Going to Europe. Need advice.

[Steven1621]

I could use a bit of help from some of you European members out there.

This summer, I will be backpacking London and Paris for 12 days. (6 days in each city) I have looked online and in some books as to what is cool to see, but I would like some ideas from "real" people. What is worth seeing? What isn't so great? Any help would be appreciated. Many thanks.

[Applespider]

Lots of advice in this thread about both Paris and London

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=99247

[Blue Velvet]

If you're backpacking, you may be on a tight budget.

If you need accomodation, then you could try the YHA (http://www.yha.org.uk/Home/Home_Page/index.html).
They have a beautiful hostel in Holland Park, just off Kensington High Street...

Link (http://www.yha.org.uk/hostel/hostelpages/141.html)

London = expensive

[Sir_Giggles]

This summer, I will be backpacking London and Paris for 12 days.

You going solo or with a travel buddy?

[edesignuk]

London = expensive
Add to that the current value of the $ vs £ :eek:

[whocares]

Add to that the current value of the $ vs £ :eek:

As well as $ vs. € (that's a Euro sign in case it doesn't come up on your screen ;) )

So I guess you'll find Paris to be expensive too...

[Steven1621]

You going solo or with a travel buddy?

yup. me and a fellow college kid.

[Steven1621]

Add to that the current value of the $ vs £ :eek:

yeah it is going to going to cost a lot. fortunately, i get a lot of discounts as a student. i have been doing a lot of research to save money.

[Steven1621]

So I guess you'll find Paris to be expensive too...

Living in New England and spending a lot of time in New York City, I know how expensive it will be. I'm not so much concerned abotu the cost as I am with getting my money's worth. If I am spending this much money, I want to get the most out of my trip.

[OutThere]

Living in New England and spending a lot of time in New York City, I know how expensive it will be. I'm not so much concerned abotu the cost as I am with getting my money's worth. If I am spending this much money, I want to get the most out of my trip.

Even against NYC prices, things in Europe are quite expensive. On getting your money's worth in Paris, I would suggest the following.

See a couple of the "tourist" attractions. It's necessary to visit the Eiffel Tower, even though it's blatantly "touristy" and very expensive, it offers some incredible views of Paris. If you are on a really tight budget, you can get some pretty nice views from L'arc de triomphe. The Louvre (you don't have to go in, closed tuesdays) is incredible, and a joy to just wander around. Also, Notre Dame is: :eek: :eek:.

I would suggest that, once having been sufficiently acclimated with the city through the tourist zones, you should wander through the streets, visit little cafés and parks, see the little boutiques and street corners that are filled with life. Tour the bustling quartiers. This is the magic of Paris. While doing this, you have to have a good map. No exceptions. Without a good map you will lose hours trying to find your way back.

Something else you probably will no matter what, do, is eat at a small, bustling café on the street, outside. Have a sandwich and a coffee. It is an experience, that is uniquely from Paris.

Another thing that you'll need to do is to walk (stick near the Seine river) at night. Paris isn't called the City of Lights for no reason. :)

Something else that is really awesome are European castles. At some point during your time there you might enjoy visiting a medieval castle, as many of them are able to be toured. They are so incredibly disconnected from the world that we live in today, that they create their own bubble of perfection, and vivid history....blah, enough with the fancy schmantzy I wish I was there right now stuff, but in any case, the castles are cool (woowoo I can do alliterations!)

Well, I hope that maybe at least one of these suggestions will help contribute to your journey in Europe, and I really hope that you have a great time. :)

edit: BTW: If you are taking your computer, which you might, (I would), buy the Apple power outlet adapter kit (40 USD), it's a lifesaver. :)

[Applespider]

Haviing said that it's expensive, make sure you've budgeted enough to make the holiday worthwhile.

A bed's a bed (unless you wanted the full Ritz/Savoy experience) and you don't have to go to very expensive restaurants (the Stockpot and Bodeans in the thread mentioned above are good and cheap!). But don't skip out on the sights themselves. I had two friends from Vancouver who came over to see London - but then decided that they didn't want to spend the cash to go into the Tower of London or St Pauls (time your visit with a service - you only have to pay to go into the Whispering Gallery IIRC).

Don't pay for the following - the London Dungeon and Madame Tussauds are a rip-off and you won't learn anything about London besides how to stand in a long line.

Many of the museums/galleries are now free in London and worthwhile going to - although obviously it depends what you're into. I like the British Museum, Museum of London and the Tate Modern. I go to the V&A if there's an exhibition I'm interested in (I used to go to see their glass staircase but now there's a better one in Regent St :) )

Check whether buying a weekly travel card might work out cheaper than the daily ones - then you can jump on/off buses/Tubes without any problems.

[jayb2000]

I could use a bit of help from some of you European members out there.

This summer, I will be backpacking London and Paris for 12 days. (6 days in each city) I have looked online and in some books as to what is cool to see, but I would like some ideas from "real" people. What is worth seeing? What isn't so great? Any help would be appreciated. Many thanks.

I have not been to London, but have been to Paris twice.
For dinner/going out somenight, check out the Bastille district, some good clubs and restrants. There is a great Cuban restraunt - I forget the name.

If you like sculpture, find the Rodin museum, it was a great experience, without the hustle of the Louvre.

The best time to go to the Eiffel tower is just before sunset. You can go up during the day, spend 30 min looking at the views and then watch the lights of the city come up.

One tip: Learn a little french before you go. If you can at least start a conversation or find the bathroom without saying "EXCUSE ME, WHERE IS THE TOILET?!" You will find are much better received. I have heard many Americans say that French are rude. But those are generally the same people who complain about people in the US not speaking English. If you are in a country where English is not the native language, at least make the attempt to speak that language, its polite and makes it easier to get along. Paris is a large, metrpolitan, international city, but there are people that do not speak English. Not trying to be preachy, just I have found it makes it a more pleasant experience.

Oh, as a college student, if you are into any of the French Philosophers (Camus, Baudriarde, etc) then you must go spend a few hours at a good sidewalk cafe drinking coffee, writing or discussing something weighty. Now and then a bit of spirited discourse revitalizes the mind.

Bon Chance and Bon Voyage! :D

[johnnyjibbs]

To echo what others have said, London and Paris will be very expensive compared to America, and especially at the moment with the current exchange rate. You'll find that with many things you'll be paying nearly as many pounds as you were dollars (although £1 currently equals almost $2).

Don't expect your student discount to help you much either, especially as it's an international one, but give it a try anyway - no harm in that.

Both London and Paris have good transport networks and bus/tube/metro passes aren't too expensive. Plus, although your accommodation will be expensive (even "cheap hostels" in London), walking down streets, seeing sights and looking in shops isn't. Many museums, such as the Science Museum and Natural History Museum in London are free to enter (although you may not want to waste any time in those, even though they are good museums).

Don't miss the Chanse E'llise (no idea how you spell that!) or the Luvre and Eiffel Tower in Paris, plus Sacre Cur (spelling!) and the Arch de Triumph. In London, don't miss Big Ben and the Houses of Parliament, Tower Bridge, the Tower of London, the London eye (and don't forget to glance over at the Millennium Dome but don't bother visiting it because there's nothing there!), Oxford Street and Regent Street (I gather you'll be wanting to peek in the Apple Store there!), Buckingham Palace and some of the parks in the centre.

Above all, have a good time and explore the back alleys!

[wordmunger]

I found that the most impressive things in both Paris and London were things that I already knew something about. Seeing Rousseau's grave at the Pantheon in Paris, or Elizabeth's portrait in the National Portrait Gallery in London, meant more to me than, say, the Eiffel Tower or the houses of parliament, because I had read Rousseau's Social Contract and studied Elizabeth in college. So, my suggestion is to do a little research in advance, and find the things that have some bearing on your own reading or study -- no matter what your interest, I'm sure you'll find important sites relating to it in both Paris and London. Then seek them out when you get there.

[OutThere]

When in London, I've heard that the Cabinet War Rooms, and Churchill's Secret Bunker are an incredible place to visit, and only £7.50 to get in. You can take a virtual tour online at the website, and it looks really awesome. :)

[Ugg]

I second the suggestion for the Rodin Museum. If you go take some time to look at Les Portes de l'Enfer (http://www.musee-rodin.fr/senf1-e.htm) . Ils sont Incroyable!

[puckhead193]

what ever you do, DO NOT do the london eye, a waste of an hour or more. Vist the apple store in London :p Go to the Effiel tower and go to the top (isn't there a post office on top of the Effiel tower) and take a boat rid on the Sin river. Try a crepe esp with nutellia (did i spell that right) I forgot the the name, but i'm sure a few of u might know this, what that "hill" that has a good view of paris......There are some good shops and resturant around there.....

[Blue Velvet]

what ever you do, DO NOT do the london eye, a waste of an hour or more.


I love the London Eye, especially at sunset.

But I think it really helps if you know what you're looking at. As a local, I had many people in our capsule asking me what this or that was and I think that's what makes the difference. You just need the details to be fleshed out a bit... people just weren't sure exactly what they were looking at.

[wordmunger]

what ever you do, DO NOT do the london eye, a waste of an hour or more. Vist the apple store in London :p Go to the Effiel tower and go to the top (isn't there a post office on top of the Effiel tower) and take a boat rid on the Sin river. Try a crepe esp with nutellia (did i spell that right) I forgot the the name, but i'm sure a few of u might know this, what that "hill" that has a good view of paris......There are some good shops and resturant around there.....

The "hill" is Montmartre, and on top is the Sacre Coeur cathedral, a very famous but (relatively) unimpressive sight -- but there are indeed great views from the top of the dome. You can take a funicular railroad to the top of Montmartre or use the (very long!) staircase.

[takao]

Don't miss the Chanse E'llise (no idea how you spell that!) or the Luvre and Eiffel Tower in Paris, plus Sacre Cur (spelling!) and the Arch de Triumph.

i second that... the Sacré Coeur with all it's suroundings is really worth a look

and i add the first (smaller) model of the state of liberty on that list ..might be interesting to you

[Steven1621]

many thanks to all for the advice. this is a lot more helpful than any book. i am working on my french so that i can say basic phrases. i am hoping to find some great political conversation with some europeans as well. a persective different from an american's is a very welcome insight.

[OutThere]

many thanks to all for the advice. this is a lot more helpful than any book. i am working on my french so that i can say basic phrases. i am hoping to find some great political conversation with some europeans as well. a persective different from an american's is a very welcome insight.

Knowing some basic phrases in French is a very good thing, and don't let me discourage you, because it will help immensely, but let me note that you shouldn't feel intimidated, because a large number of people there speak english quite well, which makes things easier, but it helps to be able to say, order food, ask where a bathroom is, or be able to ask where you are. :)

[Ugg]

Remember, you will no longer be in America. I'm not being sarcastic, just pointing out something that many travelers forget. Things will be done differently, and a winsome American smile won't count for what it does back home. If at all possible in a new situation where you are doubtful as how to proceed, look around and see what others are doing. The Brits, as evidenced by those on this board, are invariably friendly and mostly understandable :D

The French can be great as well, but you'll be there during peak season and tempers get frayed so take it all with a grain of salt and remember that French froideur is the equivalent of the American, "Have a nice day! :) " It can be just as appealing if taken the way it is meant.

[wordmunger]

Best piece of advice I ever got for getting good service from French merchants: Whenever you enter a shop or restaurant, make sure you smile and greet the shopkeeper with a cheerful "bonjour" (or bonsoir, as appropriate).

This is considered common courtesy in France, whereas in America we wait for the shopkeepers to greet us.

[Abstract]

When going to museums in many cities, it's generally cheaper to wait until 2 hours before it closes. You'll either get in free, or you'll get charged half price or something. I believe this is true at the Musee D'Orsay in Paris, if I remember correctly. Its possibly the same at the The Louvre, but I don't remember.

Its quite overrated if you don't have a strong appreciation for paintings of Jesus and other religious things. Places like the Versaille Palace, Eiffel Tower (not even sure if it's worth going to the top...), Sacre Coeur and Montmartre, etc, may be of more interest for you if you're not an art freak. Same with the Musee D'Orsay since it contains lots of Post-Impressionist artwork that is easier for regular folks to appreciate. Think Claude Monet or something. ;)

Many museums in London are free.
Make sure you go to Greenwich so that you can see where 0 degrees longitude is. Pretty cool. :) And there's a "pie shop" there where you can get beef pies and apple pies and such for very cheap. Good place for lunch. ;)
Go to the Apple Store.
Go to Camden Market, or the 2 markets near Liverpool St. Station (Spitalfields and the other one...forgot the name :( ) since they have great stuff for cheap.
McDonalds £1 burger menu is as cheap as you can get, and not a bad sized McDonalds burger if you don't mind eating at McDonalds.

[Steven1621]

How far is Arles from Paris? There is a grand prix track meet there, and it would be cool to go to that. Is it easy to get to by train or other mode of transportation?

[johnnyjibbs]

Oh, and don't forget that while you'll be greeted with a smile and an enthusiastic "Bonjour!" in French shops, you'll most likely be greeted with a grunt if you're lucky in Britain from someone chewing gum! We British in general have some way to go in terms of shop greeting attitutes! :D

[JohnStrass]

How far is Arles from Paris? There is a grand prix track meet there, and it would be cool to go to that. Is it easy to get to by train or other mode of transportation?

Arles is too far, but on the TGV everyting is close....

I lived in France for 2 years, one of them in Paris at the Sorbonne.
My favs: Notre dame (don't go to the top, just buy a good guide book there which explains the architecture and windows for you) , walking along the Seine across the Pont des Arts at night, continuing down to the ile saint-louis. This is all very close together and good for a few hours' saunter.

My favorite view is from the top of the Centre Pompidou (also close to notre dame) where you can have a coffee. Also, the museum there is one of the best if you like Modern art ( i.e. late 19 to early 20 century art: Dali, Bacon, Balthus and the like).

One of the most touristy things to do is dring wine on the steps of Sacre Coeur / Montmartre at night. It is one of those things that are packed with tourists (many strumming guitars and getting baked) that is just so nice that you expect it to be crowded.


Everyone loves the Rodin museum, and sculptures are usually not part of travelling shows, unlike the impressionist patintings which are in the USA pretty often. It is not too crowded.

Take a day trip (on the train) to Chartres. Probably the best gothic church in the world. Again, read before you go. you are in college after all and if you are interested in history it will make your visit fantastic. Thats where the color term "Chartres blue" came from BTW.

I lived in london for a month and loved the parliament tour - you can sit in the gallery and watch them debate: more down to earth than the USA: one Lord came and chatted with me.

A day trip (again by train) to Cambridge or Oxford is a must.

[Frump]

Dude, here's the beef on Paris! Forget the language part it will only delay things. Just point with an expectant look on your face. Don't bother doing all that tourist crap. Go directly to euro Disney and do not leave until you need to board your plane to leave, they have this science fiction cannon looking thing that you can get in-to and you get shot in-to the air or some thing like that. Other cool things are all the freaky looking cartoon creatures walking around. The Eiffel tower is nothing like the science fiction cannon looking thing in euro Disney. Not quiet sure what that thing is in Euro Disney but it looks like a whole lot more fun than all those cultural buildings.

If you need advise on anything else please don't hesitate to ask.

Frump.

[skunk]

Oh, and don't forget that while you'll be greeted with a smile and an enthusiastic "Bonjour!" in French shops
When did you last visit Paris?

[Blue Velvet]

Don't bother doing all that tourist crap... Not quiet sure what that thing is in Euro Disney but it looks like a whole lot more fun than all those cultural buildings...

:eek: :D :confused:

[skunk]

In London, I would recommend visiting some museums, if you like that kind of thing, such as the Victoria & Albert, the British Museum and the National Gallery, walking around Soho (keeping everything well secured) and, if you have time, visit Richmond Hill. Best view in London, good riverside pubs and five minutes from the 2000 beautiful acres of Richmond Park with its 600 deer. Of course, I might be somewhat biased. :p

In Paris, take a "bateau mouche" (http://www.bateaux-mouches.fr/English_index.htm) glass-covered ferry trip on the Seine, visit the Père Lachaise cemetery (http://www.pere-lachaise.com)(home to Oscar Wilde, Edith Piaf and Jim Morrison). The Quartier Latin, near the Sorbonne, is full of great little restaurants whether you're into French, Arab, Tibetan, Chinese, West Indian, African or Southeast Asian food. Forget the flea markets (marchés des puces): full of absolute tat.

[OutThere]

Dude, here's the beef on Paris! Forget the language part it will only delay things. Just point with an expectant look on your face. Don't bother doing all that tourist crap. Go directly to euro Disney and do not leave until you need to board your plane to leave, they have this science fiction cannon looking thing that you can get in-to and you get shot in-to the air or some thing like that. Other cool things are all the freaky looking cartoon creatures walking around. The Eiffel tower is nothing like the science fiction cannon looking thing in euro Disney. Not quiet sure what that thing is in Euro Disney but it looks like a whole lot more fun than all those cultural buildings.

If you need advise on anything else please don't hesitate to ask.

Frump.

What am I supposed to make of this? It's a joke, right?

[skunk]

What am I supposed to make of this? It's a joke, right?
I certainly hope so.

[Blue Velvet]

...if you have time, visit Richmond Hill. Best view in London, good riverside pubs and five minutes from the 2000 beautiful acres of Richmond Park with its 600 deer. Of course, I might be somewhat biased. :p

I love Richmond Park! :)

[skunk]

Great for horse-riding, too.

[Blue Velvet]

Great for horse-riding, too.

Aaah... horses are not quite my thing, best left to the experts.
I'm afraid I'll never make the horsey, twin-set & pearls brigade...

Isn't there a time of the year when the deer in Richmond Park are a little frisky, apparently? Slightly aggressive or is that rubbish?

[Frump]

What am I supposed to make of this? It's a joke, right?

What! you don't want to go to Euro Disney... Shame, I was hoping you could tell me all about that cannon thing they have there. Not sure but I think Aerosmith have something to do with it. One of those sponsored rides or something like that. Watch out for Donald duck! I hear the french version is actually some bloke in a costume.

Frump.

[skunk]

Aaah... horses are not quite my thing, best left to the experts.
I'm afraid I'll never make the horsey, twin-set & pearls brigade...
I'm glad to report that you don't need to wear a twinset to ride a horse. I actually learned when I was working as a Jackeroo on a sheep station in NSW in 1971...

Isn't there a time of the year when the deer in Richmond Park are a little frisky, apparently? Slightly aggressive or is that rubbish?
Rutting season is in October. They also close the park for a day in the autumn (that's "fall" to you Yanks) for culling.

[Ugg]

Rutting season is in October. They also close the park for a day in the autumn (that's "fall" to you Yanks) for culling.

Aha! The perfect solution for those redcoats upset over the hunting ban, turn them loose in the park for a day or two! They could cull (kill) to their hearts delight and do a public service as well.

[Blue Velvet]

What! you don't want to go to Euro Disney... Shame, I was hoping you could tell me all about that cannon thing they have there. Not sure but I think Aerosmith have something to do with it. One of those sponsored rides or something like that. Watch out for Donald duck! I hear the french version is actually some bloke in a costume.

Frump.


:D ;)