Full Speed [Archive] - MacRumors Forums

victoria_skimboards

Jan 5, 2002, 10:05 AM

The Mac vastly improves upon the ease of using a personal computer. The iPod vastly improves upon the ease of (effectively) using an MP3 player. What other "lifestyle appliances" are difficult to use or have poor usability?

- Extensive A/V systems
- VCR's
- PDA's
- Cell phones
- Automobile computer systems

The last one intriques me the most. No, this is not the fabled chip in the engine compartment that controls shift points and things like that. This is the collection of systems in the "cockpit" of the car: GPS, stereo, heating/air conditioning controls. Most of these systems are very difficult to use and this level of difficulty prevents you from A) driving B) using them to their full potential.

But what if... (cue music please)
Apple designed an "automobile computer system" and it was installed in a heck of a cool car (BMW M3?). Voice recognition, always-on wireless, and a sweet interface.

GPS? No problem.
Hands-free cell? No problem.
Listen/dictate emails and IMs? No problem.
Price tag? Perhaps a little bit of a problem.

It could happen -- full speed ahead and lust factor ten.
Rather this than a TiBook with a larger processor and a 10x CD-RW.

detroitsuperfly

Jan 5, 2002, 10:10 AM

Dang! Apple getting into the porn industry?

beigemac

Jan 5, 2002, 10:23 AM

The full speed ahead thing may have a double meaning as in that Mac SanFran is coming soon, and also as a CPU speed metaphor. Now how many things have a lust factor of ten? I know the female species think i have a lust factor of ten. Female life gaurds running in slow-mow on Baywatch have a lust factor of ten! Heck some of you may even think Fake Britney Spear porn images have a lust factor of ten (u perverts)! A Mac kicking a PC's ass or even a SGI's ass in 3d rendering, now a mac like that will definetley have a lust factor of OSX!!!!!

Mr. Anderson

Jan 5, 2002, 10:35 AM

Lust factor ten? Ok, an order of magnitude it seems to me, but of what. It can't be MHz, hah, 10 GHz machines! That would be nuts.

Ah, only two more days, and Apple is still managing to keep the hype alive.

Falleron

Jan 5, 2002, 10:46 AM

Its not apples aniversary of anthing is it? They did produce a 20th anniversary mac!

@lex

Jan 5, 2002, 10:47 AM

Come on dudes.. Apple is just refearing to Mac OS X... MAC OS 10 standard in all the machines....

Falleron

Jan 5, 2002, 10:50 AM

Could be!

iapple

Jan 5, 2002, 10:57 AM

Ten.. hmm..
Several things that apple has to do with Ten.

Mac OSX---meaning a update, 10.2 in store? New functions? More speed (full speed ahead.)?

TEN hundred Mhz.. 1000 ---1GHz full speed ahead---OVER 1GHz! yes that's it!

These are what I think about with this one.

Lehman

Jan 5, 2002, 11:13 AM

The past two catch phrases at apple.com have been Star Trek refrences. What cool gadgets did Captain Kirk have? How bout communicators?

Or an iPhaser?

johnpaul191

Jan 5, 2002, 11:19 AM

i thuink it really isn't until April, but this is 25 years for Apple, so i would assume we will see something special at some point........

rice_web

Jan 5, 2002, 11:29 AM

The more of these phrases that come out, the less that I believe this MacWorld will feature much that is exciting. I'm starting to think that this MacWorld will feature something with space though...

nubneck

Jan 5, 2002, 11:37 AM

Frankly, I think they will be releasing the iWalk. I also think that the machine will be more than just a common PDA, capable of several cool new things that nothing on the market can do right now. If this is what they are releasing, I would be completely sold on it and excited about buying it.

That video from a few days ago wasn't doctored (you can find "jumpyness" in any compressed video). I really believe that this is the new amazing product that's coming. If so, amazing it will be!

Home_Slice

Jan 5, 2002, 11:38 AM

I dunnno, that seems weaker than the previous catch phrases that were on there, tomorrows better be good!

mcbane

Jan 5, 2002, 11:42 AM

10ghz G5's WOOO!

arn

Jan 5, 2002, 11:46 AM

The best "cool technology" phrase I like is the following

I want one!!! .... What is it?

:) This embodies a cool "lust factor" device.

arn

blakespot

Jan 5, 2002, 11:52 AM

http://www.insanefine.com

Home_Slice

Jan 5, 2002, 12:00 PM

IF anymone went on there the other day they saw that it was removed due to legal issues. I think Spy Mac just did that to make it seem more convincing. That way people would think, "Oh if Apple Legal told them to take it of that must be it!" Apple wouldn't let this big of a secret get out espically on video.

Ramble

Jan 5, 2002, 12:08 PM

Digital lifestyle.....

well, this mac world falls right around 2 major Auto Shows (LAAS and NAIAS) mabye apple has made an arangement with an car maker (which would be good for anyone who has used one of the new systems that control everything and have 600+ page manuals.

just a thought, i like apple and i like cars

iCinder

Jan 5, 2002, 12:09 PM

I think they are referring to either 10.2 (which i hope is downloadable or i can get it for free at a store) or a new PDA OS based on OS X. They may not even make a PDA to go along with the new OS... palms and visors can upgrade their firmware. Along with most other PDA's

justguesting

Jan 5, 2002, 12:15 PM

Apple Stores will be renamed the Apple 5&10's...featuring g5's and osX, of course.

Cable ready iMacs....so you can throw your TV away.

- justguesting....

ps:

If it is a car, its a VW Bug....

If it is smaller, it is a segway

Cisco

Jan 5, 2002, 12:16 PM

I think the Star Trek references are the key here. I'm anticipating some sort of handheld device, presumably a "PDA plus" with enhanced usability/functionality- voice recognition? I suspect that the ipod was partly designed to test the waters in terms of consumer and press reactions to this class of device from Apple.

russ192

Jan 5, 2002, 12:18 PM

Here is the deal. As an investor in apple I can tell you this is what could transpire.

Apple right now has a lot of extra cash, this cash will be used to purchase a company called connectix. They have taken the source code and optimised it to run with OSX seamlessly. You will all now have the power of 2. Run whatever game you want, whatevery software that comes available. You got the dream machine. Lust factor of X(ten).

They will not have OSX on windowz (yet)

iapple

Jan 5, 2002, 12:34 PM

Originally posted by Cisco
I think the Star Trek references are the key here. I'm anticipating some sort of handheld device, presumably a "PDA plus" with enhanced usability/functionality- voice recognition? I suspect that the ipod was partly designed to test the waters in terms of consumer and press reactions to this class of device from Apple.

I'm sorry guys, but Steve HATED the newton. I can't believe they are going to release a PDA into this dry market!

Ofcourse, that is, unless the new PDA is so fabulous that it will "Blow away" palm and PocketPC..

I think it is more a digital hub device

elgruga

Jan 5, 2002, 12:36 PM

Its a new PDA.

And the 'lust factor of ten' refers to OS X working properly - at last.
I mean, the GUI on X is so jerky sometimes, I thought I had a fake Mac!

PDA with wireless built in and a 5 gig drive - (like iPod)
OS X hits prime time- (not before time)
Gigahertz across the board except for low end iMac and iBook.

Thats it.

PDA with 5 gig and wireless is a major leap, listen to music, surf the web, all the old Newton stuff as well.
QT movies on the thing, etc.etc.

[Edited by elgruga on 01-05-2002 at 01:40 PM]

iapple

Jan 5, 2002, 12:38 PM

Originally posted by russ192
Here is the deal. As an investor in apple I can tell you this is what could transpire.

Apple right now has a lot of extra cash, this cash will be used to purchase a company called connectix. They have taken the source code and optimised it to run with OSX seamlessly. You will all now have the power of 2. Run whatever game you want, whatevery software that comes available. You got the dream machine. Lust factor of X(ten).

They will not have OSX on windowz (yet)

Sorry for the double post, but YEAH!
I think they should have some Virtual PC-ish program STANDARD on every Mac. (I don't think they should make OSX for Windows though..) Then all the WINdoWz people will be assured that all their programs will work on the Mac! If you compare the Mac and some junky Dell, and if the Mac can work the PC programs TOO, then who is going to buy the Dell?

I think we are getting some where..

Doraemon

Jan 5, 2002, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by russ192
Apple right now has a lot of extra cash, this cash will be used to purchase a company called connectix. They have taken the source code and optimised it to run with OSX seamlessly. You will all now have the power of 2. Run whatever game you want, whatevery software that comes available. You got the dream machine. Lust factor of X(ten).

Hmm. That's a very intresting idea. And I must say it would be brilliant! Let's wait and see... :)

sinbushar

Jan 5, 2002, 12:42 PM

mmaaaayyyybbeee.....by saying lust..they mean they are completely changing the look at least of the imacs..maybe customized cases....or maybe the G5's (pplllleeeaasssee!!!) will be incredibly hott....we'll just see...

macttv

Jan 5, 2002, 12:46 PM

I like this idea. Throw away your TV and boom box and replace it with a device that:

- is a computer
- is a cable-ready tv
- plays and records DVDs
- plays and records music
- has a companion device to go portable

It might explain Quicktime TV Channels a bit more....

elgruga

Jan 5, 2002, 12:48 PM

Lust means desire means we will lust after one.

Its a product, not software.

Think hardware. Think sex. Jobs called the Tibook sexy, so this is a theme.

Small isnt usually associated with sexy, so its maybe larger than a PDA.

Then again, the iWalk we all saw on Spymac was not so small, so......

nahaliel

Jan 5, 2002, 12:49 PM

DAVE built into OSX would be nice :)

i_did

Jan 5, 2002, 12:52 PM

Originally posted by nahaliel
DAVE built into OSX would be nice :)

What for? OS X has UNIX networking. I share files w/linux and windows machines w/no problems.

IndyGopher

Jan 5, 2002, 12:55 PM

Ok, let's see if everyone is on the same page. Apple would buy Connectix, or license VPC, or write their own version, or go back to putting DOS/Windows compatibility cards in all their computers... Now *every* new Apple product will run *every* Windows/x86 application. We'll ignore any difficulties, and just say flatly that they somehow do this.

From that moment on, why would *ANY* developer write *ANY* application specifically for the Mac? They wouldn't. They would write only for Windows, saving themselves TONS of money on porting and duplicating effort.

If this is what you want to see happen, then just put your Macs on eBay right now and go buy that Gateway.

(For historical reference, IBM made this same mistake with OS/2. The got the Windows stuff down pat, and the rhetoric from dozens of software companies became, "We're not going to port it to OS/2, the Windows version works on OS/2 already.")

elgruga

Jan 5, 2002, 12:55 PM

some ok rumors here:

http://www.gamedb.com/ssps/0/10/00005

pik0

Jan 5, 2002, 12:59 PM

like putting lipstick on a chicken
That's a quote from Bill Gates when he had heard of the Novell/Apple joint project to port Mac OS 7 to Wintel back in 1992. Read this (http://www.macspeedzone.com/articles/appleconfidential/startrek.html) article to see some other interesting quotes such as:
the two companies immediately began working together on a project that came to be called Star Trek, because it would boldly go where no Mac had gone before: the Intel platform.
Once again, another Star Trek reference similar to the tease from a day or two ago "to go where no PC has gone before".

Finally, this quote is the most exciting:
Free of managerial meddling, the small team not only succeeded in getting the Mac's Finder to run on the PC clones, they also managed to get QuickTime and some of QuickDraw GX working, as well as the "Welcome to Macintosh" startup greeting.
So this has already been partially completed!!!

Now, in 1997 another article (http://www.geektimes.com/michael/techno/computing/hardware/products/apple/macintosh/misc/project-star-trek.html) was written in geektimes outlining the consideration that Apple may have taken up the gauntlet once again. Quote this:
In the end, it wasn't technical difficulties that derailed the project. It was internal politics, especially the loss of key backers.

So, all the internal BS that killed it before and the offensive from Microsoft to force ALL PC's to be shipped with Windoze, are no longer an issue.

A great deal of what makes Mac OS X complete, has already been cross-compiled to Intel, Darwin. What remains is the Cocoa Library (a mechanical effort to rewrite as they've already done that once) and then Aqua itself.

Just a thought.

Andrew

jaykk

Jan 5, 2002, 01:03 PM

How about Mac OS X goes primetime Big (blue) way - IBM Db2, Lotus Notes, .. Also, Sun and Oracle support for OS X as well - OS X becomes the industry standard. plus a whole bunch of OS X based products.. iNewton (yes its not iWalk), iPalm and iEverything runs under OS X..not just Apple products.. does that count as "Full Speed Ahead: Lust Factor Ten" and "To Go Where No PC Has Gone Before" ?

grouse

Jan 5, 2002, 01:04 PM

http://a772.g.akamai.net/7/772/51/e4988a92bee0e0/www.apple.com/home/images/12/mwsf02_1day.gif

is the first bit of tomorrow's line, but despite my best guesses I can't find the accompanying gif.

over to you

pik0

Jan 5, 2002, 01:09 PM

That's amazing!!! How did you find it? Usually the URL on akamai is rather cryptic unguessable...

Andrew

adidasx2004

Jan 5, 2002, 01:15 PM

iWalk, I know everyone is debating this thing, and I used to be astonished by how much time people put in to invesgate this thing, but now I caught the bug, and I noticed something...
This is from SpyMac.com:
"...German voices in the background and a seemingly deliberately-planted (foreign) electrical socket makes the origin questionable.. and the source safe..."

Wait a min! German voices in the background? What a counicedence (I cant spell, thats what spell check is for, right!?) It just so happens that, in a footnote on spymac.com, it says that they are being hosted on a, get this, GERMAN server that is owned by a GERMAN friend. Could it be that iWalk was faked in Germany? I Think so...

grouse

Jan 5, 2002, 01:19 PM

Well, actually, it was pure guess work!

But as I say, I reckon the interesting bit is entirely unguessable, you'd have to guess the actual words used in the graphic and by then you'd know what was coming anyhow!

I'm still trying though...

uponetoo

Jan 5, 2002, 01:26 PM

Just this minute I was watching Tech TV and they had a promo spot
"See Macworld live on Tech TV-Is there a G5?, the new imac, Steve Jobs ends the rumors. Plus we'll show you the new home entertainment appliance that's so secret we can't show you until then. Watch it Live, Monday starting at 9 on Tech TV"

"the new home entertainment appliance" hmmm........

networkman

Jan 5, 2002, 01:29 PM

put a windows os/emulation on the mac? no

port os x to intel so we make the money and show xp users who is better

burger011

Jan 5, 2002, 01:43 PM

I think, after reading the above articles, and seeing the last two "proclamations" from Apple I think the big thing is OS X on Intel.

"To Boldly go where no PC has gone before"--refers to the the box makers. One place they haven't been is OS X land

"Full speed ahead": Lust factor 10"--refers to, I think, OS X.

I think this would be a great idea.

pik0

Jan 5, 2002, 01:47 PM

Despite all the rumors, and even in light of the TechTV home entertainment reference, I would REALLY love to have an iWalk. My old MP100 is getting a little long in the tooth at 9 years old... :)

Now, having said that, consider this. The latest trend in home entertainment are devices that allow quick and easy recording of TV shows (a la Tivo and Ultimate TV). The other latest trend is moving from rear projection TV to front projection TV.

It's actually cheaper to buy the Sony VPL-CS4 (about $1700) at 1000 ANSI Lumens (fairly bright even at 12.5' diagonal) than to get a rear projection TV (about $4000) that is capable of the same "screen size".

Could Apple be introducing new hardware considering they really are a hardware company?! Perhaps they will combine a Tivo-like device and a projector into one device?!?!

I'm currently pricing out a front projection TV to replace my ailing 36" TV. Perhaps I'll wait until after Monday before I make any rash decisions... :)

Andrew

amichalo

Jan 5, 2002, 01:50 PM

I think the ideal of OS X on Intel boxes is sexy. It beats MS at their own game and if Apple can get other retailers like Dell and Gateway to offer OS X as an alternative to Windows XP, now that MS can't enforce a lockup (thanks DOJ), they could make a strong offensive for market share.

Imagine if Apple took just 5% of the intel user base from Windows. It would almost double Apple's installed user base!

udannlin

Jan 5, 2002, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by amichalo
I think the ideal of OS X on Intel boxes is sexy. It beats MS at their own game and if Apple can get other retailers like Dell and Gateway to offer OS X as an alternative to Windows XP, now that MS can't enforce a lockup (thanks DOJ), they could make a strong offensive for market share.

Imagine if Apple took just 5% of the intel user base from Windows. It would almost double Apple's installed user base!

Apple has done things like this before that cannabalized their hardware sales. remember the mac clones? they licensed out their hardware architecture in an attempt to lower prices on Mac compatibles (ala IBM PC) and what ended happening was it killed their hardware sales. This would do exactly the same thing. Also, does apple really want to deal with the driver compatibility issues with 3rd party hardware? I think not.

dantec

Jan 5, 2002, 02:44 PM

installing OS X on an Wintel comp?

1. You would have to rebuy all your software...
2. Classic wouldn't work, or it would work but at the speed of a 2mhz PPC chip...
3. Couldn't use iMovie caus you don't have Firewire ports.
4. Still couldn't use an iPod... :(

And if apple was dumb enough to do this, it would canabalize their hardware sales and make them forced to support so many different configurations!

i_did

Jan 5, 2002, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by pik0
That's amazing!!! How did you find it? Usually the URL on akamai is rather cryptic unguessable...

Andrew

Actually the akamai part is superfluous.

http://www.apple.com/home/images/12/mwsf02_1day.gif

Please notice that the above url is taken from part of :

http://a772.g.akamai.net/7/772/51/e4988a92bee0e0/www.apple.com/home/images/12/mwsf02_1day.gif

justguesting

Jan 5, 2002, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by pik0

Now, having said that, consider this. The latest trend in home entertainment are devices that allow quick and easy recording of TV shows (a la Tivo and Ultimate TV). The other latest trend is moving from rear projection TV to front projection TV.....

Andrew [/B]

Cable ready macs designed to replace the TV!

Anything replacing the TV would be revolutionary. Changing TV from one-way to two way, uniting interactivity and productivity with entertainment, would be big. Broadcasters would love this, as their flirtations with companion web sites for TV shows becomes more integrated. Customers would love it because of the simplicity of an all-in-one solution, with higher resolution.

The only reason our iMac isn't in the living room is that we have a TV and stereo there. It could boldly go into the living room/bedroom/dormroom/classroom with a few adjustments to the current design, as many have pointed out already.

Maybe it ships with a free Star Trek DVD...

Beam me up....

adidasx2004

Jan 5, 2002, 03:02 PM

http://www.mecha.net/iBrator/ibrator.htm <-Wow, some people have even less of a life than i do...

blackpeter

Jan 5, 2002, 03:16 PM

This isn't another STUPID hardware rumor/joke... so don't worry.

I know - I know, they were funny the first 500 times. But it's funny how a lack of humor will hardly stop those wacky jokesters from posting their iToilets and iBrators... (yawn)

So anyway, this is a real invitation:
Whoever wants to get high with me & Steve before MacWorld can join us behind Moscone (near the carousel) at 8:00am. Look for the tall skinny guy standing with the man in a black turtleneck (he'll probably be wearing sunglasses and a baseball hat also).

If you're holding don't be stingy... bring some to share with me and Steve.

And remember:
Puff - Puff -Pass. Right is polite. Steve will call you on that **** too... major pot snob.

kirknord

Jan 5, 2002, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by @lex
Come on dudes.. Apple is just refearing to Mac OS X... MAC OS 10 standard in all the machines....
I really don't think the world is ready for OS X standard unless Adobe, Macromedia and Quark have all their acts together really really quickly.

razoné

Jan 5, 2002, 03:22 PM

I'm still convinced that TEN means this....
g5 = current pipeline 7 stages to TEN stages....+2ghz

Computer & tv all in that flatscreen imac that would be an orgasm! + wireless keyboard & mouse....yammie!

reyesg4

Jan 5, 2002, 03:24 PM

What we will get on Monday is looks and speed. Looks will be iMacs that look like the iPod, white fronts and chrome backs covered in glass. There is no need to make them see-thru anymore. Speed will be 1Ghz + processors. The low end will do what the high end did 6 months ago. I just hope they make the speakers over 50 watts and add a subwoofer. Wireless keyboards with trackpads on them and mice with a scroll wheel. Also, Apple will sell a wireless printer and a wireless camera/webcam. Apple will be the first computer maker to make an all wireless PC.

It is messed up that they might be running 10.1.2 because with new machines should come new OS's. I hope Apple surprises us on that front.

For those people talking about putting VPC on every mac, that means putting windows on every mac, i would not want to pay M$ $300 bucks for that crap. Besides, by the end of the year, VPC will run at the speed of an 900mhz PC on the high end machines. By 2003, you will be able to run anything on a virtual Win98 PC inside your mac. You can already run anything dos on the mac and most of win95 apps and games.

Steve Jobs will focus mostly on the speed of the Macs this year, he will make new cases, and keep them the same for a year and a half. But I will bet you that the speed increases we will get this year will be like nothing we have seen before. Forget about 50mhz speedbumps anymore, we're talking 200mhz and higher buses too. Start saving your money because even if you have a 2 year old machine that you are happy with, you'll still want a new machine.

markseaton

Jan 5, 2002, 03:25 PM

How do you think steve always comes out with such cool stuff, and always seams relaxed, i say suck back a J and lets watch the show. :)

BC is the PlAcE To Be...

Rocketman

Jan 5, 2002, 03:30 PM

Originally posted by dantec
installing OS X on an Wintel comp?

1. You would have to rebuy all your software...
2. Classic wouldn't work, or it would work but at the speed of a 2mhz PPC chip...
3. Couldn't use iMovie caus you don't have Firewire ports.
4. Still couldn't use an iPod... :(

And if apple was dumb enough to do this, it would canabalize their hardware sales and make them forced to support so many different configurations!

What it would do is allow Apple to sell PCI add-in cards with Apple approved ports to all PC owners upgrading to a stable and useable OS.

It would increase the market for MacOS compiled apps, especially OSX apps.

It would increase Apple market share.

It would show people once and for all why they want a mac. Most PC owners upgrade every 3 years or less because their machines are so darn crippled. They might upgrade to a Mac for the first time simply because they are alreay familiar with the interface.

Consider it Mac Kindergarten.

Rocketman

i_did

Jan 5, 2002, 03:36 PM

Originally posted by razoné
I'm still convinced that TEN means this....
g5 = current pipeline 7 stages to TEN stages....+2ghz

Computer & tv all in that flatscreen imac that would be an orgasm! + wireless keyboard & mouse....yammie!

Yay! Let's increase the pipeline stages! Let's increase the pipeline stages!

*SMACK*

Shorter pipeline = lower branch penalty. Longer pipeline = longer branch penalty. Newer processor designs are using SHORTER pipelines. The G5 has a shorter pipeline than the G4. All of the new 64 bit processors have shorter pipelines than their predecessors.

Moby 1

Jan 5, 2002, 03:37 PM

OMG!

An Apple-branded phaser!

iStun

Let's see...This setting won't kill a PC and this setting will...

Moby 1

imct

Jan 5, 2002, 03:39 PM

A couple of days ago I paid a visit to Steve Wozniak's site, went to his personal webcam page http://wozcam.woz.org/ and I zoomed in on the desk. Surprise... I found what seemed to be a user manual with an Apple logo... it was a small white bookled, with a big title "GAME ROOM"... could that be the new digital lifestyle appliance??

blithnif

Jan 5, 2002, 03:42 PM

Long as they say it's astronomical...

Did Apple buy Palm, and the latest iteration of Palm OS is a mini-OS X?

Or, did they merge with HP/Compaq, which will now offer PCs with OS X installed?

Also, a friend just referred me to the following on apple's site:

http://www.apple.com/scitech/stories/skycorp/index2.html

Could Apple (& Motorola, or...) have figured out how to get good speed wireless communication for PDAs (the new iWalk)? Could that mean it will not only do Internet, but will serve as mobile phone, GPS, etc.?

Speculation...but they said it'd be 'big', and not obvious, like flat screen iMac, methinks....

DP

adidasx2004

Jan 5, 2002, 03:49 PM

I just downloaded a pic of woz's desk and it has the game room book on it
IM me on AIM (screenname adidasx2004) and i can "direct-connect" it to you so someone that nos how have put it up on this board.

Dr_Raven

Jan 5, 2002, 03:58 PM

Some of you may be to young to remember, but Apple once attempted to port the Mac OS to the Intel platform. The code name for the project?

"Star Trek"

Hmm... the recent quote on Apple's site "To boldy go where no PC has gone before" takes on a whole new meaning now doesn't it?

See the book Apple Confidential by Owen Linzmayer on page 179 for details.

justin

Jan 5, 2002, 03:59 PM

"This one is big. Even by our standards."
1) Apple's known for keeping its releases tight. But never this tight. It's not hardware. Virtually every hardware product release has leaked out in some form prior to the announcement because of the supply chain. It's not an acquisition. Too many people have to know, lawyers have to be involved. Double-sided PR would be going on right now. This can only be a software announcement with knowledge limited to a small team.

"Count the days. Count the minutes. Count on being blown away."
2) Never before has Apple made such bold claims about a product release. We're not expecting this kind of announcement. Being blown away means it's something never done before. It's not a PDA. Done. It's not dual processor. Done. > 1ghz, Moore's law puts us there anyway, so what's the big deal?. Installing OS X on an Intel box would blow us away.

"Beyond the rumor sites. Way beyond."
3) Can't find OS X on PC on the rumor sites prior to this date in any real substance. iWalk makes sense, but a Palm acquisition would be better. What's one more PDA? Of course I'll want one if this turns out to be the case, but OS X on PC would satisfy Apple's goal of reaching the other 95% of the market.

"It's like a backstage pass to the future."
4) Fluff. Duh! this is why we go to Macworld. No real indicators here.

"To boldly go where no PC has gone before"
5) No PC has run a Mac OS before. This is the first Star Trek reference. Those of you who have been paying attention for many years.... jiggle that grey matter around and think back to a long, long time ago (remember MacWeek?) Apple was working on a project similar to OS X... an x86 emulator. The project code name wasStart Trek, thus the Star Trek references.

"Full speed ahead: Lust Factor Ten"
6) Ten. X. Get it? You lust over that which you cannot have or desire to obtain. Offering Windows users an alternative operating system for their Intel platform makes this announcement a definite lust factor. Those of you who think that Apple dare not go here because it would canibalize hardware sales, think again. How many computers does Microsoft manufacture?

There are too many upsides for OS X on Intel. At $99 per OS X box, Apple would garnish a hefty profit, expand their marketshare, dent Microsoft's monopoly and invade Linux-space. OS X is a great environment for IT departments. The UNIX underpinnings have the stability and configurability that sys admins want. The true multi-user nature of offers a secure environment, and Aqua reduces the learning curve for the rest of the office. Apple hardware is too elegant to rack mount, but being able to install OS X server on Dell, Compaq, HP, IBM and other rack'em stack'em boxes give Apple instant segue into the data center.

But that's just if 10.1 ran on Intel.

Consider the additions to Jaguar required to make this a reality. Jaguar will contain an Intel version of the MacOS virtual machine layer (i.e. ROM maps) that will allow OS X to run on an Intel platform. Darwin is already native on Intel; getting Carbon and Cocoa there isn't that much more work. The Intel VM will allow PnP devices to integrate seamlessly into the OS. Remember, UNIX is highly abstracted already. The Mac OS doesn't access the hardware directly. Darwin does. Keep in mind that develop.apple.com has been scarce with information on writing drivers. IOKit has very little documentation right now. That's about to change to support the new PnP architecture for Intel. In addition to running on both Mac and Intel platforms, OS X will contain a Windows emulator that will allow Windows applications to run inside OS X much like OS 9 applications run in OS X and Mac applications to run without recompiling on Intel hardware.

So how's Stevie gonna do it? By starting a demo of 10.2 beta in the keynote. New hardware announcement-style, he will have a small table on stage with a veiled mini-tower. As the demo commences, the veil will come off the "new" hardware only to reveal a Dell desktop running the demo the whole time.

Yes, flat-panel iMacs will be there. Yes, color iBooks will be there. Yes, more dual processors will be there. But the breadcrumbs of hints from this week can only lead us to this conclusion.

Steve, if you're reading this and I'm right, pick up the note I'm leaving you at the Palo Alto Apple store on Monday.

[Edited by justin on 01-05-2002 at 05:01 PM]

justguesting

Jan 5, 2002, 04:00 PM

Originally posted by imct
A couple of days ago I paid a visit to Steve Wozniak's site, went to his personal webcam page http://wozcam.woz.org/ and I zoomed in on the desk. Surprise... I found what seemed to be a user manual with an Apple logo... it was a small white bookled, with a big title "GAME ROOM"... could that be the new digital lifestyle appliance??

That looks like foamcore (used for poster backings) more than a booklet.

My guess is that it is a small sign.

anon

Jan 5, 2002, 04:16 PM

For all you naysayers, how long have you been around?

No one knows for sure if they'll announce it, but it's certainly DOABLE.

Why???

Do ANY of you remember Rhapsody????? Well, Rhapsody DR2 ran on INTEL machines. Yes, INTEL machines. This was 4-5 years ago. I installed in personally on a P200MMX FLAWLESSLY-- even onto a Jaz cartridge. It booted up, looked just like a Mac (since it was now a Mac OS) and the video even felt faster than my 8500 at the time.

Apple could have EASILY been working on this the past 4 years or so- the same time they were working on OS X for Mac.

So stop whining bout driver this, driver that. They completed Rhapsody DR2 for Intel in very little time and got it working.

DeepDish

Jan 5, 2002, 04:17 PM

Maybe Apple can create this OS X for pcs that everyone is talking about, but it will work on only Apple Certified pc boxes so Apple can control the hardware/driver nightmare and can control the cut into it's own hardware sales?

Xapplimatic

Jan 5, 2002, 04:19 PM

I think the Star Trek idea is key. Full speed ahead meaning something will be fast, Lust Factor Ten meaning it will be running a PDA-version of OS X. . a PDA in all likelihood. You know Apple can't stay out of the PDA field... not with devices as miserably inept as Pilots and Visors.. The software on the PDAs with the exception of the Windows based PDAs which have stripped versions of MS Word etc is not mature in any sense, still very toy-like more than functional. Even the most basic element of a computer: input, is still rediculously slow. Look, I own a Palm IIIx and I find it completely uncompetetive in terms of usefullness to any laptop. For goodness sakes, the Palm OS software was JUST upgraded to allow taking free-hand graphics-tablet style notes and storing them graphically instead of doing the standard (slow) Graffiti. Find me one person who can do the Palm-style character input faster than they could write in cursive? Not one. Apple could easily build a PDA which had all the functionality of the more recent PDAs with built-in MP3 players but could include things like PDA versions of Apple Works, cursive-acceptable input methods, and it would have syncing software that actually works and fully integrates all fields with Mail.app or perhaps even MS-Entourage.. Combine the facts that Apple already made a PDA which accepted regular user cursive handwriting with the idea that Palm is being sued (by Xerox?) over patent infringement over their only input method on their PDAs (Graffitti).. sounds like a good time for Apple to jump into it. Oh ya, enabling the infrared ports on the Power Books just weeks ago under OS X to work with IR modems.. or PDAs.. how convenient!

kaneda

Jan 5, 2002, 05:05 PM

Okay, how about a iwalk that you can access your desktop computer anytime anywhere...and transfer those file on your iwalk..and connect to another computer on transfer the file to another computer...for example, while you are cruising on the freeway to work. Then you think Oh, ****! I forgot this document for a presentation. So you pull out your iwalk and connect to your computer at home. Access the desktop get the file and upload the file to your iwalk thru the net (wireless). Then when you get to work. Connect to your work computer, and upload it to your work computer..and print it out...there go your new technology...

Argo1000

Jan 5, 2002, 05:11 PM

Sorry, guys -- it's not goingto happen.

If Apple sold OS/X for all the dirt-cheap Intel boxes out there, they might as well drop ALL of their computer products the same day. End of story. And if you think they'll make it up on OS/X sales for PCs, don't bother.

The Windows enviromnent is HORRENDOUSLY complex and screwed up -- 'plug and play' for add on hardware is still a cruel joke -- and getting OS/X to run efficiently with all the tens of thousands of hardare and software bits out there would be essentially impossible for Apple (or anybody else except Microsoft who control the standards). OS/X on an Intel box as a cute, very limited demo would be doable -- OS/X as a real competitor to WinDoze on an Intel box would be essentially impossible.

And you know what? If Microsoft perceived OS/X as a threat to even **10%** of their market, they would KILL Office on Mac OS/X for Macs OR PCs, the DOJ be damned. End of Apple in 18 months. No, I don't think Apple is THAT stupid.

Much more likely - a hot WinDoze emulator coming standard with all new Macs.

To be realistic: Lightweight white flat-panel iMac with wireless keboard and Airport card, speed bumps on everything (up to 1.6 GHz) with the same prices, all new models (except the entry-level iMac) will go to G4, iPhoto, price drops on LCD screens and the AirPort base station, and JUST MAYBE the Sony-built Apple PDA (iPad), which looks much like the iPod and combines a Palm with a lower capacity iPod. Expensive, though -- $499... and watch for Star Trek: Enterprise cast members at the rollout, probably Scott Bakkula plus one or two others & a cool new iPod TV spot with Seal ...

We'll see Monday morning.

AppleJunkie

Jan 5, 2002, 05:16 PM

Maybe they are going to implement this into OS X :
http://www.winehq.org/

AppleJunkie

Jan 5, 2002, 05:28 PM

Maybe they are going to implement this into OS X :
http://www.winehq.org/

erasekid

Jan 5, 2002, 05:33 PM

Here are my 2 cents on the topic of the mystery product by Apple. I think they might throw there hat into the consumer electronics' (CE) market in a really big way! Specifically, a minor partnership with a respectable receiver company (Denon, Yamaha, etc.). This company will provide standard receiver components (D.S.P., radio, Amp, etc.) and Apple will provide a combo Drive, a large HD, a cable TV decoder & MPEG encoder.

*Has anyone else noticed that the CE market significantly marks-up their gear compared to the computer equivalent? For example, CD recorders are grossly overpriced vs their computer rivals. The same goes for HD recorders for video.*

As a result. I think Apple can cut some of the cost by using there software decoding equivalents for this super-receiver.

This product will, effectively, yield a DVD player, CD player/ recorder, HD recorder (Tivo/Replay style without the tv guide features), a regular radio, 5.1 audio out, etc. all in one box!!

Naturally, this super receiver/ media player/ replacement for your VCR will have all of the traditional Apple stylings (hopefully a titanium like case).

In addition, the system will have regular video-out, ADC, VGA, and speaker ports. The front will have Firewire and USB ports. It will also be "Airport-ready" so that one can access all of the data (MP3's one has ripped, TV shows one has recorded, etc.) via their Mac to play with using iMovie and the like- reinforcing the usefulness of the Mac as an authorship tool. Though, the product will be useable by PC user’s too.

Take note, this piece of gear does not have internet accessibility!!

The reason is that Apple is evolving into a new company which sells "Authorship tools" (imac's, ibooks, power macs and powerbooks) and "Experience tools" (just iPod for now). This product would be there second “Experience tool” and would lay the foundation for more peripheral items in the future. Naturally, your iPod and future items will easily connect to this thing via the front panel ports.

I really hope that some of this made sense and thanks for reading!! : )

khomer2002

Jan 5, 2002, 05:41 PM

"And you know what? If Microsoft perceived OS/X as a threat to even **10%** of their market, they would KILL Office on Mac OS/X for Macs OR PCs, the DOJ be damned. End of Apple in 18 months. No, I don't think Apple is THAT stupid."

That may not be that easy for microsoft... Apple has been, in advertising circle at least, poking small jabs at microsoft. I distinctly remember an OS X ad, 2 pages, in NewsWeek. It had an Apple LCD display, with os x. The slug above read:

The only thing we have a monopoly on is style.

...Now, knowing that Jobs's history with Gates, once the Office deal for the mac was made, he might have had enough and began plans to move to x86 (please pardon my sinister tones, I've been thinkin about this for a while)...

Also, if it looks like the DOJ forces, or already forced, Microsoft to continue providing support for the Mac OS, Jobs may have nothing to worry about as far as MS pulling out of OS X.

Anyway, by the time MS can stop supporting the OS, Jobs could have OS X running on a significant percentage of PC's, with some type of WindowsClassic mode, where Windows 98/2000/XP apps run side by side (no emulation required remember).

If this isn't coming out on Monday, the dude should think about it.... I can see it now, Bill Gates on the 30-foot screen, and Jobs giving him the middle finger.

anon

Jan 5, 2002, 06:08 PM

Free copy of Windoze on every OS X under emulatin or whatever would be STUPID.

No one would write apps for Macs then.. Why should they if every new Mac has windoze emulation!?!

OS X on PCs is doable, trust me. Obviously some of you have never even heard of Rhapsody- let alone use it on a PC.

I DO NOT want to see OS X on PC. I love my Mac and am content to keep using nice Apple hardware.

HOWEVER, if it helps Apple's marketshare, then I'm for it. If Apple did OS X on PCs and made a compiler that would compile Cocoa apps or whatever to intel binary w/o any change in code, then it's all quite doable.

arn

Jan 5, 2002, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by justin
[B

So how's Stevie gonna do it? By starting a demo of 10.2 beta in the keynote. New hardware announcement-style, he will have a small table on stage with a veiled mini-tower. As the demo commences, the veil will come off the "new" hardware only to reveal a Dell desktop running the demo the whole time.

[/B]

A well written post... and makes some good conclusion... but here's a few counterpoints

First re hardware announcements... Apple kept the iMac under complete wraps until keynote.

As for the whole OS X on Intel thing...

I've said it before, and I'll say it again... Apple makes most of it's money on hardware. Apple killed the clones because they cut in on Apple's high end hardware sales.

The _only_ way I could see this happening would be Apple creating OS X for Apple-branded PC hardware. They would use off-the-shelf components etc... but have some prioprietary Apple stuff in it to keep control.

But for what gain?

To run Windows under an "classic"-like mode. Let me tell you about an OS that did this pretty well... OS/2 - are people using it? No, because developers realized they could write for the lowest common denomintor - Windows... and it would work on Windows and OS/2! IBM threw a lot of money into OS/2 and was unable to dent Windows marketshare.

arn

brokenrobots

Jan 5, 2002, 06:24 PM

startrek...communicator...mac cellphone/pda...wireless everywhere internet access that can network with your powerbook for full on browsing/drive your car/wash your dog/make some mean cinnamon toast/etc.

smisaacs

Jan 5, 2002, 06:27 PM

this is what i found when i went to aple.com 20 mins ago...now its gone..... "lust factor ten" is there again

http://fury.com/clippings/apple.html

khomer2002

Jan 5, 2002, 06:33 PM

Well, it is true, but OS/2 only supported Win16 apps. And developers did see little point in developing OS/2 apps for OS/x. The one thing you left out was the Windows 95 launch. OS/2 did not support Win32. Once Developers found that out, there was no reason to use OS/2 if it didnt run Windows.

One thing many people need to remember in the coming decade is that hardware/operating system abstraction is at a point where it is a whole lot easier to port from x86 to PowerPC to any other CPU. This is in part thanks to an open source kernel, lowered cost of PC parts, and improvements in integration. Windows NT did run, at one time, on a PowerPC. Rhapsody was x86, as was the 'Star Trek' project. For a pet project by apple to advance so far in that field shows its viability.

I realize the ability isnt questioned here, but it will play an important factor in the future. No longer do we care what CPU runs our desktop. We interact with the desktop, with the interface, not with the kernel nested 3 or 4 levels deep.

Apple's hardware sales would be in question, but not for Mac users who are questioning driver compatilbility. I doubt it would dent the loyal sales.

Also, apple could create, as said before, a PCI card with ROM, PPC, and other required hardware necessary for Mac compatibility (complete with firewire adapter).

And as bad as the clone situation was in the mid 1990's it did help one thing- Mac costs. I mean, macs were on the low end selling for $2000, when PC laptops were heading for the $1000 level. MegaHertz myth hurt too, as macs were beginning to trailin cycle speeds compared to PC. To the average PC buyer, a 60Mhz Mac for $2000 isn't worth it, but a 133Mhz PC for $1199 would be, regardless of actual performance.

Maybe a Dell machine demoing OS X is what Apple would need for price considerations. Motorola is backing away from making and more CPU's (G6, etc), and if IBM cannot create a reasonable replacement from their PowerPC line, it would be wise to take a good hard look and the Intel/AMD option.

Also, a question for any hardware gurus. The PPC had in-chip 688x0 emulation, right? Regardless, how hard would it be to be designing a PPC/x86 hybrid CPU?

Cisco

Jan 5, 2002, 06:35 PM

I agree with arn and similar posts. OSX on cheap PC hardware is much too risky, Apple can't compete with all those crummy palstic PC boxes, and the support issues would be a nightmare. If it didn't run right, the Windoze goons would jump all over it.
The notion of Windows on the Mac is more reasonable, but not exactly earth shattering given how long VPC has been around.
I'm still betting on hardware, and probably not a home entertainment system. Whatever it is will have purposeful connectivity with Macs (wireless and/or Firewire). I don't think they're ready to stray into stand alone consumer electronics.

ennerseed

Jan 5, 2002, 06:40 PM

This would be the stupidest thing in the world. if Apple won't allow clones, they wont allow pcs! Apple works so good because of it's hardware/software integration! Not to mention the fact that Intel chips SUCK RISC technology is far better... Granted Motorola needs to get FIRED for their lack of production. But if the partnership was just Apple and IBM there would be MOVEMENT. Apple doesn't even ADVERTISE their os in commercials!!!!!! They are NOT going to turn around one day and be a software company! What have you people been smoking!? -get off of it, it's messing up your brain!!! God I hope steve isn't smoking it also! I'm only writing this because I personally think the idea is DUMB and hearing all of you say it repetitively is scaring me into thinking they might do it! please steve if it's true stop smoking that stuff right now... just put it down, remember how bad Evlis's music got.

Interiority

Jan 5, 2002, 06:43 PM

As I sit here, thinking that there is no way Apple will ever port OS X to Wintel hardware (for all the reasons discussed previously), a thought occurs to me...

What if Apple ports OS X Server to x86, allowing it to run on IBM / Compaq / HP Server kit? This provides a way for them to sell into the IT datacentre, gives a limited range of hardware options on which they have to test OS X, and provides a high end platform for things like Web Objects. Just a thought...

Interiority

Jan 5, 2002, 06:48 PM

Many people here are talking about an Apple PDA in terms of an updated Newton. Whilst I'm not going to speculate about iWalk etc, I will say that if Apple releases a PDA it will be based on Pixo rather than the Newton OS.

Pixo (http://www.pixo.com) is the OS embedded in the iPod, for which Apple is obviously developing new applications. Newton OS is a legacy John Sculley system, and the bad blood between Jobs and Sculley is still too strong...

kiwi_the_iwik

Jan 5, 2002, 06:53 PM

Don't you think Apple might port over OSX to the PC market, considering the fact that they have already done so for Quicktime, and (as far as rumours go) apparently the iPod and iTunes2?

It would certainly be in their best interests - considering what the sale of an Operating System did for Microsoft.

Let Apple not fall into the same trap as IBM and other big conglomerates in the 80's, by saying "...the future is in the HARDWARE, not this SOFTWARE stuff..."

Imagine the prospect of whole communities all working with totally STABLE OS's - and with full compatibility to boot.

burger011

Jan 5, 2002, 07:00 PM

I've read the posts about why it can't be done, but if you read the article posted by pik0 it seems AAPL was ready to do it but the only thing holding them back was the lock Microsoft had on box makers.

If I understand correctly, that lock has been lifted. From someone who recently bought not only jis first Mac but AAPL stock i think its a great idea. AAPL has said many times that they want a bigger market share. The best way to get wintel users to switch is to buid a bridge so that they can come across. As of now, it takes a leap of faith to switch.

By making OS X for intel, AAPL alows PC users to see the benefit of AAPL software with out making that leap of faith. If they like the app., I would think they would be more likely to switch to AAPL hardware. If AAPL makes more devices such as the iPod, this would increase there sales.

AAPL has always had 5% and as far as I can tell will continue to have 5%. The iPod or any other digital device is not going to increase this by much. That 5% may go up just a little and thats it. Unless.....the average PC buyer knows that if they buy an AAPL computer there not going to be in the minority. Must people are followers, not leaders.

As an investor, I hope its OS X on Intel.

Interiority

Jan 5, 2002, 07:04 PM

Apple will never port OS X (Client) to x86 - the availability of cheap AMD / Intel processors and other components will completely cannabilise Apple's hardware sales.

Part of the reason for the elegance and reliability of the Mac OS is that Apple makes all the hardware, and so has a very limited range of configurations on which they have to test everything. Having to write drivers for every flavour of PC hardware increases the complexity exponentially. Also, I seem to recollect Phil Schiller boasting about how Apple is the only vertically integrated hardware manufacturer (apart from Sun, perhaps) on the recent iPod video.

The opposite argument, that Apple will provide Windows emulation on PPC hardware, means that developers will no longer have any reason to write Mac-specific apps. Plus the cost of including a Windows license with every Mac sold...

Comparisons with Microsoft are not really valid either - MS makes most of its money from applications, not operating systems.

ennerseed

Jan 5, 2002, 07:14 PM

Most people that buy Intel do it because of Microsoft.

They do it because they like windows, they are ignorant, or they are sheep.

If OS X came out on Intel systems people are NOT going to flock to OS X.

Apple users that want cheap hardware would just stop buying Apple hardware. just like they did when there were clones.

kiwi_the_iwik

Jan 5, 2002, 07:16 PM

Microsoft ORIGINALLY became a big player because of an operating system - DOS. At the time, it was the most user friendly (? yes, I know!) system available - and it was what put them on the map.

Consider the ramifications of OSX on Intel/AMD machines for a moment. I'm talking true networking, a broader spectrum of applications from software houses, and a total ownership of the OS licence by Apple, which means more income => improved hardware research.

And if you're worried, Microsoft really still wouldn't lose out, because:
a: They still get to manufacture programs for OSX, and
b: Bill Gates still owns 10% of Apple's shares.

Anyway - I've heard of tests being done already to port OSX on to Wintel machines, which were quite successful. As far as software drivers go, that wouldn't be a problem for the latest technology (USB, USB2 and Firewire). It would be up to individual hardware companies to update their drivers for older systems on the web.

Xapplimatic

Jan 5, 2002, 07:22 PM

Porting OS X to Windows wouldn't Cannibalize Apple's sales.. most Windows users are using Intel only because bottom line is their bottom line.. they want the cheapest hardware.. period. End of story. That will never be Apple's approach, ever. So why not take some OS sales away from Windows? The same cheapscates will still buy Intel junkware. Mac users who want high quality will still buy Macs.. but OS X can work on both... and no, it wouldn't jeapordize Office for X development.. If Windows sales shrunk, that's all the MORE reason for Microsoft to develop for X.. They don't care where their sales come from as long as they are making sales.. again, bottom line. A sale is a sale, and nomatter what was sold, Office for Windows or Office for X. Truth is, anything that expands sales of OS X is likely to increase development of software for X, not the other way around. Utillisez-vous logique! The only thing that would undermine development for X would be to bundle Virtual PC or other Windows emulation like that with Macs.. same as what happened with IBM's OS/2. I think some of the people who are misrepresenting this argument fail to understand that on modern machines, the development efforts depend largely upon the operating system, not the hardware it resides on. Therefore, programmers developing applications for a Pentium processor based computer running OS X would develop for OS X to make it work.. not "Intel". The question of which processor it works with is simply a matter of recompiling, not really an issue anymore.

burger011

Jan 5, 2002, 07:22 PM

In terms of running the risk destroying AAPL's hardware division......What if AAPL makes it where if you want things like the iPod you have to have AAPL hardware. Intel users can use the OS, but not the cool gadgets. Even as a former wintel user, I knew AAPL made a better product and the product looked alot better. I probably would have bought a Mac many years ago if I had access to its OS on my PC and also knew that the switch to AAPL software was effortless. By providing OS X to Intel, AAPL allows wintel users to see OS X in action, it creates a bigger demand for OS X applications and will create more interest for AAPL hardware (just my opinion).

Now, I know nothing about the technology of building PC's, chips, servers etc.... But if it can be done, I think AAPL would benefit in the long run and so will my shares.

burger011

Jan 5, 2002, 07:25 PM

Most people buy Intel based PCs because 95% of the country does, not because they think its the best option.

For most people, its the only option.

Cisco

Jan 5, 2002, 07:34 PM

Originally posted by Interiority
Many people here are talking about an Apple PDA in terms of an updated Newton. Whilst I'm not going to speculate about iWalk etc, I will say that if Apple releases a PDA it will be based on Pixo rather than the Newton OS.

Pixo (http://www.pixo.com) is the OS embedded in the iPod, for which Apple is obviously developing new applications. Newton OS is a legacy John Sculley system, and the bad blood between Jobs and Sculley is still too strong...

Very interesting if correct. Can anyone confirm and/or provide details regarding Apple's ralationship with Pixo? I can't findanything too interesting on their website, certainly no mention of the iPod.

anon

Jan 5, 2002, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by kiwi_the_iwik

b: Bill Gates still owns 10% of Apple's shares.
[/B]

LOL

Someone's been smoking crack.. He does NOT own 10%. MSFT own a few shares and that's it.

geeeeeeeeeeez!!!!!!

Interiority

Jan 5, 2002, 07:37 PM

I have to agree that I would have purchased a Mac sooner if I could have experienced its OS on my PC. But I do think it more likely that Apple will try and increase its sales by allowing Intel users to play with the cool gadgets like iPod, rather than the other way around.

Interiority

Jan 5, 2002, 07:41 PM

This quote comes from the bio of Pixos CEO on their web site.

"Prior to Netscape, Dave held several senior roles at Apple where he developed and implemented the wireless communications strategy for the PowerBook and oversaw PowerBook product management."

Sreo

Jan 5, 2002, 07:46 PM

I have been reading this board a lot this week and I feel that I need to comment on the whole OS X on Intel rumors.

First let me say that it has been a long time since I last used a Mac for more than quickly scan a pic at Kinko's. I have yet to use OS X but from what I have read about it, I would love a chance to give it a try.

Now it is safe to assume that I use windows from the above statement. It is my primary OS. But, I also occasionally use Linux (mainly for the GIMP) and I even tried out BeOS 5 when they had that 500 MB demo.

It clear from other posts that OS X on Intel hardware would not be hard to do. Two problems have been raised: 1.) Drivers and 2.) Hardware sales.

Sure OS X would need to come with many drivers to handle all of the hardware used out here in Intel land. I'm sure that a large portion of the basic drivers needed could be taken from FreeBSD for x86. Also I can see the announcement at MacWorld being one saying that come July 4th all PC users will be free of Windows. That could give Apple a window to tell hardware manufacturers to get their drivers in to make it to the gold edition of OS X for x86.

On the topic of hardware sales, yes this will cut in on their hardware sales. Especially the iMac and iBook. But, if done right, it might not be as bad for the TiBooks and PowerMacs. How? Simple, the high end software that takes full advantage of the G4's Velocity engine would not be as fast on the x86 processors. So if you want to use some of the heavy stuff you still need Mac G4 hardware.

Sure Apple hardware will still take a hit with OS X for x86, but the additional revenue from software sales should make up for some of that.

rupert burrows

Jan 5, 2002, 07:57 PM

Whatever the perceived benefits or disadvantages of porting OSX to Windows machines, I don't see how this would appeal to the MW audience. Surely they will all be Mac owners?

Argo1000

Jan 5, 2002, 08:32 PM

As anybody who uses them can attest, applications running under a software emulation of ANY OS (Mac, Win,UNIX,etc...) run ****MUCH**** slower than they do on the real OS they were written for.

Win apps on Mac with ANY current emulation software run about 1/8 the speed they do on Windows, given roughly equal hardware, and Mac apps running on what MacOS emulation there currently is for windows run just as poorly.

OS emulation, is, by definition, very inefficient, and Mac emulation on a PC box (without AltiVec and other G3/G4 hardware goodies) is PATHETIC, even with a 2+GHz P4 or Itanium. An games (a VERY popular part of this, like it or not) will REALLY suffer, since their performance-critical parts tend to be written right down at the machine language (ie. VERY Intel/AMD chip-specific) level.

NOBODY will buy a (relatively expensive) Mac box to run Win software when they can get a MUCH faster real PC for about half the price, although some highly budget-limited people might by a super-cheap PC to run Windows software and Mac software, even with the crappy performance of the Mac software under MacOS emulation on the PC.

The point? Apple may bundle Win emulation on the new Mac OS/X systems, but it will always be an only-if-necessary thing for most Mac users. But to put Mac OS/X on a Win box will ONLY eat into Mac hardware sales, and there are a hell of a lot more people who would buy a cheap PC to run Mac apps than the other way around.

I've said it before -- Max OS/X on a PC box?
No way...Apple is not nearly THAT stupid.

Just wait to see what Steve has in his POCKET on Monday morning.