Apple 4th Quarter 2005 Conference Call

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple conducted their Q4 2005 Financial Results Conference call at today. Apple had already announced earnings as well as Mac and iPod shipments this quarter.

MacCentral provides a running update of the conference call.

Hilights include:

- 1,236,000 Macs sold
- 6,451,000 iPods sold
- 602,000 of the Macs were Desktops (PowerMac, iMac, eMac, Mac mini, Xserve)
- 634,000 of the Macs were Portables (PowerBooks, iBooks)
- More than a Million iPod nanos were sold within 17 days of its release.
- Mac OS X 10.4 revenue is approximately $35 million per quarter
- Hints at upcoming iPod-related announcements.
- Intel Based Macs still expected by June 2006. Some "very cool" PowerPCs in the pipeline.

[LimeiBook86]

Wow that's a lot of iPods sold! :eek:

[rjstanford]

That's a really surprising number of desktops sold, considering the overall popularity of laptops these days. And while 6.5mm iPods is impressive, its more telling to me that over 1mm of them were nanos, just because almost by definition these are impulse purchases, since they weren't known about ahead of time. Cool news.

[Chappers]

Thats a lot of Nanos

[oskar]

Apple's dedication to the iPod makes sense everytime they show these type of numbers. You can also see that a large number of sales are laptops. I guess that's why Apple hasn't been as worried as we have with better PowerBooks and iBooks, although I would suppose iBooks have sold more than PowerBooks, of course.

[edesignuk]

Figures are undoubtedly impressive - it's the million nanos in 17 days that really gets me though http://upload.yo-momma.net/uploads/smilies/1-pray.gif

[nagromme]

Good all around. I'd have expected the iPods to carry the company through the Intel transition, but it seems like PowerPC Macs are doing that just fine.

I wonder how Apple's education marketshare changed compared to last year. I didn't notice that mentioned. (They did say back-to-school went well.)

[destroyboredom]

Wow. Looks like Steve was right about the Nano!

[Some_Big_Spoon]

What I'd like to see is the numbers of PowerMacs and Powerbooks by themselves.. my guess is that those numbers aren't very good. I'll venture to guess that the vast majority of desktops are minis, followed far back by iMacs. Same with ibooks v. powebooks.

Well, hope tomorrow does something for those two lines.

That's a really surprising number of desktops sold, considering the overall popularity of laptops these days. And while 6.5mm iPods is impressive, its more telling to me that over 1mm of them were nanos, just because almost by definition these are impulse purchases, since they weren't known about ahead of time. Cool news.

[yoak]

So I think all those that think a video ipod (if it comes out) will canibalize Nano sales should think again.

[zap2]

more laptops then desktops odd but ok

APPLE!!!! :D

[mac-er]

"New 'innovative' products coming for new quarter"

[AoWolf]

more laptops then desktops odd but ok

APPLE!!!! :D

I think its almost always been that way.

[ajwitte]

"New 'innovative' products coming for new quarter"

In iPod line specifically. :D

[mac-er]

more laptops then desktops odd but ok

APPLE!!!! :D

That isn't really odd....laptops are becoming more popular across the board.

[AoWolf]

"New 'innovative' products coming for new quarter"

Hmm is "innovative" stock holder pleasing talk or does that mean something new and unexpected?

[jesuscandle]

just referred to "some very innovative products" to be introduced in the Oct-Dec quarter.

Obviously doesn't really mean much, but maybe casts some light on tomorrow. That doesn't sound like Powermac speed bumps.

[DavidLeblond]

I wonder how many of the desktops sold were minis?

[maveness]

I was finally able to get to the webcast page (Investor Relations admitted they'd been having server problems), but the QT of the audio won't play at all.

FRUSTRATING!!!!

[nagromme]

I'll venture to guess that the vast majority of desktops are minis, followed far back by iMacs.
Last we heard (I'm not aware of any recent info) the iMac was the top seller, even after the Mac Mini came out. (I don't see the Mac Mini eating into iMac sales, more into eMac sales and attracting newcomers.) I'd be interested to know how well the Mini has done too, but regardless it's a LOT of Macs sold, and that's good for the platform and the future.

[Yebot]

The bulk of the 6.4 million is iPod minis.

[aafuss1]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple is webcasting their Q4 2005 Financial Results Conference call at this time. Apple has already announced earnings (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2005/10/20051011164956.shtml) as well as Mac and iPod shipments this quarter.

MacCentral is providing (http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/10/11/liveupdate/index.php) a running update of the conference call.

Hilights include:

- 1,236,000 Macs sold
- 6,451,000 iPods sold
- 602,000 of the Macs were Desktops (PowerMac, iMac, eMac, Mac mini, Xserve)
- 634,000 of the Macs were Portables (PowerBooks, iBooks)
- More than a Million iPod nanos were sold within 17 days of its release.

That's a lot more iPods sold than Macs (but PM and PB sales must be doing poorly in light of no updates).

[macFanDave]

What I'd like to see is the numbers of PowerMacs and Powerbooks by themselves.. my guess is that those numbers aren't very good. I'll venture to guess that the vast majority of desktops are minis, followed far back by iMacs. Same with ibooks v. powebooks.

Well, hope tomorrow does something for those two lines.

It's hard to say, but generally things like minis and iBooks have lower margins than PowerMacs and PowerBooks. Apple's margin actually increased this quarter.

Regardless of the composition of Mac sales, I am very pleasantly surprised by the volume of Mac sales. I thought that the looming switch to Intel would cause Mac sales to be much lower, but they were actually quite strong.

I guess that a lot of consumers are not the computer connoisseurs that most of us who read and post here are. I have a dual 2GHz G5 so I am in no hurry to buy a new Mac, but I probably would try to hold out for an Intel-based Mac if I did need a new one.

[mac-er]

Hmm is "innovative" stock holder pleasing talk or does that mean something new and unexpected?

Steve probably told him to say that....its the RDF :)

[nagromme]

The bulk of the 6.4 million is iPod minis.
But 1 million nanos in half a month is quicker sales than 4 million minis (or whatever the number) in 3 months.


That's a lot more iPods sold than Macs
Nothing worrisome about that. iPods cost $79-399. Macs cost #499-$thousands. And iPods sell to Windows users.

As many iPods as Apple can sell is all good. Good for the Mac: the halo seems to be real, it just works over time.

[Daveway]

Anyone notice he said "We all know what we'll be talking about tomorrow."?

[manu chao]

I wonder how many of the desktops sold were minis?

One third, about 200 000.

[mac-er]

"'Cool' PowerPC products in the pipeline"

[ajwitte]

"Very cool PowerPCs in the pipeline."

[Yebot]

So I think all those that think a video ipod (if it comes out) will canibalize Nano sales should think again.

The iPod is not ready for video. Macrumors people like ourselves may be, but the rest of the world is not.

[thejadedmonkey]

This is pretty sweet. Was there any mention of the growing market share?

[mac-er]

One third, about 200 000.

Did he accidently reveal it earlier? He just said he didn't say that.

[MattyMac]

There better not be a new powerbook, i just bought one less than three weeks ago and the guy at apple over the phone said I would not need to worry about an update. if there is.. should i call and complain at 1800apple. All man this stinks

[diamond3]

Did anyone here the foreign guy ask about the progress of the intel switch. The responce was that they would have them in by summer next year. The foriegn guy then asked if they thought it would be any sooner. The response was extremely wierd, he took a pause before he said anything, then said there would be announces about it. could it be tomorrow possibly?

[Daveway]

"Very cool PowerPCs in the pipeline."

But. that pipeline expands into 2007. :(

Did anyone here the foreign guy ask about the progress of the intel switch. The responce was that they would have them in by summer next year. The foriegn guy then asked if they thought it would be any sooner. The response was extremely wierd, he took a pause before he said anything, then said there would be announces about it. could it be tomorrow possibly?
No. There would be MANY pissed developers.

[nagromme]

Did anyone here the foreign guy ask about the progress of the intel switch. The responce was that they would have them in by summer next year. The foriegn guy then asked if they thought it would be any sooner. The response was extremely wierd, he took a pause before he said anything, then said there would be announces about it.
Anyone have the exact quote? We'll want to pore over it for months and read too much into it :D I know I will. But I stopped the audio (it was skipping like mad) and missed that.

[manu chao]

The iPod is not ready for video. Macrumors people like ourselves may be, but the rest of the world is not.

Just visited friends which use a Archos (?) 2.5'' drive based device. Has one big screen on one side, covering the whole front. About the size of a 2.5'' external Firewire drive.

Stores photos, music and video. Can be operated via a remote using a TV as screen.

Essentially a crossover between a TiVo and an iPod. Or call it a portable TiVo.

Nothing to carry around everyday in your pocket, but still.

[PharmD]

Did anyone here the foreign guy ask about the progress of the intel switch. The responce was that they would have them in by summer next year. The foriegn guy then asked if they thought it would be any sooner. The response was extremely wierd, he took a pause before he said anything, then said there would be announces about it. could it be tomorrow possibly?

I noticed that too, he didn't "not" say that they wouldn't have intel products before June '06. He definately paused. Hmmm...

Also, did anyone notice he said "products" for tomorrow. So its more than "one more thing"

[bishop99]

This is pretty sweet. Was there any mention of the growing market share?


Not sweet enough, stock down 8% in after hours trading , now about $46, from a > $51 close. It's hurting, i hope they make the pain go away tomorrow :(

[Modano]

"Very cool PowerPCs in the pipeline." I hope "the pipeline" means "the event tomorrow!"

[manu chao]

Did he accidently reveal it earlier? He just said he didn't say that.
macfixit is reporting it.

[iGary]

I noticed that too, he didn't "not" say that they wouldn't have intel products before June '06. He definately paused. Hmmm...

Also, did anyone notice he said "products" for tomorrow. So its more than "one more thing"

You might need some software to run with that processor, chief. ;) :D

[ibook30]

Let's see these really cool PPC machines !!!!
It would be interesting to see Apple sell the heck out of these last versions of PPC. I know I am going to snap one more up before the INTEL switch - just to get the fastest shiniest machine I can run all my software on - smoothly.
Perhaps with that logic, there will be continued strong sales for PPC and Apple.

[Fabio_gsilva]

"New 'innovative' products coming for new quarter"

Uhu!!! GO APPLE! GO!!! Take my money away, please!

[liketom]

Not sweet enough, stock down 8% in after hours trading , now about $46, from a > $51 close. It's hurting, i hope they make the pain go away tomorrow :(
apple v's windows and linux and the rest of the os's not stock prices

[Fabio_gsilva]

Wow. Looks like Steve was right about the Nano!

He is always right! People that does not understand him sometimes...

[Daveway]

did anyone catch if they gave guidance on ipods? I was wondering, b/c we could do our own math considering the guidance includes tomorrows products.

[PharmD]

You might need some software to run with that processor, chief. ;) :D
You have a point there. I wasn't inferring that they would come out tomorrow, just before June. :D

[Fabio_gsilva]

There better not be a new powerbook, i just bought one less than three weeks ago and the guy at apple over the phone said I would not need to worry about an update. if there is.. should i call and complain at 1800apple. All man this stinks

But all mac comunity is talking about iminent powerbooks upgrades... I think you should not complain if it occurs...

And, most important, the PB line realy deserves an upgrade... don't be selfish!

[nagromme]

You have a point there. I wasn't inferring that they would come out tomorrow, just before June. :D
I'm with you :) A January announcement (February shipping) wouldn't shock me. Neither would May, but I'll hope for MWSF!

And lack of software is partly helped by the fact that they'll be selling both Intel and PPC Macs. If you can't do what you want with an Intel Mac, you'll have other options (but--probably--not the same product line). Which is confusing to buyers I know, but the transition IS going to have some rough spots, nothing can help that. It will be worth it, and I for one would like to get started on it :) Even if I need to keep my PPC Mac for certain apps for a while.

[Bear]

The split is between desktops and portables. Notice the word portable and not laptop? The Mac mini is considered a portable computer by Apple. So there were a lot of iMacs and PowerMacs sold last quarter.

Note: The Mac mini is listed as a portable in the services and support section of the website.

[powerbook911]

This sucks. After hours trading is really down. I hope the announcements tomorrow bounce it back a little.

[powerbook911]

The split is between desktops and portables. Notice the word portable and not laptop? The Mac mini is considered a portable computer by Apple. So there were a lot of iMacs and PowerMacs sold last quarter.

They have always called the portables. Mac Minis are included with desktop. In fact, before when they broke down the numbers more, they included Mac Mini sales, with iMac sales.

[manu chao]

The split is between desktops and portables. Notice the word portable and not laptop? The Mac mini is considered a portable computer by Apple. So there were a lot of iMacs and PowerMacs sold last quarter.

No, that is incorrect. Have a look at this:
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/051011/sftu144.html?.v=14

Scroll down to the bottom, have a look at footnote number two.

[capsLOCK]

Apple's hold on the mp3 player market is rediculous...

[Trowaman]

He is always right! People that does not understand him sometimes...

All hail Steve, for Steve is what we should dream to be. A nice man on the outside who once the cameras are off will put drunken sailors to shame in addition to prying into square's sex/drug lives. :eek:

So I hear. :rolleyes:

[abhishake]

This sucks. After hours trading is really down. I hope the announcements tomorrow bounce it back a little.


HOLY CRAP! Dangit, I knew I should've sold it all.. Oh my gosh, that's ridiculously bad.. It'll take a little time for it to get back up to the level that it was at. 10.49% is very very bad..

Unless Apple releases something amazing tomorrow, I don't know what'll happen.

[HiRez]

That isn't really odd....laptops are becoming more popular across the board.Right, that is the trend industry-wide. It was a couple years ago that Steve announced Apple for the first time sold more laptops in a quarter than desktops. One big reason is that for a large number of people, laptops really are a viable desktop replacement nowadays. That wasn't always the case.

[mpqtpie]

Wow, 1 million Nanos is crazy, but awesome. My eyes went a little bug-eyed after reading that! I guess it makes sense after all the publicity it's gotten, but even so.

I wonder if all the negative publicity (cracked screens, etc.) will have any effect on future sales of Nanos? With Christmas coming up you would think that the sales would remain steady or go up even more though...

[shawnce]

The split is between desktops and portables. Notice the word portable and not laptop? The Mac mini is considered a portable computer by Apple. So there were a lot of iMacs and PowerMacs sold last quarter. Nope. Look at the footnotes in the following PDF.

Apple Computer, Inc. Q4 2005 Unaudited Summary Data (http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q405data_sum.pdf)

Note: The Mac mini is listed as a portable in the services and support section of the website. Doesn't list that way for me. It shows up under the "Macs" section and not under the "Portables/Wireless" section.

[nagromme]

HOLY CRAP! Dangit, I knew I should've sold it all.. Oh my gosh, that's ridiculously bad.. It'll take a little time for it to get back up to the level that it was at. 10.49% is very very bad..

Unless Apple releases something amazing tomorrow, I don't know what'll happen.
:D Let's hope Apple can survive! ;)

[Dagless]

more laptops then desktops odd but ok

APPLE!!!! :D

I wouldn't get an Apple desktop machine. maybe an iMac for its brilliantness or a PowerMac for its power. but it would have to be top of the line.
personally I'm not a fan of desktops be they windows or Apple. and it seems to be a big trend at the moment. at least with folks at my end people are ditching desktops in favour of laptops.

[realityisterror]

Anybody else notice the lack of a music store update today?
Which historically means something iPod/iTunes related coming within the next few days.
Last time that happened was just a month ago, and our music store update came with... :drumroll: iTunes 5 and iPod nanos.

Which means... iTunes 5.0.2 and iPod video.
and PowerBook G5s ;)

reality

[nagromme]

Anybody else notice the lack of a music store update today?
Which historically means something iPod/iTunes related coming within the next few days.
While I do think iPod news is coming tomorrow, it seems they always bump the Tuesday stuff to Wednesday whenever Monday is a holiday (Columbus Day). Something to do with some sales reports they get on Monday being delayed until Tuesday, and Apple liking to have new releases follow those reports? Someone may remember more clearly than I.

[maddav]

Anybody else notice the lack of a music store update today?
Which historically means something iPod/iTunes related coming within the next few days.
Last time that happened was just a month ago, and our music store update came with... :drumroll: iTunes 5 and iPod nanos.

Which means... iTunes 5.0.2 and iPod video.
and PowerBook G5s ;)

reality


Thank you, let us not forgot good old (non distorted)reality :D

[iAlan]

Hilights include:

- 1,236,000 Macs sold
- 6,451,000 iPods sold
- 602,000 of the Macs were Desktops (PowerMac, iMac, eMac, Mac mini, Xserve)
- 634,000 of the Macs were Portables (PowerBooks, iBooks)
- More than a Million iPod nanos were sold within 17 days of its release.
- Mac OS X 10.4 revenue is approximately $35 million per quarter

I got to say that is a lot of Macs for any quarter. How many original iMacs were sold the first quarter after launch, anyone know? I would also like to know the exact number for the quarter by line - are flat screen iMacs outselling PMs and are iBs outselling PBs or vica verca?

And I am happy to have contributed 1 nano to the 'more than a million' sold in the quarter - nice to know I am helping drive a trend :p

I will be waiting another 18 hours or so for the media event (what time is it on Wednesday anyway? Whatever it is it is the midle of the night here in Tokyo, so maybe I will just check apple.com Thusday morning my time...)

[zap2]

I think its almost always been that way.


just seem werid there are so many more desktops then laptop but you know!! Im only going to use as my main computer for School, after that i plan to have a high power desk top ,PMac and a iBook or lowend PB for 'on the go'

[dontmatter]

why are there two threads for this topic?

Anyway, looks sweet and all, but actually, ipod numbers not so hot. Yes, yes, it's a lot of ipods, and growth, but it's "leveling off". Meaning, growth is slowing, meaning most who want one already have one. Which is a bad sign, and investors are seeing it as such.

I think this is why they scheduled tomorrow's event tomorrow-ipod growth has been driving the company, and seeing that slowing is NOT going to help the stock price. But a new ipod lineup seriously could help.

That said, I think all the people selling because the ipod company no longer has infinite growth potential as the ipod company are silly. As the numbers today show, as apple was turned into the ipod company, the computer side of it has become a threat with a lot of growth potential. Meanwhile, the ipod wave has a good bit more for apple to ride, for sure.

[fpnc]

I noticed that too, he didn't "not" say that they wouldn't have intel products before June '06. He definately paused. Hmmm...

Also, did anyone notice he said "products" for tomorrow. So its more than "one more thing"

This is how incorrect rumors start. He did pause before he replied but then he just repeated that they were still expecting to have Intel products by June '06. The pause could have been for any number of reasons, I actually took it as an indication that they were just a little tired of hearing someone ask that same question again (since they had already reaffirmed the June '06 date).

[nagromme]

Yes, yes, it's a lot of ipods, and growth, but it's "leveling off". Meaning, growth is slowing, meaning most who want one already have one. Which is a bad sign, and investors are seeing it as such.

I think you're right about investors. But in truth "growth slowing" does not mean most who want one already have one. I predict the reverse: the number of iPods currently is just scratching the surface of the number of people who will have them down the road.

Put it this way: what if growth didn't just slow, but hit ZERO. Sales totally flat with no increase ever again. That would STILL be HUGE numbers of iPods sold every quarter.

[manu chao]

I got to say that is a lot of Macs for any quarter. How many original iMacs were sold the first quarter after launch, anyone know?

Second highest quarterly total of Macs shipped ever. (macfixit.com)

[Superhob]

Does anyone know if tommorrow's event will have a webcast?

[rdowns]

This sucks. After hours trading is really down. I hope the announcements tomorrow bounce it back a little.

I'm a long Apple stockholder and I'm not worried in the least. The drop is typical for Apple after earnings announcements, no matter how good the news. Just some profit taking. Expect it to open lower tomorrow and begin its rise on the new announcements. We;ll be back to yesterday's levels by month's end.

[abhishake]

I think you're right about investors. But in truth "growth slowing" does not mean most who want one already have one. I predict the reverse: the number of iPods currently is just scratching the surface of the number of people who will have them down the road.

Put it this way: what if growth didn't just slow, but hit ZERO. Sales totally flat with no increase ever again. That would STILL be HUGE numbers of iPods sold every quarter.


Hmmm... How many iPods have been sold in the United States alone. In TOTAL. We have 300 million people in the United States, how many people can Apple grab?

I know that i'm just one of many who have bought more than just one iPod from Apple, but many haven't bought any at all..

[fpnc]

I believe that the reason the stock has fallen was because iPod sales were pretty flat from last quarter's results (units up about 5%). That and the normal sell off after any quarter where results are only as good as or slightly better than forecast.

[tmornini]

HOLY CRAP! Dangit, I knew I should've sold it all.. Oh my gosh, that's ridiculously bad.. It'll take a little time for it to get back up to the level that it was at. 10.49% is very very bad..

Unless Apple releases something amazing tomorrow, I don't know what'll happen.

Typical ass-backward investment mentality.

Could you have shorted it? Sure.

But...if you believe in the company (and the results say you should!) then
the stock going down is a GOOD thing, as it let's you buy some more at
a lower price!

Buy on bad news, sell on good news, not the reverse.

Look at what happened: Apple had a great quarter, broke a bunch of records, increased their market share, BEAT THEIR OWN GUIDANCE, BLEW AWAY PROFIT ESTIMATES, and missing analyst earning estimates by less than 2%. Who cares?

Buy. Dollar cost average. In fact, buy Apple on every dip and hold it for several years.

[nagromme]

It seems especially silly to sell without waiting for the benefit of whatever tomorrow brings.

Anyway, AI has a detailed summary list from the conference call:
http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1312

[TMay]

I'm trying hard to think of a previous example (maybe Sony), but, Apple seems to be innovating its way into uncharted territory. We all know that the rate of ipod growth isn't sustainable, and so does Apple, but, speculate all we want, none of us has a clue where Apple will be after the Intel transition, let alone where they will be tomorrow.

What's a bit worrisome to me, is that the competition to this point has been absolutely pathetic, but that won't last forever. Further, the more Apple dominates the media, the more vociferous will the enemies become (i.e., Apple has a stranglehold on the online music market). This is a dangerous time for Apple in that they must not appear to be abusing their fairly gained position.

[Peace]

On the contrary..
Although Apple stock went down that presents for a great time to buy stock.
Tomorrows "announcements" will make stock go way up..

[Superdrive]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple conducted their Q4 2005 Financial Results Conference call at today. Apple had already announced earnings as well as Mac and iPod shipments this quarter.

MacCentral provides a running update of the conference call.

Hilights include:
- Intel Based Macs still expected by June 2006. Some "very cool" PowerPCs in the pipeline.

That must mean temperature wise. Powerbook G5!!!!! j/k

Glad to see the nano doing better than people originally expected. I'm still waiting for my intel book.

[bankshot]

:D Let's hope Apple can survive! ;)

Yes, let's hope. Unfortunately, this turn of events seems to be the final nail in the coffin of a beleaguered company. :(

[bankshot]

Tomorrows "announcements" will make stock go way up..

Doubtful. Almost every major keynote or announcement by Apple in recent years, no matter how awesome the product was, no matter how intense the consumer demand was, was accompanied by a corresponding drop in stock price. I recall Steve Jobs even joked about it at a recent Macworld keynote. Wall Street is extremely fickle, and there's simply no rhyme or reason to it. At least, no rational rhyme or reason. :confused:

Mark my words. Wait until the dust settles after the announcement, then buy. ;)

(I am not a financial advisor, nor do I play one on TV. I've never owned Apple stock, but kick myself daily for not buying when it was $14 before the split.)

[diamond3]

Hopefully someone comes out with a record of everything that was spoken during the conversation. It would be really interesting to go over. I want to go through the part on the intel switch. It seemed weird.

[technocoy]

:rolleyes:

dude (bankshot)... you might need sarcasm disclaimers in there.... i thought you might be serious for a moment...

[musichris777]

Look I don't mean to be blunt but YOU'LL NEVER SEE A G5 POWERBOOK! Take a look at this picture: http://images.apple.com/powermac/images/indextop20050427.jpg Okay now you see the two things in that box that say G5? Yea, those would be the G5 processors-a whole lot bigger than a powerbook! IBM couldn't shrink that down to a laptop form-factor let alone keep it cool enough. Yeah they shrunk it a little bit with the iMac (picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designopenanim20040831.gif ) but look how they have to cool this thing: picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designcoolingb08312004.jpg It's just not practical or even logical to even fantisize about a G5 powerbook.....completely out of the question.

[oldMac]

It's an old wall street adage and seems to hold up pretty well where Apple stock is concerned.

[GroundLoop]

:rolleyes:

dude (bankshot)... you might need sarcasm disclaimers in there.... i thought you might be serious for a moment...

There is no sarcasm there. That is the general rule...Buy on rumor, sell on the news. Bankshot is right on when you look at the historical data.

Hickman

[digitalbiker]

Look I don't mean to be blunt but YOU'LL NEVER SEE A G5 POWERBOOK! Take a look at this picture: http://images.apple.com/powermac/images/indextop20050427.jpg Okay now you see the two things in that box that say G5? Yea, those would be the G5 processors-a whole lot bigger than a powerbook! IBM couldn't shrink that down to a laptop form-factor let alone keep it cool enough. Yeah they shrunk it a little bit with the iMac (picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designopenanim20040831.gif ) but look how they have to cool this thing: picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designcoolingb08312004.jpg It's just not practical or even logical to even fantisize about a G5 powerbook.....completely out of the question.

Do you live under a rock? IBM has already announced the portable low power G5. Of course the G5 PB was impossible with the desktop G5 chip but now there is a portable chip available.

Whether or not Apple uses it is up to them. But there are already some rumors of G5 linux laptops coming soon from other vendors.

[Harry322]

Hello - This is my first post here!

Not sure if this was mentioned or even worth mentioning, but on the conference call, someone asked about the Nanos and how they are prone to scratches. I found the response interesting:

(paraphrased): "The nanos are made from the same material as the 4th Generation iPod was."

Is the past tense mentioning of the 4G iPod anything or am i reading too deeply into it?

(by the way - I am hoping to buy my first powerbook tomorrow! :confused: )

[riversky]

I read that profits exceeded all expectations but that revenue was a little less than expected. This to me says that A LOT of those desktops are the lower margin Mini's or iMacs and that the PowerMac lines sales really suck hard. They would have greater revenue if that was the case. At the local Apple store the sales guy told me that the only thing that sells is the highest end model and that those sales are slow.

[macam]

Look I don't mean to be blunt but YOU'LL NEVER SEE A G5 POWERBOOK! Take a look at this picture: http://images.apple.com/powermac/images/indextop20050427.jpg Okay now you see the two things in that box that say G5? Yea, those would be the G5 processors-a whole lot bigger than a powerbook! IBM couldn't shrink that down to a laptop form-factor let alone keep it cool enough. Yeah they shrunk it a little bit with the iMac (picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designopenanim20040831.gif ) but look how they have to cool this thing: picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designcoolingb08312004.jpg It's just not practical or even logical to even fantisize about a G5 powerbook.....completely out of the question.

Dude, I don't mean to be harsh... but isn't this a rumour site... and therefore a forum where we can put down our reactions to rumours!? Therefore if people want to believe that there could be a small possibility of a Powerbook G5 then let them... I for one am one of those... I have even dreamt about it a couple of times! I just think that it would be an awesome piece of kit! And I would love to own one and would buy one in a flash if they were to come out! And also didn't IBM or Freescale (Whoever I don't know it's late, I'm tired!) release a low power G5 chip capable of delivering upto 1.8Mhz? If so a low power chip of this ilk would be able to sit in a much smaller enclosure and therefore quite a feasible thing for Apple to put it into their Powerbook range considering they have been putting almost 2 years plus into R&D into the powerbook G5. (Think about it before you flame me - they so have!). Also - I think a lot of us realise that there isn't a lot of hope of getting this type of machine due to the fact that we're switching *twitch* over to intel, and it's a little tongue in cheek... but hey... there are dreamers and there are people who think different.

But on a lighter note....







POWERBOOK G5s TOMORROW! BRING IT ON APPLE! :D :D :D

macam

[ajwitte]

Look I don't mean to be blunt but YOU'LL NEVER SEE A G5 POWERBOOK! Take a look at this picture: http://images.apple.com/powermac/images/indextop20050427.jpg Okay now you see the two things in that box that say G5? Yea, those would be the G5 processors-a whole lot bigger than a powerbook! IBM couldn't shrink that down to a laptop form-factor let alone keep it cool enough. Yeah they shrunk it a little bit with the iMac (picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designopenanim20040831.gif ) but look how they have to cool this thing: picture http://images.apple.com/imac/images/designcoolingb08312004.jpg It's just not practical or even logical to even fantisize about a G5 powerbook.....completely out of the question.

Those are not the processors, they're the heat sinks. (Plus a fancy aluminum "G5" placard attached to the visible side.) Obviously there are thermal issues with a G5 laptop, but the physical size of the processor is NOT a problem.

A G5 chip looks like this:
http://www.macobserver.com/images/news/2003/20030603powerpc970/89_thumb.jpg

[madmaxmedia]

Regarding the stock dropping on good news, the general consensus seems to be that the stock dropped due to slightly disappointing iPod unit sales.

I think people are trying to guess the top of the iPod potential market. I think there is much headroom to go.

But regardless, this upcoming holiday quarter is big. With a new nano and a 5G iPod, Apple will be expecting to sell well over 10 million units (based on typical patterns for 3rd to 4th calendar quarter.)

Also, keep in mind that the stock dropping has nothing to do with people perceiving that the company is doing poorly. The stock moves largely on what people believe the stock will do in the future, which is somewhat different than saying the stock moves largely on how people believe the company will do in the future.

[rendezvouscp]

Hello - This is my first post here!

Not sure if this was mentioned or even worth mentioning, but on the conference call, someone asked about the Nanos and how they are prone to scratches. I found the response interesting:

(paraphrased): "The nanos are made from the same material as the 4th Generation iPod was."

Is the past tense mentioning of the 4G iPod anything or am i reading too deeply into it?

(by the way - I am hoping to buy my first powerbook tomorrow! :confused: )

I think that the "was" was on purpose. While some mistakes can just be chalked up to poor English, I do not believe that the response would be phrased so that the production of the 4G iPod was in the past tense. However, I unless they went aluminum (totally throwing the top of the line away from the other two lines) I think that the 5G iPod would be made of the same material.
-Chase

[danielsan26]

So what is the word on the coverage for this event? Is MR going to use that AJAX thing they tried for keynote again? Is there an official IRC? Anyone know of somone on the inside? Right now I'm just expecting MR to be "too busy at the moment" pretty much from 9AM-3PMET.

[egor]

Okay now you see the two things in that box that say G5? Yea, those would be the G5 processors-a whole lot bigger than a powerbook!

You realise those two big blocks are in fact the heatsinks/cooling equipment and no processor looks like that, right?

Regarding the earnings.. what a disappointment, I've got nothing in apple, but this was meant to be the start of a couple of weeks of many major tech stocks releasing their earnings reports.. allowing the blue chips to bounce back.. LLTC for example (which actually manufactures some components found in apple products, iPods in particular). Well, we'll see, maybe AAPL will bounce back tommorow? Hopefully these were just people with short positions cashing in on uncertainty.

What a bizarre time to call the conference though.. after trading. Hopefully come tommorow they'll all start off as well as today but won't slump.

[IJ Reilly]

I'm a long Apple stockholder and I'm not worried in the least. The drop is typical for Apple after earnings announcements, no matter how good the news. Just some profit taking. Expect it to open lower tomorrow and begin its rise on the new announcements. We;ll be back to yesterday's levels by month's end.

I'll take that as a promise. ;)

[balamw]

There is no sarcasm there.
I think technocoy was referring to the "final nail in the coffin of a beleaguered company" comment.

I mean we all know Apple is dying, and has been since 1981. :rolleyes:

B

[IJ Reilly]

What a bizarre time to call the conference though.. after trading. Hopefully come tommorow they'll all start off as well as today but won't slump.

These conference calls are always held after the close of regular trading.

[Frobozz]

Who votes NEGATIVE on this story? Really? My god the best quarter in Apple history and ~10 people are still upset about that? Sheesh.

Anyway, what's more telling ... Apple is predicting 1.1 billion MORE in revenue for next quarter than this quarter. Maybe only 5 people will be upset with those numbers.

I was one of the people who already had an iPod (mini) but bought a Nano the nano-second that they came out. :-)

[bittervictorian]

http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0510oct12d.html

Thinksecret are now reporting iPod video - my head is spinning from their constant revisions!

[madmaxmedia]

You realise those two big blocks are in fact the heatsinks/cooling equipment and no processor looks like that, right?

Regarding the earnings.. what a disappointment, I've got nothing in apple, but this was meant to be the start of a couple of weeks of many major tech stocks releasing their earnings reports.. allowing the blue chips to bounce back.. LLTC for example (which actually manufactures some components found in apple products, iPods in particular). Well, we'll see, maybe AAPL will bounce back tommorow? Hopefully these were just people with short positions cashing in on uncertainty.

What a bizarre time to call the conference though.. after trading. Hopefully come tommorow they'll all start off as well as today but won't slump.

Wait, are you disappointed with the earnings, or with the after market trading? Earnings were great, the only number that disappointed was iPod unit sales (the unit sales were great too, but some were predicting more.)

[berkleeboy210]

http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0510oct12d.html

Thinksecret are now reporting iPod video - my head is spinning from their constant revisions!

Can't wait for tomorrow so this rumor madness can stop. I'm seriously losing sleep over this.

[nagromme]

Anyone else think Apple is playing games to pinpoint who is leaking to ThinkSecret? :D

PS, if TS's sudden reversal is rightm then Macs may NOT be coming tomorrow (but still soon--hang in there).

[plinden]

Yeah well, the consensus estimate was for $3.71B and they only made $3.68B, missing the numbers by 1%, while the iPod sales were only 6.45m missing the low estimate of 6.7m. No wonder the stock tanked, even though Apple beat their own guidance.

It didn't have anything to do with clueless analysts overhyping things before hand, of course. A conspiracy theorist wouldn't be surprised to see institutions buying up stock first thing tomorrow morning.

Yes, that's sarcasm - I shouldn't have to use smileys if I don't want to.

[digitalbiker]

Anyone else think Apple is playing games to pinpoint who is leaking to ThinkSecret? :D

PS, if TS's sudden reversal is rightm then Macs may NOT be coming tomorrow (but still soon--hang in there).

I think you might be on to something. Apple has probably been releasing a variety of false info around to see what appears on which website. This allows them to pinpoint where the info leak is at within the ranks.

Meanwhile Apple releases a new product that has nothing to do with any of the rumors. Apple kills two birds with one stone.

PM & PB updates have been rumored soon for the last 6 months. If nothing appears tomorrow I may just give up and buy the current top 17" PB. My old 15" is starting to fade fast and I am fading with it. :eek:

[pjmurphy77]

Did anyone here the foreign guy ask about the progress of the intel switch. The responce was that they would have them in by summer next year. The foriegn guy then asked if they thought it would be any sooner. The response was extremely wierd, he took a pause before he said anything, then said there would be announces about it. could it be tomorrow possibly? At minute 12:30 in the call, Peter clearly says "We just completed the best year...we remain enthusiastic about out product pipeline and will have some very exciting announcements to share TOMORROW.".. OK, that sounds generic enough to me - the context was not ipod - Announcements (plural)..

[Frobozz]

This sucks. After hours trading is really down. I hope the announcements tomorrow bounce it back a little.

Analysts are bean counters that only buy on over performance. By the numbers, Apple outperformed. However, some analysts were predicting up to 8.5 million iPods this quarter-- a highly unrealistic number that few investors would read in to.

Bottom line-- analysts can be very, very shallow. The miss a lot of important aspects and you see that with this sell off. You should look at this as an opportunity to acquire a few more shares. I think I might.

I made 80%+ about a year and a half ago on Apple stock. My father has made 400%+ since he held for a longer amount of time. Apple stock is hot!

[Frobozz]

Yeah well, the consensus estimate was for $3.71B and they only made $3.68B, missing the numbers by 1%, while the iPod sales were only 6.45m missing the low estimate of 6.7m. No wonder the stock tanked, even though Apple beat their own guidance.

It didn't have anything to do with clueless analysts overhyping things before hand, of course. A conspiracy theorist wouldn't be surprised to see institutions buying up stock first thing tomorrow morning.

Yes, that's sarcasm - I shouldn't have to use smileys if I don't want to.

Yes. It's important to note that analysts and larger investors can sell off small chunks to drive the price down after a conference call. Last time I looked that was 10%. They trade after hours. Then, when everyone sees that Apple beat their own estimates (awesome numbers) all these after hours traders buy back larger chunks before the bell in the morning and make 10% overnight. It's classic.

[Xtremehkr]

Good news all around, but more market share needs to be gained.

I wonder what happened to the advertising campaign that was briefly mentioned a while ago.

[Macmaniac]

I am glad for the profit and all, but tomorrow is gonna be the real day of fireworks! I can't wait to see what Apple unveils next, this could be a huge day!

Stop worrying about the stock, this is a good chance to buy, Apple is gonna release new stuff and the stock will shoot up. So calm down Apple is not tanking!

[nagromme]

PM & PB updates have been rumored soon for the last 6 months. If nothing appears tomorrow I may just give up and buy the current top 17" PB. My old 15" is starting to fade fast and I am fading with it. :eek:

Hang in for another week :) Apple may want to distance some minor (or perceivably disappointing) updates from the "big event."

[Stella]

"Intel Based Macs still expected by June 2006. Some "very cool" PowerPCs in the pipeline."

I would take this statement with a pinch of salt, when it comes to the PPC part.

Apple *always* say this, well, they have to don't they.

And everyone is disappointed when they produce the goods... which isn't so innovative as most people made the statement out to be...

[Talcott]

Apple *always* say this, well, they have to don't they.

And everyone is disappointed when they produce the goods... which isn't so innovative as most people made the statement out to be...


Sure they have to say it.......


I was pretty stoked with the first gen G5's improvements.

[Cfg5]

Has there ever been an event with as much speculation and rumors as this one has gotten?

[ender78]

Has there ever been an event with as much speculation and rumors as this one has gotten?

Um ... just every time Steve opens his mouth. This rumor is nothing on the activity of discussion scale.

[Peer]

At minute 12:30 in the call, Peter clearly says "We just completed the best year...we remain enthusiastic about out product pipeline and will have some very exciting announcements to share TOMORROW.".. OK, that sounds generic enough to me - the context was not ipod - Announcements (plural)..

I just heard it as well.!! Nice!

Regards,
Peter

[AdeFowler]

It didn't have anything to do with clueless analysts overhyping things before hand, of course.
A very good point. And now the "analysts" have analysed something and convinced themselves that the iPod Video is imminent. Whilst I'm convinced that they're correct, if Steve doesn't announce it, I guess traders will likely sell-off what Apple stock they have left.

The timing of today's event is interesting; almost like Apple new that the results would disappoint. I wonder if any of today's announcements were ready at the Nano launch, but held back as post-result sweeteners?

[iMeowbot]

The split is between desktops and portables. Notice the word portable and not laptop? The Mac mini is considered a portable computer by Apple. So there were a lot of iMacs and PowerMacs sold last quarter.

That would make no sense. In the Apple Q3 10Q filing, the Net Sales line item for Portables "Includes iBook and PowerBook product lines" while Desktops "Includes iMac, eMac, Mac mini, PowerMac and Xserve product lines." A change now would be a rather serious discrepancy to explain to investors.

Note: The Mac mini is listed as a portable in the services and support section of the website.
Where does that come from? The mini is placed under "Macs" and not "Portables/Wireless" at http://www.apple.com/support/ -- have they misfiled it elsewhere?

[egor]

Wait, are you disappointed with the earnings, or with the after market trading? Earnings were great, the only number that disappointed was iPod unit sales (the unit sales were great too, but some were predicting more.)

I'm disappointed in the slowdown of increased growth in general and slowdown of growth in the portable music player market.. it doesn't bother me that its a little under analyst's predictions on apple per se, it bothers me that it goes against estimates of renewed growth for the next couple of years in the industry as a whole. Having said that, AMD's financial results (also announced yesterday) have shot right up so I'm much more confident that the next couple of weeks will be pretty good as hoped.

[macFanDave]

It's funny how they said that Apple didn't meet analysts' revenue target. That number is just an aggregate of many analysts' predicitons. The range of guesses varied from $3.4 to $3.9 billion. I'd be interested if that $3.7-something figure was just a simple average of all the guesses or if it were weighted by the past accuracy of the analyst.

On another topic, does anyone else find the choice of words about pending PowerPC-based Macs intriguing? Did they just mean that the new line of PPC Macs are "very cool" in the slang sense of "being attractive" or does it also have a literal meaning indicating that they've addressed "the mother of all thermal challenges?" It's a shame those brain-dead analysts didn't catch that hint and press the Apple people on the issue because they've become so iPod-obsessed.

[cr2sh]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)
Hilights include:

Hilights?

[rdowns]

I'll take that as a promise. ;)


10:47 AM and it's only down $1.72 from yesterday's close. Almost back!! If Jobs announces a video iPod later, it will soar.

[IJ Reilly]

10:47 AM and it's only down $1.72 from yesterday's close. Almost back!! If Jobs announces a video iPod later, it will soar.

Wait for it... :)

[madmaxmedia]

I'm disappointed in the slowdown of increased growth in general and slowdown of growth in the portable music player market.. it doesn't bother me that its a little under analyst's predictions on apple per se, it bothers me that it goes against estimates of renewed growth for the next couple of years in the industry as a whole. Having said that, AMD's financial results (also announced yesterday) have shot right up so I'm much more confident that the next couple of weeks will be pretty good as hoped.

Here's some data:

Unit Sales (thousands)
Qtr Year Qtr Year
iPod iPod Mac Mac

Q1 2001 659
Q2 2001 751
Q3 2001 827
Q4 2001 850 3087
Q1 2002 736 iPod launched
Q2 2002 57 813 G4 iMac, 10G iPod, 14" iBook
Q3 2002 54 808 Ti Powerbook
Q4 2002 381 1044 3401 Jaguar, 2nd gen iPod, iPod for Windows, 17" G4 iMac
Q1 2003 743
Q2 2003 78 711 17" Powerbook
Q3 2003 304 771 iTMS launched, 3rd gen iPod
Q4 2003 939 787 3012
Q1 2004 733 829 Panther, iTunes for Windows, 20" G4 iMac
Q2 2004 807 749 iPod mini
Q3 2004 860 876
Q4 2004 2016 4416 833 3287 4th Gen iPod, Airport Express, G5 iMac
Q1 2005 4580 1046 Mac mini, iPod Shuffle
Q2 2005 5311 1070 Tiger
Q3 2005 6155 1182
Q4 2005 6451 22497 1236 4534 iPod Nano

It's hard to draw any outright conclusions. Year over year growth is fantastic, although 2005 Q3 to Q4 didn't increase much, while 2004 Q3 to Q4 did. Keep in mind that Apple fiscal Q1 is actually the calendar Q4.

A lot depends on this quarter's sales. To continue recent trends we are hoping for 12 million iPods sold. That's an awfully big number...

iPod sales obviously cannot double every year for another 5 years. So let's see where it goes...