and Macs (:) there is not much difference; again, in my opinion based on my experience. I have a G4 500 with 1G of RAM and a new iBook 700 384MB RAM both running 10.2. And, until last Monday (when my iBook came WITH Jag: yay!) I was using a Dell P4 at work. And while IE on the Dell always seemed snappier, I believe that Jag has finally bridged the "responsiveness" gap. On both my Mac systems IE, Office X apps all load in under 4 secons; most of the time I barely see the splashscreen! After the Jag install, my little iBook was able to launch IE, Word, Excel, Entourage, iTunes, Palm Desktop, Photoshop and Illustrator in 18 seconds! Now, the Dell is still around our office, I tried launching the same office suite apps, Internet Exploder and Outlook Express... Boy did it choke! It was not pretty; Yes, IE seems snappier in operation on a Winchoke, but any latency in responsiveness in a Mac is well worth it compared to the robust foundation of the OS and all the apps you can have open and not notice a single slow-down... not a one!

Just my thoughts.

Hey, my very first Post!

[DakotaGuy]

My iBook 600, late 2001 with 256MB RAM boots into OSX10.1.5 in 1 min and 6 seconds from the chime to the log in screen. I don't think that is too bad for a 600MHz G3, I would assume the G4 iMac should boot faster then mine, and the new iBook 700 with the 750fx should be faster as well. Who really cares anyhow...if my computer is 20 seconds slower to boot up, I don't care as long as it keeps running well as it does for me. The other thing is I have Windows at my school and the computers are really fast at boot-up and opening stuff when we first get them, but they get slower and slower and slower. My iBook boots faster into OSX 10.1.5 then my school computer a Gateway with a 900MHz Celeron boots into Windows 2k. It should be faster since it has 300 more MHZ. At least that is the MHz theory most people believe.

[Gigglebyte]

Originally posted by topicolo

it takes 20 seconds to boot up to a full working desktop in WinXP on my duron 700.

I think somebody has been smoking something here...I just tested my home system which is an Athlon XP1800, 512 Crucial CAS2, WD 80Gig 7200RPM running XP Pro and my startup time from a cold boot was 41 seconds so I just don't see how a little old duron 700 could do it in half the time.

[Gigglebyte]

Originally posted by topicolo

it takes 20 seconds to boot up to a full working desktop in WinXP on my duron 700.

I think somebody has been smoking something here...I just tested my home system which is an Athlon XP1800, 512 Crucial CAS2, WD 80Gig 7200RPM running XP Pro and my startup time from a cold boot was 41 seconds so I just don't see how a little old duron 700 could do it in half the time.

[Gigglebyte]

Originally posted by boom-boom

Taking a quick shifty over at toms hardware guide:

http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/02q2/020522/index.html

the Geforce4 mx in not much better than Geforce2 mx, and the iMac still got smoked maybe Apple should not try palming off second rate tech making people think they are getting something nearly as good as the Geforce4 Ti.


I think somebody needs to get their facts straight before they shoot off their mouth. if you look at the link you referenced you will see that it does say that the GF4MX is a new version of the GF2 BUT Tom's did a review on ALL the cards they have reviewed HERE (http://www17.tomshardware.com/graphic/02q2/020418/vgacharts-02.html) and you will see that the GF4MX is quite a bit faster than the GF2 and to make things even worse the iMac uses the GF2MX which IS a lot slower than the GF2!! Now I would also like to see where Apple is trying to 'palm off second rate tech' and say it is nearly as good as the GF4Ti?

[cthorp]

When comparing the Profile 4 to the imac several things became apparent. If you want the same capacity HD, speakers, a professional OS, or combo drive you had to pay extra. I added it all up and it was over 1800.00. Then the kicker, I called Gateway to "ask" some questions. When I said I wanted to burn dvds I was told that the technology didn't really work and was not perfected, plus it was not even an option. Sounds like BS from the barnyard.

BTW I stood in line till 12:30 a.m. to get Jaguar. I wonder if Gateway will ever have lines like that at their store?

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by Gigglebyte


I think somebody has been smoking something here...I just tested my home system which is an Athlon XP1800, 512 Crucial CAS2, WD 80Gig 7200RPM running XP Pro and my startup time from a cold boot was 41 seconds so I just don't see how a little old duron 700 could do it in half the time. I got the same results as you except my setup is Athlon XP, 512ECC cas2.5, wd 120gig 7200rpm running xp pro. Mine was 40 seconds. However, the motherboard did go through some system checks and if I turned those off it may go faster.

[dethl]

My iBook 466mhz Graphite edition with 192mb ram took 1 minute 36 seconds to get to the login prompt. After that, it was another 17 seconds to a usable desktop. I really don't care about startup since I rarely reset my computer anyway. Getaway and their Profile suck monkey balls. I wish I lived in a big city to go over to one of their "stores" and bug em about their piece of cow crap.

This is how I would see a conversation with me and a gatelaid tech would go:

<me> Why does your Profile suck?
<Gateway dude> It doesn't suck, its top of the line!
<me> If its top of the line, then why do I have to pay extra to surf the net, and enjoy DVD's on it?
<Gateway dude> *remains quiet*

Hehehehe:D

[zarathustra]

Originally posted by boom-boom


Next point PDFs, well the os is built on the god damn things (well postscript anyway!)



Quartz, is based on PDF - so yes you are right it should be faster than anything else; however, PostScript was NEVER a basis for MacOS X GUI. PostScript based GUI was first introduced in the NeXT line of machines and the "classic" MacOS was able to draw PS on the screen, but the GUI was not based on it.

BTW, It's a sad day when a company targets a specific product from a specific company by copying their concept for the advertising. Unfortunately, the herds of people seem to like Steve "DUDE" and a talking bovine, and yes they equate great computers with a weed smoking teenager and a freaking talking cow. I am afraid to face the fact that your average person is just an unsophisticated simpleton. Since we are Mac users, and not average, no reason to flame me.

¢2

[dnte42]

Ah, but a talking cow could be funny...if done right. Course, I think the ETrade super bowl commercial with the monkey and two old men dancing to La Cucaracha was one of the best ever...someone oughta make a switch add where the iMac come in guns a'blazin' and smokes the Getaway machine, then tips the cow. And then the cow says 'moo'. Funny.

[beatle888]

Originally posted by spinner

Besides people who are going to buy a Mac are going to buy a Mac regardless of what crap Gateway puts out.


thats a silly statement.:p

[chubakka]

"The new Gateway Profle does backflips over the iMac"

now that's silly!!!!

[Dignan]

Not sure if this has been posted, but i saw the full tv ad.

Gateway looks lots prettier in its "animated" form, which must have been intended, and it wiggles alot, and the imac is stiff (ironic, since imac screen moves and the other dont). anyhoo, each times it jumps over one it says how its faster, works with more programs, does this, does that, and its cheaper.


I just think its funny that you guys are all mad, like the average person watchin the news is gonna go "DAMN THEM! THOSE ARE BASED ON IMACS RUNNING 10.4!!! AND WHERES THE SUPERDRIVE?! DAUGH!!!"

[jelloshotsrule]

that's the point though dig. most people don't know that the commercial is pretty much all off... i mean, i'd believe that the profile is faster, but other than that it's not even close. and it's not even cheaper as they say

along with the misrepresentation of the moving monitor and whatnot....

so yeah, most people won't realize it. but that's why it's upsetting...

[chubakka]

we all know that the average american won't know that it's a big scam...and a pile of poo. I just feel sorry for the suckers that buy one.

[Dignan]

my point is that maybe its not worth TOO much complaining if its not gonna actually do anything about it. Everyone should be watching rushmore instead.

[chubakka]

yeah but... what???

that makes LESS sense then what you said before...

what's not gonna change what? for who? when?

and yeah we should all be watching the Thunderbirds...

[job]

Originally posted by Dignan
THOSE ARE BASED ON IMACS RUNNING 10.4!!!

lol. :D

it's all good.

[Dignan]

nah, im just saying that us pointing out how the ads are biased doesnt fix the ads, nor does it inform joe computer that they are biased...all it does is prevent us from watching rushmore, and thunderbirds (respectivly, of course)

Unless, we all chip in for a full page ad in this sundays new york times declaring the ad false.....but id rather watch rushmore

[MasterX (OSiX)]

When I saw this comemrical late night during Conan i was pissed. I even came back here after promising myself to get away from Mac rumors. Well this tears it. Let's see what i should say. I few things have me angry:
Some people "know" too much. "The GF4MX is a crap card." You could argue the GF4Ti is better, or that the Radeon9000 gives you more for the price, but you should be more specific. It's better than the GF2MX you get otherwise, how's that for an argument?? For people who don't have as much time as me they should know a little something about architectures of GPUs, nVidia has 3 out right now: GeForce2, GeForce3, and GeForce4 (sorry i forget the nv20 and whatnot codes). The GF2 and 4 come in a few flavours, but the MX is the bottom, and Titanium is the top (Pro and what not is inbetween). The GF4MX is a GF2MX with better ram and clock speed, but it's still a GF2. The GF4Ti (seen in Apple's PowerMac 1st of course) is a new system, it kicks ass (but I still want a Radeon9700 on Jaguar with drivers, that will rule).
"Final Cut Pro" is not pro. Bull, some people are working in really high end positions, and they need to get back to work. But I had an argument about this before and the guy schooled me but still I argue- FCP3 isn't prosumer, some might be able to swallow a $1000 piece of software, but most can't. FCP is also the most used software solution, not some crap from Avid, or the all too popular Premiere. FinalCut Pro is the staple in web, TV, trailers, and is even used for some movies. HD: good point, avid is probably ahead here, but not like Apple is sitting there, they have HD capture cards that work (well) with FCP3, they have computers to handle it, and they built the 23" HD Cinema for HD Editing. Why? Not for cinema, but for TV which is going HD obviously. Eventually FCP will be used for everything, but it's not a prosumer app, nor is it considered one. Is the company editing a $500,000 Cocoa-Cola commercial still considered prosumer? I doubt that somehow.
One of my theories which i'm sure will come true sooner or later- iWeb. An Apple branded web browser, based on a OS X native core, and which would rely entirely on Cocoa and Quartz. Apple can't go on with a 3rd party shipping web browser. MS's is even in the OS code for crying out loud. It'll happen eventually. And it will rule. Why? Because I can't think of anything to add to a web browser, but Apple can. It will definately combine the beauty of OmniWeb, speed of Chimera, and compatability of IE5 (which is oddly the most compatable browser on OSX). I mean for an OS so embedded in the 'net, how can apple not have a web browser. And let's not bring up OpenDoc for those of us who rememeber webDog. Ahh the good old days.
Performace. What is performace mean to you? For me performance is speed where it counts. This means scrolling, OpenGL, PhotoShop, and Quicktime (which runs compressing and Final Cut). A PC can open PhotoShop faster than even a Dual 1.25Ghz Mac, but once you're running it? All bets are off, the PC is gonna die. And if that wasn't enough, obviously with Quartz Extreme (whcih works great on any iMac with the GEFORCE2/4!) and Jaguar the system feels much more responsive (even though my copy is still on the way).
The mac advantage. Why do I put up with a "slower" system? Well in the time i save with all the genious parts of MacOS X such as path names in the window bar, the dock, quicktime integration, drag and drop, and so on and so on I think I'd probably get more done in a day than any PC user with a dual 3GHz OC'ed Xenon. Oh and I have dual displays, that helps me get things faster. I have IE's window on the right, and the report I am supposed to be writing of the left. And It's too bad you can't measure troubbleshooting time. Mac takes 70 seconds to reboot? Then the mac has a 70 second troubbleshooting time 99.99% of the time. PC has a 20 second boot time? Well I bet it's even faster in safe mode, which is good, becase when i go to your house and you've been in safe mode for a week and you can't even USE DirectX and Quake3 i will be there to laugh in your face while you're reformatting.
As for 3D performance I know something has to be up with that. I heard it was classic, i think either that or software rendering. Thank god the mac comes with working OpenGL drivers, i bet they would have botched that up too. But it's impossible because I think my G4 500 when it was new, running the Quake 3 Demo in OS9 (back in '99 guys) on the stock AGP2x Rage128 16MB SDR RAM card probably got around 30fps. Now I have a pimpin' R200 GPU but i digress, the iMac should be able to get about 100fps i think, GF4MX packs a huge whallop for those simple games (no TC&L required, 12MB texture max, simple AI, low polygon count, and so on).

What I guess i'm saying is that speed isn't everything, and even if it is, you make up for it in many more places than a PC gains on the iMac. There are so many reasons to go to a mac NOW, not the other way around. And our laptop LCDs look like GetaWay's desktop ones. So if you have an iMac 14" you're pretty much looking at one of these CowDung4s or whatever they're called.

[MasterX (OSiX)]

If they ever argue price remind them that MacOS X has $1000 Roman and $10,500 Japanese fonts. Wow, if i ever met a PC user from Japan that would be useful knowledge.

[DakotaGuy]

If you wanna go cheap...real cheap...why not just get a Classic iMac for $799...sure it is a CRT and is a 600MHz G3...but even so how much better is a Celeron even if it is clocked at 1.7 GHz? From my experience clock speed makes no difference on a Celeron processor. Okay the Profile has a flat screen display...but the iMac has a hard drive with 40GB of space and at least you can dial up and surf the net with the included 56K modem. It also has built in speakers. So for $200 less you can actually use the Classic iMac right out of the box.

[MiamiURedhawks]

My first post...my first Mac...I am what you would call a switcher...got sick of Winblows and all the problems I had with it. Just picked up my new 17 inch iMac today...ready to go...looking forward to doing things 'differently' and without BSOD.

As for Gateway - at least their cow is more intelligent than that Dell idiot! :)

If anyone has any tips for the ultimate newbie, please let me know! :)

Regards,
Mike Davis

[jaguar451]

Originally posted by MiamiURedhawks

If anyone has any tips for the ultimate newbie, please let me know! :)

Regards,
Mike Davis [/B]

And you already found the rumour site(s).... :-)

Mac OS X: The Missing Manual
by David Pogue. (http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=4-0596000820-4 - links to a used copy, but in any event, I like to support independent book sellers)

macosxhints.com for advanced tips and tricks.

versiontracker.com for what software is new.

maccentral, macrumors, and macworld tend to be the Mac sites I visit the most. (I'm a relative newby, so other suggestions welcome here as well.)

Good luck - wish I could easily upgrade the monitor on my 15" G4 iMac.

[iwantanewmac]

BAH! Gateway.............to hell.............. :)

[yada88]

Originally posted by King Cobra
I think someone has too much time on their hands! :D :rolleyes: :p

>(yada88) One more thing, while the profile 4 is ugly, I would like to go on record saying I THINK THE IMAC IS UGLY.

Are you talking about the 17 inch model? I originally thought likewise, but lighter, until I saw the WideMac in person. My father thought is was cool, and even said it. He also said he liked/wanted an eMac, but he already has a satisfying iMac G3 and OS 9. (Hey, pops, you have no idea what you are missing if you don't have a G4 and OS X muhahahahaha!)

Many people had the same misconceptions about the old iMac G3. However:
(1) Your assumptions aren't worth d[explicit]k until you see it in person, and
(2) I'm using that original iMac right now to type this. Truly, it's old, but it works. Plus, the "pinstripe" job certainly brings back the old and fancy times.

While the 17" imac is significantly better looking, I still think both are ugly. And yes, I have seen them both in person.

[Gigglebyte]

I still think the best switcher commercial would have Steve 'Dude' saying.... 'Dude....I'm buying a MAC!!!'

[jaguar451]

Originally posted by Gigglebyte
I still think the best switcher commercial would have Steve 'Dude' saying.... 'Dude....I'm buying a MAC!!!'

Steve Dell and a Jersey Cow sitting at home in front of their respective computers (17" iMac, PM with 23' Cinema display.) Steve turns to the cow and says "Dude, can you imagine how things would be if we had to use the computers that we pitch during the day?".

Closeup of Cow; fade to Cow's "imagination" - show bad stuff on WinTel boxes ("Good thing rebooting is so fast; I've had to restart 5 times in the last hour, etc.")

Back to the Mac lab. Cow says "I love you, Mac" and gives her machine a big hug.

;-)

[emagdnimy]

Originally posted by Gigglebyte


I think somebody has been smoking something here...I just tested my home system which is an Athlon XP1800, 512 Crucial CAS2, WD 80Gig 7200RPM running XP Pro and my startup time from a cold boot was 41 seconds so I just don't see how a little old duron 700 could do it in half the time.

i'm not sure what boot time really has to do with, but i'm pretty sure its not all the latest and greatest hardware. my roomate has a 1ghz p3 system.....it was running 98 and it booted in about 20 seconds. i really couldn't believe it, because my 400mhz powerbook takes forever. but then again it crashed on my almost every ten minutes...literally. and lets just say that mac os x almost never crashes...because it does! and when it does its ugly. i took pictures with my digital camera if you want evidence..kinda funny...all the kernel panic garbage spit all over me desktop. but anyway, now my roomate has xp and it got a little slower, about 25 seconds to boot. so just because you have a really hot system i wouldn't immediately assoociate that with hot boot times because there seems to be a lot of wack crap going on in pc's!

[bousozoku]

Originally posted by beatle888


sure, but gateway will air their ads more. possibly making it
look like their campaign idea in the first place.....honestly ive
only seen that cute imac ad twice AT MOST on tv. I dont
think this is good for apple, but im not saying it's horrible.

For a while, the mimicky iMac advertisement was running once or more an hour on CNBC and fewer times on more expensive channels.

I saw the Gateway advertisement tonight and, while not exactly thorough, it leaves enough doubt with the number of programmes available that people who won't look for a programme to discard the iMac rather quickly.

We need more games and the power to run them to entice people to use a Macintosh.

[LimeiBook86]

I just saw the ad on Tech TV! It was horrible! all it dose is wiggle its base, which is prorbaly un-wigglable, then it does a flip over the imac and then back, then it sticks out it's puny DVD/CRW and the tray wiggles like its gonna fall off, the guy says "Gateways new profile 4 is cheap then the iMac" he forgot to ad "and crappier too" I like the ad cuz of the free publicity for Apple :)

[dethl]

Originally posted by LimeiBook86
I just saw the ad on Tech TV!

I saw the ad as well on TechTv...that profool is a horrible looking machine, with specs to match. Gateway is slowly fading away into nothingness...the cow will finally be put to rest.. forever.

[vniow]

I just saw the ad on TNN. Base and monitor movements simulated. :rolleyes:

[Jeffx342]

Gateway just plain sucks,

it doesn't even have advd-burner as an option

[chrisfx811]

haven't read every post in this thread, but here's my .02
i just got my new 17 in imac and i don't see any version of the profile that would make me think twice
cheaper??? spec for spec it doeesn't really seem so, hard drive is smaller, no dvd-r option.
other than probably a fast processer the gateway doesn't seem to offer much at all.
mac will always have the adjustable swivel screen, all the cool , free software that newbies like myself love, superdrive, and jaguar.....
damn, i can't stay away from my computer, i love this thing! quick question, why does my "e" key seem to stick so much???

[gopher]

Originally posted by chrisfx811
haven't read every post in this thread, but here's my .02
i just got my new 17 in imac and i don't see any version of the profile that would make me think twice
cheaper??? spec for spec it doeesn't really seem so, hard drive is smaller, no dvd-r option.
other than probably a fast processer the gateway doesn't seem to offer much at all.
mac will always have the adjustable swivel screen, all the cool , free software that newbies like myself love, superdrive, and jaguar.....
damn, i can't stay away from my computer, i love this thing! quick question, why does my "e" key seem to stick so much???

e key? Do you mean like eMachine?
Or do you have a sticky key? If you have a sticky key, it probably is due to something having spilled in the keyboard. Most likely hair and dust. Take a business card or something that think and pass it between the keys and try and get the gunk out.

[jefhatfield]

imac still better

but $999 gateway has fast processor at 1.7 ghz, good graphics card with 32 megs, and ddr ram and compared to beige or black box pcs, this is better than them

i think gateway has made a worthy effort for a pc but it lacks the fine details of apple's industrial engineers but gateway certainly makes better looking machines than dell, compaq hp, toshiba, or ibm

sony isn't bad, but apple is still head and shoulders above the rest and i wish the average joe computer user would see this...with less than five percent market share, people still seem glued to their windoze machines

they are just too familiar to the way microsoft works and don't know any better

i am guilty to some point since i have never given linux a try and i admit i use windows for my pc laptop when i could be using linux which is much better...and free

[sean8102]

LOL that commercial is funny. My cousin owns a Gateway and even he as a windows use said it SUCKS and he would never buy another agian he is getting a new computer (I tried to get him to swich and he said he would if apple computers where cheaper) I think he just dose not belive in the megahertz myth. Anyway TechTV said they did not like the profile 4 and said the 3D perfomance was the worst. And if you look at the bottom of the screen during the TV ad it say's "base and monitor movements simulated".:D

[pianojoe]

Originally posted by MasterX (OSiX)
e of my theories which i'm sure will come true sooner or later- iWeb. An Apple branded web browser, based on a OS X native core, and which would rely entirely on Cocoa and Quartz. Apple can't go on with a 3rd party shipping web browser.

It won't be called iWeb, that's too cheap! I won't tell you what they will call it, but the name will definitively raise some iBrowse.

:D

[scem0]

Originally posted by sean8102
My cousin owns a Gateway and even he as a windows use said it SUCKS and he would never buy another agian he is getting a new computer (I tried to get him to swich and he said he would if apple computers where cheaper

That is true with soooooo many people. If apple cut their prices then they would have sooooo much more business. oh well :o

:D

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by scem0


That is true with soooooo many people. If apple cut their prices then they would have sooooo much more business. oh well :o

:D

crt imac 799
emac 1099
ibook 1199

cheap enough, but i would like to see, at mwsf 2003;

crt imac 599
emac 949
ibook 999

that would get your friend to switch, and of course i would like to see those lower prices with the added RAM and speed bumps which usually come every macworld anyway...i remember when sj moved the crt imac from 999 to 799 which i think was a great move in the right direction...it's the reason the crt imac is still alive

[gopher]

Apple has already cut prices as low as it will go and still keep things profitable for themselves. Apple already is cutting corners by sometimes sending in faulty motherboards to repair centers for replacement parts (I'm waiting now for the second motherboard for this machine in a week all covered under warranty), and all people do is complain they can't make them cheaply enough. So which is it? Do you want cheapness or do you want quality? Sadly you can't have both! Apple's more expensive machines have lasted longer than any other machines in the market at the time. Some people still run off Mac IIs. The Mac IIs were built like tanks. Now one can be had for $25. If you don't like Apple's current prices, check the refurbished/open box prices at http://www.megamacs.com/ http://www.macresq.com/ http://www.sunrem.com/ http://www.powermax.com/ and sometimes even under Apple's special deals section. Also if you can't budget for a new Mac all at once, Apple offers 5 year loans, 3 year loans, and even a 3 months same as cash purchase plan. So believe it not, it doesn't have to be one big gulp to swallow all at once in terms of cash. Students, educators, government employees all get discounts as well. So before you complain how cheap Macs are, ask yourself, would you rather buy a cheap computer now with known deficiencies, or a slightly more expensive computer and pay it off over 3 months and get a better quality out of it? Honestly if Apple made these machines any cheaper I'd be worried.

[jefhatfield]

apple has the best industrial design and best innovative ideas of any computer company so that could explain why they charge more, too

the pc crowd will always have cheaper machines because the parts can be built in much larger quantities making volume discounts possible...and pcs are so interchangeable and macs are more proprietary but now with uva and ata and usb, macs have come down some which is good

quality is still with apple for now...i would hate to see apple slip on their machines...even in the 90s when people said apple was down, their machines were good

[macmax]

you know, always the ugly girl talks about the beautiful one.
it would be strange seeing porsche comparing itself with a honda.
the honda in this case is the gateway.
by the way , i think they had to have a comparison beetwen the mac and a 2.6ghz ugly gateway,hahhahah
long live tha mac

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by macmax
you know, always the ugly girl talks about the beautiful one.
it would be strange seeing porsche comparing itself with a honda.
the honda in this case is the gateway.
by the way , i think they had to have a comparison beetwen the mac and a 2.6ghz ugly gateway,hahhahah
long live tha mac

gateway and dell are the hondas, vw's and big three in detroit, and the mac is the lambroghini of the computer field

but remember, those 100k/150k lambroghinis priced themselves into bankruptcy mainly because the market share got too small and one of the big three bought them out

watch out what you wish for

oracle almost bought apple in 1997, ms put money/investment into apple, dell could easily buy apple at this point

i don't want to point out the obvious again, but apple is a business and not a non profit made to make us diehard mac faithfuls happy

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by jefhatfield gateway and dell are the hondas, vw's and big three in detroit, and the mac is the lambroghini of the computer field


Apple is no Lambroghini. Lambroghini's require way too much maintenance and they're uncomfortable. You may get away with saying they have Lambroghini style, the luxury of a Rolls and the reliability of a Honda, but they're priced like a BMW’s....

The high end is for those few and far between. We’re talking all the bells and whistles like the 745i I consider that the DP 1.25 – 23” etc. Then you have the 5 series, which is the DP 1 & 867. After that comes the 3 series priced low enough for many consumers, but still out of reach for the budget consumer similar to the iMac and the Z3 is 17” iMac. The BMW Motorcycle, ibook. Of course the M3 and M5 are the TiBooks. So that leaves us with the eMacs. I don’t know what to do with the eMac.

[Geetar]

It's a Mini............a Rover made by BMW.

[pgwalsh]

Sounds good to me!

[BongHits]

Originally posted by Geetar
It's a Mini............a Rover made by BMW.
umm...BMW makes both the new Rovers and Mini's...so which r u talking about?

[P-Worm]

Not another thread that has degraded to the way over used car analogy! People, this has to stop!

P-Worm

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by P-Worm
Not another thread that has degraded to the way over used car analogy! People, this has to stop!

P-Worm

sorry...car analogies don't work because apple is truly unique and a transportation vehicle does not encompass what a mac is...a part of the family;)

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by jefhatfield


sorry...car analogies don't work because apple is truly unique and a transportation vehicle does not encompass what a mac is...a part of the family;) Can you get an educational IRA for one? :p

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by pgwalsh
Can you get an educational IRA for one? :p

that would be nice

i just have a problem with my tibook rusting when i take a shower with it

darn those rusty, rusty tibooks:p

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by jefhatfield


that would be nice

i just have a problem with my tibook rusting when i take a shower with it

darn those rusty, rusty tibooks:p That could raise some eyebrows. Well, depending on your relation to the Tibook. :p

[Geetar]

Originally posted by BongHits

umm...BMW makes both the new Rovers and Mini's...so which r u talking about?

Er....no...........BMW offloaded Rover to a private consortium well over a year ago. They kept the good bits for themselves (sounds like several other companies I can think of)

Anyway, as everyone else has said, enough of this bollocks:D

[jefhatfield]

does bmw or mercedes have a plant in mexico? or do they both?...and does that make either of those cars cheaper to purchase in the united states?

i have a volvo from '84 and am quite loyal to the brand but if i got another car, i would like a mercedes station wagon because like volvos, they last and last

funny thing, i see a lot of bmw's, but rarely an old one...same with jaguar, lots of new ones but very few over ten years old

i see tons of ford trucks, volvos, and toyotas well over ten or fifteen years old on the roads and many still in really good shape

[macmax]

reliability like a honda,come on, hondas are the biggest pos i have ever seen

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by macmax
reliability like a honda,come on, hondas are the biggest pos i have ever seen

hondas are reliable and last a long time, too

but i like my volvo...he he

not very fast though and after 21 years of driving, only one speeding ticket

[macmax]

Originally posted by jefhatfield


hondas are reliable and last a long time, too

but i like my volvo...he he

not very fast though and after 21 years of driving, only one speeding ticket

i had one,even if i have to walk,i don't take rides if it is in a honda pos.
mine was new and i now hate that company to the guts.
this is my way of saying no to them, to tell you the truth , honda could give me one of their cars for free and i would not take it,i am against that branch,period

[macmax]

Originally posted by jefhatfield


hondas are reliable and last a long time, too

but i like my volvo...he he

not very fast though and after 21 years of driving, only one speeding ticket

i had one,even if i have to walk,i don't take rides if it is in a honda pos.
mine was new and i now hate that company to the guts.
this is my way of saying no to them, to tell you the truth , honda could give me one of their cars for free and i would not take it,i am against that branch,period

[Yellow99Stang]

So i am a former mac user but current windows user. I also use linux. And i agree with your cousin, i don't wanna switch as much as i just want a mac too; maybe i really am a technology who-are like my dad says, but in regards to my latest computer, i just couldn't afford a Mac, they are pricey especially if you want a powerbook Ti or a DP powermac with a 17 inch flatpanel(cause they are so cool looking and i don't think i could have a CRT knowing that was out there!!) But for $1200 I built a top end AMD system with absolutly everything i could fit into the casing and a 19 Samsung Monitor. But my personal problem was that since i am no longer current with the mac i don't have software and Office is $400 alone. Ah well maybe next summer.

As for the Gateway v. apple ad. I have concluded that most people who are currently shopping for a computer blindly don't really know about apple and their products and that they are different and easier to use. So i can't understand why for the life of me Gateway would showcase the competitions merchandise and in essence give the otherwise unknowing consumer reason to go out in search of the Imac to test it out. Seems like stupid marketing to me. Here in the NYC metro area i have only seen the switch ads 2 times shocasing apple products, once during a Giants game and once on CNN, where as the Gateway ad is constantly on CNN and every sporting event i see. I think they are drumming up business for apple and every print ad show the imac standing next to the gateway all in one thing. Very silly. When I went to buy my Mustang GT the broschure they gave me disn't say anything about a Z28 in there. Oh well too bad for the dummies at gateway, dude if your gonna buy a pc get a dell.
my 2 cents on cars: American Cars rule, if you take care of them they last forever, how many volvo's bmw's, MB's , or Hondas or toytoas do you see from the 60's? Not many at all, cause they were junk and rusted apart or were not worth keeping. And if you ever leave the country you will see all the cheap Volvo's, Saabs, Mercedes and BMW's that they don't ship here. They are stipped down with no ac, no safety features, and have sticks and roll down windows. We only see there top of the line products, so don't get all high and mighty and try to compare this and Dailmer and BMW to the likes of Jaguar and Porsche, Like if the only Ford and GM products that were shipped to the rest of the world was lincolns and cadillacs, imagine how that would look too. And if you did ever leave the country you would see that people would give their left one to have something like a vette or a big old caddy. Wake up and see the light, the Golf and Civic and Volvo are not the car equivilant to Apple.

[macmax]

Originally posted by Yellow99Stang
So i am a former mac user but current windows user. I also use linux. And i agree with your cousin, i don't wanna switch as much as i just want a mac too; maybe i really am a technology who-are like my dad says, but in regards to my latest computer, i just couldn't afford a Mac, they are pricey especially if you want a powerbook Ti or a DP powermac with a 17 inch flatpanel(cause they are so cool looking and i don't think i could have a CRT knowing that was out there!!) But for $1200 I built a top end AMD system with absolutly everything i could fit into the casing and a 19 Samsung Monitor. But my personal problem was that since i am no longer current with the mac i don't have software and Office is $400 alone. Ah well maybe next summer.

As for the Gateway v. apple ad. I have concluded that most people who are currently shopping for a computer blindly don't really know about apple and their products and that they are different and easier to use. So i can't understand why for the life of me Gateway would showcase the competitions merchandise and in essence give the otherwise unknowing consumer reason to go out in search of the Imac to test it out. Seems like stupid marketing to me. Here in the NYC metro area i have only seen the switch ads 2 times shocasing apple products, once during a Giants game and once on CNN, where as the Gateway ad is constantly on CNN and every sporting event i see. I think they are drumming up business for apple and every print ad show the imac standing next to the gateway all in one thing. Very silly. When I went to buy my Mustang GT the broschure they gave me disn't say anything about a Z28 in there. Oh well too bad for the dummies at gateway, dude if your gonna buy a pc get a dell.
my 2 cents on cars: American Cars rule, if you take care of them they last forever, how many volvo's bmw's, MB's , or Hondas or toytoas do you see from the 60's? Not many at all, cause they were junk and rusted apart or were not worth keeping. And if you ever leave the country you will see all the cheap Volvo's, Saabs, Mercedes and BMW's that they don't ship here. They are stipped down with no ac, no safety features, and have sticks and roll down windows. We only see there top of the line products, so don't get all high and mighty and try to compare this and Dailmer and BMW to the likes of Jaguar and Porsche, Like if the only Ford and GM products that were shipped to the rest of the world was lincolns and cadillacs, imagine how that would look too. And if you did ever leave the country you would see that people would give their left one to have something like a vette or a big old caddy. Wake up and see the light, the Golf and Civic and Volvo are not the car equivilant to Apple.

i am with you in a way, but the allmighty porsche is the best car all around,i have only travel to 14 countries though

[jefhatfield]

mostly, i do car analogies for fun

but like i said before, there really is no car that is the equivalent to apple

macs are the most unique product i have ever seen in the marketplace and among the mac users i know, i know of no product with the same type of loyalty as the mac

i love my volvo, but i would not get upset if i got a new vette or porshce to replace my volvo

i like the grilled chicken sandwich at mcdonald's better than the other stuff there but if they took if off the menu, i would adjust

i am a 49ers fan and if the franchise dissolved, i would still watch football and eventually pick a new favorite like the raiders (my second fav anyway) or the chargers in san diego

but if macs went off the market, i would severely miss them and no pc would ever give the same feeling as the mac

and thus, for me, the mac is very unique and is unlike any product, car or otherwise, that i have ever seen in my 40 years:p

[ibookin']

Originally posted by jefhatfield
mostly, i do car analogies for fun

but like i said before, there really is no car that is the equivalent to apple

macs are the most unique product i have ever seen in the marketplace and among the mac users i know, i know of no product with the same type of loyalty as the mac

i love my volvo, but i would not get upset if i got a new vette or porshce to replace my volvo

i like the grilled chicken sandwich at mcdonald's better than the other stuff there but if they took if off the menu, i would adjust

i am a 49ers fan and if the franchise dissolved, i would still watch football and eventually pick a new favorite like the raiders (my second fav anyway) or the chargers in san diego

but if macs went off the market, i would severely miss them and no pc would ever give the same feeling as the mac

and thus, for me, the mac is very unique and is unlike any product, car or otherwise, that i have ever seen in my 40 years:p

Well said. Mac are indeed truly unique in this way.

[Yellow99Stang]

Agreed, i wasn't very clear as i am hastily typing cause i am at work. Th e911 TT is king of Production cars and the GT2 and GT3 are some of the greatest cars ever period. Maybe the next Powerbook Ti could be very closely compared with say the Carrerra 4.!! :D

[danielwilliams]

Originally posted by bobindashadows

actually, yes i have. My friend has an athlon 1.2 Ghz (i think, might be 1.4) that he built himself, and it starts up on windows 98 in about 10 seconds.

Just too funny:p ...

!.2 Ghz and it runs windows98.....

WOW!!! Next you will be crowing about running jet fuel through your lawn mower...