19inch iMacs?

[arn]

The Inquirer (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=5267) cites a story from the Taiwan Economic News that reports that 19inch iMacs are due in Q4:

15 inch iMac (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2002/08/20020822171217.shtml) production had previously been reported to be slowing down in October per a previous Digitimes report

[Mr. Anderson]

It sounds great, but will the price Apple asks for the machine be worth it? I can't wait to see one in the Apple Store....

D

[ddtlm]

I'd like to see an "iMac Pro" sporting a top-o-line G4 with L3, plus a larger screen. Charge enough so no $ is lost from tower sales. I'd even think about getting one, not sure if I would though.

[dwishbone]

well, all i can say is they were right about the 17" iMac.
i hope this is right too. can justify my waiting until now to get one.
bring on the 19 incher.

[jelloshotsrule]

there are two reasons i'm skeptical:

1. there is no 19" lcd from apple (yet!) so i think that will happen before the 19" imac... though the lcd could come soon.... paris or whatever

2. this would be a true prosumer machine... which would be blurring the line b/w imac and powermac..

that said, i'd still like to see it and don't doubt it will happen...

[amnesiac1984]

yeah but the 17" screen on the imac is nothing like the 17" studio..........
SO why has a 19" iMac screen got anything to do with when they release the 19 "studio, unless the studio will be widescreen Which would be cool. even so your logic doesn't follow as they released the 17" iMac and there is no screen to match it in the studio range. Does anybody know if even the 15" imac uses the same actual LCD as the 15" studio, i mean thats been around a lot longer!

All I'm saying is that there not being a 19" studio has nothing to do with whether or not there would be a 19" iMac coming or not.

:)

[technocoy]

i'm betting this deal is for a 19 in. studio display.

to put it on an imac is insane...
1: the current case design won't allow for it
2: a 19 in lcd display would nearly double the imac price
3: they are in need of a middle ground display (between the 17" and the 22")

just trying to be a little more down to earth here...

go look at the 17 inch imac in person and you'll see that a 19in just wouldn't fit with the current case, and i'm betting apple's not gonna redesign this soon

later:D

[Zaren]

Jeez... hanging a 19 inch LCD on the end of that arm would be nuts... you'd have to bolt the base to the table to stop it from falling over :)

I'd much sooner bet on it being an external monitor than a new iMac... the 17" is pricey enough.

[TechLarry]

The native resolution of 17" and 19" LCD's are typically the same (1280X1024).

Other than for people with bad eyes who need larger type, I see no need for the extra cost.

TL

[dhdave]

I'm not sure what you people are basing your physics on, but I've looked at the iMac many times in both 15 and 17 inch variants and I've gotta tell you that a 19" iMac would be no problem whatsoever for the current base and arm. That monitor arm is far stronger than you realize and the extra 2 inches of weight is absolutely insignifigant. I'm not saying they are going to do this or even that I think they should, but it's not at all impossible. :p

dh

[ffakr]

Originally posted by dhdave
I'm not sure what you people are basing your physics on, but I've looked at the iMac many times in both 15 and 17 inch variants and I've gotta tell you that a 19" iMac would be no problem whatsoever for the current base and arm. That monitor arm is far stronger than you realize and the extra 2 inches of weight is absolutely insignifigant. I'm not saying they are going to do this or even that I think they should, but it's not at all impossible. :p

dh

Insignificant?
I have a 15" LCD imac.. total weight is somewhere around 27-28 lbs.
I just ordered a 18" lcd for work... Aside from the $999 price tag, it weighed over 25 lbs with the tiny speakers and the power brick.

Let's make some estimates...
iMac base: 15-20lbs
18" lcd (surrounding plastic, no speakers, no power brick): ~15lbs.

Lexan is heavy after all. You think that putting 15lbs on an arm, and pulling it out in front of a 15-20lb base isn't going to make it tilt over? You'd need to leave the cd drawer out as a kick stand ;-)

Where did you learn physics?

[rainman::|:|]

Well this discussion doesn't sound at all familiar... bickering about whether the arm would support it or not, etc etc. BTW, dhdave, he meant that the whole thing would tip over, not that the arm would break...

so in proper iMac upgrade fashion, i'm going to bitch. Why in Gods name does anyone need a consumer machine with a 19" LCD? it'd be (guessing) as expensive as a G4 with a 15"... and then you'd have expansion capabilities. The pro and consumer lines do not need to be blured anymore. That's not to mention how god--awful it would look... seriously, i love apple, but i sure as hell wouldn't pay $2000+ for a computer that doesn't even have a PCI slot. christ...

that said, i would like to see the 15" Studio display phased out, and a 19" put in, as people were suggesting a while ago... i think most other companies have abandoned the 15" for pro users... tho granted they're not LCD based...

it just seems weird to me that so many of you were the ones rooting for Apple to pull a $599 internet appliance out of their asses, to be cheap and appeal to the masses, but the computer that currently *does* that you want upgraded with unnecessary features...

:)
pnw

[technocoy]

the point is mister physics....

apple is a design conscious company, from a design point of view the 19 in won't work... the 17 barely does... simply because visually it would be out of scale and look like it was just "hung there"

I was not implying that it was physically impossible...:)

later

[sphereboy]

TIMBER!!!

[scem0]

Originally posted by Zaren
Jeez... hanging a 19 inch LCD on the end of that arm would be nuts... you'd have to bolt the base to the table to stop it from falling over :)

I'd much sooner bet on it being an external monitor than a new iMac... the 17" is pricey enough.

I have to agree. A 19 inch mon on the current iMac would look.... well.... ludicrous/silly/bad, not to mention that it would be unbalanced etc.

[Johnny7896]

I think it would be cool if the screen could be turned sideways. Like the old radious view monitors. This would give you a portrait view.

[xelterran]

maby if they release the g5 sometime soon they could make a pro 19inch g5 imac, that would be rather cool!

[sparkleytone]

Originally posted by ffakr


Lexan is heavy after all. You think that putting 15lbs on an arm, and pulling it out in front of a 15-20lb base isn't going to make it tilt over? You'd need to leave the cd drawer out as a kick stand ;-)

Where did you learn physics?

Where did you learn design?? Apple is well known for doing the so called impossible with their industrial design. It's called not limiting yourself. Erase all boundaries. There are no lines. Think outside of the box.

If physicists and mathematicians ran the world, there would be no such thing as an airplane.

I believe it, if anyone can design it, Apple is a company that can.

[fishdoc]

Well, just taking a few seconds to look at Apple's site reveals this:

Weight of 15" iMac: 21.2 pounds
Weight of 17" iMac: 22.8 pounds

So, a difference of only 1.6 pounds. And it may not even be that the entirety is made up from the screen - I have no idea if the base or components differ at all, or if the 17" includes and added ballast to keep it stable. Of course, the difference in wt between a 19" and a 17" will be greater than between a 17" and a 15", but still - my guess is that physics would not stop a 19" from being plausible.

Fish

[gandalf55]

pretty cool... 19" iMac. With Superdrive & all...

This is great for mid-level consumers and schools... but it seems like thats the push. I don't see a ton of effort or innovations for the pro line. They want the edu market back and i don't blame them. how about spreading the love across the user base too?

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by Johnny7896
I think it would be cool if the screen could be turned sideways. Like the old radious view monitors. This would give you a portrait view.

Exactly. My first thought on seeing the iMac is that they finally incorporated that... 'course it would be a little odd with the 17", but still... it'd not be that much more expensive, it could be a BTO option. 'course it'd be nice if they simply got around to selling BTO imacs...

[dhdave]

The people who are saying a.) it's impossible, b.) it would fall over and c.) it's not necessary are utterly rediculous.

a.) It's entirely possible

b.) It WON'T fall over. It will barely weigh 2 lbs more. MAYBE 3. Not enough to make a dent. PERIOD.

c.) ANYTHING people will pay for is necessary. Sorry to shake you from your conservative roots, but there is and ALWAYS will be a market for increased screen size. I can't believe anyone in their right mind would call a 19" iMac "ludicrous".


Finally, I am the one who started the original thread on the $399 crt iMac. What does one have to do with the other? Apples and oranges. High end and low end. Loss leader to increase market share. Why is this so hard to understand? Sheesh. :confused:

dh

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by gandalf55
pretty cool... 19" iMac. With Superdrive & all...
This is great for mid-level consumers and schools...

If a 19" LCD is mid-level for consumers now, what's high-level?

And how could schools justify the money for a bit of screen real-estate? the largest thing they usually do is a newspaper, and i've seen those things done on an SE ;)

pnw

[dhdave]

Originally posted by ffakr
Where did you learn physics?

Obviously at an institution that actually teaches it, unlike others around here. ;) :p

dh

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by dhdave
Finally, I am the one who started the original thread on the $399 crt iMac. What does one have to do with the other? Apples and oranges. High end and low end. Loss leader to increase market share. Why is this so hard to understand? Sheesh. :confused:


the iMac is low-end! That's been it's whole existance! It's how people can afford a Mac without having to buy a G4 tower. I just cannot imagine the lowest-end desktop being $1500-1700 and a contemporary desktop being $1800-2100... These are *consumer* machines!

:)
pnw

[dhdave]

So according to your logic we can't have a high end and a low end consumer machine? I see a VERY clear difference here. Sorry if you don't.

dh

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by dhdave
So according to your logic we can't have a high end and a low end consumer machine? I see a VERY clear difference here. Sorry if you don't.

There already is a high end and low end consumer machine. You're talking about pushing the high-end consumer machine above the low-end pro machine. Nothing like confusing the hell out of people. Last time Apple muddied the waters of their product lines, they almost died. That's not to say that it was the sole cause by any means (can i say Amelio here without getting banned? ;) ) but it certainly contributed. That's why Jobs went to the 4-square plan. Which still exists (mostly) today... Point is, if you need a 19" LCD display, get the powermac...

:)
pnw

[Hemingray]

Absolutely ridiculous. I said it last time this came up and I'll say it again: there is absolutely no way they are going to put a 19" screen on the current iMac. Anyone with common sense who looks at an iMac, then looks at a 19" LCD screen, can put 2 and 2 together and realize that the thing will look awkward and probably be top-heavy.

If Apple does indeed do this, which is the biggest doubt in my mind since the iWalk, then I will be sorely disappointed with Apple's design team.

[dhdave]

Originally posted by Hemingray
Absolutely ridiculous. I said it last time this came up and I'll say it again: there is absolutely no way they are going to put a 19" screen on the current iMac. Anyone with common sense who looks at an iMac, then looks at a 19" LCD screen, can put 2 and 2 together and realize that the thing will look awkward and probably be top-heavy.

If Apple does indeed do this, which is the biggest doubt in my mind since the iWalk, then I will be sorely disappointed with Apple's design team.

I respect your point of view, but I remember people saying things like this about a 17" iMac. Again, I'm not saying that they will do it, only that they could. Quite easily.

dh

[neilt]

I agree with both Hemingray and dhdave on this one.

It is more than possible to put a 19" monitor on the imac base. the difference from the 15" to the 17" is only 1.4" so another 1.4" should give you 19.
Apple's Cinema HD display is a 16:10 ratio. if you used those numbers as inches and then figured out the diagonal you would get 18.7 (that pretty much says 19" to me:) )
That really isn't much bigger than what is already there, so i would think it is really possible. Especially if they cut down on the outer trim of the display. My TiBook only has about a 1/4 of trim around the screen, cut down the trim on the 17" imac and it would barely be larger than the 15" . Do the same with a 19" and it would be about the size of the current 17"

That said...I think the 17" already looks a bit out of proportion. It would suprise me if Apple were to make one that was even more out of proportion, but Apple has suprised me in the past :rolleyes:

neilt

[Billicus]

Originally posted by dhdave


I respect your point of view, but I remember people saying things like this about a 17" iMac. Again, I'm not saying that they will do it, only that they could. Quite easily.

dh

We'll just have to wait and see won't we... :D

[Hemingray]

Originally posted by dhdave


I respect your point of view, but I remember people saying things like this about a 17" iMac. Again, I'm not saying that they will do it, only that they could. Quite easily.

dh

Absolutely, I respect your point of view as well. If anyone could do it, Apple sure could. :) But it just seems to defy logic to me why they would want to. 19" just seems to be stepping out of bounds for such a consumer computer, especially the way the current iMac is designed.

Instead of bigger and bigger screens, they should be concentrating on other stuff, like, um, oh, a front USB/FW port? :p

[dhdave]

Originally posted by Billicus


We'll just have to wait and see won't we... :D

Definitely. And you know, that's really the best part. Watching to see how these things turn out. :D

dh

[dhdave]

Originally posted by Hemingray
Instead of bigger and bigger screens, they should be concentrating on other stuff, like, um, oh, a front USB/FW port? :p

You hit the nail square on the head with that one. I couldn't agree more. :)

dh

[bretm]

Originally posted by Hemingray


Instead of bigger and bigger screens, they should be concentrating on other stuff, like, um, oh, a front USB/FW port? :p

I'm confused. I thought the USB was on the front and that the CD tray was on the back. I just wish they'd move the power cord around back with the CD tray

:)

[C4!™]

Originally posted by bretm


I'm confused. I thought the USB was on the front and that the CD tray was on the back. I just wish they'd move the power cord around back with the CD tray

:)


I actually have the power button on the front with the cd tray to one side and the ports to the other side... Works great, just turn the iMac 90 degrees.

[Telomar]

Just a couple things.

Firstly Hon Hai has apparently been awarded the contract for production. If this is the case Apple will have significantly cut costs based on the contract prices being charged. Quanta charges significantly more than Hon Hai.

Secondly if they use a 19" LCD it will likely be widescreen. This means lower costs compared to regular ratios.

Thirdly the LCD will likely a 5th generation LCD rather than the 4G currently used. A 17" 5G LCD should cost around the price of an old 15" LCD and the 19" should come in probably near current 17" prices. That alone means it wouldn't be hard to switch the monitors without incurring additional costs.

Finally I don't have a clue about the arm. If the current one couldn't support 19" though no doubt they just redesigned it or improved it. I'd be interested on what sort of fatigue testing they do on those arms though.

[OSeXy!]

I've just come back from Paris where in the last few days the streets have been plastered with posters for MW on the 10th. Strangely, all the posters have a head-on shot of a _15 inch_ iMac with a blurb describing all the things you can do with it. I thought Apple would use the opportunity to show off the 17" - the 15" looks a little too familiar, now. But if Jobs does have a 19" surprise up his sleeve, maybe the ads make sense: the visual shock of the larger screen combined with the psycholgical vibe that says, "Wow, if you could do all that stuff on a 15-inch screen, imagine all the things you can do on a 19-inch!". Only likely if Apple has somehow got a great deal on larger displays.

[mcrain]

I've read quite a few posts from people about both the possible 19" iMac and the 14" iBook. Many of you seem to think that bigger is somehow a mistake.

I have one question.

Have you seen the typical American lately? American's are becoming obese. Why? Because serving sizes are increasing. Studies have repeatedly shown that when a company increases the serving size of its product (15% more chips per bag or whatever), they sell more of the product. People want more and bigger servings. It's part of American culture now.

How does that translate to computers?

Gee, why do you all think the Mega-hurts myth is such a big deal? It isn't because Americans want a computer that works better, they want a faster/bigger machine (same reason why 17" monitors are standard instead of 15"), same reason why car manufacturers increase horsepower, same reason so many people buy aftermarket equipment for cars/boats/computers.

I guarantee you that there is a market that will pay extra for a computer with a 19" monitor just because it is bigger than the 19". Go to best buy or comp USA and watch regular people, especially older people, shop for laptop computers. They gravitate to the ones that appear to have bigger screens. I've seen many people walk right by a machine with better processors, memory, etc... without even reading the card just because it looks smaller.

Oh, and as for you people arguing about physics, haven't any of you seen the weights held up by cantelever bridges? If it falls over, it won't be made, therefore, if they choose to make a 19" iMac, I guarantee you it WON'T fall over.

[lazyrighteye]

I might take this rumor "seriously" if the Inquirer spelled iBook correctly.

What's an i-Book?

[Uragon]

If the rumor is true (I hope it is), what will happen to Gateway's Profile?

[os4]

Originally posted by ffakr


Insignificant?
I have a 15" LCD imac.. total weight is somewhere around 27-28 lbs.
I just ordered a 18" lcd for work... Aside from the $999 price tag, it weighed over 25 lbs with the tiny speakers and the power brick.

Let's make some estimates...
iMac base: 15-20lbs
18" lcd (surrounding plastic, no speakers, no power brick): ~15lbs.

Lexan is heavy after all. You think that putting 15lbs on an arm, and pulling it out in front of a 15-20lb base isn't going to make it tilt over? You'd need to leave the cd drawer out as a kick stand ;-)

Where did you learn physics?

I am in no way a physicist, but I do know that physics involves many more variables than weight.

Firstly, I actually went to the Apple Spec page to get REAL weight figures for the displays and the iMac in order to have some refernce to what ADDED weight, the iMac would have to support with a 19" display. Here are the spec's:

15" Studio Display: 11.5 lbs
17" Studio Display: 14.55 lbs
23" HD Display: 25 lbs
15" iMac : 21 lbs

Given that most of the material involved in a stand-alone display is not necessary for one attached to the iMac, there is significant weight savings. More importantly, a 19" display (if you use the above numbers as reference) equates to about 18 lbs. You are accurate in your 15 lbs estimate, assuming that there is 3-4 lbs saved from no feet, ports, or cabling.

More importantly, look at the comparative numbers: a stand-alone 19" display is perhaps 2-3 lbs heavier than the 17". I am confident that the iMac base can support an added 2-3 lbs.

Regardless, the physics of a cantilever is mostly at work in the iMac. You don't even consider it in your post. There is a good reason why Ives designed a 10" diameter base and not a 5" diameter base.

In conclusion, the question of where you learned physics is irrelevant. It is obvious you never even learned physics.

[tsb2rxn]

I think it is entirely possible for Apple to make a 19" iMac. If they wanted to, they could simply reduce the size of the trim and increase the screen size. The overall size of the attached screen would therefore not change much. Worst case scenario would require a larger base to balance the computer. This wouldn't be so different from making a larger iBook case to accomodate the 14" screen. However, I don't think it will happen for economic reasons. I don't see 19" iMacs being very cheap if they come out anytime soon. If they do, I'll be the first in line to get a 17" iMac at a reduced price ;-).

[pimentoLoaf]

Looks like I'll be waiting a few more months for an iMac...

[dnelsongb]

I am an Apple technician for a school district. I myself do like Apple. But lately I've heard nothing but bad experiences with these LCD screens. They do not posess the quality that the separate LCD screens have. Screens tend to flicker and fade on both top and bottom of the screen. Even without lots of use, these screens aren't as sturdy as they look. Physically they are strong but the make up of them are anything but. Truthfully I'm not sure why the screens are turning out this way, but it sure is preventing any iMac purchases anytime soon for this school district.

Apple you make a pretty machine but...
Make it right the first time
Live up to your claims of true promises of speed and quality, not this fake Dual Processor enhancements with DDR ram that doesnt even utilize its true benefits.

People beware, Apple beware.

I change my attitude from I Love Apple to I Like Apple. Lately they have greatly disapointed me as an avid user.

[Buggy]

Simple test for those that will think it is going to tip.

Go to your 15/17" iMac and hang some wieghts off of it. Put the arm all the way down inorder to get the most leverage.

I had arguements about the 17" tipping with peopel. I suspect that anyone that thinks this is going to tip has NEVER seen an LCD imac except online or in print. These things are very bottom heavy.

I tried tiping one at work and I must have pressed down 20-25 pounds of preassure before it tipped. I think even a 22" monitor will hold up just fine.

Re: the look.

Again I don't think those that are complaining have ever really worked at an iMac. the screen obscures all veiw of the base when you are working with the monitor pulled forward (the way I like to work anyway.) So then if you add any size of monitor it will not make it look any different to the users. It will just be a bigger better monitor.

[wilburpan]

Originally posted by Hemingray
19" just seems to be stepping out of bounds for such a consumer computer....

To my mind, saying that a 19" display is out of bounds for a consumer computer is like putting a cap on how much RAM or hard drive space a consumer computer should have. I'm sure most people would heartily support putting more RAM into an iMac of any model, and that most people would support getting the biggest hard drive you can when configuring your machine.