iMac Updates at MWSF

[MacRumors]

Spymac (http://www.spymac.com) reports on an iMac update to take places at MacWorld San Francisco (Jan).

The update is reported to include speed bumps to 1GHz as well as inclusion of a slot-load drive.

[reyesmac]

Slow news day I guess.

[daRAT]

Price, thats what I would like to know. The iBooks and Tbooks are now very competitive, (take a look at Dell and Gateway notebooks & laptops..ewww).

Damn...I want a iBook!, and a Cinema Display, iPod...time to beg Santa ;]

[job]

Why would they go back to slot-loading?

They had a lot of technical issues with those drives in the past; I can personally attest to that, as both slot-loading drives in my 2 iMacs ceased to function.

[reyesmac]

Originally posted by hitman
Why would they go back to slot-loading?

The more expensive their computers look, the more they can charge. They kept the iBook and will continue to keep it with virtually the same specs since the white version came out, what did they have to do to stay competative? They had to reduce the price, because if they added features that all the competitions laptops had, they would have ended up with something better than a Powerbook at half the cost.
They don't want the same thing to happen to the iMac. They will add new things like screens and drives and keep the bus speed the same even though that would help boost speed more than a bumped up CPU. Personally, I think that the eMac would be given a price cut before the iMac does, if only to get more school sales.

[job]

Originally posted by reyesmac
The more expensive their computers look, the more they can charge.

You mean to tell me that the change may be for purely asthetical, i.e. marketing reasons?

I don't think so...

[scem0]

I think a slot loading drive would be great! I think it would look a lot better then the current trays. I think that anything lower then 1 GHz is unneceptable, because the Powermacs coming out this Jan are going to be at a lot higher speeds..... They better be. I hope apple keeps up this good streak demonstrated through the laptop updates. If apple keeps it up, then they are sure to gain market share, money, and everything else they ever wanted/needed.

[arn]

Originally posted by hitman


You mean to tell me that the change may be for purely asthetical, i.e. marketing reasons?

I don't think so...

Why not? Why else did the previous iMac go to slot loading drives?

arn

[job]

Originally posted by arn
Why else did the previous iMac go to slot loading drives?

Hm....dunno really... :)

It's all about asthetics I guess...

Ah well...

[Shrek]

What's a slot loading drive?

[arn]

Originally posted by Shrek
What's a slot loading drive?

where there is a slot on the side of the computer, where you stick a CD/DVD into.

as opposed to a tray-loading drive... where the tray comes out and you place the CD/DVD onto the tray.

arn

[Mr. Anderson]

It seems like the logical way to go, although the slot loaded vs. tray loading might be an issue of money. What if Apple put pressure on to get the slot loading superdrive for the TiPB (which required effort on the part of the manufacturer) but they had to make a concession for it, namely, make slotloading across the board and in the LCD iMacs? Makes sense to me, and the more units they buy, the cheaper they'll be.

Anyway, I don't think it will detract from the iMac at all. They'll just have to change their ad and not have it stick its slot out at the guy on the other side of the window....;)

D

[Shrek]

Ah, man. That little "tounge" is so kewl. :p

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by Shrek
Ah, man. That little "tounge" is so kewl. :p

But as it has recently been pointed out to me, what price is cool?

Would it be better to not have a slot loading super drive in the TiPB to keep the tray in the iMac? I don't think so, since the overall impact is minimal. I'm glad the superdrive made it to the TiPB (along with plenty of other people) and if it came at the price of putting them in the iMac, so be it.

D

[Shrek]

Hmmm. Why no news of a 19" iMac? And why not bump it to 1.25GHz instead of 1GHz? Just because of these two issues, I'm rating this thread at 3 stars--one star taken away for each fallacy. :p

[ChicagoMac]

Ok, so Spymac doesn't exactly say that there will be a 19" Imac, but it does say that "other details are still facing conflicting reports." So maybe there is hope. Also, did you look at the picture of the Imac with the arrows pointing out from the screen as though to suggest the screen getting larger? Maybe it's showing the change from 15" to 17"... but maybe not.:D Any other interpretations?

I would be just as happy with a price drop before Christmas!

[arn]

Originally posted by ChicagoMac
Also, did you look at the picture of the Imac with the arrows pointing out from the screen as though to suggest the screen getting larger?

yeah - they used that pic when the 15" imac went to 17".

arn

[ChicagoMac]

So does that mean it will get bigger again? Or does it mean that Spymac needs to come up with some new stock graphics?

[neonzebra]

Oh please oh please I hope they at least give us the option to get a GeForce4 Ti video card. Doom III is a big reason for me to upgrade! John Carmack has been quoted as saying "Do not buy a GeForce4-MX for Doom (3)".

[michaelyoung]

not to be negative or anything..but i have friends who _guess_ better than Spymac "reports". New iMacs would be nice though. Maybe i can get one that matches my iWalk :)

[QuiteSure]

Originally posted by hitman
Why would they go back to slot-loading?

Kids tend to put more wear and tear on cd-rom trays. Slot loading is safer for the computer.

[JW Pepper]

Slot loading is a compleatly logical move. i for one fin that every time I open the CD tray it hits the keyboard. That it exactly the sort of thing that we are told SJ hates. I also think he has a great liking for neat things and a slot is a lot neater than a tray.

the iMac has a long way to go and they can keep eeking out upgrades for a long time. Further improvements include:-

Bigger screens.
Better video cards.
Faster/better processors.
DDR
Faster bus speed, 133,166 etc.
Bluetooth.

I don't expect any of these to reallr arrive at the same time, just a logical progression and it will have to go hand in hand with the Powermac's. If we see a bug jump in the PM's next year with G4+ or 970's it make it easier for Apple to incorporate these without affecting PM sales.

[rugby]

Unless they redesign the entire cd/dvd/cdrw drawer a slot=loading iMac won't work. The purpose of the tray drives is to open the external door of the iMac (also in the g4 towers). A slot loading drive won't open the door of the iMac.

[Billicus]

Originally posted by rugby
Unless they redesign the entire cd/dvd/cdrw drawer a slot=loading iMac won't work. The purpose of the tray drives is to open the external door of the iMac (also in the g4 towers). A slot loading drive won't open the door of the iMac.

You wouldn't need an external door if they went to slot loading drives across the board. Look, for example at the later incarnations of the G3 iMac.

[Gelfin]

The real problem is the complications posed by the curvature of the iMac's case, which forces the front of the drive to be set far back from the front of the case. You have to make sure the drive can grab discs early enough and push them out far enough on ejection. You've also got to be sure they will continue to do so reliably as the drive ages. It also most likely means the iMac would no longer be able to use mini-CDs and business-card-sized CDs.

In short, I'm skeptical that a slot loader on the iMac would be practical. And really I'm not sure the coolness of a slot loader is worth the engineering hassle. I'll believe this one when I see it.

[robguz]

I think what they should really bring back is the kind of CD drive where you have to put the CD in it's own little case which gets inserted into the drive. I think it would have great marketing appeal since it would take a few minutes each time to swap CDs. Our lives are all too fastpaced so this could be marketed as a way to slow down and enjoy life. They could do a tie in with something like Martha Stewart Living or a similar magazine.

[arn]

Originally posted by Gelfin
It also most likely means the iMac would no longer be able to use mini-CDs and business-card-sized CDs.


But the previous generation of iMacs (CRT) could not use these types of discs either due to their slot loading CD drives.

arn

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by Gelfin
In short, I'm skeptical that a slot loader on the iMac would be practical. And really I'm not sure the coolness of a slot loader is worth the engineering hassle. I'll believe this one when I see it.

I agree with you. Back in January I asked one of the Apple reps on the MacWorld floor why Apple went to tray-loaders for the new iMac. His answer was that the tray mechanisms are less expensive and the drives become available as tray-loaders before they become available slot-loaders. Unless Apple has figured out how to solve both of these problems, I can't see them moving to slot-loaders for the iMac.

I'm still waiting for them to go 17" across the iMac line. The stocks of 15" iMacs are nearly gone. I wonder if these new units didn't get stuck on container ships during the longshore lockout, delaying their release. If the first few thousand of these new models have seagull poop on the boxes, we'll know.

[MOM]

From what I've seen the new ibooks are whiter than the old ones, so I would guess at a minor tweak in plastics for the imac as well. MOM

[orangedv]

For the imac to take off, Apple need to look at WHY so many PC's are in peoples homes. It isn't because they run Office at home, Macs do that too. People like to play games at home, and the PC has 2 huge advantages over the mac. First, direct X, Apple seem to think games coders have nothing better to do all day than carve games out of unix rock. Wrong Apple! Open GL is only a token help, give the games companies some motivation to work on your machines... Secondly, the PC world doesnt patronise its consumer market the way Apple does, with regard to uprgrades. PC owners have the luxury of putting whatever graphics board they like in their machine to extend its life. You can't underestimate how useful that is. How many mac owners would jump at the chance to put a 32 meg graphics board in their imacs to speed up Jaguar? But no, changing graphics cards is not for consumer scum, only 'pro' users are allowed to do this. This just makes me mad, and puts others off buying into Mac.

[IJ Reilly]

I believe it is useless to assign our personal needs and desires to everyone else. If "for instance" is any kind of a proof, I've got my own to proffer.

I've owned probably a dozen Macs over the last 17 years and over that time I haven't upgraded a single video card. In fact about a year ago I sold my 9600 and bought a Cube because after years of ownership, I found that huge, infinitely upgradable, noisy box to be completely wasted on me. The next machine to go will be a G3 tower -- to be replaced by an iMac. The G3 has never been upgraded, either. When it goes, our office will be totally free of roaring sucking sounds.

If Apple were, as you would have it, to make internal upgradability of all subsystems a strict priority, then they'd never be able to come up with innovative form factors like the Cube or the iMac. You've got to give if you want to get.

[bimmerdude]

I'm in the market for a new mac and I would love to get an iMac with a cinema display. I plan to keep the new machine for a while so I don't want it to become limited to quickly. The things holding me back are:

1. Lack of 3d video hardware. For a computer targeted at the home user, games are important and 3d hardware support is essential. The use of neutered MX video keeps me holding off. If I can't upgrade it then I at least want something up to current standards when I buy it. Also AGP should be at 4x not 2x.

2. Crippling the performance of the CPU on purpose. If I pay for a G4 I expect to get that level of performance. Not a CPU that is slowed down by a slow bus just so that it doesn't hurt thier Pro sales. I don't need DDR since the G4 can't use it anyway...I just want a decent 133Mhz Bus so the CPU can run with decent bandwidth. They require 133 Mhz memory anyway..so lets get the benefit from it.

3. 1Ghz cpu minimum. Sure the 800Mhz CPU is adequate at the moment but again...if I keep the computer how good is 800Mhz going to be 2-3 years from now? How well will it run the next generation of OS X and applications? My bet is that it will be slow. Alot like the G3 500 I have now.

None of this is asking too much and I don't see that many mods would have to made to accomidate them.

So I guess if they make a 1Ghz+ iMac with 133Mhz bus, radeon 9000 or GF4 with 64mg and cinema display 17",18" or 19" then I'm gonna be placing my order!

[Arcady]

What are you ****in kidding?

Until the iWalk comes out, why pay attention to there children and their fantasies? The only reason they exist is because of that bull they made up about iWalk. I cannot believe anyone quotes a word they say.

[schrumpl]

bimmerdude:

i'm completely with you!!!
and i think there are many others out there waiting too...

did you read this - apple?

[StuPid QPid]

Originally posted by bimmerdude
I'm in the market for a new mac and I would love to get an iMac with a cinema display. I plan to keep the new machine for a while so I don't want it to become limited to quickly. The things holding me back are:

1. Lack of 3d video hardware.
2. Crippling the performance of the CPU on purpose.
3. 1Ghz cpu minimum.
I also agree.
What ever happened to the "Build-to-Order" at the Apple Store. These days, the only things you can change seem to be the memory and hard drive.
Why can't Apple keep the same basic configurations, but offer the chance to upgrade their computers by the build-to-order scheme. That way the headline prices stay the same, but if someone wants to spend extra money on decent 4x AGP graphics, then they can pay the extra. Same goes for the Notebook lines.

One other thing about the tray vs slot loading drives. From what I know about the new Powerbook slot loading Superdrive, it's a crippled version of the PowerMac tray loader offering only 1x DVD-R instead of 2x on the tray loader. Interestingly if you only rarely burn DVD-R, but mainly burn CD-R/RW then the Combo drive is faster 16x10x CD-R/RW vs 8x4x in the Superdrive?
I was a bit surprised by that.

[Hawthorne]

Puh-lease. There are magic eightballs out there with a better track record.

And as for the upgradablity, I agree, more BTO options would be nice. But part of the Mac philosophy is that idea that the more you can muck around with things after the sale, the more things can go wrong, therefore, the design of the consumer Macs limits the amount a "non-pro" user can do.

Personally, for playing games, that's what the PlayStation is for. :)

[esbod]

As I see it the LCD iMac IS apple in the public's eye right now. It is cute, different, very interesting even for the non-apple user. It is unique and it sells. Apple is pushing the "digital hub" and I feel we should look to the iMac to carry this "steve jobs dream" forward.

Those new powermac towers are great, but frankly many are purchased by power users and in my opinion they are "just another box" to the average computer user. We, of course, know how great they are. But my point is, to the non-mac user only the iMac has a WOW factor.

Look for Apple to wow us in January. My opinion...

19" iMac with BLUETOOTH - why? To interface with the two new bluetooth devices we have heard about. New PDA and improved iPod, perhaps iPhone?

Slot load - of course, if you are buying for the powerbook then you'll put them in everything to reduce costs. Processor - top at 1.25Ghz - low 867 Ghz.

So... 19" 1.25Ghz (slot load) and minor design changes? , 17" 1 Ghz (tray load), 17" 867 Ghz (tray load) AND bluetooth devices.

[appleguy]

Originally posted by hitman
Why would they go back to slot-loading?

They had a lot of technical issues with those drives in the past; I can personally attest to that, as both slot-loading drives in my 2 iMacs ceased to function.

I never had (or have) a problem with my Cube's 2xiMac DVs and PowerBook slot loading drive.

[rice_web]

Low-end
- 15-inch LCD flat screen
- 867MHz PowerPC G4
- NVIDIA GeForce4 MX
- 256MB SDRAM
- CD-RW
- 40GB Ultra ATA hard drive
- Apple Pro Speakers
- $999

Middle of the Road
- 17-inch widescreen LCD flat
- 867MHz PowerPC G4
- NVIDIA GeForce4 MX
- 512MB SDRAM
- 80GB Ultra ATA hard drive
- Apple Pro Speakers
- $1499

High-End
- 17-inch widescreen LCD flat
- 1133MHz PowerPC G4
- Radeon 9500
- 512MB SDRAM
- 120GB Ultra ATA hard drive
- Apple Pro Speakers
- $1899

Dear god I wish these were the specs. of the next revision of the iMac. The iMac desperately needs an increased system bus, 1GHz+ G4s, a better price tag, and better graphics cards. I recommend the Radeon 9500 (not Pro), for it offers decent performance, significantly more than the Radeon 9000 and thus Geforce 4MX and 2MX.

The 15" iMac should stay for a while, offering a low-priced iMac for the masses. The Superdrive should be included into the other iMac setups to further push Apple's DVD-burning movement.

Finally, the iMac needs to price itself competitively to ensure that it can lure in customers as the economy recovers. Computer sales are up, and Apple needs to find itself attracting new customers, instead of giving them up to Dell or Compaq.

This is how the iMac Store Should Appear After MWSF (http://216.221.102.30/imac/)

[appleguy]

Originally posted by rice_web
Low-end


This is how the iMac Store Should Appear After MWSF (http://216.221.102.30/imac/)

Hate to tell you this, but what you have done here is really bad. I am amazed that Apple have not done something yet about this. I don't want to sound like a complete dork here but what you have done has broken the copywrite law in most countries. I suggest you pull it asap

[rice_web]

I know it's illegal, but it's always fun to touch up other pages. I already took it down, anyhow.

[QuiteSure]

Originally posted by rice_web
I know it's illegal, but it's always fun to touch up other pages. I already took it down, anyhow.

I didn't get to see the page, but it is not illegal to use another's trademarked or copyrighted materials as a commentary upon their practices. This is part of the "fair use" doctrine, indirectly protected by the First Amendment to the US Constitution. It would be illegal if you were selling a competitive product.

[Qunchuy]

For the imac to take off, Apple need to look at WHY so many PC's are in peoples homes. It isn't because they run Office at home, Macs do that too.

Of the several dozen people I know who use Windows at home, approximately two of them know that Office runs on Macintoshes. For most of the rest, at least, they do use Windows at home because they think that's the only way to run MS Word.

In fact, a substantial number of Windows users I talk to have a hard time distinguishing between MS Word, MS Windows, and the Internet. That's gotten worse lately, with MS Outlook using MS Word as an email editor.

There's still a dishearteningly prevalent view out there that Macintoshes are "incompatible" with everything else. Most casual PC users don't even come close to considering that it might be possible to do something they want to using a Mac. (I haven't done any real research on this, but I suspect Apple isn't showing any "Switch" commercials during Jerry Springer or Anna Nicole.)

[Hawthorne]

Originally posted by Qunchuy

Most casual PC users don't even come close to considering that it might be possible to do something they want to using a Mac. (I haven't done any real research on this, but I suspect Apple isn't showing any "Switch" commercials during Jerry Springer or Anna Nicole.)

It's only funny 'cause it's true. (http://news.com.com/2100-1040-943519.html) :) .

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by Qunchuy
There's still a dishearteningly prevalent view out there that Macintoshes are "incompatible" with everything else.

We're slipping into the OT Zone, but I have to respond to this comment with a great AMEN, because it's such a common, and frustrating, issue. I'm sure we've all had this experience: You send a file to a Windows user. They can't open it for some reason, so they blame it on the Mac, and certainly not on operator error (theirs). If the same file had come from a PC, they'd probably try to solve the problem. But if they know the file originated from a Mac then (obviously), the Mac is at fault.

[cubist]

Then it could have a slot load drive and a graphics card slot...

... just like the Cube! :D

(Oh, not another 'return of the cube' thread!)

[appleguy]

Originally posted by QuiteSure


I didn't get to see the page, but it is not illegal to use another's trademarked or copyrighted materials as a commentary upon their practices. This is part of the "fair use" doctrine, indirectly protected by the First Amendment to the US Constitution. It would be illegal if you were selling a competitive product.

What he did have on the page was illegal. Not to meation a couple of really bad logo breaches. Apple are really strick on their logos and they correct logo for the correct use. (Authorised Reseller, Service Provider) etc if you are not Authorised and say that you are that is bad.

[QuiteSure]

Originally posted by appleguy


What he did have on the page was illegal. Not to meation a couple of really bad logo breaches. Apple are really strick on their logos and they correct logo for the correct use. (Authorised Reseller, Service Provider) etc if you are not Authorised and say that you are that is bad.

Once again, it is only illegal if he is actually selling something. If he is using the items for parody or for newsworthy commentary it is considered speech that is protected by the first amendment.

In other words, you can use Apple's logos to criticize Apple, but you can't use the same logos to confuse customers in order to compete unfairly with Apple.

[iMac]

Oh, yeah, there will be iMac updates.. if there is an MWSF. They aren't really banning them are they? That would be complete idiocy. I mean, hello? Um, duh?