Going Darwin on stupid users?

[SiliconAddict]

*slams head into keyboard*

23193z.;/!@!~_+2221a-=[021[2!2!a2?32'/PWS4E


Note to self: Stop giving people more credit then they deserve when it comes to their intelligence.

I'm rolling out a new system to of my the users in my office. Called her and left a message to please let me know what her passwords are on her system. (e-mail, network, vpn, etc.) She leaves me a voicemail while I'm at lunch. "Hi Jonathan. My password is blahblahblah. Yah know it would be just easier to just e-mail it to you. Bye"

(Edit for clarification: YES. She sent me her passwords thought unencrypted e-mail.)

Now you know WB cartoons have the classic eyes popping out of their head effect. One thing that happens in real life when this occurs is that they don't go back. So after spending a few minutes rolling my optic nerve back into my head I am now trying to figure out the best way to kill this user. Death being the easiest way of resetting all the freaking passwords we are now going to have to generate service "tickets" for now because a user is CRITICALLY FARKING STUPID!!!! ARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!! Because if this user died == leaving the company and there is one single form to request that the user's accounts be disabled. *SLAMS HEAD INTO KEYBOARD AGAIN*
Why am I not allowed to do security training classes? Why? Why? Why? I’d even offer the bloody service pro bono on my own time if it meant teaching our users some basic good security practices!!! Hell I'd take a vacation day for it. Anything to raise the freaking IQ points of the users in our office above the chimp level. Of course that is insulting the chimp. Even they know to throw crap when something seems wrong. I'm starting to really hate being in a company where the T word == a swear. Once upon a time we had a dedicated IT person who did nothing but training. That was 4 years ago. You can see how people's IQ's have dropped since then. :(

That was therapeutic. Sorry had to vent somewhere.

[jdechko]

I can sympathize with you regarding stupid computer users, and the like (including corporate bureaucracy).

What does it for me is simple solutions for problems that are always overlooked. For instance, the vast majority of people hate Firefox. It would solve 95% of all pop-up/spyware problems, yet people just can't get their head around it. I had one guy (a web-developer, no less) tell me "Firefox is the devil. I can't get any webpages to look right in it."

People like that are just... :mad: ... They make me sooo mad.

[liketom]

yep users are thick is shhh*** lol but without em i would be out of a job.

how many of your users have there password's on a post it note stuck to there TFT lol

:rolleyes:

[Josh]

lol it is for similar reasons I flatout REFUSE to help people w/ their PC's at work.

I do all the web and computer "geek" stuff in our office, and this somehow gave me the title of 'the guy to go to if something breaks.'

Some samples of my anti-favorites:

-User gets new tower, keeps monitor. Asks, "Where did my icons go? I only changed computers, not screens."

-"Why can't I click this link..I made the text blue..."

[yellow]

Clearly you need a new TazerMouse™ with remote USB-overzap driver.

Yes, it's a super crappy Photoshop job.. :)

[rockthecasbah]

I can sympathize with you regarding stupid computer users, and the like (including corporate bureaucracy).

What does it for me is simple solutions for problems that are always overlooked. For instance, the vast majority of people hate Firefox. It would solve 95% of all pop-up/spyware problems, yet people just can't get their head around it. I had one guy (a web-developer, no less) tell me "Firefox is the devil. I can't get any webpages to look right in it."

People like that are just... :mad: ... They make me sooo mad.
People who hate Firefox either:
A. work for microsoft
B. never tried it
C. fear change

The truth is that more webpages look better on Firefox than IE for me. The only problem i've had with it is with loading my band's myspace, which is the only reason i still have IE on my desktop. This plus the fact that it blocks virtually all of my pop ups and that I can use tab-browsing makes Firefox the best windows alternative to IE in my opinion. :)

[killuminati]

-User gets new tower, keeps monitor. Asks, "Where did my icons go? I only changed computers, not screens."


HAHAHA, thats just so sad!!!

My friends often call me up with stupid things like that but nothing that bad.

[feakbeak]

I'm a programmer now, sufficiently shielded from end-users. However, when in college I worked helping users in the university computing labs. The all time best question I have ever received is...

I'm using Hotmail for the first time and trying to send a message, do I click Send to send the email?It seems hard to believe but I did not make this up and I was not on drugs at the time. As a side note this user was a blond female - I can't help but throw that in because the way she spoke really did fit the stereotype.

LOL Oh, those were the days - that job provided so many great stories.

[liketom]

People who hate Firefox either:
A. work for microsoft
B. never tried it
C. fear change


D. are stupid users
E. don't know what the ANY KEY is lol



:D

[xsedrinam]

Here's a lyric to a nice, old song to play in your head while reading through the posts in this thread: "They would not listen, they're not listening still; perhaps they never will." For the frustrated programmers and computer geeks, there are options other than suicide or homacide. I wish we all could improve on our listening skills, though.
X

[skubish]

*slams head into keyboard*

23193z.;/!@!~_+2221a-=[021[2!2!a2?32'/PWS4E


Note to self: Stop giving people more credit then they deserve when it comes to their intelligence.

I'm rolling out a new system to of my the users in my office. Called her and left a message to please let me know what her passwords are on her system. (e-mail, network, vpn, etc.) She leaves me a voicemail while I'm at lunch. "Hi Jonathan. My password is blahblahblah. Yah know it would be just easier to just e-mail it to you. Bye"

Now you know WB cartoons have the classic eyes popping out of their head effect. One thing that happens in real life when this occurs is that they don't go back. So after spending a few minutes rolling my optic nerve back into my head I am now trying to figure out the best way to kill this user. Death being the easiest way of resetting all the freaking passwords we are now going to have to generate service "tickets" for now because a user is CRITICALLY FARKING STUPID!!!! ARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!! Because if this user died == leaving the company and there is one single form to request that the user's accounts be disabled. *SLAMS HEAD INTO KEYBOARD AGAIN*
Why am I not allowed to do security training classes? Why? Why? Why? I’d even offer the bloody service pro bono on my own time if it meant teaching our users some basic good security practices!!! Hell I'd take a vacation day for it. Anything to raise the freaking IQ points of the users in our office above the chimp level. Of course that is insulting the chimp. Even they know to throw crap when something seems wrong. I'm starting to really hate being in a company where the T word == a swear. Once upon a time we had a dedicated IT person who did nothing but training. That was 4 years ago. You can see how people's IQ's have dropped since then. :(

That was therapeutic. Sorry had to vent somewhere.


Better questions to ask:
1. Why do you need her password? At my company we don't need a user's password to deploy a new computer. Just image the HD, plug in new computer, done!

2. Why do we have to keep changing passwords all the time? Every 90 days at my work and it can't be anything previously used.

[mkrishnan]

1. Why do you need her password? At my company we don't need a user's password to deploy a new computer. Just image the HD, plug in new computer, done!

Ditto this... that's strange. I have never heard of IT managers calling people and asking for their passwords on voicemail. What did you expect her to do? Or were you testing her? But then again, I have only worked at sites with large managed systems (always in the 5k+ seats range).

[Mr. Durden]

HAHAHA, thats just so sad!!!

My friends often call me up with stupid things like that but nothing that bad.


I'm not in IT, but somehow I became the answer person for some computer issues at my work. The two must stupid comments I've gotten are:

1. "What do you mean "right click"?"

And...

2. Q. "The "Start" button? Wheres the "Start" button?"
A. "Its at the bottom left of your screen. Move the pointer to the bottom left and it should pop up."
Q. "I think my Start button is broke. It wont stay up. When I move the mouse, it goes away.

At which point my eyes just glaze over.

[andiwm2003]

in our company the it people never need our password. i remember 1 instance when they needed my password for setting up some webmail. i told them verbally and changed it right afterwards. my password is none of their business. but must users have their first name or 1234567 anyway. i guess i'm the only one using a random pw and changeing it frequently.

but yes, you're right. (we) users are stupid regarding computers. but computers are not our business. we just use them. if a tool is to complicated then people screw up. it's nice that you want to train users but it shouldn't be that way. the systems have to become so easy and intuitive that we don't need training. in fact as a user i shouldn't be dealing with the os at all, just with the program interface that i need for my job, nothing else. the rest is for private life, for fun or for IT. (e.g. i don't need to know anything about car electronics to be a good driver.)

but we're a long way from computers like this. so it seems we will have to live with complicated systems and dumb users......

[mac-er]

I'm rolling out a new system to of my the users in my office. Called her and left a message to please let me know what her passwords are on her system. (e-mail, network, vpn, etc.) She leaves me a voicemail while I'm at lunch. "Hi Jonathan. My password is blahblahblah. Yah know it would be just easier to just e-mail it to you. Bye"


Am I missing something?

You call and ask what her passwords are. She calls back and lets you know what the passwords are.

So how does this make her stupid? She was giving you the info you requested.

:confused:

[MongoTheGeek]

Clearly you need a new TazerMouse™ with remote USB-overzap driver.

Yes, it's a super crappy Photoshop job.. :)

I know people who want to get those installed where I work.

[Sun Baked]

Looks like you need a couple decent bumper stickers for you office door.

May I suggest...

http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3570

or

http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3826

[Duff-Man]

Duff-Man says....when not pushing Duff, I work as an I.T. guy...and today I had two real losers one right after another....first one calls - my screen is black, nothing on it at all...so I ask - is it powered on? Short silence....then she asks - where is the power button? Of course, that was exactly the problem. Second loser - stops me in the hallway - a laptop user that also has an external display...can't get anything to show up on the external display...I go look - yup - he didn't have it connected to the laptop.....oh yeah!

[SiliconAddict]

Better questions to ask:
1. Why do you need her password? At my company we don't need a user's password to deploy a new computer. Just image the HD, plug in new computer, done!

2. Why do we have to keep changing passwords all the time? Every 90 days at my work and it can't be anything previously used.

Kinda hard to replicate notes without her password. Little hard to install the various apps that are user profile specific. Next to impossible to setup the VOIDA dialer and Nortel VPN client without being IN the user's profile.
90 days. Would you like to wait 90 days after a series of passwords were sent in plain text over the net? Do you know anything about VPN authentication? An embedded password in a certificate does not expire after 90 days. Nor can it without being reissued. :rolleyes: If IT at my company hadn't been cannibalized 3 years ago and turned into a political cluster**** maybe. Just maybe I would have the environment you are talking about. As it stand I can't even roll out a new version of Acrobat reader without a project plan that has to go through 8 managers.
Let alone change how the desktop works. It’s the difference between playing armchair admin and actually working in a medium sized environment. You need to be allowed to make massive changes to how people log into the system to get to the point you are describing. I was well on my way to getting where you are now when IT got roadblocked. Now its simply a matter of just surviving. For now. I do the best I can. We JUST got rid of the last Netware 4.11 box running IPX\SPX last week. I've been pushing for 4 years for that.
Getting back to asking the person for their password. My rule of thumb is full resets on most passwords when the system is deployed so I don’t know then but my point of the post is this person sent ALL of her passwords via e-mail. Check that non-encrypted e-mail.
If that doesn’t get you all bug eyed then you obviously don’t understand how pop e-mail works or don't appreciate the nature of what they did.

[SiliconAddict]

Am I missing something?

You call and ask what her passwords are. She calls back and lets you know what the passwords are.

So how does this make her stupid? She was giving you the info you requested.

:confused:



Reread my post. She sent her passwords in an e-mail. Yah e-mail that goes on the net. Net where e-mails that are unencrypted are fair game to just about anyone.

[munkle]

Check out clientcopia.com (http://clientcopia.com/) to know that you're not alone!

An example:
I work for a monthly newspaper. Client came in to give us
"pointers" on his ad. Direct quote:

"I know a lot about design; I've got an eye for it. Now, do you
have Comic Sans?"

[killuminati]

Check out clientcopia.com (http://clientcopia.com/) to know that you're not alone!


Those top 20 are hysterical. Number 14 is just sad though. I had to sit in silence for a couple minutes after reading that just to really understand what I had just read.

[bartelby]

A while back I needed some software installed. The IT guy had never heard of it, even though it's a free download from our own website so customers can access datasets.
He said that he'd give me full admin privileges so I could do it myself.
Now I'm no IT person, but surely that's against most IT policies?

[MongoTheGeek]

A while back I needed some software installed. The IT guy had never heard of it, even though it's a free download from our own website so customers can access datasets.
He said that he'd give me full admin privileges so I could do it myself.
Now I'm no IT person, but surely that's against most IT policies?

It depends but most places yes.

Consider yourself lucky.

[mkrishnan]

It depends but most places yes.

Consider yourself lucky.

And keep quiet, so you don't get them taken away! :eek: ;) :D

[mkrishnan]

Those top 20 are hysterical. Number 14 is just sad though. I had to sit in silence for a couple minutes after reading that just to really understand what I had just read.

:D

Number 3 did that to me. I'm still not sure I understand what was going on in #10, or that I want to....

*sigh*

[munkle]

You can't beat #2:
(after a few minutes troubleshooting with a client) Me: It sounds like you have a virus on your computer that's causing the problem.
Client: I don't get viruses.
Me: Excuse me?
Client: My computer is immune to viruses, I have Windows 98.

Unfortunately this seems to be what happens when an average person sits in front of a computer:

[jared_kipe]

I have worse stories coming from my mom, both from windows and mac os. For instance, on ichat we were talking once (meaning I type and wait 30min for the 'yes' to be pecked off the keybord) and well it takes her longer to respond so I call her. "its greyed out" she says, "what is greyed out" I says, "your talking window, it won't type anymore and its greyed out" she says. Turns out she clicked off the window somehow and the little close/maximize icons are "greyed out" and when they types nothing apears, because the ichat window isn't active.

[rainman::|:|]

if you asked her for her password, you're the original security breach. passwords should never have to be given out, even to support personnel. There's NO secure way to do it, in reality, the voicemail system is probably not much more secure than the email you're berating her for using...

If you want security, you have to go all-the-way, you can't blame people for failing to meet your in-between expectations.

[xsedrinam]

Maybe a little memo like this from time to time would keep it lively :)
http://img3.picsplace.to/img3/51/stupidalert_320.jpg
X

[mkrishnan]

If you want security, you have to go all-the-way, you can't blame people for failing to meet your in-between expectations.

SiliconAddict, I totally sympathize with your frustration, and I feel like now I'm the ignoramus for asking, but I still don't understand this. Why are there things that you cannot accomplish with superuser / root access on the computer in question? I can't really ever recall being asked for passwords by IT (again, at large installations, >5k seats), and this includes OS upgrades, hardware upgrades, changes in e-mail systems, etc....

[Sharewaredemon]

1. "What do you mean "right click"?"

And...

2. Q. "The "Start" button? Wheres the "Start" button?"
A. "Its at the bottom left of your screen. Move the pointer to the bottom left and it should pop up."
Q. "I think my Start button is broke. It wont stay up. When I move the mouse, it goes away.

At which point my eyes just glaze over.


ROTFL thanks for that.

[Xtremehkr]

Sorry, the title is bugging me. Instead of 'Going Darwin', how about 'Darwinizing stupid Users.'?


It sounds like "I'm going to go evolution on your ass!"

[dejo]

It sounds like "I'm going to go evolution on your ass!"

Sounds kinda cool to me. Evolution: The next step beyond Medieval!

[mkrishnan]

Sounds kinda cool to me. Evolution: The next step beyond Medieval!

Don't make me carbonize you. :eek: ;)

[Thom_Edwards]

similar to jared_kipe's story, i'm in my 2nd year of training my mom over the phone on the use of computers. she's on xp because all of her friends told her that's what she wanted. anyway...

she *still* calls her desktop 'the green leaves' because that is her wallpaper. "all i see are my green leaves and some little pictures." the first time she told me that i was SO confused. it took a few minutes to figure that one out.

also, since she doesn't know what things are called, pronouns are used way too much. "i clicked it, but then it wouldn't do it. and when i tried to drag it to the other one, it wouldn't take it."


in reference to the original poster, i certainly understand your frustration. when i get to that point, i try to imagine if someone asked me to do their job. the things that are so common to me are, well, common. but if i was to do anything from carpentry to accounting to almost any skill, there would be a million and one things that i wouldn't understand *without training*.

good that the original poster at least wants to train his people. i know plenty of people that expect others to "just get it" by osmosis or something. just because some people know something doesn't mean everyone else does. also, there are plenty of people that just don't get it because they don't see any importance in it. kind of like how some people are with their cars. they let regular maintenance go by the wayside because their car is running fine (for now).

[Flynnstone]

I'm a programmer now, sufficiently shielded from end-users. However, when in college I worked helping users in the university computing labs. The all time best question I have ever received is...

It seems hard to believe but I did not make this up and I was not on drugs at the time. As a side note this user was a blond female - I can't help but throw that in because the way she spoke really did fit the stereotype.

LOL Oh, those were the days - that job provided so many great stories.
maybe she wanted you ;)

[Flynnstone]

I think most users are "untrained/[insert term here]".
So software should be written for them, not the "geeks".
One of the premises behind the Mac is that the user is human and makes mistakes. If the software is crappy, the user will make more mistakes.
Check out "Humane Interface" by (the late) Jef Raskin.
This is part of the reason that Windows OS & apps are so crappy.
If you write software, it needs to be written for the user and their perspective, not the programmers!

[notjustjay]

There are stupid users, sure.

But there are also arrogant tech people.

Some of you have great stories about stupid clueless users.

Others of you come off as arrogant jerks belittling everyone who's not as smart as you.

Not so much in this thread, perhaps, but I was reading that Clientcopia website that was previously linked, and thinking... half of these stories are amazing, and the other half conjures up this image of over-smug nerds with no patience or tact.

[mkrishnan]

Not so much in this thread, perhaps, but I was reading that Clientcopia website that was previously linked, and thinking... half of these stories are amazing, and the other half conjures up this image of over-smug nerds with no patience or tact.

I thought that too about Clientcopia.... :( But I also noticed we're not alone...the ones that I thought were thoughtless mostly received really poor ratings from other people too...so I pegged them with an "awful" and let it go.

[xsedrinam]

There are stupid users, sure. But there are also arrogant tech people. Some of you have great stories about stupid clueless users. Others of you come off as arrogant jerks belittling everyone who's not as smart as you. Not so much in this thread, perhaps, but I was reading that Clientcopia website that was previously linked, and thinking... half of these stories are amazing, and the other half conjures up this image of over-smug nerds with no patience or tact.

Ahh skills; like woodchuck skills, bow-hunting skills, computer hacking skills, people skills..... :)
X

[weg]

(Edit for clarification: YES. She sent me her passwords thought unencrypted e-mail.)

Why am I not allowed to do security training classes? Why? Why? Why?

Because a responsible system administrator would NEVER ask a user for his password. Never! Never! Never!

He would set a dummy password and ask the user to change it as fast as possible. His systems would be set up in a way that there's simply no need to ask anybody for his password.

[munkle]

Not so much in this thread, perhaps, but I was reading that Clientcopia website that was previously linked, and thinking... half of these stories are amazing, and the other half conjures up this image of over-smug nerds with no patience or tact.

But, like mkrishnan said, the ratings are normally pretty good separating the smug stories from the funny ones.

[weg]

I'm not in IT, but somehow I became the answer person for some computer issues at my work. The two must stupid comments I've gotten are:

1. "What do you mean "right click"?"


No stupid question at all if you were talking to an Apple user ;-)


And...

2. Q. "The "Start" button? Wheres the "Start" button?"
A. "Its at the bottom left of your screen. Move the pointer to the bottom left and it should pop up."
Q. "I think my Start button is broke. It wont stay up. When I move the mouse, it goes away.

At which point my eyes just glaze over.

With respect to 2, the user probably had the auto-hide feature of the task bar enabled. How would a computer novice be able to know this?
And again.. if you were talking to an Apple user, he would have spent hours searching "the Start button" ;-)

[andiwm2003]

Those top 20 are hysterical. Number 14 is just sad though. I had to sit in silence for a couple minutes after reading that just to really understand what I had just read.


well, my interpretation of #14: very smart woman. probably her colleagues made fun of her not having awireless keyboard. well, she could fill the paperwork and get the request denied or she can cut the wires and get a wireless keyboard in an instant.

at least for mice i have seen that happening to get a new optical mouse. User: sorry, i thought the little ball wasn't part of the mouse and when i took it out it just rolled away and i can't find it anymore. but you have certainly some spare balls? IT:what? what!!!!?? spare balls?!!!

[Prom1]

SiliconAddict.

There was a TV episode, on discover channel I think, explaining how dangerous it is just giving out your passwords over the phone. I firm was training a whole company not to do this. They even had a meeting in a hall for an entire floor, and some guy came into the room - wearing a suit - and pickup up the laptop & bag of someone that was assisting the presentation (he left while this occured). When asked 15 minutes later why nobody in the audience of this security presentation didnt say anything, they all thought he was picking it up for the person. Also nobody even looked at him good enough to give an accurate discription. Scratch one expensive notebook and accessories and case. And even here in Toronto, Ontario, Canada one company lost a total of 50+ PC laptops to just 1 person. Posting a photo from security servielance of whom they "thought" did the robbery. Why would anyone want to take crappy PC laptops? ;)

[notjustjay]

well, my interpretation of #14: very smart woman. probably her colleagues made fun of her not having awireless keyboard. well, she could fill the paperwork and get the request denied or she can cut the wires and get a wireless keyboard in an instant.

Ah, so it's the old play-stupid-to-manipulate-and-get-my-way trick.

So these people are either incredibly stupid or incredibly clever.

[pigwin32]

There are stupid users, sure.

But there are also arrogant tech people.

Some of you have great stories about stupid clueless users.

Others of you come off as arrogant jerks belittling everyone who's not as smart as you.

Not so much in this thread, perhaps, but I was reading that Clientcopia website that was previously linked, and thinking... half of these stories are amazing, and the other half conjures up this image of over-smug nerds with no patience or tact.
Yeah agreed. We IT people think we're so intelligent because we know how to use/program computers and users are stupid because they don't. That's just solid waste. Of course the poor user just wants to use the tool and will normally try to be helpful if an IT person asks them to do something. This is exactly why social engineering attacks work. Quite apart from the number of idiots who work in IT and think they're geniuses.

[Abstract]

Reread my post. She sent her passwords in an e-mail. Yah e-mail that goes on the net. Net where e-mails that are unencrypted are fair game to just about anyone.

If emailing passwords are the best example of bad computer usage (and its not even THAT bad), then your job must be very very easy, because many people are worse.

And leaving a password over voicemail is 1000x worse, so I don't know what you're complaining about.

And IT people do generally know more about computers than the average user. You are the TECH guy. You don't expect everyone to know about computers, do you? That's why you were hired.

FYI, you probably wouldn't last an hour working in a law department, and I hope the lawyers don't think you're stupid because you're not an expert on the law.