Intel Transition, MacBook Name, and Windows on Mac?

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

As readers digest all the announcements from Apple at Macworld San Francisco, we've noted a few interesting tidbits:

- Steve Jobs announced that Apple's entire product line will be transitioned to Intel in 2006. This is earlier than previously announced at WWDC 2005. Jobs notes that over the coming months we will hear announcements as each product line is transitioned. All by the end of this calendar year.

- MacBook Pro naming. Steve Jobs: "It's a new name because we're kinda done with Power and because we want Mac in the name of our products." This would imply that the MacBook name may not only replace the PowerBook but the iBook as well. Also raises some questions about the continued use of the "PowerMac" name.

- Phil Schiller maintains (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10789855/page/2/) that Apple will not prevent users from booting Windows on the new machines, though no first hand reports whether or not this is easily accomplishable.

“That’s fine with us. We don’t mind,” Schiller said. “If there are people who love our hardware but are forced to put up with a Windows world, then that’s OK.”

[ahmurphy7]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'

[macosxuser01]

I guessing by spring or early summer the powerbooks will be a thing the past.
say goodbye to powerbooks and ibooks and PowerPC

[arn]

Seems MacBook must replace both the iBook and PowerBook over time.

iBook -> MacBook
PowerBook -> MacBook Pro

arn

[macosxuser01]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerMac'
ture but does the name really matter. its not like apple could of called it intelbook

[cheapnis]

- Phil Schiller maintains that Apple will not prevent users from booting Windows on the new machines, though no first hand reports whether or not this is easily accomplishable.

extremely sensible attitude and one that will surely bring a lot of people who would otherwise be doubtful over from the darkside ;)

How would partitioning and disk formatting work though?

[technicolor]

Will you be able to run OS X on a PC now?

[technicolor]

Seems MacBook must replace both the iBook and PowerBook over time.

iBook -> MacBook
PowerBook -> MacBook Pro

arn

That is exactlywhat I was thinking.

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

[AndrewMT]

Since the intel iMacs are shipping today, I'm hoping that someone will test them for dual booting pretty soon. I am particularly intersted in intel iMac and Macbook's video game performance under Windows, because the only reason I put up with my Windows PC is the game library.

Unfortunately, Apple went with the X1600 for their first "Pro" intel laptop, instead of the much more powerful Nvidia Geforce Go 7800 (or even the 6800), which can be found in most professional Windows laptop's (including Dell, with the magnificently powerful XPS laptop).

[iMeowbot]

How would partitioning and disk formatting work though?
We'll find out when the hardware ships :) Even booting may (or may not) be a problem, depending on what EFI options they have included.
Will you be able to run OS X on a PC now?
People are already doing that :D Right now, the version of OS X that you can buy (without a Mac) is still only for PowerPC, so doing that would still be against their license agreement (though I'm sure people will think of loopholes).

[macosxuser01]

sense apple switch to intel will there be more games available for OS X?
Call of Duty 2 for mac:D
Battlefield 2 for mac :D
Counter-Strike for mac :D

[Nermal]

How would partitioning and disk formatting work though?

I'm expecting someone to come up with a "loader" that emulates the necessary BIOS calls (there is no BIOS in the Intel Macs, and Windows needs one) and kicks off the installation for you. Take a look at XPostFacto - it allows you to run OS X on OldWorld computers. I think the same sort of thing will appear for running Windows on Intel Macs.

sense apple switch to intel will there be more games available for OS X?
Call of Duty 2 for mac:D

Already on its way, from Aspyr :)

[puuukeey]

not that it matters at all. but I always thought putting power before anything was a bit... well... 80s action figure-esque


SUPER ULTRA MEGA POWER BOOK TRON 2000!!!!!

/as usual I'm unhappy to see apple taking over more of a computer users life alla blank casts. as if it didn't dominate my life enough already

[k28]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

[dangerding]

http://www.youtube.com/p.swf?video_id=Y3xKhLlhzfM&l=124&eurl=&t=Jobs

[Trowaman]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

I agree with your first solution. I really doubt "iBook" is going anywhere. If it does it'd keep the "i"

iMac to-go
iMacBook
iMac Mini

[macosxuser01]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?
they wouldn't just leave it Mac. there going to keep it iMac. what will they do to PowerMac. Its going to be wired saying MacBook Pro it needs to be easy to say fast like powerbook. if ibook is chang to MacBook people will be confuse when talking to people because people say things in slag and in short. like we don't say iPod shuffle we say "you got a shuffle".
we don't say Powermac G5 we say "can you help fix my powermac"
do u get the picture

:confused: :eek: :eek:

[wasimyaqoob]

Should be good, but i dont like the name 'MacBook' just doesnt have the same sound 'oh yeah look what i bought, a POWERBOOK/MacBook' PowerBook just sounds so much better. As regards to the Intel chips, Ok yes fair enough, creating a new laptop thats faster than the G4 yes, but when they say 4x faster they are comparing the PowerPC G4 BASEMODEL with the Intel Dual Core top end model which is why is comes at 4x and you will only notice these dramtic changes when you are doing something like video rendering etc.... so for the everyday user PowerPC G4 was fine but ah well.... I dont like Intel :)

[kugino]

a woman at macworld today asked one of the apple workers who were helping with the macbook pro demos whether windows could be installed...and the apple guy said, "we're not allowed to comment on that..." so i joked that that means, "yes". and he smiled.

even though it's probably doable, i sure wouldn't want windows ruining my nice macbook pro!

[dantec]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

I've been pondering this all day. I think the iBook & iMac names will be the last to go though. Apple will probably hold onto them for a couple of years. They hold so much market value. And a lot of PC users often mistake iMac for Apple (e.g. "Oh so how is that new iMac mp3 thingamagiger", "I like your iMac laptop..." *bangs head on wall*)

The powermac is pretty much a done deal though. That will definitively become Mac Pro to mirror the 'product matrix' Steve set up for apple when he first joined in 1997 - then again Steve has deviated from his own matrix strategy (Powermac Cube, Mac mini).

Mac(odd?)

Would it really be odd? The iMac in many ways is much like the original Mac (both have a simple attractive innovative all in one design, both were machines that pushed apple into an era of prosperity - well the first one did for a while :), both brought upon revolutions (desktop publishing/homevideo))

Who knows, maybe they decide to change the name at the 25th anniversary of the Macintosh.

---

On another note, is it just me or does MacBook Pro just sound stupid? I much prefer Powerbook...:confused:

Edit: Then again when I first heard iPod, I thought it was the most retarded name on earth. It didn't turn out so bad :D

[macosxuser01]

http://www.youtube.com/p.swf?video_id=Y3xKhLlhzfM&l=124&eurl=&t=Jobs
lol. but wtf:mad: so apple going using Intel processors means there going to the darkside??? Ok how about this, who here would rather have a Powerbook G4 when the Mac Book Pro is 4x faster then the current powermac right now. people make no sense. did anybody watch the when they compare the power per watt at the keynote???

http://macworld.apple.com.edgesuite.net/mw/index.html

[ChrisH3677]

Steve said "We want Mac in the name of our products". You can't get much clearer than that - the iBook is going. iMac already has a "Mac" in it so it will stay.

Really simple.

[robotx21]

I can see it now. Go into a general computer repair store.

"Hi, can you fix my Mac Book?"
"You're what?"
"My Mac Book"
"What's a Mac Book?"
"You know, the apple laptops?"
"Oh, you mean powerbook"
"No, Mac Book."
"What the **** is a Mac Book?!"
"THE NEW APPLE LAPTOPS!"
"Sorry, I don't know what a Mac Book is. We only fix powerbooks and ibooks."
"Moron...*sigh*"
"Mac Book...*sigh*"

[The Man]

I already proposed the change just before the announcement in an earlier thread

"iPod
iPod nano
iPod shuffle
iPod whatever

iMac
Mac mini
Mac pro
Mac whatever (HDTV, etc)

MacBook
MacBook mini
MacBook pro

iMac would be the exception (instead of simply Mac) because when we talk about Mac, we also talk about the Mac platform."

I thought, however, that the designation would go lower case like the iPods, but apparently Apple went with Pro. Somebody proposed that Apple use Express for consumer line, but I think it's not that catchy. Mac Express, MacBook Express. Some say use Home, but that's not right either, because what if it's used at school? No, Apple will keep it simple like the iPod

[macosxuser01]

they should of just left it powermac and ibook. i think steve jobs made it MacBook Pro so that no one got confused. apple has a good reason changing the name 'power' because 'power' was used in most of computers when apple switch to powerpc in mid 90s. thats how apple got powermac from and powerbook

[technicolor]

I can see it now. Go into a general computer repair store.

"Hi, can you fix my Mac Book?"
"You're what?"
"My Mac Book"
"What's a Mac Book?"
"You know, the apple laptops?"
"Oh, you mean powerbook"
"No, Mac Book."
"What the **** is a Mac Book?!"
"THE NEW APPLE LAPTOPS!"
"Sorry, I don't know what a Mac Book is. We only fix powerbooks and ibooks."
"Moron...*sigh*"
"Mac Book...*sigh*"
Find another shop.
Who would want someone not even up on the latest offerings fixing their machine anyway.

[vollspacken]

nah, just keep the "Powerbook" label... it's an established name and IMHO much better overall. the portables had this name from the start (if you only count the real laptop-like machines...), so it has nothing to do with PowerPC (the Powerbook 100 had a 68000 CPU).

not a smart move

vSpacken

[zync]

lol. but wtf:mad: so apple going using Intel processors means there going to the darkside??? Ok how about this, who here would rather have a Powerbook G4 when the Mac Book Pro is 4x faster then the current powermac right now. people make no sense. did anybody watch the when they compare the power per watt at the keynote???

http://macworld.apple.com.edgesuite.net/mw/index.html

I think I'll be using my PowerBook for a few years still, sorry. Even if I bought a "MacBook" I'd scratch off the Mac part or the Book part from my LCD bezel and I'd still keep this PowerBook.

PowerBook just sounds so much better. MacBook is the most ridiculous name I've ever heard in my life. Someone asked on another thread if we'd all like it to be called xBook then since it's x86 and not PPC, and you know what? I would actually, anything other than MacBook. Even something as boring as Mac Laptop would work for me. Hell, why not just Mac and Mac pro!?

[Evangelion]

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

Duh! Since PowerBook was change to MacBook, logic dictates that PowerMac will be replaced by MacMac ;). If not that, how about "Big Mac"?

[Dr_Maybe]

Steve Jobs announced that Apple's entire product line will be transitioned to Intel in 2006. This is earlier than previously announced at WWDC 2006.

That should be WWDC 2005, right?

[dubbz]

That is exactlywhat I was thinking.

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

Mac Pro?

*shrug*

Edit: k28 already mentioned it. didn't see. just one of the first thing that popped to mind. don't know whether or not i like the name.

[Evangelion]

I think I'll be using my PowerBook for a few years still, sorry. Even if I bought a "MacBook" I'd scratch off the Mac part or the Book part from my LCD bezel and I'd still keep this PowerBook.

PowerBook just sounds so much better. MacBook is the most ridiculous name I've ever heard in my life. Someone asked on another thread if we'd all like it to be called xBook then since it's x86 and not PPC, and you know what? I would actually, anything other than MacBook. Even something as boring as Mac Laptop would work for me. Hell, why not just Mac and Mac pro!?

So, you don't want to use some computer because of it's name? Maybe in 1984 many people felt that "Macintosh" is a gay name as well?

[Skiniftz]

Seems MacBook must replace both the iBook and PowerBook over time.

iBook -> MacBook
PowerBook -> MacBook Pro

arn

...therefore....

PowerMac -> MacMac

[thalwil]

iMacBook

Go figure... Apple will leverage the iMac brand to boost the iBook even further!
And no, there won't be a MacBook mini...

[dubbz]

PowerMac -> MacMac

That was the second name I thought of... :p

pMac?

[Lollypop]

I really don’t like the MacBook name, with the cool stuff coming from apple couldn’t they do a nice cool new name... MacBook sounds so... :( beige... :(

As for windows in a Mac, I’m sure it will be possible, but I don’t think apple is going to bundle windows with a Mac and definitely not make it supper easy to do.

[gunga]

Steve said "We want Mac in the name of our products". You can't get much clearer than that - the iBook is going. iMac already has a "Mac" in it so it will stay.

Really simple.

I agree. iMac to stay. There's alway iPod to keep it company.

[mcarnes]

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

iMac Pro

[stevesien]

I like "AppleMacIntel NonPro Rev A 2006 "



If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

[faustofernos]

I'm reallly REALLY needing to buy a PowerMac G5 and I'm wondering if I should just get a high end iMac, since it feels the next OS wont be supported on old macs, or am I just being paranoid.

If the new Intel iMac's are 4x as faster, are they just as fast as the mid-range PowerMacs?

I mostly use photoshop, Logic Audio (podcaster here), iMovie, Garage Band and Final Cut.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! And while you're at it, check out my podcast: www.feastoffools.net

[iEdd]

iMac, Mac Pro, iMacBook, MacBook Pro, MacMini

OR

iMacTop, MacTop Pro, iMacBook, MacBook Pro, MacMini

#1. Obeys all the rules. #2. Almost does except requires renaming of the iMac.

[LACOSTE]

Noticeably, the form factor of the MacBook did not stray that far from that of the powerbook.

It is possible that maybe mid2007, they will replace it with a new laptop altogether. It may not be called MacBook at all. Hopefully it comes in other metallic colours.

Aluminium clad isight bearing, IR wielding MacBook Pro would probably be transitioned into a newly improved PC Thinkpad killing machine. Not that the macBook isnt one already, it has all the weapons to win the game-set-match... its just overly expensive (the best things are).

sidenote: *** how about changing the PowerMac name to ProMac... has a nice ring to it.

i think the "Apple iBook" name would stay.

FUTURE Probably a tabletMac in the pipes as well. And please Apple make a freakin useful fone, and put Nokia and motorolla out of its misery.

"Whats in a name anyway?" I think apple did a splendid Job with these new machines, naming them not withstanding.

[dubbz]

If the new Intel iMac's are 4x as faster, are they just as fast as the mid-range PowerMacs?

I'm also curious about how they compare. Can't wait for benchmarks between the dual core Intel iMac and dual core PowerMac.

[shanmui1]

sense apple switch to intel will there be more games available for OS X?
Call of Duty 2 for mac:D
Battlefield 2 for mac :D
Counter-Strike for mac :D

All three + Colin McRae Rally 2005 for me :D

[macidiot]

Ok, so after spending a lot of today reading the spec sheets on the new iMac and Powerbook (I hate the name macbook, sounds like something a clueless windows user would call a powerbook), even though I really am in the market for a laptop, I have to say I'm leaning towards getting an iMac. Mostly because I think the new laptop is a placeholder for the real hardware coming out in a few months and the iMac will be fine till then. Besides I want a machine right now :P

Anyway, I'm wondering how hard it would be to use an external drive formatted with xp and boot off of it. Anyone have any input? Would I be able to use some sort of key combination at start up? Could I simply designate the startup volume and reboot? This really is beyond my expertise, since I've never encountered a situation where I'd be booting Windows and MacOS on identical hardware... :eek:

[combatcolin]

Would be the easiest way to run XP.

NO messing around with disk partations and the like.

On the Intel Powermac it could be even easier, just slap in a blank SATA hard drive and use that just for Windows XP.

Hold down "W" at boot for Windows and Bobs your Uncle.

Anyone else feel like PPC Powermac sales will carsh and burn now?

[dubbz]

Anyway, I'm wondering how hard it would be to use an external drive formatted with xp and boot off of it. Anyone have any input? Would I be able to use some sort of key combination at start up? Could I simply designate the startup volume and reboot? This really is beyond my expertise, since I've never encountered a situation where I'd be booting Windows and MacOS on identical hardware... :eek:

It's possible to install and run XP off an external drive and there's some key combos you can use for booting Macs off external drives. I assume this will be possible, though we won't know for sure until someone actually tries it...

[nataku]

I think that iBook still sounds perfect for the Intel version. I don't find any reason why Apple will change this. Then again, iBook-->MacBook and Powerbook-->MacBook Pro also sounds logical. But i doubt it because they wouldn't want to maroon the iMac as the only one having the "i". Hmmm... what if they do change the iBook to MacBook and change the PowerMac to iMac Pro....? To me it sounds ok but it won't be as catchy as POWERMac.

I am sure that they wouldn't be stupid enough to follow the branding scheme they gave with the Powerbook-MacBook. If they did, it would come out as MacMac. wow sorry if that was lame but i just had to get that out! :)

Will you be able to run OS X on a PC now?

why? are you waiting for it to do so? Sorry dude. Not in your wildest dreams. If people do figure out a way to install the prodcution version of the Intel OS X, Apple will stop at nothing to make their Masterpiece a Mac only. i can imagine Apple impairing a Windows machine running OS X illegaly. Plus, you won't be able to run it as smooth as silk. :p

It makes me proud to be a Mac user. Other people can only dream of having OS X. :D

[iCraig]

I mostly use photoshop, Logic Audio (podcaster here), iMovie, Garage Band and Final Cut.

I'd wait if I were you even Steve himself said Photoshop doesn't run under Rosetta that fast, well fast enough for professionals anyway.

Besides why do you need a new Mac so bad? Your current one blown up or don't you own one at the moment?

Back on topic, like has been mentioned above the name Powerbook was coined in October 1991 in the Sculley era, even when Powerbooks used Motorola 68000's so nothing to do with PowerPC's.

My reckoning is Steve wants to get away from the names coined by his predecessors at Apple while he was away. Already gone after a few months in office were the Centris, Quadra and LC names and branding, along with Newton etc etc, and he probably wanted to get rid of Powerbook and PowerMac too maybe just that would've and is taking longer to do?

Just my slant on things of course?:D

[zync]

So, you don't want to use some computer because of it's name? Maybe in 1984 many people felt that "Macintosh" is a gay name as well?

Is that what I said? Because I certainly don't remember writing that. I've never been truly fond of the name Macintosh actually. I like Mac. That said, what I said was, if I bought the MacBook I'd personally scratch the name to read something less hideous. I never once said that I wouldn't use a computer because of it's name. No wait, that's not true: DELL :D

I did, however, say that I'd be using my PowerBook for a good while. It performs well and there's nothing wrong with it. It makes me money, it gets me through video editing and Photoshop. That's all I can ask really. Would I like it to be faster, sure, who wouldn't want that. Am I going to pay for a computer that's faster but has features comparable (and some less than) my current 2 year old laptop?

No

[dubbz]

If people do figure out a way to install the prodcution version of the Intel OS X, Apple will stop at nothing to make their Masterpiece a Mac only. i can imagine Apple impairing a Windows machine running OS X illegaly.

Meh. It's just software and It'll be cracked. It's not like Apple can come into people's home and disable their machines from running it.


It makes me proud to be a Mac user. Other people can only dream of having OS X. :D

Are you saying that other people can't buy Macs? :confused: :eek:

[MacNut]

The MacBook is a prototype that will be phased out when the permanent laptops are unveiled. If they are gonna announce a brand new intel laptop why change the name and have it look just like a PowerBook, it was a rush for today to distinguish the new lines.

[iEdd]

The MacBook is a prototype that will be phased out when the permanent laptops are unveiled. If they are gonna announce a brand new intel laptop why change the name and have it look just like a PowerBook, it was a rush for today to distinguish the new lines.
Maybe, but why did the imac (which has more similarities with its G5 ver.) not have a name change?

[redAPPLE]

That is exactlywhat I was thinking.

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

Mac Pro?

if i'd get a MacBook. i would personally still call it Powerbook. eat that Apple.

[anthonylambert]

Did anyone else notice that the specs for the MacBook Pro fail to mention battery life?

Also in a related issue they don't say whether Apple use the Centrino chipset I guess not. One of the major benefits to using it is battery life... I would guess that the latest machine doesn't complete with Centrino based INTEL portables.

Can anyone throw any light on this?

Anthony

[iEdd]

Are you saying that other people can't buy Macs? :confused: :eek:
No, he is saying only mac users can have os x.

[MacNut]

Maybe, but why did the imac (which has more similarities with its G5 ver.) not have a name change?In the keynote Steve said "we couldn't fit a G5 into a PowerBook so i believe that the MacBook has a redesigned inside but they didn't have enough time to retool the case. The iMac was designed probably with the intent to be able to hold an Intel chip.

[iMeowbot]

In the keynote Steve said "we couldn't fit a G5 into a PowerBook so i believe that the MacBook has a redesigned inside but they didn't have enough time to retool the case. The iMac was designed probably with the intent to be able to hold an Intel chip.
But they did retool the case. It's all different dimensions. The year they say they spent on it would have been plenty of time to come up with a different look, if that's what they wanted to do.

A much more reasonable explanation is continuity. The new models will look and feel and act just like their predecessors, reassuring customers that the machines are still Macs just like last week's models. Apple did exactly the same thing with the transition from 68K to PowerPC.

[a456]

I guessing by spring or early summer the powerbooks will be a thing the past.
say goodbye to powerbooks and ibooks and PowerPC

MacBook makes sense, because everyone is now using the i prefix. They can't use the Mac prefix though, so it re-asserts some individuality. Where is FW800 on these MacBook Pros though? It is on the cheaper 15" PowerBook.

[Dr_Maybe]

All three + Colin McRae Rally 2005 for me :D

Colin McRae is pretty lame, unless you are looking for an arcade type game. I prefer simulation like racing games with realistic steering and physics etc.

But Richard Burns Rally is cool - too bad it's not available for mac.

[macidiot]

Would be the easiest way to run XP.

NO messing around with disk partations and the like.

On the Intel Powermac it could be even easier, just slap in a blank SATA hard drive and use that just for Windows XP.

Hold down "W" at boot for Windows and Bobs your Uncle.

Anyone else feel like PPC Powermac sales will carsh and burn now?


well I wouldn't want to do that, swapping out the hard drive each time I wanted to switch os's wouldn't be all that convenient, especially on an imac. As for the partitions, thats why I'm thinking to use an external drive...no need to worry about disk formatting structures. Too bad its just imac and laptop right now... neither are all that internal expansion friendly.

[JoeBeCrazy]

I thought, however, that the designation would go lower case like the iPods, but apparently Apple went with Pro. Somebody proposed that Apple use Express for consumer line, but I think it's not that catchy. Mac Express, MacBook Express. Some say use Home, but that's not right either, because what if it's used at school? No, Apple will keep it simple like the iPod

I don't think i'm feeling you on the "Mac" names for all the computers. The "i" is always fitting for the watered-down professional (iLife, iWork, iCal). iBook seems to be set to stay. "i" applications and hardware seem to already group themselves to be a made for home/educational/small business and budget conscious system. They can't give that up.

The Ambiguouity of the MacBook "Pro" is simply trying to go with the naming of "final cut PRO" or "soundtrack PRO" or "Logic PRO". Apple seems like they are trying to take the focus away from the CPU. It's a good selling point, because PCs users are going to compare speeds and not compare purely about practicality and productivity. So the name won't obtain the type of CPU. Question is there going to be a "MacBook Express"?

I say the Desktop line would probably leave the "Power" because for (1) it is kinda cheesy if your really think about it and (2) no more PowerPC. So we probably would see MacDesk Pro, MacStation Pro, or MacStudio Pro.

Plasma Screens and Home Entertainment. If this is true, I really think Apple is not going to use their Mac name, because it's not a Mac...literally. Technically it is, but it's not going to function as a computer (namely "mac"). Also i think they'll make it elegant enough so that it won't sport the "i" name.

A little tangent: Apple is always going to gear toward Media instead of Office Machines. Notice their "i" is basically their Office end covered (ilife, iwork, ical). They've taken Music as their basis. I'm thinking they are copying the MTV route. MTV was about the music, then music videos, which fed on to film entertainment, movies, and now it's about reality shows. So thinking "Media" and what's been done... it won't be too long until we see handheld iChat Live or PodChat, a Wifi/bluetooth iPod, .... etc. Long live Apple. Can't wait til the next product.

[macidiot]

I'd wait if I were you even Steve himself said Photoshop doesn't run under Rosetta that fast, well fast enough for professionals anyway.

Besides why do you need a new Mac so bad? Your current one blown up or don't you own one at the moment?

Back on topic, like has been mentioned above the name Powerbook was coined in October 1991 in the Sculley era, even when Powerbooks used Motorola 68000's so nothing to do with PowerPC's.

My reckoning is Steve wants to get away from the names coined by his predecessors at Apple while he was away. Already gone after a few months in office were the Centris, Quadra and LC names and branding, along with Newton etc etc, and he probably wanted to get rid of Powerbook and PowerMac too maybe just that would've and is taking longer to do?

Just my slant on things of course?:D

I'm pretty sure Powerbook was around when Steve was there the first time. It was the name of the first real Apple laptop, the Powerbook 100. Actually, its widely considered the first modern laptop, period. There was an Apple portable before that, but it was really a luggable.

And the Centris, Quadra, and LC names were all gone before Steve came back. The only name he might have killed was Performa... I never followed that consumer line, so I don't know much about them...

[iMeowbot]

I'm pretty sure Powerbook was around when Steve was there the first time
He'd been gone a good 5 or 6 years before those came out.

[gedto]

Back on interesting topic:

It seems Schiller has stated clear that these new Mac Intel computers will be able to run Windows just fine. Isn't this a great added-value to the Mac?

[The Man]

Steve says that he wants Mac in the name, so iBook brand is going. And I think Steve is right on this.

iBook is a good brand, but Mac is a better brand. People should own a Mac in name. That's why PowerBook was also bad.

Look at the iPod, people. Every iPod is just an iPod. People get this. Even on an iPod mini, only iPod is inscribed on the case. iPod is iPod, the brand is clear. Mac should be Mac.

Think of it in terms of the first Macintosh computer. It was simply called Macintosh. Now currently, iMac is the Macintosh, like the iPod with video is iPod. iMac is hard to scrap as a brand, but everything else can be scrapped with ease. (I don't think iMac Mini and iMac Pro is an option)

So

iPod shuffle
iPod nano
iPod

iMac*
Mac Mini (instead of mini)
Mac Pro

MacBook
MacBook Mini
MacBook Pro

* Simply Mac would make no sense. See a conversation:

Person #1
Do you own a Mac?

Person #2
Yeah, I own a Mac. Shall I bring it with me?

Person #1
You want to lug a desktop to school?

You see, if iMac was called simply Mac, like the first Macintosh, people would confuse the Mac computer with the Mac platform. Do you own a Mac? No, I own a MacBook. So iMac is here to stay. Scrap everything else.

[VespR]

It's all well and good running Windows on a 'MacBook Pro' (hate that name). But windows can be quite funny when it comes to drivers. It's gonna be a bitch getting your isight to work. You're going to need to someone to write the software for it, which I doubt will happen.

To be honest I buy a Mac to get away from Windows. If I'm going to be switching OS's I still want my music collection there to listen to, movies etc and there's no way I'll take two copies of everything.

[nms]

here's what i think would make a better naming strategy:

take away "power" because they're not PPC. we still want the same catchy (stylish, imo) naming scheme...replace Power w/Pro

iBook
ProBook
iMac
ProMac

and the others?
iPod family
ProPod ooh,some sort of über PMP. or rename the mac mini to ProPod, and have it totall a media centric thing.
mmm..

too bad it's not real.

[VespR]

I liked what someone said up ahead about the x86 architecture.

iBook
xBook

iMac
xMac

etc...

I just don't associate the word 'Mac' with the laptop range. It's always been 'Book'

[iMeowbot]

It seems Schiller has stated clear that these new Mac Intel computers will be able to run Windows just fine.
Really, he said nothing of the sort. He said that Apple wouldn't mind if people got Windows to run on the machines. He didn't say that Apple have performed the necessary extra work to make it happen.

For an EFI-based PC to boot current Windows versions, some extra compatibility code has to be added to the firmware. It may be present, if Apple worked from existing reference code and left it in there, but we don't know yet. If it's not there (Apple wouldn't really need it for OS X), someone else will have to write it.
Isn't this a great added-value to the Mac?
I think that a hosted Windows (a la VMware) would be a lot more interesting, really. It would be a lot more likely to work well on current and future Macs too. Dual boot is clunky.

It's all well and good running Windows on a 'MacBook Pro' (hate that name). But windows can be quite funny when it comes to drivers. It's gonna be a bitch getting your isight to work. You're going to need to someone to write the software for it, which I doubt will happen.
It may not be so bad. The original iSight works with Windows, since it uses a fairly generic DV interface. If the new integrated ones (apparently connected via USB internally) are similarly generic, there could already be drivers out there for them.

[Stu-Duncan]

Will XP or Vista run on an Intel Mac? - Yes M$ just has to add a few more drivers.

Will OSX run on Windows hardware? - yes, but it won't be supported and won't include most of the drivers.

Net result: Mac Users think Vista is good - it will run on their Mac
Windows users think OSX is lousy - it won't work on their Dell

What is important is that for every 10 Intel Macs sold, M$ will sell 7 copies of Windows. M$ wins again.

Probably a good trade off for Microsoft to keep Office going for 5 more years on the back of all those extra Vista licences they are going to sell at "full" (not bundled) price.

[dubbz]

hProPod ooh,some sort of über PMP

The überBook, and the überMac.

[avus]

As industrial designer/technical illustrator who must use professional CAD/CAM softwares, Windows is so dominant in this field that I can't get away from it. I use Rhino3D, my friends from college years use Alias Studio, Solidworks and Pro/E, but we all grew up using Mac and never wanted to give it up. We had no choice but set up multiple machines running different OS.

So, this new era is really, really a blessing. I hope a third-party will be specializing in setting up dual-booting Intel Macs. I also want Apple to use Quadra or Fire as graphic card. Then, it can truly be called a PRO machine.

[nms]

The überBook, and the überMac.

überMacBookProPod with Video.

[Nermal]

Really, he said nothing of the sort. He said that Apple wouldn't mind if people got Windows to run on the machines. He didn't say that Apple have performed the necessary extra work to make it happen.

For an EFI-based PC to boot current Windows versions, some extra compatibility code has to be added to the firmware. It may be present, if Apple worked from existing reference code and left it in there, but we don't know yet. If it's not there (Apple wouldn't really need it for OS X), someone else will have to write it.

Yes! Somebody else gets it! I can stop tearing my hair out now :)

[gnasher729]

It seems Schiller has stated clear that these new Mac Intel computers will be able to run Windows just fine. Isn't this a great added-value to the Mac?

He hasn't stated that at all. He has stated that Apple hasn't done anything actively to prevent Windows from running. If Windows needs feature X in a machine to run, and MacOS X doesn't need it, then nobody has told the Apple engineers to remove feature X so that Windows won't run. Nobody has told them to add it either. And nobody has told them to test it, so the feature might be there, but not working or not working reliably, or it might not be there because nobody thought of adding it.

Microsoft is free to buy a dozen iMacs and to test if Windows XP or Longhorn install and work on it, and if it doesn't work, they can modify XP or Longhorn to make it work so they can sell Windows to Macintosh owners, and Apple won't do anything to prevent it. But Apple won't help them either.

[Booga]

I'm reallly REALLY needing to buy a PowerMac G5 and I'm wondering if I should just get a high end iMac, since it feels the next OS wont be supported on old macs, or am I just being paranoid.


You're just being paranoid. All the major apps will be Universal for years. I would imagine that not only would 10.5 be available for PowerPC, but 10.6 as well... it would be very profitable for Apple to do, so it's kind of a no-brainer.

[Dasmo]

I think MacBook is more than likely a transition name. It's not as catchy as PowerBook, and PowerBook was used before PowerPC was even used by Apple.

At the moment they have two laptop options for pro users and it's easier for someone to buy the one they want if they remember the name of it. Can't see them sticking with such a ***** name. mac-top would've been ok though.

[aussie_geek]

With regards to Phil's comment about windows - I am all for it!! Hopefully we can have the best of both worlds. Mac for productivity. Windows for games. How much better can it get??

aussie_geek

[illegalprelude]

Duh! Since PowerBook was change to MacBook, logic dictates that PowerMac will be replaced by MacMac ;). If not that, how about "Big Mac"?

lmao. BigMac would be awesome. dear lord

[vollspacken]

take away "power" because they're not PPC

again: "Power" in Powerbook has nothing to do with PowerPC

[bobthedino]

Will XP or Vista run on an Intel Mac? - Yes M$ just has to add a few more drivers.

Note that as far as I know Windows XP does not support EFI (which is the Intel Mac's OpenFirmware replacement) and so probably can't be installed, whereas Vista will support EFI.

[nms]

again: "Power" in Powerbook has nothing to do with PowerPC

no, i UNDERSTAND that, but to emphasise the change, the difference, and avoid confusion...

[vollspacken]

avoid confusion...

just name it this way:

iBook
Powerbook Core Duo

iMac
Powermac Core Duo

I don't know what would be confusing about that. this is the way it has been for years and it did not confuse me (or anyone I know) in the past...

vSpacken

[Jimbob42]

Hi All,

First of all, really looking forward to the next few weeks. Will be very interesting to hear user reports of dual boot capabilities etc.

Second, what is up with the typo's on Apple's site?

On the Mac Book pages:

(Wireless tab)

Travel, unfettered

Hndreds of hotels around the world have made Wi-Fi compliant 802.11b wireless local area networks (WLANs) available in their guest rooms.

and...

(design tab)

The new power adapter with MagSafe connector is just that: a magnetic connection instead of a physical one. So, tripping over a power cord won’t send MacBook Pro flying off a table or desk; the cord simply breaks cleanly away, without damage to either the lough or the system. As an added nicety, this means less wear on the connectors.

Surely the PR and marketing people would be proofing this!

This kind of spelling mistake / typo is not something I would expect from a multinational company announcing a brand new product!

Thoughts?

James

[howard]

who gives a crap about the name??

whats amazing is that now I can have a mac, boot up into windows and play all the games I want, then boot up into os x for the rest of my computer life. this is amazing!!

[cal6n]

Mine's going to be called "Hobbes", once it gets here!

:p

[gekko513]

extremely sensible attitude and one that will surely bring a lot of people who would otherwise be doubtful over from the darkside ;)

How would partitioning and disk formatting work though?
The Windows multi boot tool is not happy booting anything other than Windows versions as far as I know. You have to install Linux after Windows and use one of the Linux boot loaders (grub/lilo) to multi boot Linux and Windows.

I'm not sure if Mac OS X has any suitable boot loaders as of yet, but I'm sure someone will figure out a solution.

[NickFalk]

Seems MacBook must replace both the iBook and PowerBook over time.

iBook -> MacBook
PowerBook -> MacBook Pro

arn

I rather think it will be three different brands now:
iBook
MacBook Express
MacBook Pro

Or even:
iMac portable
MacBook Express
MacBook Pro

Heck, even the packaging of the new MacBook Pro (har to get used to!) mimicks the packaging of the Pro applications.

[Hattig]

You won't be able to install Windows XP on these new 32-bit Macs.

Apple Used EFI (http://developer.apple.com/documentation/MacOSX/Conceptual/universal_binary/index.html)

The only version of Windows that can run from EFI is Windows 64-bit.

But Yonah is 32-bit.

So no way to boot Windows.

It'd probably be quite hard to find an EFI bootable version of Linux. Does Grub or Lilo support it even?

Vista will probably support EFI however, so you may be able to install a version of Windows later this year.

Edit: Oh, it might have already been pointed out. Sorry.

[Warbrain]

MacBook Pro is such a terrible name. I can't stand it. It seems to half-assed for Apple. I expect a name change at some point when all the computer lines go Intel. At least I pray for a name change since MacBook Pro is just awful.

It doesn't sounds as good as 'PowerBook' or 'iBook' does. It's strange. And I don't think it will ever be normal to call it 'MacBook Pro'.

Should've kept the 'Power' prefix. It would've sounded better, but I know Steve is trying to make the transition as idiot-proof as possible. I've been through the first transition and this transition has overshadowed it in terms of how it's been managed.

And to the one post I read about how the OS won't be supported on PPC after yesterday: Mac OS X will be coded and supported on PPC Apple computers for at least another 5 years. Apple knows that they can't leave us all behind if they want us to buy a new Apple computer when our PPC-based computers finally die.

[gekko513]

I like the name MacBook (Pro). I don't see what't so terrible about it.

[Jesus]

They should have had a blast from the past and called the MacBook the PowerBook Duo, in reference to the 'Core Duo' processor.

I hope that Apple see sense and calls the next PowerMac a PowerMac, as the Powermac is the best possible name for the high end IMHO.

[michael666]

I like the name MacBook (Pro). I don't see what't so terrible about it.

Me too. I like its simplicity: it states that the product is a mac and that it is a notebook. Nothing else. No marketing buzz like power, performa, quadra, uber etc.

[Vanilla]

I must admit I'm hoping that behind the scenes Microsoft are talking to Apple with a view to creating a much improved "VirtualPC" product to take advantage of the new MacPro architecture, that would enable one to have a windows environment either fully bootable or in a window on your desktop.

Being able to access and run with reasonable speed such software as Microsoft Project (which I absolutely have to use) and say Lotus Notes or Outlook to link to my corporate Blackberry all from the same cool machine would be brilliant.

Vanilla

[SiliconAddict]

*shrugs* I'm going to be experimenting with loading XP onto my PowerBook* for several business reasons and one personal one....Civilization IV. :D I fully expect that in short order there will be tools like that will help you setup Windows on the system for dual booting.

[joemama]

Seems MacBook must replace both the iBook and PowerBook over time.

iBook -> MacBook
PowerBook -> MacBook Pro

arn

Arn is right - people who are buying these new MacBooks are really buying the new "iBooks". In June we will see a 17" MacBook Pro. Maybe Apple will release a 12" low-end MacBook as well.

[SiliconAddict]

I like the name MacBook (Pro). I don't see what't so terrible about it.


I personally don't have any problem with it. What I do have problems with is a name change for the sake of "because" The PowerBook name was a good name. A recognizable name. Now they threw that out the window because they changed CPU's? Kinda seems like a stupid reason to me. *shrugs*

[Arcus]

That is exactlywhat I was thinking.

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

It will be called the MacMac

[irrªtiºnal]

... But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

MacMac, XMac, SuperMac, Mac WorkStation, ProMac, MacStudio, Mac-minator, RoboMac... i don;t know! :confused:

[conradzoo]

It will be called the MacMac


A Big mac? :D

[~Shard~]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'

Perhaps, but what is marketable is that it has Intel under the hood. Plus, it's only a name.

[SiliconAddict]

You won't be able to install Windows XP on these new 32-bit Macs.

Apple Used EFI (http://developer.apple.com/documentation/MacOSX/Conceptual/universal_binary/index.html)

The only version of Windows that can run from EFI is Windows 64-bit.

But Yonah is 32-bit.

So no way to boot Windows.

It'd probably be quite hard to find an EFI bootable version of Linux. Does Grub or Lilo support it even?

Vista will probably support EFI however, so you may be able to install a version of Windows later this year.

Edit: Oh, it might have already been pointed out. Sorry.

Hehe. You do realize that this specification is using Intel EFI. If you think Windows won't be compatible in short order you would be wrong. Someone will get XP to a compatible state one way or another. even if someone has to load a helper app to "talk" to EFI. It will happen.

[ebally]

I don't think MacBook Pro is a transitional name, I think it is here to stay. But I do think the casing will change once Leopard is released in January 2007.

I predict by 2007 the names of Apple's hardware lineup will be:

NoteBooks
MacBook Pro
MacBook Mini

Consumer Desktops
iMac
Mac Mini

Professional Desktops
ProMac

[nms]

i think that the problem with the name is simply the inease (is that a word?) of saying it. MacBook Pro compared with PowerBook. I understand that Power- doesnt mean PPC but if they HAD to change it (which might've been a feasable idea to reflect the change in...everything) a name that simply replaced the Power prefix with something else wuld've been more prudent.
MacBook Pro/PowerBook Core Duo....theyre all a bit long and fiddly.

...Which is why i'm going to be calling it the ProBook. Either that, or some powerful lobbying/kidnapping Jonathan Ive campaign to change it.

To be fair, they'll all end up having redesigns anyway. And i doubt there will be ANOTHER name change, that'd be a little stupid IMHO. If you're gonna do it, get it right the first time.

BTW, does anyone esle thing the frontpage of the Apple Store (in the UK at least) is a mess? PowerMac is in Displays section, there's PPC and Intel all over the shop...hell, i knew all about it, but it still made me baulk...everything's EVERYWHERE...

[dernhelm]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

How far we have come that we now consider "Mac" to be the odd name.

[SiliconAddict]

I can see it now. Go into a general computer repair store.

"Hi, can you fix my Mac Book?"
"You're what?"
"My Mac Book"
"What's a Mac Book?"
"You know, the apple laptops?"
"Oh, you mean powerbook"
"No, Mac Book."
"What the **** is a Mac Book?!"
"THE NEW APPLE LAPTOPS!"
"Sorry, I don't know what a Mac Book is. We only fix powerbooks and ibooks."
"Moron...*sigh*"
"Mac Book...*sigh*"

Sounds like a bad who's on first, what's on second, i don't know's on third skit. :eek:

[dguisinger]

Hehe. You do realize that this specification is using Intel EFI. If you think Windows won't be compatible in short order you would be wrong. Someone will get XP to a compatible state one way or another.

Do you even understand the difference between BIOS and EFI?

The Windows XP boot loader makes plenty of calls into the BIOS to read the disk initially before drivers are loaded to load individual drivers; as well as for power management and PnP configuration. Thats why its nice to see the BIOS going away, it was the worst adhoc design ever. Every few years, a new set of BIOS APIs were added...some needing to run in 32-bit protected mode, others in "real-mode" (aka 8086 emulation mode).

All publically available builds of XP REQUIRE the BIOS. Simply replacing the bootloader won't let Windows XP run.

On the other hand, Windows Vista is DESIGNED to run on BOTH EFI and BIOS.

So sure, you might be able to hack XP to attempt to start; but I doubt without serious driver changes and possibly kernel changes that you'd get very far.

More likely, VMWare would step in and build a MacOS X version which would let you run just fine; as VMWare emulates the BIOS for host systems.

[~Shard~]

It's great news to hear that the Intel transition is proceeding ahead of schedule. From the sounds of it, we may see Intel PowerMacs before 2007 now, which would be great. It will be interesting to hear an update from Intel on when Conroe and Woodcrest will be available, and if they are indeed ahead of schedule.

[GuyClinch]

Vista is coming out soon enough anyway and it will run all those old XP programs. So it doesn't matter that much if XP doesn't work. I think someone will find a way to make it work though.

Pete

[darrens]

The first PowerPC Macs in fact weren't called Power Mac at all.

The first three were named

Power Macintosh 6100/60
Power Macintosh 7100/66
Power Macintosh 8100/80

but I forget how the 9100 fitted in to that and I sold the things at the time of the PowerPC transition!

Somewhere along the line, Apple gave in to common usage and started labelling their desktops Power Mac.

Maybe Steve will take us back to the beginning and go for Macintosh Pro...

As for Windows XP I'm sure someone will write a boot loader for it - but don't expect to run Windows on a MacBook as soon as you get it in your hands.

WINE or an open source project like BOCHS are more likely to let you run Windows apps in the short term.

[SiliconAddict]

I think I found out what happens when you try loading OS X on a PC and Windows on a Mac. . .Its not pretty. :eek: ;)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1999499897470398424

[helmsc]

Duh! Since PowerBook was change to MacBook, logic dictates that PowerMac will be replaced by MacMac ;). If not that, how about "Big Mac"?

I'll have one without the pickles :p As for the new iMac I have one coming to replace my mom's aging Strawberry iMac. Next in line is my old PowerMac. I want a "BigMac" with OS X Server.

[iMeowbot]

All publically available builds of XP REQUIRE the BIOS. Simply replacing the bootloader won't let Windows XP run.
There's more to EFI than you may think. Read me. (http://www.google.com/search?q=efi+%22compatibility-support-module%22)

[sfwalter]

I'm not looking to dual boot, but I do want server virtualization. If VMWare makes a version of their product for Mac OS X you will be able to run windows inside a "window" on your Mac OS X desktop.

[bpd115]

Write it down

Powermac will become a ProMac.

Hopefully we'll see dual optical drives make a return and room for more than 2 HDs..

[darrens]

I'm not looking to dual boot, but I do want server virtualization. If VMWare makes a version of their product for Mac OS X you will be able to run windows inside a "window" on your Mac OS X desktop.

This is exactly what I want!

I don't think we'll see Microsoft updating VirtualPC for a while:

1) from their comments today
2) due to the amount of time they took to get VirtualPC running on G5s
3) because Windows Vista will support EFI and probably boot on a MacBook (there are few non-standard parts in it!)

so I hope VMWare comes to the rescue.

Perhaps Apple will make something to take advantage of the Virtualisation tech in the Core Duo - they do have that patent...

[d.perel]

so, I'd say it'll be about 1-2 months for XP to be publicly hacked and run on a new intel mac, and when vista is released, maybe 3-4 weeks. And you know where the only macs running windows are right now? In Apple's secret basement, that used to only house the x86 versions of OS X...Phil Schilller is reading this whole thread and laughing right now...

[Bye Bye Baby]

Is anyone a bit dissappont3ed with the announcements? While these 'new' computers seem interesting- it sure wasn't an explosion that opened Macworld this year. I was expecting my socks to be knocked off. Didn't happen.

They same like good machienes- but the are definately not awesome mac products. In reality it is more of the same. I wonder if it means that Apple might be having more problems than we know??:eek:

Mac mini???? I can't see why they didn't get one on the shelves?:D

[darrens]

And you know where the only macs running windows are right now?

In the hands of developers?? :)

[chibianh]

All this talk about booting a Mac into windows is blasphemy! Why would you want to do that?!?! If anything, I'd want windows apps to launch and run directly in OSX.. now that would be awesome.. Heck, I'd even settle for a VPC-ish window running Windows.. natively. ;) That way, when you have an argument with a PC zealot claiming there's not enough software on the Mac, you can smack him around and say "****, I can run anything you can.. and more!"

As far as the naming goes, I could care less what it's called. Joe schmoe, if he's even a bit computer literate, only knows the term 'Mac' whether it's a powermac, imac, macbook, powerbook, ibook... first thing he'll ask you is "Is that a Mac?"

Now all I am waiting for is a replacement for my Power Mac G5 1.6ghz. Hopefully, sooner than later. :D

[Paul Grayson]

There's a lot of legacy hardware that Windows expects to be there, which I can't see the new Intel Macs having in the same format. Things like system timers and real-time clocks. The device drivers for these are embedded into XP and can't be updated.

[darrens]

All this talk about booting a Mac into windows is blasphemy! Why would you want to do that?!?!

So I can throw my PC in the bin and only have Macs? :D

That's my plan - keep my iBook G4 and get an intel Mac mini for dual booting/virtualisation.

[ruud]

Also in a related issue they don't say whether Apple use the Centrino chipset I guess not. One of the major benefits to using it is battery life... I would guess that the latest machine doesn't complete with Centrino based INTEL portables.
As far as I know, at this time there are no chipsets other than Centrino that support the Core Duo processor.

[jayscheuerle]

Out of the box. Sure, somebody will crack it, but this crack won't be widespread enough to cause Apple any financial damage. Chances are that Apple will make every new software update incompatible with known cracks, forcing yet ANOTHER crack to be applied. After cracking 10.4.4, 10.4.5, 10.4.6 and 10.4.7, Crackers might just realize that their time is worth enough money to buy a Mac.

Mac is now in the name "MacBook" for marketing reasons. Not everybody new iBooks and PowerBooks were Macs. Now they will. It's the rationale that led Acura to drop the names from their cars and replace them with letter-number combinations; it forces you to say the name of the company. If you say you owned a "Legend", many people would not have known who made the car. Now you say you own an "Acura TSX" and all is known. Instead of driving a 650i, you drive a "BMW 650i". It seems that Apple is going to start caring about their computers again and marketing them to the legions that don't use them or don't understand them. The name doesn't have a very "mac-like" ring, but it's a smart move.

[eric_n_dfw]

I think they should go back to Macintosh, and mayne call it the Macintosh 3 or something.

BTW: There are a couple of threads here from last summer talking about this:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=130655
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=1519363

And my blog post from around that time, in case anyone cares: http://geekreality.blogspot.com/2005/06/with-intel-inside-is-it-still-powermac.html

[Machead III]

Alright you hackers, you had better get working on whatever hack will be needed to cleanly duel boot to Windoze, becasue I just ordered myself an Intel iMac, and I want to be running Half Life 2, Deus Ex 2, FEAR and all the glorious games we Mac users have been denied ASAP :D

[eric_n_dfw]

Alright you hackers, you had better get working on whatever hack will be needed to cleanly duel boot to Windoze, becasue I just ordered myself an Intel iMac, and I want to be running Half Life 2, Deus Ex 2, FEAR and all the glorious games we Mac users have been denied ASAP :D
I'm curious to see how fast WINE is available - with it, and a copy of Windows, you "should" be able to run Win32 apps seemlessly.

[darrens]

Out of the box. Sure, somebody will crack it, but this crack won't be widespread enough to cause Apple any financial damage.

I think it just got a lot harder - what's the bet that the release version of Mac OS X 10.4.4 for Intel doesn't support BIOS, only EFI.

[dguisinger]

There's more to EFI than you may think. Read me. (http://www.google.com/search?q=efi+%22compatibility-support-module%22)

Yup. Did you read your own link? It says it allows a BIOS vendor to integrate their existing code for compatibility. It doesn't say its a required mode. Apple doesn't have legacy BIOS code. Apple also doesn't have anything at all that requires legacy BIOS code. Therefore Apple can save money, install a smaller flash ROM, and not have EFI CSM because they don't need it.

People need to just realize if they want windows, wait for VirtualPC, VMWare, or Vista.

We don't even know that the Apple firmware sits in the same location in memory as a standard BIOS. It was always a crippling design on IBM PCs that ROMs sat in the middle of memory space (it was originally at the top of memory space, until CPUs supported more than 1MB). Windows always got by that by changing how the memory appeared using paging; which works...but still left theugly design.

Here's to hoping Apple got rid of a bunch of legacy adhoc design changes made over the years by PC vendors.

[SiliconAddict]

I'm curious to see how fast WINE is available - with it, and a copy of Windows, you "should" be able to run Win32 apps seemlessly.

WINE isn't a good solution. WINE will only work with a handful of apps and frankly forget running anything that uses DirectX which a good majority of games do these days. the best performance you are going to get, for games of course since you don't really need performance for most everyday apps, is going to be booting into Windows with Windows controlling the GPU.

[flahiker]

I'm curious to see how fast WINE is available - with it, and a copy of Windows, you "should" be able to run Win32 apps seemlessly.

The whole point of WINE is that you do not need windows. It translates the win32 API into the native API. Currently that has been for the X-Windows APIs on the UNIX variants. DARWINE is porting it to OSX and to Aqua, I believe. That would allow cut and past between Windows and OSX aps.

Still if I have to run VMware and XP in a window, I will be very happy.

[iMeowbot]

Yup. Did you read your own link?
Yes, I did. did you?

It says it allows a BIOS vendor to integrate their existing code for compatibility. It doesn't say its a required mode.
*golf clap* Who did say it was required? Not I.

Apple doesn't have legacy BIOS code.
So, you have one of these production Macs in your hand and you've looked at the firmware? No, you haven't. None of us has, and this is the p[oint that you and others are missing.

We don't know where Apple got their firmware yet. We don't know what options were built in. It is unreasonable at this time to make any assumptions, based only on the knowledge that Apple used EFI for their firmware, about what will and will not work.

The required code is under 64K, space is not an issue. The only issue is whether or not Apple felt like leaving it in.

[AUBPsych]

I am assuming that the MacBooks will go through another revision before April or May comes around. I really do appreciate the early adopters, though. ;)

I just hope this new MacBook Pro serves me well for four years when I buy one...

[BenRoethig]

Yup. Did you read your own link? It says it allows a BIOS vendor to integrate their existing code for compatibility. It doesn't say its a required mode. Apple doesn't have legacy BIOS code. Apple also doesn't have anything at all that requires legacy BIOS code. Therefore Apple can save money, install a smaller flash ROM, and not have EFI CSM because they don't need it.

And they could forget the switchers too. Schiller saying that it will run windows seems to indicate that the CSM module is present.

[Hattig]

The name 'Mac Mini' was the first step in this new naming scheme.

We will have, by the end of this year:

Mac Mini (Celeron version of Yonah, coming in a few months)
Mac (? standalone Mac, not for power users, feasible but unlikey (Grrr!))
iMac (Integrated Mac)
Mac Pro (Replacing PowerMac, although PowerMac does have 'Mac' in it...)

MacBook Mini (10.6" laptop, feasible but unlikely)
MacBook (Repacing iBook - Celeron Yonah variant)
MacBook Pro (Replacing PowerBook, 17" and 13" will arrive within 6 months)

And, of course, the Mac Media, with 50" Plasma Display hehe :p

[Lacero]

Found this link funny - Why Steve turned to Intel (http://www.youtube.com/watch.php?v=Y3xKhLlhzfM)

Here's to the Crazy Ones http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=35452 (http://www.uriah.com/apple-qt/movies/think-different.mov)

[1macker1]

Blah, if he doesn't care that people will install Windows on a intel Mac, then he shouldn't care if people installed OS X for intell on PCs. What type of hypocritical ******** is SJ trying to pull.

[BenRoethig]

I am assuming that the MacBooks will go through another revision before April or May comes around. I really do appreciate the early adopters, though. ;)

I just hope this new MacBook Pro serves me well for four years when I buy one...

I wouldn't think so since Merom is slated for release around July.

[darrens]

Schiller saying that it will run windows seems to indicate that the CSM module is present.

He didn't say that - he just said Apple won't be stopping you from installing Windows. There will not be a piece of hardware that detects Windows and disables it.

He didn't say you could buy a retail copy of Windows XP and install it then add a few drivers.

[dguisinger]

Yes, I did. did you?


*golf clap* Who did say it was required? Not I.


So, you have one of these production Macs in your hand and you've looked at the firmware? No, you haven't. None of us has, and this is the p[oint that you and others are missing.

We don't know where Apple got their firmware yet. We don't know what options were built in. It is unreasonable at this time to make any assumptions, based only on the knowledge that Apple used EFI for their firmware, about what will and will not work.

The required code is under 64K, space is not an issue. The only issue is whether or not Apple felt like leaving it in.

Actually Intel OpenSourced EFI code. Check their site, that is most likely where Apple got it. The Apple boot process will look and feel exactly like booting a PPC mac; you can bet they customized it to their hearts content. The question of CSM still is on the table; but my bet would be no CSM, which reflects their comment that they won't stop windows, but they wont say XP will run either.

[Hattig]

WINE isn't a good solution. WINE will only work with a handful of apps and frankly forget running anything that uses DirectX which a good majority of games do these days. the best performance you are going to get, for games of course since you don't really need performance for most everyday apps, is going to be booting into Windows with Windows controlling the GPU.

Transgaming currently allow Linux (http://www.transgaming.com/products_linux.php) systems to run Windows Direct X games. I believe it uses Wine and an in-house reimplementation of Direct X targetting Linux technologies.

Indeed they also offer a Mac porting layer (http://www.transgaming.com/products_mac.php), but of course in the past the game needed to be recompiled to PowerPC. I wonder how many Mac 3D games use this extra layer translating Direct X calls to OpenGL calls - it might explain why some games run slower.

I don't think it will take them long to create a product that will allow Windows Direct X games to run directly on x86 Macs. Once that happens one of the major arguments for using Windows will disappear for a small fee.

[dguisinger]

And they could forget the switchers too. Schiller saying that it will run windows seems to indicate that the CSM module is present.

Not nessecarly. He didn't say would run Windows XP. It will run Windows Vista no matter what, because Vista works natively without CSM. Vista is only a year away, I'm sure Apple has access to the beta's through MSDN since they produce some complex software (aka QuickTime) for Windows. So they would know Vista works just fine.

[AUBPsych]

I wouldn't think so since Merom is slated for release around July.

O RLY? That would be kinda good for me, since I could hold off for a month and a half to buy a Merom machine. I really need one in late May...but from all the talk, Merom sounds like it would be worth the wait. Thanks for that bit of info :)

[BenRoethig]

Since the intel iMacs are shipping today, I'm hoping that someone will test them for dual booting pretty soon. I am particularly intersted in intel iMac and Macbook's video game performance under Windows, because the only reason I put up with my Windows PC is the game library.

Unfortunately, Apple went with the X1600 for their first "Pro" intel laptop, instead of the much more powerful Nvidia Geforce Go 7800 (or even the 6800), which can be found in most professional Windows laptop's (including Dell, with the magnificently powerful XPS laptop).

The 7800 won't fit in the MacBook Pro's form factor. These are more for the ThinkPad crowd. Look, Apple is about form over function and will be as long as Steve Jobs is at the helm.

[LordMord]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'


Ill have a MacBook, fries and a large Coke to go please... nice...

Will they make a MacBook meal I wonder?

:D :cool:

LM

[Don't panic]

The name 'Mac Mini' was the first step in this new naming scheme.

We will have, by the end of this year:

Mac Mini (Celeron version of Yonah, coming in a few months)
Mac (? standalone Mac, not for power users, feasible but unlikey (Grrr!))
iMac (Integrated Mac)
Mac Pro (Replacing PowerMac, although PowerMac does have 'Mac' in it...)

MacBook Mini (10.6" laptop, feasible but unlikely)
MacBook (Repacing iBook - Celeron Yonah variant)
MacBook Pro (Replacing PowerBook, 17" and 13" will arrive within 6 months)

And, of course, the Mac Media, with 50" Plasma Display hehe :p

i think it would make sense, but without the "standalone mac", so:

Mac Mini
iMac
Mac Pro

and

MacBook Mini
iBook
MacBook Pro

[ifjake]

the name i have only slight qualms with. it's stuff that i'll quickly get over i'm sure. but the biggest problem for me is the price. the MacBook Pro is more expensive than the PowerBooks were. i thought one of the benifits of going to intel was that it was going to mean cheaper machines. nope. guess not.

[BenRoethig]

Not nessecarly. He didn't say would run Windows XP. It will run Windows Vista no matter what, because Vista works natively without CSM. Vista is only a year away, I'm sure Apple has access to the beta's through MSDN since they produce some complex software (aka QuickTime) for Windows. So they would know Vista works just fine.

And with Vista having so many Mac like feature, how many do you think would choose Apple after having to wait that long?

[jennysbelly]

I'd wait if I were you even Steve himself said Photoshop doesn't run under Rosetta that fast, well fast enough for professionals anyway.

Besides why do you need a new Mac so bad? Your current one blown up or don't you own one at the moment?

Back on topic, like has been mentioned above the name Powerbook was coined in October 1991 in the Sculley era, even when Powerbooks used Motorola 68000's so nothing to do with PowerPC's.

My reckoning is Steve wants to get away from the names coined by his predecessors at Apple while he was away. Already gone after a few months in office were the Centris, Quadra and LC names and branding, along with Newton etc etc, and he probably wanted to get rid of Powerbook and PowerMac too maybe just that would've and is taking longer to do?

Just my slant on things of course?:D

Here's my dilemna. I am currently MAC-less, with a cheapo HP desktop at home, and a wintel laptop at the office. I've been looking at getting a MAC for awhile, and had decided on the 20" imac. Although I didn't anticipate the imac being intel-ed so soon, I decided to wait for the expo. I currently do not own ANY Mac software, and am starting a graphic design online program shortly. I don't feel like buying the G5 is the good option, so should I just bite the bullet, by the Intel, and by the software and deal with rosetta until the binaries come out? Is there another option I'm not seeing?

[Goldcard]

Yea i was really disapointed when apple didnt release a cheap mobile machine with intel. i was looking for an ibook around the 1000 dollar price range and was disapointed when the lowest price book came in at 2000. something i was not ready to fork over for a computer i wouldnt get until febuary. so last night i bit the bullet and bought the crappy 12" i book. that'll have to do until later this year or later next year. how long do you guys think manufacturers will keep making software compatible with powerpc?

[BenRoethig]

the name i have only slight qualms with. it's stuff that i'll quickly get over i'm sure. but the biggest problem for me is the price. the MacBook Pro is more expensive than the PowerBooks were. i thought one of the benifits of going to intel was that it was going to mean cheaper machines. nope. guess not.

Whoever said it would be cheaper? Apple's expense comes from profit margins, better quality component, and custom designed parts. Dell has most of the work done for them. If you look at wintel machines with non-standard form factors, they are not cheap either.

[atari1356]

the name i have only slight qualms with. it's stuff that i'll quickly get over i'm sure. but the biggest problem for me is the price. the MacBook Pro is more expensive than the PowerBooks were. i thought one of the benifits of going to intel was that it was going to mean cheaper machines. nope. guess not.

The Intel Core Duo processors are more expensive for Apple to buy than the G4 processors were - so it's not surprising to me that the new models are a little more expensive. It's still less than I paid for my 1.5Ghz PowerBook a year and a half ago... and they're much faster and have some nice new features. Dropping FW800 was probably a cost cutting measure.

Think of it this way, you're getting 4-5 times the processor power and a much faster front side bus for only a couple hundred dollars more. I'd gladly pay the extra.

[xejn]

the reasons for the name change are apparent:

1) The name PowerXXXX came from the use of the PowerPC. No more PowerPC, no more PowerMac and PowerBook. There could even be contractual issues with using the name.

2) The name Power came from the days of John Sculley as CEO. We all know the rumour about how Jobs killed the Newton because it was Sculley's baby. This is of course a less likely reason.

3) Even if there are no contractual issues, it does make sense from a marketing standpoint to differentiate the products.

4) Marketing reason number 2, cleaner nameing for product lines. Mac Book Pro and iMac, that leads to Mac Pro for the desktop pro machine and iMac Book for the consumer notebook (though it could still be iBook). Thus we have Mac XXX Pro for pro and iMac XXX or iXXX for consumer.

All of that said, I'm still not crazy about Mac Book Pro, it just has no ring to it and feels clumsy to say. I wish they went with Pro Mac Mobile.

[halse]

some info on the current lineup of PC duo core models at
http://www.notebookreview.com/
http://www.pcmag.com/
two things of note: the duo core models beat the previous Pentium M by about 50% (overall) to 200% (content creation) and the battery life is pretty much the same or a bit worse

[darrens]

1) The name PowerXXXX came from the use of the PowerPC. No more PowerPC, no more PowerMac and PowerBook. There could even be contractual issues with using the name.

This is just false - I wish people would stop repeating it.

The first PowerXXXX was the PowerBook 100. The PowerBook 100 had a 68k in it, not a PowerPC.

[AidenShaw]

As far as I know, at this time there are no chipsets other than Centrino that support the Core Duo processor.
The "Centrino" bundle is CPU, chipset, and Intel WiFi mini-PCI card. Without all three, you can't use the name "Centrino".

The code name for the Yonah chipset is "Napa", or 945 Express.

http://www.intel.com/products/chipsets/945pm/index.htm

http://www.intel.com/products/i/chipsets/mobile/block_diagram_945pm.gif

[iSee]

not that it matters at all. but I always thought putting power before anything was a bit... well... 80s action figure-esque


SUPER ULTRA MEGA POWER BOOK TRON 2000!!!!!



Whoa, gimmie some of that!

[Super Dave]

That is exactlywhat I was thinking.

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

MacTower?
TowerMac? :rolleyes:

David :cool:

[jihad the movie]

here's what i think would make a better naming strategy:

take away "power" because they're not PPC. we still want the same catchy (stylish, imo) naming scheme...replace Power w/Pro

iBook
ProBook
iMac
ProMac




I couldn't agree more, in fact, I just was about to make the same post.

[Hattig]

Yea i was really disapointed when apple didnt release a cheap mobile machine with intel. i was looking for an ibook around the 1000 dollar price range and was disapointed when the lowest price book came in at 2000. something i was not ready to fork over for a computer i wouldnt get until febuary. so last night i bit the bullet and bought the crappy 12" i book. that'll have to do until later this year or later next year. how long do you guys think manufacturers will keep making software compatible with powerpc?

I have to admit I'm quite happy my 5 month old iBook 12" hasn't been obsoleted totally (I could have handled the typical 66MHz upgrade, but not a dual-core beast that's 4x faster) yet. I'm thinking it'll be intelised in March, April at the latest though (Apple's 30th Anniversary ... new hardware?) but that's purely from a selfish point of view.

As for PowerPC compatibility ... probably years to come. Even by the end of this year, 80%+ of Mac owners will be PowerPC. By the end of 2007 60%. Macs last a long time. Intel optimisations will take precendence over PowerPC optimisations though, no Altivec enhancements for the applications that can benefit.

[darrens]

i was looking for an ibook around the 1000 dollar price range and was disapointed when the lowest price book came in at 2000.

The Core Duo has only been out a week - it's the latest Intel mobile processor. I don't think there's a manufacturer out there that has a $499 or $999 Core Duo notebook

Apple would have had to use the last generation Pentium M to make a cheap Intel iBook.

I don't think Apple would consider releasing a Mac with a Pentium inside after bagging Pentiums for so long - even though it's just a name.

When Merom replaces Yonah, then perhaps we will see some really cheap Core Solo iBooks. Not until then.

[macnews]

Here's my dilemna. I am currently MAC-less, with a cheapo HP desktop at home, and a wintel laptop at the office. I've been looking at getting a MAC for awhile, and had decided on the 20" imac. Although I didn't anticipate the imac being intel-ed so soon, I decided to wait for the expo. I currently do not own ANY Mac software, and am starting a graphic design online program shortly. I don't feel like buying the G5 is the good option, so should I just bite the bullet, by the Intel, and by the software and deal with rosetta until the binaries come out? Is there another option I'm not seeing?

If you are doing serious graphic design, then go with a power mac (or perhaps soon to be Mac Pro). The full desktop model, esp the new ones, are fast and rumored to perhaps be faster than the intel model which will replace them.

Not to offend you or anything, but if you are looking at a 20" imac and consider that good enough for the graphic design you want to do then running via rosetta should be just fine, just bump up your ram to max. I have an 8 month old imac G5 and run CS suite so they are fine for graphic design, but I am not a full time designer.

[AidenShaw]

Apple's expense comes from profit margins, better quality component, and custom designed parts. Dell has most of the work done for them.
Profit margins, for sure.

Better quality components? It looks like the same disks, memory, CPUs, chipsets, graphics, networking and other things have the same part numbers as Dell.

Custom designed parts? OK, there's a TI 1394 chip on the mobo that's not standard on all the other Intel mobos.

Work done for them? Aren't Apples and Dells built by the same contract factories in Taiwan and China?

Before too long, the "Apples last longer" and "Apples hold their resale value" claims will not be supportable by facts.

[dogsbody]

I reckon they'll call the new Powermac just mac:-

iMac

MacBook
MacBook Pro

Mac
Mac Pro

The 'Mac' may just be the new name for the Mac Mini....

What do you reckon? :)

[AidenShaw]

I don't think Apple would consider releasing a Mac with a Pentium inside after bagging Pentiums for so long - even though it's just a name.
Yonah is just a rework of the Dothan Pentium M - but you may have a point.

I wonder if the Steve helped to convince Intel to change the name :eek:

[mi5moav]

Hopefully, Apple won't give away the name and after 2007 powerbook moniker will return. IBM/LENOVO won't change the thinkpad name because of the chip the powerbook is a thinking book. The book has power of thought like thinkpad. It had nothing to do with the chip. I think this will actually hurt sales. When going to best buy you will clearly see a mac book or a win book. Well, sorry i need to run windows so I can't use the macbook. Would rather go into Best Buy and see an Xbook and say does this run windows?? Sure, it does but it comes preloaded with OS X but you are more than welcome to install any OS you like. So, a macbook with Windows installed is no longer a macbook it's a winbook.

xbook pro mac / xbook pro win / xbook pro dual boot
xbook
xmac
imac
macmini

[Super Dave]

<snip>

Mac is now in the name "MacBook" for marketing reasons. Not everybody new iBooks and PowerBooks were Macs. Now they will. It's the rationale that led Acura to drop the names from their cars and replace them with letter-number combinations; it forces you to say the name of the company. If you say you owned a "Legend", many people would not have known who made the car. Now you say you own an "Acura TSX" and all is known. Instead of driving a 650i, you drive a "BMW 650i". It seems that Apple is going to start caring about their computers again and marketing them to the legions that don't use them or don't understand them. The name doesn't have a very "mac-like" ring, but it's a smart move.

The name MacBook Pro grows on you. Yesterday when I heard it, I immediately hated it. Now I like it.

It reminds me of when Apple dropped the rainbow colours from their logo and it took me 2 weeks to get over it. Since this only took a day, I'd say it will work well.

Also, for all the gripers out there Apple just released a MAC teleision ad.

David :cool:

[Super Dave]

I reckon they'll call the new Powermac just mac:-

iMac

MacBook
MacBook Pro

Mac
Mac Pro

The 'Mac' may just be the new name for the Mac Mini....

What do you reckon? :)

I agree, except I can't imagine them dropping the "mini" name from the Mac Mini. It's too cutesy and exactly what Apple is all about. The branding is great.

I imagine it will either be as you say or call them MacTowers.

David :cool:

[Seasought]

After about a year of the "MacBook" and other such name changes everyone will be used to it. It's really not that big of a deviation from Powerbook. I guess it doesn't bother me as much as others. I guess I'm more impressed with what's to come concerning "under the hood" and performance.

As for me, I now own a 2 month old, brand-new relic (Powerbook G4). :D

"Congratulations! Your species is going extinct!"

Doh.

[dogsbody]

I agree, except I can't imagine them dropping the "mini" name from the Mac Mini. It's too cutesy and exactly what Apple is all about. The branding is great.

I imagine it will either be as you say or call them MacTowers.

David :cool:

...or maybe they'll differentiate the Powermacs with Intel as Mac (single core) and Mac Pro (dual core)...

...or have a smaller tower (i.e. expandable Mac Mini) as the Mac. Wonder if they'll release it on the 1st April as well (they did mention it'd be 30 years or something on 1st April 2006).

[darrens]

Yonah is just a rework of the Dothan Pentium M - but you may have a point.

I wonder if the Steve helped to convince Intel to change the name :eek:

I'm sure Intel knew that it was going to be a hard sell to convince Steve that the new heart of the Mac should be a Pentium.

However, I think it's probably just part of Intel's strategy to get away from Pentium = Wintel PC, and broaden the market to Consumer Electronics with things like ViiV.

It's the same strategy that brought Intel to Apple's door - Intel has admitted it wanted a partner that could bring software to market quickly to take advantage of Intel's hardware advances and that's Apple for sure - there's no way Microsoft moves quickly enough.

But it's chicken and egg stuff.

I wonder what the new high-end Intel chips will be called once Pentium completely bites the dust. Does anyone know? It will be the chip in the intel Power Mac replacement, so it may give a clue to naming.

[darrens]

...or maybe they'll differentiate the Powermacs with Intel as Mac (single core) and Mac Pro (dual core)...

...or just drop Power and stick with with they have - Mac Quad

[Stonecoldcleric]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

- MacBook Pro naming. Steve Jobs: "It's a new name because we're kinda done with Power and because we want Mac in the name of our products." This would imply that the MacBook name may not only replace the PowerBook but the iBook as well. Also raises some questions about the continued use of the "PowerMac" name.


iBook will continue on - they couldn't risk looksing their low-end college buyers and others who don't need all the power. Also, he didn't say they were getting rid of the "iEtc" name, infact we have new iLife and etc. I suspect a new line of iBooks soon.

[slughead]

I'd be anxious to see how well windows works on these machines.

[p0intblank]

I like the name MacBook Pro. I'm still getting used to it, but it's all for the cause. :)

[dogsbody]

...or just drop Power and stick with with they have - Mac Quad

That works. But it is a Pro machine....

Besides, Mac Quad sounds like a tabloid headline for a surprise birth of quadruplets in a fast-food chain.

[darrens]

Mac Quad sounds like a tabloid headline for a surprise birth of quadruplets in a fast-food chain.

Doesn't Mac Pro sound like the head-honcho burger flipper at said fast-food chain? :D

[powerbook911]

I think we'll see

iBook become Mac Book
Powerbook is already Mad Book Pro

iMac is iMac (already has Mac in the name)

Mac Mini can remain unchanged

Mac Pro - may be the name of Powermacs.

[gauchogolfer]

I admit that when I saw the keynote stream for Macbook Pro, I was at first a bit worried about the viability of my rev D 15" Powerbook. But, after some reflection, I realize that I don't really push the boundaries of my current machine, when running CS2 or Mathematica for work. So, while it would be "nice" to have a new machine (as always), I'm having a harder time staying away from the new iMac. That baby looks sweet.

[dogsbody]

Doesn't Mac Pro sound like the head-honcho burger flipper at said fast-food chain? :D

Well, doesn't Mac Mini sound like something from the kid's menu...:rolleyes:

[itsa]

http://www.youtube.com/p.swf?video_id=Y3xKhLlhzfM&l=124&eurl=&t=Jobs

Cheesy work.. but funny

[damnyooneek]

you people have too much time on your hands to complain about the name of a product. who cares as long as the product is good thats all that should matter? its not like steve jobs named your first born kid. its just a computer?

[jennysbelly]

If you are doing serious graphic design, then go with a power mac (or perhaps soon to be Mac Pro). The full desktop model, esp the new ones, are fast and rumored to perhaps be faster than the intel model which will replace them.

Not to offend you or anything, but if you are looking at a 20" imac and consider that good enough for the graphic design you want to do then running via rosetta should be just fine, just bump up your ram to max. I have an 8 month old imac G5 and run CS suite so they are fine for graphic design, but I am not a full time designer.


Well I'm not a designer at all right now. I'm taking a class. I don't have the money or the need for a Powermac.

[darrens]

Well, doesn't Mac Mini sound like something from the kid's menu...:rolleyes:

At least they got MacBook Pro right - doesn't fit on the menu at all. Can't see that particular fast food joint selling literature.

Night - I'm off to bed!

Hopefully there will be some more juicy details from those at MacWorld in the morning Aussie time! I was late to work this morning catching up with all the news. :o

[darrens]

its just a computer?

Yes - but it's fun! Midnight - really must go to bed!!!

[DrEasy]

iBook
ProBook
iMac
ProMac

I agree too! I came up with the same names as well.

[esaleris]

Look, guys - to be honest, there are some names that are better, and some names that sound worse. But in the end, all its used for is making sure the customer - and everyone around him - knows the product. It was imperative to change the name so that when Customer A goes into the store and some random dude asks "Is that a PowerBook," A can say "No, it's a MacBook" and turn random dude into Customer B. Frankly, I'm more bothered by the fact it looks like PowerBook, more than the name.

As for general likability, the word "Power" is only good because we KNOW it. We got used to it. If Apple had named their music play iPack in 1999/2000, then we would all be used to it, and think "Pod" was stupid.

If it bothers you this much, and continues to, I'm sure some genius is going to come out with business out of making thin re-appliable vinyl stickers that matches the silver tint of the notebooks - stickers that you can order with customizations to display "___'s PowerBook" or whatever.

[Mike Teezie]

That video was hilarious.

[ruckus]

wow. Apple just released a sweet laptop and people are saying they will stick with G4s because of the name? regaurdless of the performance of the new one?

I was shocked by the name change as well, but you know what? it works, its simple, and it is still an apple laptop. One with dual core and a slew of other features to boot. The name will be commonplace soon enough.

Can't wait till mine shows up. February can't come soon enough!

[Goldcard]

yea i wish i could get a new one haha. poor college kid here. had to get a G4 :rolleyes: oh well its my first mac and i get it in a few days so i'm excited.

[nms]

I couldn't agree more, in fact, I just was about to make the same post.

I agree too! I came up with the same names as well.

prefixes are the way forward, and can keep the Pro-aspect of it all....suffixes are clumsy.

as i said before, ProBook, i await you...

[wildmac]

All this talk about booting a Mac into windows is blasphemy! Why would you want to do that?!?!

Yoh Dude! chill!

I'm a web developer. I need to test websites under windows, and under OSX. I don't give a rat's ass about games. It's all about testing, and using PC-only tools.

[mcdermd]

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

Um, maybe "Macintosh"? I'm surprised only two other people have come to that same conclusion in this thread.

[localghost]

i own a powerbook myself, but i like the new name.
to anyone who isn’t very 'apple' the mac-part is explanation and advertisement at the same time, geeks will refer to nicknames like TiBook, AlBook etc anyways.

but wait - actually, i couldn’t care less about the naming.
i’m going for the right mix of functional+esthetical design, built quality, specs and price. i rather see the power in the benchmarks only than in the name only. :D

[alexf]

Too bad they had to name the new laptop the "MacBook Pro." Sounds quite cheesy to my ears. It would have been nicer if they had left the "Pro" out, but I guess they will need this little word to differentiate it from the renamed iBook, soon to come...

Fortunately names are not important.

Just my 2¢, for what it's worth.

[Mitch1984]

If iBook change to MacBook, wouldn't it be odd that iMac is only product that has "i"?

I think iBook will not get the new name. There is only 2 way of products name that i can think of...

1st - keep "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, iMac, Mac Pro
Notebook - iBook, MacBook Pro

2nd - get rid of the "i"
Desktop - Mac mini, Mac(odd?), Mac Pro
Notebook - MacBook, MacBook Pro

What do you think?

Posted it for me, I think it's gonna be option 1.
The iMac & iPod are iconic now they won't get rid of the "i".
Apart from the iBook, they will call that the MacBook.
Although your option 2 does looker alot 'cleaner'.

[wildmac]

Here's my dilemna. I am currently MAC-less, with a cheapo HP desktop at home, and a wintel laptop at the office. I've been looking at getting a MAC for awhile, and had decided on the 20" imac. Although I didn't anticipate the imac being intel-ed so soon, I decided to wait for the expo. I currently do not own ANY Mac software, and am starting a graphic design online program shortly. I don't feel like buying the G5 is the good option, so should I just bite the bullet, by the Intel, and by the software and deal with rosetta until the binaries come out? Is there another option I'm not seeing?

If you are taking classes, then the iMac will be fine. Buy the current software at a student discount, and get started with learning. In a year, when Adobe CS3 is out, and the ProMacs are out, then you can upgrade if it still looks like you will persue it as a career choice.

[strange days]

hola, hadn't got the time to go through the 8 pages yet, so sorry if this is a repost; but the new MacIntels boot under EFI.

Is this a problem for dual booting ( or emulation ) ?

[macnews]

Well I'm not a designer at all right now. I'm taking a class. I don't have the money or the need for a Powermac.

In that case, I suspect you will be fine with a 20" iMac. The speed bump by the intel processor may not make it faster running stuff under/through rossetta, but I think it will be good enough for what you want. If you can wait a few weeks, I would thus allowing all the mac pubs to get their hands on an actual imac and run some tests. I know many have looked at putting the CS suite through its paces to see how non-universal binaries compare to universal ones.

[~Shard~]

In that case, I suspect you will be fine with a 20" iMac. The speed bump by the intel processor may not make it faster running stuff under/through rossetta, but I think it will be good enough for what you want. If you can wait a few weeks, I would thus allowing all the mac pubs to get their hands on an actual imac and run some tests. I know many have looked at putting the CS suite through its paces to see how non-universal binaries compare to universal ones.

Yeah, I think this is good advice. Wait a for a few weeks until some hardcore users get their hands on these machines and put them through the paces. When we see sopme real live benchmarks and hear some reviews and impressions, then we'll have a better idea of how these machines really perform and if they are as good as Apple it touting them to be.

[sfwalter]

Since the intel iMacs are shipping today it should be a week or so before we get some good feedback on performance.

[Dunepilot]

I think the replacement Powerbook name is useless. Too disjointed.

I'm going to keep calling them Powerbooks.

I also think the name 'MacStation' as mentioned earlier in this thread would be the best option for the PowerMac (which I will still call a PowerMac), seeing as they've decided to change it.

[Damek]

With regards to Phil's comment about windows - I am all for it!! Hopefully we can have the best of both worlds. Mac for productivity. Windows for games. How much better can it get??

*raises hand*

Um ... not having to boot into Windows for games?
:p

[Damek]

sense apple switch to intel will there be more games available for OS X?
Call of Duty 2 for mac:D
Battlefield 2 for mac :D
Counter-Strike for mac :D

Not being too into games anymore, except for a bunch of old ones I'm already familiar with and love playing over and over, like the original Dooms and Quakes, Half-Life 1, Unreal Tournament 1, and some old adventure games...

I'm most interested in seeing older Windows games run on these new machines.

For games like Doom & Quake where there's source, I suppose it'll be the same old thing, with some ports available, but for other games, unless WINE makes big headway, I'm not expecting much.

The biggest thing isn't going to be the chip, but OS X and the way it handles graphics and sound. There are fewer OS X source ports of games where you can do that because people don't have Macs to work with and make sure the ports work. Sadly, that isn't necessarily going to change just because Macs now include Intel chips.

Big companies making new games may find it easier to port their games to Mac, but old games whose availability relies on fans of the game trying to port it are still going to be hindered by what computers the fans have.

[macosxuser01]

if apple can't call the new notebooks powerbooks, i think instead of MacBook Pro it should be called iPowerbook. the i standing for Intel even though the 'i' means internet.

[sfwalter]

From what I read its up to Apple's implementation of EFI if you will be able to dual boot with windows xp (or before) and linux. EFI can include a bios compatibility module but it's not required.

So since Apple has no need for the old pc bios, the question is did Apple include it or not?

[chibianh]

Yoh Dude! chill!

I'm a web developer. I need to test websites under windows, and under OSX. I don't give a rat's ass about games. It's all about testing, and using PC-only tools.

So am I... you should have read the rest of my post. ;)

[interlard]

Where did the S-Video output go? Will there be some kind of adaptor, like the VGA adaptor that comes with it?

I can live without:
- great battery life (I just use it at home)
- PC card slot (ExpressCard instead)
- FW800
- dual layer DVD burner

But if I get one of these, I'll need to finally buy a DVD player. Hmmm.

[macosxuser01]

no s-video but also they need to have a firewire 800 port.:D

[portent]

I find it odd that Apple now wants to put the "Mac" name in all of its products. Before the iMac, every Mac OS computer Apple made had "Macintosh" in the name.

Old PowerBooks were called..."Apple Macintosh PowerBook." Photos prove it:

http://www.allaboutapple.com/museo/pictures/donazioni/pb1400_cs.jpg
http://www.macmothership.com/gallery/newads3/3400a.jpg

Sometime in the G3 series, Apple dropped the "Macintosh" altogether.

Why not just put the "Mac" back where it was before they messed with the name?

[nsb3000]

I must admit I'm hoping that behind the scenes Microsoft are talking to Apple with a view to creating a much improved "VirtualPC" product to take advantage of the new MacPro architecture, that would enable one to have a windows environment either fully bootable or in a window on your desktop.

Vanilla

I agree. Duel boot, while it sounds like a nice idea, it is really only feasible if you spend the mass-majority of your time in one OS or the other. What you really want is something like Virtual PC (Accept now at a usable speed), or even better a compatibility layer like a windows version of X11 or something, that allows you to use the windows apps you have to along side your mac apps.

[Object-X]

...therefore....

PowerMac -> MacMac

Actually I think it should be...

Mac² <-- Mac squared, why doesnt that tag work?

Being dual core and all

[Westside guy]

Re: dual-booting the new Macs w/ Windows...

I think rather than doing that, folks might want to keep an eye on Codeweavers (the company that makes Crossover Office, which allows MS Office to run on Linux via WINE). They've already said they're going to work on getting their WINE implementation to work on the Intel Macs. An advantage to this approach is it'll run Windows apps in "rootless mode" (in its own window, without an underlying XP window such as you see with Virtual PC), and without launching a full-blown Windows session - that'll mean Windows apps will launch more quickly.

[Macheath_Messer]

I like "AppleMacIntel NonPro Rev A 2006 "


LOL, or how about:

"MacBook Amateur"!! :p

[d_saum]

I can see it now. Go into a general computer repair store.

"Hi, can you fix my Mac Book?"
"You're what?"
"My Mac Book"
"What's a Mac Book?"
"You know, the apple laptops?"
"Oh, you mean powerbook"
"No, Mac Book."
"What the **** is a Mac Book?!"
"THE NEW APPLE LAPTOPS!"
"Sorry, I don't know what a Mac Book is. We only fix powerbooks and ibooks."
"Moron...*sigh*"
"Mac Book...*sigh*"

Huh? Macs don't break? Why would you need to take it to be repaired? Just to mess with the repair techs? You cruel bastard!!!! JK... Although, If your macbook was still so new that they didn't know what it was, why would you be taking it to a "general computer repair store"??? And also, who would ever trust someone who didn't know the name of the products they worked on?

Speaking of names, I'd bet money its going to be:

Mac mini
iMac
Mac Pro (maybe...)
MacBook
MacBook Pro

iBook is outta there and power mac will be changed, but DEFINITELY not to iMac Pro.

[micsaund]

*raises hand*

Um ... not having to boot into Windows for games?
:p

Yep, I'm hoping you're right! Hopefully with the Intel CPU and the rising awareness of OS X (and Linux) more gamedevs will be targeting multi-platform releases. And, with the new CPUs, the Macs will finally have similar game performance available, so maybe they'll actually release for Mac native. That's my hope at least :)

Mike

[smiley]

It's all well and good running Windows on a 'MacBook Pro' (hate that name). But windows can be quite funny when it comes to drivers. It's gonna be a bitch getting your isight to work. You're going to need to someone to write the software for it, which I doubt will happen.

To be honest I buy a Mac to get away from Windows. If I'm going to be switching OS's I still want my music collection there to listen to, movies etc and there's no way I'll take two copies of everything.

I'm the same way. I don't want to run windows, I even hate running virtualPC. What I want is to be able to run win32 apps in something like Wine. Wrap a cocoa interface around it like we have now with X11 and then I can run my ONE or TWO windows apps that I'm forced to keep around. I don't need the whole windows thing.

That would be sweet.

edit: Sorry, codeweavers already mentioned. But, I second it. I have an old version of codeweavers from my linux days (preswitch) and it worked remarkably well. I'd buy a copy for Mac in a heartbeat.

[Peace]

I dont understand what all the fuss is about..
Why would anybody even want to dual-boot?..
I had my DTK dual-booted mainly for testing purposes.The only windoze app I ever used was flight simulator..
It wont be worth the hastle imho..
As for naming conventions..How many people here refer to their "
Mac" as a "Mac" already ?..
I understand folks are used to the name powerbook but before that name was around people still refered to their Mac as a Mac!..

The Powermac will be called the ProMac 64..

[bugfaceuk]

So dual boot with XP would depend on Apple's EFI including CFM, which is optional, so why would they do it? They don't have a legacy BIOS issue, why build one into their machines? It's not Apple being evil or lazy, it would be Apple being as productive as possible.

Dual boot would be "ok-ish", the virtualization solution is "prety ok if performance is OK" but want I want is "Suspend & Switch", hit a key combo, sleep the mac, switch into Windows (or boot if it's the first time) sleep windows, wake mac... My reasons are the same as others have stated, games.

Even better would be a robust Wine solution, BUT it's fiddly and despite really great hard work from all in the wine/crossover teams, I've not ever been that impressed with the reality, but the vision is a great one.

As to MacBook Pro as a name... eeeehhh.... I don't think it's going to hurt, and I don't really care that much myself.... but... it's not great is it...

Mind you, no one ever listens to me... The Intel machines should have been called "Mintels"

[ruud]

I'm the same way. I don't want to run windows, I even hate running virtualPC. What I want is to be able to run win32 apps in something like Wine. Wrap a cocoa interface around it like we have now with X11 and then I can run my ONE or TWO windows apps that I'm forced to keep around. I don't need the whole windows thing.

Check out the DarWine project.

[wildmac]

So am I... you should have read the rest of my post. ;)

But what you were suggesting, running Windows apps natively under OSX, would not provide a true testing environment.

But perhaps I missed something else...:rolleyes:

[mrwalker]

Duel boot

Now THIS I cannot wait to see:D

[dr_lha]

Where did the S-Video output go? Will there be some kind of adaptor, like the VGA adaptor that comes with it?

I can live without:
- great battery life (I just use it at home)
- PC card slot (ExpressCard instead)
- FW800
- dual layer DVD burner

But if I get one of these, I'll need to finally buy a DVD player. Hmmm.

There's a $19 DVI->Composite/S-Video adapter that Apple makes for this purpose. I think that's fine, its what us 12" PB owners have had to put up with for years.

I always wondered why they put an S-Video out on PBs. VGA I can understand (nothing worse than getting to a conference having forgot your DVI->VGA adapter when using a Projector).

[~Shard~]

Duel boot

Cool, I've never heard of duel booting before - can you please explain this concept more? Do the OSes actually battle to decide which one loads? Do they use pistols at dawn or some other method? :p :cool:

[Goldcard]

haha. nice. i bet they fight with viruses. especially if windows is involved in a duel. :p

[Bubbasteve]

I dunno if this was mentioned in previous posts, for I just skipped to the end of the thread... but I really can't see them replacing the iBooks name with Macbook (since Powerbooks are Macbook Pros)... the "i" is a trademark to them, and they still implement the "i" in the iMac... I could see the change to Macbook w. the "Power"line but that is just my opinion

[Chupa Chupa]

It seems to me when Jobs said Apple was "done with Power," it just didn't come out right to me. Why would an computer company struggling to get powerful laptops, and finally gets them say it is done with power? Seems counterintuitive.

I realize Apple wants to get more brand awareness for the Mac brand, but MacBook just doesn't have that cool name that Apple products usually have...though I thought iPod was kinda weird too...still do. As others have noted the Power moniker had nothing to do with the PPC. I'm not sure why they didn't just call the new machine the PowerBook DC (Dual Core).

[whatever]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'
How can you make such a statement.

All PowerBook is to all us is a familiar name. Apple didn't sell more laptops because of the name. At an airport the non-Mac users I travel with don't say "oh look there's a PowerBook and there's a iBook...."; they say "oh look at all of the Mac laptops."

What's marketable is that little Apple logo (rightside up which took forever!).

Whatever!

[dogsbody]

At least they got MacBook Pro right - doesn't fit on the menu at all. Can't see that particular fast food joint selling literature.

Night - I'm off to bed!

Hopefully there will be some more juicy details from those at MacWorld in the morning Aussie time! I was late to work this morning catching up with all the news. :o

What about an expert's guide to fast-food?

[Thanatoast]

I'll put in my vote to nickname the new laptops "probooks". It's a compromise, but whaddaya gonna do?

[xPismo]

Steve said "We want Mac in the name of our products". You can't get much clearer than that - the iBook is going. iMac already has a "Mac" in it so it will stay.

Really simple.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this as simple. Apple is finally using its real name again: Macintosh.

Mac mini
iMac
Mac Pro

MacBook (iMacBook would be a mouthful)
MacBook Pro

As much as I like the marketing concept of a 'power book', I'm not at all upset that Apple is finally cleaning house with its naming system.

[nagromme]

Having "Mac" in the laptop name is very smart for reaching the clueless mass of "what's a Mac?" people. It's good branding and ties all Macs together--finally.

Here on planet Mac we forget how things are on Earth: you can throw a rock in the air and hit someone who doesn't know WHO makes PowerBooks or what they are! In fact, here's a rock... there! Just did it. Point made.

Ironically, the Power in PowerMac DID (originally) stand for PowerPC, while the Power in PowerBook (despite Steve's comment) did NOT. But it's all just "power," apple can keep using the name PowerMac if they wish. I predict that they will stay with that since it has "Mac" already.

I think Steve commenting on "moving away from Power" was an off the cuff comment (and historically inaccurate) and not to be taken too seriously. Adding "Mac" was the real reason I suspect.

My hope: that the future "MacBook"-NON-"Pro" (12"? 13") won't be the ONLY small model. I'd like a small MacBook that keeps as many pro features (dual core, GPU) as possible. Hook up an external display and have it all!

[Multimedia]

Well it is definitely up there with the all time greatest hits of SteveNotes. I am at the show. So a grand slam is 4 runs with one hit.

1. iPods RULE. 83% market share is MASSIVE DOMINANCE.
2. iLife '06 is a MUST HAVE KILLER SET of multimedia applications. They've automated ENHANCED Audio Podcast Production in GarageBand 3. This is HUGE for audio podcasters.
3. Yonah Core Duo iMac is AMAZING. Feel sorry for those who bought last quarter. Same feature set, Intel motherboard running 2-3x faster.
4. Yonah Core Duo MacBook Pro is FANTASTIC. Oh the speed 4-5x faster. Must Have 17" version when it ships in Spring (my guess).

When Microsoft announces "Virtual PC" for Intel Macs, the dirty little secret that the new MacIntels will run Windows Natively, only poor people will want to keep buying PCs. And even that is in question once the Mac Mini and MacBooks (formerly iBooks) ship with single processor Yonahs.

Seems like the last PPC iMacs were kind of a trick. I feel sorry for those who just bought one for Christmas. The speed difference is 2-3x faster on the new ones. I am definitely getting a MacBook Pro. But I'm gonna wait for the 17" model as I want the highest resolution screen I can get for video editing. BTW Crucial is listing the 1 GB MacBook Pro sticks for only $130.99 vs Apple's $300. Amazing price difference. They are the only vendor with a listing at Ramseeker.com (http://ramseeker.com). DDR2 PC2-5300 CL=5. Is that the expected latency figure? A lot slower than pervious ram isn't it? I guess when you are running at 667 MHz that higher latency number won't matter much.

Downside is the need for .Mac. Looking into if that is completely true.

[Meyvn]

I think this naming monikre is retarded. If they HAD to get rid of power, they could have been more creative than 'MacBook Pro.' It just sounds stupid. I mean, if they wanted to keep it simple, they could have at least done 'ProBook.' That would've sounded infinitely less stupid, IMO. iMac, ProMac. iBook, ProBook.

[CaptainHaddock]

Anyway, I'm wondering how hard it would be to use an external drive formatted with xp and boot off of it.

Forgive me if I've overlooked anyone else's response to this. :)

What you suggest won't work, because EFI isn't like a PC BIOS. BIOS looks at a specific little sector on the start-up disk and blindly runs whatever code is located there. With a Windows installation, that'll be the Windows kernel.

EFI has a more intelligent and customizable way of choosing the OS to load. The firmware of an Intel Mac is almost certainly not designed to mimic an 8086 PC. It won't look for a boot sector, and it won't know offhand what to do with an XP-formatted disk.

[riversky]

The only reason the computers were named "PowerBook", "PowerMac" was because they had a PowerPC CPU. That is why they are dropping the name. Around the floor there is a feeling that Apple did the right thing and will leave not only the PowerPC architecture in the past but the name that went along with it.

The talk around the hotel last night was that the PowerMac will be called the "ProMac"

[dr_lha]

The only reason the computers were named "PowerBook", "PowerMac" was because they had a PowerPC CPU.

As has been said over and over again, the Powerbook name predates PowerPC. The first Powerbook had an Motorola 68K family chip in it.

[nightcap965]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'

In response to all those claiming that the name "Macbook" is somehow less desirable or marketable, please note that this is Steve Jobs we're talking about. Steve "Reality Distortion Field" Jobs, CEO of the two hottest companies in the country, Pixar and Apple, and arguably the greatest marketing genius who ever lived. Unless you're currently the brightest executive at Chiat-Day, I would be inclined to take Steve's word that "Macbook" is not only a good name, but eminently marketable. I'm betting that inside of two months, we'll see a distinctive silver case with a white stylized apple in the middle of it and think, "Oh look, a Macbook!"

-- Bill

... and *this*, son, is Shinola.

[benpatient]

nope.

say it out loud.

Mac Book Pro

Power Book

the PB name really is stronger.
The phonetics of it, the cadence...

at least for english-speaking peoples...

[helmsc]

Since the intel iMacs are shipping today it should be a week or so before we get some good feedback on performance.

I'll give my first impressions to the group sometime Thursday night. I have a friend that works at an Apple Retail Store that is supposed to be overnighting my mother's iMac to me.:cool:

[sehix]

The 'MacBook' name isn't nearly as marketable as 'PowerBook'

Not yet.

[Lepton]

But what are they going to call the Power Mac?

"Macintosh." It makes sense.

iPod
iMac
MacBook
Macintosh

[JoeBeCrazy]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this as simple. Apple is finally using its real name again: Macintosh.

Mac mini
iMac
Mac Pro

MacBook (iMacBook would be a mouthful)
MacBook Pro

As much as I like the marketing concept of a 'power book', I'm not at all upset that Apple is finally cleaning house with its naming system.

We're forgetting the levels of professionalism and the integration between applications and hardware.. If you say that apple is getting rid of the "i" then they will eventually get rid of the "i" in their line of applications. iBook is totally good to stay to be the white machine with iMac. Which is like the "softcore" version for home/education/little business use. the "i" Applications describes the home/education/little business genre. Where as the MacBook Pro is a great name matching their Pro lines of apps: FinalCut Pro, Soundtrack Pro. Will there be a MacBook by itself? I don't think so.. there isn't FinalCut by itself. So the "Pro" at the end seems to describe more seriousness and it means what it means: professional-grade hardware and software.

[rockthecasbah]

while i felt an odd feeling saying "Macbook Pro" and feeling the name was stupid, after saying it a lot i kinda like it... it almost grows on you. i still have other gripes with the machine but not in terms of names...

As for the rest of the line, I think they are going for simplicity. Macintosh. Back to Apple's computer roots. The "i" was once meaningful, standing for internet, is no longer needed.

Desktops - Mac Mini, Macintosh, and Mac Pro.

Laptops - Macbook and Macbook Pro.

[dorleac]

I prefer "AppleBook" myself. It retains the rhythm of "Powerbook."

I agree they'll probably call the new pro desktop "Macintosh." I just hope it's not "MacTop" or "MacDesk."

[quigleybc]

a woman at macworld today asked one of the apple workers who were helping with the macbook pro demos whether windows could be installed...and the apple guy said, "we're not allowed to comment on that..." so i joked that that means, "yes". and he smiled.

even though it's probably doable, i sure wouldn't want windows ruining my nice macbook pro!



It will run on OSX, but it will be hacked and essentially bootlegged..so I doubt the performance will be that great.

Without the good speeds and performance I don't see why running Vista or whatever on my Mac would even be worth it..

[JoeBeCrazy]

The "i" was once meaningful, standing for internet, is no longer needed.

Internet?? Not too sure about that. i think it stood for "I" like for the individual.

or maybe "INCREDIBLE"
or maybe "INDESCRIBABLE"

... well i dont' know, who am i to say.

[sfwalter]

I called my local Apple Store to find out when iLife 06 will be available. They finally got smart the automated system says "press 9" for availablity of Macworld products.

I was a little discouraged when I heard "The Macbook Pro will be available by the end of February." I was hoping for an early to mid February.

[Peace]

I called my local Apple Store to find out when iLife 06 will be available. They finally got smart the automated system says "press 9" for availablity of Macworld products.

I was a little discouraged when I heard "The Macbook Pro will be available by the end of February." I was hoping for an early to mid February.

iLife'06 is shipping right now.I just got the FedEx tracking number for my order.