attitude towards PCs and PC users [Archive]

sparkleytone

Mar 1, 2003, 08:11 PM

i am a former pc user. i hate pcs now. i built my own pcs and ran both linux and windows. i beta tested XP and thought it was really good. i was pretty happy with win2k. i thought i disliked macs.

then i was exposed to OS X and the Mac in general. everything i loved about linux, and nothing i hated about it. this was during the time when m$ really began to show their true colors, with the extortionist licensing schemes and getting into bed with big money interests on digital rights management. this is when microsoft began to try and take over the internet media, yet again much too let, with windows media and other inferior products/codecs. i am tired of the ways of microsoft. i have a choice and i made it. i feel sorry for anyone who is unable or unwilling to make this choice.

pcs are fast machines. they are cheap and full featured. usability of those machines is crap. why would i want a bunch of stuff that i have to fight with to use? i know windows and linux better than just about everyone i know, yet i CHOOSE to use a mac. the only reason i know how to tweak, fix, etc a windows pc is because i have always HAD to do so in order for it to work in an acceptable manner.

to close this rant, i want to USE my computer. i want to sit down with a goal in mind and accomplish it. the computer should not get in my way. if it does, i get frustrated. call me spoiled, but my mac shows me that i am not dreaming.

macktheknife

Mar 1, 2003, 08:15 PM

I agree. People on many Macuser boards seem to have this chauvanistic and sometimes illogical anti-PC attitude. As someone who uses both a Mac and a Windows PC on a regular basis, I can see the benefits and drawbacks of using each of platform.

I love my TiBook, but many Macusers seem have adopted some sort of "double-think" when confronted with problems with the Mac platform. Macs are more expensive? We pay for what we get! What, Macs are slower? OS X is a more stable OS! What, Windows XP is pretty stable too? Well, eh, Macs just look great, and I *love* to fork my money over to Apple!!!

King Cobra

Mar 1, 2003, 08:21 PM

Here is how I see the Mac vs. PC war... (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=258674)

I like PC users appreciating Macs with either honesty, or bashing of PCs, or not worshiping their PC. I hate it when they bash Macs for no reason.

You reading this, computer techie at my HS??

Then again, one room at my HS has two real old PCs, one with a broken mouse at any one point, and both getting the blue screen of death about a few times per week. It puts a smile on my face. :)

Independence

Mar 1, 2003, 08:36 PM

@sparkleytone: you say you hate PCs now and that usability of PCs are crap. a properly configured linux system (or even windows 2000) enables you to get work done, just like with your mac. if you had an aging PC that just wont run much of anything anymore with a bit of stability (like me, though i suspect an insufficient power supply) i can understand your frustration. but that doesnt make PCs bad. i've gotten quite a bit of use out of this PC and for a long time it's served me well. i never saw the usability as crap. take a look inside the case of a pc and a mac. they look the same.

guitargeek

Mar 1, 2003, 10:22 PM

take a look inside the case of a pc and a mac. they look the same.

I think you're calling him racist! :eek: ;)

shadowfax

Mar 1, 2003, 11:00 PM

Originally posted by Independence
a properly configured linux system (or even windows 2000) enables you to get work done, just like with your mac.

i thought this was sparkley's point? who really wants to have to go through an elaborate setup to get everything stable and working right?:rolleyes: i never thought of my windows PC as really troublesome, till i used my Tibook for awhile. and i am one of those people that had his XP box running for over a month without restarting.

guitargeek

Mar 1, 2003, 11:08 PM

Originally posted by Shadowfax
i thought this was sparkley's point? who really wants to have to go through an elaborate setup to get everything stable and working right?:rolleyes:

No one. That's why you use linux. I would hardly call setting it up as "elaborate". All I did was a pretty generic install of Mandrake, and no tweaks other than a recompiled kernel (and only because a new one became available). But even before the kernel compile, it was running flawlessly.

Linux is to the point where you can install it and it just works, no tweaking required.

shadowfax

Mar 1, 2003, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by guitargeek
Linux is to the point where you can install it and it just works, no tweaking required.

i agree. i was mostly talking about Windows, but yeah. i think that still, anytime you run into troubles in linux, however rare, it's usually a bitch to fix. but linux is moving up there, and i definitely respect it.

bousozoku

Mar 1, 2003, 11:18 PM

I don't have a problem with PC users or PCs, in general. I use a PC at work and the place is full of them. Of course, some of the users claim that Macs are toys. I can't see ease-of-use making a computer a toy and I find that it takes a lot more steps to do most things in Windows (98SE, 2000, or XP) than Mac OS 9 and just a few more steps than with Mac OS X.

I almost bought a PC last summer. After using WinXP, I'm just glad I didn't.

You know, these fights have been going on for quite a while. It used to be Apple vs. Commodore vs. Atari way back when.

uhlawboi80

Mar 1, 2003, 11:58 PM

i dont really mind PCs...in fact i still have an old PC laptop that stays in my house all day (the powerbook travels). My big reason for preferring Mac is because OSX is where linux will be in years, at which point OSX will be all that more advanced.

besides that, i have a huge issue with microsoft. It seems there are just way too many ways people can observe everything you do. That and the fact that microsoft and intel have gone in with the big brother-esque computer monitoring. I dont want them deciding software or files of mine arent "legal" or whatever else they may decide and deleting them. Apple believes in the good of their customers and Microsoft just assumes you will be a criminal and makes sure they can stop you. Personally id rather use a superior product from a company that shares my basic optimism for humanity.

sparkleytone

Mar 2, 2003, 01:24 AM

Originally posted by Independence
a properly configured linux system (or even windows 2000) enables you to get work done, just like with your mac.

why would i ever want to configure anything? that was basically my point. i just want it to work.

Rajj

Mar 2, 2003, 01:48 AM

Originally posted by sparkleytone
why would i ever want to configure anything? that was basically my point. i just want it to work.
I grew up with P.C.’s and almost every time I use XP Pro, something goes wrong i.e. freezing applications, it just pisses me off!! :mad:
So I just jump back on Jag and I am cool, but no OS is flawless; for instance, I constantly have to repair permissions in Jag to get my apps up to par or I have to log out to stop that damn beach ball from spinning so much!! :mad:

To rap it up, I concluded; that I need both Operating Systems to satisfy my needs, until software companies can make all apps available for Jag!!

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 01:54 AM

Originally posted by xrhajj's sig
“By any means necessary”

been listening to some malcolm X speeches, have we?

it's odd how some people i know just had SO MUCH trouble with XP being very buggy and unstable, and many others, myself included, never had any trouble running it at all--crash-wise, anyhow:rolleyes:

jaykk

Mar 2, 2003, 02:02 AM

Mac OS X/unix is a well integratred system. No registry crap. I am tired of getting those DLL missing massages. Alas, i have to use Win 2000 at work. I swicthed to Mac about a year ago as my primary computer at home, and I think Mac OS X is the best OS ever..

1) Its unix
2) The gui is more fluid - quiet opposite of regid Win systems
3) The peripherals are just plug & play - unlike plug 'n' pray in Win
4) Its more of life style change

Rajj

Mar 2, 2003, 02:05 AM

Originally posted by Shadowfax
been listening to some malcolm X speeches, have we?

it's odd how some people i know just had SO MUCH trouble with XP being very buggy and unstable, and many others, myself included, never had any trouble running it at all--crash-wise, anyhow:rolleyes:

Yep Malcolm X is very influential to me!!!;)

The funny thing about Operating Systems is that they work different on the same type of hardware. Also after you download the update intending to fix the previous problem?. it sometimes exacerbate it!! :eek:

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 02:12 AM

Originally posted by xrhajj
The funny thing about Operating Systems is that they work different on the same type of hardware. Also after you download the update intending to fix the previous problem?. it sometimes exacerbate it!! :eek:

well, now that i think of it though, i have seen a good deal of variance around here with OS X and 10.2.4 causing some problems for people.

weev

Mar 2, 2003, 04:00 AM

Originally posted by uhlawboi80
i dont really mind PCs...in fact i still have an old PC laptop that stays in my house all day (the powerbook travels). My big reason for preferring Mac is because OSX is where linux will be in years, at which point OSX will be all that more advanced.

besides that, i have a huge issue with microsoft. It seems there are just way too many ways people can observe everything you do. That and the fact that microsoft and intel have gone in with the big brother-esque computer monitoring. I dont want them deciding software or files of mine arent "legal" or whatever else they may decide and deleting them. Apple believes in the good of their customers and Microsoft just assumes you will be a criminal and makes sure they can stop you.

Personally id rather use a superior product from a company that shares my basic optimism for humanity.

That's beautiful!!

________
weev

Independence

Mar 2, 2003, 07:30 AM

Originally posted by sparkleytone
why would i ever want to configure anything? that was basically my point. i just want it to work.
huh? you gotta configure mac os x too unless it reads its ethernet settings from your mind. it takes less that two minutes to configure such a thing (static IP).

it's odd how some people i know just had SO MUCH trouble with XP being very buggy and unstable, and many others, myself included, never had any trouble running it at all--crash-wise, anyhow
i guess user error and hardware come into play here.

King Cobra

Mar 2, 2003, 08:38 AM

Originally posted by xrhajj
So I just jump back on Jag and I am cool, but no OS is flawless; for instance, I constantly have to repair permissions in Jag to get...that damn beach ball from spinning so much!!

I have a feeling you have a lot of software and do not realize what you are installing from who and what certain software can do to your system. If you have a lot of third party apps in beta or alpha mode, there is always the chance that something negative will occur within your system software. Also, I have noticed that a large portion of apps targeted towards PCs release insufficient or partially operative Macintosh software.

Remember, it's what you install on your system that can either improve it or screw with it.

Also, when was the last time you completely wiped the Hard Drive and performed a fresh install?

Over Achiever

Mar 2, 2003, 08:59 AM

Lets see...I use a PC, and I've been using a PC for years. No problems with it.

I'm getting a powerbook NOT because of the OS, but because apple knows how to design laptops. Do I dislike OS X? NO, I expect to have fun using it. Will I hate MS or XP after using OS X? Probably not.

I don't see the reasons to bash macs, but I don't see a reason to bash PCs either. But I have seen many mac users (i did not say all mac users) continually bash PCs, and "microsuck/microcrap" and I don't see the point. Got anti-piracy issues? There are ways to get around that. Miffed at the price of the OS? Apple's hardware isn't that cheap either. On the other side of the spectrum there are some PC users (note I did not say all) that don't understand why I'm even considering buying Apple. They are biased too on Apple's compatibility (like PDA software), and the selection of software.

I don't see the whole PC vs. Mac thing...I don't even see the point. It's a frikkin' computer, just as long as you can get your work done, and get it done quickly and efficiently (and PCs can do that just fine), then it's a good computer. I have a 550 MHz laptop and a 200 MHz desktop, and i can get the stuff that can be run on them done just fine. My friend has a 3 GHz PC and it can run games just fine. I know someone with a 500 MHz powerbook, and again, you get my point.

End rant.

MacFan25

Mar 2, 2003, 09:51 AM

It's not that I dislike PC users, it's just that I think that Mac OS X runs better than Windows. Some PC's are a good deal. But, I would rather not buy one, because of windows. So, I bought a mac.

markjones05

Mar 2, 2003, 10:17 AM

Originally posted by Independence
i notice that a lot of mac users badmouth PCs and PC users. do mac users hate PCs in general or the OS that is most commonly run on them? macs aren't all that different from PCs inside the cases so i really dont see any reason for the conflict.

I agree! So many people in here jump on people for asking questions aout pc's or just tell them to get a mac as an answer to their question. Some people act like they are in some exclusive club where macs are superior to PC's and thus they are superior to PC users. Its really funny and kinda sad to watch this.

macktheknife

Mar 2, 2003, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by Over Achiever
I don't see the whole PC vs. Mac thing...I don't even see the point. It's a frikkin' computer, just as long as you can get your work done, and get it done quickly and efficiently (and PCs can do that just fine), then it's a good computer. I have a 550 MHz laptop and a 200 MHz desktop, and i can get the stuff that can be run on them done just fine. My friend has a 3 GHz PC and it can run games just fine. I know someone with a 500 MHz powerbook, and again, you get my point.

End rant.

Yup. To paraphrase Linus Torvalds, people don't really want to use a computer per se. What they really want is a "magic box" that will let them surf the net, play some games, do some work, organize their schedules, and make their lives more manageable.

In the end, it really doesn't matter what computer you use, so don't buy into Apple's propaganda about how great their computers are too much. Yes, I think my TiBook is a really good machine, and, yes, I love OS X. However, is the TiBook flat out better than a Dell laptop with a faster processor, a generally stable OS that gives the user greater compatibility with the rest of the software industry, and cost alot less?

Whatever your opinion, you can see the answer isn't as clear-cut as "PCs suck/Mac rocks!"

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 01:08 PM

Originally posted by Independence
huh? you gotta configure mac os x too unless it reads its ethernet settings from your mind. it takes less that two minutes to configure such a thing (static IP).

or you have a DHCP server, VERY common among broadband users with multiple computers. i haven't set up a network on either platform (mac/PC) in over 3 years, though... i do have to admin the router:rolleyes:
i think we are talking more about drivers and various hardware configuration here.for instance, i have to go and get the latest drivers--which is often performed by system update, but even now, vendors make their own drivers that microsoft doesn't endorse that you have to go to their site and get...

i dunno, i think that the configuration thing is a little bogus, as you really only have to do it once on either platform anyways.

DLL/registry issues, though... i've never seen anything to compare with that on OS X.

alex_ant

Mar 2, 2003, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by Independence
huh? you gotta configure mac os x too unless it reads its ethernet settings from your mind. it takes less that two minutes to configure such a thing (static IP).
"Less than 2 minutes" just to change a static IP? And you still have to know how to do it, and even if it's with a simple control panel or something, will you be able to count on that control panel in the future when you change or upgrade distros, or when the make of your distro goes out of business (Ximian, probably Mandrake...)? Anyway, that's not the point. Ethernet is simple to configure. When I can plug my digicam into a Linux box and have an iPhoto equivalent launch and automatically import my photos without having to configure anything, I will be impressed. When I can have subpixel font antialiasting and alpha blending take effect inside all my apps without having to configure anything... when I can set up my USB audio device with a simple graphical control panel and use it as the system sound device with <5ms latency without having to build a custom kernel... when I can customize my mouse buttons and have the changes take effect across all apps... heck, when all my apps look and work the same... I will be impressed.

OS X (and OS 9) are leaps and bounds ahead of Linux in the usability & consistency (which is a part of usability - something Linux users haven't learned yet) dept. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Mac zealot, Linux was my primary OS for nearly 4 years. But to say "Linux is there" is incredibly disingenuous. And I do like Linux overall - it has a lot of things going for it. But I must remind myself that I get what I pay for.

It reminds me of that Michael Keaton movie, I forget the name, where he's managing a Japanese auto plant in the US and he's got all the cars his factory produced lined up to show the boss, they all look brand spaking new and perfect, but the boss opens up the hood of one of them and there's no engine inside, he goes to touch the windshield of one of them and there's no windshield, Keaton drives off in his and it falls apart. Most Linux environments try first and foremost to be Windows knockoffs, and where they can't succeed, they use lots and lots of ideology, hype, and duct tape. There is no unified vision that can harness all the fragmented development. Work is duplicated and the project as a whole suffers. So, no, I don't hate Linux, but I do enjoy using a superior desktop OS. ;)

Rajj

Mar 2, 2003, 01:27 PM

Originally posted by King Cobra
I have a feeling you have a lot of software and do not realize what you are installing from who and what certain software can do to your system. If you have a lot of third party apps in beta or alpha mode, there is always the chance that something negative will occur within your system software. Also, I have noticed that a large portion of apps targeted towards PCs release insufficient or partially operative Macintosh software.

Remember, it's what you install on your system that can either improve it or screw with it.

Also, when was the last time you completely wiped the Hard Drive and performed a fresh install?

I do have a lot of software installed but most of them are in neither beta nor Alpha mode.

I want a basic apps for Mac, like some mapping software for Jag?.there is nothing available?..that is just plain crazy!!! Or Kazaa!!! I could go on and on but I will not.

Also, that is another thing that we should not have to do, is perform a clean install all the time, it is very annoying, because I have over 4,000 songs in iTunes, and I get tired of waiting for them to transfers from my Firewire HDD!!

cubist

Mar 2, 2003, 01:40 PM

Mac users usually choose their machine. Very few PC users do.

If you're a PC user, and you've built a PC and it works well for you, I can respect that.

But if you're a PC tech or IT manager or PC user, and you say "we don't support Macs because we don't have time to train anybody," and you buy PCs in bulk from Dell, and you pay Microsoft whatever they ask in license fees, that's not an attitude I can respect. It's arrogant and incompetent.

Working in the corporate world, I see arrogant and incompetent PC users all the time.

For somebody to come to Mac Rumors, a Mac message board, and not to expect to see some emotional backlash against the arrogant and incompetent people that make up the majority of PC users in the world, is rather shortsighted.

Go to a PC rumors site (there must be some?) and see whether they say anything insightful or sensible about the Mac. Chastise them if you want to chastise somebody. We're the minority; don't expect us to be magnanimous.

King Cobra

Mar 2, 2003, 01:46 PM

>(xrhajj) I want a basic apps for Mac, like some mapping software for Jag?.there is nothing available?..that is just plain crazy!!! Or Kazaa!!! I could go on and on but I will not.

I'm a little lost here...what is mapping software?

Before you download and, especially, install a third-party app, read the reviews for it and check the bugs sheet, even if it isn't a beta or alpha. If you are willing to risk using it and you end up with OS problems, you're at fault.

>Also, that is another thing that we should not have to do, is perform a clean install all the time, it is very annoying, because I have over 4,000 songs in iTunes, and I get tired of waiting for them to transfers from my Firewire HDD!!

As for waiting for your 4000 songs to be transferred over to your computer again, T.S. And how often do you perform a "clean install"? If you have to completely erase the Hard Drive more than a few times per year and you still have these problems, then there is a problem with how you maintain your system, period.

G4scott

Mar 2, 2003, 02:01 PM

In my opinion, pee-cee's (I'm being sarcastic, ok) are alright, as long as you want to play games. If you really need software that is windoze (more sarcasm) only, then go for a pee-cee. You can get one that works for about $500. If you do games, you'll spend much more...

I love the Mac because it's easy to use, I don't have to configure every part of the OS (yes, I can connect to ethernet or airport networks with no configuration), and it has the software I need. I don't need office. I have AppleWorks, and text edit. Text edit is fine for just typing notes or regular papers, and Appleworks works fine for everything else.

I also know that my Mac won't be completely obsolete in 1 year... My iBook is over a year old and still runs fine. My brother's blueberry iBook still runs, but the battery is pooping out, and it has some other issues, but he still plays diablo 2, surfs the net, and does what he needs. These days, a 300 or even 600mhz celeron (or any other G3 equivilant) is really slow in the pee-cee world, and is most likely unsupported. Both iBooks run 10.2.4...

There are also many more reasons as to why I see the Mac as a better machine than a PC (for practical uses, not gaming...)

PC's do have their advantages in that they're dirt cheap, and will always have games available for them, but I look for qualitiy and function in a computer, and the Mac's got it...

Oh, and xrhajj, you can try out a software app called Neo. It's a kazaa client, but you have to search for clients. Not as convenient, but it still works...

Rajj

Mar 2, 2003, 02:49 PM

Originally posted by King Cobra
>(xrhajj) I want a basic apps for Mac, like some mapping software for Jag?.there is nothing available?..that is just plain crazy!!! Or Kazaa!!! I could go on and on but I will not.

I'm a little lost here...what is mapping software?

Before you download and, especially, install a third-party app, read the reviews for it and check the bugs sheet, even if it isn't a beta or alpha. If you are willing to risk using it and you end up with OS problems, you're at fault.

>Also, that is another thing that we should not have to do, is perform a clean install all the time, it is very annoying, because I have over 4,000 songs in iTunes, and I get tired of waiting for them to transfers from my Firewire HDD!!

As for waiting for your 4000 songs to be transferred over to your computer again, T.S. And how often do you perform a "clean install"? If you have to completely erase the Hard Drive more than a few times per year and you still have these problems, then there is a problem with how you maintain your system, period.

Mapping software is like Street and trips, it is GPS software, and since I travel a lot, this software is a prerequisite for me!!

FYI, the maintenance of my system is impeccable, I consistently monitor my system?s structure, so do not try to tell me that I do not take care of my system!!!
:rolleyes: :cool:

Rajj

Mar 2, 2003, 02:55 PM

Originally posted by G4scott

Oh, and xrhajj, you can try out a software app called Neo. It's a kazaa client, but you have to search for clients. Not as convenient, but it still works...
Yeah I tried it?.it sucx, so I just use Limewire or mainly Kazaa, and then transfer the files via Airport!!
Thanx anyway!!

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 03:48 PM

Originally posted by cubist
Mac users usually choose their machine. Very few PC users do.

If you're a PC user, and you've built a PC and it works well for you, I can respect that.

But if you're a PC tech or IT manager or PC user, and you say "we don't support Macs because we don't have time to train anybody," and you buy PCs in bulk from Dell, and you pay Microsoft whatever they ask in license fees, that's not an attitude I can respect. It's arrogant and incompetent.

Working in the corporate world, I see arrogant and incompetent PC users all the time.

For somebody to come to Mac Rumors, a Mac message board, and not to expect to see some emotional backlash against the arrogant and incompetent people that make up the majority of PC users in the world, is rather shortsighted.

Go to a PC rumors site (there must be some?) and see whether they say anything insightful or sensible about the Mac. Chastise them if you want to chastise somebody. We're the minority; don't expect us to be magnanimous.

man, you're the coolest :D; that's why i quoted you in my sig, heh.

i think i can see the point that mac users (myself included) get out of hand on rants, and tend not to step back and see the big picture, but you definitely have a great point that the average PC attitude is something to be ashamed of and ridiculed, being at the most basic level short-sighted, and perhaps (thinking M$ here) even masochistic.

it's good to have your input here, as it strikes me as very well-thought-out--you have lots of good experience to share. thanks.

King Cobra

Mar 2, 2003, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by G4scott
xrhajj, you can try out a software app called Neo. It's a kazaa client...

Screw that. Neo hardly has the files.

A better program for files is Limewire. Once I got Xnap to work :eek:

But an even better Macintosh P2P app (I think) is Drumbeat (http://drumbeat.info/). The downside to this app is it is a 15 day trial until you pay/register.

BOT:
>(cubist) But if you're a PC tech or IT manager or PC user, and you say "we don't support Macs because we don't have time to train anybody," and you buy PCs in bulk from Dell, and you pay Microsoft whatever they ask in license fees, that's not an attitude I can respect. It's arrogant and incompetent.

You need to speak to my HS computer techie, a complete PC user and Mac basher, in the same context you put it. :rolleyes:

beatle888

Mar 2, 2003, 04:50 PM

Originally posted by Independence
huh? you gotta configure mac os x too unless it reads its ethernet settings from your mind.

i never had to configure my ethernet settings....its set to automatic. i never configure my system. i just complete tasks on it and surf the web. i dont need to know how computers work. apple did that for me. i dont want to be a computer wiz, i leave that up to apple. i do however have to know how to restart my computer and run the repair permissions feature....but i only do that once every couple of months. thats why i like macs. "it just works!"

beatle888

Mar 2, 2003, 05:03 PM

Originally posted by cubist
For somebody to come to Mac Rumors, a Mac message board, and not to expect to see some emotional backlash against the arrogant and incompetent people that make up the majority of PC users in the world, is rather shortsighted.

Go to a PC rumors site (there must be some?) and see whether they say anything insightful or sensible about the Mac. Chastise them if you want to chastise somebody. We're the minority; don't expect us to be magnanimous.

i agree with this post most of all.

Independence

Mar 2, 2003, 06:15 PM

beatle888: i dont know what default ethernet settings mac os x has. all i can do is guess till i get a mac for myself.

For somebody to come to Mac Rumors, a Mac message board, and not to expect to see some emotional backlash against the arrogant and incompetent people that make up the majority of PC users in the world, is rather shortsighted.

Go to a PC rumors site (there must be some?) and see whether they say anything insightful or sensible about the Mac. Chastise them if you want to chastise somebody. We're the minority; don't expect us to be magnanimous.
i came here to find out why mac users bash PCs. and you call the majority of PC users arrogant (however true it may be) but i've seen a lot of arrogant mac users too. just dont forget that. a lot of people on either platform are arrogant.

WinterMute

Mar 2, 2003, 06:27 PM

It's a simple choice, for me the TiBook lets me do all the stuff I need to do and it doesn't crash (often).

I run ProTools, Logic and reason plus a host of soft synths for music production, Final Cut Pro and After FX for video and DVD Studio Pro for the visuals, I can mix directly to stereo or any format up to 7.1 straight from the Ti, import and export video via FireWire to the camera, combine and edit the audio/video, author a DVD and burn from DVDSPro ALL IN THE SAME PORTABLE PACKAGE.

Additionally I surf, mail and usenet, manage all my personal info plus music via the iPod, design course materials for my work, run spreadsheets and student databases in Excel and File Maker, play games and watch DVD's and import and edit pics from the digi stills camera...

Now my point is that whilst you can do all these things on a PC, you simply can't do them as seamlessly and quickly as on a Mac, certainly not on a portable and at the same time.

Apple's integration of core systems is approaching awesome in audio and video, buying eMagic was just the nads, and OSX just gets better and better.

Sure some stuff still bites, taking 18 months to get ProTools and Logic to OSX hurt, and losing native VST support pissed a lot of my students off, but Audio Units are cleaner and less power hungry, and core Audio and MIDI services are excellent.

Add to all that the fact that the TiBook is still the coolest, crowd-pulling, arse-kickingest computer on the face of the planet and there's no choice.

I love my Mac, and you will take it only when you pry my cold dead fingers from it...:D :D :D ;)

beatle888

Mar 2, 2003, 06:38 PM

Originally posted by Independence
beatle888: i dont know what default ethernet settings mac os x has. all i can do is guess till i get a mac for myself.

i came here to find out why mac users bash PCs. and you call the majority of PC users arrogant (however true it may be) but i've seen a lot of arrogant mac users too. just dont forget that. a lot of people on either platform are arrogant.

i agree. but the arrogant mac users dont just save it up for PC users :D i wish they did. if you surf around this site you'll see that some mac users here bash on anyone....regardless of platform :D.

about the ethernet set up>
im not sure if its a default setting. its more like an automatic setting. this will give you an example of what it sets up....

configure: using dhcp

IP Address: somerandomnumber (provided by dhcp server)

subnet mask: somerandomnumber (as far as i can tell :D)

router: somerandomnumber

ethernet address: somerandomnumber

and thats it. im not sure what all those numbers are for or how my computer knew to use them....i just selected the automatic option and thats what it gave me. its really weird, i didnt even have to tell the computer what online service i was using. i really love that. i know i sound rediculous, not knowing anything about computers but, thats not what i want to put my time towards. i would rather have a beer with my friends during my free time. not figure out what all that stuff means. i remember once someone said to me, i dont want a computer, i dont care to be forced into becoming a computer geek just to get my system running. they were satisfied with just using the computers at work. i thought they were close minded and lazy, but now, i understand. its so nice when you dont have to massage your computer to get it to work. but you know what, you are the hardest person to convert to the mac platform. you already know how to tweak your system. so you can run on fast hardware and xp pro. you know how to keep it running and remain productive...so honestly, i dont see a reason for you to switch, unless of course you didnt like xp pro. however once the 970 comes out and apple is selling them in their new systems like hot cakes......you wont have an excuse to not convert :D.

Independence

Mar 2, 2003, 07:13 PM

yeah, i figured you were using dhcp. here on my home network, we have static ip addresses for the PCs and the printer.

and it looks as if i'll be getting a mac sooner than expected because this computer im using right now is going to have its life span cut short (by me, selling off its internal components). hell, my 9 year old ibm thinkpad works better. i guess it kinda serves me right for buying three dirt cheap motherboards.

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 07:21 PM

Originally posted by Independence
yeah, i figured you were using dhcp. here on my home network, we have static ip addresses for the PCs and the printer.. [/B]

I think a mac will autoconfigure itself on a static IP network as well, without bothering to ask you, but i could be wrong.

Rower_CPU

Mar 2, 2003, 07:25 PM

Originally posted by Shadowfax
I think a mac will autoconfigure itself on a static IP network as well, without bothering to ask you, but i could be wrong.

Static IPs always need to be entered manually, in my experience, on Macs or PCs.

shadowfax

Mar 2, 2003, 08:10 PM

Originally posted by Rower_CPU
Static IPs always need to be entered manually, in my experience, on Macs or PCs.

oh. alright. it seems that i had it randomly (it seemed) pick an IP address when i had it off DHCP, but now that i think about it, this was just its latest DHCP address before i took it off the router. i guess it's kind of impossible to do much automatically with static stuff, as there's nowhere to "ask" for the right info... oh well, my bad.

bcsimac

Mar 2, 2003, 09:26 PM

I tell you why I hate PCs. 1. PC users have made fun of me for being a Mac user and called me stupid and ignorant and even a fruity. 2. I can't get much of anything done on a PC. 3. I can't fix a PC, but I sure can fix a Mac. 4. Michael Dell telling the media that Steve Jobs would do the whole world a favor if he closed up Apple and gave the money back to the stock holders......now that really pissed me off! 5. Idiots like the Dell Dude! 6. PC users who says Macs can't run Word, Excel, and Powerpoint.....basically same point as 5......they are just ignorant idiots. 7. PCs eating work I had done.....especially if it was school work and a really important assignment.........Macs have never done that to me....EVER!!!!!! 8. PC users calling Macs toys! 9. PC users saying Apple is Dead and has always been dead.......I used to work at CompUSA selling and repairing macs.......customers would always say Apple was dead.....when I mentioned Macs.....I was standing there with a Mac right next to me too! 10. PC users calling me dumb! 11. PC users making jokes about Macs when they don't know a darn thing about Macs and even admit they are totally ignorant about them......at least as the Pro-Mac person......I do spend some time learning a little about my competition.....for instance Virus issues, processor architecture, and how good some video cards are.......and I do read the benchmarking information. 12. PC users saying Macs don't have software......and then they list a title the Mac has and then argue with me about the fact. 13. PC users taking a knife and carving out an X or Microsoft is king on the Apple Studio Display.....the Side of a G3 and into a Powerbook G3 screen. 14. PCs taking more steps to do a job than it takes on a Mac......now that really gets me going in frustration!

vniow

Mar 2, 2003, 10:56 PM

I don't hate PCs (I use one as my main machine) if you do it right you can have a fast stable machine that will be more than satisfactory for most uses.

But you won't truly enjoy it (unless you're a gamer) like you enjoy a Mac.
Everybody runs Windows, everybody knows their way around it, everybody knows a tip, hint, or trick or two about it.
A Mac is something completely alien to those people, they're either drawn in by OSX's beauty or completely repelled from it because it's not Windows (think John Dvorak here) or they learn little things about them over a period of time and they will eventually have one sitting beside their PC.

There's idiots on both sides, the FUD from the PC world comes from people who don't know what Apple is at all, have used older ones at school or just pick up litle snippets of info from what they see on TV or what their friends tell them or what they see in magazines.

The FUD from the Mac world usually comes with insecurity that Macs may not be all their cracked up to be covered with a comfort blanket of percieved superiority.

I don't know if I'll go back to using just one platform now that I've used both, each has their place and I don't see why it has to be an either/or situation.

Mazzone

Mar 3, 2003, 02:18 AM

Originally posted by vniow
I don't know if I'll go back to using just one platform now that I've used both, each has their place and I don't see why it has to be an either/or situation.

Personally I am looking at using a Mac laptop and use PC desktops. Seems more logical for my needs, gaming at home and more professional work while moving around without internet. Of course $$$ is always a big issue.

shadowfax

Mar 3, 2003, 02:31 AM

Originally posted by Mazzone
Personally I am looking at using a Mac laptop and use PC desktops. Seems more logical for my needs, gaming at home and more professional work while moving around without internet. Of course $$$ is always a big issue.

Anyone want to argue that there exists a PC laptop that is better than mac laptops of the same class?

I think we should all be able to agree that Apple makes the best laptops in the world. but i eagerly await disagreement. :D

Mazzone

Mar 3, 2003, 02:33 AM

Well the only thing i can think of is for a Gaming person, how about a fast Fujitsu with a Ge-force 4 in it?

shadowfax

Mar 3, 2003, 02:41 AM

Originally posted by Mazzone
Well the only thing i can think of is for a Gaming person, how about a fast Fujitsu with a Ge-force 4 in it?

perhaps, but a laptop i think can be defined as more of a productivity/mobility solution than a gaming machine. if games are your ultimate goal, i doubt a mac is ever going to be the computer for you.

Mazzone

Mar 3, 2003, 02:44 AM

Originally posted by Shadowfax
perhaps, but a laptop i think can be defined as more of a productivity/mobility solution than a gaming machine. if games are your ultimate goal, i doubt a mac is ever going to be the computer for you.

But why not have gaming and productivity all in one if you can't afford to own 2 platforms?

shadowfax

Mar 3, 2003, 02:49 AM

Originally posted by Mazzone
But why not have gaming and productivity all in one if you can't afford to own 2 platforms?

the other value is mobility in a laptop. there are, of course, a lot of people who would argue that you can be just as productive on a PC as a mac, and i am not going to disagree--there are plenty of people, yourself, scem0, and vniow included, who can be productive on both platforms. but there are no PC laptops that i have seen that offer the appeal of macs--the sturdiness of the ibooks, the size/weight/performance ratio... if gaming is very important, of course macs aren't going to be on the top of the list, but otherwise, from the mobility/productivity standpoint, i think macs win in this area with little contest.