Sony declares full assault on XBox Live

[GFLPraxis]

To all the naysayers that believed the rumors that Sony would have no centralized online server even when they said they would at E3...

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/01/31/sony-declares-full-on-assault-on-xbox-live/

[2nyRiggz]

Gunz blazing baby!!!


Bless

[yankeefan24]

This proves it. the ps3 WILL be BETTER than the Xbox 360. It will be the supercharged powermac of the game console world. End of discussion. Live with it. Sony makes something better than MS. not hard to do, but this is much better.

EDIT: Just when i submitted this there was an ad for a free ps3 on the bottom of the screen. wow. thats good advertising.

[Josh396]

As much as I love XBOX Live there are a few areas that it needs help in. I wasn't planning on buying a PS3 at launch but if they can make their online system better than the 360's I may have to rethink that idea.

[clayj]

<yawn>

I'll believe it when I see it. My previous experiences with Sony software have left me less than impressed.

[p0intblank]

Only time will tell how well this service will do. I tend to not trust Sony that much when they are talking about the future. Hard drive, anyone?

[Ja Di ksw]

hahaha, "it scrolls like butter"! Nice pointblank (sorry for the hijack)

[wwooden]

I am getting tired of the whole "PS3 is better.....no, XBox 360 is better...." arguments that go on. I feel like all the next gen systems are targeted at different genres. The XBox is the system to get if you are big into FPS and playing online. The PS3 will kick but in sports and RPG, while the revolution will be cool because you can play more arcade style games, more interaction with the game. I love my XBox and even if the PS3 has better specs, the types of games that go on the Playstation platform don't really interest me. There has only been one game on the PS2 that I really liked, guitar Hero.

[GFLPraxis]

Now don't get me wrong. I know Sony likes to make things up and overhype. My main point is that this kills those idiotic rumors that Sony would not have a centralized online system (in direct contrast to their E3 statements that said they would). I just hope it's free, then I might buy it in addition to the Revolution.

[bigbossbmb]

This is exactly what PS3 needed to have...if done right PS3 will pwn XBOX

[takao]

I'll believe it when I see it. My previous experiences with Sony software have left me less than impressed.

same here... Sony Software.. ughh

but now it's pretty clear that both Sony and Microsoft will both be in exactly the same category

[crachoar]

A 'Sony-Rumor' (the best kind!) to squash a rumor?

What is this world coming to?

[aswitcher]

Making it dirt cheap would be a really good move to begin with.

I will wait and see for Christmas 06 to see what the deals are but I think it would be wise to wait for eofy 07 for real deals

[fadetoblack86]

i dont know about the PS3... everytime Sony has backed up a new future design. it backfired on them. will it be the same with the blu-ray? well as history tells us, most likely yes. but yeah the online service is definitley a plus for sony if it's true.

[nimbus]

<yawn>

I'll believe it when I see it. My previous experiences with Sony software have left me less than impressed.

As Microsoft software left you whimsically inspired? Oh my, to chuckle!

It's interesting that it works with the PS3 AND PSP. Very nice features indeed.
I think this is the preverbial "curtains" for 360 if its even half way decent.

But the truth is, PS2 cleaned Xbox's clock with no real set-up online service.
Now this will put them to sleep...
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Dagless]

This just makes the Xbox 360 look like an even worse deal. of course its all down to price. The 360 is fast, but the PS3 is faster still. The PS3 supports blu-ray, an online service to rival the 360, support for more controllers...

Why the hell don't MS and Sony just merge the 2 now and be done with it? This is so pointless having 2 systems near identical to each other. It's times like this that I'm glad I'll only get a Revolution (unless the PS3 isn't absurdly overpriced, but its Sony so I'm guessing it will be). The other 2 are just too similar to each other.

But yea. The 360 just becomes more and more the poor mans PS3. unless the PS3 ends up being cheaper than the 360. inwhich case the 360 is going to have a very hard time in the market.

BUT then again this is Sony speaking. This is hyperbole, lies, exaggeration. This is typically Sony. I'll believe it when its out and not a moment sooner. When I'm seeing dual 1080p monitor at 60fps :p I still laugh myself to sleep with that one

[Dagless]

<yawn>

I'll believe it when I see it. My previous experiences with Sony software have left me less than impressed.

Same here. Over my 20 years on earth, and with my fair share of Sony products only one has survived to this day. my Sony MZ-R91 minidisc player. its ancient too, by gadget standards. but its metal and built like a bloomin tank. Nothing else of Sony's, not their TV's, sound systems, DVD-RW drives, cameras, tape walkman, CD walkman, PS1 and 2 have survived for me. I cant understand why people put value to a company who clearly bang out less than decent products for as cheap as possible. Sure its business, but the competition in all fields do a better job.

Then again MS aren't the best. Windows is just tripe, my Xbox has had its fair share of problems, their mice just fell apart on me twice... yea.

[yellow]

I really do hope that the PS3 will slaughter the xPox. There's nothing like Microsoft coming out of a fight all bloody and beaten.

As for Sony products.. all mine have survived quite well. Still have a fully functional modded PS1, PS2, TVs, Video Cameras, Walkman, portable CD player, DVD player, etc, etc. Nearly 16 years of products, and they all still work.

[Symtex]

This just makes the Xbox 360 look like an even worse deal. of course its all down to price. The 360 is fast, but the PS3 is faster still. The PS3 supports blu-ray, an online service to rival the 360, support for more controllers...

Why the hell don't MS and Sony just merge the 2 now and be done with it? This is so pointless having 2 systems near identical to each other. It's times like this that I'm glad I'll only get a Revolution (unless the PS3 isn't absurdly overpriced, but its Sony so I'm guessing it will be). The other 2 are just too similar to each other.

But yea. The 360 just becomes more and more the poor mans PS3. unless the PS3 ends up being cheaper than the 360. inwhich case the 360 is going to have a very hard time in the market.

BUT then again this is Sony speaking. This is hyperbole, lies, exaggeration. This is typically Sony. I'll believe it when its out and not a moment sooner. When I'm seeing dual 1080p monitor at 60fps :p I still laugh myself to sleep with that one

what makes you think Sony can come out with something that took 4 years for Microsoft to build at launch ? I'm experience online gaming with SOE and I don't think Microsoft is afraid of what Sony online will be offering. By the time Sony refines the online network, Microsoft is already one step ahead and adding new features. I don't see Sony winning in the online world.

[paddy]

Same here. Over my 20 years on earth, and with my fair share of Sony products only one has survived to this day. my Sony MZ-R91 minidisc player. its ancient too, by gadget standards. but its metal and built like a bloomin tank. Nothing else of Sony's, not their TV's, sound systems, DVD-RW drives, cameras, tape walkman, CD walkman, PS1 and 2 have survived for me.

You obviously don't treat your products with care so. I've had a Sony radio since the 80's thats still in perfect order (it's on now), even after its been knocked straight off a shelf. How did you manage to break a PS2? Their relatively new machines and hard enough to break. Take more care of your products-they might last longer

[Piarco]

I've said it many a time, but I HATE fanboy comments. Nobody knows for sure that the PS3 will own the 360 because NOBODY has used both consoles. All people are doing are either letting the world know their own fanboy "opinion" or using paper spec to form a rough opinion.

I've only just got my first console - a 360 - (can't count 2 months of PSOne ownership), and I'm loving it. It was bought as a PC gaming rig replacement and its doing its job great. And thats the main reason I bought it - the xbox tends to have more ex-PC titles available than the PS's did.

But if Sony actually do pull off the PS3 I will get one if resonably priced. Not for the games, as generally Sony titles don't appeal, but for the Blu-Ray drive. If it does everything its supposed to (upscaling, HDMI output) it'll be a fairly cheap next-gen DVD player. And that is one reason why it'll sell bucket loads - not only does it appeal to rabid fanboys - like a couple of posters in this thread - but to those of us who buy a product not out of brand loyalty but because of its actual abilities.

Interesting times lie ahead...

You obviously don't treat your products with care so. I've had a Sony radio since the 80's thats still in perfect order (it's on now), even after its been knocked straight off a shelf. How did you manage to break a PS2? Their relatively new machines and hard enough to break. Take more care of your products-they might last longer

I had several Sony Walkman/MD products break on me - and I baby my gadgets. The PS2 has a well know problem with their DVD drives (because they were cheap and nasty) and I know at least one person who went through three within a year before he got one that didn't fail. Its not that myself or my friend mistreated the various items - they just broke for one reason or another. It happens, and its not just Sony that it happens to (hell, I went through 5 PB replacements last year - duff superdrive, lower memory slots failing, faulty keyboards etc..), but don't make the mistake of presuming that just because someone has had misfortune with some products that they beat the crap out of them or something.

[takao]

what makes you think Sony can come out with something that took 4 years for Microsoft to build at launch ? I'm experience online gaming with SOE and I don't think Microsoft is afraid of what Sony online will be offering. By the time Sony refines the online network, Microsoft is already one step ahead and adding new features. I don't see Sony winning in the online world.

well the question is will those additional features be enough for microsoft... even if sony starts with a half-assed online thing microsoft will have a hard time (especially when the sony service is free)

as much as SOE's software/server services suck they _have_ a much longer experience with online gaming services than microsoft or nintendo which both start(ed) at scratch ... even though nintendo is working together with gamespy afaik

edit: and yeah i've a broken sony discman ...

[Dagless]

You obviously don't treat your products with care so. I've had a Sony radio since the 80's thats still in perfect order (it's on now), even after its been knocked straight off a shelf. How did you manage to break a PS2? Their relatively new machines and hard enough to break. Take more care of your products-they might last longer

How on earth can you say that? I molly coddle my gadgets. my iPod mini? not a spec of age on it. no smudges on the screen no dust no nothing. perfect condition. PowerBook? Looks like it was bought yesterday, gets cleaned weekly. DS? immaculate. 2 year old Mobile phone? could sell as new. Pocket PC? scratch-less. my old 3G iPod? almost faultless (took very good care of that).

What I find interesting though. My Sony amp and speakers packed in 5 years after purchase. the tweeter on the left speaker just stopped working. checked wiring and everything. just couldn't fix it. now... I'm using an amplifier here from the 1970's and 2 Wharfedale speakers from 1994. Not a problem! The amp is a little bit wrecked through the dial grips wearing out but the insides itself still function as good as when my dad bought it 16 years before I was born.

Just search or ask around here for faulty PS1 and 2's. just ask around anywhere. there's a reason all the computer shops I see stock replacement PS2 lasers (no Xbox, GC and never saw DC).
However. the Minidisc player I have is excellent. peak of Sony's prowess. I had a hard time giving that up for a 128mb MP3 player.

[GFLPraxis]

If it's free, it'll be worth it for me. Even if it's better than Live, if Sony charges, I probably won't be using it (or buying a PS3 for a while).

[flyfish29]

Making it dirt cheap would be a really good move to begin with.


Yeah, like free would be best. That would be cool- sort of give M$ a bit of their own medicine. (Can we say Netscape-IE wars) M$ is notorious about using their financial resources to compete...if they can't make a better product (which they usually can't) then they either give it away below cost(x-box) or for free (IE)

It is funny- I play PS2 Battlefield 2 Modern Combat online and have only had one issue of poor performance after playing over 60 hours of games online. And yet I hear everyone saying how great Live is and yet after going to the BF2 forums I see everyone complaining about their LIve connection, etc. NOw, this game has had its share of server outages and such that affect all platforms, etc, but overall I have had great success with the game online. (I even beta tested the game on the PS2 and had only one time that it crashed during the test.)

So I guess I am saying online is not reliable overall and with so many factors and the indepth games, etc the online performance is not going to be what an at home game performance is going to be- probably for many years to come. I sort of relate it to phone service. Pretty much everyone has very reliable land line phone service, but with cell service due to so many factors it won't probably ever be as reliable. And yet, people still get very ticked off at cell phones for not being perfectly reliable. Same with onilne game play- people hold it to too high of standards most of the time.

I think the Sony online service will only help in the long run, but not to say there won't be plenty of bumps in the road to come even if they do have a sony controlled online service.

[XNine]

The PS3's real-time graphics are great. So far it looks very promising, and to all of those naysayers and tools that badmouth sony, you can suck it.

I've owned every console that's been released in the last 7-8 years. The best ones have been from sony. Software availability, support, everything has been great. Nintendo's been the worst experience, and I love my Xbox 360.

We'll see what happens, but either wya, MGS 4 and the new Armored Core will be on PS3, so I'll buy it either way.

[Tommyg117]

honestly, I don't really care which is better. I'm a nintendo and sony fan. But I have an xbox 360 and it is an amazing system that has provided me with a lot of solid gaming experiences. Why isn't it possible to like all 3 of these next gen systems? I love my gamecube, xbox and PS2 and they have all had good use and each have had amazing exclusive games, as I'm sure will be the case with the next gen.

[aloofman]

This just makes the Xbox 360 look like an even worse deal. of course its all down to price. The 360 is fast, but the PS3 is faster still. The PS3 supports blu-ray, an online service to rival the 360, support for more controllers...


Except for, you know, the fact that PS3 doesn't exist yet.

[beatpanda]

It says in the article that they started working on it right after the PS2 network adapter came out, meaning they've had at least as much time as Microsoft did to refine XBOX LIVE.

Not that I give a ****. I just wanted to clear that up.

[bigbossbmb]

PS3 is going to outshine 360 because of Blu-Ray (and the lack of HD-DVD in 360). My main reason to get a PS3 is the Blu-Ray drive. I don't play that many games anymore, but to have a next gen drive AND sick games for a reasonable price (hopefully)? perfect. for a lot of people, including myself, their PS2 was their first DVD player. now sony is doing the same with Blu-Ray, and it will catch on...

[2nyRiggz]

Like i said over and over again i like all the systems but i hate all the hating on different consoles and garbage of that nature. I do hope sony brings it right and step up to the plate that it created for itself. Xbox360....whatever i got it and it feels like an xbox nothing more but i will wait until later this year when better games come into play.

I will be getting all the systems because i like all of them they all have their strong points (current systems)

Whos to say that the REV wont suck or the PS3....the xbox is going on strong now but still needs some help. I would hope all the consoles bring what they and stop the raging(dumb arse) war between the N-dogs, Sony Soldiers and Xbox Navy.


Bless

[saunders45]

2 words: "Emotion Engine"

[Dagless]

2 words: "Emotion Engine"

3 consonants: "PSP" :D

[~Shard~]

I think it all comes down to a matter of personal preference. Each system has its pros and cons, and is targetted at different audiences due to its different strengths and weakenesses and game selection. I bought the PS2 because of its games and the DVD player at the time, and so I could play PSX games. I don't play games any more myself, yet if I were to buy a system, it would be a PS3, regardless of the specs, etc. of the competitors.

I think too many people are making too big a deal about which system is "better". I think this is more of a subjective argument than an objective one, so there can be no true winner. (Unless of course one of these systems turns into another Dreamcast... :eek: :p :cool: )

[thechris69]

What else can they possibly add to online gaming? online gaming has one soul purpose, is to play your games against anyone around the world, but microsoft releases all this unnecesary stuff for it like the media center etc, plus all the new features they add can be easily accesed on the internet? are people that lazy that they cant get up to go to there computer to download something, they have to download it on your system? a big waste of time if u ask me, they should just stick to pure online gaming, and make that the best it can be...

[clayj]

What else can they possibly add to online gaming? online gaming has one soul purpose, is to play your games against anyone around the world, but microsoft releases all this unnecesary stuff for it like the media center etc, plus all the new features they add can be easily accesed on the internet? are people that lazy that they cant get up to go to there computer to download something, they have to download it on your system? a big waste of time if u ask me, they should just stick to pure online gaming, and make that the best it can be...You're talking about apples and oranges here.

The Xbox 360 is designed not only to be a powerful gaming console, but also a home entertainment hub. Not everyone has a computer, and not everyone who has a computer has one in their living room. That the Xbox 360 can play music, videos, photos, and that it has the potential to be an Internet radio, a Web browser, and an e-mail client are all GOOD things.

[thechris69]

Yea, you make a good point, but if they stopped with all the digital hub and entertainment stuff, they can focus more time into the actual online gaming, with better connections, menus, leader boards, etc. they should focus more on what online gaming really is...

[XNine]

Yea, you make a good point, but if they stopped with all the digital hub and entertainment stuff, they can focus more time into the actual online gaming, with better connections, menus, leader boards, etc. they should focus more on what online gaming really is...

But that's up to the independant developers to do. If the developer doesn't put up leaderboards, and doesn't compeltely dedicate whole buildings full of servers to handle the load of millions of gamers, that's they're deal, not MS's.

MS has done a fien job thus far with Xbox live. The marketplace, althought stills carce in useful data, is a great idea. Arcade games are great, and their version of MArble Blast pisses me off on the most difficult levels! :mad:

Traditionally, people connect to a host and everyone plays the game off of their connection. I've only hosted one game in COD 2 that lagged at all. All the others have been more than fine. The problem is all these people with AOL conenctions and crappy DSL lines hosting.

[GFLPraxis]

You're talking about apples and oranges here.

The Xbox 360 is designed not only to be a powerful gaming console, but also a home entertainment hub. Not everyone has a computer, and not everyone who has a computer has one in their living room. That the Xbox 360 can play music, videos, photos, and that it has the potential to be an Internet radio, a Web browser, and an e-mail client are all GOOD things.

That we know of, PS3 has the same goals. Sony has said that Linux will be preinstalled on the hard drive and it can play music, videos, and photos out of the box. Then they hype that it'll have more and it will be beyond your imagination blah blah blah.

[weldon]

same here... Sony Software.. ughh
Of course, Sony just hired Tim Schaaff (former Apple software exec) the other month so maybe things will get better?

[MacRumorUser]

I will get a PS3 for those exclusive games on that format...

Graphically I expect it to be the same as the 360 give or take..

BluRay is not a persuader in my book, what if it doesn't take off??? That battle has yet to be fought, added to the fact that China has been given the go ahead from the DVD forum to develop a third format.. 3 format's to wage war....

I don't see why we have to have the argument which is better, as it all boils down to games and gameplay... These are games consoles after all.

[Dagless]

I don't see why we have to have the argument which is better, as it all boils down to games and gameplay... These are games consoles after all.

You completely misunderstand modern gaming. It's not about games or gameplay, its teh graphics!

[d_saum]

Graphically I expect it to be the same as the 360 give or take..

BluRay is not a persuader in my book, what if it doesn't take off??? That battle has yet to be fought, added to the fact that China has been given the go ahead from the DVD forum to develop a third format.. 3 format's to wage war...

1. I (swear Im not a fanboy!!!) think the ps3 is going to whoop the 360 graphically. Have you seen the actual GAMEPLAY footage of Metal Gear 4?

2. What if Blu-Ray doesn't take off??? Have you been following it at all??? It has already won the war (whether or not you want to admit it). It has tons of support, more storage, and will saturate the market with the release of the PS3. Do some research on it and you'll see.

And what are you talking about with China? China is a country, not a media company. Also, I havent heard anything about a 3rd format and I read A LOT of tech news sites and forums. The closest thing I can think of that you might be mistaken on is the holographic media, but thats a whole other deal, not a 3rd DVD format.

[GFLPraxis]

1. I (swear Im not a fanboy!!!) think the ps3 is going to whoop the 360 graphically. Have you seen the actual GAMEPLAY footage of Metal Gear 4?

To be perfectly fair, remember that almost every XBox game currently on the market began life as a current gen game console or PC and THEN was made on the 360 (Kameo, King Kong, CoD 2, etc). When we see some truly next gen games the 360 should be closer to that.


2. What if Blu-Ray doesn't take off??? Have you been following it at all??? It has already won the war (whether or not you want to admit it). It has tons of support, more storage, and will saturate the market with the release of the PS3. Do some research on it and you'll see.

No, it's a lot of Sony hype. Blu-ray has NOT already won. HD-DVD is still supported by a number of major studios, and a lot of those in the Blu-ray camp are actually supporting both. Sony is just really pushing Blu-ray news to the forefront and making it SOUND like a guaranteed win.

[clayj]

No, it's a lot of Sony hype. Blu-ray has NOT already won. HD-DVD is still supported by a number of major studios, and a lot of those in the Blu-ray camp are actually supporting both. Sony is just really pushing Blu-ray news to the forefront and making it SOUND like a guaranteed win.It doesn't help that Blu-Ray players are going to cost about three times as much as HD-DVD players when they first hit the market. HD-DVD still has a lot going for it.

That said, I will probably end up buying a PS3 if for no other reason than to get a Sony-subsidized Blu-Ray player. It all depends on what the PS3 ends up costing (which NO ONE can say for sure).

[aloofman]

And what are you talking about with China? China is a country, not a media company. Also, I havent heard anything about a 3rd format and I read A LOT of tech news sites and forums. The closest thing I can think of that you might be mistaken on is the holographic media, but thats a whole other deal, not a 3rd DVD format.

He's not mistaken. China signalled it's intentions to make a high-def DVD format for its own market, probably so they can better control content and distribution, as totalitarian states are wont to do.

At this point it's doubtful that this format (if it's ever finalized) would actually compete with Blu-Ray and HD-DVD in the global market. Considering the corporate might of the companies and consumer markets behind them, China would have to come up with something incredibly compelling to supercede them. I don't think anyone's really expecting that to happen.

Even if China succeeded in adopting the format at home, it's not clear how much direct competition there would be. Most likely the electronics firms would just make players that are cross-compatible so that the West's bootlegs will still play on Chinese TVs, kind of like the way the current DVD format's region encoding has been mostly negated.

[GFLPraxis]

It doesn't help that Blu-Ray players are going to cost about three times as much as HD-DVD players when they first hit the market. HD-DVD still has a lot going for it.

That said, I will probably end up buying a PS3 if for no other reason than to get a Sony-subsidized Blu-Ray player. It all depends on what the PS3 ends up costing (which NO ONE can say for sure).

HD-DVD has plenty going for it. Apple is in both camps (they announced they'd ALSO support Blu-ray more recently, but they are a member of the DVD Forum which is fully supporting HD-DVD alone).

The entire DVD Forum + a couple major studios + costing about half as much as the cheapest Blu-ray players gives it a good chance. Even IF Blu-ray gets more studios, if the consumers pick HD-DVD the publishers will follow. Don't get me wrong, both formats have equally good chances of success. But don't rule out either.

[2nyRiggz]

I will get a PS3 for those exclusive games on that format...

Graphically I expect it to be the same as the 360 give or take..

BluRay is not a persuader in my book, what if it doesn't take off??? That battle has yet to be fought, added to the fact that China has been given the go ahead from the DVD forum to develop a third format.. 3 format's to wage war....

I don't see why we have to have the argument which is better, as it all boils down to games and gameplay... These are games consoles after all.

Indeed...who is getting blast for all of this DVD bs, us the consumers...i don't give a damn which one gets the plate but i hope soon so i won't be hoping around from foot to foot buying arsy-fied products.


Bless

[d_saum]

Does anyone have a link for this China thing? This is seriously the first Ive heard about it.

And yes, I know its not "official", but it's my opinion that Blu-Ray has already won. Yes, a lot of studios are supporting both, but BR has the majority. Couple that with more capacity (100GB already has been hit as opposed to 35-40GB for HD-DVD) and the only thing HD-DVD has going for it is price. That is why I think the PS3 is going to be a major helper for that just like it was many people's first dvd player. Also, I think the price will SHARPLY drop to compete with HD-DVD players. So yes, it is my OPINION ;) that Blu-Ray has won. I should bookmark this thread and come back a year from now to see where we are at in the format war! :D

[Dagless]

Does anyone have a link for this China thing? This is seriously the first Ive heard about it.

And yes, I know its not "official", but it's my opinion that Blu-Ray has already won. Yes, a lot of studios are supporting both, but BR has the majority. Couple that with more capacity (100GB already has been hit as opposed to 35-40GB for HD-DVD) and the only thing HD-DVD has going for it is price. That is why I think the PS3 is going to be a major helper for that just like it was many people's first dvd player. Also, I think the price will SHARPLY drop to compete with HD-DVD players. So yes, it is my OPINION ;) that Blu-Ray has won. I should bookmark this thread and come back a year from now to see where we are at in the format war! :D

I've made a bunch of predictions in recent years and got all of them right, but I reckon HD-DVD will be in most homes. regardless of quality, regardless of anything; the cheapest will win. thats a given. Ask your grandma, your neighbour or a random person in the street who is out buying these DVD products if they care much about disc space. its an issue yes, they can add more features and that, but price will (it already is) the biggest standpoint when it comes to selling a product. Why would anyone other than us quality freaks, us geeks and the audio/visualphiles pay more for a film?
Even using that argument I don't think any format is going to win. not for a very long time. DVD is sufficient for Joe Public. I've even watch the X-Men 3 trailer in all 3 sizes and didn't notice much different on either my 20" HDTV or my parents 32" HDTV.
Whats going to win? DVD has already won.

[clayj]

DVD has already won.Well, of course standard DVDs will remain the standard for a LONG time. Like LaserDisc, Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will be niche products bought by videophiles who demand the very best possible picture quality. Standard DVD looks plenty good for most people... it'll be a LONG time before it's replaced by either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

I guess the one thing I hope for is that the two formats become merged on the hardware side of things, so you can buy one player that handles both formats.

[AP_piano295]

I am getting tired of the whole "PS3 is better.....no, XBox 360 is better...." arguments that go on. I feel like all the next gen systems are targeted at different genres. The XBox is the system to get if you are big into FPS and playing online. The PS3 will kick but in sports and RPG, while the revolution will be cool because you can play more arcade style games, more interaction with the game. I love my XBox and even if the PS3 has better specs, the types of games that go on the Playstation platform don't really interest me. There has only been one game on the PS2 that I really liked, guitar Hero.

wait.. what are you basing this on or is it just a completely arbitrarey statement?

[AP_piano295]

Well, of course standard DVDs will remain the standard for a LONG time. Like LaserDisc, Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will be niche products bought by videophiles who demand the very best possible picture quality. Standard DVD looks plenty good for most people... it'll be a LONG time before it's replaced by either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

I guess the one thing I hope for is that the two formats become merged on the hardware side of things, so you can buy one player that handles both formats.

It seems to me that blue ray will have to become the standard at some point for capacity reasons alone, you can only fit so much onto a disk, and with games taking up more and more space all of the time blue ray will be a necessity not simply a preference.

I see what you mean that they will be niche products for watching video but not for gaming needs.

[Counterfit]

The PS3's real-time graphics are great. So far it looks very promising, and to all of those naysayers and tools that badmouth sony, you can suck it.

I've owned every console that's been released in the last 7-8 years. The best ones have been from sony. Software availability, support, everything has been great. Nintendo's been the worst experience, and I love my Xbox 360.

We'll see what happens, but either wya, MGS 4 and the new Armored Core will be on PS3, so I'll buy it either way.
Quality wise (graphics, gameplay, and manufacturing) The N64 **** all over the first PlayStation. Really, take a side-by-side look between Mario 64 (a launch title) and, well, any version of Crash Bandicoot, or basically anything else. Then, try playing them. Analog stick (for EVERY game) > d-pad. And then there were overheating issues with the first revision of the Playstation, while my N64 (and NES, and other old Nintendo hardware) is still going strong, after months of neglect in my basement, along with almost every other game system I own.


And as for Blu-Ray vs. HD-DVD. All I will say is: VHS vs. Beta.

[GFLPraxis]

It seems to me that blue ray will have to become the standard at some point for capacity reasons alone, you can only fit so much onto a disk, and with games taking up more and more space all of the time blue ray will be a necessity not simply a preference.

I see what you mean that they will be niche products for watching video but not for gaming needs.

That's not true this generation.

Microsoft's system maxes out at 8.5 GB.

HD-DVD maxes out at 45 or 60 GB at this point, Blu-ray at 100 IIRC. Blu-ray is expected to expand to 200 eventually.

In reality, HD-DVD already provides 5-8 TIMES what Microsoft has. Blu-ray is around 12 times. Either one is PLENTY for this generation, unless you expect Microsoft to ship games on ten disks.

The THIRD XBox and PS4 might need to go to that level of space.

Sony will have the advantage of being able to cram bonus features, I suppose.

[GFLPraxis]

Oh, definitely. People forget that Sony has ALWAYS had the least powerful system, every generation (well, depending on where you see the dreamcast, it's sort of halfway in between the two generations).


N64 > PS1

XBox > GameCube > PS2

In fact, Nintendo generally has had the most powerful system (till Microsoft showed up selling the XBox at an insane loss). Sony also had to copy the analog stick and rumble (which the original PS1 controller didn't have) and the controller itself was a SNES controller with extra shoulders.

[Pistol Pete]

Same here. Over my 20 years on earth, and with my fair share of Sony products only one has survived to this day. my Sony MZ-R91 minidisc player. its ancient too, by gadget standards. but its metal and built like a bloomin tank. Nothing else of Sony's, not their TV's, sound systems, DVD-RW drives, cameras, tape walkman, CD walkman, PS1 and 2 have survived for me. I cant understand why people put value to a company who clearly bang out less than decent products for as cheap as possible. Sure its business, but the competition in all fields do a better job.

Then again MS aren't the best. Windows is just tripe, my Xbox has had its fair share of problems, their mice just fell apart on me twice... yea.


i know those mini discs are tough!!! haha, oh yah all my other sony stuff sucks and am in the same field as you...

by the way i just bought a 360 today....YAY

[Lastinline39]

Quality wise (graphics, gameplay, and manufacturing) The N64 **** all over the first PlayStation. Really, take a side-by-side look between Mario 64 (a launch title) and, well, any version of Crash Bandicoot, or basically anything else. Then, try playing them. Analog stick (for EVERY game) > d-pad. And then there were overheating issues with the first revision of the Playstation, while my N64 (and NES, and other old Nintendo hardware) is still going strong, after months of neglect in my basement, along with almost every other game system I own.


And as for Blu-Ray vs. HD-DVD. All I will say is: VHS vs. Beta.


Yea N64 had the Graphics, but I'd take realistic sound any day over that midi stuff on N64 games. Characters couldn't talk on N64 and real music couldn't be heard, so while it may have been graphically superior to the PS1, it was not aesthetically superior.


"XBox > GameCube > PS2

In fact, Nintendo generally has had the most powerful system (till Microsoft showed up selling the XBox at an insane loss). Sony also had to copy the analog stick and rumble (which the original PS1 controller didn't have) and the controller itself was a SNES controller with extra shoulders."

It is true that GC was more powerful than PS2, but it did not have online play at all. (Yea I know PS2's online sucked most of the time, SOCOM's was ok, but it was still nice to have it.)

And yes, it is true that Sony completely ripped off Nintendo design for controllers, but they had it coming. If you remember, Nintendo and Sony were developing the Playstation as an addon for the SNES (possibly n64?) and Nintendo simply left Sony out to dry for Panasonic I believe.


Finally, PS1 was graphically inferior to N64 because it went with CDs over cartridges. PS2 was graphically inferior to both GC and Xbox because it came out wayyyy before them. However, PS3 is coming out long after 360 (obviously) and Nintendo has already stated it is not going to enter the power war, so bringing up the past doesn't really fit here. However, I don't know if I believe Sony's claim that their online service will be a Live-killer. It most likelyhood we will be somewhat dissapointed with what Sony offers, but then again I was dissapointed by Live (Original), if you look at it, it isn't very impressive compared to the Computer (even Mac) online scene. The only thing Halo 2 has over SOCOM II (online wise) is a better buddy list and custom games. I'd like to see a big lobby and different rooms to go into, GameRanger or Gamespy style.

[clayj]

It seems to me that blue ray will have to become the standard at some point for capacity reasons alone, you can only fit so much onto a disk, and with games taking up more and more space all of the time blue ray will be a necessity not simply a preference.

I see what you mean that they will be niche products for watching video but not for gaming needs.Actually, I read a very good analysis of disk space usage in video games recently. Although the amount of space used on a DVD has gone up for MOST games, the fact is that as compression algorithms continue to improve, the amount of space required to store a game's code actually DECREASES, assuming no new space-intensive elements (such as pre-rendered cut scenes or long music tracks) are introduced. Some newer games have actually decreased in size over their predecessors, even with the addition of improved graphics and new features.

In other words, DVD will still be good for quite a while, unless programmers start being irresponsible with their disk space requirements. And HD-DVD or Blu-Ray (either one) would be sufficient for a VERY long time.

[GFLPraxis]

And yes, it is true that Sony completely ripped off Nintendo design for controllers, but they had it coming. If you remember, Nintendo and Sony were developing the Playstation as an addon for the SNES (possibly n64?) and Nintendo simply left Sony out to dry for Panasonic I believe.


That's not true. Nintendo and Sony never could agree on how the profits would be divided, the final specs on the system, or the licensing.

Wikipedia also notes:
Nintendo asked Sony to develop a CD-ROM add-on called "PlayStation" for the SNES. Because Sony wanted 25% of all profits Nintendo earned from sales of this PlayStation and all PlayStation games, after Sony revealed that they were developing it, Nintendo instead went to Philips.

On top of that I've read some places that Sony added a clause that they would get rights to games Nintendo produced on the addon.

AND the competitor's Sega CD flopped.

Sony's demands were too high and the two could not agree and they jointly split up.

Nintendo didn't "have it coming" to get blatantly robbed of their design.


Finally, PS1 was graphically inferior to N64 because it went with CDs over cartridges.

Are you joking? How the heck can using a format that stores MORE data give you inferior graphics? CD's store more but load slower, cartridges load faster but store less and are more expensive.

PS2 was graphically inferior to both GC and Xbox because it came out wayyyy before them.

Definitely true.

However, PS3 is coming out long after 360 (obviously) and Nintendo has already stated it is not going to enter the power war, so bringing up the past doesn't really fit here.

Never argued with that, but I've heard people in other threads acting like Sony always has the greatest technology, so I just wanted to point that out.

[clayj]

Finally, PS1 was graphically inferior to N64 because it went with CDs over cartridges.This is quite possibly one of the most stupid things I have ever read.

[Lastinline39]

"Are you joking? How the heck can using a format that stores MORE data give you inferior graphics? CD's store more but load slower, cartridges load faster but store less and are more expensive."

Because the console gaming technology had been with cartridges forevar. Other than the SegaCD (did Saturn come out before or after PS1?), PS1 was venturing into new territory. [Edit: It may have been unclear but my point wasn't that because CD was new technology it was harder to get graphics with, but that Sony was putting the money into the CD tech-and-whatnot, instead of power for the system.] Whether or not CDs should have had better graphics than cartridges, they didn't when it came to n64 and ps1. My point was that PS1 more than made up for the graphical inferiority with audible superiority.

On the stuff about the SNES Playstation deal, you're probably right. I just saw that stuff on G4-TV and that channel blows. :D

[GFLPraxis]

"Are you joking? How the heck can using a format that stores MORE data give you inferior graphics? CD's store more but load slower, cartridges load faster but store less and are more expensive."

Because the console gaming technology had been with cartridges forevar. Other than the SegaCD (did Saturn come out before or after PS1?), PS1 was venturing into new territory. [Edit: It may have been unclear but my point wasn't that because CD was new technology it was harder to get graphics with, but that Sony was putting the money into the CD tech-and-whatnot, instead of power for the system.] Whether or not CDs should have had better graphics than cartridges, they didn't when it came to n64 and ps1. My point was that PS1 more than made up for the graphical inferiority with audible superiority.

Perhaps, but I'm unsure on that. That I am aware of, CD's are MUCH cheaper to produce than cartridges. The CD drive may have been more expensive at the time, perhaps. But how can you be sure history won't repeat itself? If what you say is true, and the PS1 used a really expensive disk drive technology and had to go with weaker system specs to sell at a decent price- isn't it possible the PS3 is doing the same (considering a Blu-ray player is $1000 right now)?

It's rather unclear at the moment.

Anyway, if what you say is true, how much did the CD drive cost? Because the PS1 launched at $300 and the N64 at $200. You're stating that the CD drive cost around $150? Wow...that's quite a lot.

On the stuff about the SNES Playstation deal, you're probably right. I just saw that stuff on G4-TV and that channel blows. :D


Oh, definitely. How I miss the glory days of TechTV, before G4 bought them, fired everyone, and cancelled every decent show worth watching except for XPlay, replacing them with their perverted, obsessed, 'hip', fact-less shows so they could get the old TechTV audience to view them...grr.

[angelneo]

Actually, I read a very good analysis of disk space usage in video games recently. Although the amount of space used on a DVD has gone up for MOST games, the fact is that as compression algorithms continue to improve, the amount of space required to store a game's code actually DECREASES, assuming no new space-intensive elements (such as pre-rendered cut scenes or long music tracks) are introduced. Some newer games have actually decreased in size over their predecessors, even with the addition of improved graphics and new features.

On a certain level, I think this is true, but I think our need for higher resolution and details far outstrip the rate at which compression algo can go. Even for in-game rendering, I think there is a limit at how much we can compress whereas our need for quality can be as far as we can dream of.

[Lastinline39]

"Anyway, if what you say is true, how much did the CD drive COST? Because the PS1 launched at $300 and the N64 at $200. You're stating that the CD drive cost around $150? Wow...that's quite a lot."

Look I was just speculating as to why the PS1 was graphically inferior, it seemed like a good idea.

"Perhaps, but I'm unsure on that. That I am aware of, CD's are MUCH cheaper to produce than cartridges. The CD drive may have been more expensive at the time, perhaps. But how can you be sure history won't repeat itself? If what you say is true, and the PS1 used a really expensive disk drive technology and had to go with weaker system specs to sell at a decent price- isn't it possible the PS3 is doing the same (considering a Blu-ray player is $1000 right now)?"

That is a fair enough assumption. Although, this time around we know (well hopefully we know) what chips and what power the PS3 has. Theoretically it seems as powerful if not more than the 360. I was only 10 (maybe less) at the time of the ps1 launch so you'll forgive me if I don't know what they said about the specs in relation to the n64. However, Sony has already decided to lose money on this console, rather than sacrificing power or blu-ray. How much money they can let themselves lose is another question though :-/.


"Oh, definitely. How I miss the glory days of TechTV, before G4 bought them, fired everyone, and cancelled every decent show worth watching except for XPlay, replacing them with their perverted, obsessed, 'hip', fact-less shows so they could get the old TechTV audience to view them...grr."

Yeah, I always heard about TechTV, but I only got cable when I came to college. So I never got to see it :(. Anyway I wouldn't call G4 hip (I figured you wouldn't actually either judging by the 's). It really is just more mainstream nerd. The comedy on that channel is just childish. I'm not talking about their subject matters, but their delivery is just so...cheesey. My old roommate was a huge nerd (well he was small but ya know) and he would laugh at X-Play. It was sad. I really don't understand who watches that channel, they have 4 shows which they just recycle throughout the day and then they might have some anime at night. Sigh, I wish there was a mac channel.

Oh yea PS3 online woo.

[bigbossbmb]

if the consumers pick HD-DVD the publishers will follow. Don't get me wrong, both formats have equally good chances of success. But don't rule out either.

publishers will follow the consumers - very true

Consumers will go with Blu-Ray since PS3's will definitely, without a doubt, saturate the market by outselling all of the HD-DVD players this year. And just like UMD with the PSP, people are going to want to buy content for their PS3. UMD's are selling really well, considering they only play on that tiny screen. If Sony can push UMD to sell well, they will do the same with Blu-Ray.

[d_saum]

Ok ok, I have a new prediction... well...kinda... Instead of just saying that Blu-ray has won (in my opinion), Im going to say that this is going to end up exactly the same as the "dvd-r vs dvd+r" battle. In a short period of time, it will be merged together in one player/drive and will play every disc you have. HD-DVD/Blu-Ray/DVD-RW/DVD+RW/SACD/CDRW ( I know there's one Im forgetting for strictly audio, but I can't remember what it is...like dvda or something similar to sacd)

[GFLPraxis]

"Anyway, if what you say is true, how much did the CD drive COST? Because the PS1 launched at $300 and the N64 at $200. You're stating that the CD drive cost around $150? Wow...that's quite a lot."

Look I was just speculating as to why the PS1 was graphically inferior, it seemed like a good idea.

Oh no, don't get me wrong, you had an interesting point (that CD technology was expensive back then) that I hadn't thought of, I was just thinking further on the subject. Speculate away.


That is a fair enough assumption. Although, this time around we know (well hopefully we know) what chips and what power the PS3 has. Theoretically it seems as powerful if not more than the 360. I was only 10 (maybe less) at the time of the ps1 launch so you'll forgive me if I don't know what they said about the specs in relation to the n64. However, Sony has already decided to lose money on this console, rather than sacrificing power or blu-ray. How much money they can let themselves lose is another question though :-/.


Yeah, about the same age here, I looked up the specs and launch pricing.

My speculation on the matter is this. Sony is willing to sell the PS3 for a MASSIVE loss (and I mean massive, even over a hundred or two- Microsoft sold the first XBox for a $70 loss and took $4 billion in losses), if it gets Blu-ray in every home.

Sony is willing to lose several billion on the PS3 if it hands them the entire movie industry on a silver platter. They'll make much more controlling the movie industry than they would on just a console.


Yeah, I always heard about TechTV, but I only got cable when I came to college. So I never got to see it :(. Anyway I wouldn't call G4 hip (I figured you wouldn't actually either judging by the 's). It really is just more mainstream nerd. The comedy on that channel is just childish. I'm not talking about their subject matters, but their delivery is just so...cheesey. My old roommate was a huge nerd (well he was small but ya know) and he would laugh at X-Play. It was sad. I really don't understand who watches that channel, they have 4 shows which they just recycle throughout the day and then they might have some anime at night. Sigh, I wish there was a mac channel.

Oh yea PS3 online woo.

Yeah, I worded that wrong. By 'hip' I meant, like MTV, it TRIES to be cool. Tries too hard. I too find the comedy childish. It's usually absolutely retarded.

I have to defend XPlay though. XPlay is the only surviving TechTV show (as it was the only TechTV show about gaming rather than Tech). And XPlay...rocks. You have to watch more of it :) But don't watch anything on G4 other than XPlay, Star Trek, and E3 coverage.

[Lastinline39]

"My speculation on the matter is this. Sony is willing to sell the PS3 for a MASSIVE loss (and I mean massive, even over a hundred or two- Microsoft sold the first XBox for a $70 loss and took $4 billion in losses), if it gets Blu-ray in every home.

Sony is willing to lose several billion on the PS3 if it hands them the entire movie industry on a silver platter. They'll make much more controlling the movie industry than they would on just a console."

That's exactly why I think the PS3 is gonna be so good. Even if it sells for 700 dollars, it will be incredible value for money. Unfortunately most people won't see it that way and instead view 700 for a console as ridiculous. As for Sony Online, hmm. On the one hand they may just go for more massive loss and make it awesome and free. On the other I could choose reality.

I'm not really a sony fanboy, but I do hope/think the ps3 will be the most powerful system. You'll have a PS3 to blow your mind and grab your heart, you'll have a Revolution to have a ton of fun, and you'll have a 360 to be dissapointed. :D

[Edit: Yea, I guess we'll agree to disagree on X-Play. I've watched about 10 episodes. When I'm up at like 4 in the morning and everything else is infomercials I watch it though :)]

[Symtex]

Let me resume this thread :

Microsoft / X360 = Evil . bad, disspointing no matter what they do

Sony / PS3 = everything online they ever did was bad but since they are Sony they will make it an 100 times betters because they are sony

Revolution = No matter what nintendo will always be cool.


Now back to reality. Sony is a hype machine. Now they are trying to hype their online network because they know that X360 is the leader in the online console market. I can't believe how many people still belive in Sony's hype after the Emotion Engine and the Online adapter add-ons.

[takao]

Now back to reality. Sony is a hype machine. Now they are trying to hype their online network because they know that X360 is the leader in the online console market. I can't believe how many people still belive in Sony's hype after the Emotion Engine and the Online adapter add-ons.

well some people will simply swallow it up.. i've got such a friend myself who after seeing the revolution controller video from e3 went on with how cool it was and complained about playstation 3 design & xbox360 only to finish with the sentence "but i'm still going to buy a PS3"
me: "why ?"
him: "because of games like metal gear solid, gran turismo and final fantasy"
me:" but you don't even own any of those games "
him: "..."

[saunders45]

well some people will simply swallow it up.. i've got such a friend myself who after seeing the revolution controller video from e3 went on with how cool it was and complained about playstation 3 design & xbox360 only to finish with the sentence "but i'm still going to buy a PS3"
me: "why ?"
him: "because of games like metal gear solid, gran turismo and final fantasy"
me:" but you don't even own any of those games "
him: "..."

I think you just described every Sony fanboy out there.

[Dagless]

You know what's excruciatingly funny? All this money, time and effort is being pumped into next generation power and graphics... but people still look like plastic toys, they still have horrible load times and they are getting more and more un-fun.

Agree with the above post too. I played the first Metal Gear Solid on the PS1 and Gamecube. no game like it. everything works perfect. its like OSX over windows. then out came MGS2. No thanks. MGS3? nah. I'm happy with MGS1, the rest are just pants. but thats just me. and Final Fantasy has been getting worse on non-Nintendo handheld systems. FF7 is my favourite. followed by the GBA NES remakes. whereas FF on PS2 and PC and the rest have just been falling deeper into a pit of poo-ness. They seem to have thier head screwed on with the DS though (Crystal Chronicles, 3D FF3/6). Maybe they should just drop down to portable games only...

[~Shard~]

I think you just described every Sony fanboy out there.

Um, I own a Metal Gear, Gran Turismo and Final Fantasy game for my PS2... oh but wait, I'm not a fanboy - sorry, nevermind... :p ;) :cool:

[yellow]

Lucky for me, I have no interest in online console gaming. So my choice of the PS3 will be entirely unaffected by their 'war' with MS and the xPox. I can base my choice completely on my dislike for MS products, my not wanting to put cash in their coffers, my disinterest in 90% of the games they offer, and my willingness to continue being loyal to Sony and the PS platform.. which will play my PS2 games. Will your xPox360 play your old xPox games? :rolleyes:

[~Shard~]

You know what's excruciatingly funny? All this money, time and effort is being pumped into next generation power and graphics... but people still look like plastic toys, they still have horrible load times and they are getting more and more un-fun.

Agree with the above post too. I played the first Metal Gear Solid on the PS1 and Gamecube. no game like it. everything works perfect. its like OSX over windows. then out came MGS2. No thanks. MGS3? nah. I'm happy with MGS1, the rest are just pants. but thats just me. and Final Fantasy has been getting worse on non-Nintendo handheld systems. FF7 is my favourite. followed by the GBA NES remakes. whereas FF on PS2 and PC and the rest have just been falling deeper into a pit of poo-ness.

Couldn't agree more. MGS is my favorite of the series and FF7 is my favorite FF game, hands down. "Next generation power and graphics" means squat if you don't have a good game with a compelling, intelligent storyline and engaging characters like the above games have. Not saying that no new games are good, but I think some game companies are putting their focus and priorities in the wrong place at times. :cool:

[nimbus]

It says in the article that they started working on it right after the PS2 network adapter came out, meaning they've had at least as much time as Microsoft did to refine XBOX LIVE.

Not that I give a ****. I just wanted to clear that up.
Oh so true. I hope that clears up things for those that don't know.

Oh, and here's an interesting tidbit. Perhaps a reason why PS3 will sell more copies than Xbox 360.


M U L T I

- Famitsu conducted a survey with developers, dealers and consumers regarding to current and next-gen consoles.

Which next-generation console will you be most satisfied with in 2006?

Developers:
# PlayStation 3 - 53.7%
# Revolution - 41.4%
# Xbox 360 - 2.4%

Dealers:
# PlayStation 3 - 56.9%
# Revolution - 43.9%
# Xbox 360 - 1.7%

Consumers:
# PlayStation 3 - 46.3%
# Revolution - 43.9%
# Xbox 360 - 7.9%

Which console will be No. 1 in 2006?

Developers:
# Nintendo DS - 49.9%
# PlayStation 3 - 16.7%
# Revolution - 10.0%
# PSP - 5.0%
# Xbox 360 - 1.7%

Dealers:
# Nintendo DS - 38.3%
# PlayStation 3 - 31.5%
# Revolution - 12.3%
# PSP - 1.7%
# Xbox 360 - 1.7%

Consumers:
# PlayStation 3 - 40.3%
# Nintendo DS - 32.6%
# PlayStation 2 - 11.8%
# Revolution - 11.5%
# Xbox 360 - 2.5%
# PSP - 0.3%

What is the expected retail price of PlayStation 3?
# Developers: 40,000 yen (US$339) average
# Retailers: 40,000 yen (US$339) average
# Consumers: 50,000 yen (US$424) average

What is the expected retail price of Revolution?
# Developers: 20,000 yen (US$170) average
# Retailers: 25,000 yen (US$212) average
# Consumers: 30,000 yen (US$255) average

http://the-magicbox.com

Of course this is in Japan, but Japan sales rival US sales.
Ja mata ne...
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[saunders45]

Couldn't agree more. MGS is my favorite of the series and FF7 is my favorite FF game, hands down. "Next generation power and graphics" means squat if you don't have a good game with a compelling, intelligent storyline and engaging characters like the above games have. Not saying that no new games are good, but I think some game companies are putting their focus and priorities in the wrong place at times. :cool:

And I completely agree. While I can say that I have never completed a FF Game, all my friends who do play them are saying that they are getting less-fun. MGS1 was the freakin bomb. I remember when my cousin went and picked up MGS2 and took it back to his house to play. We used to do this for every new big game that we anted to play. We would play until we pretty much passed out. It was cool for a little bit, and we did end up beating it over the course of the weekend, but we both agreed it sucked compared to MGS1. Vampires and force field chicks, um..... no thanks.

[hulugu]

Lucky for me, I have no interest in online console gaming. So my choice of the PS3 will be entirely unaffected by their 'war' with MS and the xPox. I can base my choice completely on my dislike for MS products, my not wanting to put cash in their coffers, my disinterest in 90% of the games they offer, and my willingness to continue being loyal to Sony and the PS platform.. which will play my PS2 games. Will your xPox360 play your old xPox games? :rolleyes:

Yes. Instead of funding Microsoft you can fund Sony, whose disrespect for your personal technology became abundantly clear with last year's rootkit debacle.
Neither one is a particular bastion of morality.

[hulugu]

Let me resume this thread :

Microsoft / X360 = Evil . bad, disspointing no matter what they do

Sony / PS3 = everything online they ever did was bad but since they are Sony they will make it an 100 times betters because they are sony

Revolution = No matter what nintendo will always be cool.


Now back to reality. Sony is a hype machine. Now they are trying to hype their online network because they know that X360 is the leader in the online console market. I can't believe how many people still belive in Sony's hype after the Emotion Engine and the Online adapter add-ons.

Exactly. I want to see what Sony can deliver for online play, right now it's a mish-mash of different systems, while Xbox Live has one system, which makes it easy to switch between games and still play online.

[~Shard~]

And I completely agree. While I can say that I have never completed a FF Game, all my friends who do play them are saying that they are getting less-fun. MGS1 was the freakin bomb. I remember when my cousin went and picked up MGS2 and took it back to his house to play. We used to do this for every new big game that we anted to play. We would play until we pretty much passed out. It was cool for a little bit, and we did end up beating it over the course of the weekend, but we both agreed it sucked compared to MGS1. Vampires and force field chicks, um..... no thanks.

Couldn't agree more. ;) :)

[yellow]

Yes. Instead of funding Microsoft you can fund Sony, whose disrespect for your personal technology became abundantly clear with last year's rootkit debacle.
Neither one is a particular bastion of morality.

I don't think the comparison between Sony and Microsoft is an apt one to make. Particulatly not based on the rootkit lunacy.

I use Sony products every day.. happily. They are a constant source of amusement to me.

I use Microsoft products every day.. very much unhappily. They are a constant source of irritation to me.

[GFLPraxis]

Sony products work good when they work, but are prone to breakage.

Microsoft products rarely break entirely, but instead bug up constantly as you use them until you rip your hair out.

[BrianKonarsMac]

You obviously don't treat your products with care so. I've had a Sony radio since the 80's thats still in perfect order (it's on now), even after its been knocked straight off a shelf. How did you manage to break a PS2? Their relatively new machines and hard enough to break. Take more care of your products-they might last longer
it would help if he was old enough in the 80's to have purchased a product DESIGNED to last, not be replaced.

How did he break his PS 2? he probably turned it on and let it do the work for him.

neither Microsoft nor Sony really has an advantage over the other, they both put out the cheapest product possible and charge an exorbitant amount of money, aside from gaming machines where they sell them at a loss to undercut the others advantage, and then push out loads of half ass games for obscene prices.

[Mord]

360 live impresses me every day, the way i can set up a privet chat between friends whatever is going on, i can eject a disk navigate menu's change games, anything bar turning the console off and the voice link will stay on, so you can discuss with your friend what game to join as your browsing hosts, it's great, as shown time and time again by REAL hardware comparison the 360 and ps3 are just about even graphics are not and issue and the 360 has all the games i like, for me this console is bliss, crystal clear HD graphics intuitive OS, and country to popular belief the consoles do not self-distruct, funnily enough most of the ps3 dev kits have.

the one and only thing that bugs the hell out of me is that because i'm useing a vga adapter which only supports 60Hz all my 50Hz only xbox games (pal) wont run under emulation via vga, why couldn't Microsoft drop every 6th frame?

otherwise i would recommend the console to any live/HDTV owner and i wouldn't discourage an SDTV owner, it's not that bad in SD.

[nimbus]

I'd get an Xbox 360, but there's no games on the forcast that I'd want to play. Xbox Live sounds great though, but I don't want to buy the system and pay for XBL just to chat. I was going to get Xbox 360 for FFXI Online, but I hear that it's not all that great on Xbox 360 compared to PC and PS2. Time will tell though. I might get one, but I'm getting a PS3 for sure.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Mord]

if you like japanese rpg's then the 360's not for you but cod2 is great, as is perfect dark zero on live, pgr3 rules, full auto will be great (demo kicks ass, only racer to allow co-op, the controls are on both pads so one person can do weapons the other drives or vice versa, it's like co-pilot controls).

and apparently doa4 is good, but i never liked doa.

[Dagless]

neither Microsoft nor Sony really has an advantage over the other, they both put out the cheapest product possible and charge an exorbitant amount of money, aside from gaming machines where they sell them at a loss to undercut the others advantage, and then push out loads of half ass games for obscene prices.

congratulations! you just summed up 2/3 of the console market!

[Lastinline39]

And I completely agree. While I can say that I have never completed a FF Game, all my friends who do play them are saying that they are getting less-fun. MGS1 was the freakin bomb. I remember when my cousin went and picked up MGS2 and took it back to his house to play. We used to do this for every new big game that we anted to play. We would play until we pretty much passed out. It was cool for a little bit, and we did end up beating it over the course of the weekend, but we both agreed it sucked compared to MGS1. Vampires and force field chicks, um..... no thanks.

Yeah MGS2 was a huge dissapointment in relation to MGS1, but MGS3 made up for it. Though not quite as good as MGS1, Snake Eater was a phenomenal game that reminded me of MGS1 much more than MGS2 did.

[~Shard~]

Yeah MGS2 was a huge dissapointment in relation to MGS1, but MGS3 made up for it. Though not quite as good as MGS1, Snake Eater was a phenomenal game that reminded me of MGS1 much more than MGS2 did.

Still wanting to play MGS3 just to see how it stacks up. MGS4 looks pretty sweet from the scenes I've seen of it. Not sure if it'll be good enough to make me buy a PS3 though... ;) :cool:

[mac.head.high]

If you look at Sony's online strategy with SOCOM 3, then you can see where they are heading. In SOCOM 3 you can play for free, or you can play for free and register your self to your credit card for the ability to keep scores online. As ll the Bug forum and many other forums are directly accessible from the online game menu. So if you have a compliant or a good game story or whatever, you can hit the forums through the game menu and then use the PS2 or and USB keyboard to post. These posts are seen directly by the development team.
That should give you and idea of Sony has in mind. It wont just be an online game service, it will actually be a gaming community with the community accessible from the console. My guess is that Sony goal is to keep the experience going. And by making every aspect of the gaming experience -from the gaming itself to the direct connection to the developers be part of the console itself; then Sony could actually Pull ahead M$ with ease.

I have a lot of PS2 online time logged. From Need From Speed Underground, SOCOM 1, SOCOM 2, and SOCOM 3. And I feel, for a free service, that Sony has done very well so far. Also Sony stamped out online cheating after only one game cycle; From SOCOM 1 to SOCOM 2. So I have faith in Sony to make a more secure online gaming experience than M$.

Also I have a previous rant about the tank-ness of my PS2. I invite you to read it since it is in alignment with this topic of discussion.


http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2000467#post2000467

[XNine]

Oh come on people! MGS 3 was amazing! It was 10 times as difficult as the other 2 combined! The simple fact that you have to stay healthy, not just alive, makes it that much mroe difficult.

MGS 4 will be great, I'm sure. Snake is in the middle of two warring nations (probably in the middle east somewhere). OF course, what we see in the demo may just be a joke from Hideo, if you recall he likes pulling the wool over his fans eyes!

[~Shard~]

Oh come on people! MGS 3 was amazing! It was 10 times as difficult as the other 2 combined! The simple fact that you have to stay healthy, not just alive, makes it that much mroe difficult.

This is why I want to play it, as I haven't had a chance yet. MGS2 left a bitter taste in my mouth, but I want to play MGS3, and MGS4 does excite me, but will be it be enough for me to justify buying a PS3? ;) Well, if FF7 gets remade for PS3 then we'll talk... :cool:

[skubish]

After Sony's rootkit fiasco, they will never get any of my money again.

[XNine]

After Sony's rootkit fiasco, they will never get any of my money again.


How many times do I have to say this? It was SONY BMG, not SONY CE. Blame the morons with the RIAA and Sony BMG.

You can't blame all of Sony for the stupidity of one of their divisions.


As for MGS 3, it is SWEET. The boss fights are incredible, the story is great (not wacky like MGS 2) and there's hardly any parts that I would consider boring. And let's face it, what other video games do you get the chance to where an aligator head as a hat, burn leaches off your body with a cigar, get to listen to funky surfer music to heal yourself, and zap monkeys in the ass in a mini game? NONE. This game rules!

[Dagless]

How many times do I have to say this? It was SONY BMG, not SONY CE. Blame the morons with the RIAA and Sony BMG.

You can't blame all of Sony for the stupidity of one of their divisions.


As for MGS 3, it is SWEET. The boss fights are incredible, the story is great (not wacky like MGS 2) and there's hardly any parts that I would consider boring. And let's face it, what other video games do you get the chance to where an aligator head as a hat, burn leaches off your body with a cigar, get to listen to funky surfer music to heal yourself, and zap monkeys in the ass in a mini game? NONE. This game rules!

sorry to be pedantic, but what game can you smash up Peach as Bowser, or give Mario a gun, or have 3 of your mates gang up on 1 guy each holding a baseball bat with invincibility suits? NON! thats what Smash Bros rules ;)

seriously though. I don't know why I didn't like MGS3. Perhaps it was just this new route games are going (GTA: SA being another) where you have to look after the player first, then play the game. Its like a tactical espionage version of The Sims. MGS4 does interest me though. the mini story "2 nations at war" just sounds ultimately intriguing.

[Lastinline39]

sorry to be pedantic, but what game can you smash up Peach as Bowser, or give Mario a gun, or have 3 of your mates gang up on 1 guy each holding a baseball bat with invincibility suits? NON! thats what Smash Bros rules ;)

seriously though. I don't know why I didn't like MGS3. Perhaps it was just this new route games are going (GTA: SA being another) where you have to look after the player first, then play the game. Its like a tactical espionage version of The Sims. MGS4 does interest me though. the mini story "2 nations at war" just sounds ultimately intriguing.

You hardly had to take care of CJ in SA. You had to eat occasionally, and that was only if you wanted to keep his muscle mass, which wasn't even an option in previous GTAs. I didn't mind taking care of Snake in MGS3, but the fact that it was in a menu that time didn't dictate made it too easy. I could stop in the middle of a boss fight and fix a broken limb. Although I don't know why this was a turnoff for you, seeing as MGS3 was probably the easiest MGS, it's not like taking care of snake made it tedius.

[2nyRiggz]

Yeah MGS2 was a huge dissapointment in relation to MGS1, but MGS3 made up for it. Though not quite as good as MGS1, Snake Eater was a phenomenal game that reminded me of MGS1 much more than MGS2 did.

MGS2 was a great game its just rayden messed it up just by being in it but the game was top. I dont get the comment someone said about playstation games are half arsed......have u ever played the games playstation made?...primal, ICO and shadow of the colossus to name a few.


Bless

[Abulia]

Let me resume this thread :

Microsoft / X360 = Evil . bad, disspointing no matter what they do

Sony / PS3 = everything online they ever did was bad but since they are Sony they will make it an 100 times betters because they are sony

Revolution = No matter what nintendo will always be cool. Yea, pretty tiresome, isn't it? I gave up the hope of having intelligent and respectful discussions on cross-platform and console gaming on this site months ago.

In my MBA class we're doing a market analysis/case study on the Xbox and their strategic plan. Interesting stuff. Love 'em or hate 'em, they had a clear plan and followed it.

It will be interesting to see Sony's online offering. Will they erase a 4 year headstart in one fell swoop? Highly unlikely.

[clayj]

It will be interesting to see Sony's online offering. Will they erase a 4 year headstart in one fell swoop? Highly unlikely.Especially since, as I've noted previously, Sony is not known for producing quality software. As someone who's had a number of Sony PCs over the years, I can tell you that the quality of Sony's software (GigaPocket, PictureGear, Click to DVD, SonicStage, MoodLogic, etc.) has NEVER been very good. Crappy UI, crappy upgrade process, arcane software requirements, etc.

They make good gear, most of the time... but their software sucks, most of the time.

[toomuchstereo]

If the mass amount of people like me who have had to return multible 360's to MS can get this information out into the public, I think alot of people will stay away from the system. Its a mess. Unless you get enjoyment out of your 400 dollar system spending most of its time on a UPS plane, and in a repair center.

I just want sony to put out a system that works. MS put the 360 out about 6 months to early, and the bugs and failed systems prove it. But thats what MS always does.


To clarify, the first round of 360's had overheating problems, and those anyone over the past two weeks who has gotten a replacement from MS for this problem is getting ones that the hardware is incapable of connecting to XBOX Live. Customer support says this is around 1000 people with this particular problem.....if this was a iPod I have no doubt that there would be a Class Action Suit.

[hulugu]

How many times do I have to say this? It was SONY BMG, not SONY CE. Blame the morons with the RIAA and Sony BMG.

You can't blame all of Sony for the stupidity of one of their divisions.

I guess you have a point, I love Microsoft's Mac Business Unit and I enjoy Halo 2 Multiplayer on my Xbox, but I can't stand Windows.

However, the Sony Rootkit fiasco was such an assault on the relationship between customer and company that I feel a pound of flesh must be taken. So, I have not only boycotted Sony BMG, but Sony Entertainment as well. The reason? I hope the other divisions, which in Sony's case mean much more than the MBU to Microsoft, recognize that Sony BMG is a dangerous boat-anchor worthy of 86'ing for the good of the company.
My dollar doesn't mean a damn, but if the PS3 failed to sell as a direct result of furious consumers you can bet that Sony, and other companies, would be more cautious.

[GFLPraxis]

I guess you have a point, I love Microsoft's Mac Business Unit and I enjoy Halo 2 Multiplayer on my Xbox, but I can't stand Windows.

The Mac Business Unit is IMO the only good part of Microsoft.

Halo 2 was not developed by Microsoft.

However, the Sony Rootkit fiasco was such an assault on the relationship between customer and company that I feel a pound of flesh must be taken. So, I have not only boycotted Sony BMG, but Sony Entertainment as well. The reason? I hope the other divisions, which in Sony's case mean much more than the MBU to Microsoft, recognize that Sony BMG is a dangerous boat-anchor worthy of 86'ing for the good of the company.
My dollar doesn't mean a damn, but if the PS3 failed to sell as a direct result of furious consumers you can bet that Sony, and other companies, would be more cautious.

You don't think Microsoft's forced registrations, repeated privacy violations, illegal business practices, downright crappy software, repeated violation of industry standards, and common outright lies (even using doctored video in court), is not equally bad?

I don't get the logic.

Sony BMG does bad things, thus you boycott everything relating to Sony whether it be good or bad, all divisions.

Microsoft does bad things, but it's only necessary to boycott the divisions that do bad things.

I don't see how that makes sense...make it one or the other.

[Dagless]

I'm boycotting both. Or as much as I can. infact! a list;

Xbox> chipped it, no longer funding MS.
PowerBook to replace Windows laptop
Sony amp> Teleton A390 (2 decades older and better, how'd that happen?)
random 80's Sony square speakers> 4x Wharfedale Modus
Playstation 1> N64
Microsoft mouse> Logitech mouse
Windows web server> Linux web server
Sony MZ-R91> i-Bead 100 > iPod> iPod mini
random Sony TV> Panasonic Quintrix
random old Sony record player> Aiwa record player
Sony 2x DVD-RW> unbranded DVD-RW that somehow has lasted longer

the body and mind are cleansed.

[JRM PowerPod]

I'm boycotting both. Or as much as I can. infact! a list;

Xbox> chipped it, no longer funding MS.
PowerBook to replace Windows laptop
Sony amp> Teleton A390 (2 decades older and better, how'd that happen?)
random 80's Sony square speakers> 4x Wharfedale Modus
Playstation 1> N64
Microsoft mouse> Logitech mouse
Windows web server> Linux web server
Sony MZ-R91> i-Bead 100 > iPod> iPod mini
random Sony TV> Panasonic Quintrix
random old Sony record player> Aiwa record player
Sony 2x DVD-RW> unbranded DVD-RW that somehow has lasted longer

the body and mind are cleansed.

Sony still have you buddy, they are AIWA... the record player has to go...
But you're nearly there

[XNine]

Sony still have you buddy, they are AIWA... the record player has to go...
But you're nearly there

lmfao Too true, too true.

Sony CE is a great company. They redfined the console. While others were able to play CD's long before it arrived, Sony did it right, and cheaply. As far as I'm concerned ANY record company complying with RIAA demands are to be stricken, or simply pirated.

Sony's PS 3 is looking to be a great console. Don't discount all of Sony just because Sony BMG sucks.

[Dagless]

Ok! replaced with a Phillips one from the attic. its actually much better I think. its got a fancy light pattern thing which serves no real use at all.

I forgot to add; the above list of Sony and MS products either broke or there were identically priced products that offered more.

[bigandy]

If it's free, it'll be worth it for me.

my exact thoughts on xbox live :rolleyes:

[hulugu]

The Mac Business Unit is IMO the only good part of Microsoft.

Halo 2 was not developed by Microsoft.


You don't think Microsoft's forced registrations, repeated privacy violations, illegal business practices, downright crappy software, repeated violation of industry standards, and common outright lies (even using doctored video in court), is not equally bad?

I don't get the logic.

Sony BMG does bad things, thus you boycott everything relating to Sony whether it be good or bad, all divisions.

Microsoft does bad things, but it's only necessary to boycott the divisions that do bad things.

I don't see how that makes sense...make it one or the other.

Good point about Halo, although Bungie is owned by Microsoft, so it follows that a game developed by Bungie is from Microsoft.

My point was simply that Sony ticked me off and I want to show my displeasure by boycotting their products. Since the electronics division is most of the company, boycotting that section because of Sony BMG is a much bigger blow to the company than boycotting the MBU would be for Microsoft. Boycotting the MBU would actually just hurt me in the long run, because if sales dropped enough, Microsoft might just abandon the unit. If Sony abandoned the Electronics division there would be another company: Phillips, Toshiba, etc. to pick up the slack.
I'm not saying one is better than the other, both have acted as if customers are a necessary evil rather than the prime reason the companies exist in the first place.