Bullseye! Sniper kills FBI agent! [Archive]

mischief

Oct 15, 2002, 12:48 PM

The FBI spends a ton of money training profilers to do this but it's often easy to guess based on norms for such things and modify for the case at hand.

White male 35-45. Likely to have christian fundamentalist leanings. He has a swingshift "day job". 70% chance to have served in the Marines. 99% chance to have been rejected by the FBI due to "Mental Instability".

Likely be single and have very few friends. May care for an invalid, overbearing mother. Likely to have been raised by a single parent; either a weak male or overbearing female. May have been raised by grandparents or be a product of multiple foster families.

Likely to have a Methamphetamine and/or drinking habit. Distinct sense of powerlessness has led to a psychotic break and de-evolution into sociopathy. May have a recent Traumatic Event involving a close family member or life-partner. Likely to have had multiple abusive relationships and may have been charged with Rape or Sexual Assault. Likely to have lost a loved one to 9/11.

Aggression is directed at the National Law enforcement agencies et al. Victims are incidental and arbitrary but chosen carefully to reduce pattern and profile accuracy. Subject is attempting to either impress or humiliate the FBI and BATF, perhaps both. Subject is employed by a warehouse somewhere in the DC area.

jefhatfield

Oct 15, 2002, 12:56 PM

i just heard cnn where chief moose claimed that the fbi employee was not involved in the sniper case (she was involved in counter terrorism as related to computers)

also, washington dc and some surrounding areas is the murder capital of the usa, so every shooting has to be confirmed first as the bullet type used is fairly common

the shooting that occured when a woman shot her boyfriend looked like a lead...the boyfriend had the same type of vehicle, the same type of gun, police scanners, area maps, and a marine corps sniper manual (additional reports about a tarot card being found in his possession were erroneous)

as it turns out, this man who had all these things, and was shot, was found to be innocent

krossfyter

Oct 15, 2002, 12:59 PM

nah..

apprently all the shots this guys is taking are from an easy range. people are giving him too much credit for markmanship. a lot of people who can be trained to shoot any gun could shoot like this. thats what im hearing at least. dont know from expierence though. although his ability to dodge detection and capture and possibly tease the media and or law enforcement is very good.

jefhatfield

Oct 15, 2002, 01:04 PM

Originally posted by krossfyter
nah..

apprently all the shots this guys is taking are from an easy range. people are giving him too much credit for markmanship. a lot of people who can be trained to shoot any gun could shoot like this. thats what im hearing at least. dont know from expierence though. although his ability to dodge detection and capture and possibly tease the media and or law enforcement is very good.

since the sniper has made bold moves like shooting someone near a cop indicates that this person is crazy like the son of sam

i don't think the sniper cares if they get caught

they just want the attention from the press and be vilified and remembered and put on the same list as son of sam, the nightstalker, and charles manson

whatever they have done, they have already gone down in criminal history and definitely will be the subject of books and most likely a tv movie...where the sniper could watch it from jail and be proud of themselves

i am sure son of sam and charles manson love the attention the public still gives them:mad:

jelloshotsrule

Oct 15, 2002, 01:04 PM

it can't be too easy a range or someone would have seen him by now.... well, more of him.

jefhatfield

Oct 15, 2002, 01:13 PM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
it can't be too easy a range or someone would have seen him by now.... well, more of him.

son of sam had a mysterious side about him since no one really knew what he looked like

it was by pure chance that he was caught, where he instantly and coldly confessed like a person with the mind of an eight year old

the lead investigator, full of hate for david berkowitz (son of sam), said he felt sorry for him the minute he met him/interviewed him since he said, "the man is just this vegetable/idiot"

i think we are dealing with a schizophrenic person who does not know they are doing wrong...they could be led by voices and some uncontrollable urge to kill...perhaps as a sexual thrill as in son of sam's case where he would masturbate at the crime scene after he shot his victims...to berkowitz, he was just trying to express himself

SilvorX

Oct 15, 2002, 01:29 PM

i sure hope they catch the killer SOON :(, if the death penalty is in that state, he will certainly be getting that..

beatle888

Oct 15, 2002, 01:46 PM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
it can't be too easy a range or someone would have seen him by now.... well, more of him.

It was stated on the news that the shots were
most likely made from 55yards. That isn't very
far at all. I would think with a scope and a
decent rifle that an average person could make
the shot. A marksman actually stated this on
TV as well. He said within training someone
for an hour he could have them make these
shots (55yards). I think the FBI and other
authorities need to do more. Why can't we get
help from the national guard and do some type
of state wide net? And when this guy strikes
put 50 helicopters in the sky and nail the guy.

Thirteenva

Oct 15, 2002, 01:49 PM

Thirteenva

Oct 15, 2002, 01:51 PM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
it can't be too easy a range or someone would have seen him by now.... well, more of him.

Many people have called in reporting seeing the gunman speed away from the scene, thats why they are looking for these white vehicles and believe he has a driver/accomplise

jefhatfield

Oct 15, 2002, 01:55 PM

Originally posted by SilvorX
i sure hope they catch the killer SOON :(, if the death penalty is in that state, he will certainly be getting that..

he/she has killed in dc, maryland, and virginia so they will get nailed to the fullest extent of the law

but if the person is like a manson or son of sam, and thus mentality incapable of rational thought, then they cannot put him to death...at least, not easily

whether he gets killed in the action, executed, or put away for life, i hope this killer(s) is taken off the street as soon as possible

someone killing so boldly, leaving shell casings behind, and leaving notes on tarot cards is someone destined to get caught...if not wanting to get caught and get the publicity they seem to feel they have the right to have by the world

Mr. Anderson

Oct 15, 2002, 01:59 PM

I don't doubt they'll be caught eventually, but as someone who's living in the target area, I can say its having an impact. The media is being over zealous and needs to calm down. I'm going to get gas and picking stations that give me the most cover. My wife gets all worried when I go to the store or walk the dog.

I just hope he gets caught before he gets a chance to kill anyone else.

D

jefhatfield

Oct 15, 2002, 02:18 PM

Originally posted by dukestreet
I don't doubt they'll be caught eventually, but as someone who's living in the target area, I can say its having an impact. The media is being over zealous and needs to calm down. I'm going to get gas and picking stations that give me the most cover. My wife gets all worried when I go to the store or walk the dog.

I just hope he gets caught before he gets a chance to kill anyone else.

D

did you know that twice as many people were killed in car accidents in the same time period in the same areas in and around dc?

and we have talked about this before, but the dc area and some surrounding areas (alexandria, va) is the most likely place to be shot in the united states...for many years now and that will not change anytime soon...most years, dc is even more dangerous than manhattan!

an african american male living in washington dc has a lower life expectancy than an african male living and fighting in somalia during the time of the warlords as depicted in the movie "black hawk down"

some scale has to be brought upon the situation and i agree with the officials in and around dc to ask everyone to go about their daily routine...he/she cannot stop all life and commerce in the area and i don't envision everybody in the area to start wearing bullet proof vests and installing bullet proof windows in their vehicles

the killer(s) will be stopped and i don't think the president will order door to door searches of the entire area

when we had a rash of highway shootings on the california highways due to road rage, there were people who actually bulletproofed thier vehicles

and the los angeles drive by shootings made many in urban areas scared to go out

while in reality, most shootings in california were domestic violence problems and many californians died from accidents, smoking, and drunk driving...though the press didn't mention much about those issues since the drive bys and road rage highway shooting made the press everyday and gave people a false big picture of california and los angeles in particular

statistically, the danger in dc is more from being in a car accident or being a victim of an unrelated shooting more than being a victim of this particular, highly publicized "sniper"

Gelfin

Oct 15, 2002, 03:02 PM

Yeah, 50-150 yards does not qualify one as a well-trained sniper. If he was all that good, it'd be more like 500-1000 yards, and there would be no "seeing a white van speeding away from the scene" because he wouldn't be AT the scene. Not being "at the scene" is kind of the point of being a sniper.

But personally, I'm getting annoyed with the amateur sleuthing surrounding this case. From the beginning it's played out like a stupid cop drama, and the media and the public have run with that.

To paraphrase a friend of mine, the whole "tarot card" thing proved that the sniper was deadly, deranged, and incredibly lame. I mean, it's as if some laid-off TV script writer decided to start killing people.

And because the armchair detectives of the world have been exposed to the same trite crap, they're dutifully responding by trying to "establish a pattern," based on tarot card lore or numerology. What's next? Plotting the killings on a map and playing "find the pentagram" so you can determine the location of the next killing ahead of time and catch the deranged maniac like the clever hero protagonist?

Maybe in the face of something as horrific and senseless as this, people need to feel in control by ascribing some highly simplistic and predictable logic to it. Certainly that's what MSNBC is doing when they try to link the killings to video games (http://www.msnbc.com/m/mw/mw.asp?t=V&id=tdy_bloom_sniper_021010&sk=&pl=seeking_a_killer_&name=&opt=0). Mind you, these are the same asshats who attempted to link the 9/11 attacks to MS Flight Simulator (thanks to Penny Arcade (http://www.penny-arcade.com/news.php3?date=2002-10-14) for finding and pointing out this idiocy). But in trying to find some explanation that's satisfying from a narrative standpoint, the media and the public are putting themselves into a creepy codependent relationship with the killer. They want him caught, but at the same time, they depend on him to fill out their stories and prove or disprove their little pet theories.

Let me just spoil the ending for you. The police catch him. His defense team attempts an insanity defense (I mean, how could they not?). The jury doesn't buy it. The end. In the meantime, I wish we could just stop mythologizing the jackass.

peter2002

Oct 15, 2002, 03:20 PM

Is it just me, or is this whole episode just like the first Dirty Harry movie, except the locale is in the D.C. area?

Peter

Spike Spiegel

Oct 15, 2002, 04:27 PM

theres also the chance that this person is changing vehicles, there have been numerous sightings(white astrovan, white truck, cream colored van) a truck and a van are fairly easy to dinstinguish between, though the descriptions could be muddled due to the rattled nerves of the witnesses. I have a feeling this investigation will not go into a large scale, very expensive, multi-helicopter sting operation. at the most, well probably see a dragnet type of tactic if the killings persist.

jelloshotsrule

Oct 15, 2002, 04:38 PM

Originally posted by Thirteenva

Many people have called in reporting seeing the gunman speed away from the scene, thats why they are looking for these white vehicles and believe he has a driver/accomplise

didn't mean to imply that people have seen nothing. hence the would have seen "more" of them..

so apparently the shootings were from pretty close. i'm just trying to mentally put together distances and stuff.... in a parking lot setting.. how can SOMEONE not see this guy well if he's shooting from less than 300 ft from the people. ahh man. interesting.

maybe some sort of dumb surveillance camera at a store or gas station will pick something up if things stay on track as they are now... i could see that happening what with gas stations having cameras to keep people from driving away without paying and such...

i was walking around outside today (in nyc) and wondering how i'd be acting if i knew there were a sniper on the loose in the area.... things would be different, even if i'd like to think they wouldn't be..

krossfyter

Oct 15, 2002, 05:28 PM

i just dont understand how this killer(s) can evade ....not only the local authorites but the FBI, ATF as well as the american public , media.. the entire government for that matter ... for this long. I mean is this actually easy to do this or is it extremely hard? In order for someone to do this they must be pretty advanced in being stelth like right or what? Your thoughts...

eyelikeart

Oct 15, 2002, 07:51 PM

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 09:08 AM

Originally posted by krossfyter
i just dont understand how this killer(s) can evade ....not only the local authorites but the FBI, ATF as well as the american public , media.. the entire government for that matter ... for this long. I mean is this actually easy to do this or is it extremely hard? In order for someone to do this they must be pretty advanced in being stelth like right or what? Your thoughts...

just saw this retired fbi agent on cnn who mentioned this type of person is hard to catch since we are talking about a person or "maybe" two persons who have dark skin...that represents the vast majority of the people in the target areas

some promising leads ( most of a license plate, etc) show this person could be a person with dark skin living in washington, dc who owns a firearm...gee, that sounds like 99 percent of the populace we are talking about in the suspected area

plus it's not as if the person or people are driving a tank or some vehicle that is out of the ordinary

every day i go out, in california at least, i see tons of white vans...a very common vehicle used in a blue collar working environment

certainly, the cops know way more than they are telling the press...catching the guy is one thing, and who may be an african american in a largely african american urban area...but also the police have to have the evidence to nail the shooter

being a minority myself, i know the authorities have to be extra sensitive and it would look really bad if they caught an innocent black person and pointed the finger at him, espcially if we find out later the killer was a dark skinned hispanic or of east indian descent...heck, i am asian american and have darker skin than many african americans

so the authorities have to be very careful and the last thing we need is a rodney king incident on top of the shootings

Fat Tony

Oct 16, 2002, 10:10 AM

Actually the suspect they are looking for is of "olive-skin", not black. Unfortunately this could be interpreted in many ways, of which I've heard local news reports suspect a possible terrorist in the Sept. 11th sense of a terrorist.

I live about 5 minutes away in Arlington from the latest attack. I shop at that Home Depot all the time. I work in Montgomery County about 4 miles away from the first spree of shootings. I have to admit even though getting shot probably has the same odds as winning a lottery, I'm pretty damn shook about all this...

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 10:24 AM

Originally posted by Fat Tony
Actually the suspect they are looking for is of "olive-skin", not black. Unfortunately this could be interpreted in many ways, of which I've heard local news reports suspect a possible terrorist in the Sept. 11th sense of a terrorist.

I live about 5 minutes away in Arlington from the latest attack. I shop at that Home Depot all the time. I work in Montgomery County about 4 miles away from the first spree of shootings. I have to admit even though getting shot probably has the same odds as winning a lottery, I'm pretty damn shook about all this...

olive skin can mean anything, but if they said that, then it could mean middle eastern among other things

i heard dark skin, but there are shades of olive skin that could be interpreted as dark

the one thing that leads me to believe it is not a middle eastern terrorist is from what i heard the white house press secretary say

1) incidents of middle eastern terrorism usually come with claims of resposibility

2) it is not in the nature of a middle eastern terrorist to say "mr. policeman, i am god" on a tarot car...it would be considered blasphemy by a jihad member to make that claim

i did hear a caller on an abc talkshow mention something pretty obvious, that using the stilted term "dear" would indicate it could be someone who is not native to america and thus possibly be a foreigner, and perhaps middle eastern terrorist

or it could be a new tactic by al qaeda to throw us off by not claiming resposibility and using the phrase, "i am god" to rule them out

MacBandit

Oct 16, 2002, 10:40 AM

It's funny that the profile says there is a 70% chance of him being a Marine. I said there was a good chance of him being a marine after the second shooting. History just proves it. There have been a large number of Marines that have gone crazy and just picked a bell tower or building and just started shooting away.

I too thought that he was a good shot at first. This was because he was shooting and killing people with a 223 at a decent range. I consider anything over 100 yards for a guaranteed kill with a 223 a good shot. The reason is is that the bullet is small and penetrates rather then transferring it's energy into the target so you have to get eye shots, neck shots, or heart shots for guaranteed kills. Well after people started surviving and it came out that he was within throwing distance you just had to realize that it doesn't take that much of a shot.

I also immediately thought of Son of Sam when this first started.

Moxiemike

Oct 16, 2002, 10:41 AM

Originally posted by jefhatfield

olive skin can mean anything, but if they said that, then it could mean middle eastern among other things

i heard dark skin, but there are shades of olive skin that could be interpreted as dark

the one thing that leads me to believe it is not a middle eastern terrorist is from what i heard the white house press secretary say

1) incidents of middle eastern terrorism usually come with claims of resposibility

2) it is not in the nature of a middle eastern terrorist to say "mr. policeman, i am god" on a tarot car...it would be considered blasphemy by a jihad member to make that claim

i did hear a caller on an abc talkshow mention something pretty obvious, that using the stilted term "dear" would indicate it could be someone who is not native to america and thus possibly be a foreigner, and perhaps middle eastern terrorist

or it could be a new tactic by al qaeda to throw us off by not claiming resposibility and using the phrase, "i am god" to rule them out

IMHO? I think it's a woman. Probably 27-35. Least likely suspect. Blends in reallllly well. :)

Other thought? Shooting from sewer drains on streetcorners. Or wearing a black cap, opening a manhole cover and BLAMMO.

I dunno. Just odd thinking that doesn't seem to be brought up. I'm willing to bet my mac plus that the "witnesses" have basically constructed a "middle-eastern" looking person since I think all the patriotic fanatics REALLY WANNA BELIEVE that this has something to do with terror.

just my nickel.

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 10:45 AM

this story has got me glued to internet and news on tv

the authorities will possibly put out a composite sketch of the suspect or suspects

someone saw the shooter quite clearly

also based on the partial license plate, plus narrowing the car down to two or three models, one area police chief said this could lead to an arrest

six people have been questioned and apprehended for questioning

there is a person or people clearly in the crosshairs of the authorities...at least in the last 48 hours, but they really better be very, very sure

remember richard jewell (not sure about first name or spelling)? but he was the man the fbi thought put on the olympic bombings but later found to be innocent

for the first time since the sniper shootings, a member of the law enforcement team has used to term arrest which made cnn legal experts say that use of this word from a law enforcement chief means they have a person in mind

no law enforcement personnel is allowed to use that term in an investigation like this unless there is some profound evidence in the case

that does not mean we have the killer's identity 100 percent since catching someone has to also come with being able to convict them and put them away...easier said than done

look at oj simpson, who i think was guilty...but that does not explain the sworn testimonies of bystanders at a restaurant who saw oj simpson a hour and a half away from the scene of the crime at the time of death according to law enforcement

obviously, someone dropped the ball in the oj case and putting the time of death at the precise time forty people saw oj simpson at a restaurant an hour and a half away from the scene of the crime means that it was shotty police work

i still think oj did the crime but the cops bungled the case

this is why the sniper case has to be carefully investigated...they have most of the letters of a license plate, a vehicle(s) with some defining characteristics, and later today or this week, we will have an official sketch of the shooter

it's a matter of time before the shooter is caught

MacBandit

Oct 16, 2002, 10:45 AM

Originally posted by Moxiemike

IMHO? I think it's a woman. Probably 27-35. Least likely suspect. Blends in reallllly well. :)

Other thought? Shooting from sewer drains on streetcorners. Or wearing a black cap, opening a manhole cover and BLAMMO.

I dunno. Just odd thinking that doesn't seem to be brought up. I'm willing to bet my mac plus that the "witnesses" have basically constructed a "middle-eastern" looking person since I think all the patriotic fanatics REALLY WANNA BELIEVE that this has something to do with terror.

just my nickel.

The ballistic evidence shows the shots coming in from above ground and in some cases from above nothing from below.

Oh and every act of crime against America is a terrorist act now. Thanks to the new bills passed in congress this year. Oh and an act against America can be interpreted to be just about anything.

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 10:57 AM

Originally posted by MacBandit

The ballistic evidence shows the shots coming in from above ground and in some cases from above nothing from below.

Oh and every act of crime against America is a terrorist act now. Thanks to the new bills passed in congress this year. Oh and an act against America can be interpreted to be just about anything.

shooter works from ground level and always had an escape route making sure there was a barrier between them and taget like a wall or road divider...something to make it hard to pursue the shooter's vehicle directly

shooter also possibly uses back streets to avoid vehicle searches on highways

shooter knows the dc area as only a local can, but while planning in the shootings is there, it is not overly planned according to experts...it's one step from being sloppy and uncontrolled

it is thought that shooter lives very close to dc if not directly in dc

Moxiemike

Oct 16, 2002, 11:03 AM

Originally posted by MacBandit

Oh and every act of crime against America is a terrorist act now. Thanks to the new bills passed in congress this year. Oh and an act against America can be interpreted to be just about anything.

That doesn't sound like democracy to me... sounds like a police state. Hm.

Anyone read boondocks in teh sunday paper this weekend?

Thirteenva

Oct 16, 2002, 11:33 AM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule

i was walking around outside today (in nyc) and wondering how i'd be acting if i knew there were a sniper on the loose in the area.... things would be different, even if i'd like to think they wouldn't be..

Did you know that there was a sniper in NYC once, I heard it on the news last night, they said he never got caught.

The topic came up when they were discussing how they need the DC sniper to kill again in order to catch him because there is so little evidence to track him. The more he kills the better the police chances are of getting good evidence or on a very slim chance, catching him in or after the act.

Then they brought up the topic of the sniper in NYC who stopped killing when he thought the cops were getting close and they never found him.

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 11:58 AM

Originally posted by Thirteenva

Did you know that there was a sniper in NYC once, I heard it on the news last night, they said he never got caught.

The topic came up when they were discussing how they need the DC sniper to kill again in order to catch him because there is so little evidence to track him. The more he kills the better the police chances are of getting good evidence or on a very slim chance, catching him in or after the act.

Then they brought up the topic of the sniper in NYC who stopped killing when he thought the cops were getting close and they never found him.

but did they have shell casings?

slugs?

car descriptions?

license plate state id?

partial letters or numbers on the plate?

eyewitenesses who saw vehicles?

eyewitnesses who saw shooter?

same media coverage?

the way i see it, this shooter is toast and it is just a matter of time before they are caught

and the word "arrest" is a legal term only used when the authorities have a suspect in mind

they want to catch this person but also be able to put them away forever, so the job of the police is to gather evidence for a good case, not a hasty seizure which may save a life or two

because of the law, the interest is in getting the most damning evidence first to get best conviction, then to save human life...it's just a reality of our litigious society

i was shocked when dr. dean edell mentioned that the main reason for a doctor's decision(s) was so they wouldn't get sued vs. giving best advice to save a person's life...we live in a litigious society and that is an unfortunate fact

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 12:16 PM

now cnn is saying that the eyewitness accounts of the shooter are not going to produce renderings right away

apparently, cnn is backing off on saying that shooter is dark skinned of african american as previously believed

now they say "olive or dark skinned"

before they said "dark skinned or olive skinned"

originally, it was just "dark skinned"

then it went from seeing one person from every witness and one witness backpedaled and now say they saw two people

with those types of discretions, the shooter will walk free

this is the shottiest piece of sh** police work and reporting i have ever seen

it is so sad and maddening to see how the news and cops are being this shooter's best friend and what seems like a guarantee that when they are caught, the evidence will be too scattered

so who is the shooter, a figgin chameleon who can change skin color? wtf????

and come on, one person or two? jesus, make up your mind already

this is why eyewitness accounts are almost always in favor of the criminal

...

and just in...the shooter is confirmed to be a "man" and the eyewitness who got a close good look actually did not get that good of a look for the police to put out a sketch for the media

and the shooter at home depot is said to have been 30 years away, not 50-100 yards away

...

why does the media report different things every day?

could it be about ratings???

peter2002

Oct 16, 2002, 01:19 PM

Maybe the shooter is Osama Binladen and his sidekick. He has already killed 2800. What another 12 more?

Peter

Mr. Anderson

Oct 16, 2002, 01:38 PM

The problem with the last shooting and the fact that the sniper was seen is that the Home Depot covered parking area where it happened has these really nasty orangish lights, not very bright as well. It has a tendency to color things a little different. Add to the that the emotion and excitement of the event and getting an possitive ID is going to be difficult.

I've been there a couple times before - not the best Home Depot, but its located close to a bunch of other shops so for a quick stop I've found myself there about as much as the one closer to me. I prefer Lowes myself.

D

diorio

Oct 16, 2002, 03:15 PM

Originally posted by peter2002
Maybe the shooter is Osama Binladen and his sidekick. He has already killed 2800. What another 12 more?

Peter

I'm sure we would notice Osama Bin Laden running around with a sniper rifle.:rolleyes:

jelloshotsrule

Oct 16, 2002, 03:21 PM

i don't know that i'd blame witnesses changing their stories on the police.... i'm not saying the police are doing a great job. i mean, the guy/gal's not caught. so i guess it's not that good. but then again, i don't know everything so i'm not going to say they're doing terribly.

also, if the shooter were really that "sloppy", wouldn't he be caught already? i'd think of sloppy as getting caught the first time. not 9 or 10 people in....

not perfect perhaps, but not sloppy either.

beatle888

Oct 16, 2002, 04:11 PM

"The topic came up when they were discussing how they need the DC sniper to kill again"

I really doubt they said they NEED the sniper to
KILL AGAIN....jesus give me a break.

Update: the military IS going to help out. and
the investigation IS NOT going to be hindered
by budgets.

MrMacMan

Oct 16, 2002, 04:21 PM

If there is one thing I Can't stand for is everyone calling these killings, killing by a Sniper. I will prove my point.
In real life, the stats say that the Most likey gun in these killing is the AR-15. Which if you were/are in the military everyone would call the M-16 Carbine. It uses the .223 measurement in bullets. Over 7 Million of these guns were sold so this would be the gun of choice. Besides that this is a Normal rifle The ONLY way for the media to be pushing saying that it was a "Sniper" is if he/she used a Scope (little attachment at end of gun, helps aiming and other features). That is the Only way they can call the killer a sniper. There are MANY differneces bewteen a Rifle and a Sniper rifle.
Rifle can kill in one shot. Sniper Rifles are Supposto kill in one shot. Rifles are for spraying bullets to kill. Sniper rifles are specifically placed shot to kill a person.
Now how to attach pictures...
Below is The AR-15 With Scope. The Gun probably used in the killings.
Erg, too big, must resize...

jelloshotsrule

Oct 16, 2002, 05:03 PM

no gun expert here or anything. but you said sniper rilfles kill in one shot. and regular rifles can, but are meant to spray bullets.... this guy's not spraying bullets. so it doesn't support your argument at all.

MrMacMan

Oct 16, 2002, 07:27 PM

Um...maybe you DIDN'T UNDERSTAND. The Military doesn't use Rifles to pick off one person at a time, But this KILLER IS.
A Sniper Rifle would be a BETTER CHOICE. But who cares? :D

DavPeanut

Oct 16, 2002, 08:03 PM

You guys may think that the sniper is just some peice of news, but I live in Montgomery county. My parents wount even let my go to the movies theaters that have entrences outside and where I have to go outside to get to restaurants. Actually, they will let me, but only if I buy myself a bullet proof vest ($250) and 2 ceramic plates to protect me against the high velocity rifle bullets ($200 each). It really sucks. This is no laughing matter.:mad:

beatle888

Oct 16, 2002, 08:07 PM

peanut don't think we don't care what you and
the other's in the area are going through. we're
just talking about what has happened in a
casual forum...nothing to formal.

Spike Spiegel

Oct 16, 2002, 08:10 PM

to continue macmans thought, this is a true sniper rifle

jefhatfield

Oct 16, 2002, 08:17 PM

stay safe, Dav

sometimes i think the news is over reporting

then i realize that the news is not news anymore, but entertainment and that, to me, is really tacky

snipers are hired professionals who work for law enforcement and the military, no psychos taking potshots

and now the so called "sniper" is being called the tarot card killer

i can't believe the way the media has turned this into a cheap summer movie...people are dying

it reminds me of the gulf war, many of you probably don't remember the news clips if you are under 20 or so, but it was almost presented as if it was some video game

5 percent of iraq's population was killed or injured...that would be nearly 14 million people if another country attacked the united states

i want to know the facts of the story of this psycho, but it's hard to watch in the entertainment format the media is presenting everything in

my wife asked me the other night, "how come the news reporters smile when they relay this type of news?"

it kind of reminds me of that don henley song which talks about the newscasters spouting dour news with a smile on their face...if you are intersted, the song is called "dirty laundry"

it's kind of fitting since september 11th and this month

Mr. Anderson

Oct 16, 2002, 08:19 PM

Originally posted by MrMacman
Um...maybe you DIDN'T UNDERSTAND. The Military doesn't use Rifles to pick off one person at a time, But this KILLER IS.
A Sniper Rifle would be a BETTER CHOICE. But who cares? :D

But the military trains sharpshooters - so the sniper can have had training as a sharpshooter and the weapon he is using is irrelavent, as long as he can hit something only with in a few hundred yards. The rifle ranges used by the military sharpshooters has the closet targets placed at 100 yards - which is considered a simple shot.

D

jelloshotsrule

Oct 16, 2002, 08:26 PM

the caps cleared things up for me mr.macman.

actually, i understand what you're saying. but your point about the rifle vs sniper rifle and the spraying of shots vs one shot didn't make sense because you never finished the point.

you were talking about why it wasn't a sniper rifle, and then you suddenly say that a rifle sprays shots. which doesn't support your point.

could've started a new thought about how this person is not trained by the military/law enforcement based on their use of a regular rifle... though i don't think that's a solid point either. perhaps someone who can use a regular rifle to make as accurate a shot as this person is (one shot kills) whether close or far, is pretty well trained after all. are these rifles more readily available than true sniper rifles? maybe that's the sole driving force behind the choice of guns.

beatle888

Oct 16, 2002, 08:40 PM

yea i was on the right track :) it looks like the
pentagon is going to assist in the investigation
of this criminal. i suggested that they bring in
helicopters from the military and some crew
from the national guard. but instead they will
bring in spy planes and use of their satelites.

that impresses me :) it makes me feel better
knowing that the government isn't just saying
ah well we got the power to help but this is a
a civilian matter and the military shouldn't get
involed...which to me would be very cold...so
im glad that isn't the case.

MrMacMan

Oct 16, 2002, 08:46 PM

Yes. I didn't want to seem like I was droninng on and on so I stoped.
My dad trained as a sharpshooter in the army, so I know such information. This Rifle Can Yes, kill people in one shot, Which seems the case in this "Sniper".
My point was to be made that a real Sniper would use a Sniper Rifle for better killing percentage, placement of shots and so forth. Not to say Rifles aren't arcuate (oh man I spell bad). The first shot out of a rifle hits the target.
The Military uses this gun in gun combat becuase of lack of recoil, easy to carry and acruate* (*spelling). I was pointing out that the Media hypes that the Killings are Sniper shooting and that this person had experiance. I don't belive in this at all.
"1. A skilled military shooter detailed to spot and pick off enemy soldiers from a concealed place.
2. One who shoots at other people from a concealed place."
Well...thats a little strech for the media... :rolleyes:
It just shows how gun control is needed or police need to be big brother and watch you all the time.
I hope that Clears up everthing, urg....

rainman::|:|

Oct 16, 2002, 08:47 PM

i agree that it's probably a white male, females tend to use poison as method of choice and usually kill family/acquiantances, often for personal gain. I don't agree about him being crazy. Sociopath, probably, but that doesn't mean crazy-- it just means that he's extremely far removed from certain emotions. obviously if the guy's been operating for a couple of weeks, with this many victims, he's not your average crazy bastard-- he's intelligent, methodical, and knows the best way to kill people without leaving the forensic evidence that's so damn incriminating. Most times killers are caught through the theory that a killer *always* leaves something at the scene and *always* takes something with him-- this way, those two things are virtually null.

i think the tarot card was probably just an afterthought to make him seem crazy. Obviously the guy's intelligent enough to know that the "death" card isn't taken literally-- it usually means change or transformation. and he certainly doesn't fit the normal transformation serial killer profile, who tends to be a "collector" (keeps the bodies).

He also doesn't seem to be falling into the usual self-destructive pattern that most do, he's not become impulsive (the rush lasts shorter and shorter amounts of time) which makes him *extremely* dangerous because 1-he's not rushing into that crucial mistake that the feds are praying for, and 2- he might actually stop. obviously tho only serial killers that don't get caught are the ones that stop (for various reasons, several are suspected to have died during a cycle but never connected to the crimes). See also the Lipstick Killer, among others...

anyway, i do have sympathy for all those whose lives have been affected by this. Random killers are very scary.

:)
pnw

jelloshotsrule

Oct 16, 2002, 09:03 PM

mr. macman- yeah, that clears things up basically

do you think that this person is *necessarily* not trained just because they don't use a sniper rifle though? that part was the only thing i wasn't sure about what you meant.

as for using the term sniper.... i agree that it's wrong in that it gives people the idea he's very far away shooting. and he's not...

30 yards is not much at all...

he's clearly crazy in the sense that unlike *most* people he doesn't think another's life is not his to take. but yeah, i think he's more intelligent and meticulous to be considered totally gone and "sloppy"

MacBandit

Oct 16, 2002, 11:59 PM

When you refer to the media calling this guy a Sniper I totally understand your frustration.

I live in Springfield, OR where the Kip Kinkle killed at Thurston High School. Everytime they talked about his gun in the media they reffered to it as an assault rifle. For god sake he used a bolt action 22.

I personally have thought for years that the media uses some sort of script/filter and when they type in hand gun it automatically converts it to Glock. When they type in rifle it automatically converts it to Assault Rifle. A fully automatic gun converts to UZI and random single shot killings obviously converts to Sniper.

Everything in America is driven by dollars. So the media and the government spend all there time with polls and do what the people want and by doing so they can make money. This means making stuff up, exagerating things, and for the media focussing on the worst things because this keeps the publics attention.

jefhatfield

Oct 17, 2002, 10:20 AM

Originally posted by paulwhannel
i agree that it's probably a white male, females tend to use poison as method of choice and usually kill family/acquiantances, often for personal gain. I don't agree about him being crazy. Sociopath, probably, but that doesn't mean crazy-- it just means that he's extremely far removed from certain emotions. obviously if the guy's been operating for a couple of weeks, with this many victims, he's not your average crazy bastard-- he's intelligent, methodical, and knows the best way to kill people without leaving the forensic evidence that's so damn incriminating. Most times killers are caught through the theory that a killer *always* leaves something at the scene and *always* takes something with him-- this way, those two things are virtually null.

i think the tarot card was probably just an afterthought to make him seem crazy. Obviously the guy's intelligent enough to know that the "death" card isn't taken literally-- it usually means change or transformation. and he certainly doesn't fit the normal transformation serial killer profile, who tends to be a "collector" (keeps the bodies).

He also doesn't seem to be falling into the usual self-destructive pattern that most do, he's not become impulsive (the rush lasts shorter and shorter amounts of time) which makes him *extremely* dangerous because 1-he's not rushing into that crucial mistake that the feds are praying for, and 2- he might actually stop. obviously tho only serial killers that don't get caught are the ones that stop (for various reasons, several are suspected to have died during a cycle but never connected to the crimes). See also the Lipstick Killer, among others...

anyway, i do have sympathy for all those whose lives have been affected by this. Random killers are very scary.

:)
pnw

liptsick killer...wasn't that the prostitute who had aids and would write "you're dead" on the bathroom mirrors after she had sex with her customer...but mostly to scare them since very few, if any, of the johns got infected (i can't recall the story and i might be mixing it up with a tv movie i saw)

about your theory of the shooter...have you even watched a recent news clip in the last week?

how could the shooter be white? unless he puts face paint on him to hide his real identity? (actually, not a bad idea)

this shooter is one of the sloppiest serial killers in history and has left shells, bullets, a tarot card behind, is careless and willing to shoot in daylight...near a cop...near a police station, shoots victims near his home, has witnesses who have seen 1) him 2) his vehicle 3) the ladder rack on his vehicle 4) most of the letters of his license plate including the state of origin

this guy, crime wise, is sloppy and wants to get caught and as an investigator has mentioned, "want to go out in a blaze of glory"

a careful sniper would shoot from much further away, use different guns and bullets, and certainly not shoot all victims in daylight and allow himself to be seen by three witnesses, if not more

come on, now

think about it...driving around in a van with a friggin ladder rack on top?

the killer does not give a damn and wants the ultimate act be a highly televised shootout between him and the authorities

a possible profile of this man is exactly the opposite of everything you said and the chance of the killer being a white female like one poster said is no more ridiculous than your claims

this post is most definitely not a personal attack on you since i nornally enjoy your posts

but it seems too many people want to ignore the hard evidence and glorify the hidden identity of the sniper and place the killer as

1) some white christian skinhead who is nuts
2) a female serial killer
3) al qaeda

facts point to a minority who is male (most likely african american) and who likes, no...loves to leave evidence behind and gets off on the chase

for some reason, someone like that does not capture the imagination of the public...a black man from the muder captial of the country...washington dc...it kind of sounds mundane, predictable, and boring

but it is...this man, most likely a local due to knowledge of local escape routes, who is like water or electricity...he takes the path of least resistance and is bound to get caught

i am a minority and well aware of racism in a way very few white people will ever understand, but i believe the media is scared to mention that the man could be an african american local from dc due to the fact that the city is, and always has been, a powder keg ready to blow up into another los angleles or watts type race riot

if the media shows a group of mostly white fbi agents killing a black man, even if he is the killer, there will be an outrage and claims of racial profiling

the political correctness and fear of racial profiling could be hindering the investigation and that is the reason that most of the lead investigators that talk to the press are african american...they know they want to quell the bad feelings when this killer, most likely a dark or olive skinned african american, is caught or killed

my two cents

MacBandit

Oct 17, 2002, 10:35 AM

As stated before the guy could simply be mentally disturbed like the Son of Sam.

jefhatfield

Oct 17, 2002, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by MacBandit
As stated before the guy could simply be mentally disturbed like the Son of Sam.

there is no doubt that this man is like the son of sam, only black and possibly hispanic

the son of sam was loose for a whole summer!!! ...and i remember being really scared of him as a teen...and i was in california

my wife lived in the burroughs of nyc and she was really terrified...understandably so since the son of sam was the scariest killer vilified by the media

his letters to the cops got printed in the new york times and everybody got involved

it takes a hell of a lot to scare a new yorker, especially a harlem resident like my wife, but son of sam terrified new york and the nation

jelloshotsrule

Oct 17, 2002, 12:29 PM

explain to me how this person is so sloppy if they'd "sloppily" killed nearly 10 people and have yet to be caught???

yeah, he/she is doing things that aren't best to keep your cover. daytime, not shooting from further, etc... but so what? they still haven't been caught.

i'm not saying he hasn't left things behind. but sloppy implies no planning or "skill" or whatever. and i'm not seeing that.

mc68k

Oct 17, 2002, 01:03 PM

maybe they mean a sloppy sniper, not a sloppy killer

one shot kills don't make someone a sniper, it's range + stealth + marksmanship

sniper is convinient for the media, because serial killers don't usually kill in this manner

jefhatfield

Oct 17, 2002, 03:20 PM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule

yeah, he/she is doing things that aren't best to keep your cover. daytime, not shooting from further, etc... but so what? they still haven't been caught.

sloppy is as sloppy does

the reason he hasn't been caught yet is more due to luck than any extreme planning

he could have used different vehicles, guns, bullets, used the cover of night more, shot from further away, spaced the killings further in frequency, used a much larger geographical area...this is very, very sloppy on his part

one of the most hard to catch arsonists was a mentally ill man, who in the light of day, would stand at his buildings and light it with a bic lighter at waist height in a crowded urban area

typical of big city people, no one reported this lunatic and he burned down many structures

he finally got caught millions of dollars later and he turned out to be mentally ill and never really planned his strikes...when the compulsion hit, he lost control and literally, slowly lit up buildings with just the aid of his lighter

on a sidenote, my childhood friend torched his neighbor's roof by accident using safe and sane fireworks on the 4th of july...sunny, but not hot, but in an area that gets less than 19 inches of rainfall per year...so the roof went poof like a wad of dry newspaper

peter2002

Oct 17, 2002, 04:26 PM

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/17/entertainment/main526012.shtml

The frightening, ongoing mystery of the Washington-area sniper is proving a compelling story for cable news networks, which have attracted their largest audiences of the year.

On Tuesday, Fox News Channel averaged 1.12 million viewers, CNN had 1.06 million and CNN Headline News had 294,000. For each network, it was the most-watched single day of the year, according to Nielsen Media Research.

That was the day after the sniper claimed its latest victim, 47-year-old FBI analyst Linda Franklin, outside a Home Depot in Falls Church, Va. The story dominated the news networks.

MrMacMan

Oct 17, 2002, 07:54 PM

Well yeah, it is instinctive to watch and learn about death...
These Killings are not an execption, death makes great news work. Sure the killer is sniper the the whole frikken washigton area is baffeled... I mean Local police, ATF, FBI, and the pentagon satilites can't seem to stop this killer... The Best thing is for the killer to go back dormant, intill starting to kill again OR go on a killing spree to end the violence.
I don't see the Police and Gov't officals cracking this case, what so ever.

Mr. Anderson

Oct 17, 2002, 08:59 PM

I've been doing a lot of travelling over the past couple days because of work and I've noticed that all the major highways have cops in the median, just sitting there - a lot more than normal.

My guess is at the next shooting it won't take 10 minutes to shut down the highways, its going to happen immediately. It can't go on for much longer.

jefhatfield

Oct 19, 2002, 11:51 AM

everybody with a mac...look at your default apple netscape startup page/home page or go to www.cnn.com

there is a story on it that mentions some rental car worker found a matching white truck with the matching bullet shell inside it

let's hope there are enough clues in physical evidence and paperwork documentation (paper trail) to put this killer away

if we catch him, but have weak evidence, he walks and that is very unfortunate

i hope this is it and he is caught

tibookowner

Oct 19, 2002, 12:18 PM

Gee and I thought I had it bad ...

job

Oct 19, 2002, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by jefhatfield
paperwork documentation (paper trail)

Unless the guy stole the rental truck, the rental paperwork should provide ample amounts of evidence for the police...

jefhatfield

Oct 19, 2002, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by hitman

Unless the guy stole the rental truck, the rental paperwork should provide ample amounts of evidence for the police...

i think the rental car worker was clening it out for next use, so someone had to rent it

unless, one person rented the car, the shooter hijacked the renter, killed him, hid the body, took his wallet, took his identity, and simply returned the car as the original driver

do the clerks at the rental car booth really pay that much attention

or what if a totally innocent mover used the truck and had a bullet roll out of their chest, as a cnn reporter just mentioned, and the bullet happened, by coincidence, to be the same caliber, in a truck which happened to be the same model........sure, it's very implausibe but not impossible

or what if the renter was an accomplice of a conspiracy terrorist group...handed the truck off to someone else who did the shooting, and then handed the truck back off to the renter, and had the renter bring back the truck to the rental agency

at that time of return, the shooter could have established an alibi somewhere else when the renter is possibly apprehended

who knows how smart the shooter and his possible accomplices is/are?

and i hate to say this, but maybe al qaeda had this planned carefully well before september 11:(

MacBandit

Oct 19, 2002, 05:58 PM

Originally posted by jefhatfield

i think the rental car worker was clening it out for next use, so someone had to rent it

unless, one person rented the car, the shooter hijacked the renter, killed him, hid the body, took his wallet, took his identity, and simply returned the car as the original driver

do the clerks at the rental car booth really pay that much attention

or what if a totally innocent mover used the truck and had a bullet roll out of their chest, as a cnn reporter just mentioned, and the bullet happened, by coincidence, to be the same caliber, in a truck which happened to be the same model........sure, it's very implausibe but not impossible

or what if the renter was an accomplice of a conspiracy terrorist group...handed the truck off to someone else who did the shooting, and then handed the truck back off to the renter, and had the renter bring back the truck to the rental agency

at that time of return, the shooter could have established an alibi somewhere else when the renter is possibly apprehended

who knows how smart the shooter and his possible accomplices is/are?

and i hate to say this, but maybe al qaeda had this planned carefully well before september 11:(

It is after all a very common round. .223 that is.

Mr. Anderson

Oct 19, 2002, 06:03 PM

We haven't had a shooting since Monday - everybodies on edge. Going out today I noticed quite a few less people shopping. Its amazing how much this is affecting everybody.

But I wouldn't be surprised if the sniper stays quiet for a few weeks and lets people think they're safe and then come out and shoot a couple people like he did the first day.

I just hope they catch him soon.

D

jefhatfield

Oct 19, 2002, 08:21 PM

Originally posted by MacBandit

It is after all a very common round. .223 that is.

it was a .223 round, a common round used in many guns, and there are a lot of guns with that caliber in the world, a common truck, a common license plate, a common color of truck, and a common area of the united states of america being the east coast near washington dc, the capital city of the united states...alone and by themselves, any of these facts do not bring suspicion

but you put all those facts together and then you have a unique situation which may lead to the eventual capture of the sniper

j763

Oct 19, 2002, 10:47 PM

Originally posted by mischief
The FBI spends a ton of money training profilers to do this but it's often easy to guess based on norms for such things and modify for the case at hand.

White male 35-45. Likely to have christian fundamentalist leanings. He has a swingshift "day job". 70% chance to have served in the Marines. 99% chance to have been rejected by the FBI due to "Mental Instability".

Likely be single and have very few friends. May care for an invalid, overbearing mother. Likely to have been raised by a single parent; either a weak male or overbearing female. May have been raised by grandparents or be a product of multiple foster families.

Likely to have a Methamphetamine and/or drinking habit. Distinct sense of powerlessness has led to a psychotic break and de-evolution into sociopathy. May have a recent Traumatic Event involving a close family member or life-partner. Likely to have had multiple abusive relationships and may have been charged with Rape or Sexual Assault. Likely to have lost a loved one to 9/11.

Aggression is directed at the National Law enforcement agencies et al. Victims are incidental and arbitrary but chosen carefully to reduce pattern and profile accuracy. Subject is attempting to either impress or humiliate the FBI and BATF, perhaps both. Subject is employed by a warehouse somewhere in the DC area.

100% likely to be a member of the gun lobby.

The amount of shootings (in general, not in this particular case) would rapidly decrease if the gun lobby was broken up. speaking of which, has anyone seen michael moore's new movie?

whfsdude

Oct 20, 2002, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by dukestreet
But I wouldn't be surprised if the sniper stays quiet for a few weeks and lets people think they're safe and then come out and shoot a couple people like he did the first day.

You are wrong :-( he shot again tonight :(

This guy has guts, he is going to go down like the shotgun killer, or the sniper in Nebraska, who shot paper boys a long time ago. :(

whfsdude

Oct 20, 2002, 12:12 AM

Originally posted by j763
speaking of which, has anyone seen michael moore's new movie?

Nope....

But I hear it is really good.

btw its called Bowling for Columbine.

jefhatfield

Oct 22, 2002, 11:37 PM

now it's possible that the serial killer is a ransom killer

does he really think that the authorities can eft him a ransom so he will stop killing?

748s

Oct 23, 2002, 02:20 AM

Originally posted by j763

speaking of which, has anyone seen michael moore's new movie?

m. moore's film starts here 26th december

whfsdude

Oct 23, 2002, 06:18 AM

" An angry letter found tacked to a tree behind a restaurant where the sniper wounded a man last weekend complained of six failed attempts to reach police, and threatened more killings -- of children in particular -- if millions of dollars were not deposited in a bank account within two days, according to law enforcement sources.

The letter listed half a dozen calls that had been "ignored" by operators answering phones at the command center in Rockville, the Montgomery County police station and the FBI. It even named some of the people who had taken his calls.

They had hung up, the letter stated; that was "incompetent."

"Five people had to die" because of it, the letter said, according to one law enforcement source who has seen a copy of the letter.

The letter gave a deadline of Monday for the money to be deposited in a bank account, the source said. Several people who had seen photocopies of the letter said the amount demanded was $10 million.

The letter warned investigators that if they were more concerned with "stopping" the killings than making an arrest, they should follow the orders precisely, or else there would be "body bags," said a source.

And it ended with an even more ominous postscript, officials said:

"Your children are not safe anywhere at any time."

The handwritten letter running at least three pages was found sealed and wrapped in plastic in the woods behind a restaurant in Ashland, Va., after Saturday's attack, several sources said. The letter was neatly printed on lined paper and included a number of grammatical errors, including sentence fragments and misspellings, said sources."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2317-2002Oct22.html

jefhatfield

Oct 24, 2002, 12:08 PM

letter may have 17 year old john lee malvo's fingerprints on it

and the boy has left fingerprints on the scene of a montgomery, alabama robbery and shooting using a handgun

his stepfather, john mohammad, is said to be the main suspect of the sniper shootings

both were found at a maryland rest stop in a car which included a suspicious gun with tripod and scope and could use .223 caliber bullets

but neither has been officially charged with the many sniper murders in the dc area

it looks like the sniper shootings have ended

jelloshotsrule

Oct 24, 2002, 12:13 PM

Originally posted by jefhatfield

it looks like the sniper shootings have ended

that's a pretty hasty conclusion eh?

granted, i'd like to think they have too, and that the police have the guys responsible.

but i'm not sure i'll be so quick to assume it

interesting to see that the guy has muslim roots... i'm sure that the press will go nuts with that.

jefhatfield

Oct 24, 2002, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule

that's a pretty hasty conclusion eh?

granted, i'd like to think they have too, and that the police have the guys responsible.

but i'm not sure i'll be so quick to assume it

interesting to see that the guy has muslim roots... i'm sure that the press will go nuts with that.

cnn just reported the caprice car that the two were found in had a hole bored in the trunk which could have been used as a gun port with the back seat coming down

the press will slowly report the facts as they come together and i hope that the mounting evidence proves that the two are the snipers or sniper and driver

i do admit there is a possibility that they are innocent of the sniper shootings...remember the olympic bombing and how the press thought it was the security guard richard jewell (someone who liked to fool around with explosives)

but still, the fbi had that one wrong

jefhatfield

Oct 24, 2002, 12:37 PM

Originally posted by j763

100% likely to be a member of the gun lobby.

The amount of shootings (in general, not in this particular case) would rapidly decrease if the gun lobby was broken up. speaking of which, has anyone seen michael moore's new movie?

it will be interesting to see if the man or his stepson were members of the nra

i guessed correctly that the sniper was african american due to the reports of a dark or olive skinned man at the scenes of the shooting

i had thought that it could be an ex-cop due to the knowledge of firearms the shooter had to have and elusive nature...but john mohammad was in the us army for many years

i don't get how a white truck could be suspected when the vehicle the two were found in was the caprice sedan...unless, of course they stole, rented, or borrowed a white truck/van

i had thought the weapon to be an assault rifle and had no idea it would turn out to be a bushmaster hunting rifle

there may be restictions on weapons like these in the future since it is believed a silencer was used in some of the shootings...why would a hunting rifle be easily outfitted with a third party silencer?

i am not a hunter so maybe someone who hunts can explain this to me

i used to see silencers in gun mags many years ago but not recently...are they illegal in every state? and i heard they may only be illegal if sold with a gun...like a bong is legal but not the marijuana that comes with it, dude;) head shops in california states that bongs are used for tobacco, as if that is really good for you:rolleyes: