More TV Shows on the Way? FrontRow iMac Only.

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

MacCentral posts (http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/10/12/ipodvideoanalysis/index.php) some notes about yesterday's announcements including analyst comments as well as comments from Apple executives.

With regard to there only being 5 TV Shows presently available on iTunes, Apple's Greg Joswiak explains that they only told the one network (ABC).

“You see that we have the top two shows on TV, as well as the top shows on the Disney Channel. We couldn't really start off with a better foot forward. This is just the beginning."

Meanwhile, Apple's David Moody, confirms that "at this time [FrontRow is] only on the iMac as part of the integrated hardware software solution".

[wordmunger]

Interesting. Also, the headline is a bit misleading. At first it sounded like the new TV shows would only be available on the new iMac.

The fact that frontrow is iMac only is rather disturbing, since the Mac mini is probably a better home multimedia device.

[Maestro64]

Well that really sucks you have to buy a new imac G5 to use frontrow. This is so non-apple like.

But this just be the way tests the waters on video on deman and the settop box area. It would be great to store all you content on the computer and then stream to any media center in you home, or you could just watch tv on your computer....

[bketchum]

Meanwhile, Apple's David Moody, confirms that "at this time [FrontRow is] only on the iMac as part of the integrated hardware software solution".


I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.

[Superdrive]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

MacCentral posts (http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/10/12/ipodvideoanalysis/index.php) some notes about yesterday's announcements including analyst comments as well as comments from Apple executives.

With regard to there only being 5 TV Shows presently available on iTunes, Apple's Greg Joswiak explains that they only told the one network (ABC).



Meanwhile, Apple's David Moody, confirms that "at this time [FrontRow is] only on the iMac as part of the integrated hardware software solution".

It's only a matter of time until FrontRow finds itself on the next generation of Macs. I dont necessarily see it coming ever on Powerbooks or other portables, but desktops or future boxes will definitely have it.

I also noticed that they did not say anything about additional shows in the announcement yesterday. Hopefully some good deals are going on as we speak. Curb Your Enthusiasm, other HBO, TLC. It could be the goods. We'll see exactly where this plan is going in the spring time, which is exactly why I won't buy until then.

[Lacero]

Front Row for PCs. Now that should stir things up. :D

[dloomer]

This is picky, but it's spelled "Front Row," not "FrontRow." The latter would be so 1998 :D

[bketchum]

Meanwhile, Apple's David Moody, confirms that "at this time [FrontRow is] only on the iMac as part of the integrated hardware software solution".


For now, including FrontRow just in iMacs is an interesting strategy to perhaps sell more of these machines.

[liketom]

can't see it being long before someone pulls that front row out of the iMac and pops it online -

why o why is it just for the iMac ??

[Superdrive]

Well that really sucks you have to buy a new imac G5 to use frontrow. This is so non-apple like

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.

[liketom]

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.
easy this one

Powerbook - dvi - 42" Plasma running Front Row !
Mac Mini - to Plasma running Front Row

how hard can it be ?

[aviationwiz]

It sucks that Front Row is only for the new iMac, but I was sort of expecting it, judging by the event which I watched last night. Don't worry, someone will make a program like Front Row soon enough.

[MacFan782040]

The fact that frontrow is iMac only is rather disturbing, since the Mac mini is probably a better home multimedia device.

Yeah, I definitly agree. Why and where would you put a $1299 computer with a 17" screen in your living room just to watch pictures and stuff? It definitly would have made a ton more sense to put it on the Mac Mini, where you could hook it up to your (larger than 17/20" screen) TV.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Frontrow is more of an "impress your friends" thing, and not really something people will buy specifically for their living room.

[iAlan]

...what about other countries? Will we get TV content here in Japan? Is Apple negotiating with networks in other TV markets? You won't be able to access TV content from outside your country (as is the case with music) as many shows rely on overseas syndication as a source of produvtion revenue/cost spreading. This really limits the effectiveness of teh video function.

BTW can any Qt file in the appropriate compression and size be played on the new iPod? Yuo could reformat stuff you record or download. couldn't you?

[Le Big Mac]

It sucks that Front Row is only for the new iMac, but I was sort of expecting it, judging by the event which I watched last night. Don't worry, someone will make a program like Front Row soon enough.

That company is Apple. And it will be called Front Row.

I can't imagine that it won't be made available for other Macs in some way or another. The mini is an obvious candidate, but presumably it could be bundled with other machines as well.

Why would Apple make software for only one type of machine? I can understand for a brief period as a marketing tool. But ultimately they'll have to make it available for all machines for it to make sense. That, and an IR receiver to retrofit.

[Mr Maui]

It sucks that Front Row is only for the new iMac, but I was sort of expecting it, judging by the event which I watched last night. Don't worry, someone will make a program like Front Row soon enough.
Saying it is only for the iMac likely means it will not work with older hardware (until someone finds a workaround), but it will likely be available on all future computers to come out of Apple.

[peterjhill]

Has anyone tried to get mythtv working on a mac yet.. www.mythtv.org
the screenshots are pretty nice... I have a tv and I also have a mac mini that I replaced with a 17inch powerbook... I am so tempted to use the mini in my stereo setup...

My wife would appreciate the super easy way frontrow allows playing music or doing slideshows... An automated job to sync the pictures on the mini and the G5 (my other machine) and we would be good to go... Same with music.

[enygma]

<insert obligatory "where's the powermac/powerbook updates" here>

As for front row, update the Mac Mini with Front Row, make it a little bigger so you can fit a 3 1/2" drive in it, load it with 250GB, include a remote, superdrive and all the wireless goodies and add optical audio outputs.

Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.

[wdlove]

I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.

I certainly hope that Front Row will become available to all users. Hopefully it will work on older iMacs and other Mac's also.

[nemesis_256]

It sucks that Front Row is only for the new iMac, but I was sort of expecting it, judging by the event which I watched last night. Don't worry, someone will make a program like Front Row soon enough.
There already was one, and it's called centerstage: http://centerstageproject.com/

[Stella]

Apple, how about getting the shows onto other iTMS locations - the usa isn't the only country in the world.

There have been no statements yet from Apple saying they are working other countries networks in order to get content onto iTMS.

Hello BBC!??

[feffer37]

I've got reports from my brother who purchased 2 music videos through iTunes 6 onto his high-grade video-oriented pc, and got horrible results. Apparantly the video was jerky at the normal 320x240 ipod size resolution though the picture quality was good, but when he tried to enlarge them, they were horribly pixelated & VERY jerky when playing on Quicktime Pro 7 (with all updates downloaded).

Has any other PC user tired to buy and view video content on their PC? I'm a Mac Only guy, so I can't try to verify or solve the problem for him.

But overall, this is going to be so huge. I can see it now: Subway Commuters watching Sportcenter Video Updates downloaded every morning on their iPod via their paid subscription. My god, the possiblities are endlesss. I can't wait for Cartoon Network to get on Board and make the Adult Swim cartoons avaliable for the iPod.

I will upgrade to the new iPod, no question. New iMac....Super Cool, but since my girlfriend's rule is that if I buy another computer I have to get rid of one, I think I'll be waiting and buying the Apple tablet running the Intel super cool chips ;D

[puckhead193]

why o why is it just for the iMac ??
Because if you have a laptop you don't need it. Apple wants the mac mini to be as "cheap" or affordable as it can be. And if you use a PM, more then likely you have it because you need the processing power for advance programs like final cut and photoshop. Your not going to view movies on your PM. It will prob. happen but the imac is the "family computer"

[execproducer]

The ABC thing is simple, disney owns ABC, and Iger wants some of that Pixar "flow" (that Eisner put in jeopardy) back/to be cont.

Front Row is now subject to the laws of business evolution, if it floats, it foats across the board, if it sinks it only sinks in 1 imac rev., no biggie.

Apple is really on the move, it's very exciting.

Just bought a nano... damn...

[Superdrive]

<insert obligatory "where's the powermac/powerbook updates" here>

As for front row, update the Mac Mini with Front Row, make it a little bigger so you can fit a 3 1/2" drive in it, load it with 250GB, include a remote, superdrive and all the wireless goodies and add optical audio outputs.

Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.

Not to be a downer, but do you really think that a Mini can, with the elegance and speed, drive Front Row like the iMac G5 did yesterday? I mean this machine can't even do the droplet effect on dashboard, what makes you think it can do a reasonable job doing more than that?

[Josh396]

<insert obligatory "where's the powermac/powerbook updates" here>

As for front row, update the Mac Mini with Front Row, make it a little bigger so you can fit a 3 1/2" drive in it, load it with 250GB, include a remote, superdrive and all the wireless goodies and add optical audio outputs.

Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.
I agree to an extent. As someone else stated the idea of the Mac mini is to be as cheap as possible so they don't want to add all those devices. Now if they introduced something else that was capable of doing it a then yes I could see that but I don't see it happening for the Mac mini, at least right now (I would love to have something like that though).

[Porchland]

It will be interesting to see how quickly the other networks get on board with Apple, but look at some of the video possibilities you get just from Disney:

1. ESPN's "SportsCenter" video blog.
2. "Commander in Chief," "Boston Legal" and other ABC shows.
3. Recently remastered "Cinderella" or promo features from the DVD.
4. ABC News video blog updates.
5. The Miramax catalog.
6. "All My Children" recaps
7. Catalog episodes of who knows what: Every episode of "General Hospital" from the beginning of time, coverage of post political conventions, etc.

[Maestro64]

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.

Well if the remote is the limiting factor, that should not be the case, I use a keyspan media remote with my laptop to control itunes and DVDs, what couldn't you use that with Front Row....

[w00master]

I've got reports from my brother who purchased 2 music videos through iTunes 6 onto his high-grade video-oriented pc, and got horrible results. Apparantly the video was jerky at the normal 320x240 ipod size resolution though the picture quality was good, but when he tried to enlarge them, they were horribly pixelated & VERY jerky when playing on Quicktime Pro 7 (with all updates downloaded).

Has any other PC user tired to buy and view video content on their PC? I'm a Mac Only guy, so I can't try to verify or solve the problem for him.

But overall, this is going to be so huge. I can see it now: Subway Commuters watching Sportcenter Video Updates downloaded every morning on their iPod via their paid subscription. My god, the possiblities are endlesss. I can't wait for Cartoon Network to get on Board and make the Adult Swim cartoons avaliable for the iPod.

I will upgrade to the new iPod, no question. New iMac....Super Cool, but since my girlfriend's rule is that if I buy another computer I have to get rid of one, I think I'll be waiting and buying the Apple tablet running the Intel super cool chips ;D

Can't say what's causing the jerkiness, because on my Windows machine all the videos and movies run smoothly. Perhaps he needs to update quicktime? As for pixellation running the video @ fullscreen? The reason for this is b/c the movies have been encoded @ 320x240 which you're stretching out to 600x400, 1028x480, etc. You're going to notice this issue on all machines.

w00master

[oliverlubin]

IBut overall, this is going to be so huge. I can see it now: Subway Commuters watching Sportcenter Video Updates downloaded every morning on their iPod via their paid subscription. My god, the possiblities are endlesss. I can't wait for Cartoon Network to get on Board and make the Adult Swim cartoons avaliable for the iPod.

why paid? i realize everything cant be free but for something like sportscenter im not going to pay $2.00 per day to watch it during my commute. i probably wouldnt pay more than $20/month for unlimited # of subscriptions.

the thing with TV shows like lost or desperate housewives is that they have a "re-watch" value. things like sportscenter are stupid to watch the next day. it's watching yesterday's news. same could go for any daily TV show. it'll be interesting to see which is the first daily TV show to offer free next day or post airing iPod download -- for FREE and NOT through the iTMS. THAT will be cool.

[Mr Maui]

6. "All My Children" recaps
7. Catalog episodes of who knows what: Every episode of "General Hospital" from the beginning of time, coverage of post political conventions, etc.
What's really scary ... These two (and other soap opera related content) will probably sell like wildfire. :D

[snowmoon]

<insert obligatory "where's the powermac/powerbook updates" here>
Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.

Um... apple knows about this segment, but the mini will never be able to do that.

1) 720p - Mac mini is TOO SLOW with a pathetic video card and it's ability tops out at 480p for h.264, 1080i is totally useless with this device.

2) Audio - With the lack of a optical or digital audio out this unit is crippled.

I would have snagged a mini months ago as it would be a killer DVD replacement, but not with those limitations when I have a DLP projector ( 8" wide screen ). I'm not investing into a product that's already been obsoleted.

I don't believe apple will remedy the situation until they have higher margins on the mini... they have no reason to canabalise much higher margin iMac sales.

[jdechko]

I hope that they work out a deal with Fox (24 & simpsons), NBC (scrubs), cartoon network, and comedy central real soon.

[Superdrive]

Well if the remote is the limiting factor, that should not be the case, I use a keyspan media remote with my laptop to control itunes and DVDs, what couldn't you use that with Front Row....

I'm not sure if you and I are together on the page. If your remote works already (I learned something new), what do you need Front Row for? Put in the disc, or open the playlist, push play and sit down. What I'm thinking is that the iMac series will see Front Row because it is a computer that acts as a hub in the house rather than an office computer.

[enygma]

Not to be a downer, but do you really think that a Mini can, with the elegance and speed, drive Front Row like the iMac G5 did yesterday? I mean this machine can't even do the droplet effect on dashboard, what makes you think it can do a reasonable job doing more than that?
Update the GPU. The damn thing is running a Radeon 9200 with 32MB video memory.
I agree to an extent. As someone else stated the idea of the Mac mini is to be as cheap as possible so they don't want to add all those devices.
True, mind you, most of the features I mentioned can be added to the cost of the Mini today, but regarding the hard drive, 3 1/2" drives are generally much cheaper for higher capacities. I can pick up an 80GB Seagate notebook drive for roughly the same price as a 250GB Seagate desktop drive. The only thing they would need to add as an option if possible was the optical capabilities.

[Mac_Freak]

I would just get Elgato EyeTV and record all the shows you want and then recompress/resize them with QT Pro

[aegisdesign]

I can't imagine the restriction to running Front Row only on new iMacs sticking for long. It's presumably because the remote is infrared and only the new iMac has a receiver which I'd guess is actually the iSight camera picking up IR itself. Notice that Jobs demoed the camera's ability to detect infrared 'heat' as an effect in Photo Booth.

I'd also guess that the current iSight doesn't work and we'll see an update with added Front Row ability then.

[dongmin]

Front Row will obviously make its way throughout the entire line. I think this is a major app for Apple. BUT, they need to sell computers and make money in the holiday season. So they're putting the new tech in their newest computer. As a result, the iMac should do really well.

You'll see Apple including Front Row with future Macs as they become redesigned. The Mini will get it, I'm sure, but not until it is overhauled with Intel chips. Same with the PowerBook. I imagine the PowerBook will have expanded capabilities, like running Keynote via the remote.

Also note that you need a IR receiver to make this work, since Front Row is activiated by the remote (complete hardware-software solution, getit?). I belive the new iMac is the only Mac with IR built in. The big question is why Apple decided to go with IR instead of BT, especially since BT2 is becoming standard across their line.

[Super Dave]

I can't imagine the restriction to running Front Row only on new iMacs sticking for long. It's presumably because the remote is infrared and only the new iMac has a receiver which I'd guess is actually the iSight camera picking up IR itself. Notice that Jobs demoed the camera's ability to detect infrared 'heat' as an effect in Photo Booth.

I'd also guess that the current iSight doesn't work and we'll see an update with added Front Row ability then.

This is standard with all Apple innovations. Use them as an upsell reasong for anywhere from 3+ months and then include them standard or as options on other models. The MightyMouse was an upsell when it came out for.... about 3 months I think, though I didn't really count. Colour on the full sized iPod was an upsell for almost a year. I imagine either an iSight (if that is really the IR sensor) or a smaller IR only sensor being released for other Macs later. I know i can't wait to hook one up to my PowerBook at home and watch things on the 17" monitor on my desk.

David :cool:

[fabsgwu]

When the Mac Mini gets the intel update, maybe it'll be able to tackle the media center duties, doubtful now tho..

[zigziggityzoo]

BTW can any Qt file in the appropriate compression and size be played on the new iPod? Yuo could reformat stuff you record or download. couldn't you?


In QT: File:Export:To iPod (320x240)

[nagromme]

Of course Front Row is iMac-only--for now. Only the iMac has the IR receiver for the remote.

But I won't be surprised to see more Macs gain that (old!) feature back, or a USB receiver for that matter. (Or better yet, just go Bluetooth.)

Nor would I be surprised to see Front Row (and maybe Photo Booth) sold as part of iLife '06.

[peterli]

It will be interesting to see how quickly the other networks get on board with Apple, but look at some of the video possibilities you get just from Disney:

1. ESPN's "SportsCenter" video blog.
2. "Commander in Chief," "Boston Legal" and other ABC shows.
3. Recently remastered "Cinderella" or promo features from the DVD.
4. ABC News video blog updates.
5. The Miramax catalog.
6. "All My Children" recaps
7. Catalog episodes of who knows what: Every episode of "General Hospital" from the beginning of time, coverage of post political conventions, etc.
8. Bugs Bunny
9. Tom and Jerry
10. other classics WB cartoon shorts

[paulypants]

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.


Okay, I use my PowerMac and ACD to watch DVDs and listen to iTunes in bed all the time. As of right now I have to use my BT keyboard as a remote control, which is a little clumsy. Front Row and that Remote is just what I was looking for, but Apple decided to not let me use it, hopefully only temporarily

[Ibrin]

Yeah, I definitly agree. Why and where would you put a $1299 computer with a 17" screen in your living room just to watch pictures and stuff? It definitly would have made a ton more sense to put it on the Mac Mini, where you could hook it up to your (larger than 17/20" screen) TV.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Frontrow is more of an "impress your friends" thing, and not really something people will buy specifically for their living room.

I really don't think Apple is positioning this for the Living Room. Check out the Front Row web page (http://www.apple.com/imac/frontrow.html). The eye-catching quote is "Do the math. iMac G5 + remote control + DVD = the most popular dorm room" It's been ten years since I was in college, but I never knew anyone with a big TV. A 20" widescreen TV would have been pretty sweet. The fact that it's in a G5 iMac is all the better...

Apple isn't targeting this at your (or your parent's living room), they are targeting it at the high school and college kids. Photo Booth is certainly targeted to them as well.

[joshuacw]

Forget the fact that Front Row is only on the iMac right now. It's a first step. I think what were seeing is possibly a peek at Apple's version of TIVO. Either when they add it to the mini, and/or create a totally separate box, and/or release a video enabled AirPort Express, this will be how you're able to share the videos, pics, music, etc. on your Mac via your television (just like you can now use your stereo via AE to listen to the music on your Mac).

I agree with Jobs that the TV and PC will never merge into one device, but they definitely will interact (and I think this is Apple's first major step in that direction). Anyway, just my opinion. But that was my first thought while watching the event online, "I want this on my TV!"

[dashiel]

the television content is way overpriced... i mean i was excited as the next person when i read TV in the macrumors update, i don't have television service nor do i want it. there are shows i'd like to watch though, the daily show, arrested development, simpsons and one or two more. let's just say 5 shows total, well at 22 episodes per season that's $18 a month, cheaper than cable, but when you consider that you're getting about half the resolution of television it doesn't sound like such a good deal.

come at it from another direction - lost season 1 on itunes (can they really keep calling it itunes?) is $34.99, i can get the dvd box set with superior resolution, and oodles of extras for $38.99 ($59.99 msrp). i know it's two different markets, but effectively this is cream for the movie studios. the production is already done, advertising has already paid, they just spend encode the video as H.264.

i understand that they really couldn't come in with a price lower than the music because of the perceived differential in value between video and audio so they were sort of stuck.

i'll still probably use the service for shows that don't come out on DVD (the daily show) instead of bittorrent, for the same reason i use itunes now, it's more convenient. for shows that do come out on DVD though, forget it. i hope that apple would offer some sort of season pass for $20, they (apple and the studio) get money upfront, you get a discount. it wouldn't work for new shows, those would almost have to be given away free for the first season. either that or allow some sort of rebate for direct purchase of the dvd. e.g. i can buy episodes of arrested development as they come out, if i buy all 22 from a season i then have the option to order the DVD set from apple for $10.

oh and i agree with the others, front row will appear on normal macs next year, possibly as an addition to ilife, or as a complimentary package. ilife, iwork, frontrow. the mac mini will probably be the first new intel mac released and if the new imac is any indication, it will include optical audio out and a powerful enough processor to decode HD, and i will buy one the second it appears.

[Sport73]

I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.


You hit the nail on the head.

iLife '06 introduced in January with Front Row included.

Almost a guarantee since it's really just an extension of iLife anyway.

[arkmannj]

I hope FrontRow does become part of iLife/iWork
I think it would be good, even for PB's and iBooks.
especially if it could tie in well with Key-Note, DVD Player
etc... this would be great for personal, and professional use IMHO

[itsa]

Who cares about the little remote? I just want the program! Why not just make it so you can use a presenter remote? I use my notebook and my Desktop to watch movies and listen to itunes all the time and have been for years. This just does not seem like something Apple would do. They are know for their supporting "older" mac's and more so know for making things everyone one wants and can to use.

[Mr Maui]

snip ...

... i know it's two different markets, but effectively this is cream for the movie studios. the production is already done, advertising has already paid, they just spend encode the video as H.264.
Bingo! Does anyone believe this isn't about making money? For Apple, for the studios, etc.? Actors will want royalties and residuals as well. It's all about the money. You betcha! :)

[jct101]

I think apple did a good thing. Front Row is cool for dorm rooms and good for a lot of people who mirror out. It's screen based instead of remote based so it's more like M$MC than Salling Clicker. Apple is giving us two options at least with their hardware and software. Use Front Row and the Apple controller, or w/ a palm, symbian phone, etc use Salling Clicker 3.0 and pop a few dollars on it. Personally, I like seeing the artwork when I'm away from my computer and controlling the playlists without having to look at a screen for music. I'd use Front Row as well, but it's basically added value done well and w/o stepping on anyones toes.

That said, Quicktime Pro conversion to the iPod video format is not fast. It's also a large file. It seems like the chipsets decode in 4:3 and cropped 16:9 w/o letterboxing at a lower resolution w/ h264 and can decode a higher res mpeg-4 (screen, size, and quality taken into account here). I think you'd get better encoding speeds w/ ffmpeg and the x264 codec than w/ Quicktime Pro. Besides, we don't have an Apple branded break-out box yet so what are you going to do..transcode from dv formac or eye-tv fixed resolution mpeg-4, 2, or 1 to the right size? I see peripheral opportunities in the very near future.

Speaking of formats. People are arguing about a per connection charge to the ipod universal connector for peripheral manufacturers and at the same time saying we need a universal connector across portable products (think the palm connector being identical to the ipod one and all other products) but NOT just firewire or USB. What about format? What's the point in being able to encode your own video for an ipod when it only plays on that device and in iTunes? Oh, people will only buy iPods. Sure that's great, but there is competition in this field so why not look to a few common sizes and settings so encodes work on every device (that way nobody can whimper about not liking itunes) AND there will be quicker transition and adoption because everyone doesn't have to re-encode their collection for the ipod.

Of course we'll get more tv shows. I bet Apple sold a ton of episodes on day one just to the people who wanted to see what it was like and that looks good on paper, plus we'll get the future episodes so Apple can analyze the trend AND the music video market picks up so the thieving studios got thrown a bone. They are in the press..In the REALLY important tech section....right below the Sharks Home win at HP Pavillion...so they have the medias attention..now get my sports online.

[Lynxpro]

Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.


Uhm, no. The G4 isn't powerful enough to encode/decode 1080i video live, from all the reports I've read. If Apple had slapped a G5 or a PentiumM into the machine, then that would be a big 10-4 for your post.

[mulletman13]

I was just thinking... if Front Row was given out with new Macs (or sold... I have a Rev. B imac >_<), people could simply use wireless multi button mice.

I have a Logitech MX1000, and it has all 6 buttons the apple remote has on it, and would work perfectly, with a great range :-D

[bketchum]

Not to be a downer, but do you really think that a Mini can, with the elegance and speed, drive Front Row like the iMac G5 did yesterday? I mean this machine can't even do the droplet effect on dashboard, what makes you think it can do a reasonable job doing more than that?

Update the GPU. The damn thing is running a Radeon 9200 with 32MB video memory.

I agree to an extent. As someone else stated the idea of the Mac mini is to be as cheap as possible so they don't want to add all those devices.

True, mind you, most of the features I mentioned can be added to the cost of the Mini today, but regarding the hard drive, 3 1/2" drives are generally much cheaper for higher capacities. I can pick up an 80GB Seagate notebook drive for roughly the same price as a 250GB Seagate desktop drive. The only thing they would need to add as an option if possible was the optical capabilities.

Apple seems to be doing a good job increasing performance and adding features while lowering prices at the same time, so doing all this in a Mac mini might not be too far fetched.

[Lynxpro]

Apple, how about getting the shows onto other iTMS locations - the usa isn't the only country in the world.
There have been no statements yet from Apple saying they are working other countries networks in order to get content onto iTMS.
Hello BBC!??


The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.

[Lynxpro]

It will be interesting to see how quickly the other networks get on board with Apple, but look at some of the video possibilities you get just from Disney:
2. "Commander in Chief," "Boston Legal" and other ABC shows.


Not if those shows aren't produced by ABC. There's a reason why "Night Stalker" (for example) was one of the shows available. Its an ABC Production. Not every show that airs on ABC is an ABC Production.

For example, look at the shows on the F/X Network. "Nip/Tuck" is a Warner Bros. Production. "Rescue Me" is owned by Sony. "The Shield" is Fox. So if Apple signed up Fox/the F/X Network, they'd have "The Shield" but not "Nip/Tuck".

[bketchum]

...The big question is why Apple decided to go with IR instead of BT, especially since BT2 is becoming standard across their line.

I was just thinking that a wifi remote would be cool. I'd like to be able to access my office computer in the living room. Take it further... How 'bout a wifi keyboard and mouse sitting on the coffee table in the living room to access the upstairs office computer.

[enygma]

Uhm, no. The G4 isn't powerful enough to encode/decode 1080i video live, from all the reports I've read. If Apple had slapped a G5 or a PentiumM into the machine, then that would be a big 10-4 for your post.
June my friend... June. :D

Either that or the next revision of the Mac Mini may include ATIs AVIVO platform (http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2536) which includes hardware transcoding of H.264.

[splintah]

and those shows seem to be us only

so people from other countries will have to wait for the dubbed episodes
which lets them only one choice if the cant wait for the next episode or if some show doesnt air over the national channels:

torrent

which in my opinion sucks big time since its illegal

so pleas apple let those shows be downloaded worldwide
p2p networks are worldwide aswell



*if that problem was already covered in a post: sorry i am in a hurry and cant read 70 posts right now*)

[ErikGrim]

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.Of course Front Row is iMac-only--for now. Only the iMac has the IR receiver for the remote.I just don't follow. It's lame that the new software that required a peice of hardware that your computer doesn't have? Then I guess it's lame that my Mac won't be able to record BluRay DVDs when the first new models come out that can.
The apple remote is not the only remote controller for the mac :rolleyes:

I've been using IR remotes since 98 with a PowerMac 6100 and later Salling Clicker from 2001 with SE T68i, T610 and K700. As long as Front Row is AppleScriptable (which it should), any remote will be able to control it.

[Peel]

Meanwhile, Apple's David Moody, confirms that "at this time [FrontRow is] only on the iMac as part of the integrated hardware software solution".

Originally Posted by Steamboatwillie
That sucks rotten friggin' eggs. Lame lame lame. :mad:
I just don't follow. It's lame that the new software that required a peice of hardware that your computer doesn't have? Then I guess it's lame that my Mac won't be able to record BluRay DVDs when the first new models come out that can.

[Stella]

I wouldn't call the bbc stupid, they are fact, very innovative.

They are trial-ing their own download system... something few other networks have ventured into ( bar iTMS ). They were also quick to get into Digital TV etc.

BBC content may still come, but as I said before it may not go down very well in the UK because the population has already paid a license fee ( which is very good value, I say again ) and they shouldn't have to pay for content again...

BBC could offer iTMS downloads to other countries via iTMS.


The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.

[hyperpasta]

Front Row is obviously coming to other computers, but its a computer feature, not an add-on program. As for shows, I'm sure we'll see more as early as next week.

[hyperpasta]

what about Photo Booth? Do we need an imac for that too?

For now, yes. But I expect it to come with the iSight soon.

[balamw]

Front Row is obviously coming to other computers, but its a computer feature, not an add-on program. As for shows, I'm sure we'll see more as early as next week.
I'm wondering if, in part, this is what has been holding up the formal announcement of the Mac mini (late 2005)? Maybe the true Mac mini (late 2005) has IR capability and Front Row included.

If so I'm buying one for the living room.

B

[SiliconAddict]

Unless they get Stargate: SG1, Battlestar Galactica, and possibly CSI I really couldn't care less.

And even then the only reason I would be interested in downloading is to play catchup on a missed episode...lets see....$1.99 for a one time viewing

or

free off of bittorrent (Which will be deleted once I'm done watching it.), that also doesn't have DRM, and is a higher quality so it wouldn't look like crap on 1920x1200.

That's a tough one.

I will take this as I see it. Apple dipping a toe into the video dist waters. For now their initial offering is pretty much crap IMHO.

-No media center to allow those of us with HDTV to watch their content. Instead we are apparently intend to view "stuff" from a distance on a 20" iMac.

-Video iPods that do video output but who's content is so low res that even on a normal TV its going to look like crap.

-Only one video codec supported.



Again Apple dipped their toe into the water. But they screamed like a little girl and ran back into the house.

PS- Wonder if FrontRow would run on a Mac Mini which if it really did get an upgraded GPU could be a sweet HTPC system. Hmm. Anyone know if that remote is IR based?

iMac specs says Built-in 54 Mbps AirPort Extreme Wi-Fi (802.11g)3; built-in Bluetooth 2.0+EDR (Enhanced Data Rate) module.

So this might be a BT device and if so might work with the Mini hmm....

[Signal Man]

The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.
Yes they are stupid they still use real player and are still doing a podcast trial wake up BBC. I just upgraded to itunes 6 and cant log on to the music store.

I'm waiting for Steve to introduce BACK ROW it's going to be a hell of a lot more interesting than front row .

[hyperpasta]

I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.

You need an IR receiver and 128MB of VRAM for it to work. (could use less VRAM but wouldn't be as slick).

[~Shard~]

Apple, how about getting the shows onto other iTMS locations - the usa isn't the only country in the world.

There have been no statements yet from Apple saying they are working other countries networks in order to get content onto iTMS.

Hello BBC!??


Good point, I hadn't thought of that. Having BBC content would be great!

Some countries would still like iTMS to begin with as well... ;)

[digitalbiker]

Not if those shows aren't produced by ABC. There's a reason why "Night Stalker" (for example) was one of the shows available. Its an ABC Production. Not every show that airs on ABC is an ABC Production.

For example, look at the shows on the F/X Network. "Nip/Tuck" is a Warner Bros. Production. "Rescue Me" is owned by Sony. "The Shield" is Fox. So if Apple signed up Fox/the F/X Network, they'd have "The Shield" but not "Nip/Tuck".

It is actually even more complicated than that. Ownership of the show is one thing. Exclusive broadcast rights are another.

Right now you must request waivers from your local television station not the content owner in order to view out-of-market television content that competes with your local market exclusive broadcast rights.

The way DVD sales and most likely Apple internet broadcasts get around this exclusivity contract is by providing old, already, broadcast content. I don't know what the exclusivity period is for the local stations, but I imagine that it may vary in different areas.

If the local networks were to lose the exclusive broadcast rights for their market then it will substantially reduce what they can get for comercials. Internet, cable, and satelite are all considered content providers and are coverd under the same FCC broadcast rules for the various market areas.

If Apple were for example to provide "Desperate Housewives episode 44" before episode 44 aired on your local television station then Apple would get their pants sued off of them by every network affilliate in the country.

[~Shard~]

The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.

I'm lucky, here in Canada the CBC picked up all the new Doctor Who episodes. :cool: But yes, this would be cool! The BBC could even offer old episodes of Doctor Who as well - I'd say I would download them, but I already have a copy of every single episode (less the missing ones) since 1963! :eek: :cool:

Oh, and the BBC is an awesome network - definitely not stupid. Take that back! :mad: :p ;)

[Le Big Mac]

I just don't follow. It's lame that the new software that required a peice of hardware that your computer doesn't have? Then I guess it's lame that my Mac won't be able to record BluRay DVDs when the first new models come out that can.

It would be lame if Apple prevented you from using an external BluRay burner on your mac, though, and wouldn't sell you the new version of iDVD needed to burn to it.

[hyperpasta]

I'm wondering if, in part, this is what has been holding up the formal announcement of the Mac mini (late 2005)? Maybe the true Mac mini (late 2005) has IR capability and Front Row included.

If so I'm buying one for the living room.

B

January at MWSF06 - Meet the new Mac mini. Intel Merom, Front Row, Core Image, Wireless on every model, $699 model has 128MB VRAM, $599 model has SuperDrive.

Meet the new iBook. Intel Merom, 64MB VRAM on $999 model, SuperDrives across the board, 128MB VRAM and widescreen of $1299 model. Front Row.

Joining the Front Row Powerbooks and Power Macs shipping later in October.

All of a sudden, all new Macs have picked up Front Row, and the low end has picked up Intel. So it's only fittting that a new Airport is introduced that automatically streams whatever is on your Computer's screen to your TV, so you can enjoy Front Row from your TV. The Airport has its own IR receiver for use with the Apple remote.

Also, FOX has now signed on to the iTMS Video program.

iLife 06 debuts. All prgrams get the iTunes Dark Platinum look so they look good in Leopard when Finder and Safari go Platinum.

iWork 06 debuts with Numbers, Pages 2, and Keynote 3.

Something else suprising happens! (It always does)

[Lynxpro]

I wouldn't call the bbc stupid, they are fact, very innovative.


They aren't business savvy. And thus I stand by my statement that the BBC is stupid. Or in British English speak, the BBC ARE stupid.

Is Doctor Who being televised in America? Nope. They asked for $1 million plus per episode from SciFi, even though its not shot on HD. Stupid. At one point in the negotiation, they wanted SciFi to televise the classic series as well and made that a requirement. Stupid. Then they (the BBC) could not even get Christopher Eccleston to agree to a longterm contract (even though Paul McGann had signed for 5 years had the 1996 Telefilm been a success in the States) and Eccleston walked out after Series1 was complete. When word of Eccleston leaving hit the industry, SciFi and others lost complete interest in the series because they weren't interested in a musical chairs act and especially with essentially the unproven David Tennant - completely unknown in the U.S. - taking over the role.

Oh, did I mention how BBC WorldWide has priced the classic series (1963-1989) so high that all but two PBS stations can't afford to televise it? How the classic series is even too expensive for the BBC America channel to televise? That would indicate stupidity. BBC WorldWide also won't allow BBC America to televise the new series either.

Then, BBC WorldWide won't let Warner Home Video release the new Doctor Who series on DVD here in America (err, all of Region1 -meaning Canada can't get R1 DVDs either until the show airs in the U.S.) because they think if it is released then no cable channel will buy a contract to televise it. So the North American DVD release is being held up until a pie-in-the-sky-offer is made and gets it aired. Warner Home Video considers anybody importing the Region2 DVDs into America as a "parallel import" pirate and isn't happy with the BBC's cavalier attitude over it since it robs Warners of money. Oh yeah, and new Doctor Who is being released on Sony PSP UMD format too, but not in the States/Canada/R1.

I think I've made my case about how stupid the BBC is. Or ARE if you prefer.

I stand by my previous statements.

Oh...and I should mention that the BBC plans on releasing Series1 of Doctor Who for R1 DVD in LATE 2006 if no American cable company bites down and contracts with the BBC on their terms to televise the show in the States. Late 2006 will make a DVD release moot since Blu-Ray will be the rage at that point, thanks to the Sony Playstation3 being the to-die-for Christmas 2006 gift. Again, stupidity in action.

[stealthboy]

Has anyone tried to get mythtv working on a mac yet.. www.mythtv.org
the screenshots are pretty nice... I have a tv and I also have a mac mini that I replaced with a 17inch powerbook... I am so tempted to use the mini in my stereo setup...



I use myth on my macs all the time. Only the front-end works, so you have to be connected to a Linux mythbackend server

[bketchum]

Apple, how about getting the shows onto other iTMS locations - the usa isn't the only country in the world. There have been no statements yet from Apple saying they are working other countries networks in order to get content onto iTMS. Hello BBC!??
The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.

Too funny! The new Doctor Who show is good. It's getting good reviews in Canada. It's on CBC up here. I'd definitely buy the episodes I've missed. I want HBO on board, as I've missed all the Rome episodes, which I hear are amazing.

[digitalbiker]

January at MWSF06 - Meet the new Mac mini. Intel Merom, Front Row, Core Image, Wireless on every model, $699 model has 128MB VRAM, $599 model has SuperDrive.

Meet the new iBook. Intel Merom, 64MB VRAM on $999 model, SuperDrives across the board, 128MB VRAM and widescreen of $1299 model. Front Row.

Sounds good except Intel roadmap has Merom scheduled to debut 2nd half 2006 and since they are already having problems achieving dual core Yonah on schedule, I doubt that you will see merom in computers intil early 2007.

[Stella]

I hardly think its the BBCs fault that you can't log on to iTMS after upgrading to iTunes 6...

When it comes to Real, BBC also offer Microsoft Media. They have partnered up with Real for Live content for international users, and its expensive to change. This is why BBC still use Real.

I would love BBC using QuickTime, I'd buy a subscription today for its content. Unfortunately I don't think its going to happen. There is more of a market for Windows Media / Real.

Yes they are stupid they still use real player and are still doing a podcast trial wake up BBC. I just upgraded to itunes 6 and cant log on to the music store.

I'm waiting for Steve to introduce BACK ROW it's going to be a hell of a lot more interesting than front row .

[KREX725]

I also noticed that they did not say anything about additional shows in the announcement yesterday. Hopefully some good deals are going on as we speak. Curb Your Enthusiasm, other HBO, TLC. It could be the goods. We'll see exactly where this plan is going in the spring time, which is exactly why I won't buy until then.

I would love to see HBO and Showtime get on this. Sometimes it takes so long for their shows to make it to DVD. It would be nice to have an alternate way of seeing Sopranos without having to subscribe to HBO or wait a year for the season to be released on DVD.

[Play Ultimate]

Forget the fact that Front Row is only on the iMac right now. It's a first step. I think what were seeing is possibly a peek at Apple's version of TIVO. Either when they add it to the mini, and/or create a totally separate box, and/or release a video enabled AirPort Express, this will be how you're able to share the videos, pics, music, etc. on your Mac via your television (just like you can now use your stereo via AE to listen to the music on your Mac).

I agree with Jobs that the TV and PC will never merge into one device, but they definitely will interact (and I think this is Apple's first major step in that direction). Anyway, just my opinion. But that was my first thought while watching the event online, "I want this on my TV!"

I fully agree. The iMac is perfect for now, considering it has a built in monitor to view the downloaded media. An Airport Video Express (AVE) would be the next logical step to transmit material to your T.V. Now the cool thing would be to have Front Row communicate with an AVE

Re: the Mac Mini...to soon. Need to have internet access and hard wire to the T.V. Maybe eventually the Mini will work. A more elegant solution with be a wireless connection.

[urbanlung]

Front row is the software end of a remote control interface so it would be completely pointless on a mac without such control. Of course it could be sold as a hardware software combination in the future but Itrhink all this bitching at this stage is a bit stupid or ill thought out.

[dashiel]

-No media center to allow those of us with HDTV to watch their content. Instead we are apparently intend to view "stuff" from a distance on a 20" iMac.

sure you can, just hook up the imac to your HDTV via the included s-video or composite video port.


-Only one video codec supported.


not true, quicktime supports loads of codecs. open up imovie and export something, you've got sorenson, mpeg4, h.264.

[dashiel]

They aren't business savvy. And thus I stand by my statement that the BBC is stupid. Or in British English speak, the BBC ARE stupid.

the bbc doesn't have to be business savvy, they're a publicly funded organization. they exist as a public service to the people of britain. i for one am glad they're not the money grubbing scum like cnn and fox news. they don't have to cater to the lowest common denominator for ratings, or throw dozens of ads on their website just to stay in business.

though by the conjectures you make in the rest of your post they obviously seem savvy enough. the price might be high, but obviously people are paying it. just because their business logic doesn't get you what you want doesn't mean they're stupid.

[Ord]

I just don't follow. It's lame that the new software that required a peice of hardware that your computer doesn't have? Then I guess it's lame that my Mac won't be able to record BluRay DVDs when the first new models come out that can.

I think the thing you don't follow is that while BluRay would be a NEW piece of hardware, an IR remote is old and not a very useful computer technology, hence the reason it was NEVER included previously on a Mac. This device should be BT or Radio.

[iMeowbot]

Apple, how about getting the shows onto other iTMS locations - the usa isn't the only country in the world.
You would need to take that complaint to Disney, its their call where availability happens.

They are the only studio who were given all the details of the service before the launch, but others will follow. Apple have already stated that others are on the way.

[csubear]

...So this might be a BT device and if so might work with the Mini hmm....

I was at the apple store last night, and I asked about the remote. I was told that the remote worked on BT.

[giveup]

If we think about Apple is hardware company, that we can understand why frontRow iMac only is to push iMac to sell. I dont think Apple couldnt make it runs other Macs. And it is very Apple like.
I hope this stupidity will end soon, as current customer like Mini owner will be pissed quite seriously.

[notjustjay]

I was at the apple store last night, and I asked about the remote. I was told that the remote worked on BT.

Sure looks like IR to me, with the smoked plastic panel at the front to cover the emitter...

[BGil]

2008 will bring us "First Seating" for Windows Vista :rolleyes:

I don't get it. Media Center offered all this stuff plus TV recording in 2002.

[Skraemer123]

its IR from the remote description on the apple store

"Compatible with Apple products introduced in 2005 or later that have a built-in Infrared (IR) receiver."

[giveup]

the bbc doesn't have to be business savvy, they're a publicly funded organization. they exist as a public service to the people of britain. i for one am glad they're not the money grubbing scum like cnn and fox news. they don't have to cater to the lowest common denominator for ratings, or throw dozens of ads on their website just to stay in business.

though by the conjectures you make in the rest of your post they obviously seem savvy enough. the price might be high, but obviously people are paying it. just because their business logic doesn't get you what you want doesn't mean they're stupid.

I think paying £126 color TV license for watching TV is one of stupid thing i have ever met in that Country.

[hayesk]

I think paying £126 color TV license for watching TV is one of stupid thing i have ever met in that Country.

That's actually not a bad idea. It ensures we don't all get the same lowest common denominator crap that major commercial networks produce.

[HD Max]

Right so Front Row is only on the iMac AT THE MOMENT. But what about the future? WWDC 2005 as well as Intel PowerBooks and iMacs I want an Intel iTheatre which will basically be the same size as a standard DVD player, it'll be HD with DVI and HDMI outputs supporting upt o 1080p, It'll have an InstantOn feature whifch lets you get to Front Row without fully starting the system, and it'll be about the same as Front Row is now but with two satellite tuners compatible with UK Sky and TV features incliding an EPG and recording features using the second satellite tuner... It'll be £799 - £ 1299 sort of price range and I'll order mine on the day it's released.

[hyperpasta]

Sounds good except Intel roadmap has Merom scheduled to debut 2nd half 2006 and since they are already having problems achieving dual core Yonah on schedule, I doubt that you will see merom in computers intil early 2007.

Whoops my bad. I meant Yonah. Though I hadn't thought about dealys.

[Mr Maui]

I would love to see HBO and Showtime get on this. Sometimes it takes so long for their shows to make it to DVD. It would be nice to have an alternate way of seeing Sopranos without having to subscribe to HBO or wait a year for the season to be released on DVD.
I'd have a hard time watching "Rome" on an iPod. ;)

[kcmac]

iWork 06 debuts with Numbers,(1) Pages 2, and Keynote 3.

And it will be marketed as
iWork, Easy as 1,2,3! :D

[Misplaced Mage]

its IR from the remote description on the apple store


"Compatible with Apple products introduced in 2005 or later that have a built-in Infrared (IR) receiver."...which, in the case of the iMac, is probably the camera. Most CCD and CMOS imagers are actually rather sensitive to infrared, and digital cameras frequently (but not always) have an IR filter or coating somewhere in the optical stack to block it. By using the camera as an IR receiver, Apple further reduces the cost of the remote. Bluetooth is getting cheaper, but IR's been around for a long time now and the hardware's really cheap by comparison.

Try pointing and clicking your TV remote at a cell phone camera while the viewfinder's running sometime. I once couldn't figure out why the side of my PC laptop (at work) was flashing in the viewfinder. Turns out I had IrDA turned on, and I was seeing the IR LEDs polling for other devices.

[Lynxpro]

the bbc doesn't have to be business savvy, they're a publicly funded organization. they exist as a public service to the people of britain. i for one am glad they're not the money grubbing scum like cnn and fox news. they don't have to cater to the lowest common denominator for ratings, or throw dozens of ads on their website just to stay in business.

BBC WorldWide is separate from the public BBC. BBC WorldWide (BBCWW) has the goal of selling BBC product outside of the U.K. And since that's the goal, they are greedy just like all other corporations. The only difference is BBCWW is probably more incompetent than the average corporation, as shown in the evidence I provided in my post.


though by the conjectures you make in the rest of your post they obviously seem savvy enough. the price might be high, but obviously people are paying it. just because their business logic doesn't get you what you want doesn't mean they're stupid.


Savvy? You mean anti-savvy. Through their actions, one of their flagship products - Doctor Who - is not aired in the States, the largest commercial market for television product. All through the 80s, the BBC received a lot of money from PBS stations airing classic Doctor Who. But the BBC got too greedy and started pricing the show like it was on par with Star Trek and other expensive American programming despite the fact that WHO was a low-budget production in comparison. The BBC's actions bankrupted its own American distributor - Lionheart Television - and the BBC had to step in and buy it up to save face. When the BBC could not get the Doctor Who Fan Club of America to rubberstamp support for their own cheesy tour, the BBC decided to launch their own official fanclub which ultimately split the fanbase here in the States in the pre-internet days. They subsequently priced Doctor Who so high that PBS stations across the U.S. dropped the program because they could not afford it anymore. It had been the most popular non-American PBS program and then it disappeared due to the BBC's stupidity and bilking.

So following that up, the BBC could have galvanized their former fanbase by budgeting the classic Doctor Who series so PBS stations could again air it (instead of "Are You Being Served" televised for the bazillionth time) and the BBC could get free advertising for the new series and get some cable channels interested in the new series. But they didn't do that. So WHO gets almost 0 airing instead. That's not business savvy. That's stupidity.

Need more proof?

[digitalbiker]

I would love to see HBO and Showtime get on this. Sometimes it takes so long for their shows to make it to DVD. It would be nice to have an alternate way of seeing Sopranos without having to subscribe to HBO or wait a year for the season to be released on DVD.

It depends on HBO's contract deals with it's cable and satelite providers.

HBO owns the content but they have no way to deliver the content without striking a deal with the local cable and satelite companies.

In most cases these broadcasters have exclusive rights to this content in their area for some period of time. HBO may not be able to sell the content to another provider until that time period is up. So there will always be a delay but maybe not necessarily a year. Also HBO is in a better position to offer content to multiple providers in the same area because they most likely aren't bogged down by the legacy contracts like the network television stations are.

[lcde]

Sure looks like IR to me, with the smoked plastic panel at the front to cover the emitter...

(just speculation.)
Easier to show which way is up on an all white remote. Typically you have to aim, this gives you that option.

[Superdrive]

For those bent on the remote not being Bluetooth, I'm pretty sure you would be required to pair your remote before using it. That takes away from the ease of use. With it like this, you can take your remote from home, pop in a DVD at the school, and rock it with Front Row right away. No pairing, no worries.

[duklaprague]

<insert obligatory "where's the powermac/powerbook updates" here>

As for front row, update the Mac Mini with Front Row, make it a little bigger so you can fit a 3 1/2" drive in it, load it with 250GB, include a remote, superdrive and all the wireless goodies and add optical audio outputs.

Hook that bastard up to your 720p/1080i capable HDTV and 5.1+ channel receiver and now you have the ultimate HTPC (Or HTMac, however you look at it). If these specs are met, I would be inclined to buy one as soon as humanly possible.

this is basically it in a nutshell, and something of the ultimate set up.

(until the next thing looms on the horizon obviously)

Iain

[davey-nb]

The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.
Well it's been, what, 24hrs since Apple added TV shows to iTunes?
I'd give the Beeb and others another day or two to jump on board before branding them stupid... ;)

[Mr Maui]

For those bent on the remote not being Bluetooth, I'm pretty sure you would be required to pair your remote before using it. That takes away from the ease of use. With it like this, you can take your remote from home, pop in a DVD at the school, and rock it with Front Row right away. No pairing, no worries.
Pairing is only required one time ... then it would be easy after that.

[csubear]

(just speculation.)
Easier to show which way is up on an all white remote. Typically you have to aim, this gives you that option.

Well i guess the people at the apple store where wrong, if you go to apple.com and look up the remote it now says:



Compatible with Apple products introduced in 2005 or later that have a built-in Infrared (IR) receiver.



So not only will this not work with existing machine, but it won't work with the powerbooks that actually shipped with IR....

One can only hope you can hook up the new ipod dock to your computer and use the remote that way.....

[Counterfit]

I would just get Elgato EyeTV and record all the shows you want and then recompress/resize them with QT Pro
You don't even need QT Pro to encode for the iPod now.
And I think I'll stick with Salling Clicker + BT phone for my remote needs.

[bdkennedy1]

His answer isn't good business sense at all. What difference does it make if I have an iMac, PowerMac or PowerBook sitting in my living room? People that want an all-in-one solution will buy an iMac. Everyone else that has extra machines around can benefit from this. Put Front Row in a box for $99, which I'm sure is 5x what it costs to integrate it with an iMac, and let us have our fun dammit.

[duklaprague]

Um... apple knows about this segment, but the mini will never be able to do that.

1) 720p - Mac mini is TOO SLOW with a pathetic video card and it's ability tops out at 480p for h.264, 1080i is totally useless with this device.

2) Audio - With the lack of a optical or digital audio out this unit is crippled.

I would have snagged a mini months ago as it would be a killer DVD replacement, but not with those limitations when I have a DLP projector ( 8" wide screen ). I'm not investing into a product that's already been obsoleted.

I don't believe apple will remedy the situation until they have higher margins on the mini... they have no reason to canabalise much higher margin iMac sales.

surely if not a mac mini, but some apple branded product/box that sits by the tv as a media server allowing us to view all this stuff on our tvs in our lounges, rather than as students in our dorms?

Iain

[JamSoft]

Topic already created regarding this: < http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=154470&highlight=petition >

-----------------------------------------------
To Apple Consumers:
Apple released many new and innovative products today, including a piece of software called "Front Row." Unfortunately this software is only available on the newly released iMacs. As a loyal Apple consumer I feel that Apple should release this software/feature as a standalone product.

Apple listens to their customers, so I urge those who feel the same way to cast their vote. Please follow the link below to read and sign the petition.

Apple 'Front Row' Petition
< http://new.PetitionOnline.com/frontrow/petition.html >

Sincerely,
Nathan Sharp

[maya]

I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.

iLife 2006 with included remote control. ;) :)


Actually is using the same formula they used with the iPod that they are now using on the iMac G5. Simple. :)

Apple puts out a new generation iPod with one or more features that will not be included in the previous generation iPod, thus creating more profit and envy for the new feature set. They can surely upgrade the previous generation iMac or iPod for that matter, however due to business sense they will not. ;) :)

[AidenShaw]

This just does not seem like something Apple would do. They are know for their supporting "older" mac's and more so know for making things everyone one wants and can to use.
Like the class-action suit regarding OS X support for graphics in the original iMacs?

http://www.macworld.com/news/2002/01/31/g3osx/
http://www.lowendmac.com/musings/01/1224.html

[duklaprague]

the bbc doesn't have to be business savvy, they're a publicly funded organization. they exist as a public service to the people of britain. i for one am glad they're not the money grubbing scum like cnn and fox news. they don't have to cater to the lowest common denominator for ratings, or throw dozens of ads on their website just to stay in business.

though by the conjectures you make in the rest of your post they obviously seem savvy enough. the price might be high, but obviously people are paying it. just because their business logic doesn't get you what you want doesn't mean they're stupid.

indeed, and Front Row has only just been announced after all.

we have Telewest cable here in the UK, and now have true video on demand through the set top box - most of the content is BBC stuff.

plus, the BBC have already made a selection of full programmes available to view as straming media from their website, and are currently trialling their iMP application which will enable people to download programmes to watch at their leisure for one week after inital broadcast.

so the BBC are actually pretty on the ball with this stuff - their head of media has commented positively today on Fromt Row, and its now within the realms of possibility that BBC programming could be made available through their commercial wing which produces videos and DVDs etc, which in turn subsidised the licence fee we pay here in the UK.

Iain

[duklaprague]

anyway - i've just downloaded coldplay's video for fix you and its a bit pixellated at full screen on a 15" powerbook - which at £1.89 (@$3.30) is a bit dissapointing.

What's the idea here - to be able to download videos specifically to view on the new iPods, or be able to watch on our macs? If its the latter, then how can they expect people to pay these prices for such low quality video?

I could see myself buying quite a few videos if they were better quality, and I could make my own compilation DVDs with them - but am I correct in thinkking the DRM does not permit DVD burning?

Whoever's behind this - most likely the record companies - have dropped the ball surely - if I can't do what I'd have considered a pretty good thing thing to do with these videos, then I ain't gonna buy them.

Iain

[MongoTheGeek]

I see FrontRow requiring the remote to work and with the iMac the only comp with the remote it makes sense that its only available on the iMac. What I wonder though is where is the ir port on the iMac. I don't see one. Could it be that it reads it with the built in iSight?

[swingerofbirch]

Apple Revolutionizes Television With 5 Re-runs in Low Definition

Cupertino, CA

Oct 12, 2005

Today Apple turned the world of television on its head with the iTunes Music Store as it did with the music industry and the iTunes Music Store a scant few years ago.

Customers will find something that fits every taste with a selection so large, that a user with their computer's resolution at the lowest setting, might actually have to scroll to see all five shows listed at the store! In addition Apple has extended its award-winning search tool to help users wade through the diverse programming available.

For example, when a user searches for Desperate Housewives, Desperate Housewives comes up along with a selection of four other shows the user might like based on their search.


Because of the wide away of programming, Apple is also introducing a Just For You Show Picker. After answering a couple of questions, Apple will help you pick the right TV show.

For example:

Do you consider yourself a desperate housewife?
If so, check out Desperate Housewives!

Did you like Gilligan's Island?
If so, check out Lost!

Are you a night owl?
If so, check out Night Stalker!

Are you a child under the age of 13?
Ask for mommy's credit card and download the Cosby girl's show.

Are you an Apple enthusiast?
Pay for that other Disney show no one has heard of.

All of the shows are featured in brilliant Low Definition, and play on the new iPods. Low Definition feauters new Apple technologies such as Artifacts, Pixelation, and Interlacing. Bonjour to the future!

Now you can catch up on your five favorite re-runs as you drive to work!

In addition, in the ramp up to the holiday season, Apple will be providing Al Roker's weather reports three days after they air. Al can be seen reporting the weather in his easy to understand fashion of barbecuing and kissing babies.

Apple ignited the personal computer revolution in the 1970s with the Apple II and reinvented the personal computer in the 1980s with the Macintosh. Today, Apple continues to lead the industry in innovation with its award-winning desktop and notebook computers, OS X operating system, and iLife and professional applications. Apple is also spearheading the digital music revolution with its iPod portable music players and iTunes online music store (now with five TV shows!).

[lcde]

surely if not a mac mini, but some apple branded product/box that sits by the tv as a media server allowing us to view all this stuff on our tvs in our lounges, rather than as students in our dorms?

Iain


isn't that what a video airport would do?

[dashiel]

Need more proof?

yes, i do. fair point about bbc world wide, but to your other points, it seems entirely focused on doctor who. what about the office, faulty towers, the prisoner, hitchikers guide, black adder, hell they've even got coronation street, not to mention loads of doctor who DVDs. i understand being frustrated over not having a show you want to watch being available, but clearly the BBC offers a considerable amount of the library on DVD and broadcast to america. i'm just curious what else makes them so stupid?

[~Shard~]

yes, i do. fair point about bbc world wide, but to your other points, it seems entirely focused on doctor who. what about the office, faulty towers, the prisoner, hitchikers guide, black adder, hell they've even got coronation street, not to mention loads of doctor who DVDs. i understand being frustrated over not having a show you want to watch being available, but clearly the BBC offers a considerable amount of the library on DVD and broadcast to america. i'm just curious what else makes them so stupid?

Very good point and excellent shows to use as examples! I love Fawlty Towers, Black Adder, The Office, and I could go on and on. Doctor Who is only one of the great shows BBC has to offer! And yes, much of it is on DVD, so it's not like it isn't available.

[feffer37]

Ah ha ha ha ha..... too funny!
Dude, don't get married, it'll just get worse. BTW.... whipped. ;)

Well, I wouldn't say whipped. I've got 4 Macs in the house, ( three iMac's & 1 Powerbook), Plus 1 Dell Desktop for Business Research. Not to mention her POS Dell laptop :D

Oh, and I may be whipped, but at least she wears kinky leather when doing so :eek: :D

[ryanyogan]

No one has even braught this up,but I would assume between the GPU, the outdated G4, 4200 RPM HD, and low bus speed the Mac mini most likely can not handle Front Row. I don't know if anyone noticed when front row is activated how it slides out the desktop and it slides in, so everything on the desktop is still running in the background, etc.... Apple is a big fan of there effects, if something wont work right they don't want people to see it all choppy. Also they really like the remote, without the remote its useless, they would have to make a USB IR device for the mini, that would also have to stick up weird because the USB port on mini is in the rear. I am just going to assume once they update the mini, they will add some kind of IR up front...

[MacFan782040]

I really don't think Apple is positioning this for the Living Room. Check out the Front Row web page (http://www.apple.com/imac/frontrow.html). The eye-catching quote is "Do the math. iMac G5 + remote control + DVD = the most popular dorm room" It's been ten years since I was in college, but I never knew anyone with a big TV. A 20" widescreen TV would have been pretty sweet. The fact that it's in a G5 iMac is all the better...

Apple isn't targeting this at your (or your parent's living room), they are targeting it at the high school and college kids. Photo Booth is certainly targeted to them as well.

I guess, but I'm in college and a lot of people haver pretty big TV's already. I just have a 13" in my dorm, but my iMac G5 is set up at my desk, and it would be awkward to watch movies from it cause of the position of my bed and chairs...ect.

Just the fact they said "sofa" made me think living room.

[dlyons]

It would be a simple fix for Apple to allow all other Macs to use Front Row. All Apple would need to do is sell an upgrade kit which would provide an IRDA input which would be connected to a USB jack and include the Front Row software and remote (it could also add the IRDA receiver to new keyboards to keep that USB port free). The specs for the new iMac are not markedly different from the last generation iMac. The only difference is (other than the included iSight and slightly upgraded video card) is the IRDA reader on the box. I don't suspect that it's too processor or video card intensive to allow all other Macs to be similarly upgraded. Indeed, it would be another valuable revenue source for Apple to draw from. I suspect that it's only a matter of time before this happens anyway. Once Apple reaps the expected initial bump in iMac sales due to this feature, I suspect it will release the upgrade kit in a box similar to the iSight. Recognizing that I may be a novice here and am just guessing, does this make any sense to anyone?

[seelab]

Where are the TV Shows for other countries than US ??? Common Apple ...

[neutrino23]

...what about other countries? Will we get TV content here in Japan? Is Apple negotiating with networks in other TV markets? You won't be able to access TV content from outside your country (as is the case with music) as many shows rely on overseas syndication as a source of produvtion revenue/cost spreading. This really limits the effectiveness of teh video function.

BTW can any Qt file in the appropriate compression and size be played on the new iPod? Yuo could reformat stuff you record or download. couldn't you?

The technology for doing this has been around for a while, just look at all the Torrent activity. The huge problem has and will continue to be licensing.

As long as you have a credit card in the country where the product is sold you can buy it. We live in the US but still have a credit card from a bank in Japan from when we lived there. We are able to use that to purchase music in the US from iTMS Japan. A new industry could develop providing false identities in various countries so you could legally buy content from around the world.

[fed-ex]

Where are the TV Shows for other countries than US ??? Common Apple ...

I think you mean "come on apple". Duh.

[duklaprague]

isn't that what a video airport would do?

Something like that, I don't know or care how its done :D

But basically something like the Front Row app running on a TV.

This is where the whole media center pc / iMac with front row thing looks the business, until you realise that its actually no use at all if your pc/mac isn't actually in the lounge with the sofa and the tv.

It may be do-able if you know what you're doing, but it would be great to have something as intuitive and out of the box as Front Row.

Iain

[PharmD]

I could see FrontRow eventually being in iLife O6 to help sell the latest version of that suite.
That's what I was going to say. Good thing I read earlier posts. :D MWSF, look for this to happen. Also, that's why they made iTunes version 6, so it will match with iLife 06.

[Lynxpro]

That you're a nerd? Nope, you've covered it pretty well. :rolleyes:


That's rich coming from someone else posting on MacRumors. People in glass houses...

[Lynxpro]

so the BBC are actually pretty on the ball with this stuff - their head of media has commented positively today on Fromt Row, and its now within the realms of possibility that BBC programming could be made available through their commercial wing which produces videos and DVDs etc, which in turn subsidised the licence fee we pay here in the UK.Iain



If the BBC were on the ball, they would have offered content on the day of launch just like ABC. But they weren't on the ball. You'd think they would be considering they hosted the U.K. launch presentation, but again, that's asking for too much from the Beeb.

[abhishake]

I'm worried about Dell making computers with OS X....

[nomad01]

If the BBC were on the ball, they would have offered content on the day of launch just like ABC. But they weren't on the ball. You'd think they would be considering they hosted the U.K. launch presentation, but again, that's asking for too much from the Beeb.

Anyone have a take on whether certification would be required for online video content in the UK?

I know TV is pretty free and easy and I don't think it HAS TO have BBFC certification but most video/dvd you buy in the UK has to be passed by the BBFC.

[Lynxpro]

yes, i do. fair point about bbc world wide, but to your other points, it seems entirely focused on doctor who. what about the office, faulty towers, the prisoner, hitchikers guide, black adder, hell they've even got coronation street, not to mention loads of doctor who DVDs. i understand being frustrated over not having a show you want to watch being available, but clearly the BBC offers a considerable amount of the library on DVD and broadcast to america. i'm just curious what else makes them so stupid?


And is/are the BBC currently making episodes of The Office, Black Adder, Faulty Towers, or Hitchhiker's? No, they aren't. However, they are making new episodes of...get this....Doctor Who! It was the smash hit of this year. And unlike all the other shows you mentioned, it has not been televised in the States, nor is it available on R1 DVD, for all the reasons I cited. It would be the perfect show to market via iTunes in the States. It would get the word out and make the show an underground sensation, which would lead it to being picked up on a cable channel like SciFi. Genre sells. Desperate Housewives, Lost, and Night Stalker are all genre. Hence my harping over the lack of Doctor Who due to the BBC's ineptitude.

You also cited The Prisoner and Coronation Street. Those aren't BBC properties. Nor is Benny Hill. Nor is The Tomorrow People. Just because the show is made in Britain does not mean that the BBC owns it, or originally televised it.


ps. I guess you missed the whole irony of the BBC hosting the UK presentation for Apple, yet did not announce any of their own content available for purchase through iTunes. Not only is that ironic, but also idiotic.

[Lynxpro]

Anyone have a take on whether certification would be required for online video content in the UK?


Since you were citing my original post, my rant had to do with the lack of the BBC content through the iTunes U.S. Store. The lost opportunity at being *first* and getting a lot of free press over it.

[BGil]

Topic already created regarding this: < http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=154470&highlight=petition >

-----------------------------------------------
To Apple Consumers:
Apple released many new and innovative products today, including a piece of software called "Front Row." Unfortunately this software is only available on the newly released iMacs. As a loyal Apple consumer I feel that Apple should release this software/feature as a standalone product.

Apple listens to their customers, so I urge those who feel the same way to cast their vote. Please follow the link below to read and sign the petition.

Apple 'Front Row' Petition
< http://new.PetitionOnline.com/frontrow/petition.html >

Sincerely,
Nathan Sharp


So what's innovative about Front Row? The fact that they're charging for low res shows and music videos that you can get for free in other places.

[dernhelm]

Well this one does not exactly have Microsoft shaking in their boots...

The big news here is what was not released. No TV tuner - Apple doesn't want to be a TV, but they realize that there is a lot of cool video content on people's computer. No Apple owned content (ala MSN) - thank heavens. No high-resolution widescreen - this is not targetted to replace a TV/DVD player.

So what is this for? If Apple does not want to be a TV, and Apple does not want to replace your DVD player, then what does Apple want to do with this, and why does it have a remote control?

The idea is a simple one. People have, store, and create a lot of content on their Macs. Apple is making one simple way of accessing that content (still on the mac) without navigating a bunch of different applications. You know the stuff is there, so just go get it in a simple and straightforward way.

This is actually pretty cool, and is something my wife has been asking for on my powerbook. I get the "can you show that sldeshow of the kids at the beach for me again" request, and I have to fire up iPhoto, locate it, run it, its all more of a process than she would like. This silly little remote concept is perfect for that, point it at your computer, and "finished" content can be found easily and quickly. Apple's remote is quite simply a context specific mouse replacement. And from a human interface perspective, a really, really good one.

I'm sure most people will view this as a "failed media center", because of lack of high-res video content, and no TV-tuner capability. But the only video content I ever download to my mac is low-res stuff anyway. If I want high-res I've got a 46" dlp tv set. So for me, this is a welcome step forward from a human interface standpoint, and it is something I wish they'd offer for my pb.

[illegalprelude]

do you guys think this will be a software released later on? I know apple is saying this is Software and hardware but I dont get why this cannot be intergrated to other lineups. I feel and I know the PowerMac is suppose to be a pro machine but for the 1st year I got mine, I used it for everything except pro things. Just chatted, pics and music and movies and the G5 always gets a shaft in terms of new stuff like that I feel

[memos]

Joining the Front Row Powerbooks and Power Macs shipping later in October.


if what you're saying is really true, (and if you mean October '05) i will find you and give you a HUGE JUICY KISS!!! :D

(or buy you a huge juicy macchiato at your nearest Starbucks :) )

[MacSlut]

I have a 2.6GHz P4 and Lost played just fine on my 20" Dell LCD. It looked better than I was expecting given the resolution.

As far as cost and quality, I think some people are missing the point. The point is about being able to watch missed shows. If you've been watching Lost all season, and you miss an episode somewhere, the $2 is going to be totally trivial. There are many people who have some show that they would pay a heck of a lot more than that to catch if they missed. And sure the quality could be a whole lot better, but again, this is for *catching* a lost episode so you can watch the rest of the season. And of course in time, the quality will improve as will the download times.

Front Row is not going to be included in iLife. It's a hardware and software solution.

Infrared was chosing for Front Row because that's what most learning remotes use. If they went with BlueTooth, most people who use universal remotes would be pissed.

I'm sure Front Row will be largely desired by users and will be rolled out across the line with new products, and perhaps as an add-on for older products. I would easily by a dedicated Mac for Front Row.

[Takeo]

easy this one

Powerbook - dvi - 42" Plasma running Front Row !
Mac Mini - to Plasma running Front Row

how hard can it be ?

Or for that matter, ANY Mac -> DVI -> 42" Plasma.

Why would anyone want to use Front Row on an iMac... aside from the "dorm room" scenario. It's no different than using Front Row on ANY computer. If I had a new iMac, I'd be hooking it up to my widescreen HDTV. I've done this with my Rev A G5 iMac to run iTunes (with a wireless mouse and/or Keyspan remote)... but the VGA out with the TV adapter looks like crap unless you're in 640x480... even though my TV is capable of much higher resolutions... so I end up not seeing very much of the iTunes interface. Front Row would be a great solution for that setup. It really BEGS to be use with a TV. That's where it would make sense. It doesn't make sense with a computer since you're almost always going to be sitting 2 feet away from it anyway. And the new iMac really should have a DVI or HDMI output for viewing Front Row on a HDTV.

[CHess]

I was just thinking... if Front Row was given out with new Macs (or sold... I have a Rev. B imac >_<), people could simply use wireless multi button mice.

I have a Logitech MX1000, and it has all 6 buttons the apple remote has on it, and would work perfectly, with a great range :-D


I can just see how this will play out in many a household:

"Honey, I need to send this e-mail out right away, have you seen the mouse?"
"Isn't it on the coffee table?"
"No, I've looked everywhere! Who was watching the iMac last???"
"I thought you were... Did you look inside the couch?"

:)

[Takeo]

I'm not sure if you and I are together on the page. If your remote works already (I learned something new), what do you need Front Row for? Put in the disc, or open the playlist, push play and sit down. What I'm thinking is that the iMac series will see Front Row because it is a computer that acts as a hub in the house rather than an office computer.

I have a KeySpan remote. I would LOVE to have Front Row because it would allow me to surf my iTunes library abd playlists from across the living room... when I'm not computing... when I'm just listening to music. That's why. With the standard iTunes interface, you need to be in front of the computer to see and use the interface... in which case... what's the point of having a remote? I'd also have the iMac hooked up to my HDTV... which has a much bigger screen than my 20" Rev a iMac.

[mac_hine82]

I think that FrontRow is a good thing. BUT now everyone is going to have to make there computer desk the focal point of there room. I mean who is going to pull a chair up to a entertainment center and start using the computer for everything else. Even if you used bluetooth keyboard and mouse from the couch there is no way it would be a good experience.

[nagromme]

The BBC is too stupid. They hosted the U.K. presentation, yet they did not sign up with Apple to market their shows. It would be a no-brainer to sell new *Doctor Who* through the iTunes Store here in the States - since no cable channel signed up to televise it - but did they? Nope! Why? Because they are stupid.
Don't give up on Dr. Who yet... Apple didn't tell ANY companies EXCEPT ABC/Disney what they were doing. There was no offer or refusal, no stupidity, just secrecy. The BBC just wasn't in on the plan.

Now the cat's out of the bag and Apple's talking to the rest. That may include the BBC :)



So what's innovative about Front Row? The fact that they're charging for low res shows and music videos that you can get for free in other places.
Front Row isn't where you download/buy content. You're confusing it with iTunes.

Front Row is a large-size (for sitting far away), super-simplified/super-easy interface for playback. That's all. Simplicity isn't the most incredible innovation, but what's wrong with that? Few companies seem able to manage it, yet it's a huge benefit to users.

[Takeo]

sure you can, just hook up the imac to your HDTV via the included s-video or composite video port.

The iMac only has VGA output. You have to buy an adapter... but the output is crappy. The iMacs should have DVI.

[Takeo]

For those bent on the remote not being Bluetooth, I'm pretty sure you would be required to pair your remote before using it. That takes away from the ease of use. With it like this, you can take your remote from home, pop in a DVD at the school, and rock it with Front Row right away. No pairing, no worries.

They went with 1980's technolgy because it's cheaper... not better... and also because you are meant to view Front Row on the iMac screen... so you would always have line of sight. If it was meant to be run on an external big screen HDTV... perhaps even in a different room than the computer, the remote would have to be Bluetooth or RF. RF by the way does not require pairing.

The scenario you describe sounds like a fringe case to me.

[hyperpasta]

His answer isn't good business sense at all. What difference does it make if I have an iMac, PowerMac or PowerBook sitting in my living room? People that want an all-in-one solution will buy an iMac. Everyone else that has extra machines around can benefit from this. Put Front Row in a box for $99, which I'm sure is 5x what it costs to integrate it with an iMac, and let us have our fun dammit.

The thing is, the system requirments are high. It has a LOT of eye candy, even if it is understated. So you need Core Image. Also try watching a large H.264 flick on a Rev. A iMac. Doesn't work. From now on, you can bet you'll see Front Row bundled with all macs that can support it. I wouldn't be surprised if it came on the Powerbooks and PowerMacs later in the month. (For Power Mac, force bundling of a new iSight with built-in IR receiver?)

[Lynxpro]

Don't give up on Dr. Who yet... Apple didn't tell ANY companies EXCEPT ABC/Disney what they were doing. There was no offer or refusal, no stupidity, just secrecy. The BBC just wasn't in on the plan.


You actually believe that? The BBC hosted the U.K. presentation. It was the BBC itself that let it slip about the video iPod. They certainly knew about online distribution of video.

What's funny is that the Motorola ROKR can do video but it certainly won't do the iTunes TV episodes. Bet'cha Motorola is cheesed off even more so now.

[Takeo]

I'm sure most people will view this as a "failed media center", because of lack of high-res video content, and no TV-tuner capability. But the only video content I ever download to my mac is low-res stuff anyway. If I want high-res I've got a 46" dlp tv set. So for me, this is a welcome step forward from a human interface standpoint, and it is something I wish they'd offer for my pb.

Great post. However, I just want Front Row on my TV for surfing my iTunes... since my TV and Stereo are in the same room of course. I don't care about turning my Mac into a DVR. I just want an interface for my iTunes on my TV. I've hooked up my Mac to the TV and used the iTunes interface... but the iTunes interface is not suited to a TV.

[lucas]

And if you use a PM, more then likely you have it because you need the processing power for advance programs like final cut and photoshop. Your not going to view movies on your PM.
That's the most retarded fanboy comment I've read yet. who the **** are you to tell someone they arent going to watch movies on their pc? so what if they use final cut and photoshop on it; you expect them to buy another ******** PC to watch movies cause its not its primary purpose? your stupidness astounds me

[m-dogg]

It depends on HBO's contract deals with it's cable and satelite providers.

HBO owns the content but they have no way to deliver the content without striking a deal with the local cable and satelite companies.

In most cases these broadcasters have exclusive rights to this content in their area for some period of time. HBO may not be able to sell the content to another provider until that time period is up. So there will always be a delay but maybe not necessarily a year. Also HBO is in a better position to offer content to multiple providers in the same area because they most likely aren't bogged down by the legacy contracts like the network television stations are.

I don't think it would be in HBO's interest to allow this. Wouldn't they make more money off people subscribing to cable to see these shows than they'd make allowing people to download them from iTMS?

With that said, I would love it if they did!

[lcde]

Apple has trademarked “Vingle” at the U.S. Patents and Trademarks Office. The trademark has been filed on October the 7th and includes a logo.

Here is an extract of the trademark’s description:

“Telecommunication services, namely, electronic transmission of streamed and downloadable audio and video files via computer and other communications networks; providing on-line chat rooms, bulletin boards and community forums for the transmission of messages among computer users concerning entertainment, music, concerts, videos, radio, television, film, news, sports, games and cultural events; web casting services; delivery of messages by electronic transmission; provision of connectivity services and access to electronic communications networks, for transmission or reception of audio, video or multimedia content.”


Ran into this today

http://tess2.uspto.gov/ImageAgent/ImageAgentProxy?getImage=78728980

[iQuit]

Steve was clowing on the Windows Media Controller when half the buttons are numbers, so you can change the channel, that is because you can watch TV on it and use it as a DVR. You can also plug in a game console and do a whole bunch more. The fact that the iMac controller has less is nice, but in reality it doesn't do as much. Which is misleading, because he acts like it is 6 buttons but can do as much as all the 40 buttons on a WMC controller can. I like the new iMac though, I am buying one.

[dejo]

The iMac only has VGA output. You have to buy an adapter... but the output is crappy. The iMacs should have DVI.

Except DVI is dying. It should be HDMI.

[areyouwishing]

Front Row is mainly to help push iMac sales for Christmas. As soon as that hump is over Front Row will be included into iLife 06 at Macworld. That is not rocket science.

For the meantime, I'm going to sell my Rev 1 mini and probably upgrade my G4 tower. I wish apple would just stop dorking around with the Power Macs and release something moderately affordable like the single 1.8 was.

[rdowns]

I can just see how this will play out in many a household:

"Honey, I need to send this e-mail out right away, have you seen the mouse?"
"Isn't it on the coffee table?"
"No, I've looked everywhere! Who was watching the iMac last???"
"I thought you were... Did you look inside the couch?"

:)

Excellent point. Too bad Apple missed this. A way to find the remote via a sound through your KB/mouse would be ideal.

[duklaprague]

If the BBC were on the ball, they would have offered content on the day of launch just like ABC. But they weren't on the ball. You'd think they would be considering they hosted the U.K. launch presentation, but again, that's asking for too much from the Beeb.

well it depends on whether or not they had been approached.

Apple being a US company may have sought to get US broadcasters on board initially.

But I'd say the BBC were more on the ball generally than any other broadcaster in the UK at least when it comes to interactive tv content delivered via set top boxes, and now over the internet.

Iain

[duklaprague]

due to the BBC's ineptitude.


I don't get why its down to BBC's ineptitude tho' - do you presume that they were approached for content, but couldn't or wouldn't come up with the goods?

A US computer company launches a new, initially US centric, application offering TV shows - an initial total of just five shows. And the fact that there are is no BBC content is down to the BBC?

Iain :confused:

[rdowns]

Are you all done yet?

Apple released a new product, it won't work with your older one. Get over it. Maybe they'll offer a stand alone package later.

It's the content, dummy. That is the significant part of all this.

I want to download super HD 18000 x 16000 resolution content. This crap sucks.

Relax, it's a start. You don't get the kitchen sink until the rest of the kitchen upgrade is done. Patience please. This is the start of a whole new ball game, provided the new iMac and video downloads are a success. I think they will be.

Please return to your insanity.

[duklaprague]

You actually believe that? The BBC hosted the U.K. presentation. It was the BBC itself that let it slip about the video iPod. They certainly knew about online distribution of video.

Surely it takes a lot longer to organise the provision of content for a set up like this than it does to arrange a presentation.

At what point would they necessaily know about this online distribution of video? After all, they have content available right now.

Also - are you in the UK or the US? Because presumably the BBC will never sell content online, because here in the UK we'll soon be able to download stuff for free from the BBC directly as part of our licence fee.

Or if you're in the US talking about US content, then that would most likely be dealt with through the BBCs commercial arm, which is a (virtually) totally separate entity.

Iain

[Peace]

The ONLY reason ABC jumped on board is because Disney owns ABC.Iger just took Disney over and is a friend of Jobs by way of Pixar.

[dejo]

The ONLY reason ABC jumped on board is because Disney owns ABC.Iger just took Disney over and is a friend of Jobs by way of Pixar.

Disney and Pixar are not really friends right now.

[EricNau]

Originally Posted by dejo
Disney and Pixar are not really friends right now.
More like enemies. Now they are compeditors, just like Microsoft & Apple. (kinda)

[EricNau]

When I go to iTunes, and try to preview a TV episode, nothing happends. Anyone else experience this?

[ddrueckhammer]

I have a KeySpan remote. I would LOVE to have Front Row because it would allow me to surf my iTunes library abd playlists from across the living room... when I'm not computing... when I'm just listening to music. That's why. With the standard iTunes interface, you need to be in front of the computer to see and use the interface... in which case... what's the point of having a remote? I'd also have the iMac hooked up to my HDTV... which has a much bigger screen than my 20" Rev a iMac.

FYI if you get an Airport Express and a Networked Tivo you can surf your music using the interface on the Tivo Desktop software. It seems to be working again with 10.4.2.

[darwen]

24! 24! 24!

Who hijacked this thread to be talking about powerbooks anyways? I want more TV shows. Apple... please give me the real #1 show!

24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! ... etc.

[dashiel]

And is/are the BBC currently making episodes of The Office, Black Adder, Faulty Towers, or Hitchhiker's? No, they aren't. However, they are making new episodes of...get this....Doctor Who! It was the smash hit of this year. And unlike all the other shows you mentioned, it has not been televised in the States, nor is it available on R1 DVD, for all the reasons I cited. It would be the perfect show to market via iTunes in the States. It would get the word out and make the show an underground sensation, which would lead it to being picked up on a cable channel like SciFi. Genre sells. Desperate Housewives, Lost, and Night Stalker are all genre. Hence my harping over the lack of Doctor Who due to the BBC's ineptitude.

again you're talking about one show that *just* ended in gb and using that as a basis for the beeb being stupid. you know that going the other way, american shows in britain, take just as long if not longer most of the time. give it time jeez. extras is already done in gb, but it just started airing on HBO here despite HBO being a co-producer on the show.

and apparently disney was the only company approached for this launch. you can hardly blame them for not doing something they never had the option to do in the first place.

like i said i know how frustrating it can be waiting for DVDs of shows that exist, but one show that just barely finished it's run, not being immediately available to you does not make the company stupid. i think you're letting your passion for the show overwhelm you at this point.

i also have to question your comments on the expense of the show, apparently it's being screened in canada, austrailia, new zealand, italy, hungary, denmark, norway, holland, france and south korea. i find it difficult to believe that those countries could afford the show and an american company couldn't. though perhaps the bbc tried to change the price.

finally if you're that hot and bothered by it, just download the shows from bittorrent or edonkey. in all good humor i find it hard to believe such a zealous fan of a relatively obscure british science fiction show doesn't know the shadowy realms of P2P. it'd be better quality than what you get from itunes anyhow.


You also cited The Prisoner and Coronation Street. Those aren't BBC properties. Nor is Benny Hill. Nor is The Tomorrow People. Just because the show is made in Britain does not mean that the BBC owns it, or originally televised it.

my mistake, i hadn't watched my prisoner DVDs in ages and wouldn't watch coronation street to save my life.

[~Shard~]

Except DVI is dying. It should be HDMI.

Precisely - HDMI is totally the way to go! At least from what I've seen and heard... ;)

[~Shard~]

24! 24! 24!

Who hijacked this thread to be talking about powerbooks anyways? I want more TV shows. Apple... please give me the real #1 show!

24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! 24! ... etc.

I take it you're a fan of 24? ;) It is a pretty cool show, although I haven't seen too many episodes myself. I did meet Keifer Sutherland in a bar a couple years back and we actually chatted for quite some time - nice guy. He was impressed that I knew that his grandfather was the Premier of my province at one time! :D

Maybe when you're a 6502 you can use this for your avatar... :cool:

[dashiel]

More like enemies. Now they are compeditors, just like Microsoft & Apple. (kinda)

i said this when the split happened and iger's appearance seems to confirm it. the whole split was nothing more than a power play to expedite eisner's removal. there was a series of press releases that happened last year that were released too close together to be coincidence. i believe in the space of three days we got the following:

1) pixar releaes a high profile press release cast information about cars
2) roy disney calls for shareholders to oust eisner at the shareholder meeting
3) pixar announces they've split with disney

all of this was a few days before the disney annual shareholder meeting.

keeping in mind that jobs and roy disney are friends, and jobs and eisner hate each other.

now that eisner is gone all disney has to do is kill the current toy story 3 production, which i believe was started under eisner's watch, and pixar and disney can go on making movies together. their partnership just makes too much sense for both parties. guaranteed ratatouille will be a pixar/disney production.

[dashiel]

When I go to iTunes, and try to preview a TV episode, nothing happends. Anyone else experience this?


do you have quicktime 7.0.3 just released yesterday afternoon and it's required for itunes video.

[Mr Maui]

I take it you're a fan of 24? ;) It is a pretty cool show, although I haven't seen too many episodes myself. I did meet Keifer Sutherland in a bar a couple years back and we actually chatted for quite some time - nice guy. He was impressed that I knew that his grandfather was the Premier of my province at one time! :D

Maybe when you're a 6502 you can use this for your avatar... :cool:Hey Shard, what's a good program for making animated Avatar's. Not my area of expertise and I just got the opportunity to have one yesterday. :cool:

[guylafleur]

Why should I pay for TV shows that are free? :confused:

I could Tivo the shows I want to watch and then transfer them to my iMAC hard drive. :D

Downloading movies is fair enough, but Jobs is just trying to make a market where there was none.

If he were really interested in the consumer, he`d put a TV tuner in the iMAC and have some cool Tivo-killer software for it, rather than making us PAY TO WATCH TV THAT IS ALREADY FREE!!!! :mad:

I Repeat, FRONT ROW and iTunes6 SUCK!

[~Shard~]

Hey Shard, what's a good program for making animated Avatar's. Not my area of expertise and I just got the opportunity to have one yesterday. :cool:

Although it's the obvious answer, Photoshop works great. Other than that, I am not aware of any other lower cost apps which create animated GIFs, but I'm sure there must be a couple out there. Anyone?

[Mr Maui]

Although it's the obvious answer, Photoshop works great. Other than that, I am not aware of any other lower cost apps which create animated GIFs, but I'm sure there must be a couple out there. Anyone?I use Photoshop, but is there a "feature" that makes animated GIFs easy? Sorry, it's an area I've never used or researched before. I work in graphic arts, not internet-type stuff. Never had an interest or need for the animated thingy before now. ;)

[Squonk]

In reading this thread and thinking about the fact that it might be cool to be able to download video content from iTMS, the small format (320x??) is not going to cut it for anything other than watching it on the iPod or on your Mac's screen in its native resolution.

There are always going to be those of us who are going to want to download content and watch it on our lifesize TV's. The 320 format is not even worth thinking about. This is akin to those of us who prefer to purchase our music on CD's so that we have the option of choosing how much quality we want while soaking up the drive in our pods.

When looking at the market that Steve & Co. are looking to exploit - I say bravo - it's just not me. I really wonder if watching TV on a iPod on an airplane would be worthwhile or would it be just too dang small?

One last thought - there have been posts about people saying they want a subscription service, or prebuy a season or buy the season of a show get a discount off the DVD version when available. These are all nifty thoughts! But, this does run counter to the iTMS core model - ala carte. aka, no subscriptions. Wouldn't that put everything on its ear if there were video subscriptions but not audio. Hmmm.

DISCLAIMER - I have not read all the posts over the past few days, if this is redundant or simply stupid, please ignore...

[~Shard~]

I use Photoshop, but is there a "feature" that makes animated GIFs easy? Sorry, it's an area I've never used or researched before. I work in graphic arts, not internet-type stuff. Never had an interest or need for the animated thingy before now. ;)

No problem. :)

Photoshop (or an equivalent design program like that) is only the first piece of the puzzle - you need a program like Gif Movie Gear, GIF Builder Carbon or GIFfun to assemble and finish it off.

Actually, wait a second...

Kay, here (http://www.versiontracker.com/php/search.php?mode=basic&action=search&str=GIF&plt%5B%5D=macosx&x=0&y=0) you go. That should help. :cool:

[vrabz]

Why should I pay for TV shows that are free? :confused:

I could Tivo the shows I want to watch and then transfer them to my iMAC hard drive. :D

Downloading movies is fair enough, but Jobs is just trying to make a market where there was none.

If he were really interested in the consumer, he`d put a TV tuner in the iMAC and have some cool Tivo-killer software for it, rather than making us PAY TO WATCH TV THAT IS ALREADY FREE!!!! :mad:

I Repeat, FRONT ROW and iTunes6 SUCK!

whoever said Steve was interested in the consumer? It's all about the $$$ and stock price my friend. To your point though, it is true that it is pretty stupid to pay for this stuff, especially when Tivo works great to record episodes you aren't around to watch live. I do see a role for downloading episodes if you happen to start watching a new show in the middle of the season and want to catch up. Either way, having a tv-tuner in an imac or mini would be the B-O-M-B (typing this in an airport)... :cool:

[NicP]

Except DVI is dying. It should be HDMI.

Well considering HDMI will be crippled by "Content Protection" I think i'd prefer DVI

[NicP]

Why should I pay for TV shows that are free? :confused:

I could Tivo the shows I want to watch and then transfer them to my iMAC hard drive. :D

Downloading movies is fair enough, but Jobs is just trying to make a market where there was none.

If he were really interested in the consumer, he`d put a TV tuner in the iMAC and have some cool Tivo-killer software for it, rather than making us PAY TO WATCH TV THAT IS ALREADY FREE!!!! :mad:

I Repeat, FRONT ROW and iTunes6 SUCK!

For a start the TV shows arent free, they either get paid for by the advertisments or when you go and buy the dvd.

Secondly the TV idea sucks (of course this is just my opinion), different parts of the world use different broadcast technologies so you cant exactly make a universal tuner. All the stuff on tv here sucks anyway, i havent watched tv in something like 6 months.

[guylafleur]

For a start the TV shows arent free, they either get paid for by the advertisments or when you go and buy the dvd.

Secondly the TV idea sucks (of course this is just my opinion), different parts of the world use different broadcast technologies so you cant exactly make a universal tuner. All the stuff on tv here sucks anyway, i havent watched tv in something like 6 months.

Of course, most TV does suck, you`re right, but there`s still lots out there that doesn`t.

As for the cost thing, Tivo can take care of those commercials, and even if it couldn`t, I could fast forward through them.

There is still no reason to pay for TV that is free! :rolleyes:

[DTphonehome]

Maybe this has been discussed, but I've been away for Yom Kippur and no way can I read all these comments...

Is there a way to rip DVDs to this device? It uses .m4v files, but how about any other formats? Is there an encoder/trancoder which can make .m4v's out of DVDs or DiVX?

--DT

[dejo]

Maybe this has been discussed, but I've been away for Yom Kippur and no way can I read all these comments...

You're right. It has been discussed. And maybe you can't read all the comments but the search does that for you...

[Kirbdog]

Apparently there is an app that converts DVD to iPod format H.264. It is called HandBrake I read about this morning on www.tuaw.com This app is shareware so it is worth a demo.

[EricNau]

Originally Posted by Kirbdog
Apparently there is an app that converts DVD to iPod format H.264. It is called HandBrake I read about this morning on www.tuaw.com This app is shareware so it is worth a demo.
I'm thinking this has to be illegal. If it's not, please, someone let me know.

[beatle888]

I think people are not seeing the point of the FrontRow app. It really does not add any functionality to the computer. It is only a means for control while away from the computer. Why would you need a full screen control on your PowerBook to play a slideshow in iPhoto, a song in iTunes, or a DVD in DVD player. As much as we all want the newest and coolest things, I'm pretty sure Apple knows what they are doing.



if you've been watching apple for the last three to four years you would understand that early on they asked us to support their vision of an integrated computing/media experiance and iTunes was just the beginning. They said they wanted to computer to be the media hub and a lot of people supported their vision. now when they finally offer us something to bring it all together (the glue to bind all the different media type together in an apple like way) they limit it to their newest system only. not because of hardware limitations but because of profits only. i understand they are in the business of making money but this just seems like a kick in the teeth to people that realized they were on to something and supported them.

if you look at the old keynotes from years ago you'll see that apple used the FRONT ROW interface (the four huge icons on a glossy black reflective surface) to illustrate their idea of a united media experience. just an observation.

anway we pay for them to leed us to water and once we get their they say well, you have to pay again. not because the system you bought from us four months ago wont run the new software that we've been promising you for ages, but because we want you to buy a new system to increase our bottom line.

sorry, apple never made me so dissapointed until today. this seems like a rip off if you bought into the apple vision long ago. theres just no reason for it.

i think eventually it will be released for all macs but if not then as a user i could care less about all their hype. as a stock holder i say hell yea! stick it to em' steve.

[beatle888]

I just don't follow. It's lame that the new software that required a peice of hardware that your computer doesn't have? Then I guess it's lame that my Mac won't be able to record BluRay DVDs when the first new models come out that can.


no its lame that some people believe that anything older than the new imac couldnt run Front Row. give me a break i can run final cut on my power book. do you really think this little utility/browser couldnt work on a G4?

[iMeowbot]

I'm thinking this has to be illegal. If it's not, please, someone let me know.
It depends on where you live. Since your location says California, you may be interested in what is happening at the Library of Congress. Every two years the list of DMCA exemptions is revisited, and a new comment period will open on 2 November. Link. (http://www.copyright.gov/fedreg/2005/70fr57526.html) Aside from court decisions, this is how fair use rights are created, so anyone who wants to gain the right to legally make home copies of commercial DVD content should speak up. This is Important, participatory governments only work when people... participate.

[duklaprague]

Great post. However, I just want Front Row on my TV for surfing my iTunes... since my TV and Stereo are in the same room of course. I don't care about turning my Mac into a DVR. I just want an interface for my iTunes on my TV. I've hooked up my Mac to the TV and used the iTunes interface... but the iTunes interface is not suited to a TV.

I agree - even that would be good. At the moment you can pop your iPod in a dock next to your hi-fi, and control it with that little remote control (or the third party ones that have been out for a while) - but you can only skip tracks or change the volume - but what if you want to browse for something to listen to - you can't.

Iain

[steebu]

FrontRow needs lots of power to look good its not just any toy app

[duklaprague]

That's the most retarded fanboy comment I've read yet. who the **** are you to tell someone they arent going to watch movies on their pc? so what if they use final cut and photoshop on it; you expect them to buy another ******** PC to watch movies cause its not its primary purpose? your stupidness astounds me

I'm not sure he was really being stupid - more likely just suggesting a possible rationale/thinking behind it.

I think its extremely likely that this will appear in future macs, but the iMac probably was the obvious starting point.

Media centre PCs are most ideally suited to dorms or bedrooms rather than lounges - so the chances are most kids or students if they have a mac in their dorm or bedroom are most likely to have an iMac rather than a PM.

I still think FR would be great in the laptops too - we use our PB to watch DVDs in bed for example - so FR with a remote would be a good addition.

Ultimately I'd imagine this is a start down a path - as has been said, this thing cries out to be used on a TV, so hopefully Apple will come up with something - surely all it needs are three things :

1. A mac mini, or similar, that sits by the TV and acts as a home media server.
2. Some video airport type device
3. To sort up the quality

Iain

[duklaprague]

Why should I pay for TV shows that are free? :confused:


I know - its crazy, isn't it?

Why do all the TV companies release DVDs of their shows, when everyone's already seen them?

It doesn't make sense!

Iain :confused: :D

[beatle888]

FrontRow needs lots of power to look good its not just any toy app


really? and how much power does it take? do you think a 17inch powerbook that can run final cut pro could handle it? or how about a dual G5 2.0 powermac? what about the revB imac? you dont know what your talking about.

give me a break.


by the way, what makes you think its so demanding? the new iMac is only a 2.1Ghz and the 17" is only 1.9 Ghz

[Signal Man]

I hardly think its the BBCs fault that you can't log on to iTMS after upgrading to iTunes 6...

When it comes to Real, BBC also offer Microsoft Media. They have partnered up with Real for Live content for international users, and its expensive to change. This is why BBC still use Real.

I would love BBC using QuickTime, I'd buy a subscription today for its content. Unfortunately I don't think its going to happen. There is more of a market for Windows Media / Real.
Thank you for all the info on the BBC a real insight to how they think,are you one of their producers.?

Stella I love that woman

[GorillaPaws]

One last thought - there have been posts about people saying they want a subscription service, or prebuy a season or buy the season of a show get a discount off the DVD version when available. These are all nifty thoughts! But, this does run counter to the iTMS core model - ala carte. aka, no subscriptions. Wouldn't that put everything on its ear if there were video subscriptions but not audio. Hmmm.

I guess the main argument here is that video is consumed much differently than audio. We are used to paying for tv service monthly to recieve unlimited content, but most of tv content (crap) we only watch once and are satisfied (i.e. we wouldn't want to own 99% of what we've watched on tv during our lifetime-- and this is the crucial part, this includes content that we actually enjoyed). Movies are different though, they're more like music in the sense that if we enjoyed it we typically want to own it and watch/listen to it whenever we want w/out having to pay monthly to keep it. Certain tv shows are exceptions of course (such as the Sopranos, Lost, Band of Brothers) essentially anything that is similar to an extended movie series.

Although, if Apple released a service in a year or two that gave unlimited ad-free, on demand access to every movie/tv show/sporting event/song ever produced (ok not EVERY one but a HUGE library), I think many people would be willing to pay a pretty hefty monthly subscription fee - maybe $75/month.

[Evangelion]

Well that really sucks you have to buy a new imac G5 to use frontrow. This is so non-apple like.

I guess that's because only the iMac has the needed hardware to support FrontRow

[Evangelion]

So what's innovative about Front Row? The fact that they're charging for low res shows and music videos that you can get for free in other places.

You buy the tv-shows through ITMS, and you can use that content in Front Row. Any failings of the ITMS or the content (like the offered resolution) is not Front Rows fault.

So repeat after me: The choice of TV-shows or the resolution or price they are offered is NOT Front Row's fault. Front Row is a tool to view and use multimedia, NOT a method of aquiring that media!

[duklaprague]

no its lame that some people believe that anything older than the new imac couldnt run Front Row. give me a break i can run final cut on my power book. do you really think this little utility/browser couldnt work on a G4?

this is why i'm inclined to think that maybe it will become part of iLife - look at the icons, and the media itself - all it really is a nifty little GUI to browse / navigate your iLife media.

even if there are reasons why we might not all need it, i think most of us would quite like it anyway - and seeing as it only really is a pretty minor app, its something that would add value to iLife, and so be anincentive to upgrade in 06.

having ugraded to iLife 04 and 05 it really does offer a great deal now - iPhoto especially has added a lot of stuff that was needed.

last week i would have doubted that i'd have got my wallet out for another new version in January - but add in FR and i think i probably would.

Iain

[MongoTheGeek]

Hey Shard, what's a good program for making animated Avatar's. Not my area of expertise and I just got the opportunity to have one yesterday. :cool:

I used GraphicConverter. It came registered on my mac. You can download a free trial from lemkesoft.com.

[Takeo]

I guess that's because only the iMac has the needed hardware to support FrontRow

They already sell the remote as a seperate item. All they'd have to do is add a USB receiver... or you could even use the new iPod dock. There is no reason to have this run on the new iMac only. It's insane. They should sell a package at the Apple store that includes the remote, a receiver and the software... for like $60 or so.

BTW... a seperate receiver would be far better anyway! You just KNOW that a lot of people are going to hook their new iMacs up to their TV's in order to use Front Row. It's just obvious. But with the reciever embedded in the bezel of the iMac... you'd have to have your TV and you iMac on the same wall opposite your couch in order to use the remote from the couch. With a seperate reciever, you could buy a long USB extension cable and put the reciever in the best possible location for your uses. Actually, BT or RF would be preferrable or course... that's also too bad. Obviously this thing was designed with low cost and dorm rooms in mind... not home entertainment.

Also, I already own a Keyspan remote. I see no reason why I could not program my KeySpan remote to work with Front Row... and I'm sure people will try this. I would not expect Apple to provide a free download of Front Row since putting the onus on the user to program a 3rd party remote to work with Apple software is not the Apple way... and rightly so. Anyway, at some point (probably soon), I'm sure someone is going to snag a copy of Front Row off a new iMac and try to get it working on another Mac. I have a rev a G5 iMac... 20"... and I'd LOVE to have Front Row... having a remote controlled TV style interface for my iTunes has been something I've wanted for years... hence my Keyspan remote... but the iTunes interface is not suited to TV... and I can't really justify selling my 1 year old iMac to buy a new iMac... just for Front Row. I'll probably wait until the Intel iMacs come out... that would be a more significant updgrade... and hopefully it's not too far off!!!

[clcnyc]

When I go to iTunes, and try to preview a TV episode, nothing happends. Anyone else experience this?


Same thing with me, and apparently a lot of other people. I checked out the discussion boards on Apple.com, and it's a problem across the board. Videos preview fine, but not TV shows. You have to take some long way around it. Hopefully this will be fixed in 6.0.1. :confused:

[Fab_Fab]

What about using a Bluetooth remote control.
For example the new Sony-Ericsson phones (K700, W800) have a Bluetooth remote control built-in which also works with my iMac. (Arrow Keys, Mouse...)

I think it would be great controlling front row with your mobile Phone.

[DTphonehome]

You're right. It has been discussed. And maybe you can't read all the comments but the search does that for you...

I suppose this is off topic, but does anyone else find the search feature of this forum software to be seriously lacking? Maybe I'm just spoiled by Google...

[Juventuz]

Same thing with me, and apparently a lot of other people. I checked out the discussion boards on Apple.com, and it's a problem across the board. Videos preview fine, but not TV shows. You have to take some long way around it. Hopefully this will be fixed in 6.0.1. :confused:

I just tried previewing and episode of Lost and it now works.

[NicP]

Of course, most TV does suck, you`re right, but there`s still lots out there that doesn`t.

As for the cost thing, Tivo can take care of those commercials, and even if it couldn`t, I could fast forward through them.

There is still no reason to pay for TV that is free! :rolleyes:

what we need is some decent internet TV streams, that would be cool! I ditched normal radio for internet radio, i'd love to be able to do the same with TV

[Le Big Mac]

I see FrontRow requiring the remote to work and with the iMac the only comp with the remote it makes sense that its only available on the iMac. What I wonder though is where is the ir port on the iMac. I don't see one. Could it be that it reads it with the built in iSight?

I read somewhere that, yes, it's built into the isight. Or really iSight is capable of being an IR receiver as well.

All the more reason why Front Row should be adaptable to all macs (assuming sufficient processing power, which I can't imagine is an issue--it looks like a new way to start a slideshow, which works on most G4s just fine).

Buy an iSight, and the remote, and get the software, and done.

[Ibjr]

What about PhotoBooth? I imagine that will be coming out for other Macs soon.

David :cool:

only after isight is found in the others as well. Remember those patents for laptops and isights?

[Ibjr]

I really don't think Apple is positioning this for the Living Room. Check out the Front Row web page (http://www.apple.com/imac/frontrow.html). The eye-catching quote is "Do the math. iMac G5 + remote control + DVD = the most popular dorm room" It's been ten years since I was in college, but I never knew anyone with a big TV. A 20" widescreen TV would have been pretty sweet. The fact that it's in a G5 iMac is all the better...

Apple isn't targeting this at your (or your parent's living room), they are targeting it at the high school and college kids. Photo Booth is certainly targeted to them as well.

One of the most mac friendly campuses, Stanford, has kids with projectors. a 20 inch TV wouldn't be as big of a deal as they seem to think.

[wdlove]

I read somewhere that, yes, it's built into the isight. Or really iSight is capable of being an IR receiver as well.

All the more reason why Front Row should be adaptable to all macs (assuming sufficient processing power, which I can't imagine is an issue--it looks like a new way to start a slideshow, which works on most G4s just fine).

Buy an iSight, and the remote, and get the software, and done.

I am certainly hoping that it will work with other Mac's also. Not everyone will be getting a new iMac.

[villanova329]

Eh. FrontRow. Doesn't really impress me.

I've BEEN having a bluetooth remote that I know I like eons better than the Apple one: Salling Clicker for my Palm Tungsten T3

It has a screen, it controls all the iLife apps plus more, and you can control system preferences with it.

Microsoft Media Center Remote = 45 buttons
Dell Media Center Remote = 43 buttons
Apple Remote = 6 buttons
Salling Clicker for Tungsten T3 = 5 buttons

I win=)

[indirstr8s]

I own the one version previous imac G5. I bought this beauty just a week back. Im also using it as my music server to stream music into my main stereo. It sits quite a bit away from the stereo and streams music over wireless.
Front row is very important to me so that I can browse the music collection when I am not sitting near the computer. The front row further facilitates this by showing info in BIG text.
I really hope the Front row app becomes available for other macs, also the blue tooth version of the remote. Anything less is a very crappy policy from Apple.

[~Shard~]

I suppose this is off topic, but does anyone else find the search feature of this forum software to be seriously lacking? Maybe I'm just spoiled by Google...

I find the Advanced Search capabilities to be more than adequate whenever I need to find anything.... <shrug>

[PRØBE]

I find the Advanced Search capabilities to be more than adequate whenever I need to find anything.... <shrug>



I just noticed that the UK iTunes store has added music videos. They are charging £1.89p per video (same price for the pixar shorts, which you used to be able to stream for free from the Pixar site). This converts to $3.304.


Anyone else think this is just too much?

[indirstr8s]

Eh. FrontRow. Doesn't really impress me.

I've BEEN having a bluetooth remote that I know I like eons better than the Apple one: Salling Clicker for my Palm Tungsten T3

It has a screen, it controls all the iLife apps plus more, and you can control system preferences with it.

Microsoft Media Center Remote = 45 buttons
Dell Media Center Remote = 43 buttons
Apple Remote = 6 buttons
Salling Clicker for Tungsten T3 = 5 buttons

I win=)

After reading villanova's message, I downloaded the salling clicker and am using it on my ipaq. Neat.

[nagromme]

Or really iSight is capable of being an IR receiver as well.
You may be on to something. This download lets iSight (even the standalone version) see in the dark:
http://www.ecamm.com/mac/iglasses/

That's not going to help the paranoid any :D This iMac a) has a sensor that knows when it's dark, and b) has a camera that can SEE in the dark :p


only after isight is found in the others as well. Remember those patents for laptops and isights?
That has been on my mind :) (Apple wouldn't be the first, though. Sony had at least one subnotebook with a low-quality cam.)

[~Shard~]

I just noticed that the UK iTunes store has added music videos. They are charging £1.89p per video (same price for the pixar shorts, which you used to be able to stream for free from the Pixar site). This converts to $3.304.


Anyone else think this is just too much?

Don't worry - being in Canada I'm used to getting screwed on the exchange rate on many things. ;) However I must say, I do believe we have the cheapest iTMS in the world since our songs are only $0.99 CAD comapred to $0.99 USD in America. It's nice to get a break for once. ;) :cool:

[Thanatoast]

I just noticed that the UK iTunes store has added music videos. They are charging £1.89p per video (same price for the pixar shorts, which you used to be able to stream for free from the Pixar site). This converts to $3.304.

Anyone else think this is just too much?hey, it costs a lot to import those videos all the way from america. and it's the english-version riaa that you should take it up with.

and also slightly off topic, will there ever be plans for an int'l store? what if i wanted to buy japanese anime or mexican soap operas or baywatch in german?

[duklaprague]

I just noticed that the UK iTunes store has added music videos. They are charging £1.89p per video (same price for the pixar shorts, which you used to be able to stream for free from the Pixar site). This converts to $3.304.

Anyone else think this is just too much?

i might have considered using it to buy some videos if they were hi-res and i could burn my own compilation dvds - but as they are i can't imagine buying more than the odd one.

will have to get the oild classic pixar short with the lamps tho'!

and going back to the thing about the iMacs with FR being aimed at dorms or bedrooms - true, although watching Jobs' presentation, he did say something about how cool it would be to view all this stuff from the sofa. this is the problem - my iMac (if I had one) wouldn't be in the same room as our sofa.

Iain

[dejo]

I suppose this is off topic, but does anyone else find the search feature of this forum software to be seriously lacking? Maybe I'm just spoiled by Google...

Then you'll love MRoogle (http://mroogle.yo-momma.net/)

[Blackjack75]

The only thing you couldn't do with frontrow on a macmini is the same thing you couldn't do in Quicktime: playing hi-res content. Apart from video-decoding it does absolutetly nothing that wouldn't run on a PC with any cheap openGL card.

Just look at the demo. What do you see? FOUR freaking flat openGL textures moving around and a few text boxes moving smoothly. Wow. You surely do need a quad-G5 and the lastest ATI for that kind of interface. You know you can run 3D games on a mac mini? Sure it's not the smoothest, but believe me a game is a thousand times more demanding than a lovely GUI. I've been programming with OpenGL on my iBook (same radeon 9200) and one thing you can be sure is that you shouldn't be afraid of mapping and rotating a dozen faces.

I know lots of people want HD and nothing else but I am one of those who are pretty satisfied right now with DVD resolution/quality. Which a macmini can play well, even in h264 (I guess so since my iBook 1.2 ghz with the same radeon can do it). I'd just love to be able to connect my iBook on a macmini on my TV and use frontrow as the GUI.

And for the remote as others said, there are other solutions. As the following site explains if you can control front-row or any other app (itunes, VLC, Quicktime, DVDPlayer) through keyboard then you can easily create a HID description file for it. Just upload this file to your phone to remotely control that app from your compatible mobile phone with bluetooth (eg. my K700). Salling clicker does something similiar (but not for free).

See make_your_mac_a_bluetooth_zombie (http://creativebits.org/toolbox/make_your_mac_a_bluetooth_zombie)

[fklehman]

It's be wicked cool if we coulde eventually download TV shows from other countries--Britcoms, etc. I pay $10 a month for basic basic cable, just because I refuse to pay $50 a month to those damn telecom/cable behemoths for a bunch of religious and shopping channels I don't want. I would rather just pay for a couple shows I really want to watch instead of shell out tons of dough just to get BBC America. Someday soon the Chinese will put up a satellite and offer it to American TV couch potatoes for $20 a month, and then our own profit-mongering DirectTVs etc. will go belly up and I won't shed a tear...or they will at least have to offer TV channels a la carte and the stations that suck will go belly up as they should have years ago. Let's put the free market back into cable/satellite so people aren't subsidizing crap channels that they don't care about. Anyway here's hoping internet video could make that happen.

[BWhaler]

Front Row will be coming for other Macs in the future. It's a business decision, that's all, so discussing the technical angles is naive. Apple would rather sell at 1300+ computer than a $49 software package. But give it time, since this announcement--along with video--was just the beginning of the exciting things to come.

I am excited for now as to what has been released, as it indicated exciting things to come...

[BWhaler]

I hope we get new shows quickly. I travel abroad a great deal, so it would be nice to buy current shows I am missing.

I hope the networks move quickly to provide content. There is a ton of money to be made here...

[ErikGrim]

I use Photoshop, but is there a "feature" that makes animated GIFs easy? Sorry, it's an area I've never used or researched before. I work in graphic arts, not internet-type stuff. Never had an interest or need for the animated thingy before now. ;)Yes it is, it's called Image Ready (you might have noted that other app in your Photoshop folder?). Click the Send to Image Ready button in Photoshop to automatically start it and transfer your image to it.

[Peace]

I personally don't watch Lost on ABC but it was on the tube and I noticed they are moving the "number one rated" show from it's Saturday line-up to Wednesday.The same day as the new Apple "Pro" event..

Maybe a little Front Row will be introduced with one or all the rumored pro Macs.

[EricNau]

I personally don't watch Lost on ABC but it was on the tube and I noticed they are moving the "number one rated" show from it's Saturday line-up to Wednesday.The same day as the new Apple "Pro" event..

Maybe a little Front Row will be introduced with one or all the rumored pro Macs.
Huh? Lost has always been on Wednesdays, sounds like what you were watching may have been a re-run.

[speleoterra]

[QUOTE=Maestro64]Well that really sucks you have to buy a new imac G5 to use frontrow. This is so non-apple like.



Noo,..it doesnt..
it is the HALO effrect of the iPod to Windows users.crew
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$...bottom line, and a big screw to Bill !