Apple Tablet Computer Design Patent [Archive]

MacRumors

May 10, 2005, 07:53 PM

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Many readers note that Apple was granted a US patent on "the ornamental design for an electronic device, substantially as shown and described". The US patent was filed on March 17th 2004 and posted today (May 10th, 2005).

Readers will recall that many of the same images were revealed in August 2004 (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2004/08/20040813111236.shtml) (images (http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15971)).

The patent application images (http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=/netahtml/search-adv.htm&r=1&p=1&f=G&l=50&d=ptxt&S1=D504,889.WKU.&OS=pn/D504,889&RS=PN/D504,889?tMoJk) this time also depicts a person using the device as a tablet with touch screen. Little other information is offered on this potential design.

Of interest, this is not the first time Apple has worked on a tablet based computer. An early prototype Newton is pictured here (Messageslate) (http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=1339656&postcount=7) as well as a tablet-based PowerBook prototype is pictured here (http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=1339656&postcount=7).

Rocket Rion

May 10, 2005, 07:55 PM

I'd buy one!

NoCleverSNForMe

May 10, 2005, 07:57 PM

Hmm...that's interesting.

What do you guys think of this? Will they target this towards both Mac+Win users? Are we going to see a combo of this device and the iPod? Is this one of those ideas that will never see the light of day?

You have more experience in this than me, so I'd love to hear your thoughts and comments.

SiliconAddict

May 10, 2005, 07:58 PM

Who do I have to bl......Umm pay to get one of these? :eek: :D ;)

zap2

May 10, 2005, 07:58 PM

im try to get soem cash to buy a new ipod but when this comes out the im try to get one of these not sure(based on price) more or less the ibook or powerbook?

asif786

May 10, 2005, 08:00 PM

hmmm..i wonder:

a) airtunes/airvideo remote?

b) ipod video?

c) in home video watcher thingie-bob

d) tablet mac?

i'm guessing probably a..

<cross posted fromhttp://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=125798 >

PlaceofDis

May 10, 2005, 08:00 PM

i would love a tablet mac, it would work much better than a laptop for me in several cases, now only if they would come out with one and make it somewhat affordable it would be awesome

Slipperyskates

May 10, 2005, 08:01 PM

Thanatoast

May 10, 2005, 08:01 PM

What would it do better than an ibook or powerbook? It's got a smaller (right?)formfactor, so there are even more resrictions on it's capabilities than usual. And for the graphics professionals, since I am most definitely not one, do you draw on this thing? Or do you more manipulate already created images? Is a pen-based interface all that efficient? It must be easier to draw on paper than on a computer screen, right?

EJBasile

May 10, 2005, 08:02 PM

I'm guessing a PDA, a tablet, or a video iPod.

With the available option of buying videos on iTunes I think the chances of a video iPod are getting bigger.

crackrock

May 10, 2005, 08:02 PM

grizzlybrice

May 10, 2005, 08:02 PM

It'd be awesome if it will have similar functionality of a Wacom Cintique... I can only dream. It's Apple though... they make dreams come true... well, for the most part... (come on G5 powerbook!)

B

jadam

May 10, 2005, 08:03 PM

I would die to own a tablet mac, I have really really wanted a tablet PC for school lately, but I also want to buy a new OS X laptop, so this would literally make me splooge!

Dr.Gargoyle

May 10, 2005, 08:03 PM

Me want... The question is when it will arrive. Another topic in the line with PB G5? :p

PlaceofDis

May 10, 2005, 08:04 PM

Let the good times roll for LG-Phillips. I can imagine a lot of the LCDs will get cracked without the lid protecting it.

My iPod screen is scratched to hell, I can't even imagine how bad one of these would look after a year of regular usage.

Won't be getting one of these.

actually, the pc based tablets that are around already have incredibly durable and long lasting screens, so i dont see that to be an issue

this does have some potential, lets hope that it comes to be though!

clayj

May 10, 2005, 08:08 PM

Dr.Gargoyle

May 10, 2005, 08:11 PM

tj53

May 10, 2005, 08:13 PM

Why not?

If G5 powerbooks are far off, which they certainly are due to heat issues. (My PB Ti 1GHz gets damn hot with not even heavy usage. I can't imagine a G5 being reasonable.) Then it would be plausible for apple to develop a product like this to add to their portable line.

I use by PB at school and it is great, but would certainly love the ability to be able to write and draw directly on my screen. It is my no means new technology. Heck one photographer recently made his own out of an iBook. (forget the link, but I'm sure others have it)

I currently have to lug around a notebook along with my laptop in order to take down diagrams and the like. Not a huge issue after-all. But it would be awesome if Apple came out with a tablet laptop. I'd buy one, if the price was reasonable and I was able to get the money.

Object-X

May 10, 2005, 08:13 PM

I would die to own a tablet mac,..!

What good would it do you if you're dead? :confused:

SAukland

May 10, 2005, 08:14 PM

http://homepage.mac.com/saukland/.Public/jawdrop.gif I want one already. Now.

johnbro23

May 10, 2005, 08:15 PM

I can't get most recent image to show up... the page doesn't load. Could someone upload it for me?

AnewMac

May 10, 2005, 08:17 PM

PlaceofDis

May 10, 2005, 08:19 PM

Did anyone see a keyboard?

This could be huge for Apple in the educational setting. With schools out of space, more schools (mine included) are going to wireless mobile labs. A class set of Apple tablets would be nice. This could be a huge emerging market.

the point of tablets is to Not have a keyboard, except for those stupid hybrid laptop/tablet ones, which i have heard some things about the screen connector breaking...

Dr.Gargoyle

May 10, 2005, 08:20 PM

Am I missing something here? It looks just like any generic tablet computer. Dont get me wrong, I would love to have one made by Apple, but I fail to see what is new from the pics. IMHO, an Apple tablet computer is long over due.

anubis

May 10, 2005, 08:21 PM

I'd buy one as long as its feature set was reasonable. For example, I once tried using a Tablet PC, but the stylus-screen interface was magnetic instead of touch based. It made using it to jot notes in Microsoft Notes virtually impossible, as lifting the pen from the surface did not necessarily mean that the tablet registered the fact that you had lifted the pen.

Little things like that, that I would imagine Apple would address (as opposed to this HP piece of crap or whatever it was I tried). I'd buy one if it had a touch-based interface, quality handwriting recognition algorithms, preferrably running full Mac OS X (instead of some watered down OS, like Microsoft does with its Windows CE or whatever).

d.perel

May 10, 2005, 08:21 PM

Well, I guess it could work (don;t mind the skeptic), but who would buy it? Unless it is priced competitively, of course ;)

Bubbasteve

May 10, 2005, 08:26 PM

I'm not to sure if anybody brought up the idea that this might be the rumored iBook Micro (or Mini which ever)

Superdrive

May 10, 2005, 08:27 PM

You'll have to show me a real one before I care. The old prototype and the drawings really do not tell you much about what the new product could be, could do, or could look like.

I'll believe the tablet rumors when I see it on apple.com Tuesday morning. Whatever happened to PC tablets that were supposed to be all the rage?

PlaceofDis

May 10, 2005, 08:27 PM

Based on the illustrations I saw, I have just one question: How in God's name did they get a patent on that? I've seen plenty of other computers (heck, I even own a Vadem Clio, which looks a hell of a lot like that) that use a design like that. Where's the innovative quality that makes this worthy of a patent?

i was wondering the same thing, and HP and some other tablets are referenced too, wonder if Apple was ahead of the crowd and got the patent first? it also links to other patents for similar pen/stylus based computers

GFLPraxis

May 10, 2005, 08:29 PM

bbyrdhouse

May 10, 2005, 08:33 PM

I would sure like to see something like this from Apple. It seems that the creativity from Apple has slowed down just a bit lately.

Since the new form factor iMac there really hasn't been anything "cutting edge" in style from Apple. (Not counting software or OS)

tykles

May 10, 2005, 08:34 PM

This would certainly tie in nicely with all the possibilities of A/V streaming, etc that are starting to pop up. I vote for Airport remote. Imagine streaming h.264 content to your TV, switch over to check your email, change the iTunes track in the next room, see if your FCP project has finished rendering back in the office, etc, all controlled from the couch. probably just wishful thinking.......

iindigo

May 10, 2005, 08:40 PM

Am I the only one seeing this:

POSSIBLE NEWTON REPLACEMENT

Yeehaaa!

Lacero

May 10, 2005, 08:42 PM

Whats the big deal? It's like an iBook, only the screen is flipped the other way.

dan_

May 10, 2005, 08:43 PM

i'm thinking this will be apple's PSP.

PlaceofDis

May 10, 2005, 08:45 PM

Whats the big deal? It's like an iBook, only the screen is flipped the other way.

but there is no keyboard! thats the best part, its more like having a big pad of paper in your lap....

as to the poster who mentioned the psp, apple wont going into gaming, this could be a PDA, but i doubt it, the only other possibility that i see is a remote control for your mac/airport and maybe a medio device that apple could come out with to compliment all of this

Stike

May 10, 2005, 08:46 PM

Is this the video iPod? :eek: :D

jouster

May 10, 2005, 08:46 PM

.....I think it would be more of a novelty than anything else. Apple has always been about media, and I don't see people editing DV in FCP on a tablet...

I doubt if Apple sees people editing DV in FCP on a tablet either.

brap

May 10, 2005, 08:57 PM

Tablet PCs never took off. The Newton died a death. They bowed to their better judgement on the Duo-derivative...

This has to be something damn special to make it in what's really a fairly crappy marketplace. Either it has to be revolutionary, or a must-have tie-in with an existing product.

agreenster

May 10, 2005, 08:58 PM

This is an essential toy for all animators

jeremy.king

May 10, 2005, 09:01 PM

This is an essential toy for all animators

and lazy web surfers like myself who don't need to be tethered to a desktop machine and don't want to afford a laptop. Please be affordable :)

Aside, talk about getting your moneys worth out of the G4 line of processors. First the mini and now a real touchscreen iBook tablet? I guess if you can't get the G5 to run cool enough, just build interesting form factors around "older" G4s.

Warbrain

May 10, 2005, 09:04 PM

woxel1

May 10, 2005, 09:05 PM

How 'bout... a video iPod with touch-screen controls? EH?

AtHomeBoy_2000

May 10, 2005, 09:09 PM

It would be sweet if Apple were to actually make this, but I don't see it happening. It's just logical. Like others have said, tablet PCs never took off and weren't seen as even being worthy of normal use. So I don't think it'll happen. Apple wouldn't waste the money on selling these unless it was education only.

I disagree, kinda. I think the Tablet PC or Mac has a market, it just isnt here yet. THat market is medicine. As you may know, the US government is moving the US towards a computerized healthcare system instead of out BAD paper system. In the near future (about 2-5 years from now) doctors are going to need to have small portable computers that can be linked up the the internet or local database for when they put in patient information. What better format to make a SECURE network than one that runs on the Mac platform. I love the idea.

apexfork

May 10, 2005, 09:12 PM

What good would it do you if you're dead? :confused:

Obviously, you could mount it to your headstone set to run a slideshow of moments from your life. Tie it into iPhoto and call it the iDeath Application Suite.

GFLPraxis

May 10, 2005, 09:13 PM

and lazy web surfers like myself who don't need to be tethered to a desktop machine and don't want to afford a laptop. Please be affordable :)

Aside, talk about getting your moneys worth out of the G4 line of processors. First the mini and now a real touchscreen iBook tablet? I guess if you can't get the G5 to run cool enough, just build interesting form factors around "older" G4s.

The G4 will be around a while.

Dual core G4's take a fraction of the power of current SINGLE core G5's, at dual 1.5 GHz!

And Motorola/Freescale is working on 64-bit G4's that scale up to 2 GHz.

Not too bad if you ask me.

Even if it remains the Celeron of the Mac world, the G4 will be around for a while. I expect dual core G4's to be the next PowerBook, rather than G5's.

GFLPraxis

May 10, 2005, 09:13 PM

Obviously, you could mount it to your headstone set to run a slideshow of moments from your life. Tie it into iPhoto and call it the iDeath Application Suite.

I prefer iDead :D
Or perhaps iDied.

Or maybe iGrave...iRip...

Make a version with a G5 processor and call it the PowerDeath :D

~Shard~

May 10, 2005, 09:23 PM

It's the new PowerBooks! :eek:

mcohen

May 10, 2005, 09:23 PM

I prefer iDead :D
Or perhaps iDied.

Or maybe iGrave...iRip...

Make a version with a G5 processor and call it the PowerDeath :D

iDie. Definitely iDie.

kainjow

May 10, 2005, 09:24 PM

The Tiger AppKit release notes (http://developer.apple.com/releasenotes/Cocoa/AppKit.html) mention quite a lot more changes and improvements for tablet support. Scroll down to "Tablet event support" and see for yourself...

joeboy_45101

May 10, 2005, 09:27 PM

Eh... This really isn't interesting to me. I don't see how it could be any better than an iBook or PowerBook. I don't really believe that Tablet PC's are the next big thing. Maybe this is just a science project for Apple. They probably do that all of the time, develop machines of all shapes and sizes and then pick apart the most innovative features and incorporate them into their actual line of products.

bellis1

May 10, 2005, 09:28 PM

I was just at the bar conversing about how I am on the verge of entering the PDA, blackberry, palm arena just wishing there was something a little different. Maybe something a little bigger than PDA but smaller than my ibook beater. Must be that time of year again for the tablet rumors.

LimeiBook86

May 10, 2005, 09:37 PM

I would love one of these. As an artist a screen that you can just draw on is awesome. If I were able to use this with Flash or Photoshop I would be so happy.

Come on Apple! :D

El Duderino

May 10, 2005, 09:45 PM

I bought a Toshiba M205 tablet PC which i am currently trying to sell becuase i didnt know that my current major requires an Apple Powerbook purchase. Now if a tablet Apple comes out its really just going to be annoying, because the re-sale value on my tablet is absolute garbage. O'well, what can i do, theres always something better coming out.

edit: The screen has held up remarkably well after 2 full semesters of writing on it almost every day. Its show virtually no wear, incredible technology and its not glass so it feels more like paper. So i dont see any problems with reliability in an Apple Tablet

GregA

May 10, 2005, 09:55 PM

tdewey

May 10, 2005, 09:56 PM

biohazard6969

May 10, 2005, 09:57 PM

they're still a ways off....and are tablets generally more or less then the standdard laptop of he same company?

Blackheart

May 10, 2005, 09:58 PM

I don't know how practical that would really be. I think it would be more of a novelty than anything else. Apple has always been about media, and I don't see people editing DV in FCP on a tablet- especially if the cost is signifigantly more than a standard notebook.

Do you see people editing DV in FCP on a Mac Mini?

My point is that Apple has been noticing that they can't stay in a niche market if they intend to make money. There are people other than video editors who need computers. The more Apple can satisfy their needs, the better.

Apple!Freak

May 10, 2005, 09:59 PM

From my understanding, you would plug some type of componet into the back of your already exisiting Mac and the device would wirelessly transmit to the tablet Mac which would basiclly be your Mac sitting on your desk just a wireless transmit to it and with the wireless transmit you could control the Mac, in addition to view the screen.

Sounds like a neat idea. It's like the concept of carrying your iMac around the house but without the 25 pound iMac shell. If the tMac is released with something like a 14' (;)) screen for about $500, there will be bound to be many buyers. Something like $1,000 might be a bit rich. I would say 500 is the sweet point.

HasanDaddy

May 10, 2005, 10:08 PM

dongmin

May 10, 2005, 10:09 PM

Technologically wise, Tiger offers a few features which may be of use to a lite OS....

1. Dashboard - these apps don't require a full fledged OS. Also, many of them could easily be used on a touch screen.

2. Quartz extreme... it has very low bandwidth between the OS and the graphics card. A remote display would thus be much easier, wouldn't it?

No idea if either of those ideas has a bearing on a Tablet PC - but it is possible that a low-power cheap tablet could be a very usable system around the house or office.that's great except that technologies like quartz extreme relies on a fast graphics card. it is not a 'lite' technology by any measure.

personally, i don't think these will sell all that well. sure there'll be a lot of hypein the beginning and gadget freaks with money to burn lining up to get one, but i just don't see these things having much widespread adoption. if the choice was between getting a tablet without a keyboard or an ibook/powerbook, most people would chose a full-featured laptop with a keyboard.

there just aren't that many uses and advantages of a tablet. some say graphic artists but i doubt many will abandon their existing setup for a keyboardless i/o system. others say they'd take notes on it, but my guess is most people would rather have a quite keyboard to type their notes than scribbling them. beyond the coolness factor, there just aren't any 'killer apps' out there...yet.

still, if all they're having to do is repackaging an existing ibook/pbook and selling it at a comparable price, why the heck not. i doubt it'll do much for apple's bottom line, but it probably won't cost a lot of r&d either to produce one of these. worth a gamble.

G5Unit

May 10, 2005, 10:47 PM

I made a tablet mac a long time ago on my computer. It was cool, but now they finally came out with it.

aswitcher

May 10, 2005, 10:51 PM

Looks good. Here's hoping its priced right.

MaCaDDiCT21

May 10, 2005, 10:51 PM

Try wedging a G5 Processor in one of those :D

aussie_geek

May 10, 2005, 10:52 PM

Nope - not for me. I'm happy with my PowerBook thanks.

aussie_geek

Vader

May 10, 2005, 10:52 PM

Try wedging a G5 Processor in one of those :D
I am sure that would cause a fire!

itsbetteronamac

May 10, 2005, 10:55 PM

If it's out by June 13th, I would be interested in buying one... maybe. But, would it really be any MORE useful that a powerbook? I mean No keys, and really no way of proping it up on the go.

~Shard~

May 10, 2005, 10:58 PM

If it's out by June 13th, I would be interested in buying one... maybe. But, would it really be any MORE useful that a powerbook? I mean No keys, and really no way of proping it up on the go.

Maybe it's a revolutionary laptop that will change the industry itself! ;)

swissmann

May 10, 2005, 11:04 PM

I just hope it is small enough to fit in a large pocket. Any bigger and I am buying a full blown laptop.

GregA

May 10, 2005, 11:05 PM

that's great except that technologies like quartz extreme relies on a fast graphics card. it is not a 'lite' technology by any measure.The new Quartz technology doesn't actually require a fast graphics card per se - as far as I understand, it allows a low bandwidth description of the entire MacOSX screen to be sent to another chip, which does the displaying.

As such, the slowest old G3 iBook could have a display-only OS installed - optimised simply to display a remote terminal of another OSX machine. It wouldn't have to have a fast graphics card - simply devote all of its measly CPU power to being an effective display. As long as you've GOT another OSX machine with enough grunt, it would be a nice way of getting longer life out of your other Macs.

Now while I think an OS for old Macs would be great I think it's unlikely - the point is the Tablets. They could, really, be ONLY a screen with a high end graphics card and a pen interface, using airport to send data back to another machine. Couldn't they? - no CPU at all, no hard disk, no keyboard, no DVD drive. Or they could be a lower speed but fully fledged computer (without a great graphics card), and with an OS that EITHER works stand alone and is pretty limited (and syncs to your main Mac), OR becomes a remote display for that Mac.

That's all some big assumptions - I mean I'm assuming it's the cheapest thing Apple can make that you carry around, with a screen, and pen input. Maybe it'd be something more powerful. I figure Quartz extreme and Dashboard allow for the "lite" and cheap concept, but I may be simply dreaming.

mvc

May 10, 2005, 11:19 PM

...They could, really, be ONLY a screen with a high end graphics card and a pen interface, using airport to send data back to another machine. Couldn't they? - no CPU at all, no hard disk, no keyboard, no DVD drive. Or they could be a lower speed but fully fledged computer (without a great graphics card), and with an OS that EITHER works stand alone and is pretty limited (and syncs to your main Mac), OR becomes a remote display for that Mac...

Not sure this is technically feasible just yet, transferring the display info would be really a hi bandwidth job, esp if you decided to watch a dvd on your "server" mac as it were.

In any case, I want one of these gadgets instinctively, though I can't for the life of me see any practical purpose for it that wouldn't be better served by a laptop, except for the smaller form factor, which is probably a negative in actual usage terms.

So, surprise me Apple! (again) :p

840quadra

May 10, 2005, 11:23 PM

I guess this isn't the first time Apple has worked on a Tablet computer

http://homepage.mac.com/gpalermo/.Public/0.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/gpalermo/.Public/1.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/gpalermo/.Public/2.jpg

This is owned by a Macrumors member that I guess worked with Apple in the past. The design is dated, but it was new and unique back when the Powerbook Duo was still alive.

It is a good indication that Apple may have been one of the leaders in the Tablet comptuer relm. The timing was too early, but may have helped them get their foot in the door for current and future patent applications on this technology.

Zappaman

May 10, 2005, 11:34 PM

I heard that Apple had some close ties to Freehand Systems... www.freehandsystems.com and was interested in their MusicPad Pro... Could be interesting for them, perhaps. This is a great product for musicians.
This product looks very much like the patent drawings....

-Zappaman

Porchland

May 10, 2005, 11:40 PM

i'm thinking this will be apple's PSP.

Yep. I totally see this as an personal video player a la Sony PSP. Assuming Apple has this device in development, it has some serious decisions to make about what sort of device Apple wants to have. The choices are almost unlimited:

a. an iPod video
b. a game device
c. a fully functioning iBook
d. a WiFi remote
e. combinations of the above

Apple tends to try to do one thing (at least initially) and do it really. If they follow that logic with a tablet device, we might be looking at, more or less, an iPod video that may or may not also play DVDs.

jeremy.king

May 10, 2005, 11:42 PM

I guess this isn't the first time Apple has worked on a Tablet computer

...

This is owned by a Macrumors member that I guess worked with Apple in the past. The design is dated, but it was new and unique back when the Powerbook Duo was still alive.

It is a good indication that Apple may have been one of the leaders in the Tablet comptuer relm. The timing was too early, but may have helped them get their foot in the door for current and future patent applications on this technology.

and also linked to in the first post of this thread...

nagusjim

May 10, 2005, 11:43 PM

I don't understand why everyone rips against tablets all the time. They're really useful. Students rejoice! Take your tablet to class, scribble your notes on it, it transcribes them (remarkably accurately, too. it's impressive), organize them. drop links in them when you review. Send paper drafts back and forth with your advisor complete with red ink scrawled in the margins (green ink for politically correct profs :p ), and never print anything again. ever.

It's like carrying a filing cabinit in your backpack. All of your documents, ready to read. ready to edit. ready to do whatever you do with paper. Some of my colleagues in grad school have tables (a gateway and a motion) and they absolutely rock. Certainly in education and research, I'd say it's the most efficient tool anyone could buy. I'm 150% mac, but i'd buy a windows tablet, simply because apple doesn't offfer one. The stuff that a tablet gives you MORE than makes up for dealing with windows.

If apple produces one, I'll just give them all of my credit cards. :D

LGRW3919

May 10, 2005, 11:49 PM

Sounds like a neat idea. It's like the concept of carrying your iMac around the house but without the 25 pound iMac shell. If the tMac is released with something like a 14' (;)) screen for about $500, there will be bound to be many buyers. Something like $1,000 might be a bit rich. I would say 500 is the sweet point.

the tmac would spark a lawsuit-- ever heard of the shoes?

how about the "IBM-PSPK-BAB"

ibook mini-psp killing-bad @$$ beast :-D

Abstract

May 10, 2005, 11:52 PM

You beat me to it. I mean it is not like the world hasn't heard of a tablet computer before.

Exactly, especially when Apple has no competitors in the Macintosh arena. :confused:

budugu

May 11, 2005, 12:19 AM

the point of tablets is to Not have a keyboard, except for those stupid hybrid laptop/tablet ones, which i have heard some things about the screen connector breaking...

At times it becomes totally impractical to use the pen... like a long mail ... or need to enter forms that need to be accurate etc... then it is very helpful to get a keyboard (eveen as slightly crappy one). I have been using the HP TC1100 for a few months now and i definitely see the importance. Using a pen on a tablet definitely takes some learning too! Anyway i love my TPC!

budugu

May 11, 2005, 12:35 AM

there just aren't that many uses and advantages of a tablet. some say graphic artists but i doubt many will abandon their existing setup for a keyboardless i/o system. others say they'd take notes on it, but my guess is most people would rather have a quite keyboard to type their notes than scribbling them. beyond the coolness factor, there just aren't any 'killer apps' out there...yet.

still, if all they're having to do is repackaging an existing ibook/pbook and selling it at a comparable price, why the heck not. i doubt it'll do much for apple's bottom line, but it probably won't cost a lot of r&d either to produce one of these. worth a gamble.

The best tablet arround is TC4200 (HP) It is exactly, well not exactly, their NC4200 notebook with Windows TPC (and it has the same price! $1600 with 1.6PM). Tablet PC's are very good when used with software like one note, or even when you are reading journal artical and need to make some comments on it and save the PDF. It will take a certain amount of time to get used to it. But once you are over the initial phase they work like a charm. The best part is you donot have to take care of those few 100s of papers with you comments and reviews and archive them using 10 different methods! It is extremely useful in project meetings. Just the tilt of the TPC will be soo much better than a notebook (which is right in the way of performing a normal conversation with the other person accross the table)
gives better impression of communication. most of experimental plans etc are hand drawn on letter pads in meetings and if you donot archive them you are totally lost.

Best use of Tablet PC: No need to remind yourself that you need to take a pen to the meeting. :D (and no more hating the guy/girl who gets 20 different writing instruments to take good notes :cool: )

Mr. Anderson

May 11, 2005, 12:40 AM

I'd love to see the specs on the system - don't know if I'd want to buy it for the novelty, I'd be more interested in its capabilities. It would be a cool thin to have for digital photography - take pics in the field, download them to the pad, view them, maybe small edits and have a dvd burner to archive them.

D

MontyZ

May 11, 2005, 12:46 AM

I'm also shocked they could get a patent for that, based on those illustrations. Typical, the US Patent Office hands out patents these days like beaded necklaces at Mardi Gras.

MontyZ

May 11, 2005, 12:50 AM

I have a feeling this will be used for something else and won't necessarily be a tablet computer. I mean, who wants to go back to hand-writing everything? Not me. I want a keyboard and mouse. Maybe the keyboard will be on the display itself, but, even so, it's hard to type on a flat surface like that.

But, I can see this working great on an iPod. They can get rid of the wheel thingy and add a larger touch-screen to the iPod instead, making it easier to use, like a PDA. I hope that's how this will be used.

areyouwishing

May 11, 2005, 12:50 AM

Darrin Bell

May 11, 2005, 01:10 AM

Well, I guess it could work (don;t mind the skeptic), but who would buy it? Unless it is priced competitively, of course ;)Artists, architects, designers, technical illustrators. Pretty much anyone who draws for a living or hopes to someday draw for a living (assuming it works like the Cintiq). And then there's whoever already buys tablet PCs...

I'd buy one in a second.

MontyZ

May 11, 2005, 01:11 AM

Maybe Apple will use this to make one of those touch-screen universal remotes. That would be cool. :)

PlaceofDis

May 11, 2005, 01:14 AM

Pass...

It's a novelty to me.

A) I can type faster on a keyboard than i can write. I think most can.
B) Imagine the neck strain trying to watch TV and surf the web. I could use it in bed i guess.
C) I see it useful in a boardroom sense, but how many Mac users are really boardroom types?

I think Apple developed this as a "Just in case the tablet takes off" measure. I do think it is amazing that they were able to get a patent on this though.

i can actually write freehand faster than type, and i type pretty fast too, but thats because im used to jotting down notes and dont worry about spelling either. i think this is good for anyone constantly on the go. train, car, bus, airport/airplane i think this would be awesome, using a pen while having something in your lap is probably easier than typing, because of the hight of the machine.

man i really want one of these now

840quadra

May 11, 2005, 01:15 AM

and also linked to in the first post of this thread...

ahh, so that was the link that wouldn't load for me. I didn't see that it was linking to that topic..

My bad.. I wll go back to lurking on here.

Superdrive

May 11, 2005, 01:18 AM

musiclover137

May 11, 2005, 01:53 AM

I disagree, kinda. I think the Tablet PC or Mac has a market, it just isnt here yet. THat market is medicine. As you may know, the US government is moving the US towards a computerized healthcare system instead of out BAD paper system. In the near future (about 2-5 years from now) doctors are going to need to have small portable computers that can be linked up the the internet or local database for when they put in patient information. What better format to make a SECURE network than one that runs on the Mac platform. I love the idea.

this cannot be reiterated enough. if this was the only market they were going after, it would still probably do well. even if it's just selling them in bulk to doctor's offices. i hate to say it is still probably a ways off though.

musiclover137

May 11, 2005, 01:55 AM

The good thing about a keyboard is I can read my writing almost everytime. (Unless I am anebriated). Plus getting information on a paper is much more efficient using a keyboard. I'm sure Apple could sell me on whatever they crank out from this, if they ever do. The bottom line is, I just think this would be better as anything BUT a laptop.
tablets and laptops are not really the same thing. it probably would not be a fully functioning OS X. something more simple and easier. maybe OS X Cub or Kitten

Balin64

May 11, 2005, 02:05 AM

This does not mean anything, necessarily. Steve Jobs has said that Apple is not interested in this kind of technology...

But then, who konws.

As for myself: this does not work into my work-flow, so I don't care very much.

A tablet Mac will be wonderful, I am sure. We will see.

nms

May 11, 2005, 02:45 AM

Apple has filed tons of patents, many of which never see the light of day....if enough people want this tablet pc....im guessing it'll never see the light. :(

speleoterra

May 11, 2005, 02:53 AM

[QUOTE=Zappaman]I heard that Apple had some close ties to Freehand Systems... www.freehandsystems.com and was interested in their MusicPad Pro... Could be interesting for them, perhaps.

Apple would never release a tablet unless it was Insanely Great.
You guys are thinking small if it is a gaming device or a graphics design interface. (i'm a Graphic Designer, Tell me; why would Apple market that to myself and a very small % of the population? duh?) You guys are thinking that Apple is going after the comicbook guy on the Simpsons lying on his couch eating potato chips, an iTablet on his stomach while watching Star Trek on TV, updating his iTunes & iPhotos from his greasy fingered screen?

Apple is only going to release SOMETHING that is iPod-ish that will change the way we navigate daily. Wasn't Stevie in talks with Fedex awhile back?
Imagine a "dumb" iScreen that could be interface to whomever corporate customer they can bring on board. Whatever the use, the screen is just a piece of hardware that can be OS X'ed or have custom unix applications written to it; all interfacing wireless with a OS X Server system.(1) client like Fedex, using it as a delivery notepad would convince everyone that it is the standard, much like the iPod now is the standard. Medical institutions sign up as a "chart replacement" with it's own programing interface. Military, The MusicPad Pro reference above for musicians, airlines, education etc. OS X is gaining solid acceptance across the board. THIS will the interface that will make it scream in industrial and corporate sectors; where the money is. Sure,..you can also make it change channels on your TV; "Oooooooooooo.......Ahhhhhhhhhhh"

function

May 11, 2005, 02:54 AM

Although I think the tablet idea is really far fetched.

Has anybody thought, Bluetooth Keyboard / Mouse??

Really, all you would need is a cradle/dock of some sort to recharge it, and you can use a BT Keyboard/mouse, it would function just like a desktop, when you aren't lugging it around.

Many tablet PCs have similar features. Keyboard when you want it, then mobile.

Like said, it's not exactly practical, but it could be useful for specific users, especially for business / professional use.

Balin64

May 11, 2005, 02:56 AM

But I do remember reading that SJ said that he saw no market for tablet Macs. Admittedly, the PC and Windows tablet market has not exactly taken off. This patent may pave the road for other things. Why would Apple patent something that Windows tried and failed at?

Gus

May 11, 2005, 02:58 AM

I long for the old days when people like AmbitiousLemon et al would have ripped this thread to shreds. You even mentioned Newton, PDA or tablet, and they went berserk.

Look, as much as many of us want one, and as long as some of us have been waiting (my Newtons are getting VERY long in the tooth), I just don't think we will ever see a PDA out of Apple with Steve Jobs. As far as a tablet goes, the only way I see these really making it is if Ives and Co. can come up with a design that is so spectacular that it is unique. The real problem with all of these types of computers has been the interface. How can you quickly and naturally get information in the dang thing, and then move it to other machines. WiFI, Bluetooth and all of that junk will of course be available-that isnt what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a quick, usale interface that isn't clumsy, slow or more trouble than just typing it later. I'm sure they could do it, but would they?

Regards,
Gus

Jalexster

May 11, 2005, 03:02 AM

speleoterra

May 11, 2005, 03:33 AM

i can actually write freehand faster than type, and i type pretty fast too, but thats because im used to jotting down notes and dont worry about spelling either.

Stevie has already said Apple is not developing anything that replaces typing; such as pen writing on screen. Other than small uses of Inkwell technology, he's already stated that it is not going to happen.

virividox

May 11, 2005, 03:34 AM

i want i want

PlaceofDis

May 11, 2005, 03:35 AM

Stevie has already said Apple is not developing anything that replaces typing; such as pen writing on screen. Other than small uses of Inkwell technology, he's already stated that it is not going to happen.

yeah but one can dream can't they?? Steve also said no flash based ipods either, people do change their minds eventually

Savage Henry

May 11, 2005, 03:35 AM

I think Apple developed this as a "Just in case the tablet takes off" measure. I do think it is amazing that they were able to get a patent on this though.I kinda think you may be on to something there. I would very much doubt this product will see much in the way of daylight.

A PDA may get my ears twitching, but I see nothing special here beyond novelty.

speleoterra

May 11, 2005, 03:43 AM

Basically, everything is stored on the PC. Apps, data, etc... Anyway, all the processing and stuff is done at the Thin Client. It's like the old Terminal-to-Mainframe idea, but for the home. Oh, and Microsoft already tried it out. AND IT SUCKS..

This guy has got the idea. Light, portable and usefull in all kinds of
ways a big heavy PC Tablet isn't.

In your home, sit on the toliet, read the news streaming from your MacMini in your home office.

Or hell, Velcro it to your refrigerator and use it as a internet appliance like the 3com AUDREY. (Got one. Love it! Getting long in tooth though)

speleoterra

May 11, 2005, 03:52 AM

yeah but one can dream can't they?? Steve also said no flash based ipods either, people do change their minds eventually

Ahhh, that was just clever "brilliant Bill Gates saber rattling marketing"

They knew the market and were waiting for the tech to evolve to the price point that they could do it. Would you want to let the cat out of the bag to Creative? They did it right; misinformation so the competition was asleep at the wheel. Now, like another thread mentioned; 50% FLASH market share with the Shuffle (luv mine!) in under 2 months!

God/Jesus/then you. F'king brilliant Stevie.

G.Kirby

May 11, 2005, 03:54 AM

This could be a great design tool. However, it would need to have a quality tablet pen and have the power to do large Photoshop, Illustrator, Quark files. And upto 2Gb Ram would be cool. :rolleyes:

Fukui

May 11, 2005, 04:20 AM

\Is a pen-based interface all that efficient? It must be easier to draw on paper than on a computer screen, right?
No, its not very efficient except for drawing pictures and signing names.
I don't think this is a mac. Something else entirely... which is good.

Poff

May 11, 2005, 04:56 AM

I'm not to sure if anybody brought up the idea that this might be the rumored iBook Micro (or Mini which ever)

You mean this? (attachment) :D I don't think it was an actual rumor, just a mock-up of a 10" tablet.

I think it will take a long time before tablets take off. They are priced high, and are under-spec'ed. And you don't see them in stores, because they don't sell much, and they don't sell much because you don't see them in stores..

it's a vicious circle. I want one. :D

aswitcher

May 11, 2005, 05:11 AM

Nice...

SpaceMagic

May 11, 2005, 05:42 AM

CANT WAIT UNTIL WWDC :D :eek:

COOL!!!

New iBook? These tablets usually act as laptops and then the screen slides over keyboard and bob's your uncle, you've got a tablet!!

HEHEHEH Happy now cos im in market for IBook

Maxiseller

May 11, 2005, 06:38 AM

erm spacemagic, you know the above was a mock up?

rockthecasbah

May 11, 2005, 06:42 AM

It would be awesome to have a tablet mac but im not so sure how useful it would be to the average joe. As of this time, the writing ability is still very flawed in the few i've seen, often writing different words than desired. I think professionals specializing in medicine/treatment, or all of science for that matter, would find this very useful for recording notes without a lot of work and having them in a permanent source. For the rest of us, eh.

SpaceMagic

May 11, 2005, 06:50 AM

erm spacemagic, you know the above was a mock up?

Yes i know! I just think the tablet will be a transforming iBook. Where else would it fit in? Unless its gunna be über expensive and sell for photoshop people and have good specs?

tdewey

May 11, 2005, 08:01 AM

Yep. I totally see this as an personal video player a la Sony PSP. Assuming Apple has this device in development, it has some serious decisions to make about what sort of device Apple wants to have. The choices are almost unlimited:

a. an iPod video
b. a game device
c. a fully functioning iBook
d. a WiFi remote
e. combinations of the above

Apple tends to try to do one thing (at least initially) and do it really. If they follow that logic with a tablet device, we might be looking at, more or less, an iPod video that may or may not also play DVDs.

This makes more sense to me than a tablet computer.

bellis1

May 11, 2005, 08:01 AM

Anyone else see this popup today:

Echostar buys into Archos
...the company has come up with a fancy new portable DVR, they call AV 700 which resembles the old Newton in size and shape. It works with all sorts of video formats like Divx, MPEG4 and Windows Media, even though it is a linux-based device, with a nice 7 inch screen. It can record television shows with nary a computer in sight....

bring on the tvmac

edit: oh, and they have an aricle on the tabet mac...

ijimk

May 11, 2005, 08:06 AM

I hope apple gets on this train. I am actually surprised they have not rryed this way sooner, see their target audience. Any way i own a 4 by 6 wacom but i am very intrested to see what apple brings to the table. :cool:

Evangelion

May 11, 2005, 08:21 AM

I have two words for you all:

Thin Client

Basically, everything is stored on the PC. Apps, data, etc... Anyway, all the processing and stuff is done at the Thin Client. It's like the old Terminal-to-Mainframe idea, but for the home. Oh, and Microsoft already tried it out. AND IT SUCKS.

Clearly, you have no idea what you are talking about. I have worked on thin clients. (I did my final thesis on LTSP (http://www.ltsp.org/)), and they work very, very well. just because Windows doesn't work with them that well, doesn't mean that the idea is bad. Fact is that thin clients and remote X has been used for LONG time. Thin clients have been used for long times, and they are used even today. And they work very well. Of course they are not suitable for every occasion, but they have lots of uses.

In my tests, my "server" was my 800Mhz AMD Duron machine, and the client was a 120MHz Pentium with 32MB of RAM. And it ran up-to-date version of KDE (http://www.kde.org/) (version 2.2.2 back then) just fine. Hell, I could even watch near DVD-quality movie on the client without any problems, and the performance was VERY good!

Using a tablet for thin client might actually work. Wireless LAN makes it possible. They could sell if for few hundred bucks, and it could act as an terminal to a more poweful Mac.

Les Kern

May 11, 2005, 09:05 AM

This guy has got the idea. Light, portable and usefull in all kinds of
ways a big heavy PC Tablet isn't.

Exactly. I had a tablet, a nice top-of-the-line HP. Pretty nice, but slow, cumbersome and it didn't really increase or even ease my productivity or complement my creative work. At all. I mean AT ALL. Apple I'm sure has seen the stats on tablet sales and SHOULD stay away from the current concept. But I'm sure if Apple DOES introduce one they will change that concept to something only Apple can dream up.

cubist

May 11, 2005, 09:11 AM

Based on the illustrations I saw, I have just one question: How in God's name did they get a patent on that? I've seen plenty of other computers (heck, I even own a Vadem Clio, which looks a hell of a lot like that) that use a design like that. Where's the innovative quality that makes this worthy of a patent?

It's a design patent, which protects the appearance of a product from copycats. On the positive side, this means that Apple is very likely to release this product substantially as shown. Yay!

clayj

May 11, 2005, 09:23 AM

It's a design patent, which protects the appearance of a product from copycats. On the positive side, this means that Apple is very likely to release this product substantially as shown. Yay!And I'm saying that that particular appearance has already been used by many other tablet-style devices. Hence, I don't understand why the USPO would issue a patent, other than the usual excuse of "we're overworked and we let stupid crap slip through, like one-click ordering".

kirk26

May 11, 2005, 09:36 AM

If Apple releases a Mac Tablet I will come back to the Mac family.....

~Shard~

May 11, 2005, 09:41 AM

If Apple releases a Mac Tablet I will come back to the Mac family.....

Why did you leave?

nubero

May 11, 2005, 09:55 AM

Based on the illustrations I saw, I have just one question: How in God's name did they get a patent on that? I've seen plenty of other computers (heck, I even own a Vadem Clio, which looks a hell of a lot like that) that use a design like that. Where's the innovative quality that makes this worthy of a patent?

I have an idea: Maybe it's the finger. Did you notice that this fing get's used with your index finger instead of a (damn) pen?
That's what I found to be the most interesting bit about this Device. And it could explain for the patent (even though I haven't read it and don't know the legal system/laws concerning patent applications). Imagine if that thing is to be used with fingers only...

CTYankee

May 11, 2005, 09:56 AM

Before people start saving their money...realize that many patents do not stand the chance of being developed into commecial products. You do not need a prototype to even get a patent. All you need is an idea and some 'prophetic examples'.

All this patent means is that Apple came up with an idea, patented it, and only they can use it. This is very common in industry. Patent things and let them rot in the patent office so no one else can do them. (think fuel cell cars...guess who owns those patents now) Some countries do not allow this and even let patents lapse if the owner does not try and bring the idea to market.

This is likely just apple expanding the patent space. The larger their patent space, the less room competitors have to work in. Patents are often more defensive than offensive moves.

SiliconAddict

May 11, 2005, 10:06 AM

Am I the only one seeing this:

POSSIBLE NEWTON REPLACEMENT

Yeehaaa!

Is Jobs still in charge of Apple? There's your answer. :mad: :(

GregA

May 11, 2005, 10:07 AM

Not sure this is technically feasible just yet, transferring the display info would be really a hi bandwidth job, esp if you decided to watch a dvd on your "server" mac as it were.A thin client would not be able to do everything a fat client does. It would also be far cheaper. I think video is possible since there are already wireless devices with streaming video, but I doubt Apple is thinking of video for their tablet.

Now IF the tablet was a very thin client... I started asking myself - what wires would be useful for the wireless client? Firewire? Power charging? (maybe a charging dock?). Would Apple put a connector like the iPod connector on their tablet?
... which reminded me.... Does anyone remember the write-ups on how the Mac Mini has what LOOKS like a dock for the iPod on its top? (hidden below the case now). I wonder if Apple, a year ago, was thinking of docking a larger tablet/screen on top of the Mini. Like an iMac with a screen you could disconnect and keep right on working in a different room. While docked you'd have a high data connection to the screen.

Of course, if Apple a year ago was building their Mini, and their Tablet, and got a patent on the tablet, and built the Mini with a dock, then decided not to release the tablet - the question is did they simply say "nah, it's not worth it!", or did they say "the remote screen isn't responsive enough, we need Quartz Extreme and some dashboard apps before this is worthwhile!"

NavyIntel007

May 11, 2005, 11:12 AM

This could be a hit. I'm not so sure I'm crazy about it being a thin client. How is that going to be useful when I need to take notes in my business classes away from my home server?

It needs certain features to make it great that Apple could certainly do.

1. 8-10 hours battery life. This device needs to be able to go a full day without charge.
2. Light. Tablets are coming in at 5-6 lbs now. That's very heavy for what it does. 3-4 lbs or lighter is best.
3. Price point needs to be below $1000. $800 would be ideal. This device should supplemental to desktop ownership. Buying a Mac Mini and a tablet would come in at about the same price as a powerbook.

Questions I have.

1. Ports. I'd like to at least have a USB port. Maybe a firewire. But I'd like it to be as clean as possible.
2. Docking station. Can I use this as a standalone machine? Will I have a superdrive option in the dock?
3. Integration with other macs. Instead of a thin client, this computer needs to be everything OS X is along with advanced integration and backup solutions with desktop macs and servers.
4. Screen size. 12" would be optimal. 14" is huge.

I'm not in the market now. I'm going to milk my 12" until it's dead. But when it does, I would like to get a desktop and a machine like this.

cubist

May 11, 2005, 12:09 PM

You guys are still missing the point. This is a DESIGN PATENT. It does not cover functionality in any way whatsoever. The thing might be a flat tank for pet turtles for all the PTO cares.

The product must look almost identical to what was submitted, or the design patent is worthless. Therefore it will not have a lot of ports, since the figure does not show any ports other than what appears to be an iPod dock connector.

The only rational explanation is that this is a video iPod. It is not a PDA; nobody would edit data on a PDA with their fingertip, they would want a stylus, and as we know iPods are read-only devices.

The market for tablets is miniscule. The market for iPods is huge. Think about it.

Lord Byron

May 11, 2005, 12:39 PM

It's an iNewton!

MontyZ

May 11, 2005, 12:48 PM

You guys are still missing the point. This is a DESIGN PATENT.
That's even MORE suspicious then, because it looks like an iEtch-A-Sketch.

Rustus Maximus

May 11, 2005, 01:49 PM

This is an essential toy for all animators
Pretty much anyone who draws for a living or hopes to someday draw for a living (assuming it works like the Cintiq)

Maybe that's exactly who they are aiming at with this. Set the price point right and it would be hugely successful.

Perhaps that's exactly what this would be. Apple's version of a Cintiq. Maybe this isn't a new tablet computer at all but rather a next generation monitor complete with OLED :)

vanherk

May 11, 2005, 02:17 PM

I have two words for you all:

Thin Client

Basically, everything is stored on the PC. Apps, data, etc... Anyway, all the processing and stuff is done at the Thin Client.

Just for clarification, what you are describing here is a Client/Server implementation with a FAT Client.

In a Thin client architecture, your client does very little processing. It is just a 'view' to the application....presentation only.

Business logic, processing, and data store is handled by application servers / databases on the 'back-end'

So, if it were to be a thin client device, it could accept video/audio/data streams from multiple sources in your home/business that you could control/manipulate.

dongmin

May 11, 2005, 02:26 PM

Artists, architects, designers, technical illustrators. Pretty much anyone who draws for a living or hopes to someday draw for a living (assuming it works like the Cintiq).This is one of the biggest misconceptions. I was a graphic designer for magazines for four years and now just finished four years of architecture school so i know a little bit about the markets you're talking about.

first of all, most illustrators who like to hand-draw would keep on hand-drawing on paper/canvas/etc. wacoms have been around forever and only a small percentage of illustrators use them.

all modern graphic design programs have interfaces that are built around the keyboard and mouse. pros relie on their keyboard for shortcuts. the idea of having to do everything on a pen-based system would be horribly inefficient.

architects don't "draw" anymore. most people use AutoCAD which is heavily command-based. same for any kind of visualizing and modeling.

so if you're having to lug around a keyboard all the time to use photoshop, illustrator, autocad, etc., what's the point of having a tablet???

Dr.Gargoyle

May 11, 2005, 04:01 PM

This is a DESIGN PATENT..
If so, how does this contraption (turtle tank or computer) differ from any generic tablet computer? I was under the impression that patent protection only was given to unique designs.
The only rational explanation is that this is a video iPod.
I like the idea, and you might be right. However, it is possible to imagine a stylus doubling as a pen, which would explain why there isn't a designated slot fro the stylus. As I see it it would be in line with Apples "less is more design". I don't have any problem envision Apple trying to sell me a $59 white plastic stylus/pen. ;)

Rustus Maximus

May 11, 2005, 04:09 PM

first of all, most illustrators who like to hand-draw would keep on hand-drawing on paper/canvas/etc. wacoms have been around forever and only a small percentage of illustrators use them.

I agree paper isn't going anywhere just as oils, watercolors and canvas aren't going anywhere just yet. However, even though Wacoms have been around for ages they are only now getting into the realm of actually drawing on the screen with effective resolution and pressure sensitivity.

The Cintiq 21 is the first in that new line of artist oriented computer tablets. Many artists have shyed away from Wacom because they can't make the transition to drawing without looking directly at where they are drawing.

So I disagree, an Apple version of something similar to the Cintiq could do enormously well.

Peterbob

May 11, 2005, 04:29 PM

Hi all,

Not sure if anyone else has had this exprience, but since installing Tiger and playing around with the firewall settings (switching iTunes music sharing off) I now get an warning message when starting iTunes. The message states "Your computer is using firewall software that prevents you from sharing music or using a remote control for Airtunes. To share music or use a remote control, open system preferences, click sharing, then click firewall, and select "iTunes music sharing"

Just wondering if the new tablet device could be the fabled Airtunes remote control or am I barking up the wrong tree?

Dr.Gargoyle

May 11, 2005, 04:33 PM

Just wondering if the new tablet device could be the fabled Airtunes remote control or am I barking up the wrong tree?
A remote the size of a small ibook? Don't you think that would be overkill? It might double as one, but I doubt that would be its main purpose... but what do I know... Jobs RDF might have kicked in. :rolleyes:

Peterbob

May 11, 2005, 04:39 PM

A remote the size of a small ibook? Don't you think that would be overkill? It might double as one, but I doubt that would be its main purpose... but what do I know... Jobs RDF might have kicked in. :rolleyes:

Please ignore my ignorance (being a newbie etc) but I was under the impression that patent illustrations were not always to scale, that the illustrations were just to show the principal idea, rather than actually dimension, form factor etc. I'm sure I read that the iPod touch control was demonstrated on an illustration showing a mouse.

ijimk

May 11, 2005, 04:53 PM

What do you think the average price would run on this tablet mac?

Figures they would talk about this i just bought a 4 by 6 wacom last week :rolleyes:

Dr.Gargoyle

May 11, 2005, 05:18 PM

Please ignore my ignorance (being a newbie etc) but I was under the impression that patent illustrations were not always to scale, that the illustrations were just to show the principal idea, rather than actually dimension, form factor etc. I'm sure I read that the iPod touch control was demonstrated on an illustration showing a mouse.
Hey, you know just as much as I do about this.... Besides, you do have a point about scaling. My point was just that it struck me as overkill with a laptop sized remote. To sum it up, we are both in the darkness what this contraption might/could be. Your guess is just as good as mine. :)

MontyZ

May 11, 2005, 08:47 PM

This is one of the biggest misconceptions. All modern graphic design programs have interfaces that are built around the keyboard and mouse. pros relie on their keyboard for shortcuts. the idea of having to do everything on a pen-based system would be horribly inefficient.
True. I've tried these tablets a number of times over the past 10 years, and while they were fun at first, eventually I went back to the mouse because it was just easier. The tablet is just another, different type of input device.

m4r71n1

May 11, 2005, 09:09 PM

common... give us a new portable... this would be nice.. if you would shove in a decent graphics card. IT COULD BE A WHOLE NEW LINE! and help both pros and students!
i just want a portable

brd2887

May 11, 2005, 11:00 PM

as far as I'm concerned, a tablet mac wouldn't benefit me all that much, nor would a video iPod, or any of the other things that people are speculating, but if it did happen to turn out to be a tablet mac, I think that it would probably end up something like the G4 Cube (who here remembers those things?)... it wouldn't end up being more than a novelty at first, but it might set something in motion that could possibly lead to a much better and more useful idea. (G4 Cube -> Mac Mini ; Tablet Mac -> ???)

dongmin

May 12, 2005, 12:55 AM

The Cintiq 21 is the first in that new line of artist oriented computer tablets. Many artists have shyed away from Wacom because they can't make the transition to drawing without looking directly at where they are drawing.

So I disagree, an Apple version of something similar to the Cintiq could do enormously well.I haven't test drove a Cintiq so I can't speak about the functionality of these things. BUT the cheapest Cintiq runs $1800. And that's just for the display. To get a high-quality display with proper touch sensitivity for artist use is gonna cost you. This would be an ultra ultra high-end niche product. And in case you guys haven't noticed, Apple's interest these days are creating mass-appeal products like the Mini and iPods.

RichP

May 12, 2005, 11:29 AM

Hi all,

Not sure if anyone else has had this exprience, but since installing Tiger and playing around with the firewall settings (switching iTunes music sharing off) I now get an warning message when starting iTunes. The message states "Your computer is using firewall software that prevents you from sharing music or using a remote control for Airtunes. To share music or use a remote control, open system preferences, click sharing, then click firewall, and select "iTunes music sharing"

now THIS is INTERESTING!

Personally, i want an Apple PDA. I have been looking for a while, and none of them really measure up to what I think Apple can do.

speleoterra

May 12, 2005, 01:17 PM

Rustus Maximus

May 12, 2005, 02:14 PM

Please,..no more speculation that it is a graphic designer tablet.
I think the couple of guys here including myself from the industry
are agreeing that this is a flawed concept. The market is too small and niche for it to be anything of that nature. End of discusion. :mad:

Don't be mad. :)

The market for this tablet wouldn't be just Visual Designers, artists whatever. It also would include the medical field as someone mentioned earlier, so the market might not be too small after all. Visual Design could just be one focus of it.

Jesus

May 12, 2005, 03:16 PM

I disagree, students will be interested. My old TiBook needs a replacement and as I go to college this year, and a tablet would be excellent for me, and i think many others agree. IMHO, if Apple was to release this product ever, Students and (some) Graphic Designers would rejoice. That's my opinion. :eek:

dongmin

May 12, 2005, 03:32 PM

Don't be mad. :)

The market for this tablet wouldn't be just Visual Designers, artists whatever. It also would include the medical field as someone mentioned earlier, so the market might not be too small after all. Visual Design could just be one focus of it.Ummm, hello? Since when is the medical note-taking field a big enough market to create a brand new product for??? Graphic design is Apple's bread and butter; it's their most loyal base of users. The medical field, I'd say, is a drop in the bucket compared to graphic design.

If Apple does create a tablet, they will no doubt come up with some new ingenius applications for it, applications that will have bigger market potential than doctors and illustrators. Apple is becoming a consumer electornics company, more and more everyday. They are NOT gonna create anything unless it can appeal to the masses.

I think a tablet-like computer has some potential, but more as a multi-media device. It needs to be small (2/3 the size of an iBook) and cheap (somewhere between a Mini and an iBook). It's gotta have hip, cool design. AND it's gotta have some hip, cool applications. My votes:

1. iChat AV + internet telephony: with a camera attachment, this could be a cool little video phone that you can take anywhere. With internet telephony becoming mainstream, I can see Apple creating an add-on to iChat that lets you make actual phone calls.

2. Portable video player: yes, not a new idea, but it's finally time for Apple to get on board. With iTunes supporting video, this device (with something like a 800 x 534 widescreen) could be the perfect complement to take on plane rides and long road-trips.

3. Car accesory: people are already doing this with the Mini, but it would make even more sense with a tablet with a touch screen already built in. When you drive into your garage, it can wireless sync with your home Mac and update all your iTunes music and videos, travel itinerary, shopping lists, etc.

4. Home entertainment controller: the iRemote everyone's been clamoring for. Not only will you be able to control iTunes, but also the DVD player, Tivo, Quicktime, etc.

To make this work, Apple needs a computer fast enough to handle video. The cheapest way would be to just repackage the iBook. Take out the optical drive, 2.5" HDD, keyboard, trackpad, speakers. Add in a 1.8" HDD integrated with the motherboard a la iPods, a 9" touchscreen, and a shrunken battery. You have a tablet 2/3 size of an iBook but only marginally slower. By taking out some components, you could probably shave some of the cost. Price them aggressively, maybe at $699 and you'd see them fly off the shelves. (Apple could make their money back on accessories like a dock, wireless keyboard, iSight mini, GPS add-on, etc.) With proper marketing tie ins to iPods, Apple could easily sell a million or two of these a year, add a couple percentage points to Mac's marketshare, and substantially boost OS X's installed base.

capone2

May 12, 2005, 04:12 PM

I have been waiting for this !! Sold.

PB 17" 1.5ghz/1gbram :)

firebox

May 12, 2005, 04:16 PM

Ummm, hello? Since when is the medical note-taking field a big enough market to create a brand new product for??? Graphic design is Apple's bread and butter; it's their most loyal base of users. The medical field, I'd say, is a drop in the bucket compared to graphic design.

If Apple does create a tablet, they will no doubt come up with some new ingenius applications for it, applications that will have bigger market potential than doctors and illustrators. Apple is becoming a consumer electornics company, more and more everyday. They are NOT gonna create anything unless it can appeal to the masses.

I think a tablet-like computer has some potential, but more as a multi-media device. It needs to be small (2/3 the size of an iBook) and cheap (somewhere between a Mini and an iBook). It's gotta have hip, cool design. AND it's gotta have some hip, cool applications. My votes:

1. iChat AV + internet telephony: with a camera attachment, this could be a cool little video phone that you can take anywhere. With internet telephony becoming mainstream, I can see Apple creating an add-on to iChat that lets you make actual phone calls.

2. Portable video player: yes, not a new idea, but it's finally time for Apple to get on board. With iTunes supporting video, this device (with something like a 800 x 534 widescreen) could be the perfect complement to take on plane rides and long road-trips.

3. Car accesory: people are already doing this with the Mini, but it would make even more sense with a tablet with a touch screen already built in. When you drive into your garage, it can wireless sync with your home Mac and update all your iTunes music and videos, travel itinerary, shopping lists, etc.

4. Home entertainment controller: the iRemote everyone's been clamoring for. Not only will you be able to control iTunes, but also the DVD player, Tivo, Quicktime, etc.

To make this work, Apple needs a computer fast enough to handle video. The cheapest way would be to just repackage the iBook. Take out the optical drive, 2.5" HDD, keyboard, trackpad, speakers. Add in a 1.8" HDD integrated with the motherboard a la iPods, a 9" touchscreen, and a shrunken battery. You have a tablet 2/3 size of an iBook but only marginally slower. By taking out some components, you could probably shave some of the cost. Price them aggressively, maybe at $699 and you'd see them fly off the shelves. (Apple could make their money back on accessories like a dock, wireless keyboard, iSight mini, GPS add-on, etc.) With proper marketing tie ins to iPods, Apple could easily sell a million or two of these a year, add a couple percentage points to Mac's marketshare, and substantially boost OS X's installed base.

Just read this and i can't really see any other way this SHOULD go, exactly the kind of product that would blow the next generation away, and stay ahead in a completely new market... now whether the hardcore mac fan is gonna like this or not is another question alltogether, all things considered all they really want is the actual computer, but apple is a business, and homes are gradually turning into big scale entertainment centres :)

Blackheart

May 12, 2005, 05:47 PM

Hey, if I can take notes with it in class then I'll take one. Paper is SOOO last year. :)

MontyZ

May 13, 2005, 08:11 PM

I still think it's going to be some sort of programmable remote control device. Apple keeps pushing further and further into consumer electronics.

dongmin

May 13, 2005, 09:17 PM

I still think it's going to be some sort of programmable remote control device. Apple keeps pushing further and further into consumer electronics.You're right about the consumer thing. But why would you need such a large tablet for a simple remote (assuming that fig. 9 is close to the real thing)? Really, for an effective iTunes remote, you don't need anything bigger than an iPod. Even if this 'remote' controlled other apps like quicktime and dvd player, it'd still be overkill. It's not cheap producing a touch LCD screen that size. You'd need a decent graphics processor to drive it, plus airport and a decent size battery. All in all, it wouldn't be a cheap, 'consumer' solution. Who'd be crazy enough to spend $400-500 for an iTunes remote???

Blackjack75

May 14, 2005, 12:22 PM

I just posted on my blog (http://jack.link-u.com/?p=19) about the subject. I came up with this (dubious perspective) mockup.

My idea (for those who can't read french, therefore my blog) is to have a rotating screen that would allow switching a normal notebook to a tablet. I just wish my 12" iBook had this option so I could play with painter directly on the screen!

So it wouldn't be a new product but a BTO option for the current (or next) notebooks.

Darrin Bell

May 14, 2005, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by Darrin Bell
Artists, architects, designers, technical illustrators. Pretty much anyone who draws for a living or hopes to someday draw for a living (assuming it works like the Cintiq).
This is one of the biggest misconceptions. I was a graphic designer for magazines for four years and now just finished four years of architecture school so i know a little bit about the markets you're talking about....And I'm a syndicated cartoonist, illustrator and graphic designer, so I also know a little bit about the markets I'm talking about.;)

first of all, most illustrators who like to hand-draw would keep on hand-drawing on paper/canvas/etc. wacoms have been around forever and only a small percentage of illustrators use them.That's only because of the disconnect between drawing on a tablet and watching a monitor. It's annoying not being able to watch your hand while you draw. And from what I've seen and heard from others in my field, they would love to get their hands on something like this.

all modern graphic design programs have interfaces that are built around the keyboard and mouse. pros relie on their keyboard for shortcuts. the idea of having to do everything on a pen-based system would be horribly inefficient.The new Wacom Intuos 3 has several programmable buttons that have eliminated my need to use a keyboard, so no, pros no longer rely on keyboards for shortcuts. If an iTablet had a similar feature set, I and many other professional artists who use Macs (and are tired of spending hours scanning in hand-drawn images) would probably sell our left arms to own one of these.

architects don't "draw" anymore. most people use AutoCAD which is heavily command-based. same for any kind of visualizing and modeling.
so if you're having to lug around a keyboard all the time to use photoshop, illustrator, autocad, etc., what's the point of having a tablet???
:p
Fair enough, I don't really know much about architecture, autoCad, etc... So let's leave them out of the equation (although I'm not convinced that they'd have no use for it) -- it still probably leaves a potential global market of illustrators and art students (not to mention whoever currently uses tablet pcs) numbering in the millions. I'm sure there are other uses for such a device that I haven't thought of.

dongmin

May 14, 2005, 09:26 PM

Fair enough, I don't really know much about architecture, autoCad, etc... So let's leave them out of the equation (although I'm not convinced that they'd have no use for it) -- it still probably leaves a potential global market of illustrators and art students (not to mention whoever currently uses tablet pcs) numbering in the millions. I'm sure there are other uses for such a device that I haven't thought of.What you're suggesting is a tablet with a touch screen sophisticated enough to use for illustrating. As I referenced before, the 17" Cintiq goes for $1800, just for the display. Let's say a compact version, a 12" screen, can be had for 2/3 the price--$1200. Add that to the cost of an iBook, probably about $800 without the screen, and you're talking about a $2000 for 'low-end' system. As a frame of reference, Apple sold a total of 195,000 PowerBooks at an average price of little over $2000 last quarter. You see where I'm driving at??? A tablet geared for artists is gonna be expensive and end up being a limited niche product.

And we haven't even discussed the whole question of what Apple can add that's not out in the market already. As you say, the Wacom Intuos are nice products, as are the Cintiqs. It's a good solution for people who like pen solution.

The vision I'm offering is at the other end of the spectrum: a consumer-level system with cheap touchscreens that you find in PDAs. It'd be priced in that magic sub-$1000 range. And it'd be designed specifically with consumer applications in mind, i.e. music, video, chatting, web surfing, etc. You can look at it as a suped up ipod or as a portable mac mini.

Darrin Bell

May 14, 2005, 11:09 PM

What you're suggesting is a tablet with a touch screen sophisticated enough to use for illustrating. As I referenced before, the 17" Cintiq goes for $1800, just for the display. Let's say a compact version, a 12" screen, can be had for 2/3 the price--$1200. Add that to the cost of an iBook, probably about $800 without the screen, and you're talking about a $2000 for 'low-end' system.The Cintiq's way too expensive, but since I've seen Tablet PCs for about $1200 that include keyboards and hard drives, I'd wager Apple could keep the price below $1500. That's actually not that expensive, even for a starving professional artist like me.

As a frame of reference, Apple sold a total of 195,000 PowerBooks at an average price of little over $2000 last quarter. You see where I'm driving at??? A tablet geared for artists is gonna be expensive and end up being a limited niche product.I agree it would cost more than a Mac Mini, but I don't think the price would be outrageous. And Apple could simply do what other PC manufacturers have done and add a stowaway keyboard (make the screen swivel, or do something original) to turn it into a full-fledged laptop/tablet hybrid. As for limited niche products, that's what most people say the Mac is, and it's doing pretty well. I, for one, am not willing to predict that the niche for an iTablet would be too small to be successful.

And we haven't even discussed the whole question of what Apple can add that's not out in the market already.I'm sure they can think of something.

As you say, the Wacom Intuos are nice products, as are the Cintiqs. It's a good solution for people who like pen solution.Only if you don't mind being tethered to your desk all day. I'd like to be able to go sit out on the balcony or at the beach with my tablet on my lap and draw.

The vision I'm offering is at the other end of the spectrum: a consumer-level system with cheap touchscreens that you find in PDAs. It'd be priced in that magic sub-$1000 range. And it'd be designed specifically with consumer applications in mind, i.e. music, video, chatting, web surfing, etc. You can look at it as a suped up ipod or as a portable mac mini.I'm a little confused about this. If it's a portable Mac Mini that means it's a self contained system with a screen you can "write" (or in my case, "draw") on. That sounds exactly like what I've been advocating, only with a slightly more sophisticated screen that has Graphire-level pressure sensitivity for those who want to pay around $1000 (and an option for one that has Intuos-level pressure sensitivity, for those who don't mind paying $1500-$2000 for it). IF Apple could keep the price in those ranges and make it appealing in some way that current tablet PC makers haven't (like they did with the MP3 player), I think this would have a good shot.

speleoterra

May 15, 2005, 11:30 AM

...And I'm a syndicated cartoonist, illustrator and graphic designer, -- it still probably leaves a potential global market of illustrators and art students (not to mention whoever currently uses tablet pcs) numbering in the millions.

like that's Apple's business stratagy for the future?, developing products for
graphic designer & art students? Thats the 80's man. Yea, shareholders would love that product debut, watch the stock plummet.
(well then I'd buy some more i guess) I'll stick with my table, pen and paper for illustrating thank you and wacom for photoshop.

and as for a swivel screen that lies flat back on the notebook,..Uh,
i think thats what a PC tablent is. Apples not going to follow that route

MontyZ

May 15, 2005, 02:07 PM

You're right about the consumer thing. But why would you need such a large tablet for a simple remote...

Well, the illustration may not show the device at the actual size. It could be a bit smaller, something along the lines of this device which has a 7-inch screen:

Archos (http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/portable-media/archos/archos-av700-previewed-verdict-big-103090.php)

Darrin Bell

May 15, 2005, 10:33 PM

like that's Apple's business stratagy for the future?, developing products for
graphic designer & art students? Thats the 80's man.I guess you missed the part where I said "not to mention whoever currently uses tablet pcs." I didn't mean to say they should design a product for graphic designers and art students (and other professional artists), I only mean to say that's one market it would appeal to (not the only one).

Yea, shareholders would love that product debut, watch the stock plummet.
(well then I'd buy some more i guess) I'll stick with my table, pen and paper for illustrating thank you and wacom for photoshop.Feel free to stick to those, I would be happy to switch. Having choices is good. As you know, different consumers want different systems.

and as for a swivel screen that lies flat back on the notebook,..Uh,
i think thats what a PC tablent is. Apples not going to follow that routeI love when people only reply to parts of posts, ignoring the rest. Such as the part where I said "or something original." I'm sure if anyone could come up with a good solution to the keyboard issue, it would be Apple.

Anyway, I'm not predicting that's what Apple's going to do, I'm just saying that if they came out with something like that, I would buy one and there would be a market for it. I don't know if it would be a large enough market to be worth it, but then that's exactly how I (and other people on forums like this who contemptuously dismissed the entire concept) felt about MP3 players before Apple introduced the iPod. I was perfectly happy with my Discman.

If Apple could figure out a way to make a full-fledged tablet (not a thin client) appealing to the masses, that would be great. And I'm not as clairvoyant as others who seem to already know it wouldn't work.

iMeowbot

May 16, 2005, 04:44 AM

If so, how does this contraption (turtle tank or computer) differ from any generic tablet computer? I was under the impression that patent protection only was given to unique designs.

The design patent simply gives them protection for exactly what was granted: an "electronic device" (so turtle tank manufacturers are safe) with the illustrated form factor. If someone else wants to make a flat electronic thingy with a display on top, they will need to use different cabinet styling (different corners, or whatever) is all.

I like the idea, and you might be right. However, it is possible to imagine a stylus doubling as a pen, which would explain why there isn't a designated slot fro the stylus. As I see it it would be in line with Apples "less is more design". I don't have any problem envision Apple trying to sell me a $59 white plastic stylus/pen. ;)

It may have been much less ambitious than a full-fledged computer. I'd be surprised if Apple didn't at least consider using a larger display for the iPod photo models before settling on the existing form factor.

Sedulous

May 16, 2005, 08:07 AM

"Yes, I see, this is going to be some sort of computer. Let's patent it" what is the point of that?

One thing is for certain, if this is going to be a tablet, it will probably find itself used mostly in an industrial setting. It is still more efficient to type. Besting the current form factor of the "notebook computer" is going to be hard.

GregA

May 16, 2005, 06:56 PM

One thing is for certain, if this is going to be a tablet, it will probably find itself used mostly in an industrial setting. It is still more efficient to type. Besting the current form factor of the "notebook computer" is going to be hard.MOSR is reporting that the tablet was prototyped and dropped for lack of market.

Personally, I doubt it was aimed at an industrial setting. Unfortunately, there are so many things it could have been - maybe a full fledged computer (basically a laptop in tablet form at the same price as a laptop) or a light OS (a Photo iPod with a big screen, dashboard, web browser, and maybe email or a pages 'lite').

I guess we may never know!
Greg
ps. I still like the idea that the tablet was a light OS and could also be a remote screen for a Mac, as I said earlier.
I found a link where someone describes the strange dock on the Mac Mini - perhaps it was a dock (for charging and higher speed data transfer) to the tablet.
http://www.lbodnar.dsl.pipex.com/macmini/macmini_ipod.html

MontyZ

May 16, 2005, 10:03 PM

Maybe it will just be a serving tray and not a tablet computer.

davidarb

Sep 12, 2005, 05:29 PM

I noticed today that Samsung is rushing its deliver of 2GB flash memory to market in in '06 instead of '07 as expected. Apple sources its flash from Samsung for the Ipods and is their biggest customer so no surprise on the rush but I found it interesting that Samsung pointed out they chained 16 of these cards together to form a single 32Gb memory. Likely too big physically to put into the size-obsessed iPod family but might fit into a tablet form factor nicely. Dumping the hard-drive in favor of flash based memory would give this tablet a dramatically longer battery life than anything comparable out there.

YS2003

Nov 27, 2005, 05:05 PM

I am in the market for the tablet/convertable notebook computer and I hope Apple is working on the table notebook in its R&D dept in Cupertino (or wherever their R&D facilities are located). I think there is the market for the tablet/convertible notebook. I am intrigued by Lenovo X41 tablet, Fujitsu Lifebook T4020, Toshiba Tecra M4, or HP tc4200.

I am in sales and I take lots of notes at the meetings with customers and colleagues/management team and the thought of having all info in one slim table notebook is good way to improve my productivity. I already use a ultraportable PC notebook, iBook (for creating marketing materials), Palm LifeDrive (for managing contacts and appointments among others) at the same time. But, a good tablet will replace my binder-type notebook (which I need to carry with me all the time for note taking) and bunch of other paper folders I have to carry with me.

I read good reviews on XP's tablet edition and active digitizer input method. I think I will buy one of them by the end of this year. But, if there is an option, I prefer Mac OS to XP. But, sadly, Apple has not entered this market as of now.

bingadingding

Nov 28, 2005, 01:23 AM

I hate taking notes on paper pads, since I then need to transcribe everything to my Mac. But for me, electronic note-taking is a royal pain. Laptops are cumbersome, make a lot of keyboard-clicking noise in a lecture hall or meeting room, and present a sort of physical barrier between me and others. A tablet PC would work better, but the current tablets are way too large and heavy, because they're trying to double as full PCs. And PDAs are useless, as their screens are way too small.

What I need is a unit the size of a standard steno pad (about 6"x9"). Large enough to take pages of notes on (without constant scrolling) and to draw freeform tables and other things a lecturer might present or I might dream up. Small enough that I can hold it with one hand and use the stylus with the other, just as I'd use a steno pad. But it shouldn't be too thick or heavy, as I'd want to hold it for an hour or so.

The advantage of this form factor is that it could also be used as a writing utensil, as a collaboration tool for a couple of people at a cafe, as a free-form sketch pad, a comfortable e-book reader, PDA, web browser (if the unit had wireless), and even a media player. It wouldn't have to be a full PC (if you didn't want to implement all of these feature sets), and could be something you need to sync with your Mac in order to download video, pictures, etc. and upload your notes.

I've been waiting for this type of solution for about 5 years now, and not even the PC manufacturers have the foresight to produce something this size. Apple has created great products for video folks, for graphics folks, for musicians, etc. The last creative group is we writers, and this is the hardware solution we need. Please help!

YS2003

Nov 28, 2005, 06:44 PM

The new line of Convertable-type of tablet PCs (the ones with the sturdy hinge you can rotate the screen) are getting ligher. IBM X41 is about 3.5 lbs. (with a 12" XGA screen) and Fujitsu Lifebook T4020 is about 4.7 lbs (with a 12" XGA screen). They are both convertable version and you can use the keyboard if needed.

The light weight is slate type table PC. This type of tablet PC does not come with a keyboard attached to the unit. You can add a keyboard via docking station or USB. Even though the slate type is very light (less than 3 lbs), I prefer the convertable type as I would like to keep both keyboard and pen/screen input methods all the time with the unit.

I am seriousely thinking about buying Fujitsu T4020 or IBM X41 because of their form factor/features. I think either of them can replace my portfolio folder I carry with me for meetings (which is like 4 to 5 lbs, without other paperwork) Fujitsu is a little heavier than X41; but it comes with the optical drive in a unit (not as an add on like X41 and the most of the other tablet PC). I am also tempted by Toshiba Tecra M4 because of its high performance (albeit its poor battery performance and 6.5 lbs of heavy weight).